# Disturbing scene at Caesar's Creek.



## ryanhipsher

I was an eye witness today of The State of Ohio stocking Muskie in Caesar's Creek Lake. Around 1:30 I was waiting on the the Tuesday Night Tournament to start when a large truck with the Division of Wildlife sticker on the side of it pulls to the side of the water and dumps, I forget the digits, but it was a lot of 12 inch Muskie. You Muskie fisherman say what you want to, but there are a lot more crappie and bass fisherman on this lake than muskie fisherman. In my opinion and 25 years experience on that lake it was a sad day. If you think bass and crappie fishing is tough there now, it has just begun. It is sad to say that the State of Ohio can afford to stock a bunch of no count muskie that are good for nothing but eating, #*&%@!, and slimming your boat, instead of a decent trash receptacle to keep our parks cleaner. All they are trying to do is lure out of towner to this lake. The only thing they are going to accomplish is more trash laying on the banks and in the parking lots! The lake is pitiful enough, let alone doing stupid things like that. I don't know who makes the decisions, but they clearly are not fisherman, and they are obviously not studying fish biology. So, for the old timers who like to go over to cc and float a bobber and relax, and bring home a couple slabs to put in the frying pan, you can thank the State of Ohio when you jerk and recieve nothing, because a muskie has took your whole shootin match. I don't want to offend, but it's my opinion. My fishing partner, Keving and I won tonight with 2 fish. The ONLY 2 fish caught. We won 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and big fish. Out of 25-30 competitors, BUT the Muskie's are biting! Thanks Ohio!


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## karuso

what were you doin there when the tourney does'nt even start till 6.oopm or so(plantin fish) just kiddin


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## TK916

Well said.


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## socdad

"I was an eye witness today of The State of Ohio stocking Muskie in Caesar's Creek Lake."

What on earth are you talking about?


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## Weatherby

Excuse me but I must take offense. Muskies have been stocked in Caesar Creek for 11 years now. 

I catch more crappie, bass, and saugeye than I do muskie.


You have 25 years experience on this lake and didn't know muskie have been stocked for 11? Puzzling.


If you will notice bass and crappie have a size limit on CC. Muskies do not. 




> and they are obviously not studying fish biology


Actually fish biology studies (from Ohio, Minnesota, Wisconsin, and Canada) prove that muskies prefer to eat soft rayed fish (such as shad) over bass, crappie, etc.

You probably don't want to hear this but bass eat more bass than muskie do. Crappie eat more crappie than muskie do.

Now I will not say a muskie won't eat a bass, or crappie ( I know they do) but not near the same rate they eat their own.

A major study was undertaken from July of 1991 through October of 1994, and other documented studies were conducted as long ago as 1952.
These studies, as well as others, came to the same conclusion. Game
fish such as walleye make up a very small part of a Muskies diet. In one
particular study, the stomach contents from 1092 Muskies were
evaluated. The results proved that a Muskies diet is quite diverse, and
that in 74% of the sample fish, only one food item was present. Muskies
are not voracious feeders consuming fish after fish, as some people would
have you believe. Walleye ranked extremely low in the Muskies diet. In the 1092 study fish, only five contained traces ofwalleye. This study collected
Muskies from 34 separate bodies of water, including lakes with large
populations of walleye. Despite their abundance in those lakes, walleye
proved to NOT be an important food source for Muskies. During the
study, Muskies and walleyes were observed in very close proximity to
one another, as the walleye is also a predator. Walleye made up 3.4% of
the total stomach content volume found in the Muskies in that study.
Bass species found accounted for 3.1%, even lower than that of
walleye. 63.5% of the total stomach content volume was made up of
yellow perch and various minnow species.

Source:http://www.brainerdmuskies.com/WhatDoMuskiesReallyEat.pdf


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## Fisherman 3234

I agree with weatherby, not to mention that there is only one resevoir in the state where there has been a "possible" natural reproduction taking place, so the muskies that are in there are at a set number unlike bass and crappie. If you want to put the blame on a predator taking bass and crappie out of that resevoir in large amounts, then I would probably put the blame on humans. Not to mention muskies aren't the only large predatory fish found in CC.......


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## fishdealer04

Muskies have been in there for a long time now. I have not caught 1 yet. I dont fish the lake a ton, maybe 4 times a month or so when I take my dad out. I have caught quite a few LM bass, some crappie, some perch, and a fair share of saugeye now as well. The lake is full of fish, its just a matter of finding them. The stocking of small muskies are not going to hurt this lake anymore. Most of those fish will not survive, they will be eaten by larger fish, die of natural causes, and the ones that do survive are not going to decimate the bass population.

If they are going to eat anything they are going to tear into the white bass in that lake, that have absolutley over run the lake. It is full of the 6 inch white bass. So in fact maybe the muskie will eat some of them up and therefore making a better white bass fishery as they will be able to grow larger.

We pulled in plenty of fish today and not once was anything eaten by a muskie, I have yet to see one in this lake. 

I do remember you posting earlier in the year talking about the nice messes of crappie you were catching at CC. Obvioulsy the muskies have not effected that much now have they?


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## Fish G3

Not a big fan of yours and to no offense I think your complaining to the wrong group of guys. There is plenty of lakes for bass and other game fish but there just arent to many with musky. Go fish somewhere else if you dont like it.


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## bonsai87

After all the years of service i would say the division of wildlife would know what they are doing by now...if they feel those muskies should be put in there...well i would say they have their reasons and have done their research....if that spot isnt producing the #'s of fish that you like...the state is full of other places to hook one..branch out and give it a try


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## Ol'Bassman

What is a disturbing scene to some is good news for the rest of us. Glad to hear they are stocking more muskies in the lake. 

In my opinion the lake has far too many white bass and those 12" ers will do a good job of controling their numbers. Looking forward to some nice big and fat muskies for years to come. Sounds like good lake management to me bringing in musky to eat the white bass! 

Ryan, I've never seen any credible scientific studies that indicate that muskies target LMB more than any other fish. Until I do, I cannot place any credibility in your concerns. I think the low numbers of LMB are due more to the pressure they receive from fishermen than they receive from muskies. That and the minimum size limits on LMB's. From you post, I assume you are complaining because you would have liked to see a truck full of LMB's dumped in the lake. Your problems seems to be about the allowcation of funds. For my two cents, I like the diversity of being able to go to Cowan for crappie, EF for Hybrids, OR for LMB or CF and, yes, musky at CC.


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## flintlock

Great news, love the diversity.


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## bwhntr4168

guys before you throw ryan under the bus !!! what he is saying is, instead of the state of ohio spending the money on the stocking of fish at this time ( becaue the muskie are doing just fine) as well as plenty of other species in the lake!! buy some trash cans!!


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## bkr43050

bwhntr4168 said:


> guys before you throw ryan under the bus !!! what he is saying is, instead of the state of ohio spending the money on the stocking of fish at this time ( becaue the muskie are doing just fine) as well as plenty of other species in the lake!! buy some trash cans!!


