# Sunday, December 20th 9am



## Eclipse (Sep 27, 2009)

Well it's day two of the two day weekend hunt and so far I have not seen anything as of 9am. Not a single shot, even off in the distance. A great morning, nice and cold light snow so what is going on? I only had four shots way way off in the distance yesterday to lead me to believe I am not the only person that wants to put some venison on the table. I have hunted really hard this year and the deer seemed to just go nocturnal where I am! Six trail cams and very little early morning, late like 10 minutes before dark late movement. I am starting to question ODNR's estimation of the deer population or the cycle of natural movement? This is crazy! I don't know what to think but one thing is for sure my mind is running in overload trying to figure it out. There just doesn't seem to be many people hunting anymore either. Has it become frustrating for just me or does anyone else share this same frustration? Hmmm?:!


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## a1deerhunter (Feb 26, 2008)

I just got back from hunting I saw 4 bucks. All within range 60-80 yards. I already got a buck so no shots for me.


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## willieg89 (Dec 5, 2008)

hunted yesterday from 1 to dark. didnt see a deer. during bow season before it got cold i saw deer everynight from that stand crossing a field right before dark. lately i havent seen a deer there in the past 3 times ive went.


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## CasualFisherman (May 21, 2004)

I am over in Greene county and I agree that the gun season has not been what it used to be. I am used to hearing 10-20 close shots on opening morning alone and this year I only heard two and they were far off. I think with the extra weekend and more people taking up bowhunting, the pressure on opening day just isn't there. Talking with some of the neighbor's it seems half of the people took their deer early in bow season. I am used to seeing everyone and their brother out during gun season and now I see very few. I think it is both good and bad but it sure isn't like it used to be where you were just as likely to see deer at noon since so many people were stirring them up. 

Fortunately I am still seeing deer during daylight though. They haven't gone completely nocturnal here.


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## idontknow316 (Mar 21, 2008)

I'll probably get drilled for this but..... I think the limits are a bit high. You could get like 12 deer if you went zone to zone, I know this is unlikely but come on 12 deer? I could not imagine having 12 deer. But I think the increased popularity in bow hunting, a lot of guys have already filled their tags. I heard quite a few shots the first day of gun in November. Not so much after. Anyone agree with me that the limits are a bit liberal?


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## Lundy (Apr 5, 2004)

I really am not sure if the limits are too high or not, don't seem to see a huge increase in the deer kil from it

unlike Lake Erie fishermen, I don't think many take the maiximum limit of deer each year, most just don't need that many


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## Huntinbull (Apr 10, 2004)

The DOW officers that I deal with in my classes tell me that less than 1/10 of 1% of hunters in Ohio will take 4 or more deer, no matter what the tag limit is.


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## crappiedude (Mar 12, 2006)

Huntinbull said:


> The DOW officers that I deal with in my classes tell me that less than 1/10 of 1% of hunters in Ohio will take 4 or more deer, no matter what the tag limit is.


I agree with this, I've taken 3 and I quit.


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## Eclipse (Sep 27, 2009)

I believe the limits are too high and I also think ODNR hands out way to many nuisance permits but I am sure the revenue is great for the state with guys buying up permits. I base my opinion on the fact that not that long ago you would see larger groups of deer traveling together and occasionally two large family groups in a day. Now if you see the groups of three or four your doing good. I'm not necessarily including early bow season and counting fawns with their mother a heard. The only time I see larger groups or heard of deer in central Ohio is at locations within or right at the edge of the cities. It just isn't the same and it sure takes the thrill away. I am an avid bow hunter but I also enjoy the gun season for the excitement and action, it used to have. 

I did see a lot of activity until just about the time change and then it all took a drastic downturn.


Thanks to all that have kept this post going its great conversation good, bad or indifferent.


