# Time to change the impeller?



## Gottagofishn (Nov 18, 2009)

I have a 2013 150 4s Merc. I imagine changing the impeller wouldn't be a bad idea. Anything I should be careful of or should know before I tackle this? Is this something I can do alone? Any tips?
Thanks,
Al


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## Draggin' Fish (Jul 10, 2007)

Gottagofishn said:


> I have a 2013 150 4s Merc. I imagine changing the impeller wouldn't be a bad idea. Anything I should be careful of or should know before I tackle this? Is this something I can do alone? Any tips?
> Thanks,
> Al


Very easy job to do by yourself. Usually need to put motor in forward to gain access to shift linkage connection. Spraying new impeller with wd-40 makes installation easier. A vise or fixture to hold lower unit is very helpful. Make sure all water tubes/passages are re-connected when re-assembling. Watch a few videos on google and you should be all set.


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

one person can do the job, but its nice to have a second person to help when lifting the lower unit back in place. I always just put a light coating of grease on the inside of the housing to make it easier to install the new impeller. but I suppose the wd40 would work just as good. on my mercrusier and merc outboard I put the shift handle in forward gear before removing the lower unit. that way when you install the lower unit you can turn the prop if the splines on the shaft doesn't line up.
sherman


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## firemanmike2127 (Mar 17, 2013)

My preference is to have a 2nd pair of hands available to turn the flywheel clockwise (as viewed from the top) to align the crankshaft splines with the driveshaft splines as the lower unit is being installed. Some good spline (or moly) grease should be applied to the driveshaft prior to reinstallation. The 'helper' also gets to ensure that the upper water pump housing & water supply tube line up properly. I pull the prop prior to reinstalling the gearcase, & also grease the prop shaft splines when I'm done. By having the prop off you're less likely to rotate the shift shaft out of it's properly indexed position. The key thing to remember is to never turn the crankshaft counterclockwise. Mike


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## brettmansdorf (Apr 5, 2013)

I'll only add two items too that which has already been said...
First - BUY AUTHENTIC - by that I mean "MERCURY" not quicksilver.
Second - its approximately a 6 pack in time-frame (3 each with two, 6 is your all by yourself)... .


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## bustedrod (May 13, 2015)

have to change my impeller also this season on my 90 hp merc, along with my zinc trim tab. don't get aftermarket like brett said. have tried such and wound up with more trouble ..


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## brettmansdorf (Apr 5, 2013)

bustedrod said:


> have to change my impeller also this season on my 90 hp merc, along with my zinc trim tab. don't get aftermarket like brett said. have tried such and wound up with more trouble ..


and by AFTERMARKET he IS referring to "QUICKSILVER"...
If it says quicksilver - don't buy it unless you simply cannot find the authentic MERCURY.


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## Carpn (Apr 5, 2004)

They are easy to do . Hardest part is getting the shift linkage correct. I use dawn dish soap on the impeller . Slide the top half of the pump housing down to the impeller , then gently turn the drive shaft while pushing down on the top of the pump .


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

Carpn said:


> They are easy to do . Hardest part is getting the shift linkage correct. I use sawn dish soap on the impeller . Slide to top of the pump down to the impeller , then gently turn the drive shaft while pushing down on the top of the pump .


never tried that before. I always just installed the impeller in the housing then installed it together. but your way sounds like it would work better than my way. i'll have to try it the next one I change.
sherman


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## Uncle Paul (Jul 10, 2004)

sherman51 said:


> never tried that before. I always just installed the impeller in the housing then installed it together. but your way sounds like it would work better than my way. i'll have to try it the next one I change.
> sherman


Gottagofishn:Bustedrod don’t be told Quicksilver parts are aftermarket parts They are genuine Mercury parts made in the same factory and at the same time as the Mercury branded part. Mercury branded parts can only be sold by Mercury dealers and Quicksilver parts are sold by non-Mercury stores such as Cabelas and some big box stores.Want an easy way to check,an example is the part # for a quart of High Performance Gear lube is 92-858064Q01 for the Quicksilver bottle and 92-858064K01 for the Mercury brand bottle (the Q is for Quicksilver and K is left over from the old Kiekhaefer parts listing that Mercury still uses) the Merc will be in the black bottle and Quicksilver in gray. The main difference is packaging Generally the Quicksilver parts will be sold as kits if you get the water pump kit it might include the impeller along with all the gaskets and seals you might need .If you go to a Merc dealer you will be able to order just the parts you want.Paul


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## firemanmike2127 (Mar 17, 2013)

I'm not a Mercury dealer & I don't always use OEM components in my shop. Curious as to what kind of problems you guys have had with aftermarket impellers. I have used Sierra brand cooling system parts on many service jobs at my shop, & have only ever had an impeller fail (hub separated from the blades) on one occasion, & that was after 2 seasons of use. I have noticed that some of their carburetor kits are what I consider sub-standard, & will not use them on certain applications. By that, I mean using a paper bowl gasket instead of a good quality viton rubber (tan) seal. Some of the Sierra carb kits don't include a new float either. I'll always buy OEM parts when the quality of an aftermarket part is questionable, but that being said, I sure have used a bunch of Sierra brand components with excellent results & good service life. Mike


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

I've been using after market impellers for many yrs and never had a problem. but I do usually change them after a few yrs depending on how much I use the boat and the water conditions. I buy the kits off ebay and replace the upper housing the lower wear plate and the impeller. and I use the new gaskets.
sherman


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## firemanmike2127 (Mar 17, 2013)

Off topic a bit but thought I'd share a few things I've seen on multiple occasions. Here's a little more insight on OEM vs aftermarket parts.... I'll pick on Mercury & Sierra here. Quicksilver brand fuel hose (gray vinyl w/ a liner) has caused a host of fuel system maintenance issues. I personally don't care for their earlier primer bulbs either, because after cutting several of them apart I've found that the rubber has deteriorated on the inside. I absolutely won't use aftermarket primer bulbs (Sierra, for example) because they don't hold up well either. I prefer to use genuine OMC primer bulbs, which now cost about $ 31.00. I haven't got an opinion on these new double wall bulbs that are fairly new on the market. My opinions aren't based on brand preference, but performance, reliability, & value are what I look for when purchasing replacement parts. Basically what I'm saying is do your homework. There are a lot of opinions out there but I like to make my purchasing decisions as an informed & educated consumer. I sure have learned a bunch from being a member of this site....lots of great knowledge & experience here. Mike


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## brettmansdorf (Apr 5, 2013)

Most of my experience has been in the 50hp an under...

