# Chagrin Not Right



## brickman (Jun 2, 2008)

I have been steelhead fishing for many years, mostly fish the Chagrin as it is like 3 minutes from my house. Fish with a group of experienced anglers and we all run with centerpins.
This season has been very weird from a numbers stand point on the Chagrin. We / I am used to getting at very least a couple fish each time out and have done many double digit days. This year no where near the case. Sunday went out at sun up, 4 of us, one fish between the group. Any one else seeing this or have we just forgot how to fish?


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## OHtard (Sep 27, 2013)

Same here. I got so frustrated I pulled out a bass rod, and started throwing rooster tails... only managed 4 total in 3 days of fishing. Went out today with the pin, and nothing, beads, jigs, even tipped the jigs. Seems like they just are not there. Currently looking for a new river, chagrin was easy, because it’s close. Guess I will just wake up earlier.


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## master of steel (Oct 12, 2008)

There's only 2 rivers that have been lights out so far this season. The others have been average to down right awful. I think it's this new strain of steelhead the ODNR has been stocking. They seem to push up river really fast. It will be an interesting spring.


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## zimmerj (Oct 17, 2014)

I caught two early in the season at North Chagrin Reservation and one just last week at the South Chagrin Reservation. A fisherman who fishes the South Chagrin a lot told me mine was the first one he has seen caught this season. It has been a strange year.


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## ForeverSnagged (Oct 24, 2015)

I don’t fish the Chagrin much, but I, and many people I have talked to, have had a poor year so far on the Grand.


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## kapposgd (Apr 10, 2012)

The new strains they are stocking are behaving differently than the manistees do. I've been catching the majority of my fish in and adjacent to the faster water. They also seem to have a higher affinity for wood and the color chartreuse. That said the chagrin doesnt have the numbers we're accustomed to seeing and the size I've been catching has been way below normal (even for this time of year). My two most recent outings have been the best so far of the year on the chagrin by covering a ton of water. 

It sounds like you're familiar enough with the river to know when you're putting a good drift through the run. If I dont get hit within the first 5-10 drifts - im gone. Over and over again I would catch 1-3 fish in the first 15 mins of fishing a hole, then catch nothing for the next 30-45 mins. They have been willing biters when they're there.

I'm holding out hope it gets better over the next few months when some of the older manistees start coming in

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## kapposgd (Apr 10, 2012)

ForeverSnagged said:


> I don’t fish the Chagrin much, but I, and many people I have talked to, have had a poor year so far on the Grand.


Had a mediocre day on the grand turn well into double digits by switching to plugs in faster water - I dont fish the river much but it might be something that works for you too









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## KTkiff (Jul 30, 2004)

I don’t think it’s the new strain. The last two years it’s been phenomenal. It’s not like those fish just disappeared. The walleye bite was off this fall. Something is up. 

Last year I easily averaged 10-15 in 3-4 hours on the Chagrin. This year 1-2 in that time frame. All small. Like really small.


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## allwayzfishin (Apr 30, 2008)

I have been up to oak orchard, elk, grand and the chagrin this year. All the rivers I fished have been the lower stretches as in less than 5 miles from the lake. I’ve done well in each river using minnow imitations. Brown trout eggs used to be like steelhead crack, not so much the case for me these days. Color nor size. Once I started to pay attention to my surroundings, I watched and listened. I adapted my presentation and offerings. IMO, these fish are a winter run strain...most fish are staging still in the lower stretch. I don’t see fish rolling upstream in the deep holes like we did 5-8 yrs ago in October. I haven’t done very good on numbers either, but the closer I stay to the lake, and the more I play with minnow patterns, the better I seem to do. Heck, I was out vertical jigging in front of the chagrin river bar restaurant place using a blue Crome vibee. I got seven the fish day, then two from that spot the next. I moved closer to the lake and I caught 3 more. Hooked a bunch but didn’t land them.


