# My 1st Boat! Could use some advice...



## H.I.McDunnough (Sep 24, 2010)

I've taken the plunge and bought my first boat. Got tired of seeing all these awesome looking fishing spots from shore that I can never reach on foot. I've actually wanted a little boat long before I recently got into fishing. Just seemed like a good time to buy with Old Man Winter hobbling up the sidewalk to our door.

For anyone else who may be looking, Dick's Sporting Goods is blowing out their stock of Pelican Bass Raider 10E's for only $449.99. They usually run about $600 - $750 new so I feel confident with that price considering it's got a 2 year manufacturers warranty.

So here's a question for you experienced Captains on the forum: what kind of motor should I buy?

I thought about just going with a high powered trolling motor and a bad-ass Optima battery. I don't plan to take her out on lake Erie or anything but it would be nice to get out on a bigger lake on a calm day. Would a 55 lb. trolling motor move this thing at a reasonable speed? What about a 80 lb.? I've noticed the 80 lb. motors require 24V. Does this mean a huge battery and a really long shaft? Too much for this little boat?

The other option is of course a gas motor. I've been looking at 2.5 - 3.5 HP models because the manual says I should keep the motor weight on the transom to 36 lbs. The 3.5 Mercury and Tohatsu models I've been looking at are about 40-43 lbs. I doubt it'll make much of a difference but I'd like to get your opinions. Another question I have is about the shaft length. I've read online that you should measure from the top of the transom to the bottom of the hull. That's 19" so do I need a 20" long shaft or would I be OK with a 15" short shaft. I was very interested in this nice looking little Suzuki (price and weight are low. only 30 lbs.!) but I'm afraid the shaft might be too short. They don't offer the 2.5 in a long shaft and the comparable 3.5 Mercury and Tohatsu models are about $200 more!

Any guidance would be very much appreciated.


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## oarfish (May 12, 2004)

I would get a 40# electric motor fro Walmart and use the little fishing vessel.
You can always upgrade if needed. Most people will upgrade to a bigger boat with gas motor for bigger water..


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## WishinIWuzFishin (Jun 17, 2009)

http://www.pedalboat.com/oz/4/com/fish/br10/br10e.html

According to this site a 15" (short) shaft is recommended. 
If it were mine I'd have a tough time deciding which motor to go with but if you go with an electric I agree 40 lb should be plenty, but I think I might lean towards a gas motor actually.
Sounds like you got a heck of a deal on it!!


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## H.I.McDunnough (Sep 24, 2010)

WishinIWuzFishin said:


> http://www.pedalboat.com/oz/4/com/fish/br10/br10e.html
> 
> According to this site a 15" (short) shaft is recommended.


Thanks for the feedback, guys. And thanks for the link. That's quite interesting. I got a hold of Pelican customer service to confirm if I needed a long shaft and the woman told me I did indeed need a long shaft. That's confusing me because if the transom has a 36 lb. limit then I can't use any motor with a long shaft, as they are all weighing over 36 lbs. 

When I mentioned this anomaly to her, she said that I should stay within the 36 lb. thrust limits, so I don't think she even knew what the hell she's talking about. 

Maybe I'll call those folks on that pedalboat.com website and see what they say.


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## Ga. transplant (Oct 13, 2010)

H.I.McDunnough said:


> Thanks for the feedback, guys. And thanks for the link. That's quite interesting. I got a hold of Pelican customer service to confirm if I needed a long shaft and the woman told me I did indeed need a long shaft. That's confusing me because if the transom has a 36 lb. limit then I can't use any motor with a long shaft, as they are all weighing over 36 lbs.
> 
> When I mentioned this anomaly to her, she said that I should stay within the 36 lb. thrust limits, so I don't think she even knew what the hell she's talking about.
> 
> Maybe I'll call those folks on that pedalboat.com website and see what they say.


a friend of mine has the same boat and has a 46# minn cota on it and it moved us around real good. we are both good sized guys. imo a gas motor is to much for such a small boat I personally would go electric.


