# Bluecats in Alum Creek?



## BottomBouncer (Jan 20, 2005)

I was fishing the Scioto a couple days ago and spoke with a guy...he mentioned that a couple years after Alum creek was made, the state made a deal with Oklahoma to bring several million bluecat fry to stock Alum. I think he said there was an article in the news paper?

Do any of you fellas recall this?


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## Fish-N-Fool (Apr 12, 2004)

Don't have any facts on this gentleman's info., but I know for a fact that there are indeed some blues in Alum Creek.

I always thought the blues in Alum were "stocked" by local fishermen, but maybe this explains it?

I am very curious to see what kind of information you get here from some of the older central OH members


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## BottomBouncer (Jan 20, 2005)

I emailed the dnr to get what ever info they can provide.

How many of you have caught them, or thought you have caught them at Alum?


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## Net (Apr 10, 2004)

Here's an old thread with some alum blue's
http://www.ohiogamefishing.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14617&highlight=blues


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## joel_fishes (Apr 26, 2004)

I'm pretty sure the ODNR has said before that there are not blue catfish in central Ohio. 

Looked it up and here is the link. Says there are only blues in the Ohio River


http://www.dnr.ohio.gov/wildlife/Fishing/aquanotes-fishid/chancat.htm

Joel


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## Fish-N-Fool (Apr 12, 2004)

joel_fishes - OH DNR is wrong; their data is based upon state stocking data and creel/electro fishing surveys. The state may not stock blues in any of the inland lakes, but they get in there one way or another.

I know for a fact that both CJ Brown and Alum Creek have a limited population of blues. 

IMO - they are only small populations and rarely caught by fishermen. When they are caught, most people mistake them for channel cats.

The Dr. caught a 12 lb Bluecat in CJ a couple weeks ago when I had talked to him. If anybody wants to argue with Doc about his ability to identify a blue from a channel - be my guest


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## FishThis (Sep 2, 2005)

What is the difference between a blue and a channel?


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## catfish1998 (Jul 8, 2004)

An old man caught one a few weeks ago at the chestshire docks.We had a few people look at it.


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## crittergitter (Jun 9, 2005)

Here's a tip. You can not tell a blue cat by the color of the fish. Simply can NOT be done. Most cases people catch a big gearthy channel and think it is a blue because of it's color which is misguided. Read any article or book on how to identify a channel catfish from a blue catfish and you have to analyze the fins shape and the number of spines in one of the lower fins. I think it works something like that. I know you can't tell by color alone.

CG


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## joel_fishes (Apr 26, 2004)

That's what I had heard cg. I trust the ODNR - they know more than I do. I agree that some bait bucket biologists could have put some in there, but it would seem hard to establish a fishable population like that. The ODNR doesn't stock channel catfish in Alum either.

Joel


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## Doctor (Apr 5, 2004)

Blue cats are really muscled well compared to a Channel Cat, there anal fin is cut straight along the bottom and trailing edge, they will have more than 30 rays on there anal fin, older blues have a real prodomenate hump just ahead of there dorasl fin on the top portion of there head.

Channels are not muscled as well but during spawn they have nodes on there heads that swell up, there anal fin is rounded along the bottom and the trailing edge, they will have less than 30 rays on there anal fin generally around 24-28 is the norm, juveniles till about the age of 3 years will have spots along there sides.

Your best judge is to look close at the anal fin if it is straight cut it's a Blue, rounded it's a Channel, as with everything there are always exceptions to the rules, Donnie caught a fish on the Cumberland river that had the head of a Flathead and the body of a channel, and was colored like a Blue weird looking fish, we looked at that fish for a long time trying to figure what we should call it...........Doc


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## crittergitter (Jun 9, 2005)

Yup, I'd say you described the differences to a "T" Doc. I knew it was something like that, but I just couldn't put it into those words. 

CG


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## crawdiddy (Apr 10, 2006)

I bet there's some huge Blue Cats in Alum. Are there flatheads in alum? If so, that would be quite the trifecta to catch one of more of each in a season there.


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## BottomBouncer (Jan 20, 2005)

I always see it this was...the Scioto river is connected to the Ohio. Every major creek in Central Ohio(Big D, Little D, Walnut, Alum, etc.) eventually, in some way connect to the Scioto. We all know the Scioto has flatheads...why wouldn't all the creeks that feed it?


