# Corona (Live update)



## hatteras1

This site is in real-time, and it's scary

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/


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## DHower08

14,000 deaths from the flu for 2019- 2020 

3,168 from Corona virus. 

People are freaking out because it's something new


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## stormfront

DHower08 said:


> 14,000 deaths from the flu for 2019- 2020
> 
> 3,168 from Corona virus.
> 
> People are freaking out because it's something new


What I'm hearing is that the mortality rate for the flu has been about .5% but for Coronavirus, it's 2.3% and there is no known antibiotic to fight it right now. I'm not in the healthcare field and don't claim to be very knowledgeable about this but from what I'm hearing from those who do work in this field, there is cause for concern right now. Time will tell.


These new super bugs are downright scary in that they morph into new and more dangerous bugs.


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## buckeyebowman

DHower08 said:


> 14,000 deaths from the flu for 2019- 2020
> 
> 3,168 from Corona virus.
> 
> People are freaking out because it's something new


Heard that over 77,000 Americans have died from the flue over the past 3 years! Can't think of the last time that story led the news.

And antibiotics don't fight viral infections, they fight bacterial infections. Remember just a few years ago when we were all going to die from the Ebola virus?! And this is nowhere close to a pandemic. A lot of folks fear mongering out there.


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## stormfront

No fear mongering on this end. However, if those knowledgeable speak of the dangers of this strain, I'll gladly listen. As said, I'm not nor have ever been in the healthcare field but when it comes to getting an understanding of a medical issue, I'll seek info from a doc or scientist.

That being said, the news outlets are sure going into overload with this. I'm wearing out the mute button on the remote between this subject and politics right now.

And I did use the word 'antibiotic' instead of treatment or vaccine. My bad.


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## Redheads

Not biting.
The media is a big part of this problem........like always


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## stormfront

I do believe that it has the capacity to become a big problem but it is too early in the game to even use the word pandemic.

Buckeyebowman, this will support your argument.....

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/preliminary-in-season-estimates.htm


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## M R DUCKS

https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6


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## M R DUCKS

news interviewed a girl traveling from Italy ( one of the targeted 5)
she got rerouted through Amsterdam... was only asked " did u travel to China or Iran" 
this was asked as she was walking through an airport
system failure !


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## M R DUCKS

The Arnold Classic here in Columbus, goes on, but
No spectators or trade show -except for the finals.
Normally 250,000 people attend. 
Approx. 4000 tickets Sold for the finals, 
....also, still in discussion, so possible changes could still occur


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## jbo

More people dye by the flue however if given the choice I would prefer to catch the flue over the Corona Virus, You ask why? Corona you have a 2.2% chance of dying the flu you have a .5% chance of dying. Lets put this into numbers people understand. With the flue 5 people out of 1000 contracting it will dye, with the Corona Virus 22out of 1000 who contract it will dye. This is what the big deal is and why their trying to keep the cases down and the virus from spreading.


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## hatteras1

The numbers are changing every 30 minutes and 81 areas/countries are listed. The cure is said to be a year to a year and a half away. My girlfriend works in a hospital, so i'm taking this one serious.


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## cheezemm2

hatteras1 said:


> The numbers are changing every 30 minutes and 81 areas/countries are listed. The cure is said to be a year to a year and a half away. My girlfriend works in a hospital, so i'm taking this one serious.


Yes, healthcare is taking this very seriously...i can attest to that.


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## 1more

Wash your hands with 60% alcohol and fist pump instead of shaking hands... We will get over it just us Common sense..


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## TomC

My wife is an rn, I said should we be worried. Nope more people die from the flu. The media is blowing this out of proportion, and should be leaving the medical advice to the medical professionals. When the Gov says be worried, then things will change for us.


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## DHower08

Don't forget everyone this is an election year. The "other side" is all about getting that free health care for EVERYONE at the expense of the middle class. What better way to do that than with the aid of a new virus.


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## hatteras1

I posted a link and it's overwhelming if you follow it to the last page. It's not an election thing when it comes from the WHO. 

*WHO Risk Assessment: Global Emergency*
_See full details: *WHO coronavirus updates*_

On January 30, the World Health Organization declared the coronavirus outbreak a Global Public Health Emergency.

For more information from the WHO regarding novel coronavirus: _WHO page on Novel Coronavirus (2019-nCoV)_


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## Fishballz

I know this health "scare" has scared the hell out of the bond right now! Go refinance your house and buy that new 622 Ranger you've been dreaming about 

Sent from my moto g(7) play using Tapatalk


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## hatteras1

This is our conversation from a friend in Brazil. This was today.


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## hatteras1

Think this time it's serious. Hope I'm wrong!!

*The United States now has a total of 124 cases: 76 domestic *and *48 repatriated *(45 from the _Diamond Princess _cruise ship, and 3 from Wuhan, China)*.* Domestic cases by state:
27 in Washington State (including 9 deaths and 1 recovered) 
24 in California (including 2 recovered)
4 in Illinois (including 2 recovered)
3 in Florida
3 in Oregon
2 in Arizona (including 1 recovered)
2 in Georgia
2 in Massachusetts (including 1 recovered)
2 in New York 
2 in Rhode Island
2 in New Hampshire 
1 in North Carolina
1 in Texas
1 in Wisconsin (including 1 recovered)


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## Workingman

People are dying of all kinds of things all the time! I'm not gonna worry one bit about it! Plenty of other stuff I'm trying to not worry about also! Haha, nobody gets out of here alive.


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## capt.scott

jbo said:


> More people dye by the flue however if given the choice I would prefer to catch the flue over the Corona Virus, You ask why? Corona you have a 2.2% chance of dying the flu you have a .5% chance of dying. Lets put this into numbers people understand. With the flue 50 people out of 1000 contracting it will dye, with the Corona Virus 220 out of 1000 who contract it will dye. This is what the big deal is and why their trying to keep the cases down and the virus from spreading.


I think your number are off, based on a 1000 people contracting.


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## threeten

capt.scott said:


> I think your number are off, based on a 1000 people contracting.


That’s more like 25%


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## DHower08

The coronavirus needs to worry about getting me . Not me getting coronavirus


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## Row v. Wade

Heard about guy on a dating site who has the coronavirus wanting to meet a gal with lymes disease. (rimshot)


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## Tbomb55

Deaths outside China now exceed those inside the country for the first time since the start of the outbreak.


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## Tbomb55

"In total, fewer than 500 people have been tested across the country (although the CDC has stopped reporting that number in its summary of the outbreak). As a result, the current “official” case count inside the United States stood at 43 as of this morning (excluding cruise-ship cases). This number is wrong, yet it’s still constantly printed and quoted. In other contexts, we’d call this what it is: a subtle form of misinformation."

https://www.theatlantic.com/technol...any-americans-really-have-coronavirus/607348/


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## hatteras1

Numbers as of 5:30 PM 03/03
92,881 cases- 3,168 deaths- 48,494 recovered.
as of 09:56AM 03/04
94,344 cases- 3,222 deaths- 51,316 recovered
(Link- Live data WHO)
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/


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## BuckeyeFishinNut

This actually worries me very little. Its not like we haven't heard about the next "global pandemic" before. Avian flu, swine flu, Ebola, etc. were all 3rd world disease that got blown out of proportion. We are moving into the spring, and much like other diseases, the spread of this will decline with warmer weather. The media will say that countries finally have it under control, but it will more than likely be the natural order of things and not human intervention. 

It is silly to cancel any event in the United States when so few have actually contracted the disease. I am going to Vegas in May and got a cruise in June, I am not cancelling anything. This seems like a lot of fear mongering by the media.


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## partlyable

DHower08 said:


> The coronavirus needs to worry about getting me . Not me getting coronavirus


Don’t worry it won’t kill you, your young. But it is a serious concern and the newest death rate is 3.4 which is incredibly significant. The major concern is not for you, but if someone over that age of 80 gets it, it’s an 18 percent death rate. 70’s is an 8 percent and 60’s is a 4 percent. Younger than 40 it has killed almost no one. I hope all of the people that are not concerned about it are right and it fizzles our before it gets to our area. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## hatteras1

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/
(as of 12:29PM)
47 new cases in 2 1/2 hours
USA +13 137 total 9 deaths

*Coronavirus Cases:*
94,391
*Deaths:*
3,221
*Recovered:*
51,317


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## fastwater

hatteras1 said:


> https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/
> (as of 12:29PM)
> 47 new cases in 2 1/2 hours
> USA +13 137 total 9 deaths
> 
> *Coronavirus Cases:*
> 94,391
> *Deaths:*
> 3,221
> *Recovered:*
> 51,317


Wasn't one of the deaths in Washington State in their 50's?


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## jamesbalog

jbo said:


> More people dye by the flue however if given the choice I would prefer to catch the flue over the Corona Virus, You ask why? Corona you have a 2.2% chance of dying the flu you have a .5% chance of dying. Lets put this into numbers people understand. With the flue 50 people out of 1000 contracting it will dye, with the Corona Virus 220 out of 1000 who contract it will dye. This is what the big deal is and why their trying to keep the cases down and the virus from spreading.


your math is a bit off. at .5 percent 5 of 1000 people would die of the flu and at 2.2 percent 22 of 1000 would die of the corona virus


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## Stars-n-Stripers

I'm not an alarmist by any means, however I AM being vigilant, washing hands often and taking normal precautions, but I have always done this to avoid colds and flu as well. I read many years ago, for the most part, viruses enter your body through mucus membrane contact. 

Pay attention once to how many times you itch your eyes, or nose, or lick your fingers to turn a page........and then think of everything you've touched prior to that. I go in and out of a lot of retail buildings daily, and am very conscious of everyone that's touched that door handle prior to me. 

