# crossbreed bass?



## robistro (Apr 13, 2007)

Can anyone identify this specie of fish? Looks like a cross between a whitbass or striper and a smallmouth or spotted bass. I place my foot so I could measure this length, which is about 13" First time I've saw anything like this.
I hope everyone can view the picture. I had trouble trying to upload.
Thanks.


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## Brian.Smith (May 18, 2006)

Looks like a smallie to me


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## 1badmthrfisher (Apr 4, 2005)

That is a spotted bass. Also known as a Kentucky bass.


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## robistro (Apr 13, 2007)

I originally thought spotted bass, but they usually have a defined horizontal pattern on the side. (at least the ones I am familiar with) This fish just seemed to have whitebass or striper features is why I wanted other opinions.
Anyway, it didnt bite me and it was set free. Catch and release.


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## cadyshac (Dec 9, 2005)

Thats a spot.


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## BlueBoat98 (Nov 5, 2004)

I'm going with Spot also. The dark spot on the gill cover is the best identifier in the absence of clear body markings. Also, it's not genetically possible for a White Bass, Striper, or Hybrid Stiper to crossbreed with a a Smallie, Largemouth or Spot. The first are in the Morone genus and are true Bass. Largemouth, etc are in Micropterus which is really a Sunfish. They are as likely to reproduce as your Pit Bull and Siamese Cat.

MC


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## robistro (Apr 13, 2007)

Thanks for all the replys and info, very helpful. 
I'd hate to run into a siamese pitbull! I did see quite a few snakes on the banks of the river today.


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## catmando (Aug 21, 2006)

Spot

View attachment 13457


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## robistro (Apr 13, 2007)

only reason I didnt think it was a 'spot' was no definitive horizontal line and rows of dark spots on the sides. Also, I caught this fish in Ohio not Kentucky.... lol


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## Wiper Swiper (May 24, 2005)

Actually, that could quite possibly be a spot/smallie cross. I'd have to do some digging, but I've seen such examples on the web before.

Disturbing, if was in a creek that spots have expanded their range into. I hope it came from the Ohio river, or at least not far from it.


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## skeeter150zx (Apr 22, 2008)

Where was this fish taken? It is a spot. They are very agressive and very fun to catch. I've caught a few on the Ohio river, but not much else in Ohio.


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## riverKing (Jan 26, 2007)

thats just a spot, the s look like that most of the time in the ohio. i have seen pictures of black bass hybrids but they are so rare in the wild they are not worth mentioning. also, spots are 100% native to all of our streams in the ohio river drainage, they dont take over smallie creeks they're abundace has gone up because they prefer more silted areas which we have provided them. they live throughout the ohio i have personally shocked them in pitsburg and they have always been up in places like the darby and the upper lmr, if you dont like invasives (i dont either), you atleast have to get them right.


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## Wiper Swiper (May 24, 2005)

You're wrong.

Whereas spots are native to the Ohio river drainage, their historiclly native range is expanding. Yes, it is a water quality issue (mainly hydomodification) that has made this possible.

Spots are extremely prolific, and voracious feeders. They will out compete smallies for food and prime spawning habitat. Cross breeding is rare, but if this fish came from outside the spot's historic range, it bothers me.

The more I look at it, the more I think it's a cross. Bronze color, dark fins, and stripes on the head all look smallie. The white pearly belly, body shape, and jaw line look like a spot. I'd love to see it with it's mouth closed, and know whether or not it had a tongue patch.

Outside their range, spots ARE invasive...just like cormorants. Granted, we don't have a huge problem...yet...say, like Indiana or Missouri. But, if I catch them where they're not suppose to be, I do reduce them to my posession limit.


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## WALLEYE WALLHANGIN' (May 10, 2008)

look at the jaw.......its a spot!!! i fished lake lanier GA for 10 years.....thats a malnurished looking spot!!


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## walleyevision (Aug 4, 2005)

Wiper Swiper said:


> .
> 
> The more I look at it, the more I think it's a cross. Bronze color, dark fins, and stripes on the head all look smallie. The white pearly belly, body shape, and jaw line look like a spot. QUOTE]
> 
> I have heard of a cross of a smallie and a spot called a meanmouth bass before, but I agree it does look like both.


