# Line Tie Options - Opinions



## fugarwi7 (Sep 20, 2006)

I will do my best to present my scenario without confusing everyone...I am seeking opinions about line tie options attached to a lip...The first pictures below are how I did my first baits. Do you guys see any inherant issues with the line tie being "sideways". I can only think that my snap may have a tendancy to slide to the side causing the bait to go out of tune. Any thoughts on this design?


















The next two are options I am thinking about changing to to eliminate my concerns with my original design. The problem I have with this is my baits are so skinny, there is not a lot of lure body to run the wires vertically into the body and stay below the lip slot. Any thoughts or suggetions with using this method?










The last set of pictures is another concept I am thinking about. With this design, the line tie simply floats in the holes and is not anchored to the body. The idea is the pull of the bait will prevent it from dropping down from the lip. I will pin the lip to the lure body so there is no risk of pulling the lip from the body if I hang a larger fish (which is the plan). Do you guys have any opinions of this design, good, bad or indifferent??


















Any thoughts, suggestions, opinions, experience, or just plan rhetoric is greatly appreciated. I want to ultimately use one design that provides a simple and effective method, with no fear a lip will pull from the body and that is not an engineering marvel to build...quick and simple would be best, but with no comprise of quality and durability. Thanks


----------



## vc1111 (Apr 13, 2004)

Brian, I would hesitate to use the one pictured on top because tuning would be difficult. The lip/line tie combination in conjuction with the body configuration is a key component in getting a bait to run properly as I'm sure you know. If the lip has any alignment problems or acquires any from having the line tie moved after hitting an obstruction while fishing, the first method shown with a transverse arrangement won't accomodate much side to side adjustment, if any.

The bottom one might have similar problems because it will be tough to get enough leverage on it to tune bait because the tie is sort of free floating. But...it might tune itself too. I would try it and see what happens.

As to the tucking in the wire using the standard method, for most fishing circumstances that wire may only need to be inserted about 3/4 of an inch to maybe an inch. For musky baits, I want more than that, but for all others, the lip holds the line tie and the line tie basically needs only to be secured inside the body enough so that it won't move.

I'm finding that drilling that channel for the wire is easier with a drill press if I start by making a pilot hole, then hold the bait against the drill bit gently, and fire up the drill press. That way I can guide the bit into the bait at the appropriate angle and to the appropriate depth.

Also I put both tag ends of the wire in the same hole as opposed to drilling two holes, one for each wire as shown in the top photo.

The second picture shows a line tie separate and not attached to the bait. That is exactly the bend/method that I use on all my lures. Its strong and accomodates tuning nicely. It requires two holes in the lip and one in the body and you're good to go.


----------



## goolies (Jun 28, 2007)

I can't comment based on tackle making experience since mine is limited. Based on the material properties of polycarbonate and what I have seen on the deep diving walleye lures that I have purchased I might shy away from the bottom option. I'm assuming that your lip material is only 1/8" thick. If you fish any cold water with those lures the polycarbonate is going to become more brittle which may cause a break with the stress of a big fish. Wiring back into the body takes that stress off the lip. Also, the manufactured deep diving walleye lures that I have purchased with the line tie embedded in the lip typically have a lip that has been beefed up along the center back to the lip slot. Just my .02.


----------



## hazmail (Oct 26, 2007)

fugi- The staple idea (last pic) is used here a lot, including on Murray Cod lures. I have never made one, so can not vouch for it- quite often the lip is aluminum, but also use Lexan. It's not unusual to catch a 50lb cod in some of the rivers and sometimes 100- (the record is 212lb, I think), so go for it, but as you say, I would also pin the lip.
Nice, sharp work on the lures, and wire too. 
Heres one manufacturer:
http://www.waggafishingworld.com.au/legendlures.asp
Sorry, the record is 112kg, about 290lb.
http://www.sportsfish.com.au/fishing/fish-freshwater/murray-cod.html
pete


----------



## vc1111 (Apr 13, 2004)

I've never seen that staple idea before. I'm going to try it on a few baits and see how it works. If its tough enough, I have a few new things I'm working on that will dovetail well with that.

I've also seen a way of making the line tie from a single wire. I'll see if I can find a picture of it. I'm considering trying the single wire method for the smaller baits, which are geared more for species other than musky.


----------



## whittler (Feb 10, 2008)

In the bottom picture, either of those will work great. As hazmail said many baits from down under are made in that fashion and are extremly strong. I have tested a lot of line ties and those two are among the strongest.


----------



## fugarwi7 (Sep 20, 2006)

Great feedback--thanks everyone. Pete, thanks for the website and some pics of the staple idea...I was thinking it would be a good way to build a lip with a simple line tie...but as Vince mentions, I may have trouble with tuning...I don't know now if I know more or less about which way to go...I think I will do a couple of each and when I get on the lake I can test each one, take notes and adjust from there. 

I also thought if I could get my hands on a small machine threaded eye with a nut, I could simply bolt through the lip and seal the nut in place. Anyone know if something like this is available in stainless?