I wonder how many folks would be _more_ concerned, if this said Ohio instead of Washington:

Nine people in the United Stated have died from COVID-19, the disease caused by the new coronavirus — all of them in Washington, which has reported 31 cases of the disease. Eight of the deaths were in an area of King County about 20 minutes from downtown Seattle, and one was in neighboring Snohomish County.


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## hatteras1

There were 10 or so cases in Washington State, but i don't have the specifics
(late with my info) see above!!


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## Row v. Wade

I read the summer Olympics are in jeopardy.


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## hatteras1

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/
This is the link. This is real time and use World Health Organization (WHO) for accurate numbers


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## jbo

threeten said:


> That’s more like 25%
> Your right I didn’t add extra 0 when calculating. Should be 22 deaths per 1000 from Coronas At a rate of 2.2%. Thanks for catching error.


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## 1MoreKast

jbo said:


> More people dye by the flue however if given the choice I would prefer to catch the flue over the Corona Virus, You ask why? Corona you have a 2.2% chance of dying the flu you have a .5% chance of dying. Lets put this into numbers people understand. With the flue 50 people out of 1000 contracting it will dye, with the Corona Virus 220 out of 1000 who contract it will dye. This is what the big deal is and why their trying to keep the cases down and the virus from spreading.


Your math is a tick off.


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## jbo

1MoreKast said:


> Your math is a tick off.


Agreed should be


1MoreKast said:


> Your math is a tick off.


Agree should be 5/1000 dying of flue and 22/1000 dying of Corona.


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## jrose

hatteras1 said:


> There were 10 or so cases in Washington State, but i don't have the specifics
> (late with my info) see above!!


I believe the deaths in Washington were from the same place, a retirement/nursing home. These were elderly people with compromised immune systems that fell ill and passed do to the virus. The virus was introduced from a family visitor that was infected and did not know it.


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## STRONGPERSUADER

Some numbers for ya...


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## garhtr

I only worry when Government officials say "don't worry". If it's nothing to be concerned about they normally build it up so they can pretend they saved us all from impending doom. The more it's downplayed by CDC the more concerned I'll become, not to mention---Im in the catch--it and die age range.
Hopefully warmer temps will dissipate the virus and it won't go from human to animal, or animal to human 
Good luck


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## STRONGPERSUADER

hatteras1 said:


> Numbers as of 5:30 PM 03/03
> 92,881 cases- 3,168 deaths- 48,494 recovered.
> as of 09:56AM 03/04
> 94,344 cases- 3,222 deaths- 51,316 recovered
> (Link- Live data WHO)
> https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/


So that’s quite a jump from the end of Jan 2020 numbers I posted. Now that’s pretty scary if I’m reading it right?


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## ress

Wonder if thing can live on products imported from infected manufacturing items? Car parts and such. 

Sent from my LGLS990 using Tapatalk


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## Lil' Rob

Stopping the spread of anything is a monumental task. Think about this...

I had to fly for work this week to a very busy east coast airport. Even at my home airport I see this. How often are the bins cleaned that you put your laptop, shoes, etc. into? How often are they sanitized? Are the chairs at the gates being cleaned where people are constantly touching the armrests. Same question for the seats on the planes. 

I was in the security line flying out on Monday and there was a young woman ahead of me that had every one of her fingers in her mouth, chewing on her fingernails. Think she washed them before touching anything? 

I am currently working at that airport I flew into and see these types of things play out all day long. Every day I am here, I walk past the security checkpoint several times a day. I've been working at this airport, and others, a lot over the last 3-4 years

How about the furniture, etc. in the hotel rooms? The insides of taxi's, Ubers, etc.?

I think about all these things I just typed, then see so many people all over wearing the face masks, and wonder whether they are trying to prevent getting something...or trying to prevent spreading something ! ? 

I am not trying to be an alarmist, or scare people more than they might be already. This is just an observation from my experience each and every week I travel for work...which is most of the year. I see it play out all the time, not just during times like we are gong through now.


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## hatteras1

817 new cases since 10:00 am today
USA is 149 total cases (25 are new)


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## Muddy

The US is not testing many people. Therefore the data is not an accurate count of the total number of infected people. There’s probably a lot more than we know. Hopefully it fizzles out as we progress into spring. No one knows if it will run it’s course and dissipate as the flu virus tends to do. It looks like the virus can live outside of the body for 7-9 days.


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## Tbomb55

So a briefing intended to inform the public and keep the public safe is being blocked from the public? That's nice work from the "most transparent administration in history".


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## KaGee

Meanwhile a top cardiac specialist at Cleveland Clinic died last week of the flu.
He wasn't that old. Oh, and he had a flu shot too!

What's the saying? "Never let a good crisis go to waste"?

And did you notice, just like that, the Chinese protests have ended... hmmmm.


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## STRONGPERSUADER

KaGee said:


> Meanwhile a top cardiac specialist at Cleveland Clinic died last week of the flu.
> He wasn't that old. Oh, and he had a flu shot too!
> 
> What's the saying? "Never let a good crisis go to waste"?
> 
> And did you notice, just like that, the Chinese protests have ended... hmmmm.


KaGee, I can never tell if your being sarcastic or not, except when you’re about ready to ban me.  But that very well could be. They were really protesting there for awhile. They probably figure it’s better than running them over with tanks and shooting them on the spot like a few years back. The majority of those infected are in China so.. Terrible. Then it makes you wonder if they sent those people out on travels to spread it. It’s definitely an eye opener now. Someone needs to step up and halt all international travel to the US. To quote a good movie, there’s something rotten in Denmark.


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## Snakecharmer

KaGee said:


> *Meanwhile a top cardiac specialist at Cleveland Clinic died last week of the flu.
> He wasn't that old. Oh, and he had a flu shot too!*
> 
> What's the saying? "Never let a good crisis go to waste"?
> 
> And did you notice, just like that, the Chinese protests have ended... hmmmm.


Source?


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## STRONGPERSUADER

Snakecharmer said:


> Source?


https://www.wkyc.com/mobile/article...uenza/95-3b80e3d4-ff1c-430d-a0e2-962c514f7a46


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## Snakecharmer

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> https://www.wkyc.com/mobile/article...uenza/95-3b80e3d4-ff1c-430d-a0e2-962c514f7a46


Thanks!


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## 1basshunter




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## stormfront

KaGee said:


> Meanwhile a top cardiac specialist at Cleveland Clinic died last week of the flu.
> He wasn't that old. Oh, and he had a flu shot too!
> 
> What's the saying? "Never let a good crisis go to waste"?
> 
> And did you notice, just like that, the Chinese protests have ended... hmmmm.


I take this not as a support of the current crisis but as a statement that the flu bugs continue to morph into heinous monsters and research and treatments cannot keep pace. I shudder to think what these influenzas will be like in 20 or 30 years.

The Chinese government said that they've stonewalled the current outbreak and it's diminishing in occurrence. I doubt much this claim. In fact, I take all claims by all superpowers with a grain of salt, our government included.

Sad about such a gifted physician passing away from complications of the flu. I take this as we are all vulnerable regardless of socio-economic class or profession.

Hopefully Covid-19 will not accelerate and that warm weather will end this outbreak.


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## buckeyebowman

jbo said:


> More people dye by the flue however if given the choice I would prefer to catch the flue over the Corona Virus, You ask why? Corona you have a 2.2% chance of dying the flu you have a .5% chance of dying. Lets put this into numbers people understand. With the flue 50 people out of 1000 contracting it will dye, with the Corona Virus 220 out of 1000 who contract it will dye. This is what the big deal is and why their trying to keep the cases down and the virus from spreading.


Unfortunately, your math is a bit off. I'm surprised no one else caught this, and if someone did I apologize. I skipped some posts to get to the end. One half of one percent of 1000 is 5 not 50. 2.2% of 1000 is 22 not 220.


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## stormfront

buckeyebowman said:


> Unfortunately, your math is a bit off. I'm surprised no one else caught this, and if someone did I apologize. I skipped some posts to get to the end. One half of one percent of 1000 is 5 not 50. 2.2% of 1000 is 22 not 220.


He's been made aware of it numerous times already.


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## Row v. Wade

Everyone's got a guy, I do too. Been told the death toll numbers coming out of China pale in comparison to actual. Delete if I need to factualize this post.


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## MIGHTY

I ordered an expensive pair of boots back in December. They haven’t arrived yet and they’re made in Spokane, Washington.....hopefully they ship them Coronavirus free


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## $diesel$

Once a virus starts, it's stays around, from what i understand. And i understand their are several forms of the covid been around for years.
Our doctors have still not found a way to kill viruses and probably won't any time soon as they've been trying for several years,........ but there may be a new way to fight all viruses.
I saw a news program yesterday that claimed a lab in Wisconsin was able to kill it with some type of light. To me, thats real big news, cuz that finding could step up the research in a totally new way if this light is leathal to all viruses.
Someone will figure out how to weaponize this light and eradicate the viruses, i just hope i'll be around to see it.
Imagine getting a very vicious cold and going to the doc and have it wiped out in a day or so instead of dealing with it for 2 weeks or more.


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## bobk

I don’t understand the thinking of the governor and mayor regarding the Arnold. They claim they will screen/ test people as they get off the planes in Columbus. Why in the world wouldn’t you screen them Before they get on the planes. It’s too late once they have landed. If they are infected when they land now all the other people on the plane are a concern of getting the virus. Ass backwards if you ask me.


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## Redheads

What is the Arnold ?


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## bobk

https://www.nbc4i.com/news/local-news/dewine-ginther-set-press-conference-on-arnold-classic/


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## Tbomb55

California just declared a health emergency.

We are in trouble.


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## cheezemm2

You guys think Japan shut down school for a month just because? Remember, there is no flu vaccine to at least lessen the symptoms. This will put a massive strain on healthcare workers.

I don't think we're all going to die, but the massive economic ripple this could have based on socioeconomic factors is mind boggling.


