# Lake Erie wind farm



## chuckle (Jul 15, 2012)

Well according to the news last night they"re going to put six wind turbines ten miles off Cleveland. I don"t know how everyone else feels about this, but I think it"s a bad idea!


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## ApeShip (Apr 17, 2006)

Why do you think it’s a bad idea?


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## creekcrawler (Oct 5, 2004)

I think it's a good idea. Plus, boaters in Cleveland will have something else to drive out to besides the crib, lol.


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## chuckle (Jul 15, 2012)

ApeShip said:


> Why do you think it’s a bad idea?


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## chuckle (Jul 15, 2012)

I don't think they should be putting them in our great natural resource.


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## creekcrawler (Oct 5, 2004)

Well, I do think it's a lot of extra work to put them out in the lake. Foundations, running electric lines to the shore, etc.
Would have thought it would be a whole less expensive to put them on shore. If you head east of Cleveland, there's a ton of open lake front space all the way to Erie, Pa.


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## One guy and a boat (Aug 8, 2018)

I think it's a good idea. Could create cooler water and won't have to go 20 miles out to find the eyes 

Kip


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## PapawSmith (Feb 13, 2007)

ApeShip said:


> Why do you think it’s a bad idea?


I, personally, don't think its a good idea for several reasons. One being they will never, in their lifetime, generate enough power to exceed the cost to manufacture, transport, install, commission, and then maintain them. Just like solar farms, wind energy is 100% about the money that is made within the manufacture/sell/install industry and the massive dollars dished out in the form of 'energy credits' to the entities that purchase them. It is a giant, for profit, transfer of taxpayer dollars under the guise of "green energy". That and each of these turbines holds about 80 gallons of oil in their gear box that needs changed annually and almost all of them, in their max 20 year life span, blow a seal a time or two and dump all that oil on the space below. Wind energy, in my opinion, is a great money maker for the players, and a great waste of my and your tax dollars.


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## bountyhunter (Apr 28, 2004)

papasmith well said. and you said it all.


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## Josh1257 (5 mo ago)

The great green new deal come oooon haha


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## Josh1257 (5 mo ago)

do you think it will actually happen?


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## Ol' Whiskers (Aug 11, 2004)

won't put em on land cause they mess wit real estate values. Ten miles out = "not in my back yard!"


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## loweman165 (May 15, 2015)

Maybe they'll have charging ports for our boats when they tell us we can't use gas engines on Erie because GAS IS BAD!


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## Josh1257 (5 mo ago)

Could you imagine that having to stop and recharge


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## Hatchetman (Apr 13, 2004)

IF they go in, I would bet you that you will not be able to legally get close to them. They will tell you they are protecting them from"terrorists"....


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## berkshirepresident (Jul 24, 2013)

While I'm all in favor of being "green"....within reason......I think wind power is essentially....a fraud.
When you read the ridiculous comments made by those who will profit from this "farm", there is no way they will generate enough power to make them worth while or power what their promoters are claiming.
Wind power kills many birds.....and looks awful, IMHO. The turbine blades are NOT currently able to be recycled. Another form of pollution, IMHO....b/c the Lake will look worse with them.
The ethanal industry and the wind power industry are based on lies and b.s. - for lack of better terms.
If you want to go green, Solar and (gasp) Nuclear are your real options.


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## Ron Y (Dec 2, 2020)

Thats why they put them 10 miles out so no-one sees them. And all the birds they kill will sink or drift away. If you want really green power , go nuke.


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## MechMark (Nov 3, 2021)

Here's my 2 pennies. If you go to the north west corner of Erie between the Michigan shore and Canadian shore, on a clear day you can see the power sources for each country. Wind turbines on Canadian side, 2 sets of smoke stacks and a nuke plant on the US side. Id rather see the clean turbines than the smoking stacks.


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## snagless-1 (Oct 26, 2014)

Once again it's a feel good thing..........


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## berkshirepresident (Jul 24, 2013)

MechMark said:


> Here's my 2 pennies. If you go to the north west corner of Erie between the Michigan shore and Canadian shore, on a clear day you can see the power sources for each country. Wind turbines on Canadian side, 2 sets of smoke stacks and a nuke plant on the US side. Id rather see the clean turbines than the smoking stacks.


Have you ever seen pictures of bald eagles, other raptors, and other birds in general....especially migratory game birds....that have been killed by the blades of wind turbines?
Have you ever seen the piles of used turbine blades sitting around b/c no one can figure out what to do with them/where to dump them? Wind power is not a free ride, unfortunately.
Your point is well taken......but I don't think it's fair to assume that Canada is getting all of their power from wind turbines. They are not.


