# Pure Crap for OR cat people



## jkeeney20 (Mar 21, 2006)

Was down at the local bait store and talked to a guy who said he was at the shawnee marina and seen a few large boats pull in with at least 400-500 catfish....All he said was over at least 15lbs...said they got rid of all the small ones....said he was standing there and they asked him if he wanted any of the larger ones that had torn up tails from guarding nest, said they would cause disease in his lakes or something...Talked to another guy about it and he said he seen them on the actual OR and was wondering what was going on...The guy said it was for a pay lake up near chillicothe.....Bunch of Bull S**t if you ask me....what do you guys think of this....someone said they got netting permission or liscence from the state of KY....I think its wrong myself! Just my 2 cents!


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## riverKing (Jan 26, 2007)

unfortunatly we cant do much about it becasue KY still allows people to commercial fish the ohio. however i think i know wich paylake you are talking about, he is the only person that fishes the ohio part of the big o for paylakes, he is also the least ethical person i have ever met. he fishes up here because he is to cheap to get fish from down south where every other paylake gets there fish, i also think he will go out of buisness in a few years because he is the last paylake left (that i know of) that still pushes the legal boundries on where he gets his fish, hopefully soon the dnr will bust him


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## Daveo76 (Apr 14, 2004)

If they have permission from Ky,don't they have to exit the river from Ky? I fish the Marina a lot but never saw anything like that. Were you at Ol Dads Or what bait shop?


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## SKEET (Apr 1, 2006)

I have catfished for 12 years,7 by boat. It was nothing to catch 10 to 15 cats a night a couple 20 lb and if lucky a 30 or 40 lb. Now 3 to 6 fish in this pool is a good night. Commercial fishing has RAPED the OR ,Maysville is proof of that. Cabelas king kat tournament coming to town in August hope to find a honey hole soon, away from the commercial fishing!


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## macfish (Apr 7, 2004)

Look the only thing you can do is cut there nets when you see them on the river.


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## ohiou_98 (Mar 19, 2007)

Check your Ohio fishing regulations, it states (& cautions) that in certain areas of the river you must also comply with KY fishing restrictions, or WV, (depending on the section of the river your fishing). In the opposite, KY requires KY folks to comply with Ohio fishing laws on the river. If an Ohio DNR person was there, they would've been busted. Their story regarding a KY commercial fishing license reeks of a lie.


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## Chuck P. (Apr 8, 2004)

Just think of this way, every paylake in the ohio river region stocks around 2,000 lbs of catfish EVERY week, EVERY paylake!! Some actually stock several times a week.

Of those 2,000 pounds, some are farm raised channels, some are wild channels while 100% (If I'm wrong about the 100% part, I'm sorry) of the blue and flathead catfish are wild, taken by whatever means they are taken.

I don't think I've ever heard of a blue or flathead farm


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## williambauman (Apr 11, 2005)

Chuck P. said:


> I don't think I've ever heard of a blue or flathead farm



NEVER HEARD OF ONE EITHE R


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## riverat (May 26, 2004)

There are legal netters working the Portsmouth area, I've talked with them.
One of two things needs to happen. It either needs to be illegal to sell to a pay lake or most likely the lakes should have to post signs, warning folks about the pcb's and mercury in the fish. They have no idea that the fish is highly contaminated.


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## wader (Dec 9, 2004)

It states in the ODNR fishing regulations that it is illegal to transport fish from one body of water to another in the state of Ohio. If these guys are really taking fish from the river to a paylake, it should be an easy enough case to settle. It sounds to me like some state employees are getting their wallets fattened to turn a blind eye.


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## BuckeyeFishinNut (Feb 8, 2005)

The easiest way to protect the catfish population would be to put creel or size limits or both on the Ohio River. Right now you can keep as many as you want as big or small as you want. I always thought it was a contradiction of the law that they were allowed to stock fish in a pay lake from the Ohio River since you aren't supposed to transport fish between bodies of water. I don't care if they are private lakes, many are close to streams, rivers, or other lakes. All it takes is a dam to break or a flood and those fish are in public water. Its a shame what people are "legally" allowed to do sometimes.

Jake


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## boonecreek (Dec 28, 2006)

u,r right i know of one such person tha ownes a pay lake that fishes(NETS) the ohoi river. the vilage of Moscow ran him off there ramp last summer.


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## jeffmo (Apr 7, 2004)

with a new governor sitting in the statehouse(plus the fact that he's from southern ohio),it might be a good time for the members from this site to talk to their representives about making this practice illegal.
i'm not a catter but i see nothing fair about these pay lake owners being allowed to take from state waters.