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## allwayzfishin (Apr 30, 2008)

Try this...drift a 1/16 oz black jig head with a clouser minnow pattern tied sparsely no longer than 2” by itself. Fish deep holes closer to the lake, use a bobber with a stop to adjust the depth. Still place your shot accordingly in series above and below the micro barrel swivel. Use 4-6lb floro too as your leader. This has put double digit days in the books for me this season. But only in the lower deep sections. See, the emerald shiners are the prime forage for most lake run trout. These shiners come into the cold rivers to spawn just like trout during the winter. The shiners become weak and usually die afterwards and dead drift down stream for easy pickins. Just my observations and what had been working for me. Which I’m cool with because I hate messy egg sac tying sessions. I’d rather tie my own fly/jig patterns


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## master of steel (Oct 12, 2008)

allwayzfishin said:


> I have been up to oak orchard, elk, grand and the chagrin this year. All the rivers I fished have been the lower stretches as in less than 5 miles from the lake. I’ve done well in each river using minnow imitations. Brown trout eggs used to be like steelhead crack, not so much the case for me these days. Color nor size. Once I started to pay attention to my surroundings, I watched and listened. I adapted my presentation and offerings. IMO, these fish are a winter run strain...most fish are staging still in the lower stretch. I don’t see fish rolling upstream in the deep holes like we did 5-8 yrs ago in October. I haven’t done very good on numbers either, but the closer I stay to the lake, and the more I play with minnow patterns, the better I seem to do. Heck, I was out vertical jigging in front of the chagrin river bar restaurant place using a blue Crome vibee. I got seven the fish day, then two from that spot the next. I moved closer to the lake and I caught 3 more. Hooked a bunch but didn’t land them.


There's plenty of fish upstream and I mean way upstream. I was catching fish back in early September. The majority of Lake Erie steelhead don't imprint well on their streams of stocking. We can get Ohio, PA, or New York stocked fish and they can be fall, winter, or spring run fish. The whining about the lack of fish are usually the guys that park at their favorite spot and don't move. The fish are spread out, you have to cover a lot of water.


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## master of steel (Oct 12, 2008)

KTkiff said:


> I don’t think it’s the new strain. The last two years it’s been phenomenal. It’s not like those fish just disappeared. The walleye bite was off this fall. Something is up.
> 
> Last year I easily averaged 10-15 in 3-4 hours on the Chagrin. This year 1-2 in that time frame. All small. Like really small.


I've noticed this new strain which is from Wisconsin, tends to move upstream more faster than other strains. There's always been small fish as long as I can remember. What I haven't seen lately are shiners in the lower stretches. We commented about the lack of them, but the majority of the fish I've caught have been short and plump, so there's not an issue of lack of forage out in the lake. As for the walleye bite being off, the guys I know that fish for them would beg to differ.


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## OHtard (Sep 27, 2013)

Thanks for all the info. This is my 3rd year chasing chrome, and my goal is to go to new water. It was just too easy to drive to the closest river and fish. I spent most of yesterday in the truck, and this morning before work online looking at maps. Hopefully I’ll get a day out next week, and all this info is helping. Thanks.


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## langer (Apr 26, 2014)

I have noticed the exact same thing. The Chagrin used to be money for me, I don't know what has happened. Numbers and especially size are terrible this year. With prime conditions, other rivers have been good but the Chagrin has been disappointing. Maybe it is those Gaharaska strains not imprinting or moving upriver fast. 

It's tough to make the drive up from Columbus when it is starting to become such a struggle.


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## brickman (Jun 2, 2008)

master of steel said:


> There's plenty of fish upstream and I mean way upstream. I was catching fish back in early September. The majority of Lake Erie steelhead don't imprint well on their streams of stocking. We can get Ohio, PA, or New York stocked fish and they can be fall, winter, or spring run fish. The whining about the lack of fish are usually the guys that park at their favorite spot and don't move. The fish are spread out, you have to cover a lot of water.


Well this is not true in my group, we take two trucks and park so we can walk a ton and have a ride back to where we started. I agree with chartreuse being a favorite color now.
The walleye bite is definitely different this fall, there has been very little shore fishing after dark because the fish are not there. The fall bite has been deep, 35 - 45 foot. On a normal late fall early winter the bite is very close to shore, not this year.


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## 1MoreKast (Mar 15, 2008)

I agree that these fish are moving up rather quickly. Fishing far upstream is typically a no-go before March for me but as of this December we've fished fairly far upstream and gotten into a few.

Another thing I've heard, I can't confirm though, is that guys walleye fishing have seen LOADS of shad between Cuyahoga and Connie. I'm wondering if these fish (both walleye and steelhead) have no reason to eat nor move much if there is such a plentiful source out in the big water, also to why maybe allwayzfishin is finding success on more minnow patterns.

On another note, my group fished Big Man and PM up in Michigan this past November and we had our best year yet....


