# Veterans and CCW's



## OhioMadMan (May 16, 2004)

Ohio recently passed a new bill that allows veterans to get their concealed carry license with their DD-214 for their class requirement and they waive the fees to get it so it's free and you don't have to take the class.
Just thought I'd pass that along. also when renewing they waive the fees if you're a veteran.


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## MuskyFan (Sep 21, 2016)

Had to renew last year but before this took effect. Maybe it will still be available next time...


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## Specwar (Sep 22, 2014)

Just renewed mine and had to pay.


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## EB1221 (May 24, 2012)

Interested to see how that works. When I was in the army ('65 to '67) I did not get pistol training. m60 and m14 in Nam. I'll ask around and see if it applies to all.
EB


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## OhioMadMan (May 16, 2004)

I never qualified with a pistol in the army neither I just gave him my DD-214 and they never asked about pistol training. 2 hours later I had my license.
This was in Sandusky county


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## All Thumbs (Apr 11, 2004)

i called in my county (clark) and they said just a dd214 with honorable discharge will get you a ccw (along with passport size photo). i told them the dd214 is 40 years old and that didn't matter either.


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## bobk (Apr 30, 2004)

There’s something really wrong with this new bill. We will read about this in the future.


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## Farmhand (Jul 11, 2011)

Pretty sure you have to have been discharged within 5 years or something. It’s been allowed for a long time. Or did they just change the required time period after discharge ?


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## Specwar (Sep 22, 2014)

bobk said:


> There’s something really wrong with this new bill. We will read about this in the future.


I have to agree with this. I have the utmost respect for all my brother and sister veterans , however not all veterans were throughly trained in the usage of weapons ( firearms ).


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## leeabu (Apr 10, 2004)

The way I read the rule change is if you have an honorable discharged within the last two years and have proof of training in the military, you do not need the training course. I looked at my records from 1974 and they show proof of 45 cal and riot gun training.


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## loweman165 (May 15, 2015)

I know it's been a while since I was in basic (94'), but I remember very little actual firearm safety training. In fact I don't think I ever looked down the muzzle of so many rifles.


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## EB1221 (May 24, 2012)

I checked with a local gun shop that conducts ccw classes and he verified that all you need is your dd214. go to the sheriff's office and apply. no time limits or proof of handgun training required. may still be up to the county sheriff. we will find out.
EB


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## Specwar (Sep 22, 2014)

Gonna be some people running around with permits that certainly are not qualified.


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## Deadeyedeek (Feb 12, 2014)

I 


Specwar said:


> Gonna be some people running around with permits that certainly are not qualified.


got mine, heres the deal..the state is putting in 1.5 million every year for Vets to get ccw, each year when the 1.5 is gone, its gone for the year, next year another 1.5 put in, agian when its gone its gone,etc..you can use to renew. My ccw expired just before new change, now its free to vets..also when you buy a gun and have it shipped to your ffl, you show them your ccw, dont have to fill out all that paperwork. Great deal for Vets


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## Drm50 (Dec 26, 2014)

My DD 214 only shows m14 & m16 badges. I do have additional military documents from USAAds
weapon school for 1911, M60, M2, M79, Bofors 40mm. But that was 50yrs ago. Is it still good for free CCW.


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## Deadeyedeek (Feb 12, 2014)

Drm50 said:


> My DD 214 only shows m14 & m16 badges. I do have additional military documents from USAAds
> weapon school for 1911, M60, M2, M79, Bofors 40mm. But that was 50yrs ago. Is it still good for free CCW.


Yes..accualy you do not need any proof of prior weapons training.Just an honorable discharge..DD214, photo id(which you can get at Wallgreens for 50cents.(has to be recent) do the background check with your Sherriffs dept..thats it.when I was down to statehouse in Feb, the 1.5mil is budgeted for the next 5 yrs..came from Dewines office.


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## Drm50 (Dec 26, 2014)

I wouldn't worry about untrained Vets. Half the people running around with CCW are mental midgets. They got a gun under their coat and they let you know it. I'm surprised there hasn't been
more problems than there has. Vets are the least of our problems and most vets had as much if not
more weapons training in basic than civilians get in some of these speed coarses.


