# Battery Issue, melted Positive lug off.....



## Igotgills2 (Apr 23, 2013)

OK, so I will acknowledge that I may not have been as attentive to my batteries and charging system recently as I should have. That being said, I hopped in the boat before I drove to the lake Saturday morning to check how much gas I had. When I first got to the boat, I checked the battery charger and all 4 banks showed a green light (MinnKota 460D charger with (3)deep cycle interstates and a Interstate cranking battery, all 27 series). I did this since I ran down the battery on my last trip, requiring a jump on the lake. I "Thought" I had tightened everything down good and I am positive that the wiring was reconnected to the proper location before I ever plugged the charger in. I marked all of the wiring and its respective battery when I bought the boat just in case. 

So I went to the control panel and nothing....... I went back and flipped the main fuse Off and reset it, walked back to the control panel and nothing, couldn't get it to light up....... (WTF?). well walking back to the charger again, I smelled it... swung open the battery compartment lid and "surprise". Smoke rolling and the protective RED plastic sleeve on the Positive terminal was on fire. (awesome). So after I cussed like a sailor, and convinced myself I was screwed I started to dissect things and realized that I had a few loose connections on the Main switch in the charger bay, that controls or directs current. (don't have a pic so hopefully this makes sense) where you can turn all batteries OFF, only have 1 or 2 selected or Both selected. 

The jumper leg from the Neg on cranking battery, to the Pos on the Deep cycle was melting off. from what I can determine to this point, is that I had a crappy connection on the Pos lug for the crank battery which caused the short to melt the lug off, and then with this break in the circuit, it caused the jumper to burn up. I am now thinking that the Original crank battery was hurt somehow from either a previous poor connection, 2 days fishing 4'ers, or my running it so low several times this year and I made things worse with a dirty, loose connection after the last trip. I've gone thru every wire running to these batteries, to make sure they are TIGHT and not damaged and just bought a new cranking battery. All terminal ends have been cleaned up, jumper re-made etc. 

Looking for anyone that has seen this, had this happen etc that may shed insight into something I haven't considered and/or should be aware of before this all goes back together this week. I am crossing my fingers that the charger isn't bad, control panel isn't damaged and the 250 opti isn't hurt somehow. I've had the Deep cycle batts tested and they are all good. 



thanks in advance.









Chris


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## bountyhunter (Apr 28, 2004)

I<M no guru but,it appears you have a dead short some where, takes a lot of heat to melt lead, hope things work out, and double check every connection. any way your lid could touch things.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Igotgills2 said:


> The jumper leg from the Neg on cranking battery, to the Pos on the Deep cycle was melting off.


Hmmm...you threw me for a loop there.
No doubt you have a dead short.

If I understand things right, you have 3 deep cycle batteries and one cranking battery.
Since your ignition system is most likely 12volt why is there a jumper wire from the *Neg post* on the *cranking* *battery* to the *Pos. post* of the *deep cycle battery*?

Sounds to me like you have the batteries wired in series rather than wired in parallel .Which if this is the case and you have all four batteries hooked in the 'series ' loop, you are pushing 48volts and only supposed to have 12volts. if you just have the cranking battery and one deep cycle. battery hooked in series, then you are pushing 24volts in a 12volt system.

Both would cause things to get hot.

Here's a schematic of batteries wired in series *which gives you higher voltage*(they are 6v that makes 12v, if they were 12v they would make24v):



Here's a schematic wiring in parallel which gives you the same voltage but longer capacity:




Again, these are 6v batteries but would be the same for 12v batteries.

Do you have anything requiring 24v or 48v on your boat IE trolling mtr., radios etc.

If not then your batteries should be wired in parallel(negs. to negs., pos. to pos.)

FWIW, IMO, It's always best to have your cranking battery wired to nothing but your engine. Everything else(trolling mtrs.,depth finders, lives wells, radio's, lights etc) wired to the other batteries.


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## tomb (Oct 9, 2004)

How are batteries used?
A: 36V trolling motor and starting battery?
B: 24V trolling motor, starting battery, and backup battery?


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## Igotgills2 (Apr 23, 2013)

Fast and Tomb, thanks for the responses. I should provide a bit more information. 

