# Lure worth trying



## bubba k (Mar 29, 2006)

Although an avid fisherman, I'm somewhat new to the muskie scene. I've caught my fair share of trophy bass, walleye, steelhead, etc, and now I'm hooked on muskie and really not interested in fishing for anything else. I've only caught a handful in my life thus far, but I'm getting more and more confident with what I doing and how I'm doing it. Reading and sharing info on the site really helps! Anyways, I recently found a new lure that I think could be productive. I'm seeing how a lot of guys are catching fish in the spring downsizing to bass-size baits. With that in mind, I picked up a spinner made by Blue Fox that is an imitation of a double cow girl. It's just a smaller version that is 1/4 oz. and about 3 inches long. It looks really good and worth trying!


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## bubba k (Mar 29, 2006)

Here's the lure:

http://www.basspro.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10151_-1_10001_10204646____SearchResults

Also, I added a skirt and attached a single hook to the treble, and put a twister tail on it to bulk it up a litle more.


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## esox62 (May 19, 2006)

heck ya those will work. they have the new twin turbos out, but didnt know about the mini ones..my best muskie{47"} was on a blk/sil musky buck back in '05 at w.b.


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## bubba k (Mar 29, 2006)

esox62 said:


> heck ya those will work. they have the new twin turbos out, but didnt know about the mini ones..my best muskie{47"} was on a blk/sil musky buck back in '05 at w.b.


I would think so....I plan on tryin them castin in the shallows this weekend....I'll let you know how I do.


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## ShutUpNFish (Apr 17, 2007)

Nothing special really...double bladed spinners of all sizes have been around for years...Same goes for the double cowgirls. Productivity is a result of how much "quality time" you put on the water and has little to do with the lures you use...as long as you have confidence it what you're using! 

If your question is will this lure catch muskies, the answer is YES. However, so will a plain piece of 1X1 wood with hooks attached. Don't fall victim to all the fancy gimicks out there today, I did that years ago and thats how I ended up with all the "junk" I have laying around and hardly use. Just find something you really/truely have confidence in that produces for you and stick with it. And put your time in on the water....Good Luck!


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## Cincyghosthunter (Jun 4, 2008)

I've used a Gizz 4 from Smack Tackle to catch some of mine

www.smacktackle.com


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## bubba k (Mar 29, 2006)

ShutUpNFish said:


> Nothing special really...double bladed spinners of all sizes have been around for years...Same goes for the double cowgirls. Productivity is a result of how much "quality time" you put on the water and has little to do with the lures you use...as long as you have confidence it what you're using!
> 
> If your question is will this lure catch muskies, the answer is YES. However, so will a plain piece of 1X1 wood with hooks attached. Don't fall victim to all the fancy gimicks out there today, I did that years ago and thats how I ended up with all the "junk" I have laying around and hardly use. Just find something you really/truely have confidence in that produces for you and stick with it. And put your time in on the water....Good Luck!


Don't you believe that showing fish something new (whether it is pattern, lure size, or design) can make a difference? I am new to the musky scene, but I know that most other species will respond well to certain lures when first introduced. I've obviously seen hundreds of double bladed spinners, but not in the size and shape that Blue Fox just put on the market. If they exist then I have never seen them anywhere. I'm not into the whole "gimmicky lure thing", but I have been witness to some pretty impressive results with new lures. I look for slight variations (like the blue fox mentioned above) rather than the bizarre stuff (crazy creature looking crankbaits). For example, I went pike fishing 3-4 years ago on Fletchers Pond in Michigan, and just about everyone on the lake fishes white spinnerbaits. I opted to use a white chatterbiat, and it outfished the spinnerbait that a few of my other buddies were using 3 to 1. I'm convinced that it was a result of using a lure that the fish had never seen before. The profile wasn't that much different, but the water displacement and vibration through the water was different enough to elicit strikes from fish that had been conditioned to a certain lure. I'm a firm believer that fish get weary especially older fish in lakes that get a lot of pressure (which are most in Ohio).


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## MuskieMan35 (Mar 5, 2008)

I agree with ShutUp- confidence is #1, time on water #1.1...
Here's some tips I like to live by after a few hours on the water-
I'm up to about 82 hours straight without a hookup.
(I'm not counting the skii I lost a few weeks ago on a crayfish rapala)

#1 - putting time on the water
#2 - fishing in those quality times at quality locations (moon changes- pre-thunderstorm)
#3 - When trolling- don't go too deep! 
#4 - When casting- ALWAYS! ALWAYS! Figure 8... deep & wide
#5 - Keep confidence up & put time on the water


I DIDN"T catch two skiies last year that followed to the boat becouse it was at the end of a 9 hour casting spree and I was tired & fishing sloppy... I'm convinced that IF I kept that lure in the water for another 2 ft... I would of been netting my two largest fish. Both fish played tag with the lure in the instance that I pulled it out of the water... 

