# Head shots...?



## aquaholic2 (Feb 17, 2010)

Hang on....special circumstances prompt me to ask if anyone has ever attempted this on deer with a long gun...? I took a decent buck the old-fashioned/hard way in October, but didn't have time to harvest a doe thru the gun season. Venison helps a great deal when managing a retirement budget, and I would like to add a doe to this next years resources.
We have harvested "meat" deer from the back porch of our SE Ohio cabin several times. For us old guys this is a welcome method of take. But recovery from a legal ML kill in these temps and snow cover is still difficult. My CVA wolf puts every 245 power bullet in the end of a soda can,at my expected range inside 50yds. My thought is to try a head shot that should drop a doe in her tracks and simplify the harvest. Just wondering if anyone has had acceptable results from this or is the brain too small to expect a quick humane kill....?


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## 9Left (Jun 23, 2012)

Yup...if I know I have a steady rest, and enough time to settle the crosshairs on the Deers head for several seconds .. I will take a headshot whenever I can .. i've never taken a head shot of more than 50 yards...I can double lung the deer at 120 yards , even if i end up an inch high or low or left or right .. I'm still going to get both lungs . but at 50 yards or less, I am 99.9 % confident that I'm going to hit right where the crosshairs are settled. and for what it's worth, IMO, a broadside shot through the neck will drop them just as fast


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## Shortdrift (Apr 5, 2004)

That is the poorest and highest potential slow death shot you can take. I ounce saw a doe harvested that had it's lower jaw blown off by an inexperienced hunter. Another that had a nice chunk taken out of it's snout. I don't care how good you are with Old Betsy, There is always a first time for an uncontrolled shake, a bullet that decides to fly off coarse or any number of things that can lead to a slow painful death. A shot in the boiler room ruins very little meat or a neck shot will always work or provide a clean miss. My uncle always said respect the game and take a shot that gives a little room for human error.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Have seen the same as Shortdrift.
Also, whether caused by human error or equipment issue, have never seen a m/l that has never been guilty of not shooting an occasional flyer.
Head shots are out for me as well.


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## Shad Rap (Nov 10, 2010)

9Left said:


> Yup...if I know I have a steady rest, and enough time to settle the crosshairs on the Deers head for several seconds .. I will take a headshot whenever I can .. i've never taken a head shot of more than 50 yards...I can double lung the deer at 120 yards , even if i end up an inch high or low or left or right .. I'm still going to get both lungs . but at 50 yards or less, I am 99.9 % confident that I'm going to hit right where the crosshairs are settled. and for what it's worth, IMO, a broadside shot through the neck will drop them just as fast


I'll take a headshot whenever the situation presents itself too...you can put a bad shot on a deer anywhere that will cause a slow painful death...gut shots are the ones you see the most from aiming at the shoulder anyway.


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## Lundy (Apr 5, 2004)

No, no and no one more time.

Irresponsible, unethical and shows a lack of respect for the animal you are hunting.

I don't care who you are, how good you are, what you know or don't know it is not something that anyone I would consider a hunter would ever do.

I have seen personally the results of these type of ego shots more than a few times over my 45 years of deer hunting.

If I come across too strong in my response, sorry but I have strong feelings on this subject.


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## Flathead76 (May 2, 2010)

One muzzleloader season I shot and killed a doe at around 100 yards. When I got up to where she fell the deer that I shot was skin and bones. Upon further examination I discovered a lump in the side of her jaw. After gutting her I decided to use my knife to take a closer look. Quickly I found the remains of a rifled slug. That deer probably did not eat since shotgun season. After seeing that I would tell people that if you respect the game that you hunt don't take head shots. The margin for error is not very large.


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## Shad Rap (Nov 10, 2010)

Lundy said:


> No, no and no one more time.
> 
> Irresponsible, unethical and shows a lack of respect for the animal you are hunting.
> 
> ...


So you don't take headshots on a squirrel with a .22 either?..personal preference I guess.


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## Lundy (Apr 5, 2004)

I haven't hunted squirrels in 35 years and when I did it was with a shotgun so I can't really answer your question adequately.


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## buckeyebowman (Feb 24, 2012)

The only problem with a head shot is that's the part of a deer that seems to always be in motion, and can move quickly even though nothing else on the deer may be. 

If you have a broadside or slightly quartering away or quartering to shot, the high shoulder shot will drop a deer in it's tracks. Provided your gun is accurate enough, and I don't think the accuracy for that shot is as critical as it would be for a head shot. 

Reminds me of how I was taught to tackle in youth league football. I was taught to look at the belt, not at the head. The head can move all around and cause you to miss. The belt can't move around that much!