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## Saugeyefisher

Being someone that takes immune suppressing drugs. It concerns me. But like another poster said. I've always tried to avoid getting sick. Wash my hands frequently,use sleeves to open doorways,avoid other sick people,and other common sence things. 
I went out an bought a little more cold medicine an teyonal then I usually do,only because if my kids get a cold or flu I dont want to not have anything to help relieve them. Or tame there fever. In case there happens to be a shortage on over the counter meds(I havnt noticed a shortage yet). Hopefully this runs its coarse like everything else has.


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## Lewis

There is a female judge in Summit county Ohio who is in quarantine after return from a vacation to Italy.


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## Redheads

bobk said:


> https://www.nbc4i.com/news/local-news/dewine-ginther-set-press-conference-on-arnold-classic/


Thanks

Clearly steroids doesn't stop the virus or they wouldn't have cancelled it


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## ezbite

If you are not concerned you're being foolish IMO


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## snag

The only good thing from all this is the price of gas has dropped a lot around my area, being China is a leading importer of oil and they have about shut down everything less cars on the road now so excess oil on the market now. Our lowest at a sheets is $2:01. But I hope the virus does slow down cause I’m in the high mortality age now , but glad I’m retired now so I don’t have to go out as much and I mainly fish alone .


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Lewis

Disturbing footage...


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## bulafisherman

I work for a fortune 500 company that has plants around the globe,they have banned travel between plants, cancelled the annual company banquet that was to be held this coming weekend, put the company picnic in June on hold. No known cases within the company as of yet. I think we will all be exposed to it at some point, it will run its course. Individual immune systems will determine the outcome of each person. Serious? Without a doubt but... Social media and news outlets have run with it and hyped it up, IAM chosing to enjoy the sun shining and live today as the first day of the rest of my life as I try to do everyday!


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## stormfront

ezbite said:


> If you are not concerned you're being foolish IMO


I absolutely agree. There's no need to overreact or to get caught up in the hype right now but there is no reason why we all shouldn't be aware of the potential risks. Unlike the other ''flues'' that have had a much longer life, Covid-19 is in its' infancy so where it goes is uncertain. If they (whoever they may be) get this under control, it will only be replaced soon enough with an even stronger virus. That seems to be the historical trend over the past few decades.

I still believe that the problem continues to grow in China though they claim otherwise. They have control of their media so only what they want out will get out.


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## Misdirection

There is a very large healthcare technology conference in Florida next week (HIMSS). You would think they would cancel, but they haven't. Some companies have states that they will not be staffing their booths. 

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## M R DUCKS

Redheads said:


> What is the Arnold ?


The Arnold Schwarzenegger Sports Festival.. the official name.
Est. 1989
A multi-sport event
Body building professionals,
Strong man contest
Fitness,
Figure and bikini 
Etc.
250,000 attend
Generates $53,000,000 to local economy

problem arises that people from 80 counties attend this event!


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## Misdirection

Misdirection said:


> There is a very large healthcare technology conference in Florida next week (HIMSS). You would think they would cancel, but they haven't. Some companies have states that they will not be staffing their booths.
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


Someone at HIMSS must have read my post! Conference has been canceled.

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## Dovans

They going to cancel Blue Jackets? How about the Crew? Loads of vendors lost a lot on the cancellation of the trade show at the Arnold.


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## STRONGPERSUADER

Apparently 3 people in Ohio awaiting blood test results for the virus.


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## M R DUCKS

I Understand the argument to cancel other events, and not totally against it
But
These other events don’t have people coming from 80 different countries!?


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## FOWL BRAWL

Tbomb55 said:


> California just declared a health emergency.
> 
> We are in trouble.


In trouble REALLY ????
*Woman shocked to discover plant she’s been watering for 2 years is fake*
*NEWS*

*by: Nexstar Media Wire*

*Posted: Mar 5, 2020 / 12:32 PM EST / Updated: Mar 5, 2020 / 12:32 PM EST*

CALIFORNIA (WTVO) — Caelie Wilkes shared a shocking discovery on Facebook after finding that the plant she’d been taking care of for two years was actually made of plastic.

She wrote: “I’ve had this beautiful succulent for about two years now. I was so proud of this plant. It was full, beautiful coloring, just an overall perfect plant. I had it up in my kitchen window. I had a watering plan for it, if someone else tried to water my succulent I would get so defensive because I just wanted to keep good care of it. I absolutely loved my succulent.”

She realized the plant was fake when she tried to transplant it to a new vase.

“I go to pull it from the original plastic container it was purchased with to learn this plant was fake,” she wrote. “I put so much love into this plant! I washed its leaves. Tried my hardest to keep it looking its best, and it’s completely plastic! How did I not know this? I pull it from the container it’s sitting on Styrofoam with sand glued to the top!”

Wilkes, a 24-year-old stay-at-home mom, concluded by saying, “I feel like these last two years have been a lie.


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## ress

How many likes has she got? Gezzz

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## fastwater

FOWL BRAWL said:


> In trouble REALLY ????
> *Woman shocked to discover plant she’s been watering for 2 years is fake*
> *NEWS*
> 
> *by: Nexstar Media Wire*
> 
> *Posted: Mar 5, 2020 / 12:32 PM EST / Updated: Mar 5, 2020 / 12:32 PM EST*
> 
> CALIFORNIA (WTVO) — Caelie Wilkes shared a shocking discovery on Facebook after finding that the plant she’d been taking care of for two years was actually made of plastic.
> 
> She wrote: “I’ve had this beautiful succulent for about two years now. I was so proud of this plant. It was full, beautiful coloring, just an overall perfect plant. I had it up in my kitchen window. I had a watering plan for it, if someone else tried to water my succulent I would get so defensive because I just wanted to keep good care of it. I absolutely loved my succulent.”
> 
> She realized the plant was fake when she tried to transplant it to a new vase.
> 
> “I go to pull it from the original plastic container it was purchased with to learn this plant was fake,” she wrote. “I put so much love into this plant! I washed its leaves. Tried my hardest to keep it looking its best, and it’s completely plastic! How did I not know this? I pull it from the container it’s sitting on Styrofoam with sand glued to the top!”
> 
> Wilkes, a 24-year-old stay-at-home mom, concluded by saying, “I feel like these last two years have been a lie.


Lol...considering coming from California...why isn't this surprising. She will probably find somebody to sue cause her feelings are hurt.
And will surely get a bill passed in California making it a law to label all fake plants as such so others feelings aren't hurt as well.


----------



## EnonEye

It's a virus, spreads with the wind. How or who can control it? I got groceries yesterday, an Asian lady bagged them and put them in my car, I briefly spoke with her. Today I did my usual chores at the local church where there will be services on Sunday. How many people just got exposed if I was when speaking with the Asian lady? All of her friends are Asian, wouldn't take long to trace back to a sick friend I'm sure. In another example a friend is in a nursing home where the very first time you visit there they tell you the code to get in and out so the staff doesn't have to open the door. Today I checked and they've not changed the code on any of the doors into or out of the place. Just saying what do we do? And it doesn't seem we're doing enough to attempt to mitigate the spread of this killer. Don't know bout the rest of ya but I'm praying.


----------



## MIGHTY

fastwater said:


> Lol...considering coming from California...why isn't this surprising. She will probably find somebody to sue cause her feelings are hurt.
> And will surely get a bill passed in California making it a law to label all fake plants as such so others feelings aren't hurt as well.


 lol I hear ya. California just now declared an emergency? Hopefully now they clean up some of the human feces all over the place out there along with all the random syringes.....


----------



## fastwater

Have had some issues going on lately that has forced me to go to the Doctor. I don't go to the Dr's office on a regular basis. The last time I was at his office(prior to this recent issue) was in 2014.
Just got back from a follow up appt. and all office staff and nurses were wearing face masks. Though I don't live at the Dr's office, I have never seen that before and 3weeks ago,p at my first appt. they were not wearing them. Made me feel naked without one on.
I can tell ya I hit every hand wash location on my way out.


----------



## Saugeyefisher

fastwater said:


> Have had some issues going on lately that has forced me to go to the Doctor. I don't go to the Dr's office on a regular basis. The last time I was at his office(prior to this recent issue) was in 2014.
> Just got back from a follow up appt. and all office staff and nurses were wearing face masks. Though I don't live at the Dr's office, I have never seen that before and 3weeks ago,p at my first appt. they were not wearing them. Made me feel naked without one on.
> I can tell ya I hit every hand wash location on my way out.


I havnt seen this at ohio health yet but it wouldn't suprise me. I've been to the hospital alot more then normal the last couple months,and I'm with you. Lol my hands are dry as can be from washing them so much.... 
Hope all is well with you buddy..


----------



## CoonDawg92

Our family has been doing a little “prepping” in case there is an outbreak in our area and they close schools/businesses, requiring us to stay close to the house for a while. Nothing that we shouldn’t probably have on hand anyway in case of a prolonged power outage or similar.

I agree with those who are saying most of us will likely be exposed at some point and the chips will kind of fall where they will. 

The prepping is more for the social disorder that may occur for a while and not the virus itself. But immune boosting vitamins and hand cleansing items were on the list.


----------



## fastwater

Saugeyefisher said:


> I havnt seen this at ohio health yet but it wouldn't suprise me. I've been to the hospital alot more then normal the last couple months,and I'm with you. Lol my hands are dry as can be from washing them so much....
> *Hope all is well with you buddy*..


Thanks Saugeyefisher!
Got issues goin on with C5-6 in my neck that is affecting nerves,strength and range of motion in my left shoulder/arm/hand.
Headed to an Ortho/Neuro specialist here in a week or so for further testing.


----------



## Tbomb55

As of Thursday afternoon, there have been 209 confirmed cases and 11 deaths in the US.


----------



## Bluewalleye

Tbomb55 said:


> California just declared a health emergency.
> 
> We are in trouble.