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## Specwar (Sep 22, 2014)

It's not that I am worried, it's just another ill thought out program from our state government. If an individual is a Veteran, then they must have been trained with all firearms. Duh, wake up people.


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## EnonEye (Apr 13, 2011)

Talked with the deputy sheriff in this county that got the CCW info as an extra duty I'm sure (anyone who's ever been a government employee knows how those extra duties work), anyhow... he didn't seem too enthused but told me pretty much what ya'll speak of here, DD214 and fill out a 4-page application (find on-line) which is not easy as it asks for every address you've lived at chronologically since you were 18 years old. Anyone know how hard that is for someone who's retired military and moved every 2 years?... yikes, might be easier to take a class and pay the fee although much more expensive. I believe he said they'll take the pic there at the district office when I go in. As for being trained on guns unless when active duty you're specialty involved handguns most were trained on long rifles and I believe that is the basis for issuing based on the DD214, safety handling of any firearm, rather than specifically handling of a handgun. The deputy stressed to me I might want to take a class based on the legality of when you can and can't shoot (not his job to explain the law to me). I don't believe that theory is taught in basic classes required for civilian CCW permit holders. I've personally given this a lot of thought as far as do I want that responsibility of carrying and decided... yep, things are just getting worse and worse here in the good ol USA in regards to everyday personal safety and some of us are not at our fighting weight any longer.


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## Specwar (Sep 22, 2014)

That multiple page background information packet where you must list all your previous addresses is required whether you are a Vet or non-Vet.


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## Drm50 (Dec 26, 2014)

As far as I know every service member in basic or boot camp trains with the infantry rifle. As a last ditch measure everyone can be "premoted" to 11 Bravo. I know a young guy who is from a family that Dad and two sons promptly got CCWs soon as available in Ohio. Last year he shot a 15 yr old
kid by accident. Not a altercation just mishandling a pistol. 15yr old still undergoing surgeries. That
is a graduate of a paid for firearms training coarse. I know some cops who are nice guys but I don't trust them to make any life and death situations. They aren't firearms experts and wouldn't shoot unless they were forced to qualify. Its the mental capacity and temperament of CCW holders that worries me more than marksmanship.


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## All Thumbs (Apr 11, 2004)

has anyone heard of somebody failing the ccw course? that sounds like little league baseball, everyone gets a trophy even if they suck. at least the vets have been taught weapons safety whether it be pistol or rifle.


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## yonderfishin (Apr 9, 2006)

Specwar said:


> That multiple page background information packet where you must list all your previous addresses is required whether you are a Vet or non-Vet.




I cant find info on how far back the address history needs to go.....is it just a certain amount of time or all the way back to when you were 18 ? Sheesh!! for some of us who have moved around , coming up with every address since age 18 will be right near impossible.


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## All Thumbs (Apr 11, 2004)

https://www.ohioattorneygeneral.gov...ed-Carry-License-and-Renewal-Application.aspx

the application i see from the AG of ohio does not ask address history.


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## yonderfishin (Apr 9, 2006)

All Thumbs said:


> https://www.ohioattorneygeneral.gov...ed-Carry-License-and-Renewal-Application.aspx
> 
> the application i see from the AG of ohio does not ask address history.



Thats what I cant figure out. I have read and heard that at some point in the process you must provide an address history but I can find no details about it. Ive lived many places in Florida , Georgia , and Ohio since I was 18 and its been so long since then that I cant remember exactly where or when anymore and I doubt I will be able to track down half of them. It bothers me that I cant find anything about it online


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## Fish-N-Fool (Apr 12, 2004)

I personally would still recommend the class. The focus of the CCW class I took was NOT firearms safety. That was the most insignificant portion of the class. My instructors focused on the laws, and spent the most time on situational awareness and how to avoid and deescalate confrontation. There were 2 females and 1 male with no/limited experience. They used a laser training pistol in the classroom with them separately to get acquainted with safely handling, drawing, aiming and carrying, etc. The instructor used a Kimber .380 semi-auto and a S&W revolver and showed them the various operations. He even had a cam loader for the Kimber. At the range they split the group into 3 categories: 1) those 3 individuals 2) experienced group 3) very experienced no assistance necessary.

