# Sticky  Tips and Tricks for new pinners



## KSUFLASH

_*Tips and Tricks for new pinners*_










Every year many new centerpinners are born. They come to the dark side as it is called. Just like the other methods of targeting steelhead, the centerpin has its tricks and challenges. The other alternatives such as Spin and Fly fishing are also effective and have their place just like the pin. The purpose of this particular post is more along the lines of the how, what and why specific to the pin. 

When an angler decides he is going to try the centerpin, the first question most will ask is what to buy. He will then get several different answers by the online community. As pinning becomes more popular, manufactures are making available to us more affordable gear. As a novice, it is hard to decipher what is fact and what is marketing hype. A novice pinner does not need a $500 reel and $400 rod to be an effective pinner. Several options are out there for the beginner. Most popular is the Okuma Sheffield reel and Okuma Guide Select rod. For around $250 you can get the combo on Ebay and other online outlets. In my opinion this is a good starter package.

There are other combos out there and the price point for most looking to learn about pinning will benefit most from a combo similar to this. 

Now maybe even before you ask what to get, you are thinking why should I try a centerpin? What is the advantage? Good question.

1. The Centerpin allows for the most effective drag free drift for a longer distance than any other method.

2.	Fighting a fish without a drag system if very rewarding when you land the fish. Unlike the Fly and Spin outfits, most centerpins will freely spin both forward and backward. The only drag you have is your hand palming the reel.

3.	Centerpins can be rigged up the same way as a spin outfit. So for many anglers, going from a spin to centerpin outfit is a natural transition.

The first thing that most all pinners do when they pick up a reel is spin it. They are testing to see how smooth the reel spins, and how long it spins. All those that say how long a pin spins doesnt matter are half right. In general it doesnt matter if a centerpin spins for 5 minutes or 2 minutes, but I guarantee you that they like a pin that spins smooth.

Most centerpins have a Clicker. This is not a drag, but rather a gear that when activated doesnt allow the spool to spin freely. It is and should only be used during transport. It is not effective for a drag, and if you attempt to use it as a drag, you will likely have problems not only landing a fish, but also with your reel down the road. If you dont use the clicker during transport, especially during your drive to the river, you will quickly find out why you should have used it. 

The centerpin is a very well balanced piece of equipment. Any vibration gets that spool spinning, and it spins for a long time. Just imagine what kind of bird nest you will have when you get to your parking spot streamside, and see that for the past hour your reel has been unspooling itself in the back of your vehicle!!!

Ok so you got your first centerpinCongrats!!!

You take it to the river and try to cast.Many cuss words come out of your mouth....and the most common this rig is junk. Well not exactlyThe most challenging thing of a pin is casting. Second to that is learning to land a fish. There are several methods of casting. Each have a benefit and drawback. I could spend all day describing it, but a video is probably a better option for you. Do a Google Search for Centerpin Side Cast and Centerpin Spinning Side Cast. There are more casts but these are the most common. 

You need to practice, practice, practice in the back yard with just a float and shot on your line. Once you get past casting, your almost home freekinda!!!

If you have been a successful angler with the spinning rod, then rigging a centerpin is very similar. 1 difference though is that a centerpin can hold A LOT of line! More than you would need. So we put a backing on our spool first, then we tie in our main line. This saves us from having to use so much Monofilament on the spool. This is the same concept that the fly guys do with their fly line backing.

Monofilamentdid I just say Mono? Yes! Pinners use monofilament as their main line. This is how it typically works.Backing, main line monofilament, leader fluorocarbon, hook.

So there is an intro on centerpins There is plenty more, and maybe I will focus on some specific areas in the future specific to pins.

1.	Floats
2.	Shot Patterns
3.	Leaders
4.	Fighting fish
5.	Centerpin Etiquette

Dont be afraid to ask questions, as there are many of us willing to help where we can. We all have been there before. We have had the same questions in the past.


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## steelheadBob

I stuck this thread because pinning is and has became a big part of Steelheading.
Please refrain this sticky to only questions and answers. Thanks and good luck to you this season.


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## banshe2008

Ok. I have the outfit and most of the terminal tackle. (i think) please describe a basic rig. Also, when you are drifting, do you mend the line like fly fishing or do you just let lt it float? Also, what kind of maintenance do i need dto do on this reel? thanks


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## KSUFLASH

A basic rig for a centerpin starts with your main line. In steelhead alley I primarily use a 10 pound main line spooled up. 12 pound would also be fine. Depending on your float choice you have a few different methods of attaching the float to the line.

