# out east!



## Addiction (Apr 18, 2008)

does anybody think any of the rivers out east will fish thursday or friday? im thinking of heading up there one of these days thanks


----------



## Fishin Musician (Jan 2, 2007)

The Grand is still a mess. The tribs off the Grand are good but I didnt see many fish in them today. I fished Paine Creek for 3 hours and got 1 fish.


----------



## Saltshaker (Oct 9, 2008)

Same with the Chagrin...stopped there today but just not worth the time.


----------



## MuskieJim (Apr 11, 2007)

I understand that everyone wants to help out, but why give the exact location FM? Next time you fish there be ready for a few more fisherman, probably make your 1 catch a 0.


All main rivers here in NE Ohio are blown. Your best luck would be the tribs, but if you are traveling far I'd just wait until a stocked river is fishable if you're looking for numbers.


----------



## Addiction (Apr 18, 2008)

thank fishin musician i appreciate the info help out i dont get it why people get there panties in a bunch when people give an ``EXACT LOCATION`` something about that i dont get but owell what do they say 10% of the fisherman catch 90% of the fish right? so who the heck cares if you give an exact location.


----------



## MuskieJim (Apr 11, 2007)

I will tell you who cares, people who go out and fish themselves, who don't look for answers on their computer. I'm not being a jerk here, but there are many many steelheaders that would agree, the minute a location is on the forum, be ready to see lots and lots of people there. I mean, you're asking for fishable water, and if you decided to come up tomorrow and fish, only to see 10 cars in the lot by the time you get there, you'll be happy???? Doubtful.

Just looking at your past posts shows how much you care about exact locations. No wonder that river has been so packed.


----------



## zachtrouter (May 1, 2006)

I agree with muskiejim on this one. You'll realize after you post about a certain trib or spot then go there consecutive days to find 10x as many people on the second day. Some people come on here just to see where to go and they arent even members. Its a unwritten steelie rule, at least in my book!! There are pm's for a reason!


----------



## ryosapien (Jul 5, 2008)

oh zt this is rich.......lol 
In regards to the original question the chagrin is at like 418 right now and has been dropping mega fast this week i think if we avoid any major spikes friday should be prime i have been tying like mad and am ready. after the last two weeks i have had i am due. any flow level <350 is worth my time


----------



## elkhtr (Oct 23, 2006)

Addiction said:


> thank fishin musician i appreciate the info help out i dont get it why people get there panties in a bunch when people give an ``EXACT LOCATION`` something about that i dont get but owell what do they say 10% of the fisherman catch 90% of the fish right? so who the heck cares if you give an exact location.


It would be hard to catch fish if you cant even get in a spot to catch them. It probably would be prudent to mention a small creek, or small water without being specific. A stocked trib can be mentioned because there is so much water to fish. Some of the small water only offers a couple of prime areas to fish and it is easy to be crowded out.

I feel for the people who live hours away and only get to fish a few times per year. It is difficult to time up a good bite and good conditions when you only fish a few times. It takes time to learn what tribs will be fishable and when.

People wonder why the steelheaders here are touchy about this stuff. It is not like a lake where there are thousands of acres of fishable water. Although a creek may be a mile long, there may only be a few sections holding fish. If there are big crowds there, the fishing is shot.

I am all for helping others learn and catch fish. However, there are many people lurking here that could care less about others and are just for themselves. I dont really want to share information with them.

If you would like to help someone from the site out with a specific location, why not just shoot them a PM. You may benefit from some good information back too.


----------



## MuskieJim (Apr 11, 2007)

Amen Elkhtr! 

I'm all about sharing info, and I too feel for people who live hours away. I have the privilege of fishing 3 to 4 times a week and users PM me all the time for info. I don't think that posting a creek less than a mile long on a public board is a good idea. Period. 

Posting Small Water and Unstocked Tribs = More fisherman = less fish for you and the people who get off their butts and check it out for themselves.


"i dont get it why people get there panties in a bunch when people give an ``EXACT LOCATION`` something about that i dont get" 

Are you serious?? You don't get it? You must not fish very often.....


----------



## nicholasburnsworth (Oct 23, 2007)

I totally understand not mentioning specific locations. Same thing happens with unspoken public hunting locations. We have a prime spot in SE Ohio that maybe 20 people tops have been hunting in the last 8 years during gun season. last year there were a few unfamiliar faces and this year there were about 30-40 guys hunting this same area. Some people don't know how good something is until it's gone. Be careful who you tell, and how much you tell them or your favorite spot might become everyone elses favorite and your loss.