Bubba- I agree with your "new or slightly different" concept as well.. but truly if you have confidence with what your using- that's all you need... Having confidence allows you to stay on the water for ....9 hours, it allows you to constantly be figure 8ting, it allows you to vary your retrieve... you stay on top of your game and your environment..
Believe me - a lake like Pymo requires you to have CONFIDENCE!


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## Coon_Shark (Feb 6, 2006)

bubba k said:


> Don't you believe that showing fish something new (whether it is pattern, lure size, or design) can make a difference?


Hi Bubba,
IMHO, I don't believe that showing them something new will make a difference. I really believe that if the vibration of the lure appeals to the fish, it will chase it down and take it. But certain colors, white in your example, produce better at certain lakes, conditions. I'm not for sure, but I think that fish don't have memory or enough logic to decifer (sp?). 

I just think that your surface bait's action-vibration appealed to the fish more. If everyone on the lake was using the same lure as you, I'm not even sure if they'd get conditioned to it? I just think that if the vibration appeals to the fish, it'll make a difference. Just my 2 cents.

But, I do believe that certain baits will out produce others outside of a persons confidence....but, in general, confidence is #1. I'd think that if it was only about confidence and not lure selection, we'd never spend $20 for a musky lure?


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## bubba k (Mar 29, 2006)

I don't argue confidence. I too feel that you have to feel confident with what you are doing and how you are doing it otherwise you won't give yourself a chance. However, if you aren't using the right lure with the right presentation then it doesn't matter. Fish may be dumb, but they aren't that dumb otherwise we'd all be catching loads of fish every time out. I just feel that lure innovations has to be a part of the equation. There's a reason why certain lures out-produce others. Although much of my frame of reference pertains to other species of fish, I'm learning that a lot of what I am having success doing works with various species. Getting a reaction strike from a hungry fish can happen by throwing a pop can with hooks, but enticing a weary fish that has been caught more than once takes a lot more than being "confident". Just my opinion.


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## bubba k (Mar 29, 2006)

_
#1 - putting time on the water
#2 - fishing in those quality times at quality locations (moon changes- pre-thunderstorm)
#3 - When trolling- don't go too deep! 
#4 - When casting- ALWAYS! ALWAYS! Figure 8... deep & wide
#5 - Keep confidence up & put time on the water_


I do agree 110% in that all 5 of those things are VERY important, but I think that the lure you are using has to be added to the list.


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## Weatherby (May 27, 2005)

I'm sure that lure choice plays some part. To what extent I don't know. 

I've seen muskies caught on lures as small as crappie jigs and as big as 18" trolling baits.


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## crittergitter (Jun 9, 2005)

bubba k said:


> _
> #1 - putting time on the water
> #2 - fishing in those quality times at quality locations (moon changes- pre-thunderstorm)
> #3 - When trolling- don't go too deep!
> ...


I agree as well. That is a very good list. Lure choice is mostly over-rated. You want to consider the conditions and choose accordingly. However, if the conditions dictate a flashy, colorful double bladed bt is the right choice..............then it won't matter if it's a Blue Fox, Mepps Marabou or a DCG. Put it where it counts and the fish will either eat it or it won't. In fact, in many cases when a musky is "hot" ready to eat.......if she follows and won't chomp...........most guys come back later with an altogether different lure. Raised her on a crank.........went back with a BT. Raiser her on a jerkbait................went back and got her on a surface bait..................etc. Some guys spend half their time switching out baits. Some guys spend the whole day flinging their confidence bait that they know matches the conditions. Then.............some days....................often the case when musky fishing...........................none of it matters. !#


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## Snakecharmer (Apr 9, 2008)

At 3/8 or 5/8 that's smaller than what I normally throw but it might be a good spring muskie lure and I wouldn't be surprised that bass might go for it too. Thanks. I'm sure it would work for snakes in Ontario too.


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## bubba k (Mar 29, 2006)

Weatherby said:


> I'm sure that lure choice plays some part. To what extent I don't know.
> 
> I've seen muskies caught on lures as small as crappie jigs and as big as 18" trolling baits.


