# Goby



## Rod&Reel (Jun 4, 2005)

I know this kinda sounds stupid coming from me, but right off the top of my head I can't remember what the problem fish is we have here in Ohio. I think it is the Goby. Am I right, is that what it is? This is a very important question as it will tell me if I will be starting a new thread and asking to have this one closed as soon as a mod reads this (but only after my question is answered).


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## Mushijobah (May 4, 2004)

We have a few...Goby, silver carp, bighead carp, there is another that the odnr recognizes but has also recognized it as a game fish...I wont say it, I usually get in trouble!


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## Rod&Reel (Jun 4, 2005)

Ok I was out fishing yesterday and caught a fish that I have never caught before. I was fishing Big Walnut Creek. Not giving out the exact location because it is a good spot to fish and I don't want it over fished. Not my best day there, but I caught 12 fish. Anyways I can conferm that we have Goby in Big Walnut. After catching it and not knowing what it was. I came home and searched the internet to find out what it was. Well it's a Goby and I let it go not knowing (sorry about that) what it was. I thought about bringing it home, but being a C&R fisherman, I decided against it. I wish I would have now. Just wanted to let everybody know this little bit of info. Has anybody else caught any? And where (what body of water) did you catch it?



P.S. Please close my other thread.


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## Mushijobah (May 4, 2004)

I highly doubt you caught a goby, and I would not worry about them in a stream. Maybe a pirate pearch?


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## Rod&Reel (Jun 4, 2005)

I know what a yellow perch is, but what a pirate perch? And the Goby is the only fish I seen that looked like what I caught.

I just looked up the pirate perch and nope thats not it. I do believe it is a goby.

This is what it looked like.
http://www.dnr.state.oh.us/wildlife/Fishing/nuisance/goby.htm


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## leckig (May 11, 2005)

I would not call carp a "problem fish". Just imagine how many predator species fish feeds on carps? I think it may be a major food source for all predators.


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## Rod&Reel (Jun 4, 2005)

leckig said:


> I would not call carp a "problem fish". Just imagine how many predator species fish feeds on carps? I think it may be a major food source for all predators.


Not all carp, just some.


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## saugeyeslayer (Jul 6, 2004)

when carp get big. that is the problem...sure small ones make up part of the diets of most predatory fishes, but when they get too big for a nice walleye/bass/cat ect... that is when they turn into nest destroyers, silt kicker-uppers, and space taker-uppers...lol sorry about those "-uppers" i know its not proper grammer. also i have noticed when observing them in silty ponds/alum creek; when they swim overtop of methane beds they release those "harmful?" gasses into the air/stream...the reason i call them harmfull is because they small horrific...are they harmful?


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## Marshall (Apr 11, 2004)

How long was it. Hopefully it was a darter of some kind.


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## misfit (Apr 5, 2004)

could this possibly be what you caught?gobies are pretty much confined to lake erie in ohio,and it's doubtful any will be found around here.
btw,mods are not in the habit of closing threads because someone asks a serious question.they in fact,welcome them,and try to help answer them if possible 
mottled sculpin.


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## saugeyeslayer (Jul 6, 2004)

yes i was thinking darter...i occasionally catch green sided darters on roostertails and worms, but a goby?...thats mostly impossible
darter


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## saugeyeslayer (Jul 6, 2004)

heres more...
DARTERS 

pirate perch


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## Rod&Reel (Jun 4, 2005)

No thats not what I caught and thats one ugly fish. I am pretty sure it was a Goby and even contacted ODNR about it. I gave them the exact location. It was about 5-6" long.


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## Mushijobah (May 4, 2004)

Lol i dunno man...goby in big nut? Sounds like another "2 eyed carp" sightings!


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## Rod&Reel (Jun 4, 2005)

Ok after looking at the latest post and checking the links, I do believe it was a Darter. It looked like the on on top, but not so much green in it. http://www.science-art.com/gallery/93/93_1211200320567.jpg
If the ODNR gets back to me I will tell them false alarm.


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## Mushijobah (May 4, 2004)

Thank goodness! Instead of catching a bad fish, you caught a fish that indicates excellent water quality! Bravo!


