# Car thefts by juveniles across central Ohio



## Parris Island (Mar 6, 2012)

The Columbus Division of Police said juveniles are stealing purses off of women who are alone and then stealing their vehicles.
Is this only happening in Central Ohio?


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## Saugeyefisher (Jul 19, 2010)

Parris Island said:


> The Columbus Division of Police said juveniles are stealing purses off of women who are alone and then stealing their vehicles.
> Is this only happening in Central Ohio?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


No. It's happening across the country.


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## chadwimc (Jun 27, 2007)

Is this only happening in Central Ohio?


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## Lazy 8 (May 21, 2010)

There's also a rash of catalytic converters being stolen.


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## ironman172 (Apr 12, 2009)

Only going to get worse , with get out of jail free passes ,telling police to stand down as cities and property is vandalized/ looted , distroyed ...... we as a society sure are teaching well 
Bring back respect ,honor and personal responsibility ..... and punishment for crimes committed


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## johnboy111711 (Apr 7, 2004)

ironman172 said:


> Only going to get worse , with get out of jail free passes ,telling police to stand down as cities and property is vandalized/ looted , distroyed ...... we as a society sure are teaching well
> Bring back respect ,honor and personal responsibility ..... and punishment for crimes committed


Not saying that there is any excuse for a crime to be committed, but after working in the juvenile and adult system, I can honestly say that punishment really doesn't deter crime. plenty of studies to back it up as well. there are way more social and environmental factors that come into play. Even while working and my job depending on arrests and detainees, If more money was spent on education and opportunity for youths, there would most likely be less crime. However, punishment is big business, and there is mucho $$$ made from this. And in the words of the great Antonio Brown "business is BOOMIN"


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

And it's going to continue as long as the courts just turn them loose as fast as police arrest them.
The two juvenile thugs that were caught yesterday and made the news in yet another stolen car had just been arrested last week for the same thing and the courts put them back out on the street.

Read a post a member wrote the other day in I believe was the thread about the new gun bills in which poster says " if the police would just do their job we wouldn't need any more gun laws."
Wanted to laugh out loud at the post but post was really too sad to do so.
Sad because it's obvious that that poster...like many...doesn't have a clue of what's really been going on for a long time when it comes to LE arresting these thugs (both juvenile and adult) and the court system putting them right back out on the street to re-offend.
Cops are out doing what they were hired to do everyday. They are arresting criminals. Many of these criminals they repeatedly arrest, the cops have arrested them so many times they are on a first name basis with them.
So while it's very easy to point the finger at...and target what some consider the first line of public defense against crime and say the police aren't doing their job...please research that thought a bit by researching what the court systems are doing with these thugs after they are arrested.

And no...you will never publicly hear the above from LE for fear of their jobs from the higher ups.
Politics at its finest...









Central Ohio police seeing uptick in car thefts, say ring of teens associated with thefts


Video shared with ABC6/FOX28 by Grove City Police starts simply enough, an 80-year-old getting gas along Stringtown Road in early January. It then gets hard to watch. You see teens approach the car and get aggressive, eventually ripping the woman from the car before attempting to take off. Gas...




abc6onyourside.com


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## BuckeyeFishinNut (Feb 8, 2005)

This is going to eventually become one of those FAFO (F--- Around and Find Out) stories. Way too many people are getting their concealed carry, especially women, due to no longer feeling safe when they are alone. This is a good way for a kid to get shot and killed. My wife conceal carries, she is a good shot, and because she has a concealed carry purse she would not allow someone to steal it before she pulled her gun out.


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## loves2fishinohio (Apr 14, 2011)

Yeah I've got the Citizen's app installed on my phone, there's a ton of crime in my area. All day and all night, it's nuts.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

There's been a few suggestions on here as to the solution for the rising problem.
No doubt $ could play a part in getting programs started for youths but IMO, $ is a very small part of the solution.
And I think the dump truck loads of $ that's continually dumped into our continued failing school systems is a perfect example. Spend all the $ you want on the school systems but if the kid isn't there and is out jacking cars...that $ isn't doing any good.

Again, IMO, it's an old worn out theory but still remains just as true today as it ever did...the solution has to start at home. These juveniles...some as young as 10yrs old committing these crimes have what are supposed to be parents. Maybe one of the parents isn't around. But as I remember my childhood...with 7 siblings...dad wasn't around much either. He was always at work and mom was at home with us.
One thing I can guarantee you...at 10-14yrs old...she knew where we were at. And it wasn't out gang banging. Did we get into trouble at times...yep. But if we got in trouble say at school...the school made sure mom knew we got in trouble and at the end of the day...that was a long walk home cause we knew we were in big trouble as soon as we walked into the house. And that 'big trouble' did NOT consist of a time out or a 'go to your room'(and play your video game) punishment.


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## ironman172 (Apr 12, 2009)

You can have the best parents or the worst ..... it comes down to personal choices 
Many things come into play , both at home ,school, friends , you don't choose your parents or family , like they don't choose the children..... you make the decision in life and the path you take, some have it way easier then others but that doesn't always guarantee goodness 
Society needs to quit making excuses ..... evil exsist, brainwashing is happening too 
I'll get off my soap box now , 
This is a thread that could get me a vacation


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## garhtr (Jan 12, 2009)

Imo it's a parent's job to guide youth in the right direction. Certainly it doesn't work in every situation but in tooo many instances parents are not giving any or little guidance to their children. If you think youth today have the same respect for others that youth had in the past I think you're mistaken and again Imo that starts at home and falls primarily on their parents.
Good luck


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## matticito (Jul 17, 2012)

johnboy111711 said:


> Not saying that there is any excuse for a crime to be committed, but after working in the juvenile and adult system, I can honestly say that punishment really doesn't deter crime. plenty of studies to back it up as well. there are way more social and environmental factors that come into play. Even while working and my job depending on arrests and detainees, If more money was spent on education and opportunity for youths, there would most likely be less crime. However, punishment is big business, and there is mucho $$$ made from this. And in the words of the great Antonio Brown "business is BOOMIN"


Lol these kids have to go to school to have money wisely spent on schools. They dont care. There were kids 13, 14 16 stealing cars. They not even old enough for high school, driving or even buying grand theft auto to play 😂😂😂


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## BuckeyeFishin07 (Apr 10, 2017)

ironman172 said:


> You can have the best parents or the worst ..... it comes down to personal choices
> Many things come into play , both at home ,school, friends , you don't choose your parents or family , like they don't choose the children..... you make the decision in life and the path you take, some have it way easier then others but that doesn't always guarantee goodness
> Society needs to quit making excuses ..... evil exsist, brainwashing is happening too
> I'll get off my soap box now ,
> This is a thread that could get me a vacation


I agree with you to an extent, it does come down to personal choices. But if a child understands that if he messes up that dad will be waiting at home to put a foot deep in his you know what, that usually makes a kid think! I know it did me as a kid, I was more afraid of the consequences at home than with the police! haha But I agree with you, too many excuses given to people today for the crap they pull, if they know someone will just make an excuse for their actions then what is there to be afraid of. I also agree with you on the brainwashing also!!!!!


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## matticito (Jul 17, 2012)

BuckeyeFishinNut said:


> This is going to eventually become one of those FAFO (F--- Around and Find Out) stories.


I hope so! Maybe kids will stop thuggin


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## Muddy (May 7, 2017)

I think that the best thing that a parent can do for their children is give them your time. Old school family values are going away, every one is too busy to spend the time to teach the basics of life to their kids. Parenting is hard work and there is no instant gratification. We need to get back to basic family values to stop the downfall of our society. It’s not an easy fix, so most people won’t care to do it.


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## johnboy111711 (Apr 7, 2004)

matticito said:


> Lol these kids have to go to school to have money wisely spent on schools. They dont care. There were kids 13, 14 16 stealing cars. They not even old enough for high school, driving or even buying grand theft auto to play 😂😂😂


It's a systematic failure. Many of the issues such as poverty and lack of education started 20-30- maybe 100 years for some families. there is a laundry list of things to focus on to prevent crime, but honestly, from the tone of the post, people are more interested in complaining and planning on how many people they will need to drop, either physically or with a weapon. the cycle will perpetuate until the social issues are addressed. Until then, people can continue to keep their heads in the sand.


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## ironman172 (Apr 12, 2009)

It's partially a generational thing, how can a parent teach when they don't know themselves you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink ....type thing
I have personal experience with good and bad kids & grandkids , being raised by the same parents/ grandparents(us) ..... no matter what was done they chose the path they took ....

be very blessed that your children aren't a burden to society, I'm thankful for the good I have (morals and values)


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## CHOPIQ (Apr 6, 2004)

What I see happening is one of these kids will try to steal a car and get their ass whipped by someone and that person will end up going to jail. They will be told you should have just let them take the car. You had no right to kick their butt.


