# Bermuda Triangle or Martians?



## Snakecharmer (Apr 9, 2008)

With the mysterious disappearance of the Malaysian Airline Jet, it is looking like it was swallowed into the Bermuda Triangle or maybe abducted by Men from Mars.

What are your theories regarding this event?

I'm hoping everything turns out well but this is strange.....

_*And for every circumstance that would seem to support one theory, another undercuts it.

From NBCnews.com
http://www.nbcnews.com/#/storyline/missing-jet/puzzle-no-pieces-what-happened-malaysia-plane-n49121
"It's a thousand-piece puzzle, and we have two pieces and we're trying to make a picture with that," said John Goglia, a former member of the National Transportation Safety Board.

"I'm totally confused, to be honest with you. Nothing makes sense."

Added former NTSB investigator Greg Feith, "You can't rule anything out at this point
*_


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## Daveo76 (Apr 14, 2004)

Flew thru a rift in space and time to a parallel universe


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## ducman491 (Oct 31, 2011)

If it crashed there would have to be a debris field. I wonder about disabling the transmitters with something like an emp and landing in a different location. I would assume an emp would disable the controls of the plane too but I don't know. Also, what would be the motive for something like that?


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## lunker4141 (Apr 19, 2010)

The Avengers.....must be involved. In all seriousness who knows what happened? 

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## Jigging Jim (Apr 3, 2010)

Maybe it slid underneath a Rice Paddy someplace. Kind of like when you put your Spoon in a Bowl of Oatmeal. The Spoon slides in - but the surface of the Oatmeal does not show any change on its surface.... That's my guess.


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## Dirty Mudskipper (Mar 2, 2011)

I'm sure Big Brother knows. All they'd have to do is rewind the tape on one their surveillance satellites. (Enemy of the State). Sorry... I got nothing. LOL. Although... Never mind.


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## FOSR (Apr 16, 2008)

> Maybe it slid underneath a Rice Paddy someplace.


There was ValueJet 592 that nosedived into the Everglades, leaving not much more than a pool.

IIRC the "improperly stored cargo" was a bunch of oxygen generators that caught fire, and melted the cockpit floor.


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## RJohnson442 (May 14, 2013)

I think the engine's stopped for one reason or another. And it dropped like a rock outta the sky. If the plane was intact when it hit the water from 30000 feet it wouldn't leave much debris on the surface. Without power these planes cant stay above stall speed and will literally fall out of the sky. The black box will have what everyone wants to know if it will ever be found. And they've already look at satellite photos of the area to see by chance if anything was recorded and nothing yet. 

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## Toad Man (Oct 8, 2013)

Kinda reminds me of this.


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## Lowell H Turner (Feb 22, 2011)

Near as can tell, the last reported position was over land. Assuming it broke up at altitude there would have been a quite loud explosion and large scattered debris field. Even over the jungle there are villages that would have heard and/ or seen the disaster. Same is true over the ocean, if the plane violently came apart at height there would be bodies, luggage, seat cushions, pieces of foam cabin insulation scattered for miles. If the plane stayed intact and nose dove into the ground, again, the explosion and smoke column would be VERY noticeable, the crater and knocked down trees would be quite obvious at a distance viewed from the air. IF however it nose dove into the sea, the force of the crash could possibly accordion the fuselage , compressing everyone and thing in it to the back 1/4th, hitting, and just keep on going. At least 2 crashed jet airliners have been found on the sea bed in exactly this condition. What I find most mysterious is WHY are the searchers NOT hearing the `squalkers` inside the "black boxes" (which are actually bright orange and all but indestructible) ? These signal beacons operate on their own totally alone UN assigned frequency that nothing else can legally use, so they are as stealthy as a Led Zeppillin concert sound and light show, will go on active mode for like 2 months then go to low energy mode; these things will ping at the top of Mount Everest, 20,000 ft below sea level, or on the surface of the Moon. They are TOUGH, and were almost the only parts of Flight 93 to remain identifiable after that aircraft slammed into the Pennsylvannia field inverted at 80 degrees and at over 600 mph on 9/11. And the fact every commercial jet air liner is required to carry 2 of them all but ensures at least 1 of them will tell the actual detailed chain of events leading to the aircraft`s loss; every control setting, every instrument and display reading, every word spoken in the cockpit, every maneuver, fuel remaining, air speed, alarms, radio transmissions, ALL of it, in real time...they SHOULD be EASY to at least locate, especially with orbiting satellites...


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## All Eyes (Jul 28, 2004)

The plane that is missing had auto systems with several back up systems that would automatically send a distress signal in the event of any failure such as altitude drop, loss of cabin pressure, fire, engine trouble etc. Whatever took that thing down happened in a blink. It had to have exploded somehow or else there would have been a mayday sent from the computer systems on board. If it simply fell from the sky due to engine failure they would have known immediately. My feeling is that either a bomb was on board or it was shot by a ground missile.


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## flyman01 (Jan 23, 2013)

It is my understanding that two people were on this flight using stolen passports. Ironically, these two passports were not scanned by Interpol, which is a data base to identify stolen passports, which is used in an effort to prevent terroist acts. If this is true as I am gathering, the others were scanned and these were not; one could speculate that this could be an inside job and an act of terrorism. It is certainly possible that one of these or both could have been carrying a bomb or forced the plan down. Until more details surface, such as the black box, it is hard to determine what exactly happened.


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## Net (Apr 10, 2004)

New from the AP:


> KUALA LUMPUR, Malaysia -- The Malaysian military has radar data showing the missing Boeing 777 jetliner changed course and made it to the Malacca Strait, hundreds of miles from the last position recorded by civilian authorities, according to a senior military official.
> 
> The development injects more mystery into the investigation of the disappearance of Saturday's flight, and raises questions about why the aircraft was not transmitting signals detectable by civilian radar.
> 
> ...


IMO this is sounding more & more like a hijack & ditching. At least now they know what direction the plane was heading when it first veered off course.