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## Shad Rap (Nov 10, 2010)

buckeyebowman said:


> The only problem with a head shot is that's the part of a deer that seems to always be in motion, and can move quickly even though nothing else on the deer may be.
> 
> If you have a broadside or slightly quartering away or quartering to shot, the high shoulder shot will drop a deer in it's tracks. Provided your gun is accurate enough, and I don't think the accuracy for that shot is as critical as it would be for a head shot.
> 
> Reminds me of how I was taught to tackle in youth league football. I was taught to look at the belt, not at the head. The head can move all around and cause you to miss. The belt can't move around that much!


Accuracy for ANY shot is critical...you can just as easily gut shoot a deer aiming for the shoulder...that happens more than screwing up a headshot...my guess is 99 percent of the time when you screw up a headshot you completely miss...maybe I'm wrong...myself, I've never screwed one up...lucky me...I do headshots on squirrels all day long and have done my share on deer...guess it just depends on who you are and where you came from.


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## Lundy (Apr 5, 2004)

Shad Rap said:


> .you can just as easily gut shoot a deer aiming for the shoulder...that happens more than screwing up a headshot...my guess is 99 percent of the time when you screw up a headshot you completely miss...


Amazingly ridiculous statements


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## aquaholic2 (Feb 17, 2010)

Shad Rap said:


> Accuracy for ANY shot is critical...you can just as easily gut shoot a deer aiming for the shoulder...that happens more than screwing up a headshot...my guess is 99 percent of the time when you screw up a headshot you completely miss...maybe I'm wrong...I do headshots on squirrels all day long and have done my share on deer...guess it just depends on who you are and where you came from.


Let me go back a little further with some of you....when I was courting the cutest girl in the class....back in high school...the only money I could muster for our dates was from trap line $ in NW Ohio,,, when I came up on a dry set, ****, fox, possum....there was only place to place the .22 slug. Why does it make more sense now to shoot our meat deer that supplements our remaining time together, thru the ribs/shoulder and waste 10/20 lbs of meat...?


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## Lundy (Apr 5, 2004)

Aquaholic,

Send me your phone number and I will send you mine. If your condition requires that you need some help getting a deer out of the woods and back to your home in these less than ideal conditions you call me and either I will come or I will find someone to come and help take care of it for you. 

I feel very confident that there are more than just me on OGF that are willing to help you out with your need.


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## Lundy (Apr 5, 2004)

aquaholic2 said:


> , when I came up on a dry set, ****, fox, possum....there was only place to place the .22 slug. Why does it make more sense now to shoot our meat deer that supplements our remaining time together, thru the ribs/shoulder and waste 10/20 lbs of meat...?


Because if you miss the shot at a animal already restrained in a trap, you just shoot again, it can't run away wounded.


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## bobk (Apr 30, 2004)

We can all punch holes on a bench. Hunting is so much more different. All the conditions are different. I wouldn't think of attempting to shoot a deer in the head during hunting conditions. I've seen the results from attempted head shots. It's sickening. 

If my only option to shoot a deer was a head shot I'd quit hunting.


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## bobk (Apr 30, 2004)

aquaholic2 said:


> Let me go back a little further with some of you....when I was courting the cutest girl in the class....back in high school...the only money I could muster for our dates was from trap line $ in NW Ohio,,, when I came up on a dry set, ****, fox, possum....there was only place to place the .22 slug. Why does it make more sense now to shoot our meat deer that supplements our remaining time together, thru the ribs/shoulder and waste 10/20 lbs of meat...?


How are you losing 10-20 lbs of meat from
a rib shot?


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## Shad Rap (Nov 10, 2010)

Lundy said:


> Amazingly ridiculous statements


Amazingly ridiculous is right...why is your view or stance on this issue so right?..do what you want and I'll do what I want...guess we can agree to disagree.


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## Shad Rap (Nov 10, 2010)

bobk said:


> We can all punch holes on a bench. Hunting is so much more different. All the conditions are different. I wouldn't think of attempting to shoot a deer in the head during hunting conditions. I've seen the results from attempted head shots. It's sickening.
> 
> If my only option to shoot a deer was a head shot I'd quit hunting.


Just like results from gut shots...and I'm not talking about taking a free hand headshot...not even saying to take a headshot every time either...to each their own.


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## Shad Rap (Nov 10, 2010)

bobk said:


> How are you losing 10-20 lbs of meat from
> a rib shot?


I really didn't understand this one either.


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## Shad Rap (Nov 10, 2010)

Lundy said:


> Because if you miss the shot at a animal already restrained in a trap, you just shoot again, it can't run away wounded.


Roflmao...how about just whacking it over the head?


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## Shad Rap (Nov 10, 2010)

.


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## Shad Rap (Nov 10, 2010)

bobk said:


> We can all punch holes on a bench. Hunting is so much more different. All the conditions are different. I wouldn't think of attempting to shoot a deer in the head during hunting conditions. I've seen the results from attempted head shots. It's sickening.
> 
> If my only option to shoot a deer was a head shot I'd quit hunting.