----------



## hazmail (Oct 26, 2007)

Fugi- Some builder here used to drill a line of holes down the center line of the lip, so you can vary the depth/tune of a given lure, by moving a staple/clip up and down - there is also one who has changeable lips, where you pull one out of a slot an replace it with a shorter/longer one, I think they came with four curved poly lips and were at high end of price range, good lures though - can't remember the name of the maker.
Like Vince, tuning is the first thing I thought of too, but factory built, means lots of jigs, so everything is pretty predictable, it would have to be, for the numbers this particular maker sells. 
Those nice even curves (symmetry) of you lures pictured, should make it easy to make a jig for the lip placement and holes etc . Jigs/templates, make as many as you can, they make life much more predictable. pete


----------



## walleyevision (Aug 4, 2005)

fugarwi7 said:


> I also thought if I could get my hands on a small machine threaded eye with a nut, I could simply bolt through the lip and seal the nut in place. Anyone know if something like this is available in stainless?


fug,
I have had that idea run through my head while at work. My wire strippers have 4 or 5 holes for cutting machine screws down, and I use them alot to cut down machine scews to length without damage to the threads, nuts still go on easy. While cutting some screws down about a week ago I had a thought to try to cut down one of my stainless hook hangers down and tap some threads in the lip and thread through with some glue or epoxy and nut on the other side. Not sure how the strippers will cut stainless or if I even have a tap with the right thread pitch, but I plan on giving this an attempt on the batch I am working on now. The hook hanger may even be able to tap the hole itself.

Not sure how this would affect the strength of the lip either.


----------



## hazmail (Oct 26, 2007)

Walleye/Fugi- you can make a tap quite easily out of the bolt you need to use and get a perfect tight fit. I have done it many times on my boat where I need to fit a metric bolt into Aluminum, all you need to do is make sure the bolt is harder than the material you are tapping.
Get the thread you need and a three cornered file, file 3 flutes in the bolt, with the cutting edges under 90 deg- grind a taper all round on the bolt down to the size of the core diameter of the bolt (subtract thread height), which will be about your hole size. I have made these down to about 1/16 dia for different jobs - stainless is pretty hard so you should be able to do Lexan, brass, Al etc easily. Make one in no time and really tight fitting. pete


----------



## vc1111 (Apr 13, 2004)

Pete, we're going to start calling you MacGyver!


----------



## hazmail (Oct 26, 2007)

Fugi- You will never guess!!!!!!!!!, I found some of those lures in the shed, so here is a picture of the staple setup. The lure is 80mm long with 40mm lip (total 120) -The tow point (first hole) is 25mm from the front of lip. I think they make these up to about 8" bodies. You never know what you will find in y cave. pete


----------



## hazmail (Oct 26, 2007)

Vince- rings a bell, but that's about all- Who is McGyver****?pete


----------



## walleyevision (Aug 4, 2005)

Thanks hazmail, I would have been checking threads with a thread gauge and searching for a tap. Making one will be alot more simple.


----------



## vc1111 (Apr 13, 2004)

Pete, here's link to answer your question about MacGyver:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_problems_solved_by_MacGyver


----------



## hazmail (Oct 26, 2007)

Vince -Yep, never saw the show, but have heard of it. I don't watch commercial TV, too much propaganda etc. Sounds like it would have been a funny show though.pete


----------



## fugarwi7 (Sep 20, 2006)

Hey Pete, 

You definitely have some MacGyver in ya with all of the gadgets you make  

Thanks for the info and insight...and those lures you show look quite interesting...may have to add something similar to my to-do list for walleye...as for the line tie saga, everyone has helped with this...except I now have a couple more thoughts on the topic to try...I still like the staple thing and have a few like that to install on my current batch...time on the water this spring will determine whether it is a good way to go...most of what is on my bench now will get wired through to the body...

walleye, if you have success with the threaded deal, let us know...I am still going to try something along those lines and will post a picture if/when I get something I am happy with.


----------



## Swede (Jan 17, 2008)

I think the lure Pete is talking about is the StumpJumper lure it has changable lips 



hazmail said:


> Fugi- Some builder here used to drill a line of holes down the center line of the lip, so you can vary the depth/tune of a given lure, by moving a staple/clip up and down - there is also one who has changeable lips, where you pull one out of a slot an replace it with a shorter/longer one, I think they came with four curved poly lips and were at high end of price range, good lures though - can't remember the name of the maker.
> Like Vince, tuning is the first thing I thought of too, but factory built, means lots of jigs, so everything is pretty predictable, it would have to be, for the numbers this particular maker sells.
> Those nice even curves (symmetry) of you lures pictured, should make it easy to make a jig for the lip placement and holes etc . Jigs/templates, make as many as you can, they make life much more predictable. pete


----------



## hazmail (Oct 26, 2007)

Thank you Swede, I did not realize they had so many different lips available - will have to get some more. Pete

See here: http://stumpjumper.com.au/catalogue.html


----------

