# The younger workforce. ....what happened?



## idontknow316 (Mar 21, 2008)

Let me start out by saying I'm only 31. I work in a machine shop unlike any other you've probably ever seen. We work with casings straight from our in house foundry. They are giant cylinders that are up to 60 plus inches in diameter and over 30 feet long and weighing over 100 thousand pounds. If you do the math, that means our tools and equipment are large and heavy as well. 
With that being said, we often get guys that are new hires that are "machinists"and I use that term lightly. We've had many many guys that don't know basic shop math, or how to read a tape measure and don't have a understanding of fractions. But, wait you said you were a machinist, that's kinda required for this position. I blame my employer a little for not doing a basic test before offering employment. 
Also, many are very lazy. We have guys that have been at my employer for 35 to 40 years and they work harder than the 20 something that should be in better shape to out do the more experienced guys. 
And when it comes to working overtime? You would think they we asking for your first born. Nobody wants to work overtime, but on the other hand at time and a half and double time why wouldn't you work some at least? 
If anyone out there that owns a mechanical based business, is it really that hard to find someone who isn't afraid to get dirty now a days that knows at least basic information pertaining to the job?


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## Yourhopeandream (Jul 12, 2014)

Hell it don't even have to be a mechanical based job. I work at a pizza shop and we're burning through teenagers like cigarettes. They just don't want to work let alone do the job right. There's a few good ones but other than that it's pretty sad. It's a small pizza shop and the past year we've gone through 4 teenagers and a few adults because they don't want to work or do it right. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## monsterKAT11 (Jun 20, 2004)

it's our culture now a days man, the whole entitlement mentality has definitely turned people lazy. They all want something for nothing...or at least very little.


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## jac (Apr 14, 2004)

monsterKAT11 said:


> it's our culture now a days man, the whole entitlement mentality has definitely turned people lazy. They all want something for nothing...or at least very little.


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## jac (Apr 14, 2004)

man sure make me glad I'm retired 20 year ago


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## meats52 (Jul 23, 2014)

Back when I started working, 1968 for U.S. Steel, pretty much everyone were good workers. If there were any slackers the other employees would straighten them out. The wages weren't great but the incentive (production bonus) was pretty good. Guys figured that anyone that slowed down production was costing them money so they made sure that everyone pulled their weight. I'm not sure what happened over the years. There are still some good young workers out there, but most of them already have jobs that they like so they aren't putting applications in anywhere.


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## For my Son (Apr 23, 2007)

I call it our fast food society. They want it NOW and they want it as easily as they possibly can get it. The company I work for hired 80 people in the last 3months and 50 are gone already. They don't like the hard work, they don't want to work the overtime but they complain because no one will give them a break. You can blame anyone you want but I have to put it squarely on the parents. I am raising three children and they all have to work for the extras they want. My oldest mows lawns, paints, shovels snow, and whatever else to get money so he can have the things he wants. The youngest takes out trash, cleans the house, and pulls weeds so he can get the new Xbox game he HAS TO HAVE. I believe these lessons will translate for them as they have for me.


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## Bonecrusher (Aug 7, 2010)

I hire for the trucking industry. Can you imagine how hard it is to find younger folks to work nights and weekends? It is next to impossible.

No one wants to work. Even fewer want to work hard. Everyone wants handouts.


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## Seaturd (Apr 14, 2004)

We have a hard time getting potential employees who can pass a drug test let alone an aptitude test.


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## bowhunter1487 (Aug 13, 2014)

Seaturd said:


> We have a hard time getting potential employees who can pass a drug test let alone an aptitude test.


Oh please. Maybe if employers would exit the stone age and stop testing for cannabis they could find a better talent pool.

I work a desk job so I don't know how strictly it translates. Maybe it is tougher in the blue collar. I think this is mostly bull crap that older generations have been spewing about younger ones since we were hunting freaking mammoths.


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## supercanoe (Jun 12, 2006)

The construction industry is really hurting for younger workers. Very few young people are going into skilled trades-it is too much work. We can't find anyone with skills and work ethic. Plumbers are becoming really hard to find. They are old and retiring, very few young people are learning the trade to fill their shoes.


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## idontknow316 (Mar 21, 2008)

I will also state from experience, I have done machining since I took a vocational class in High School, very few employers give inexperienced guys a try. There lies another issue imo


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## mck1975 (Jun 18, 2009)

bowhunter1487 said:


> Oh please. Maybe if employers would exit the stone age and stop testing for cannabis they could find a better talent pool.
> 
> I work a desk job so I don't know how strictly it translates. Maybe it is tougher in the blue collar. I think this is mostly bull crap that older generations have been spewing about younger ones since we were hunting freaking mammoths.


Come do the work I do and see how you feel when a guy is high on weed running a 200 ton crane moving 175 tons of molten steel + the ladle weight. Also NEVER forget the salt of the earth comes in a BLUE container!


