# Who has replaced thier deck / stringers?



## Skinny1 (Aug 2, 2013)

So the deck in the old boat isn't what it use to be. Considering winter project to replace.
Fiberglass 20' Sea Ray. Floor looks like its laminated in fiberglass too. 

Has anyone replaced there deck and stringers? Where can I find supplies and how to information??


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## KaGee (Sep 8, 2006)

Suggest you go to the restoration forum at IBOATS dot com. Lots of info. Plus I think your transom should be looked at too.


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## parmachris (Sep 25, 2013)

I replaced my aft stringers,motor mounts and rebuilt my entire transom. Id be happy to answer any specific questions you may have! 

1978 century 5000


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## parmachris (Sep 25, 2013)

skinny.....there is a guy named frisco jarrets. He has tons of videos on you-tube that are just what you are looking for. The are all extremely high quality and informative. I didn't do everything the same as he did, but his vids are what inspired me to take on the job. And trust me...its a messy job! But worth it!!! My boat handles like new. No more taking on water! Below is a link to just one of his many vids. He video documents his entire resto projects. 


http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q...&mid=2C3B9D2383B6C8840E322C3B9D2383B6C8840E32


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## Skinny1 (Aug 2, 2013)

That Frisco Jarrets is pretty inspiring, makes it look easy! 

I haven't completely convinced myself to restore this boat or start over. The only thing I plan to do is fish Erie with it. So I'm kinda in a quandary - do I find a boat more suited for Erie fishing or convert the Sea Ray?? Decisions , Decisions

I want to be prepared for full Deck-Stringer-Transom restore if necessary. 

Parmachris can I ask where you bought your supplies??


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## parmachris (Sep 25, 2013)

certainly! I bought my supplies from only two places. Home Depot,and US Composites (just google that for the website). Most of the items were acquired at home depot. The exterior grade plywood,the PL construction adhesive, and the poly resin. The only products I purchased from US Composites was the cabosil,and 1/4" chopped fibers...(two of the ingredients needed for making "peanut butter", which you will learn to do from the frisco jarrets vids). I happened to get lucky and knew someone who had the rolls of glass I needed for my project, but US Composites carries that too. As far as the resin, I used bondo. I know, everyone jokes about the name, but ill tell you what...its made by 3M, and 3M DOESNT make junk! Plus the beauty of it is, if you run short of resin, which you will, you can just run up to either home depot or lowes and get more right away,instead of waiting for ups to deliver it. However, DO NOT buy it at an auto parts store....its $10.00 more per gallon. I even called 3M to see if its any different then what you would buy at a home center and they said "no", its the exact same product, just in a different can. 
I love talking boat repair, so if theres more you would like to discuss, let me know. Or if you reach a point in your project where you have a question, I will do my best to help you out!


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## BWOutrage19 (Apr 5, 2014)

A boat restoration project is not to be taken lightly. Make sure you really love the boat and like working with your hands because it will take two to three times longer to do the work than you anticipate and cost twice as much as you budget. You will have to learn lots of new skills, buy new tools and supplies and give up free time you could spend with the family or doing something more enjoyable. It is often cheaper to buy another used boat.

I find it therapeutic to work on my stuff and it is an awesome feeling to know that you can fix anything made of fiberglass.


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## mr. lucky (Nov 22, 2010)

My advice is look up a local saw mill for air dried white oak nice for stringers they will also have the marine plywood for the deck and transom if you need it don't know the size you have but it cost me 2000. for an 18 foot


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## parmachris (Sep 25, 2013)

I spent about 800. And yes, its possible to avoid these repair costs by purchasing another boat. But heres the thing...I bought mine for $1600.00. Now, its entirely possible to spend $4000.00 or even $6000.00 on a boat, and when you really start digging down in there, it has the same rotting issues as the one you have now,or is on the verge of having them. And don't let anyone tell you any different. If you go the route of buying a different boat, pay the extra few hundred and hire a surveyor. The problem with that though...you are being charged that couple hundred buks for EACH boat you look at.


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## parmachris (Sep 25, 2013)

here are some after shots of my transom and bilge.


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## parmachris (Sep 25, 2013)

Other variables to consider are the resources I had to work with. Im a machinist by trade, and had access to many things. Including a 5 ton overhead crane for pulling the engine.


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## BWOutrage19 (Apr 5, 2014)

parmachris said:


> I spent about 800. And yes, its possible to avoid these repair costs by purchasing another boat. But heres the thing...I bought mine for $1600.00. Now, its entirely possible to spend $4000.00 or even $6000.00 on a boat, and when you really start digging down in there, it has the same rotting issues as the one you have now,or is on the verge of having them. And don't let anyone tell you any different. If you go the route of buying a different boat, pay the extra few hundred and hire a surveyor. The problem with that though...you are being charged that couple hundred buks for EACH boat you look at.


