# advice on tieing harnesses



## AngerManagment (Jul 10, 2009)

I was wanting to see if anyone can offer some advice as to what pound test line is most commonly used when tieing harnesses for bottom bouncers, trolling, and flipping harnesses for use on Lake Erie. Do you recommend regular mono or the fluro? I have had bad experience in past with fluro breaking.

Also, are there any good websites to purchase the custom blades off of. They are pretty nice but are also pricey. One last question, do you recommend using the clasp that allow for easy blade changes or do you use the metal clasp. 

Thanks for your help. This is the first year I was going to play around with tieing my own as there is nothing else going on this time of the year.


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## Mike_13 (Jun 11, 2007)

we use Seagar 25# flourocarbon leader material. 

check out erieoutfitters.com for a great selection of blades and beads...... craig is a great guy and is very helpful if you have questions. his prices and shipping are reasonable. for this year i tied up some harnesses with the quick change clevises. have not used them yet though. maybe others can chime in on this.


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## Shortdrift (Apr 5, 2004)

If you have had a problem with Fluro breaking, you either have a (poor grade or degraded) batch of fluro or you are not lubricating the tie points enough as you cinch it down. I have been using Seagaur Fluro for over seven years without problems other than wear from the clevis area after long use. I use 20# for tying all my harness, both trolling and casting.


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## G.LoomisMan (Aug 12, 2006)

I don't troll, so if you want my personal advice on casting harnesses...don't use flouro...its not durable enough to use. It like frays and gets knicked up easily. I prefer 20# mono. If you change alot of blades, then use the quick change but i just prefer to use the brass clevises. That's just my opinion...im sure someone else has their preferences...


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## hearttxp (Dec 21, 2004)

I agree No Flouro !! 20 or 25 # test ! Plus use quick change swivels ! I tie well over 250 harnesses for either bottom bouncers or casting ones. Casting ones are between 16" to 20" and bouncers are usually around 36" long with two hooks.


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## buck.eyehunter (May 27, 2007)

I agree with shortdrift with the line. I have been running 20lbs seagaur for years with out break off due to line. I have used vanish it is very weak and nicks up very easy. lube up knots with seagaur and you should be fine.

I like quick change clevis, but get the black ones with the extra keeper. you will have alot more options with colors with them. The only time I've have trouble is .8 and less and with size 4 and smaller colorados. There are pros and cons to them, but to me the pros out weight the cons.

erieoutfitters.com web site has all the silverstreak and other custom colors and good prices too. 

........................................ mike


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## AngerManagment (Jul 10, 2009)

What size and finish on the blades would you say is most productive. I figured #4 but some of the blades i see only come in # 5 on his site. Also, would you say copper finish is the best to get. 

Thanks again


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## Papascott (Apr 22, 2004)

Copper, gold, and painted backs all have their days. To me cup color OS more important than the front. Call Craig at Erie outfitters and he can sell you what works or Don at old Pete's has always been great to deal with and knows his stuff too.

Scott


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## boatnut (Nov 22, 2006)

AngerManagment said:


> What size and finish on the blades would you say is most productive. I figured #4 but some of the blades i see only come in # 5 on his site. Also, would you say copper finish is the best to get.
> 
> Thanks again


I use 30lb test trilene XT or big game on all my harnesses. I tie a swivel in lieu of a loop on the end. I make mine as far as my arms can stretch...roughly 6'.

I hardly ever run #4's. 80% of the time its' #5's and the rest #6's. I like both copper and gold back's. I also recommend erieoutfitters. Can't go wrong with any of the silver streaks and I like the new ones in the UV finish. Craig can recommend good selection of colors. I use mostly the folding clevises for attaching blades.


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## K gonefishin (May 4, 2004)

20 pound Seaguar has never let me down, even while lazy and not retying often while fun fishing tourney fishing they get retied fresh. I've caught 30 fish on a spinner without it breaking. Lube the knots when cinching is right!! 

If you have Seaguar breaking it's not the line your doing something else wrong.


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## JIG (Nov 2, 2004)

Im using 20# mono. I like the idea of longer leaders so I can switch from weight too dipsey then just stick the harness back on. Also use a circle hook with the stinger hook @ 15# mono. Colors are white,perch,gold,chrome,purple and orange that seem to work best. Good Luck!