1. A Drennan style has caps that you slide onto your line, then you slip the antenna and stem of the float through these caps. 

2. A slip float can be used. Rig it up with your slip knot/bead just like you would a crappie setup on a spinning rod.

3. A weighted float with the lead plug in the bottom. These are commonly used for panfishing. These floats are styrofoam and typically have an orange top.

Once you have attached your float to your main line, the next item is a swivel. I use micro swivels. After you attach the swivel to your main line, then you would select a florocarbon leader. I use a leader lighter then the main line. If I get a snag or a fish breaks me off, I don't loose my float, but rather the line breaks at the weakest point. That being the lighter leader. 4lb leader in clear water. 6-8 lb leader in other water conditions. Leader length that I use is typically 3'-6' depending on water clarity.

Then you can tie your presentation to the end of the leader. If that is a hook for spawn sacks, or if you decide to tie on a fly.

Lastly I put a shot pattern onto the leader. Some put it on the main line, but I haven't ever had issues with putting shot onto the leader. The shot that I use is the style that doesn't have the wings. These wings, the ones we typically bite to open the shot causes issues with the leader getting snagged and hung up around the wings. They make shot that looks like BB's and have no wings.

The most common shot pattern that I use is called the shirt button pattern. I start about 6-12" below the float with a split shot. I then stagger smaller shot down the line. Once you get the hang of it, you will know how many shot to put on to balance out the float. I try and keep the shot 12-18" away from the presentation. 

The split shot allows you to get your presentation down to the fish and stay down. When fishing in the river current, not all of the water column is flowing at the same rate. 

So you are standing at your spot, you think it is about 5' deep. Set your float at about 6' deep and make your first cast upstream. If you snag up quickly, then begin making your float shallower 6" at a time. Cast up stream. So on and so forth until you can get a drift that doesn't snag the bottom. If you are not fishing towards the bottom, your catch rate is greatly reduced. If you don't snag up at 6' then maybe the hole is deeper then you thought. Go 6" deeper until you snag. Then reverse until you dial in the depth. I like to fish 6"-12" off bottom as a start.

In regards to mending you line, it is recommended that you mend your line just like a fly fisherman does. The downstream loop eventually catches up with the float. Once this happens, the float begins moving faster downstream then the actual current. The float begins getting pulled downstream by this loop. If the float is moving faster then your presentation, then your presentation begins getting pulled up off the bottom and out of the strike zone. Longer rods help with keeping line off the water, and assist with this loop. In smaller streams where casting very far isn't needed, the longer rod allows you to keep all the line off the water. 

When casting, as soon as the float his the water you can give a little wrist flick to mend the line upstream. The longer that monofilament sits in the water the more difficult it is to mend upstream.

Maintenance of a centerpin is minimal. If you don't dunk the reel in the river, you should have very little problems. If for some reason you get some grinding, you may have to dunk it. Many times there is some small dirt that gets behind the spool and backplate. Some reels allow for an easy removal of the spool. You can remove the spool streamside, dunk the backplace, and your back in business.

If I have had no problems with the reel during my trip, I leave it be. If during cold weather or dirt issues I get some grinding, I will take the spool off at home, and with a rag wipe the backplate and spool areas. You can also use sewing machine oil on the centerpin shaft, and if you have unsealed bearings a drop of oil on them should be fine.

Where the reel starts getting gummed up is when you land a fish, and your reel lays in the stream water. As you are shuffeling your feet around with your fish, you are kicking up silt that inevitably gets into your reel. At that point, all you can do is try and swish around your reel in some clean water.

-KSU


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## riverhack

do you have a secret pattern for the shot you use or can ya use a buch of weight with a slip weight attachment?


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## Mepps3

Here is a link to some shotting patterns: 

http://www.raventackle.com/Shotting Patterns.pdf

Split shot size conversion chart:

http://www.questoutdoors.net/gear/articles/shot-size-conversion/


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## riverhack

Mepps3 said:


> Here is a link to some shotting patterns:
> 
> http://www.raventackle.com/Shotting Patterns.pdf
> 
> Split shot size conversion chart:
> 
> http://www.questoutdoors.net/gear/articles/shot-size-conversion/


can you tell me why the need to put all that on your line? it seems to me just bunching up some med size shot would work just fine vs putting all that on your line?


