# Hybrid Stripers to be stocked in Griggs/Oshay



## acklac7 (May 31, 2004)

While it's not yet "official", several credible sources have confirmed that the DNR is going to be stocking Hybrid stripers in both Griggs and Oshay this Spring! 

Personally I think it's a great decision, as us river anglers will have a new species to target, especially during high water events:B


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## fishslim (Apr 28, 2005)

Sounds interesting but WOW! All the rivers being in trouble due to a saugeye being in there,what will the smallmouths do with a even more agressive predator in the system. Ask Wiper Swiper he should love to hear that one,after the way he feels about them in Kiser. Would make for a spillway action again though!!


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## acklac7 (May 31, 2004)

fishslim said:


> Sounds interesting but WOW! All the rivers being in trouble due to a saugeye being in there,what will the smallmouths do with a even more agressive predator in the system. Ask Wiper Swiper he should love to hear that one,after the way he feels about them in Kiser. Would make for a spillway action again though!!



Other people in the fisheries field know more than I do, but I believe Hybrid Stripers are open-water piscivores that primarily target baitfish (shad) and wouldn't really be a big threat to Smallmouths.

Either way im sure it's going to stir up some controversy. 

The avid Smallie guys should know that you rarely catch Saugeye and Smallmouth side-by-side (in the Scioto), except for below spillways. I think the same pattern would apply to the Hybrids.


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## acklac7 (May 31, 2004)

fishslim said:


> Sounds interesting but WOW! All the rivers being in trouble due to a saugeye being in there,what will the smallmouths do with a even more agressive predator in the system.


And what rivers are you talking about in particular? While I hate to admit it, the DNR does a good job limiting the #'s of S-eye in the U.Scioto in order to maintain a natural predator/prey ratio...Maybe Big Walnut and the GMR are a whole different story?


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## fishslim (Apr 28, 2005)

No particular one or was it meant towards you A.J. Was more just a tounge and cheek statement towards older threads that have been on the subject. Figure your thread would bring out some interesting posts. Will see. If they do i will be ready to let them burn up my reels below the spillways.


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## Bubba bass bigfoot (May 8, 2006)

Sounds good to me. Hope they go through with it.


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## fishingredhawk (Apr 14, 2004)

You've got to be kidding me. They also lifted the 12" minimum on bass.

Are they trying to destroy the bass population?


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## acklac7 (May 31, 2004)

fishingredhawk said:


> You've got to be kidding me. They also lifted the 12" minimum on bass.
> 
> Are they trying to destroy the bass population?


I had a feeling the LM guys were not going to be pleased...That being said i'd love to hear some qualified arguments on the subject, instead of the same old "OMG there going to eat all of the baitfish and let the Bass starve" rhetoric (no offense Mike ) 

And as I understand it this is a *one time only* trial stocking.


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## Mushijobah (May 4, 2004)

At least they won't be screwing with the the lower Scioto's native sauger stock.


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## crittergitter (Jun 9, 2005)

Any concerned fishermen can go to the ODNR Open House meeting and ask them about it directly. The meetings are this Sunday.

http://www.ohiogamefishing.com/community/showthread.php?t=112143

As for them stocking hybrid stripers, it doesnt matter to me.


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## Net (Apr 10, 2004)

I did hear Ray Petering mention at the hoover seminar on saturday that the state is looking at stocking blue cats in some ohio reservoirs. He wouldn't name any names though. I would think hoover would be a front runner with its abundance of shad.


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## Scientific Angler (Jul 12, 2007)

A.J. is right about how hybrid stripers are open water piscivores and so there shouldn't be to much overlap with bass or saugeye in the lakes. Also the DNR has measured the gizzard shad biomass in these lakes and have decided that these lakes aren't gizzard shad limited which basically means that there are plenty of giz for all species. 

One worry though is that hybrid stripers are very migratory and might not stick around. Personally I think it is a good idea to try it out for a few years and see what happens. If it works out it could create a pretty awesome resevoir and tailwater fishery.