I don't really think that was what he was saying at all. I think he was obviously flaming at the muskie folks based on some very inaccurate and misleading notions that muskie ruin bass fisheries. As Weatherby stated they feed on the shad as their primary food source. I am sure that the bass that are in the lake make a bigger dent in the panfish population than the muskie given their numbers in relationship to muskie. Just because you don't want to target the muskie it is suddenly a "nuisance". I don't really know why anyone who enjoys the fight of a nice size bass would not enjoy the fight from something much, much larger. Unfortunately I think I know the answer and it is involves $$$$$. If there were tournaments on a regular basis to target the muskie then the tourney fishermen would covet them. I say that everyone should enjoy the catch and not the prize.

Oh by the way, don't tell the panfish folks that the bass are putting a hurt on their fish. They may start promoting the harvest of the bass to save their fish.


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## truck

bwhntr4168 said:


> guys before you throw ryan under the bus !!! what he is saying is, instead of the state of ohio spending the money on the stocking of fish at this time ( becaue the muskie are doing just fine) as well as plenty of other species in the lake!! buy some trash cans!!


Realy??? You Muskie fisherman say what you want to, but there are a lot more crappie and bass fisherman on this lake than muskie fisherman. In my opinion and 25 years experience on that lake it was a sad day. If you think bass and crappie fishing is tough there now, it has just begun.


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## TeamPlaker

bwhntr4168 said:


> guys before you throw ryan under the bus !!! what he is saying is, instead of the state of ohio spending the money on the stocking of fish at this time ( becaue the muskie are doing just fine) as well as plenty of other species in the lake!! buy some trash cans!!


I think he threw himself under the bus. That was a fraction of what was said. It seemed the main argument was made that stocking muskie in CC is an attempt to draw out of towners leading to more garbage around the lake.
Here's a thought: Wouldn't attracting out of towners lead to more revenue and ultimately the ability to afford to maintain more trash cans around the lake? And... what exactly does that mean?? Only out of town muskie fishermen leave trash? I travel to Cave Run several times a year to fish for muskie and never once have I had the notion "Hey! I'm an out of towner... I'm just gonna throw my trash right here!" The people who leave their trash are usually the ones along the shoreline drowning nightcrawlers, looking for "anything that will bite".
I don't want to get too long winded so I'll be brief on this point. I get the notion that people will blame a bad fishing day on whatever they can rather than to just accept it for what it is... a bad day. I can't tell you how many posts I've read on here "Went to CC, we caught 50 slabs, kept 30." I don't think there are many fish, let alone muskie, that eliminate 30 fish in a day. You could stock a thousand muskie in that lake and they couldn't damage the fish population as much as a hundred people could (and would).


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## Katmandu

I can understand Ryan's off-the-cuff reaction to seeing a truck load of predators being stocked into the lake...but if you could compare that to the mass of predators already there...it would be a drop in the bucket. Weatherby hit the nail on the head (with nice science based backup) that most predators prefer soft-rayed fish (those spines on sunfish are there for a reason) and especially if soft-rayed fish like shad or suckers are more numerous in a lake (and they are!) then a good predator is going to go for the easy meal. 
Ohio Wildlife has many hats to wear and does not just look out for a few individuals but must think on a whole state approach. Our money (from tackle and licences etc.) goes to fund fish stockings and if a population of popular sport/food fish cannot naturally sustain itself...then stockings come into play. Caesar has so many different types of people using the lake for fishing that Wildlife will never please them all...but they do their best given science and what people want. As for trash cans...talk to your state legislature...that is a Parks (not Wildlife) issue and it was to save money because they again were budget-cut. The difference is Parks relys on the State government for funding (from our tax dollars) and Wildlife relys on user fees (licences) and a specific tax on fishing/hunting equipment (administered by the Federal govt) for funding...so not stocking muskies would not get you any closer to getting trashcans back...nor would it improve your bass/crappie fishing either...Thanks for letting me carry on!


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## crittergitter

ryanhipsher said:


> I was an eye witness today of The State of Ohio stocking Muskie in Caesar's Creek Lake. Around 1:30 I was waiting on the the Tuesday Night Tournament to start when a large truck with the Division of Wildlife sticker on the side of it pulls to the side of the water and dumps, I forget the digits, but it was a lot of 12 inch Muskie. You Muskie fisherman say what you want to, but there are a lot more crappie and bass fisherman on this lake than muskie fisherman. In my opinion and 25 years experience on that lake it was a sad day. If you think bass and crappie fishing is tough there now, it has just begun. It is sad to say that the State of Ohio can afford to stock a bunch of no count muskie that are good for nothing but eating, #*&%@!, and slimming your boat, instead of a decent trash receptacle to keep our parks cleaner. All they are trying to do is lure out of towner to this lake. The only thing they are going to accomplish is more trash laying on the banks and in the parking lots! The lake is pitiful enough, let alone doing stupid things like that. I don't know who makes the decisions, but they clearly are not fisherman, and they are obviously not studying fish biology. So, for the old timers who like to go over to cc and float a bobber and relax, and bring home a couple slabs to put in the frying pan, you can thank the State of Ohio when you jerk and recieve nothing, because a muskie has took your whole shootin match. I don't want to offend, but it's my opinion. My fishing partner, Keving and I won tonight with 2 fish. The ONLY 2 fish caught. We won 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and big fish. Out of 25-30 competitors, BUT the Muskie's are biting! Thanks Ohio!


This should get an award for post of the year. I think someone was hittin grandpa's cough medicine a little to much last night.


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## riverKing

all I am going to say is that, before that poor creek was impounded. It would have had a strong native population of muskies. but due to the habitat the largemouth and crappie populations would have been small and isolated to non existant.
its a sad day when sportsman forget science and want only one fish species and when they dont have enough talent to catch the fish they blame it on biologists.

edit in
I forgot to mention, it was either in the 97' or the 03' fisheries transactions(july I think) there was an article done on predator preffered species. only four species showed black bass in measurable numbers in stomach contents. smallmouth, largemouth, and spotted bass; as well as channel catfish but they also had the widest range in foods taken. striped bass, muskie, gar and flathead catfish, all had less than 10% fish OTHER than cluepidae


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## sporto

"NO Count Muskie" - That could be the most retarded post I've read on here and I'm a tourny fisherman, so please don't think that all tourny guys are idiots...


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## Bluebuster6912

I sure do love a good arguement
As far as im concernend I wish they would stock Bluecats, Pike, Lake trout, and anything else that will live in the lake. All I really want to do is catch fish, Whatever the species is. Variety is the spice of life


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## wader

So, what's up Hipsher? Are you going to continue taking this beating, or post some science to defend yourself? Without all of that no good meddling from the state, you wouldn't have a lake to fish on, would you? You wouldn't have saugeyes to catch, would you? I guess expecting some real thought from a guy who pulls a boat with a limo was asking too much...


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## truck

Bluebuster6912 said:


> I sure do love a good arguement
> As far as im concernend I wish they would stock Bluecats, Pike, Lake trout, and anything else that will live in the lake. All I really want to do is catch fish, Whatever the species is. Variety is the spice of life


About the best thing I have read so far


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## dtigers1984

Remember when throwing the ODNR under the bus that the federal government signs off on the state programs. A state must submit plans for any wildlife projects funded by tax dollars collected under the Pittman-Robertson Act. (10% of every dollar collected in the sale of hunting and fishing equipement) Therefore, if the State of Ohio is being neglegent in their use of tax dollars collected by this act, the federal government can withhold funds. Which they have not done. Just another angle to look at.