All 3 groups had a range master. My wife and I were in group 3. We basically did the required shooting testing in 1-2 minutes and were done. The instructors split and went with groups 1 & 2. One instructor ended up staying with group #1 an extra hour at the range until they were all comfortable. I watched them for a few minutes and they were doing a great job from top to bottom training the inexperienced group. They did not do any live fire shooting for at least 25 minutes....group 3 was all done before they started.

I realize there is no standard with training, but the folks we used did a great job. For me personally I was not in need of a safety course, or to learn about handguns. The course was perfect as I got to spend my time focusing on legal issues (even state to state travel, etc.), situational awareness, and practice confrontation avoidance.

And as a guy with a military family and several highway patrolman and police officers I would recommend they take the course. They are no different than the public. I have family that I would deem experts in firearms that served and I also have both military and former police that don't know how to handle or shoot a handgun. My uncle, retired police chief couldn't hit me at 25 feet with a handgun of his choice. He is scared of guns and only shot enough to qualify.....hasn't handled a gun since he retired. Struggled to qualify when the police testing is a joke to be honest. My cousin did 8 years in the Navy and carried a handgun on his side. Same thing for him - no idea how to handle one today and did the bare minimum when enlisted. He doesn't even own a gun. He was on a "belly ship" and spent 3+ years going back and forth moving bombs and ammunition back in the 80s when we closed the bases in Philippines the first round. Had to move all those bombs to Japan...there and back...there and back! 

My personal opinion is that everybody should have to take the course for this reason. I also believe the focus of the course should be like mine - if you need a firearm safety course you should not be enrolled in CCW course. Two different things IMO. Covering basic safety is a given, but should not be the focus at all.


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## Specwar (Sep 22, 2014)

^^ well said.


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## fryerman (May 26, 2012)

Heres my recent experience,I live in lorain county,made my appt to apply last tuesday and went today.i had downloaded a copy of the application and filled it out at home,got my 2"x2" photo at walmart.so today took the application,copy of my dd-214,photo, and drivers licence.got there at 12:55 and 10minutes later i was fingerprinted and told it could be processed anywhere from 1 to 3 days but could be up to 45 days.said they will call when ready to pick up.Thats it


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## Farmhand (Jul 11, 2011)

fryerman said:


> Heres my recent experience,I live in lorain county,made my appt to apply last tuesday and went today.i had downloaded a copy of the application and filled it out at home,got my 2"x2" photo at walmart.so today took the application,copy of my dd-214,photo, and drivers licence.got there at 12:55 and 10minutes later i was fingerprinted and told it could be processed anywhere from 1 to 3 days but could be up to 45 days.said they will call when ready to pick up.Thats it


So out of curiosity when was your discharge date?


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## Terry R Magnuson (Jan 9, 2019)

Specwar said:


> Gonna be some people running around with permits that certainly are not qualified.


I disagree with that statement. I for one served 23 yrs and had training on more weapons than one could imagine. You tell me what qualifies. No better institute to be deemed qualifying agency than the military. Also, it's not all about handling a weapon either. Its about about making conscious right decisions in a split second . That in itself is part of training in the military. Look at all the people who passed hunter safety and have hunting violations.


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## fryerman (May 26, 2012)

Right on Terry Ive hunted and handled shotguns and pistols all my life and recieved expert badge when i was in basic.Discharged 1990 . My original intent was to show "at least in lorain county" how easy it was to apply for your ccw permit if u are a vet.Oh by the way my application never asked for former address's.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Terry R Magnuson said:


> I disagree with that statement. I for one served 23 yrs and had training on more weapons than one could imagine. You tell me what qualifies. No better institute to be deemed qualifying agency than the military. Also, it's not all about handling a weapon either. Its about about making conscious right decisions in a split second . That in itself is part of training in the military. Look at all the people who passed hunter safety and have hunting violations.


I think the key word in specwar's statement is 'some'.
IMO, not 'ALL' X military personnel have had the same amount of training or have handled firearms all their lives.
FWIW...just like some Ive seen that have never been in the military that I wouldn't trust with a slingshot, I've seen a few X military people the same way. 
This is in no way being disrespectful to any military personel but I know several X military people that had no interest in guns while they were serving and still don't and did just enough 'firearm wise' in the military to continue the reason they went in the military. Some of these people only handled a firearm during that brief training in their whole life and of the ones I know personally, that varies between 30-50 yrs ago. So considering the topic of this thread, I have to ask myself would these individuals be anymore qualified today to handle a firearm today than someone that hasn't been in the military?