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## icingdeath

Gotta put in my .02.The shot helps get your resrntation down fast and to aid in the tracking of the float.remember the current is faster on top than the bottom.also i recommend learning the modified wallis cast.i started off with the side cast but that line will eventually twist ruining the day.i know!also the pull cast is easy to master.

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## ShutUpNFish

riverhack said:


> can you tell me why the need to put all that on your line? it seems to me just bunching up some med size shot would work just fine vs putting all that on your line?


A more even distribution of weight on your line, also helps for making smoother casts. Try casting with bunches of weight high and low with big gaps of line in between the float and presentation....wind-knots and tangles galore.

To add: Pinning is not for everyone and I feel many people get into it for the wrong reasons. They see a pinner on the streams smackin' down fish left and right and think "Wow! it must be that centerpin outfit". Wrong! I would highly recommend mastering, or at least gaining confidence, with the proper methods of "drift" fishing using a noodle rod and spinning outfit. Before running out and buying that "magical" centerpin. Then, like KSU mentioned, one can make a smoother more natural transition into pinning and appreciate it a whole lot more. And theres nothing wrong with the side cast when you get started until you feel you are ready to move on to pull casting. This ALL said, it helps to fish with someone that is a well established drift fisherman....you will learn the most that way, as long as you are attentive and receptive to learn.


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## stak45dx1

what kind of line is used for the backing?


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## Lundfish

Dacron line


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## MuskieManOhio

I'm new to pinning and I'm getting it down thanks to you guys on here! The question is on my Aventa I don't think I'm understanding the reason for the clicker some guys told me its just there for show that you turn it on when you hook a fish to make the drag sound other guys told me not to turn it on that its just for storage. One other question is when you set the hook do you palm it and set or just push with your fingers and set thanks a lot guys!

Gillie


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## KSUFLASH

Clicker was originally intended as a way to put a brake on the spool so that it would not spin during transport to and from the river. Leave the brake off while you are driving down the road and see what happens if the spool isn't sitting up against something. You will have a nice bird nest.

While I have seen some flip it on during the process of fighting a fish, that isn't the original intended use. It is not a drag system it is a brake for transport.


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## Wbranch

This center pin information is very interesting and helpful to me. I've fly fished for fifty years and am quite a good caster yet I can't get the damn center pin setup to cast two feet. It's pretty embarrassing! Sometimes I wonder if the reel is a contributor to my problem. I bought it on Ebay, new, from a tackle company in England. They call it a "Center pin Trotting Reel" but I'm thinking that is just a name for the type of long drift fishing that they do. My reel is called a Cyprinus Monarch and it looks and acts like a pin reel. It is 4 1/4" diameter, has two handle knobs, a clicker, and spins freely for about 70 seconds which seems quite adequate to me.

My problem is when I go out in the back yard, or on the river, to practice the line never seems to pay out counterclockwise from the underside of the reel (like how it comes off of a fly reel) as I attempt to perform the Wallis cast the line comes off of the side of the reel as there is a little gap between the reel foot and the spool of about 3/32". When this happens the line invariably gets hung up around one, or both, of the wooden reel knobs. I know I spooled it correctly with 100 yards of backing and then a braided line specifically developed for center pinning, another 145 yards.

I wish I lived near someone who pinned so they could see my setup and give me a few pointers. When I practice cast all I have on are two Raven micro swivels, a float and one, or two, BB's. Do you think I might not have enough weight on to build up enough inertia to pull the line forward and make the spool start to spin? Any comments will be most appreciated. Anyone who might need some fly tying or fly fishing help can PM me.


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## KSUFLASH

Centerpin casting can be a challenge in the beginning. Once you get it down pat, it will be like riding a bike.

#1. During practice you more weight on the end of your line. If you release your hand from putting a break on the spool, the spool should spin and line should roll off. The more weight the easier it is to practice casting.

#2. The line is likely getting tangled around your reel handles because you have your left hand too close to the reel. With your left hand you pinch the line with your index and forefinger, then quickly turn that into a circle that the line passes through. Think of it as an extra guide.