----------



## buckeye6 (Jun 17, 2005)

i have to agree with mj.last yr i got bashed for saying the same thing about a unstocked river that home owners let guys fished. well now its private.just pm guys.i have pm mj,and guys have pm about rivers. its great to help,but pm it. ever notice when there are 20 guys fishing an area,that is prime,but u are below,and u start catching fish.half of those guys are in your pocket. i had a guy that tried to snag the fish i had on my line. steelhead brings out alot of crazy people.help people by pm with locations.


----------



## ngski (Aug 16, 2005)

I know we like to keep the our spots secret, but when the information is public knowledge on the internet are we really giving up specific names of tribs a major fopah.


----------



## MEISTERICS (May 15, 2006)

My my how things change. I remember quite a few people being upset about not wanting others to post specific spots and unstocked tribs. Now there tone has changed for a different direction.

LOL. As of last spring we lost an entire half of a steelhead stream because that was thought by many as PUBLIC. Now its posted and shut off at least 4-6 miles of stream. Maybe that woke some people up.

I am glad we are starting to realize what posting on the internet can do to a river. Its not like a lake where there are thousands of acres to share.


----------



## Fishin Musician (Jan 2, 2007)

Paine Creek, there are NO fish in it....
Whats the problem with that. Maybe, just maybe I hammered them yesterday and I dont want anyone there to fish with me! Hey addiction...PM me for info so these boys wont bunch their panties!


----------



## Mepps3 (Apr 23, 2006)

Fishin Musician said:


> Paine Creek, there are NO fish in it....
> Whats the problem with that. Maybe, just maybe I hammered them yesterday and I dont want anyone there to fish with me! Hey addiction...PM me for info so these boys wont bunch their panties!


This is why I don't post much on this site anymore. Exact locations will take away more stream access.


----------



## creekcrawler (Oct 5, 2004)

I rarely get involved in this, but I used to fish Paine years ago and it was nice.
It was a decent place to go when there wasn't anything else to fish because the big rivers were all blown out. 
BUT, that creek can accomodate about 4-5 people comfortably at the most.
AND, now, you'll see people fishing there even when the flow is down to a trickle.

Let's face it, most steelheaders are ho's and are always looking for new spots,
especially the newer guys. Every lil ho that read this post made a little mental note (or even wrote down) to check out the creek sometime in the future.
Might not be this week or this month, but they'll check it out eventually.

When you go there, if it's a weekend, you will find 8 guys lined up fishing a little pool 50 ft long. If you hit on a weekday, unless some fresh, dumb fish came in, you won't get much 'cause the fish were hammered all weekend long.


In the old days us old ho's had to get out our DeLorme Atlas and go exploring to find these places.


----------



## MEISTERICS (May 15, 2006)

Maturing of a River fisherman...

New guy starts posting asking how and where to catch fish and get upset when someone says NO.

New guy learns to catch river fish and is now a partially experienced angler and shares info with others publically.

Partially experienced angler learns more and more info and becomes a above avg. angler. He or she continues to share their info.

Soon enough the Angler notices larger traffic on his found locations. Angler Becomes upset that he losses access to his spots and learns the power of the internet.

Above avg. angler no longer posts reports on his locations. And occasionally helps less experienced anglers with technique.

Above avg. angler notices other less experienced anglers doing the same mistakes he made when he started and informs him not to do those things.

Other anglers who are upset by the above avg. angler trying to deter the less experienced angler from posting above specifics, decide to bash him and call him selfish. 

Eventually the angler no longer participates in the site discussions. 

Now his knowledge is gone forever.

Landowners get mad b/c all the additional new fisherman who thought the land that was "PUBLIC" trash and disrespect their property. Land gets posted.

Less land to fish.

More arguing on the discussion boards. Moderators get mad.

Newer anglers lose opportunities of knowledge b/c the above avg angler no longer shares.

Moral of the story... everyone loses.

So happy posting.


----------



## creekcrawler (Oct 5, 2004)

> get there panties in a bunch


Correction. Steelheaders would get their _*polypropalene, extra heavy thermals*_ in a bunch. 


This whole post wouldn't have happenend if everybody just learned how to read
the *flow gauges*. 

Maybe we ought to have a sticky with river flow gauges?


----------



## creekcrawler (Oct 5, 2004)

oooops, my bad. Didn't know there was a sticky .....