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## Lowell H Turner (Feb 22, 2011)

The LACK of `squawking" from those `black boxes" is what is the current real mystery. Passive sonars can hear then at quite a distance underwater, and emergency beacon seekers can hear them several hundred miles away on land. If disabled in the plane (almost impossible in flight) they AUTOMATICALLY go active. To silence them they have to be physically removed, `squawking` the whole time, and physically disassembled with specialized anti tamper fasteners similar to custom locking lug nuts, which are not easy to come by. Unless you fly the plane into an erupting volcano or bury it far underground, the searchers SHOULD hear them broadcasting "HERE I AM..." Even flying the plane directly into 30` of solid cement or into the sea from 35,000 feet straight down will NOT silence these things ...all 8 from the 9/11 crashes were recovered and spilled their electronic data...


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## All Eyes (Jul 28, 2004)

I haven't heard one way or the other, but are cell phones and mobile devices permitted on these flights? If so, it's hard for me to believe that 2 men could hijack a multi compartment airliner of that size without one single transmission getting out from the crew or any of the 239 passengers. Either way it sounds like whatever happened did so really fast. As in kaboom.


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## Net (Apr 10, 2004)

Lowell H Turner said:


> Passive sonars can hear then at quite a distance underwater


A few miles at the most. This plane was carrying enough fuel to fly halfway around the globe. Where do you start looking?


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## buckeyebowman (Feb 24, 2012)

Net said:


> A few miles at the most. This plane was carrying enough fuel to fly halfway around the globe. Where do you start looking?


Uh, that's not what I heard on the radio today. The plane carried enough fuel for a 7 hour flight. Also, to enlarge on net's post, the Malaysian military estimated that the plane flew at least 350 miles with it's transponders turned OFF! Curiouser and curiouser! That plane is somewhere. Will we ever be told where? You have to wonder!


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## ducman491 (Oct 31, 2011)

I would think there are some pretty remote areas where it could be brought down and somewhat hidden if it could be landed without crashing too hard. But like was said before with out something like an EMP how do you disable all of the cell phones and black boxes.


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## Net (Apr 10, 2004)

buckeyebowman said:


> Uh, that's not what I heard on the radio today. The plane carried enough fuel for a 7 hour flight.


Yep you caught me trying to make a point. I should've fact checked it first.

A general question: What sort of cell phone service would those passengers have while flying over the south china sea?


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## Lowell H Turner (Feb 22, 2011)

A "transponder" (civilian version of "Identification Friend or Foe"-`IFF`) is a continuous signal transmitted by the plane to ensure anyone interested KNOWS this is a Boeing 777, serial number #123456, call sign ABCD which took off here and is cleared to land there. Kind of like an electronic tag, broadcasting the plane`s position , flight number, and other info constantly. The ` black boxes` are designed so that even if the plane catastrophically blows up in flight as SOON as external power to them and/ or the data stream is lost they AUTOMATICALLY switch on, and cannot be switched off unless deliberately opened, and are mounted so they are accessible only from outside the airframe, so they CANNOT be deliberately switched off...missiles can shoot the plane down, but the chances of BOTH boxes being completely destroyed are nil. They have survived the 9/11 suicide crashes, mid air collisions, submerged at 15,000+ feet, explosive decompressions, fires...there are about 4 ways to 4 ways to "shut 1 up": an atomic detonation, which is unlikely, falling into an erupting volcano, possible but unproven, a meteorite strike (very slim odds BUT it COULD almost completely and instantly pulverize the plane) or buried deep underground...as far as satellite phones, possibly pretty good from 1st class section.


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## Lowell H Turner (Feb 22, 2011)

btw, forgot to mention, the outer casings of the newer versions required and now in use since after 9/11 have titanium housings, are resistant to 1,200 degrees F for no less than 6 minutes and as have said are expected to survive a 3600 "G" force impact, roughly equal to being within 25` of a US Mk 82 500 pd bomb detonation...and then still `squawk` "Here I am..." also Net, believe you are correct, the maximum range capability is almost 10,000 miles. Of course, it can fly shorter distances too...


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## Bonemann (Jan 28, 2008)

I think if it were terrorists they would have come forward to claim it by now.
But if it was done by a couple of knuckle headed terrorists on their own who knows ?
Also it looks like an awfully big search area in the middle of nowhere.


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## ostbucks98 (Apr 14, 2004)

just calm down and give some time....air france took 2 weeks to locate and that was on a known course. 

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## bajuski (Apr 9, 2004)

RJohnson442 said:


> I think the engine's stopped for one reason or another. And it dropped like a rock outta the sky. If the plane was intact when it hit the water from 30000 feet it wouldn't leave much debris on the surface. Without power these planes cant stay above stall speed and will literally fall out of the sky. The black box will have what everyone wants to know if it will ever be found. And they've already look at satellite photos of the area to see by chance if anything was recorded and nothing yet.
> 
> Sent from my Event using Ohub Campfire mobile app



Modern airliners don't drop out of the sky even if they lose all engines, from 35000 feet he could have glided at least 100 miles on clean wings. A while back a 767 ran out of fuel totally, engines both shut down and he landed at an airport in Canada safely. The engines windmill just enough to provide some hydraulic power and all modern airplanes have a RAT, a small propeller driven unit that pops up out of the belly of the fuselage as a last resort to try to save the airliner.

As for the transponder, it's not considered crucial for flight and the airplane can fly with it inoperative under some conditions. All it does is give air traffic control more detail about the blip on his screen and bloom if he hits the ident button. Maybe it cannot be turned off I don't know about this particular model but everything on an airplane is on a circuit breaker in the cockpit and all they have to do is pull it. I've seen many voice recorder breakers pulled, the pilots hate voice recorders and often disable them by pulling the breakers. They'll deny it of course, it must have just popped!


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## Lowell H Turner (Feb 22, 2011)

Believe you are correct, bajuski...and as soon as the engines lose power, that completely AUTOMATIC flight data recorder ("black box") is designed to go off and start `squawking". AND there is no way to "shut it up" from INSIDE the plane...even if you can somehow physically get to it, you still need specially made tools to OPEN it and turn it off. That titanium armored box is gonna laugh at even a fire axe...