But haven't you found that certain lures work better in certain bodies of water? One thing that I learned over the years bass and walleye fishing is that certain presentations during certain conditions on certain bodies of water work better than others. It's hard for me to belive that muskies are that much different. There has never been any "magic lure" for any body of water, but I think that the forage base coupled with the makeup of the body of water is always the biggest factor. With that, don't you try to match a specific lure to those conditions? In most cases, I try to imitate the existing forage base while adapting to the conditions. That requires specific lure presentations.....at least it does for bass and walleye....and I'd assume the same holds true for muskie. I am the first one to say "it's not the arrow...it's the indian", but the better the arrow the more effective that indian will be. I'm trying to pick everyone's brain so please don't take my inquiries as me being sarcastic or combative.


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## ShutUpNFish (Apr 17, 2007)

bubba k said:


> Don't you believe that showing fish something new (whether it is pattern, lure size, or design) can make a difference? I am new to the musky scene, but I know that most other species will respond well to certain lures when first introduced. I've obviously seen hundreds of double bladed spinners, but not in the size and shape that Blue Fox just put on the market. If they exist then I have never seen them anywhere. I'm not into the whole "gimmicky lure thing", but I have been witness to some pretty impressive results with new lures. I look for slight variations (like the blue fox mentioned above) rather than the bizarre stuff (crazy creature looking crankbaits). For example, I went pike fishing 3-4 years ago on Fletchers Pond in Michigan, and just about everyone on the lake fishes white spinnerbaits. I opted to use a white chatterbiat, and it outfished the spinnerbait that a few of my other buddies were using 3 to 1. I'm convinced that it was a result of using a lure that the fish had never seen before. The profile wasn't that much different, but the water displacement and vibration through the water was different enough to elicit strikes from fish that had been conditioned to a certain lure. I'm a firm believer that fish get weary especially older fish in lakes that get a lot of pressure (which are most in Ohio).


Do you really think those fish have a memory bank which stores the sort of information in their brains which allows them to decipher one lure from another especially when it comes to slight changes or differences in lure design which are really, when you look at it, basically the same? A spinner is a spinner....adding more flash or more vibration may make a difference, IMO, but does a different design really matter to that muskie? IMHO, we obviously can decipher and see the differences and it is us who usually bite almost 99.99% of the time. Therefore my answer to you is NO, that fox spinner will not outproduce or increase you odds of catching muskies over your everyday average/traditional Mepps spinner. You can break this whole issue down, so many ways for so many various types of lures, but we are talking spinners here...The only real differences I find in spinners are color, flash, size and multiple spinners and all those things have been experimented with by various manufacturers for years...thats why I said its nothing new or all that different....Thats just my .02

I had to write this quickly and will try to address some of your other questions later...


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## MuskieMan35 (Mar 5, 2008)

bubba- Yes, I would agree that some lure COLORS may work better then others due to the forage available... etc... Lures are Lures, but I believe the rattle or color or action on any specific type will trigger a hit... There may be so many subtleties between 10 different monster shads... a slight difference in the rattle or wiggle- who knows?

ALot of guys will tell you "I don't know why but that clown color outfishes all my other lures!" Everyone establishes that "go-to-bait" and with ski fishing your go to bait may be a handful of lures becouse you just can't afford much more.

The best bucktail I have is a black buchertail- I've had the most action on it.... know why? Cause that's the only bucktail I use! (I lost my double 10 at WB 2 years ago) I own about 8 other bucktails but none spin and work as well as that buchertail... Who knows- maybe I would of still got those fish on with a different bucktail... it all goes back to: confidence.


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## ShutUpNFish (Apr 17, 2007)

bubba k said:


> I don't argue confidence. I too feel that you have to feel confident with what you are doing and how you are doing it otherwise you won't give yourself a chance. However, if you aren't using the right lure with the right presentation then it doesn't matter. Fish may be dumb, but they aren't that dumb otherwise we'd all be catching loads of fish every time out. I just feel that lure innovations has to be a part of the equation. There's a reason why certain lures out-produce others. Although much of my frame of reference pertains to other species of fish, I'm learning that a lot of what I am having success doing works with various species. Getting a reaction strike from a hungry fish can happen by throwing a pop can with hooks, but enticing a weary fish that has been caught more than once takes a lot more than being "confident". Just my opinion.


IMO, when it comes to muskie fishing, time and persistance are the main keys to success. Once you have equipped yourself with the right equipment and knowledge, its now time to go learn specific bodies of water, the characteristics of the water and what works best in any given system. After all that, its totally up to those fish to either strike your presentation, follow or ignore it, and the day I accepted that fact that its beyond my control, was the day muskie fishing became a lot more enjoyable for me.