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## WALLEYE WALLHANGIN' (May 10, 2008)

contrary to my last comment,now that i look at the tail.........that might just be some kinda toxic waste mutant..............the spots along the belly tell me spot,but that tail......unlike any spot ive seen...and ive caught hundreds over 5lbs.


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## dobester111 (Jul 17, 2005)

http://www.fishin.com/articles/meanmouth.htm this page might help some. doug


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## catmando (Aug 21, 2006)

Can anyone read! If you look at my post with a description of bass it states that adult spots have the vertical spots, so if you wait a few years it could have spots!!!


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## robistro (Apr 13, 2007)

This fish was caught in the littlemiami river (milford) I didnt think to analyze the fish at the time, but while I kept fishing I was thinking to myself "what the hell kind of fish was that?" So when I got home, I posted the pic and asked others their opinion.


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## robistro (Apr 13, 2007)

WALLEYE WALLHANGIN' said:


> contrary to my last comment,now that i look at the tail.........that might just be some kinda toxic waste mutant..............the spots along the belly tell me spot,but that tail......unlike any spot ive seen...and ive caught hundreds over 5lbs.


The TAIL is the main reason I questioned this catch. Looked like a white bass tail to me. I've caught spotted bass myself in the Ohio River. NONE looked like this fish and were easily identifiable.


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## GMR_Guy (Apr 10, 2004)

I think that it is a cross between a smallie and a spot.


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## leupy (Feb 12, 2007)

I can't say for sure but given it's size I would guess it should have a pronounced lateral line if it were a spot. Google yellow bass and check it out. I am suggesting this due to the color and you did not provide a good photo of the dorsel fin.


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## cantsleep (Jul 25, 2007)

It's definately a black crappie.


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## Lunkers (Mar 8, 2007)

I think it is a meanmouth. I remember reading/hearing about cross bread bass in the southern region. I seen a link about the meanmouth. I would think this is a example of cross bread Smallie/spot. I am no biologist, but I know I have read about this from people who are experts. Belly is too white and back is to brown/yellow to be either indivdually, but both combined......maybe.


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## riverKing (Jan 26, 2007)

its not a meanmouth, nor a cross in any way. its a full spotted bass.
swiper, if you would like an icthyology lesson i would be willing to ablige, you really need to check your info, 30 miles farther up a river is not expansion, there are no natural barriers it is within range. next you will be telling me they are introducing non native shovelnose sturgeon into the scioto.


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## Lunkers (Mar 8, 2007)

I dont know if this will work. These are links to meanmouth photos, look pretty similar too me.




http://www.tnfish.org/PhotoGalleryFish_TWRA/FishPhotoGallery_TWRA/pages/MeanmouthBassHybridSmallmouthSpottedNorrisNegus_jpg.htm


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## Lunkers (Mar 8, 2007)

Like I said, I am no biologist, but I have found these links. These fish are very much like the one in this thread. I would like a explanation as to why this fish could not possibly be a meanmouth, and must be a spot. I have caught alot of spots and never seen brown/orange/yellow on them. Although I am male and could be color blind.
http://www.outdoorcentral.com/mc/pr/03/10/14a1.asp


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## Bassnpro1 (Apr 6, 2004)

I'm with ya riverKing, an Icthyology class would go a long way with some of these people. Looks like a normal spotted to me. I shocked Ohio's streams for a summer and ran into some interesting things, but this doesn't appear to be one of them.


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## Flathead King 06 (Feb 26, 2006)

cantsleep said:


> It's definately a black crappie.


LOL... or is it a white one... better count the dorsal spines  sorry guys....


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## seethe303 (Dec 12, 2006)

Bassnpro1 said:


> I'm with ya riverKing, an Icthyology class would go a long way with some of these people. Looks like a normal spotted to me. I shocked Ohio's streams for a summer and ran into some interesting things, but this doesn't appear to be one of them.


I would love to hear about these interesting things!


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## Flathead King 06 (Feb 26, 2006)

seethe303 said:


> I would love to hear about these interesting things!


Me too!!! Enlighten us Bassnpro1


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## Bassnpro1 (Apr 6, 2004)

Most of the interesting crosses occured in sunfish. I can't remember any specific ones, but we always brought the fish back to the lab for ID when we weren't positive of the ID. Some of the cool stuff were pike coming from trickles, or a brown trout out of a trib of the Ohio(Washington county). A green sunfish that came out of a ORANGE acid mine drainage stream. I have no idea how he was still living in that thing. Some streams looked like crap and spit out 4 lb smallies, others looked great and didn't have much. It was always interesting every time we got the shocker in the water.


