# Collar types for Pointers?



## BaddFish (Jun 20, 2009)

Hey guys- I have a young brittany that is coming right along in training and can't wait to hit the woods with her this fall. (she's big fishes dog's sister)

A pointing dog is new to me.....I've seen guys with bells and beepers...
What do you recommend?

I would suspect that a young pup would probably need a regular collar for any mis-behaving but also have the constant beeper for location. Maybe bells can be used for more settled mature dogs?

What do you guys recommend? Any comments appreciated.


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## PapawSmith (Feb 13, 2007)

I personally don't like any noisy accessories hanging off my pointer when we are hunting, it spoils the atmosphere to me. I did however have a very short in stature Springer Spaniel years ago that I would occasionally hang a small bell on if we were hunting deep grass areas just so I could hear if she stopped moving and was not in view, but the beepers I see guys use just drive me nuts. I train my pointers to hunt close and that probably makes a big difference. I often see guys running dogs a hundred yards or more out front and I don't care to hunt that way. I just keep a Trionocs collar on my dog that I can hit the audible beep on if she is not following my voice commands or hunts out a bit too far. The 'beep' is all she needs, I never have to hit her with any stimulation. It is all a preference thing though, the crazy beep and bell guys are doing nothing wrong, just doing it differently than me and noisy-ing up the serenity of the walk in the wild. (Sometimes I want to take away their controller and stomp on them when they keep hunting around us). Good luck and enjoy your new pointer, there is no more enjoyable hunt than over a good pointer IMO.


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## johnrude (Mar 29, 2009)

i agree with Papa train the dog to stay close enough and you won't need anything. But on my wirehair i run a bell on him and he stays fairly close already. he blends in so well with the cover i have a hard seeing him sometimes,so when the bell stops i move towards the last area i heard it.


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## big_fish (Dec 21, 2004)

Hows the pup going we had her brother to the vet he is 30.4 lbs and pointing good I have ran a bell on him a few times but I will let the cover decide if I need it on him or not. Im with the other fellas the beepers seem a little to hitech for me and it takes away the quietness I often look for. All I want to here is the dog in the brush and the sound of wings after I flush it and of course the sound of a bird falling (if it only worked out that way all the time) I have been training him to hunt close I don't let him range out to far.I was at a few field trials with the fella who owned the father of our pups but those dogs ran way to big for me.


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## BaddFish (Jun 20, 2009)

I think I agree with all you guys...that beep sounded like something from star trek...the bell seems more....old school or authentic (for lack of better words).. Plus for our budget right now a bell fits just perfect!

BigFish- Ya, Molly is doing good- as far as I can tell. She points robins in the yard and when we get the wing & rod out she's super excited and focused... She points real good and even lets us spread her legs and push her tail up without moving. We started training basic obedience months ago and we try and give her training at least once a week. Its been tough lately with the heat and crazy mosquitos we have here. Probably 3 weeks ago we started training "whoa" and she does OK, not real crisp yet. She had a week were she was sooo bull headed, but then the next time she's all about us and making us happy.

When I let her run in the back yard & woods, she runs with our lab- I'm a little concerned that her ranging may be out of wack... I need to get her out without the lab and see if she's still ranging nicely. Do you just put a long leash on them to keep them 20-30yds away?

Yes, JJ likes those dogs ranging far...he says that our litter will be prime for that...?? I don't have an opinion on this yet... I guess if the dog locks up like a statue even if its 60-80yds away and stays put until you get there...? 
JJ hunts from horses in the south... so the ranging makes sense for that.

Cant wait for the fall! Hope to go to the U.P. with her in Oct.


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## big_fish (Dec 21, 2004)

I have a 50 ft check cord I hook on him and let him run. In the beginning he would range out and I would chase him down afraid I would loose him then a older guy told me to try to hide or loose my dog and I would see that I am running after him for nothing he will come back. Being from a retriever/flusher back round I had to get the ranging thing in my head to differ from my old dogs and let him get out a little. He will hunt in the fields out about 50 to 75 yards. In the woods he stays a little closer with 50 yards being the extreme. we have been working on whoa to for a few months and he was hard headed to in the beginning but it is coming together and Im with you I cant wait until fall. Do you have an E-collar on her? I have conditioned him on it and he wears it when we are out and that has helped with the ranging to far. I am very pleased with the intelligence of these dogs it was a good breeding and produced good pups. I have homing pigeons I work him on when I can(rain and heat) and quail I will start shooting over him in a few weeks if everything stays on the path were on. Your more than welcome to bring her down and we can put her on some pigeons if you want. the pigeons save so much money on training birds and very easy to keep.