In EVERY case if you take the QS next to the authentic Merc - you can actually see a difference in the parts.
Much like buying aftermarket parts for you car - there will always be those who swear by OEM and those who laugh at them. I have found that the authentic OEM parts are rarely that much more - so I spend the money. The value of an impeller or hose joint not failing in a boat is much like the value of the ball joint not failing in a car. 

For those of us who are gearheads - if you have ever replaced a control arm for a 'cheap' friend who saved 15 dollars by buying the autozone knockoff - only to find its just a hair off - and YOU get to mash and pound it into place... Or - radiator - rockauto has your oem for less $ than orielly has the aftermarket locally. The OEM slips right in and the fittings work - the aftermarket - well get some extra clamps - and be gentle of that nipple that was steel on the OEM but is now plastic on the aftermarket.

YES there is a difference. QS is a parts brand which is geared towards more than just Mercury. Mercury is a marine power manufacturer and their products are the exact same as came from the factory (in essence). 

In 30 years of tinkering with them - I've NEVER had an exceptional experience with a QS part. My motors average 200-300 hours a year min - and my last baby (8hp) ran nonstop since 1991, and NEVER had a rebuild. I wish Mercury built lawnmowers and reasonably priced cars (zr-1).


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## Uncle Paul (Jul 10, 2004)

firemanmike2127 said:


> Off topic a bit but thought I'd share a few things I've seen on multiple occasions. Here's a little more insight on OEM vs aftermarket parts.... I'll pick on Mercury & Sierra here. Quicksilver brand fuel hose (gray vinyl w/ a liner) has caused a host of fuel system maintenance issues. I personally don't care for their earlier primer bulbs either, because after cutting several of them apart I've found that the rubber has deteriorated on the inside. I absolutely won't use aftermarket primer bulbs (Sierra, for example) because they don't hold up well either. I prefer to use genuine OMC primer bulbs, which now cost about $ 31.00. I haven't got an opinion on these new double wall bulbs that are fairly new on the market. My opinions aren't based on brand preference, but performance, reliability, & value are what I look for when purchasing replacement parts. Basically what I'm saying is do your homework. There are a lot of opinions out there but I like to make my purchasing decisions as an informed & educated consumer. I sure have learned a bunch from being a member of this site....lots of great knowledge & experience here. Mike


Firemanmike21- the old Gray fuel line Merc/Quicksilver used a few years back has been replaced with a ethanol resistant fuel line ,and an easy way to check the if you have the new line it will have all the EPA,CARB and CG regulations printed in BLUE on the gray fuel line. However this might not be the latest line that is ethanol resistant as there was a rumor last year that Mercury was coming out with a better line so you need to check. And yes I have seen the separating of the inner liner many times with the older lines


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## Uncle Paul (Jul 10, 2004)

firemanmike2127 said:


> I'm not a Mercury dealer & I don't always use OEM components in my shop. Curious as to what kind of problems you guys have had with aftermarket impellers. I have used Sierra brand cooling system parts on many service jobs at my shop, & have only ever had an impeller fail (hub separated from the blades) on one occasion, & that was after 2 seasons of use. I have noticed that some of their carburetor kits are what I consider sub-standard, & will not use them on certain applications. By that, I mean using a paper bowl gasket instead of a good quality viton rubber (tan) seal. Some of the Sierra carb kits don't include a new float either. I'll always buy OEM parts when the quality of an aftermarket part is questionable, but that being said, I sure have used a bunch of Sierra brand components with excellent results & good service life. Mike


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## Uncle Paul (Jul 10, 2004)

Firemanmike: since you asked if an OEM part is available that’s all I will use and what I mean by that if the part is in a warehouse or is still being manufactured that what gets installed. However there are times we must use aftermarket parts such as when we have older engines and the parts come up as NLA or engine brands that have been out of production for 30 or more years. The Sierra brand in my opinion is one of the best sources for these no longer produced or obsolete parts yet they will be my last choice for parts because of their one size fits all thinking. I have seen all of the extra parts in the carb and lower unit kits but they do that so the same kit can be used in a wider range of engines.OEM if at all possible for me


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

For me, it depends on the particular part as to whether I stay OEM or not. Some parts may be stamped Mercury or in the auto industry GM, Ford, Chrysler etc. but that doesn't mean those business's actually manufacture those part. Another company manufactures the part for those business's and those business's put their trademark stamp on the parts or packages. Bearings, hoses, belts, gaskets,orings, seals, oils and sometimes filters,etc. are just a few of many examples. 
Bottom line is, if you know who manufactured and distributed those 'OEM' parts for the brand of equipment you have, you can buy directly from the source usually at a savings and are getting the same 'OEM' spec'ed part.


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## brettmansdorf (Apr 5, 2013)

IMHO - in general when I open the big trap most call my mouth - its only MY OPINION.

Radiator - Toyota Ford GM - either Denso or Nissens - why - because those guys build it to the manufacturer's spec for ORIGINAL deployments - hence its truly bolt in. Although the product is NOT manufacturers by the auto manufacture - its still OEM, as its the EXACT same as what came with the car when it was new.

I get the out of production - but if its still made by the manufacturer - then its usually a safe bet. I can't tell you the last time a replacement part was superior to the OEM for the core functionality (sans the damn engine mount bolts on my jeep - COME ON chrysler!). 

I'm sure there are certain parts which are better made by the aftermarket - but my experience in both marine and automotive has been the OEM sets the bar and the aftermarket only attempts to get "CLOSE"... When its a control arm, a radiator, or something ever so vital as an impeller - is a couple bucks really worth the risk?

