# Early Muzzleloader Season CHANGE



## Nightprowler (Apr 21, 2004)

Early Muzzleloader Season: Special Permit Required (Wildcat Hollow, Salt Fork Wildlife Area, Shawnee State Forest) may be done away with this year. Theres talk of NOT needing to enter a drawing or needing a special permit. Also being allowed to hunt Buck or Doe with your regular hunting/ deer permit. Anybody else heard about this??


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## flattiesinohio (Sep 30, 2007)

nope....the only thing i heard was that there was talk of adding to bow season again...and i dont even know how true that is cause i'm a gun hunter never used bow cause im a left hand draw and i cant find a bow im my price range to get one so i'll stick to my shot gun....lol


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## Richman (Sep 1, 2007)

Heres a link to the proposed regulations for 08/09


http://www.dnr.state.oh.us/Home/News/NewsReleaseArchivesII/tabid/19075/EntryID/351/Default.aspx

Rich


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## deer_turkey328 (Feb 27, 2008)

I havent heard of any of that either. I hunt mainly with a bow and I did read an article about adding the extra doe permits at a reduced price again, but making it a little simpler this year. There was alot of confusion last year on them. They are talking about extending them maybe after gun season also, but havent heard anything concrete yet. There were even suggestions about starting gun season on the weekend instead of monday which I absolutely dont like but I'm sure that would help out a ton of people. tony


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## flattiesinohio (Sep 30, 2007)

deer_turkey328 said:


> I havent heard of any of that either. I hunt mainly with a bow and I did read an article about adding the extra doe permits at a reduced price again, but making it a little simpler this year. There was alot of confusion last year on them. They are talking about extending them maybe after gun season also, but havent heard anything concrete yet. There were even suggestions about starting gun season on the weekend instead of monday which I absolutely dont like but I'm sure that would help out a ton of people. tony


that would be great for someone like me that only hunts with gun....if you think about it during gun season if you only hunt with a gun and you go spend money to get your tags you only got 7 days to fell them but with a bow you have from november to jan to fell them so in that case it would be great now if i had a bow and could shot it(i never shot a bow)it would all work out


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## bulafisherman (Apr 11, 2004)

Iam also a lefty. if you keep your eyes open you can find good deals on left hand bows as for the early blackpowder hunting at salt fork and wildcat hollow ect...are you saying they are doing away with it all together or still having it just doing away with the drawing and permits, I can only imagine what a free for all it would be if they opened it to everybody without regulating the amount of hunters, seems a little extreme.


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## Guest (Mar 9, 2008)

I think that i read on OON that they are still having the hunt, but are doing away with the permits. 

Yes that does seem extreme and i hope that i read wrong, but I dont think that I did. I can only imagine the onslaught.  It seems that an onslaught is exactly what the DNR wants with our deer heard though.


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## flattiesinohio (Sep 30, 2007)

i have family that does time shares at rocky fork just in the winter time just for hunting at salt fork but a few years ago they where talking something about salt fork cut there public hunting grounds down meaning they made it smaller alot smaller.....and if they do away with permits in that stage you will be elbow to elbow with the locals that will be in there also for muzzleloader...i know alot of ppl around saltfork and they all like hunting there thats why i try my best to stick with privete prop. or drive out to blue rock state forest where there isnt as many ppl


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## Bassnpro1 (Apr 6, 2004)

They should open the early muzzleloader to the whole state. They keep trying to keep the herd down and they aren't doing a very good job of it.


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## flattiesinohio (Sep 30, 2007)

yea i think they should extend muzzleloader and gun season this year instead of bow......its only right they give muzzleloaders and gunners the same oppertunity as bow hunters i believe even if it is only adding 2 days on each season its better then a 7 and 3 days of hunting


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## Guest (Mar 9, 2008)

I would have to disagree with you both. I believe that the population is very much under control and at a manageable level statewide. I'm sure that there are some spots that need more deer taken out then others, but overpopulation is NOT a statewide problem!! I mean the DNR will tell you that themselves.


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## Bassnpro1 (Apr 6, 2004)

traphunter said:


> I would have to disagree with you both. I believe that the population is very much under control and at a manageable level statewide. I'm sure that there are some spots that need more deer taken out then others, but overpopulation is NOT a statewide problem!! I mean the DNR will tell you that themselves.


 
Then why does the state keep adding more liberal harvest limits and more days to hunt? I'm sure that the deer can sustain the level they are at, but in many places forests are suffering because young plants don't get a chance to grow up. I can see both sides of the argument though. Hunters want more deer to hunt and farmers/insurance companies want the herd thinned out. It would be nice to go back to where the deer herd was before humans( much less than right now) but it will never get back down to that.


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## flattiesinohio (Sep 30, 2007)

if deer aint a problam i guess its hundereds of humens jumping out in front of deer when they are driving down the road...or its the humens lieving thousands of humens dead all over the state from ehd.....the point is that deer are to over populated!!!so over populated that one day odnr are gonna tell us not to eat deer cause they are carring a desease that can affect us meaning humen we have to keep the deer population in check so it doesnt get to that point!!!i myself enjoy hunting and having a nice fat deer burger or steak once in awhile.i'm 30 years old and never once hit a deer til last year and i ended the year with 5 on my bumper so i concider them over populated!!!!


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## Bassnpro1 (Apr 6, 2004)

flattiesinohio said:


> if deer aint a problam i guess its hundereds of humens jumping out in front of deer when they are driving down the road...or its the humens lieving thousands of humens dead all over the state from ehd.....the point is that deer are to over populated!!!so over populated that one day odnr are gonna tell us not to eat deer cause they are carring a desease that can affect us meaning humen we have to keep the deer population in check so it doesnt get to that point!!!i myself enjoy hunting and having a nice fat deer burger or steak once in awhile.i'm 30 years old and never once hit a deer til last year and i ended the year with 5 on my bumper so i concider them over populated!!!!


wow that is something...