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## WishinIWuzFishin (Jun 17, 2009)

Here's my thoughts on the matter of long vs short shaft. On a planing boat with a 20" transom and a 20" shaft motor, the motor shaft would be sitting deep in the water at rest because the hull is partially submerged. Like maybe 5-10" deeper than it needs to be. But on plane the hull rises out of the water leaving the motor cavitation plate just under water. But your boat is not going to plane. So on your boat if a short shaft motor is far enough in the water at rest, that is where it will stay whether moving or not. Your boat will not rise up out of the water under power so IMO a short shaft would be fine. I would just make sure when you mount a short shaft and put the boat in the water that the motor is submerged deep enough (cavitation plate under water). Unless your boat totally floats on top of the water a short shaft should be ok. IMO

Just for your information....from what I have read.....JUST A ROUGH ESTIMATE.....20lbs of thrust on an electric motor is equal to 1hp......40lbs thrust=2hp...etc


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## bkr43050 (Apr 5, 2004)

I would go by the web site info that was listed above as that seems much more reliable than the voice on the line that you had. If you measured from the top of the transom to the bottom of the hull and got 20" then I don't see how a long shaft would be a recommendation. You are going to be drafting at least 5-6" and that puts you in the range of a short shaft motor (15" to the cavitation plate). The web site clearly states that the 36# is motor weight and not thrust. In fact your boat should have a capacity plate on it that states the maximum HP rating allowed.


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## WishinIWuzFishin (Jun 17, 2009)

Also, from my own experience, any supposedly short shaft 15" motor that I HAVE ACTUALLY MEASURED has always been 17-18" by my measuring, from the inside top of the transom mount to the cavitation plate.


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## H.I.McDunnough (Sep 24, 2010)

Ga. transplant said:


> a friend of mine has the same boat and has a 46# minn cota on it and it moved us around real good. we are both good sized guys. imo a gas motor is to much for such a small boat I personally would go electric.


Yeah, at first I was thinking electric would be the way to go. Then I noticed the weight of a decent battery (39-59 lbs.) minus the actual trolling motor was even heavier than a little gas outboard (30-40 lbs.) I'm not worried so much about sinking the boat as its total capacity is 600 lbs. I'm more concerned with having to lift it to get it on a utility trailer. Any weight savings will possibly help save our backs! I'm mostly going to be taking my girlfriend or her kids on this boat, so I want something we can handle without too much trouble.

Also, having it all self contained in a small outboard with built in fuel tank seems more logical on such a small boat where space is at a premium. Don't really want to mess around with a bulky battery sliding all over the deck, _and_ the trolling motor.


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## bkr43050 (Apr 5, 2004)

By the time you figure the small outboard motor's fuel weight in along with the motor you probably match or exceed the weight of a trolling motor and battery. In either case you can pull them off the boat before launching/loading to make it easier. If it is a small outboard I think you would probably not want to leave it on the transom when transporting anyway as you will most likely not have a way to connect a transom saver to take the stress off the transom. Bouncing around while on the trailer puts more stress on the transom than while in the water.

Years ago I used to use a small jon boat that was just using a trolling motor and we had to do it much like you are describing. We pulled the motor, battery, tackle boxes, etc. from the boat to make it manageable to lift on to the truck and then placed everything back inside the boat for the ride.


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## oarfish (May 12, 2004)

H.I.McDunnough said:


> Yeah, at first I was thinking electric would be the way to go. Then I noticed the weight of a decent battery (39-59 lbs.) minus the actual trolling motor was even heavier than a little gas outboard (30-40 lbs.) I'm not worried so much about sinking the boat as its total capacity is 600 lbs. I'm more concerned with having to lift it to get it on a utility trailer. Any weight savings will possibly help save our backs! I'm mostly going to be taking my girlfriend or her kids on this boat, so I want something we can handle without too much trouble.
> 
> Also, having it all self contained in a small outboard with built in fuel tank seems more logical on such a small boat where space is at a premium. Don't really want to mess around with a bulky battery sliding all over the deck, _and_ the trolling motor.


Those are good consecrations. Don't forget however about a few things: all electric lakes + noise + fumes + maintenance.


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## H.I.McDunnough (Sep 24, 2010)

WishinIWuzFishin and bkr43050, thanks for the info on the shaft length!