Recently did a control arm - and the actual spec vs. the aftermarket was a difference of 2.6 degrees angle - which translated to a return and ordering it online. The guy at Autozone said "sorry" - I asked and found that the angle was altered to allow it to fit multiple vehicles - GREAT! That was 2 hours of my life I'll never see again.

Will a QuickSilver work - sure. Will it outlast and out perform the OEM - NO, Seems simple to me (especially this time of year when getting it on today vs. next week - really doesn't matter).


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## Uncle Paul (Jul 10, 2004)

brettmansdorf said:


> IMHO - in general when I open the big trap most call my mouth - its only MY OPINION.
> 
> Radiator - Toyota Ford GM - either Denso or Nissens - why - because those guys build it to the manufacturer's spec for ORIGINAL deployments - hence its truly bolt in. Although the product is NOT manufacturers by the auto manufacture - its still OEM, as its the EXACT same as what came with the car when it was new.
> 
> ...


Gottagofishing looks like your thread has drifted a bit so back to your original question Over the years I have removed/installed hundreds maybe more lower units I can’t say for certain I have removed your exact combination of engine lower unit (3013 150hp 4 stk Mercury) So a few tips for you. There are plenty of videos on line for help also don’t be afraid to take pics when taking it apart. You can do it by yourself but for the first time I would get help they are heavy. Remove the bolt under the torque tab completely then remove 3 of the 4 remaining nuts leaving the 4th loose but not completely off so it will support the gear case. Then one of the most overlooked things is locating the speedometer pickup tube it is a black plastic tube that’s in the lower unit forward of the shift linkage you must disconnect it before dropping the unit. Another tip make sure you install the seal that gets installed on the driveshaft over the top of the water pump housing using the supplied in the kit installation tool


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## brettmansdorf (Apr 5, 2013)

Apologies - as In reading back over my passionate comments regarding OEM for Mercs - I'm feeling fortunate I didn't slip off that soapbox and hurt myself.


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## Gottagofishn (Nov 18, 2009)

Thanks for all the input... Hopefully I will get around to it this winter. I'm guessing the engine probably has around 150 hrs on it so I don't know if it's critical, but I will try to get it done none the less.
Thanks again,
Al


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## brettmansdorf (Apr 5, 2013)

Others can answer the 150 hrs... On the smaller motors I have or had, I inspected at least twice a year, but I used mine in rivers often (silty/muddy). I'd GUESS look at it once a year - feel it - if it feels a bit off - change it. I always ordered extras - but mine where always under $20 for the lil' ones. On the smaller motors I learned to familiarize with - shift linkage (LOTS OF PHOTOS and be good with puzzles), the Carb, and the impeller. Keep those going - and the mass majority of the problems will elude you. On bigger motors - I'm NO expert - but my lil' ones saw lots of crappy waters - and on average I'd say 12-18 months until my paranoia forced the change (impeller). Those larger ones have "SYSTEMS" - you know - the things created by woman to confuse men... My only other experience was with a pair of v8 OMC Sea Drives - UG.or OMG or RUN FOREST, RUN, is all I will say.


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## Gottagofishn (Nov 18, 2009)

OK, gonna make this happen. I do have one more question... Where do I find Mercury parts. So far, I call, ask for the mercury parts and the end result is Quicksilver. Does it matter?


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

Gottagofishn said:


> OK, gonna make this happen. I do have one more question... Where do I find Mercury parts. So far, I call, ask for the mercury parts and the end result is Quicksilver. Does it matter?


I personally think quicksilver is just as good as oem. even if I type in mercury oem impeller on ebay quicksilver impellers comes up in the listing. I have used aftermarket impellers for many yrs and never had one fail. but I change them out every 3 to 5 yrs.
sherman


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## brettmansdorf (Apr 5, 2013)

Unless you know the dealer you won't buy Mercury locally. Their 'contract' requires them to carry QuickSilver.
Amazon is a wonderful place...
https://www.amazon.com/Genuine-Mercury-Impeller-Repair-Kit/dp/B00N6DJ2N4


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## Gottagofishn (Nov 18, 2009)

I talked to Merc yesterday and they said "
Thank you for your e-mail regarding your Mercury engine. We appreciate the opportunity to respond to your concerns. 

Quicksilver parts and oil are the same as Mercury parts and oil, the only difference is the packaging. If you would want the Mercury part the part number for the impeller is 43026T2. The part for the complete water pump repair kit is 8M0094529 and retails for $103.33."

So the answer is...... who knows????


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Gottagofishn said:


> I talked to Merc yesterday and they said "
> Thank you for your e-mail regarding your Mercury engine. We appreciate the opportunity to respond to your concerns.
> 
> Quicksilver parts and oil are the same as Mercury parts and oil, the only difference is the packaging. If you would want the Mercury part the part number for the impeller is 43026T2. The part for the complete water pump repair kit is 8M0094529 and retails for $103.33."
> ...


Was told this very thing many years ago by a Mercury Dealer in Delaware Ohio that I used to get all my Quicksilver outboard oil at. Same exact product...different packaging.


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## brettmansdorf (Apr 5, 2013)

3 years ago. 8HP 1990's.. Impeller - Quicksilver has a noticeably different colored inner ring, and the rubber itself is a bit lighter. 
I'll just go out on a limb and suggest if you were a licensed merc dealer - your email would have said something different. 
My understanding is that a non-licensed merc dealer cannot sell mercury parts, only quicksilver.

YMMV!


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

brettmansdorf said:


> 3 years ago. 8HP 1990's.. Impeller - Quicksilver has a noticeably different colored inner ring, and the rubber itself is a bit lighter.
> I'll just go out on a limb and suggest if you were a licensed merc dealer - your email would have said something different.
> My understanding is that a non-licensed merc dealer cannot sell mercury parts, only quicksilver.
> 
> YMMV!


There again, I'd bet anything Mercury doesn't make their own orings. They have a vendor/distributor that specializes in Orings they purchase their Orings in bulk from. Usually, in this situation as an example, Mercury would make a list of specs. of Orings and bid out a contract to oring distributors. Lowest bidder wins contract to supply Orings in bulk to Mercury. Color of oring wouldn't make a difference as long as it meets or exceeds written specs.(heat range, fluid compatibility, etc) set forth by Mercury.