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## Rod&Reel (Jun 4, 2005)

Mushijobah said:


> Thank goodness! Instead of catching a bad fish, you caught a fish that indicates excellent water quality! Bravo!


Thats always good to know. I have always thought it was a clean creek. I grew up fishing it. I mean I know things like tires, friges, shopping carts, ect. ect. are in there, but that is trash and not pullotion. If that makes sense to you like it does me  .


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## Mushijobah (May 4, 2004)

Yes trash does not worry me as much as storm sewer runoff, factories/car shops, even retail stores dump things (i work at one).


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## leckig (May 11, 2005)

saugeyeslayer said:


> when carp get big. that is the problem...sure small ones make up part of the diets of most predatory fishes, but when they get too big for a nice walleye/bass/cat ect... that is when they turn into nest destroyers, silt kicker-uppers, and space taker-uppers...lol sorry about those "-uppers" i know its not proper grammer. also i have noticed when observing them in silty ponds/alum creek; when they swim overtop of methane beds they release those "harmful?" gasses into the air/stream...the reason i call them harmfull is because they small horrific...are they harmful?


The gas would be methane with some CO2 I believe. Harmfull? Well, we all release it, especially after eating beens. Sure it is a stinky gas and about 30% of all total methane in atmosphere comes from swamp and waters, it is very potent "greenhouse effect" gas, but carps wont change much in this.

And do not tell to loud close to Ak and others that big carp is a problem. Only, when it does not bite!
Take care,


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## Rod&Reel (Jun 4, 2005)

You sure like fishing for them Carp don't you Leckig. We still need to hook up and go fishing. Oh and when I was fishing yesterday and caught this Darter, I hooked into a pretty good sized smallie on my first cast, but it got off after only about 10 second. Just long enough for me to get a look at it. I can't believe how well I have been doing with my fishing since I started wading the creeks and rivers I fish. I have waded six times since I started and 4 is the lowest number of fish I caught and that day the water was up and muddy, so the odds was against my from the start. I am averaging 17.5 fish per wading trip right now. I would say thats pretty good. Granted all the fish aint big, but they are fish none the less.


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## BigChessie (Mar 12, 2005)

> And do not tell to loud close to Ak and others that big carp is a problem. Only, when it does not bite!


Ak IS the keeper of the carp!! lol


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## andyman (Jul 12, 2005)

With all due respect, it's pretty safe to say that you didn't catch a darter in the 'Nut. Probably a Madtom or a sculpin. Depending how close to the mouth of the river you were.

BTW, don't kid yourself about the pollution levels there. Along with the tiredumps, pallet graves, and just random steel dumping, there has been some nasty runoff reported.

Take a camera next time to document the trash if you would. Send me the pics and we'll see if we can't scare someone into cleaning that crap up!


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## andyman (Jul 12, 2005)

.....and stick a pack or two of these in your pack, too:

http://www.madtoms.com/baits.htm


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## Rod&Reel (Jun 4, 2005)

andyman said:


> With all due respect, it's pretty safe to say that you didn't catch a darter in the 'Nut. Probably a Madtom or a sculpin. Depending how close to the mouth of the river you were.
> 
> BTW, don't kid yourself about the pollution levels there. Along with the tiredumps, pallet graves, and just random steel dumping, there has been some nasty runoff reported.
> 
> Take a camera next time to document the trash if you would. Send me the pics and we'll see if we can't scare someone into cleaning that crap up!


Nope sorry but it was a darter. It had the same fin setup and everything. Personnally I am done with trying to figure out what it is. I know it was a Darter. And me being a wader, I can say I haven't ran into all that much trash. As far as taking a camara to take pictures of trash, I think I will save the film for the fish.