So now I'm wondering if any of you can recommend a dealer/retailer where I can purchase a new outboard at a fair price. I'm not sure what I should be paying for a brand new 2.5 HP outboard. I know I could buy a used one for considerably cheaper, but if it's going to be the only source of power for my little boat (aside from an oar or two) I'd like to make sure it's 100% reliable and not been overused and/or abused. Also, I like the idea of having a warranty.

http://www.newoutboards.com/ has that little Suzuki for $739. No tax and free shipping. I like no tax and free shipping. Does this seem like the right ballpark. Might I be able to find a local dealer that can get me out the door for around that same price or less?


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## H.I.McDunnough (Sep 24, 2010)

oarfish said:


> Those are good consecrations. Don't forget however about a few things: all electric lakes + noise + fumes + maintenance.





bkr43050 said:


> By the time you figure the small outboard motor's fuel weight in along with the motor you probably match or exceed the weight of a trolling motor and battery....EDIT


Those are good points too! Damn! What to do?


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## bkr43050 (Apr 5, 2004)

It looks like if you really wanted to you could put both a gas motor on the back and a trolling motor on the front. It looks like it is designed for placing a transom style trolling motor up front. The only thing then that you would have to be careful of is your overall weight. I know you said it is rated for 600#. With 2 guys, both motors, battery, gas, tackle boxes, you may be closer to that 600# than you think.


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## bkr43050 (Apr 5, 2004)

If you are looking to do small bodies of water to start I would go ahead and go with a good trolling motor. It gives you good mobility and as mentioned will get you on the electric only lakes. You could build from there if you feel the need. I know I personally would not want to be forced to use the gas motor only.


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## WishinIWuzFishin (Jun 17, 2009)

I would go with both motors myself. In fact I did with a 12 ft alum boat I have. I have a 40 lb thrust electric and a used 5hp gas motor and I think your maximum weight capacity is even more than my boat. I fish Mosquito with it and like the idea that my chances of ever having to row are very small. I used to carry oars with me but as I became comfortable that the 5hp was going to start every time, I don't even take them now. I can also troll with either one depending on wave conditions. Also, I'm not trying to talk you out of buying a new gas outboard.....all your points are valid.....but I've been to a lot of auctions recently looking for used outboards. Although not real common at auctions, when I do see one of the smaller 2-3hp motors, they are usually in very good condition. Seems like lots of times they got bought but used very little. You could buy an electric now and look for a cheap used gas motor over the winter. I saw a 2 or 3 hp (can't remember for sure now) Johnson at an auction a few weeks ago that looked BRAND NEW and it sold for like $120. It was an older motor (80's I think) but I personally would have no problem with that old of a motor in a smaller hp if it looked and ran good. You could get yourslf a brand new electric motor, new battery and look for a gas motor over winter and end up having less than $400 invested in all of it, even less if you bought a used electric. Then you always have the option of putting both on the boat for maximum reliability or using one or the other when necessary. It gives me a lot of peace of mind knowing I have 2 very reliable means of power besides rowing.


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## H.I.McDunnough (Sep 24, 2010)

bkr43050 said:


> If you are looking to do small bodies of water to start I would go ahead and go with a good trolling motor...





WishinIWuzFishin said:


> I would go with both motors myself...


Probably good advice. So if I wanted to go with a bow mount trolling motor, how does it fit on? The ones I've seen look like the kind that attach perpendicular on the front of a larger fiberglass boat:









I've read that you can take apart the transom mount motors and reverse the shaft or prop, but it's not ideally designed for this purpose and it makes the motor operate noisy and not at peak performance?

Maybe I'll just go with a 55 lb. motor attached to the transom and that way I can also have night time running lights, fish finder, CD player, 800 watt amp and a couple 10" subwoofers. Don't want to go with 12" or 15" speakers because that might take up too much space, dawg.


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## WishinIWuzFishin (Jun 17, 2009)

I've taken apart several electric trolling motors in the past and if I recall correctly on every one of them you could take the top "head" off and reverse it on the shaft so the handle was in the right direction if bow mounted. The one I have now just has a bolt going through the shaft...remove the bolt....rotate the handle part 180 degrees and put the bolt back in. I seem to remember some might have had set screws instead of thru-bolts, but either way on all of them you could have reversed the handles very easily. Just don't pinch the wires when putting the bolts back in. From the pic it looks like there is a standard transom type mount on the bow of your boat.


