# Opening weekend numbers



## Uglystix

Here is the tally for the opening weekend.


Adams: 89 (104); Allen: 22 (13); Ashland: 43 (41); Athens: 74 (102); Auglaize: 8 (9); Belmont: 93 (132); Brown: 88 (104); Butler: 49 (50); Carroll: 101 (98); Champaign: 25 (20); Clark: 8 (2); Clermont: 62 (82); Clinton: 19 (18); Columbiana: 79 (107); Coshocton: 65 (107); Crawford: 14 (13); Darke: 13 (16); Defiance: 41 (41); Delaware: 21 (31); Erie: 12 (9); Fairfield: 32 (26); Fayette: 1 (2); Franklin: 1 (5); Fulton: 19 (28); Gallia: 80 (97); Greene: 12 (5); Guernsey: 110 (135); Hamilton: 28 (26); Hancock: 5 (10); Hardin: 20 (23); Harrison: 104 (115); Henry: 9 (15); Highland: 65 (92); Hocking: 60 (67); Holmes: 43 (54); Huron: 19 (30); Jackson: 51 (94); Jefferson: 88 (106); Knox: 54 (78); Lawrence: 52 (50); Licking: 65 (84); Logan: 39 (29); Lorain: 25 (29); Lucas: 13 (13); Madison: 1 (2); Mahoning: 46 (47); Marion: 11 (8); Medina: 21 (26); Meigs: 92 (122); Mercer: 5 (5); Miami: 11 (6); Monroe: 75 (116); Montgomery: 3 (8); Morgan: 67 (84); Morrow: 46 (31); Muskingum: 86 (114); Noble: 72 (97); Paulding: 13 (15); Perry: 55 (69); Pickaway: 1 (5); Pike: 42 (52); Portage: 42 (52); Preble: 47 (29); Putnam: 10 (11); Richland: 44 (55); Ross: 72 (80); Sandusky: 5 (7); Scioto: 50 (65); Seneca: 26 (31); Shelby: 11 (15); Stark: 56 (62); Summit: 18 (16); Tuscarawas: 104 (113); Union: 15 (11); Van Wert: 7 (4); Vinton: 47 (70); Warren: 23 (23); Washington: 69 (114); Wayne: 33 (26); Williams: 50 (50); Wood: 7 (4); Wyandot: 11 (17).


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## ironman172

0 for 0 here, did see some scratching..... but then moving and cutting firewood won't see much , and none if they aren't present anyway


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## M.Magis

There are far less birds now than in the late 80s before we even had a season. If I happen to hear one I’ll take one of the kids after it, otherwise its not worth putting my boots on this year.


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## Deadeyedeek

The backoff to 1 bird should make a difference in next couple years in Williams Co, our numbers have declined rapidly, weather plays a big part in hatch,rac ***** eating eggs is a big problem..we will see


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## squidlips2020

Numbers are way down in my neck of the woods as well in Tuscarawas County. Haven’t even heard a bird usually hear 3-4


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## M.Magis

Decreasing the number of gobblers taken, unfortunately, isn't gong to do anything. It's not hurting anything either, but it will have no significant affect on wild turkey numbers. They made the change because enough people have complained and they wanted to pretend they're making an effort. But from the outside looking in, to me it looks like they're just waiting for the other states that are doing actual research into the issue to come up with conclusions so they can follow suit without actually doing anything. Maybe I'm wrong, but I see no real effort so far.
The decrease in numbers is so widespread and has happened so fast, I'm sure there can't be just one reason. But it doesn't take a genius to figure out that reducing the over populated nest raiders can only help. I've not seen a poult around here for years, yet each late spring I see groups of hens getting back together because they've lost so many nests that they've given up. I know I sound like a broken record, but it pizzes me off that not only is there still a season for racoons, possums and skunks, but we still have to PAY EXTRA to take them. Removing all restrictions from taking nest raiders isn't the end-all fix, but its something simple that can only help.