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## BottomBouncer (Jan 20, 2005)

I just tried to look up a bluecat id on the dnr site....they don't even have it listed in their fish id list. It seems they have completely ruled out the possibilty of catching one.


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## joel_fishes (Apr 26, 2004)

BB,
I agree the creeks all get together one way or another. A blue cat would have to hitch a ride around the dam at Alum to get in the lake though.

Joel


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## Mushijobah (May 4, 2004)

Knowing the blue cats habbitat, it is very doubtful that it would venture past the point of alum creek dam even if there were no dams on the creek. If anyone has Fishes Of Ohio, read their habbitat. They are not small stream fish. Even today they are only found in the Ohio river and a few miles into the Scioto, Great Miami, and Muskingum. You must also remember that before A. Creek dam was built, there were 4 roller dams in place. If there is a blue cat in there, it was transplanted.


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## crawdiddy (Apr 10, 2006)

I saw someone catch a paddlefish below alum dam a couple years ago. who would have ever guessed that?


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## Mushijobah (May 4, 2004)

I doubt it was Alum. Possibly paint creek or deer creek. They are snagged there sometimes. There are no dams for those fish to overcome but on alum there are 4.


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## crawdiddy (Apr 10, 2006)

it was alum right there below the dam where you park and kick it on the concrete wall with a lawn chair. funkiest fish I ever saw. guy said it was a paddlefish (and not his first caught there - he was an old timer who looked liked he'd been fishing below the dam since it was built). I got home and googled paddlefish and sure enough it was. I also saw a large freshwater eel in the olentangy in worthington that made it from the atlantic.


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## shuvlhed1 (Apr 13, 2004)

Fish-N-Fool said:


> IMO - they are only small populations and rarely caught by fishermen. When they are caught, most people mistake them for channel cats.


No, most people mistake channels that weigh more than 2lbs for blues. I can't count how many people I have laughed at for catching "blues" all over the area, even showing them when they are clearly channels.


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## Mushijobah (May 4, 2004)

Deer Creek spillway looks just like Alum, you may have been mixed up...Especially if you were younger. My grandfather snagged a paddlefish below Deer Creek back in the 80's.


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## Mushijobah (May 4, 2004)

AMEN shuvlhed. Fishes Of Ohio is a great book. Ichthyology is also nice to have as a fisherman. It reduces fish stories 10 fold.


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## crawdiddy (Apr 10, 2006)

I know the alum spillway been fishing it since 79


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## worm queen (Apr 14, 2005)

Although rare, we do see paddlefish come out of Deer Creek every so often. Strangest fish I've ever seen! As far as blue cats here...nope, nada, zip. Some people may try to convince you otherwise, but they're ummmm...misinformed.


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## BottomBouncer (Jan 20, 2005)

I don agree that blues coming up the scioto and into the others feeder creeks is HIGHLY unlikely, I was referring to flatheads migrating around... As far a paddlefish in Alum. Why not? It is possible....there is a SLIGHT chance that not every odd ball fish has been harvested out of these areas after dams were built.

The fact that people say there are not flatheads in areas like O'sh., Griggs and Alum(among others) either means they are trying to hide that fact that there are flatties in these areas or they are completely ignorant(which is to my advantage, less people will be fishing for them  )


I've seen a small flatty lying on the bank of the teeny tiny Blacklick creek....


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## crawdiddy (Apr 10, 2006)

yeah.....and there's no musky in oshay either.....


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## BottomBouncer (Jan 20, 2005)

....or northern pike.

Numbers may be small.....but they're in there. 

There are pike in the northern parts of the river and musky in the southern stretches. They just moved out of the area in central when the flatheads broke the news that dams were going to be built.


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## DaleM (Apr 5, 2004)

crawdiddy said:


> I know the alum spillway been fishing it since 79


How old are you again Craw?? That was 27 years ago!
Man if you fished it in 1979 you had to be a wee little tike!!


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## crawdiddy (Apr 10, 2006)

summer before 4th grade. I fish all the time so I look younger than I really am . And yes my family was fishing down there back in nine-teen-seventy-nine (1979 is a smashing pumkins song). Just 4 more years until I'm "over the hill".