FWIW, the Mercury dealer I referred to in my post was a licensed Mercury dealer and sold both Mercury and Quicksilver labeled parts. 

Too, the reason I got all my Quicksilver oil there was he would have a 'case' sale there once a year on the Quicksilver. It was such a savings per case it made my trip from hocking Co. to Delaware worth the trip when buying 2-3 cases a year. There were a couple time I'd take orders from fellow boaters and get a skid which if I remember correctly was 36 cases.
Quicksilver was the only outboard oil he sold.


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## brettmansdorf (Apr 5, 2013)

The beauty of boating / fishing / internet is opinions. 

Perhaps you are correct and the two impellers I bought were in fact the same identical part and the coloration of the o rings and the rubber compound were just a function of the vendor using different suppliers.

Considering the cost differential is negligible - I (me, myself &) would go with the OEM part.

I'm on the side that there is a difference between OEM and OEM replacement. If you have never done a radiator, or a control arm - they you have likely experienced the difference. Will a quicksilver part work - ABSOLUTELY. 

Fluids are different colors as I remember when I had a sixty - QS differed from the mercury in color. What's it mean - considering the price was $1.90 more for the authentic - I didn't care what the difference was. 

Now when you move into bigger parts like props - I can show you the difference between a mercury prop and a quicksilver prop - its visible. For this - an impeller - the CHOICE is that of the owner.

There are cases where an aftermarket part is better than OEM - but its rare, and if you are happy with the motor why take that chance over a couple of dollars - that's my attitude. I'm an advanced parts - exchanger, not a builder, not a mechanic.

I ran an early 9.9 till 2012 - with it NEVER seeing a mechanic. I was on the water near 100 days /yr with it. I'd guess it had something like 5000 hrs or better when I sold it. I always spent the $ to acquire "Mercury" branded parts. Would it have lasted with QS - probably - but me personally - not willing to take that chance over what amounted to an extra $100 over 30 years. In Canada when I worked on the Pickerel river - those motors saw 1000 hours a season (easy) and they would last 10 seasons on (up there) expensive "mercury' branded stuff. 

You go with what you know.

Can I say QS is bad - ABSOLUTELY NOT. Is it my first choice - obviously no. Do I believe QS and Merc are the same - No, for reasons already said.


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## Gottagofishn (Nov 18, 2009)

Hoping to get the impeller changed this weekend. I watched a couple videos last night and now I have more questions... Should I use a gasket sealer on the gasket? Any particular type? In one video the guy applied some silicone prior to putting the lower unit back on, is that something I need to do? What about the linkage, how do I know if it's hooked up correctly? Also, how do I align the spline? what exactly do I turn to align it? The last question is do I torque the lower end bolts? If so, to what torque?

Sorry for all the questions.... I may be making this tougher than I need to but I do tend to be a bit anal about things...
Thanks all


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Against the advice of a marine mechanic I know, I used to use silicone on the gaskets but don't anymore. I stopped after some of the silicone I had used squeezed out to the inside, breaking off and clogging pee hole. While I was in there cleaning that out, pulled the thermostat and found some of the silicone had the thermostat hung open alittle. Luckily I was able to take my time and get most all mine out of the cooling system. But it was touch and go for awhile after I got it back together again and ran it cause there's areas I just couldn't get to to inspect without a total tear down. Again, I got lucky cause I never had anymore trouble. This is what the guy I knew told me would happen. I didn't listen and it cost me down time and aggravation.
One thing you do want to do is, when you get your impellar seated into its housing(making sure impellar fins are turned the proper way) take some Vaseline and pack into the housing around the new impellar. This help on the initial start up of priming the water up to the impellar faster as well as lubricating the rubber impellar when it initially turns for the 1st time. Don't worry, the Vaseline will wash out with no issues.

Far as the linkage goes, put mtr in gear before you remove lower unit and leave it in gear throughout the process. When you put lower unit back on, move the linkage attached to the lower unit to where you unhooked it above the lower unit. Do not move the part of the linkage not attached to the lower unti to align. That way your unit will still be in gear and most likely will not need adjusted after you get lower unit back on.

Aligning the spline can be done by rotating prop shaft. Another reason an extra set of hands is helpful. One guy holds the lower unit and pushes up slowly while the other turns prop shaft and aligns things up. If doing it by yourself, you can use a floor jack placed under scag.

There are torq. specs on the lower unit but I'm not sure what they are for your particular unit. I torque mine but they won't be the same as yours.


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## Gottagofishn (Nov 18, 2009)

I appreciate all your input....
I'm still not sure on the use of peratex or some other liquid gasket for the gaskets? Yea or nay?


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

If you mean 'permatex' spray gasket or permatex spray copper gasket, IMO, that will be a personal call. If your mating surfaces are clean and smooth with no pitting, I don't see the need for it, don't use it and have never had an issue. 
Others may chime in with their thoughts.


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## firemanmike2127 (Mar 17, 2013)

If you go back to the 3rd post on this thread you'll be able to review how I prefer to reinstall an impeller & gearcase housing. The 'clockwise' rule is something I never deviate from. By rotating the flywheel clockwise (as viewed from the top) you eliminate the possibility of 'flipping' a vane of the impeller the wrong direction. When you rotate the prop shaft there is 50% chance that you'll turn the driveshaft in the wrong direction, especially if you've not checked the direction of rotation ahead of time. I never use silicone on a gearcase....period. I always use OMC's Gasket Sealing Compound (same product as Mercury's Perfect Seal). I'll coat the threads of ALL the bolts with this to prevent corrosion between the SS bolts & the aluminum gearcase housing. Also, apply a good grade of moly grease on the driveshaft to crankshaft splines. The only time these splines ever get lubricated is when the gearcase is removed, so that's a pretty important step as well. Feel free to give me a call & I'll be glad to walk you through my procedure. Mike Bruns. Grand Lake Marine Service. Celina, OH. 419-305-8111 (cell # with V/M & text)


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## Gottagofishn (Nov 18, 2009)

Mike, I really appreciate all the help. I was thinking this was going to be a breeze and then watched a couple videos. There was some conflicting info on them that left me a bit confused. I know there is a cap I need to remove to get to the bolt on the back of the lower end. Whats the best way to get that cap off?
And, I will be doing this Saturday. Hopefully I won't need to but If I would need to call it would be Sat. afternoon.
Thanks,
Al


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## firemanmike2127 (Mar 17, 2013)

Al, It's actually not too bad of a job & only requires some basic tools. I'll look over the parts diagram & shift linkage to ensure that I know exactly what you'll have in front of you on Saturday. I'm off duty on the 14th so you should be able to reach me by phone anytime. Mike


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## BlueMax (Dec 3, 2006)

Don't let it scare you. First time you are a bit uncertain but if you are just of average skill this job is doable. You have the luxury of taking your time.


