# Several Pond Questions: Increase LM size and add wipers



## kfi (Nov 11, 2013)

Hello all - I am trying to help out my Dad with his farm pond located in central ohio. 

Here are the pond details:
Area = 0.5 Acres
Perimeter = 600 ft
Max Depth = 12 ft
Min Depth = 3-4 ft
Spring Fed (though in the dry part of the summer the flow reduces down to just a trickle). The pond is basically just an oval shape with very little cover except for a couple christmas trees in ~ 5 to 7 ft of water.

Here was my Dad's stocking program:
Date: Spring 1999
-75 LM Bass
-150 Bluegills
-75 Shellcrackers (another sunfish similar to bluegill)
-30 Channel Cats
- 500 feeder minnows
- 4 Amurs

Then in 2004 he added 12 more Amurs (for additional algae control) and 500 more minnows. No other stocking. He very rarely takes any fish out to eat (maybe once a year if that). You can catch 12-14 inch LM all day long with a very occasional 16 incher. While you will occasionally catch a decent bluegill the majority of those also tend to be on small side. The only fish to really thrive were the Cats and they got pretty large and have for the most part been removed from the pond (to eat or show off). We don't think the cats were naturally reproducing because we understand that they have to have some type of submerged overhanging cover to successfully do so...? (to hold the eggs because they float??)

Here are my questions:
1) He wants to increase the LM size in the pond. Does he need to start culling fish? and how do you know which to pull out and which to keep? How many should you pull out?
2) How expensive would it be to electro shock fish in the pond to confirm the size range?
3) Have heard/read a lot about wipers. What is the min size to stock initially that you can readily get (to keep from getting eaten by the LM) and what number is reasonable for that size pond with idea that LM's are also going to be in there..?
4) I'm pretty sure the Bluegill/Shellcrackers are also overpopulated. Should I cull some of those or leave em in there for food source for LM/Wipers?
5) What about additional feeder minnows or some type of commercial fish food? Good/Bad?
6) The amurs are huge and we have heard they do not eat as much once big (lazy and slow like us when we get old I guess.. Some years he does get fair amount of algae/moss and ends up having to rake it out. Should he remove the large amurs and re-stock smaller ones??
7) Last option, would he be better off removing everything and starting over from scratch??? Don't think he really wants to do that but just asking since populations have been in there awhile...

Any feedback welcome. Thx.


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## Mr. A (Apr 23, 2012)

I am not an expert but I would cull some bass if there is a good population of them, and take no less than 5 baitfish per pound of predator fish. I don't think you wanna put wipers in that small of a pond, seems like they'd do great initially, then become a huge problem afterward. 

Mr. A


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## snakedog (Feb 12, 2009)

Your apex predators are already in place, they just need more of a food base to get larger. Stocking more baitfish might be the best thing to do. That would work to fatten up the existing bass. Fathead minnows and golden shiners are good. Sinking some cover, like an evergreen tree, is going to help them reproduce. Introducing wipers just creates more competition for food. Check Jones Hatchery for a deal on baitfish. Here's some hints from an extension service in Indiana:

http://www.batesvilleheraldtribune.com/local/x934960263/Educator-discusses-stocking-ponds/print


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## [email protected] (Dec 22, 2006)

That's about triple the number of bass that should have been stocked and 1/3 as many bluegill in a half acre pond and that was a long time ago. Bass need to be heavily culled to keep the remaining fish growing, every year...I really can't stress this enough. I also seriously doubt a couple of fisherman could over-cull the bass. Cull, cull, cull. 

Electroshocking isn't really a practical option for a 1/2 acre pond. Seining would probably be the way to go for surveying and culling. Decent 100' seines with mudlines and floats can be purchased for a few hundred bucks online. They can be used over and over and you might even get some other pond owners to rent it for a few bucks here and there.

Stop wasting money on minnows. It's simply not cost effective. Fish farms like to sell minnows but they aren't feeding their own fish minnows. If pellet feeding and a feeder are an option, the money is better spent there.

If there is still a significant population of channels, and they're not a high priority, remove as many as you can. They eat a lot, big ones eat a lot of fish and will eat a lot of pellets if you go that route. I completely eliminated at my place...I think. 

Leave the bluegill alone for the time being. If they bass start growing, they'll need take care of the small and medium sized bluegill. Redears, have low reproduction rates, I wouldn't factor them into the plan much at this point as they aren't all that significant. 

That's way too many grass carp too. Two fish stocked every few years is plenty. Remove the old ones, they do little for algae control anyway as the spacing of their gill rakers widen and metabolism decreases...they're just taking up biomass. The teenagers are the ones that do most of the eating and can be slightly effective at filamentous algae control. Grass carp don't eat all weeds. Supplement weed control with appropriate chemicals if needed. Tilapia do compliment grass carp well though as they tend to eat what the amurs don't.

Hybrid stripers could be an option if a feeding program is introduced. I'm a bass fisherman at heart but the wipers are a fantastic fighting, easy to manage pond fish. They readily take and grow fast on commercial pellet feed and they don't reproduce. Here's a couple of fish from an evening a couple of weeks ago in my 1/2 acre pond. I have no regrets about stocking them, other than a few lost lures. They fill a somewhat different niche than bass but will compete for forage. Pellets reduce their competition with bass.

Starting over is an option but you can turn it around with a solid plan and diligence. I'm sure there are a few good fish lurking in there somewhere. You'll be in the same spot in 4 or 5 years even if you wipe out the pond and restock...unless the management practices are changed. Small ponds are like gardens, you get out of them what you put into them. Sticking a bunch of seeds in the ground and letting nature take it's course isn't going to produce nearly as well as a cared for garden.


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## T-180 (Oct 18, 2005)

^^^ Great advice right there !! Remove the cats & grassies, thin the bass. A 1/2 acre pond can get out of balance in a hurry. If you need help with those grassies, let me know ..... I'm near Marysville & took care of a couple ponds.


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## Snyd (May 5, 2004)

i am not an expert but it sounds like you need to thin the bass out before they get stunted. Also instead of minnows try putting shad in the pond.


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