# pay lakes ?



## basscatcher89

what good are pay lakes. they take a ton of catfish entrap them in a small area and then they starve them what fun could a guy get out of that. Also those fish never look to healthy with there bellys all sunken in. I think that every die hard pay laker should come spend a day out on the ohio river with me and experience a real catfishing trip. i also think that river cats which fight the current all day put up alot better and fun struggles.


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## fishfinder

I do a lot of paylaking and I enjoy the experience. it might seem like it is unfair, that maybe it is easier to catch fish in paylakes than it is in natural waters , but it is not. You have to spend time learning the lakes to be sucessfull, just as in natureal waters.


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## catmaster

i to do some paylakeing and fishfinder is right you need to study anylake to be sucsessfull. and i have caught a lot of heathy fish out of a paylake.


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## Lundy

Not all fish in paylakes are from the wild. The paylakes that I used to fish as a younger man did not have any really big cats, rather just a bunch of farm raised channels trucked in from Arkansas fish farms.

My kids when they were young used to love to go there and fish for cats and trout.

So I guess to answer your question, at least some paylakes can provide opportunity for families to go fishing for a few hrs with a enhanced chance of the kids catching a few fish. It could be the first positive exposure many have to fishing at a young age.

In my book any fishing is better than no fishing.


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## catmaster

you can fish in all the public lakes and streams but paylake is alright


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## squid_1

Maybe some people just like the fact that they are close, usually can sit a chair on level ground, have a small fire and drink beer till the sun comes up without worrying about open container laws.


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## shuvlhed1

I have a lot to add here, but it will just get me into trouble. More people at paylakes equals less people in my way at the river.


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## peple of the perch

their is no challange in pay lakes it is good for a family or beginner fisherman


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## dinkbuster1

shuvlhed1 said:


> I have a lot to add here, but it will just get me into trouble. More people at paylakes equals less people in my way at the river.


i have to agree with you dude! leave the paylakers alone in their little world so they will stay out of mine  can you imagine if all the paylakes were closed this year? the rivers and lakes would be full of drunks, trash, and thered be no place to fish.


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## peple of the perch

i have to agree too


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## Lundy

dinkbuster1 said:


> can you imagine if all the paylakes were closed this year? the rivers and lakes would be full of drunks, trash, and thered be no place to fish.


I doubt that many would notice any differnce at all, except for no place to fish.


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## Catbird

I have never been interested in fishing paylakes. I think that half the fun in finding large catfish is in the hunt. After you put in hours, days, weeks, even months and years, and you finally locate and catch larger catfish in the rivers and state lakes, you develope a sort of inner pride and confidence in yourself and your techniques. I can't see that happening with paylake fishing where you pay someone to put fish in a confined area and then catch them? It would seem like hunting turkeys on a turkey farm.


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## H2O Mellon

Some paylakes may not be bad, if the fish are farm raised, but lets take a look at the most fmaous Pay Lake in our area:



















Here is an excerpt from their web site: *"Catfisherman's Paradise stocks over 12,000 pounds of Big Blues and Flatheads every spring starting in March of every year."*

This is horrible, outragous & a shame, but hey it's just catfish, right? Oh how loud the screams would be if there were a Pay Lake helping to slaughter & kill & destroying Bass like this.

Could you imagine a paylake that was full of Largemouth & Smallmouth Bass all between 5-10 #'s & was "fished" hard like paylakes around here are?


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## Flathead King 06

Catbird said:


> I think that half the fun in finding large catfish is in the hunt. After you put in hours, days, weeks, even months and years, and you finally locate and catch larger catfish... you develope a sort of inner pride and confidence in yourself and your techniques.


Actually, I have grown up fishing in paylakes and in rivers for big cats and, though I am only 18 years old, I find all the joy and pride in catching a monster cat at a paylake the same as I do in a river and am very pleased with myself and the technique(s) I used to catch it. And to some extent the cats, especially the blues and shovels, originally came from some major water way (mississippi r., ohio r., etc...) And in the area of the "hunt" it takes time to actually get to know a paylake and find out how to fish it just right in order to catch the big ones.


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## Flathead King 06

H2O Mellon said:


> Could you imagine a paylake that was full of Largemouth & Smallmouth Bass all between 5-10 #'s & was "fished" hard like paylakes around here are?


Yes I can because Rei Lakes in springfield is a paylake that has a total of 5 lakes totaling somewhere in the 50 surface acres. Each of the "ponds" or should I say small lakes, is stocked with different species for each: one with nothing but cats, one with nothing but panfish, one with the pike family (walleyes, perch, pike, musky, etc...) one with bass and related fish, and then they have a main lake that has a depth of over 60 ft I would say (old gravel pits) that has everything in it. And to fall back on what you said, people go and buy season tickets just for the panfish and bass in the spring when they open. And actually it isn't that bad, considering if you are the fisherman instead of the owner who has to pay to get the lakes stocked each year.


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## H2O Mellon

Flathead King 06 said:


> And to some extent the cats, especially the blues and shovels, originally came from some major water way (mississippi r., ohio r., etc...)


*THATS THE FREAKIN POINT. THEY CAME FROM THE RIVERS. HOW ABOUT WE GO TRAP SOME WHITETAIL DEER FROM THE WILD, PUT THEM IN YOUR BACKYARD & SHOOT THE HELL OUT OF THEM FROM YOUR PORCH. *
 

You KNOW where the fish are coming from & are still OPENLY showing your support for these certain pay lakes. In my opinon it's a total lack of respect for the fish, not only are you open about it your PROUD of it. 




Flathead King 06 said:


> And to fall back on what you said, people go and buy season tickets just for the panfish and bass in the spring when they open. And actually it isn't that bad, considering if you are the fisherman instead of the owner who has to pay to get the lakes stocked each year.


