# Coshocton 26pt poached buck



## ErieIslander (Jul 12, 2012)

https://woodburyoutfitters.com/the-..._COPY_01)&mc_cid=e44c5fbe14&mc_eid=f72cdc6657


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## Flathead76 (May 2, 2010)

This is probably the first time since the new restitution fine system that the fine has been paid. The poacher paid on the spot. Worst than that is since he is Amish his face will not be plastered all over the news and social media like anyone else who would have poached a buck of this caliber.


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## 1more (Jan 10, 2015)

What a shame, that’s a monster of a buck.


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## mike hunt (Jan 19, 2014)




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## Shad Rap (Nov 10, 2010)

Not too often do you see a mainframe 16 point...


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## Roosted (Sep 28, 2014)

Yeh what a shame on a deer like that. That was probably pocket change to that Amish. Pretty much a slap on the wrist. What a idiot to think he could get away with that checking a buck prior to that the same day. He should of had his license taken away for life in Ohio. What a waste !


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## chadwimc (Jun 27, 2007)

At least they held *ONE* amish poacher accountable. They seem to get a pass. Every time. Poaching, trespassing, road hunting from a Yoder toter. I've seen it all. Law enforcement just shrugs it off. *IF* they respond at all. Now if the state would just police the amish deer farmers who knowingly introduce CWD to Ohio...


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## buckeyebowman (Feb 24, 2012)

chadwimc said:


> At least they held *ONE* amish poacher accountable. They seem to get a pass. Every time. Poaching, trespassing, road hunting from a Yoder toter. I've seen it all. Law enforcement just shrugs it off. *IF* they respond at all. Now if the state would just police the amish deer farmers who knowingly introduce CWD to Ohio...


True that! My BIL deals with it every day. He calls the Amish the "Blue Scourge"! He manages a 400+ acre property in Amish country, and they trespass and poach like crazy! He patrols the woods on a regular basis, and one benefit of this is that they keep him supplied with tree stands, which he confiscates! Yet, try to ask permission to hunt on Amish owned land, forget it! 

And does anyone besides me find it amazing that a member of a religion that "seems" to decry material possessions can come up with a chunk of change in excess of 28K?! In one fell swoop?!


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## slimdaddy45 (Aug 27, 2007)

I think they all come together I watched a you tube video where if they need dr care that they all pitch in to pay the hospital bill after the family pays so much they all pay the rest sorta like amish insurance so maybe that's how he came up with all of it


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Dirty rotten shame.
Agree that his hunting privileges should be taken away for much longer.


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## bobberbucket (Mar 30, 2008)

buckeyebowman said:


> And does anyone besides me find it amazing that a member of a religion that "seems" to decry material possessions can come up with a chunk of change in excess of 28K?! In one fell swoop?!


If you’ve ever been to a gun or land auction where the Amish are present you’d know that they show up with the community’s money and if they want it they buy it! 

Im sure he had to have an awkward conversation with the bishop about it but that fine was a drop in the bucket compared to how much cash the Amish community wields. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

no jail time and just 1 yr hunting suspension because he was able to pay his fine was a slap in the face to every true sportsman out there. we would all love to be hunting and have a monster like that walk in. the fine was good but the jail time should have been at least a yr with suspension of hunting privileges for 10 yrs or for life. I just hate to see a real trophy poached by anyone. punishment did not match the crime.
sherman


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## loweman165 (May 15, 2015)

I have family that lives in that area. They refer to the amish as " Locusts" because they'll rape your land of everything, including any wild berries, ginseng, or any other edible plant life.


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## Doboy (Oct 13, 2008)

Most Likely, he's part of the SAME GANG that loaded up the TOTER,,,, and came down to Dresden * TO HUNT DEER WITH DOGS!!!*
The Amish didn't own the dogs,,,,, the local, that lived up on the hill above our camp, did. 
He had a slew of 'em. 
We would shoot 3 or 4 dogs as they ran the deer in archery season,, but the OLD FART would raise 3 or 4 more. I still wonder how much he was getting paid!?

Ya,,, I/ WE HAD a beautiful private property camp Right on the Muskingun River bank,,,,, 
since 1975ish.
It became sickening,,,, usually 4 of us sitting in tree stands all day,,,,, then watch 3 or 4 hounds run pass,,, chasing ALL of the deer out of our private property,,,, up over the hill & down into the next valley! The dogs stop barking, shortly after the gun goes off. (archery season)

During gun season, I approached the 'Toter',,,,,, The driver, was sitting, waiting in the van.
He told me to go back & open up the box trailer lid. There had to be 7-8 deer stacked in there,,, I couldn't see the bottom, & I never seen a tag. I WISH one of us had a camera!
All of the 'boys' were still out there in the dark, searching for the wounded deer,,,,
& We could still hear the dogs barking!
& Yes,,,,, the warden knew exactly what was going on,,,,, & who owned the dogs.
He knew that those dogs were fed 365, all year long,,,,, with the deer that were chased off of the gamelands.
& We knew that for a fact.



