# Demo Paddle Results... Delight, Confusion, and Questions



## ML1187 (Mar 13, 2012)

Thanks again to all the OGF members who have offered advice on purchasing my first Yak. I figured I'd start a new thread with updated questions since my demo last night.

Here are two fishing boats I tried:


The first is a Wilderness Systems Slayer in 14.5. Even though this boat is big it moved really well I thought. I absolutely LOVED the seat... way up off the deck and comfortable enough to fish all day from. It was very heavy but it does have a small wheel on the back to help with transport. I imagine because of it's large profile it could be a problem in the wind.

The second boat I tried was the Wilderness systems Ride 115. It's 11.5 ft long. Very stable although it didn't have a raised seat. There is actually a raised seat platform that you can purchase but I didn't try it out. This boat didn't seem to handle as well as the Slayer. It just felt heavy and clunky. I didn't much care for the layout. It also had holes in the bottom of the boat that filled up w/ water pretty easily. The weight capacity is supposed to be around 400-450 for this model but it seemed to sit very low to the water. I liked it just not as much as the slayer....

I also tried a sit in model that is an all purpose rig and could be used for fishing. HATED it. Felt like I was going to take a swim anytime.... so one thing I learned was def a SOT.

DELIGHT:

This was my first time in a YAK. I loved it. 10x better than a canoe. I know a few folks mentioned canoes as a good option b/c of size and storage and weight capacity. After being in a YAK vs a Canoe... no comparison. Being in a YAK is FUN!!!!

CONFUSION:

One of the responses I had over and over in the other thread was that for river fishing I need a boat 12ft or shorter. I had in my mind that 14.5 would be just way too big, but man that Slayer was NICE! I paddled right up on shore in less than a foot of water and the thing did not drag. 

Once I finished up the owner of WhiteWater Warehouse met me on the bank. Super nice guy. I told him I liked the Slayer but the 14.5ft would seem to me to be just too big for the river. He talked to me about how a bigger boat would be better for someone like me, even on the river. Why I asked? He said you need as big as you can get to even out the weight distribution and make going over shallow areas easier. The more weight in the boat the more likely to drag obviously so spreading it out would be beneficial. He went on to explain w/ the proper technique handling a boat that size on the river could be done. THAT MAKES SENSE TO ME. What's the advantage for someone like me having a boat under 12'?

Final thoughts:

I really really REALLY liked the high and dry seat on the Slayer. I know the Coosa has the same setup. I think with someone my size a seat like that is going to have to be a must.

I need to spend some time and money on training. What's the best equipment in the world worth if you don't know how to use it properly?

I need to loose some weight (we all knew that though right! 

I really like Kayaks. I may even want to fish more on the lake with one than I previously thought.....

Regards!

ML1187


----------



## MIKE*A (Apr 12, 2009)

I don't think a14' would be a problem on rivers around here......I went with a 12' just for ease of portability.......a14' would be a better all around boat, especially in bigger water.....most of these livery canoes floating on these same rivers are 16-18' long.....my $.02.......also go up to GMO and try the native watercrafts and Jackson's! 

Mike


----------



## backlashed (Mar 19, 2011)

ML1187 said:


> ..... It also had holes in the bottom of the boat that filled up w/ water pretty easily.


Those are called scuppers, they allow water to drain out. Scupper plugs help keep the water out, I have a set and I never use them. Scupper Plugs are supposed to improve the lift of a SOT.

'Rivers', well, I'm a lake guy, and my guess is that shorter kayaks are handy on *narrow *creeks and streams with swift water. I regularly take my 14' 4" 'Cuda up Caesar Creek (the Creek), Anderson Branch and the many small coves in CC and never have any issues. True river yaks have a different hull (more rocker) and little to no keel, as Bubba keeps pointing out. I'm glad he has, it took me a while to really understand what he was talking about.

Straighten me out if I'm wrong here boys.


----------



## Lostleader (Apr 19, 2013)

You know Native makes a 12 foot slayer that Whitewater warehouse has or at least did. I tested the slayer and the ride and ended up with the ride 115 with the high seat. I felt more comfortable and had zero issues with water coming up the scuppers. I am pushing 260 and even in the slayer I had very little water in the boat without the plugs. Both great boats cant go wrong with either.


----------



## yakfish (Mar 13, 2005)

Lostleader said:


> You know Native makes a 12 foot slayer that Whitewater warehouse has or at least did. I tested the slayer and the ride and ended up with the ride 115 with the high seat. I felt more comfortable and had zero issues with water coming up the scuppers. I am pushing 260 and even in the slayer I had very little water in the boat without the plugs. Both great boats cant go wrong with either.


I looked at the 12 foot slayer about a month ago there. It looks like an awesome boat. I'd love to get one, one of these days.


----------



## Love2kayak (Apr 30, 2011)

Also checked out slayer and ride through the whitewater warehouse and went with the ride. Love it. Internal storage made the decision for me. 


Posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire


----------



## SeanStone (Sep 8, 2010)

Glad you leanred a few things and got to demo some yaks from whitewater warehouse. The whole weight issue vs surface area definitely makes sense. I have a 13' 10" yak and I take it in skinny water all the time. The problem lies In maneuverability in fast water. A shorter yak will respond much quicker to paddle strokes and keep you going the way you want to go. I have been sideways going down rapids one too many times. Hit one rock sideways and your swimming with the fishes...and your gear. Lol.

Good luck on your purchase. Keep doing demos and research and you will be fine.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Ohub Campfire mobile app


----------



## shwookie (Jun 15, 2007)

Love2kayak said:


> Also checked out slayer and ride through the whitewater warehouse and went with the ride. Love it. Internal storage made the decision for me.
> 
> 
> Posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire


Exactly why I ended up with coosa when comparing slayer vs. coosa.


----------



## Bubbagon (Mar 8, 2010)

SeanStone said:


> The problem lies In maneuverability in fast water. A shorter yak will respond much quicker to paddle strokes and keep you going the way you want to go. I have been sideways going down rapids one too many times. Hit one rock sideways and your swimming with the fishes...and your gear. Lol.
> 
> Good luck on your purchase. Keep doing demos and research and you will be fine.
> 
> Sent from my SCH-I545 using Ohub Campfire mobile app


X10
Which is why you need to paddle lots of stuff before you buy. Especially big guys that have to consider that trade off: Length vs. volume and displacement.
And for the record, when I talk about rivers in Ohio, I'm talking about floating 5+ miles from point A to point B. Any boat will do just fine in big pools, slow water kind of stuff. But it's a day's worth of riffles and shelves that will alter one's opinion on the value of maneuverability. 

So I had the same dilemma as you, because I wanted to take my lab with me on small Ohio streams. That made my person + dog weight 260ish, but I still wanted to be maneuverable. 
The boat that won in almost every category ended up being a 14 foot solo downriver canoe. 
Weight capacity wasn't an issue. It floats very high in the water versus a 14 foot kayak. I easily float over stuff that hangs some kayaks.
It has almost no keel so it never catches a rock or ledge funny to tip you. In fact, even with a very energetic 90# puppy in it I've never even come close to tipping.
And it can out maneuver almost any kayak, and certainly any kayak 12 foot or longer....by a LONG shot.
And it's infinitely configurable for fishing. Like owning a Jeep when it comes to accessories and options.
It's also considerably lighter weight that a 14 foot sit on top kayak, and WAY easier to handle and carry alone.

Just like kayaks, there are 1,00,000 different kinds of canoes that all paddle completely differently. I wouldn't rule out a 14 foot solo DOWNRIVER style canoe until you've paddled one.


----------



## ML1187 (Mar 13, 2012)

Well I'm still working/deciding/ researching. Thanks again for all the replies!

Went last night and checked out the Field and Stream Talon at Dicks. I remember I asked before could a $450 boat work? Is a Coosa or Slayer for $1000 just that much better?

I found out my answer last night... THERE IS NO WAY that Talon would work for me. It took all of 30 seconds sitting in it to decide. The seat = TERRIBLE (Im sure it would be fine if you were "regular" size lol).

So I've come to a conclusion... A raised seat is a MUST for me.

I'm thinking I have it narrowed down to three models- Coosa, Slayer, and Ride.

From what I'm gathering probably can't go wrong with any of these!


----------



## Bubbagon (Mar 8, 2010)

Coosa is a must test drive first boat. Just because it's much different than the others.
If you can swing it, and the weight capacity is enough, it's always my first choice for river fishing.


----------



## streamstalker (Jul 8, 2005)

ML1187 said:


> I also tried a sit in model that is an all purpose rig and could be used for fishing. HATED it. *Felt like I was going to take a swim anytime*.... so one thing I learned was def a SOT.


Then there is the Kilroy...more comfortable than just about anything on the market, as stable as any SOT, and a complete fishing machine! It doesn't twirl like the Coosa, but at least you won't fall out of it when one of those unfortunate incidents happen...and they will. 

And it is way easier to put on top of a vehicle than a SOT if that is how you are carrying it and you don't always have help. That is an issue which should not be underestimated.


----------



## Yakphisher (Jul 9, 2013)

streamstalker said:


> Then there is the Kilroy...more comfortable than just about anything on the market, as stable as any SOT, and a complete fishing machine! It doesn't twirl like the Coosa, but at least you won't fall out of it when one of those unfortunate incidents happen...and they will.
> 
> And it is way easier to put on top of a vehicle than a SOT if that is how you are carrying it and you don't always have help. That is an issue which should not be underestimated.


Did you test ride the Kilroy? I been thinking of checking one out for another yak for next year.


----------



## Bubbagon (Mar 8, 2010)

He owns one. I keep forgetting about that boat. It's BADASS.
Quite honestly, it's kind of perfect for a big dude the more I think about it.