I sure as heck hope you don't think the owner is paying to have those ponds stocked out of the goodness of his heart, he's doing it because HE IS MAKING MONEY from the people that are paying to fish there.

The Bass lakes are not full of 5 & 10 # Bass either. There is no Pay Lake (at least around here) where "Anglers" pull 12,000 pounds of Bass out every spring.

I can understand, tolerate & even support a paylake that uses farm raised fish, but not one(s) that RAPE our natural resources (ie: Native Catfish from our Rivers) just so they can be stacked upon each other while coutless people line the banks of some tiny to small size pond hoping that a "trophy" fish gets so straved that it's forced to hit what's on one of those countless "anglers" line. Have you ever seen the # of dead cat carcuses that thrown away from the larger paylakes in our areas? There are a few OGF members that have done investigations into this. The results of their investigations were truely heartbreaking and sad. I am not sure if those members are still active on here or not, but if they are, I wish they would go over those results once again.


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## Flathead King 06

H2O Mellon said:


> *You KNOW where the fish are coming from & are still OPENLY showing your support for these certain pay lakes. In my opinon it's a total lack of respect for the fish, not only are you open about it your PROUD of it. I sure as heck hope you don't think the owner is paying to have those ponds stocked out of the goodness of his heart, he's doing it because HE IS MAKING MONEY from the people that are paying to fish there.*


*

Yes I know that the fish are coming from a river or a farm from somewhere, but that isn't the point! But the problem you are facing is the # of people willing to make a 5-10 min. trip to a lake where you may catch one of the biggest fish you will ever catch versus a 1-2 hour trip or even more to a lg. cat fish producing river where can't be garanteeda fish, granted you face the same problem at a paylake, but for some people, starters for one, it is easier for them to fish at a paylake. And when you said, "THATS THE FREAKIN POINT. THEY CAME FROM THE RIVERS." that is no different form some stupid *** from going to the ohio river and taking 100 shovelheads from it, there is no regulations on the fish except for when they are over 35"*


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## flathunter

I say we go to lake erie and net tons of smallmouth bass, and walleye, and start a paylake..Almost all paylakes get there fish from public waters.


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## Flathead King 06

To be truthful, that is how a paylake is started. And I'm not rying to start arguments or fights but it is a whole lot easier to go up the road instead of across the state to catch fish especially if you're paying about the same for a fishing tag as you are fishing lisence.


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## Flathead King 06

I am not disagreeing with H2O Melon in this discussion, don't get me wrong, because blue and shovels especially don't get the respect they deserve. In a sense a paylake is almost likea death -camp for fish or that magnitude. But it brings the fish to the people, and I'm not saying I'm like the other 1.2 blah blah million people who won't travel to catch fish because I will. But in all respect isn't a bait vender, who catches WILD bullheads, bluegill, chubs, suckers, ect... just like a paylake in that it is taking from a river or lake just to make a profit, even though a shovelhead and a blue have and deserve a little more respect than that? I beleive that it is, not that I really care what a bait vender does or how they catch the bait that I BUY from them.


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## H2O Mellon

No it's not the same , becasue it is *ILLEGAL* for a bait vender (as in a bait shop) to sell Bullheads & Bluegills & if you are buying them from a bait vender then you are breaking the law as well.


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## flathunter

Peace fellows, It's late..I have fished I think 5 paylakes in my life, I personally will not ever go to one agin..I left with the feeling I was doing something wrong, something unsporting, and unethical...So I Persoanlly could not consider myself a true catfisherman if I ever went back....Thats just my opnion, however if they could ever grow some big flatheads and blue cats in hatcherys and then stock them in paylakes I would not have the same problem with them..But they dont, all the big fish come from public waters.. And thats where I personally have the problem with them..This is a no win argument.


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## H2O Mellon

Yes I too will promise not to post anymore in this thread. I will go back from where it as that I came.


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## dinkbuster1

aww, come on guys! keep fighting! im really enjoying this!


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## Rod&Reel

I just read this whole thread for the first time. Seeing this has gone south, I won't get in it. But I pretty much feel the same way as H2O and Flathead here. Paylakes are bad news.


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## fishfinder

If they used farm raisded fish it would be a different story, but fish just don't grow fast enough to make it profitable.


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## Lewis

Guys...do your best to keep this thread civil.


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## BottomBouncer

I've been to several paylakes. Family took me when I was younger and I have been to paradise a couple times. In all those trips only one time I caught any cats. 

For people to say that anyone can go catch a big cat at a paylake...or catch anything at all for that matter don't know their ______ from a hole in the ground. Been to paylakes, paradise included, where no one was catching anything and this was a warm summer weekend too.

I don't agree with how most paylakes get their fish. But by no means is it as easy as putting deer in your back yard or hunting a turkey farm.

Why don't you guy dig a hole and put 'eyes and bass in it? Doubt many people would make the trip to fish it. If people are going to pay to catch fish or for the opportunity, they want to catch something big....something they can't get by going down to the local metro park or river bank. 

Many of the people I fish with can not get to the good river cat spots due to physical issues.

So, don't judge people just because they fish paylakes. Not all the people are backwoods, *******, natural lite drinking, trash that you make them out to be..... A good deal of the people I have seen at these places include men with their family or kids, older folks or guys and their wife/girlfriend. 


Keep in mind.....many fisherman associate those that fish for cats with the backwoods, *******, natural lite drinkin', trash stereotype.....the same stereotype that you guys place on people that fish paylakes.

And no......I don't frequent paylakes...have only been to one in the last three years.


