# Got accused of baiting



## 3 dog Ed

We went out on opening day with high hopes for geese. Our buddy had scouted and gained permission on a harvested tomato field that was holding 100 birds. We set up and hunted a few hours with no luck. The birds had gone to another field. At 10a the county game warden comes to us and says we are breaking federal laws for baiting by hunting this field. No time for argument or debate so we agreed to leave. He did not write us a citation but warned us that the Feds patrol the area and we should not try again. We were stunned by the whole thing. Anybody got any stories or insight on this?


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## Tyler8866

Fight if ur right.... f them I wouldn't of left and would had him tell me when I was doing wrong.. we hunt over corn fields so is that baiting to? U didn't put the food there just tonattract birds.. prob a new cop


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## jray

I guess he is suggesting that you were breaking the 10 day rule. That whole law is pretty fuzzy imo but that's my guess. My question would be who has seen US game and fish in Ohio? I never have maybe someone on here has?


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## Flathead76

A tomato field is considered a baited field? Now I have heard it all. That's rediculous.


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## 3 dog Ed

No, not a 10 day rule. He was highly suggesting that all of the tomato and sweet corn fields would be off limits for the entire season. And that the 'influence' would make the hay fields and field corn off limits as well. For miles he said.
He told us that this area is patrolled by the 'Feds' and that they would not be as forgiving with us as he was. Sounded like BS to us. This is near Racine OH.
The tomato field had been harvested, the plants and plastic removed, and the rows were plowed under. He said that since they plowed the rows and broke open the leftover tomatoes that the seeds were exposed and that put it in the baited category.
We were not going to argue this one in the field as a $500 fine is not what we wanted. After doing some research it seems that the vague rules on 'baiting' make it nearly impossible to fight this in court.
Anybody been cited for baiting?


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## Shad Rap

It would seem to me that baiting would mean to purposefully put bait out for attracting game...I wasn't aware that a setting that wasn't intended as bait couldn't be used as such...like corn fields, tomatoe fields, bean fields, etc...couldnt you say the same about hunting near a corn field?..doesnt sound like it would ever hold up in court if you ask me...sounds ridiculous...just my 2 cents...
And patrolled by the feds???..thats ridiculous too.


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## Mitch b

I hunt tomato fields in my area every year with no issues. They are eating the seeds in the tomatoes after they have been ran over by the equipment or they have fallen through the harvester...normal agricultural harvesting or normal agricultural post-harvest manipulation...at least that's in my area.


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## TClark

3 dog ed, I think that guy wanted that field for himself or friends.
Feds Patrol? Maybe.
**Fish and *Game Warden* Job Description. *Federal* wildlife law enforcement officers are referred to as special agents, although they are informally often referred to as fish and *game wardens*. ... They also often work undercover to infiltrate illegal wildlife trafficking rings.** 

**Neither *waterfowl* nor doves may be hunted on areas where grain or other feed has been distributed once it has been removed from or stored on the field where grown. Contact an *Ohio* Division of Wildlife district office or a state wildlife officer for clarification on *baiting regulations* before you hunt.**


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## Muddy

It sounds like he wanted to keep that field for himself. I was accused of baiting a few years ago. The game warden searched a cut silage field back and forth and sideways looking for a bait pile. For some reason he couldn't believe that we killed a 3 man limit of doves from that field with out the aid of bait. Who would bait a 100 acres of silage that had every dove for several miles going to it on their own? We all sat there and watched him go back and forth, back and forth.


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## Shad Rap

Tyler8866 said:


> Fight if ur right.... f them I wouldn't of left and would had him tell me when I was doing wrong.. we hunt over corn fields so is that baiting to? U didn't put the food there just tonattract birds.. prob a new cop


I agree...nothing wrong was being done here and I would've stayed right there...no laws were being broken...sounds like another tough guy cop trying to throw his weight around...but he is wrong...would of definitely got the officers name and reported him...its sad because you rarely even see an officer and then you hear of something like this happening...BS.