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## cement569 (Jan 21, 2016)

here is my take, criminals no longer fear the police because they think they wont go to jail because of the flu. and that is partly right because in my town we have a weekly news paper and i read the police log every week and 8 out of 10 arrests are let go with a warning because summit co. jail wont take them unless its a violent crime. does anyone remember an old rolling stones song sympathy for the devil? there is a verse in that song that says " every cop is a criminal and all the sinners saints" thats what todays generation is trying to push, but sure there are a few bad cops but not like the media tells it....i support the men in blue %100 they have a tough job


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## Ol' Whiskers (Aug 11, 2004)

RE: ... say that punishment really doesn't deter crime.

At the risk of sounding neanderthal, I think the punishment should actually fit the crime. I've seen people of majority age run in and out of the corrections system without consequence. These people are role models for the young ones coming up, in every way. It's really about teaching risk vs. reward to the young ones, as the old ones (already criminal role models) don't measure things in such a fashion. 

So without being unfair to the young folk who have only learned form the system and video games, it's time to modulate the risk-reward model for the old ones, and the young ones will take notice. For example, in some middleeastern countires, Wednesday is the day for municipal punishment to be meted out. EVERYONE attends, all citizens, guests, visitors. The subject is presented with the evidence of the crime, the judgment, and the penalty is carried out then and there. If you stole something, you lose your hand - most likely the hand you eat with leaving you ony the hand you wipe with. If you harmed someone in the theft you bodily lose something else of equivalence. If you killed someone, they run you up to 30,000 feet in a C-130 and push you out into the desert sky. Some variations on this theme exist, but most not too far away. If you are a repeat offender all bets are off. Definitely not revolving door, no bail, no serial appeals for years, not much burden on the taxpayer or the government, no money to be made by lawyers and contractors. And not much crime.

Let the young ones see that, and the children will very soon be able to accurately gauge risk versus reward. Parents will then have an instructable moment, and the prepetrators will learn considerably faster. Sound barbaric? How barbaric is it the other way around, where rapists and murderers are let out to ruin yet another life, theives set out into society with only a slap on the wrist?

I apologize in advance if I somehow crease someone's sensibilities here, but we need to have a quantum change.

Dennis


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## Mickey (Oct 22, 2011)

We are fortunate to have excellent and knowledgeable moderators on OGF.


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## BuckeyeFishinNut (Feb 8, 2005)

johnboy111711 said:


> It's a systematic failure. Many of the issues such as poverty and lack of education started 20-30- maybe 100 years for some families. there is a laundry list of things to focus on to prevent crime, but honestly, from the tone of the post, people are more interested in complaining and planning on how many people they will need to drop, either physically or with a weapon. the cycle will perpetuate until the social issues are addressed. Until then, people can continue to keep their heads in the sand.


A systemic failure, LOL! Plan and simple, these issues fall primarily on the parents, secondarily on their own personal choices, and tertiary on their community. The only thing that is systemic is that they fail to learn from their mistakes, and many of their communities glorify violence, crime, and lack of respect. 

These kids get the same access to education that every other kid in the United States does, a free K-12 education. If they fail to take advantage of their opportunities, that's on them and their parents.


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## johnboy111711 (Apr 7, 2004)

BuckeyeFishinNut said:


> A systemic failure, LOL! Plan and simple, these issues fall primarily on the parents, secondarily on their own personal choices, and tertiary on their community. The only thing that is systemic is that they fail to learn from their mistakes, and many of their communities glorify violence, crime, and lack of respect.
> 
> These kids get the same access to education that every other kid in the United States does, a free K-12 education. If they fail to take advantage of their opportunities, that's on them and their parents.


I would agree with you to an extent. Many of these arguments come down to the chicken or the egg. I would say that poverty has a larger toll on crime rates. this is also tied to education. schools in lower income neighborhoods do not receive the same amount of tax money as schools in more affluent neighborhoods. This is strictly based upon and backed by Ohio's current funding through regional property taxes. $$$=opportunity. And if you are still unsure, break the current population of our jails and those who commit crime like this: Do people who have money, shelter, transportation, and overall security commit more or less crimes. There are a number of independent studies, both local, statewide, nation wide and world wide that all show that poverty rates are a direct correlation with crime and recidivism of those convicted. For anyone with the ol' boot straps comment, it is nearly impossible in todays world to lift yourself up through hard work. too many jobs require technical training, either through college or a trade . we can even bring the availability of health care and health education into the mix. 

I am not saying there are easy answers, the problems are just easy to complain about.


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## baitguy (Dec 17, 2013)

there has been a boatload of them in Cleveland area recently, cops aren't allowed to chase, perps know it and just floor it to get away ... had a couple really bad accidents here in the last few weeks that involved chasing car jackers, some folks got dead and police explanations as to why violent felons have to be apprehended get drowned out by the "what about their rights" crowd ... a news babe here was shamelessly baiting a local Chief about it, he stood his ground but shouldn't have had to ...



johnboy111711 said:


> If more money was spent on education and opportunity for youths, there would most likely be less crime.


very misguided as pointed out below ... they've been playing this card since I was in high school and LBJ was Prez in the 60s and it's never helped a single solitary bit ... well hell, if 5 billion wasn't enough, lets give them 20 ... 30 ... 50 ... we're into the hundreds of billions in this latest bill and it won't do anything but make the government bigger and more intrusive and line the pockets of companies providing those government services ... the only way it's raising people out of poverty is giving them $$$ to spend on whatever they want but it won't help their standard of living, after 2 weeks for most of them that money is pissed away on non-essential things and right back where they were ... as has been pointed out here by some guys who are from my era, parentel back-bone and moderately high stadards are the key ... you got grounded w/homework or read a book, there weren't video games, and that was after the ass whoopin ... I have a bro-in-law who's idea of discipline is to "re-direct them" to something else 😳 there are to many entitled, spoiled brat, ungrateful kids and they got that way because that's what they were taught ...



fastwater said:


> And I think the dump truck loads of $ that's continually dumped into our continued failing school systems is a perfect example. Spend all the $ you want on the school systems but if the kid isn't there and is out jacking cars...that $ isn't doing any good.


you are soooo right fastwater, might as well just flush the $$$ down the toilet .... oh, wait, we're already been doing that for over 50 years  my bad


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## johnboy111711 (Apr 7, 2004)

baitguy said:


> very misguided as pointed out below ... they've been playing this card since I was in high school and LBJ was Prez in the 60s and it's never helped a single solitary bit ... well hell, if 5 billion wasn't enough, lets give them 20 ... 30 ... 50 ... we're into the hundreds of billions in this latest bill and it won't do anything but make the government bigger and more intrusive and line the pockets of companies providing those government services ... the only way it's raising people out of poverty is giving them $$$ to spend on whatever they want but it won't help their standard of living, after 2 weeks for most of them that money is pissed away on non-essential things and right back where they were ... as has been pointed out here by some guys who are from my era, parentel back-bone and moderately high stadards are the key ... you got grounded w/homework or read a book, there weren't video games, and that was after the ass whoopin ... I have a bro-in-law who's idea of discipline is to "re-direct them" to something else 😳 there are to many entitled, spoiled brat, ungrateful kids and they got that way because that's what they were taught ...


See, there is a chasm in ways of thinking. As you pointed out, funding has been off for years, but it hasn't been fixed. And "throwing" money at a community isn't an answer either and should be noted, wasn't suggested. Your argument is very convoluted with your own opinions and isn't a true reflection of what should happen. In reality, an investment in the infrastructure and businesses in a community would benefit all. Going back to the income levels, generational weather and security are more of a contributing factor to crime than one time lump sum payments. which of course is tied into educational access and needs.There is also a link to the average age a person has a child and whether they have the resources they need to survive. It is all a very divisive issue and like I stated before, it isn't as simple as beating your child or being accepting of the current climate in the world of policing. 

many issues, not many solutions.


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## G-Patt (Sep 3, 2013)

It's a complicated problem, but I have a simple solution: God, Family and Consequences. The kids causing these issues and worse, have none of this. I did 2 years working in a county job for Family Services. Those were the longest and saddest years of my life. No amount of money, sympathy or government programs can help. It's a personal decision for which they are individually accountable. No system or government assistance can do for them what they can simply do for themselves. Once they turn their life over to Jesus and make the decision to live a straight and clean life, that's when real progress is made. I've seen it happen, and it's the only thing I've seen work in those 2 years of hell.


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## Specwar (Sep 22, 2014)

Bust the parents @ss for not teaching their off spring right from wrong after the first offense. If it happens again lock up the parent and off spring together in the same cell where they have the opportunity to discuss just how they arrived at this dwelling. Perhaps 50% of them would change course, however the other 50% are low life parasite scum of the earth that will never change. SAD WORLD WE LIVE IN TODAY, and only getting WORSE.


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## baitguy (Dec 17, 2013)

well, what should happen and reality are about as close as California and Maine ... what should happen is parents stay together and show kids the way to be a good person is not always the easy way out ... they have been throwing money at infrastructure the entire time ... they are building completely new schools in Cleveland that are twice as big as they need to be, in many cases because there's no kids to send to them ... and they're being trashed almost as fast as they build them ... you want to fix education, throw out the teachers unions as comprised and adapt the Parochial and private school methods which are many times better in all aspects ... the tax base doesn't support it, and people in the burbs are getting tired of more of their hard earned money going to social programs that have almost always failed ... they totally rebuilt hundreds of units in the "Estates" in Cleveland, yet they have to renovate every 5 years or so because the people that live there have no stake in anything and don't care, the government wil;l fix it so why worry ... here's something to consider about folks who are needing to get out of poverty, have no money and no skills and no transportation but how many of them have bling and tats and $200 Nikes and out partying all the time ... they shoulkd not be rewarded for continually making poor choices in life ... no problem with a hand up for folks that are trying to improve their lives, but WAY to much of our bloated social program largess is in reality a hand out and total waste with nothing to show for it...