Ya,,,,, I'll continue to tell this story, till the day I DIE!
I'm still pissed.

THANKS,,,,, for posting that link. I'll pass it on to my old gang.
I'm SURE that they'll be TICKLED PINK,,,, reading about it!!!


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

I just read a follow up story on another forum that tells how he got caught. but its to much for me to put all the details in this post. but it was another hunter that had been hunting the same deer. I don't know if i'll get away with this but here goes. I read it in a thread at Michigan-sportsman.com
sherman


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## Muddy (May 7, 2017)

One of my friends had a run in with the Amish running dogs on his farm during deer season. They came from public land two miles away and trespassed across multiple farms before they got to him. They had radio tracking collars on their dogs. They said that they were coyote hunting. Maybe they were hunting coyotes, maybe they weren’t. He has his entire farm clearly posted with huge home made signs. He absolutely lost it and the argument got very heated. They haven’t come back.


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## Ctowner (May 9, 2017)

Roosted said:


> Yeh what a shame on a deer like that. That was probably pocket change to that Amish. Pretty much a slap on the wrist. What a idiot to think he could get away with that checking a buck prior to that the same day. He should of had his license taken away for life in Ohio. What a waste !


theres a lot of little bucks get poached dnr dont put those in the paper they also get big doent make a good story


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## ErieIslander (Jul 12, 2012)

Seems like total disrespect for following the rules and respecting other people’s property. Luckily I haven’t had any encounters or issues where I hunt. I gave one of their bus drivers a tongue lashing at the McDonald’s in Urichsville during gun season. Guy was blocking the entire entrance way while the bus of hunters were being dropped off. Blocked the entire entry parking lot and drive thru entrance. Easily could have just parked the bus in the designated parking area and prevented blocking others access. Acted like he owned the place. Should have seen his face when I told him to get they’re buggy out of the way and how rude they were...Other patrons chimed I’m too once I spoke up.


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## bobk (Apr 30, 2004)

https://woodburyoutfitters.com/the-...-poached-26-point-coshocton-county-ohio-buck/


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## bobk (Apr 30, 2004)

After reading all the crap the devious guy did he should not have a license ever.


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## Beepum19 (Apr 9, 2016)

And he would of got away with it if the other hunters were not obsessed over it. The metal tags and check stations seem like a better way of tagging a deer. You have to be present and show the deer


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## Flathead76 (May 2, 2010)

Beepum19 said:


> And he would of got away with it if the other hunters were not obsessed over it. The metal tags and check stations seem like a better way of tagging a deer. You have to be present and show the deer


No accountability with the current system. With everyone including the Amish with cell phones today there is no excuse to not have to include a picture text of the animal that you are checking in to get your conformation number. If you do not have a phone then you have to check it in the old way and they take a picture for you of the animal that you are checking in. That's how you make all this BS stop. The way it's set up you can just keep shooting until you get the one that you want. When you do just feed the unwanted rack to your dog or throw it in a ditch like this dirtbag did. Didn't get the one that you wanted this season just call in an 8 or 10 point then kill two antlered deer next year just as long as one matches the number of points your golden. Shoot an antlered deer early but still want to keep going no problem. Just throw out a drinker that you kill since 2011 and upgrade as long as the points match your good to go. The metal tags made this last case impossible.


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## ErieIslander (Jul 12, 2012)

Flathead76 said:


> No accountability with the current system. With everyone including the Amish with cell phones today there is no excuse to not have to include a picture text of the animal that you are checking in to get your conformation number. If you do not have a phone then you have to check it in the old way and they take a picture for you of the animal that you are checking in. That's how you make all this BS stop. The way it's set up you can just keep shooting until you get the one that you want. When you do just feed the unwanted rack to your dog or throw it in a ditch like this dirtbag did. Didn't get the one that you wanted this season just call in an 8 or 10 point then kill two antlered deer next year just as long as one matches the number of points your golden. Shoot an antlered deer early but still want to keep going no problem. Just throw out a drinker that you kill since 2011 and upgrade as long as the points match your good to go. The metal tags made this last case impossible.


Totally agree. This current system promotes unethical poaching and illegal buck kills.