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## flyman01 (Jan 23, 2013)

I have my own business, we are a plastics fabricator and also do a lot of custom machining on our CNC equipment. We have a core group of 5 guys and as necessary, will supplement this group with temporary help when necessary to cover spikes in orders. Obviously, we have to make sure the jobs that we use the casual labor for are not very challenging in nature, but repetitious and pretty much "no brainer". Using temporary help can be problematic, we try to avoid it by working longer hours but sometimes we have no choice and have to call upon this necessary evil to get the additional manpower needed. IMO, temp agencies are nothing more than licensed pimps who are selling bodies at a 50% premium over what you are paying the employee. Most of the labor we have used from temp agencies has been sub-par, they are temps because most are unemployable or just looking for a few bucks for drugs or alcohol and you never see them again. You do get a good one now and then, a person who lost his job due to cut backs or what ever the situation maybe and are trying to make ends meet, but they are far and few between. Our best successes in finding decent people has actually been through craigslist, placing an add describing the opportunity and qualifications and then doing a phone interview. We have had much better results than allowing an agency to just send in anyone that has a pulse, we can also pay a few more dollars on the hour because we are not paying the premium to an agency; it becomes a win-win. To me, it appears that more people come out of school and are looking for more tech related jobs than that of trades like machinists, HVAC, or other labor related positions. It is more appealing to be able to sit behind a screen in an air conditioned environment than to get their hands dirty and to a degree, I don't blame them. The fact remains that while the pickins are slim, there are some good people out there it is difficult to find them. I personally have gone threw a number of workers over the past years 8 years since my startup just to get the group that I now have in place. The work ethic of my core group is awesome, they are much younger than me, all between the ages of 25-30 and will work overtime as necessary. These guys work this way because of the way I treat them and the example I set. I am in there early everyday setting jobs up, writing the programs to operate the machines and hands on with them as necessary to get jobs out the door on time. We have situations where we have to break up the group and go on 3 shifts when we get large cutting orders with short lead-times on our CNC equipment, these guys willingly will do that and I reward each of them handsomely for doing that for me. Attracting and retaining good qualified employees is an on going process and will become more challenging as the pool gets smaller. Good luck!


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## bdawg (Apr 14, 2009)

I think too many people are directed to college prep classes and end up getting "arts" degrees that lead to no job and people that feel entitled to a desk job because they have a degree. 

There's not enough vocational training or apprenticeships out there now. Also, with most everyone having air conditioning, nobody wants work outside and get hot and sweaty. 

My dad runs a machine shop and he can't find any good employees either. I worked there for 3 months before I started college and studied hard so that I didn't have to go back! He says that the old guys and Mexicans are his best employees. 

I was at an interview once at a temp agency back in college. I watched a guy trying to pass a math test. Just simple math, fractions, and measuring. He couldn't do it. Definitely a crap shoot with them!


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## Mr. A (Apr 23, 2012)

Even with professional type positions, the people fresh out of college want to be hired to run things without paying their dues. I don't understand what they misunderstand when every losition requires a degree, and they come in with no experience and just expect to be the boss. Luckily for me, I am able to laugh about it, but others are not so lucky.


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## Lewis (Apr 5, 2004)

I worked as machinist for over 30 years, both cnc and manual. I also have done a lot of industrial maintenance repairing cnc machinery. Good employees sure are hard to find. Back when I used to hire employees and I needed part time help I would always contact the local high school machine trades teacher and inquire about his seniors. I have found some bright, young, hardworking employees that stayed on after graduation and turned into great employees.


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## spikeg79 (Jun 11, 2012)

idontknow316 said:


> We've had many many guys that don't know basic shop math, or how to read a tape measure and don't have a understanding of fractions.


I've also noticed at grocery stores the teens they hire to man the registers can't even do simple math without their phones if the register goes down. One time the item rang up wrong, it was on sale for 3/$5 and she asked me how much that was since I only got 2 of the items lol. Another time the power blinked just as another was giving us change, she used her Iphone to tell her how much change we had coming which was $1.50 lmao. It's really sad that these people are graduating high school and can't even figure out simple math in their heads.


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## backlashed (Mar 19, 2011)

A couple things happened.. Central air and all of the electronic noise that consumes kids attention is a HUGE player in all this. Throw in that schools have dumped shop classes and home ec means in important practical skills like measuring have all but vanished.

Instead we now wring our hands over the loss of art classes, choir and marching band. Careers can be learned from a computer. Sheesh!


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## backlashed (Mar 19, 2011)

bowhunter1487 said:


> Oh please. Maybe if employers would exit the stone age and stop testing for cannabis they could find a better talent pool.


Too much liability involved not to test.


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## IGbullshark (Aug 10, 2012)

Here's what ill say about the topic. I have only had two jobs in my life. The first was at a grocery store where I worked for 7 years. There was about a 50/50 split between the "younger" and "older" generation. The second and current job is a small business of 4 people, all of whom are young. Well the owner is in his mid 40s. The older people who worked at the grocery ALWAYS talked about the "older generation" having the best work ethic. Those same people were the largest offenders of just standing around. It seemed like they thought they were just there to collect a paycheck. Thats not to say younger people weren't that way as well. I would say for every older person who didn't work, there was a young person who would do the same. I think the lack of work ethic is pretty even straight across the board, I just think the older generation complains about it more.

Now, my current career is a different story. I love my job and work my tail off, as do the other young people. I clock in and clock out, working about 10-11 hours a day normally. the other guys are salaried and dont clock in. They put in the same hours as me and THEN some.