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## Terry R Magnuson (Jan 9, 2019)

fastwater said:


> I think the key word in specwar's statement is 'some'.
> IMO, not 'ALL' X military personnel have had the same amount of training or have handled firearms all their lives.
> FWIW...just like some Ive seen that have never been in the military that I wouldn't trust with a slingshot, I've seen a few X military people the same way.
> This is in no way being disrespectful to any military personel but I know several X military people that had no interest in guns while they were serving and still don't and did just enough 'firearm wise' in the military to continue the reason they went in the military. Some of these people only handled a firearm during that brief training in their whole life and of the ones I know personally, that varies between 30-50 yrs ago. So considering the topic of this thread, I have to ask myself would these individuals be anymore qualified today to handle a firearm today than someone that hasn't been in the military?


I agree with all of it. My point was that you're going to have people that take the course in order to get the CCW permit and I wouldn't trust to be around. It's the thought process of the individual. My take on the DD214 is the fact that being in the military you are taught ethos. This is from the army website.

Many people know what the words Loyalty, Duty, Respect, Selfless Service, Honor, Integrity, and Personal Courage mean. But how often do you see someone actually live up to them? Soldiers learn these values in detail during Basic Combat Training (BCT), from then on they live them every day in everything they do — whether they’re on the job or off. In short, the Seven Core Army Values listed below are what being a Soldier is all about.
One who is honorably discharged lives by those values. Now I know there may be a few that don't but trying to weed out those few would be difficult. Taking a CCW course won't place any more trust in their core values, weather they served or not. Allowing a DD214 just means they trust the individual to use good judgment when carrying. Lastly, all veterans aren't honorably discharged either. So given the fact that one must be "Honorable discharged" is the key to it all. Let's just be thankful we have CCW. It's a huge responsibility, but it will keep law abiding citizens safe. Peace to all.


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## EnonEye (Apr 13, 2011)

Just a few words for thought as some on here area stepping on my toes so I'd like to say thank you thank you thank you Ohio for this allowance, privilege and thus responsibility to carry CCW as retired military. Ya'd think all us NRA card carrying gunnies would be celebrating that gun rights have been expanded rather than debating if prior military should be allowed to carry without taking an all-pass course. Or, maybe we should really rescind anyone from carrying concealed as it used to be, after all, no law is going to weed out everyone except perfect candidates. Everyone receives gun handling training in basic, everyone qualifies on a weapon. Class course is all day classroom, hands on, take it apart put it back together, qualifying with a weapon is again all day with pass/fail/expert marksman being the 3 end official results. It's like marching, everyone marches and knows how to march a group of people. And you do it over and over until you get it right or take a boot out the door. Even the medics, the clerks, everyone. During the Gulf War I went to my medical clinic one evening to sleep for the night, upon entering there was a 50cal machine gun set up in the hallway staring at me. Gunner's primary job was playing in the band. I think he might be qualified to carry. Not all prior service will get a CCW but I'll take my chances with a dozen prior military carrying over a dozen never served civies carrying anyday. Except in Chicago, lol. I appreciate everyones input on this thread, very good read and I think we're all on the same side, yea?.


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## Specwar (Sep 22, 2014)

I see no need for me to add anything here. Refreshing to read the diverse responses .


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## fryerman (May 26, 2012)

Update- applied tuesday,picking up card thursday


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## yonderfishin (Apr 9, 2006)

There are some who take the course and I still wouldnt trust them around me with a gun. 

The course will get you the permit to conceal , yet anybody can open carry without it. There are some differences with the permit but either way its a person walking around with a gun.Some with the permit , some without. Anybody having gone through military weapons training knows a whole lot more than these guys carrying without any training at all. Its been 20 years since the military trained me and I havent used a gun for about 15 years , I havent forgot any of it.