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## Mushijobah (May 4, 2004)

I love fish stories.


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## BottomBouncer (Jan 20, 2005)

Case closed:

DNR responded with these numbers:

Alum Creek -
September 16, 1975: 36,800 bluecatfish fingerlings
October 13, 1977: 12, 222 bluecatfish fingerlings

Imagine the monsters that could be left....


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## crawdiddy (Apr 10, 2006)

so are the blues reproducing? I would think at least some if not a decent # of them have and are. How long do blue catfish live typically? Alum could be good hapitat for them as it has some very deep spots like by the dam, and seems to have a great healthy population of a lot of species that they would eat.


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## crawdiddy (Apr 10, 2006)

want another story?

Back in middle and high school me and a buddy used to bike from downtown worthington to the dam with our poles bungied to our bike rack and our tackle in a backpack. A lot lot more of old state was a coutry road back. Ill always remember it as riding thru the country to go fish alum. ALso never caught any big fish back then either (that's not a story its the true).

cheers.


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## Steelwolve (Apr 18, 2006)

Cool Nice digging to find those numbers, that is news I love to hear. I've been driving to the Muskingum all summer to try to catch Big Cats (mind you I've only got one over 5lbs) At least I dont have to drive as far to not catch em ! I Fish from bank do you think the dam area would be my best chance? Or should I try some deep coves back by the cliffs near 36 -37? Great thread and thanks for the info BottomB


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## Mushijobah (May 4, 2004)

Duno if that adds up to a million.


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## BottomBouncer (Jan 20, 2005)

Probably doesn't add up to a million....... What it does add up to is the fact that at some point, if not still, bluecats did exist in central Ohio.

The dam area gets pretty deep, up to sixty feet... I'd say, find an Alum map and fish the area that gets you closest to the main channel. I'd fish a whole shad(4" range) on the bottom and one about 10' down under a float and as close to the channel as possible.


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## crawdiddy (Apr 10, 2006)

the people at the bait store at alum would probably know if a blue cat has been caught their this year or in years past. maybe someone could ask around there and report any findings.


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## BottomBouncer (Jan 20, 2005)

i doubt they'd know a blue from a madtom


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## crawdiddy (Apr 10, 2006)

they know how to make a great pizza though!


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## fishinking (May 17, 2004)

Steelwolve said:


> Cool Nice digging to find those numbers, that is news I love to hear. I've been driving to the Muskingum all summer to try to catch Big Cats (mind you I've only got one over 5lbs) At least I dont have to drive as far to not catch em ! I Fish from bank do you think the dam area would be my best chance? Or should I try some deep coves back by the cliffs near 36 -37? Great thread and thanks for the info BottomB


My Dad, Son and I were catfishing in a cove just north if 36/37 on Saturday morning. All in all we caught 6 nice channels from 3-7lbs. I had 2 larger fish which i never seen so i cant say what the were. one bit on small bluegil other on shrimp. Well anyways on the bluegil my hook was straightend less than 30 seconds into the fight and on the shrimp my 18lb test spiderwire was snapped like a twig...i personally dont believe there are channel cats @ Alum big enough to do that? What could these fish have been? my Dad cant stop tlking about it......any ideas anyone?????


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## crawdiddy (Apr 10, 2006)

so you're asking what's in alum that we hope is in there but are not sure.

30+ lb channel cat
100+ lb blue cat
70+ lb flathead
50 lb musky
20 lb saugeye
10 lb smallmouth
13 lb largemouth
4.5 lb crappie,etc,etc
, etc,etc,etc


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## fisherman (Jun 3, 2005)

guys and gals i been reading here. i went looking i found this site. on catfish id thought you might be interested in it.


http://www.katmasters.com/catfishid.html


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## FINMAN (Apr 14, 2004)

I posted a pic and didn't even know it was a blue until Acklac pointed it out to me. I keep searching in Alum and Hoover, but I know there are blues in Griggs!


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## Mushijobah (May 4, 2004)

That "Blue" has no more than 26 anal rays. The head in not accomponied by lump with a raising back either. The tail is not forked at a definite angle either. Looks like a washed out channel to me!

"The anal fin has 24-29 soft rays, in contrast to the blue catfish which always has 30 or more rays in the anal fin."-A channel cat.


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