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

bobk said:


> https://woodburyoutfitters.com/the-...-poached-26-point-coshocton-county-ohio-buck/


thank you for posting the follow up mr bob. I didnt know how to do it.

in Indiana now they want you to check your deer in by phone, a poachers dream come true.
sherman


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## ErieIslander (Jul 12, 2012)

https://www.cleveland.com/expo/news/erry-2018/12/4b0fff1e7c8540/buggies-vs-big-rigs-143-millio.html Big money being spent to accommodate buggies. Has anyone else noticed buggies conserving their lights and only turning them on when they see a car coming? I have in Guernsey. I think a better system would require multiple and constant lighting when on the roadways during low light and at night. Seems like common sense especially on hilly/winding Ohio roadways.


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## Ctowner (May 9, 2017)

Muddy said:


> One of my friends had a run in with the Amish running dogs on his farm during deer season. They came from public land two miles away and trespassed across multiple farms before they got to him. They had radio tracking collars on their dogs. They said that they were coyote hunting. Maybe they were hunting coyotes, maybe they weren’t. He has his entire farm clearly posted with huge home made signs. He absolutely lost it and the argument got very heated. They haven’t come back.


built a 6 foot fence around ur land deer can get in dogs and coyotes cant


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## Beepum19 (Apr 9, 2016)

How easy do you think it is now for your wife or girlfriend or any non hunter to check a buck in now? Antlers crazed guys now will buy people tags before the season starts to kill a extra buck. At least with the metal tag system you had to be present. And always took the risk of seeing a game warden at the check station. The system is flawed. It comes down to profit.


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

we had the check at check in station with metal tags. then Indiana went to a phone check in and they just give you a number to write on the paper tag you print online on your printer. how easy does Indiana want it to be to poach?????????
sherman


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

sherman51 said:


> we had the check at check in station with metal tags. then Indiana went to a phone check in and they just give you a number to write on the paper tag you print online on your printer. how easy does Indiana want it to be to poach?????????
> sherman


Gotta say it again uncle Sherm...
...*a poacher is gonna poach regardless of the system used!
*
Have you ever known a law to stop a criminal from committing a crime if they want to commit it???


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## Shad Rap (Nov 10, 2010)

fastwater said:


> Gotta say it again uncle Sherm...
> ...*a poacher is gonna poach regardless of the system used!
> *
> Have you ever known a law to stop a criminal from committing a crime if they want to commit it???


Exactly...these people blaming the system are ridiculous...it was just as easy to not take a deer to the check station as it is to not pick up the phone...or to have your wife buy a tag or whoever and check it in under their name...it's not the system...it does not promote poaching...most absurd thing I've ever heard...a poacher was always a poacher...the system of check-in is irrelevant.
Right...all these poachers were waiting for the system change then said 'Hey let's go poach a deer'....roflmao.


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## Shad Rap (Nov 10, 2010)

Beepum19 said:


> And he would of got away with it if the other hunters were not obsessed over it. The metal tags and check stations seem like a better way of tagging a deer. You have to be present and show the deer


He would of got away with it if he kept it all to himself...but why do that...if you poach something like that, you can't do anything with it...then that comes back to the question of why poach it anyway?..can't even brag about it let alone show it to someone.


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## Flathead76 (May 2, 2010)

Shad Rap said:


> He would of got away with it if he kept it all to himself...but why do that...if you poach something like that, you can't do anything with it...then that comes back to the question of why poach it anyway?..can't even brag about it let alone show it to someone.


Regardless of how you killed a monster buck you are unfortunately hated by your fellow hunters due to jealousy if your kill was legal or not. Unfortunately the best thing that you could do if you kill a monster deer is just keep it to yourself. If you own the property it will be hunted to death on all sides of you. If you do not own the property it will be leased out with a quickness and you will be ass out on ever hunting it again. If it were on public the entire county would feel the pain of your success. Most likely you wouldn't make one thin dime on your kill.


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## Flathead76 (May 2, 2010)

fastwater said:


> Gotta say it again uncle Sherm...
> ...*a poacher is gonna poach regardless of the system used!
> *
> Have you ever known a law to stop a criminal from committing a crime if they want to commit it???


Fortunately most of the people who do poach are stupid and have to show off their stupidity of their actions. That how most of these numb nuts get caught by showing off their kills to their friends through text or Facebook. The new check system is great for people who poach that can keep their mouth shut on what they have killed.


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## miked913 (Feb 29, 2008)

Flathead76 said:


> Fortunately most of the people who do poach are stupid and have to show off their stupidity of their actions. That how most of these numb nuts get caught by showing off their kills to their friends through text or Facebook. The new check system is great for people who poach that can keep their mouth shut on what they have killed.