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## Flathead King 06

BottomBouncer said:


> Many of the people I fish with can not get to the good river cat spots due to physical issues.
> 
> So, don't judge people just because they fish paylakes. Not all the people are backwoods, *******, natural lite drinking, trash that you make them out to be..... A good deal of the people I have seen at these places include men with their family or kids, older folks or guys and their wife/girlfriend.
> 
> 
> 
> I agree with you BottomBouncer in the fact that it is hard for some people to get to a good river, etc... to catch cats for whatever the reason may be. That is what I was trying to get at when I posted a reply to all those other replies, and I am very sorry if I crossed anyone's paths or ideas about places like paylakes, but I sincerely believe to SOME point, and I'm stressing "some", a paylake is, I guess ok if you yourself believe it is. If it wasn't for a paylake I would never have gotten into catfishing.
Click to expand...


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## C J Hughes

Paylakes are the worst example of catch and release I have ever seen . If PETA ever sees the light on Paylakes they would jump all over it . 
That 90 lb Blue cat that was caught from the Ohio River and released was the best post of catch and release I have ever seen on any fishing site . To release that fish back to the Ohio River unharmed was great ! That fish will cause more dreams and hopes from people up and down the Ohio who fish for cats than anything that has been done in years because it was released back into the wild not a PAYLAKE .
They could of sold it for at least a buck a pound to any paylake maybe more due to the size , but they released it my hat is off to them .
Paylakes do nothing more than rob our great Ohio River of one of its greatest treasures . They need to put a stop to all HOOP NETTING of cats out of the OHIO . If they have Hoop nets in Ohio when it comes up such as it is now the nets tend to spin in the current and kill all of the fish inside , they just dump them back into the river and reset the net .
Paylakes today is all about gambling nothing more you are not even allowed to take any BLUES or Flatheads out of most Paylakes . Guys place a bet on the biggest fish per hour per day per weekend .
I understand about the limits that some people have so I see a need for Paylakes just make all of the fish in the lake farm raised cats perch trout whatever . But you are talking about more money when you say farm raised fish and that is the driving force behind the whole paylake mindset make more money . It is not and uncommon event for guys to catch a 1000 lbs of cats in hoop nets in one day during the right time of year on the Ohio River .
I can't even imagine what a free roaming 90 lb blue cat placed in a 5 acre pond is going thru . Sad state of affairs in my mind . One other thing that needs to be done is a DEPOSIT on anything PLASTIC then the banks of the OHIO won't be stacked bank high with bottles and such . You put a dime deposit on such and people will be out picking plastic up , there again the driving force is MONEY . Anyways I feel much better since I have got this all off of my mind thanks .


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## flathunter

great post CJ!


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## dinkbuster1

i second that! great post!


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## Fish-N-Fool

I don't fish them and never will; I agree with what CJ posted.

I just had to post because I hear the argument from paylake advocates all the time about the disabled, elderly, etc.. not having access to fish. This argument is simply CRAP! Most of the state lakes have peers built for this purpose and I can count the lakes that don't have bank access on 1 hand. 
I don't mean to sound like I don't care about disabilities, etc... because that is far from the case. But I just don't buy this argument; it leads me back to the same reason most people fish paylakes - they are lazy! 

Hey, if a guy posts on here and says he loves to fish paylakes because he likes to gamble, doesn't want to work to find fish, and likes being able to pull his truck up to the water and play the radio - I can buy that. Anybody else is simply trying to justify their actions (in their own mind). I know a couple guys like this, but they don't pretend to be doing something they're not. And they sure don't ask me to join them either. 

Flathead King - I live maybe 12-15 minutes from you; actually just up the road from another paylake in Springfield (Forest Lakes). There are numerous places within 1 hour that you can catch large Flats, if you are willing to do so.


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## dinkbuster1

great news everyone! Rainbow lakes will be opening March 17th stocked full of fish, anyone wanna go?


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## Rod&Reel

The funniest part about me commenting here is I don't even catfish.


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## JIG

I Mahoning we HAD a few pay lakes that were stocked with all kinds of fish. Now they are under private owner and cost about 400 a season to fish. As a kid I spent ALOT of time with family and friends on them. All I have now is memories. And Great ones. If it wasnt for pay-lakes none of this would be possible. I can understand the concern for cats out of the OHIO but isnt it the people whom give the right to net fish more so than the pay-lake. ALOT of kids out there that if it wasnt for the pay-lakes would be on the street. Im living proof and WILL pay the 400 eventually!


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## Predator225

With the new regulations in place, this may mark the beginning of the end for pay lakes in Ohio. Noone can sit here and tell me that our rivers have not been impacted by paylakes. Several years ago, due to car troubles, I ran short on time in regards to gathering bait in southeastern ohio, i went to a paylake (last resort) to buy bait and was told by the "kid" quite proudly that he was paid $5.00 for each flathead he caught & released into the lake. What is the fishing on the Scioto like now as compared to 20 years ago, or the Big Darby, Muskingum?


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## River Walker

I've never visited a paylake,so I really can't comment on whether it's wrong or right to do so morally.My own personal feelings on this topic reach out a bit farther than most others opinions.Myself,I would never pay to fish or hunt period.I would never go on a charter boat,head boat,enlist the services of a guide,hunt a private (commercial) game farm,or fish at a paylake.If I did do any of the above at any time,then I wouldn't feel right being critical of anyone else's moral issue's.BTW,I see just as much trash left behind on public areas as I'm sure that's left behind on private land.To me,a fish and game slob is just as non-caring on public land as he is on private land.


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## Lundy

The ONLY negative that I personally see with a paylake is IF they use wild fish to stock the lakes.

The wild fish belong to everybody and should not be able to be utilized for private monetary gain.

The blame for this situation has to go to the lawmakers, not the paylakers. The laws have recently been changed somewhat and may have some impact on the wild fish supply for the paylakes that specialize in big cats.