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## Flathead King 06 (Feb 26, 2006)

Bassnpro1 said:


> Most of the interesting crosses occured in sunfish. I can't remember any specific ones, but we always brought the fish back to the lab for ID when we weren't positive of the ID. Some of the cool stuff were pike coming from trickles, or a brown trout out of a trib of the Ohio(Washington county). A green sunfish that came out of a ORANGE acid mine drainage stream. I have no idea how he was still living in that thing. Some streams looked like crap and spit out 4 lb smallies, others looked great and didn't have much. It was always interesting every time we got the shocker in the water.


Pretty cool... but I was expecting something to have like 4 eyeballs and a laser beam emitter or something...


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## Bassnpro1 (Apr 6, 2004)

we shocked some streams where I thought that might be the case, but I never saw any laser beams


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## LMRsmallmouth (Jan 10, 2006)

Looks alot like a "fish" to me......


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## Wiper Swiper (May 24, 2005)

riverKing, the location of the catch wasn't revealed until after my last post. No conflict...yes, I consider 30 miles upstream of the Ohio in the LMR well within the spot's historic range.

It was this statement that I take exception to-- *"also, spots are 100% native to all of our streams in the ohio river drainage..."*

Spare me the icthyology lesson. If you don't know that's far too broad of a generalization...there's not much you can show me.

It's a picture. I don't know if it's a hybrid, and neither do you. Again, I agree that if it's not a hybrid it's a spot. The picture does show unique color variations, and an interesting dorsal/caudal fin development. Perhaps I'm staring at the jaw line a little too hard....but, I think the fish shows some degree of hybridization. Maybe after hatching, it actually had the notion to swim downstream? 

As spots introduce themselves into skinny water, competition for spawning habitat increases the probability of cross breeding. What was rare (all things being equal), has changed with human initiated variables. Spots threaten traditional smallie strongholds. What's wrong with killing an invasive, overpopulated species...isn't that what selective harvest is all about?

Let me guess...double crested cormorants are native, and their rapidly increasing numbers are no cause for alarm???

Did you know that if you shoot the off their roost with a crossbow at daybreak...they don't spook and the Ranger never heard a thing?


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## Lunkers (Mar 8, 2007)

Oh my goodness. It never surprises me where these threads end up. We can let our emotions respond, when we should use our knowledge. This is a interesting subject about fish ID in a SW Ohio watershed. Either way it is a unique fish and post. I do appreciate the thread for what it is. Thanks for posting. I just think we will never know.


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## riverKing (Jan 26, 2007)

they are listed (varies slightly depending on who writes it) as native in the ohio drainage expect in the upper muskingum and some of the upper gmr, my generalization(which it was) was pretty close. also i never said anything about keeping them, i dont care, but breaking the law in the morning is reckless. this is getting out of hand, im out before the thread is closed


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## chrsvic (Apr 20, 2005)

This has been a most entertaining thread!

I guess my first instinct would be to call it a spot, when i see the dark "lines" on the belly. They seem to have more of a potbelly shape than smallies. I just wish they grew bigger.

I've caught them in Caesar's Creek, Darby Creek, and the Ohio River. The Ohio is a good place to catch all three.


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## LMRsmallmouth (Jan 10, 2006)

I agree....intresting fish and interesting thread, everything else is just speculation at this point, seeing how the fish is now back in the water and not with a biologist.

On a side note....it is amazing how much this site has changed in the last year. Seems to be going downhill now a days, an awful lot of know-it-all's and alot less useful info and posts. Hence the reason I never give fishing reports anymore. Alot of people wanting to know everyones fishing holes and alot of people willing to give them up. They will be regretting that in a few months when their "honey holes" are crowded forever and all the hard work they did to scout holes will be for nothing. I am sure I am not alone in my feelings, especially from the old timers.....


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## robistro (Apr 13, 2007)

I never thought I would get so many replies to this post. Seems there is no definate answer, only speculation. Thanks for all that replied. I really didnt think much about the fish until I got home and downloaded my pictures. I always try to take my camera along when I fish. If I would have realized this fish was unusual, I would have taken more pictures for identification. As for me, I'm going with a whitebass crossed with a smallie. And maybe next time, I'll be more careful before I stick my thumb in the mouth of a fish!


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