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## brummy (Mar 15, 2006)

i have to agree that the bag limits and the nuisance permits need to be cut way down. i am not seeing a third of the deer that i saw lets say 5 - 7 years ago. i hunt about 250 acres that adjoins very well known state land here at the corner of highland and ross county. and the deer just seem to be dwendling more and more every year. i am also on a mead lease not to far from here that used to loaded and i mean loaded with deer. and this year out of 4 of us hunting including bow season only 2 deer were taken granted some deer where let walk during bow season but still 2 deer c'mon in my opinion keep urban permits where they are and drop the limit outside the areas way down espeacialy nuisance permits.


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## bobk (Apr 30, 2004)

I've taken 4 deer off of the property so far this year. Tons of tracks in the snow today on my way to the stand. I saw 8 doe and 2 bucks this afternoon. There are still a bunch of deer out there. Heard a lot of shots this afternoon also.
The archery kill was up quite a bit this year, that could be effecting some areas as far as how many hunters are being seen.


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## Stripers4Life (May 2, 2007)

The regular gun season was hell for us. I hunted 4 days and each day ran into other groups of hunters. the one day I swear there had to be 20 amish people in a line on one of our favorite blocks. talked to the owner and he never gave them permission. The last day of gun season we actually had the cops called on 2 of our drivers for "trespassing" however the field that we don't have permission was 200 yards to the north of where they were walking. We saw 2 deer all week and not very many shots. 

Bow hunting this year I had seen more deer than any past season that I remember. However, driving around this year, I haven't seen as many deer as I usually do on the road. I've been hunting since I was old enough to follow my dad into the woods, and can't say that I have seen a drop in the amount of deer I see. If anything I have been seeing more deer the older I get, I don't know if I'm getting smarter, or the deer are getting dumber, or weather their numbers are dropping or getting bigger. But it seems to me, that there are plenty of deer around, especially does.

Also, I think there are more hunters now, than when I first started hunting. I know for a fact that bow hunting is gaining huge popularity, weather these are new hunters, or gun hunters trying there hand at bow hunting. not sure, but I do have alot of trust in the odnr, and what they do to keep our natural resources around. I know these guy's know alot more about the populations and quantity of the deer herd in our state than I do. In some more urban areas, deer will eat everything from peoples gardens, to ornamental flowers. And in rural areas, a big herd of deer on a farm will decimate your crop. So the nusiance permits IMHO serve a good purpose. The new program the state has trying to hook farmers up with hunters is a good step forward. however I have heard that out of state hunters have been taking more advantage of this than the residents. If there were anything I disagree with, it's the cost, and amount an out of state tag costs. People around the country are starting to get wise to our awesome deer hunting and the price of out of state tags. And as said in other posts, our state has a high population so what we have is already spread thin. 

Sometimes I think that the amount of deer you see each year has alot to do with the weather, the moon, and pressure. One year may be great for seeing deer during daylight hours, and another year they may be more prone to move at night. Or maybe one year it was a bad year for acorn so they key in on other food that isnt on the prop. Speaking from past experiences I can say that some spots I hunt are amazing one year, and dead the next. I don't know, that's just my 2 cents.


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## littleking (Jun 25, 2005)

i wish i could have MORE tags... i tag out each year and still would like more deer meat. My family substitutes venison for beef in EVERYTHING that we make.

I hunt within 1 square mile, no more. Along with several others... and our deer population is healthy.

I'm not sure what to tell you, but I'm not seeing the same decrease in numbers that you are.

and IDontKnow316, what is this 12 deer limit you speak of? you cannot aggregate zone limits, you might want to re-read the regs


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## bkr43050 (Apr 5, 2004)

littleking said:


> and IDontKnow316, what is this 12 deer limit you speak of? you cannot aggregate zone limits, you might want to re-read the regs


Actually you can do this now. This is a recent change to the regulations. Here is the line from the regulations.


> Deer Zone bag limits are separate and do not impact deer hunting in other Deer Zones.


Actually if you read the regulations closely you will see that one could take up to 18 deer if they also take 6 from the urban permits.