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## Nitro_boy

I think that the fact that we aren't catching crappies in 85 degree water has little to do with the muskies. The fishing isn't good during this warm water time. I caught tons of crappies this spring in shallow water along with bass but I'm not very good at deep fishing for these same fish so during the summer I fish saugeyes and go pontoon boating and jetskiing till the water cools.


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## Jackfish

Wow... I had hoped we had gotten past this. The idea of a site like this is a place for sportsman to share tips and tales. And in the process learn and become more educated about our waterways.

The original poster made a number of comments and implications that have no grounds in reality.

Let me share a few thoughts:
-	Every major study one can find will draw the same conclusion  Musky predetation does not have a meaningful impact on other game fish populations. Dont believe this because Im saying it  do some research. Saying I think this, or this is my opinion does not count as research.
-	Human predation  even the OP stating they want to take a few slabs home will account for a much larger loss of fish than Musky ever will. You and anyone else harvesting their catch, is a much larger problem than Musky.
-	Majority of Musky fisherman are catch and release. They by and large go out of their way to preserve the recourse they are pursuing. In addition, Musky fishermen rarely use live bait. 98% of them are fishing by boat. Do you really think someone that would take 15 minutes to revive a spent Musky is going to be the guy to dump his trash in the parking lot?
-	Crappie fishermen are by and large catch and take. A fair number are shore fisherman. A fair number are using live bait.
-	Who is more likely to leave trash? Someone who has invested hundreds to thousands (musky gear is very pricy) of dollars to pursue a rare sport fish, with the hopes of a photograph and a release. Or someone who hikes down to the lake with a bunch of bait containers, and hopes to take a bunch of fish home with them?
-	Having out of town fisherman coming to CC because of Musky would be great. It would pull in revenue; it would be a success story that would shine a favorable light on our park management. Favorable lights = makes politicians look good = more dollars spent in those areas. This would be a plus for everyone.

In your post you state I dont want to offend anyone.

Well you did. 

Your thoughts on Musky are risk to a very rare and prized sport fish.

If you want better Crappie action, maybe you should try leaving a few slabs in the water instead of the pan. You want a cleaner park; take a trash bag with you next time you head down there.

On top of that, you claim Musky are good for nothing. Come on. I will fish for everything from Carp using corn, to Brown trout on fly. All species have their place. Im very happy that Musky at CC have started to find theirs.


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## Oldlogin

wader said:


> So, what's up Hipsher? Are you going to continue taking this beating, or post some science to defend yourself? Without all of that no good meddling from the state, you wouldn't have a lake to fish on, would you? You wouldn't have saugeyes to catch, would you? I guess expecting some real thought from a guy who pulls a boat with a limo was asking too much...


Gee , if he can't find any fish to catch anymore, maybe he should hire a GUIDE


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## fishymcgoo

crittergitter said:


> This should get an award for post of the year. I think someone was hittin grandpa's cough medicine a little to much last night.




thats pretty funny i have to say i also believe that those musky wont hurt anything. however i do wish some money would be spent cleaning up some trash. i have to disagree that the people that leave trash are the ones drowning nightcrawlers and catching anything. i think the people that are leaving trash are a mixture of all kinds of fisherman. actualy they dont even deserve to be called fisherman so i will call them people that should be wearing a helmet that fish i will sometimes throw a nightcrawler out in the river and just sit and enjoy the outdoors and i not only dont leave trash but i pick up other peoples trash. and its not only the people that drink that leave trash because i have a friend that has a couple beers while we fish and he picks up others trash too and is very respectful. i was fishing using live bait a couple weeks ago and a guy walked by and said i should try "real" fishing sometime. i just ignored him as he walked away and threw his cigarette butt on the ground. i use live bait and artifical lures. i also obey the law and am very respectful not only to other people enjoying our many fishing holes but to the environment as well. i kind of got long winded and this was originally about muskies and i have only caught a few but i had to get my 2 cents in about the trash.


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## Jackfish

http://www.nwtigermuskies.com/muskiediet.html

Washing Dept Natural Resources study linked above.

Here is another one that is out of MN:

The Facts About Muskies 
The MN DNR has been working feverishly to find out some hard facts on Muskie diet, stocking effects and the overall impact on lakes before and after the introduction of this Top of the line predator, here is some of their observations and research, I hope you will take a moment to read and open your mind to these new and ground breaking findings, and the good news is they are going to be spending more time and effort to to gain more knowledge and get the FACTS out to all concerned interests 

MN DNR Biologist Jerry Younk notes that Trophy Pike outnumber Trophy Muskie in the same lakes 3 to 1. 

Muskies grow as large in Southern MN (French Lake) as they do in any other region of the State, this is do to ample food supplies of Rough fish. 

Muskies diets were found to contain very few species of fish that may be of concern to Anglers, Bozek 1999 investigated 34 Northern Wisconsin lakes through the spring summer and fall Yellow Perch and White Sucker where the primary diet with crayfish a bigger part of the diet than Walleye despite being abundant on many of the lakes, Muskies actually eat more small Muskies that Walleye. 

Muskies once thought to have extreme negative effects on Pike and Walleyes were studied by Fayram in 2005, evaluating evidence of predation and competition between several species of fish including Walleye, Northern Pike, Smallmouth Bass, Largemouth Bass and Muskie, the findings came to a shock to some but were confirmed beliefs of many that fish lakes like Mille Lacs and Vermillion, in the study lakes the only fish that had a negative effect were the Largemouth Bass negatively effecting the abundance of adult Walleye during electro fishing studies, the Muskie electro fishing effort showed that Muskies have a positive effect on the numbers of adult Walleye, stating competition between these fish was stated as unlikely. 

Muskies are now being actively stocked in 41 MN lakes by the MN DNR there findings were focused on 7 species and lake classes these are the results. 

Northern Pike numbers declined in 3 individual lakes and increased on 2 with the weight of fish being no different across the state, the distribution of fish per netting or trap was similar to years before the Muskie was introduced. 

Walleye Numbers Increased on 9 individual lakes and declined on 2, with a lack of year class stocking being sited in 1 of these lakes, the average weight was not any different statewide. 

Yellow Perch numbers increased on 3 lakes, with no significant decreases and no difference statewide, with distributions of fish similar to before stocking. 
Bluegill numbers increased on 2 lakes and showed no significant decline or statewide trends. 

White Sucker numbers declined on 4 lakes and increased on 1, with no significant statewide or lake class trends. 

Black Crappie numbers increased on 2 lakes in gill nets and showed no difference in trap nets, post stocking numbers were within or above in comparison with lake classes. 

Tullibee showed no differences at any level before or after stocking 
. 
Therefore the lack of any constant trends across any of these species lakes or lake classes combined with the fact that most of these lakes were considered above the average for their lake class and within the range expected suggests that Muskie coexist and have coexisted very well in these types of lakes and at the densities that the MN DNR Manages its Muskellunge program. 