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## ERIE REBEL (Jan 28, 2006)

I have used twenty pound Trilene XT for years.As far as the clevises go, on my trolling harnesses go I use quick change with the keeper, for casting harnesses or the ones I use for bottom bouncers I use the folded clevises.I was told and tested my self that the quick change don't quite turn as freely as the folded ones.But on the other hand a folded clevis will wear the line on a trolling harness.Just do NOT use the stirrup clevises because they will wear your line fairly quickly.


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## rizzman (Oct 25, 2007)

When it comes to making harnesses I've found a routine that has worked great over the past couple of years. Try to stay with me, it gets complicated. First I crack open a cold one, sit at the computer and go to Ole Petes web page, with me so far? next I pick up the phone and call 216-518-1669 ask for a guy named Don and place my order. A few days later I go and pick them up. It takes some practice but I'm getting very good at it.

(can you guys tell I'm bored as hell and it's only Jan.7th)


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## Tommybouy (Jun 5, 2005)

You wont go wrong with what you read. 2 other opinions are:

I use quick change clevises often but when I find the right combination I will use the steel clevises b/c they spin better than the plastic. The steel may ware the line more then plastic quick change but you will not have to pre-maturely change harnesses due to ware from the metal swivel; you will change harnesses as you normally would.

I like light line harnesses (8lb. test XT) for finesse more than heavy fluoro harnesses when they are picky.

Best!


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## Team Pursuit (Mar 27, 2008)

i like rizzmans idea but this time of year im bored to death. we dont smoke in our house so when i want a cig i will go sit at my work bench in the garage and tie 3 harnesses per cig, throw a cold beer in there with it i could have 20 done. by the time the ice thaws i should have plenty....lol


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## Gottagofishn (Nov 18, 2009)

I am a little on the lazy side but still see a benifit in the form of increased and larger catches from having my own creations. I order harnesses from cabelas (sharpened before using)and have a supply of plastic quick change clevises, black, red, yellow and white. I order blades from a varity of suppliers. I have the pieces, parts orginized in lure boxes, ziplock bags. As conditions change or the fish start leaning toward a particular color or pattern I can toss together a rig pretty quickly.
The more exotic or unusual the blade the more I like them. The fish seem to as well. Beads can be a huge factor as well.

See you on the water.


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## hearttxp (Dec 21, 2004)

Gottagofishn said:


> I am a little on the lazy side but still see a benifit in the form of increased and larger catches from having my own creations. I order harnesses from cabelas (sharpened before using)and have a supply of plastic quick change clevises, black, red, yellow and white. I order blades from a varity of suppliers. I have the pieces, parts orginized in lure boxes, ziplock bags. As conditions change or the fish start leaning toward a particular color or pattern I can toss together a rig pretty quickly.
> The more exotic or unusual the blade the more I like them. The fish seem to as well. Beads can be a huge factor as well.
> 
> See you on the water.


Hey let me know what ya want ? you can buy from me & will not have to sharpen Hooks !! I have plenty of time until April --Except fro hunting this weekend & ice fishing erie soon ???


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## moondog5814 (Apr 8, 2007)

I like using the 20 lb. Seagaur. I have had troubles with several types of swivels in the past..... stirrups,folded, and those quick change kind that are curled like a pig-tail. Since I switched to the black plastic quick change type, I have had no problems. I got most of my blades from either Erie Outfitters or Rodmaker's Shop. The blades are pricy, but once you get started tying them and then catching fish with them, you don't worry about the price anymore. It just becomes an addiction. Good Luck!


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## normd (Jul 5, 2005)

moondog5814 said:


> I like using the 20 lb. Seagaur. I have had troubles with several types of swivels in the past..... stirrups,folded, and those quick change kind that are curled like a pig-tail. Since I switched to the black plastic quick change type, I have had no problems. I got most of my blades from either Erie Outfitters or Rodmaker's Shop. The blades are pricy, but once you get started tying them and then catching fish with them, you don't worry about the price anymore. It just becomes an addiction. Good Luck!



Additction is right. My wife laughs and say's i'm making my "Man Jewelry"!!! However she sure does mimd when I bring home the Eyes!


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## Tommybouy (Jun 5, 2005)

normd said:


> Additction is right. My wife laughs and say's i'm making my "Man Jewelry"!!! However she sure does mimd when I bring home the Eyes!