I also think that there is a huge disconnect between the older and younger generations. The older generation grew up in a time where most didn't have college degrees. They didnt need them because they would get what is now called "blue collar" jobs and they could make a great living. We dont live in those times now. It is becoming much more difficult to get a good paying job without having a four year degree. Blue collar jobs are also vanishing, being replaced with jobs that revolve around computers. The older generation dont usually possess these jobs and so they dont have an expansive sample to base their opinions on. Im not saying younger people who work blue collar dont have a good work ethic, because many of them do. Im simply pointing out more and more younger people are working white collar jobs which are becoming more and more a younger persons game.

Ill end with this, throughout history the older generation has always had plenty of negative things to say about the younger people. Those complaints usually turn out to be not true. Jazz music used the be "evil that was ruining the younger generation" now Jazz is a well respected genera that is lauded for creativity.


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## Dovans (Nov 15, 2011)

spikeg79 said:


> I've also noticed at grocery stores the teens they hire to man the registers can't even do simple math in their heads.


 editing done for a point

I work at a grocery store. I can tell you that we go through the employees like you wouldnt believe. I can say how many times I've had fix the numbers for the bread dept. The kid running it does not know any math. I am not even sure he is literate. 
Getting people to care about what they are doing is the biggest complaint I have on the workforce. Most say it is because they are not paid enough... That is BS. You take pride in the work you do whether you do it for free or are being paid. Most say they are not scheduled enough hours... I've personally gone up to handful of kids and tell them I can get them more hours for the day.... OH lord.. like you slap them in the face... heavens no.. they wont.. but by god next day they are complaining about not having hours.


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## Lewis (Apr 5, 2004)

Some good points in here....


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## Flathead76 (May 2, 2010)

You may not like my answer. I went through a tool and die apprenticeship. The first main problem is China. When I got out of the trade the average starting wage for a die maker was 19.00 an hour. Yet in China the average starting wage for a die maker was 1.18 an hour. How in the hell can we as a country compete with unregulated slave labor like that. The free trade act pretty much took all those jobs and pushed them off to sea.

The second main problem is your employer. Becoming a tool and die maker is damn near impossible these days. Last that I knew in Toledo there was only one shop in town that even offered an apprenticeship. Most companies have closed their doors. The ones left simply do not have a applicant pool to select and hire from. On the flip side these companies left will not find that young kid that works hard sweeping the floor. Then invest in them to help their company grow.

Lastly in the last 15 years manufacturing has been on a death spiral in the US. Die making is a dead trade. Why would any young person these days walking into a shop for the first time find this trade desirable? All you have to do is open your eyes and observe and you will understand. The working conditions are dirty. Most shops are not climate controlled for uncomfortable working conditions. The stress of the job is unbelievable. Most have at least one divorce under their belt. Many have drinking and drug problems. The amount of money needed to purchase your tools needed to simply do your job are very expensive. The wage is alright if you work a straight 40 hour week. But seriously that will never happen because your one of the last of a dieing breed. So you too can waste your life away in front of your machine. Welcome to america where the only thing that we make is fast food.


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## James F (Jul 2, 2005)

There is a serious lack of skilled workers. Like stated previously, vocational training is not a strong point in education any more. Most of the jobs that are paying a decent wage, requires dedication and hard work in some tough conditions. Having an education is good, However,pushing the notion that a higher education is the only way one can get to the top is just not true for most of our younger generation, in fact; that has Not been true for many years. I watch people go to college and pile up huge amounts of debt, and having to accept what ever job they can get, just to start paying for the education they were convinced that would make them an instant success! !I could live quite comfy on the salary of the Deans, Presidents, and Executives &Board members.I'm not knocking higher education, but it's all about the $$$$$.Don't give the High school students too much to think about a choice just get them in the doors, and let the mind numbing begin! Not many really know what they want to do for a living, just trying to get through the day is hard enough for them. Let alone thinking ahead and planning for the future. It's not just the younger generation, more like a personal decision to do the best you can no matter what you do. I've worked with my share of slackers both young and old,I believe that every generation has heard this since the beginning of time.


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## crappiedude (Mar 12, 2006)

I run a metal service center and a fab shop. I'm one of the lucky ones who started at the bottom and made it to the top position in the company. We hire a lot of people and have plenty of turn over. It is frustrating at times but we just keep cycling through them. We hire temps and have had pretty good overall success. One thing I will say is I gave up on looking for the perfect employee years ago. If we can get a guy to just show and give a reasonable effort we keep him. Don't get me wrong I'd love to replace them if something better shows up but I'm not holding my breath. Right now unemployment is under 5% in Ohio so the selection of labors is pretty slim and guys we would have sent packing years ago we have to keep so we can keep the orders going out the door. One of the problems I see is wages are just frozen and you just can't offer much in the way of incentives to keep your best. Thankfully we have a nice bonus program and it helps. Most of the new employees will move along to someone else for more money after a few years so the cycle just keeps going on.
Like most companies we have a good core to keep things moving forward.
I agree with JamesF, there is a serious lack of skilled workers. There's plenty of blue collar jobs out there but there aren't enough skilled people to fill them. I see 4-5 hiring signs everyday on a half mile stretch of road by our shop. Lot's of machining jobs out there.
I'm retiring at the end of the year and can't wait to get away from it.