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## Uncle Paul (Jul 10, 2004)

BlueMax said:


> Don't let it scare you. First time you are a bit uncertain but if you are just of average skill this job is doable. You have the luxury of taking your time.


Gottagofishn the cap is the ½ to ¾ inch round black plastic piece just above the torque tab and it just pries up with a screwdriver or even a knife .then you need to remove the bolt most of the time it takes a 3/8ths Allen wrench but I have seen ½ inch or even a 9/16ths wrench to remove it depending size and year of the motor. As long as you are into it this far think about changing the lower unit oil as long as it’s off the engine. Good Luck


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## Gottagofishn (Nov 18, 2009)

Sooo....moving along at the speed of molasses on this. Getting ready to reassemble and I have a few questions...
First is, I bought an "impeller kit". In it there were two red o rings and one black. I see that the red o rings go in the water tube that sits on top of the impeller cover. I don't see where the black o ring goes? Any ideas?
The second question is. the videos say rotate the flywheel to align the spline..... How would one do that? Crank the engine with the spark plugs disconnected? Or can I just turn the prop shaft?
You mentioned perfect seal... In the service manual it doesn't show any gasket sealer on the gaskets. Do you just use perfect seal on the threads of the bolts? I saw in some of the videos they use 2,4,C on the threads.....
Thanks again.


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

I've changed many water pumps on mercury outboards and on mercruiser outdrives. and I've never used any type sealer for the gaskets or on the threads. and I've never had any problems. and I put my motor in forward gear before removing the lower unit. and I just turn the prop if the splines doesn't align. i'll get the shaft up against the upper splines and if it doesn't go i'll turn the prop slow and easy and the shaft will go in. I'm 65 now and can still replace the water pump by myself. but I can get my son to help with lifting the lower unit back up and it makes it a easy task.
sherman


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## firemanmike2127 (Mar 17, 2013)

I use sealant on all of the bolt threads instead of grease (2-4-C). Rotate the FLYWHEEL clockwise as viewed from the top to align the driveshaft splines with the crankshaft. Do NOT rotate the prop shaft, as this can cause improper 'indexing' of the shift linkage. The black o-ring (which should be larger) could go a couple of different places, but it's hard to tell for sure without seeing your parts. On the driveshaft just below the splines or on the underside (bottom) of the impeller if the style you purchased has the base cut for said o-ring. Mike Bruns. 419-305-8111


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## firemanmike2127 (Mar 17, 2013)

The purpose of the sealant is to act as a 'filler' between the SS bolts & the aluminum gearcase housing. A white form of corrosion often forms in this area & the sealant ensures that the fasteners will be easily removed during future repairs. Mike


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## firemanmike2127 (Mar 17, 2013)

The corrosion I mentioned forms on the threads, & I see this frequently here on GLSM. Sherman, on Mercruiser stern drives & some Mercury outboard models it's really best (IMO) not to rotate the prop shaft. When an outboard or stern drive utilizes a rotating style shift linkage spinning the prop can cause improper indexing of the shift linkage. On the stern drive gearcases, if the driveshaft splines don't line up initially I'll just lower the gearcase & rotate the driveshaft clockwise slightly & it almost always will slide right up into place. As I indicated, with the outboard lower units I simply rotate the flywheel clockwise a small amount. Mike


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

...and don't forget to put some lube the shaft spline.


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## tomb (Oct 9, 2004)

fastwater said:


> ...and don't forget to put some lube the shaft spline.


Do so, but keep the top of the shaft clean. Grease on the top can prevent it from seating all the way.


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

firemanmike2127 said:


> The corrosion I mentioned forms on the threads, & I see this frequently here on GLSM. Sherman, on Mercruiser stern drives & some Mercury outboard models it's really best (IMO) not to rotate the prop shaft. When an outboard or stern drive utilizes a rotating style shift linkage spinning the prop can cause improper indexing of the shift linkage. On the stern drive gearcases, if the driveshaft splines don't line up initially I'll just lower the gearcase & rotate the driveshaft clockwise slightly & it almost always will slide right up into place. As I indicated, with the outboard lower units I simply rotate the flywheel clockwise a small amount. Mike


I've been doing it wrong all these yrs. but I've been lucky I haven't ever had the 1st problem. and I've been changing them for the last 30 something yrs. maybe its because I've been changing them on old mercury outboards and the alpha one gen one outdrives. I've watched several youtube videos and they all turned the prop shaft. I don't even remove the prop when I change the water pump. and I just turn the prop until the splines matches up.
sherman


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## firemanmike2127 (Mar 17, 2013)

Sherman, your method will work but I've seen multiple people have issues with the rotary style shift linkage getting out of sync. I do put the Mercury/Mercruiser units into forward gear, but also prefer to remove the prop. If the prop is rotated or bumped the WRONG direction the shift shaft will rotate toward the neutral position (CCW). The other consideration is the impeller. In earlier years (a long time ago) I was always told (@ OMC Service School) to install new impellers 'dry'. Now, I always lubricate the vanes w/ some motor oil, which makes the installation of the upper water pump housing much easier. To minimize the chance of a blade 'flipping' is why I'm so religious about following what I call the 'clockwise rule' (& lubricating the impeller). I've seen this happen before....& most frequently on outboards. I'm assuming it's because the flywheel is exposed & the DIY owners just don't understand what's down there on the driveshaft, how the impeller is designed to work, & what can happen when the flywheel is turned CCW. I hope my lengthy posts will help the members here avoid some of the common problems I've encountered. Mike


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

tomb said:


> Do so, but keep the top of the shaft clean. Grease on the top can prevent it from seating all the way.


