# fish arches.



## peple of the perch (Sep 13, 2004)

I just got a Lowrance lms 339c. I took it out for the first time yesterday, and got marks that looked more like blobs than the arches that you would see on the simulator. Are they supposed to look like that or are my settings screwed up. I am also getting a lot of interference on the bottom half of my screen. I had it on both halfs of my screen then I turned up the surface clarity.


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## ParmaBass (Apr 11, 2004)

I very seldom see arches like the ones on the Simulator. Seems like most of my "good marks" look more worm like in shape. I have seen a few true arches before, but nothing like the fish Utopia that the simulator shows. I think BigDaddy300 has some screen shots of his finder on here somewhere, I'll see if I can find them, his fish marks look like mine.


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## Champion188 Elite (Jan 16, 2007)

If you are sitting still or barely drifting the arches will appear as small blobs or worm types.I beleive you need to be moving 1-2mph for arches to appear as true fish arches.

As for the screen clutter,different water conditions dictate how much sensativity needed.On todays high-end fishfinders the smallest dirt or algae particles in the water can add a large amount of clutter to your screen.Muddy or highly stained water will also add serious clutter to the screen.Usually you can clear it up by bumping the sensativity down a little at a time,when the clutter starts to clear up STOP!

Best settings I have found on both my Lowrance units are:
Ping Speed 50% (saves the life of transducer)
Surface Clarity =Low
Sensativity 75%-90%

Also use your upper/lower limits to fish the water column you are fishing, if you are fishing at 10 to 20ft set the upper/lower limits to say 8ft-22ft this will give you a much better picture than using the auto depth range which will be at 0-30ft.


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## Skunkedagain (Apr 10, 2004)

Both these replies are correct. One other thing the affects the ability to show arches is tranducer not being level. Alot of people like to drop the back end of the transducer down too far. This will cause the unit to only show you the front half of the arch.


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## bkr43050 (Apr 5, 2004)

Skunkedagain said:


> Both these replies are correct. One other thing the affects the ability to show arches is tranducer not being level. Alot of people like to drop the back end of the transducer down too far. This will cause the unit to only show you the front half of the arch.


I was going to mention the same exact thing. In fact years ago I had just a low end Hummingbird FF on my boat and it worked "okay" but I never really had a way of knowing if I had the transducer level. With the arches you can get a batter feel for the level adjustment on the transducer. As was mentioned having the transducer tilted too far down or up will cause the marks to have more tail on either the leading or trailing edge of the mark. Without getting it just right I think you will still get decent marks but not the optimal performance.

Another thing that was not mentioned is to try the zoom feature to view the marks as this will give you a better view and will show the arches bigger. Depending on how deep you are fishing the marks could show hardly any arch to them until you zoom in.


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## BigDaddy300 (Nov 1, 2004)

Here they are:


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## JIG (Nov 2, 2004)

Something else to keep in mind is that the bottom echo is the key to setting the sensativity. Notice in the top pic showing the bottom its solid. You dont want it broken up but a color change is ok. Itll vary from clarity and depth. Your manual should help ya.


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## ezbite (May 25, 2006)

i have the 339c and i find it best to run, ping-100%, chart speed-100%, sensitivity about 87 to 92. those are what I like to run with.


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## MadMac (May 2, 2005)

Try setting it like EZ suggested and turn the color level down to about 50%. I run my Eagle 642 at 83% sensitivity but it depends on how deep and clear the water is.


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## fishkiller (Feb 6, 2007)

Another thing that I feel affects arch shape is boat movement. If you have a smaller boat with a narrow beam on a choppy lake it will show on the arch shape.