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## BaddFish (Jun 20, 2009)

I may take you up on that! Molly's ranging has been great....I'm not sure about now. She's much more confident now since the last time I walked her. When the labs not around she tends to stay by me....


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## steelmagoo (Apr 13, 2004)

When my setter was about a year old I got the Tritronics Sport 65 BPR G2. It worked well for about 6 years, no problems technically until lately. Hard use has knocked something loose in the collar, probably in the tiny circuit board. I found it to be a valuable training aid as well as a good way to locate the dog when she goes on point in the really thick stuff in MN. One thing I didn't like about the collar was the beeper and stimulator were a bit wide for Belle's skinny neck, so the fit wasn't perfect. The collar had a tendency to slide around, so the beeper and stimulator would end up on the sides of the neck. I think they've improved on this now. I never used the running beep, just the "on point" hawk screech. The shock collar was great for teaching yard boundaries, calling her off porcupine, teaching her not to chase deer, etc. I was very careful to DO NO HARM by overusing it. I haven't really needed to use it for most of the past 3 or 4 years, as Belle has mellowed out and smartened up. In tall grass (like in North Dakota) or thick coverts (Minnesota) I'll put a bell on the dog just to keep track of her position. I take the bell off if we're going for sharptail, it spooks them.


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## BaddFish (Jun 20, 2009)

Good stuff Steelmagoo! Readin your post makes me want to hunt today!
Ya, I have experience with collars from my lab... our Brittany is way more sensitive so I need to find a collar with super light stimulations. I agree with your take on older dogs don't need the collars as much- my lab is probably going to be collar-less this fall for waterfowl.

Your comment about porcupine made me remember our encounter years ago in ND.  We didn't have any dogs at the time- but for 5 Ohio boys standing around that big thing, it was pretty cool. Right after that a jack rabbit flushed- none of us knew what to do..it looked like a kangaroo hopping through.. Awesome memories.


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## steelmagoo (Apr 13, 2004)

This is a pic of Belle after a porkie encounter. It was entirely my fault. She pointed it in a cattail slew, I thought it was a stubborn phez. I bid her "GET IT", and she did. 
http://www.ohiogamefishing.com/photopost/watermark.php?file=57089


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## BaddFish (Jun 20, 2009)

WOW. that to be tough/ impossible to get those out yourself? Did a vet have to help?


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## steelmagoo (Apr 13, 2004)

BaddFish said:


> WOW. that to be tough/ impossible to get those out yourself? Did a vet have to help?


This was close to Gardena, ND in 2008, on a Sunday afternoon. Closest vet was over an hour and a half away in Rugby and the quills had already been in there for a while by the time we got her to the truck. By the time we could have gotten her to the vet the quills would have softened to the point that they would have been too hard to remove, I was advised. We took her back to a friends house and removed them ourselves. It was heartbreaking for me. Two of us holding her down while a buddy (registered nurse) pulled them. the ones that went all the way through were the easiest. the dead-end ones were the worst. After the first 8 or 9 she just gave up resisting while I tried to comfort her. Awful. She hunted like a champ the next day and the rest of the week. The pic does not really show how many were in there.


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## longhaulpointer (Mar 12, 2009)

not sure how far your dog ranges but i would definitely suggest some sort of e collar for the first couple of years. The up is a big area and if your dog starts on a deer you might never see it again if you cant reach out and touch it with some electric. Also the disadvantage of a bell is that if the dog is in real thick and on point you'll have some problems locating. with that said i hunt my dogs with shock beeper combo collars. I also have several bells that i use when grouse hunting. I prefer the deep woods bell from lioncountrysupply.com you can hear those bells from a mile away in the woods.


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## BaddFish (Jun 20, 2009)

Thanks longhaul...ya, she's ranging more and more everyday... in fact, she ignored my wife pretty bad two days ago so we have a Sportdog collar 425 on its way. She has alot of confidence- which I love but can be a pain at times. (same thing we dealt with in our lab) thx for the info about the bells..


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## PapawSmith (Feb 13, 2007)

I saw something cool this morning that I was unaware was available. Garmin makes a handheld satellite dog tracking system called Astro 320. A little pricy at $600 but better than losing a good dog. I have been fortunate to have not had a dog that is prone to stray away or chase other game, like deer mentioned earlier, but have hunted with others that have. We lost half a day on Drummond Island MI a couple years ago chasing a friends Brittany that had got onto a deer, this would have been perfect for chasing that bitch down. I can see where this unit would be useful with chase dogs hunting other types of game as well. In 10 years they will probably be $50 and we will all have them on our dogs.