I must say that I've been doing this for a few years and have seen "innovations" come and go and have yet to see something come along which is above and beyond that has magical powers to entice fish to hit when its really not in the mood. What I look for in a lure is good action, quality hardware/paint-job and that will run true in any given situation that I want it to run true in. After that, I make sure I get the lure to where I know the fish are going to be. And as I said before, then its ALL up to that fish, no matter how you look at it or what it is thats tied to the end of your line....muskies will either be hungry or strike out of reaction. And if in the right mood, will hit whatever it is as long as they see it, smell it or feel it! Tight lines.


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## bubba k (Mar 29, 2006)

ShutUpNFish said:


> Do you really think those fish have a memory bank which stores the sort of information in their brains which allows them to decipher one lure from another especially when it comes to slight changes or differences in lure design which are really, when you look at it, basically the same? A spinner is a spinner....adding more flash or more vibration may make a difference, IMO, but does a different design really matter to that muskie? IMHO, we obviously can decipher and see the differences and it is us who usually bite almost 99.99% of the time. Therefore my answer to you is NO, that fox spinner will not outproduce or increase you odds of catching muskies over your everyday average/traditional Mepps spinner. You can break this whole issue down, so many ways for so many various types of lures, but we are talking spinners here...The only real differences I find in spinners are color, flash, size and multiple spinners and all those things have been experimented with by various manufacturers for years...thats why I said its nothing new or all that different....Thats just my .02
> 
> I had to write this quickly and will try to address some of your other questions later...


Spinners are VERY different in many ways. It all starts with the blade shape (tear drop versus willow versus colorado versus bell) which determines the amount of vibration emitted and water displaced. Although important, I don't see flash as being nearly as important as vibration and water displacment. Having the correct blades in murky water can be VERY crucial. 

I read an article where Pete Maina commented on how the double cowgirl emitted a drastically different sound and vibration than that of a normal bucktail spinner. This was based on the double cow bell blades creating a very tight sound/vibration halo that when the fish swam in and out of the radius it created something much different than that of a traditional spinner. It was described as like walking in and out of a sound proof room with a loud band playing. Outside of the halo it was silent but within the halo it was very loud and erratic. 

What do I know? Maybe Pete Maina is lying in an effort to get more endorsements. Maybe guys like Maina and Doug Stange that fish 365 days a year experimenting with lures and logging results are all just trying to swindle us? Maybe I am just naive and gullible? Maybe bass fishing is just that much more of a science than musky fishing? I just feel that there is so much more to musky fishing than just "confidence", "# of casts", "time on the water", and "being at the right place at the right time". Much of my enjoyment in fishing is trying to figure out all of these things that I see as being complex rather than being as simplistic as many have described. For me, the process is just as enjoyable as the product.


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## bubba k (Mar 29, 2006)

_muskies will either be hungry or strike out of reaction. And if in the right mood, will hit whatever it is as long as they see it, smell it or feel it! Tight lines.[/QUOTE]_


You state above that muskies will either strike because they are hungy or strike out of reaction. Is this due to you being a powerfisherman or is it because finessing muskie is not really an option? What I mean by finessing is concentarting on pieces of structure using a slower more deliberate approach in dissecting areas that you feel are likely to hold fish. In bass fishing, I decided my approach based on the conditions. 

I appreciate your responses in being very straight forward and frank. I would much rather have that thenm somebody sugercoat things.


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## Coon_Shark (Feb 6, 2006)

I still think that the characteristics of one spinner to another could have a difference in productivity. It's just the flash, vibration, colors that offer a different package will produce differently as compared to other lures. They could look the same, I just think the real test is the water test where all the factors work together. Same with cranks. The DCG has obviously been a consistant producer of hawgs, but I still think that other lures on the market that are similar still don't out produce the DCG.


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## ShutUpNFish (Apr 17, 2007)

_I read an article where Pete Maina commented on how the double cowgirl emitted a drastically different sound and vibration than that of a normal bucktail spinner. This was based on the double cow bell blades creating a very tight sound/vibration halo that when the fish swam in and out of the radius it created something much different than that of a traditional spinner. It was described as like walking in and out of a sound proof room with a loud band playing. Outside of the halo it was silent but within the halo it was very loud and erratic. _

I'm going to say this in the nicest way I possibly can because I'm sensing some difficulty here and you must remember this is merely my opinion. However, I can assure you that my opinion is based on nearly 20 years of "strictly" muskie fishing experiences. I really don't care what Pete Mania or Doug Stange have written/said in some magazine or TV. Keep in mind that these guys are PR people trying to sell products and publications. Of course, I don't think they would be lying to you, but they are certainly good at "enhancing" a product's appeal with far fetched attributes(sometimes). And what gives you or Pete Mania the idea that just because that spinner displaces the water in some special way, it is exactly what muskies actually are more attracted to? If the muskie knows the lure is there, its either going to eat it, follow it or ignore it depending on whatever particular mood its in at that time....I don't care what the lure is, does or looks like. One of the keys is placing that lure in the right place at the right times as with ANY other fishing anywhere!