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## dholmes (Jun 29, 2014)

Chag has been uncharacteristically slow for me this Fall/Winter as well. I caught fish earlier in the season than most years, but nowhere near the numbers I'm accustomed to. Hopefully just a sluggish start to the run.


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## Osmerus (Dec 5, 2012)

Got 3 lost one yesterday morning on the chag. Managed 6 last sunday. They are there. The fishing pressure has been very high this year, at least it seems that way. Once ya hook a fish they shut down for a bit. You gota be one the first guys to fish an area. Lots of the popular areas to fish the chag have filled in over the years and they don't hold as many fish. I move around alot also. Fish for a half hour then move. Moving around alot is they key to catching more fish. I fish down low and up high all in one day.


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## KTkiff (Jul 30, 2004)

Osmerus said:


> Got 3 lost one yesterday morning on the chag. Managed 6 last sunday. They are there. The fishing pressure has been very high this year, at least it seems that way. Once ya hook a fish they shut down for a bit. You gota be one the first guys to fish an area. Lots of the popular areas to fish the chag have filled in over the years and they don't hold as many fish. I move around alot also. Fish for a half hour then move. Moving around alot is they key to catching more fish. I fish down low and up high all in one day.


The pressure is no different than any other year. The Chagrin is always packed. Some years are just better than others. Wish we knew why.


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## CaptainFishpond (Nov 28, 2016)

The bite has been tougher (for me) this year in the Rocky compared to the last couple years. 

Also the bass bite in the river this past summer was HORRIBLE compared to the last year. 

I hope things turn around. More so in the bass fishing tbh


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## Archer4life (Apr 16, 2013)

Here's what we have now in Ohio for steelhead. Manistee,Ganaraska,and Chambers Creek strains. The latter two due to Michigans in ability to provide us with reliable Manistee numbers the last few years. thank you Wisconsin for helping out. Manistees are not a early run fish for the most part. Majority tend to enter the rivers in late winter and if we are lucky and get the right weather in late winter we can fish for them. if not we are frozen out as early as December. They are spring spawners. We all know the trouble with that is our tribs especially the grand can stay unfishable for weeks in the spring. Sometimes a month. Manistees tend to be in out real quick when they are on the spawn. They will come in on the high water and are sometimes gone before the creeks drop to fishable levels. How many of you have thought you were going to kill them after extended high water periods in the spring only to find a bunch of empty beds and little or no fish? That's the draw back to winter run/spring spawners. The Chambers creek and Ganaraska strains are also winter run/ spring spawners who make a push in late November /December and may not have substantial runs again till spring arrives coinciding with warmer water temps and the most unstable fishing conditions of the year pertaining to fishable river flows. Yes they may trickle in till then. This might be what you are experiencing. Water temps can effect the intensity of the runs. A lot of the fish tend to sit in the lake until they are close to the spawn if the lake is warmer than the creeks. More comfortable for them and abundance of food. There are a lot of factors that can effect steelhead numbers in winter. all you can do is keep fishing. change creeks. fish different sections of the creeks till you find some. Heck. I've resorted to fishing the lake when possible if fish numbers are low in the tribs. They will hit jig n maggot just like they do in the fall. As for the Chagrin, it always has been more iffy as far as a winter bite compared to the other tribs. I have noticed the lack of fish this past month. My buddy and I fished Christmas Eve day. We started up high. South chagrin res high. Nothing. He fished low and managed
a few skips. Saw very few fish landed.. Christmas Day I fished a deserted reeves rd park and lit them up. Not one angler there but me. Go figure. Have you all noticed the lack of quality fish in December/November. A lot of cookie cutter 25s 26s. Bigger fish are showing up now though.


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## Osmerus (Dec 5, 2012)

Like people have said. Lots of factors influnece the strength of runs in late fall and early winter. This year in Nov the rivers were much colder than the lake. That slowed the fish down. The past month its been the opposite and larger fish are now showing up. River and lake temp has a huge influnece on the strength of runs. The chag also has less holdings area compared to the rock and grand so fish are more scatterd. 

Side note. The chag is the highest gradient river in N Ohio. It falls the most in elevation from the headwaters in Geuaga to the lake. Hence why most of the bottom is shale and not gravel sand and clay. Nice thing about the elevation is the Chag has more miles of cold-water tributary streams than any other watershed in the state. That means natural reproduction of steelies is quiet common on that river.