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## All Eyes (Jul 28, 2004)

If the black boxes are transmitting why is it so hard to locate them? I'm not sure how that works


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## bajuski (Apr 9, 2004)

All Eyes said:


> If the black boxes are transmitting why is it so hard to locate them? I'm not sure how that works


The cockpit voice recorder and the flight data recorder are the only units that have the pinger installed in their cases. The pinger is small, smaller than a beer can and doesn't put out a very strong signal. You've gotta be fairly close to pick it up. They will find this aircraft. The transponder is just a radio transmitter that sends data to the ATC. It also has codes the pilot can dial in to alert atc that the airplane is being hijacked etc. It does not have a pinger, it's just a plug in unit on the radio shelf.


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## All Eyes (Jul 28, 2004)

bajuski said:


> The cockpit voice recorder and the flight data recorder are the only units that have the pinger installed in their cases. The pinger is small, smaller than a beer can and doesn't put out a very strong signal. You've gotta be fairly close to pick it up. They will find this aircraft. The transponder is just a radio transmitter that sends data to the ATC. It also has codes the pilot can dial in to alert atc that the airplane is being hijacked etc. It does not have a pinger, it's just a plug in unit on the radio shelf.


Thanks for making sense of that. I'm not up on the tech involved and it was sounding like conflicting reports from different media coverage. 
For you guys that have the aviation knowledge, wouldn't it seem like it would take more than a few people to pull off a hijacking of a Boeing 777? Especially without any communication or warning of any kind? Are there air marshal's on these flights? Aren't the cockpits locked and made more secure since 911?


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## All Eyes (Jul 28, 2004)

All I know is that if Justin Bieber is somehow involved in this, Nancy Grace is gonna have a field day.


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## Lowell H Turner (Feb 22, 2011)

All aircraft made in or flying in/ over US airspace are now required to have armored doors to the cockpits. Before 9/11 you could basically kick 1 open. NOT any more. Reportedly the cockpit bulkhead and cockpit door of modern air liners contain Kevlar material similar to a bullet proof vest so a terrorist cannot just shoot thru it and kill the pilots...and YES many air lines have highly trained Air Marshalls aboard whom would take a damn `dim view` of someone attempting a hijacking. And last but not least, the passengers themselves now KNOWING their chances of survival drop significantly if terrorists seize control might not take that literally meekly `sitting down`. Since 9/11 at least 5 attempted hijackers/ terrorists have been seriously beaten senseless and in a couple of instances were permanently crippled for life by enraged passengers who realized it was kill or be killed, and knowing there was no escape at 35.000 feet they fought back VERY viciously...and WON !


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## bajuski (Apr 9, 2004)

Lowell H Turner said:


> Believe you are correct, bajuski...and as soon as the engines lose power, that completely AUTOMATIC flight data recorder ("black box") is designed to go off and start `squawking". AND there is no way to "shut it up" from INSIDE the plane...even if you can somehow physically get to it, you still need specially made tools to OPEN it and turn it off. That titanium armored box is gonna laugh at even a fire axe...


It sounds like you may be confusing the cockpit voice recorder and data recorder with the locater beacon (pinger) that is installed on recorders. It is built to take a real beating and survive for sure, it doesn't start emitting signals until impact with water. It takes special equipment to receive this signal and if it's in deep water they may have to use a submersible vessel to locate it. It took two years to find the boxes of Air France 747 when it went down even though the exact location of the crash was known.
Here's a pic of a flight recorder with the pinger, the silver cylindrical thingy!


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## Lowell H Turner (Feb 22, 2011)

Am speaking of the 777 system. Look it up. They also are finally talking about longer battery life, 90 as opposed to the current 30 days...


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## Lewzer (Apr 5, 2004)

> A general question: What sort of cell phone service would those passengers have while flying over the south china sea?


None. have you ever tried to use your cell at 30,000-35,000' flying over the US?
They can't find a signal.

I think Little Kimmy Jong Dong Ughhh was playing with his latest military toy.


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## Toad Man (Oct 8, 2013)

Diego Garcia :airplane:


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## bajuski (Apr 9, 2004)

Lowell H Turner said:


> Am speaking of the 777 system. Look it up. They also are finally talking about longer battery life, 90 as opposed to the current 30 days...


You're probably right, I'm talking flight recorders I worked with a few years back before I retired. Hell I used to change the rolls of aluminum tape on the first generation of flight recorders when I first started working on the b720's, 707 predecessor, it only had 7 parameters with styluses scrolling data onto the aluminum tape. Now they have hundred of parameters.
Apparently they did pick up the pings for a few hours anyway, it probably sank in deep water making it difficult to find now.


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## Lowell H Turner (Feb 22, 2011)

Diego Garcia- now THAT brings back some BAD memories...spent almost 2 wks there once...


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## fakebait (Jun 18, 2006)

Lets just hope it was not a inside job with the pilots and the two Iranians. Lets think hard about it. If you were going to pull this off you would not use people on the watch list. You would use fresh faces trained outside of normal practices. It was already reported the crew has violated cockpit protocol in the past. If they needed the means to deliver a package over a long distance by remarking the plane to make it fit their scheme. It could be stored in a special bunker with shielding so they could retro fit the plane with new electronics. Then fly it any where around the globe to make a strike. It all sounds impossible but; if someone pulled off the first part they probably could pull off the rest. I would never thought 9/11 was possible and we found out how unsafe we were. All the people on the plane could be use as hostage barter at a later date. If nothing else I should own the movie rights for this.


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## Lowell H Turner (Feb 22, 2011)

Correct me if I am mistaken, but thought the flight data recorders automatically TURNED ON the beacon if they lost power or data flow and were only accessible from OUTSIDE this aircraft...obviously am wrong...there are a few WW2 airfields scattered in the Indian Ocean islands but certainly doubt you could land a modern 777 on an abandoned airfield safely simply due to the weight of the plane and relatively short runway lengths common in WW2. Am positive unless that airfield was both modernized AND lengthened, even if a pilot could land, he would never it back into the air. The refueling requirements alone would be enormous...


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## All Eyes (Jul 28, 2004)

So let me get this straight. After 911, the cockpit doors were beefed up, airport and in flight security was amped up ten fold, they're searching shoes and bras and taking your deodorant and sun tan lotion, billions of dollars were spent to pay for leading engineers to design a more secure system and fund the anti terrorism front, and you're telling me there's a stupid 10 dollar switch in the plane that you can turn off and vanish without a trace???
Forgive my ignorance but why does that sound like an episode of The Simpsons?