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## Specwar (Sep 22, 2014)

G-Patt said:


> It's a complicated problem, but I have a simple solution: God, Family and Consequences. The kids causing these issues and worse, have none of this. I did 2 years working in a county job for Family Services. Those were the longest and saddest years of my life. No amount of money, sympathy or government programs can help. It's a personal decision for which they are individually accountable. No system or government assistance can do for them what they can simply do for themselves. Once they turn their life over to Jesus and make the decision to live a straight and clean life, that's when real progress is made. I've seen it happen, and it's the only thing I've seen work in those 2 years of hell.


Unfortunately God, Jesus, and Christianity are not taught or recognized today.


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## hatteras1 (Jan 18, 2011)

The court is a theater and the best actor wins!!!


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## Buckeye419 (Dec 11, 2020)

G-Patt said:


> It's a complicated problem, but I have a simple solution: God, Family and Consequences. The kids causing these issues and worse, have none of this. I did 2 years working in a county job for Family Services. Those were the longest and saddest years of my life. No amount of money, sympathy or government programs can help. It's a personal decision for which they are individually accountable. No system or government assistance can do for them what they can simply do for themselves. Once they turn their life over to Jesus and make the decision to live a straight and clean life, that's when real progress is made. I've seen it happen, and it's the only thing I've seen work in those 2 years of hell.


God and Jesus? Believing in fairytales won't do anything. If that were the case, we would just send them down to benny hinn or Joel osteen.. Poverty and disease wouldn't be a thing anymore either


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## matticito (Jul 17, 2012)

Buckeye419 said:


> God and Jesus? Believing in fairytales won't do anything. If that were the case, we would just send them down to benny hinn or Joel osteen.. Poverty and disease wouldn't be a thing anymore either


And think, without God and jesus, we arent out robbing and killing people are we? 😉😉

Dont need any of that to be decent.


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## Parris Island (Mar 6, 2012)

What we are seeing in Central Ohio is more young females committing these crimes. Sometimes groups of females. I think this is a relatively new phenomenon and very concerning!!


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## baitguy (Dec 17, 2013)

G-Patt said:


> It's a complicated problem, but I have a simple solution: God, Family and Consequences. The kids causing these issues and worse, have none of this. I did 2 years working in a county job for Family Services. Those were the longest and saddest years of my life. No amount of money, sympathy or government programs can help. It's a personal decision for which they are individually accountable. No system or government assistance can do for them what they can simply do for themselves. Once they turn their life over to Jesus and make the decision to live a straight and clean life, that's when real progress is made. I've seen it happen, and it's the only thing I've seen work in those 2 years of hell.





Buckeye419 said:


> God and Jesus? Believing in fairytales won't do anything. If that were the case, we would just send them down to benny hinn or Joel osteen.. Poverty and disease wouldn't be a thing anymore either



we need to understand that these folks don't think logically ... too many of them are second, third or even fourth generation living on the dole that they contribute nothing to and have no concept of going in every day and being productive because nobody they know has ever had to, they get everything w/o having to worry about that little issue ...... pretty sure Jesus was a hand up guy, you were expected to contribute in some way, he would not support hand outs so they don't have to work ...


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## chadwimc (Jun 27, 2007)

Its nothing new. The poor, misunderstood yoots were robbing people and stealing cars at gun point around the University of Cincinnati 20 years ago. 12-14 year old kids sticking a gun in your face. Nobody had the courage to address the 800 lb gorilla in the room, tho'... It got so bad that parents were telling the Trustees "You better do something or we're out". _THAT_ got their attention. They had meetings and awarded each other accolades for discussing the problem. I do believe the only person that slowed the crime was Darwin...


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## baitguy (Dec 17, 2013)

chadwimc said:


> I do believe the only person that slowed the crime was Darwin...



brother, you got that 1000% right, most of those folks have no idea who Darwin is  but he knew about thinning the heard


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## missionfishin (Sep 21, 2011)

johnboy111711 said:


> Not saying that there is any excuse for a crime to be committed, but after working in the juvenile and adult system, I can honestly say that punishment really doesn't deter crime. plenty of studies to back it up as well. there are way more social and environmental factors that come into play. Even while working and my job depending on arrests and detainees, If more money was spent on education and opportunity for youths, there would most likely be less crime. However, punishment is big business, and there is mucho $$$ made from this. And in the words of the great Antonio Brown "business is BOOMIN"


I don't believe more money for education will fix these idiots. Just read recently that Baltimore spends approximately $16,000 ( third highest in the nation) per student per year and not one student out of 13 high schools was proficient at math. At another school a student had a 0.13 grade average and was in the top half of his class. Unbelievable. The parents and culture of these kids need to change, but that ain't gonna happen anytime soon.

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## Parris Island (Mar 6, 2012)

The causes of these problems are probably a combination of everything discussed above. 
Solutions? I honestly have not heard anything encouraging from our leaders, (From either side of the isle). Without intelligent, competent ,courageous leadership, willing to commit themselves to solving these EXISTING complex problems we will continue to suffer as a society. For many of these young people committing these crimes, the window of opportunity has probably already closed. 
For those of us living in this dysfunctional mess...........?


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## buckeyebowman (Feb 24, 2012)

johnboy111711 said:


> Not saying that there is any excuse for a crime to be committed, but after working in the juvenile and adult system, I can honestly say that punishment really doesn't deter crime. plenty of studies to back it up as well. there are way more social and environmental factors that come into play. Even while working and my job depending on arrests and detainees, If more money was spent on education and opportunity for youths, there would most likely be less crime. However, punishment is big business, and there is mucho $$$ made from this. And in the words of the great Antonio Brown "business is BOOMIN"


I only quoted this one, but could have quoted a bunch! We spend plenty on education and pay the freight with outrageous property taxes, which the legislature has repeatedly failed to address. Youngstown City Schools are spending in excess of 10 thousand dollars per year per student, and the school system is a total joke! And our justice system is quickly becoming the same. Just a revolving door, with criminals being released to commit more crimes. Fewer fathers at home to enforce discipline. And what's the base reason. I could say, but that would get this thread shut down pronto!


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## baitguy (Dec 17, 2013)

I heard Cleveland was throwing $11K a student at the problem, they have about a 15% graduation rate that can read and write at a level that can even be understood, and half that would be accepted to any college that had actual acedemic standards and didn't have to accept kids who can't fill out the application on their own ...but the teachers are holding out because they haven'e been guarenteed perfect health accomodations, unlike the rest of us who didn't move to the front of the line and refuse to go to work ... pathetic what passes for educators any more ...


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## Drm50 (Dec 26, 2014)

Down here in Poduck we have very little crime. It’s usually limited to what the local politicians can steal over at county seat. Crime is risky down here. Good chance to get a hole in your pelt in the act.


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## snagless-1 (Oct 26, 2014)

The leaders want to break up the family and lines of communication between us.The reason is they want government dependence .The masses should grab the bull by the horns and bring back family values,discipline,respect and GOD.


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## ironman172 (Apr 12, 2009)

Divide and conquer


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## One guy and a boat (Aug 8, 2018)

I have to agree with other posters about punishment alone not being the answer. I recently hired a guy that did a 4 year stint in prison, getting his CDL while in. Had to nudge my company a little bit, but it felt like the right thing to do. Young kid that made a stupid decision. He was working fast food and no one would take a chance on him. He's done a great job his first month and hopefully turns into a productive member of society for the next 50 years or so. If he does then it's well worth the few thousand dollars the driving school cost. I know that training like that doesn't work for all people. Some are just to far gone. But with proper screening while in prison, I would think it could be a win for some. Which would be a win for society as a whole. 

Kip


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Drm50 said:


> Down here in Poduck we have very little crime. It’s usually limited to what the local politicians can steal over at county seat. Crime is risky down here. Good chance to get a hole in your pelt in the act.


Used to be the same 20 yrs ago when I lived in Logan(Hocking Co.). Didn't live in town. And of course...didn't have many issues out where we lived. I understand that today, the Logan PD in town have their hands full compared to back then.
Can tell you for sure its that way today within Lancaster city limits. Have a few friends on Lancaster PD DEA unit. Both are short time,will retire in a couple years and over the years, they have met and worked closely with DEA guys from other surrounding towns. So over the years, they've seen the issues in other towns and watched them go downhill. Both of them will tell you that they've not seen another town for its size anywhere go downhill as fast as Lancaster has.