I'm not real big on telling someone else how to live their lives, just as I don't want them telling me how to live mine. If someone enjoys fishing pay lakes for whatever reason they choose, it's perfectly fine with me, it is after all their personal right to do so.

If someone wants to effect change in a situation that is legal under current law, that you have problems with, go to the only resource that can change it, the lawmakers


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## cheezemm2

Since this subject has come up for years, and I literally mean years, I have mixed feelings. I think in a way it's the few bad apples that stick out like a sore thumb....

I have never personally been to, or around any paylake, but imagine there are some that are run correctly. i.e. making sure there's a population that's sustainable or one that is similar to our saugeye stocking programs right here in ohio...give and take so to speak

The ones that we all seem to view negatively are the ones that are basic exploitation of the very resources we pay for and disregard for the effect that it will have on the public as a whole...however, you probably can't blame a lot of people as their education only lies in the fact that they're making money...I think good heads will eventually prevail in this one and it seems Ohio is in the process of limiting "harvesters"


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## Rod&Reel

River Walker said:


> Myself,I would never pay to fish or hunt period.


 Um......................Do you have your fishing license? I had to pay for mine.


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## Flathead King 06

Fish-N-Fool said:


> I just had to post because I hear the argument from paylake advocates all the time about the disabled, elderly, etc.. not having access to fish. This argument is simply CRAP! Most of the state lakes have peers built for this purpose and I can count the lakes that don't have bank access on 1 hand.
> I don't mean to sound like I don't care about disabilities, etc... because that is far from the case. But I just don't buy this argument; it leads me back to the same reason most people fish paylakes - they are lazy!
> 
> Flathead King - I live maybe 12-15 minutes from you; actually just up the road from another paylake in Springfield (Forest Lakes). There are numerous places within 1 hour that you can catch large Flats, if you are willing to do so.


I agree with you that ALOT of people are lazy. They think they can go to a paylake just to "relax"- kick back drink beer and talk bs about everything while fishing. I don't think that that is the right impression you should have on a paylake. I, to also agree with many that posted within this argument, was one of those kids that was raised up on a paylake. 
I don't believe anyone is thinking that you are or would say anything to besmurge the name of disabled fishermen...but you do pose a good responce, in saying that most if not evry lake I fish at does have handi-accessible areas, and that is a good thing. But of those that are disabled, how many do you think have what it takes to actually get out there to fish even if it is just 10-15 mins. up the road? And I'm not talking will power... I'm saying that most that are in that state are living off of SS or welfare, etc... I don't think they SS or a Doc. is going to approve or write a Rx for a fishing rod, do you?
And finally, yes I am willing to travel to catch big fish, I even said that bad a while ago in another thread to this post, but it is that fact that I was raised up on a paylake and like to fish them. I'm sorry I guess, but I don't see any difference in any one person going and taking out 100 or more shovelheads under 35" according to ohio regulations. The only thing is, is that some business type person-LAZY is making a profit for letting people catch his fish which he has paid for, not to say that he didn't get a bargain...
Do you see what I'm getting at?


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## Ol' Whiskers

http://www.ohiodnr.com/news/jun02/0611mudcat.htm


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## Fish-N-Fool

Flathead King - no I don't see what you are getting at  
If you are implying that most disabled individuals are on a fixed income (social security/ disability, etc..), then it would make even less sense for them to fish paylakes. Why pay a fee each time they fish when they can purchase a relatively cheap permit once and fish anywhere in the state all year long? They need a fishing rod/reel and tackle wherever they fish - public, private, or paylake?

As far as somebody keeping a 100+ shovelheads under 35'' - well IMO that is also wrong if they are going to stock a pond, charge a cash fee and profit from raping the state of Ohio's natural resources. I don't like to see anybody practicing "overkill" harvest techniques, but if they kept 100 shovels under 35'' and ate every single one of them - well that is fine by me. 

I'll just agree to disagree with you on this one. 

If the paylakes were stocking farm raised fish (of any species) for a put and take pay fishery, they would have my 100% complete support. I might even become a paying customer on a rare occasion. As long as they continue to purchase wild fish for their purpose, I will strongly oppose those operations. 
I know of one very well ran paylake using farmed raised fish (trout and perch ponds), and am confident there are others. But far too many of these operations (including those local payponds mentioned in the Springfield area) 
are exploiting mature blues and flats that take many years to obtain their size
for the oh mighty dollar. I drive by the billboard type sign for the one by my house daily. Most of last summer the sign read something like "Catch a large fish and win a chance to spin the wheel and win up to $1,500" They also run the "big fish jackpot" of $500 on the weekends. That sounds more like gambling than a nice family fishing spot.  

I'm done with this one!


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## fishfinder

I do fish paylakes a lot, and I have only been to one that actually takes care of the fish in their lakes. I've seen many lakes that have fish die every day. If the fish are cared for I do not see any thing wrong with it.


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## Guest

but even if they are not cared for then you still fish them,....right?


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## BottomBouncer

I'd like to know what handycap fishing area has the opportunity to catch anything more than runt 'gils and bullheads????


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## JIG

That would have to be WB!!!!  :B


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## jiggin'fool

hodgson has handicap accessibility and you can catch crappie, perch and trout from it! never seen any handicaps fishing from it but the platform makes a nice tightlining rod holder!


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## INSANE_SQUAD

I have taken my blind,handicapped,wheelchaired bound Dad to a few paylakes.If i can bring a smile to his face and have him forget just for a second his problems i have NO problem with paylakes. When i see that smile i do not care where the fish came from. Granted he does not have the ability to catch anything large..But it would be fun to see his pole ripped from his frail hands and pulled into the lake. Then we can talk weeks about the one that got away.

Gas---$10.00
Tickets---$20.00
My dad catching fish again--"PRICLESS"!