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## whitebass (Apr 18, 2004)

I have caught madtoms in darby before while seining for chubs. I thought that is what rod & reel might have caught. It looks like some sort of baby catfish, so I put them in my tank at home and just watched them. After a couple of weeks I called odnr to figure out exactly what fish it was. The girl at odnr asked me if it looked like a baby catfish, I told her yes and then she told me to take them right back down to the creek where I caught them. She said they were an endangered species and if caught again to immediately release them. Good thing I didn't take them with me catfishin. 
Just a little info
Bryan


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## Rod&Reel (Jun 4, 2005)

lol This Darter didn't look nothing like a baby catfish, thats for sure.


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## Mushijobah (May 4, 2004)

Green sided darters are in no means small darters. They will hit small baits.


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## Rod&Reel (Jun 4, 2005)

Mushijobah said:


> Green sided darters are in no means small darters. They will hit small baits.


Yea I caught this one on a small crankbait.


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## saugeyeslayer (Jul 6, 2004)

i have caught some in the 4-6 inch range...they are closley related to perch and walleye.


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## andyman (Jul 12, 2005)

The EPA, FSA, NPS, and Ohio Rivers Foundation, amoungst others, will all be happy to hear that the 'Nut is trash free and abundant with darters.


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## Rod&Reel (Jun 4, 2005)

Well not being happy until I found out exactly what kind of Darter I caught, I found the species that I caught. Here is a link to it http://www.natureserve.org/explorer...es.wmt&paging=&elKey=106504&save=false&page=1 I would swear somebody took a picture of my fish and posted it here if I hadn't been alone. This picture looks exactly like mine, color and all.



andyman said:


> The EPA, FSA, NPS, and Ohio Rivers Foundation, amoungst others, will all be happy to hear that the 'Nut is trash free and abundant with darters.


Thats good to know, although I wouldn't say it is "trash free", just nowhere near as bad as you try to put it.


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## ashtonmj (May 3, 2004)

That link "ERRORs" for me, what is it of you got me curiuos now. Did ya try the watershed distribution map  ?

Andy - why would you come out making a statement like that so strong statement about a whole family of fish not being somewhere? Not trying to start something just curious. There are in fact multiple species of darters in that watershed and the mainstem.

Whitebass - you got some misinformation from the ODNR, which doesnt surprise me, especially if it was just a secretary or non biologist, especially even more so because it deals with a cryptic non game fish. Stonecats are ALL over the place in the southern ohio drainage basins and are far from state or federally listed. In fact there is only one federally listed madtom in the state, and the only federally listed fish at that matter, the Scioto Madtom, and it was restricted to the Scioto, and hasn't been seen in 30+ years and is assumed extinct. The Mountain and Northern Madtom both exist in Ohio and are state listed, can't remeber what exactly, but the Brindled Madtom is in that area and is not listed.

Down here in TN we have caught log perch while trying to catch lake sturgeon to tag, and it is widely known that tangerine darters are fished for with hook and line and eaten and even have a generic fishing name like river slicks.


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## Rod&Reel (Jun 4, 2005)

ashtonmj said:


> That link "ERRORs" for me, what is it of you got me curiuos now. Did ya try the watershed distribution map  ?


Yes I did use the watershed distribution map. And it is a "Percina caprodes" AKA "Logperch". Even though it doesn't have Darter in it's name, I am guessing it is still in the Darter family. Am I right?? Yea now the link won't work. Got me. Maybe that site doesn't allow you to link to it without asking first, who knows.


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## ashtonmj (May 3, 2004)

That map is a great resource isn't it? Yes "Logperches" (and there are quite a few) are part of the family Percidae, which includes "Darters" of the genus Etheostoma, Rainbow, Greenside, Orangethroat, etc...and Logperches and Darters in the genus Percina as well as two other genuses. Percidae as a family is second highest in diversity of North American fish species.


...its an easy fish to keep, is a great tank mate of the types of sunfish you want, and they have a cool behavior of flipping over small rocks with their snout to look for food. Full of personality too will follow you around everywhere.


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## Rod&Reel (Jun 4, 2005)

ashtonmj said:


> ...its an easy fish to keep, is a great tank mate of the types of sunfish you want, and they have a cool behavior of flipping over small rocks with their snout to look for food. Full of personality too will follow you around everywhere.


