# Tournaments causing bass decline?



## cedar1 (Feb 5, 2006)

This was written in the Record-Courier today. The first comment is in regards to Portage Lakes. " Slight but ominously steady downward trend continues in the face of relentless tourneys onslaught." The second pertains to Lake Erie. "No longer an automatic choice. Hundred fish days of the recent past only a memory as tournaments and morally-challenged charters wreak their havoc".


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## Nipididdee (Apr 19, 2004)

WOW- Jack seems to be a tad tournament biased!!! lol I thought writers, even for the outdoors section of the podunk courier, are supposed to reflect facts not opinions! He musta had a stone in his shoe when he wrote it.

Let the biology tell you... let the numbers of angler samplings from year to year tell you... or you can read my letter to the editor to the Record-Courier if they choose to publish it next week.

The short version rebuttal- he is so very,very incorrect. 

Nip
www.dobass.com


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## johnboy111711 (Apr 7, 2004)

nip, buddy i'm with you... wieghts at portage are awesome, didn't know jack fished portage? i know the tourneys at the river hurt the populations of pike, atleast in the front street area, IMO. fish that have been dragged around on a stringer usually aren't in good shape.


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## ParmaBass (Apr 11, 2004)

That guy needs to fish a season of tournaments on Portage once!  Where you consistently need 10lbs just to cash a check season after season. No decline going on there.


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## cedar1 (Feb 5, 2006)

Go get em Nip. I was pretty p.o.ed when I read that today. I don't no if you read the retched courier much, but he bashes tournament guys and their " big fast boats" every chance he gets. I guess if your not fishing the river in a undersized, VERY overloaded, plastic boat you are not where its at.


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## Shortdrift (Apr 5, 2004)

Was part of an interesting conversation with officers from Fish & Game. The discussion covered a lot of subjects and then centered around the Erie smallmouth situation and specificly the decline through the recent past years and what appears to be a promising first look at the as a result of the closed season during the spawn.
I'll not go into a lot of detail but can say that last years hatch is very encouraging regarding the number of fry and fingerlings produced. Common sense should dictate that the numbers increase are a result of the far lesser numbers of boats and fishermen pursuing the smallmouth during the spawn.
This was certainly very pronounced on Ruggles as the nightly local tournaments which I witnessed over the past four years were no longer taking place during the spawn as they had in the past.
I'm sure that anyone who activly pursued the smallmouth in the past three to four years was very aware of the lack of smaller bass ( 1 to 2 pound) numbers with the majority of caught fish being in the 3 to 6 pound class.
Befor I get a lot of flak from the dedicated bass angler regarding my comments I will add I am fully aware of the efforts by many to release the fish after weigh in and the care taken during the livewell retention. The detrimental factor is when the fish were removed from the nest during the spawn and subsequent predator destruction of the eggs. Anyone that argues this point is not recognizing the the true facts.
Cormorants are also contributing to the decline of not only the smallmouth but all fish in Erie but is now being addressed and corrective measures are to be taken.

I for one am also in favor of a closed season on samallmouth and largemouth state wide during the spawning cycle until such time as a pronounced increase in reproductive numbers are seen.
Now remember that the majority of my comments are what I heard and discussed with quailified personnel. You can take aim and fire away regarding my own personal feelings and statements. [email protected] !$


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## cedar1 (Feb 5, 2006)

Which is worse, catch and release bass tournaments or charters running two trips a day 6-8 guys per trip and bringing in limits of females day after day during the spawn. I would assume the results we will see shortly in the bass fishing getting better will be because of the charters not bring them on dry land, NOT because of no tournaments. Whats the excuse for the fish out of Geneva declining in recent years? There aren't any tournys of any size that go out of that area but yet the fishing isn't a no brainer like it used to be. P.S. You can ask where the writer gets his facts at www.buckeyeangler.com he will surely welcome a fresh post on that very stale site


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## johnboy111711 (Apr 7, 2004)

great post cedar....very good points all around


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## Nipididdee (Apr 19, 2004)

Shordrift- very well spoken and ripe for discussion- no issue taken at all.

Lake Erie is a whole different animal number one.

The state did reasearch (along with other neighboring states that already impose restrictions) and found it to benefit a potential smallmouth decline.
No issue with this at all- totally in favor. BUT it has so little to do with tournament anglers, about 10% little. 100% to do with all  fisherpeople who harvest/catch and release during the spawn.

Number two - can't in anyway argue with the fact that if bass are removed during a tournament- and released elsewhere, that the chances of them continuing a successful spawn (*guarding nest/fry) is reduced. BUT- thus far, the inland lakes are not being negatively impacted by this. The ones that electroshockings and angler surveys show otherwise- have indeed been regulated with restricitions by way of size limits. 

If future un-biased sound studies of fisheries clearly indicate a *need * for the prosperity of a bass fishery by establishing an off-limits period- definately a good thing.

BUT- the bottom line, the reservoirs mentioned in the article were a top five pick of bass lakes! Ironic! It was a low blow that just furthers a myth- OPINION- that bass tournaments are the reason for poor fishing for others.

Sopranos are on.... Jack just emailed me too... gotta run  

nip
www.dobass.com


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## Tritonman (Jul 4, 2004)

My personal opinion about Lake Erie is-----------I don't know!!!!!But as for Portage. Oh my Lord! All I have to say is 30-40 fish days, 17 lbs. to win a 4 hour nightly tournament. 3-4-5 tournaments a week. During the spawn it may take 25.1 lbs. to win. These fish have been coming off beds for years and I have not seen any decline in numbers or size. Yeah it is a pressured lake and Yeah things change all the time. Just like Lake Erie, 8-10 years ago you could drift in 3 footers and catch limits of walleye, now the lake cleared up. The charters had to switch it up to make money and they did. Am I a fan a bed fishing? I stink at it. But I'll do it because over the years I haven't seen the bass population hurt. Look at the electro-fishing results. They don't lie. As a matter of fact I'll bet a paycheck that all the coppersulfate they pour into Portage hurts the fry(bass, redear, bluegill, etc.) population more than bed fishing. I thought that was the only way you caught panfish was in spawning areas. The state sprays coppersulfate and so does the lake residents. That is alot of coppersulfate. I put that stuff in my acre pond. I killed 87 fish. In an acre pond, applied according to directions.