From easy to difficult, I think it goes:

1. Side Cast
2. Spinning Side Cast
3. Wallace Cast

Some say skip everything and go straight to the Wallace, but when just learning in general on casting, line twist is the least of your worries. The motion is what you are working on.


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## stak45dx1

i fish with quite a bit more weight than you are describing and that still doesn't have enough momentum to over come the inertia of the spool being at rest, the best tip i have gotten is that you have to use your free hand to get the spool spinning before you cast. so you pull the line with your left hand to get the spool spinning and a split second later you throw your rig out with the rod in your right hand. once you get the timing down i think you'll find more success.


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## Wbranch

Thanks fellas! I'm kind of thinking the weight, or lack there of, might be my problem especially since I'm a newbie to centerpin casting. I can throw a WF#7 fly line 60' with just one false cast but can't get this damn thing to spin HaHa.

As soon as there is some decent weather down in my neck of the woods I'm going to get out there with the outfit and add a couple 3/0 shot to my leader to see if the added weight gets the spool to start to spin and pay out line when I try to cast. I can say one thing though about my reel spools ability to rotate easily; if I have just one Drennan type float on and two BB's and if I lift the rod to about the 11:00 position and let go of the spool just the mere weight of the float and the BB's causes the spool to turn and release line so I'm thiking the reel isn't the culprit it's the dope holding it.


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## ngski

It is the weight, match the float to the type of water your pinning. The trick is to get the reel to spin out without tangling and use the side cast, wait for enough line to spin out then cast out (someone correct me if that's a wrong statement) when casting out both arms are moving at the same time the hand that pulled the line is following the casting arm as a guide for the line to spool out without tangling. Then ya got to apply the break on the spooling reel when the float hits the water.

I've been on youtube search for centerpin fishing you'll see a bunch of videos there will be casting ones that are helpful. Nothing beats practicing on the water and then hook a fish by accident.

I'm still learning maybe we need a pinning conclave somewhere on one of the rivers I still have questions about set up.


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## ngski

OK I'm really making an effort to learn the pinning, while others around me are picking up chrome I refuse to use my fly rod. He's the question are the fish getting spooked from the float, fishing in knee deep or less water, using the raven fs floats the short and fat ones, got about 4 feet of line below the float, position above the fish. I believe the presentation is ahead of the float, using about 4 feet of line below the float, 2 fly setup. Fishing fast water, making sure the float is at current speed or less. 

Am I doing anything wrong?? Or they taking and I'm just missing the indication they took the fly because the set up is floating towards them.


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## KSUFLASH

I assume you are then doing the technique called trotting. This is when you feather the reel as it spins. Feathering being you are slowing it down momentarily as the current takes your presentation down the stream.

In knee deep water, using a 4' leader seems to be a bit too long. I also would say that for me personally, the centerpin is more effective on stretches of water that are deeper then knee deep. It is quite a bit more challenging to fish the quick shallow water with a pin for sure.


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## ngski

KSUFLASH said:


> In knee deep water, using a 4' leader seems to be a bit too long. I also would say that for me personally, the centerpin is more effective on stretches of water that are deeper then knee deep. It is quite a bit more challenging to fish the quick shallow water with a pin for sure.


I like a challenge, can the pin be successful enough in knee deep faster water, or should I go back to my fly rod, or shorten up the leader???


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## KSUFLASH

I think the fly rod is more effective in those areas personally.


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## ngski

Thanks for the reply I'm just addicted to the pin fishing especially on the fight the chrome got all that spring energy and you got'em on with no drag. I'll mess around some more on the short water got a few on have not landed any just want to make sure I got the right rig I'll shorten up the leader.


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## Lundfish

If you're knee deep in water, as Ben said; 4 feet is too long IMHO.

I would still keep those flies above the bottom unless you're purposely trying to bottom bounce. I would also do a 'check' several times if the water is really fast making you're float in front of your presentation. That's where pulling (checking) the float would come in handy.

You can also use slinkies and just bottom bounce if you have good current. I guess you can bottom bounce like you are but I think your baits are under the fish...hence no strikes.


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## ngski

I'm interested how many switch back to a fly rod in knee deep fast water. Do you have the same amount of hook ups on a pin or a fly rod in this condition.