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## dculberson (10 mo ago)

Nobody claims wind turbines are a free ride. But they’re a damn site better than coal.


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## Ron Y (Dec 2, 2020)

Go nukes


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## ditchdigger (Feb 22, 2012)

This is where they plan on putting these. I’m not a big fan! (no pun intended) Looks like starting with six then who knows how many they will add in the future! They say you’ll barely be able to see them on a clear day standing from shore. I don’t want to see them from the boat either! Oh yea, how are they going to maintain them in the middle of winter if the lake is frozen?🤔


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## baitguy (Dec 17, 2013)

dculberson said:


> Nobody claims wind turbines are a feee ride. But they’re a damn site better than coal.


yeah, right, untill the wind isn't blowing at all or enough to turn the blades ... or when the wind is blowing to hard, I'm thinking much over 20 mph ... there are several in Cleveo area that aren't working on windy days ... and let's not forget maintaining equipment 10 miles out in the lake, it can get a bit tricky between say thanksgiving and Easter ... the problem w/all the "renewable" energy stuff is that if the good lord doesn't cooperate for a day or week or more and we have overcast days w/no wind, or conversely, storms and high winds, you got Nada ... so we're gonna spend how many bazillions of $$ to find out that for every nickle spent we get a pennies worth of juice  nuke power is good but not feasible everywhere ... coal is going by the wayside eventually, but w/todays technology it's a lot cleaner than it used to be, and natural gas is plentiful, affordable and pretty clean ... oh yeah, I forgot, current administration is discouraging anything to do w/fossil fuels  considering our size and the magnitude of our industry, despite what CNN tells you, USA is probably near the top of environmentally responsible countries, EPA is everywhere whether we need them or not  it's a lot easier to be "clean" when you don't produce anything, I'd venture a wager of an adult beverage that most any country bigger than Cleveland that does better is rather wealthy and doesn't have much Industry (think Switzerland, Iceland, etc) ... all the tree huggers and earth first folks need to get on China and India's case, among others, they're building new coal plants as fast as they can put them up, and they don't use scrubbers and etc. on the smoke stacks ...


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## Meerkat (Aug 10, 2008)

Lots of people out there who bend the truth to make themselves look good. Sweden for instance is very proud to announce that they don’t mine coal to produce electricity. True! But what they don’t tell you is that Sweden does not have any coal to mine. And they buy electricity from Germany who produces it from lignite which is so-called “dirty coal”. 


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## JOE W (Jun 4, 2004)

I think it’s a bad idea because they just got the one at Cuyahoga fair grounds
working after around a year of being broken . I also heard wind mills will never make enough wind to cover their cost .


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## Super G (Oct 3, 2012)

PapawSmith said:


> I, personally, don't think its a good idea for several reasons. One being they will never, in their lifetime, generate enough power to exceed the cost to manufacture, transport, install, commission, and then maintain them. Just like solar farms, wind energy is 100% about the money that is made within the manufacture/sell/install industry and the massive dollars dished out in the form of 'energy credits' to the entities that purchase them. It is a giant, for profit, transfer of taxpayer dollars under the guise of "green energy". That and each of these turbines holds about 80 gallons of oil in their gear box that needs changed annually and almost all of them, in their max 20 year life span, blow a seal a time or two and dump all that oil on the space below. Wind energy, in my opinion, is a great money maker for the players, and a great waste of my and your tax dollars.


Spot on PapawSmith! They don’t pay out and are a money grab for politicians and their “green new deal”! Notice how none of the politicians want them in the water in front of their coastal properties?


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## bowhunter1487 (Aug 13, 2014)

The one in Conneaut worked out well!

Pretty neutral on it I'm not gonna be a keyboard warrior on green energy because I really don't know the facts. They are on the high ridges near where I live they are ugly AF.


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## Scorpio V (Aug 23, 2013)

Anyone give consideration to what the bases of the windmills are going to do to the currents of the lake?


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## Kenlow1 (Jul 14, 2012)

After the blades of the windmills chop up a few endangered "spotted crested Lake Erie sea gulls" or two, the do gooders will file petitions and then they will have to be taken down!


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## Gottagofishn (Nov 18, 2009)

Hatchetman said:


> IF they go in, I would bet you that you will not be able to legally get close to them. They will tell you they are protecting them from"terrorists"....