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## RMK

[QUOTE="3 dog Ed, post: 2360798, member: 51457"*]No, not a 10 day rule. He was highly suggesting that all of the tomato and sweet corn fields would be off limits for the entire season. And that the 'influence' would make the hay fields and field corn off limits as well. For miles he said.*
He told us that this area is patrolled by the 'Feds' and that they would not be as forgiving with us as he was. Sounded like BS to us. This is near Racine OH.
The tomato field had been harvested, the plants and plastic removed, and the rows were plowed under. He said that since they plowed the rows and broke open the leftover tomatoes that the seeds were exposed and that put it in the baited category.
We were not going to argue this one in the field as a $500 fine is not what we wanted. After doing some research it seems that the vague rules on 'baiting' make it nearly impossible to fight this in court.
Anybody been cited for baiting?[/QUOTE]

that is simply not true. i m guessing he wanted the fields to himself to hunt. i d be curious to see if he really was even a wildlife officer. 

i had a buddy get sited for baiting in a crappy situation. hunting a picked corn field... the morning flight slowed down and out of being bored, he picked up a near by ear of corn and starting pulling kernels off and flicking them at a nearby decoy... bam!-baiting.


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## 3 dog Ed

Hey Mitch b where are u located? We are going to contact the OSU Extension service as they supposedly have the authority on 'normal agricultural practice'. I would love to talk to you if you don't mind. My ph 937-564-0670. 

Thanks for all the input, we are going to keep you posted on this. Like my brother said, it is a shame to open an early goose season with a five bird limit and not let guys kill the birds on a fair chase hunt. These are resident birds and all would agree of the nproblem they are becoming in public areas.
This guy is a wildlife officer in Meigs county. My dad was told by the Athens county GW that a different field we hunt was considered baited because of a deer hunters corn pile in the far corner of a five acre plot. There hasn't even been a goose within 100yds of that pile.
Thanks guys!!


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## Mitch b

From the U.S Fish and Wildlife Service website...pictures are a little blurry and I couldn't copy it all so here is a link also...https://www.fws.gov/le/waterfowl-hunting-and-baiting.html


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## buckeyebowman

As Ted Nugent once said, "God baits!" I guess farmers do too, though unintentionally! 

I supposed a high priced legal team could punch a lot of holes in this "Warden's" story, but who could afford it? 

And "Feds" crawling all over the place? How many of them are there? The usual story is there's not enough wildlife law enforcement to go around. Hell! Ohio can't even fill the GP positions in every county! 

Something is fishy here, for sure!


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## Gotworms

In portage a guy got a ticket hunting a sweet corn field that the farmer threw left over corn in. The farmer not the hunter. This was last year or the year before. He was hunting opposite end of field not sitting over a pile of corn. I have no clue who is right or wrong just putting it out there


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## ducknut141

The law is a federal law. If other states officers choose not to enforce it shame on them. As soon as they manipulate the field ie. mow,disc or plow ect. that exposes food for waterfowl it's bait in the entire country not just Ohio. A field is considered baited until the last seed, kernel,salt ect. is gone then 10 days after. I have seen and spoke at length USFW officers in Ohio about the gray areas and hard to understand baiting rules. If you are cited by an Ohio officer you will get one from a fed also. Putting the corn back in the field is black letter baiting, a hunter does not have to know the field is baited to be cited. You can also be cited for running traffic on birds that are going to and from baited fields.


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## loweman165

Not sure why its ok to hunt deer over bait but not birds? Anyways, think I would have at least got his name and headquarters and put a call in to a supervisor for clarification.


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## ducknut141

it's waterfowl, baiting laws are different for doves


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## jray

ducknut141 said:


> , a hunter does not have to know the field is baited to be cited.


Yep calling bs on this one. You cannot be cited for something you have no knowledge of. Will some gw's try? Yep. Do you have enough money to fight it? Maybe not. Is it illegal to hunt a field you have no idea is baited? Hell no


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## ducknut141

post #15 is an example the gentleman didn't know it was baited but it was and he was given a ticket. yes it is illegal to hunt a field you don't know is baited. All you would have to do is say I didn't know to get away with it.


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## Mitch b

Ducknut...are you just talking about sweetcorn fields or are you talking any agriculture field?


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## ducknut141

for what?


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## Carpn

Without a doubt waterfowl baiting laws are some of the dumbest there are . To many of us baiting means actively dumping bait in a area , but when it comes to waterfowl it isn't that simple . You could very easily be cited for baiting in a situation you had no knowledge of , and common sense would tell you is not a baited situation . But the way baiting laws are for migratory birds common sense isn't enough .