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## Lundfish

Yes. Sometimes you have to shorten your leader. Heck you could throw on an indicator and fish it just like a fly rod. There's 100% no point of using an indicator on a fly rod anyway unless you just like to use a fly rod. Oh, and if you like shorter drag free drifts!

When you get better at casting you can cast a pin with no weight (or very little) using a wallis cast.


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## ngski

Lundfish said:


> When you get better at casting you can cast a pin with no weight (or very little) using a wallis cast.


Assume you're using lighter line to get that cast out with no weight, what's the distance you get out of that cast??


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## Lundfish

ngski said:


> Assume you're using lighter line to get that cast out with no weight, what's the distance you get out of that cast??


It just depends on the day. I'm not an expert caster. I can get it across the entire river on the rivers we fish in OH. 12 pound Suffix is what I was using more recently on my backup Raw. I plan to put 8 pound Pline on my new Kingpin when it arrives. 

I have some weight on there. A couple of small split shot below a 5 gram float. Not enough to get the 5 grammer to look right though. It's all about how fast you get the spool going. I also just got a St. Croix 13ft float rod. It's a lot lighter than the Raven IM9 and IM6 that I'm used to.

Practice, practice, practice. I still get a birds nest now and again. I've only been doing it for 2 years now. I started with the "modified side cast." That is like a side/wallis cast in one. Gets you familiar with the wallis cast and has less line twist than the side cast.


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## ngski

Ok I got a chance to swing by Erie Outfitters, got some excellent advice, so hopefully I'm good with my fast low water dilemma, still not enough weight. I posted on another centerpin forum they all say you can fish any type of water with a pin, so with low and fast keep a good contact on the float probably 95% of the hits are felt rather than seen and I should feel the take.


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## Lundfish

ngski said:


> Ok I got a chance to swing by Erie Outfitters, got some excellent advice, so hopefully I'm good with my fast low water dilemma, still not enough weight. I posted on another centerpin forum they all say you can fish any type of water with a pin, so with low and fast keep a good contact on the float probably 95% of the hits are felt rather than seen and I should feel the take.


Well that's honestly beyond me as far as using a pin and feeling takes. I have a lot to learn as well.


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## Fishman

I love the pin.

See those dudes 200 yards down stream of you? Dang low-holers~!

Time to run a drift through them.

BAM! Steel on!


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## Wbranch

KSU wrote;

"I think the fly rod is more effective in those areas personally."

I might be a newbie with the pin outfit but I've fly fished for trout for over fifty years and fly fished for steelhead about twenty-five years. I think a fly rod is far more effective than any pin outfit when you are fishing short, swift, runs no more than 15 feet long and no more than 3' deep.

I do use an indicator when nymphing for steelhead but never when nymphing for trout. I use an indicator for steelhead primarily so I don't get hung up on all the loose shale on the Erie and eastern Ohio streams. I believe on those narrow and swift runs 1' - 3' deep and maybe a dozen feet long I can run a drift through there repeatedly in the course of a minute. 

I roll cast upstream and mend line up, then just allow the current to take the flies and indicator downstream. When the indicator gets below me all I need do is flick the rod tip a bit to shake some line through the guides to extend my drift if I want to lengthen it. When I start to get drag I just lift the indicator out of the water and execute another roll cast and repeat the manuvuer until I hook up or move on.


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## Lundfish

Wbranch said:


> KSU wrote;
> 
> "I think the fly rod is more effective in those areas personally."
> 
> I might be a newbie with the pin outfit but I've fly fished for trout for over fifty years and fly fished for steelhead about twenty-five years. I think a fly rod is far more effective than any pin outfit when you are fishing short, swift, runs no more than 15 feet long and no more than 3' deep.
> 
> I do use an indicator when nymphing for steelhead but never when nymphing for trout. I use an indicator for steelhead primarily so I don't get hung up on all the loose shale on the Erie and eastern Ohio streams. I believe on those narrow and swift runs 1' - 3' deep and maybe a dozen feet long I can run a drift through there repeatedly in the course of a minute.
> 
> I roll cast upstream and mend line up, then just allow the current to take the flies and indicator downstream. When the indicator gets below me all I need do is flick the rod tip a bit to shake some line through the guides to extend my drift if I want to lengthen it. When I start to get drag I just lift the indicator out of the water and execute another roll cast and repeat the manuvuer until I hook up or move on.