Would you shoot a squirrel in the head with a .22?..


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

I sure hope that those here condoning risky head shots with a firearm don't bow hunt. I'd hate to see the shots you would take with a bow.
Before I'd take a head shot, that deer would walk for sure. I respect the game I'm hunting enough to take the best percentage shot that provides the most humane kill as possible. To me, anything less makes me a slob Hunter and I'd quit hunting before that happens.

And FWIW, I, like a few others here have had to put deer down that have had days, maybe weeks of suffering in which they actually stunk from the rot and gangrene from misplaced shots. And a few of those have been attempted head shots. But not one of them have been gut shot. Most likely the reason is a gut shot deer will only run far enough to feel safe, lay down and if not pushed will lay right there and die. And no, that's obviously not as good as a bang flop kill.
Not so with a deer with its lower jaw blown off. That deer isn't gonna die from blood loss like a gut shot deer. It's gonna die from days of starvation and from its flesh rotting.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Shad Rap said:


> Would you shoot a squirrel in the head with a .22?..


Shad Rap, You seriously asked that again???

I really wish you would do a little honest research on whether a head shot on a medium to large size game animal is a good idea.


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## Saugeye Tom (Oct 6, 2010)

Head shots on deer are a ABSOLUTE NO..if you'e ever saw a deer with a busted jaw because of a bad shot you would stop attemptng them sr


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## Saugeye Tom (Oct 6, 2010)

It only takes 1 mistake...pain and suffering follows


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## lawrence1 (Jul 2, 2008)

On small game I actually recommend a head shot if possible, so as not to destroy the meat, but that's mostly with shotshells and mostly on Rabbits being pushed to me by dogs. It's all about the meat right?

I used to occasionally kill Deer with head shots if the opportunity presented itself. I'd rationalize it to myself by using the logic of how much I like to grill out and eat Deer ribs and how much a bullet would tear up the ribs on a heart/lung shot. Certainly no 10-20 lbs of meat but you get what I mean.

Until on a ML hunt where a Doe came in close and I chose a head shot but much to my dismay my shot was about an inch high and took off the top of her skull leaving her crazy brained and running in 10yd circles. Not my proudest day in the field as she suffered for a good two minutes while I hung my head and reloaded. 

Some of you would probably scoff if I bragged on the number of Deer I've killed but suffice it to say I've forgotten about a lot of the Deer I've killed but I've never forgot that one. 

I don't recommend head shots on Deer but if you're going to do it (close up shots only) don't do it with a ML as you have no quick follow up shot.


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## Flathead76 (May 2, 2010)

Saugeye Tom said:


> Head shots on deer are a ABSOLUTE NO..if you'e ever saw a deer with a busted jaw because of a bad shot you would stop attemptng them sr


If people could see the condition of the deer that I mentioned earlier in this thread the ones saying it's ok to take head shots would have a better understanding of what suffering the animal goes through on a missed shot.


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## Saugeye Tom (Oct 6, 2010)

Flathead76 said:


> If people could see the condition of the deer that I mentioned earlier in this thread the ones saying it's ok to take head shots would have a better understanding of what suffering the animal goes through on a missed shot.


Well understood FH


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## Flathead76 (May 2, 2010)

Lundy said:


> Aquaholic,
> 
> Send me your phone number and I will send you mine. If your condition requires that you need some help getting a deer out of the woods and back to your home in these less than ideal conditions you call me and either I will come or I will find someone to come and help take care of it for you.
> 
> I feel very confident that there are more than just me on OGF that are willing to help you out with your need.


Feel free to add me to that list.


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## Bowhunter15 (May 17, 2016)

No for me. While bad shots happen, this seems like a dangerous game. Way to much room for error and if it goes wrong there will be alot of suffering.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Flathead76 said:


> Feel free to add me to that list.


Me as well!


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Aquaholic, here's a pic of a deer brain. Notice it's not much bigger than its eye. At 50yds, that would be like busting golfballs at that range with your m/l. And remember, you're only getting one shot. Not impossible...but the odds compaired to the paper plate size heart/lung target just doesnt make logical sense. Lots of room to miss hitting in the muzzle,jaw etc then there is a good chance the deers gonna run. Surely a much much more risky shot than a heart/lung shot. Also, you take a broadside shot into the boiler room, instead of high shoulder shot, your not gonna loose hardly any meat at all unless you're counting a very little rib meat and the heart.


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## doegirl (Feb 24, 2005)

On the very first deer I harvested I took a head shot and actually hit it right behind the jaw. The deer did die but it wasn't pretty. It was foolish of me to take such a high risk shot and an animal had to suffer because of my poor judgement. 
I can't believe there is an actual debate about this. Head shots on big game is not ethical, period.