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## bobk

M.Magis said:


> Decreasing the number of gobblers taken, unfortunately, isn't gong to do anything. It's not hurting anything either, but it will have no significant affect on wild turkey numbers. They made the change because enough people have complained and they wanted to pretend they're making an effort. But from the outside looking in, to me it looks like they're just waiting for the other states that are doing actual research into the issue to come up with conclusions so they can follow suit without actually doing anything. Maybe I'm wrong, but I see no real effort so far.
> The decrease in numbers is so widespread and has happened so fast, I'm sure there can't be just one reason. But it doesn't take a genius to figure out that reducing the over populated nest raiders can only help. I've not seen a poult around here for years, yet each late spring I see groups of hens getting back together because they've lost so many nests that they've given up. I know I sound like a broken record, but it pizzes me off that not only is there still a season for racoons, possums and skunks, but we still have to PAY EXTRA to take them. Removing all restrictions from taking nest raiders isn't the end-all fix, but its something simple that can only help.


So are you good with just killing the nest raiders and pitching them in the woods? I’m seriously asking, not trying to be a smart ass. This is something I struggle with. The fact that they aren’t worth skinning is a big part of it. (raccoons)
I can smack the crap out of raccoons with dog proofs during season but you can’t find someone that even wants to mess with them. I’m sure not doing all that work for a couple dollars.


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## jmyers8

Georgia's just passed year round raccoon and opossum season to help with there turkey population and nest productivity. I really hope other states follow along. 


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## M R DUCKS

Pondering :

NWTF
Here are four facts that researchers find may be the cause for decline.

Production, not predation, drives turkey populations
With high population densities, a significant number of hens won’t access quality nesting habitat and may not successful hatch or raise a brood
Carrying capacity becomes an issue, productivity is declining because hens are nesting in suboptimal habitat
Vegetation measurements contribute to the success or failure of nesting sites… little vegetation means little chance at poult survival.
it’s complicated, no easy fix.


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## M.Magis

bobk said:


> So are you good with just killing the nest raiders and pitching them in the woods? I’m seriously asking, not trying to be a smart ass. This is something I struggle with. The fact that they aren’t worth skinning is a big part of it. (raccoons)
> I can smack the crap out of raccoons with dog proofs during season but you can’t find someone that even wants to mess with them. I’m sure not doing all that work for a couple dollars.


It doesn’t bother me even a little. At one time it did. But after walking into our chicken coop day after day, finding dead chickens covering the floor each morning until they were nearly all gone, I got over it. Now they’re worse than rats in my eyes. Between my yard and barn, I killed over 100 in a year. Thats a ridiculous amount raccoons in such a small area. 
Again, its not the answer but something that can only help and is extremely easy to implement. Something worth noting is that GA has been doing significant research into the decreased turkey population. Its no accident they’ve eliminated closed seasons for raccoon and possums.


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## excalman

How does bobcats coyote and birds of prey equal into turkey population?


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## M.Magis

Have to assume all predators factor in to some degree. Putting an exact number to it would be tough because it would be so area specific. To be fair none of the predators are a new thing in the eastern part if the US where the problem seems to be worst. But thats the perplexing thing, theres nothing thats obviously new. Especially considering the dramatic drop in just the last several years. It wasn’t a long slow decline, at least not here. 5 years ago was fantastic, now its like they don’t exist.


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## jmyers8

10ish years ago we had distemper run through here bad and take out alot of raccoons. You would find 10 to 20 dead in a block of woods most around den trees. And even in the last 10byears there was still a market for fur. The last 5 years you csnt even find a buyer. That would be one of the reasons why I would think in the recent past.

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## Carpn

I hate raccoons more than mosquitoes. At least mosquitoes get eaten by swallows , martins, and bats . 

I had one waiting in a dog proof set by my chicken coop when I got home tonight . 

I think the are multiple factors at play affecting turkey numbers . People place alot of blame on predators but modern farming practices , West Nile , and weather during the hatch are all contributing factors . 



