# Gun control coparisons



## Shortdrift (Apr 5, 2004)

I received this from a lady that is totally against gun control and thought I would pass it on. If you would like a complete copy that includes comparisons of medical, traffic, etc, related deaths, send me a PM.

Very Interesting Facts About Gun Control

> There are 30,000 gun related deaths per year by firearms. That is not
> disputed.
> What is never shown though,is a breakdown of those deaths to put them in
> perspective; as compared to other causes of death.
>
> 65% of those deaths are by suicide which would never be prevented by
> gun laws.
> 15% are by law enforcement in the line of duty and justified.
> 17% are through criminal activity, gang and drug related or mentally
> ill persons 3% are accidental discharge deaths
>
> So technically, "gun violence" is not 30,000 annually but drops to
> 5,100. Still too many?
> Well, first, how are those deaths spanned across the nation?
> 480 homicides(9.4%) were in Chicago
> 344 homicides(6.7%) were in Baltimore
> 333 homicides(6.5%) were in Detroit
> 119 homicides(2.3%) were in Washington DC (a 54% increase over prior
> years)
> So basically, 25% of all gun crime happens in just 4 cities. All 4 of
> those cities have strict gun laws so it is not the lack of law that is
> the root cause.
> This basically leaves 3,825 for the entire rest of the nation or about
> 75 per state.
> That is an average because some States have much higher rates than
> others.
> For example, California had 1,169 while Alabama had 1.
> Now, who has the strictest gun laws by far? California of course but
> understand, it is not the tool (guns) driving this.
> It is a crime rate spawned by the number of criminal persons residing in
> those cities and states.
> So if all cities and states are not created equal, then there must be
> something other than the tool causing the gun deaths.


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## MassillonBuckeye (May 3, 2010)

A quick google search says Alabama had the third highest rate of gun deaths in 2013. Trailing only Alaska and Arkansas.

http://www.al.com/news/index.ssf/2015/01/alabama_ranked_had_third-highe.html

They go on to say, and I quote: "States with Weak Gun Laws and Higher Gun Ownership Lead Nation in Gun Deaths, New Data for 2013 Confirms."

18 firearm deaths for every 100,000 people.

So I don't know if I would trust your source. Or mine for that matter. Who cares, they can't take our guns.


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## beaver (Sep 28, 2010)

"According to a report from a gun control advocacy group"

I don't think his source is the only one that might be biased.


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## MassillonBuckeye (May 3, 2010)

beaver said:


> "According to a report from a gun control advocacy group"
> 
> I don't think his source is the only one that might be biased.


Never said they weren't lol. They all are anymore. No one can just tell the truth anymore it seems.
But Wait! Theres More! 3 Alabama counties rank highest in the nation in Accidental shooting deaths. Can't blame the thugs here. Or can you?:
"
*Three north Alabama counties rank highest in accidental shooting deaths"*
http://whnt.com/2016/07/11/three-north-alabama-counties-rank-highest-in-accidental-shooting-deaths/

Those stats are coming from the CDC.

"*Death by gun: Top 20 states with highest rates*"

#1. Alaska.
Death by firearm per 100,000 population: 19.8

No permit required for purchase of a firearm.

In Alaska, suicide was the leading cause of gun deaths, with it being the main factor in more than 80% of all firearm deaths. John Roman, senior fellow at the Urban Institute, an economic and social policy think tank told USA Today that states with the highest rates of suicide also usually had the strongest culture of gun ownership. "There are many more suicides in places where it's easy to get a gun," he said.

#2.*Louisiana*
Death by firearm per 100,000 population: 19.3

No permit required for a purchase of a firearm.

*3. Mississippi*
Death by firearm per 100,000 population: 17.8

No permit required for a purchase of a firearm.

*4. Alabama*
Death by firearm per 100,000 population: 17.6

No permit required for purchase of a firearm.

*5. Arkansas*
Death by firearm per 100,000 population: 16.8

No permit required for purchase of a firearm.

*6. Montana (TIE)*
Death by firearm per 100,000 population: 16.7

No permit required for a purchase of a firearm.

*6. Wyoming (TIE)*
Death by firearm per 100,000 population: 16.7

No permit required for a purchase of a firearm.

*8. Oklahoma*
Death by firearm per 100,000 population: 16.5

No permit required for a purchase of a firearm.