I had heard the area around the turbines will be off limits... for the above quoted reasons.
Not a fan of turbines, I'm a birder when not fishing.


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## Morrowtucky Mike (May 2, 2018)




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## berkshirepresident (Jul 24, 2013)

Gottagofishn said:


> Not a fan of turbines, I'm a birder when not fishing.


Our raptor population has made tremendous strides over the past several decades....if not generations. Losing them to wind turbines is very unsettling to me.
I also think people, by and large, do not understand how damaging to the environment the used windmill blades are. To me, this is NOT Green Energy.
If you're paying attention, you may start to see the smoke and mirrors that are being pedaled when it comes to wind power.
Solar and nuclear are real options, IMHO. This is a sham.






















Wind Turbine Blades Can’t Be Recycled, So They’re Piling Up in Landfills


Companies are searching for ways to deal with the tens of thousands of blades that have reached the end of their lives.




www.bloomberg.com


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## groundsize (Feb 5, 2013)

Horrible. Wind energy is a scam.


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## Eastside Al (Apr 25, 2010)

Who will pay for fill to build them on and and cost to maintain ?

Every wind idea costs taxpayers....


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## bountyhunter (Apr 28, 2004)

great idea build them,then knock them over good, fish hiding area,s


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## Snackmans Dad (May 2, 2007)

I wonder what the voltage drop would be in 10 miles??


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## baitguy (Dec 17, 2013)

Eastside Al said:


> Who will pay for fill to build them on and and cost to maintain ?
> 
> who do you think??? the good fairy s going to do it while we're sleeping and they'll do the maintenance out of ther goodness of their hearts, what could go wrong there????
> 
> Every wind idea costs taxpayers....





Snackmans Dad said:


> I wonder what the voltage drop would be in 10 miles??


you just need a bigger extension cord, the tax-payers will pony up because we all believe in that clean energy BS  just double your electric bill because, well, they can


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## Safety1st (Apr 20, 2007)

Voltage drops, can't escape it. Also, I just wonder how many stormy days boaters cannot get out in that part of the lake. I would imagine even the Coast Guard has problems. What to do in an emergency exactly?

Oh and for you birders and eagle concerned types DON'T WORRY , how is anyone going to know what species is whacked? 10 miles out, ''whack thump'' , bird falls to the..water, fishfood .

''See, nothing happened''

Oh and post #24 for the win, we are using CLEAN NATURAL GAS to fire electric plants the high % of plants. Remember the timeline... coal is dirty! Ok appease, coal scrubbers etc. That started back late 70's? THEN...that wasn't good enough so now it's dirty nat. gas? So what's the next after this DOESN'T work? Er, appease the greenies? hmm?


Remember what I posted b4 in other threads...get used to the bus schedules,try using off peak times...subsistence fishing, the ppl 4 doors down raided the garden again we have no food.....etc.


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## Jtom (Apr 6, 2007)

PapaSmith said:

"I, personally, don't think its a good idea for several reasons. One being they will never, in their lifetime, generate enough power to exceed the cost to manufacture, transport, install, commission, and then maintain them. Just like solar farms, wind energy is 100% about the money that is made within the manufacture/sell/install industry and the massive dollars dished out in the form of 'energy credits' to the entities that purchase them. It is a giant, for profit, transfer of taxpayer dollars under the guise of "green energy". That and each of these turbines holds about 80 gallons of oil in their gear box that needs changed annually and almost all of them, in their max 20 year life span, blow a seal a time or two and dump all that oil on the space below. Wind energy, in my opinion, is a great money maker for the players, and a great waste of my and your tax dollars."

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Ding Ding Ding.........................................we have our winner!

Imagine that, a man with critical thinking skills just pointed out that "green energy" is built on a foundation of feel good fraudulent claims that cant stand up to a true analysis of ROI or true environmental impact.

Thank you sir.

(you'd think I could figure out the quote procedure)


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## Meerkat (Aug 10, 2008)

I am all for protecting the environment but the green movement has morphed into a scam to enrich politicians & bureaucrats by fleecing taxpayers. 

Case in point: There is a politician currently in the news whose personal wealth has increased 600% since she was elected to congress 5 years ago. 

Yes! You read that right. 600%!


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## Triple Trouble (Aug 13, 2018)

There is tons of empty space around the nuclear reactors on Lake Erie, the electrical infrastructure is there so no need to run power cables for miles, can service them year round and they get the onshore breeze as well. No waterspouts, no interference with shipping lanes, no need to worry about the effect on the lake, etc. If they aren't installing them at these locations, why would anyone even consider them in the lake?