----------



## Addiction (Apr 18, 2008)

nobody at all was getting upset about anything all i asked is any river going to be fishable tomm thats it i dont wanna waste a trip coming an hour and half away and thats what started it all. i catch my steelhead everytime i go out and dont need anybodies help telling me where to go i do it on my own all i was asking if they thought it would be fishable. thanks but i guess this is too hard of a question to asssk!


----------



## MEISTERICS (May 15, 2006)

Check flow guages. You could have answered the question on your own. Most people drive long distances to rivers. Ninety min is common. Its a part of the game.


----------



## Addiction (Apr 18, 2008)

ive asked before and it was probly some one you people that gave me the figure it out kinda answer no help at all so thats why i decided to ask but gee thanx for the help buddy


----------



## Fishin Musician (Jan 2, 2007)

Addiction said:


> ive asked before and it was probly some one you people that gave me the figure it out kinda answer no help at all so thats why i decided to ask but gee thanx for the help buddy



Feel free to ask me anytime Addiction......Just PM me, if you dont like to get beat up! 
Maturing of a Fishermen or Trying to be a nice guy....Your choice.


----------



## Addiction (Apr 18, 2008)

appecitate it fm i deal with these type of people everyday on the job so i know what makes them tick, but never thought on here there would be such a bashing on here for just asking if any river would be fishable. guess ill just have to find out on my own ( i thought this was a site where you shared info) guess i was wrong thinking that. and if anyone wants to help me to learn how to read a ``flow chart`` i would appreciate it and dont bother if your going to be a smart a$$ about it.


----------



## K gonefishin (May 4, 2004)

Pretty much.....




MEISTERICS said:


> Maturing of a River fisherman...
> 
> New guy starts posting asking how and where to catch fish and get upset when someone says NO.
> 
> ...


----------



## ryosapien (Jul 5, 2008)

flow charts don't tell you about clarity. the sticky numbers are pretty accurate a little lower for fly fishing. In general on the downslope means stream is clearing and fishing will be good due to new influx of fish and inc. feeding of holding fish. Consistent levels accompanied by rains can mean muddy waters, see what people are saying here if you are far away. raising water even at the optimal level usually means murky waters. I take notes with flow levels each time i go out. 24hr precipitation at counties in ohio can be found here. http://www.afws.net/states/oh/oh.htm
got that from a nice guy on here. an anomaly i have noticed is that if you fish on low water days when rain is scheduled fishing can really pick up just as it starts to rain. LIve and learn .....the progression of the steelhead fisherman is dead on hilarious.


----------



## MEISTERICS (May 15, 2006)

Fish, there is a sticky on the top of the page that idicates what rivers fish at what flows. CFM stands for cubic feet per min. If the river is higher then those suggested flows its not likely NOT favorable conditions by most people standards. The illustration on that post will teach you no more or less than anyone on this site.

The info is there and no one is hiding it from you. You have to do some leg work. 

And being able to tell if the river will fish this weekend is about as easy as predicting the weather this week. The temps are going to be dipping into the low 20's causing slush and freezing. They are calling for precip everyday. So you can wake up early check the temps and flows before driving. VERY EASY.


----------



## MuskieJim (Apr 11, 2007)

To be clear, I did try to help you and let you know that everything was blown out. You asked if things were fishable. This question's answer does not lead anywhere to naming a specific location. That's all I'm saying. Naming a stocked river that you fished (i.e. Grand, Chargin, Rock) is one thing, but small water is fished hard enough without being put under the microscope of the internet forums. FM, if you can't understand that at all, then I'm sorry that we can't agree. I too am more than happy to share info, and was not "bashing" on anyone. This is nothing personal.


----------



## Patricio (Feb 2, 2007)

creekcrawler, you would have loved it this past spring. I used to fish it almost eclusively, then last year I went there for my usual sunday outings, and man, there must have been over a hundred people there. those of us who fished it regularly kinda got to know each other, or at least recognize one another or the same vehicles that were there every weekend. but wow, completely new faces and many of them hadnt a clue on this stream. this is prolly the most difficult stream to fish, as the fish hide in particular spots, and the only way to know this is to fish it regularly. I went home and read the board that night only to find out someone hot spotted it the day before. someone with 1 post, and even gave directions. since then, I find garbage laying about, broken nets, beer bottles and the like. its never been the same since. 

what I dont get is the centerpinners that were there that day. the ditch is 10ft wide in some areas, whats the point of a 13ft long rod? overkill. but I have seen a centerpinner there since. so that's nice.