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## butchers. (Aug 5, 2014)

I worked in a packing house for 22 yrs. You want to see a drug problem, you didn't have to look far. Coke was a biggy,juiced up brownie's another one, guys would get Midol from the nurse because of the speed in it. Even on the night shift,,if you had your eye on a women,,during their break they would slide out on the roof and relieve their horemones you might say. While working there,I welded at night for my brother-in-law, and when my brother got out of the navy as journeyman machinist and opened his own shop i helped him.The packing house closed and I was forced to take a job in a metal fab shop building a very popular roll-off hoist and metal front load garbage containers. On 6-30-93 I went from 45degrees to what,,,, 125 degrees under a welding helmet on a production weld line. It was of a time were the people made all of the difference in the world. We had fun, pulling pranks on each other, putting mig grease on the phone for the foreman if you want to call him that. I was asked to go back to the mach shop for a few weeks to make a few parts for our hoist line. The foreman was right there over your making sure you didn't have accident and help out if there was a problem. We would get a lot of young guys and some would stay and some would go. The one problem I saw was " it's not my job to train him" from some of the older guys. My pet peeve was the kid" is worthless". No kid is worthless,,,you have to figure out what his worth is. This changed a lot peoples minds on how they did things. I would rather train some one who has never been in a mach shop as opposed to some one who has and formed bad habits. we didn't have drill grinders except for a 10" stand up grinder with a fine wheel for drills.

Today,,,,you walk back into that same shop,,,the kids are perched on stools in front of their CNC's texting on their phones. There is no running 2 or 3 machines for these people as they are kids from a dad in the front office,,,,guess what happens from here... I don't have to because my dad is,,,,,,we have a real mess on our hands.

Why is it I'm not working there any more, I got fired for over running my Family Leave Time due to staph infection in my replacement knee. Why didn't I go get my old job back,,,I would NOT work for new foreman who had nothing to say but a bunch of lies and I had to tell Him that.


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## Mushijobah (May 4, 2004)

Lots of interesting points on here. The problem seems to be more dynamic than a lazy younger generation. Who made these people lazy? It's a societal trend and everyone is to blame. The good thing is a hard working individual can REALLY stand out during these times. The opportunity for greatness (in the employment world) is within arms reach for more people than ever, you just have to work hard, focus on self improvement (education, training, diversified world-view) and be consistent. On a lighter note


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## 9Left (Jun 23, 2012)

U.S. Manufacturing jobs are declining for only one reason, because we're damn good at it. All you guys that worked so hard to get your kids thru college, was money well spent. A lot of those kids became smart engineers and found better ways to simplify manufacturing, be it thru automation, computers, or whatever technological advances and new buiseness strategies they have mastered, and they are able to eliminate payed manufacturing jobs, increasing their company profits.... Education pays ... It always has.


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## CountryKat (Apr 5, 2004)

I agree with pretty much everything that has been said so far, there is an entitlement mentality with a large number of younger generation. There are still some very hard working kids out there too though. I used to go to my grandparents for the whole summer every year. I would help my grandpa build houses all summer long and loved it. I would be swinging the hammer well in the evening. We would always go fishing for pike at the end of the week, I was a youngster so this was fun. I remember 1 summer very well, I think I was 13 or 14 not sure, but it was the first morning after I got there and grandpa was looking out the back window, I thought maybe there were some deer out there so I hopped up on the counter top too see. Well, there were no deer but there was 2 semi flatbed trailers out there in the field that were full of 8' oak logs. I asked why are those out there grandpa, he looked over at me and said "Well that's your summer job buddy boy" Back then I said awh man. It took me 2 summers but I made it through and they had plenty of firewood. I would give anything to have those days back. Grandpa and grandma taught me how to work and I wouldn't trade it for the world. Even now I normally work 48 - 60 hours a week and when I'm off I work on my business that I started this past spring. Work keeps me outta trouble.


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## saugmon (Jun 14, 2006)

I work in a factory and the unemployed workforce of our area is pathetice.Many can't pass a drug test.We've got a lot of temps filling jobs that used to be full time jobs.That is the new post 2008 corporate policy.Even the larger companies like honda,toyota are filling their full time jobs with temps and outsourcing particulars of jobs like moving/delivering parts to the assembly lines. Half pay and you get what you pay for.Think about that next time you're in a market for a new vehicle!!! This new car was built by temps!! 

I feel sorry for the young kids that want to find a good job after high school.They'll have the choice of college,military,bum,or deciding which temp agency to start with in the hopes of getting hired on as full time..


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## Lundy (Apr 5, 2004)

Mushijobah said:


> The good thing is a hard working individual can REALLY stand out during these times. The opportunity for greatness (in the employment world) is within arms reach for more people than ever,


Absolutely!

I have always very much appreciated stupid lazy people. They have been an integral factor in my success in life.


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## Misdirection (Jul 16, 2012)

My nephew landed a job with Norfolk Southern railway when he turned 19. Been busting his butt for the last two years working overtime and making about a third more per year than he would have been otherwise. With luck he'll work his way up and make a great living. But he's putting the dues in now...


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## chatterbox (Jan 7, 2013)

I am a machinist, manual and cnc, plus programmer. I graduated from a trade high school and was taught the trade in the United States Navy. I also have college engineering drafting, physics, algebra, and trigonometry. My resume reads like a book as far as varied experience, most with fortune 500 companies. I also have tool and Die experience. I don't smoke, drink, or use drugs.