I do have a 36V trolling motor, where the 3 Deep cycles are wired in series, each battery (including the cranking battery) having a connection to the Minnkota charger (with a 30amp inline fuse on each of the positive connections to the charger, all are still good) a single 12V Cranking Battery for the big motor with the accessories connected thru the main control panel (bilge, livewell, radio, HDS units, etc). I have attached a crude whiteboard schematic as I see it, and a pic. Unfortunately i had just removed one of the TM batteries before i took the pic. I ended up pulling "EVERYTHING" out to clean and make sure something wasn't missing in the connection.


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## RJohnson442 (May 14, 2013)

You grounded the positive out somewhere without a fuse to save it. Be happy you still have a boat! This is also why post are made of soft lead, in the event that the battery shorts they are designed to melt off and kill the short before the battery starts on fire / explodes. Only problem you have with this is you have multiple batteries tied together and chances are if you killed one you killed the rest by flipping the switch to all of em.


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## FAB (May 26, 2013)

I have to agree with a couple of the other opinions , the jumper wire from your cranking battery to your trolling motor group is your problem , take it off.


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## tomb (Oct 9, 2004)

The ground jumper is the problem. You accidentally went + to - instead of - to -. The jumper provides ground when using the bottom trolling battery as an emergency starting battery.


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## Igotgills2 (Apr 23, 2013)

The connections on the Main switch were loose, which have now been tightened. see the attached pic, again all of these were loose.


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## Igotgills2 (Apr 23, 2013)

tomb said:


> The ground jumper is the problem. You accidentally went + to - instead of - to -. The jumper provides ground when using the end trolling battery as an emergency starting battery.


Tomb, i might be seeing the light. So the "Jumper" that I have connected from the POS on the TM battery, to the NEG on the crank battery is incorrect? The "Jumper" should be connected from the NEG on the TM battery, to the NEG on the cranking battery? I am now realizing I wired the entire bank in series......


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## tomb (Oct 9, 2004)

The loose connections aren't OK, but that wasn't what caused the meltdown. The bottom deep cycle battery will only provide 12V through the switch if you move the jumper to negative post.


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## tomb (Oct 9, 2004)




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## tomb (Oct 9, 2004)

Igotgills2 said:


> Tomb, i might be seeing the light. So the "Jumper" that I have connected from the POS on the TM battery, to the NEG on the crank battery is incorrect? The "Jumper" should be connected from the NEG on the TM battery, to the NEG on the cranking battery? I am now realizing I wired the entire bank in series......


Yes. Exactly.
I missed something in your previous explanations. When did it get moved? The boat definitely hasn't been wired that way for long.


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## Igotgills2 (Apr 23, 2013)

Thanks Tom, and everyone for the insight. Not sure how the .... i did that, but glad i didn't FUBAR everything. Had the TM batteries checked yesterday and they are all fine. 

I moved that jumper last time out. I fished almost all day, with all the accessories on and i didnt start the Big motor to charge the crank battery (don't have a kicker). I literally was DEAD in the water with not enough juice to get started as I ran my TM batteries pretty low with the 4' waves. I had a good Samaritan stop and give me a jump (had alot unhooked trying to jump it myself) and when I got home (late, tired, pi$$ed off) i hooked it up wrong. I connected the charger, got all green lights on the bank and i went home. When I began to power everything up this past Saturday, it presented itself. 

Ok just to be clear now moving forward, I will replace the jumper and connect it Neg on TM battery to Neg on crank battery but whats the best procedure to "Jump start a dead Crank battery" from that setup?


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## RJohnson442 (May 14, 2013)

connect straight to the motor battery and use the switch set to one (motor battery only). Really you should have all accessories run off the house batteries and have a dedicated motor starting battery.