They have 1000s of people literally crapping in their streets and 1 older person dies from the virus and now they have a health emergency? That is the most backwards state in the entire country LOL


----------



## Specwar

363,000 people died of obesity last year , and Doritos adds a new flavor to their line up. Just saying!


----------



## Bluewalleye

I just had oral surgery to remove 4 teeth. Not one person was walking around with masks on until they started the surgery. I am not in the least concerned about this virus. If you are a healthy person with no issues with your lungs, then the chances of someone dying of this is very slim. It attacks the lungs and older people or people with lung problems are the ones who should be more conscious of it.


----------



## BuckeyeFishin07

Specwar said:


> 363,000 people died of obesity last year , and Doritos adds a new flavor to their line up. Just saying!


Hey now I am obese! What is the new flavor by the way? LMAO


----------



## JamesF

Washing your hands is a good practice. Remember to use a moisturizer, dry, cracked skin, can lead to open sores. Or easily have skin tears. I used to wash my hands at work so often that I was having issues with tears, cuts, and fissures deep enough to have my doctor warning me to ease up. I told him Super glue works great. The other issue at work was, a few guys that claimed that they don't get sick  are freakin dumb ass liars 
Both had little snot lickers running around their house. Their excuses were same thing every time. "My sinuses are acting up". . After one nasty outbreak, I wasn't the only one to call them out. One was just ignorant, the other, a self proclaimed pro fisherman  and pro-every thing! He was very indignant about his abilities, and threatened to do bodily harm ! Called him on that one in front of a handful of guys.  He just sat there like a two year old, which BTW, was the cause of the crud that kept going around. He wouldn't talk to us for about three weeks .


----------



## 1more

I am more concerned about my 401K than I am catching the carona virus.


----------



## KaGee

California had a health emergency long before Corona was cool.


----------



## $diesel$

This stuff IS getting kind of scary. I just ordered 50 new filter sets for my 3M masks. I'm going to have a hard time getting the ole lady to wear one, but i will win that one. I also am going to H/F tomorrow to stock up on my nitrile gloves.
I've never even thought of something like this before.
I guess i feel it's better to be safe than sorry.


----------



## 1more

Don’t live in a bubble,
It will pass its course!


----------



## CoonDawg92

401k will come back after the corona virus spreads far enough and exposes enough people in the US for everyone to realize its not the end of life as we know it. Earnings will be down for multinationals and supply chains will take a while to re-establish continuity, but I believe far more money has come out of the market in panic than a dip in earnings will justify.


----------



## CoonDawg92

Hey Diesel, I bought a few boxes of nitrile gloves also. Not exactly sure why I would need them yet.


----------



## Saugeyefisher

CoonDawg92 said:


> Hey Diesel, I bought a few boxes of nitrile gloves also. Not exactly sure why I would need them yet.


There great for grilling/smoking... toss a pair over a pair of semi thick cotton cloves.


----------



## bobberbucket

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## $diesel$

CoonDawg92 said:


> Hey Diesel, I bought a few boxes of nitrile gloves also. Not exactly sure why I would need them yet.


Good deal. I figure when this virus gets worse, we're not gonna be able to get the stuff or pay exorbant prices for them.
I use the gloves in my shop every day as well as the mask, so nothing will go to waste either way, brother.


----------



## 9Left

cheezemm2 said:


> Yes, healthcare is taking this very seriously...i can attest to that.


Pfffft!! I'm working right now…Sitting here at the nurses station ... Yes Of course there's always some level of concern with a virus… But just wash your damn hands and use your common sense… Because according to the stupid media ...this is going to wipe out the world just like H1N1, and Ebola, and the Zika virus, and the bird flu, and the swine flu, and anthrax, and west nile …just wash your hands people…


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Hell, my immune system is pretty much screwed but I’m not worried about the virus itself. The more the media tries to portray this as the “end all” people can easily become really crazy and people do stupid things when they get really crazy and paranoid. I think our best bet right now is just to heighten our awareness a little bit IMO. What’s going on around you, you know? I refuse to live in a bubble.


----------



## KaGee




----------



## Row v. Wade

1more said:


> I am more concerned about my 401K than I am catching the carona virus.


Dow 29950, short of a lifetime. I missed that one. Still eyeballing a short position.


----------



## hatteras1

My mom is in her 80's and my stepdad, 90's. That's my concern. As for me, i'll probably get hit by a train, or a flying Asian carp will knock me unconscious, and i'll drown.. 
I'm concerned about family more than anything


----------



## Specwar

Media driven panic, nothing more, nothing less.


----------



## Redheads

We somehow survived Y2K, this will be no different.


----------



## chardoncrestliner

Back after 9-1-1 the federal government poured billions into fire, police and local health districts to develop plans because of the possibility of future terrorist attacks including biological agents such as weaponized anthrax and smallpox. There was panic back then. I do know that local Emergency Services (because I was a Director) set up Terrorism Task Forces. One component of this was for local Health Districts to create plans for these types of events. And they tested them on a yearly basis and plans are updated on a yearly basis. Therefore, those plans along with the ability of a local Health District Commissioner to require a quarantine, if necessary should bode well for those Counties that have kept these plans and groups up to date and conversing on their role. Each County has a Disease Surveillance Coordinator who I am sure is daily gathering data from doctors, nursing homes, hospitals, medical treatment centers and others to not only track a potential coronavirus event but also the flu and other events such as communicable diseases As with any event, people should have at least a two week supply of food and water. Not for this event, but for any type of event because on a national scale and disaster/emergency situation may overtax the state and federal government for a time. It's all about common sense.


----------



## c. j. stone

CoonDawg92 said:


> Earnings will be down for multinationals and supply chains will take a while to re-establish continuity.


I'm a mite concerned abt buying Sping fishing lures in bubble wrap(from my "fave general mercantile") made in the Orient(as everything there seems to be)! You might be opening up "more" than a poorly painted package of jigs!


----------



## CoonDawg92

Agree with FW, we should be able to keep a civil discussion about a relevant public health issue going on here.

Don’t take the troll bait!


----------



## Saugeyefisher

Guys always have to get political. And I dont get it. No one here is changing any minds on what party to vote for. Speaking up on a fishing message board about politics is pointless.
I havnt seen anyone on here panicking or putting themselfs in bubbles. 
An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of.............


----------



## bobk

CoonDawg92 said:


> Agree with FW, we should be able to keep a civil discussion about a relevant public health issue going on here.
> 
> Don’t take the troll bait!


I agree and my post wasn’t to open a can of worms or get the thread locked. I at times can’t control my fingers. It was his second attempt to turn the thread political so I started typing. There is no need for politics in these threads but he is acting childish and ignoring the tos for ogf.


----------



## bobk

Saugeyefisher said:


> Guys always have to get political. And I dont get it. No one here is changing any minds on what party to vote for. Speaking up on a fishing message board about politics is pointless.
> I havnt seen anyone on here panicking or putting themselfs in bubbles.
> An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of.............


Seeds?


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

This is concerning. Apparently a lot of our meds including most antibiotics are made in China. Why? For pennies on the dollar of course. It’s not like they lead the world in drug producing tech. Another thing I didn’t realize is that hospitals get 30-60% of their revenue through meds administered. Not only is this trying to be a big scare, it’s big business also.


----------



## cheezemm2

While the virus is concerning, I'd still be more worried about the economic fallout. If I was closer to retirement and still heavily invested in stocks, I'd be angry! 

Companies closing down non-essential domestic air travel should tell you something. I'm hoping common sense solutions and weather shut this thing down soon so we can get back to normal.

Interesting China article:
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...hina-cautiously-returns-to-work-idUSKBN20T1LE


----------



## bobk

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> This is concerning. Apparently a lot of our meds including most antibiotics are made in China. Why? For pennies on the dollar of course. It’s not like they lead the world in drug producing tech. Another thing I didn’t realize is that hospitals get 30-60% of their revenue through meds administered. Not only is this trying to be a big scare, it’s big business also.


Last night I saw that China has leveled off on new cases. (If we can believe what they say.) Maybe it’s slowing down over there. I could be wrong on my numbers but I think I recall like 70-80% of the meds are made there.


----------



## garhtr

9Left said:


> But just wash your damn hands and use your common sense…


 Good idea, also turn off your television and go fishing, never picked up any germs out on the river 
Good luck and good fishing


----------



## jrose

Lewis said:


> Disturbing footage...


Bummer! Another reason not to go to Iran!


----------



## hatteras1

Latest as of 11:57AM


----------



## KaGee

*Warning.... any more political contributions will find the poster on the outside looking in.*

Thank you to those who have been contributing with on-topic dialog. Much appreciated.


----------



## jrose

I just listen to a guy who has the coronavirus who is Corentine in Omaha,Nebraska. He was on one of the cruise ships. His only symptoms was a high fever and a dry cough, no nausea, sniffling or aches and pains. He told the interviewer that he thought that this “epidemic “ has been blow way out of proportion. He stated that the effects of the virus where minimal compared to the flu that he has had in the past. He also stated a high fever is probably the only predictable symptom that he noticed.


----------



## UNCLEMIKE

Wash your hands, after fishing as well. Years ago a red raised patch appeared on the end of my nose several days after fishing lake Erie. I ignored it for a long while. Finally went to a skin doctor. He said it was a fungus I picked up off a fish. Cured in days with an antifungal prescription cream.


----------



## stormfront

UNCLEMIKE said:


> Wash your hands, after fishing as well. Years ago a red raised patch appeared on the end of my nose several days after fishing lake Erie. I ignored it for a long while. Finally went to a skin doctor. He said it was a fungus I picked up off a fish. Cured in days with an antifungal prescription cream.


I talked with a guy who contracted Giardiasis, (Beaver Fever) while fishing. He had a tough go of it for a while. Lost some weight and was pretty sick until it was diagnosed. Doc thought he may have contracted it through a small, open cut. This is why I no longer wet wade.