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## Softshellcrab (Aug 31, 2016)

loweman165 said:


> Maybe they'll have charging ports for our boats when they tell us we can't use gas engines on Erie because GAS IS BAD!


Good one. But hey, the chargers will only work us on the days when it's too windy to go that far out!


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## steelhead steve (May 5, 2012)

berkshirepresident said:


> Have you ever seen pictures of bald eagles, other raptors, and other birds in general....especially migratory game birds....that have been killed by the blades of wind turbines?
> Have you ever seen the piles of used turbine blades sitting around b/c no one can figure out what to do with them/where to dump them? Wind power is not a free ride, unfortunately.
> Your point is well taken......but I don't think it's fair to assume that Canada is getting all of their power from wind turbines. They are not.


if you are going that route have you ever seen a lake or river that had an oil spill ? there was a pipeline spill in wyoming today 45000 gal of diesel went into a river . and how about the oil spill in the gulf of mexico or alaska tell me how good that made fishing or was good for wildlife. with pipelines its never will they spill its when will they spill..


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## Meerkat (Aug 10, 2008)

Not tor one minute am I dismissing spills but if you look at the data, spills from rail car shipments of oil exceed pipeline spills. So I guess we should stop rail shipments as well?


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## berkshirepresident (Jul 24, 2013)

steelhead steve said:


> if you are going that route have you ever seen a lake or river that had an oil spill ? there was a pipeline spill in wyoming today 45000 gal of diesel went into a river . and how about the oil spill in the gulf of mexico or alaska tell me how good that made fishing or was good for wildlife. with pipelines its never will they spill its when will they spill..


I hear what you are saying.....but pipelines and wind power are two different topics completely.
Whether or not this wind farm is a good idea has little correlation to pipelines, IMHO.


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## berkshirepresident (Jul 24, 2013)

Meerkat said:


> Not tor one minute am I dismissing spills but if you look at the data, spills from rail car shipments of oil exceed pipeline spills. So I guess we should stop rail shipments as well?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Rail spillage, while unfortunate, is often limited in size/volume........


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## Whitley (Sep 10, 2010)

Meerkat said:


> I am all for protecting the environment but the green movement has morphed into a scam to enrich politicians & bureaucrats by fleecing taxpayers.
> 
> Case in point: There is a politician currently in the news whose personal wealth has increased 600% since she was elected to congress 5 years ago.
> 
> ...


Never a shortage of wind there.


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## baitguy (Dec 17, 2013)

Meerkat said:


> I am all for protecting the environment but the green movement has morphed into a scam to enrich politicians & bureaucrats by fleecing taxpayers.
> 
> Case in point: There is a politician currently in the news whose personal wealth has increased 600% since she was elected to congress 5 years ago.
> 
> ...



Meerkat, it's not the way it looks ... I heard she found a number of thousands of dollars in an envelope ... after she searched relentlessly, high and low over hill and dale for the rightful donor  I meant owner, the rightful owner  and exhausted all of the proper channels available, it was awarded to her for being such an upstanding citizen  then it was just a matter of a few lucky investments, of which she had absolutely no prior information not available to anyone else about their possible increase in value  and she's now investing in wind turbines 🤠 you see, when you look at it from the proper perspective, it's really all very understandable


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## Meerkat (Aug 10, 2008)

berkshirepresident said:


> Rail spillage, while unfortunate, is often limited in size/volume........


Yeah but there are a whole lot more of them. Easy to cover up & don’t make headlines. 


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## bad luck (Apr 9, 2009)

I believe they typically shut off the entire area where these are at, to any sort of fishing or even driving through…..


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## 18inchBrown (May 1, 2016)

I want to know , how do they change the shaft bearings on that fan? That's a cantilever load so they got to wear out, don't they?. Do they just run them to they brake and let them sit?

The wind doesn't always blow even on Lake Erie. Will they have an on-demand gas plant ready to fire up then or will there just be a blackout? What about if the wind blows 60 or 70 mph, can the fans handle that?


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## homebrew (Apr 13, 2009)

Safety1st said:


> Voltage drops, can't escape it. Also, I just wonder how many stormy days boaters cannot get out in that part of the lake. I would imagine even the Coast Guard has problems. What to





Snackmans Dad said:


> I wonder what the voltage drop would be in 10 miles??