*9. New Mexico*
Death by firearm per 100,000 population: 15.5

No permit required for a purchase of a firearm.

*Motor vehicle traffic deaths*

Number of deaths: 33,804
Deaths per 100,000 population: 10.7
*All firearm deaths*

Number of deaths: 33,636
Deaths per 100,000 population: 10.6
Ban cars right? No. Regulate them? How many of you think seat belt laws make sense? I think its a violation of my freedom personally. I should have the choice to wear my seat belt or not. I don't have the God given right to travel as I see fit?

I love these discussions.


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## beaver (Sep 28, 2010)

Yea, places with more guns have more gun deaths. Id be willing to bet that places with more cars have more car related deaths as well. I bet places that harbor more rattlesnakes have more deaths caused by rattlesnakes as well.

The fact that suicide is the leading cause of those deaths still says a lot. Suicidal people don't kill themselves because they have a gun. They may use the gun because they have it, but if they didn't, they'd still be dead. 

Show me a scenario where gun ownership is just as high in a state with stricter gun laws, yet has fewer gun deaths, then I'll start to consider the validity of the gun control argument.


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## Flannel_Carp (Apr 7, 2014)

It's on the Internet and I agree with what it seems to support, so it must be true.




“Torture the data, and it will confess to anything.” – Nobel Prize Laureate Ronald Coase

Nobody/Nobody 2016.

I approve this message.


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## MassillonBuckeye (May 3, 2010)

beaver said:


> Yea, places with more guns have more gun deaths. Id be willing to bet that places with more cars have more car related deaths as well. I bet places that harbor more rattlesnakes have more deaths caused by rattlesnakes as well.
> 
> The fact that suicide is the leading cause of those deaths still says a lot. Suicidal people don't kill themselves because they have a gun. They may use the gun because they have it, but if they didn't, they'd still be dead.
> 
> Show me a scenario where gun ownership is just as high in a state with stricter gun laws, yet has fewer gun deaths, then I'll start to consider the validity of the gun control argument.


http://qz.com/437015/mapped-the-us-states-with-the-most-gun-owners-and-most-gun-deaths/


I dunno. I don't really care. Like I've said a million times, they can't take our guns. Thats not even on the list of remote possibilities. I just get a kick out of each side trying to make their case with ridiculous statistics.


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## Flannel_Carp (Apr 7, 2014)

MassillonBuckeye said:


> http://qz.com/437015/mapped-the-us-states-with-the-most-gun-owners-and-most-gun-deaths/
> 
> Looks like Vermont is gonna be your winner.
> 
> I dunno. I don't really care. Like I've said a million times, they can't take our guns. Thats not even on the list of remote possibilities. *I just get a kick out of each side trying to make their case with ridiculous statistics.*


Normally you and I are at odds, but I wholeheartedly agree here. It is sad and ridiculous but mostly sadly ridiculous.


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## MassillonBuckeye (May 3, 2010)

Flannel_Carp said:


> Normally you and I are at odds, but I wholeheartedly agree here. It is sad and ridiculous but mostly sadly ridiculous.


Thats not my fault! Lol!


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## Snakecharmer (Apr 9, 2008)

How about Truck control? 60 + deaths in one act of terror in France.....


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## MassillonBuckeye (May 3, 2010)

The roads are pretty heavily regulated already. I can't say for sure but I doubt the answer is less regulation or more trucks!


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## EStrong (Jul 23, 2014)

Two things drive me absolutely nuts when I hear them on the news: AR15 Rifle is a "Military Assault Rifle", BS! ...and when they call a magazine a "clip". Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh! 

Everyday innocent people are killed or injured by those who drive vehicles under the influence of alcohol or drugs (heroin). BUT, because it's not a hot button political issue, nobody brings it up, addresses it or attempts to fix the problem. I don't know the stats but I bet the numbers of those deaths or injuries are as close to or higher than what I consider real gun deaths.

When it comes to gun control common sense should dictate, but neither the left wing Hoplophobes or the right wing open carry gun nuts do anything to make the situation better. A good middle ground and some actual thinking and not emotional reaction is the way to deal with it but nobody has the brains to figure that out yet (politicians).

One thing I do know for sure: Any area deemed a "gun free" zone is nothing but a target rich environment for someone with illegal intentions to carry out their act of violence without resistance.