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## bobk (Apr 30, 2004)

Shad Rap said:


> Would you shoot a squirrel in the head with a .22?..


No I would not.


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## garhtr (Jan 12, 2009)

Over the years I've taken maybe 3 headshots, most or all have been from a tree and I think all the deer were less than 20 yds , probably much less, I don't prefer it but at close range on a stationary target I feel confident enough to pull the trigger. Take the shot your personally confident in.
I would guess shooting at running game results in far more wounded animals than head shooting ? ( stop it )
Good luck and good Hunting.


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## Bprice1031 (Mar 13, 2016)

I agree with shortdrift, the neck shot is a great way to harvest deer. I never have attempted nor will I attempt a head shot. Give me broad side shot at the neck, and I'll take it every time.


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## CFIden (Oct 9, 2014)

9Left said:


> Yup...if I know I have a steady rest, and enough time to settle the crosshairs on the Deers head for several seconds .. I will take a headshot whenever I can .. i've never taken a head shot of more than 50 yards...I can double lung the deer at 120 yards , even if i end up an inch high or low or left or right .. I'm still going to get both lungs . but at 50 yards or less, I am 99.9 % confident that I'm going to hit right where the crosshairs are settled. and for what it's worth, IMO, a broadside shot through the neck will drop them just as fast


X2 on the neck shot.


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

Shortdrift said:


> That is the poorest and highest potential slow death shot you can take. I ounce saw a doe harvested that had it's lower jaw blown off by an inexperienced hunter. Another that had a nice chunk taken out of it's snout. I don't care how good you are with Old Betsy, There is always a first time for an uncontrolled shake, a bullet that decides to fly off coarse or any number of things that can lead to a slow painful death. A shot in the boiler room ruins very little meat or a neck shot will always work or provide a clean miss. My uncle always said respect the game and take a shot that gives a little room for human error.


i can attest to this not being a ethical shot to take on a deer. i took a head shot 1 time many yrs ago. i took the shot then walked down to where the deer was standing and found blood. then looking around i found the lower jaw from the deer. i was sickened at the thought of what the deer would go through before it died. i might think about taking another head shot if the deer was only a few yrds away and it was the only shot i had and i had been busted by the deer. but i'll track a deer for the short distance it takes them to go down if a good shot was made to the boiler room. I've taken a lot of deer when they dropped or traveled less than 75 yrds before going down.

as for the neck shot I'm not to hot on taking that shot myself. i had a deer coming in on me one time. i was using a double barrel 12 ga black powder shotgun. i had one barrel sighted in with a scope and the other one with the iron sights. i cocked the scope side then the deer just kept getting closer. at about 15 yrds i decided to use the iron sights. i cocked the iron sight barrel. then i aimed for the neck and pulled the trigger. the deer just started running around with its head hanging down and bleating like crazy. i started to shoot it again with the scope side but it had fired when i shot. so this deer was hit in the neck at 15 yrds with 2 690 round balls with 90 grns of black powder behind each ball and it didn't take the deer down for some time.
sherman


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## Shortdrift (Apr 5, 2004)

aquaholic2 said:


> Let me go back a little further with some of you... Why does it make more sense now to shoot our meat deer that supplements our remaining time together, thru the ribs/shoulder and waste 10/20 lbs of meat...?


 


I have never shot a deer with a firearm that could ruin 20# of meat.


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## garhtr (Jan 12, 2009)

Shad Rap said:


> Would you shoot a squirrel in the head with a .22?..


 I certainly have and hope to shoot a few in the head this W/E, maybe a rabbit too.
Good luck and good Hunting


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## floater99 (May 21, 2010)

All I will say is head shot NO! neck shot better odds clean kill or clean miss and no tracking This is still a marginal shot go for the boiler room first


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## crappiedude (Mar 12, 2006)

I've made head shots on 2 animals.
1 was a pesky coyote that had been chasing deer all morning and when he ran a couple of does right below me, he stopped about 45 yards out. A head shot piled him up where he stood.
The 2nd was a deer I snuck up on in it's bed. It was maybe 40 yards out in front of and facing me. The way it was bedded my best shot was a head shot. The deer never moved from it's bed.
At the time I was much younger, much steadier and I used to shoot my guns a lot more than I do right now.
At this point it's not a shot I will try again. After shooting that deer I realized just how small of an area I had to hit to anchor that deer and I felt lucky.
I'm not here to judge others but the margin of error is pretty small. Anyone attempting this shot really needs an intimate knowledge of their weapon beyond what the average hunter would have. Most people aren't aware of the true trajectory of a bullet once it leaves their barrel. On a scoped weapon with a scope sighted at 50 yards a bullet can impact several inches low at 25 yards since the bullet at that point is rising from the muzzle to the line of sight of the scope. On weapons with raised scope mounts (such as see through mounts) the amount of rise increases and will cause an even lower impact.
In my 45 years of hunting I've chased a lot more bad hits where people messed up on chest shots but to be fair I've only know of 1 other head shot from my friends and that deer piled up when it was shot.


