# Deer Gun & Bow Season Together?



## Sluggo (Aug 30, 2004)

I just wanted to see what others think of having the deer gun season (or maybe muzzleloader season only) start and end on the same dates as the deer bow season. Why wouldn't this work? My initial thoughts are as follows:

1. It would obviously allow hunters much more opportunity to hunt deer with gun than does the current 1 week of gun season.

2. It would reduce the total number of gun deer hunters in the woods at any one time as they would be spread out over many more days of hunting rather than crammed into a single week. So it seems as though it might be safer.

3. The harvest limits would not be changed so the same amount of deer allowed to be harvested would be the same. Or, the DNR could modify the allowable number of deer harvested as needed for the "new longer" season.

4. If a long deer season works fine for deer taken with bow why wouldn't it work for those taken with gun???? The method of hunting doesn't seem to change whether a longer season is workable or not. So why wouldn't this type of system work?


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## jonnythfisherteen2 (Mar 5, 2011)

That would seem fair. The guys with bows get months and months of hunting while guys with guns get like a entire week. Pretty lame if you ask me. It might also keep people from going out of state to hunt with their guns, due to having more time to hunt.


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## garhtr (Jan 12, 2009)

I think most bow hunters would not like having to wear orange for the entire season unless you were thinking of dropping hunter orange requirements. Also having more gun hunters in the field during the rut might put added pressure on bucks. I also think that adding that much time for gun hunters( even just muzzle loaders) would lead to MUCH higher numbers of deer bagged. I doubt this will ever happen in Ohio.


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## fishwendel2 (Nov 19, 2007)

Wishful thinking on your part but never going to happen. You think there are no deer now...a month of gun shooting and you will be seeing deer swimming the Ohio River to neighboring states!


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## JohnD (Sep 11, 2007)

Good way to get more property posted. Don't think bowhunters in the stealth mode. selectively hunting from tree stands for a specific big buck in his natural rutting routine would be too happy with an army of guys driving the same woodlot twice a day. Just my thoughts.


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## Bonemann (Jan 28, 2008)

It is an interesting idea to have a longer gun season (not that I believe that would ever happen in Ohio).

I could imagine having a 30 day open gun season say the 3rd week of Nov. running through the 2nd week of Dec. As long as we had a state wide 1 or 2 deer limit.


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## Shaun69007 (Sep 2, 2009)

As a bow hunter, I enjoy my quiet bow hunting. I will not gun hunt for safety concerns. I look at gun hunters and new years eve drunks that wonder why they get a DUI at 230 AM..... amateur hour..


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## Sciotodarby (Jul 27, 2013)

It's safer to hunt during gun season than it is to drive a car....


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## garhtr (Jan 12, 2009)

Sciotodarby said:


> It's safer to hunt during gun season than it is to drive a car....


 Or cleaning out your gutters, taking a bath, climbing stairs , plus ten thousand other things . Most injuries during gun season are self inflicted.


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## Shad Rap (Nov 10, 2010)

Shaun69007 said:


> As a bow hunter, I enjoy my quiet bow hunting. I will not gun hunt for safety concerns. I look at gun hunters and new years eve drunks that wonder why they get a DUI at 230 AM..... amateur hour..


Its really not all that bad dude...as long as you dont shoot yourself you'll be ok...


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## Sciotodarby (Jul 27, 2013)

I wonder what the stats are of people getting injured during bow season vs gun season? I know a bunch of guys who have fell off ladders, or had stand/harness failures while bow hunting.


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## Lundy (Apr 5, 2004)

Sluggo said:


> 3. The harvest limits would not be changed so the same amount of deer allowed to be harvested would be the same. Or, the DNR could modify the allowable number of deer harvested as needed for the "new longer" season.


Harvest limits are set with consideration of hunter success rates. 32-35% of deer hunters on an average are successful at harvesting a deer. If extended seasons facilitated an increase in hunter success rate then the allowable bag limits would need to be reduced to maintain the same harvest totals. 

There are a bunch of hunters that do not like the proposed return of the extra 2 day gun season fearing a big increase in overall harvest. The last 2 day gun season, 2012, resulted in a harvest of 14,365 deer. This year if you factor in the elimination of the 2 day early MZ season that had a kill of 6613 to offset the total, you could reasonably expect somewhere around a 6-10,000 net increase in deer harvest if everything else remains the same

The archery harvest for the 2013 season for the first time in history exceeded the 7 day gun harvest in Ohio. This was a result of a huge increase in the number of bowhunters, high bag limits, reduced tag pricing and a long season. In an effort to flatten and maybe even reduce the archery harvest the bag limits have been reduced and the reduced cost tags have all but been eliminated.