I hear what you are saying and I love restoring old stuff instead of stuffing landfills... 1968 34' sailboat, 1853 farmhouse, numerous Boston Whalers (none of the BW's had any "rot" even ones that were kept in the water full time- their construction is different) but this activity requires lots of time and patience and it is for the most part hard, dirty work with potentially dangerous materials and chemicals. Epoxy is as dangerous as agent orange. When I say to buy another used boat, I mean one that someone else has already fixed up. Why? Because when you get done with the boat it is usually not worth much more than it was when you started unless you are dealing with a classic boat in high demand and bought it cheaply. Forget about your labor, you will be paying yourself $2 per hour as a beginner. If you are really good and fast maybe much more, but then you wouldn't be asking what you need to learn. 

Boatyards are littered with decaying project boats that were someone's dream at one point, now just a yearly storage cost. 

Let's take the example of buying a boat for $1600 (IMO any boat with rotten stringers should be a free boat, if the deck is soft you can assume the stringers are probably rotten) and then spending $800 in materials. Now you have $2400 and 75 to 400 hours of your time invested. At $10 per hour, that adds roughly $1500 more to the investment or $3900. For most people, they would be better off working at doing something they are already good at and saving up their money to buy a more expensive boat. 

This is not even considering the human toll of spending all of your free time working on your boat instead of having a boat that you can actually go out fishing on this weekend. 

Once you have a boat you like that is already seaworthy, learn how to take care of it so that it won't get rotten decks- look up MaineSail's/Compass Marine articles on how to properly prepare deck penetrations. Putting a screwhole through your fiberglass and into your core material will result in a huge area of rotten core without proper technique. 

Also, don't use Bondo in a boat repair. It is hydrophilic and not meant to be used in marine applications. Evercoat Rage is an appropriate filler to use.


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## parmachris (Sep 25, 2013)

Bondo ALSO makes a polyester fiberglass resin. That's what I used....not bondo auto body filler. Im thinking you have me confused.


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## parmachris (Sep 25, 2013)

The only way that one can put a price on there own time is if they can be earning money for that time instead. Most people whose employers have them scheduled to work 40hrs a week DO NOT have the authority to dictate to their employers that they are going to work 60hrs a week. Otherwise putting a price on your own time null and void. If you enjoy it...do it.


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## MassillonBuckeye (May 3, 2010)

Skinny1 said:


> So the deck in the old boat isn't what it use to be. Considering winter project to replace.
> Fiberglass 20' Sea Ray. Floor looks like its laminated in fiberglass too.
> 
> Has anyone replaced there deck and stringers? Where can I find supplies and how to information??



You'll want to watch this. This guy did exactly what you are asking to do on a 1995 Sea Ray 220. He's got a bunch of vids on the replacement of the deck, stringers and transom. Odd are if your stringers are shot, so is your transom. Its not an easy job as he'll show you. All vids can be found in order on his site here:
http://friscoboater1995searay.blogspot.com/






I now see someone already posted about Friscoboater, but here he is again! He did it!


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## BWOutrage19 (Apr 5, 2014)

parmachris said:


> The only way that one can put a price on there own time is if they can be earning money for that time instead. Most people whose employers have them scheduled to work 40hrs a week DO NOT have the authority to dictate to their employers that they are going to work 60hrs a week. Otherwise putting a price on your own time null and void. If you enjoy it...do it.


Well, anybody smart enough to be able to go fishing can work at WalMart for $10 an hour in their spare time, it is just a hypthetical argument. 

For every rose-colored glasses example you can produce to persuade someone to repair a rotten old boat, I can produce ten horror stories of people that haven't had it work out in their favor. 

Yes it can be done. Yes it can be rewarding. Yes it can save you money. 
Most of the time an old boat with rotten stringers isn't worth repairing unless you are retired/penniless/unemployable, already have the skills, like to wallow around in fiberglass dust in a Tyvek suit wearing a respirator drenched in your own sweat like a piece of chicken being dredged through flour, love a challenge etc. 

This is a lot like trying to talk an 18 year old out of getting married to his one true love.


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## BWOutrage19 (Apr 5, 2014)

Great video on the perils of boat purchasing. This was a case of the experienced boater not doing due diligence on performing a self-inspection of the boat (because the boat's cosmetics were so pretty.) He didn't tap all over the deck to look for weak spots (dull thuds with a screwdriver are bad!) and didn't notice one area of the deck was even soft to walk on. Don't trust a surveyor either, they frequently miss easy important stuff, especially on cheap old boats which they do not consider worthy of their time. 