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## Guest (Mar 9, 2008)

> Then why does the state keep adding more liberal harvest limits and more days to hunt?


I think you answered your own question. The state is doing it too calm the whining farmers that wont let anyone hunt, and insurance companies. Like I said I understand that some areas are indeed overpopulated with deer, but this is where the nuisance permits should kick in. The majority of places ( especially Public Land!! ) are not overpopulated. To make all this extended seasons and more liberal limits is a pacifier mainly to the Farm Bureau.


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## Guest (Mar 9, 2008)

Flattiesinohio,


Well I didn't understand most of your post but.....

I never said deer were not a problem on the roadways because obviously they are, and they always will be regardless of how many deer are killed. I mean its inevitable. And as far as the EHD go's thats a viral diesase that the deer contacted from a gnat bite. It was due to the unusually dry summer we had, and had nothing to do with the deer being overpopulated.


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## flattiesinohio (Sep 30, 2007)

traphunter said:


> I would have to disagree with you both. I believe that the population is very much under control and at a manageable level statewide. I'm sure that there are some spots that need more deer taken out then others, but overpopulation is NOT a statewide problem!! I mean the DNR will tell you that themselves.


read your own post bro....dnr will tell you what they want you to believe if you think the deer population is under thats your desision....all we are are doing is discussing hunting seasons you wanted to take it to the other level....its no biggie to me because i believe what i believe and deer all over ohio are a problam.....as far as you not understanding all i can say is think instead of talk!!!!


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## Guest (Mar 10, 2008)

Don't get offensive man!! I am just stating my opinion, I respect yours as well. Stating a little facts never hurts either though.

By the way, I enjoy my venison just as much as anyone else. In facts I ate some Deerburger helper just tonight, was quite tastefull I must say!! Now I wish I only had some more in my freezer cause it is getting mighty low...


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## flattiesinohio (Sep 30, 2007)

im not mad at you...lol....dont think i am!!!i'm just talking and speaking my mind just like you if you dont think deer are a problam then thats what you think....we was just discussing seasons and next thing i know its about populations!YES,it is a problam thats y dnr is discussing more tags and longer seasons all i want to see is more days added to gun season....lol....no offense takin i hope the same with you


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## buckeye024 (Apr 14, 2006)

DNR is not doing away with the early muzzleloading season, just making a change to it. The season is still the same time as before and in the same areas. A few years ago they implemented a permit system with drawings. If you notice the drawing results from those years...everyone who applied got a permit. The only difference was whether you got a buck or doe permit.

Now the early season will be open to all, you do not need to apply for a drawing anymore and you can use any of your permits, buck or doe. Since everyone that applied got a permit before, the only real change I can see is that there will be more bucks killed during that season because you can use your licenses as you see fit, not as the DNR grants you.


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## Guest (Mar 10, 2008)

With the DNR in such a "herd reduction spree", why would they want this though? It seems so contradicting. Their whole purpose of the new antlerless tags was to increase the amount of does killed, while decreasing the amount of bucks killed. 

Also with the hunt being open to everyone with no drawing neccesary, Im sure many more people would show up then did before, simply because of the convienience of not having to go through the hassles of a drawing.


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## flattiesinohio (Sep 30, 2007)

traphunter said:


> With the DNR in such a "herd reduction spree", why would they want this though? It seems so contradicting. Their whole purpose of the new antlerless tags was to increase the amount of does killed, while decreasing the amount of bucks killed.
> 
> Also with the hunt being open to everyone with no drawing neccesary, Im sure many more people would show up then did before, simply because of the convienience of not having to go through the hassles of a drawing.


thats tue...like i said earlier i know lots of locals around salt fork that like hunting there and i have family that come from cleveland to hunt there and they all want that mount on their wall you would think they would keep the drawling and just let you hunt the does(which on the way to my mothers yesterday i counted 22 deer just by the beach laid up under trees and then another 30+ on my way home).....you would figure that taking the number of does down would be good enough or even do a raffel on a controled hunt that targets just the does


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## buckeye024 (Apr 14, 2006)

I own property in Morgan County. The property is one of the few private properties that border against Wildcat Hollow and is within the boundaries of the early muzzleloading area. I can hunt on the property during the early season.

I used to complain alot before they went to the drawing system. A few years ago, the early season was open to anyone and it was buck only. Look at the results just for the one area. For example, in 2004, 69 bucks were taken from Wildcat Hollow during that season. In 2003, it was 72. When hunters are taking 70 bucks out of the area every year, that has to make a huge impact. Combine that with all of the other deer seasons and you have a ton of bucks being killed in a relatively small area every year. From my own observations, we would see a lot of deer, but the quality of bucks was very low.

I was and still am a big advocate of expanding that season statewide. I felt something had to change. I thought they took a step in the right direction with the drawing. Supposedly, out of the total number issued, only 10&#37; we issued buck permits. Look at the results for 2007. 127 deer were taken from Wildcat Hollow. I don't know how many were bucks, but given only 10% of the permits were buck permits, you could extrapolate that to the results and say, on the safe side, 20 or less, were bucks. That's much better for the herd than the 70 every year prior to the drawing. The last 3 years we have seen a big improvement in the quality of bucks in the area. The last couple years we have seen at least 2 bucks each year that were 12 points or greater. We believe one to have been 16. Before we would rarely see anything larger than 6 points with 8 being the largest.

I think changing the season and removing the drawing is a step backwards, but at least it isn't going all the way back to when you could only kill a buck during the season. I still feel strongly that the season should be made statewide.


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