We here in MN enjoy some of the best fishing on the planet and its all due to the hard work and dedication of a few individuals and the MN DNR, when we can work together to manage the resource for the sake of the resource we hit a home run every time, as is evident in the Walleye and Sturgeon program on Rainy River, also the extensive regulatory needs that have been imposed on the Walleye Factory Mille Lacs, if we can understand that regulations are imposed for the betterment and welfare of the ecosystem and not as a punishment for individuals or groups we will continue to have great fishing opportunities. 

Thank You 

Bozek,M.A. T.M. Burri, and R.V. Frie. 1999. Diets of Muskellunge in Northern Wisconsin lakes. North American Journal of Fisheries Management 19:258-270 
Fayram A.H., M.J. Hansen, and T.J. Ehlinger. 2005. Interactions between Walleyes and Four Fish Species with Implications to Walleye Stocking. North American Journal of Fisheries Management25:1321-1330 
MN DNR Preliminary Stocking Data 66-0038-00. 2007. 
Fish Community Response to Muskie Introduction, MN DNR M.Knapp., S.Mero, and D. Bohlander. 2007.


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## Nightprowler

This is a masterpiece because it puts to an end the age old question,"Doesn't anyone know an easy way to remove those nasty "Y" bones from a Northern or Muskie?"
http://www.nobonesaboutit.com/fillet2.html
Now we have plenty to practice on....jus kiddin.....sorta!


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## Juan More Fish

I have never been to CC, But would like to fish there. I have heard good things, and the idea of hooking in to a musky intrigues me.
I like white bass, and crappie. But, i do not leave my trash/line evry where. Its sad that other fisherman, leave their trash cartons from worms/shrimp or other bait packages around. The forum the guy started here, was his idea. I dont think it matters,For people to get upset, because ODNR is not gonna change it!2nd, Ithinking he was just blowing off some smoke, on what he thought.Sometimes, we dont know all the facts,and insert our foot.
CC is a deep lake, and hopefully,ill meet some great fisherman down there sometime. BENT POLES, AND STRAIGHT LINES FOR EVERYONE!


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## mpd5094

I don't look at Southwest's Ohio's forum much, as I don't fish that area. I have to say, the original post was hilarious. I can just picture the bottle of Jack next to the feathered pen when it was written!


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## farleybucks

As someone else said....just because it was a bad day on the water...may mean it was just a bad day on the water and not that musky are to blame. When that cooler front moved in this past weekend it has cooled down the fishing at all of my normal spots. Maybe you should just count your blessings that you did catch two fish and move on. 

I noticed you told people to check out your site in another post by googling your name, so I did. I found a lot of pics of a lot of fish caught at CC of both crappie and bass.

Most people would be happy at that kind of success at any lake.


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## Oldlogin

Click on the original posters name ---go to the links-----business must be bad---- this is starting to look like a trolling post---like I said before, maybe he needs to hire a guide-----


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## Rob

Wow! I don't even know where to start. I can't believe you bass fisherman would believe this stuff. But hey, everybody is entitled to there opinion, however twisted, IN MY OPINION.

rOB


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## MuskieJim

Study after study, it's clear that muskies may be eating a small (very small) percentage of gamefish (5%)? That means that 95% of the problem is the fisherman, not the fish 

Yeah, we've all heard stories about it. I personally have had muskies shread a smallmouth right off the end of my line. But blaming muskies for you not catching fish is just silly. Like Weatherby said, there's been muskies present in that lake for years! Maybe the chef recently changed the menu from shad to crappies


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## ryanhipsher

I can obviously see that I have bit off more than I can chew, I voiced my opinion thats all I was doing I didn't mean to offend anybody but it was upsetting but it is upsetting when you walk into the restroom and theres trash laying everywhere knowing that they have the money to stock the lake instead of trash removel! For a fish thats all its good for is a fight, when you eat them you take a chance of getting choked to death because of the bones!! The lake has done had plenty enough of Muskys that are doing just fine, I feel that it needs no more! If you want to catch a fish that puts up a good fight, get you some dough balls and catch Carp, the hook up ratio is much better and they are easier to pattern  They don't hurt a thing! Thats my opinion, all species of fish are beautiful no matter what kind! Keep the bobbers bobbing and your line tight and catch a fish, I LOVE YOU ALL no matter what you say!! 
P.S.
I don't think Iaconelli got skulled this bad when he ripped
the American flag off that back of his boat! Nothing but 
love on this end of the keyboard, SEE YOU ON THE WATER!!


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## H2O Mellon

Wow.

Heck it's not even winter yet and we get a post like this. I love the fact that CC could possibly be a "trophy" Muskie lake! (I'm talking a C-P-R trophy Muskie lake.)


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## Weatherby

Ryan,

There is no connection between stocking CC (or any lake) and having trash receptacles and cleaning the restrooms. They are controlled by two (or more) different departments. 




> For a fish thats all its good for is a fight, when you eat them you take a chance of getting choked to death because of the bones!!



Why do you fish for bass? Do you keep and eat everyone of them? I would suspect you ENJOY fishing for them and that you don't eat them all.

I fish for muskie for the same reason. I enjoy it. There is no feeling in the world (to me) like seeing a 4' fish following your lure and smashing it at boat side. Jumping completely out of the water several times while trying to throw the lure. Getting it in the net is sometimes just a bonus.


You mention carp in your latest post. Carp are (were) an invasive species. Although fun to catch they do hurt alot of things. Ever see them schooled up in the shallow water in spring? Notice that they leave a big "mud slick" in the water? Think that area may be a spawning area for other fish?


There are a couple "problems" I see with your posts. 

1. Your opinion is based on non-scientific data. 

2. With your opinion and seeing how you are a public figure (at least thats the impression I get from your website, self promotion, and sponorship from 105.9 The Rebel.) There are some people that will take your word as the truth, when it is not.


I invite you to come to the "dark side" and go muskie fishing with us sometime.

One last thing. Nice fish!


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## TheKing

As a fisherman on the lake since before it was filled, I'll gladly add to the dispute. CC was an outtanding LM lake from the start and may still be that in the non-pressured condition, but a lure thrown every minute to each sweet spot all day long makes it a big suck for LM in the present day. It has been an "OK" lake for bluegill, never a spot to seek the crappie or saugeye for those that know what good conditions are around the tri-state waters. A great lake for carp, drum and white bass, especially in the creeks over the last 10 years.
Muskie might thrive - and since nothing else does under the pressure that this lake has, then it just could become a niche for CC. CC needs a thriving species - tournaments keep the LM hard to find and worn out, maybe Muskie is worth our support to be the dominator. I have not heard of hundreds flocking to catch tournament Muskie.........yet.


----------



## Fishman

Muskys being stocked is the end all be all of other fish populations. The world is also flat.
Simple researching either of those statements before calling foul would yeild results stating otherwise. I think you owe it to people to know the facts, before you preach on such a subject.

Most people would consider all state lakes to lack quality fishing. There are a lot of bass in our lakes, shocking surveys prove that. You arn't fishing a farm pond anymore, you're fishing a public lake that holds a lot more features than a glorified hole in the ground plus additional pressure.