I really don't think the increase in the bag limits has had that great of an effect on the deer herd population. They have been putting larger bag limits year after year and the harvest is staying relatively constant. As Huntinbull mentioned very, very few folks take over 4 deer. The percentage of the annual harvest that could be attributed to the deer taken beyond the 4th or even 3rd deer would make up a very, very small portion of the number. And if this were indeed overharvesting the herd we would be seeing it in the subsequent season totals. After all the deer would no longer be plentiful. But in actuality our season totals for this year (up to before the bonus weekend) was within 4% of the number last year at that same point. If we begin to overharvest we will not just hear folks commenting about it but we will also see it in the final numbers. I do believe that in my area the numbers have been controlled a bit better in the last 5 years or so but the overall population is still fine. I don't see the herds of 10-15 at a time very often (except late winter when they begin to yard up) but there is still enough deer.

Every year at this time we seem to go through this conversation about doom and gloom but things always seem to end up being in much better condition than the picture being painted on here.

I think that overall the deer herd in the state is in pretty good shape as I see it. There will always be areas that seem more dense than others and also areas that seem scarce but the regulations can not be easily controlled to handle all of these situations. Really the only thing that I can see that affects small areas more directly is the damage permits. I have seen these damage permits have a drastic affect within a tight area and I suspect that others can attest to that as well. I have not seen the totals for the damage permits in the last couple of years but I know that the county I live in (Knox) at one time was by far the highest number issued. They were accounting for over 10% of the entire state's damage tags at over 1,000 each year. I am curious to see the numbers to the recent years to see if that number has changed much. There were a couple of farms that were allotted 100 tags and I had talked to some guys who bow hunt that area. They were seeing far less deer and were real concerned with the situation.

The bottom line though for the entire state is that the damage tags only make up around 5% of the state's harvest. That means that as a whole for the state they are not impacting it too drastic. As I said it is just a much more concentrated area harvest.


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## littleking (Jun 25, 2005)

well hell, sounds like im going to have to travel to get some more deer


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## Fishstix (Aug 16, 2005)

I would agree that the deer herd is healthy here in Ohio. There are two things that I think about when it gets late in the season. First, there are less deer in the woods due to all the deer that were killed during hunting season. Second, deer are getting smarter at this point of the hunting season. They have now dealt with hunting pressure for close to 3 months. I believe that also has an affect on the number of deer you see while hunting the late season.

I hunt in Holmes County and have dealt with damage permits for the last 5 years. This year I saw one mature doe on opening day. I didn't see another one until November 1st. I began to question if the farmer was shooting the mature Does. Come to find out, the farmer hired someone to come in and kill 20 mature Does on damage permits, which makes sense due to the lack of mature Does I saw throughout the year. I did see more mature Does during gun season mainly because they were being pushed around. Saturday, I saw a group of 8 Does, 7 of which were mature.


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## bkr43050 (Apr 5, 2004)

I was able to find the 2008-2009 Summary of Deer Season from the ODNR web site. The last couple of pages of this report lists the damage tags and kills.

http://www.dnr.state.oh.us/Portals/9/pdf/pub304.pdf

Knox county still is by far the top in damage permit kills with nearly 13% of the total at 1,002. They are nearly double that of any other county. My main concern with this approach is down the line when they manage to curb the herd. Will they continue to give these same numbers of permits to the farmers? I can say that I am a bit skeptical that the numbers will be reduced any time soon. I know a few of the farmers that were getting these permits and the numbers that they were getting seemed ridiculous. One guy had like 100. I would really like to see the list detail of the permits to know if any of them are on nearby properties. I am not sure if that detail is available anywhere though.


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## Guest (Dec 23, 2009)

idontknow316 said:


> I'll probably get drilled for this but..... I think the limits are a bit high. You could get like 12 deer if you went zone to zone, I know this is unlikely but come on 12 deer? I could not imagine having 12 deer. But I think the increased popularity in bow hunting, a lot of guys have already filled their tags. I heard quite a few shots the first day of gun in November. Not so much after. Anyone agree with me that the limits are a bit liberal?


I agree with you 100%, and so do many other hunters I have talked to. I am afraid we will not see them changed for a number of reasons. The ODNR wants less deer, and that is what we have. Express your concerns to the DNR via email or during their open houses in March, I know I will be. They work for us, maybe they need reminded.


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