For example , you can bushhog a field and hunt doves ... perfectly acceptable. But if you shoot a goose that comes to , or by that field it's baiting .


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## Mitch b

ducknut141 said:


> The law is a federal law. If other states officers choose not to enforce it shame on them. As soon as they manipulate the field ie. mow,disc or plow ect. that exposes food for waterfowl it's bait in the entire country not just Ohio. A field is considered baited until the last seed, kernel,salt ect.


It's called post harvest manipulation!


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## 3 dog Ed

Hey jray *it is true* that you can be cited for something you have no knowledge of. You need to educate yourself according to the Federal baiting laws if you are a waterfowl hunter. It is a rude awaking that I am just starting to learn about and that part is laid out clearly.


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## ducknut141

any agriculture field. As soon as they scatter the crop with a farm implement it's bait. The plowing, I stand corrected is not written in the law. The big thing to make sure of is that all of the grain or corn has been harvested not just selective harvest like sweet corn where only the best is taken and the rest stays in the field then they bush hog or disc the rest to help it break down to turn in with a plow. I'm not sure how tomatoes are harvested that would leave unharvested crop in the field.


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## carp

ducknut141 said:


> The law is a federal law. If other states officers choose not to enforce it shame on them. As soon as they manipulate the field ie. mow,disc or plow ect. that exposes food for waterfowl it's bait in the entire country not just Ohio. A field is considered baited until the last seed, kernel,salt ect. is gone then 10 days after. I have seen and spoke at length USFW officers in Ohio about the gray areas and hard to understand baiting rules. If you are cited by an Ohio officer you will get one from a fed also. Putting the corn back in the field is black letter baiting, a hunter does not have to know the field is baited to be cited. You can also be cited for running traffic on birds that are going to and from baited fields.


Then why do duck hunters, hunt cut corn fields, silage fields, plowed fields, sunflower fields, etc. I'm sure not every seed is gone before, during, or after the season, thats impossible to remove ever seed. Ive hunted cut corn fields my whole life, and have been checked many times. NO GW has ever mentioned pick up every single seed in a 500 acre field, or dont hunt it because of exposed seed!


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## fishkiller

The word manipulated is commonly misunderstood. It is used to mean what is being done is to attract waterfowl.
Normal agriculture practices tillage, harvesting or planting are normal practices. If I open up the sieves on a combine & leave half of the grain on the ground or don't cover the seed while drilling wheat, that's not normal practice. Mowing or discing of sweet corn is considered baiting, but should not be. What the Feds are trying to prevent is someone
baiting & trying to hide it as a normal ag practice. How planting millet, buckwheat or corn & flooding it is not considered baiting I don't know.


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## J2jm

You can be ticketed for baiting.
The law was written so no one can claim ignorance.
That is why the man says you have to ask how and when was the field/property prepared and by who.
If you do not, it is on you.
By asking those questions you can determine if it is a baited area. It is solely the hunters responsibility to determine if the area is baited or huntable under the current regulations.


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## ducknut141

Some may be missing the biggest point. If the whole crop is harvested as it is in silage, field corn, oats or other grain then it is a field you can hunt. If the whole crop is not harvested like in sweet corn, where only the good quality corn is taken and the rest left in the field and then manipulated it can not be hunted. I don't know how sunflowers are harvested. If any of the crop is returned to the field like day old corn, moldy corn or grain from storage that is bait. The hunter may not even know the farmer has taken it back to the field but it is still bait.


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## ducknut141

I agree fishkiller they need to stop all the crop flooding. That is nothing but legal bait. I think it is easier for the waterfowl to get to the food in flooded crops than dry fields when someone dumps bait. the flooded crop is more of an attractant with the water and cover.


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## carp

Pretty good reason not to hunt any fields! Especially when someone said you get ticket for hunting plowed or disc corn fields? Not sure why you would want to hunt as plowed field but i guess it exposes grain?


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## G3guy

To the OP. I know the general area you are talking about. I hunt the big O from ravenswood WV down to below Racine. Mostly just hunt the late season. But I've been checked twice in last 5 yrs by the FEDS. Not state game wardens. And they like to go through everything...... so they do patrol the area and will sit and watch you for a long time.....