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## boonecreek (Dec 28, 2006)

how do we go about that


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## riverKing (Jan 26, 2007)

frankly with how little patlakes actually affect OUR waters i dont care that they exsit, this is probably the last guy getting them from the ohio up this far all the fish come from down south. i always think where are all those paylakers gonna fish if theres no paylakes, theres enough beer cans, trash, and jerks on the river already and there are thousands of guys fishing those paylakes, now im not saying all of them are that stereotype but i think there would be more damage done by a bunch of fresh people out on the river keeping every flathead they catch to show it off or put it in thier pond, than by letting two lakes in alabama get overfished while we can still get out to a quiet section of river. if your mad about the one guy fishing the ohio part of the ohio river than figure out a way to ban commercial fishing in the section no matter who you are lisenced by.. also dont cut the nets c'mon, lets have the trap float down the river, and what if that trap net was set by orsanco, the odnr, some researcher trying to do studies on how commercial fishing effects us. im sorry i just get sick of the paylake crap, they dont ohio's lakes and if you dont like them show off the big cats you are catching without having to pay $12 for a ticket and $10 for bait after the gas you spent to get there, thats what will shut down the paylakes, no demand


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## jason454ci (Dec 27, 2005)

The biggest thing you guys need to understand is that ODNR has absolutely nothing to do with the matter of commercial fishing on the Ohio River. It doesn't matter what side of the river they are launching at. They only way you have to abide by the Ohio laws is if you hold only an Ohio licenses or are bank fishing the Ohio side. Like it or not they are fishing legally by Kentuckys laws. So you would need to start there not here. On the matter of not transporting fish from one body of water to another in Ohio. That would hurt everyone in the state. No one would be allowed to stock their private ponds or would the state be allowed to stock anything into public waters. Until other states find a reason to change their laws this situation is not going to change. And for the most part it doesn't look like they are working too hard at changing anything anytime soon.


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## fisharder (Mar 18, 2005)

If you catch fish with the intent to resell the fish a sampleing of the fish has to be sent to the FDA in Arkansas.The fish has to meet standards or they can`t be resold.If you put fish in a pay lake your intention is to sell the fish.I would bet this step has not been taken.I think it is a federal offence??If you know this guys name and his business name give the FDA a call what do you have to lose.Its public info and they have to tell you hell check there web site you might be able to report him there??The transportation of fish is fuzzy but it doesn`t sound kosher to me.I met some commercial fisherman on the OR one day and what they do is when they send there fish to be tested they use the very small ones because the young fish are not as contaminated as the larger older fish.Think about that next time you fish a pay lake and keep a catfish to eat..This dope could be posining people.Perfectly legal???Nobody is perfect..


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## spot chaser (Apr 13, 2004)

jason454ci said:


> The biggest thing you guys need to understand is that ODNR has absolutely nothing to do with the matter of commercial fishing on the Ohio River. It doesn't matter what side of the river they are launching at. They only way you have to abide by the Ohio laws is if you hold only an Ohio licenses or are bank fishing the Ohio side. Like it or not they are fishing legally by Kentuckys laws. So you would need to start there not here. On the matter of not transporting fish from one body of water to another in Ohio. That would hurt everyone in the state. No one would be allowed to stock their private ponds or would the state be allowed to stock anything into public waters. Until other states find a reason to change their laws this situation is not going to change. And for the most part it doesn't look like they are working too hard at changing anything anytime soon.


According to ODNR - It IS illegal to move one from one body to another.

GENERAL INFORMATION

-It is unlawful to buy or sell any fish taken by angling from any water area in the state where an Ohio Fishing License is required.

-It is unlawful to transport and introduce any aquatic species (fish, inverte-brate, plant) from one body of water to another.

Now whether this covers private water - don't know.

http://www.dnr.state.oh.us/wildlife/fishing/fishregs/

Both Il and Ky allow commercial netting in the Ohio - but so far I haven't found the exact rules.


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## jason454ci (Dec 27, 2005)

spot chaser said:


> According to ODNR - It IS illegal to move one from one body to another.
> 
> GENERAL INFORMATION
> 
> ...


The ODNR laws do not apply to putting fish into private waters. This is why you do not need a fishing licenses to fish in a private pond. But if the pond has a stream that flows out of it that fish can use to migrate in and out of, then the states laws apply to it.


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## M.Magis (Apr 5, 2004)

> According to ODNR - It IS illegal to move one from one body to another


No, it's not. It states it's illegal to *intruduce* from one body of water to another. There's a difference.