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## H.I.McDunnough (Sep 24, 2010)

WishinIWuzFishin said:


> I've taken apart several electric trolling motors in the past and if I recall correctly on every one of them you could take the top "head" off and reverse it on the shaft so the handle was in the right direction if bow mounted.


Well thanks for the tip, mang! You've been very helpful. Actually all you guys have been a great help and I really do appreciate your input and suggestions. You're all welcome to stop by for a few beers whenever you're in town.


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## H.I.McDunnough (Sep 24, 2010)

Today I scored an outboard motor from Craigslist!

3.5 HP JC Penney (Tecumseh/Eska) for only $65! Starts right up on the first pull and burns real clean. Sounds nice and healthy too. He said the points and the plug were just changed out and it's been very reliable for him. I figured for $65 it was a pretty good deal.

If Mad Max was using an outboard, I think it'd look like this one. I'll probably repaint the cover and maybe I'll get the JC Penney logo and some flames painted on...


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## oarfish (May 12, 2004)

Nice going, hope you get to take the boat out soon before cold hits.


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## surffishn (Jan 20, 2010)

That motor is A beauty!


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## WishinIWuzFishin (Jun 17, 2009)

Cool looking motor !! Do you know what year it is? Is it air cooled or does it have an impeller?


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## H.I.McDunnough (Sep 24, 2010)

oarfish said:


> Nice going, hope you get to take the boat out soon before cold hits.


Me too. Trying to scrape up the funds for a decent used utility trailer. I don't care if it's cold, I'm getting this thing out ASAP. I'm as excited as a kid one week before Christmas.



surffishn said:


> That motor is A beauty!


Well she ain't gonna win any pageants but she runs great (at the moment) and the price is right. Even if I only get a few months or maybe a year out of it that's still not bad for $65.



WishinIWuzFishin said:


> Cool looking motor !! Do you know what year it is? Is it air cooled or does it have an impeller?


From my online research, I've discovered it's a 1978 Eska (JC Penney model #0901) with an air cooled Tecumseh motor. 85cc I think. This particular model has no impeller that I know of but it has a little tube near the propeller that gets water forced in to cool the exhaust. At least I think that's how it works.  Amazingly, there's still quite a few parts available from this website: http://home.earthlink.net/~brixent/brix_enterprise_002.htm


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## 7thcorpsFA (Mar 6, 2010)

I'm getting my 2 cents in a little late, but these guys are giving excellent advice. I'd go with 2 motors as well. That way if one craps out on you, you've got a backup. This will allow you to save your battery juice. If you use your trolling motor only, it will eat up your charge much quicker. Constant running at heavy load causes them to drain very quickly. This will allow you to go with a smaller lighter battery, even a smaller, lighter Tr. motor if you want. With your gas motor you can go all day with no worries about running down your battery. Get a high quality deep cycle battery. A high efficient tr. motor costs more but will worth it in the long run. Now that you have a boat your fishing experience will be better, your odds will increase dramatically. Good luck! And good fishing to you!


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## H.I.McDunnough (Sep 24, 2010)

7thcorpsFA said:


> I'm getting my 2 cents in a little late, but these guys are giving excellent advice...


Thanks. I was actually going to go with the trolling motor first but that ad on craigslist just popped up this morning. $65 just seemed too good to pass up, even though I really wanted a newer (maybe brand new) motor. I still might be buying a newer gas outboard and trolling motor. I'll see how this old Eska performs and maybe I'll keep using it indefinitely and buy a fancy 55 lb. electric outfit with an Optima battery. I love those Optimas. I'm not even going to consider another brand. In the past 8 years I've had three different cars as my main vehicle and I keep moving the same old Optima (yellow top deep cycle) battery from car to car. Sold my 88 Toyota pickup and pulled the battery. The 92 Celica died on I-75, pulled the battery. Now it's sitting in my 88 Lincoln Town Car. Starts everytime!


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## oarfish (May 12, 2004)

That gas motor was a good buy. It will give you experience on the water.
Like bkr43050 said mobility will suffer without electric motor since it is not practical at all to fire up the gas every time you want to move. Eventually that electric setup with the modern battery will be the way..., or both if the little vessel can handle it.


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