Why would you think this system is any different? Once again I point to West Virginia 2015 the 1st year they went to telecheck, their deer kill increased by 32% how can you possibly account for an increase of 1/3 of the deer kill without saying it is a BETTER system? Even if you think it was a good year it was still more than 10% better than any other kill by comparison.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk


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## Flathead76 (May 2, 2010)

miked913 said:


> Why would you think this system is any different? Once again I point to West Virginia 2015 the 1st year they went to telecheck, their deer kill increased by 32% how can you possibly account for an increase of 1/3 of the deer kill without saying it is a BETTER system? Even if you think it was a good year it was still more than 10% better than any other kill by comparison.
> 
> Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk


Post #22 gives you all sorts of examples on how to check in an antlered deer with zero accountability.


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## miked913 (Feb 29, 2008)

Then post 36 says you're full of sh*t

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## Flathead76 (May 2, 2010)

miked913 said:


> Then post 36 says you're full of sh*t
> 
> Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk


Thanks for post #36 that lists all of the examples backing up the points of your discussion. Your post is a prime example of why discussions on topics in threads get locked up. Just because someone's opinion is is different than your does not mean that they are full of ****. Merry Christmas.


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## Hatchetman (Apr 13, 2004)

Shad Rap said:


> He would of got away with it if he kept it all to himself...but why do that...if you poach something like that, you can't do anything with it...then that comes back to the question of why poach it anyway?..can't even brag about it let alone show it to someone.


A poacher is a poacher is a poacher. Having a telephone does not make you a poacher. Do you honestly think that an individual that doesn't poach would suddenly decide to start poaching because they can phone check? Get real guys, there are people that are born to break the law and a metal tag isn't going to stop them from doing it. If the truth be known, the phone system it made it easier for the law abiding people, I know it did for me....


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## J. Tyler cline (Jun 30, 2018)

Flathead76 said:


> Thanks for post #36 that lists all of the examples backing up the points of your discussion. Your post is a prime example of why discussions on topics in threads get locked up. Just because someone's opinion is is different than your does not mean that they are full of ****. Merry Christmas.[/QUOTE


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## Captain chrome (Oct 20, 2018)

Amish are definitely taking over with hunting and now with fishing on Lake Erie they own boats docked and have them towed to the lake, I’ve talked to some and they brag about keeping over a 1,000 eyes last season ?


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## Muddy (May 7, 2017)

Hatchetman said:


> A poacher is a poacher is a poacher. Having a telephone does not make you a poacher. Do you honestly think that an individual that doesn't poach would suddenly decide to start poaching because they can phone check? Get real guys, there are people that are born to break the law and a metal tag isn't going to stop them from doing it. If the truth be known, the phone system it made it easier for the law abiding people, I know it did for me....


I agree on all points. I like the phone check system. There are dishonest, greedy, low life people who poach deer. There always have been, and always will be. We can’t change that. For the majority of honest people the phone check system has made life easier. It can also help law enforcement with real time information. I would venture to bet that the new system has helped law enforcement to do their job better more than once.


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## miked913 (Feb 29, 2008)

See post 34 where I even gave stats! Have yourself a happy new year! 

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## Flathead76 (May 2, 2010)

miked913 said:


> See post 34 where I even gave stats! Have yourself a happy new year!
> 
> Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk


Then don't reference post 36.


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

fastwater said:


> Gotta say it again uncle Sherm...
> ...*a poacher is gonna poach regardless of the system used!
> *
> Have you ever known a law to stop a criminal from committing a crime if they want to commit it???


I agree with you on a criminal or poacher if they want something bad enough they will find a way to get it. there are bad people, good people, then there is people that is on the fence. make something easy enough and some of the people will fall off the fence. I have always said locks wasnt for criminals but to keep honest people honest.



miked913 said:


> Then post 36 says you're full of sh*t
> 
> Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk


just saying there is no reason to slam anyone because you disagree with them. I have more or less been told I am full of $hi*. but thats just because they disagree with my logic. so please lets keep it clean.
sherman


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## Morrowtucky Mike (May 2, 2018)

sherman51 said:


> no jail time and just 1 yr hunting suspension because he was able to pay his fine was a slap in the face to every true sportsman out there. we would all love to be hunting and have a monster like that walk in. the fine was good but the jail time should have been at least a yr with suspension of hunting privileges for 10 yrs or for life. I just hate to see a real trophy poached by anyone. punishment did not match the crime.
> sherman


Just proves that it’s all about the money with our court system.


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## FarmerChris (Oct 31, 2011)

So is this thread opinions on Amish or game law violators? I’ve read more sophisticated stories of poaching by organized “non Amish” people. It appears to me this fellow was severely tempted. He shot a nice 8 pt buck and legally tagged if. He continued hunting to fill the 2 antlerless tags when this buck of a lifetime comes by. He shot it and tried getting it mounted using tag from the other buck. How many of you or others you know would do the same if faced with same situation? It is not right. He got caught and will pay the price society has determined appropriate for the crime. I have lived among Amish for 50 years. They love to hunt and fish. I don’t condone thir practices and have had several personal run in’s with them. I don’t believe they are conservation minded sportsman. As long as they follow the law we should not be judging them. IMO. Many of the previous posts only serve to form my opinion of the writer, not the subject under discussion.