I see the CJ Special in there! I had him paint some older crankbaits in that pattern. Bad-mamma-jamma!!%


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## K gonefishin (May 4, 2004)

Tommybouy said:


> I see the CJ Special in there! I had him paint some older crankbaits in that pattern. Bad-mamma-jamma!!%


I have some Reef runner Ripsticks and Reef runners 800's in CJ Special....they work GOOD! Cj is a real hot blade.


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## walcat (Apr 11, 2004)

I use 15 lb. nylon coated wire. They can't bite thru that if it gets into a Chinese fire drill. Use #2 Kahle hooks. Never have lost one at the boat or come unbuttoned. Those hooks are great. Use #4 willowleaf blades as they seem to prefer those more here in Erie part of the lake.


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## ETC (Aug 30, 2007)

Gotta agree with all these posts who say that Seaguar fluoro leaders is the way to go. I have NEVER had a leader break with a fish on. I have had a couple of hooks straightened out by steelies when I have had to tighten the drag to stop it from creeping out due to wave conditions. Which also is a testimony to the leader and knots strength. I pull out the straightened hooks at times to show people on charters just how violent the steelie hook ups are.

Ray
Erie Therapy II


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## Kableguy (Apr 23, 2009)

You guys have got me excited to try tying my own. Quick question. I am going to use the two hook setup with a trailing treble hook. How much space do I leave between the hooks, and how long do I make the harness? Is it the same length for trolling behind dipseys and inline weights behind inline planer boards? Thanks.


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## rockytop (Mar 19, 2008)

Been_awhile said:


> You guys have got me excited to try tying my own. Quick question. I am going to use the two hook setup with a trailing treble hook. How much space do I leave between the hooks, and how long do I make the harness? Is it the same length for trolling behind dipseys and inline weights behind inline planer boards? Thanks.


the space is 2 to 3 inches between the hooks about. dont matter what is important get the worm straight as you can. single hook in nose treble in above or below coler of the worm, just staight. i make mine 12 inches long. i make 6 to 7 foot leaders, if i want to use spoons put a spoon on a crank put a crank on. worms put a 12 inch harness on. i know some use 6 foot i hate winding them with all the hooks. rockytop (BOB)


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## rockytop (Mar 19, 2008)

normd said:


> Additction is right. My wife laughs and say's i'm making my "Man Jewelry"!!! However she sure does mimd when I bring home the Eyes!


what is the name of the one left of the cj special. that was a good one for me. rockytop (BOB)


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## AngerManagment (Jul 10, 2009)

What one is CJ7? Those are some nice looking harnesses.


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## AngerManagment (Jul 10, 2009)

One other question i forgot to post. When you guys make your flipping harnesses are you just tying a loop with a bead at the end to put your weights through it. Didnt know if there was any other better ways.

Also, when you make your bottom bouncer ones, what is the best to put at the end of that to attach to bottom bouncer, just a swivel. 

Thanks guys, This is very helpful and informative


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## boatnut (Nov 22, 2006)

AngerManagment said:


> What one is CJ7? Those are some nice looking harnesses.


CJ special is the dark purplish one , center right, with dots on it. to the left appears to be pink panties.


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## eyeangler1 (May 21, 2004)

Nice lookin' harnesses for sure. I'm savin' the pic to copy the bead patterns.
Now... next question... is there really any advantage to a double blade harness? I haven't been able to find any (or am I just "not noticing"!)


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## blue dolphin (Jul 18, 2004)

What kinda blades are you talking about eyeangler??


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## walcat (Apr 11, 2004)

Tied singles for 30 yrs. and done just fine.


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## freyedknot (Apr 10, 2004)

tied my first batch last year and now i have over 100 tied ,way too many!


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## eyeangler1 (May 21, 2004)

blue dolphin said:


> What kinda blades are you talking about eyeangler??


Gary~
Colorados or willows. I've double bladed both and don't notice the advantage.


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## normd (Jul 5, 2005)

Here's some more i've made!


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## Scout Abaco (Jun 13, 2009)

I use 20# Seagaur for my casting harnesses 24 and 36 long. For my trolling harnesses I use my left over 40# Power Pro only 10 long and tie a ball bearing swivel on. I get my spinners and clevises from Eire outfitters


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## moondog5814 (Apr 8, 2007)

AngerManagment said:


> I was wanting to see if anyone can offer some advice as to what pound test line is most commonly used when tieing harnesses for bottom bouncers, trolling, and flipping harnesses for use on Lake Erie. Do you recommend regular mono or the fluro? I have had bad experience in past with fluro breaking.
> 
> Also, are there any good websites to purchase the custom blades off of. They are pretty nice but are also pricey. One last question, do you recommend using the clasp that allow for easy blade changes or do you use the metal clasp.
> 
> Thanks for your help. This is the first year I was going to play around with tieing my own as there is nothing else going on this time of the year.