I'm a Cold War era baby so we grew up with threats and fears. After a while I realized that there will always be threats and learned to deal with the threats seriously but not to give up on living. Most threats pass but it's always wise to be prepared.

It seems these days that drama and conflict are our national pastime. Too often opinions and facts are confused with each other. Too often we are all guilty of fighting or defending an opinion without knowing the facts or accepting them. Politics, sports, entertainment, and all that we are involved in. It only gets worse as time moves on. I guarantee that those of ''The Greatest Generation'' would have a hard time recognizing what we've become.

This virus is real but to what extent it will affect us cannot be determined this early. They say that it will reappear again this fall. As for me, I'll go into my garden and go fishing. I've not enough years left to fret it too much.

''An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure''.

And sorry for the long rant.


----------



## M R DUCKS

Cases reported in Indiana and Pennsylvania today
NCAA basketball game spectators being banned


----------



## JamesF

Giardia is present in waters that mammals defecate in. Unless there is some form of current, the fecal matter basically stews into a biological bacteria. Nasty stuff.


----------



## Muddy

Giardia can be picked up in free flowing water as well as stagnant water. I picked it up one summer while living in the Rockies and drinking treated creek water for the entire summer. I drank from cold high mountain streams and treated it with Iodine. It tore me up for awhile until I got to a doctor.


----------



## crappie4me

i had Chinese for dinner tonight...pretty tasty


----------



## ICENUT

Switch to Bud or Micholob then wont have to worry


----------



## $diesel$

I see a lot of wasted words rather than any panic.
I'm sorry if i don't work in an office building where i can jump up and wash my hands every 2 minutes.
I don't see any panic in trying to protect ones self or ones family, only prudence.
I also hope none of you "DON'T PANIC" guys, don't get sick as well as your families and friends.


----------



## cement569

every flu season I prepare the same way, when I go shopping I go early in the morning, I don't touch door handles, when I pump gas I wear gloves. when I get home I wash my hands several times and I avoid crowds. I also take an old amish remedy I make at home, its elderberry syrup and they swear by it. it builds your immune system, my wife and I have been taking it for 4 years and so far no flu.....knock on wood


----------



## buckeyebowman




----------



## KaGee

buckeyebowman said:


>


Mic drop....


----------



## fastwater

...and apparently 'the smarter people' decided things may have been bad enough not to risk having the Arnold Classic...or at least allowing spectators there. And also not allowing some of the athletes there as well.
Think I heard that's a 50 some million $ event.
You can bet the Governor didn't just up and make that decision on his own.


----------



## wildman




----------



## wildman




----------



## wildman




----------



## All Eyes

All of us older folks can relate to the overwhelming number of things that were sure to destroy humanity over the years. The list goes on for days. I'm not up to speed regarding the facts on the Coronavirus, but have a much greater fear of the rippling effects over some stupid tweet from a guy like Kanye West than I do about this virus. We live in a completely unchartered territory these days with social media and everyone's collective mind on display for the world to see and react to. And boy do we have our share of nutbags or what?


----------



## BuckeyeFishinNut

I still find a lot of what is going on hilarious. 2 cases show up in a state with millions of people and they shut down events, schools, offices. I work as a teacher, i always say its the 2nd most diseased environment outside of a hospital. When the flu is going is going around we might have 80 kids out of 500 in a building out of school, almost 20% at certain times. We sanitize the building, use Clorox wipes in the rooms, etc but school continues. I haven't gotten the flu in 8 years and never get the flu shot (its a scam btw, only protecting you from 3-4 strains out of thousands.) Its been even longer since I got the stomach flu and a few years since I got the common cold. My wife says they need to find a way to bottle and sell my immunity. How do you get immunity to things? Your body fights them off, not sitting in a bubble. Hell, when we were kids a bunch of us were sent by our parents to a friends house to get chicken pox so we could get it outta the way. 

For certain groups, I can see why you would want to be cautious, especially if you have a compromised immune system or lung problems. Don't let fear and politically motivated reporting keep you shacked up. Live your life, this "epidemic" shall pass too.


----------



## ress

To each his own.


----------



## fastwater

BuckeyeFishinNut said:


> I still find a lot of what is going on hilarious. 2 cases show up in a state with millions of people and they shut down events, schools, offices. I work as a teacher, i always say its the 2nd most diseased environment outside of a hospital. When the flu is going is going around we might have 80 kids out of 500 in a building out of school, almost 20% at certain times. We sanitize the building, use Clorox wipes in the rooms, etc but school continues. I haven't gotten the flu in 8 years and never get the flu shot (its a scam btw, only protecting you from 3-4 strains out of thousands.) Its been even longer since I got the stomach flu and a few years since I got the common cold. My wife says they need to find a way to bottle and sell my immunity. How do you get immunity to things? Your body fights them off, not sitting in a bubble. *Hell, when we were kids a bunch of us were sent by our parents to a friends house to get chicken pox so we could get it outta the way. *
> 
> For certain groups, I can see why you would want to be cautious, especially if you have a compromised immune system or lung problems. Don't let fear and politically motivated reporting keep you shacked up. Live your life, this "epidemic" shall pass too.


Shooeee....good thing leprosy wasn't around when you was a kid.


----------



## Tbomb55

*** Anyone else??? ***
K


----------



## ress

^^ That's funny


----------



## TomC

So more people this year have died from the flu. Every other year theres some new killer plague or disease that's going to to wipe out everyone. I dont know bout you all but, I wont be concerned for a long while, and the news needs to stop reporting and scaring everyone.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER




----------



## fishless

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> View attachment 345513
> View attachment 345513


Well said


----------



## Dovans

We sold out of hand sanitizer today..This was at noon...


----------



## wildman

BuckeyeFishinNut said:


> I still find a lot of what is going on hilarious. 2 cases show up in a state with millions of people and they shut down events, schools, offices. I work as a teacher, i always say its the 2nd most diseased environment outside of a hospital. When the flu is going is going around we might have 80 kids out of 500 in a building out of school, almost 20% at certain times. We sanitize the building, use Clorox wipes in the rooms, etc but school continues. I haven't gotten the flu in 8 years and never get the flu shot (its a scam btw, only protecting you from 3-4 strains out of thousands.) Its been even longer since I got the stomach flu and a few years since I got the common cold. My wife says they need to find a way to bottle and sell my immunity. How do you get immunity to things? Your body fights them off, not sitting in a bubble. Hell, when we were kids a bunch of us were sent by our parents to a friends house to get chicken pox so we could get it outta the way.
> 
> For certain groups, I can see why you would want to be cautious, especially if you have a compromised immune system or lung problems. Don't let fear and politically motivated reporting keep you shacked up. Live your life, this "epidemic" shall pass too.



There you go worried and talking about yourself. My worry is for my friends parents. Old people's lives matter too.

I've been watching this virus for over 8 weeks+
I watched the small talk start. I watched 65 million quarantined in China during their New year's. I watched Russia close 2300 miles of border. I've watched the virus expand to where it's at now. 

There are many out there and I would include you in it that think the world revolves around them and the US. They want to think that the media is politically pushing this virus because Trump is the president. It's about the economy.. every year there's something to be scared about yada yada yada. I don't think the largest industrial city in Italy close down for any of those reasons. I don't think the schools closed for those reasons either. I don't think China quarantine 65 billion people during their New year's because of President Trump. 

There's obviously a bit more to this thing than many want to let on. There's little known and It has mutated. 

It has an RO of 2.7 give or take a little and the death rate varies.

There's many reasons why the Spanish flu killed a lot of people. war being part of it but when the Spanish Flu originally hit it killed lots of elderly. The next year it came back and it attacked healthy people one fear that this virus carries because they don't know about it. I think the government will handle this problem well but it is a little spookier than anything else we've had to deal with.

I'm not attacking you personally there's just a lot of people that are overly panicked and in this particular case was a lot of people that are under playing it.


----------



## cement569

I just follow my precautions I posted earlier, I will not let this virus dictate my lifestyle. the media is blowing this thing up that's how they make their money. my saying has always been......if you don't face your fears head on, plan on living your whole life in fear


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

wildman said:


> There you go worried and talking about yourself. My worry is for my friends parents. Old people's lives matter too.
> 
> I've been watching this virus for over 8 weeks+
> I watched the small talk start. I watched 65 million quarantined in China during their New year's. I watched Russia close 2300 miles of border. I've watched the virus expand to where it's at now.
> 
> There are many out there and I would include you in it that think the world revolves around them and the US. They want to think that the media is politically pushing this virus because Trump is the president. It's about the economy.. every year there's something to be scared about yada yada yada. I don't think the largest industrial city in Italy close down for any of those reasons. I don't think the schools closed for those reasons either. I don't think China quarantine 65 billion people during their New year's because of President Trump.
> 
> There's obviously a bit more to this thing than many want to let on. There's little known and It has mutated.
> 
> It has an RO of 2.7 give or take a little and the death rate varies.
> 
> There's many reasons why the Spanish flu killed a lot of people. war being part of it but when the Spanish Flu originally hit it killed lots of elderly. The next year it came back and it attacked healthy people one fear that this virus carries because they don't know about it. I think the government will handle this problem well but it is a little spookier than anything else we've had to deal with.
> 
> I'm not attacking you personally there's just a lot of people that are overly panicked and in this particular case was a lot of people that are under playing it.


Let’s make sure we get our flu shots too boys n girls.
Overall, the CDC estimates that in the US, 12,000 and 61,000 deaths annually since 2010 can be blamed on the flu. Globally, the World Health Organization (WHO) estimates that the flu kills 290,000 to 650,000 people per year. 