Fish have preferences, as others stated before. Our lakes are packed with shad. Hybrid stripers havn't put a dent in the population, nor will the musky. Reality of it is these lakes can support these fish and it opens an entirley new fishery for hardcore musky fishermen, plus the chance of you catching one while fishing for another specie.

I'm REALLY interested to see what happens to East Forks fishery. The lake is a tough one to fish, but consistanly yeilds 3-4lbers on Tuesday night tournaments. Shad out the gills too. Already heard of a few guys catching them, one guy said the one he caught was probably 17". Personally I think it's a good thing!


----------



## eatwhatyoukeep

If the crappie numbers are down it is more than likely due to the white bass. I'm fairly sure that white bass spawn before crappie and they probably fed heavily on the crappie fry since they seem to chase anything that moves. I agree that they have taken over the lake. I'm sure muskies will eat white bass but they really prefer longer/narrower fish


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## eatwhatyoukeep

Here is an article about pike and muskie prey preference. Bass isn't listed but they are certainly easier for a fish to swallow than a perch. Muskies might eat saugeye too.

http://www.greatplainsgameandfish.com/fishing/muskies-pikes-fishing/gf_aa086203a/


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## MuskieLuv

Is it snowing outside and I just didn't notice?? It's a little early for your Muskie ate my Bass debate. Lets throw in the Muskie size limit conversation and maybe a little politics for good measure. LOL

The data is there and the studies have been done. I hate to see CC have bad Bass fishing just as much as the next guy, but give it up with the Muskies being the problem. Unless CC has a rare strain of Skies that are vicious Bass eating machines, I think your problem lies elswhere. I don't hear stories of big numbers of Bass being caught at CJ, Acton, EF, etc. No Muskie there!

The budget was only one part of the decision to remove the trash cans and this was happening in other parks around the state before it happened at CC. The other reasons were thier appereance, smell, and mainly the amount of nusiance animals they were feeding in the parks. As stated before, they were different budgets anyway. 

No one makes you fish CC, no one makes you caugh up money every tuesday night in hopes of one good fish. Go somewhere else if CC makes you so upset. I think there are a lot of fisherman that hit CC all the time and manage to have a good time and are not complaining. The only thing that has trouble coexisting at CC is on top of the water and not below. 

ML


----------



## ryanhipsher

Weatherby said:


> Ryan,
> 
> There is no connection between stocking CC (or any lake) and having trash receptacles and cleaning the restrooms. They are controlled by two (or more) different departments.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why do you fish for bass? Do you keep and eat everyone of them? I would suspect you ENJOY fishing for them and that you don't eat them all.
> 
> I fish for muskie for the same reason. I enjoy it. There is no feeling in the world (to me) like seeing a 4' fish following your lure and smashing it at boat side. Jumping completely out of the water several times while trying to throw the lure. Getting it in the net is sometimes just a bonus.
> 
> 
> You mention carp in your latest post. Carp are (were) an invasive species. Although fun to catch they do hurt alot of things. Ever see them schooled up in the shallow water in spring? Notice that they leave a big "mud slick" in the water? Think that area may be a spawning area for other fish?
> 
> 
> There are a couple "problems" I see with your posts.
> 
> 1. Your opinion is based on non-scientific data.
> 
> 2. With your opinion and seeing how you are a public figure (at least thats the impression I get from your website, self promotion, and sponorship from 105.9 The Rebel.) There are some people that will take your word as the truth, when it is not.
> 
> 
> I invite you to come to the "dark side" and go muskie fishing with us sometime.
> 
> One last thing. Nice fish!


My sponsor's have nothing to do with the fact of muskie being stocked at caesar's creek lake. Yes, I would like to think that I have an impact on the way that people can catch more fish and be more productive on the waters. That is why I have a website to prove that cc is not the "dead sea". There are nice black/white crappie, and bass to be caught. Out of my 25 years experience on that lake, fishing has changed over the last several years due to the muskie population, I will argue that.


----------



## ryanhipsher

My post last night was not due to the fact that I had a "bad day" on the lake. I wouldn't call cashing a $650 check a "bad day" I don't believe there are bad days if you are on the water with a pole in your hand. Everyday out there is a learning experience for ANYONE! There were also several posts stating that I needed to hire a guide. FOR WHAT? Because I have an opinion. Yes, the "facts" that all of you have copied and pasted in the reply box may be true, but those are "book facts". I guarantee that if you put 4 men/women that have spent 6 years in college studying habitats and diets of different types of fish in the same room as 4 men/women who have spent their life on the water fishing (some making a living out of knowing habitats and diets) there would be HEAVY debate about what does what. I think a lot of you have spent more time in front of a computer moniter instead of behind a trolling motor. This was just an OPINION! There was also another comment about me not having any talent. FISHING IS NOT JUST TALENT! IT IS KNOWLEDGE!! Anyone can throw bait into water and say they are fishing (the same people who are leaving trash behind for us to pick up) but it also takes skill and knowledge to be a fisherman. I don't have anymore trouble catching fish than the rest of you do, I just know that the muskie stocking is not going to HELP anything. Everyone has one type of fish that they like to catch more than others. I don't like catching muskie. They smell, and yes, they DO sometimes eat other fish off of your line when you are reeling in. That sucks! From any fisherman's point of view. I know I turned a few heads, well, more than a few with my original post, but IT WAS AN OPINION. Everyone has one and I honestly wasn't trying to offend or blow off steam with it. I am confident and proud at what I accomplish everytime I am on the water. Anytime you guys would like to stop by the house and see my trophy room, feel free to call me, and we will sit out on the porch and "sip grandpa's cough medicine". 
Just for the record Muskie are gone out of Rocky Fork Lake in Hillsboro. Bass fishing is booming and the crappie's are making a come back. Coincidence? For instance, Steve Greene's night tournament, I took 2nd place and big bass with a 6.2 largemouth at Rocky Fork Lake, and if you have viewed my website you would see that I have numerous 4-5 lb. bass from that lake. Why can't I do this at Caesar's Creek Lake anymore? By the way, THANKS steve for a great night tournament! 
SEE YOU ON THE WATER!


----------



## ryanhipsher

wader said:


> So, what's up Hipsher? Are you going to continue taking this beating, or post some science to defend yourself? Without all of that no good meddling from the state, you wouldn't have a lake to fish on, would you? You wouldn't have saugeyes to catch, would you? I guess expecting some real thought from a guy who pulls a boat with a limo was asking too much...


Well, I did take quite a beating, didn't I? Everything that was posted with scientific facts were all true, but when you are an EYE WITNESS to some things that are happening that books are saying doesn't happen, what are you going to believe? Book pages or your eyes? Pulling my bass boat with a limo doesn't require thought, just a little personality. Fishing requires thought, and my accomplishments can speak volumes. By the way, the state that does all the "no good meddling" was not the persons responsible for building that lake period, so I should thank the US ARMY CORP OF ENGINEERS, for having a lake to fish on.