Currently work with a guy that his wife has worked for the juvenile court system in Lancaster for many years. She can tell you of instances, not only with the circumstances with the offending juvenile, but the parents/parent of the juvenile that's in trouble that will make you stand there absolutely speechless.
How bout this for just a very small example...lil Johnny that's suspended from school for truancy, mom calls insisting lil Johnny's court time be changed from 0945 to sometime after noon.
Why...cause lil Johnny always sleeps at least til noon and if his sleep is disturbed, he is hard to live with.
Response to lil Johnnys mom..." if lil Johnny always sleeps till noon...how did he commit the assault he was videod doing and arrested for at 10am.? Have him here at 0945 or there will be an arrest warrant issued for him."
The real kicker...this wasn't lil Johnnys first assault case. Still on probation for prior assault on his own mom...the one calling in for him at 11am while her lil darling is no doubt still sleeping.
In that case...mommy made all kinds of excuses for lil Johnny saying he just beat her up cause he's seen his father do the same to her.

Speakin of dad...setting a great example for lil Johnny by doing what he has always done best...bouncing in and out of jail attempting real hard to be the next John Gotti of Lancaster and failing miserably at that. But the law keeps arresting him...and the courts keep putting him back out on the street. Most likely will end up reading about him in the paper when he picks on the wrong 'victim'.


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## privateer (Apr 26, 2012)

The USA will eventually become like many of the South American countries. Those with $ will live in secured enclaves and travel with armed personal security forces.


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## DUCKHEAD (Apr 28, 2007)

_The theory that poverty perpetuates crime has some truth to it. But what causes poverty? Nothing is absolute but in many cases its attitude. I seen people even in my own family have an opportunity in life to make a better situation and they wouldn't take it and 20 years later they are still struggling. A friend I graduated with had the same opportunities as others and had a good factory job making good money but still decided to follow the wrong group and got into serious trouble with a gang and drugs and did 20years in prison. He wanted the easy way to make more money. I believe society would like to help alot of needy people but we have to stop and realize we cant just keep taking money from good people and waste it on some that will never change. We have to get them out of society whether it be for a deterrent for some or to just protect the good people of society. We love the underdog, the 1 who came from nothing to make something of themselves but these are rare stories, they dont happen just because we gave someone an opportunity. They have to have the right attitude and morals to take it. If some leaders are not willing to make these decisions then they should not be our leaders._


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## DUCKHEAD (Apr 28, 2007)

I saw a show on animal planet about some difficult elephants that were killing water buffalo and rhinos. They found out they were young male elephants killing them. This was unusual. I dont remember the country in Africa but they had a war and alot of mature males were killed for their tusks and money. They found out that the young bulls were acting up because when they went into musk their were no mature males around to keep them in line like in other parts of Africa. We could learn alot from nature and keep dads in homes and give these young kids some discipline instead of these psychology professors that have convinced people and schools not to spank kids anymore.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

^^^In short...for every choice/action...there is a consequence.
Good choices ='s reward.
Bad choices ='s 'play stupid games...win stupid prizes.

Have a family member that chose the same path as your friend Duckhead.
If you talk to him today, he will tell you his first few years of his well earned incarceration stint were absolutely wasted by him. Not so the last few.
How did he waste the first few?
The same way that got him in prison in the first place...his attitude.
It wasn't until his self pity, the world owes me a living attitude changed with the help of a counselor in prison that he finally realized the world owed him nothing and that the big ugly world didn't really care about his self pity.
Again...these are things he would...and has told more than a few wanna be thugs.


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## Parris Island (Mar 6, 2012)

fastwater said:


> Used to be the same 20 yrs ago when I lived in Logan(Hocking Co.). Didn't live in town. And of course...didn't have many issues out where we lived. I understand that today, the Logan PD in town have their hands full compared to back then.
> Can tell you for sure its that way today within Lancaster city limits. Have a few friends on Lancaster PD DEA unit. Both are short time,will retire in a couple years and over the years, they have met and worked closely with DEA guys from other surrounding towns. So over the years, they've seen the issues in other towns and watched them go downhill. Both of them will tell you that they've not seen another town for its size anywhere go downhill as fast as Lancaster has.
> 
> Currently work with a guy that his wife has worked for the juvenile court system in Lancaster for many years. She can tell you of instances, not only with the circumstances with the offending juvenile, but the parents/parent of the juvenile that's in trouble that will make you stand there absolutely speechless.
> ...


Fastwater,
I also live in Lancaster. I know we have some problems but had no idea it is as bad as you described. I make use of some of the parks and portions of the bike path. 
Honestly, I have never felt unsafe. Maybe I’m always in the right place at the right time? Maybe I have my head in the sand. Is there a good source for crime data here?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## BuckeyeFishinNut (Feb 8, 2005)

The low hanging fruit is always the education system. People want more money dumped into it, others want it defunded. The truth of it all is, kids are in school 6 hours a day in a structured school environment and spend 18 hours a day left to their own devices. If nobody in their life values education, what do you expect the education system to do? Most teachers see a student for 45 minutes-1 hour a day. School used to be about education, now its about not only education but morals, values, psychological and emotional help. Most of that stuff used to be handled at home or church but now its dumped on the educational system. We no longer hold anybody personally responsible and just like to point fingers at the easiest targets.

Poverty exists the way it does in this country because we failed to protect the higher paying, minimal education jobs. You could come out of high school and make nice money working in factories, mills, and mines. Wheeling-Pittsburgh Steel was the largest employer in West Virginia, today its Walmart. When do you think people were better off? This has happened all over this country. Instead of protecting our industry, it was allowed to be over taken and the government replaced it with government assistance. My dad told me back in the 50's-60's the only people who were on government assistance were drunks and drug addicts because they couldn't hold down a job. Today, these people are paid more to stay at home than to go get a job.


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## Lewis (Apr 5, 2004)

I never understood how people can use poverty as an excuse for violent crime. Do you realize how many of us people grew up in dirt poor Appalachia and never turned into a violent criminal? These folks attended one room schoolhouses. Some had no shoes and had barely enough food to survive. I guarantee one thing...you could walk through their hollow and not get jacked. They might share what little food they had with you. So stop with the I'm poor excuses.
We have a very severe cultural problem with these inner city kids. Many of these young mothers are squirting out these convicts and are passing their terrible morals onto their own offspring.
The entire bullshit, gangsta mentality and lifestyle needs called out by everyone for what it is and what it glorifies.
Instead we are worried about Dr. Seuss.


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## johnboy111711 (Apr 7, 2004)

It would take all day to address all the issues in this thread. But after reading them, a few things are apparent; 1. many are out of touch with reality and have little to no clue about the difference in education and educational resources/infrastructure between schools and/or school districts. 2. Many people think violence towards others is the best way to fight crime. 3. that many of the kids now are lazy ( is it possible that the world is or should evolve? 4. Most people wants to address why crimes are committed but agree they should stop??? 5. finally, I have heard very few viable solutions to crime, but everyone is quick to point out that the ideas I proposed are wrong??? 

Take some time and do some research. Find out why the neighborhood are failing. when you find an answer, dig deeper. Talk to teachers, find out what works in education and what doesn't. Find out where that per diem goes for every student ( quick hint, it's rarely towards technology and resources but often goes to up keeping archaic buildings with failing roofs, heat, and AC. ) Find out how much teachers and staff make? and ask yourself, could you or would you do it for less? 

Take pride in making your neighborhood and community better. Reach out to the youth and families. The world needs more of that and a hell of a lot less of people complaining on online forums about how bad things are and the good ol days. Please do not quote this, as I will not change your minds and most will say " I do enough" "its not my problem". Do some soul searching because I can guarantee we have all become just as "lazy" as those mentioned above and could do more to make the world better. If you are religious, read the scripture about lifting up your brethren, not crucifying them. Let God do the judging, not you.


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## johnboy111711 (Apr 7, 2004)

Lewis said:


> I never understood how people can use poverty as an excuse for violent crime. Do you realize how many of us people grew up in dirt poor Appalachia and never turned into a violent criminal? These folks attended one room schoolhouses. Some had no shoes and had barely enough food to survive. I guarantee one thing...you could walk through their hollow and not get jacked. They might share what little food they had with you. So stop with the I'm poor excuses.
> We have a very severe cultural problem with these inner city kids. Many of these young mothers are squirting out these convicts and are passing their terrible morals onto their own offspring.
> The entire bullshit, gangsta mentality and lifestyle needs called out by everyone for what it is and what it glorifies.
> Instead we are worried about Dr. Seuss.


This is the craziest post yet. The fact that you have only called out "inner city" kids is beyond me. Before you call the kettle Black, do research on those appalachia crime rates. Turns out, while they aren't always as violent, they are felony's none the less. I took a 2 second search and found some great material. Don't let your prejudices cloud your vision.








Appalachia: The big white ghetto


In Appalachia, jobs have vanished, and people live for pills, soda pop, and welfare



theweek.com


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## Lewis (Apr 5, 2004)

I knew it was coming. Can one not be a realist and not be a racist? DO NOT play the race card on me pal! The appalachian drug heads will saw off your catalytic converter, the inner city kids will shoot you in the face with a 9mm. Quit sugarcoating things. We all know who the violent young criminals are and where they live. We are discussing violent crime here, such as carjacking. No one can ever have a serious discussion about this without being real.