I also agree with MJ, I grew up next to a small stream not too far from there, caught my first trout on a fly back in the early 80's in that stream, and now that section is closed off to fisherman.

btw: its not a great stream to fish. the fishing isnt constant. the fish are in it irregularly. they come one day and leave the next.


----------



## reo (May 22, 2004)

Very, VERY well stated!



MEISTERICS said:


> Maturing of a River fisherman...
> 
> New guy starts posting asking how and where to catch fish and get upset when someone says NO.
> 
> ...


----------



## joewallguy (Jan 18, 2008)

Mepps3 said:


> This is why I don't post much on this site anymore. Exact locations will take away more stream access.



Exactly the reason I dont post either. Too many loud mouths.


MuskieJim, good to see you have learned it dosent pay to give away locations.

I know many,many more great steelheaders that will not post here for the same reasons. People that could really add to this forum.


----------



## Patricio (Feb 2, 2007)

with hacks like Darcy Egan making their careers out of hot spotting, I'm beginning to think it doesnt matter. the idiot writes for a major newspaper and openly mentions ditches that will be fishable. god I hate that guy.


----------



## jlamson (Oct 18, 2006)

the only thing that gets me, is the guides that bring fisherman from all over and are making $$$ on the holes that may took someone to find it on him or herself, but what can ya do, its the facts. i guess i dont fish if its over crowded i go somewhere else, and its only going to get worse. the way i prevent this from happing i get to the whole an hour early most cases theres never anyone there. since gun season is postponed till 20th time to get a line wet  good fishing all


----------



## ShutUpNFish (Apr 17, 2007)

I haventn't read down through all these posts, so this may have already been covered. However, its called "spot burning" soon to effect the Ohio tribs like it has effected the PA tribs. I have seen the negative effects that various fishing boards have played as well as the positive ones....the spot burning is certainly a negative one. I just think people should use discretion and good judgment when talking about certain places to fish....especially when the places are smaller, more secluded and hold less fish that could potentially be ruined by being over pressured. The numbers of fishermen on the Erie tribs has grown tremendously in just the past few years and part of the reason is clearly these boards....All we can do is ask that folks be smart about posting specifics about spots that not only YOU enjoy. Theres a difference between telling a couple friends about a spot and posting out here for the whole world to view! Just my .02

p.s. Jim when you coming out East here to fish the "zoo" with me...Its actually not too bad this time of year if you can stand the cold...I personally love it! Later


----------



## MuskieJim (Apr 11, 2007)

I'm in! I'll shoot you a PM soon! You can come to my neck of the woods too! Lots of private property with permission to fish  

Fishing Musician, I saw your post on another thread saying that everyone "jumped" you. Once again, this is nothing personal. There are a lot of people who feel that posting a 1/2 mile long creek on a public forum (Note: that you don't even have to be a member of to read!    ) a little inappropriate.


----------



## Fishin Musician (Jan 2, 2007)

Geesh, Let it alone already. 

That stinking little stretch is a PUBLIC PARK! It is on EVERY STINKING Lake Metro parks Flier. Sorry to tell you that it NOT a secret. Now I wont tell about my secret places....But buddy THAT PLACE AIN'T NO SECRET!


----------



## nooffseason (Nov 15, 2008)

Hey can I get the coordinates for Paine Creek?

hahahah, jk


----------



## KSUFLASH (Apr 14, 2004)

> I know many,many more great steelheaders that will not post here for the same reasons. People that could really add to this forum.


Signed

flash---------------------------out


----------



## ShutUpNFish (Apr 17, 2007)

Some people just don't get it and probably never will unless their "honey hole" starts getting hammered....its not worth the time nor the aggravation!


----------



## ryosapien (Jul 5, 2008)

ShutUpNFish said:


> Some people just don't get it and probably never will unless their "honey hole" starts getting hammered....its not worth the time nor the aggravation!


that's what she said


----------



## JohnnyN (Oct 9, 2008)

Am I the only one that thinks this thread has gone on a bit too long? I may be a relative noob to this forum, but I think we can agree that the arguments to be made have been made, and no one is switching their minds because of what the other guys are saying. We all know no one is going to "win" this debate, so maybe the hostility could go down a few notches. It may be time to just let it die... Now I'm guilty of adding my two cents like the rest of you

-JN

Edit:


ryosapien said:


> that's what she said


hahaha nice


----------



## DanAdelman (Sep 19, 2005)

I agree not to mention unstocked tribs... How they do crowd so easily....As much water as ohio has at certain off times there can only be a few places to catch fish...


----------