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## buckeyebowman (Feb 24, 2012)

Shad Rap said:


> He would of got away with it if he kept it all to himself...but why do that...if you poach something like that, you can't do anything with it...then that comes back to the question of why poach it anyway?..can't even brag about it let alone show it to someone.


Exactly. Some years ago a group of poachers tried to recruit my buddy into their ranks. He was known to play a little fast and loose with the waterfowl regs since his family had documents that gave rights "in perpetuity" to hunt that lake. New ownership said no such rights existed, and the local courts (paid off) agreed. 

So, this guy takes my buddy up into the loft of his barn where there are B&C racks galore! My buddy made the same point you do, Shad Rap, how can you brag about it?Who can you show this to?! 

These guys were cruising around in the middle of the night on ATV's with rifles equipped w/night vision scopes. Yes, they were first and second generation scopes, but they'd suffice!

My buddy told them to stuff their program where the sun don't shine!


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Old system versus the new, there is absolutely no difference in means of poaching. 
Under the old system:
If someone didn't want to check a deer...they didn't.
If they wanted to check a deer in someone else's name...they could. Just had to have that person take the deer in. 

The only thing different from the old to the new system is not physically taking the deer to a designated location. That's it!

Please name me one way a deer can be poached under the new system that it couldn't be done under the old.


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## Flathead76 (May 2, 2010)

fastwater said:


> Old system versus the new, there is absolutely no difference in means of poaching.
> Under the old system:
> If someone didn't want to check a deer...they didn't.
> If they wanted to check a deer in someone else's name...they could. Just had to have that person take the deer in.
> ...


You are done hunting deer for the year. You didn't kill an antlered deer. So just call in an 8 point. Next year kill the first 8 point that you see. Cut it up yourself. Chuck last years conformation number on the rack and keep hunting with your 2019 tag. If you get checked by the DNR you have a legal tag on it. There is no way that this could be done under the old system with the metal tag.


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## Flathead76 (May 2, 2010)

fastwater said:


> Old system versus the new, there is absolutely no difference in means of poaching.
> Under the old system:
> If someone didn't want to check a deer...they didn't.
> If they wanted to check a deer in someone else's name...they could. Just had to have that person take the deer in.
> ...


In 2011 they changed the tag where you made your own tag. Your biggest risk of getting caught is getting the deer to your truck. With the old tags you had to fill out the tag that you purchased. If you filled out the colored tag even if you did not check the deer into a check station the tag was pretty much worthless to try and use again. With the make a tag there are definitely people who keep on using the same tag if they cut up thier own deer.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Flathead76 said:


> You are done hunting deer for the year. You didn't kill an antlered deer. So just call in an 8 point. Next year kill the first 8 point that you see. Cut it up yourself. Chuck last years conformation number on the rack and keep hunting with your 2019 tag. If you get checked by the DNR you have a legal tag on it. There is no way that this could be done under the old system with the metal tag.


Correct...but if I'm a poacher, under the old system if I shot a buck early on and wanted to keep on hunting, I just didn't check that deer, processed it myself and kept it in a relatives/ extended families freezer(and if I was real stupid, kept it in my own) and kept right on hunting. Which in reality, was easier cause I didn't even have to bother calling in that deer keeping track of numbers/which meat went with which deer etc.

There is not a system out there that someone will not beat. Not unless every Hunter is assigned his/her ODNR officials that hunts with them everyday.
Poaching has always been a huge problem. Want to slow it way down, make the fines and jails times so insane...and mandatory with no exceptions for even first time offenders that more people think twice before poaching.
If the poacher still wants to roll those dice(and there will be some)...well they just have to pay the price.


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## jbo (Apr 24, 2014)

fastwater said:


> Old system versus the new, there is absolutely no difference in means of poaching.
> Under the old system:
> If someone didn't want to check a deer...they didn't.
> If they wanted to check a deer in someone else's name...they could. Just had to have that person take the deer in.
> ...


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

jbo,
Why couldn't the same not been done under the old system?
I live within 2 miles of two different counties and within 10 miles of 3.
Under the old system, I could have easily shot a deer and checked it in any of the three counties.