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## dKilla (May 1, 2007)

Love it. I doubt there'll be much impact on the bass fishery. Although I havent spent much time on Oshay, I can say that it seems like there are PLENTY of shad to go around @ Griggs. As long as they don't overstock the hybrids this could be a win-win.


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## dKilla (May 1, 2007)

NitroRider can attest to the fact that there is already at least one BIG hybrid in Griggs. He caught one last year that was 8lbs+ as I remember. There's a pic of it on here somewhere.


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## norseangler (Jan 8, 2009)

Question: What's your source for saying the 12-inch limit is being dropped? According to the fishing regulations that go into effect March 1, the various 12-inch, 15-inch and 12-15 slot limit lakes are the same this year. As for putting wipers in O'Shaughnessey, it shouldn't have much effect on the bass, for the reasons already stated. They put wipers in Dillon a couple years ago and it certainly hasn't hurt the bass fishing there. They probably go through the dam like the saugeye do.


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## misfit (Apr 5, 2004)

actually,wipers have been in dillon for years.i caught fish in the spillway there in the 90's in the 5-8 pound range.
as for griggs and o'shay,it might be a nice addition if forage base is sufficient.


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## Phil Carver (Apr 5, 2004)

If they have stocked wipers in Dillon , they must not be doing to well. I remember Charles Mill being polluted with shad at one time and in just a few years the shad population had dropped dramatically. The shad cover the lake at Dillon every year.

Ido not see the wipers causing any threats to any other fish species on the river. I do however see a great angling opportunity!


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## misfit (Apr 5, 2004)

i'm not sure the wipers would have hurt the shad pops that much at cm. buckeye lake is overrun with shad,and has good wiper pops,and has for years.


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## Swick (Mar 6, 2007)

Wipers barely put a dent in the shad population at charles mill. I'm from there and I have no problem filling a cast net when im going cat fishing. From my experiences there since they have put wipers in there, I think the bass fishing has gotten better. Not to mention catching those wipers is a whole lot of fun.


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## DaleM (Apr 5, 2004)

Buckeye has had them stocked for years and as anyone that fishes Buckeye knows, it is still a great Bass lake. O'Shaugnessy could use some help on the shad population, even Griggs wouldn't be hurt by the stocking. I doubt they will "over stock" the rivers anyway. 
I will say the bigger ones are a blast to catch.


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## norseangler (Jan 8, 2009)

misfit said:


> actually,wipers have been in dillon for years.i caught fish in the spillway there in the 90's in the 5-8 pound range.
> as for griggs and o'shay,it might be a nice addition if forage base is sufficient.


Some nice wipers were caught at Dillon back in the 80s or early 90s (I remember getting reports of fish in the 7-pound class) but I don't believe the state ever stocked them there (at least I don't recall them ever being stocked there; doesn't mean they weren't) -- they were apparently making their way down from Buckeye. For some reason, about the last 10 years or so, there have been far fewer reports of them being caught at Dillon. As for the recent stocking, the biologists in Athens told me the huge shad population there was at least one of the reasons for trying the recent stocking there.


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## Tsuribaka (Aug 19, 2008)

I've actually caught some hybrids in the scioto between oshay and griggs. It's a weird feeling. I used to associate hybrids with the great lakes, but thy're here, and I can't help but wonder about they're impact on the ecosystem. Meh, that's just me. I'm sure the other fish will do just fine.


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## rweis (Dec 20, 2005)

This is only anecdotal and not scientific. In the Scioto, I have caught SM, Saugeye, Crappie, Rock Bass, White Bass, Carp, Suckers, Chubs, and Gill in the same 30' run. Seems like everyone was getting along nicely.