Wanted, one good job. Must pay $36.50/Hr. to start, Company paid retirement plan, Blue Cross Blue shield 100% benefits 100% paid for by the company. 

HAVE TOOLS WILL TRAVEL. I CAN STAY HOME AND BE POOR AND WILL! The Young people are a lot smarter than given credit for.


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## FishOhio99 (Dec 3, 2013)

Years back I had a very meaningful conversation with my Grandfather. He was a construction worker in the Navy and carried that over into a private woodworking shop. He put in bluntly when he stated that his generation was the hardest working this county will ever see. I myself couldn't agree more. Now a days everything is convenience driven. There is no willingness to work towards anything. If you cant have it by tomorrow then its out of sight out of mind. As the parent of two small children I strongly believe that the best gift I can pass down to my kids is a work ethic. No matter what path they choose in life I want them to be willing to pull there sleeves up and be willing to work until they achieved there goals.


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## butchers. (Aug 5, 2014)

FishOhio99, you said a truck load with one comment" the best gift you can give your kids is a work ethic". One question, how many single parents are doing this? They try,,, but what happens when a cow finds a hole in the fence? I would hate to be a younger person today.


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## NCbassattack (May 5, 2014)

Saw on the news where some fast food workers were sorry they got the big raise, because it's cutting out their welfare. Like the man said in an earlier post, we're living in the age of entitlements. And it's very sad. They hand out hs diplomas to people that couldn't tell you who George Washington was, and that couldn't survive ten minutes without a cell phone or IPad. It's pathetic.


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## NCbassattack (May 5, 2014)

When my grandfather retired from Globe Furniture here in High Point, he went to work at a small frame shop knocking up frames part time. I went to get him one day at work, and his boss told me he turned out more work in four hours than the younger men did in eight. He was 82 at the time..


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## saugmon (Jun 14, 2006)

Here's a good story to a typical young person and he lives next door to one of my buddy's at work.In fact,his father retired from the same place we work at. This kid is now 40. Spent some time in college,does not have a vehicle or drivers liscense. He lives with his mom and dad and plays with his remote control truck every day.He even has a little obstacle course set up in the back yard in view of my buddy and his wife.They confronted these neighbors 1 day and asked why their kid doesn't work. He told him that the boy keeps their computers running.No housework,no yardwork. 1 kid with zero stress. Wonder what the kid will do after mommy and daddy are gone?

My daughter's half brother has been out of high school 2 years now.All he lives at his mothers to play video games and play on his cell phone.No drivers liscense,no car..I see him post on facebook all the time about how bored he is and constantly wants people to tweet or message him. His step dad keeps commenting on facebook about working for him to hang vinyl siding and the kid wouldn't reply back.

Another side note.This older temp that I had to work with past 2 days bragged about working 3 years with perfect attendance. I told him I'm working on my 27th year of perfect attendance.


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## NCbassattack (May 5, 2014)

That story is all too common these days. Just pathetic. When Dad and Mom are gone, he'll be downright pitiful, a ward of the state, and you good folks up there will be keeping him up.


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## Dovans (Nov 15, 2011)

saugmon said:


> Another side note.This older temp that I had to work with past 2 days bragged about working 3 years with perfect attendance. I told him I'm working on my 27th year of perfect attendance.


Damn.... I've been working at one place for 14 yrs and only called off twice. Amazing you've gone 27 yrs.. congrats


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## NCbassattack (May 5, 2014)

Started at FEDEX in March 88. Missed six days, three for funerals.


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## shwookie (Jun 15, 2007)

Maybe at some point we quit blaming "entitled new workers" and blame those that raised them that way.


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## yonderfishin (Apr 9, 2006)

A good work ethic is usually taught to us as children , we had work and responsibilities as we were growing up , we were told go to go outside and stay active during our free time , we werent allowed to sit around all day eating and playing video games , when we wanted something we earned money to get it. But the "easy life" of modern families now days raises children who dont know what work is and dont have any pride in providing for themselves.


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## jschace (May 12, 2015)

Being in a position of supervision and merely browsing through some of the comments, I have a few things to say. Some people do you have learning disabilities and have problems with the mundane things that we take for granted. Nature has already been unkind to them, and who are we to judge anyone. In the few years that I have worked at my job, some of those people with those disabilities can be a huge asset; others not so much. This leads to the next point and I have seen it all to well, and have pretty much put a stop to. No one wants to work for a bunch of older guys that are complete [email protected]#$s all day and will not show them anything. Most of us in the manufacturing sector are not preforming rocket science, all you need is a little training. And as far as not missing any work, I can tell you this for one thing. Perfect attendance will never be for me, I work to have a life, not live to work. And everyone is always replaceable.


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## shwookie (Jun 15, 2007)

yonderfishin said:


> A good work ethic is usually taught to us as children , we had work and responsibilities as we were growing up , we were told go to go outside and stay active during our free time , we werent allowed to sit around all day eating and playing video games , when we wanted something we earned money to get it. *But the "easy life" of modern families now days raises children who dont know what work is and dont have any pride in providing for themselves.*


Again, this is a product of parenting skills, not society. This "lazy" generation is raised by the laziest of the lazy.