----------



## big_b16

Somebody mentioned baskets of fish early on in this post. Got me to thinking of a story I heard of a basket of largemouth sunk on a point on Rocky or Paint a while back. Guy who snagged it said there was another angler who drove up to that point several times while he was fishing there. Then he snagged that basket and had a pretty good idea why. Wish I remembered who they said the persistent fisherman was.

Rocky fork has a hair more vegetation than CC does. That might have something more to do with numbers of fish surviving a spawn. Plus, at CC there were many fish yanked off beds during tournaments during the spawn. That in and of itself was detrimental to the bass survival rates. If you would like to find a direct reason for bass not surviving that well, look at the guys who yank fish off the beds for a couple hundred bucks each week. Then wonder why the bass survival rates are down. Many true fishermen who value the species will not fish bedding fish...but some people only care at certain times of the year.


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## Bassnpro1

Ryan, I think you personally convinced me to start taking the 15" bass out of CC that I catch. Unlike Musky, Bass are good to eat!


----------



## H2O Mellon

ryanhipsher said:


> The lake is pitiful enough, let alone doing stupid things like that. I don't know who makes the decisions, but they clearly are not fisherman, and they are obviously not studying fish biology.


So... your complaining about the quality of CC then also complaining about them stocking it with something that has proven to have been a success so far? 




ryanhipsher said:


> The only thing they are going to accomplish is more trash laying on the banks and in the parking lots!


Huh? Stocking of Muskie = An increase in trash? 




ryanhipsher said:


> My fishing partner, Keving and I won tonight with 2 fish. The ONLY 2 fish caught. We won 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and big fish. Out of 25-30 competitors


Just a question (and I'm being serious) if only two fish were caught how did you win 1st, 2nd & 3rd places? I can understand 1st, 2nd and Big Fish, but 3rd?




ryanhipsher said:


> I don't know who makes the decisions, but they clearly are not fisherman, and they are obviously not studying fish biology.


I understand your trying to become a professional bass fisherman, but are you currently or have you studied Fish Biology? I ask becasue there are those on OGF who are studying this or have studied this who completely disagree with your thoughts/ideas.




ryanhipsher said:


> There was also another comment about me not having any talent. FISHING IS NOT JUST TALENT! IT IS KNOWLEDGE!! Anyone can throw bait into water and say they are fishing (the same people who are leaving trash behind for us to pick up) but it also takes skill and knowledge to be a fisherman.


Again... What? So they people who are simply throwing bait in the water are also slobs leaving trash behind? For someone griping about who has knowledge and talking down about the "book smarts" and all that, you are providing zero resources for your statements. 




ryanhipsher said:


> My post last night was not due to the fact that I had a "bad day" on the lake. I wouldn't call cashing a $650 check a "bad day" I don't believe there are bad days if you are on the water with a pole in your hand. Everyday out there is a learning experience for ANYONE! There were also several posts stating that I needed to hire a guide. FOR WHAT? Because I have an opinion. Yes, the "facts" that all of you have copied and pasted in the reply box may be true, but those are "book facts". I guarantee that if you put 4 men/women that have spent 6 years in college studying habitats and diets of different types of fish in the same room as 4 men/women who have spent their life on the water fishing (some making a living out of knowing habitats and diets) there would be HEAVY debate about what does what. I think a lot of you have spent more time in front of a computer moniter instead of behind a trolling motor. This was just an OPINION! There was also another comment about me not having any talent. FISHING IS NOT JUST TALENT! IT IS KNOWLEDGE!! Anyone can throw bait into water and say they are fishing (the same people who are leaving trash behind for us to pick up) but it also takes skill and knowledge to be a fisherman. I don't have anymore trouble catching fish than the rest of you do, I just know that the muskie stocking is not going to HELP anything. Everyone has one type of fish that they like to catch more than others.  I don't like catching muskie. They smell, and yes, they DO sometimes eat other fish off of your line when you are reeling in. That sucks! From any fisherman's point of view. I know I turned a few heads, well, more than a few with my original post, but IT WAS AN OPINION. Everyone has one and I honestly wasn't trying to offend or blow off steam with it. I am confident and proud at what I accomplish everytime I am on the water. Anytime you guys would like to stop by the house and see my trophy room, feel free to call me, and we will sit out on the porch and "sip grandpa's cough medicine".
> Just for the record Muskie are gone out of Rocky Fork Lake in Hillsboro. Bass fishing is booming and the crappie's are making a come back. Coincidence? For instance, Steve Greene's night tournament, I took 2nd place and big bass with a 6.2 largemouth at Rocky Fork Lake, and if you have viewed my website you would see that I have numerous 4-5 lb. bass from that lake. Why can't I do this at Caesar's Creek Lake anymore? By the way, THANKS steve for a great night tournament!
> SEE YOU ON THE WATER!


Count how many times you say "I" or commit on what YOU've done. Please understand there are other people out there, other fishermen out there who are just as dedicated and (gasp!) just as good as you who like to Muskie fish. Until folks like yourself realize this, posts such as yours are only going to do more harm than good to our sport (fishing). As someone else mentioned wheter you want to admit it or not, you not only represent your own image when you post, but also those of your sponsors. Trust me, I have multiple national sponsors who donate products or money to our club, none of which like to see their people posts things like this. Posting topics that can be backed by proof is another thing.




ryanhipsher said:


> they DO sometimes eat other fish off of your line when you are reeling in. That sucks!


 I like that comment. Come on, please think about what you typed. When you throw a crankbait aren't you hoping that a Bass does the same thing? When a Bass hits a crankbait they are hoping it's a nice juicy shad or other bait fish. So... isn't a Muskie doing the same thing? Oh by they way, a few years ago at the Kettering Rec Center my son had a very nice Largemouth hit the Bluegill he was reeling in, so Bass do it too. 



ryanhipsher said:


> I don't like catching muskie.


Perfectly clear and there is nothing wrong with that. I don't Muskie fish either, but I also know that the Muskie isn't the Terroristic Toothy Demon that your claiming they are. ( I can provide more stats for you, but it would be "book facts". For example, please refer to NAFC's Hunting Trophy Muskies and Northerns book from the 90's by Joe Bucher.) For the record, in my own opinon I think the state should turn CC into a trophy Flathead or Blue lake! 

Maybe this is a good time for a Muskie joke I heard while in upper Minnesota fishing for Northerns years ago: -_*A few boats were out on Lake Vermillion for opening day of Muskie season fishing a cove. All of a sudden they heard an old woman start screaming that her baby fell in the water. Of corse, they flew over to try and help. Once they got there they realized the woman had walked out to her dock to check the mail box with her poodle. What happened next was that the poodle jumped in the lake, it wasn't a real baby. The lady was craying and beside herself nonethe less. She informed the fishermen that not long after the poodle went in a huge Muskie came up and ate it. The fishermen all at once asked.... "What color was your poodle".*_


----------



## The Yeti

There seem to be a lot of various emotions on both sides but here's my reaction:

I see stories and pictures all the time of guys standing next to a cooler absolutely full of crappies, bluegills, perch, bass, etc. but no one complains about over-harvesting until a truck-load of muskie is dumped in the lake? That makes less sense than you know whats on a nun! Maybe instead of blaming a bunch of 12" fish, you should blame yourself. I'm sure little bluegills and crappies aren't the only thing your diet consists of! Not to mention the amount of pressure CC gets is ridiculous compared to most lakes.