Please explain to me exactly how a fly rod is more effective. You've simply explained how you like to fish. You can do the exact same thing with a pin setup, only you don't have to flick the rod tip to get more line out (which is a total pain btw and ruins a good section of the drag free drift). Have you ever even used a pin setup?


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## Fishermon

Extending the drift with the a fly rod by flicking the rod tip or feeding line out is not a pain and does not ruin a good section of the drift, it is really simple to do and becomes second nature. When done properly you don't impact the drift at all unless you intend to, (I like to check the indicator when I am extending the drift). I don't mean to speak for the original poster, just giving my opinion and experience. When fishing a short fast run like the example given, a fly rod is an ideal tool for the job. Roll cast, mend, drift, another mend, drift, repeat as necessary.


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## Wbranch

"Please explain to me exactly how a fly rod is more effective. You've simply explained how you like to fish." Okay, pinning is more effective.

"Have you ever even used a pin setup?" Yes, I'm kinda wondering why you seem so irate about my mild comments?? I'm not saying fly rodding is better than pinning. I'm just saying that I believe each method has attributes that the other might not have and there are instances where each method will perform but one method will perform better.


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## Lundfish

Wbranch said:


> "Please explain to me exactly how a fly rod is more effective. You've simply explained how you like to fish." Okay, pinning is more effective.
> 
> "Have you ever even used a pin setup?" Yes, I'm kinda wondering why you seem so irate about my mild comments?? I'm not saying fly rodding is better than pinning. I'm just saying that I believe each method has attributes that the other might not have and there are instances where each method will perform but one method will perform better.


Sometimes type comes off the wrong way. I'm not irate at all.

I'm only pointing out that the same can be accomplished with a pin (if one desires to do it). Personally as Fishermon said, for short and fast drifts I would prefer a fly rod. However, I have yet to encounter a run on the OH rivers I fish where I thought to myself; I should've brought my 8 wt. I don't fish the redds but I'm not saying I never will.

I prefer a fly rod out west in the Rockies. A lot of the rivers are very small and high sticking is the preferred method. However, I've thought about bringing the pin next time.


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## ngski

Tried out the pin in very fast water instead of using a float I tried bottom bouncing its not as hard as I thought got the same amount of hook ups as my fellow fly rodders. Still was able to control the speed but that was only on a longer bounce. Made sure to use enough weight to feel the bottom. Missed a few strikes due to not holding the spool and setting the hook, but it was a learning experience.

I gave up was having fewer snags and a longer drift. Felt this way I was able to play nice in an area full of people.


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## ngski

ngski said:


> Tried out the pin in very fast water instead of using a float I tried bottom bouncing its not as hard as I thought


After a season under the belt of pinning I now trust the float during one of my trips to the grand I had a hero's drift on a float had a lot of line out could barely see my float I felt a bump I set the hook, fish on, and pinned some very fast water had the right amount of weight and felt the take. Love to Pin, keep telling my fellow flyer's addicted to the no drag free fights.


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## AWGunS

Just picked up a new centerpin rig, totally new to me.

Been eyeing them for awhile, finally decided to pull the trigger, now I am looking for tips.

Backing line is a braided line I have. 20lb. Test, with siglon 8#. My braid ok for backing?

Leader length? 2'-3' below float? Longer?

Plan on getting out Thursday morning to try it out. Think I am heading to the Rocky, but maybe Chagrin if it is fishable. If you see a guy that looks like he doesn't know what he is doing, it might be me. Advice greatly appreciated.


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## ngski

Coming from a fly fishing background and switching over to pinning for the past two years I've noticed that I never used enough weight and learn to trust the float. I use the raven floats, and depending on what water I'm fishing high water, slack water, or fast water need to match the weight to the float. 

What's worked for me is staggering the weight from high to low, I like to end up with 2 to 3 small shots above my lure, also pay attention to what the float is doing if it's lying flat on the surface of the water you probably running too deep and need to adjust.

Control the float which is the core of pinning simply by pulling back (known as trotting) on the line and allowing the current to flutter up the lure and keeping contact on the float you will feel any takes using this method. This method will keep the lure down steam of the float allowing a more natural presentation to the fish.

I'll use a pin in high water conditions, fishing big waters like the grand and deeper pools.