Hope this opens up for you because there is a wealth of information about tying harnesses. This is where I learned. Hetfield does a great job of going step- by- step plus there is a lot of other info. Good Luck.
http://www.ohiogamefishing.com/community/showthread.php?t=85206&highlight=trolling+worm+harnesses

P.S. I see that you are from Midland. I used to work at the steel mill there back in the 70's.


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## blue dolphin (Jul 18, 2004)

eye angler smaller colorados like 3 and 4 can be good at times if you want to try something sweet go with double hatchets on a tough bite you will like what you see i like size 6. As far as double willows they are pretty sweet for summer fishing I very rarley run a single willow I like the doulbe cause remember there mostly all flash and no vibration so that extra flash is best IMO and its simulating a smelt school and thats one of there favorite things to eat. Hope this helps. Gary Zart Blue Dolphin


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## ErieAngler (Apr 15, 2006)

K gonefishin said:


> 20 pound Seaguar has never let me down, even while lazy and not retying often while fun fishing tourney fishing they get retied fresh. I've caught 30 fish on a spinner without it breaking. Lube the knots when cinching is right!!
> 
> If you have Seaguar breaking it's not the line your doing something else wrong.


Ive had steel snap 20lb Seaguar - other than that, its the cats meow. Not often a bullet hits a harness though!


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## K gonefishin (May 4, 2004)

ErieAngler said:


> Ive had steel snap 20lb Seaguar - other than that, its the cats meow. Not often a bullet hits a harness though!


In the link that was posted below (ah memories of a great thread) I posted that I used 15 pound, come to think of it I did use 15 pound. Heck I only use 10 pound main line in mono and have caught plenty of steelies and 1000's of walleye. I have had steelies bust harnesses but it's usually when they jump or and when they get wrapped in it or on the initial run and I'm not prepared for a hit by one. If I'm dipsey fishing I'm always ready for them 

Berkely 100% Flouracarbon is good flouro as well. I tied a couple noodles at my friends shop last year and that line held up just as well, no issues. Since I'm such a huge fan of Maxima I've been itching to try their flouro I read some reviews from steelie fisherman online that use it for leaders....tough as nails..doesn't surprise me one bit the mono is unreal strong.


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## blue dolphin (Jul 18, 2004)

You got that right Kevin that Maxima is unbelievable stuff you made me a huge fan. Great reccomendation. Dolphin


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## eyeangler1 (May 21, 2004)

blue dolphin said:


> eye angler smaller colorados like 3 and 4 can be good at times if you want to try something sweet go with double hatchets on a tough bite you will like what you see i like size 6.


Geeeeeez Gary!!!! Now you got me goin' with hatchets? Now I've gotta find another part-time job to pay for this new chapter in harness tyin' and I won't have time to get out on the lake... at all! LOL! 
I"ll stop by at the show and say hi (and maybe try to tap a little more into that wealth of harness knowledge you store in that pumpkin of yours). I'll even catch your seminar... again. You always have things we all can learn.
Thanks!
Bill


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## blue dolphin (Jul 18, 2004)

Lol Bill ya harness fishing is never ending with possbilties gotta love it. Looking foward to seeing you at the show. Dolphin


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## silver shad (Jun 18, 2006)

Gary are you going to have your pro cure at the boat show?


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## blue dolphin (Jul 18, 2004)

Yes I am when were you coming??


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## Never Done (Jan 9, 2010)

Those harnesses in the photos look like top quality stuff! I was wondering on the double willow spinners, what size willow blades do you recommend? Also, what size folded clevis is used for the #5 colorado and the willow blades? And finally, are the beads in the photos 6mm?

I'm new to this site. I've been a member of the GLA site for years but not much info. regarding walleye fishing over there.