Good call tomb. Grease on the splined side of the shaft only. Not on the very top flat part.


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## Gottagofishn (Nov 18, 2009)

Mike, 
Does using the sealer on the bolts create any issues next time as in removing or reinstalling the bolts? Also, on my engine the flywheel is covered. Is there a way to turn it without removing the cover? 150 2013 Merc.


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

firemanmike2127 said:


> Sherman, your method will work but I've seen multiple people have issues with the rotary style shift linkage getting out of sync. I do put the Mercury/Mercruiser units into forward gear, but also prefer to remove the prop. If the prop is rotated or bumped the WRONG direction the shift shaft will rotate toward the neutral position (CCW). The other consideration is the impeller. In earlier years (a long time ago) I was always told (@ OMC Service School) to install new impellers 'dry'. Now, I always lubricate the vanes w/ some motor oil, which makes the installation of the upper water pump housing much easier. To minimize the chance of a blade 'flipping' is why I'm so religious about following what I call the 'clockwise rule' (& lubricating the impeller). I've seen this happen before....& most frequently on outboards. I'm assuming it's because the flywheel is exposed & the DIY owners just don't understand what's down there on the driveshaft, how the impeller is designed to work, & what can happen when the flywheel is turned CCW. I hope my lengthy posts will help the members here avoid some of the common problems I've encountered. Mike


I understand where your coming from. I'm very careful not to turn the shaft the wrong way. and for some people it could happen very easy and screw something up. and I just use a little grease on my finger and lube the inside of the upper housing before installing the impeller. I would guess any good lube would work motor oil, grease, wd-40, Vaseline, and a list of other lubes. when I 1st started changing impellers I didn't know to use any lube, made it much harder to get the impeller in with all the vanes going the right direction, LOL.
sherman


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Not Mike but the issues that's created by using a 'non hardening' sealer on the bolts are positive issues in that your bolts will not seize up do to corrosion and will remove easily the next time.
Have used both Loctite brand Marine Grade Never Seize as well as LockTite 'liquid' pipe thread sealant on bolt threads with great results. Both are non-hardening.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

sherman51 said:


> I understand where your coming from. I'm very careful not to turn the shaft the wrong way. and for some people it could happen very easy and screw something up. and I just use a little grease on my finger and lube the inside of the upper housing before installing the impeller. I would guess any good lube would work motor oil, grease, wd-40, Vaseline, and a list of other lubes. when I 1st started changing impellers I didn't know to use any lube, made it much harder to get the impeller in with all the vanes going the right direction, LOL.
> sherman


Sherman,
I like to use Vaseline. And also pack a bit between the impellar fins. IMO, it helps in faster priming of the pump. It melts out quickly and is compatible with the rubber the impellar is made of.
A bit of caution should be taken when choosing a lube to lube the impellar or any Orings as some lubes will soften or deform many types of rubber.


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## firemanmike2127 (Mar 17, 2013)

Gottagofishn, Fastwater is correct about using a non-hardening type of sealer on the threads. I use OMC's Gasket Sealing Compound. It actually inhibits the white form of corrosion that I mentioned by 'filling' the threads. Your Merc probably has SS bolts with SS nylon lock nuts that bolt the gearcase to the exhaust housing. I'll just use a small dab of penetrating oil on those fine thread SS bolts/nuts. I'll apply sealer to any fasteners that thread into the aluminum exhaust housing or gearcase. Non-hardening sealers in this area help ensure ease of removal in the future. My 225 EFI just has a plastic cover over the flywheel that is secured with nylon wing nuts (as do many of the later model Mercs). Mike


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## firemanmike2127 (Mar 17, 2013)

As for impeller lubricant during assembly I just use a small amount ordinary petroleum based motor oil. I read in a Mercury service manual where the factory reccomended using gear oil. I think that using Vaseline, as Fastwater stated, would be a good alternative. Mike


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Mike,
Would you suggest that Gottagofishn change his thermostat(if applicable) as well while he is down?


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## firemanmike2127 (Mar 17, 2013)

My 1998 225 EFI Mercury still has the original thermostats. I don't routinely change thermostats that often in outboards unless there's a temperature problem related to flow restrictions within the engine. That being said, if the motor has ever ingested a good wallop of sand or bottom muck, a thorough flush job (both directions) of the entire cooling system (including the high speed bypass)+ replacing the impeller, & t-stats is just about mandatory. With routine impeller replacement I like to run the engine under load & monitor the temperature of the block, heads, & exhaust covers with a Raytech infrared temp gun. The inexpensive ones from Harbor Freight work just fine for this also. I keep one of them in my pond tackle bags for checking the surface water temps. Mike


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

firemanmike2127 said:


> My 1998 225 EFI Mercury still has the original thermostats. I don't routinely change thermostats that often in outboards unless there's a temperature problem related to flow restrictions within the engine. That being said, if the motor has ever ingested a good wallop of sand or bottom muck, a thorough flush job (both directions) of the entire cooling system (including the high speed bypass)+ replacing the impeller, & t-stats is just about mandatory. With routine impeller replacement I like to run the engine under load & monitor the temperature of the block, heads, & exhaust covers with a Raytech infrared temp gun. The inexpensive ones from Harbor Freight work just fine for this also. I keep one of them in my pond tackle bags for checking the surface water temps. Mike


Checking heat with the temp. gun is a good idea.
A couple summers ago, I was prepping an old 25hp Mariner mtr. that had been setting for several years to run on my boat. Rebuilt carb., changed filter and tuned engine. When replacing old impeller noticed a few chunks missing from the old impeller fins. Ended up pulling the t-stat just to check it and found a piece of the impellar holding the T-stat open just a bit. Replaced stat and took weed eater cord and ran through water ports and shot compressed air through ports best I could removing more chunks of rubber. There was also a chunk wedged at the pee hole exit.
So I guess the moral of the story is if we replace the impeller and there are pieces missing from the old impeller fins, it's a good idea to try and remove all rubber that we can from the cooling system.