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## misfit (Apr 5, 2004)

> Some nice wipers were caught at Dillon back in the 80s or early 90s (I remember getting reports of fish in the 7-pound class) but I don't believe the state ever stocked them there (at least I don't recall them ever being stocked there; doesn't mean they weren't) -- they were apparently making their way down from Buckeye


i wondered about that too.i never heard of them being stocked then,but they were there.some people didn't believe it,but we know better


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## cubsfan (Nov 17, 2008)

rweis said:


> This is only anecdotal and not scientific. In the Scioto, I have caught SM, Saugeye, Crappie, Rock Bass, White Bass, Carp, Suckers, Chubs, and Gill in the same 30' run. Seems like everyone was getting along nicely.


 we must fish the same run I to have caught all those species in a 30' run on the scioto. I have had severval 5 species day on the scioto but have yet to catch a wiper on it.


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## riverKing (Jan 26, 2007)

saugeye and smallies get along fine, sauger and walleye were here with the smallies long before we destroyed the rivers. and hybrids being so different in feeding habits will not effect smallies. my biggest problem with saugeye is the genetic issue. as for hybrids, this is a great managment plan, it will not effect the bass in a negative way, and it will provide a great fishery.
though I like the Idea of conservation over managment, and there I have an issue, but the wipers are the least of the issue there.


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## OSU_Fisherman (Mar 1, 2007)

I'm having a hard time coming up with an opinion for a stocking in Griggs. The only lake I have fished (that I know of) that has both Hybrids and LM Bass has been Seneca Lake. I was able to catch several quality LM Bass out of Seneca last year, so I doubt the hybrids are having much effect since the smallest fish I caught there last year was about 2 pounds.

Who knows, maybe Griggs will start offering better multi-species action. I guess we will see!


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## Phil Carver (Apr 5, 2004)

Swick said:


> Wipers barely put a dent in the shad population at charles mill. I'm from there and I have no problem filling a cast net when im going cat fishing. From my experiences there since they have put wipers in there, I think the bass fishing has gotten better. Not to mention catching those wipers is a whole lot of fun.


I remember that the shad used to be so thick that you could almost walk across them. There are still alot of shad in Charles Mill but they are not as bad as they ounce were. I will have to agree that the bass fishing seemed to get better after they intorduced the wipers to the lake. About a year or 2 after they were stocked , we caught some nice sized fish. It doesn't take wipers long to grow and they are one tough fighter. Those things about rip your arms off ! I believe that if they were to stock them in the river that they would take off and be a great angling addition.


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## Wiper Swiper (May 24, 2005)

*"Ask Wiper Swiper he should love to hear that one,after the way he feels about them in Kiser."*

< Sigh... >

The deal is, I'm not a fan of bio-engineering period. Particularly when the State's driving force is to simply sell more fishing licenses. In the broadest picture, we're turning Ohio into one big paylake. You can't continue pumping tons of top end predators annually into our water and not believe that something other than gizzard shad is being displaced in the biomass. Carrying capacity is one thing, but it's the habitat overlap that bugs me the most. The potential reproduction from hybrids with our native gamefish is a crime.

Saugeye don't have to actually eat riverine smallies to impact them. They only have to occupy and control the best feeding stations. Throw in a little spawning with the sauger, and I see negatives that out weigh the positives. I've caught saugeye and wipers flipping a jig/pig into pads covering 2' of water... _"open water piscivores", _my arse. They eat what's easy, and get FAT in doing so.

Wipers were stocked in Apple Valley to control the stunted crappie population. But, they'll leave the O'shay crappie alone??? Saugeye are good for the Ohio river drainage, but not good for the Erie drainage??? Direct saugeye stockings into the GMR was OK, then no good, but direct stockings into the Scioto IS good management??? The ODW speaks with a forked tongue.

Do what I do...kill 'em all. Little ones, big ones, fill your freezer! They're put and take, and I for one do my fair share of taking! Makes it easier to release those 8" gills and 12" crappie.

I've got more, but I'm late. You guys keep lovin' those hybrids. Fish so stupid you don't need skills to catch them! Just drag a crankbait behind your boat, sit back, crack a beer, and come on here telling the world that you are the MAN! I get a kick out of it!

Fish on.


