# controlled hunt issues



## ohfisherman (Aug 16, 2007)

seems to be some complaining on the way the controlled hunt drawings are conducted. people who do not agree with the current situation should contact the division of wildlife and voice their concerns. i would really like to know how many transferred permits were from people who never even had an ohio hunting license. my chances should be equal with everybody elses. i put in 1 application and the next guy invests $45.00 putting in 15 applications? is this fair? its a crock and the people running it know it. it all comes down to money. you should be able to apply ONLY IF YOU HAVE A VALID CURRENT OHIO LICENSE!!! the state and a bunch of people who apply numerous times have really screwed up what was once a good thing. by the way, in 14 years i have gotten drawn twice. once last year and this year for mosquito muzzleloader. there people who have had extra hunts that they try to sell or trade off. it states right on the permit when you get it "IT IS UNLAWFUL TO BUY, SELL, OR TRADE CONTROLLED HUNTING PERMITS ISSUED BY THE OHIO DIVISION OF WILDLIFE (ORC 1501:31-15-06)" i hope somebody from the division of wildlife reads this. its a law that is not enforced. the sad part is that everybody will just PM each other to break the law now.......by the way it is not sour grapes. there are enough permits on these sites and on craigslist that if i really wanted to go i could.


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## Mad-Eye Moody (May 27, 2008)

I would like to see a system where you have to apply for the hunt at the time you buy the license. They kicked that around before. Don't know what happened to it.

I don't think it is about money. GreatLodge, the sales agent, takes a pretty good chunk of the fee. The rest goes towards promotion, and staffing of the events. 

Now it is probably true that even though it is largely break even now, the loss in revenue from the loss in applications may make it hard to hold the hunts. But I would rather pay $10 an app. and have three times the chance to win.....


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## freyedknot (Apr 10, 2004)

at 3 bucks an entry , good luck trying to get that changed . thats sum bread and butta there !


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## ohfisherman (Aug 16, 2007)

my problem is not with the guys who enter one time. my big problem is with the tools that put in their neighbors, friends, wife, whoever. i just think that the state should do a random check to see if any of the entrants even had a hunting license before. when you signed up online it was illegal to put in other peoples info (i talked to an investigator about this and he found people who put in 10 entries with other peoples name but the same credit card!! that is why they changed it when you signed up). it states right on the permit that under ohio revised code it is unlawful to buy, sell or trade a permit. people are trading permits online as i post this, yet the state turns a blind eye towards it. i think its something about not killing the cash cow they have created. hey old timers-- remember way back when there was no entry fee? hunters were doing a service to save the state/nasa/arsenal money they would have had to pay to cull the deer. someone says 'hey, we can make some money off of this''. it went from $5.00 down to $3.00 if you do it online. i think the cost savings was from not having people open envelopes. it is bull&*@$ plain and simple. hopefully i will see a few of you at the game hearings where we can suggest things for the upcoming season. not a lot of people replying to this post. just think about it. you could put in 1 entry and probably have better odds than buying 5 or 10.


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## freyedknot (Apr 10, 2004)

then they would not GET ALL THAT MONEY!


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## Toxic (May 13, 2006)

ohfisherman said:


> when you signed up online it was illegal to put in other peoples info (i talked to an investigator about this and he found people who put in 10 entries with other peoples name but the same credit card!! that is why they changed it when you signed up).


So what do I do when my wife who hunts and my 2 son's want to go on a controlled hunt. Am I supposed to get a credit card for each one of them and they put themselves in. Or what to I do when my Dad who never owned a credit card want's to go? I have no problem with providing a hunting lic info on the app. But that to can be bypassed.


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## ohfisherman (Aug 16, 2007)

its fine if your wife and/or kids go. most of these people put in their wife and kids and then transfer over the permit to themselves. like i said they should audit these things to see if a lot of these entrants ever had a hunting license.


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## Toxic (May 13, 2006)

The only way to stop it is to allow no transfers what so ever. Bad thing is that the areas that allow controlled hunting, count on X amount of hunters in to cull X amount of deers. So what do you do to make up for the numbers of the hunters who cannot make the hunts due to what ever reason. Allow alternates? Alternates are not guaranteed to hunt. So would I drive 3-4 hours to go to a place I might not get to hunt? Probably not. 

What it boils down to is money. The ODOW makes little off of them. But what little they get, they are not relinquishing.