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## Smallmouth Crazy (Apr 4, 2006)

We have many where I work as well with no work ethic(young and old alike) I blame my employer as well, we get guys in as temps, a couple months later they are hired and in a lot of cases you end up stuck with guys who don't give 2 you know whats about the job or the company(even though they are getting paid a real descent wage) I better stop here as I could go off on a long winded rant.


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## AlanC (Jun 16, 2010)

Mike Rowe seems to have the right idea. Help youngsters get an education in fields that actually have jobs waiting.


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## meisty66 (Jul 14, 2015)

shwookie said:


> Maybe at some point we quit blaming "entitled new workers" and blame those that raised them that way.


AMEN!! I'm 30 years old and have worked in a steel mill for 7 years (and a brick yard from the time I was 15) and I'm sick of hearing about the younger generations not knowing what works is. Hate to break it to everyone but there are just as many lazy worthless people in their 40's and 50's as there is in their 20's and 30's. Matter of fact, if I had a choice of who I worked with in my department, %75 of them would be my age. I see just as many older guys working harder to get out of work as I do young ones. And as was said, you dont grow up to have a cappy work ethic if you have PARENTS THAT SET AN EXAMPLE AND WHIP THAT REAR END WHEN NEEDED! Quit blaming society and take responsibility.


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## saugmon (Jun 14, 2006)

There is a conspiracy theory which reminds me of why the younger generation is more on the girly/docile side. Plastics!!

Post world war II is when the plastics boom began. Testosterone levels of men since wwII has dropped to half.Myself and the mid 40's and older grew up on soda pop in bottles.Most things came in glass,tin can,aluminum cans.Milk was the 1 of the few items that came in a plastic jug. Then everything went to plastic.Plastic baby bottles,sippy cups,cups,water bottles,soda pop.It is said there is a chemical in plastics,when it breaks down, that mimics estrogen which is harmful for males. Now,everything is plastic.Plastic lines every aluminum can. Very few items can be bought in glass jars/jugs/bottles nowadays.


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## icebucketjohn (Dec 22, 2005)

The young generation has had it way too easy. They haven't gone hungry or starved. There is no driving desire in most of them except pleasure and partying. They lack fortitude. They've been raised on "Instant Gratification" and expect such. They've seen how easy it is to scam "The System" and have adopted that mantra. 

I feel sad the for future of this country.


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## yonderfishin (Apr 9, 2006)

shwookie said:


> Again, this is a product of parenting skills, not society. This "lazy" generation is raised by the laziest of the lazy.


I agree , but for many the parents were raised the same way. It is now so common for this lack of ethic to be passed down through generations , and so common for parents to raise kids with no ethic that it has become a society product.


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## I Fish (Sep 24, 2008)

yonderfishin said:


> I agree , but for many the parents were raised the same way. It is now so common for this lack of ethic to be passed down through generations , and so common for parents to raise kids with no ethic that it has become a society product.


And to add, every kid in school today is told they don't want to dig ditches for a living, they want to be the boss. Blue collar type jobs are looked down on. Just look at what the schools teach today. My old high school doesn't even have a shop class anymore. The kids that graduate from there are never taught how to use basic tools. Unless their parents have a shop, I'd say most probably couldn't identify most basic woodworking equipment, let alone operate it. Working metal would be like speaking an unknown language. They get turned loose in society thinking they are going to be the boss, you know, find their niche and make a million. Therefore, they will not work to excel in their job, because it's not the job they think they deserve.


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## flyman01 (Jan 23, 2013)

There are so many directions and causes to point at which we feel are the reason(s) for this dilemma; each one certainly has contribution toward it in some way or another. While technology has greatly reduced the need for skilled labor in many areas, thousands of other jobs have been eliminated as a result of China, Korea, Mexico and India due to the reduced labor costs that these countries offer. Sadly enough, our Nation’s leaders seem to be doing very little to bring back manufacturing and other unskilled jobs to the U.S.; perhaps some of them are reaping financial gain as it has been revealed in some cases so why do so? On the other hand, where is the incentive for some of the younger people to learn a trade or want to perform labor? When the Great Depression hit back in 1935, many families suffered. It was estimated that one-fourth of the labor force was unemployed during the worst part of the depression. With many families suffering financial difficulties, the government stepped in to solve the problem and that is where the history of welfare as we know it really began. While the purpose of Welfare to assist needy families was conceived with good intent, it has evolved to the point where people make a career out of doing nothing but drawing a check. We are faced with 3rd generation recipients who according Wisconsin State Rep Glenn Grothmann “A single parent with a couple kids can easily get $35,000 a year in total benefits between the health care and the earned income credit and the Food Share and the low-income housing and what have you. … That’s after taxes. In essence a bribe not to work that hard or a bribe not to marry somebody with a full-time job,” From a financial perspective, that contribution in monies is the equivalent of a person working full time for $20 an hour. Something is wrong with that picture.