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## Flathead76 (May 2, 2010)

fastwater said:


> Correct...but if I'm a poacher, under the old system if I shot a buck early on and wanted to keep on hunting, I just didn't check that deer, processed it myself and kept it in a relatives/ extended families freezer(and if I was real stupid, kept it in my own) and kept right on hunting. Which in reality, was easier cause I didn't even have to bother calling in that deer keeping track of numbers/which meat went with which deer etc.
> 
> There is not a system out there that someone will not beat. Not unless every Hunter is assigned his/her ODNR officials that hunts with them everyday.
> Poaching has always been a huge problem. Want to slow it way down, make the fines and jails times so insane...and mandatory with no exceptions for even first time offenders that more people think twice before poaching.
> If the poacher still wants to roll those dice(and there will be some)...well they just have to pay the price.


Your correct on the part of if there is a way to beat a system someone will figure out a way to beat it. With today's technology there isn't any reason to not have where a picture text of the deer being checked in. By doing this you could make it more difficult for the person who has different people check in deer for you. Could you imagine a person getting checked by a game warden and having multiple racks of deer from people hanging in their home. There would be some serious explaining as to why are there mounts from other people displayed in the home that do not live at the home. It would be extra difficult to explain if pictures were also part of the conformation number process. No two whitetail racks are the same. A lot of these trophy deer become celebrities in the areas in which they live. Having to provide a picture as part of the call in system might make people think twice before doing something stupid. Some of the old check in stations would take Polaroid pictures of the bucks that got checked in as a bragging board for other hunters to see.


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## J2jm (Apr 20, 2015)

Surprised this thread has 3 pages. Usually administrators remove anything not flattering about the Amish.


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## son of rooster (Apr 25, 2005)

Shad Rap said:


> Exactly...these people blaming the system are ridiculous...it was just as easy to not take a deer to the check station as it is to not pick up the phone...or to have your wife buy a tag or whoever and check it in under their name...it's not the system...it does not promote poaching...most absurd thing I've ever heard...a poacher was always a poacher...the system of check-in is irrelevant.
> Right...all these poachers were waiting for the system change then said 'Hey let's go poach a deer'....roflmao.


I agree that the current system has nothing to do with making people poachers. People poached under the days of check stations and metal tags too.
People act like the people at the check station had some ODNR authority/interrogation capability to determine if your kill was legit or not. When if fact it was some person usually who was a young kid or non-hunter who didn't know a buck from a doe.
People are going to poach, because some people are turds.


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## squid_1 (Jun 2, 2005)

fastwater said:


> Old system versus the new, there is absolutely no difference in means of poaching.
> Under the old system:
> If someone didn't want to check a deer...they didn't.
> If they wanted to check a deer in someone else's name...they could. Just had to have that person take the deer in.
> ...


Old system you cannot move deer from field unless tag is filled out and attached.
New system same thing but you print off several copies. Get the deer home tag is removed and deer is processed. Next time out you still have a deer permit and so on and so on.


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## crappiedude (Mar 12, 2006)

I've knew more people under the old system who would not check in deer or would hunt out of season it was unbelievable but in all fairness I was out and about more people back then so maybe I just heard about it more.
One problem the DNR said of the old system was it was almost impossible to keep track of all that information. Lots of those old paper records got lost in the shuffle or the info was entered in to the system incorrectly once they obtained it. 
On several of the check stations I would use they had a table set up. You walked in, filled out the paper work and give it to the guy behind the counter. He'd hand you the tag to put on the deer. I asked him if he was going to put it on and he said no. One guy said he wouldn't leave his store unattended to tag a deer. It's easy to figure out how accurate this system was.
As I said in another thread, everyone back in the day knew someone who'd check in deer for others so they could keep hunting. If you knew the guy who owned the check station well that opened up a whole new possibility for inaccuracy.
It's was just as easy back then as it is now to just shoot a deer and take it home and butcher it. I have to say in 45 years of hunting I don't know anyone who encounter a game warden during the process. I don't know anyone who had their freezer checked to see what you have in there to make sure it's all legal.
As far a making the punishment worse it's just not going to happen. The jails are full with violent criminals and it too expensive to house a guy for killing a deer. Who's going to pay for building jails just to house poacher's or game violators? No one.

The real truth is that one system isn't any better than the other. Deer checking is largely made up of being on an honor system. It's not the system that's bad...it's the same people who violated the rules back then are still going to violate the rules now.


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

fastwater said:


> Correct...but if I'm a poacher, under the old system if I shot a buck early on and wanted to keep on hunting, I just didn't check that deer, processed it myself and kept it in a relatives/ extended families freezer(and if I was real stupid, kept it in my own) and kept right on hunting. Which in reality, was easier cause I didn't even have to bother calling in that deer keeping track of numbers/which meat went with which deer etc.
> 
> There is not a system out there that someone will not beat. Not unless every Hunter is assigned his/her ODNR officials that hunts with them everyday.
> Poaching has always been a huge problem. Want to slow it way down, make the fines and jails times so insane...and mandatory with no exceptions for even first time offenders that more people think twice before poaching.
> If the poacher still wants to roll those dice(and there will be some)...well they just have to pay the price.


large fines and mandatory jail time of at least 1 yr for 1st offenders. huge fines with mandatory 5 yrs in prison for repeat offenders. then advertise what the penalty is for poaching so everyone knows what happens to poachers. this wouldnt stop poaching but it would make it better.