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## bajuski (Apr 9, 2004)

Lowell H Turner said:


> Correct me if I am mistaken, but thought the flight data recorders automatically TURNED ON the beacon if they lost power or data flow and were only accessible from OUTSIDE this aircraft...obviously am wrong...there are a few WW2 airfields scattered in the Indian Ocean islands but certainly doubt you could land a modern 777 on an abandoned airfield safely simply due to the weight of the plane and relatively short runway lengths common in WW2. Am positive unless that airfield was both modernized AND lengthened, even if a pilot could land, he would never it back into the air. The refueling requirements alone would be enormous...


The Underwater Locating Beacon, known as the pinger is a stand alone unit attached to the recorders. It doesn't even have wiring going to it from the recorders or airframe. It works all alone and starts sending out pings, radio signals so that it can be found when it gets immersed in water, it doesn't care if the recorders are running or not.
And I agree, it would be difficult to land this fly by wire airplane on a dirt strip without ILS/glide slope equipment, especially at night. The recent crash in San Francisco is an example, an experienced pilot stalled the airplane near the runway making a landing without the glide slope. And that was in daytime with good visibility and a long runway.


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## ClickerCrazy (Feb 4, 2006)

how far could this plane fly if it was full of fuel? I haven't heard the news say. If it is out there and sadly these days, it's just hard to tell. Can it reach the Continental US?


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## shroomhunter (Aug 6, 2004)

I think its on the ground and negotiations underway, either someone wanted cash or asylum in the West. Way to much sophisticated equipment shutdown and disabled for some wacko to just crash it heck they could've done that right away. Only 3 Americans on board, hardly enough for a terrorist to be concerned with and I can't imagine a terrorist wanting China to hammer down on them.
Just my thoughts from the beginning...hope them folks are all ok regardless.


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## Slatebar (Apr 9, 2011)

Lol,,,,,Looks like it has been found.. joking

http://vietnam.craigslist.org/for/4372477162.html


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## Snakecharmer (Apr 9, 2008)

ClickerCrazy said:


> how far could this plane fly if it was full of fuel? I haven't heard the news say. If it is out there and sadly these days, it's just hard to tell. Can it reach the Continental US?


Latest news said it could fly for about 8 hours on full tank and they know the engines ran for at least 7. I'm thinking they landed in the desert some where.


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## City fisher (Jul 12, 2012)

A couple things here. 1- Not all muslims are bad. My ammo carrier for the 240 Bravo while I was in the ARMY was a Muslim. His last name is Anwarzi, we just called him alphabit. But lumping them all together because of 9/11 is just wrong, discriminatory, profiling and racist. I actually cant believe the mods have let the Muslim bashing go as long as it has. I am not saying there are not bad Muslims, I am sure there still are, but I dont lump them all into one catagory because of 9/11. Thats just ignorant. 

2- If the plane flew for 6 to 8 hours after they lost contact with it, why are they searching in an area that is well inside those time frames? Seems kind of ignorant to search an area that is only two hours of flight time away when they say they have proof that it flew for 6 to 8 hours. 

I also heard on the news last night that even if the flight recorders are recovered they will be useless in telling us what happened at the beginning because they are on a 2 hour loop. Meaning that after 2 hours of recording time, it starts to over write its self. Any one else hear that last night?


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## bajuski (Apr 9, 2004)

Flight recorders will have data for the last 25 hours. The voice recorders do loop, that 2 hours sounds about right. And they do have an erase button and can easily be disabled.


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## Snakecharmer (Apr 9, 2008)

City fisher said:


> A couple things here. 1- Not all muslims are bad. My ammo carrier for the 240 Bravo while I was in the ARMY was a Muslim. His last name is Anwarzi, we just called him alphabit. But lumping them all together because of 9/11 is just wrong, discriminatory, profiling and racist. I actually cant believe the mods have let the Muslim bashing go as long as it has. I am not saying there are not bad Muslims, I am sure there still are, but I dont lump them all into one catagory because of 9/11. Thats just ignorant.
> 
> 2- If the plane flew for 6 to 8 hours after they lost contact with it, why are they searching in an area that is well inside those time frames? Seems kind of ignorant to search an area that is only two hours of flight time away when they say they have proof that it flew for 6 to 8 hours.
> 
> I also heard on the news last night that even if the flight recorders are recovered they will be useless in telling us what happened at the beginning because they are on a 2 hour loop. Meaning that after 2 hours of recording time, it starts to over write its self. Any one else hear that last night?


I don't see any bashing. Some posts may have been erased that I miseed though. The news has reported that 1) The two pilots are Muslim 2) the men using the stolen passports were Iranian and 3)the commuication devices were purposely turn off. While not proven, the information provided would lead one to believe that one or both or the pilots probably decided to pirate the jet and take it who knows where and who knows for what reason. Lack of a group claiming responsibility lends credence that who ever did it was probably a rogue individual and not part of a well known terrorist group.Doesn't mean he was isn't a terrorist as I'm sure the families of the mainly Chinese passengers are terrorized.


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## fishergibb (Mar 10, 2014)

I'm going with the Bermuda Triangle theory


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## bajuski (Apr 9, 2004)

I still think there was a struggle of some sort in the cockpit and the airplane was taken by someone with some flying experience but not much, like 9-11. No experienced pilot would take an airplane beyond it's operating ceiling. 
All kinds of things start happening in thin air.
1. It takes a lot more control surface movement to keep the airplane on course, aileron and rudder movements have less effect.
2. Air cycle machines are robbing more and more air from the engines to keep the cabin heated and pressurized. Engines may stall.
3. Pressure relief valves are opening because the differential between the cabin and outside pressure is too great, can cause damage to fuselage.

Airplane goes into stall and nosedives, there's bells, whistles, lights flashing, and stick shaker rattling causing even more chaos. The airplane is finally recovered at 20000 ft. Shaken,the inexperienced pilot now has no idea where he is and wanders over the Indian ocean until he runs out of fuel.

That's my guess anyway! What do you think?


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## Talonman (Sep 12, 2013)

I think the Annunaki/Nephilim got them for their DNA.

Probably beamed the entire plane right into one of their ships.