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## Uncle Paul (Jul 10, 2004)

fastwater said:


> Checking heat with the temp. gun is a good idea.
> A couple summers ago, I was prepping an old 25hp Mariner mtr. that had been setting for several years to run on my boat. Rebuilt carb., changed filter and tuned engine. When replacing old impeller noticed a few chunks missing from the old impeller fins. Ended up pulling the t-stat just to check it and found a piece of the impellar holding the T-stat open just a bit. Replaced stat and took weed eater cord and ran through water ports and shot compressed air through ports best I could removing more chunks of rubber. There was also a chunk wedged at the pee hole exit.
> So I guess the moral of the story is if we replace the impeller and there are pieces missing from the old impeller fins, it's a good idea to try and remove all rubber that we can from the cooling system.


Mike something I was told long ago to do is when I flush engines I remove the Thermostats and poppet valves if the engine has one you would be surprised how much junk comes out. After flushing reinstall the parts. Some people might not know but on later Merc engines you can disassemble the thermostats they just snap apart and you can check the sealing surfaces for sand or parts of the water pump vanes Put them back together and to test suspend them in a pot of water on your stove and heat the water they will open up at a temp that is stamped on the thermostat if not replace with a new one.


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## firemanmike2127 (Mar 17, 2013)

Uncle Paul, I had to flush several engines last season due to muck ingestion (we had really low water levels last fall). You're right on with the observation about all the debris that will get trapped in an outboard motor's internal cooling passages. I've even had to remove cylinder heads & water pocket covers (on the heads) in order to clean inside the block casting to avoid 'hot spots' & ensure adequate cooling water flow. I've tested thermostats before as you described ....It's a nice simple way to verify that the T-stats fully open at the proper temperature. Mike


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## MassillonBuckeye (May 3, 2010)

brettmansdorf said:


> Most of my experience has been in the 50hp an under...
> 
> In EVERY case if you take the QS next to the authentic Merc - you can actually see a difference in the parts.
> Much like buying aftermarket parts for you car - there will always be those who swear by OEM and those who laugh at them. I have found that the authentic OEM parts are rarely that much more - so I spend the money. The value of an impeller or hose joint not failing in a boat is much like the value of the ball joint not failing in a car.
> ...


You might be right but, whats another name for Mercury(element)? Quicksilver! Quicksilver IS Mercury. Quicksilver is to Mercury as MOPAR is to Chrysler. Or Motorcraft is to Ford. Its that simple. Could there be differences in parts? Probably. Just as there probably could be variances in Mercury branded parts as well. 

"Mercury makes Quicksilver parts and accessories meet the same tough standards and testing as their engines. For over 70 years, Mercury has built the highest quality marine engines and components known. So when you purchase Quicksilver parts and accessories, you can be sure that you're getting world-leading products that are designed with you and your engine in mind, allowing you to fully enjoy your time on the water."
https://www.quicksilver-products.com/en/about

"quicksilver is the premier supplier of *Mercury Marine Original Equipment* replacement parts and accessories."

Also note the copyright at the bottom of the page: "© 2017 Mercury Marine. All Rights Reserved. Reproduction in whole or in part without permission is prohibited. Mercury Marine is a division of Brunswick Corporation."


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## tomb (Oct 9, 2004)

Pot testing Tstat is easy. Pretty sure both my owner's manuals say to do it yearly. I know the big outboard does for sure. Easy to rig up something on the stove. I do that kind of stuff in warm weather months (no heated shop to work in)


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

MassillonBuckeye said:


> You might be right but, whats another name for Mercury(element)? Quicksilver! Quicksilver IS Mercury. Quicksilver is to Mercury as MOPAR is to Chrysler. Or Motorcraft is to Ford. Its that simple. Could there be differences in parts? Probably. Just as there probably could be variances in Mercury branded parts as well.
> 
> "Mercury makes Quicksilver parts and accessories meet the same tough standards and testing as their engines. For over 70 years, Mercury has built the highest quality marine engines and components known. So when you purchase Quicksilver parts and accessories, you can be sure that you're getting world-leading products that are designed with you and your engine in mind, allowing you to fully enjoy your time on the water."
> https://www.quicksilver-products.com/en/about
> ...


you are so right about parts being oem under other names. I was looking for a used transmission for a old mercury bobcat. I had a hard time finding the right one. it turned out there was 5 different ones. I found out ford was farming out the transmissions for the ford pinto and the bobcat. if they needed 200,000 transmissions they took bids on them. the next time they needed more transmissions they took bids on them. they were all oem parts but came from 5 different companies. go figure!
sherman


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## Gottagofishn (Nov 18, 2009)

Just for the record... Mercury says.... Quicksilver is the same.


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## Gottagofishn (Nov 18, 2009)

I really appreciate everyone's input, it made this doable from my perspective. 
Before I start, I am really anal about doing things to spec..... I'm blaming my father.....

I rounded up the impeller kit from West Marine. She was nice enough to give me a more reasonable price I was quoted from a local marina. Had it disassembled in no time, no problems with any bolts or gaskets. When I started to reassemble it the first thing I ran across was the bolts holding on the impeller cover are supposed to be torqued to 60.2 in-lbs. Well sure... so I picked up an in-lb torque wrench. By the way, it ain't much, 60.2 that is.... ( I also picked up some crows feet wrenches to torque the bolts that hold the lower unit on as a socket wouldn't fit.) Mercury said to put nothing on the bolts, the service manual said 2-4-C. I did see some corrosion on them when I disassembled it so I did use Perfect Seal when putting them back on as suggested by some.
Once I had the cover back on I slipped the lower unit back on easily, thankfully everything seemed to line up pretty good. I had a couple folks mention if it didn't line up to turn the flywheel.... _How_? I took the cover off the top of the engine but that flywheel wasn't about to turn in the least... Anyway, it didn't matter as it lined up. 