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## pkent (Oct 31, 2011)

heat shots drop them in there tracks, I have done this in past. the only thing I don't like about it is that the deer did not bleed out. I like to let the heart pump all the blood out.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

pkent said:


> heat shots drop them in there tracks, I have done this in past. the only thing I don't like about it is that the deer did not bleed out. I like to let the heart pump all the blood out.


No...that's an absolute, often quoted statement made out of ignorance that is just NOT true!!!
Brain shots drop them in their tracks....not head shots.

It is common knowledge for anyone that respects/cares enough about the animal they are hunting to research that just cause you hit a deer in the head does NOT constitute the deer dropping in their tracks. And as has been pointed out in this thread as well as in many other sites when this same topic comes up, that head shots often leads to deer suffering a long, senseless, painful death.
Head shots are an irresponsible shot that should never be taken.
The proof is free and it's out there for anyone to research. But again, a person must first respect the animal enough, and secondly, care enough to be willing to want to receive valid info. If that person doesn't care, or has the mindset 'it's worked for me in the past so why change' then those are the people that will continue to cause everyone else to have to clean up that persons messes and put suffering animals out of their long suffering misery.

Furthermore, in 45plus years of hunting during gun season I don't ever recall a situation that I shot a deer when that deer only presented a head shot. Keeping my itchy booger hook off the trigger and being a bit patient has always resulted in the deer I've killed presenting a much more higher percentage shot.


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## Popspastime (Apr 1, 2014)

The only time I've heard "Head shot" is from a very in-experienced hunter or like fastwater said "ignorance". Used to hunt 4 states from 16 years old and can't even begin to remember how many were taken by bow, shotgun, rifle, or muzzle loader but I can remember this... Not 1 was ever shot in the head or ever the thought of trying to hit one there. Always take the boiler room out if you can and then hope to go no farther out then the lungs and I can guarantee a fast clean kill. 
With a rifle that I spent many hours at the bench with I'd take a neck shot every time inside 200 yds. where the neck meets the chest) big target and instant ground pounder. Any further then that in the boiler maker. Don't even listen to someone who says all headshots, it's ignorance.


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

Shortdrift said:


> I have never shot a deer with a firearm that could ruin 20# of meat.


like you shortdrift I've never lost more than a few oz of rib meat at the most. the deer i shot the lower jaw off of i lost the whole deer.

and i did remember 1 deer back when i first started hunting that i head shot. i was setting on the ground and the deer came up behind me and seen me the same time i seen it. it turned into some heavy brush and went about 30 yrds and stopped facing away from me. the only shot i had was the back of its head. i took the shot and the deer dropped in its tracks. the top of the head was gone and its brain was laying about 2 feet from its head. even though that shot turned out ok it was about 20 yrs before i tried the 2nd head shot that i'll regret the rest of my life.
sherman


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## Harry1959 (Mar 17, 2011)

No thanks to the head shots for me. I did it by accident on my first deer 42 years ago, it did drop on its tracks, 44 mag. Buck was facing me and was aiming for its chest. 
Neck shots....Probably ok with a gun, but not ideal. I speak from experience, don’t try it with a crossbow. I did, big mistake and never again. Still makes me sad when I think about it. Not even sure if I will ever shoot one in the neck again with a gun.


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## ezbite (May 25, 2006)

i did it once and will never NEVER do it again. when I shot the first shot it hit a bit low (i couldnt tell at the time) and blew the jaw off, deer dropped and I figured it was dead, I sat down grabbed a drink and it popped its head right up after a few minutes with the bottom jaw just hanging from skin. seems all I did was knock it out... I had to shoot it again as it laid there looking at me like WTH are you doing.. NEVER again!!


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## 3 dog Ed (Apr 25, 2014)

I will never attempt a head shot on a deer. It does not even make sense to me.


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## 9Left (Jun 23, 2012)

Well guys...my reply did not go the way I expected it to... and I will contribute that to being the first one to reply to this thread, and it sounded like I was supporting head shots as an ethical manner to Kill deer at any opportunity ...so I guess I should clarify my reply, I have killed exactly 46 deer in my years of hunting.. and exactly 3 of those were Headshots, and all three were far less than 50 yards… more like 10 or 15 yards..I guess all I can say is, in that specific moment, in those specific situations.. I personally felt like I knew exactly what was going to happen when I pulled the trigger. so I'm definitely not going to apologize for doing it, I did what I was confident with. and it sure as heck did'nt have anything to do with being "cocky"..or doing it just because "I wanted to see if I could "... obviously, lung or heart shots are the way to go and that is what I usually aim for. But like I said earlier, a few times ,the situation presented itself perfectly for a good headshot and i took it.


