# Max. Caliber For Groundhog?



## c. j. stone (Sep 24, 2006)

I know you can't use HP rifles in Ohio for deer(I think due to the travel distance, and potency of the bullet?), but is there a caliber limit on what you can use for groundhogs? Scanned the regs and can't find any info.


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## M.Magis (Apr 5, 2004)

I don't believe there is any sort of maximum.


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## Rednek (Nov 6, 2006)

I believe that the maximum cartridge for groundhog hunting is the .950 JDJ. LOL


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## bkr43050 (Apr 5, 2004)

My boys have been using a 30-06 which most would consider overkill but it is what they have to work with. Plus I think they like the BOOM!  I think a lot of the smaller calibers would carry as far or farther so I don't see where a maximum caliber would accomplish anything. Regardless of the caliber there still is the need for caution and ensuring proper backdrop.


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## big red (Feb 4, 2010)

there is no cal. limit on shooting varmits in the state as long as you shoot in a safe direction and there is a good backstop area or no buildings or persons within the bullets max range.best thing to do is use common sense and ehtics.


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## Whaler (Nov 16, 2004)

C J Elmer used to shoot em with his 3.5 inch magnum turkey loads.


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## c. j. stone (Sep 24, 2006)

The reason I was asking is that there are smaller farm fields on both sides of me. I live in, obviously, a rural area but there are a number of residences, all around the fields with narrow strips of woods, with pets and farm animals out all day. I saw a couple young people(renters from a nearby mobile home) walk into a neighboring field with a rifle, fire three quick shots, and sounded like at least a 30-30, 30-6, or .308. I don't quite understand why it's illegal to hunt deer in those fields/woods with a HP rifle, and ok to use them for groundhogs? Same place, same guns, same state! When I can hear the shots(sounding like a cannon!!), scaring my pets into the garage, and freaking out my wife down in the garden, I have to get kinda concerned!? That kind of firepower could easily blow thru a tree, ricochet off a rock, and end up coming in the direction of my house(assuming these "hunters" are not careful where they're shooting)?


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## M.Magis (Apr 5, 2004)

Number people afield is the reason for the difference. No offense, but if you want to live in the country or suburbs, certain things come with it. Gunshots from people shooting ground hogs is one of them. It&#8217;s private property outside of the city, they&#8217;re allowed to shoot their guns. 
Blow through trees? Seriously? You may not have a lot of understanding of firearms. Unless you have idiots walking through your neighborhood while shooting, you don&#8217;t have anything to worry about.


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## icingdeath (Jun 2, 2010)

I have to comment. We tested 7.62x39 rounds at the cottage.using a 12 round apple tree.hollow points....no.FMJ yes.ranged from 15-50 yards.

_OutdoorHub Mobile, the information engine of the outdoors_


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## c. j. stone (Sep 24, 2006)

[/QUOTE] Unless you have idiots walking through your neighborhood while shooting, you don&#8217;t have anything to worry about.[/QUOTE]
That just might be the case(idiots). The farmers don't hunt, most of the shooting is from people who don't own the property they shoot on or bother to ask for permission: 
I was on my roof cleaning my chimney year before last and heard some .22 rifle fire in the woods behind and a little north of me. It was probably during squirrel season. After the last shot, I hear the whine of a small caliber bullet traveling above me probably 5-6 feet. I got down off the roof pretty quick after that, called the farmer the woods belonged to and asked if he knew who was hunting behind his field. He said he wasn't even aware anyone was out there. (I think therein lies most of the problem-no control!) I've also seen people drive slowly past and stop ON the road and shoot at groundhogs off the hood of their trucks. This is just plain reckless firearm use. 
My understanding of why no HP rifles allowed while hunting in Ohio is that it's relatively flat, the range of the bullets, and the state is so heavily populated.
And for the record, being a hunter myself for over 50 years, I have an above average understanding of firearms and their capabilities. Most of the woods in the area have been heavily timbered years back and some are only a few feet deep(tree lines) between fields and farms. A jacketed high powered rifle bullet could easily shoot thru a 4-5" tree-I've even done it with rifled slugs while deer hunting in "big boy" woods where I bothered to acquire permission to hunt and fire a gun.


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## bkr43050 (Apr 5, 2004)

What you are describing is an issue with the people and not the guns. Irresponsible and reckless individuals could endanger people even with a rimfire as you stated yourself. Bottom line is with a proper backstop guns of any caliber are safe and acceptable. If you are concerned about these individuals it sounds like you may want to have a discussion with the other owner again and make sure he is aware of what is going on.


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## M.Magis (Apr 5, 2004)

I agree with Brian, it&#8217;s the people not the guns. In your own example, you say a .22 was used. Clearly, that wouldn&#8217;t be near the maximum allowed yet the bullet can travel for 2 miles. I do understand what you&#8217;re saying, but a maximum caliber isn&#8217;t logical. Sounds like you&#8217;re talking ranges that even a shotgun slug would be a problem, in the hands of idiots. In the wrong hands, a slingshot is dangerous.


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## c. j. stone (Sep 24, 2006)

I suppose the loudness is the issue right after the "questionable judgement" of the users. It is more unnerving to hear a large caliber rifle shot vs. the short(less obtrusive) crack of a varmint caliber go off within 100 yds of your residence! I personally feel, if I ever got "accidentally" shot, I would hope it was NOT with a HP rifle. I've discussed the merits of allowing Tom, Dick and Harry to hunt on the adjacent farms(same family owns both), with absolutely no controls, guidelines, or restrictions in place, with the farmer. He basically said he didn't care what they did-that varmints do a lot of crop damage and he's not going to do anything to deter them! I just hope one of his animals, or family members never becomes a victim of this careless atitude. In the meantime, I plan to move mine to cover when I see "shooters" in the fields. Just don't think this is something I should have to be concerned about.