It will take time and practice, I basically put the fly rod down for a season to learn pinning. I still go back the fly rod if I'm fishing an area that prevents me from taking long drifts and I need to play nice with my fellow fisherman.

Good luck it's a blast hooking a chrome in big water with no drag.

Shoot me a PM if you have any questions, I'm still learning.


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## salmonsteel97

Well backing is a lot thicker then 20 pound braid but it should be fine. Should bump your main line up some as it will help a new pinner cast without as many over spins maybe 12 pound. 
Leader length could be around 24" depending on water conditions and with your float on your main line.


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## master of steel

The others are right as I use 20# dacron for backing. I prefer to 10# as a mainline because it will cover all water conditions and I find thinner line works better in colder weather. I generally use a 8# leader about 4' with a micro swivel and the tippet is 6#. I always use a fluorocarbon for both leader and tippet. 

I like to stagger my split shots like a button shirt.


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## salmonsteel97

I personally use 10 pound low vis line so I can run my main line down to my leader. I use 6 pound leads so if I Hang up on bottom I know I will get my float back and shot.

I really never run to much of a shoting pattern pattern usually just bulk my shot by the swivel and run my leader to my jig. For spawn I with say a 6.2 raven I run 2 number 7 shot about 2 foot up from my swivel and one at my swivel and on my leader I put a bb shot about 10 inches up from my sac.


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## ngski

salmonsteel97 said:


> I personally use 10 pound low vis line so I can run my main line down to my leader. I use 6 pound leads so if I Hang up on bottom I know I will get my float back and shot.


Use the same setup, with a 13 foot rod it's got enough to absorb the shock and if the steelhead are tippet shy I sometimes go down to a 4lb. Weight on the main line, micro swivel, fluorocarbon tippet, a couple of shots your done ready to catch fish.

As far as leader length figure around 3 feet start out with, if the water is clear might want to go a little longer. All this depends on the depth of water you are pinning.


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## atrenz

I too would recommend stepping up the mainline from 8, especially since it is hi vis.... if you want to run siglon, also rig a shot line. So if wanting to fish 6lb leader, put a cut of 8 lb above the leader for your shot, then up to your main. This keeps the hi vos line out of the water, and shot off the fragile leader. I like to step it down personally for each, so I know at most I'll lose my shot and not my float. I run 16 siglon for main with float, swivel, then 12 lb shot line with split shot, swivel and then 4-10 lb leader depending on conditions. I stick to water that is at least 3 foot deep, so I rig a 2 foot shot line, and about a foot long leader. Anything deeper, and the hi vis line protruding into the water is now far enough away from the presentation to make me feel comfortable at around 3 foot. Typically bulk shot 3/4 near the float, with 1/4 near the final swivel to the leader. Meaning for an 8 gram float, about 6 grams would be right under the float, and 2 grams at the bottom.

Hope this helps!


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## flyphisherman

I would recommend learning the Wallis cast, or any cast that has your line peeling off the front of a spinning spool. It may take more time to learn, but you will never suffer from the "line twist blues"


Good luck


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## atrenz

flyphisherman said:


> I would recommend learning the Wallis cast, or any cast that has your line peeling off the front of a spinning spool. It may take more time to learn, but you will never suffer from the "line twist blues"
> 
> 
> Good luck


Very good point! I myself use a spinning side cast. It too was odd to learn, but I can get some great distance with it, without forming twist throughout the day.


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## kapposgd

The side cast is great for distance but it puts terrible twist in your line


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## salmonsteel97

I wallis cast, But when I need to get crazy distance I do a spinning side.


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## MuskieManOhio

I just bought some high vis line and now I'm reading I have to add a shot line to my set up is this true if so how do I rig it?


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## EyeCatchEm

MuskieManOhio said:


> I just bought some high vis line and now I'm reading I have to add a shot line to my set up is this true if so how do I rig it?



Ehh, just tie the mainline to the leader. Put shot on your main line under your float and I usually put one small shot a foot above my bait.


Sent from my iPhone using Ohub Campfire


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## atrenz

EyeCatchEm said:


> Ehh, just tie the mainline to the leader. Put shot on your main line under your float and I usually put one small shot a foot above my bait.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Ohub Campfire


For the most part, I would agree with this, AS LONG AS the leader is at least 3 feet long. Would you want a high vis line any closer to your bait than that?