If the fallen have ships as big as two Aircraft Carriers, that plane could fit in one of their hangers.


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## SConner (Mar 3, 2007)

A friendly reminder that discussion that might be considered disparaging of any race or religion is prohibited on OGF.


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## ironman172 (Apr 12, 2009)

Terrorists with future things to come


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## Stampede (Apr 11, 2004)

We all know that the aliens live underground with bigfoot.That's where the sinkholes come from.The aliens use flight paths in and out of the oceans and this plane got to close,now all the passengers are being used as labors to prop up the earth and stop the sinkholes before we discover them and start an human/bigfoot/alien war.


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## Talonman (Sep 12, 2013)

SConner said:


> A friendly reminder that discussion that might be considered disparaging of any race or religion is prohibited on OGF.


Understood...


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## Hook N Book (Apr 7, 2004)

ClickerCrazy said:


> how far could this plane fly if it was full of fuel? I haven't heard the news say. If it is out there and sadly these days, it's just hard to tell. Can it reach the Continental US?


Depending on the model (777-200?), engine type and overall configuation it will have a flight range of 5,235 to 9,380 nautical miles (9,695 to 17,372 km).


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## yonderfishin (Apr 9, 2006)

A new report on the missing plane suggests that this man may know its whereabouts and the location of its passengers , but so far he isnt saying anything.


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## Socom (Nov 3, 2005)

The Langoliers2

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## TimSr (Mar 15, 2014)

It was hijacked by Jimmy Hoffa, Sr and Elvis.


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## 7thcorpsFA (Mar 6, 2010)

I listened to an American Air Force General on the radio. He said the US government knows exactly what happened. The plane is sitting on the ground in either Pakistan or Iran. He said it has been kept secret because they fear it may be used to carry out a terrorist attack with a weapon of mass destruction. He suspects the passengers may have been killed. This explanation is the only one I've heard that makes any sense. If he is correct, all this searching is just a multibillion dollar smoke screen. The interview was on the Hannity radio program last week.


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## ostbucks98 (Apr 14, 2004)

And it refueled in flight and dodged radar to get there....oh and all the passengers cell phones were jammed from being tracked.

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## ostbucks98 (Apr 14, 2004)

I did notice radar units being mobilized and rolling up 23n last week.....china and russia would have a hard time hitting us with stealth bombers but this jetliner is gonna fly right on in.....i would think air defense patrols are on high alert and any unidentified jet is gonna get alot of attention.

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## Snakecharmer (Apr 9, 2008)

7thcorpsFA said:


> I listened to an American Air Force General on the radio. He said the US government knows exactly what happened. The plane is sitting on the ground in either Pakistan or Iran. He said it has been kept secret because they fear it may be used to carry out a terrorist attack with a weapon of mass destruction. He suspects the passengers may have been killed. This explanation is the only one I've heard that makes any sense. If he is correct, all this searching is just a multibillion dollar smoke screen. The interview was on the Hannity radio program last week.


If it proves to be false, I hope he gets courtmartialed. And if it is true them someone should be courtmartialed for spending the $2.5 million to look for the jet in thee ocean.


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## buckeyebowman (Feb 24, 2012)

Snakecharmer said:


> If it proves to be false, I hope he gets courtmartialed. And if it is true them someone should be courtmartialed for spending the $2.5 million to look for the jet in thee ocean.


I couldn't agree more! Nothing like blowing millions in taxpayer money to put up a facade! Or, lieing your butt off in order to spread disinformation! 

And for ostbucks, this jetliner is *not* going to fly right in! There are no such things as "unscheduled" airline flights. They are all numbered, and are supposed to follow specific flight paths, provided weather doesn't intervene. The U.S. and other countries are right to be a little paranoid when a jetliner the size of a 777 just "disappears". You are right in saying that a jetliner that shows up out of nowhere, especially if its transponders are off and it's not communicating with air traffic control, will attract a lot of attention. 

You also state that it refueled in flight. A couple of questions here. I'm not aware of a civilian aircraft that is capable of in flight refueling. Is the 777 unique in that regard? Also, if that is case, who refueled them?


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## ostbucks98 (Apr 14, 2004)

Wow...go ask for help turning your sarcasm meter on...come on man winter is putting a hurting on you.:beer:

Sent from my ZTE-Z990G using Ohub Campfire mobile app


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## Hook N Book (Apr 7, 2004)

There were 230+ humans onboard this flight. It's not a joke or a conspiracy. Some of these post are disturbing. 

Bad subject line too...!


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## Toad Man (Oct 8, 2013)

Hey hook, prove it.


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## 7thcorpsFA (Mar 6, 2010)

ostbucks98 said:


> And it refueled in flight and dodged radar to get there....oh and all the passengers cell phones were jammed from being tracked.
> 
> Sent from my ZTE-Z990G using Ohub Campfire mobile app


 The General suggested that the passengers were all killed by sudden loss of pressure in the passenger compartment. He said the pilot could do this from the cockpit. Death would be sudden and no one would have time to use a cellphone. I'm not an expert by any means. Just reporting what he said.


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## 7thcorpsFA (Mar 6, 2010)

buckeyebowman said:


> I couldn't agree more! Nothing like blowing millions in taxpayer money to put up a facade! Or, lieing your butt off in order to spread disinformation!
> 
> And for ostbucks, this jetliner is *not* going to fly right in! There are no such things as "unscheduled" airline flights. They are all numbered, and are supposed to follow specific flight paths, provided weather doesn't intervene. The U.S. and other countries are right to be a little paranoid when a jetliner the size of a 777 just "disappears". You are right in saying that a jetliner that shows up out of nowhere, especially if its transponders are off and it's not communicating with air traffic control, will attract a lot of attention.
> 
> You also state that it refueled in flight. A couple of questions here. I'm not aware of a civilian aircraft that is capable of in flight refueling. Is the 777 unique in that regard? Also, if that is case, who refueled them?


 According to the General they had enough fuel to get it done. Again, just what he said. Right or wrong? I don't know.