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## johnboy111711 (Apr 7, 2004)

Lewis said:


> I knew it was coming. Can one not be a realist and not be a racist? DO NOT play the race card on me pal! The appalachian drug heads will saw off your catalytic converter, the inner city kids will shoot you in the face with a 9mm. Quit sugarcoating things. We all know who the violent young criminals are and where they live. We are discussing violent crime here, such as carjacking. No one can ever have a serious discussion about this without being real.


not sugar coating it, I live in a city and have never had a crime committed against me. Are you blind to the fact that violent crime happens outside of cities as well. You aren't dumb. but you did make a broad generalization about a population that resides in a city. You showed prejudice along with many others who like the word thug or gangbanger. thats fine, but I'm not afraid to call someone out on bullshit. it's 2021. try to be better.


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## matticito (Jul 17, 2012)

johnboy111711 said:


> 3. that many of the kids now are lazy


They absolutely are. They get hired and work for 3 days and say it's too hard. Had a 14 yr old pregnant girl quit after a week. Good luck girl. I think 2 kids have stuck it thru training this year. 

2 from past year finally quit. They got tired of us telling them to do something beside stare out the window... dont let the door hit ya.

This is mostly parents. Partly government. Why work when they've been working and getting handouts? We're on our 3rd handout.... its gunna get worse.

Everyone wants to be a [email protected]$$. I was walking thru target parking lot on strongsville Sunday. It was busy. I was looking for cars as I walked so some fancy car didnt run me over. I accidentally kicked a stone that happened to go near someone. He got all mad and I apologized as was an accident. Said "iz bout to kick ur effin azz" alright bro. That lime size rock could've hit any of the 5 or 6 people walking, bounced up and hit a fancy car.... like it was intentional. No respect. None at all. These wanna be hoodlums deserve all the respect. Remember that guys.


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## Lewis (Apr 5, 2004)

Ok...for starters I walked into my buddies carryout in Akron, Ohio on Christmas Eve in 1977 to purchase a six pack I walked right in on a robbery. I was pistol whipped and violently assaulted by 3 inner city youths. Spent that night getting staples in my head at the ER.
Fast forward to 1997 In Akron Ohio. My 18 year old nephew, also from Akron thought it would be cool to become a weed dealer. He was robbed,shot in the head and killed in broad daylight by a couple inner city youths.
So I know exactly what I am talking about.
You could line the streets with gold, build huge palaces for schools and hire Harvard professors to educate them, but kids need morals and direction taught at home.
Also, everyone knows exactly where most violent crime happens and who commits it.
We can never fix the problem by being apologists or excuse makers.
I'm done with this discussion.


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## Lewis (Apr 5, 2004)




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## G-Patt (Sep 3, 2013)

I've seen some poo, poo my comments about God and Jesus calling them fairytales and nonsense. That's fine, you're entitled to your opinion. I can't prove to you that God exists, nor can you prove that God doesn't exist, nor can you prove that something comes from nothing. Anyhoo, I've been in the trenches and seen what works and doesn't work, so my earlier comments don't come from some theoretical base, which is what most of this discussion is. It comes from what I actually witnessed and seen the results.


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## BuckeyeFishinNut (Feb 8, 2005)

G-Patt said:


> I've seen some poo, poo my comments about God and Jesus calling them fairytales and nonsense. That's fine, you're entitled to your opinion. I can't prove to you that God exists, nor can you prove that God doesn't exist, nor can you prove that something comes from nothing. Anyhoo, I've been in the trenches and seen what works and doesn't work, so my earlier comments don't come from some theoretical base, which is what most of this discussion is. It comes from what I actually witnessed and seen the results.


I had a professor that told me kids should get their education at school, discipline at home, and morals in church. I have taught for 10 years in a small district that has a 70%+ free/reduced lunch participation and 25% special education rate. Many of this students are not what you would consider "special education", but they fit the government definition because they are at least 2 years behind in reading or math. I have had families of 4 or 5 kids, all identified as special education. The chances of that happening are off the charts but all of them were at least 2 years behind in reading. Did the education system fail every one of those kids or did there parents not help them at all when they were in the earliest stages of reading? 

You can't hold every student back who struggles, it would create a tremendous log jam at 3rd and 4th grade. I see this kind of stuff every day. I have had middle school kids tell me school is a waste of time, they will just live off the government like their parents and grand parents. Where do you think that idea came from? 

Those that want school choice and voucher programs, we had a charter school open up in town, it lasted 2 years before it got shut down. They basically cooked the books and did nothing for those kids other than take money from the government. They opened up in the poorer area of town, many of our special education and poorer kids went there because they would walk to school. The IEPs they wrote for those special education kids were criminal. Kids that had already had fallen behind, fell even further behind for a quick money grab. Sometimes its better to take the devil you know, versus the devil you dont know.


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## Specwar (Sep 22, 2014)

johnboy111711 said:


> It would take all day to address all the issues in this thread. But after reading them, a few things are apparent; 1. many are out of touch with reality and have little to no clue about the difference in education and educational resources/infrastructure between schools and/or school districts. 2. Many people think violence towards others is the best way to fight crime. 3. that many of the kids now are lazy ( is it possible that the world is or should evolve? 4. Most people wants to address why crimes are committed but agree they should stop??? 5. finally, I have heard very few viable solutions to crime, but everyone is quick to point out that the ideas I proposed are wrong???
> 
> Take some time and do some research. Find out why the neighborhood are failing. when you find an answer, dig deeper. Talk to teachers, find out what works in education and what doesn't. Find out where that per diem goes for every student ( quick hint, it's rarely towards technology and resources but often goes to up keeping archaic buildings with failing roofs, heat, and AC. ) Find out how much teachers and staff make? and ask yourself, could you or would you do it for less?
> 
> Take pride in making your neighborhood and community better. Reach out to the youth and families. The world needs more of that and a hell of a lot less of people complaining on online forums about how bad things are and the good ol days. Please do not quote this, as I will not change your minds and most will say " I do enough" "its not my problem". Do some soul searching because I can guarantee we have all become just as "lazy" as those mentioned above and could do more to make the world better. If you are religious, read the scripture about lifting up your brethren, not crucifying them. Let God do the judging, not you.


Respect your theory and input, however truth be known I could give a $hit less about the low life scum we are referring to, if they drew their last breath tomorrow I would not mourn a single second for them. They are who and what they are and will never be anything or anybody that contributes to the good. 
Some of us grew up in a different time and culture and know and respect what we were taught is right and what is wrong.
Let those we are referring to do as they wish, however dont do it to me or mine because I guarantee them severe consequences.


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## johnboy111711 (Apr 7, 2004)

Specwar said:


> Respect your theory and input, however truth be known I could give a $hit less about the low life scum we are referring to, if they drew their last breath tomorrow I would not mourn a single second for them. They are who and what they are and will never be anything or anybody that contributes to the good.
> Some of us grew up in a different time and culture and know and respect what we were taught is right and what is wrong.
> Let those we are referring to do as they wish, however dont do it to me or mine because I guarantee them severe consequences.


i completely understand, but a few things to point out. this isn't one individual like the recent mass killings the white kid did over his hate for asian americans (not sure why no one brought this up before, maybe it didn't fit the narrative of a "thug" or "inner city youth" that gets throw around. which we all know who you are referring too...) the crimes are being committed by all ages and races across america and have a uniting factor, POVERTY. it is important to address the issues not the individual. Yes, not caring whether another individual lives or dies is very chivalrous, but once again, that isn't a solution, unless you are suggesting genocide of the impoverished. And these issues have not' popped over night, as mentioned by Lewis and the unfortunate history of violence that has befallen him and his family. These issues are generational. and many started with your generation. So once again, lake a long look in the mirror and ask what you have done to make your world a better place?


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## cincinnati (May 24, 2004)

johnboy111711 said:


> i completely understand, but a few things to point out. this isn't one individual like the recent mass killings the white kid did over his hate for asian americans (not sure why no one brought this up before, maybe it didn't fit the narrative of a "thug" or "inner city youth" that gets throw around. which we all know who you are referring too...)


The massage parlor shooter has already confessed that the murders were NOT racially motivated. He says he has a sex addiction & that the shootings were directed specifically @ massage parlors. Maybe they rubbed him the wrong way.  









Here's what we know about the metro Atlanta spa shootings that left 8 dead | CNN


Investigators said they were trying to determine whether the shootings were connected.




www.cnn.com


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## johnboy111711 (Apr 7, 2004)

cincinnati said:


> The massage parlor shooter has already confessed that the murders were NOT racially motivated. He says he has a sex addiction & that the shootings were directed specifically @ massage parlors. Maybe they rubbed him the wrong way.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


yes, but his confession goes against eye witness accounts. And you get less time if it isn't a hate crime. Guessing his lawyer possibly talked to him. And when did people in Ohio start taking CNN's news reporting seriously...