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## hailtothethief (Jan 18, 2017)

Hunting in thickets i get more potential head shots then body shots. There’s always some deer standing in the prickers behind some trees sticking its head out. I’ve heard the horror stories of people blowing jaws off and feeling bad about. I dont really care for the deer if i had claws and fangs id eat them alive. But with a human nervous system i wouldnt want to suffer from taking that shot. I dont think a deer can really suffer much but i sure could.


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## bobk (Apr 30, 2004)

^^ Total ignorance. Slob hunting at it's best. I'll stop now so I don't get banned.


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## hailtothethief (Jan 18, 2017)

I dont know about slob hunting. Putting holes in a deers side and gutting them.. all the blood. It bothers me. However you do it.

I’ve watched some bear documentaries of them hunting deer gruesomely. I figure i could have easily been born a bear. Id have no emotional complex for how i killed the deer. Id eat them alive.

Ive never taken a head shot. I dont think theres really a moral head shot. You gotta be on point with the shot. Of course there’s rifles with pin point accuracy and a brain shot is an instant kill. So im sure some sharpshooters find some moral justification. There’s always exceptions.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

delete


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## Harry1959 (Mar 17, 2011)

Just because most of us don’t think head shots are a good idea, that doesn’t mean we should berate someone who takes a head shot from time to time. To me s 25 ya head shot would be more ethical than the aiming for the lungs at 150 yards and has never shot his gun at that distance, doesn’t know the wind drift or yardage. And I’ve wounded and left to suffer several deer with attempted lung shots at reasonable range. Like I said, “no thanks to the head shots” but imo worst shots are taken than a 35 yd head shot on a still and relaxed deer,


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## P-NUT (May 17, 2009)

I have taken one head shot in 36 yrs of hunting deer. It was a 27 yard shot off a rest with a scoped muzzleloader zeroed at 25 yards. The result was as I expected. I have also passed a 127 yard shot on a buck with a 7mm rem mag because of wind and lack of a very solid rest (this was in montana). Just because I have taken a head shot does not mean I am a slob hunter. Under certain conditions, I feel a head shot can be ethical but I have only witnessed the perfect conditions once in 36 years.


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## crappiedude (Mar 12, 2006)

Harry1959 said:


> To me s 25 ya head shot would be more ethical than the aiming for the lungs at 150 yards


As I've been reading this thread I've been thinking this exact same thing. I would think the margin of error would be similar and on even much closer range than 150 yards.


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## dirtandleaves (Sep 28, 2009)

Playing with fire on head shots. Dumb shot. No thanks


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## P-NUT (May 17, 2009)

I have to wonder how many of you that have seen deer suffering from botched head shots were actually attempted head shots? How many of those deer were hit in the jaw by someone shooting at a jumped running deer or a deflected bullet from taking a long shot through the woods?


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

i for one don't believe in taking a running shot at deer. just to many things that can go wrong. however i did shoot one at about 10 or 15 yrds that was trotting past my stand. it went about 40 yrds and died quickly.




P-NUT said:


> I have to wonder how many of you that have seen deer suffering from botched head shots were actually attempted head shots? How many of those deer were hit in the jaw by someone shooting at a jumped running deer or a deflected bullet from taking a long shot through the woods?


and as ive said i don't do head shots any more. but i will not call names to those that take them. because i tried it myself and the results were very bad. i think we have all made some stupid decision in our life so we have no right to judge others that disagree with us. i would never suggest to anyone to take a head shot. but if a deer was less than about 20 yrds and it was the only shot i had i might rethink myself.
sherman


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## lawrence1 (Jul 2, 2008)

^^^good question^^^P-NUT

I once saw a good buck shot through the loins and its penis was hanging by a thread of hide. Some dogs had it down eating it alive. Good shot somebody.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

If we are fortunate enough to hunt long enough, kill enough deer, sooner or later there WILL be that shot we wished we had back. Might be that twig or sapling we didn't see, might be the deer moves at the very second we pull the trigger or let an arrow fly, might be we flinched...or even an occasional flyer that happens.
We can debate and argue this 'head shot' topic till the cows come home. But we really need to narrow it down and call it what it should be called...BRAIN SHOTS. Those are 100percent lethal, bang flop shots every time...no question.
Head shots are NOT 100percent lethal and often result in what some of us have witnessed here...long duration of pain,suffering, starving to death with often lost deer due to the fact that many times there is little blood trail. We get to come out of the field without our deer knowing we are the ultimate cause of an animal suffering that night(and often, many nights to follow) when we crawl into our warm beds. If we're able to sleep well that night (or nights to follow) and that doesn't bother us, IMO, it's time to do some looking in the mirror, question what hunting and the life of another living creature means to us.