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## Lowell H Turner (Feb 22, 2011)

Was assigned to Aviation Flight Training as a Aviation Survival Equipment Specialist (Parachute Rigger) for 30 days TAD. From what remember, loss of pressurization in the aircraft above 35,000 ft will cause almost instant unconsciousness and the blood and fluids in your body to rapidly expand, basically, for lack of a better medically correct term it "boils" inside your body, causing almost instant death. KEEP IN MIND, at 1 time the aircraft was thought to have climbed to 45,000+ ft of altitude. AS FAR as am aware, the cockpit of the 777 does NOT have a SEPERATE pressurization system; if you lose cabin pressure, you ALSO lose cockpit pressure. And while almost any aircraft can be modified to receive in flight refueling (Boeing 707 turned into a KC-135 "Stratotanker", or Lockheed L1011 turned into a KC-10, no civilian 777 or any other civilian aircraft that have ever heard of has this INSTALLED. Lastly, you are correct; ANY large commercial aircraft with no scheduled arrival data and NOT using it`s transponder WOULD be picked up VERY quickly and intercepted by fully armed fighters. Upon visually identifying it and getting it`s call numbers and reporting them, they would attempt to communicate by radio. If unanswered, they would likely pull dead in front of it to make absolutely CERTAIN anyone in the cockpit SAW them, drop back and carefully fire their 20MM rotary cannons DIRECTLY across the flight path of the intruding aircraft without hitting it to make it PERFECTLY CLEAR they MEAN BUSINESS: this is your LAST WARNING...if the landing gear does not drop, or they attempt to evade, GOOD BYE. They would simply start launching AMRAAM 120 and AIM-9 "Sidewinders" until the flaming wreckage hit the surface of the sea...and TRUST me, a pair of modern fighters carry enough missiles and cannon rounds to knock down ANYTHING that flies. It AIN`T gonna be hitting anything except the surface of the ocean. And you can just forget about a sea skimming ultra low level approach; most modern air liners would very rapidly burn up most of their fuel attempting this: they are designed for ECONOMICAL flight at much higher altitudes where the air is much thinner. At just over sea level the jet`s range is 1/4th or less of what it is as 30,000 ft...


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## saugmon (Jun 14, 2006)

I read one of those conspiracy theory reports on this flight and associating it with AWACS plane jamming the radar of planes and even taking control of other planes. Supposedly there were 20 chinese computer engineers on board that plane. They listed the countries like USA,Russia,China,Israel as having AWACS planes.They said in a certain spot,the jamming could take out the military and civilian radar if it lined up properly. The military had that plane on radar for an hr longer than the civilian radar. The really bizarre part of this conspiracy theory was that when I went to re-read it again the next day using the original link,it disappeared to a completely different story with no mention of awacs.


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## 7thcorpsFA (Mar 6, 2010)

Lowell H Turner said:


> Was assigned to Aviation Flight Training as a Aviation Survival Equipment Specialist (Parachute Rigger) for 30 days TAD. From what remember, loss of pressurization in the aircraft above 35,000 ft will cause almost instant unconsciousness and the blood and fluids in your body to rapidly expand, basically, for lack of a better medically correct term it "boils" inside your body, causing almost instant death. KEEP IN MIND, at 1 time the aircraft was thought to have climbed to 45,000+ ft of altitude. AS FAR as am aware, the cockpit of the 777 does NOT have a SEPERATE pressurization system; if you lose cabin pressure, you ALSO lose cockpit pressure. And while almost any aircraft can be modified to receive in flight refueling (Boeing 707 turned into a KC-135 "Stratotanker", or Lockheed L1011 turned into a KC-10, no civilian 777 or any other civilian aircraft that have ever heard of has this INSTALLED. Lastly, you are correct; ANY large commercial aircraft with no scheduled arrival data and NOT using it`s transponder WOULD be picked up VERY quickly and intercepted by fully armed fighters. Upon visually identifying it and getting it`s call numbers and reporting them, they would attempt to communicate by radio. If unanswered, they would likely pull dead in front of it to make absolutely CERTAIN anyone in the cockpit SAW them, drop back and carefully fire their 20MM rotary cannons DIRECTLY across the flight path of the intruding aircraft without hitting it to make it PERFECTLY CLEAR they MEAN BUSINESS: this is your LAST WARNING...if the landing gear does not drop, or they attempt to evade, GOOD BYE. They would simply start launching AMRAAM 120 and AIM-9 "Sidewinders" until the flaming wreckage hit the surface of the sea...and TRUST me, a pair of modern fighters carry enough missiles and cannon rounds to knock down ANYTHING that flies. It AIN`T gonna be hitting anything except the surface of the ocean. And you can just forget about a sea skimming ultra low level approach; most modern air liners would very rapidly burn up most of their fuel attempting this: they are designed for ECONOMICAL flight at much higher altitudes where the air is much thinner. At just over sea level the jet`s range is 1/4th or less of what it is as 30,000 ft...


 Lowell, if you have time, go to Sean Hannity Official Site. Click SHOWS, then click on Mal. Airline Mystery. then go to Download MP3"s. Click on General McInerney and listen to what he says. Let us know what you think. This is a very interesting interview that many of you might want to check out. The interview starts about half way through the segment.


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## Lowell H Turner (Feb 22, 2011)

You have to realize the Straits of Maulacha (?) between Sumatra and Thailand are a MAJOR shipping lane with the major port of Singapore guarding it. It is a natural "choke point" for maritime and naval traffic; more than 50% of the Persian Gulf oil comes thru this strait headed to China or Japan. Therefore many countries keep a very close eye on what goes on in this area...btw after 9/11 there was a plot by Al Quida or a splinter group to attempt to hijack a Liquid Natural Gas carrier and sail it into Singapore and blow it up in the dock area. The resulting blasts would have been equivalent to a small tactical nuclear weapon going off. Luckily the hijacking crew was tracked and as soon after they boarded their 2 fast small craft, were completely wiped out by helicopter gunships and jet attack aircraft before they could get to their target...


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## Hook N Book (Apr 7, 2004)

Toad Man said:


> Hey hook, prove it.


I'm not sure what I need to prove. The fact is, a commercial aircraft disappeared with human beings aboard. Until all the facts are uncovered, anything else is pure speculation.
Sorry, I choose to deal in reality.