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## tomb (Oct 9, 2004)

You won't have to jump if the trolling battery has enough charge left at the time. Put the switch on 2 WITH THE TROLLING MOTOR OFF AND PULLED BACK ON BOAT. The batteries are 36V with trolling motor on closing the circuit. The switch only gets 12V in the 2 position with trolling motor off. You can also try the 1+2 position which uses both batteries in parallel, just like jumper cables do. In a real jam you can do another battery in parallel using the short wires off your 36 volt system.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Along with removing the misplaced jumper wire, as has been suggested here a couple times already, you really need to consider isolating your cranking battery and dedicating it for nothing but starting your engine. Especially since you are cranking a big 250 Opti. Would also consider going to the largest cranking amp battery with the most reserve capacity I could get.
As long as your engine charging sys. is in good shape(charging as it should and your dedicated cranking battery is good) you should not have an issue with a dead battery out on the water. Where we get into trouble is putting all the accessories that we want to run while sitting still and then expect the charging system to recharge the battery if the engine does start. Not gonna happen! Especially if we're doing a lot of short runs from fishing spot to fishing spot.


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## Igotgills2 (Apr 23, 2013)

Well, after reconnecting everything I flipped the breaker and turned the switch..... a pop and nothin. Smelled something near the switch and everything is dead. (yay) thinking (hoping)the battery switch is toast now. Might have been damaged from loose connections. At this point I'm gonna try and get a local shop to diagnose. Thanks again for all the time and help guys. Lesson learned.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

It's very possible that a battery is now shorted inside when they were wired wrong. 

FWIW have dealt with battery disconnect/Perko style switch's for a lot of years on fleet trucks and equipment. IMO, just another place for electrical system issues/problems to develop. 

Glad you are taking it to a shop.


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## tomb (Oct 9, 2004)

Good luck on repairs. Shorted battery sounds likely.


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## tilefish (Aug 6, 2012)

Great post! Thanks to those who shared their knowledge. I just bought my first bass boat. It's a '94 and I have been trying to figure out the battery configuration. While I haven't had any problems, you have helped me make sure I don't cause any. Thanks again and good luck Igotgills2. Please let us know what you find out.


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## Whaler (Nov 16, 2004)

You are very lucky you did't have any fuel vapors near those batteries !


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## MassillonBuckeye (May 3, 2010)

Please make sure to keep us updated! Hopefully not too costly.


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## Igotgills2 (Apr 23, 2013)

I talked with the shop yesterday and they were just getting to it. The battery switch had failed, and they are replacing that...... crossing fingers that I dodged a major issue. Will update when i get the final tally.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Igotgills2 said:


> New I talked with the shop yesterday and they were just getting to it. The battery switch had failed, and they are replacing that...... crossing fingers that I dodged a major issue. Will update when i get the final tally.


The very reason for my earlier post referring to not liking these switches . Yours probably failed due to the batteries being wired wrong but still yet again , IMO, they are a very weak link in an electrical system when installed. Have just seen too many fail. And seems the more that is hooked to them, the faster they fail. FWIW, if I had one on my boat, I would surely know how it was wired so I knew how to bypass it in case it went bad out on the water. Especially if I were boating Erie and had no kicker. If I had an electric start kicker, it would not be wired through the switch . It would be wired direct.


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## Igotgills2 (Apr 23, 2013)

I hear ya Fast. I'm rapidly becoming more than just familiar with my electrical system just in case. That and I'm telling Santa about the kicker.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Igotgills2 said:


> I'm telling Santa about the kicker.


Ha! Hope you've been very good this year. 

There have been a few nice ones coming up here on OGF from time to time. What size have you been thinking about?


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## Igotgills2 (Apr 23, 2013)

Been looking at the merc 9.9 pro kicker. Had a good deal on a 2 year old, new in the crate and let it slip thru my fingers. Already rigged up and ready to go, just need to find another deal.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Will keep an eye out this way. Long or short shaft ?


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## tomb (Oct 9, 2004)

Get the pro kicker with tiller handle. That way you have backup propulsion and steering to cover various failures. The kicker will also turn over on a run down battery that isn't charged enough to fire the main.


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## tomb (Oct 9, 2004)

Revving up the kicker provides enough juice to fire the main.


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## Igotgills2 (Apr 23, 2013)

OK gents, finally have a functional boat. The battery switch did fail, and the 100amp fuse link on the Opti was toast. Purrs like a kitten now. total was $380 (not including the new cranking battery I replaced myself). Dont care about the elevated shop rate, most important is it is "as new" and i wont be constantly worrying about it while on the water. 

Again, Thanks to everyone who helped on this, I owe you a collective beer. 

tight lines 

Catchin ZZZ's.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Great! 
Glad to see you are back on the water.


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