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## missionfishin (Sep 21, 2011)

johnboy111711 said:


> i completely understand, but a few things to point out. this isn't one individual like the recent mass killings the white kid did over his hate for asian americans (not sure why no one brought this up before, maybe it didn't fit the narrative of a "thug" or "inner city youth" that gets throw around. which we all know who you are referring too...) the crimes are being committed by all ages and races across america and have a uniting factor, POVERTY. it is important to address the issues not the individual. Yes, not caring whether another individual lives or dies is very chivalrous, but once again, that isn't a solution, unless you are suggesting genocide of the impoverished. And these issues have not' popped over night, as mentioned by Lewis and the unfortunate history of violence that has befallen him and his family. These issues are generational. and many started with your generation. So once again, lake a long look in the mirror and ask what you have done to make your world a better place?


Not sure why you even brought this up either. Not everyone killed was asian. Go ahead and pick that race card back up. 

Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk


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## johnboy111711 (Apr 7, 2004)

no, it was more toward the fact that all races commit crimes, but some people only acknowledge when African American do. I don't have a problem with race, I try and make the world better each day! I'll say a prayer for you you! Actually all of you!


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## Specwar (Sep 22, 2014)

johnboy111711 said:


> i completely understand, but a few things to point out. this isn't one individual like the recent mass killings the white kid did over his hate for asian americans (not sure why no one brought this up before, maybe it didn't fit the narrative of a "thug" or "inner city youth" that gets throw around. which we all know who you are referring too...) the crimes are being committed by all ages and races across america and have a uniting factor, POVERTY. it is important to address the issues not the individual. Yes, not caring whether another individual lives or dies is very chivalrous, but once again, that isn't a solution, unless you are suggesting genocide of the impoverished. And these issues have not' popped over night, as mentioned by Lewis and the unfortunate history of violence that has befallen him and his family. These issues are generational. and many started with your generation. So once again, lake a long look in the mirror and ask what you have done to make your world a better place?


I don’t care what color, creed, nationality, age, sex or any other term that they use to describe themselves. My statement covers them all.


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## johnboy111711 (Apr 7, 2004)

Specwar said:


> I don’t care what color, creed, nationality, age, sex or any other term that they use to describe themselves. My statement covers them all.


Correct, you made zero racist remarks, but the part about the generations before and the good ol days days apply. someone has to have dropped the ball, and if we won't acknowledge that Poverty plays a significant role, then the direct blame has to fall on the generations before us that knew right from wrong and had respect, but evidently this wasn't passed on. And please don't take this personal. I don't know you and from what I assume, most who have replied, including yourself are probably great parents. But the fact is, actions are learned behaviors. And someone has to be to blame.


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## cincinnati (May 24, 2004)

johnboy111711 said:


> yes, but his confession goes against eye witness accounts. And you get less time if it isn't a hate crime. Guessing his lawyer possibly talked to him. And when did people in Ohio start taking CNN's news reporting seriously...











Georgia spa shooting suspect, charged with 8 counts of murder, attended rehab for sex addiction


Two sources told USA TODAY that Robert Aaron Long, the suspect in Tuesday's deadly Georgia spa shootings, had been in rehab for sex addiction.



www.usatoday.com













Man charged with killing 8 people at Georgia massage parlors


ATLANTA (AP) — A white gunman was charged Wednesday with killing eight people at three Atlanta-area massage parlors in an attack that sent terror through the Asian American community , which has increasingly been targeted during the coronavirus pandemic.




apnews.com


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## johnboy111711 (Apr 7, 2004)

I only trust infowars and aol.com news!


cincinnati said:


> Georgia spa shooting suspect, charged with 8 counts of murder, attended rehab for sex addiction
> 
> 
> Two sources told USA TODAY that Robert Aaron Long, the suspect in Tuesday's deadly Georgia spa shootings, had been in rehab for sex addiction.
> ...


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## cincinnati (May 24, 2004)

johnboy111711 said:


> I only trust infowars and aol.com news!











‘A crime against us all.’ Outrage, grief after deadly spa shootings


Metro Atlanta was gripped by shock and anger on Wednesday, the day after a deadly shooting spree killed eight people - most of them Asian women.




www.ajc.com





Links to those eyewitness testimonies?


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## johnboy111711 (Apr 7, 2004)

I'm sure they will pop up. They always do. So back to the original issue, How can we fix America's problem with gun violence and violent crimes. Any takers?


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## Rooster (Apr 8, 2004)

Dude murdered 8 people…….How exactly would his motivations (whatever they may be) make the crime of murdering 8 people any more egregious?


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## baitguy (Dec 17, 2013)

johnboy111711 said:


> no, it was more toward the fact that all races commit crimes, but some people only acknowledge when African American do. I don't have a problem with race, I try and make the world better each day! I'll say a prayer for you you! Actually all of you!



actually, it's quite often exactly the opposite ... last weekend there was a mass shooting at a party in Chitown, something like 15 people shot and several dead, where is the outrage ... no outrage, barely reported on, nothing to see here, just another day in the hood in Chicago ... it was black on black crime which seldom has the same degree of media frenzy as other crimes that are similar in all other ways except the ethnicity of the people who committed them ... the media plays down or doesn't even report the shootings they can't exploit, just like the lack of coverage of the recent continuing crazyness in Portland, but they are quick to hammer anything that fits their agenda ...


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## johnboy111711 (Apr 7, 2004)

baitguy said:


> actually, it's quite often exactly the opposite ... last weekend there was a mass shooting at a party in Chitown, something like 15 people shot and several dead .... barely reported on, it was black on black crime which seldom has the same degree of media frenzy as other crimes that are similar in all other ways except the ethnicity of the people who committed them ... the media plays down or doesn't even report the shootings they can't exploit, just like the lack of coverage of the recent continuing crazyness in Portland, but they are quick to hammer anything that fits their agenda ...


Thats the same as the anyone who as posted on this thread. pick and choose which areas and crimes affect us and comment on those. No offers on how to make the world better, just narrowing of the target range. And like the national or city media, this too is media.


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## Rooster (Apr 8, 2004)

johnboy111711 said:


> How can we fix America's problem with gun violence and violent crimes. Any takers?


All violent crime has plunged since 1990:
U.S.: violent crime rate graph 1990-2018 | Statista

Incarceration rates have skyrocketed:
Incarceration in the United States

Want to stop crime……..lock-up the criminals


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## johnboy111711 (Apr 7, 2004)

You guys are too much sometimes! Hope you have a great day. Prayers on the way!


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## Lewis (Apr 5, 2004)

I'll take a stab at it. There are dangerous kids of all races. Most mass shooters are white kids with psychological problems. Fortunately these are relatively rare, numbers wise. However the ones who are shooting each other in record numbers every day in all of America's major cities are mostly black kids. That is not a racist statement anymore than saying Muslims or middle easterners are mostly responsible for flying planes into buildings and for terror bombings. Facts cannot be changed. 
In my opinion where it started to go badly wrong was when these kids became enamored with and began to idolize the gangsta rap culture, which denigrates women, promotes gun violence, promotes drug dealing and the large amounts of cash it brings. In reality that lifestyle brings death or prison. It would go a long way if all black leaders would call this crap out and promote a positive message rather than sending a constant message of victimhood. I could say much more, but I'll refrain from politics. 
Black dads need to step up. We all know the numbers on fatherless inner city kids.
I personally hate the poverty excuse. These major cities are filled with millions of people who all need the service industry, thus making employment available to many. Might not be the job you want and it won't stuff your pockets with cash like dealing drugs, but it will keep you off the streets. Just pull your pants up, show up on time, work hard and good things will happen. Life is about choices.


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## Parris Island (Mar 6, 2012)

johnboy111711 said:


> I'm sure they will pop up. They always do. So back to the original issue, How can we fix America's problem with gun violence and violent crimes. Any takers?


For starters we have to remove all illegal guns from the streets. This is a monumental task, I understand that. To accomplish this we need courageous, intelligent competent leadership. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Parris Island (Mar 6, 2012)

Rooster said:


> All violent crime has plunged since 1990:
> U.S.: violent crime rate graph 1990-2018 | Statista
> 
> Incarceration rates have skyrocketed:
> ...


With all due respect, this is very misleading. Violent crime in the Country has declined however violent crime in almost every large city has increased. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## baitguy (Dec 17, 2013)

Lewis said:


> I'll take a stab at it. There are dangerous kids of all races. Most mass shooters are white kids with psychological problems. Fortunately these are relatively rare, numbers wise. However the ones who are shooting each other in record numbers every day in all of America's major cities are mostly black kids. That is not a racist statement anymore than saying Muslims or middle easterners are mostly responsible for flying planes into buildings and for terror bombings. Facts cannot be changed.
> In my opinion where it started to go badly wrong was when these kids became enamored with and began to idolize the gangsta rap culture, which denigrates women, promotes gun violence, promotes drug dealing and the large amounts of cash it brings. In reality that lifestyle brings death or prison. It would go a long way if all black leaders would call this crap out and promote a positive message rather than sending a constant message of victimhood. I could say much more, but I'll refrain from politics.
> Black dads need to step up. We all know the numbers on fatherless inner city kids.
> I personally hate the poverty excuse. These major cities are filled with millions of people who all need the service industry, thus making employment available to many. Might not be the job you want and it won't stuff your pockets with cash like dealing drugs, but it will keep you off the streets. Just pull your pants up, show up on time, work hard and good things will happen. Life is about choices.



that's a pretty accurate stab there Lewis ... but see, that's what the problem is ... why let facts get in the way of a stupid, failed argument that's been unsuccessfully tried with countless changes for 7 decades, none of which ever did anything but spend billions and nothing to show for it ... oh yeah, I forgot the solution, now we're gonna throw trillions at it and not even accountable for how it's spent 🤑 I'm sure this time it will lift them from poverty 🙄 nice job, fine job, GREAT job by the new govt.😎


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## Southernsaug (May 23, 2019)

It can't be legislated out of society. The problem is moral decline, when the country started legislating God out of the schools, government and daily life we lost our moral compass. Whether you are people of faith or not we need a moral base. Right and wrong is not a policy debate it's an inherent trait learned from moral leadership that starts in the home. We don't need more laws we need more Jesus! Ok, I said it, I'm ready for the critics, open fire.