You dont have to do the shot line, no. I prefer to for the reasons I stated earlier, especially because I crimp the last split shot onto a tougher line than my 6lb-ish leader.... plus the fact that as I snag up, typically all i lose is my hook and leader. I replace the 1 foot cut mentioned prior, and back in business. Get hung up 10x throughout a weekend, go thru up to 10' of leader material with a shot line, vs up to 30' with no shot line. With a high quality flourocarbon, that translates to at least 3 bucks, vs 10 bucks...give or take.

Its all personal preference at the end of the day. The above is just what I have honed in after much trial and error!

Another big recommendation, tie snelled leaders before you go! the angle of a snell knot seems to hold into the fish much better, and having these pre-tied saves you a lot of time on the river, and gets you back in business faster! That is of course for fishing bags/beads/any other plain hook bait. If fishing jigs, disregard.


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## atrenz

As for how to rig, here is my earlier explanation....

"I run 16 siglon for main with float, swivel, then 12 lb shot line with split shot, swivel and then 4-10 lb leader depending on conditions. I stick to water that is at least 3 foot deep, so I rig a 2 foot shot line, and about a foot long leader."

I cant really find a diagram of this online handy, but if you dont follow, let me know, and I will attempt to get artistic for ya!


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## MuskieManOhio

Thanks I appreciate this!


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## salmonsteel97

As for high vis under a float, I run hi vis all the time in the summer for bass and cats and what not and they don't mind it at all. I like low vis for steelhead though because its more personal confidence.


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## AWGunS

Thanks for the tips.

I will add some more leader. Having high vis line close to bait doesn't make much sense. Next order I will get some heavier mainline. Makes sense as well.

I have to be honest though. I have pulled the pin reel off and now using my spinning reel. Spent an afternoon trying to get some casts out with the pin reel with little to no luck. I put the spinning reel back on for my last trip, and spent what little time II had fishing instead of fussing (and cussing).


Still have not caught a steel head yet. Unfortunately, it is going to be awhile before the weather and the rivers cooperate.

Again, thanks for the input.


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## atrenz

Casting does not come with ease for most, or overnight. To be honest, the first two days I fished it, I wanted to throw it in the river! After that, it became 1 bad bird nest a day, with hooking but losing a ton of fish. But after less than a year, I started hooking and landing more steel than I ever have with spinning rigs, with a bad cast or bird nest verrrrrrrry rare - once every few times out I'll slip up. So stick with it, you'll love it! Take this time to go practice casting! It's much more efficient to learn casting off the water rather than waste river time! ..... if I was closer I'd offer getting together to give pointers and get ya started, but alas I'm in michigan..


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## salmonsteel97

Biggest thing that I learned when casting is do not put that bobber all the way up to your tip and expect to pull the line. Keep your float/weights about eye level then try the wallis.

After pulling keep some drag on the spool with one of your fingers. Once you get the cast down you will say to your self why was this so hard to learn.


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## flyphisherman

atrenz described my own learning curve also......

The cast is not difficult.....It's all a matter of timing. Getting the timing perfect each cast is the challenging part. 

It gets easier each and every time you use it.

I have good memories of picking apart a birds nest while watching my float dunk......oops


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## ngski

Casting took me a while I threw away a lot of line the first season I still use the side cast and the easiest way to learn is pull the line off the spool till it starts coming off the spool then cast. If it's a short distance pull easy if you need distance pull a little harder. Then make sure to stop the spool when the float hits the water. If your on he grand this season shoot me a pm I'll be happy to help ya out.


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## ngski

Ok question for all the veteran pinners with all this high water at what flow is pinning not effective because the flow is too high and the fish are on the move or is it better to start pinning when the flow peaks and starts to drop.


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## Raylaser

Thanks to all who've posted set-up suggestions here. I'm just starting my research into pinning and the info you guys have shared is great and very detailed. Some sites you visit you'd think you were asking for the secret formula to Coke, LOL! Will post more after I start to buy equipment and practice the skills and techniques presented on this site. Thanks again for all the shared knowledge!!!


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## A-5

All I can say is. New pin era start with heavy floats and weight. Not totally ridiculous go about 11gr float. It will help with the pull and chuck to spin ratio. Get the hang and reduce weight as needed.


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