And guess what tastes just like walleye? Yup...muskie. So you see, they actually ARE good for something (bones shmones). And I still can't figure out why people go to a giant lake to catch little panfish. I can go to the local stream or some backyard pond and catch huge ones all day long! Saves on bait, gas money, time, etc. Maybe if you were a little friendlier, a landowner would give you permission?


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## bwhntr4168

Welcome , to the ryan hipsher roast!!!!!!!!!!


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## Carpn

Bassnpro1 said:


> Ryan, I think you personally convinced me to start taking the 15" bass out of CC that I catch. Unlike Musky, Bass are good to eat!


Heck...IMO muskie are great eating too....stir...stir stir...lol
Even Yeti thinks they are pretty good.


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## TeamPlaker

ryanhipsher said:


> I don't believe there are bad days if you are on the water with a pole in your hand.


Well, from the sound of it, you were on the water... and I may just be speculating, but I guess you had a pole in your hand. So... what's the problem?

It's apparently obvious that no matter how much you try to educate people with research and FACTS that they will believe what they want to believe. I wonder just how many people will try to add more facts to this post before it ultimately dies until another one just like it springs to life in the next coming months.
A quick story... early this spring I was goofing around with my ultralight and hooked a 10 inch bass, as I was reeling him in, a much larger bass (probably 6-7 lb. range) came out of nowhere and inhaled my catch.
Somebody should do something about those big bass, they're eating all the bass.


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## wader

ryanhipsher said:


> Pulling my bass boat with a limo doesn't require thought, just a little personality.


I guess a truck requires a real job, or a larger tournament check. That $650 went real far didn't it?


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## bwhntr4168

Nightprowler said:


> This is a masterpiece because it puts to an end the age old question,"Doesn't anyone know an easy way to remove those nasty "Y" bones from a Northern or Muskie?"
> http://www.nobonesaboutit.com/fillet2.html
> Now we have plenty to practice on....jus kiddin.....sorta!


its on now, i heard there good to eat if clean them right!!! now we know!!!!


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## eatwhatyoukeep

MuskieLuv said:


> The data is there and the studies have been done.
> ML


Since you know the studies have been done and the data is there please show us where to find it. Bass certainly fit the shape of prey that muskies and pike feed on. 

I don't think that is the only problem though, too many people are fishing and keeping too many fish. How many years does it take a bass to reach five pounds, seven years or longer? What are the odds that a fish has been caught in the 3rd thru 5th year so it never reaches five pounds? 

I don't fish much for bass anymore but I know Caesar has a lot of fish in it because we have caught quite a few this year. We have caught some nice crappie, white bass and saugeye. But I don't think we have caught a small crappie all year


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## MZehring

I don't usually chime in on stuff like this, but does it really worth all of this bickering back and forth. I mean after all The State chose to stock them, The Muskies are in the water and the last time I checked our small voice won't change what they are trained and educated to do.
Hope I don't offend, but seems simple.


----------



## fshnteachr

The Yeti said:


> That makes less sense than you know whats on a nun!


I am a little slow....someone help me out on this one?  LOL


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## lpead

rhymes with "pits on a nun"............


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## fshnteachr

lpead said:


> rhymes with "pits on a nun"............


i'm an idiot, thanks lpead.


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## MuskieLuv

"


eatwhatyoukeep said:


> Since you know the studies have been done and the data is there please show us where to find it. Bass certainly fit the shape of prey that muskies and pike feed on.
> 
> I don't think that is the only problem though, too many people are fishing and keeping too many fish. How many years does it take a bass to reach five pounds, seven years or longer? What are the odds that a fish has been caught in the 3rd thru 5th year so it never reaches five pounds?"
> 
> eatwhatyoukeep,
> 
> Read post #5 & #28, those state the general conclusion that all the studies that I have seen in fishing magizines, and reports you can find on the net. Instead of wanting more proof that muskies are not eating your Bass, why not look for studies that will convince your Bass friends that over harvest, pulling them off their beds, and fishing pressure probably play a bigger role than the 3% diet of the Muskie.
> 
> I don't fish for Bass but we have put 6 Bass in our boat over last couple years while Muskie fishing and none of them came from a stump, laydown or bank. All were open water fish over humps on big baits. 2 were over 5 pounds. All fish went back in the lake. I wonder if Ryans Skie went back in????
> 
> ML


----------



## bwhntr4168

IS all this really necessary?? in the end they still stocked the fish !!!! this is getting out of control over absolutely someones opinion!! its got so bad !! i think we should relax a little!!! why would a muskie fisherman get offended over this in the end they still stocked !!!!!!!!!! i think ive heard enough studies and research to last me a few years!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Roscoe

Ryan,is this the right approach to becoming a Real Bass Pro?Also did you ever hear of anybody who might have killed some Muskies because they didn't like them?You just have to work with what you are dealt.You do catch some nice Lunkers though.

Roscoe


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## Jackfish

bwhntr4168 said:


> IS all this really necessary?? in the end they still stocked the fish !!!! this is getting out of control over absolutely someones opinion!! its got so bad !! i think we should relax a little!!! why would a muskie fisherman get offended over this in the end they still stocked !!!!!!!!!! i think ive heard enough studies and research to last me a few years!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



How many times to you come across Bass that have had there gills slit and put back into the water??? This happens to musky - and I'm going to make a guess that it is not the musky fisherman doing this. If someone's opinion helps spread WRONG & HARMFUL concepts, then yes - it is necessary to point out they are wrong.


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## Jackfish

Wow - I just clicked on original posters homepage -

Pics of nice fish - most of which are not showing water in the background....

What is that 30, 40 crappies in a net laying on the ground? Decent musky bug eyed lying in what appears to be a driveway? Bass being held up with a house in the backgroud?

I'm guessing these guys are not still swimming....

And this guy is complaining about fishing quality? Really?


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## Harbor Hunter

I live right by Clear Fork Lake,it's known as a great musky lake and a great bass lake.Does that make sense?


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## imalt

the 260lb girl i saw on a jet ski last night at cc is whats eating all the bass in that lake. I know there is size limits on bass what about some size limits on what can get a bathing suit on that lake. i had just eaten dinner before i got there and saw that. everybody worried about whats eating what i just wish something would eat one of my lures.


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## bassman1976

the lakes in ky have muskie and bass and you can still catch a big bag of fish


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## symba

Wow. I want the 10 minutes I just spent reading this thread back...

"I dont like Muskie!"



"But I like Muskie!



"But I already said I don't....."