I still say here in Indiana that a person can kill and make out his own tag then tag the deer. get the deer in his truck then check the deer in from another county by phone and keep on hunting in the same county. or they could have there little sister check the deer in and tear up the tag they filled out. then they could keep hunting and make out a new tag if they killed another deer. at least when you bought your license and got the license and tag once the tag was filled out you couldn't make out another tag. they should go back to this system and add the county killed in.

I still say some people that wouldnt normally poach will be temped if its made so easy for them. then they might just do it just once but if they get away with it they might be tempted again hence a poacher is born.
sherman


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## dutchbuoy (Dec 24, 2014)

I am a former Amish and I thought I would share my opinion about this subject. I agree that this guy got off too easy, especially with his hunting privileges. But lets be careful not to declare all Amish as unlawful citizens, when in fact the vast majority of them are honest and law abiding. Hunting and fishing are high on their list (and yes there are many diehards) but to lump them all together and declare them as crooks is unfair. This guy was a bad apple in an overall good group, just like there would be in any other denomination.


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## Bluegillin' (Jan 28, 2009)

From what I have read, many people on here know of or have heard of people that were poaching. My suggestion would be to offer a few thousand dollar reward for turning in someone that is poaching. If convicted, then the person providing the information on the poacher gets paid. This could be anonymous, but given the way people can't keep their mouths shut, it would inevitability result in more people being caught. Maybe even fine all poachers an additional amount to cover the reward program. We know that game wardens cannot be everywhere so providing an incentive to the general public to stop these behaviors is the only way in my opinion.


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## Bluegillin' (Jan 28, 2009)

dutchbuoy said:


> I am a former Amish and I thought I would share my opinion about this subject. I agree that this guy got off too easy, especially with his hunting privileges. But lets be careful not to declare all Amish as unlawful citizens, when in fact the vast majority of them are honest and law abiding. Hunting and fishing are high on their list (and yes there are many diehards) but to lump them all together and declare them as crooks is unfair. This guy was a bad apple in an overall good group, just like there would be in any other denomination.


Totally agree that we should never characterize a group by a few. I will say that as a society, we could probably learn some positives from the amish. If we came together as a whole to help those in need and to support one another, this world would be better off.


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## Fish-N-Fool (Apr 12, 2004)

I have said for a long time I am a big fan of the new system! I love it! It has saved me time and gas money. Under the old system I would have to spend extra time driving to a couple places. The deer had to be checked in the county of kill or an adjacent county. I was often traveling 2+ hours from home and this was a problem a few times. Same issue with shooting a deer in the evening - the couple places within 20-30 minutes would close up at 8pm. Have to get them iced and wait until the morning.....then get to a processor if not doing yourself. 

Now there is no worry, no time constraint / crunch. I have used my cell phone to tag the last several with the only delay being when I can get good clear service. Check the deer in on the way home or to the processor and get on your way. 

I can't disagree the new system provides easy opportunity to cheat the system. However, everybody I know tags their deer in with the new system. All the guys I have always hunted with or grew up with, etc. and they all like the new system. I would guess the same is true of the rule benders and breakers - they continue to bend and break the system.

At the end of the day let's face it - the state of Ohio really doesn't place much value on a deer. And frankly, they are correct. A deer is worth little. A trophy buck really isn't all that valuable unless it is of elite caliber (I would say this 228 incher is in that Elite class). If you look at poaching penalties it rarely fits the crime which sends the wrong message to the public. Understanding their should be balance it seems the guys at the far end deserve more punishment. IMO hit guys where it hurts - cannot hunt in OH if guilty of any violation for 5 years. More severe cases up to a lifetime ban. If caught hunting under suspension jail time. Sure there would be those that ignore it, but if caught they'd owe a lot of money and 30-90 days in the tank is no joke.


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## bobk (Apr 30, 2004)

There’s no room in jail for a poacher. Heck the guy that rear ended me had no drivers license, no insurance and 2 dui’s that he never went to court over was let go. If a guy like that gets to walk a poacher is most likely walking too. Cops said they had no room in jail for him.

The old check system isn’t coming back. I don’t know a single friend that doesn’t like the phone in system much better. It’s kinda funny that it’s still being rehashed. It’s gone for good.