Insane-----out


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## husky hooker

i ve had 2 heart attacks and bad heart troubles,legs cant walk far but i ve found many a place to fish for nice fish around here and the ohio river,muskingum lakes are good with handicapped docks and the ohio has good places too.thats why this site is so good.all ya got to do is ask where!! i won t mention names,but the four of us hit a place close to medina,we fished and caught cats all day and had a blast,released all.all channels farmed raised.no bets,no trophys no big cost,had a good time.


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## Predator225

Well, if big, wild catfish arent that precious,i guess we should be allowed to start shooting bald eagles on the opening day of pheasant season, too.


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## flathunter

I agree preditor, and how about we be allowed to shoot a unlimited ammount of bucks in ohio also..Or better yet trap them all off of public land and then charge people to shoot them in a pen.


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## BottomBouncer

Like I've said, I don't agree with how or where the fish are taken from and MIGHT visit a paylake MAYBE once a year. Just figured you fellas might open your eyes a bit and see that not everyone goes to paylakes to tie one on and make bets. 

Someone mentioned about fixed income/low income folks fishing paylakes....which is pretty dumb to me. But, what's the difference(i'm not trying to justify anything) between those guys and someone on low income/welfare blowing a 20 on lotto tickets??? Both are looking to some extra $$$$ quick.

Seriously though.......I wish fishin' paylakes were as easy as shootin' bucks in the backyard. I believe there are hunting ranches where you can pay to do basically the same thing? Do you fellas get all worked up about that?

Flathead, a long time ago.....after a trip you made to Paradise, you told me you didn't catch anything. Why not? I'm not trying to call anyone out. But you've posted some pics of nice cats caught from public waters. I'd think someone that catches cats like you do(no sarcasm, being serious) would do pretty good at a paylake?


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## flathunter

Bottombouncer, I told the fine members here I had been to like 5 paylakes in the past and paradise was one of them..I will never go agin..Dont know why I did not catch anything that day, the lake was packed with 100's of people and I dont think I saw a fish caught, maybe they were waiting on a new load to fill the lake, as there were 100's 0f huge cats rotting in the woods beside the lake, you know the ones that die and float around till some one drives up on a fourwheeler and nets them, then takes them back to the "pile".


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## BottomBouncer

Yeah....it's pretty nasty. That, combined with all the dead bait laying around the banks....

When I was down in that area a couple weekends ago the fish truck was their...almost stopped to check it out. Can only imagine what they had...


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## H2O Mellon

you mean what they raped from other places. I am not agasint ALL paylakes, just some that lend a big hand in helping slaughter such a fine natural resource such as these trophy Catfish.


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## jason454ci

Just my two cents on the topic. I don't think the problem is with the paylakes theirselves. It is the states that allow commercial fishing. As most of the fish in the paylakes around here come from rivers in the south I really don't believe it has that much impact on Ohio waters. It is good to see ohio cracking down on the few exceptions to this. To me fishing at one of these lakes isn't much different than buying a fishing licences and going to public waters. I don't see where all the money from licences and fines are going to do improvements to the pubic fishing. When was the last time the state stocked flatheads anywhere in ohio? I haven't seen where it's been done since the late 60's or early 70's. When you buy a fishing licenses aren't you paying to fish for fish that belong to all of us anyway? So it seems to me that someone is profitting either way from people fishing. Yes I have been to a couple paylakes in the past. And I for one can tell you it's not as easy as shooting penned up deer in your back yard. I don't particularlly care for the way they get their fish. But as long as states allow commercial fishing for cats it will continue. The thing I have found totally rediculous is a deer hunting lodge in central ohio. The membership to get into this place is $20,000 and then you have to pay $5,000 a year to take a deer. Now thats what I call lazy, spending that kind of money so you don't have to go out and really work to get a trophy. To me this is always going to be one of those no win arguements. Just my opinion on the matter.


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## husky hooker

Jason,i guess you don t see all the stockings of lakes they do. saugeyes for 1 there almost in all our lakes now and some good sizes too.that came from our money.they have stocked the striper at some of our lakes.muskys too.well worth the price of my license. even thought i stalk crappie and channels.ya got to remember flatheads reproduce.just hope they don t take all the adults or we will be in trouble. i agree with the flathead guys on this one!!!!


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## Jackfish

I take my 12yr old girl to a paylake about twice every year  dont feel safe taking her to my normal catfish spots  heck I dont feel safe taking myself to my normal catfish spots sometimesI have caught very large cats out of a paylakeIf someone asks me what my best flat I ever caught was, my answer is a 28lb out of the GMR  not paylake fish, which have been larger (but who would actually count those?)the stuff out of a paylake I would never count, and I personally dont feel any sense of fish accomplishment for catching something out of a paylake I DO feel a sense of accomplishment for taking my girl out fishing and getting that time togetherwhoever said there are a lot of families and those with physical limitations fishing at paylakeswell I just have to disagreeIve seen very few of either of em. 

The last time I went I had big cooler & an airarator, was going to smuggle one out if I got a nice one and give it freedom  now when I get to do that I will feel a sense of accomplishment.

If paylakes where the farm raised stuff then great  but most of them arent. From an ethics point of view paylakes cause irreparable harm to our waterways. Big cats arent for family fishing, she could care less if its 2lbs or 20, as long as she gets a bit  the big cats are in there for those who lack the knowledge or perseverance to experience what makes trophy fish a trophy  instead taking the short cuts  seems to cheapen the sport. 

Does my going to a paylake 2x per year compound the problem and make me a hypocrite  well yes it does  but until I can find a better solution Ill stay the course

One more thing to addthe reason the paylakers always get blasted on this site is that the majority of the fisherman on this site are ethically minded, conservation oriented, sportsman  not simply fisherman


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## H2O Mellon

Right on Jackfish.
I too have taken my young son to a paylake, we usually do it once or twice a year. he love si becasue he can build a big fire and sleep outside in the sleeping bag. Bravo post, espically about the ethically minded people on OGF.