Meanwhile... 
As of February 23, 14 COVID-19 (Corona virus) cases had been diagnosed in the following six states: Arizona (one case), California (eight), Illinois (two), Massachusetts (one), Washington (one), and Wisconsin (one). Twelve of these 14 cases were related to travel to China, and two cases occurred through person-to-person transmission to close household contacts of a person with confirmed COVID-19. An additional 39 cases were reported among repatriated U.S. citizens, residents, and their families returning from Hubei province, China (three), and from the Diamond Princess cruise ship that was docked in Yokohama, Japan (36). Thus, there have been 53 cases within the United States. No deaths have been reported in the United States.


----------



## cement569

im not sold on flu shots, my sister in law got hers in nov. a week before xmas she came down with the flu so bad she missed a week of work


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

cement569 said:


> im not sold on flu shots, my sister in law got hers in nov. a week before xmas she came down with the flu so bad she missed a week of work


Yea I get it. It don’t work for everyone. I must say I’ve been taking it for the last 5yrs only because I have to and I haven’t had the flu since knock on wood. I would get it bad every year prior.


----------



## Muddy

No flu shots for me. I got the shots when I had a family member battling cancer. They requested every family member to do so because our family member had a compromised immune system due to cancer treatments. I got the flu every year that I got a flu shot. I never got a flu shot again, and I rarely get sick. Flu shots don’t work for my body.


----------



## wildman

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Let’s make sure we get our flu shots too boys n girls.
> Overall, the CDC estimates that in the US, 12,000 and 61,000 deaths annually since 2010 can be blamed on the flu. Globally, the World Health Organization (WHO) estimates that the flu kills 290,000 to 650,000 people per year.
> 
> Meanwhile...
> As of February 23, 14 COVID-19 (Corona virus) cases had been diagnosed in the following six states: Arizona (one case), California (eight), Illinois (two), Massachusetts (one), Washington (one), and Wisconsin (one). Twelve of these 14 cases were related to travel to China, and two cases occurred through person-to-person transmission to close household contacts of a person with confirmed COVID-19. An additional 39 cases were reported among repatriated U.S. citizens, residents, and their families returning from Hubei province, China (three), and from the Diamond Princess cruise ship that was docked in Yokohama, Japan (36). Thus, there have been 53 cases within the United States. No deaths have been reported in the United States.



You're off on your #'s and info. As of March 7th


----------



## cement569

my wife and I just take a shot of elderberry syrup every morning and for 4 years during flu season we have been lucky. you can buy it in some stores but I make my own, tastes pretty good and I asked some of my amish friends about it and they said that remedy has been around for years and yes they all use it. it is a immune system booster


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

wildman said:


> You're off on your #'s and info. As of March 7th
> View attachment 345571


Well as stated, that was as of Feb 23rd. I was just comparing the current growth rate.


----------



## wildman

As of now we a approaching 400 cases with 17 deaths. 
Yesterday there were 255 cases. It's spreading and it's not going anywhere.

Hopefully my friends and family won't have any ill effects from it.


----------



## wildman

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Well as stated, that was as of Feb 23rd. I was just comparing the current growth rate.


My response to your comparison..


----------



## CoonDawg92

My wife had been taking the elderberry and now the kids and I are taking it.

she was adamant to get the kind (gummies) with “extract”. They also have zinc and vitamin c for good measure.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Are our numbers considered epidemic or are the media outlets overstating? Not trying to be smart, I’m asking because I don’t know.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

wildman said:


> My response to your comparison..
> 
> View attachment 345575


I get what you’re saying... but you’re Trying to solve your equation without all of the factors as of yet. In laymen’s terms that’s called jumping the gun... putting the cart before the horse. We’ll discuss it in 13 months and we’ll see where we are at. Let’s not get confused here.


----------



## wildman

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> I get what you’re saying... but you’re Trying to solve your equation without all of the factors as of yet. In laymen’s terms that’s called jumping the gun... putting the cart before the horse. We’ll discuss it in 13 months and we’ll see where we are at. Let’s not get confused here.


I hope I'm incorrect/wrong/jumped the gun.


----------



## mas5588

First off, what's the "goal" of the media and news networks? Seriously.















It's to make money. How do they make money? Eyeballs. How do they get eyeballs? SENSATIONALISM!

Per the CDC, 18 total confirmed cases via person to person in the US (i.e. not travel related). There are 330M ppl in the US. So far this pandemic has spread to .000000045% ofthe population. If you include all suspected cases it's higher, sure. But still a tiny % of the pop. Will it continue growing? Probably. Does it have a LONG way to go? Absolutely. Head of WHO expects it to burn out around May time frame. That's a lot of people to get it when we're still averaging only a handful per day. CDC graph actually shows it slowing.

But, we add to that, many repatriated ppl are "at home recovering with few symptoms". Is it more deadly than the flu? Sure. Still 97%ish survive. Compromised immune system? Be more cautious, but you also need to be worried about the flu which as we all know is much more common.

Wash your hands, keep you phalanges out of your eyes, nose and mouth.

I'm sure I'll be proven wrong and I'll get it and turn into a Corona Zombie and miss out on all the Zombie apocalypse fun.


----------



## Specwar

As soon as the government figures a way to tax the virus it will no longer be a threat, kinda like tobacco and stuff.


----------



## buckeyebowman

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Are our numbers considered epidemic or are the media outlets overstating? Not trying to be smart, I’m asking because I don’t know.


Your list of everything that was going to kill us from 2000 to 2020 reminded me of the Michael Crichton novel _State of Fear. _In it, he explored how governments, and others, use fear as a method to exert a certain degree of control over the populace. The protagonist has a conversation with a college professor who teaches a course in "The Ecology of Thought". I know this was modeled after a real person, because I read some of the guys stuff. Absolutely brilliant, and an unconventional thinker. Wish I could remember his name. 

Just like someone earlier quote a political type. "It's a shame to waist a good emergency." 



mas5588 said:


> First off, what's the "goal" of the media and news networks? Seriously.
> It's to make money. How do they make money? Eyeballs. How do they get eyeballs? SENSATIONALISM!
> 
> Per the CDC, 18 total confirmed cases via person to person in the US (i.e. not travel related). There are 330M ppl in the US. So far this pandemic has spread to .000000045% ofthe population. If you include all suspected cases it's higher, sure. But still a tiny % of the pop. Will it continue growing? Probably. Does it have a LONG way to go? Absolutely. Head of WHO expects it to burn out around May time frame. That's a lot of people to get it when we're still averaging only a handful per day. CDC graph actually shows it slowing.
> 
> But, we add to that, many repatriated ppl are "at home recovering with few symptoms". Is it more deadly than the flu? Sure. Still 97%ish survive. Compromised immune system? Be more cautious, but you also need to be worried about the flu which as we all know is much more common.
> 
> Wash your hands, keep you phalanges out of your eyes, nose and mouth.
> 
> I'm sure I'll be proven wrong and I'll get it and turn into a Corona Zombie and miss out on all the Zombie apocalypse fun.


And you don't have to look very far to find it. What's your local weather program called? Storm Team? Storm Tracker? Why not Sunshine Team or Blue Sky Tracker? No drama! 

I can understand the government taking precautions, but shutting down multi-million dollar events with little evidence to support the action, strikes me as panic. I did notice the USA Women's Gymnastic Finals on TV today, and the stands were full!


----------



## fastwater

buckeyebowman said:


> ....I can understand the government taking precautions, but *shutting down multi-million dollar events with little evidence to support the action, strikes me as panic.* I did notice the USA Women's Gymnastic Finals on TV today, and the stands were full!


The womens gymnastic finals was a single ticket event allowing ticket holder to attend that specific event only...those were allowed. Versus a general admission ticket(not allowed)which would have allowed the ticket holder to go from one event to another at will. Which if that person was infected, could obviously expose the virus to everyone in multiple event arenas rather than in just one specific arena.
I wish I was prevy enough to have the inside scoop/knowledge to make the statement that they either panicked or didn't as far as shutting the Arnold down. Obviously I don't.
And if I were the governor, guess I would just have to do...most likely what Governor Dewine probably did(he's not a Doctor either)...and with great regret, follow the advice of the Chief Medical advisors around me. 
https://www.centredaily.com/news/business/health-care/article240915686.html

Lastly, while there may be alterior motives/agendas out there to induce panic(especially with the huge mass media machine) I cannot see one alterior motive/agenda that there would be for the Chief Medical Director of Ohio to advise not to have $50+ million event such as the Arnold unless there were enough medical evidence for the strong possibility of increasing the spread of the virus versus having it the way they did.


----------



## 1basshunter




----------



## Snakecharmer

19 USA deaths...


----------



## fastwater

1basshunter said:


> View attachment 345619


Thanks for the reminder on the clock change BH.
Can't be late at 0600 in the mornin to rub elbows with the sniffle'n, snotty nosed public...many of which will most likely be from out of state...possibly outside the country and should be at the Arnold but they're not cause they can't get in.


----------



## bobk

fastwater said:


> Thanks for the reminder on the clock change BH.
> Can't be late at 0600 in the mornin to rub elbows with the sniffle'n, snotty nosed public...many of which will most likely be from out of state...possibly outside the country and should be at the Arnold but they're not cause they can't get in.


You have plenty of time to make a sign and post it at the entrance. “Closed due to the beer virus.” You’ll be home by 0700.


----------



## Big Chief

Beliefs are to each their own. For me I’m flying to Vegas Monday for 5 days and ain’t worried a bit.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Big Chief said:


> Beliefs are to each their own. For me I’m flying to Vegas Monday for 5 days and ain’t worried a bit.


Wear gloves when handling those dirty chips...Good luck.


----------



## fastwater

bobk said:


> You have plenty of time to make a sign and post it at the entrance. “Closed due to the beer virus.” You’ll be home by 0700.


NO CAN DO mi amigo.
Gotta keep that job.
Property taxes due ....and we all know what happens if they don't get paid.