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## Flathead76 (May 2, 2010)

dutchbuoy said:


> I am a former Amish and I thought I would share my opinion about this subject. I agree that this guy got off too easy, especially with his hunting privileges. But lets be careful not to declare all Amish as unlawful citizens, when in fact the vast majority of them are honest and law abiding. Hunting and fishing are high on their list (and yes there are many diehards) but to lump them all together and declare them as crooks is unfair. This guy was a bad apple in an overall good group, just like there would be in any other denomination.


You are 100 percent correct. You can not paint with a broad brush if you do there will always be a bad apple that will bring the entire group down. On the other hand growing up in Geauga county and being around Amish I can say that I have never had a positive experience with them either. I also understand that the pocket that I grew up around are the ones that true Amish look down at.


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## Ctowner (May 9, 2017)

Captain chrome said:


> Amish are definitely taking over with hunting and now with fishing on Lake Erie they own boats docked and have them towed to the lake, I’ve talked to some and they brag about keeping over a 1,000 eyes last season ?


just because a black guy kills somebody dont make all blacks bad dont lump everybody together theres cheaters in every race and religion and good people


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

bobk said:


> There’s no room in jail for a poacher. Heck the guy that rear ended me had no drivers license, no insurance and 2 dui’s that he never went to court over was let go. If I Guy like that gets to walk a poacher is most likely walking too. Cops said they had no room in jail for him.
> 
> The old check system isn’t coming back. I don’t know a single friend that doesn’t like the phone in system much better. It’s kinda funny that it’s still be rehashed. It’s gone for good.


In before the lock...

Unfortunately, I agree with this post. 
The jails are over crowded and poachers are most likely not going to spend any time there. Hit the poachers where it hurts...their valuables. Make them forfeit the vehicle if evidence proved they transported poached game in it. Make them give up their weapon. If poached animal found in their freezer in their house, confiscate the whole freezer and put a lien on the house if they own. If they rent, contact their landlord putting legal pressure on them for the poachers to be removed. 
Also, the poachers don't have to do jail time. There's plenty of court ordered community services that can be ordered by the same judge the poacher is gonna face anyway on the poaching charges.
All of these above mentioned suggestions have been/ are currently able to be done. Laws are already in place to do so.
But just like many crimes today, the sentences/punishment for the crime handed out by the judge is much too soft.

In short...hit them where it hurts them the most. That's just not being done.


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## killingtime (Apr 29, 2009)

I must be really lucky because one of the farms I hunt is owned by the Amish but they are old style Amish which have no cell phones or community phone. These Amish do not hunt but raise a lot of produce in the spring and summer and like to keep the deer heard thinned out. We shoot our share of deer but do not overkill it. We usually give them a couple deer a year which they are very happy with. As mentioned not all Amish are the same and depending on what order of Amish you deal with their can be a big difference in their beliefs. Thankfully the Amish that run around in van loads and trespass don’t live in my area.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

squid_1 said:


> Old system you cannot move deer from field unless tag is filled out and attached.
> New system same thing but you print off several copies. Get the deer home tag is removed and deer is processed. Next time out you still have a deer permit and so on and so on.


The law under the old system were very clear as to what we were legally required to do from the time we bought our tag until we were sitting at our table eating back straps. The new system is very plain as to our legal responsibilities as well. 

Bottom line is... laws(not just hunting laws...all laws) are made for those that are going to choose to follow them.
Criminals are not going to conform to laws regardless of how hard or easy the laws make it on someone doing something the right way to continue to do it. Criminals are going to be just that...criminals. And criminals don't care of laws or the process's within those laws like law abiding citizens do.
Obviously, poaching has always been a problem regardless of what system any state has ever used. And it's going to continue regardless of what system is used


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## squid_1 (Jun 2, 2005)

fastwater said:


> The law under the old system were very clear as to what we were legally required to do from the time we bought our tag until we were sitting at our table eating back straps. The new system is very plain as to our legal responsibilities as well.
> 
> Bottom line is... laws(not just hunting laws...all laws) are made for those that are going to choose to follow them.
> Criminals are not going to conform to laws regardless of how hard or easy the laws make it on someone doing something the right way to continue to do it. Criminals are going to be just that...criminals. And criminals don't care of laws or the process's within those laws like law abiding citizens do.
> Obviously, poaching has always been a problem regardless of what system any state has ever used. And it's going to continue regardless of what system is used


All truths. I was only pointing out one way that the current system could make it easier. After what I paid to process mine this year I wouldn't want 2 anyway.


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## chadwimc (Jun 27, 2007)

As a landowner and outdoorsman, I have never had a positive experience with der amish while afield. You must belong to a special coven...


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## johnwells (Feb 5, 2011)

House arrest with GPS monitoring would be good too.

Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk


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