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## macfish (Apr 7, 2004)

What ever the reason the catfishing on the ohio has never been worse. and ia iam talking from the city of cincinnati to rising sun indiana. i fish that stretch and its bad. You can blame it on whatever you like but its a combination of things, netters, people keeping fish, (why) and those that are kept in live wells to takr back to the ramp to show off and then next thing you know there dead as well. 

CATCH AND RELEASE IS THE ANSWER.


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## mrfishohio (Apr 5, 2004)

Commercial license is not the same as a sporting license, hence, they can use nets, etc that we can't. Then they own the fish and can do as they please, use them for catfood, paylakes etc. It's an old argument, might not ever go anywhere. Obviously to me the (Ohio) officials did take heed as they have finally introduced some regulations for catfish in Ohio. (KY has not) Tennesse enacted strict requirements on their commercial fisherman, I think it's only one fish can be kept over 34 or 37" or something. So the guys going for the big fish for paylakes either went south or up into KY. 
Do a search in here for a couple of years ago and you can read 'em and weep....

click here to read part of an old thread....


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## farmboy (Oct 12, 2005)

[URL="http://www.lrc.ky.gov/kar/301/001/155.htm"][URL="http://www.lrc.ky.gov/kar/301/001/220.htm"]OHIO RIVER 
Ohio River Fishing Regulations and License Agreements 
The following Ohio River fishing regulations are the result of negotiations between the wildlife agencies of Ohio, West Virginia, and Kentucky. Since 1994 Ohios fishing regulations have been unified with those of West Virginia and Kentucky for fishing on the Ohio River between our mutual borders. The following daily bag limits and minimum size limits apply to the Ohio River and its embayments and tributaries to the first dam or riffle. Note that the regulations differ slightly between the Ohio/West Virginia border (Eastern Unit) and the Ohio/Kentucky border (Western Unit). 

Western Unit (Kentucky/Ohio border only  Lawrence County west of Southpoint, and Scioto, Adams, Brown, Clermont, and Hamilton counties). Ohio and Kentucky will honor the other states fishing licenses along their common borders on the mainstem and from the banks of the Ohio River, excluding embayments and tributaries. This agreement applies to Ohio and Kentucky residents only. The following regulations are the only unified regulations in the agreement  for all other regulations, anglers must abide by those of the state by which they are licensed, except that Ohio anglers must abide by Kentucky laws when fishing from the Kentucky shoreline, and Kentucky anglers must abide by Ohio laws when fishing from the Ohio shoreline 



Eastern Unit (West Virginia/Ohio border only  Lawrence County east of Southpoint, and Gallia, Meigs, Athens, Washington, Monroe, Belmont, Jefferson, and Columbiana counties). Ohio and West Virginia will honor the other states fishing licenses along their common borders on the mainstem of the Ohio River, including its banks and embayments and tributaries to the first dam or riffle. This agreement applies to Ohio and West Virginia residents only. The following regulations are the only unified regulations in the agreement. For all other regulations, Ohio anglers must abide by West Virginia laws when fishing the river mainstem and its banks, embayments, and tributaries in West Virginia. West Virginia anglers must abide by Ohio laws when fishing from the riverbanks, embayments, and tributaries in Ohio. 

301 KAR 1:140. Special commercial fishing permit.



RELATES TO: KRS 150.450(2)

STATUTORY AUTHORITY: KRS 150.025(1)

NECESSITY, FUNCTION, AND CONFORMITY: KRS 150.025(1) authorizes the department to regulate the size or type of devices and methods used to take wildlife, including rough fish and the places where they may be taken. This administrative regulation is necessary to specify the waters open to, and other restrictions on the use of, gill and trammel nets.



Section 1. Definitions. (1) "Bar mesh size" means the distance between two (2) knots on a line of a net.

(2) "Immediate family" means the person's spouse, mother, father, grandparent, son, or daughter.

(3) "Permit" means a special commercial fishing permit.

(4) "Rough fish" is defined by KRS 150.010(32).

(5) "Whip set" means a gill net or a trammel net rigged so it is free-floating.



Section 2. Special Commercial Fishing Permit. (1) A person shall possess a valid Kentucky commercial fishing license to obtain or retain a permit throughout the special commercial fishing season.

(2) The department shall issue a special commercial fishing permit only to a person who had previously purchased a permit for the 2003 through 2005 special commercial fishing season.

(3) For the 2006-2007 special commercial fishing season, the department shall not issue more than twenty-seven (27) special commercial fishing permits. The number of permits issued shall be reduced through attrition to a maximum of twenty-five (25).