I have worked with Juvenile offenders in a ministry for over 20 years and the number one problem is failing homes and absent fathers. When given direction and a moral base of why they are wrong they can and will change. I work within a system that has a 85% success rate with reforming youth. It can be done.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

johnboy111711 said:


> i completely understand, but a few things to point out. this isn't one individual like the recent mass killings the white kid did over his hate for asian americans (not sure why no one brought this up before, maybe it didn't fit the narrative of a "thug" or "inner city youth" that gets throw around. which we all know who you are referring too...) the crimes are being committed by all ages and races across america and have a uniting factor, POVERTY. it is important to address the issues not the individual. Yes, not caring whether another individual lives or dies is very chivalrous, but once again, that isn't a solution, unless you are suggesting genocide of the impoverished. And these issues have not' popped over night, as mentioned by Lewis and the unfortunate history of violence that has befallen him and his family. These issues are generational. and many started with your generation. So once again, lake a long look in the mirror and ask what you have done to make your world a better place?


Johnboy111711...you've made some very good points as far as poverty goes as well as the fact that our(my) generation has to shoulder a lot of the blame for our current societal issues. Especially when it comes to our younger people. And IMO, you are spot on in your thoughts that 'my' generation has to look in the mirror cause we are to blame. We are to blame for going along with all the handout, government assistance mentality that has made much of those in our poverty stricken areas view government assistance as a career field rather than an aid(assistance) to find employment to better themselves.

I don't know if you've ever actually lived in a poverty stricken area before but I have. If you haven't...I assure you, there's absolutely no substitute for the experience. You simply cannot view it from the outside, drive through, hear stories or even work everyday in a really impoverished area to fully understand living 365 days a year laying your head down every night in a poverty stricken area. Let alone if you have elementary school aged children that you're responsible for that get up every morning and go to school knowing that they are gonna have to fight older gang member thugs every day to keep their jacket, shirt or new pair of tennis shoes they just got for Christmas. And most times...these thugs came to the schools during recess to shop from their victims. 
Where were the playground teachers/monitors that were supposed to be out there watching over the kids you ask...they were there. The female principle was one of the monitors and the gang of truant junior high teenage thugs jumped and beat her, laying her up in the hospital with several contusions, broken bones and her jaws wired shut. The only thing that kept her from getting beat worse than she did was another male teacher and a neighborhood guy walking by jumped in and stopped the thugs. 
This was at Heyl Elementary school in the south end of Cols.
And please don't think this was an isolated incident...the school grounds also became an area of multiple gang turf wars with actual various letters of warning/threats sent by the gangs to the school principle making demands of various things. 
I know these things cause I was involved in the community, knew the female principle as well as her sub and read copies of the above mentioned letters myself.

Surely a totally different world than living in a middle class suburban area. 

I got to know several people and their families well. Some of their goals were the same as mine...work a job and do everything we could everyday to get out and better ourselves. 
Others views were that they didn't want to change...the government paid the rent, bought the groceries, paid the utilities...and of course...they had their 'untaxed' street hustles that made up the rest. A few were even on SSI disability which added a bit more income to the meager monthly pot. In other words, they wanted nothing else...had adopted the government assistance program as a career field and wouldn't go to work next door as a taster in a pie factory if given the opportunity. And to make matters worse, they had kids teaching them the same mindset. Perfect example was a neighbor guy that lived across the street from me. His job every day was to sit on his front porch and watch the world go by, He was probably in his mid to late 30's and had two daughters. One 14...the other 12.
Don't know how but mom was killed and both girls received an SSI check and no doubt dad controlled it. 
This guy had as much interest in...or business with those 2 girls as me having a 747 plane parked in the front yard. The girls ran the street 24/7. Was not uncommon to see them up on Parsons Ave any time of night. As with many of the kids around there, the streets were raising the kids.
Anyway, the 14 yr old gets pregnant. About 3-4 months later...the 12 yr old does as well. I watched that 14 yr old push het new born baby up and down the street that summer walking with her 12 yr old pregnant sister sadly thinking to myself...the generational government assistance tradition is alive and well.

Race...let me be clear about when I use the earned title of 'thug, gangsta'..or one I haven't seen posted yet 'hood rat'. Living where I did, I learned that in the bad areas of the south end of Cols, race played no part in poverty or those choosing the 'thug' life. 
Knew and saw just as many white as black thugs...and FWIW...the front porch dweller with the two girls were white. Too, at least one of the gang turf wars involving Heyl Elem. was a war between a white and black gang.


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## Rooster (Apr 8, 2004)

Parris Island said:


> With all due respect, this is very misleading. Violent crime in the Country has declined however violent crime in almost every large city has increased.


Nope, violent crime has dropped in most large cities as well:



https://cdn.factcheck.org/UploadedFiles/2016/07/Murder-Rate-in-Major-Cities.png


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## johnboy111711 (Apr 7, 2004)

Sound like we have very similar life experiences, just different areas. As was stated before from some other the other posters, Having a solid core family 100percent helped me excel. I made plenty of poor decisions, but I was luck to have a solid base to come home to minus running, drink able water (long story). my parents did as well they could. But I was the exception, not the norm from my area and therein lies the problem. 
I wish I had some solutions that were acceptable, but many people only see the pork barrel stimulus going to poverty, the money would be much better spent on community infrastructure and job creation. 


fastwater said:


> Johnboy111711...you've made some very good points as far as poverty goes as well as the fact that our(my) generation has to shoulder a lot of the blame for our current societal issues. Especially when it comes to our younger people. And IMO, you are spot on in your thoughts that 'my' generation has to look in the mirror cause we are to blame. We are to blame for going along with all the handout, government assistance mentality that has made much of those in our poverty stricken areas view government assistance as a career field rather than an aid(assistance) to find employment to better themselves.
> 
> I don't know if you've ever actually lived in a poverty stricken area before but I have. If you haven't...I assure you, there's absolutely no substitute for the experience. You simply cannot view it from the outside, drive through, hear stories or even work everyday in a really impoverished area to fully understand living 365 days a year laying your head down every night in a poverty stricken area. Let alone if you have elementary school aged children that you're responsible for that get up every morning and go to school knowing that they are gonna have to fight older gang member thugs every day to keep their jacket, shirt or new pair of tennis shoes they just got for Christmas. And most times...these thugs came to the schools during recess to shop from their victims.
> Where were the playground teachers/monitors that were supposed to be out there watching over the kids you ask...they were there. The female principle was one of the monitors and the gang of truant junior high teenage thugs jumped and beat her, laying her up in the hospital with several contusions, broken bones and her jaws wired shut. The only thing that kept her from getting beat worse than she did was another male teacher and a neighborhood guy walking by jumped in and stopped the thugs.
> ...


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## johnboy111711 (Apr 7, 2004)

Rooster said:


> Nope, violent crime has dropped in most large cities as well:
> 
> 
> 
> https://cdn.factcheck.org/UploadedFiles/2016/07/Murder-Rate-in-Major-Cities.png


Well there you go, we wait long enough and crime will be non-existent! Finally some data that shows what we perceive as problems, really aren't.


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## Southernsaug (May 23, 2019)

I will add to previous post. There are some who are never going to change and are just permanently deranged. They are easy t spot. 

Both my wife and I were raised poor, but our families never took assistance, we worked at whatever we could to survive


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## Rooster (Apr 8, 2004)

johnboy111711 said:


> Well there you go, we wait long enough and crime will be non-existent! Finally some data that shows what we perceive as problems, really aren't.


There will always be crime among **** sapiens.

Utopia is only a myth.

Crime is still a problem. But, despite the media propaganda indicating otherwise, or your personal perception, the world is getting demonstrably better (at lease with respect to violent crime).


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## Rooster (Apr 8, 2004)

LOL, the woke police have canceled our species.


