# Discouraged, seeking advice



## DWC (Sep 8, 2010)

I have been very excited to have the guy start on my pond. He came, dug a couple of test holes and said it looked good and I paid his backhoe guy $160.00. Came back and bulldozed a couple of days and said it looked good. Wrote him a check for a third ($5000.00). I asked if I was ok to buy my windmill bubbler and he said go ahead. ChaChing $2000.00. Bulldozed on Saturday. Came back today with his backhoe guy. Dug another hole and tells me "no go, too much sand." Naturally I was not a happy guy. Seems to think there is no way to salvage this. Said he'd give me back $4000.00 so I'm going to be $3000.00 in the hole with nothing to show but a bunch of knocked down trees, a torn up field and a windmill I have no use for. I'm thinking there has to be some way out of this without having nothing to show. He doesn't seem to keen on the idea of lining with clay - says it will crack eventually and leak. I'm willing to plunk down another couple grand if we can make this work. It doesn't seem to me this is an impossibility. Could seriously use some advice.


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## Salmonid (Apr 14, 2004)

ummm, backhoe guy should have dug 4-5 test holes several feet deeper then the depth of the pond??? If he didnt do that, then I think Id be having a serious talk with him about that. ( as far as payment) how big is the pond supposed to be? how deep, what percentage of sand/clay do you have?? a good soil and water district soil map should show exactly what you have there. If the top soil is good clay, they should be able to push that to the side, then use a sheeps foot compactor to line the bottom of the pond with it, should be all you need, getting decent clay from local worksites is the easy part, youll have to pay to have it trucked in but a dozen truckloads should give you a foot of base for about 1/3 acre pond, Im sure that would be cheaper then Bentonite as a sealer. 

Can you show pics or describe the setting so we know about your watershed size, surrounding topgraphy, etc. 

At a minimum, Id stop everything and get a second opinion for a much more experienced pond buil;der in your neck of the woods, sounds like this guy is a escavator and not too knowledgable about pond building. JUst my .02

Salmonid


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## DWC (Sep 8, 2010)

Apparently the soil map is not accurate and not the kind of soil it is claimed to be. The pond was to be 1 1/2 + acres. I asked about trucking in clay and he said it would be prohibitively expensive and there would be nothing to support it - though I'm not sure what that means. My builder has been building ponds around here for 35 years. He said this is the first he has had to fill in. He seems to think I would be throwing good money after bad to pursue this. I take some pics. He was also displeased because he did not run into any ground water when he dug down.


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## Salmonid (Apr 14, 2004)

I am confused, if your digging for ground water, then you dont want clay in ohter words 2 types of ponds, first is your typical gravel pit style, where you dig deeper then the water table and you have have lateral water moving to the point of least resistance in a well like situation, these ponds are seasonally dependant of good water tables or else your shoreline will fluctuate greatly. Second type is where you are retaining as much ground water to keep pond full and to help with that is to have a relatively clay lined bottom to keep the water in the pond as long as possible before evaporation starts to effect the water levels, I have this type of pond and it is dug into straight clay, is 100 percent escavated and at full pol is about 12 ft deep, but with the hard drought here in SW Ohio, its now down about 16-18" but is fairing better then all the surrounding local ponds. 

So where abouts are you located?? Perhaps someone local who has done some pond building can add some local flair /advise by seeing the situation firsthand. 

Salmonid


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## DWC (Sep 8, 2010)

I don't know if we were digging for ground water per se. I don't really understand it. I live in Brown County, in Blanchester.


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## Jigging Jim (Apr 3, 2010)

I don't know diddly about pond building - but here's an idea: How about talking to your neighbors who have Ponds on their land. Maybe they could give you information on your situation. Perhaps one of them had a similiar experience in building theirs.


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## T-180 (Oct 18, 2005)

When I had my pond built in '99, there was a guy who brought 1 big dump truck & a semi dump to haul the clay from my site to line his pond. He was along Big Darby and there was a sand vein that would cause a leak. He hauled enough from my 1/2 acre pond to line his 1 acre pond & do all the grading around his house, for drainage. His pond holds water just fine & I was darn glad to get rid of all that clay.
Something just sounds fishy with your guy is asking for money along the way, then wanting to bail after he gets to pocket a grand or so. I would think he'd be willing to work with you on a solution.


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## keith_r (Jun 18, 2010)

i found lots of pond info over at the "pond boss" forum;
http://www.pondboss.com/forums/ubbthreads.php

you should be able to find somebody local there as well


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## Salmonid (Apr 14, 2004)

Most of us on this forum are already Pond Boss regulars and yes, TONS of great info there. You wont find any pond digging experts, just a bunch of us somewhere in the middle of a long experiment on how to manage there ponds mostly.LOL

Salmonid


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## [email protected] (Feb 29, 2008)

I am sorry to hear about your situation; I guess you never know what you'll encounter when you start digging. First, let me say that your excavator may be correct -not every location is suitable for a pond and I am no expert when it comes to the construction. However, I think you should get a second opinion by another excavator or, better yet, have your county soil and water extension agent come out if you haven't already. Should be a free service as they are a government office.

Brown County S&W
706 South Main Street
Georgetown, OH 45121 
Phone: 937-378-4424 *** Fax: 937-378-6710

I've heard of plenty of people lining their pond with clay I don't know why it would not work in your situation. Another thing $15,000 for a 1.5 acre pond seems real cheap to me. I've always heard the figure being closer to $30,000 per acre.


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## PapawSmith (Feb 13, 2007)

[email protected] said:


> Brown County S&W
> 706 South Main Street
> Georgetown, OH 45121
> Phone: 937-378-4424 *** Fax: 937-378-6710
> ...


Contacting your local S&W District is a good idea. Here in Lorain County they are heavily involved in pond construction, we are about to dig one and had a S&W engineer out today. They can help assure that things like this, and worse, don't occur. However no one really knows, for sure, what is below the surface until you dig a hole.
I felt $15,000 was just a little on the higher side, but not bad. If $30,000 p/acre is the going rate I'm selling a bunch of crap and buying an excavator and dozer.


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## kmb411 (Feb 24, 2005)

DW- I am working in Blanchester (Clinton County), and if you drive through the county there are alot of ponds that are empty. The problem with the Blanchester area is the lack of good engineered fill, which is compactable. Most of the area is farm land and has alot of organics, which will cause leakage. What we found is that the good dirt (compactable clay) is 14-20 feet deep, deeper than a standard pond digging depth. Most of the dirt between ground level and 20' smells like pig poop, which is bad dirt. 
Most likely, trucking in dirt is the only option.


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