One thing that there's just no argument for is the fact that a 'brain shot' offers very,very little chance of either human or weapon error and the fact that the heart/lung shot is a much more forgiving shot. Doesn't matter who says what...that can't be disputed!

Bottom line, IMO is, I will always give the animal(especially mid to large animals) the respect and benefit of the quickest, most humane death it deserves and by doing so, taking the highest percentage shot I can. I'm very thankful for a dad as well as a few other mentors in my life that taught me that respect at a very young age. I hope I have taught my kids and those I have hunted with the same.

Guess we all have our opinions on this subject.
And we all have to live with our decisions good or bad.
We have to let our conscious be our guide.



.


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## hailtothethief (Jan 18, 2017)

If you hit the urine sack you ruin half the deer meat. You dont want to shoot the deer in the arse. If the deer is facing you the bullet can go through the chest and travel through the urine sack as well.


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## Harry1959 (Mar 17, 2011)

sherman51 said:


> but i will not call names to those that take them. because i tried it myself and the results were very bad. i think we have all made some stupid decision in our life so we have no right to judge others that disagree with us. i would never suggest to anyone to take a head shot.


 Well said Sherman!


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## bobk (Apr 30, 2004)

When someone says "they don't really care for the deer or think they can suffer" Slob comes to mind. Some of you apparently didn't notice my comment of a slob hunter was directed at those specific comments period. I never said all you guys that do head shots are slob hunters. I guess I should have quoted the post above mine instead of using ^^.


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

bobk said:


> When someone says "they don't really care for the deer or think they can suffer" Slob comes to mind. Some of you apparently didn't notice my comment of a slob hunter was directed at those specific comments period. I never said all you guys that do head shots are slob hunters. I guess I should have quoted the post above mine instead of using ^^.


if your referring to my post it wasn't aimed at you and what you said. i understand there are slob hunters out there and they will always be slob hunters. some of them will take any shot they get at a deer. running away and they'll take a butt shot. 150 yrds away through heave brush and they'll take a shot. 50 yrds or more and they'll take a head shot. and so on, these are all slob hunters to me. and i hate deer drives where hunters will take any shots they get, and shoot as many deer as they see. 

just for the record i always enjoy your posts and have a lot of respect for what you say. and anyone who doesn't have respect for the game they hunt shouldn't be hunting. sorry if i stepped on any ones toes.
sherman


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## ezbite (May 25, 2006)

^^ someday you'll learn sally.lol.


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## bobk (Apr 30, 2004)

Sherman, I just noticed a couple posts regarding name calling and wanted to explain why I used the slob word. 

Thanks for the kind words.


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## bobk (Apr 30, 2004)

ezbite said:


> ^^ someday you'll learn sally.lol.


I doubt it sonic susan


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## P-NUT (May 17, 2009)

Bob, I just want to say that I respect your opinion. We may not always agree 100% but that does not mean there is disrespect. No hard feelings.


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## Sean Ebra (Dec 6, 2017)

aquaholic2 said:


> Hang on....special circumstances prompt me to ask if anyone has ever attempted this on deer with a long gun...? I took a decent buck the old-fashioned/hard way in October, but didn't have time to harvest a doe thru the gun season. Venison helps a great deal when managing a retirement budget, and I would like to add a doe to this next years resources.
> We have harvested "meat" deer from the back porch of our SE Ohio cabin several times. For us old guys this is a welcome method of take. But recovery from a legal ML kill in these temps and snow cover is still difficult. My CVA wolf puts every 245 power bullet in the end of a soda can,at my expected range inside 50yds. My thought is to try a head shot that should drop a doe in her tracks and simplify the harvest. Just wondering if anyone has had acceptable results from this or is the brain too small to expect a quick humane kill....?


There's nothing wrong with head shots as long as you are confident about the shot.Saves meat! I've done it several times .It drops them fast and ethically.


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## Eastside Al (Apr 25, 2010)

Nope for me on deer


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## Seaturd (Apr 14, 2004)

No head shots, no running deer shots and I won't shoot a doe with obviously very young offspring with her. I've seen the results of both misplaced and accurate brain shots and most are pretty gruesome. Also seen the results of the "sling lead and hope" fools shooting at running deer that don't even bother to look for any sign of a hit unless the deer falls over. Also not pretty.


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## Pooch (Jun 16, 2014)

Watch all the way to the end. It's a little long, but watch to the end. Not condoning head shots but with all this talk reminded me of this video. Sorry if anyone finds this not staying on topic or inappropriate.


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## Lundy (Apr 5, 2004)

The original poster of this question bowed out many days ago but this thread continues on. 