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## Net (Apr 10, 2004)

< Sigh... >

Here we go again....the state is only motivated by greed....blah blah blah...I don't talk with the odnr but I know how everything works....be a real man and fish for ________.


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## misfit (Apr 5, 2004)

once again........ the extremely knowledgeable voice of reason


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## Mushijobah (May 4, 2004)

Wiper Swiper said:


> Wipers were stocked in Apple Valley to control the stunted crappie population. But, they'll leave the O'shay crappie alone??? Saugeye are good for the Ohio river drainage, but not good for the Erie drainage??? Direct saugeye stockings into the GMR was OK, then no good, but direct stockings into the Scioto IS good management??? The ODW speaks with a forked tongue.


I'm Mushijobah, and I approve this message.


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## I_Shock_Em (Jul 20, 2008)

rweis said:


> This is only anecdotal and not scientific. In the Scioto, I have caught SM, Saugeye, Crappie, Rock Bass, White Bass, Carp, Suckers, Chubs, and Gill in the same 30' run. Seems like everyone was getting along nicely.


I did some electroshocking work on the scioto last summer and there is way more than what rweis listed. An interesting fact is that the scioto holds the EPA record for most fish species at a single electroshocking site. There were 56 species of fish collected from one 500 meter site. pretty impressive


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## toad (Apr 6, 2004)

> Just drag a crankbait behind your boat, sit back, crack a beer


I'm totally impressed.... I'm so highly skilled that I drag a crankbaits and catch beer cans. Caught a PBR can last year, talk about a rare catch !

I don't belive the state would do anything to negatively impact the fisheries and wipers maybe a great addition to Griggs.


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## Mushijobah (May 4, 2004)

It will certainly negatively impact certain aspects of a natural system in order to have fish that are more easily caught. That is what he's saying. You can't win them all when stocking a new fish basicly directly into a river.


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## tnant1 (Nov 21, 2006)

I don't really see what the big deal is. Yes, it's not a native species, but neither were horses to North America. It's happened all over the world, some with good outcomes some not so good. If it's truly a trial, put them in, do some studies and either move forward or put a halt to it. No big deal.


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## Wiper Swiper (May 24, 2005)

That was close...walked into an 11:00 am meeting at 11:00, and the first thing out of their mouth was--"Well, you passed the first test, you were on time." Whew!...darn hybrids almost got me in trouble again!

Mushi, yer creepin' me out dude. If we keep finding common ground I'll wanna invite you for a river float or something and then what? Dogs and cats sleeping together? 

Rick, it'll be OK. I understand that folks feel differently about hybrids, but am a little perplexed as to why you never seem to see the other side? Can you honestly say that bio-engineering has no negative consequences?

Several years ago I worked the Kiser hybrids hard for a couple months late Spring. I enjoyed some 75 lb. days, caught many over 10 lbs., and had a lot of fish frys. I checked the stomach contents on every fish I caught and recorded it. The 81 hybrids brought to hand averaged 4.65 lbs. 33% (27 fish) had little to nothing in their gullet. 26% (21 fish) had partially full gullets, but the shmooze was too digested to identify with the naked eye. 24% (19 fish) contained shad, no doubt about it. 17% (14 fish) contained panfish. 2 of those fish had shad and a crappie in them, but I put them in with the 17%. I also found 1 rubber worm with no line or hook, 1 jigging spoon (that I still have), and 1 small turtle the size of a quarter.

But, that wasn't the interesting part... 

On a particular Sunday in May, I took a friend to the "hump" at daylight. We were casting #12 chrome/blue husky jerks and started hitting 6-8 lb. fish immediately. We each had a 10 lber. and both lost several more that pulled off. Once the sun got up it was over (I'm thinking around 9:00). We had 10 fish in the box, a good bit of work to do, so we left. I was shocked when we started cleaning them. Every one of them had a blugill in it. I didn't realize it at the time, but those gills were on the hump spawning and the wipers were picking them off the beds! 10 of the 14 fish I sampled that year with gamefish in them came on this one day. Point is, hybrids are voracious, opportunistict feeders that take advantage of what's easy prey whether they're spiney or soft rayed.