Quotes from the video on learning the deck and stringers were rotten: 
"my heart sank"
"didn't sleep much last night"
"felt like throwing up"
"didn't want another project"
"foam is soaked"
"don't know if I have the energy to do a stringers and deck project again"

QED


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## BWOutrage19 (Apr 5, 2014)

Regarding Bondo: you will be hard pressed to find a single expert that recommends using Bondo above or below the waterline in a marine application. 

It reminds of the old joke "yeah she looked good, like my 69 Mach 1, until you got up close and could see the cracks in the bondo." 

Bondo has as much talc in it as it does polyester resin. Talc abosorbs water. This is fine if you are using talc to thicken epoxy but it has no place in a marine polyester filler. 

For example:
http://www.thehulltruth.com/boating-forum/499419-using-bondo-repairs-above-waterline.html


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## parmachris (Sep 25, 2013)

well bw....it seems like you have made it your personal vendetta to prove me wrong. Sounds like maybe you have too much time on your hands,and might want to check into getting a part time job at walmart!

http://bondo.com/products/fiberglass/bondo-fiberglass-resin-404.html

This is NOT a filler. Its a resin for laying up fiberglass.


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## MassillonBuckeye (May 3, 2010)

Hes got a point. If you are going to do it, do it right. "Doing it right" isn't going to be cheap or quick. Frisco Boater had more along the lines of $1600+ in materials to start so whatever figures flew earlier I don't feel are very realistic. The only reason Frisco Boater did this(very reluctantly I might add), was because he bought what he thought was a TURNKEY boat. Beautiful exterior and water ready. Turns out wasn't the case. He was buried in it. I think he made the right decision based on the condition of the motor(looked spotless), hull and everything else. AND already had experience and tools to tackle this sort of job. Obviously its up to you to decide what everything is worth to you. I bought a glasser once that needed more resto than I originally thought. I opted out. Lol. BUT am in the process of restoring my 1984 Starcraft tinny one thing at a time.


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## parmachris (Sep 25, 2013)

I absolutely did it right. My transom and engine compartment are "glassed" in, not bondo'd in. 1600.00 for boat w/tandem axel trailer. $450.00 for parts to rebuild engine,$350.00 for materials for transom and eng compartment. $2400.00 for a 23 footer with tons of freeboard, a 260merc with 12 hrs on it and a COMPLETELY glassed in and rebuilt transom that far exceeds the quality of when it was brand new. I think I did pretty well with it. Oh, and everything works also.Now like I said, I had tons of resources, and I agree that to pull the floors and do the stringers is a bigger job and this guy has some decisions to make, but don't personally insult me on the work that I myself did!


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## BWOutrage19 (Apr 5, 2014)

When boats are made, they often use polyester resin to build up the laminations in the mold. There is no wax in the resin, and the layers dry a little tacky and then another layer is applied which produces a strong chemical bond. On the outermost layer, wax is added to the resin which rises to the surface as the layer dries excluding air which produces a non-tacky exterior surface. 

Repairing a boat is a different matter. Polyester resin doesn't bond to cured polyester resin as well as epoxy (500 psi vs 2000 psi) resin. Epoxy resin is a very strong glue-like water-resistant but not uv resistant product that is very strong for structural repairs that will not be gelcoated, as gelcoat doesn't bond well to epoxy. Repairs such as replacing a stringer. Vinylester resin is better than polyester resin. 

There is a huge difference between marine grade plywood and exterior plywood, especially in the glues that are used to laminate the individual layers together. It is far more expensive than exterior plywood. When marine plywood gets wet it takes a long time to delaminate and turn to mush.

The quality of resins is important. Polyester resin has a very short shelf life, and most home repair stores will have no idea (or care) how long the resin has sat on the shelf. Bondo boatyard resin has wax in it already, especially problematic for multiple layers of fiberglass when it "kicks" in 5 minutes at 80 degrees as opposed to epoxy which has a much longer working time. 

Therefore, using Bondo Marine boatyard resin to wet out your fiberglass may be adequate in some cases but if a boat is worth putting hours and hours of your time into it is worth using good materials, especially in structural areas which are subjected to flex and stress such as are found in the pounding waves of Lake Erie. 

In the previous video, the buyer stated he felt the boat wasn't safe to put in the water in its present condition, yet it looked great from the outside. Using foam with wood stringer construction is famous for resulting in extensive rotting- think Checkmate. What if the boat had hit a partially submerged log during the test? Would the boat have glided over it only damaging the outdrive or sustained damage that caused it to sink? What about when you are 12 miles offshore in 48 degree water?


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## Skinny1 (Aug 2, 2013)

Thanks guys for the many replies, you all have given me much to think about.


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