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## Parris Island (Mar 6, 2012)

Rooster said:


> Nope, violent crime has dropped in most large cities as well:
> 
> 
> 
> https://cdn.factcheck.org/UploadedFiles/2016/07/Murder-Rate-in-Major-Cities.png


Crime is a local phenomenon, however, and in some states, violent crime rates are nearly as high or higher than they were nationwide in the early 1990s. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Specwar (Sep 22, 2014)

A few have hit the nail on the head, or at least struck close to it. In a nutshell, _things don’t change, people change.
There is not a person on this site that has the ability to make that happen. You can preach to someone until you are blue in the face and if the person you are preaching to can’t find it within “themselves” to make change it is never going to happen.
Therefore continuing to ask those here what they are going to do to try to change today’s culture is a moot point._


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Specwar said:


> A few have hit the nail on the head, or at least struck close to it. In a nutshell, _things don’t change, people change.
> There is not a person on this site that has the ability to make that happen. *You can preach to someone until you are blue in the face and if the person you are preaching to can’t find it within “themselves” to make change it is never going to happen.*
> Therefore continuing to ask those here what they are going to do to try to change today’s culture is a moot point._


Agree 100% with this statement.
And will add that that just like with addiction...or getting a young person to want to get an education...unless that person realizes the need for change for themselves...you can dump as much $ into the situation as you want...change will NOT happen.

Sooo...at this point, I guess the main question as far as how the rest of us are supposed to react and protect our loved ones against these thugs that have chosen the way of life for whatever reason they chose it?
Call me crazy but in the heat of the street, God forbid that time comes for any of us...I don't think a family therapy/diagnoses session in the moment with the thug perp/perps will be very helpful nor healthy for the innocent party involved.


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## Specwar (Sep 22, 2014)

fastwater said:


> Agree 100% with this statement.
> And will add that that just like with addiction...or getting a young person to want to get an education...unless that person realizes the need for change for themselves...you can dump as much $ into the situation as you want...change will NOT happen.
> 
> Sooo...at this point, I guess the main question as far as how the rest of us are supposed to react and protect our loved ones against these thugs that have chosen the way of life for whatever reason they chose it?
> Call me crazy but in the heat of the street, God forbid that time comes for any of us...I don't think a family therapy/diagnoses session in the moment with the thug perp/perps will be very helpful nor healthy for the innocent party involved.


Amen.


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## matticito (Jul 17, 2012)

Rooster said:


> Dude murdered 8 people…….How exactly would his motivations (whatever they may be) make the crime of murdering 8 people any more egregious?


8 murder convictions. Guilty. Let's go!


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## Ol' Whiskers (Aug 11, 2004)

matticito said:


> 8 murder convictions. Guilty. Let's go!


So as it will likely come about, the state will spend a bazillion dollars trying to figure the guy out with years and years of incarceration, endless plea deals, eight life sentences transmuted to a couple years after trial and then time off for good behavior... Even less if he were lucky enough to do it in LA. Have to consider if it was just in his nature, the fault of some defect in upbringing, other mitigating circumstances.

Or drop out of a C130 eight times

Or a $.49 bullet immediately.

Which serves society best? Which serves the eight murdered people best?


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## hailtothethief (Jan 18, 2017)




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## DUCKHEAD (Apr 28, 2007)

I have a friend who's son was killed by his roommate in college. He ate his left over taco bell and they got in an arguement about it so he turn around and stabbed him in the heart. The person only spent 5 years in prison and they let him out. The boys family was extremely up set. That not justice. The justice should have been a higher judge put him back in jail and order the judge who let him out share the jail cell with him. I dont care if the person was sorry for what he did, that's great we forgive you like the lord would and he will forgive him. But you committed a serious crime so you are going to have to do the time. So society can use it as a deterrent. Punishments have to be consistent and were not. Training dogs are the same way. Inconsistent commands and punishment will lead to an inconsistent dog.


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## hailtothethief (Jan 18, 2017)

If you take my food i have every right to stab you. Try it in the penitentiary see what happens


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## DUCKHEAD (Apr 28, 2007)

It was the other way around. The guy took his food and then when he confronted him about taking it, which he admitted to. He then stabbed him after he got mad because they got into an arguement. So he took his food and then stabbed him. And then only spent 5yrs in prison for it.


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## Hatchetman (Apr 13, 2004)

johnboy111711 said:


> yes, but his confession goes against eye witness accounts. And you get less time if it isn't a hate crime. Guessing his lawyer possibly talked to him. And when did people in Ohio start taking CNN's news reporting seriously...



Maybe you should check Georgia law, murder is a capital offense punishable by death. He confessed to EIGHT murders and stated race was NOT a factor contrary to what you are trying to make it sound like....


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## Specwar (Sep 22, 2014)

Hatchetman said:


> Maybe you should check Georgia law, murder is a capital offense punishable by death. He confessed to EIGHT murders and stated race was NOT a factor contrary to what you are trying to make it sound like....


He admitted that he did it because he had a sexual addiction that was satisfied by their being available at the parlor to satisfy that addiction. Pretty clear cut if you ask me. Nothing racist about it.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Filmed just last night.
Operation 'Game Over' set up by multiple LE agencies:





A thirteen year old driver with two 15 yr old passengers.
In stolen vehicle...with stolen gun in car...what could possibly go wrong here?

Again, where's the parents???
Why is a 13 and two 15yr olds in a stolen car with a gun and not one parent knew where their kids were at?
Where is the interest right now( or for that matter...most likely in the child's past) from these kids parents to at least have a clue what their little darlings are doing out on the street?

You can bank on this, when an LEO has to shoot one of these kids...you'll see all kinds of interest from the parent/parents then. The parent/parents and the rest of the extended family along with family's newly hired attorney will be all over the news showing angelic school pics of the child and screaming what a little angel their 13yr old was and the police just shot him down.
They'll demand independent investigations at tax payers expense, there may very well be riots that the media will call protest, the poor LEO that had no choice but to shoot this child and has to suffer living with it the rest of his life will be dragged through the mud...and even though LEO did not have a choice in shooting, could possibly be politically forced to resign due to all the PR on the department...it happens.
And throughout all the media hype, the riots, the departmental and independent investigations as well as the LEO's lifetime of suffering...not one time will anyone ever stick a mic in the parents face and point blank ask the parent/parents 'where were you when your child was shot'...or...'why didn't you know where your 13yr old child was'...or...'when had you last checked on your child to insure he was where he told you he was at'.
In short...when was the last attempt you made as a parent physically checking on your child's whereabouts, activities prior to his shooting?
None of those questions will be asked of the parents by media cause the parents will obviously be in mourning and we live in such a Politically Correct society that that line of questioning would be viewed as heartless...or...a 'how dare you ask me that...I just lost my baby' mindset.

No...all the media attention and questioning will be aimed at pointing the finger at the LEO, the overly aggressive PD dept. and what the LEO should have done differently to keep from shooting this street raised,gun toting 13 yr old child. The rest of the media attention will go towards the ongoing riots demanding change within the PD's...which incidentally makes for great ratings.

Poverty and throwing $ at the solution has been mentioned in this thread.
Poverty...as stated earlier, been there...done that...and IMO, while statistics do show crime in poverty stricken areas is higher.... poverty and lack of $ has absolutely zero to do with raising your kids right.
Time spent with a child teaching him/her right from wrong and that there are consequences for your actions does...and that doesn't take $. But just like throwing $ at schools doesn't work if the kid doesn't want to be there to learn...$ thrown into poverty stricken areas doesn't make a better parent if the so called parent doesn't want to be one in the first place.

Want to invest $ in the poverty stricken areas...invest it in parenting classes for those that really want to be parents but are struggling...as well as in our already overwhelmed children services programs so we can start yanking these kids away from these so called parents that let the streets raise their kids essentially viewing their kids as nothing more than dependents to increase their government assistance...might actually give the kids a fighting chance in life.


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## Buckeye419 (Dec 11, 2020)

G-Patt said:


> I've seen some poo, poo my comments about God and Jesus calling them fairytales and nonsense. That's fine, you're entitled to your opinion. I can't prove to you that God exists, nor can you prove that God doesn't exist, nor can you prove that something comes from nothing. Anyhoo, I've been in the trenches and seen what works and doesn't work, so my earlier comments don't come from some theoretical base, which is what most of this discussion is. It comes from what I actually witnessed and seen the results.


Again.. please tell me how thoughts n prayers have solved the school shootings? Christianity is doing a really good job drawing in people w tall the thieving and molestation scandals. Maybe that's why churches are closing across the country.. *aside from the new age cult like churches. For every Joel Osteen church that opens, 20 traditional parishes are shuttered. Science is real.. religion is about as believable as a Disney story


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## Specwar (Sep 22, 2014)

fastwater said:


> Filmed just last night.
> Operation 'Game Over' set up by multiple LE agencies:
> 
> 
> ...


Nice synopsis, unfortunately there is no reaching these scum of the earth bastards or their parents. This is the new culture in America.


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## Junebug2320 (Apr 23, 2010)

fastwater said:


> Filmed just last night.
> Operation 'Game Over' set up by multiple LE agencies:
> 
> 
> ...


100% TRUTH. Well done.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Saugeye Tom (Oct 6, 2010)

Buckeye419 said:


> Again.. please tell me how thoughts n prayers have solved the school shootings? Christianity is doing a really good job drawing in people w tall the thieving and molestation scandals. Maybe that's why churches are closing across the country.. *aside from the new age cult like churches. For every Joel Osteen church that opens, 20 traditional parishes are shuttered. Science is real.. religion is about as believable as a Disney story


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