Not to mention all the giant corn piles that show up in the woods come fall and winter . You can't tell me that doesn't help the raccoon population .


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## bobk

M.Magis said:


> It doesn’t bother me even a little. At one time it did. But after walking into our chicken coop day after day, finding dead chickens covering the floor each morning until they were nearly all gone, I got over it. Now they’re worse than rats in my eyes. Between my yard and barn, I killed over 100 in a year. Thats a ridiculous amount raccoons in such a small area.
> Again, its not the answer but something that can only help and is extremely easy to implement. Something worth noting is that GA has been doing significant research into the decreased turkey population. Its no accident they’ve eliminated closed seasons for raccoon and possums.


Totally understand that frustration.


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## eyecat

Balogney on that NWTF statement. I sent a long letter to the ODNR last spring about doing away with any season on racoons and possoms. Nest predation is the number one contributor to low turkey numbers that we can help control. The proof of this is in all the bird plantations in Georgia, Alabama, S Carolina, etc. I have relatives that live down south where quail is King. These plantations are 2000 to 10000 acres and at that size have 100% control over habitat, doing burns, plots, logging for thick areas, nesting areas, etc, and with all that and continued low population and poult survival, nest predation came to be the foremost contributor to low reproduction rates. So they went to war on racoons, other nest predators.
The ODNR told me low turkey repro was habitat once, which is refuted by the controlled closed- loop southern plantation findings.
Then the ODNR lady in charge of Furbearers told me "well we dont want an open season when there are young raccoon kits", Balogney on that because there is open season on groundhogs, kits or no kits, and racoons now have no more value than groundhogs. Plus, like it or not, the fur trade is no longer relavent now, and will be even less in the future. I know people that can hardly find a buyer for furs anymore. Its time to classify racoons, opossums as pests like groundhogs are, and have no season on them.
I have been passionate about turkey hunting and managing land for turkeys for the last 30 years.


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## eyecat

Weather is beyond our control, reducing predators is not.


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## jmyers8

Another big problem with raccoon population is deer leases when I started hunting with hounds 15 years ago every single farmer gave us permission to kill them cause of crop damage. Now I have just a few and the reason why....deer leases full of corn piles and they think we run all the deer out which studies have proven as absolutely false 

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## eyecat

Yes, but you need to kill the racoons, I have known hound hunters that dont really harvest, just run the dogs and tree. They just enjoy working their dogs which I understand because we have a bird dog.


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## jmyers8

eyecat said:


> Yes, but you need to kill the racoons, I have known hound hunters that dont really harvest, just run the dogs and tree. They just enjoy working their dogs which I understand because we have a bird dog.


When we had alot of spots we did shoot alot of them when season was in. Unfortunsntly we had to contend with gun season and bad weather which made the days very limited. Now we only have a few spots so we are much more selective how many we harvest because it would be easy to wipe the woods out 

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## threeten

Could the rise of west Nile and avian flu be a contributor?
I’ve built a wire basket over the water on my pond close to shore. As I kill *****/ groundhogs I put them in the basket, at least the fish get some food from the wigglers that fall off.


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## threeten

Can’t post koons
It autocorrects it. Is it a bad word?


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## the weav

Around my immediate area it has been farmers clearing every brush pile and fence row possible.
Couple farms look like golf courses.


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## M.Magis

Any sort of environmental factor can be eliminated as a cause. It's not a localized problem, it's all across the eastern part of the US. It's in areas like around me where there are thousands upon thousands of acres of ideal habitat. Places that held large flocks just three years ago are completely void of turkeys now. Areas in the SE US with huge pieces of government ground where the birds are miles from people and anything to do with people. It's everywhere. To me, some sort of illness or disease, particularly in the summer time, makes the most sense. But that's just me speculating. Hopefully the states actually looking into it can figure it out. It sure isn't going to be anyone with the Ohio DNR.


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