# Pond Imbalance?



## crittergitter (Jun 9, 2005)

I recently fished a spring-fed pond that was absolutely beautiful. Not good with sizes, but I would guess it was at least an acre. It should have been chocked full of largemouth bass. However, there didn't seem to be many in there at all. I walked around the pond and managed to catch about 7. My friend said there wasn't very good bass fishing in that pond. The biggest bass I caught was probably 12"s and most were thin with several being pancake thin. So, if the fish are this thin and finding it hard to find food, then I am thinking I caught most of them as I would assume they were going to go for most any offering and I threw top water, crankbait and rubber worm. All techniques produced fish with the rubber worm being most consistent. This pond is also loaded with channel catfish in all sizes. We fed them dog food and bread in the evening and there fish from .5 lb on up to about 6 lbs. I was surprised as there seemed to be a LOT of them. Easily, 50 or 60. The thing that I did clearly notice about this pond was there were no small fish. It had some mature bluegill, but not a whole lot. I didn't see any small bass or fry. I also, did not see any crayfish or frogs. So, I am thinking there is not enough food for the amount of fish(especially catfish) in the pond. The pond is about 15 feet deep and has good shoreline structure with some good big boulders and rocks. What could be done to improve the fishing in this pond. I know they do use the copper-sulfate to control the algae. Also, they keep the edge very clean and mowed so not a lot of insects get into the water either. Any thoughts on how the bass popluation in this pond could be improved?


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## Salmonid (Apr 14, 2004)

Critter, yes, it sounds like your assumptions are correct. If there are 50 - 5 lb channels in there, that is 250 lbs of predatory eating machines not even counting the bass in there. so lets break it down, suppose each 5 lb catfish eats only 10 lbs of minnows/baby bluegills a year then that breaks down to the pond having to support 500 lbs of baitfish a year!! That should quickly tell you that the bigger channels need to be thinned out! 

Feeding dogfood will help support the cats but would need to be done at a 2 times a day level all through the feeding months and then they will only poach baitfish durring the late fall and winter months so that would help. 

Last thing is that baitfish need good places to hide to get to adult size, rocks are not the best types of habitat, I would suggest putting in ceder trees or some sort of structure that allows baitfish to hide in. 

Id look at stocking some adult bluegills (6-8") to star tthe spawning process and giv ethem a boost, stocking now wouldnt help much since the gills spawning season is about over but early in the spring is when I would do it. 

Adding minnows/golden shiners woud be expensive but may be a good boost to get everyone through the winter.

Immediately, thin the biggest cats, release the bass and breeder sized gills and try to get the cats on a normal feeding schedule. I might add that dogfood is just as expensive as Purina Game Fish Chow ( $20 for 50#) but doesnt offer any of the high protien that will help keep the fish healthy. 

Just my .02, Im sure Fishman and Pondfin will chime in there expert advice as well. 

Salmonid

As far as bass goes,


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## crittergitter (Jun 9, 2005)

To clarify there is a (.) in front of the 5. In other words there are 50-60 catfish ranging between 1/2 lb and 6 lbs. In fact, many of them are of the smaller variety. I am guessing that during the spawning periods those catfish are working the beds like a hoover. I don't think it has any carp, but I could be wrong. I am just not seeing much food in this pond at all and no significant weeds. I know it has at least a few white amurs. For one thing, it is not my pond. The 2nd thing is, I don't know if the owners would prefer it to be a nice looking pretty pond over one with creepy crawly frogs and crayfish and such. They swim in it a lot and may not want christmas trees and other such articles of structure submerged. 

I hope to discuss it some with my buddy and see what he thinks. I think the potential for this pond is tremendous!

Here is what I am thinking would be a big boost to this pond if it can be done:

* first thin out some of the catfish; maybe remove approx 12-16.
* add some crayfish; I am thinking about 4 buckets about half full from the nearby creek
* add about 20 lbs of fathead minnows later in the fall(mid October). 
* when iced up add a couple christmas tree beds(tie 3 or 4 together with some heavy rocks/bricks tied to them. Ideally one would be placed on each end of the pond. 

Also, the water in this pond is quite clear as it in a rocky terrain area and has a spring feeding it. I am wondering about adding fertilizer to kind of boost the phytoplankton and such.

Then, if things improve next summer and it shows some young of the year fish, I would leave it be. If not, I would consider stocking it with hybrid bluegill the following spring. I am relatively certain these changes would really help the bass a lot.


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## [email protected] (Dec 22, 2006)

The rule of thumb is an average pond will support 100lbs of predators per acre...I count channel cats as predators along with the bass. Small channels really aren't but they grow very quickly and large channels are definitely fish eaters. For max growth, I like to see the predator population closer to 50lbs per acre in an non pellet fed pond. It sounds like your pond is in need of some heavy predator culling since the catfish population alone is already or is nearing capacity. I'd remove all the bass a couple of anglers could catch this year and at least half of the channel cats.

I'd say go ahead and stock adult bluegill as the weather cools this fall. They'll be ready for spawning next spring and you may get two or three spawns out of them next year. Skip the crawfish and fatheads, the money or energy is better spent towards building the bluegill population. They'd probably just be an expensive snack and getting the correct type of crawfish for a gamefish pond isn't simple. Many types of crawfish can actually be destructive. There are many different types of crawfish and creek crawfish often aren't suited for ponds and lakes.

Feeding pellets will certainly boost the forage population and therefore the predators indirectly. Consider that 2lbs of pellets will grow a pound of forage which at a fraction of the cost of buying forage. The added food will also increase fertility giving a secondary boost the ponds natural food chain. Catfish are pellet hogs so a lot of the feed will go to them if their numbers aren't reduced.

Typically in predator heavy ponds the bluegill that survive will grow very large so there may be some very serious overpopulation issues in the pond described. As Salmonoid said, this particular pond may have low natural fertility and this would lower the rule of thumb values I talked about in the first paragraph.

Structure has limited forage benefits but it does give us fisherman a good spot to cast to so be sure to place withing casting distance from shore in 4-5' water. 

Next summer, try using different sizes of lures, 1/16 ounce roostertails up to big bass lures like large jerkbaits or jigs to see if a certain size class of bass are suffering more than another. It will give you some clues as to what size forage needs the most attention and what size class of bass needs the heaviest culling.


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