This means open season on law abiding citizens...
View media item 79163


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## beaver (Sep 28, 2010)

I agree. The thing is that guns are already regulated though. I'm not really sure what other regulations people think are going to do any good. 

Someone brought up how vehicles were regulated. That is correct, and yet there are thousands of people who drive them without licences every day. Just because a law I'd created, doesn't mean a criminal is going to follow it.

Mental health checks. I agree that Hannibal lector shouldn't be allowed to buy a gun. However, the discretion of the Dr would play a part in such checks. If the Dr is pro gun, my guess is they would be pretty lenient on who they clear. If they opposite its true, they could find anything about anyone to deny them. I'm pretty sure darn near everyone I know has either been prescribed anti depressants or served over seas at some point in time. I'm sure an anti gun Dr or politician could use that to deny someone.

I get sick of hearing about how dangerous online sales are. Either people are ignorant, or just pushing agendas. You can't just order a gun online and have it shipped to you. You can order it online and have it shipped to a dealer, where you have to fill out the proper forms and have a background check before purchasing. 

People claiming that all they want are "common sense laws" are oblivious to the fact that those laws already exist.


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## EStrong (Jul 23, 2014)

Yep, when they pass more legislation in reaction to a violent gun incident, it only brings down all the legal gun owners and doesn't solve any problems.

Like you Beaver, I'm also tired of hearing about the online sales BS and the "gun show loophole" BS. They don't exist. I've had people try to argue the fact that you can buy a fully automatic military assault rifle at a gun show without a background check... Puh lease.... I also hate the fact you need an ATF stamp to buy a suppressor. More govt. BS and left wing "saw it in the movies" crap where people think you put one on a gun and you can tap off unlimited rounds in complete silence. In Europe, it is considered rude and not polite if you hunt without a suppressor on your firearm.


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## beaver (Sep 28, 2010)

It all boils to people being closed minded and lazy. There are too many people with the attitude that if it doesn't affect their way of life, then nobody else should be affected either. Most people are also too lazy to do their own research, which is why they listen to talking heads and get their information from the movies. God forbid they look on YouTube and see how loud a suppressor actually is, or actually look into the current laws, or go to a gun show and see how things actually work.


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## bobk (Apr 30, 2004)

EStrong said:


> Two things drive me absolutely nuts when I hear them on the news: AR15 Rifle is a "Military Assault Rifle", BS! ...and when they call a magazine a "clip". Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!
> 
> Everyday innocent people are killed or injured by those who drive vehicles under the influence of alcohol or drugs (heroin). BUT, because it's not a hot button political issue, nobody brings it up, addresses it or attempts to fix the problem. I don't know the stats but I bet the numbers of those deaths or injuries are as close to or higher than what I consider real gun deaths.
> 
> ...


I hate the words assault rifle too. Uneducated fools.


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## MassillonBuckeye (May 3, 2010)

beaver said:


> I get sick of hearing about how dangerous online sales are. Either people are ignorant, or just pushing agendas. You can't just order a gun online and have it shipped to you. You can order it online and have it shipped to a dealer, where you have to fill out the proper forms and have a background check before purchasing.
> 
> People claiming that all they want are "common sense laws" are oblivious to the fact that those laws already exist.


No but I can say, Hey Beaver, want to sell me a gun? And we meet up and you sell me whatever. Like what happens all the time on OGF here. How many background checks are happening here? Can you regulate that? I doubt it.

I bought a gun on Gun Broker face to face. No background check, didn't check my ID. No bill of sale.

You are talking about if you want it shipped to you.

Gun shows. Anyone can apply for a table and go sell guns. You DONT been to be FFL to sell guns at most gun shows. If I think I still qualify as an individual and not in the business of selling firearms, I can sit there and sell out of my collection. And next week sell some more out of my collection, and then sell some more out of my collection. The onus is on the seller to determine at which point hes engaging in the business of selling firearms as opposed to casual sales and if you don't think thats a grey area that gets abused, I'd say get your heads out of the sand!






dispute that. lol Thats exactly how it works. Now does that mean ALL deals at gun shows go down like that? Absolutely not. But thats the freedom the law affords us when it comes to selling our personal firearms. Does it get abused? You make the call!


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## beaver (Sep 28, 2010)

Correct, but the internet is just how you chose to contact someone. The anti crowd tries to portray it like you can hop on Amazon and have a machine gun dropped off by the ups guy.