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## Procraft180

I'm not much of a "muskie" fisherman. I would have to agree that the population of bass in CC has declined since they started stocking the muskie's in there. I would agree with ryan on the fact that there is a difference in what you learn in books and what you learn in experience. I don't care what fish are stocked into which lakes. Most fish eat other fish thats there way of life. If a muskie eats a bass so be it. Bass eat bluegill which most of our kids fish for. Saying that muskie eat all the bass would be saying that bass eat all the bluegill, they continue to eat on eachother. They reproduce, i'm sure that a muskie will not eat a 5lb bass. Rocky fork is a good bass lake and there are not any muskies in it. It used to be a decent muskie lake many years ago from "what I have heard" from my grandparents. Muskie have every right to be in any lake that the state wants to put them in. It's not the muskie's choice. Also trying to defend ryan, if they are spending money on stocking lakes with fish, they are not spending money on trash cans and other receptacles to clean our lakes up. The example they are trying to set is that more fish is better than polluted lakes. Ryan keep on keeping on and do what you do.


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## ryanhipsher

wader said:


> I guess a truck requires a real job, or a larger tournament check. That $650 went real far didn't it?


wader, obviously, you know who I am. Apparently, you have fished with me, and I am sensing a little jealousy. If you would like to drop by sometime, I can show you how far $650 can go. You stay digging holes and I will keep on fishing for a living.


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## Sleprock

hahah what color was the poodle, ha 

cc should be 10 hp!!!!!!


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## fishdealer04

Jackfish said:


> Wow - I just clicked on original posters homepage -
> 
> Pics of nice fish - most of which are not showing water in the background....
> 
> What is that 30, 40 crappies in a net laying on the ground? Decent musky bug eyed lying in what appears to be a driveway? Bass being held up with a house in the backgroud?
> 
> I'm guessing these guys are not still swimming....
> 
> And this guy is complaining about fishing quality? Really?


Agreed 100%...but its easier to just blame the 12 inch muskies for the problem...

The only thing LMB and crappie area really good for is bait. Blue cats and Flatheads seem to really enjoy them


----------



## Rob

OK guys wanna throw your trash away??? Go to the campground ramp- they have trash containers. If you get there before the office opens (Surely you bass guys get out there early) its free and 3 lousy bucks when it is open.It's also good if you don't want to see other peoples trash. I'm not completely sure they allow limos in the campground though. lol


Rob


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## MuskieJim

bwhntr4168 said:


> IS all this really necessary?? in the end they still stocked the fish !!!! this is getting out of control over absolutely someones opinion!! its got so bad !! i think we should relax a little!!! why would a muskie fisherman get offended over this in the end they still stocked !!!!!!!!!! i think ive heard enough studies and research to last me a few years!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


There's not a musky fisherman in Ohio who cares what ryanhipsher or any other bass fisherman think. No one is offended by his opinion, but rather I suspect that we all fear what happens to any musky that is caught by him and others like him. "The state will still be stocking them". Well yes, but that doesnt help anyone. The state stocks fingerlings, and killing every mature fish you catch is just taking a step backwards. Like someone else said, if you were a tournament bass fisherman and saw a nice 5 pounder with its gills slit by ME (a musky fisherman) just because I didnt want a bass to hit my spinnerbait, I wanted a musky. It makes absolutely no sense. 

Lake St. Clair is one of the best musky fisheries on the planet. Is it a coincidence that it is also a trophy smallmouth fishery? Ever heard the term, survival of the fittest? We have a winner, ding ding ding! 

In the big picture of things, do I think killing the fish you catch is going to affect CC's fishery? No, probably not.


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## Yates

It sounds like everyone lack of fish has notting to do with ability ?


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## Oldlogin

MuskieJim said:


> There's not a musky fisherman in Ohio who cares what ryanhipsher or any other bass fisherman think. No one is offended by his opinion, but rather I suspect that we all fear what happens to any musky that is caught by him and others like him. "The state will still be stocking them". Well yes, but that doesnt help anyone. The state stocks fingerlings, and killing every mature fish you catch is just taking a step backwards. Like someone else said, if you were a tournament bass fisherman and saw a nice 5 pounder with its gills slit by ME (a musky fisherman) just because I didnt want a bass to hit my spinnerbait, I wanted a musky. It makes absolutely no sense.
> 
> Lake St. Clair is one of the best musky fisheries on the planet. Is it a coincidence that it is also a trophy smallmouth fishery? Ever heard the term, survival of the fittest? We have a winner, ding ding ding!
> 
> In the big picture of things, do I think killing the fish you catch is going to affect CC's fishery? No, probably not.


Lake of the Woods---Trophy Muskie, outstanding walleye, Trophy Smallmouth, and slab crappies to cry over------I give up---I think we are beating a dead Donkey here------


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## steveg11943

Does anyone know what lakes the state has stocked bass in? I would like to find out where I could get more information about the facts that determine where and why fish are stocked in certain lakes.


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## Weatherby

Bass are regularly stocked nowhere. Though I would guess that if a lakes population dropped drastically they might do it.


Most inland lakes are currently stocked with fish that have nearly 0% successful natural reproduction. Muskie, saugeye, trout, etc.


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## Fisherman 3234

Some people just don't want to listen to facts or to people who have fished in waters with good muskie and bass populations. Lake St. Claire is the best example. You can catch footballs and monster sized muskie. Enough said. What's the say Ron White uses? You can't fix ............


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## labman

DING DING DING,we have a winner muskie jim hit the nail on the head.


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## labman

and yes a cc muskie fishermen.


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## ryanhipsher

Jackfish said:


> Wow - I just clicked on original posters homepage -
> 
> Pics of nice fish - most of which are not showing water in the background....
> 
> What is that 30, 40 crappies in a net laying on the ground? Decent musky bug eyed lying in what appears to be a driveway? Bass being held up with a house in the backgroud?
> 
> I'm guessing these guys are not still swimming....
> 
> And this guy is complaining about fishing quality? Really?


Hey Jack, I do have some very nice pics of all of my fish. But let's clear some things up here. There is NOT one picture of me holding a bass with a house in the background. I release all of the bass that I catch, in hopes that they will get me another check someday. We do, however, eat crappie. The pictures that are of the 30 or 40 crappie in a net lying on the ground (they are nice one's, aren't they?) I put them in the freezer to eat throughout the summer when my tournament fishing starts. I fish no stop from March until November, there is little time to crappie fish. And who doesn't enjoy a little fish fry every now and then?


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## ryanhipsher

You have all mentioned that stocking muskie in cc is going to bring more revenue to the lake. Have any of you heard of Ray Scott? He started the first BASS tournament back in the 70's, and it is still going strong EVERYDAY. He has brought in more revenue than muskie fishing could ever dream about. Show me a muskie circuit that travels across the country and brings the $$$$$ to our cities and towns. Then show me a muskie fisherman who has made $3 million off of a muskie. Kevin VanDam has earned over $3 million for he bass that he has weighed in. How much of that do you think was revenue? How much do you think it was taxed? Hmm, sounds like a pretty good piece of revenue to me. Now, I know many of you are going to quote this and quote that, but getting to my point, you walk into the Bass Pro Shop and there are only 2 aisles of muskie fishing accessories. The rest are for Bass, Crappie, and Panfish. Which is bringing in more revenue? At one time The MDA Bass Tournament (now known as The Hospice Tournament) was the largest in the world. It had around 350-400 boats in it. How much revenue was that for Indian Lake and Ohio? The tournament fee is $120 per boat, that is $42,000-$48,000 in just one tournament. This also sounds like a pretty good piece of revenue to me.


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