I for one believe that the world is your oyster, but you have to work hard to gain the nice things life has to offer; I have instilled that in each of my sons’ brain by leading as an example. I have taken each one of them and shown them how to work on their automobiles, guiding them through oil changes, brake jobs and other tasks so they perform certain things on their own cars and save some money. Additionally we purchased a house that went to auction and was inhabitable. I had my sons work at my side, completely gutting the house and rebuilding it into a wonderful home that we sold 8 months later. That experience proved to be one of the best things that I could have done with them. My second son bought a home in Columbus and has done the most awesome job I could ever imagine on this house. He is now placing it on the market in a couple of weeks and the sweat equity that he poured into this place will be rewarded back 3 fold. My son thanked me three times this past weekend for that experience we did together. Not to sound boastful but my kids are intelligent, all have an education, (the youngest being a senior in college) all are employed and have skills passed down to them to use in some capacity in their life’s journey. We did our best as parents to raise our boys showing them value of an education along with an honest/ good work ethic and to be Godly examples to others.

In closing those of you who said it is how we raise our younger generation, I could not agree more with you.


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## shwookie (Jun 15, 2007)

yonderfishin said:


> I agree , but for many the parents were raised the same way. It is now so common for this lack of ethic to be passed down through generations , and so common for parents to raise kids with no ethic that it has become a society product.


I'll drink to that.


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## jray (Jan 20, 2006)

I'm 22 I work at a manufacturing company that I've been at since high school. Had to take a welding job when things got slow and there were layoffs. I attended osu and switched this fall to electromechanical engineering. I want to be a machinist. From my perspective, the problem is the younger generation has no practical experience. I remember being 13 on summer break my dad throwing me the keys to a dodge truck and saying get the torque converter out before I get home. I asked how he said figure it out and call me at lunch to ask questions. No one is raised like that anymore. Last summer my dad and 18 year old brother and I built my 1500 sq ft house from the ground up. You can't learn this skills in a book you've got to want to learn and work your butt off. I've learned that the hard way, paying for a house a car and college. It's hard but in 5 years I'll be 20 years ahead of other graduates. Working 16 hrs going to bed and doing it again is a necessary experience in my mind. And despite how much I whined about then, now I'm starting to realize how much it has done in my life.


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## mck1975 (Jun 18, 2009)

At 58 years young/old ( however you wanna see it ) I'm very proud of the generation I grew up in and would not trade it for nothing! We understand toughness, honor, principals and most of all integrity! To quote a movie - *"What We Do In Life, Echoes In Eternity*"


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## ohiojmj (Apr 16, 2004)

Too many stereotypers... I see plenty of hard working younger people. Guess I don't see that many hanging on street corners or hear of them living in mommy's basement at age 30 to join the stampede.


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## gumbygold (Apr 9, 2013)

bowhunter1487 said:


> Oh please. Maybe if employers would exit the stone age and stop testing for cannabis they could find a better talent pool.
> 
> I work a desk job so I don't know how strictly it translates. Maybe it is tougher in the blue collar. I think this is mostly bull crap that older generations have been spewing about younger ones since we were hunting freaking mammoths.



The op is 31...


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## ODNR3723 (Apr 12, 2007)

Conversation I had with a friend's high school sophomore son after he told his dad he would not empty the over flowing trash can at a BBQ.
Kid: my generation does not do that kind of work.
Me: that is why your generation is fighting for $15 an hour at McDonalds.


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## nixmkt (Mar 4, 2008)

icebucketjohn said:


> The young generation has had it way too easy. They haven't gone hungry or starved. There is no driving desire in most of them except pleasure and partying. They lack fortitude. They've been raised on "Instant Gratification" and expect such. They've seen how easy it is to scam "The System" and have adopted that mantra. ...



And here is a perfect example of that concept:



ODNR3723 said:


> Conversation I had with a friend's high school sophomore son after he told his dad he would not empty the over flowing trash can at a BBQ.
> Kid: my generation does not do that kind of work. ...



That type of thing is the dad's fault. The kid should have been laying on the ground after being slapped on the side of the head after talking back with a comment like that. Then after getting up, should have been made to pick the trash out of the can by hand one piece at a time and put it into another trash bag. Can't really blame the kid when that's the type of life he's been catered to.



.


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## mck1975 (Jun 18, 2009)

Can't argue that nixmkt... that is about what would have happened to be, after I screwed my head back on... maybe!


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## cheezemm2 (Apr 7, 2004)

Eh....too many stereotypes is right. 

Is the 30 year old "kid" who can do the job faster and better in 30 hours lazy when it takes his older co-workers 50 hours to do the same? I don't care if it's in the coal mine or on the computer. What if it's vice versa? Takes the best worker to do the most efficient job...

There's a lot to working smarter, not harder in the millenial generation...there's also a lot of bums who try (I use the word try loosely) to use this as their excuse for slacking off.

Unfortunately, the $15/hr for flipping burgers crosses all of the age lines. Pure entitlement...no one deserves $15/hr for the least amount of responsibility possible.

One thing is for sure, the valued skill set is rapidly changing. Technology is taking the place of skilled trades where applicable, leaving a lot of younger kids clueless when it comes to changing a flat tire, but they can reprogram their busted computer in their car. Wait until highways are self-driving and we get the little voice, "GPS deactivated" and everyone screams in panic when they have to drive!

I'm in my 30's and grew up with junk cars, growing what you eat, and getting your $%#@ done before you got to go play. Seems pretty simple to me...