----------



## SeanStone (Sep 8, 2010)

Bubbagon said:


> Coosa is a must test drive first boat. Just because it's much different than the others.
> If you can swing it, and the weight capacity is enough, it's always my first choice for river fishing.
> Coosa in Canadian Rapids - YouTube


Imo the Jackson coosa's weight capacity is under rated. Ive seen big guys....250lbs or more stand up and fish easily out of them. Larry... usmcgalloway.....is a fairly large guy with an equally large dog. He took it out on his coosa for a couple laps at kiser lake. I imagine he was flirting with the max weight capacity...and seemed to do fine. Maybe he'll chime in here. 

My point is dont let the weight capacity stop you from looking at that kayak. 



Sent from my SCH-I545 using Ohub Campfire mobile app


----------



## streamstalker (Jul 8, 2005)

SeanStone said:


> Larry... usmcgalloway.....is a fairly large guy with an equally large dog. He took it out on his coosa for a couple laps at kiser lake. I imagine he was flirting with the max weight capacity...and seemed to do fine. Maybe he'll chime in here.


LOL...I think it's time to rerun this video. Larry is the stumpy guy doing ballet on the Coosa. I'm the one chilling with the Kilroy on the bank. I didn't even know Stuck was recording this silliness.


----------



## StuckAtHome (Apr 29, 2004)

The idiot filming is me, and the potty mouth.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Ohub Campfire mobile app


----------



## SMBHooker (Jan 3, 2008)

I kayak with a buddy frequently, he has the slayer 12' (I'm a Coosa guy, duh!) but, the slayer is an awesome boat, great storage room and well thought out plus has the high & dry seat. GREAT option to consider IMO. 

Your excitement and enthusiasm is great you'll never regret yakfishing it don't get much better. 


Posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire


----------



## Love2kayak (Apr 30, 2011)

streamstalker said:


> LOL...I think it's time to rerun this video. Larry is the stumpy guy doing ballet on the Coosa. I'm the one chilling with the Kilroy on the bank. I didn't even know Stuck was recording this silliness.
> 
> Drew Gregory trick with coosa - YouTube


That's a sweet video. I guess ive never seen the Kilroy yet, that thing looks awesome. 


Posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire


----------



## Bubbagon (Mar 8, 2010)

streamstalker said:


> LOL...I think it's time to rerun this video. Larry is the stumpy guy doing ballet on the Coosa. I'm the one chilling with the Kilroy on the bank. I didn't even know Stuck was recording this silliness.
> 
> Drew Gregory trick with coosa - YouTube


LOL!! Friggin knuckleheads!
And I gotta figure at least half of that squad was stone cold sober...
Impressive.


----------



## backlashed (Mar 19, 2011)

Looks like a Great White Bare right there! 

Well they do better than me, I cant even manage to stand on my 'Cuda in slack water. 


Posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire


----------



## Yakphisher (Jul 9, 2013)

LMAO!! I couldn't do that on terra firma!


----------



## Bubbagon (Mar 8, 2010)

LOL! Neal really sprung into action when the Coosa was heading downstream. 
Thank God there was a Marine along...


----------



## ML1187 (Mar 13, 2012)

Great video guys thanks for sharing. I would be willing to check out that Kilroy but I really really liked that Slayer and the seat!

I'm going to try and rent both the slayer and Coosa here over the next month. 

Think I could convince any of you to let me tag along one weekend and learn something? 

We could even arrange a trading if trips of sorts if necessary... As you can see from my avatar I like to deer hunt more than I like to fish! I've got some pretty good stands with a legitimate shot at a 170 right around these parts. Deer hunting trade for kayak lessons anyone? 


Posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire


----------



## Bubbagon (Mar 8, 2010)

Dude, you can come along with us anytime. That pack of anglers will mostly have along a Coosa, a Kilroy, and a couple of downriver canoes.

And I'm also in the deer hunting camp. In fact, we scored nuisance permits this year. 1,200 acres in Delaware county. We have 8 permits left to fill by end of August.


----------



## StuckAtHome (Apr 29, 2004)

Join us anytime, but I'd steer clear of bubba, he's an idiot, lol

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Ohub Campfire mobile app


----------



## Bubbagon (Mar 8, 2010)

Maybe, but there's no video of it.  


Posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire


----------



## StuckAtHome (Apr 29, 2004)

Yet, we've been known to do stupid stuff, thank God nobody records rodeo's

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Ohub Campfire mobile app


----------



## streamstalker (Jul 8, 2005)

Bubbagon said:


> LOL! Neal really sprung into action when the Coosa was heading downstream.


I don't really spring much anymore...If people want to do 360s on their kayaks, then, well? I did jump off the damn log though! You aren't in the DDC yet.


----------



## USMC_Galloway (May 13, 2011)

As said before the Coosa's weight limit is really under rated. This is My 100 + lbs dog and myself on a float just the other week. I had her in back at first, and then moved her up from to stand on the front deck when she wasn't in the water swimming. Once up front the boat was not effected by the extra weight. If I get another boat, I think its going to be a Coosa ... 

As for the video... I think 100% of that crew was sober .. eeeek.. Need to get out again for a rec float! 

(edited): found one of her sitting in the back as well.


----------



## streamstalker (Jul 8, 2005)

If there is anything sadder than a boy without a dog, it's a dog without a boy.


----------