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## freyedknot (Apr 10, 2004)

check out the number of entries and multiply that by 3 .and you will see they get plenty of money.i call it my annual donation. i am sure they put it to good use!


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## jrsfish (May 21, 2004)

As I said in my previous post,I know of two people who do not hunt were picked and are transfering the permits to someone else,they do this all the time,to solve the unfairness,permits should not be transferable,but then that would cut down the money odnr gets,$3.00 x 44,000 applications,should pay the bills.


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## Papascott (Apr 22, 2004)

All you have to do is pay the piper! If they allow you to increase your odds by transferring permits than quit whining and start spending money.


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## big_mike (Aug 2, 2006)

I myself have never entered a "Controlled Hunt". I tried to get in during a lottery when Killdeer redzone was first opened up, but didn't get drawn. So my opinion is strictly from an outsiders point of view. First, i think you should have a valid OHIO Hunting license and deer permit, second, you must enter at the time of hunting license purchase (we have to tell them about HIP right?) Third, You can only enter the drawing 1 Time. Kentucky has a system where you enter for 4 years then automatically get drawn. It works pretty good down there.


Big Mike


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## mjeberst (Jun 18, 2007)

The Division of Wildlife is well aware of the problem with transferring the controlled hunt permits. By 2010 they are moving to a new licensing system that will allow you to apply for these hunts when you buy your hunting license. It will also require you to have held a previous hunting license to apply. People will still find a way to cheat I'm sure. I was an intern in the central office last summer and processed the paper applications. They started requring ssn's with the application to try and discourage people cheating, but you always have people out there being dishonest. As far as the division "making money" on the controlled hunts, it's a drop in the bucket after they pay for organizing, advertising, and managing these hunts. No one is getting rich from this guys.


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## Snook (Aug 19, 2008)

I agree that raising money is a big part in the developing of these hunts. If permits were not transferable there would be less applicants. More applications = more money. The number of people who get selected to hunt each area is already established before the drawings. Originally these hunts were free to enter and were developed to help reduce the deer herds in these areas. 

It's good to see people get a chance to hunt these areas but to be honest I don't think that the hunting is all that phenomenal. I have talked to many people on several different hunts and many of them never seen a deer! These areas are starting to get hunted pretty good over the past few years. Living near the Mosquito Refuge I have seen a significant reduction in the deer heard. In the late 80's early 90's that place was a whitetail bonanza with trophy class bucks and deer everywhere. Nothing to see over a hundred deer an evening with about a dozen Boone-Crockett bucks with them. Not to mention the numerous 140-150 class bucks too. When they started the hunts at Mosquito the drawing was free to enter. Just send in a 3x5 postcard with your info on it. You really had something if you were picked back then. Truthfully I don't believe they even need a hunt in there now.

The Ravenna Arsenal is another example. Although I believe that there is more deer in this area as compared to Mosquito the heard is down too. Good to see that the archery hunting drives are a thing of the past - that was CRAZY. Too bad that most of the hunts are for just antlerless deer unless they have changed things. Plus you pay an additional $5 fee at this hunt. I always felt that we were managing the heard for the APCO fish and game people by just shooting the does. Sucked that you would have a trophy buck looking at you at 10yds away and you couldn't pull the trigger. Could not see a doe to shoot. 

Interesting topic. How do others feel about the hunting in these areas?


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## ohfisherman (Aug 16, 2007)

i generally dont eat antlers so i am not really concerned about bucks. i like to get a deer in the freezer first and then look for horns later. it just so happens the first deer in each of the last two years were bucks for me. anyway, the state really needs to do something about this. the whole reason to hunt these sites was to cull the deer population. a lot of hunters walk around looking for the big bucks and dont shoot anything because they dont want to waste a tag on an average deer. i myself am from the 'if its brown its down' club. glad to see that the site members are starting to discuss this more. i was a little frustrated and figured i might as well start a good post to vent about it.


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## Snook (Aug 19, 2008)

With the exception of the Arsenal most of the hunts have a one partner either sex tag and another only having an antlerless tag. Now the good thing is that the state will let you use an "urban tag" to shoot an antlerless deer in these hunts. So if you would like to keep your more expensive "either sex" tag and still harvest a doe you can. From my understanding the success rate is about 25-30%(from the pre-hunt meetings prior to the hunt) Not all that bad considering the success rate of all Ohio deer hunters. But for those who have never been picked to participate in these hunts don't expect to see deer walking around aimlessly waiting to be shot at. In fact some hunters may not see a deer.


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