 Look up HVDC transimission (High Voltage DC). Problem solved. 
I would rather deal with the disposal of used blades than spent nuclear fuel.


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## Gottagofishn (Nov 18, 2009)

For your reading and viewing pleasure…

















Even Clean Energy Has Little Oil Spills


Wind turbines were planted along a strip of Mexico’s southern coast to make the country’s power industry cleaner. Now they’re spilling oil.




www.bloomberg.com












Oil leaks at wind turbines in the Thumb not a rarity


UPPER THUMB — Ominous black spots on wind turbines in the Thumb have raised a few eyebrows. Huron County Building and Zoning Director Jeff Smith says residents have questioned what look like grease stains on six or seven turbines between Sebewaing




www.wind-watch.org





They could use “Green lubricants” an article stated. Probably say it’s too expensive.


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## One guy and a boat (Aug 8, 2018)

18inchBrown said:


> I want to know , how do they change the shaft bearings on that fan? That's a cantilever load so they got to wear out, don't they?. Do they just run them to they brake and let them sit?
> 
> The wind doesn't always blow even on Lake Erie. Will they have an on-demand gas plant ready to fire up then or will there just be a blackout? What about if the wind blows 60 or 70 mph, can the fans handle that?


From what I read, they would need 6 mph winds to start and would stop when winds hit 55 mph. Which seems to suit Lake Erie. Seems like it would be in that range 90-95 % of the time.

Kip


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## Ron Y (Dec 2, 2020)

I am curious how they are going to anchor them. The dock pipes at 55th st marina in Cleveland are 72' long. the sheet pile along route 2 just east of the marina where the power plant used to be are up to 140' long. An engineer told me that hard material out in lake is very deep. maybe at that location its better. But the water is still about 70' deep and then their anchor piling need to go down another 50-100'. Seems like a very costly venture when they could go on land. The idea of putting them next to existing power plants makes sense. But if this is such a great idea how come First Energy is not doing it at that site on shore way or at closed Eastlake plant or by Avon lake plant or by the nuke plants ??? Whole thing sounds like boondoggle to get money from the feds.


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## Conny Predator (Aug 11, 2014)

Lake Erie a tremendous public resource and the last wilderness in Ohio being sold off to private interests who want to make a profit with windmills subsidized by tax payer dollars.
The Conneaut harbor windmill was taken down after being struck by lightning out of fear of coming down on local businesses and the hydraulic oil in the turbin catching fire.


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## creekcrawler (Oct 5, 2004)

Dang, didn't know we had so many experts on the subject here. . .


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## Muddy (May 7, 2017)

Some of my family has multiple windmills on their farm. The windmills kill more birds than I ever imagined. At first I figured that birds would steer clear of them, but apparently they don’t. Independent contractors come out every so often and flag out a grid pattern under the windmills and do a bird impact study. For some reason these studies never turn up any dead birds under the wind mills, but yet it’s not uncommon for the average person to walk out and find a dead bird😊. Our family makes some darn good money off of the lease’s though! All heavily subsidized by the taxpayers.


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## Softshellcrab (Aug 31, 2016)

Meerkat said:


> Not tor one minute am I dismissing spills but if you look at the data, spills from rail car shipments of oil exceed pipeline spills. So I guess we should stop rail shipments as well?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


There is a weighing process, and the problem with the windmills is that they are just not going to do much good producing energy, so that any environmental problems caused by them become unacceptable. For trains, sure they will sometimes have spills, crashes, etc, and for that matter accidents. But they are vital and do so much good, that we therefore accept that and just try to make them as safe as we can. It is a weighing process. Same for cars and trucks, which certainly do much more harm along the way than do either trains or windmills. But again, no one is going to argue to get rid of cars and trucks. They are just too vital and produce so much benefit to society on the other side of the ledger, so we weigh the tremendous good they do against the downsides. The problem windmills is that they just don't do much good. They don't work very well, and the ones that exist are overwhelmingly subsidized through tax breaks and direct subsidies. They will never, ever come close to meeting even our present electricity needs. And our electricity needs will double or triple if, as predicted, we move to all electric vehicles in the future. Windmills won't even put a dent in those needs. And the electricity they produce is much more expensive compared to traditional power plants.


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## berkshirepresident (Jul 24, 2013)

creekcrawler said:


> Dang, didn't know we had so many experts on the subject here. . .


But are we wrong?