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## Salmonid

Hey Jackfish, well spoken and I couldnt agree more! 
and Im glad to see your still around, I need to hook up with you for lunch soon.

Salmonid


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## H2O Mellon

No Mark, Jackfish will not meet you at Rainbow Lakes for a quick lunch time outing!


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## Salmonid

Hey Mellon, I say we get some guys together to do a "Save the Flattie" Party, we hit a few of the pay lakes, catch all we can carry out of there and release them in the rivers, sort of like a POW mission.  

Oh regarding lunch at Rainbow Lakes, your just jealous we wont invite you  

PM sent
Salmonid


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## ChrisB

Your right Flathunter. Most of those big catfish wont last a year in those lakes. Especially Paradise. When there stocked they have virtually no cover to hunt in or anything to hunt. I think that the eco-system in there is just catfish and what bait escapes or what people throw in there after they are finished fishing. Then theres being rip into by a huge hook,reeled in and thrown back on a daily basis. I've seen pictures of cats out of paylakes and they usualy look pretty sad. They are true river fish and while they can thrive in small ponds in lakes it's not in numbers as large as that. On a side note Lake Gloria is closed down for good. That was a good paylake to fish. 10 acres with a wide variety of fish. I caught a lot of crappie in the spring there as well as a lot of trout. Also had a decent par 3 golf course.


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## BottomBouncer

A big cat catch and rescue mission sounds good to me. I almost did that at paradise, but my tank was too small  
While camping at the camp ground at Alum creek I was using my well/cooler as a cooler and someone stole it. Who the hell steals at a campground. It was a good baitwell too....made it with PVC, Coleman cooler and livewell pump. Happened to have plenty of beer in it....and up and disappeared


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## H2O Mellon

I will throw my name in the hat; If we ever do a Big Cat Rescue, I'm in. Of corse it is illegal to transport fish from one body of water to another, at least I beleive so, but I'm in.


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## H2O Mellon

In fact, I think I know just the guy that has a large tank that would work well.


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## BottomBouncer

Actually......we're kinda taking them back to where they came from.....


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## H2O Mellon

Ture.

I know Traphunter (I think it was Trap) tried to get somethign like this going a year or so ago. I am all for it, in fact I can really get into & set a date & everything like that. IN order to list it on OGF, it's going to have to be non-negative, just an OGF social event kind of thing, right? Can a mod help me out, I should be able to post a thread right, as long as it doesnt go south?


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## dinkbuster1

before you get your hopes all up remember this. there is only one paylake left i beleive that will let you take a flat or blue over 10lbs off the property....rainbow lakes. as far as flats, rainbow really doesnt stock that many anymore, maybe 2 or 3 per lake a year. they mostly specialize in half starved, anorexic, skin and bones channels. you can try to sneak one out from another lake but be warned, ive tried that and have been snitched on by others at the lake and been confronted by the owners. as long as it says on the ticket "all fish over 10lbs to be returned" then you legally have to return it, that tickets a binding contract. i would love to liberate a bunch too but im not gonna try it. those folks that frequent paylakes get REALLY ticked off when they see you trying to remove "their" big fish. why not go and liberate these big flats from all these small duck ponds that everyone stocks? they average 3ft deep and i doubt the flats make it over 2 years in them.


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## H2O Mellon

Thats a good idea too dink. Thanks for the info.


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## BottomBouncer

Well.....taking the 10lbers out wouldn't be bad either.

After all...they are smaller and you could get more out rather than just taking a couple big ones, you could take four or five undersized fish.

Talking about this on a public board probably isn't the smartest thing to do


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## dip

at no time is talking to mellonhead about anything "the smartest thing to do"!


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## H2O Mellon

DIP = Lurker

Only posts to dog "Da Mellon" or "Da Jackal"


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## rockbass

ssshhhhhhhh don't tell too many people, but I have a huge tank, I am growing what is right now a 65 lb flathead, and a blue weighing in at 70 lbs that I will let anyone have a chance at catching for 20 bucks. Be warned.......they are finicky eaters and I do not gaurantee a catch. ( oh yeah I took a lot of time and pride catching them in a net from the Ohio River)

Now I will profit from people who don't care, or don't know any better.


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## Fishyguy

Ok, everyone on this site that knows me , knows I hate paylakes and absolutely think they should be banned in Ohio. Anyways, I wanna throw a crazy thought out here. I know it's a little out there, but maybe someone can kinda get what I mean. Ok, here we go. Someone in this post mentioned that they have to get their fish from public waterways because they cant take the time to grow them and make money that way. Well, there are many liquors sold that have to be aged for years and years and years. Some age for decades. They make money. The wierd point I am trying to make is why is it ok for paylake owners to cut corners to get their product to the customer and make money. If they wanted to own a few lakes and raise the fish, that's fine, but put the time and effort into creating a product, don't steal from others and sell it as yours. Thats what they do. They steal fish from public waterways that my license money pays to protect and then sell mine and your fish to others for money. These fine aged liquors arent stolen from freakin Jim Beam factory and sold, these companies spend time and money to make a good product and earn what they get for it. Some ding Dong like the owner of Catfish"Paradise" goes out with a net, and steals from me and you and them sells the stolen fish to many people for huge profit. I know a guy that got a ticket for throwing a flathead cat into another public lake but they don't ticket a guy that takes thousands of pounds of cats a month out of the Ohio??? What damn sense does that make. Bottom line is as long as people support them, they will always be around. And since noone else will say it, I will since I am the bad guy. I know I will be hated and will take some heat for this one. But I can't stand how a few people use handicapped for an excuse to fish these places. I too had a grandfather who recently passed and loved to fish and due to strokes couldn't do it much. I too took him fishing, but I didn't take him to a paylake. There are many other options available to people. We went to easy accessable places such as stonelick lake, eastfork, and a few others. maybe the state would take more money and put it toward better accessibility for handicapped people at our lakes and rivers if there were more interest in it. I just think there are tons of areas where it is just as easy to go fishing and catch fish as it is at any paylake. I know 4 bank spots on the Ohio River alone where I can park my truck and sit within 5 feet of it and fish and catch plenty of cats. Its just like any other type of fishing, you have to find spots. If your handicapped or know someone that is, part of the new challenge of fishing with them is finding easier accessible spots, and I personally think that just resorting to a paylake is the easy way out. So OK, go ahead and slam me, but I am just stating an opinion and think that all paylakes should be shut down and go make those owners earn a real living like I do. Love my comments or hate them atleast I am honest and speak my mind.