(a) A person shall purchase a special commercial fishing permit annually to retain the privilege to purchase a permit in following years;

(b) The ability to purchase a permit shall only be transferred to immediate family members;

(c) No new permits shall be issued until the total number of permits has been reduced to less than twenty-five (25);

(d) A lottery drawing shall be used to select new permittees once the number of permits has been reduced to less than twenty-five (25).

1. Persons wishing to apply for a vacant permit shall submit an application along with permit fees, as stipulated in 301 KAR 3:022, to the department prior to October 1 of the fishing season to be included in the lottery drawing.

2. No more than seven (7) of the maximum number of permits issued shall be nonresident special commercial fishing permits.




[/URL][/URL]


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## LMRcatman (May 30, 2006)

I have been fishing the river for the last three years. Three years ago when I first started fishing the OR I would average at least 10 cats a trip which wasnt too bad for being a newbie. Anyway last year was worse and this year has been really bad. I fish the downtown cincy area up to the dam. I have only caught two nice fish all year one 15 and another 25 flat head. My point is that I should be catching a lot more. I dont even mark too many fish anymore. I was fishing up by new Richmond mid April and saw a bunch of nets set up along the bank. I didnt take much notice till I saw some guys pulling one up. They pulled in a few nice blues over 20 pounds that I saw and that was just one net. They had at least 8 that I saw set up that day. The big thing that pissed me off was that I saw them leave the river on the KY side but there nets were still in the water. Any fish that gets caught in that net has to die within 12 hours or so. I also drove up close to one net and noticed a dead paddle fish that was rotten who knows how long it had been dead for. And what were they going to do with that fish and all the rest that were dead. This is too bad this kind of stuff happens on our river. Anyway I am rambling. I dont know what purpose these guys were taking fish for but I dont think it is helping our fishery. The OR really needs some kind of regulations set up. What they have right now is not working. Just my opinion


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## Flathead King 06 (Feb 26, 2006)

BuckeyeFishinNut said:


> Right now you can keep as many as you want as big or small as you want.


Read up on ohio regulations...only one flathead over 35" is allowed while you can keep as many under that as you want and for channels one over 28" and then all you want under that...but a proposed creel limit and size limit, as well as a legal doctorine declaring netting in the ohio illegal should all be in effect right now but thats what happens when law abiding citizens are lining the pockets of "dirty" odnr reps...they turn their head when it comes to enforcing their own laws (dont want to step on anyones toes, but jeeze...come on)


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## riverKing (Jan 26, 2007)

one flathead over 35 a day and unlimited under doesnt do jack to keep our trophy fish protected, the people who keep big flatties typically arn't the anglers with the skill to catch more than one that size a night, or they dont care period. with no limits on small fish a handfull of anglers who knew how to fish could legally destroy the lmr, the stillwater, or for a time smaller streches of the gmr. all these limits show is that are dnr doesnt have either the brains or the brass the actualy put real regs in effect for fear of losing license sales or maybe just the fear of having to enforce laws, they put that "trophy reg" up to shut people up. real trophy regs are the ones you find on the red river of the north, a possesion limit of five fish and a one fish over 24in limit, those are the kind of limits that work and they have been proven to work when put into affect, unfortuantly if ohio where to grow the brainpower to bring in regs like that many of the shortsited anglers that think keeping catfish to show off is awesome would complain, comercial fishing isnt the only problem these fish disapear from places the net guys cant fish and its by anglers that we probably fish with, if you complain about the commercial guys complain about the limits as a who dont make such a small portion of the problem the scapegoat


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## Doctor (Apr 5, 2004)

Kentucky has control of the Ohio river not Ohio, the creel limits are not enforced on the Ohio river because Kentucky laws are honored there is no limit on what they call rough fish on the Ohio which I call Catfish, as long as Kentucky has control I seriously doubt you will ever see any netting measures taken, anybody that nets or gets fish out of the river has a Kentucky commercial license, Ohio does not grant them.

I thought this area was bad up here, try fishing down in the areas that we fish tournaments at in Indiana, it is 10 times worse when it comes to nets and hoop nets, I see more hoop nets than gill nets the farther you go south on the river, but we are able to still catch big fish on a fairly consistent basis.

I have noticed in our area that there is not the amount of bait fish as we see down in Indiana, but the river is wider and deeper down there also, who knows, since Lynn and I have been fishing tournaments we don't fish much in Ohio waters, more Indiana than anything kind of getting spoiled with there waters and big fish.............Doc


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## Hatchetman (Apr 13, 2004)

I would imagine that since you made the statement about "dirty ODNR officials", that you have proof of this. If so, what have you done about it ? I would guess nothing because you don't have anything other than an opinion and everyone, including me, has one of those.