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## JamesF

This can be very confusing, I have hunted early goose season, twice, and I have been warned once. After that I decided not hunt private lands. We hunted public areas. In the past there have been some episodes of state and law enforcement officials, convicted of the same thing. And offering their friends to do the same! Warning others to not hunt due to baiting, when they are in fact breaking the law. This has happened several times, uncovering a big ring of poaching and selling, and leasing land for a profit. Remember that ignorance of the law is not an excuse for breaking the law! I have personally been involved with several water fowl operations. And believe me, that there are so many incidents of illegal activity by waterfowl hunters, and most are knowingly breaking the law! When you commit a waterfowl violation you are committing a dual violation, federal and state. As a Federal deputy, one does not participate in operations in their home state. As so stated, there are not enough enforcement officials to cover the amount of land in each state. I haven't hunted in ten years, and when I did waterfowl hunt, every single time on public hunting areas, I would witness some one breaking the law! They just can't resist the opportunity for getting either one duck or goose, or to get their limited.I have hunted waterfowl for about 25 years, and an investigator for ten of years. I have seen some people that actually made an accident with just one shot and honestly admit to the mistake, and contact the wardens. When people do that, you know it wasn't intentionally breaking the law.


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## 3 dog Ed

Hey G3guy thanks for the input. I am actually glad to hear that the GW was not bs'ing about the Feds patrolling the area. The GW gave us a comprehensive check of all licenses, gun plugs and magnetic check of a large number of our steel shot shells. He even questioned some empty hills in my buddies layout blind that were leftovers from last year. We hunted the first split and late season there last year and had no problems. Now I am worried about hunting this area anytime. Do you know why this area attracts Feds attention? Just trying to stay legal and educated. Call anytime 937-564-0670.


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## BASSINONE

I hunt cut fields all the time for geese and ducks. Never had any problems, and some fields we can see complete full ears of corn in them. As far as not knowing about bait, u can still be sighted. My example.....about 12 years ago, i was hunting property i own in southern Ohio for turkeys. A local guy was baiting the birds with corn piles, we had no idea, i live 100 miles from the farm. My buddy went to a open field where we see birds, set up, nothing. He moved to another area, but came back to the original area, just to call and listen. Warden walked up, told him he was hunting a baited area, took his gun, lost his licences for 6 months, and paid a 250.00 fine. This was total crap. None of us had any idea. Just my 2 cents. PS we went to court, judge said to bad.


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## steelhead steve

when it comes to hunting laws you are guilty until you can prove yourself innocent. a good example of that is you have a friend that is going to cut up a deer for you and he asks what the laws are . try to find the laws . they are not on your license the are not in the hunting regulations and they are still almost impossible to find on the internet because they change all the time and are different from state to state. 50% of game wardens may break a game law without even knowing that law exists . from my own knowledge if you didn't plant the field and that field has been harvested then how did you bait it?


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## OrangeMilk

I was accused of baiting once, we were in a harvested corn field and were accused of baiting due to the loose kernels that laid about here and there. We explained that those came from the harvest and we did not put them there and that the fact that they were there is the reason the birds come in and therefore the reason we were there.

The GW searched our trucks for the empty corn bags, of which there were none, mean while we placed a call to the owner of the field who explained that during harvest he looses plenty of kernels through the field and that he did it and not us.

Away wen the GW and we went back to our layouts.


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## david tennant

I had a game warden at Deer Creek accuse me of shooting at a mallard hen during teal season a few years back. I argued and argued, especially since he was in a thicket of cat tails about 30 yds thick and 10 ft tall.


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## 9Left

steelhead steve said:


> when it comes to hunting laws you are guilty until you can prove yourself innocent. a good example of that is you have a friend that is going to cut up a deer for you and he asks what the laws are . try to find the laws . they are not on your license the are not in the hunting regulations and they are still almost impossible to find on the internet because they change all the time and are different from state to state. 50% of game wardens may break a game law without even knowing that law exists . from my own knowledge if you didn't plant the field and that field has been harvested then how did you bait it?


 in order for your friend to process a deer for you… The only thing he needs is the tag with the 18 digit confirmation number ...same thing any butcher or deer processor would need


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