----------



## jbo

Big Chief said:


> Beliefs are to each their own. For me I’m flying to Vegas Monday for 5 days and ain’t worried a bit.


Going to Seattle Tuesday then to Vancouver. Didn’t realize Chinese population is 47% in Vancouver. In Seattle the Asian population is very big also. Good time to go because tourist is way down so the Cities aren’t real crowded rt now.


----------



## 1more

Enjoy your vacation!


----------



## M R DUCKS

Initial thought on cancellation: I’m guessing ( analysis)- basketball games, Gymnastics, football, soccer... 
Majority of people are local or state to state ( USA had few cases)
The Arnold has (had) people coming from *80 different* *countries*. 
Things have changed, in a very short time...more cases, more states. NOW we are seeing other events, as listed above, being cancelled or restricted to attendance.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

This is an example of what I was talking about earlier. A perfect setup for stupid, paranoid, people to start saying and doing crazy things. Now this is something that should heighten our awareness. Not just the virus itself imo.

A top Iranian military official is spreading a conspiracy theory regarding the coronavirus amid an outbreak in the Islamic republic that has killed more than 100 people, including an adviser to Iran’s supreme leader, and infected more than 3,500, according to official figures.
Hossein Salami, the commander of Iran’s Islamic Revolutionary Guards Corps (IRGC), suggested on March 5 that the coronavirus might be a U.S. biological weapon.
“Today, the country is engaged in a biological battle,” Salami was quoted as saying by the semiofficial ISNA news agency. “We will prevail in the fight against this virus, which might be the product of an American biological [attack], which first spread in China and then to the rest of the world,” he said, adding that “America should know that if it has done so, it will return to itself.”


----------



## jbo

1more said:


> Enjoy your vacation!


Thanks 1more.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Just got this text, seems like a lot are trying to cash in on this virus. Too funny.


----------



## JamesF

jbo said:


> Going to Seattle Tuesday then to Vancouver. Didn’t realize Chinese population is 47% in Vancouver. In Seattle the Asian population is very big also. Good time to go because tourist is way down so the Cities aren’t real crowded rt now.


The Asian population is very big in most Canadian big cities.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Italy just went from 233 to 366 in deaths overnight....


----------



## jbo

JamesF said:


> The Asian population is very big in most Canadian big cities.


A couple years ago to a trip by boat Across Lake Erie up the Detroit river and ended trip in Lake Michigan. I was surprised by the the amount of US Marshals patrolling the Rive. I ask them why such a high presence, they relied alit of Chinese try to sneak in the US by crooning the Detroit River thru Canada.


----------



## KaGee

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Just got this text, seems like a lot are trying to cash in on this virus. Too funny.
> View attachment 345663


To think there are those who fall for these scams. They walk among us.


----------



## JamesF

The entire planet is just chock full of idiot's. The sad part is, you don't have to go too far to run into one of them. Went to I hop in North Canton for a pick up order. Worst place to go, but that's what everyone wanted. The girl seating people was definitely sick! Runny nose and all. Maybe just a cold, but she sneezed, didn't cover up, and grabbed the menu's. The people turned and walked out! Didn't say a word. She looked shocked, I told her about what she did, there isn't a cure for stupidity!


----------



## fastwater

jbo said:


> A couple years ago to a trip by boat Across Lake Erie up the Detroit river and ended trip in Lake Michigan. I was surprised by the the amount of US Marshals patrolling the Rive. I ask them why such a high presence, they relied alit of Chinese try to sneak in the US by crooning the Detroit River thru Canada.


...and those are just the ones in uniform you saw. Too, the presence of Homeland Security, both visible...and not, is large there as well.


----------



## SICKOFIT

Snakecharmer said:


> 19 USA deaths...


Wife & I were scheduled for a 10 day land & sea cruisetour to Alaska in early May on the Princess ship that is quarantined of the coast of San Francisco with 21 infected crew and passengers. Broke our hearts but we decided to not take any chances and we cancelled the trip today


----------



## bobk

SICKOFIT said:


> Wife & I were scheduled for a 10 day land & sea cruisetour to Alaska in early May on the Princess ship that is quarantined of the coast of San Francisco with 21 infected crew and passengers. Broke our hearts but we decided to not take any chances and we cancelled the trip today


That stinks! Sorry to hear that. We are supposed to go to Alaska as well. As of now we are still planning to go. It’s not a cruise this time. I’d have to say , if we were doing a cruise again I’d probably cancel the trip.


----------



## jbo

SICKOFIT said:


> Wife & I were scheduled for a 10 day land & sea cruisetour to Alaska in early May on the Princess ship that is quarantined of the coast of San Francisco with 21 infected crew and passengers. Broke our hearts but we decided to not take any chances and we cancelled the trip today


----------



## jbo

I hate to hear your cancellation, but it was a good call. You have a really good chance of getting sick on a ship .


----------



## All Eyes




----------



## yonderfishin

DHower08 said:


> 14,000 deaths from the flu for 2019- 2020
> 
> 3,168 from Corona virus.
> 
> People are freaking out because it's something new



14,000 deaths from the flu for 2019-2020...…. but the flu has been circulating the world a very long time , this new virus …..new to even China where it was until recently isolated , is just now within the past few months spilling out into the rest of the world. There is not enough data yet to compare it to the flu. Percentages are far from complete. So rather than comparing the flu deaths with the coronavirus deaths , if we want to see a better picture of what this virus means to the world , we should be adding the two together until there is enough data for an accurate comparison. That's a total of 17,168 and counting.

Since people with this virus reportedly can be contagious and actively spreading it to others like two weeks before they know they have it , I have serious doubts they will be able to successfully contain it. How many people can a person have contact with in two weeks ? Potentially hundreds or even thousands. And that's just one person.


----------



## stormfront

.


----------



## KaGee

stormfront said:


> Scam? Hoax? The virus is real. It's been morphing for a long time. The incidence level is low so it's hard to say which way it will go. That's a given. I talked with a healthcare provider this weekend and was told that the alarming issue is the mortality rate. The flu that is ravaging the population right now has a mortality rate of .5% This new bug is at 4% in this country right now. There is nothing wrong with being vigilant and updated. If it passes with minimal effects then those who feel the need to claim 'scam' will have their chance and the rest of us will go on with our lives.
> 
> Right now I'll put my stock in the doctors and scientists who are more knowledgeable about this than any of us.
> 
> Fwiw, I didn't prepare for Y2K or Ebola either nor did I buy duct tape in the event of chemical warfare as Tom Ridge said to do.


I suggest you actually go back and read what I was commenting about before getting your panties in a bunch.


----------



## stormfront

My apologies and my bad. I didn't notice that your comment was a reply to another comment. 
'


----------



## PapawSmith

SICKOFIT said:


> Wife & I were scheduled for a 10 day land & sea cruisetour to Alaska in early May on the Princess ship that is quarantined of the coast of San Francisco with 21 infected crew and passengers. Broke our hearts but we decided to not take any chances and we cancelled the trip today


My wife and I had a cruise in Alaska scheduled in July and, given the recent cruise problems (I’m not getting locked on a boat or anything else, ever), were about to cancel as well and then Friday my wife got an email from the cruise lines that allows cancel up to 48 hours prior to departure. They apply 100% of your funds toward another cruise thru fall of 2023, so they don’t actually refund your monies, but for them to offer a deal like this shows how this virus scare is impacting their industry.


----------



## DHower08

Here's the deal. No one's getting out of here alive any ways. Don't live in fear, if we did no one would ever do anything fun. Wash your hands drink some beer you'll be fine


----------



## Deadeyedeek

DHower08 said:


> Here's the deal. No one's getting out of here alive any ways. Don't live in fear, if we did no one would ever do anything fun. Wash your hands drink some beer you'll be fine


Your right Hower, and its too early to get frieked out anyhow, we have been through this before and will happen again, dont live in fear and use common sence and lets see where it goes..oh ya try not to listen to the Media, they will make you think the worlds coming to an end..the fish cant get it, so go fishing and enjoy yourself..DD


----------



## cheezemm2

Corona correction is here, inverted yield curve, oil bottoming out...If you have cash, it will be time to buy before long.


----------



## $diesel$

^^^
The Dow was down over 2000 pts. this morning. S&P lost 7% kicking in the 15 minute time-out.
Talk about panicing, i guess the more one has to loose, the more frightened they get in these situations.
This sell-off has more to do with Russia refusing to cut crude production than the virus. They're willing to take the loss just to knock out the fracking industry.
No matter how mean mother nature can be, greedy humans can always be worse.


----------



## Dovans

Its only a loss if you sell..


----------



## hatteras1

ress said:


> Wonder if thing can live on products imported from infected manufacturing items? Car parts and such.
> 
> Sent from my LGLS990 using Tapatalk


*Can coronavirus be spread through the mail or through goods imported from China?*

It’s extremely unlikely. While more needs to be learned about how this particular virus works, coronaviruses typically don't live very long on surfaces, and are very unlikely to survive over a period of days or weeks when an item is being shipped.

"There is no evidence to support transmission of [COVID-19] associated with imported goods and there have not been any cases of [COVID-19] in the United States associated with imported goods," said Dr. Nancy Messonnier, director of the CDC's National Center for Immunization and Respiratory Diseases, during a call with journalists.


----------



## Specwar

That’s what’s in the missles North Korea has been firing. They have a vaccine for it and nobody else does. Yikes!!!!


----------



## cheezemm2

Confirmed in Ohio...


----------



## bobk

cheezemm2 said:


> Confirmed in Ohio...


It was just a matter of time.


----------



## 1basshunter




----------



## buckeyebowman

JamesF said:


> The entire planet is just chock full of idiot's. The sad part is, you don't have to go too far to run into one of them. Went to I hop in North Canton for a pick up order. Worst place to go, but that's what everyone wanted. The girl seating people was definitely sick! Runny nose and all. Maybe just a cold, but she sneezed, didn't cover up, and grabbed the menu's. The people turned and walked out! Didn't say a word. She looked shocked, I told her about what she did, there isn't a cure for stupidity!