Well thats good to hear. One problem. Seeing that I didn't even know this fish existed until I caught it, I have never targeted them as a fish to catch. Got any ideas on how to catch them? Or can I order them? I do think they are a pretty native fish and would love to add them to the tank.Oh and yes that map is nice. I will use it alot in the future.


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## ashtonmj (May 3, 2004)

Well they are really variable in their habitat for one thing. Ive caught them in large to medium rivers but also in lakes like Pymatuning. They can be found in riffles and runs over sand and gravel and are often in or near aquatic vegetation. I've had alot of success finding them along the margins of Justicia (water willow, the emergent plant you see in rivers and lakes commonly). They do great in a nicely planted tank with a small amount of flow in it and because they are large enough they do well with the smaller sunfishes and also wont harras other species.


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## acklac7 (May 31, 2004)

Rod&Reel said:


> Well thats good to hear. One problem. Seeing that I didn't even know this fish existed until I caught it, I have never targeted them as a fish to catch. Got any ideas on how to catch them? Or can I order them? I do think they are a pretty native fish and would love to add them to the tank..


Darters are easy to catch with a sein net...The best way to catch them would be with a 10-20 foot sien with 2-3 people. However a small solo 4ft sein will work if you know how to use it. The Darby is FULL of beautiful darters....The Scioto has a good population but the Darby has the mother load (be careful there are a number of Darters in there that are endangerd..You don't want to take those home )My brother and I seined below Griggs a while back and we would often get rainbows,greenside's and numerous other darters...Along with madtoms,stone rollers, riverchubs etc...The diversity in the Upper Scioto is remarkable...However the EPA NEVER seems to sample it for some reason .


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## Rod&Reel (Jun 4, 2005)

acklac7 said:


> The diversity in the Upper Scioto is remarkable


You got that right. The last time I fished it, we caught 9 different kinds of fish.


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## ashtonmj (May 3, 2004)

One problem with a 10-20ft + seine on inland waters in Ohio...its not legal unless you have a scientific collection permit. Max is 4' x 8' which is plenty for a 3 person group.

If you get two people to hold your seine at least one person starts at above the seine and kicks and splashes and makes the most comotion possible to chase the fish and wash them into the net. It is called as it sounds ..."Kick seining".

Pulling the seine cross and down current can be effective with two people because 1) you can outrun fish and 2) fish have a natural tendancy to move upstream.

Standing upstream of a dipnet around a few large pieces of cobble and kicking down into the net is also effective as a one person operation.


Bioassessment sampling of fish communities by the EPA is done on a 5 year cycle rotating over the major watersheds. I've found a visual schedule online before but I don't remeber how. The other times it is done is for highly polluted areas that they are required to sample at usually to back up litigation and for TMDL reports.


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## acklac7 (May 31, 2004)

ashtonmj said:


> Bioassessment sampling of fish communities by the EPA is done on a 5 year cycle rotating over the major watersheds. I've found a visual schedule online before but I don't remeber how. The other times it is done is for highly polluted areas that they are required to sample at usually to back up litigation and for TMDL reports.


Wondered why I've never heard of this before, being that I know a number of fisheries biologists that have worked for the EPA. Always wondered why south of Greenlawn was sampled every year, now it all makes sense....ashton I take it your involved with fisheries management in some way?


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## ashtonmj (May 3, 2004)

Yup that is why its so long in between hearing reports about general water quality. The ones that do come out on a regular basis usually have to do wiht toxic remediation or some sort of compliance. It would be nice if it wasn't that long and they could cover more watersheds and the cycle but thats about all they can do with their resources. There was talk in the recent past of them subbing out some work because on top of the regular cycles they do they have to develop a TMDL (Total Maximum Daily Load) for every watershed as well by a certain date and they weren't sure they could keep up both.

Yes, I worked as an aquatic biologist for a environmental consultant for two years in NE Ohio that specialized in bioassesment (fish, inverts) so I've gone through the EPA training and read many of the reports online and helped to put a few out.  I'm down in TN right now getting my masters. I try and keep up to date on large scale fisheries management stuff (Erie, statewide stuff) but my speciality is non game fish and mussels, especially T & E species.


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