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## ParmaBass (Apr 11, 2004)

Copper Sulfate is some nasty stuff!! You followed the directions and killed 87 fish, these home owners probably don't even read the bag for application rates. Just buy it and dump it. TADAAA no more weeds!


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## Shortdrift (Apr 5, 2004)

Pretty darn refreshing to get non-hostile, well though out and informative reply's to what can be a truly controversial subject. I'll admit I overlooked the charters in my comments and appoligize for that and have to agree that their inpact was greater due to the catch and kill by some, but not by all.


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## Nipididdee (Apr 19, 2004)

Not to get hung onto specifics, but that is a perfect example of what I am conveying. The BIG PICTURE of all impacting events that effects a fishery- INCLUDING *natural events of change* in any kinda of a system.

Bass anglers do more good than harm- overall- especially these days with a strong ethic of catch and release and awareness/implementation of actions to reduce post-tournament mortality rates. 

Bass tournaments are a very small portion OVERALL of bass caught from any impoundment, compared to big picture of all license sales and anglers. 

Erie particularly- fish are dumb and angler #'s are massive. Most everyone in lower levels of their quest are prone to throw a big brown one into the cooler to show mom or friends! AND if the laws permit it- then great- they can! Once managing bodies identify a future problem though, restrictions are imposed. That's why we have ODNR.

Nip


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## lakeslouie (Jan 11, 2006)

I guess it might be if you didn't participate in tournaments and didn't understand them. My numbers for the past 8 years reveal catch rates up, weights up, and participation up. Imagine Portage 3 times better. Thats what you'd have if they didn't spray each year for weeds. Habitat is always the answer!!!


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## Nipididdee (Apr 19, 2004)

My numbers at lado look like a seagul ! high avg weights six years ago- lowered the next two- and rose the next three at year increments- numbers have increased annually!

Louie- it's all your fault!!! 

I actually have been out at nights before tournaments feeding them peanut butter and marshmellow creame to get them all buttered up!!!

Nip


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## ss minnow (Aug 11, 2005)

Fish as a resource belong to all of us equally. I admire crafty anglers that can catch big bass in the toughest bite conditions. My experience is that when too many tournaments comb a body of water, it becomes obvious, aka pressured fish. The more the fish are caught, the less likely they are to being caught again, despite the fluke stories of re-catching the same fish. No tournament director or participant wants to admit he/she is making it harder for the weekend leisure angler to catch fish. Couple that with my opening statement and I believe you have the source of any bad feelings. I cannot think of any other sport where those that come before, make it harder for those that follow.


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## Nipididdee (Apr 19, 2004)

I think that is as close as you can get it SS, nicely put- but that's a statement on machismo moreso than reality. 

I wholeheartedly believe that is also just as the wind,rain,sun and clouds- just an easy excuse for one's ego as to why they didn't catch 'em on a particular day- the "enemy" I call it.
http://www.dobass.com/THEENEMY.html

Someone always smacks 'em, even on the toughest day- the most "pressured" lake. Indeed pressure is a consideration for techniques- the eaters/aggressive fish done been caught. But there are many more awaiting in a different way.

Couldn't a bass tournament anlger just as easy blame all the bankfisherpeople regarding "pressure"?

PS- I have caught the same fish 5 times in a row- a near 3lbr- back to back casts- eaters keep on eating.

Nip


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## Marshall (Apr 11, 2004)

ss minnow said:


> My experience is that when too many tournaments comb a body of water, it becomes obvious, aka pressured fish. The more the fish are caught, the less likely they are to being caught again, despite the fluke stories of re-catching the same fish. No tournament director or participant wants to admit he/she is making it harder for the weekend leisure angler to catch fish. I cannot think of any other sport where those that come before, make it harder for those that follow.



Hey life is tough and bass fishing takes time on the water and skill. This is not a fish you can just decide you want to go catch and throw a night crawler under a bobber and have sucess. Also just because you buy a few bass lures and go throw them means you are going to catch a bass. These fish are tough to catch and takes a lot of practice and skill to go to the lake and catch them. Hey i hate to see the lake packed as much as you but our lakes are not that big and people like to bass fish be it tournament or not. Deal with it. If you want easy go find a private pond full of dumb bass and you can catch all you want.


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## River Walker (Apr 7, 2004)

I believe that in all the lakes here in Ohio that host a number of tournaments each year,the number of bass in those lakes are just as good as in the less fished lakes.No lake in Ohio can possibly have more tournaments on it than Alum Creek Lake,yet the bass population in that lake is incredibly strong.Sure the fish wise up after being caught a few times,they do in every lake in America.That's what seperate's the weekend angler from the hardcore professional anglers,those guys can generally catch big bass from any body of water they fish,regardless of how pressured the fish may be.If you go to any lake here in Ohio say on a weekday,and have no luck,go to the weigh-in at some tournament on that same lake on some weekend.I'm sure your feelings on that lake being fished out,or the bass being impossible to catch will change.Like someone else said,it takes more than just cruising around and hoping to find some bass,you have to put in the time,takes a lot of patience,and a lot of skill to be successful on a regular basis.Ever wonder what KVD would do on one of our hard fished lakes? I think he would bring in a bag of fish that would totally amaze the people that think our lakes are over fished.


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