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## MassillonBuckeye (May 3, 2010)

bobk said:


> I hate the words assault rifle too. Uneducated fools.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/StG_44
this gun proper name is storm(assault) rifle. It's sole purpose was to lay waste or suppress as efficiently as possible and I'm guessing it was pretty good at it. Assault Rifles exist dude. People thinking AR stands for Assault Rifle is a little annoying I agree but ultimately I don't think it matters. People are going to be ignorant.


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## MassillonBuckeye (May 3, 2010)

beaver said:


> Correct, but the internet is just how you chose to contact someone. The anti crowd tries to portray it like you can hop on Amazon and have a machine gun dropped off by the ups guy.


\
The internet is the directory yes. The Internet is the catalog.
As far as the medias portrayal I can't say I've never seen them name a site or anything like that. I think many times they leave it vague so then people fill in the blanks themselves. Still slightly deceptive I agree. You can't stop people from having uninformed opinions though. Another problem with the internet. I was never entitled to your uninformed opinion until the internet came around. Social Media is the devil 

And when I say You, I dont mean you personally Beaver.


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## streamstalker (Jul 8, 2005)

post deleted


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## MassillonBuckeye (May 3, 2010)

streamstalker said:


> The gun murder rate would be ten times higher if people were better shots and we didn't have such good trauma centers.


Good point lol. I don't know how some of these guys survive. Luck was on their side that day!


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## EStrong (Jul 23, 2014)

MassillonBuckeye said:


> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/StG_44
> this gun proper name is storm(assault) rifle. It's sole purpose was to lay waste or suppress as efficiently as possible and I'm guessing it was pretty good at it. Assault Rifles exist dude. People thinking AR stands for Assault Rifle is a little annoying I agree but ultimately I don't think it matters. People are going to be ignorant.


Yeah, that is a "true" assault rifle. Just like a real AK47, Uzi 9mm, or a 3 burst-Fully Auto M16. When the press calls a semi-auto AR15 a machine gun or assault rifle is when I think most of us have issue. I've said this before, with the right semi-auto handgun and extra magazines, you can do as much damage as an AR15 if you had your mind set to it.

If people are selling fully automatic weapons at a gun show without the proper license and paperwork, well, they're breaking the law and should be dealt with by the authorities. Selling crack is illegal but people do it anyway, same with illegal guns and people selling via the internet posing as legal gun dealers. Technically there are no loopholes for those that chose to not break the law. If I wanted to sell you a .308 Remington or Savage via the OGF marketplace or other internet forum/meeting place that is fine. If I throw in the suppressor and we don't do the proper paperwork with the ATF then we're both idiots and should be busted.

You also know, some of those AK47s are not fully automatic. They are semi-auto versions. There's a lot of them floating around these days. Just like the AR15, they look scary but one round per trigger pull. I would REALLY like to see someone try to sell a fully automatic, ATF regulated, need a tax stamp to buy or sell it, true assault rifle at a gun show. If you're not a dealer and can prove it, as you said, anyone can sell a regular gun to anyone as a one on one transaction. The ATF and govt. keeps an eye out on those things. You do have to register to get a table and if you're pushing questionable items, you will get flagged and checked out.

Ok, I'm off to do some fishing and then put some rounds on target at the range. All this talk of guns and shooting has my trigger finger screaming out for use. LOL...


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## beaver (Sep 28, 2010)

You can't regulate the stupid or the evil out of people. Bad people are going to do bad things. It's that simple. Making good people jump through more hoops won't stop that.


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## EStrong (Jul 23, 2014)

Btw, this has been a very good thread and the posts have been informative and respectful. Just the way it should be. We all seem to be on the same page for the most part but any disagreements or grey areas are what they are, opinions in a conversation that could take place anywhere. This is why our country is great, we can have conversations like this, express our opinions and go from there. They don't talk about politics, gun control or the govt. in places like North Korea, Iran, Saudi, etc. in the open and that's a shame. God Bless America and pass the ammunition!

Be Well, E...


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## bobk (Apr 30, 2004)

MassillonBuckeye said:


> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/StG_44
> thia gun proper name is storm(assault) rifle. It's sole purpose was to lay waste or suppress as efficiently as possible and I'm guessing it was pretty good at it. Assault Rifles exist dude. People thinking AR stands for Assault Rifle is a little annoying I agree but ultimately I don't think it matters. People are going to be ignorant..