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## Meerkat (Aug 10, 2008)

Softshellcrab said:


> There is a weighing process, and the problem with the windmills is that they are just not going to do much good producing energy, so that any environmental problems caused by them become unacceptable. For trains, sure they will sometimes have spills, crashes, etc, and for that matter accidents. But they are vital and do so much good, that we therefore accept that and just try to make them as safe as we can. It is a weighing process. Same for cars and trucks, which certainly do much more harm along the way than do either trains or windmills. But again, no one is going to argue to get rid of cars and trucks. They are just too vital and produce so much benefit to society on the other side of the ledger, so we weigh the tremendous good they do against the downsides. The problem windmills is that they just don't do much good. They don't work very well, and the ones that exist are overwhelmingly subsidized through tax breaks and direct subsidies. They will never, ever come close to meeting even our present electricity needs. And our electricity needs will double or triple if, as predicted, we move to all electric vehicles in the future. Windmills won't even put a dent in those needs. And the electricity they produce is much more expensive compared to traditional power plants.


Agree with what you say except for your statement about nobody will argue for doing away with cars & trucks. Klaus Schwab, head of the world economic forum in Davos absolutely has publicly called for the abolition of private vehicle ownership. 


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## Ol' Whiskers (Aug 11, 2004)

Yes but he aint like the rest of us! He has someone to transport him on the ground, in the air, over the water, everywhere. Smug SOB, and his cronies, thinks he can command something and the whole rest of humanity is just happier than a pig in $h t to go along.


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## Ron Y (Dec 2, 2020)

Read the NASA report. Its all a BS waste of time and money.


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## EnonEye (Apr 13, 2011)

I know a fart when I smell one, you'll get your 4 acres and a mule and walk and like it, power grid goes to the rich only, some may think they'll be getting a piece of the pie, but then we would be supporting our buds in China hmmmmm


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## Whitley (Sep 10, 2010)

I believe when the wind turbines iced up last year in Texas, and 20% of the State was without electricity, the blades were deiced by spraying evil gasoline on the blades from a helicopter. What shade of GREEN is this?


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## landin hawgs (Jan 27, 2008)

G&G Sportfishing said:


> Anyone give consideration to what the bases of the windmills are going to do to the currents of the lake?


Absolutely nothing. But who wants to see that **** anyway. Between the initial cost and the maintenance these will never break even. So stupid


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## Safety1st (Apr 20, 2007)

...if I setup something on land that is known to whack protected birds such as eagles, how soon will the Feds send an army of agents to arrest me. Complete with News vans with little satellite dishes, 5-30 live broadcasts.

GUESS I DONNA HAVE THE RIGHT connections...

Hmmm....


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## I Fish (Sep 24, 2008)

A question that never gets an answer is how much power does a wind mill or solar panel actually produce in a year? Not what they could make but what do they actually make?

There are years of real world examples but, we never hear those numbers, because they are horrible.


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## PapawSmith (Feb 13, 2007)

I Fish said:


> A question that never gets an answer is how much power does a wind mill or solar panel actually produce in a year? Not what they could make but what do they actually make?
> There are years of real world examples but, we never hear those numbers, because they are horrible.


They 'claim' that it would require about 3,700 of the large off shore turbines to power New York City, but that comes from the folks that promote and sell them so I don't believe them. Even so, if it were only 3,700, that number is based on each turbine producing at its rated capicity and, in reality, wind turbines are only about 20% reliable, AT BEST, so you would have to increase that count by a factor of five times to a total of about 18,500 turbines. Where the hell would you put them? And we need to always remember that the overall cost to manufacture, transport, erect, commission, and maintain them exceeds the overall value of the energy that they will ever provide in their 20 year max lifetime. The notion that this is a viable energy source is absurd, but they are selling it to us anyway.


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## steelhead steve (May 5, 2012)

berkshirepresident said:


> Have you ever seen pictures of bald eagles, other raptors, and other birds in general....especially migratory game birds....that have been killed by the blades of wind turbines?
> Have you ever seen the piles of used turbine blades sitting around b/c no one can figure out what to do with them/where to dump them? Wind power is not a free ride, unfortunately.
> Your point is well taken......but I don't think it's fair to assume that Canada is getting all of their power from wind turbines. They are not.


how many ducks and other birds plus fish and mamals have died from oil spills , oil and nuke is not free either .


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## TRIPLE-J (Sep 18, 2006)

Lmao
Sooooooooo many experts on here
Lol


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## One guy and a boat (Aug 8, 2018)

In some ways, very true.









Kip


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