The bolts holding the lower unit on are supposed to be torqued to 44.1 lbs I think..... When you use an extension on a torque wrench there are some calculations involved. Goggle is your friend. Anyway it all went together uneventfully. I will fire it up this coming weekend to make sure it all works. Next time it will be a breeze... thanks for everyone's help.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Sounds great...and glad you did this yourself.

One question...was the old impellar all there and in one piece?

Another thing, when you start it for the first time just make sure it pee's. Can't remember on my 150 if it pee'd the minute I started it or after a few minutes when the thermostat opened up. 
After it starts peeing and while its idling, shift it into forward, then reverse and back to neutral to make sure it's selecting all gears properly. 
Also, if you're starting on a set of muffs, I wouldn't rev it to much.


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## Gottagofishn (Nov 18, 2009)

The old impeller was in pretty good shape. I really don't have near the hours on the engine I should have.... life... anyway, I will fire it up this weekend to see what happens. I'm hoping it shifts (and pee's) OK.

If anyone can clarify, unless I am wrong in my assumption, the flywheel is located on the top of the engine. (There was a starter engaged on the flywheel.) I attempted to turn it just to see if it would turn (after removing the cover) but it wouldn't budge. Is this the flywheel? Everyone said to turn that to align the spline but as I stated, it was not budging.
Thanks again everyone, couldn't have done it without you.

I'm sure you'll hear from me again with the next project!
Al


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Great that the impellar was intact.

Yes, the flywheel is as you described.
Sets on top of the engine, the starter engages into it and it has many 'teeth' for the starter sprocket to engage into when the ignition key is turned to the start position.
Without getting into a long explanation about the flywheel being hard to turn and the possible reasons why(compression stroke etc) , since your working on a bigger engine that obviously has more compression than a smaller HP engine, the flywheel will be harder to turn. And without removing the spark plugs, will very likely not be able to be done with your hands. But it can be done using a flywheel wrench or even a screwdriver by carefully wedging the screwdriver between the teeth of the flywheel and something sturdy on the engine and prying. Have seen guys do it this way but I remove the spark plugs for reasons explained below. Plus, if you are not careful what you use as leverage and pry against with the screwdriver, it's possible to break what you are prying against with the spark plugs in.
firemanmike can probably explain this better than I. Hopefully he will chime in.

As a rule, when I replace my impellar I'm gonna take the time to perform other maintenance procedures also. Changing/cleaning fuel filters, inspecting fuel lines, looking for leaks, changing/inspecting spark plugs, etc. So I'll have the engine cowl off anyways.
So the first thing I do when replacing the impellar is remove the engine cowl.
Then remove lower unit and install my new impellar.
When I go to reinstall the lower unit, if I find I have to rotate the flywheel, I'll then remove the spark plugs(again, I'm going to remove them anyway for replacement/inspection) and that lets me rotate the flywheel by hand or using a screw driver real easily. Removing the spark plugs equates to the engine not building any compression therefore letting you spin the engine by the flywheel much easier.
Hope that helps to explain.


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## Gottagofishn (Nov 18, 2009)

Ahhh... makes sense now. 
I neglected to change the fuel filters. I see there is a low pressure and a high pressure. Should I change them both or just inspect them? Or, wait till next year?


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Gottagofishn said:


> Ahhh... makes sense now.
> I neglected to change the fuel filters. I see there is a low pressure and a high pressure. Should I change them both or just inspect them? Or, wait till next year?


I'm not sure what the hour recommendation is per the manual for changing the fuel filters, especially the high pressure filter. I do know there is a procedure for de-pressurizing the fuel system when changing the high pressure filter that needs to be followed. If you have a manual, it should explain that procedure. Either that or maybe firemanmike can instruct you on that procedure or you may be able to find a YouTube vid. on it. My 150's were older carbed models.
If it were mine and they had never been changed, I would seriously consider changing them. Especially the low pressure filter. This coming season will be their fourth season.

Edit:
Did a little checking and it seems Mercury recommends changing the low pressure fuel filter at every 100hrs. The high pressure filter at every 300hrs (before if there seems to be a fuel delivery problem).
From what I read, the high pressure fuel filter on your mtr.sets behind the lower engine cowl in the fuel rail by the high pressure fuel pump. Didn't see a vid. on changing it but read that it can be done at home but requires a few special tools as well as de-pressurizing the system and most choose to have it done at the dealer.
Again, maybe firemanmike will chime in or you could shoot him a pm.


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

Gottagofishn said:


> I really appreciate everyone's input, it made this doable from my perspective.
> Before I start, I am really anal about doing things to spec..... I'm blaming my father.....
> 
> I rounded up the impeller kit from West Marine. She was nice enough to give me a more reasonable price I was quoted from a local marina. Had it disassembled in no time, no problems with any bolts or gaskets. When I started to reassemble it the first thing I ran across was the bolts holding on the impeller cover are supposed to be torqued to 60.2 in-lbs. Well sure... so I picked up an in-lb torque wrench. By the way, it ain't much, 60.2 that is.... ( I also picked up some crows feet wrenches to torque the bolts that hold the lower unit on as a socket wouldn't fit.) Mercury said to put nothing on the bolts, the service manual said 2-4-C. I did see some corrosion on them when I disassembled it so I did use Perfect Seal when putting them back on as suggested by some.
> ...


so glad to hear you got er done. its a lot easier than people think to change the water pump. after you've done it a few times it gets even easier. the last time I changed mine by myself it took less than an hour. I get the kit and change the upper housing lower wear plate and the impeller. I've changed more than a few and have never torqued any of the screws or bolts. I just use my judgement on how tight they should be and never had any problems. good luck when you check her out.
sherman


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## tomb (Oct 9, 2004)

There is a large nut with a plastic cover on the flywheel. Pop off the cover and use a 1/2 drive ratchet and appropriate socket to turn flywheel.


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## Popspastime (Apr 1, 2014)

Does anyone here know how to change an impeller? J/K..


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## Gottagofishn (Nov 18, 2009)

I do....


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