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## Fishyguy

Oh and I got a $100 dollar bill that says they close the post because of my honesty!!
LOL, If we had a poll on who had the most post closed because of them I would win hands down. I am the "official hated member"


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## misfit

i'll take that bet  
i see nothing in that post that would cause the thread to be closed,so you lose   
cash only.no checks debit cards or capitol one cards.


though nobody enjoys closing threads,it is sometimes necessary.what is not necessary,and often cause for getting threads closed is statements like this..............


> Oh and I got a $100 dollar bill that says they close the post because of my honesty!!


 it is beyond me why people make a post,and feel the need to add something like that.i take it as someone purposely for one reason or another,attempting to get the results stated.
i will reserve my remaining feelings via pm to you.


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## Fishyguy

Well, I will tell you what is beyond me. Why moderators cant take a joke. Thats what the "LOL" was about. I didn't say it to try to get a result, i dont play kid games.


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## misfit

> i dont play kid games.


 ditto  

ps....i have a great sense of humor


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## husky hooker

im with u fishyguy....bring on the handicapped and ill show you the ohio and its bank i fish from,probly hold 50 of us!!!!!! right on the river bank, i know of least 12 guys that i took so far and they will back me up on this,when it gets dark.....hang on and strap me in!!!!!!!


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## Herkel

Fishyguy, With all due respect to your post and position on PL owners and fisherman. As a sportsman myself, I think your being a little too hard on those guys. The first thing that you have got to understand is comercial fishing is as old as man itself. The fish don't belong to you alone. As far as raising the fish for stocking a lake like the people that make booze age their product one thing is left out of this example,The people that age booze don't have to feed their product for decades. Comercial fisherman also buy a permit to net fish but that doesn't make them theirs. I'am not for or against PL owners or fisherman but I am against one sportsman attacking another sportsmans sport. The fish belong to all of use to enjoy how ever we wish to enjoy them. I hope this post doesn't offend you in any way, This is only my opinion nothing more nothing less HERKEL


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## Fishyguy

No i am not offended but I think your off base. First I never said the fish were mine alone, I am implying that we pay for license to protect our fisheries and thats not happening. And as for commercial fisherman paying for their license have you ever seen the cost. A couple hundred dollars??? Thats absurd. I pay 19 and have limits, they pay a couple hundred and have no limitations, thats not right. Secondly for commercial fishing, yes it has been around a long time, but your not realizing it was never like it is now. First there hasnt always been this many people on the planet, and second it hasn't become a big business til recently, last 40 years or so. So obviously the amount of fish being taken is wayyyyyyy higher than the natural wildlife population can withstand over a long period of time. Like with oil, we used so much for so long, its running out, well so will fish if we arent careful. They will never be gone, but believe me fishing in the ohio river is not what it was even 10 years ago. And I am not judging other "sportsman", I am simply offering my opinion to other options to them.


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## jason454ci

How can anyone say that the money from their Ohio fishing licences are supposed to protect fish against commercial fishermen in the Ohio river. If they are netting them in the Ohio river ODNR has nothing to do with it. Seems to me complaining to natural resource agencies in other states would be the thing to do. They are not really stealing anything as long as these states allow it to be done legally. Why blame the owners of paylakes for making money completely legally. Seems to me the blame should be put on the officials that allow commercial fishing in thier state. But like most government agencies as long as they make a buck that's all that matters. Hopefully one day they will realize the long term effect it has on the wildlife. But until they do I find it hard to run blame a person who owns or fishes in a paylake.


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## Fishyguy

Read closer man, I said protect our fisheries I didn't specify ohio river. And yes thats what the money is supposed to be for, for protecting public waterways. I dont care if something is legal or not, some things in this world are morally wrong, and thats one. just because some goofball making laws says its ok to commercial fish to fill paylakes doesnt make it right. If they said doing drugs is legal does that make that ok too? No, its morally wrong and stupid. I personally think it is sad that the majority or your response is based off of what lawmakers tell you. Thats not what makes this country great, fighting for your rights and correcting wrong doing is what makes it great. Dont let politicians tell you whats right, common sense should do that.


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## jason454ci

You lost me somewhere. What fisheries are you talking about. The last time I checked these fish are bought from commercial fishermen that caught them in other states. How is the money you spent on a Ohio fishing licence supposed protect fish in another state. I never said that I agree with it being ok to fill paylakes with these fish. But complaining about the people that own and fish at them ain't nothing but a waste of time. Until something is done about commercial fishing for them nothing will change.


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## DaleM

Come on guys let cool off a little. Enough jabs from both sides. discussion is fine, name calling and such isn't. We all know this is a touchy subject and I have never seen a thread about it result in anyone able to agree, and I'm sure it won't happen here either.