You are certainly welcome to believe whatever you want to believe sir. You can go out and buy all the fancy lures and gimicks out there that you want, but I don't believe that they will neccessarily increase your odds any more than getting out there and doing it on a regular basis and being smart about when and where to fish and what bodies of water to what style of fishing. This you will only learn in that time. However I would respect your opinions and theories a lot more if they were based on your own fishing experiences rather than what you've read in some magazine. So, you might as well spare the debate when thats all you have to debate with. Trust me, muskie fishing is a whole different realm of fishing as far as I'm concerned...We ALL know that different lures, tactics, techniques, etc. etc. work in different ways for each individual angler whether its Pete Mania, Jim Saric or Joe Shmo from down the street. I will tell you one final thing though...I'll guarantee that Doug Stange has not come anywhere near the time I have on the water fishing for muskies, nor the number of fish. And those all recorded. Mania, is another story...its his life.

With all that said.....Here are the lures I would have in my arsenal on my vessel at all times.

*Spinners* - double bladed/single bladed - various colors - various sizes
*Crank Baits* - various sizes/colors - jointed/straight - DD/shallow
*Jerkbaits* - various sizes/colors

No Gimicks, just top quality hardware and craftmanship is what I look for. I will make them work after that.

All ya need...

Then I just Shutupnfish! Tight Lines!

Oh, and I will assure you, I do not Sugarcoat. Especially when it comes to muskie fishing.


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## bubba k (Mar 29, 2006)

ShutUpNFish said:


> _I read an article where Pete Maina commented on how the double cowgirl emitted a drastically different sound and vibration than that of a normal bucktail spinner. This was based on the double cow bell blades creating a very tight sound/vibration halo that when the fish swam in and out of the radius it created something much different than that of a traditional spinner. It was described as like walking in and out of a sound proof room with a loud band playing. Outside of the halo it was silent but within the halo it was very loud and erratic. _
> 
> I'm going to say this in the nicest way I possibly can because I'm sensing some difficulty here and you must remember this is merely my opinion. However, I can assure you that my opinion is based on nearly 20 years of "strictly" muskie fishing experiences. I really don't care what Pete Mania or Doug Stange have written/said in some magazine or TV. Keep in mind that these guys are PR people trying to sell products and publications. Of course, I don't think they would be lying to you, but they are certainly good at "enhancing" a product's appeal with far fetched attributes(sometimes). And what gives you or Pete Mania the idea that just because that spinner displaces the water in some special way, it is exactly what muskies actually are more attracted to? If the muskie knows the lure is there, its either going to eat it, follow it or ignore it depending on whatever particular mood its in at that time....I don't care what the lure is, does or looks like. One of the keys is placing that lure in the right place at the right times as with ANY other fishing anywhere!
> 
> ...


Thanks for the advice! As I stated before, I appreciate the input. I'll be fishing Alum tomorrow so I'll post a report.


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## Coon_Shark (Feb 6, 2006)

ShutUpNFish said:


> _
> You are certainly welcome to believe whatever you want to believe sir. You can go out and buy all the fancy lures and gimicks out there that you want, but I don't believe that they will neccessarily increase your odds any more than getting out there and doing it on a regular basis and being smart about when and where to fish and what bodies of water to what style of fishing._


_

Yeah, I don't think we're really disagreeing with each other. It's just my opinion that as the mood of the fish changes, they are still catchable thru changing approach, lures (size, etc). But one just can't throw anything out back and have the same percentage of a hookup with the same approach-some cranks will outproduce others. JMO._


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## ShutUpNFish (Apr 17, 2007)

Coon_Shark said:


> Yeah, I don't think we're really disagreeing with each other. It's just my opinion that as the mood of the fish changes, they are still catchable thru changing approach, lures (size, etc). But one just can't throw anything out back and have the same percentage of a hookup with the same approach-some cranks will outproduce others. JMO.



You're right ****...what you just said is caertainly a testament to versatility being as much a key to your success, muskie fishing, as persistance. Versatility in every way too...as far as your tackle, equipment, techniques, all the way down to how you vary your retrieves on any various bait and choosing the right day to venture. There are SO many variables to make your head spin....IMHO, its not all "rocket science". Keep things, simple, smart, persevere, preperation and variety are all KEY....after that, relax and have fun(if you can) and ALL should pay off in the end. Tight ones guys.


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## Coon_Shark (Feb 6, 2006)

Good Fishing!


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