# remington Kleenbore 209 primers



## ezbite (May 25, 2006)

I bought a box of these a few weeks ago and over the last few days ive been tuning in my new load for this weekends muzzleloader season. I had what seemed like a hangfire. you squeeze the trigger and snap the primer goes, then a split second later the powder fires. last week i thought I had one and I had one yesterday. i thought it was my imagination. but today I had 2 more. the 75 yard shot was one (12 oclock) and the 3 oclock at 65 was another, its throwing me off by about 4". I went back to shooting CCI shotgun 209 and didn't have anymore problems. i think im just going to get rid of these kleenbore primers and stick with the CCI. has anyone else tried these and whats your thoughts?


----------



## nick99 (Mar 8, 2010)

I bought some only shot one so far. ill post back tomorrow I am sighting in tomorrow morning I am going to shoot both cci and rem.


----------



## BigV (Nov 11, 2004)

ezbite said:


> I bought a box of these a few weeks ago and over the last few days ive been tuning in my new load for this weekends muzzleloader season. I had what seemed like a hangfire. you squeeze the trigger and snap the primer goes, then a split second later the powder fires. last week i thought I had one and I had one yesterday. i thought it was my imagination. but today I had 2 more. the 75 yard shot was one (12 oclock) and the 3 oclock at 65 was another, its throwing me off by about 4". I went back to shooting CCI shotgun 209 and didn't have anymore problems. i think im just going to get rid of these kleenbore primers and stick with the CCI. has anyone else tried these and whats your thoughts?


What rifle are you shooting?
How about the powder you are using as well.


----------



## ezbite (May 25, 2006)

T/C encore pro hunter with 250 grain Barnes solid copper and about 100 grain volume (75 grains by weight, im weighing all charges) of blackhorn 209 powder.


----------



## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

im using triple 7 powder and triple 7 primers and have had good luck with both. I haven't had any slow or hang fires or miss fires since I went from pyrodex powder and Remington primers. I have read reviews about the triple 7 primers that said they are dirty but I haven't noticed them being any worse than any other primers.

I have a new cva accura v2 that I haven't shot yet. but I hope it likes the triple 7 as well as my old tc, LOL.
sherman


----------



## BigV (Nov 11, 2004)

ezbite said:


> T/C encore pro hunter with 250 grain Barnes solid copper and about 100 grain volume (75 grains by weight, im weighing all charges) of blackhorn 209 powder.


I would say that the culprit is the Blackhorn 209. It is notorious for carbon buildup in the flame channel of your breech plug. I have been using BH 209 for several years had similar problems that you describe. I began using a drill bit turned by hand to clean the carbon build up out of my breech plug. My Omega uses a 1/8" drill bit. 
Also, make sure to seat your projectile very firm against the powder.
Do a search of "blackhorn 209 carbon build up" and you will find a lot of information on how to clean the flame channel to avoid hang fires.


----------



## bobk (Apr 30, 2004)

I've not had the hang fire problem and been using it for years. Sounds like operator error.http://www.chuckhawks.com/most_blackhorn_209.htm 
Your just making excuses for when you miss Saturday


----------



## BigV (Nov 11, 2004)

> Perfect ignition is contingent on an adequate flash hole, flame temperature that reaches the charge, and the particulate matter from the 209 primer that infuses the powder charge as well. W209 Winchester, Federal 209A and CCI 209M primers are all considered magnum strength primers and work well.





> Have you cleaned your breechplug lately? Many muzzleloading enthusiasts never have. Shoot a primed 20 gauge hull and youll see all the residue from a 209 primer. Now, imagine that same volume of residue being injected through the same breechplug again and again. It forms a hard, carbon layer that closes up your breechplug. Savage shooters have the advantage: they know that drilling out a breechplug ensures top accuracy and perfect ignition. Same rule applies for Thompson breechplugs; grab an electric drill and drill out that hard carbon every 100 shots or box of primers if you want the best possible ignition.