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## MadMac (May 2, 2005)

I didn't realize those pics weren't Peple's. I hope this will help. The reason a fish shows as an arch is due to the fact when it enters the cone of coverage, the outer edge of the cone is farther away from the transducer than the center of the cone. Now if a fish is suspended and stationary and you troll over it and it doesn't move it will appear deeper as it enters the cone and rise up as it approaches the center of the cone. When it is in the center it is showing on the screen as the very top of the arch because the line from the fish to the transducer when directly overhead is the shortest. This is the true depth the fish is at. Now as you continue trolling and start passing the fish by, the distance increases and you get the tailing edge of the arch as the fish moves away from the center of the cone toward the edge. Picture a rope tied to a branch with a ball on the end that just touches the ground when it hangs straight down. Now move the ball in one direction. It would not touch the ground as you moved it away because the distance is greater. Same as a fish that is on the outer edge of the sonar cone. The length of the arch is determined by the length of time the fish is in the cone, not its size. The size is indicated by the thickness of the arch and the brighter the color would indicate a harder or more solid target that could also mean size. A quick way to set your graph is to put it in manual depth and set the depth range for more that twice the water depth you are in. Turn the sensitivity up until you see two bottoms. One will be at the true depth and you will get a second one at twice the depth. Now put it back into auto depth control. To set the color level find somewhere that you know has a boulder and turn the color level up until it shows the rock as yellow. Now you can tell the difference between rocks and stumps. The stumps are probably going to be softer so they will appear red with maybe some yellow in the center. Weeds will probably be blue unless they get so thick they block the signal. lol Also remember, that arch showed nice and pretty because you drove right over it and it didn't move. If you don't move and the fish doesn't move it will appear as a line going across the screen and will only go up or down if the fish does or the boat does by waves or something. Some fish will only enter the edge of the cone as you or they go by. That arch would be flatter because the distance didn't change as much as a fish that came right under the boat. You will see some odd marks and have to use your knowledge and imagination to determine what you are seeing. I have a military radar background so it's easier to make sense out of. I highly recommend searching the net for tutorials so you can get the info you paid for when you bought the sonar. Not just the depth and a guess as to what you are seeing.


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## peple of the perch (Sep 13, 2004)

THANKS MAD MAC I'm planing on going out tonight. let you know how I do.


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## MadMac (May 2, 2005)

peple of the perch said:


> THANKS MAD MAC I'm planing on going out tonight. let you know how I do.


Good luck. I think I'm going to head to Berlin with Jig tonight.


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## Lightman (Jul 22, 2008)

This was Saturday..


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## ParmaBass (Apr 11, 2004)

Those aren't fish!! They are giant Reef Runners!


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## freyedknot (Apr 10, 2004)

chartruse ones at that too,or perhaps eriedescent?


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## BigDaddy300 (Nov 1, 2004)

Cheap sunglasses or pink lemonade perhaps!


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## peple of the perch (Sep 13, 2004)

I think i found the prob. I have a dual freequency transducer. At 200k it is all blury and I cant read i but at 50k it works perfectly.


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## Lightman (Jul 22, 2008)

Perhaps you have a dual frequency capable unit but not a dual transducer? 

Actually those marks could have been the barbie or pink panties, it was a dirty day out there.


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## Skunkedagain (Apr 10, 2004)

Doctor used to have some really good sonar tutorials on his website but I can't remember what it is. Maybe someone knows. The "clutter" that you are seeing with the 200khz ducer is normal. If it bothers you, turn the sensitivity down until it goes away and then turn it back up until you start to see it again. If you run the unit in auto and are in some turbid water, you will alwats see clutter. It WILL NOT keep you from marking fish!


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## boss302 (Jun 24, 2005)

Ok, SO, what should the fish look like on a slow drift, or anchored up? Do fish show up different than the bottom, or background clutter?


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## K gonefishin (May 4, 2004)

boss302 said:


> Ok, SO, what should the fish look like on a slow drift, or anchored up? Do fish show up different than the bottom, or background clutter?


The slower you go the longer the fish hooks will appear, at trolling speed they will appear as arches or hooks, sitting still achored they will almost be straight lines (check out some screen shot of guys ice fishing with lowrance units), trolling fast they will be shorter thicker hooks, running on plane they will look like verticle lines. Fish will also show up different than bottom or clutter, bottom is bottom that will never change, clutter is something you have to deal with no matter what and will also appear different. One thing to learn with reading electronics is remembering what things look like when your catching and when your not based on your settings, and once your settings are set try not to mess with them to much, I mess with mine once a year and that's when I got to lake ontario and I have no choice but when I fish Erie and Erie only I don't mess with it so I always know what walleye marks look like no matter what and I can recogize other things as well, like smelt in deep water or bait clouds etc.