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## c. j. stone (Sep 24, 2006)

I too have noticed reduced numbers, esp in the Chag. I think there are fewer fish available because more people than ever before are targeting them "by boat and yak"(and keeping!) in the mouths of the tribs, adjacent nearshore areas, and the lower reaches of the rivers when they stage in the fall! I don't fish trout in the lake, and haven't checked recently, but I think the lake bag limit is still higher? In distant past years, very few people were fishing these areas and now(with the extended fair weather the past several years), it is becoming a "huge" deal!(Just read the early fall Lake Erie fishing reports!) This is a natural evolution process(and likely stabilizing in terms of numbers) but to compensate, the State might need to up the stocking numbers to put more fish into the rivers!? One way to support add'l stocking might be an Erie Rivers trout stamp!? Maybe it's overdue?


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## creekcrawler (Oct 5, 2004)

Might be something to that theory that the fish are moving farther upstream. Everything I've caught this season has been at least 12-15 miles from the lake.


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## rickerd (Jul 16, 2008)

The state just needs to lower bag limit during summer to 3 a day per person and starting September 1 lower it to 2 per day. consider most fish caught in lake cannot be released unharmed when pulled from the depths. 
rickerd


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## CaptainFishpond (Nov 28, 2016)

Id pay another 20 a year for a trout only license.


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## creekcrawler (Oct 5, 2004)

c. j. stone said:


> to compensate, the State might need to up the stocking numbers to put more fish into the rivers!?


Goodness no. I think they're stocking awfully heavy as it is now.
I honestly liked it better, way-back-when, getting 2-3 fish a day was a great outing.


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## KTkiff (Jul 30, 2004)

Do we have scientific proof that a a river being colder than the lake slows a run?

I would think it would draw in more fish as steelhead prefer cold water.


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## Weatherhead (Dec 9, 2017)

creekcrawler said:


> Goodness no. I think they're stocking awfully heavy as it is now.
> I honestly liked it better, way-back-when, getting 2-3 fish a day was a great outing.


I would be happy with 2-3 per day too... I’m smelling like a skunk since the fall though. And would be glad to pay extra on license if it meant a better chance to catch something each outing. I live 3.5 hrs away and so even a quick up and back with a single night stay runs me $150-200 per outing. At this point I’m about $750 in on my fishing fund and have nothing to show for it.


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## Osmerus (Dec 5, 2012)

Ya when the rivers are little cooler than the lake that actually helps in the fall. This past nov the rivers were freezing up all while the lake was still in the high 40s. Fish dont like drastic temp changes. Plus nov was crazy windy and rough out on the lake. That also stops fish running up the rivers.


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## c. j. stone (Sep 24, 2006)

I don't seem to have a lot of extra cash(in retirement) these days but would gladly pay $10-20 for a trout stamp if I was SURE it would go towards stocking more fish. Think about it, the popularity of catching pre-spawn, staging fish near the tribs by boat when the water temps start to fall late in the season-and the fewer numbers available in the tribs in recent years.-Plus, theres always been the occasional steelie hook-ups(dead fish if released after that battle, so noone C&R's) while trolling deeper waters In warmer weather for walleye. Coincidence? I think not! Yes, more fish stocked means more steels available to boaters-but also more available in the tribs! I Think a Trout Stamp is inevitable in our future!


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## kapposgd (Apr 10, 2012)

KTkiff said:


> I would think it would draw in more fish as steelhead prefer cold water.


Colder than 68 degree water and colder than 38 degree are two different things

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## CaptainFishpond (Nov 28, 2016)

Sheeeet.

2-3 fish a day would be amazing for me.


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## KTkiff (Jul 30, 2004)

CaptainFishpond said:


> Sheeeet.
> 
> 2-3 fish a day would be amazing for me.


If you are a veteran the last couple years you got that many in the first 10 minutes half the time!


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## CaptainFishpond (Nov 28, 2016)

KTkiff said:


> If you are a veteran the last couple years you got that many in the first 10 minutes half the time!


I am no vet. 

Active duty trout grunt.


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## steelhead sniper 860 (Nov 6, 2013)

In the tribs I’ve fished I think there’s about a normal amount of fish around, buddy fished one hole last time out just before this rain landed 12 fish off it and called it a day. Ive been fishing my usual spots, not much different, but I do think this fall/winter has been a tad more wet then years in the past and there are probably a good number of fish further upstream.


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