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## viper1 (Apr 13, 2004)

Can't really believe what some adults think is feasible. I try to keep an open mind. But until somethings proven to exists or happen its child dreams. LOL! I don't see the confusion on this and its easy explained. 
The plane had an emergency, Probably a bad one, like gas, smoke or fire feeling the plain. Now this isn't a guess really. Typical response for this trouble is to bank hard and drop to 10000 feet or so. Trying to get to the point loosing pressure wont hurt. The box or signal every one is concerned with on this plane is located on the tail section, as were the lithium battery they were hauling but not suppose to be. We lost another plane the same way.
Reason radar lost it is with the transponder lost it had no identification on radar. So among all the planes on radar that aren't required a transponder it got hidden. Many areas have no radar as radar works in a circle and many don't reach the next and dont over lap. So once they learned it was identifying they had to contact each country to get access to radar for that period. So now they got the direction. Then from three different satellite pics they located probable wreckage. Now the real problem its 1500 miles from the nearest shore. Takes 4 hours to fly out and 4 hours to fly back. Planes have 8 hours of gas. Which means each plane can search 2 hours before heading home. Figuring their in the most desolate ocean in the world and the area they must search I think the problem is obvious to any one who don't believe a dead body can relive as a zombie! LOL! I believe the plane will never be found as they do not know point of entry, Also considering that water is over 3 miles deep. But they will answer a lot of questions with just the parts of wreckage they can recover. that i believe they will do if they find those pieces quick enough. But you martian and walking dead fans don't let me spoil your fantasy.


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## buckeyebowman (Feb 24, 2012)

Lowell H Turner said:


> Was assigned to Aviation Flight Training as a Aviation Survival Equipment Specialist (Parachute Rigger) for 30 days TAD. From what remember, loss of pressurization in the aircraft above 35,000 ft will cause almost instant unconsciousness and the blood and fluids in your body to rapidly expand, basically, for lack of a better medically correct term it "boils" inside your body, causing almost instant death. KEEP IN MIND, at 1 time the aircraft was thought to have climbed to 45,000+ ft of altitude. AS FAR as am aware, the cockpit of the 777 does NOT have a SEPERATE pressurization system; if you lose cabin pressure, you ALSO lose cockpit pressure. And while almost any aircraft can be modified to receive in flight refueling (Boeing 707 turned into a KC-135 "Stratotanker", or Lockheed L1011 turned into a KC-10, no civilian 777 or any other civilian aircraft that have ever heard of has this INSTALLED. Lastly, you are correct; ANY large commercial aircraft with no scheduled arrival data and NOT using it`s transponder WOULD be picked up VERY quickly and intercepted by fully armed fighters.


Thank you LHT!

I did not realize you were being sarcastic ostbucks. Without tone of voice or facial expression to cue off of that can sometimes be hard to pick up in the printed word. Once you posted same I went back and re-read your post and noted its position to the prior post, and the light bulb came on. Sorry, no offense meant. And yes, it's been a tough Winter! 

I think it's important for everyone to remember that there are 239+ families and many more friends grieving today. If any of you had a loved one or friend on board that flight I don't think you'd be amused by hokey comments about Martians, UFO's, or what have you. Just saying.


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## Lowell H Turner (Feb 22, 2011)

The location of the crash is REMOTE. There are only 1 or 2 pieces of land; both are wind swept rocky crags with no people; think 1 has a remote radio weather station that is serviced every 2 yrs by helicopters. No air fields, 1 is a rock that sticks almost straight up out of the sea. The area is known as the "Roaring 40s" and is almost as far South as Cape Horn and the Straights of Magellian at the tip of South America. There used to be an annual sailing race around the world along the 40th line of latitude; in 2008 (?) of the 23 sailing vessels involved 12 SANK with only 2 survivors from 41 crew members in a SINGLE storm. 6 more were de-masted and were barely able to be towed into New Zealand or Tasmania. Several USAF and Australian C-130 "Hercules" rescue aircraft were sent from research bases in ANTARCTICA which was CLOSER to them. 45 degree water temperatures are the norm (the cold water in your house if 56 dergees), 40` waves and 65+ mph winds for wks on end are common in the spring, fall and winter (remember, below the Equator, the seasons are reversed.) The chances of extremely fit persons to survive in a life raft are slim to none after about 1 wk...you would simply die from exposure even in calm weather there.


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## Toad Man (Oct 8, 2013)

Hook N Book said:


> I'm not sure what I need to prove. The fact is, a commercial aircraft disappeared with human beings aboard. Until all the facts are uncovered, anything else is pure speculation.
> Sorry, I choose to deal in reality.


Sorry you choose to be spoon fed your news. So where's the plane? Lol. I come from a long line of government agents that are family. Plenty of alphabet groups. You have lived your life in a lie. Enjoy the spoon.


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## Toad Man (Oct 8, 2013)

Here is an example, yesterday MsM heading was URGENT search for black box.
Kinda odd the use of the word "urgent" since not once over the last few weeks has the word been used in this manner. Don't you think the heading should of read, Urgent Search for passengers of flight ??? since the beginning. CNN lied everyday with new breaking news. The reason, ratings, they went with any made up story they can think of, and then spoon it down your controlled throats. If no one has learned from the past, I feel sorry, actually, I honestly feel mad, that so many can be so blind. Your rights and freedoms, (whatever is left) are going down faster than an actual real plane.

Hey Hook, Does your reality tell you how 3 buildings went down on 9-11 from two planes at free fall speed (8.4 seconds) right into their own foot print? 

Let me guess, jet fuel?? 

The show is going to get exciting. Go turn on the idiot box, CNN has more breaking news on the Ping.

Sum Ping Wong.


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## Net (Apr 10, 2004)

Toad Man said:


> Your rights and freedoms, (whatever is left) are going down faster than an actual real plane.


Interesting how you singled out Hook's post for your manifesto when he didn't involve speculation or conspiracy theories. 

So, those of us willing to wait for the truth to unfold while moving on with our lives are being stripped of our freedoms


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## Hook N Book (Apr 7, 2004)

Toadman, you've choose to make this into some kind of conspiracy/political issue. 
I've been in the aerospace business for thirty+ years and do have some insight as to what may or may not have happened. You on the hand only sight family members that have alphabets with their names, seriously!
So, let me put it into perspective for you. We're (me) not going to let you just spew your physco-babble on this site. You should seek out conspiracy theory oriented sites and post your theories. Having said that, until you have some factual information from wherever you get you news, why speculate?
Im not real sure how you know how I live my life, so, please refrain from making this one personal.