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## fishcrazy

Have you ever tried your hookless lures on nieborhood cats. Now thats catfishing, hey watch out for that "Screeeeeeeeech" Car!!!!!!
They fight and taste better than those CARP!!!!!!!!
HEEEEEE HEEEEEEEE 
FishhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhCrazzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzy
P.S. The kid that started this post is only 16 years old, and trying to stir us up. I know he's me brothers nephef!!!!!

LAUGHING OUTLOUD FISHCRAZY


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## crappielooker

fishcrazy.. i hope the next carp you catch, when we fish together next, smack the crap outta ya dooood.. craaaazyymaaan..   crapstirrer..i see you hooked a few on this thread.. 
ps.. i'll remember this and will bring it up around eagle creek's campfire..


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## Fishyguy

Dale, I dont know what name calling your talking about, or even jabs really. Just having a discussion. Ok jason, let me clear this up for you, since you think your other states comment is so good. I live in cincinnati right ( eastgate )....yes. I live within 10 minutes of Kentucky, 35 minutes to Indiana. Well I know Kentucky allows commercial fishing, and I am not for sure but I think Indiana does as well. And I know for a fact people from Kentucky sell catfish netted from rivers(not just ohio river) to paylakes in ohio. Even though Ohio dont allow commercial fishing they dont stop these people in kentucky and I think indiana from selling these netted fish to paylakes here, its an absurd loophole they allow to continue. So to get to my point since I fish the Ohio river all over I hold 3 licenses, Ohio, Kentucky and Indiana, so I am talking about any fishery in those states, because I got money in each one, as do alot of the river guys in this area. I guess you feel a fishing license is nothing more than a license to meat hunt and for other to make money off of, but the majority of people out there expect their money to go to conserving what the love. Most commercial fishing has limits, but these guys dont. They take thousands of fish every month with no limits. Even the crab fisherman you see on t.v. have limits/seasons, and size limits etc. and they do for a reason. To conserve the resource. Dale is right, not everyone will agree on this or any topic, but I feel that if people on a site such as this where I thought we were all here for a reason, which is to talk about the thing we love to do.....fishing. And I personally cant believe that anyone at all on a site such as this can feel it is in anyway ok for them to take so much out of what we love to do. This is a natural resource that is being abused and if people on a site like this cant even agree it is wrong how will the goofball lawmakers ever understand?? The only water they see is in front of office buildings, they don't understand. Thats all I have to say on this post.


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## DaleM

"if people on a site like this cant even agree it is wrong how will the goofball lawmakers ever understand?? The only water they see is in front of office buildings, they don't understand."

Fishyguy, that is one thing I think we can agree on here!


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## C J Hughes

People who are not a resident of Kentucky buy a non-resident commercial lic. to catch catfish in the Ohio . They put in on the Ohio R. on the Ohio side and sell to Ohio Paylakes . They have box cages that they sink near the ramp that they put in at to unload the fish into . After they run all of their nets then they transfer them to a truck with a container in the bed of the truck . This can take several trips . They run their nets during the week to keep down the eyeballers . Most will tie a ribbon on the bank to mark the net to help find them . If you ever wonder why you keep getting snagged at your best spot look on the bank and see if there is a ribbon tied on a tree limb . Then throw out your anchor and see what you pull in and do what you may with whatever you pull in .


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## Herkel

Fishyguy, I would like to recant what I said earlier about commerical fishing. The first thing is, It's not really a sport. I agree with you that they should have limits and restrictions impossed on how much, when and where they can fish. This is something that everyone should agree on. This is also something that should be addressed to the law makers. Keep up the good work and keep us posted on what you think we can do to change the way the law is being implemented. I will help in any I can. Herk


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## Rod&Reel

jason454ci said:


> Why blame the owners of paylakes for making money completely legally.


Just wondering, but wouldn't that be just like saying "Why blame the tabacco companys for making money legally"???


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## jason454ci

Rod&Reel said:


> Just wondering, but wouldn't that be just like saying "Why blame the tabacco companys for making money legally"???



Yes it would. But no one has ever had anyone from a tobacco company force them to use their product. It's done by choice. So why should anyone blame them for getting cancer from their product. When they choose to do it theirselves. That the same as saying gun makers should be held accountable for a murder commited with there product.

Fishyguy since you hold a licence in all three states I see where you are coming from. That was never stated before so I thought you were refering to an ohio licences. I stand corrected. And no I do not think a fishing licences is nothing more than a licences to meat hunt or to profit from. But since I don't hold licences for states that allow commercial fishing, I don't feel I have the right to complain about my money not be used to stop this activity. As far as ohio stopping fish from being sold to paylakes that would be kinda hard to do. Because the fish was taken by legal methods where it was taken. I agree something needs to be done about this. They do need to put limits in place or something. I'm just glad to ohio cracking down on illegal commercial fishing and putting limits on catfish that can be taken. Atleast some of our money is going to good use. I just think the majority of the blame on this issue is going to the wrong place. It needs to be addressed where it all starts, in the states that don't seem to care about their natural resorces like they do here.


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## Guest

So when are we going to invade the paylakes? Whats legal isnt always right. 


...Steal from the rich and give to the poor


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## Walter Adkins

My eyes are crossed over after reading this post from start. You guys have done a good job keeping it civil.


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## Rod&Reel

jason454ci said:


> Yes it would. But no one has ever had anyone from a tobacco company force them to use their product. It's done by choice. So why should anyone blame them for getting cancer from their product. When they choose to do it theirselves.


Yes, thats true, but the tabacco company's lied when they started selling their product to get it sold.


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## TheKing

I support the idea of paylakes. Heck, its where my uncle used to take me when I was a kid and I learned that they have some value. But I think that a law should be made so that Ohio paylakes have to use only farm raised fish.


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## peple of the perch

we have a little stocked lake by us that has like 30 somthing flatheads or somthing like that by us and 1 albino. catch ad release only


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