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## yonderfishin (Apr 9, 2006)

fryerman said:


> Heres my recent experience,I live in lorain county,made my appt to apply last tuesday and went today.i had downloaded a copy of the application and filled it out at home,got my 2"x2" photo at walmart.so today took the application,copy of my dd-214,photo, and drivers licence.got there at 12:55 and 10minutes later i was fingerprinted and told it could be processed anywhere from 1 to 3 days but could be up to 45 days.said they will call when ready to pick up.Thats it



So did it cost you anything at all in the process other than getting the picture ?


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## fryerman (May 26, 2012)

picked up my permit at 6 tonight,no fees.By the way the photo i gave them with the application stays with your app and on file ,they took another pic that went on my card,took 5 minutes


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## yonderfishin (Apr 9, 2006)

fryerman said:


> picked up my permit at 6 tonight,no fees.By the way the photo i gave them with the application stays with your app and on file ,they took another pic that went on my card,took 5 minutes


This may sound like a silly question but did you have to glue or tape the photo to the application or is that something they do ? I got a photo yesterday , I intend to just paperclip it to the application since I dont want to take a chance on doing it wrong.

Page 2 of the manual from the Ohio attorney generals office says anyone honorably discharged from the armed forces does not need to submit proof of training so I am gonna apply with my DD214 and see what happens. I have training and experience additional to what I received in basic training , its just not documented so its gonna be interesting to see how Hancock county handles this.


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## yonderfishin (Apr 9, 2006)

Turned in the application , photo , and copy of DD214 today. Everything seemed in order and they said they will send it to me. He wouldnt give me any idea how long it takes in Hancock county only that it takes as long as it takes.


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## EnonEye (Apr 13, 2011)

Nearly half of all Ohio House Republicans are co-sponsoring new legislation to abolish the state’s conceal-carry license and training requirements. The legislation, House Bill 174, would also expand the list of allowable concealed weapons to include rifles and shotguns, instead of just handguns. NO TRAINING REQUIREMENTS... OBoy this should get fun


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## Misdirection (Jul 16, 2012)

EnonEye said:


> Nearly half of all Ohio House Republicans are co-sponsoring new legislation to abolish the state’s conceal-carry license and training requirements. The legislation, House Bill 174, would also expand the list of allowable concealed weapons to include rifles and shotguns, instead of just handguns. NO TRAINING REQUIREMENTS... OBoy this should get fun


PA doesn't have a training requirement and most of us are still alive. Heck, my first carry license didn't even have my photo on it, my second, I had to go to Woolworths across from the courthouse for a photo booth photo that they glued onto it!

Sent from my XT1635-01 using Tapatalk


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## EnonEye (Apr 13, 2011)

Misdirection said:


> PA doesn't have a training requirement and most of us are still alive. Heck, my first carry license didn't even have my photo on it, my second, I had to go to Woolworths across from the courthouse for a photo booth photo that they glued onto it!
> 
> Sent from my XT1635-01 using Tapatalk


Yea I'm sure this will be a hot topic. My concern is this: for something as important as carrying around a weapon that kills lives why not make it so there's some effort required to do so, a privilege not a right, some training and some expense not a freebie, society moving forward not backwards 200 years. I want only law abiding decent citizens carrying, not just anyone who can find a gun somewhere. I've already contacted my House rep with my grave concerns. JMHO


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## snag (Dec 27, 2005)

Even if the law passes doesn’t mean everyone is going to be carrying, a few that already have a weapon may start to carry it, but the bad guys might b a bit Leary not knowing who is carrying, but I doubt it they don’t care or even think about it. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## yonderfishin (Apr 9, 2006)

EnonEye said:


> Yea I'm sure this will be a hot topic. My concern is this: for something as important as carrying around a weapon that kills lives why not make it so there's some effort required to do so, a privilege not a right, some training and some expense not a freebie, society moving forward not backwards 200 years. I want only law abiding decent citizens carrying, not just anyone who can find a gun somewhere. I've already contacted my House rep with my grave concerns. JMHO



Well first of all it is a right , not a privilege. And since the idiots and criminals are already carrying regardless of the law , any effort to restrict or attach a cost to be met in order to carry only affects the law abiding citizens who want to do things right....the ones you actually have to worry the least about. The irony is that restrictions and licensing just make things harder for the good guys , the bad guys ignore it all anyway and do what they want.