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## MIGHTY (Sep 21, 2013)

I read through this thread and got a good chuckle thinking about my job. I started working there in high school at 18 and it was my first full time job as all I had ever done was bale straw every summer before. I work for my good friends family owned packing house that opened in the late 1800's. When I started out we were doing a lot more work than we are now and there was probably 50-60 employees including temps. Now that number is down to around 30 and things are a lot different which I why I decided to go back to school a few years ago (paying my own way). Including myself (just turned 29 years old) there are 4 or 5 people that work there in their 20's and we all graduated together, everyone else is 45+ years old (if I had to guess the average age is probably around 52). Where to begin.... If drug testing was required at my job, we would lose well over half of our employees. 2 supervisors (in their 50's) have been know to smoke pot at lunch break in their car. Originally when I started out, we were allowed 2 20 minute breaks a day plus 1 30 minute lunch. Over the last 2-3 years it seems like every department except the one I work in, takes about 4 or 5 half hour breaks plus a lunch. Everyone comes in around 5-6am and sits around on the clock till they decide to get after it. Then they take a half hour break at 8am, another at 10am, lunch at 11:30am, another half hour break at 1:00pm then hurry up and get their stuff done so they can leave by 2-3pm and get to the bar. I can think of 3 guys right now in their 50's that's live with their parents. One of them works in my department and goes down the road every single day at lunch time to get a 6 pack. He'll run off every 20 minutes or so to suck em down till he's out. Another, told me the other day "I went to lunch a little early and fell asleep till 1pm then I went to break and left" and he thought it was pretty comical. The 3rd, a delivery driver gets back from his route at the same time every day no matter how much or how little he had to deliver. Heck the truck drivers take hour long naps, stop and mow their lawns, even go to driving ranges on the clock to hit some balls. If it wasn't for my boss (my friends dad) I would've been gone a long time ago because he's the only reason that place is still going. Heck his 58 year old brother comes in 3 days a week for a hour or so to take orders off of the answering machine before he goes to his cabin (that was left to him from mommy and daddy) for a weekend long drinking adventure (but this isn't before he complains to his nephews about how he deserves more money even though he lives in his house for free). I bounce around helping out wherever I can to speed things along in my department so they can get product to me to cook. The sooner my department gets done processing, the sooner I can get started doing my work, but oddly enough, none of the older fellas in my department stick around or even offer to help me out. So I'm left there alone until 6pm unless I have class. I've just barely scratched the surface boys. I used to have no problem offering to take over doing some pretty disgusting/tough physical jobs when someone would quit, but the work ethic of my co workers (ages 45+) must be rubbing off on me because I get frustrated listening to all these people complain about the thought of having to do a little extra. The most famous line at the plant when someone is asked to do something different is "that's not my job". I could keep going but this rant needs to end before I write a novel. Believe me, I get what people are saying when they talk about us youngsters but it must just depend on where you work, because in my personal experience it's been the exact opposite. Like previously stated, it's all about how the younger people were raised by their parents plain and simple.


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## gph19 (Apr 27, 2014)

idontknow316 said:


> Let me start out by saying I'm only 31. I work in a machine shop unlike any other you've probably ever seen. We work with casings straight from our in house foundry. They are giant cylinders that are up to 60 plus inches in diameter and over 30 feet long and weighing over 100 thousand pounds. If you do the math, that means our tools and equipment are large and heavy as well.
> With that being said, we often get guys that are new hires that are "machinists"and I use that term lightly. We've had many many guys that don't know basic shop math, or how to read a tape measure and don't have a understanding of fractions. But, wait you said you were a machinist, that's kinda required for this position. I blame my employer a little for not doing a basic test before offering employment.
> Also, many are very lazy. We have guys that have been at my employer for 35 to 40 years and they work harder than the 20 something that should be in better shape to out do the more experienced guys.
> And when it comes to working overtime? You would think they we asking for your first born. Nobody wants to work overtime, but on the other hand at time and a half and double time why wouldn't you work some at least?
> If anyone out there that owns a mechanical based business, is it really that hard to find someone who isn't afraid to get dirty now a days that knows at least basic information pertaining to the job?


I feel like I could do what you're describing somewhat effectively (19 yo, I suppose it could be due to my mechanical background) but I rarely turn down ot. I know with us (family business) we have similar issues and so it remains just us.


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## bountyhunter (Apr 28, 2004)

do away with learning foriegn languages and teach them how to operate a bull dozer. one of our local schools did and there swamped with kids who want to learn, theres a lot of young good people out there that want to learn, I don,t see help wanted WE will train signs.


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## tomb (Oct 9, 2004)

bowhunter1487 said:


> I think this is mostly bull crap that older generations have been spewing about younger ones since we were hunting freaking mammoths.


I don't know about that. It's pretty bad where I work too. Takes 50+ people to find one to stick around.


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## Aaron2012 (Mar 26, 2014)

I'm 37 and been with my employer for almost 16 years. I have ever to agree with both sides of this. There is 20 somethings that I work with that bust their tails all day or some of them can't keep their phones out of their face. Some of the older people that I work with are the same. The thing that gets me is when a boss asks someone to do something they will say "that's not my job" or "I don't get paid enough to do that". I just don't understand stand that way of thinking. The place I work for is very laid back your not rushed to get parts out but some people always complain about the work. There had been quite a few people leave the company and go to one of the competitors and say "I wish I never quit working there this new place makes us work 7 days a week" or "I had to work 16 hour days then they cut back our hours cause we were working to much". 
I don't think it's a generation that has bad work ethics just some people are going to do the work and others won't.


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