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## longhaulpointer (Mar 12, 2009)

id love one of the new garmin tritronics collars that have the function to track and shock, but like you said $600 is a little to pricy for now.


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## BaddFish (Jun 20, 2009)

We just got our SPortDog 425 collar this weekend. I love these collars- freakin perfect size.....yesterday we put it on Molly and played with her ALOT... Then we did some healing, come, stay, etc... she was awesome. She only needed a couple little "persuasions". She pointed with foot up and everything at a wing... 
I gave her "whoa" and she was rock solid... I tried to break her by yelling and lunging at her...she didn't flinch... I was really impressed.

QUESTION- In a hunting situation... after walking up on her with your gun ready... Do you generally try and flush the bird or do you send the dog? If you send the dog- what command do you use?

We used the vibrate a little with "come"...she started to get it- but we didn't want to over do it.

She made us very proud... Wifes gonna work with her everyday now.
I'll get some pics next time.


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## longhaulpointer (Mar 12, 2009)

On my older dog, my only "trained" dog i had her steady to wing and shot but that was strictly for guiding purposes. I dont trust other people who hunt once a year to shoot over a moving dog. For hunting wild ohio birds i prefer the dog to flush the birds as sometimes im in cover up to my neck. When a bird is running in thick stuff it doesn't matter how pretty the dogs point is


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## big_fish (Dec 21, 2004)

I tap his head and say ok or tap his head and say his name I have been using ok to get him to relocate and his name on retrieves I haven't been letting him flush them Im afraid he wont hold point in the field and try to flush on his own when Im not around.


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## BaddFish (Jun 20, 2009)

I think for now I'm going to leave her rock solid...then later after she is fully mature or at least next year- I'll start to let her flush it....


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## PapawSmith (Feb 13, 2007)

BaddFish said:


> I think for now I'm going to leave her rock solid...then later after she is fully mature or at least next year- I'll start to let her flush it....


That is probably best because you really need to see how she likes to hunt and go from there. All dogs do not want to point and flush,I've hunted over good dogs the owner could not get them to flush and others that would not let their pointers flush. My Braque' has always pointed, flushed, and retrieved and that is how she really likes to hunt. I never had to teach her to flush, I just had to teach her to 'hold' on point until I wanted a flush. I have always liked that she will do that because I'm often with young hunters, non hunting companions, or alone. In each of those situations I don't really want to be right on top of the bird when it flushes. On top of that, I truly enjoy and treasure the sight of a pointing dog advancing in on command and putting up a bird. I will never tire of that sight when hunting. (Hell, I'll never tire of hunting over a pointer period). Mine will rapidly wag her stub tail when she picks up on a bird; hold a firm point quietly if she sees the bird; follow, head, and point a bird she sees that is trying to move on her; and 'whine' while pointing a bird she is certain is placed but she can actually see it. ( That is something she has always done and it is quite handy to know when she can't actually see the bird. Don't know how you would train that, it's just her personality). All I have to do as I move myself and others to position is verbally calm her to 'hold' every few seconds till ready then command her to "get the bird". 

A lot of 'purists' in pointing dogs think that is sacrilege, by the way. Many think pointers should never flush and I would not be surprised if it a is point deduction in field trial competition, but I don't care because I have no desire to compete. 

If this is your first bird dog you are surely in for several years of great fun in the field. The girl I have now is, without question, the best I've ever hunted over and she turned 14 in February. She still loves the field but I only hunt her for an hour or two, anything longer than that causes her two days of pain. As before, best of luck bringing this pup along.


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## longhaulpointer (Mar 12, 2009)

PapawSmith said:


> , but I don't care because I have no desire to compete. .


exactly, whatever works best for you.


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## BaddFish (Jun 20, 2009)

Exactly PaPa- Until you know your dogs quirks- its probably not that important for me to teach her to flush right now...
This is only my second hunting dog (first was a lab) so I'm still extremely happy and satisfied when my lab brings me a goose or greenhead to hand...(I always think- how did I ever hunt waterfowl WITHOUT a dog....for almost 20 years!!????)

Can't wait to see our little Molly all serious and pointing- locked up on a grouse or pheasant.... I'll feel like I hit the lottery! 

So far she loves to retrieve balls and stuff...I think she needs reinforcing with it but it will be interesting to see if she wants to retrieve birds.


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