Maybe this all means nothing. The State says it means nothing. They wouldn't waste their time cutting open 81 wipers. They're sooo smart they can take stockings from 9000 to 18,000 to 40,000 in a 400 acre lake without even looking. 

Riddle me something...is it the State's position that hybrids don't harm native gamefish populations, or their position that they don't care about native gamefish populations??? 

Why are the rules different in the Erie drainage? Do they stock hybrid striped bass in the Erie drainage?


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## misfit (Apr 5, 2004)

> Rick, it'll be OK. I understand that folks feel differently about hybrids, but am a little perplexed as to why you never seem to see the other side? Can you honestly say that bio-engineering has no negative consequences?


you're wrong in that assumption.actually i try to see all sides of issues and make my decisions from there.i am not saying there definitely could be no adverse effcts,but i'm also not going to just assume it's a bad move,based on my personal feeling toward the dnr.
in fact you show much more bias than me.you seem to constantly base your conclusions or ideas on your apparent contempt for the dnr,and don't seem to want to give them credit for anything good.
trial and error are part of anything we do.when trying new approaches to things,some things work better than we thought they would,some worse.
as with anything,the dnr can't please everyone all the time,but it seems they can't please you any of the time.
until you can show that you are more capable of doing their job than they are,i'll give them the benefit of the doubt,and take your oipinions as just that.........opinions


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## Scientific Angler (Jul 12, 2007)

Well said misfit


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## Scientific Angler (Jul 12, 2007)

By the way wiper. If you want help reducing the wiper population why don't you post where that magic "hump" is?


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## Wiper Swiper (May 24, 2005)

Rick, you hurt my feelings...

Sure, my "opinions" may not impress you, but how 'bout my hands on experience and pointing out the contridictions in the ODW's management? (BTW--if you know anything about state wildlife management, you'd understand that the ODNR and the ODW have very little coordination between the agencys and their individual decisions aren't formulated by input from the other arm.)

I don't have to show I'm more capable of doing their job to offer criticism...we're more qualified than that. We sign their freakin' pay checks fer cripes sake!

Perhaps when I reach my golden years, I'll be more content with the "competence" of the state. Unfortunately, I'm still of the age that believes bio-engineering is not a function of government. IMHO it's a lazy answer to decades of hydro-modification offered with little regard to the impact on native fishes.

Do I really need a degree to be taken seriously by you???


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## Mushijobah (May 4, 2004)

It's hard for some to question an agency that has brought them so much joy in the past. It definately is for me. When they start moving in a wrong direction, someone has to get past to nostalgia and point out a problem. They make changes all the time when people from within the agency find a problem, or PhD's from academia let them know they are being shortsighted. They are an organization that is relient on people being happy and supporting them. They do this by stocking fast-growing and easily caught fish into our waterways for people to munch up on. As people have said before...their programs rely on us buying fishing/hunting licenses.

I support the DOW in their overall direction of conservation and general awareness. Although we shouldn't just turn our heads in regards to what their newest project to boost revenue is JUST because they are the DOW and they know best. Thinking and questioning is what this great nation is based upon.


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## fishslim (Apr 28, 2005)

Now this is what i was expecting oh what fun we have on this great site!! Wiper i am on your side as for the saugeyes as long as they keep stocking them i will keep fishing for them. Filling my freezer with their tasty fillets!! Look out saugeye i am ready to start another attack!! Hey wiper those blue chromes HJ'S are awesome baits. I love em. Wheres the hump i drive by there quite often and many times it is about sunrise.