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## ducman491 (Oct 31, 2011)

Toadman - you have got to throttle back a bit. You are coming off a bit paranoid. I don't think we are getting 100% of the story, but we are never going to. Not because they aren't going to tell us but because nobody really knows. I don't know where the plane is and neither do you. Until it's found it's all just speculation. I'll speculate that it crashed into the ocean, with a fair amount of skepticism as to why no debris has been found yet and you can speculate that it was hijacked by some Lex Luther type Bond criminal if you want. 

In regards your to family with jobs in the alphabet agencies, if they had high enough clearance to know what really happened they sure as hell wouldn't tell you so you could jump on the interweb and impress conspiracy theorists. I wouldn't be surprised if the only alphabet agencies in your family were ODOT, BMV and maybe a McD's or two.


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## Harbor Hunter (Aug 19, 2007)

I've never been one to believe in conspiracies most if not all are just illusions dreamed up in the minds of some very paranoid people.For example even suggesting that 911 was anything more than what it really was-a terrorist attack.I've said from the very start of this story about the missing aircraft on this site and others that it was just a terrible accident,not terrorists or pilot suicide or any other wacko theory.I believed,and still do that somehow a fire broke out and the pilot changed altitude to try to put it out which resulted in the suffocation of all on board(like the pro golfers plane),I then believe the plane flew on by itself until it ran out of fuel.Maybe that's a boring story for some people because it doesn't include some foreign government,some terrorist cult somewhere,or even our own government,but I believe it will go down simply as a horrific accident that took the lives of many people.


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## Lowell H Turner (Feb 22, 2011)

Flying in passenger jets at 600+ mph at 30,000+` is very common. Statistically 99.99+% of all flights are routine. By the same token, IF something goes DRASTICALLY wrong, due to physics, and speed the results CAN be instantly FATAL...


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## trapperjon (Mar 11, 2008)

It was Martians .... why won't anybody believe me. Why?????


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## FOSR (Apr 16, 2008)

Background: De Haviland Comet airliners flown by BOAC in the 1950s suffering explosive decompression

...

Look up BOAC_Flight_781 (the board software won't let me paste a wiki link)


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## Lowell H Turner (Feb 22, 2011)

Correct. PERFECT example. 3 planes lost, 2 over water. Took 2 yrs to figure out EXACTLY what was happening. Basically, the Comet`s windows were square, and the plane at certain atmospheric pressure, temperature and speed created a harmonic frequency vibration that once started caused multiple simultaneous cracks at the lower rear corner of those windows and quickly tore the fuselage apart within seconds...the `fix` was reinforcing the fuselage, raising the normal cruising speed and using ROUND windows with an outer pane and a small blow out hole drilled into it...


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## hardwaterfan (Apr 6, 2004)

i think whoever was at the controls stalled and tumbled, either by passing out or just lack of flying experience. i dont think its possible the plane exploded because nowadays planes have safety release valves to prevent that. he/she never recovered from the stall and the plane slammed into the water, in the middle of nowhere. theyll find it someday. 

thats my guess.


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## Lowell H Turner (Feb 22, 2011)

My best guess is sudden depressurization; without proper survival gear (basically a pressurized space suit), anoxia- lack of pressure and oxygen- causes the body fluid to `boil` for lack of a better term; this occurs almost instantly; even rapidly donning the oxygen mask is completely futile. Couple that with a dying pilot disengaging the auto pilot to attempt to descend before he dies and the plane flies on with no one left alive aboard, eventually running out of fuel in the Southern Indian Ocean and plowing into the sea...the comparision with the PGA Lear Jet crash is notable...a sudden loss of cabin pressure was also responsible for that incident. The plane flew almost 600 miles before finally running out of fuel and crashing carrying the dead crew and passengers...


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## yonderfishin (Apr 9, 2006)

Still hard to believe there was no foul play at all. With such a long list of suspicious circumstances and ending up with the plane underwater in such a remote location that happens to be just about the best place in the world to put something if you dont want it found , there is more than enough evidence to suggest it possible the flight was doomed before it even left the ground. Could all be coincidence but thats record book coincidences. Its enough to make anybody curious about what could have been aboard that plane and if maybe it was serious enough to cause it to ultimately end up where it did. Coincidence ? Conspiracy ? Sacrificial act to spare others ? We may never know for sure.


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## hardwaterfan (Apr 6, 2004)

if it was hypoxia i hope everyone was "asleep" and my prayers are with them. but that still doesnt explain turning the transponders off.


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## Lowell H Turner (Feb 22, 2011)

Agreed. But if you wanted no witnesses, and no potential problems from desperate passengers...think the hijackers then screwed up (possibly not realizing the cockpit IS NOT separately pressurized from the rest of the plane)...


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## yonderfishin (Apr 9, 2006)

Lowell H Turner said:


> Agreed. But if you wanted no witnesses, and no potential problems from desperate passengers...think the hijackers then screwed up (possibly not realizing the cockpit IS NOT separately pressurized from the rest of the plane)...




If it was hijackers. What if there was somebody or something aboard the plane , possibly escorted by or in the care of people aboard , that others had decided should never reach its destination ? That would explain a lot , including the reluctance of sharing or painfully slow disclosure of important information regarding the flight.


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## ostbucks98 (Apr 14, 2004)

A very trust worthy source in the family told me that area of the indian ocean is Santa's test area for his newest sled/reindeer technology. The source is saying that the plane collided with a prototype sled on an unauthorized test flight. Santa was not harmed but a test elf is missing.

Sent from my ZTE-Z990G using Ohub Campfire mobile app


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## Lowell H Turner (Feb 22, 2011)

As far as testing "sleighs" away from `prying eyes` it IS in 1 of the most remote spots on Earth. The BAD thing is you better have the technology well developed, because if you have problems there is NO other field to divert to. It`s normally 1 of the most remote spots on Earth, but not right now...


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## yonderfishin (Apr 9, 2006)

Two words..........broken arrow


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