I clean the carbon build up out of my breech plug after every shooting session. 
I never swab the barrel between shots.
I use Winchester W209 primers.
I generally shoot between 20 and 25 consecutive shots before cleaning the barrel with Break Free CLP, or Hoppes #9.
I use 100 grains (measured) = (71.5 gns weighed) of BH 209.
I used a powder measure to measure out 10 loads from a ½ full bottle and a new bottle of BH. I weighed each one and then averaged them to come up with 71.5 grains of powder. I weigh all by loads and store them in small tubes for later use.


----------



## bobk (Apr 30, 2004)

Big V, I used to go the drill bit route. It took 2 bits to clean the encore breech plug. Started using Crud Buster for the breech plug and the stuff is amazing. I spray it in the breech with a rubber glove on my hand so the solution stays in the breech a few minutes and I'm done. Just did it yesterday and would guess from start to finish on cleaning the encore was under 10 minutes.


----------



## ezbite (May 25, 2006)

I clean the entire rifle including the breech plug everytime I get back from shooting(it comes out with 1/2 a twist). I will admit I heard somewhere about the drill bit thing, but just forgot about it and have been using Qtips I cut the head off of, I still think its the primers too, clearly a difference in sound when I shoot them without a loaded rifle as compaired to the CCI, the CCI have a louder snap.

I measure out my charges before heading out too. I found that those little clear plastic dime roll holder you get at the hobby store are the cheapest way to go and 75 grains weighed only fills them about 1/2 way up, but the best part is their clear and cost $3.99 for a 5 pack. I bought all they had.


miss on Saturday....shhhhat!


----------



## revpilot (Feb 10, 2009)

Blackthorn recommends not using that primer 

http://www.blackhorn209.com/faqs/









#4-
We have experienced the best performance, consistency and accuracy with CCI 209M and Federal 209A. NOTE: DO NOT use 209 muzzleloading primers such as Winchester Triple 7, Remington Kleenbore, Federal Fusion, or CCI In-Line MZL.


----------



## Walleye 3 (Jul 2, 2005)

Never had a problem with the Winchester primers. All I use even for rifle reloading is Winchester primers. Very consistent and have always shot the best groups for me. I have tried them all.

Sent from my HTCONE using Ohub Campfire mobile app


----------



## BigV (Nov 11, 2004)

ezbite said:


> I clean the entire rifle including the breech plug everytime I get back from shooting(it comes out with 1/2 a twist). I will admit I heard somewhere about the drill bit thing, but just forgot about it and have been using Qtips I cut the head off of, I still think its the primers too, clearly a difference in sound when I shoot them without a loaded rifle as compaired to the CCI, the CCI have a louder snap.
> 
> I measure out my charges before heading out too. I found that those little clear plastic dime roll holder you get at the hobby store are the cheapest way to go and 75 grains weighed only fills them about 1/2 way up, but the best part is their clear and cost $3.99 for a 5 pack. I bought all they had.
> 
> ...


Check the flame channel, my guess it's 1/8" (the flame channel is directly behind where the primer sits). It is 1/8" on my Omega. If you have never used a drill bit on yours, you will swear the bit is too big. You might even need a drill on low speed to cut through the carbon. You will be amazed at how much carbon come out.
I always keep a spare breech plug just in case I run into problems at the range so I can just change it out. 
Here is a pick from my range session today. From a rest 8 shots at 100 yards.


----------



## ezbite (May 25, 2006)

I did exactly what you guys recommended. it took 2 different size bits and there was some build up. I also went back to the CCI primers. Called a doe in at 10 this morning and dropped her in her tracks. No hangfires today


----------



## MassillonBuckeye (May 3, 2010)

sherman51 said:


> im using triple 7 powder and triple 7 primers and have had good luck with both. I haven't had any slow or hang fires or miss fires since I went from pyrodex powder and Remington primers. I have read reviews about the triple 7 primers that said they are dirty but I haven't noticed them being any worse than any other primers.
> 
> I have a new cva accura v2 that I haven't shot yet. but I hope it likes the triple 7 as well as my old tc, LOL.
> sherman


This is about what I was gonna post. Triple 7 on both and it has always went BANG when I asked it to.


----------