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## steelheadtracker (Oct 1, 2006)

icingdeath said:


> I have to comment. We tested 7.62x39 rounds at the cottage.using a 12 round apple tree.hollow points....no.FMJ yes.ranged from 15-50 yards.
> 
> _OutdoorHub Mobile, the information engine of the outdoors_


can you explain this post it confused me lol but im interested cuz i have an sks.


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## T-180 (Oct 18, 2005)

A "varmint rifle" is as loud or very close to the 30 caliber rounds you are questioning. A jacked up 22 centerfire or .243 is just as loud as any 30-06. Carelessness is another matter. Maybe go talk to the shooters and make sure they understand your concerns and know where your house is ; I've done just this & it helped. If noise is such an issue, what about the Harleys with the ultra short straight pipes ripping down the road ??!!


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## c. j. stone (Sep 24, 2006)

Folks, as indicated before, I know which(and what) guns sound like-I hunt(for many yrs now). I've taken my share of rabbits, squirrels, ducks/geese, upland game, and many deer. I use guns for all the above and also a Horton crossbow for deer-I own several guns up to and including an AK. Wouldn't say I'm an "expert" but I prob. know as much about firearms as 75% of of the readers on here. Obviously I am not opposed to hunting, if it's done in a safe manner, and on enough property to not pose a threat to people or domestic animals on that, or adjacent properties. I own three hunting Brittanies, two are now GUN(Noise) SHY! from neighborhood hunting, random shooting, and illegal fireworks! I do not live way out in No Man's Land(within a mile of a city of approx. 30K pop.) My wife and I are outside a large part of the day with our animals. If you heard the amount of "noise" from shooting and fireworks that regularly goes on around here, I'll guarantee, you'd be concerned too. And it seems to come from people other than the property owners-and also, it seems to get worse every year. The solution is prob. to move into a condo in the city but I'm not ready for that! Just sayin.


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## FISNFOOL (May 12, 2009)

Your warden friend can deal with the idiots as we PM'd each other.

The fireworks may get even worse. Ohio is thinking of legalizing bottle rockets and some other stuff.

To fix the gun shy issue, check this out. http://www.thundershirt.com/?gclid=CIXz_-yqnqoCFcTBKgodwkrX7Q

My daughter's dog used to need medicated to get through a thunder storm. Now they have their boat at Cedar Point and the fireworks every night do not even bother him. 

It worked on a gun shy beagle I had. 

Talk to the landowners, maybe they are willing to limit the caliber of modern center fire rifles used on their property. Since you hunt maybe you can offer to hunt groundhogs on his property.


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## c. j. stone (Sep 24, 2006)

Thanks for the incite and esp. for the info on the Thundershirts!
I've evolved in my hunting career to the point where I do not shoot anything
I don't plan to eat(yeah, I know they're not bad to eat and have done so) so I guess I won't be groundhog hunting around here.(I've had a baby gh as a pet and just can't bring myself to shooting them anymore.


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## Dan44149 (Apr 12, 2011)

A slug fired from a shotgun can do just as much damage (more in 150yd shots or less) as a HP rifle. You can blame PETA for the lack of HP rifle use.

Bullets traveling by your head do not make a whistle sound. It sounds like a crack of a stick breaking over someone's knee. I've had several 7.62x39/7.62x54/5.45x39mm's miss my head by inches in various locations throughout the world.


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## Lundy (Apr 5, 2004)

Dan44149 said:


> You can blame PETA for the lack of HP rifle use.


I don't like PETA and certainly like to make sure they get the blame they deserve but rifles have not been permitted in Ohio for much longer than PETA has even been in existence


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## Dan44149 (Apr 12, 2011)

Lundy said:


> I don't like PETA and certainly like to make sure they get the blame they deserve but rifles have not been permitted in Ohio for much longer than PETA has even been in existence


Just passing along what I've been told. Not really a "range factor" anymore. I can keyhole a 3 shot group from my slug gun at 150 yds. .30-06 zero'd in for 200 yds will be impacting dirt at 400 yds so I don't see the difference. It's capable of a lot more range in the right hands, but from what I've seen at my hunting club in NC where we use them from 2nd weekend in Oct - Jan 1st... 90% of hunters aren't capable of more than 300 yds with the best of optics... most can't calculate the ballistic coefficient/bullet drop for more than that either... 

As far as the trees being fired through in earlier conversation... I saw a shotgun (breaching weapon -modified Mossberg 500) fire a slug completely through a junk car in Afghanistan and shot a tree 12" or a lil better in diameter down while zeroing in my slug gun.

I guess the relevance is that I don't see the point to shotgun with slug vs HP laws.


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## Lundy (Apr 5, 2004)

Dan44149 said:


> .30-06 zero'd in for 200 yds will be impacting dirt at 400 yds so I don't see the difference.




30-06 165gr BT, 2873 FPS
200 yd zero - 22.3" low at 400 yds, 46.6" at 500yds

SST 12 ga, 300 gr. 2000FPS
100 yd zero - 97.01" low at 400 yds, 153" low at 500 yds
150 yd zero - 85.87" low at 400 yds, 170" low at 500 yds
200 yd zero - 72.82" low at 400 yds, 153" low at 500 yds

I think a shotgun slug, even the fast ones, hit the dirt much sooner than a 30-06 and the 30-06 round still retains over a 100 ft lbs of energy at 500 yds. No shotgun slug can do that.

I wish we could hunt with rifles but when I witness gun week every year I fully understand why we can't


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