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## little d (Dec 10, 2008)

hey guys i have a new x27c and my bottom looks very jaggy and has no flat line at all. im trying to figure it out but ant suggestions on that? thanks


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## bkr43050 (Apr 5, 2004)

little d said:


> hey guys i have a new x27c and my bottom looks very jaggy and has no flat line at all. im trying to figure it out but ant suggestions on that? thanks


First of all is the water rough that you are on? If so that can cause an uneven bottom. If your boat is going up and down a foot then the measurement would do the same. Now if it is not very rough then another possibility could be that you do not have the transducer pointing straight down. If it were point back to far or ever too far to the front it will exaggerate the effect of any rocking that the boat does. You would not even have to rise in the water column to make change the reading, just a front to back rocking of the boat would be enough.


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## little d (Dec 10, 2008)

i am going to the boat tonight and check a few things out. chart speed,colorline,and top and bottom depths. i will try to get to the transducer though i cant reach it around the swim platform and touch it though. my bottom line is nothing like my buddys boat. i will check these things and get back to you guys. thanks for the help, im new of coarse


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## little d (Dec 10, 2008)

went out last night but got ruff out quickly. i dont have a bottom line from what im seeing but cant get to my tranducer. i might have to pull the boat out.


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## little d (Dec 10, 2008)

went out saturday and i now have a bottom line and things are good! thanks for the help guys. now i have to figure out why it keeps moving. dan


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## KaGee (Sep 8, 2006)

Don't know what I did to get my X-96 all fubared, but re-setting it back to factory default setting set everything straight.


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## baiter10 (Jun 10, 2008)

Hey guys I just picked up the new lowrance HDS-5 and man is it pretty slick compared to my x-76(obviously). I have definately noticed that the new unit pics up more fish....but what are the advantages to fish arches compared to the fish id set up? Thanks



Eric


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## K gonefishin (May 4, 2004)

baiter10 said:


> Hey guys I just picked up the new lowrance HDS-5 and man is it pretty slick compared to my x-76(obviously). I have definately noticed that the new unit pics up more fish....but what are the advantages to fish arches compared to the fish id set up? Thanks
> 
> 
> 
> Eric


You want to run the unit in actual Sonar mode, after using it set up this way you will soon realize and see what fish are doing and what fish actually look like through the eyes of your sonar unit, the processor in the machine will portray anything under the boat as a fish, versus the sonar showing size of the fish, how fish are laying below your boat a couple examples would be. 

Walleye show up as long thin arches on sonar, steelhead show up as longer thinner arches, smallmouth and sheaphead will show up shorter but thicker, when fish are laying close or near the bottom you can actually tell if they are in the mud or just off the bottom, on a color unit you will be able to see the color and thickness of the bottom change when fish are in the mud. When fish are coming up to feed you will see the arches pointing up on your screen, when multiple arches are shooting up this is a good sign your on feeding fish and might tell you to raise a few of your baits in the water column that your on active fish, you get a better actual idea of where the fish are actually sitting in the water column instead of a little fishy ID. It might take you a few trips and a few successful trips to figure some of this stuff out but I would bet my boat on it once you figure it out you'll never go back to fish ID again. I can't think of one think Fish ID will do for you better over reading sonar. On successfull trips make mental note of what your screens look like when your catching fish and when you go out next time try to find similar screens this makes it easier to find fish next time, one of the biggest benefits is being able to mark fish on plane while running, fish will show up as straight lines on a color sonar when your moving faster, the slower you go the longer and often the thicker will marks will be, trolling slow you will get your long thin arches, moving faster they will get shorter and thinner, this explains why they are straight lines when running. Marking bait fish is also nice and easy they will show up as clowds of yellow, bait balls most guys call them, often times you mark fish right below the clouds of bait, another indication of feeding fish attacking the bait clouds, put your baits right where you see the active fish, but always above them, predator fish like walleye, steelhead musky are always looking up, smallies and largemouth will and can look toward the bottom when feeding so that's a little different. 

Hope this helps.


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