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## MassillonBuckeye (May 3, 2010)

EStrong said:


> Yeah, that is a "true" assault rifle. Just like a real AK47, Uzi 9mm, or a 3 burst-Fully Auto M16. When the press calls a semi-auto AR15 a machine gun or assault rifle is when I think most of us have issue. I've said this before, with the right semi-auto handgun and extra magazines, you can do as much damage as an AR15 if you had your mind set to it.
> 
> If people are selling fully automatic weapons at a gun show without the proper license and paperwork, well, they're breaking the law and should be dealt with by the authorities. Selling crack is illegal but people do it anyway, same with illegal guns and people selling via the internet posing as legal gun dealers. Technically there are no loopholes for those that chose to not break the law. If I wanted to sell you a .308 Remington or Savage via the OGF marketplace or other internet forum/meeting place that is fine. If I throw in the suppressor and we don't do the proper paperwork with the ATF then we're both idiots and should be busted.
> 
> ...


Why differentiate between select and semi? Doesn't make sense to me. You can still shoot extremely fast. Its the same gun. One with a little more potential. Although you are probably a more accurate shot with semi auto. Can't just spray and pray. I've never shot a fully auto anything to know, but common sense said barrel rise, if you aren't used to it will take you off the target. Thats not what people are using to perpetrate crime these days though. Maybe back in the Miami Vice days people were using a bunch of uzis and mac-10s. Now the weapon of choice are Glocks and whatever. I don't even know. I don't read those stories. I don't what to know what they used. I don't even want to know their names. If you ask me, thats where we start when trying to tackle this problem we seem to have. Stop sensationalizing the criminals. Thats usually their motivation. Sucks for the families involved, but you can't take back what happend. That monster needs erased from history not idolized by a bunch of other monsters. 

I'd vote for banning media coverage of mass shootings/drivings/ etc.


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## EStrong (Jul 23, 2014)

MassillonBuckeye said:


> Why differentiate between select and semi? Doesn't make sense to me. You can still shoot extremely fast. Its the same gun. One with a little more potential. Although you are probably a more accurate shot with semi auto. Can't just spray and pray. I've never shot a fully auto anything to know, but common sense said barrel rise, if you aren't used to it will take you off the target.


No no no no no, I have to disagree with you this time. Semi and Fully Auto are nowhere near the same, at all. You think you can pull that trigger that fast for how long sir? HAHA, good luck. Your finger will be dead before you can get through the 2nd magazine if you're trying for speed. They've got these really neat things called Muzzle Brakes, heard of one? They'll keep your barrel from flying all over on a fully automatic and let you stay on point. Guess you've never shot a fully automatic? You should try it and then we'll talk. Once you've peeled a few rounds/mags/belts through a fully automatic weapon you'll know that there is a HUGE difference between those and the semi-auto versions. The only similarity might be how a military rifle's platform is used to make a semi auto rifle for civilian sale, that and the caliber of ammo used. Just because an AR15 is today's civilian version of the M16 and they do have semi-auto versions of the AK47, let's not lump them together as evil assault weapons. I can make a 9mm Glock handgun into full auto if I wish. Are all Glock handguns now assault weapons because of the potential to become one? Let's not even talk about modifying handgun magazines to increase ammo capacity well beyond 30 rounds, that just might scare ya.


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## MassillonBuckeye (May 3, 2010)

EStrong said:


> No no no no no, I have to disagree with you this time. Semi and Fully Auto are nowhere near the same, at all. You think you can pull that trigger that fast for how long sir? HAHA, good luck. Your finger will be dead before you can get through the 2nd magazine if you're trying for speed. They've got these really neat things called Muzzle Brakes, heard of one? They'll keep your barrel from flying all over on a fully automatic and let you stay on point. Guess you've never shot a fully automatic? You should try it and then we'll talk. Once you've peeled a few rounds/mags/belts through a fully automatic weapon you'll know that there is a HUGE difference between those and the semi-auto versions. The only similarity might be how a military rifle's platform is used to make a semi auto rifle for civilian sale, that and the caliber of ammo used. Just because an AR15 is today's civilian version of the M16 and they do have semi-auto versions of the AK47, let's not lump them together as evil assault weapons. I can make a 9mm Glock handgun into full auto if I wish. Are all Glock handguns now assault weapons because of the potential to become one? Let's not even talk about modifying handgun magazines to increase ammo capacity well beyond 30 rounds, that just might scare ya.