This is the same with fishing and daily limits. If more fisherman caught their limits everyday they went fishing the daily limits would need to be reduced substantially.

The ODNR knows that there will be many, many unsuccessful deer hunters every year. There has to be or there would be no deer left anywhere, there are more hunters than huntable deer.

If every deer hunter had a 100% success rate for killing just one deer per year there would need to be a permit lottery system where each hunter could only hunt every few years. A lot of guys only hunt a day or two or are really bad at deer hunting. That is a good thing.


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## hopin to cash (Sep 14, 2010)

Nicely put Lundy and I believe you hit a homerun with this one... could not agree more with your analogy... still believe the antlerless permits should have been limited in the lower southeast counties 7 years ago and the rest of the state 4 years ago. ODNR is responding just a few years to late... and yes I did shoot to many does over the 10 years... have changed my philosophy greatly though over the last few years.


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## FAB (May 26, 2013)

Sluggo makes some valid points as does Lundy. The current one week season is an annual event that is planned for by hunters, vacations are scheduled a year in advance, camp sites are reserved for next year, plans are made with members of the hunting camp, much gear is purchased and this one week vacation is now ready to enjoy. This happens with hundreds of thousands of hunters across this state and others just because it is a very limited opportunity to kill a deer on opening day. 

However if the season came in at the end of September and went out the following February the sense of urgency of the one week time limit is now gone and what you would have is another "Squirrel season" where guys would quickly loose interest. You would not have the armies of orange driving deer, you would not have the high first day deer kills that we now see due to the very high hunter pressure. You would actually see deer numbers increase because of lack of interest in hunting them. It would no longer be that annual event that everyone planned for. 

But more importantly to the state and the reason you will not see this is it would be an economic disaster for deer hunting. Along with the drop in license sales come the steep cuts in purchase of hunting and camping supplies.

To see how this works consider South Carolina, they have the longest gun season of any US state. Daily bag limit is 2 bucks and 1 doe, up to a season limit of 5 of each. Yet their deer herd is estimated at 750,000 to 1,000,000 deer in a state you probably never even considered hunting. Why, because it's not a big deal to them. They have 5 weeks to kill a deer if they want and most really don't care. 

Lundy is right in that most hunt only 1 or two days. If you recall most 1 week seasons here, Mondays are a madhouse with hunters moving in all directions and cars parked bumper to bumper but come Thursday you are lucky to see a couple of hunters in the woods and nobody parked along the roads. The annual event begins the Saturday before the Monday opener and by Wednesday night most campsites are empty. Spread that same scenario over 4 months and all but the most devoted hunters will totally quit. And the state knows that.


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## Fishingisfun (Jul 19, 2012)

Circumstances of the early years of Ohio deer seasons has brought us to this point. Having an old timer IMHO remembering where long archery seasons started. Modern archery season in Ohio began with hunters using recurve bows and most hunters setting on the ground or stalking a woods hoping to see a deer. The low impact on the deer herd of archery hunters lead to the increase of archery season Lengths. The learning curve and the equipment limitations for archery hunting kept the harvests low for Years. Sharing of information in print, improvements in equipment, with changes in regulations and the inclusion of crossbows increased the harvest rates significantly. Interest in archery hunting grew due to the long seasons and increasing harvest numbers. In my younger years getting a vacation day off for deer gun season was impossible as seniority meant the older guys got the deer gun season vacations. Nessisity put many hunters in the woods for archery season. Ohio did not shut down schools or businesses during deer gun season at least not around Columbus. More hunters afield meant more money spent and increased profits for businesses and the ODNR. Happy hunters was the measure of customer satisfaction with surveys taken by the ODNR. Hunters that began with a five deer limit will be hard to convince that limiting the harvest is the key to satisfaction with time spent afield observing nature and harvesting one deer for the table. 
Another old guy moment I remember going afield when several ring neck pheasants could be walked up crossing a weed field most anywhere around Columbus. After a bad winter they were gone, now when a pheasant release happens the public hunting area is swarmed with hunters. It would be sad to have a notice in the newspaper that a dozen deer would be release at the nearby public land for hunters for deer season. We all need to have self restraint with harvest numbers, we do not have the decrease the deer herd to where it was back in the 1960's. Circumstances that made the large deer herd available have changed so harvest numbers need to be adjusted downward. IMHO only


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## Had a Bite (Apr 15, 2012)

I could have taken more than a handful of big bucks this season while bow hunting if I could have used the 45/70, they just didn't make it into bow range. That being said, there is no way I would ever agree with a few months of gun season. After 2 seasons I'd have to find new plans for hunting season because the 4 or 5 deer that would be left in Ohio would not be worth chasing.