Thanks, Curt


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## normd (Jul 5, 2005)

Never Done said:


> Those harnesses in the photos look like top quality stuff! I was wondering on the double willow spinners, what size willow blades do you recommend? Also, what size folded clevis is used for the #5 colorado and the willow blades? And finally, are the beads in the photos 6mm?
> 
> I'm new to this site. I've been a member of the GLA site for years but not much info. regarding walleye fishing over there.
> 
> Thanks, Curt



I have never bought beads in my life. My young daughters had a fake jewerly making kit that they didnt want, so I use those beads. It was a gold mine of beads in the kit.


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## harle96 (Aug 2, 2005)

Hatchets also have their place. I've only used them once, but it was great day. I don't know of any suppliers that have painted blades. I've only seen the blanks. My paint skills are better with a sash brush and roller and not with a airbrush.


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## Hetfieldinn (May 17, 2004)

Never Done said:


> Those harnesses in the photos look like top quality stuff! I was wondering on the double willow spinners, what size willow blades do you recommend? Also, what size folded clevis is used for the #5 colorado and the willow blades? And finally, are the beads in the photos 6mm?


I (and most others, I think) mostly use #4 willow blades, but I've had days when #6's are hot. I only use 6mm beads on my harnesses, but I do put a 4mm bead in front of the clevis to keep the knot from binding up in the clevis. I had some good days on hatchet and chopper blades this past season.


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## silver shad (Jun 18, 2006)

Hey Gary the wife and I are planning to go on the 22 to catch you and kgone .


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## Scout Abaco (Jun 13, 2009)

Never Done said:


> Those harnesses in the photos look like top quality stuff! I was wondering on the double willow spinners, what size willow blades do you recommend? Also, what size folded clevis is used for the #5 colorado and the willow blades? And finally, are the beads in the photos 6mm?
> 
> I'm new to this site. I've been a member of the GLA site for years but not much info. regarding walleye fishing over there.
> 
> Thanks, Curt


If you are referring to my harnesses I use #6 Willow or #6 Colorado, #2 folded clevises, and SPRO power ball bearing solid ring swivels black. As far as the beads are 6 mm. I put the swivels on for convenience of switching weights, dipsy divers, or gear.
You're welcome , Tony


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## Workdog (Jan 10, 2007)

harle96 said:


> Hatchets also have their place. I've only used them once, but it was great day. I don't know of any suppliers that have painted blades. I've only seen the blanks. My paint skills are better with a sash brush and roller and not with a airbrush.


Check BassProShops on-line.


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## ShutUpNFish (Apr 17, 2007)

30 to 50 lb. Berkley Big Game is what I use. Works great!


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## Never Done (Jan 9, 2010)

Nice! Are those #4 willow blades and #2 hooks? What size treble are you using?


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## ShutUpNFish (Apr 17, 2007)

#4 willow...I use a bigger round bend treble now I think #6...the ones in the pic were what I had laying around to tie before one of my trips last year. The stinger certainly is the key...put many fish in the cooler that otherwise wouldn't have without it.


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## blue dolphin (Jul 18, 2004)

All really good stuff on this topic. Just as a reminder I am doing seminars at the cleveland boat show that starts tomorrow on everything you want to know about harness trolling on lake erie along with how i make mine. For those interested the dates and times for my seminar schedule are Friday Jan 15 at 4 pm Sunday Jan 17 at 4 pm Friday Jan 22 at 6 pm and Sat Jan 23 at 4 pm. I hope to see alot of you there. Its always a blast. Gary Zart Blue Dolphin


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## BMS (Mar 26, 2008)

great info, thanks. but do any of you guys mix up the blades? such as small colorado up front backed by a willow,or smaller willow followed by a bigger one. and any sense in useing three blades?


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## Fish Scalper (Oct 31, 2009)

A #3 Colorado with a #5 Indiana above were deadly a couple trips last year. All gold blades, red beads.


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## Hetfieldinn (May 17, 2004)

BMS said:


> great info, thanks. but do any of you guys mix up the blades? such as small colorado up front backed by a willow,or smaller willow followed by a bigger one. and any sense in useing three blades?


I only used a double willow once this past season, and that was in Geneva. From April to September, I pulled nothing but single colorados, and I had a very good year.


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## ShutUpNFish (Apr 17, 2007)

The double bladed #4 sz. harnesses usually pull most fish for us out here in PA and Conny to Ash. OH....however, the single bladed #5 Magnum bladed harness outproduced the doubles last season. Why? who knows...I just make sure I'm equipped with everything just in case!


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