Practice makes perfect! I like speed shooting. I've seen guys shoot double action pistols faster than your eye can see. Google Jerry Miculek. Now obviously hes clearly at one end of the spectrum, and also my hero, but proof you dont need an automatic weapon to put a whole lotta lead down range in a hurry. Check him out rapid firing his barret 50cal. awe inspiring.

All I asked is why classify one a certain thing, but not another just because you can't hold the trigger? Its still pretty much the same thing. Lazer guided vs suitcase, they are still bombs. I dunno. Ultimately I don't think it really matters what you call it.

Assault hammer? Its semi-auto...










Heres your actual assault hammer....








sucker looks pretty wicked.

Bob, you cool with me calling this an Assault Hammer? Or do I actually have to assault someone with it? Or does it require some other special qualities to earn that title?  Doesn't look automatic E-strong D:


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## laynhardwood (Dec 27, 2009)

That semi auto hammer looks like it would come in handy for the aging carpenter


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## joebertin (Mar 26, 2010)

Cain killed Able with an assault rock...

That aspect of humanity has not changed, anyone expecting it to change is a fool.

Human nature is the problem. 

A deep respect and value of human life would mitigate much of the problem.
That value has to be taught and embraced. Much more difficult and time consuming
than writing a law.

You can legislate for or against inanimate objects, they cannot respond either way.

We need to get our values together socially before things will improve.


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## EStrong (Jul 23, 2014)

MassillonBuckeye said:


> Practice makes perfect! I like speed shooting. I've seen guys shoot double action pistols faster than your eye can see. Google Jerry Miculek. Now obviously hes clearly at one end of the spectrum, and also my hero, but proof you dont need an automatic weapon to put a whole lotta lead down range in a hurry. Check him out rapid firing his barret 50cal. awe inspiring.
> 
> All I asked is why classify one a certain thing, but not another just because you can't hold the trigger? Its still pretty much the same thing. Lazer guided vs suitcase, they are still bombs. I dunno. Ultimately I don't think it really matters what you call it.


I've always enjoyed our conversations on here on various subjects.  A healthy banter is always good!

Ok, I've seen those speed shooters, and yes they can put lead downrange. But your average violent moron does not have the skill to do that. I would liken a pro speed shooter in the same category as someone who can throw a fastball 95mph. They are out there and there are many, but you don't find one just walking around in the general public like boogers or bubble gum under a table. To me, fully auto makes a difference regardless of how it's dressed up. Semi auto "scary" rifles are just that, scary looking. Just a point; you can take a .308 Winchester from Savage or Remington (non-bolt action, magazine fed), and rig a magazine to hold more than 50 rounds. I actually think you can buy them already made for that. Military snipers use .308s, should those be considered assault rifles now too? I've also seen people pour through rounds with a bolt action rifle and put them in a tight cluster. I think a .308 round (hollow point) does just as much damage as anything you can put through an AR15 or semi-auto AK47 depending on how those are chambered and other varied factors such as target distance, shooter skill, etc. As I said before, someone with average shooting skills could do as much damage as an AR15 with a 9mm Glock and a backpack full of large cap magazines.

joebertin's post above said it best. You can legislate and ban objects, somebody will just find a new object to inflict violence with. Just look what happened in France, idiot with a semi truck ran down 80+ people. Thank God the explosives in it didn't go off.


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## bobk (Apr 30, 2004)

Oh man, I didn't hear it was full of explosives. Agree, glad they didn't go off.


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## bobk (Apr 30, 2004)

MassillonBuckeye said:


> Practice makes perfect! I like speed shooting. I've seen guys shoot double action pistols faster than your eye can see. Google Jerry Miculek. Now obviously hes clearly at one end of the spectrum, and also my hero, but proof you dont need an automatic weapon to put a whole lotta lead down range in a hurry. Check him out rapid firing his barret 50cal. awe inspiring.
> 
> All I asked is why classify one a certain thing, but not another just because you can't hold the trigger? Its still pretty much the same thing. Lazer guided vs suitcase, they are still bombs. I dunno. Ultimately I don't think it really matters what you call it.
> 
> ...


You can call a turd a piece of chocolate cake if you wish.


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## MIGHTY (Sep 21, 2013)

It must just be because AR's are "scary" because I thought hand guns accounted for a large majority of the guns used in crimes?


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