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## Sciotodarby (Jul 27, 2013)

What were the kill numbers of the 2 week gun and long muzzleloading seasons in the 90's compared to this year?


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

IMO, this is a great idea for the satisfaction and making it easier for us hunters.

But just as great an idea for the satisfaction of us hunters, it would be by far an even greater disadvantage for our deer herd. 

We all know it is much easier to tag a buck during the different phases of the rut. There are nocturnal bucks we never usually see until the rut kicks in. But all too often, these same bucks are seen out of bow range or through thickets in which a shot with a bow is just not possible. These same breeder bucks could be easily killed with a firearm. 

We all know that at that often, at the beginning of bow, there are many bucks still traveling in bachelor groups.

We all know that doe's, like bucks are more receptive to calling and using scents as well.

Like many here, can't imagine the bucks I could have killed during bow had I had a long gun(or even a pistol) in my hands. Again, IMO, open up gun season a couple seasons during the rut and our herd will diminish even further and much faster then it has as it would really upset the doe to buck ratio.

Doing this would be disastrous to our herd.


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## DLC (May 3, 2007)

1 week of the wannna-be deer hunters that trespass and push every chunk of ground is more than enough. I'm not saying everyone does this but it's enough to say 1 week is more than enough.


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## bobk (Apr 30, 2004)

DLC said:


> 1 week of the wannna-be deer hunters that trespass and push every chunk of ground is more than enough. I'm not saying everyone does this but it's enough to say 1 week is more than enough.



That's odd I have more problems with the sneaky, cheating, self righteous bowhunters trespassing on my property.


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## fish4wall (Apr 14, 2004)

just my .02 but let me poke holes in this system (sorry in advance)

"1. It would obviously allow hunters much more opportunity to hunt deer with gun than does the current 1 week of gun season."

Yes it would..but...we'd have no more deer left! and the states deer herd isn't what the DNR thinks....

"2. It would reduce the total number of gun deer hunters in the woods at any one time as they would be spread out over many more days of hunting rather than crammed into a single week. So it seems as though it might be safer."

Not really...I'm a bow hunter and I'm out every chance I get..put it this way from the end of Sept-Feb its no loner "wife season" 
If I was just a gun hunter I'd do the same thing....

"3. The harvest limits would not be changed so the same amount of deer allowed to be harvested would be the same. Or, the DNR could modify the allowable number of deer harvested as needed for the "new longer" season."

The limits would need to change... guns have a longer range than a bow....plus there's more gun hunters than bow...so more hunters in field.

"4. If a long deer season works fine for deer taken with bow why wouldn't it work for those taken with gun???? The method of hunting doesn't seem to change whether a longer season is workable or not. So why wouldn't this type of system work?"

Again the deer numbers would drop...

Yes I am a bow hunter...And a system like this would SUCK!!
IMO if you want to hunt the same months as bow hunters do then pick up a bow and practice! if I can do anyone can...and if you think you can't IM me and I'd more than happy to tech you how to shoot a bow...

Jonny....
"That would seem fair. The guys with bows get months and months of hunting while guys with guns get like a entire week. Pretty lame if you ask me. It might also keep people from going out of state to hunt with their guns, due to having more time to hunt."

There's nothing "lame"...get a bow learn how to use it and practice! if you are not able bodied then get a cross bow. You and only you are limiting your deer season....not bow hunters.....


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## Bonemann (Jan 28, 2008)

I see nothing detrimental about a month long season with a one deer limit.

Start it the week of Thanksgiving (as West Virginia does) and end in the 2nd week of December.

I think the key here would be one deer with a firearm (pistol, shotgun, muzzle loader, rifle) or bow.

I don't think the length of the season is the problem here. I believe it's the liberal bag limits that hurt the herd.

And if you need more deer to feed your family get a better job or a smaller family. LOL !!!


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## Lundy (Apr 5, 2004)

Unless the longer season were to lead to a higher hunter success rate which would lead to a higher harvest, even if there were just a one deer limit.

Today less than 35% of deer hunters are successful, of those 35%, 75% already only harvest one deer per year.


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## Shaun69007 (Sep 2, 2009)

Lundy said:


> Unless the longer season were to lead to a higher hunter success rate which would lead to a higher harvest, even if there were just a one deer limit.
> 
> Today less than 35% of deer hunters are successful, of those 35%, 75% already only harvest one deer per year.


And out of that 35% what is the number of successful bow hunters? By tagging the 2 seasons together with the Afghanistan sounding war zone that is gun week, how many bow hunters do you believe will be successful.


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## fish4wall (Apr 14, 2004)

better job or a smaller family....yea funny...


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