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## EnonEye (Apr 13, 2011)

FOP are opposed to the bill... I'll stand with them


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## Snakecharmer (Apr 9, 2008)

Terry R Magnuson said:


> I disagree with that statement. I for one served 23 yrs and had training on more weapons than one could imagine. You tell me what qualifies. No better institute to be deemed qualifying agency than the military. Also, it's not all about handling a weapon either. Its about about making conscious right decisions in a split second . That in itself is part of training in the military. Look at all the people who passed hunter safety and have hunting violations.


I knew some cooks in the Army that I wouldn't trust with a steak knife let alone a .45...


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## yonderfishin (Apr 9, 2006)

EnonEye said:


> FOP are opposed to the bill... I'll stand with them



I can respect that. I fully respect law enforcement and even their opinion in this matter.

However they don't write the law or decide which of our rights are valid and which are not. It is not their duty to oppose law they don't agree with , only to enforce it. And as civil servants sworn to uphold and enforce the law , they should be seen publicly in favor of constitutional law and rights not opposed to them. Seems the FOP may be having an identity crisis.


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## yonderfishin (Apr 9, 2006)

Snakecharmer said:


> I knew some cooks in the Army that I wouldn't trust with a steak knife let alone a .45...



Well to be fair.......you can find some like that in any group , even among the police force. LOL


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## Snakecharmer (Apr 9, 2008)

yonderfishin said:


> Well to be fair.......you can find some like that in any group , even among the police force. LOL


One time during guard mount ( I was a MP) the officer of the day was checking a MP's pistol and accidently blew a hole in the ceiling thinking he had cleared the pistol....There were some brown shorts that day....

Plus seen a couple bullets in the clearing barrel from guys who forgot to take out their mags before clearing their pistols.


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## Deadeyedeek (Feb 12, 2014)

S


Snakecharmer said:


> One time during guard mount ( I was a MP) the officer of the day was checking a MP's pistol and accidently blew a hole in the ceiling thinking he had cleared the pistol....There were some brown shorts that day....
> 
> Plus seen a couple bullets in the clearing barrel from guys who forgot to take out their mags before clearing their pistols.


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## Snakecharmer (Apr 9, 2008)

Deadeyedeek said:


> S


???


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## Deadeyedeek (Feb 12, 2014)

I am one of the veteran who took advantage of the free CCW permit, with that said, I when through the course and paid. Am glad I did, and would recomend EVERYONE to at least take the basic course. There is alot to when, where and should you ever have to do the unthikable. You are not going to get a free pass when you shoot someone! Gets rather ugly when cops show up. Spent this last weekend going through the advanced USCCA class, with 2 cops and a female FBI(Whom is required to take refresher every year) Learned a hell of alot of things that I didnt think about! Those of you whom are USCCA members will know what I mean..Hat off to the female agent..took the time to show me how to hold my 40(before that couldnt hit chit) GOT ME SHOOTING A WHOLE LOT BETTER. Encourage everyone to join the USCCA for the piece of mind when the unthikable happens..Thanks for reading DD


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## yonderfishin (Apr 9, 2006)

Deadeyedeek said:


> I am one of the veteran who took advantage of the free CCW permit, with that said, I when through the course and paid. Am glad I did, and would recomend EVERYONE to at least take the basic course. There is alot to when, where and should you ever have to do the unthikable. You are not going to get a free pass when you shoot someone! Gets rather ugly when cops show up. Spent this last weekend going through the advanced USCCA class, with 2 cops and a female FBI(Whom is required to take refresher every year) Learned a hell of alot of things that I didnt think about! Those of you whom are USCCA members will know what I mean..Hat off to the female agent..took the time to show me how to hold my 40(before that couldnt hit chit) GOT ME SHOOTING A WHOLE LOT BETTER. Encourage everyone to join the USCCA for the piece of mind when the unthikable happens..Thanks for reading DD



Great post. More education and training is always a good thing. I am taking advantage of the completely free deal for veterans too but at this point not doing the class. Not that I think I wouldnt benefit from it but if I ever had to do the unthinkable and use a firearm for self defense it will be a last resort , literally a me or them situation , so whatever happens next dont matter because I defended my life or the lives of my family and thats worth everything. I also have considerable experience and shoot well so I dont see a need for spending more. My wife will be taking a course though at some point and I may just do that with her.


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