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## flathead (Apr 11, 2005)

I would Defiantly have to agree with whoever said the Ohio river fishing is down. I went this past weekend fishing for Channels and Flats, got two nice flats, but between three people fishing on a boat not one of us caught a channel. That is the first time i have ever fished the river this time of year with out catching a channel. I don't what is going on, but things have defiantly changed, something is having a major impact on the Rivers Cat population. I believe its a combination of several things.


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## BuckeyeFishinNut (Feb 8, 2005)

Flathead King 06,

If you read up on the Ohio Regulations you will see this in *BOLD* under the statewide regulations.

*These regulations apply to all public waters in Ohio, EXCEPT that SITE-SPECIFIC regulations apply to water areas included in the SITE-SPECIFIC, LAKE ERIE & TRIBUTARIES, OHIO RIVER, and PYMATUNING LAKE regulation sections, listed above. *

If you check under the Ohio River regs you will see nothing protecting flathead, channel, or blue cats.

Jake


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## Flathead King 06 (Feb 26, 2006)

hey sorry bout that...dont fish the ohio much and those fine print laws never really applied to where we fish here inland...but rather sorry for pointing a finger

Flathead King


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## Flathead King 06 (Feb 26, 2006)

Hatchetman said:


> I would imagine that since you made the statement about "dirty ODNR officials", that you have proof of this. If so, what have you done about it ? I would guess nothing because you don't have anything other than an opinion and everyone, including me, has one of those.


not to step on anyones toes, and yes i am entitled to my opinion just the same as you, but there again...as has always been said, opinions are like buttholes they all stink...... but here in the cj brown area they, the dnr reps and officials turn their heads when it comes to enforcing their laws (watching people with small children heading out on the water with no life jakcets and not be checked or anything)...many know of byron rice-game warden for clark county...well straight from his own mouth to me in a conversation about the legality of hunting cj reservoir for turkey..."since the lake isnt what you would consider a 'state oriented' park but rather a local run organization through the rangers (even though it is listed as one) and I being a "state" game warden, I really dont have any authority to help you with your trespassing problem... so you need to contact the rangers" well these were his words, when I questioned him about why people were able to hunt the north end of the reservoir during turkey season when all hunting is closed from march 1st until october 15th... so i contacted the ranger station out at the lake and all they could tell me was that there wasnt supposed to be anyone hunting it, but i told them that there was, well they said they would have an officer check it out...but i hunted my land next to it the next 5 days and never seen hide nor hair of any ranger... so i called the distrcit office in xenia about it and all they could tell me was i would have to get in touch with byron rice...so you see it was a loosing battle....but bet your bottom dollar byron will be out there this year and next and so on during deer season checking people, issuing tickets, or during the WB run issuing tickets for no license, etc... even though it isnt his in his authority...sounds fishy...theres your proof


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## FISHNASTY (Oct 19, 2004)

Flathead King, there are two types of opinions, educated and stupid, yours is the latter. I personally do not work for wildlife, but I do work for DNR and I can assure you they are not "dirty". I'm not going into specifics but I handle many citizen complaints and 99.9% of the time they have no idea what there talking about and constantly accuse us of being dirty or on the take. It's such a joke. Meanwhile your fishing paylakes and transporting fish, a real model citizen and conservationist. Even in your ranting barely inteligble post you misquote the regulations. Call a DNR wildlife office and file a formal complaint, they'll get back to you.


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## Flathead King 06 (Feb 26, 2006)

FISHNASTY said:


> I handle many citizen complaints... {real model citizen} fishing paylakes and transporting fish....


Well I'm glad to see at least one person doing their job...sorry if i have made anyone mad...but fishnasty, you're not even in the jurisdiction of which I speak, so i don't really know if you know half of what i speak of, so I don't know how you can speak for all DNR reps/officials... but when a citizen comes to their local authority in hopes of solving a problem or situation, and they get blown off, I have a big problem with that...and yes I did misquote the regulations...but as I have already stated, I dont fish those areas much where the inland state regs. apply....but we are all human and make mistakes

As for the model citizen remark...I am sure there are many people on here that would applaud my actions of returning a fish to its original habitat or something close to it rather than a crap hole for them to die in... and I'm not too sure about this, but the only person that would be upset about my actions would be the owner of the paylake, because technically speaking, the regulations say nothing of transporting fish from a private body of water to another private body of water...and at that is says "*introduce any aquatic species (fish, invertebrate, plant) from one body of water to another.*" I didnt introduce any species of fish... they are already in the body of water I released them into...


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## FISHNASTY (Oct 19, 2004)

My point is if people don't fish the paylake it will go out of business, the money you paid to catch that fish finaces the purchase of other fish to be thrown into the craphole.


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