So many of those that profess to be proficient and accepting of head shots wear it like some badge of prowess. In my opinion and personal experience it is primarily ego driven, much like those that make videos of extreme long range shots or head shots at long yardages. Why even make those videos ( statements of greatness). Do they really believe that the masses will line up to admire their overwhelming presence? Certainly there will be some that will admire and aspire to raise to such a level of self proclaimed awesomeness. I personally am not only not impressed with such displays of attempted skill on a live animal for the purpose of enlarging ones own head as they seek attention on themselves, but I view them as unethical, dare I say, slob hunters.

Case in point. Do you ever hear I guy tell you he killed a nice buck during gun season and go on to describe that he shot it between the 2,d and 3rd rib? But the guy that killed a dear with a head shot will never, ever, fail to immediately bring up that he killed it with a head shot. Egomaniacs!

Become a hunter and not a shooter and you will never find it necessary to take questionable shots, hunt ethically and you will never choose to.

Just my opinion


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

Lundy said:


> The original poster of this question bowed out many days ago but this thread continues on.
> 
> So many of those that profess to be proficient and accepting of head shots wear it like some badge of prowess. In my opinion and personal experience it is primarily ego driven, much like those that make videos of extreme long range shots or head shots at long yardages. Why even make those videos ( statements of greatness). Do they really believe that the masses will line up to admire their overwhelming presence? Certainly there will be some that will admire and aspire to raise to such a level of self proclaimed awesomeness. I personally am not only not impressed with such displays of attempted skill on a live animal for the purpose of enlarging ones own head as they seek attention on themselves, but I view them as unethical, dare I say, slob hunters.
> 
> ...


very well put!
sherman


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## 9Left (Jun 23, 2012)

Lundy said:


> The original poster of this question bowed out many days ago but this thread continues on.
> 
> So many of those that profess to be proficient and accepting of head shots wear it like some badge of prowess. In my opinion and personal experience it is primarily ego driven, much like those that make videos of extreme long range shots or head shots at long yardages. Why even make those videos ( statements of greatness). Do they really believe that the masses will line up to admire their overwhelming presence? Certainly there will be some that will admire and aspire to raise to such a level of self proclaimed awesomeness. I personally am not only not impressed with such displays of attempted skill on a live animal for the purpose of enlarging ones own head as they seek attention on themselves, but I view them as unethical, dare I say, slob hunters.
> 
> ...



funny..... not one post here EVER bragged about taking head shots... that is your misinterpretation and your ASSumption of what was said. As far as I have read, everyone that has admitted to taking a headshot, either said they would never do it again, or agreed that it is not always the best shot to make.

Heck...your post was so long-winded, you probably go back and read it to yourself every day just to hear yourself talk.


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## Lundy (Apr 5, 2004)

9left,

The world is larger than OGF and thank you for your kind words.


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## garhtr (Jan 12, 2009)

I'll take a body shot every time --- If that shot is available no question about it but at close range I'm still confident enough to shoot one In the head and yes I do practice every season at 10 - 15 yrds,
I know what my gun will do at those ranges. I'm much more confident in a 10 yd head shot than 80 yd body shot . To each his own
Good luck and Good luck


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## 9Left (Jun 23, 2012)




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## Lundy (Apr 5, 2004)

garhtr said:


> I'm much more confident in a 10 yd head shot than 80 yd body shot . To each his own
> Good luck and Good luck


I agree, everyone gets to make their own choices.

I do find it a little counter intuitive that anyone is more confident at hitting a 1-1/2" circle at 10 yds than they are a 10" circle at 80 yds per your example. The required skill set for one is very high for the other extremely low. I'm trying to understand.

Thanks


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## garhtr (Jan 12, 2009)

Lundy said:


> I agree, everyone gets to make their own choices.
> 
> I do find it a little counter intuitive that anyone is more confident at hitting a 1-1/2" circle at 10 yds than they are a 10" circle at 80 yds per your example. The required skill set for one is very high for the other extremely low. I'm trying to understand.
> Thanks


 The areas I hunt are extremely thick and I don't think I've ever attempted a shot over 40 yards and I doubt I ever will, I wouldn't be comfortable shooting at 80 but that's me and my gun isn't really set-up for it but I am comfortable shooting one at close range in the head under the right conditions but that's me. Anyone who is uncomfortable doing it probably shouldn't attempt it --- I'm uncomfortable shooting at long distances--- I probably shouldn't be attempting it and I won't..
Good luck and good Hunting ?


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## Lundy (Apr 5, 2004)

Thanks for the explanation.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Lundy said:


> I agree, everyone gets to make their own choices.
> 
> 
> Thanks


"I agree, everyone gets to make their own choices"....and sooner or later, live with the consequences.

There, fixed that for ya Lundy.


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## Saugeye Tom (Oct 6, 2010)

Sean Ebra said:


> There's nothing wrong with head shots as long as you are confident about the shot.Saves meat! I've done it several times .It drops them fast and ethically.


Stirring the pot with 1 post...???? Welcome to ogf sean ebra


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