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## misfit (Apr 5, 2004)

> Rick, you hurt my feelings...


sorry about that
it is not that your opinions don't impress me,but the fact that they generally negative.again,i don't see the dnr,dow or any agency as all knowing and not capable of a certain degree of failure in some areas at times.and i also base some of my opinions on my own hands on experiences,as ell as info provided by multiple sources.
you just seem to be against anything they do that involves what you presume will interfere with mother nature.that isn't always the case,and in some cases can even improve certain resources.
you do not need a degree to be taken seriously,but in your golden years you may come to realise that state may be just a wee bit more competent than you think at this point in time.
i honestly haven't seen a drastic negative overall impact that has been caused by all that "hydro-modification".
again,have they made some hiccups?yes.are they a complete disaster as you seem to portray them.....no.
i've been fishing for well over 50 years,and have seen lots of changes in our fishing resources.i've seen waters devoid of fish,that are great fisheries now.i've also seen great waters destroyed in one way or another.many lakes and reservoirs we fish today,didn't even exist,or were in their infancy when i started fishing.
with the population growth over those years,changes come.some of these bio-engineered fish fill a niche that offers more opportunities.
and one thing i'll disagree with every time,is the idea that the only driving force behind these programs is $$$$.
that's about as ridiculous as saying the only reason the state builds highways is to give them a way to make money from traffic tickets.


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## Marshall (Apr 11, 2004)

It would be nice to see some habitat placement in the lakes and rivers in this state. If anyone has been to kentucky lake you have seen the stake beds that pump out huge crappie and bass. Im not sure what impact the wipers will have on griggs and osr but one thing is for sure some habitat placement could not hurt all of our native fish. Im a bass guy but i mean for all native fish. Most gizzard shad grow so big they are no longer preyed upon by the fish population. Heck ive seen 18 inch shad. More habitat for spawning and cover will make the overall fish population strong and help balance out the ecology of the lakes and rivers. Just a though. I am also suprised to see the dnr spend the money to stock the hybrids with such a budget issue. Personally i would rather see them spend it in maintaining our ramps and docks if not used for habitat enhancement.


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## fishingredhawk (Apr 14, 2004)

acklac7 said:


> I had a feeling the LM guys were not going to be pleased...That being said i'd love to hear some qualified arguments on the subject, instead of the same old "OMG there going to eat all of the baitfish and let the Bass starve" rhetoric (no offense Mike )
> 
> And as I understand it this is a *one time only* trial stocking.


AJ, of course no offense taken!  It would take a lot more than that!

But playing Devil's advocate, I'd love for someone to present a qualified argument showing that in fact stocking hybrid stripers into a small reservoir won't have a negative impact on other predatory species such as largemouth and smallmouth bass.

The truth of the matter is, I highly doubt that any particular study was undertaken by the DOW/DNR to see whether or not this stocking would have a negative impact on current bass species in Griggs. It seems to me that it would be prudent for the governmental body that is proposing the stocking to first perform research before spending tax dollars on something that isn't a sure bet, and that could potentially hurt the current healthy bass populations in those reservoirs.

Maybe I'm wrong? Has a study been conducted on the affect that stalking hybrid stipers in small river reservoirs has on bass? If so, and the empirical evidence shows that there is no negative impact, then I stand corrected!

Either way, I'm gonna be pi$$ed when one of those things crushes my crankbait during a tournament. Talk about a disappointment


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## crittergitter (Jun 9, 2005)

Mushijobah said:


> It's hard for some to question an agency that has brought them so much joy in the past. It definately is for me. When they start moving in a wrong direction, someone has to get past to nostalgia and point out a problem. They make changes all the time when people from within the agency find a problem, or PhD's from academia let them know they are being shortsighted. They are an organization that is relient on people being happy and supporting them. They do this by stocking fast-growing and easily caught fish into our waterways for people to munch up on. As people have said before...their programs rely on us buying fishing/hunting licenses.
> 
> I support the DOW in their overall direction of conservation and general awareness. Although we shouldn't just turn our heads in regards to what their newest project to boost revenue is JUST because they are the DOW and they know best. Thinking and questioning is what this great nation is based upon.


Yeah............what he said.

:woot:


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## JamesT (Jul 22, 2005)

I really like these fish  6 of the 7 I caught tonite. Cranks and spoons just before/at dark. All released so that someone else can have a big  on their face someday.


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