Went to a local Italian store today for some carry out. The guy in front of me in line sneezed twice. I backed off 2 steps after the first one! He covered up but sneezed into his hand, not his elbow, and then stepped up and paid in cash! As soon as he was out the door the cashier went to the sink, washed her hands, and then used hand sanitizer! She looked at me and said, "That was not my favorite thing in the world!" I told her that I completely understood. Wasn't mine either. Washed my hands the instant I got home!



cheezemm2 said:


> Confirmed in Ohio...


Yes, 3 people in Cuyahoga Co. All had returned from travel overseas.


----------



## bobk

Only 2 of them were overseas. The other was in DC.


----------



## Snakecharmer

bobk said:


> Only 2 of them were overseas. The other was in DC.


Some would argue, that's a foreign country....


----------



## EnonEye

hatteras1 said:


> *Can coronavirus be spread through the mail or through goods imported from China?*
> 
> It’s extremely unlikely. While more needs to be learned about how this particular virus works, coronaviruses typically don't live very long on surfaces, and are very unlikely to survive over a period of days or weeks when an item is being shipped.
> 
> "There is no evidence to support transmission of [COVID-19] associated with imported goods and there have not been any cases of [COVID-19] in the United States associated with imported goods," said Dr. Nancy Messonnier, director of the CDC's National Center for Immunization and Respiratory Diseases, during a call with journalists.


 well, that definitely does it for all next day delivery orders for me.


----------



## fastwater

The Ohio State University has cancelled all in person classes and lectures until the end of the month.


----------



## JamesF

I'm not living in fear. Just being vigilant. If I go somewhere, I pay attention to those around me, and use the wipes or hand sanitizer if available. Sometimes you see people that appear to have cold like symptoms. I try to avoid them. I feel that I am vulnerable, due to a few health issues. I never liked crowded places to begin with. A


----------



## JamesF

My wife just informed me, that, the cleaning service at her place of employment, also cleans a place called Glass Doors, this company is a hiring consultant. They have people from all around the world coming and going. This is in Green, at Corporate Woods. They have been closed for a week and will be closed longer. She found this out from the cleaning woman. Our son is at a greater risk, due to Asthma. I am also at risk due to being diabetic, and still battling an ongoing problem from being bitten by several Brown Recluse spiders. I have been informed to schedule a visit with my Cardiologist, Endocrinologist, and the Specialist that is currently treating me for the spider bites. I recieved two emails and a call from my Primary care provider,before 5:00 pm. My appointments will be the first one on each day. These appointments are just the same as a physical exam, testing my immune response, mostly from the spider's effects. Which has my brachial region and sinuses giving me fits. Antibiotics aren't an option for a virus. Ohio State (THE), has canceled personal classes. I really don't need to go anywhere, retired. Just need to take precautions.


----------



## SICKOFIT

bobk said:


> That stinks! Sorry to hear that. We are supposed to go to Alaska as well. As of now we are still planning to go. It’s not a cruise this time. I’d have to say , if we were doing a cruise again I’d probably cancel the trip.


We are still going to go though. We rented a cabin outside of Fairbanks and we be headed up for a two week stay


----------



## stormfront

My wife and I are barking like dogs, 99% sure it's just a cold. I had a procedure done yesterday and while in the OR my wife sat in the lobby, away from others and fighting the urge to cough. She said others in there were hacking too. Reminds me of the Martha Reeves and the Vandellas song, ''No where to run, no where to hide''.


----------



## stormfront

I see the Dow Futures is up almost 1000 points already. Here comes another roller coaster ride. We're not on this ride as we're retired and our money sits in a low risk closet. I'm selfishly glad I'm not in this right now. Be it Covid-19, Crude Oil prices or the possibility of this longest ever Bull Market coming to an end would have me eating BP pills like M&Ms. (Okay, I exaggerate a bit. lol. But it has to be a bit disconcerting for those in their 50s and who still have a way to go).


----------



## bobk

SICKOFIT said:


> We are still going to go though. We rented a cabin outside of Fairbanks and we be headed up for a two week stay


Enjoy the trip!


----------



## $diesel$

I understand that Corona is the same strain as the cold virus. Smells to me, like somebody's genetics department has been up to no good?


----------



## bobberbucket

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## DavidRK

I had West Nile virus back when that was the big scare. Only missed two days of work but I did feel very lethargic for about six months.


----------



## cheezemm2

Italy shuttering the country is a new development...


----------



## turkey hunter

You got lucky with the west Nile then my dad got it and was paralyzed from the waist down. Doing better but no use of his left leg.and years of therapy. And hospital visits still for treatment.been about 6 or 7 years.


----------



## 1basshunter




----------



## 1basshunter




----------



## $diesel$

DavidRK said:


> I had West Nile virus back when that was the big scare. Only missed two days of work but I did feel very lethargic for about six months.


I wouldn't worry about that, David, i've been feeling lethargic for some 50 years or so.


----------



## DavidRK

turkey hunter said:


> You got lucky with the west Nile then my dad got it and was paralyzed from the waist down. Doing better but no use of his left leg.and years of therapy. And hospital visits still for treatment.been about 6 or 7 years.


Sorry to hear about your dad. Yes, it did affect different people in very different ways. There was a local woman my same age who contacted it and ended up on disability. Sadly and ironically she died years later of colon cancer and I am a recent colon cancer survivor.


----------



## Burkcarp1




----------



## Saugeye Tom




----------



## 1basshunter

Good news guys!!!!! 

China has just announced mail order brides are now 75% off


----------



## Jim white

Burkcarp1 said:


> View attachment 346079


Here we go lol just glad Cleveland finally has something to look forward to if they could just get their head out of there as!!!!!. Hey that would be great wouldn't it. Just sayin


----------



## cement569

watched fox 8 news Cleveland this morning, 3 people tested positive for corona. and these newscasters are calling it an outbreak, these morons will do anything for ratings and to get people to keep tuning in......even starting a panic


----------



## Specwar

Dirty Laundry by the Eagles!!


----------



## Flathead76

Face to face classes are suspended at Ohio State, Ohio University, Akron, and the University of Toledo until March 30th. Athens city schools have also cancelled classes.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

Flathead76 said:


> Face to face classes are suspended at Ohio State, Ohio University, Akron, and the University of Toledo until March 30th. Athens city schools have also cancelled classes.


Pure panic


----------



## Dovans

I remember OSU cancelling classes during the blizzard of 78... It was a Party! Holy Cow.. the RA's closed there doors and didnt come out


----------



## Saugeye Tom

Dovans said:


> I remember OSU cancelling classes during the blizzard of 78... It was a Party! Holy Cow.. the RA's closed there doors and didnt come out


That's the only time I remember school closing


----------



## Firelee83

Plain and simple common influenza is way more dangerous. We have a vaccine and it still kills a lot of people. Covid19 is like influenza but less symptoms and lives longer in air. It’s believed many Covid19 cases go unreported due to very minor sniffles. Go living your life we’ll be ok just like after swine flu and sars and all the other fear tactics used in past. For gods sake leave some TP on the shelves for people who actually need it not just to stockpile it. TP shortage really?


----------



## buckeyebowman

bobk said:


> Only 2 of them were overseas. The other was in DC.


Yes, found that out later. However, he was at a "America/Israel Conference" of some sort, so he was probably in the company of foreign nationals.


----------



## jcrevard

Burkcarp1 said:


> View attachment 346079


I'm sure the Buckeye fans would appreciate this one
Go green









Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


----------



## Stryder

DHower08 said:


> 14,000 deaths from the flu for 2019- 2020
> 
> 3,168 from Corona virus.
> 
> People are freaking out because it's something new


Death rate from flu is 0.1%, death rate from COVID-19 is somewhere between 2.5% and 5.0%. So, your chances of catching it are slim at the current time due to the measures which are being taken, but it's 25 to 50 times MORE LETHAL than the flu.


----------



## Burkcarp1

Stryder said:


> Death rate from flu is 0.1%, death rate from COVID-19 is somewhere between 2.5% and 5.0%. So, your chances of catching it are slim at the current time due to the measures which are being taken, but it's 25 to 50 times MORE LETHAL than the flu.


Where are you getting your stats from because that opposite from mine?


----------



## Im2spooky

Saugeye Tom said:


> View attachment 346081


Is there an election in Italy this year, how about Iran,


----------



## David Coleman

Just a quick note: Darwinian theory of natural selection dictates that it will grow less lethal over time. Not undermining the seriousness of the situation but a little optimism never hurt anyone.


----------



## bobk

Saugeye Tom said:


> Pure panic
> View attachment 346119
> View attachment 346121


Dang Tom, now your boat is going to get the beer virus.


----------



## SICKOFIT

bobk said:


> Enjoy the trip!


Thank you. There will be 8 of us so the guys will fish and the women will spend money everywhere. Really looking forward to the trip.Got great airfare on Delta too


----------



## Pooka




----------



## bridgeman

All will be well, calmer heads will prevail. the Berkley-tards in the media are trying to generate mass hysteria


----------



## Shad Rap

Burkcarp1 said:


> Where are you getting your stats from because that opposite from mine?


Liberal news.


----------



## Shad Rap

Stryder said:


> Death rate from flu is 0.1%, death rate from COVID-19 is somewhere between 2.5% and 5.0%. So, your chances of catching it are slim at the current time due to the measures which are being taken, but it's 25 to 50 times MORE LETHAL than the flu.


It's not more lethal than the flu...lol...it just depends on who gets it...you have people overcoming Covid-19 everyday without even knowing it...


----------



## Pooka

Well boys, if you think it is no big deal, go out and getcha some.


----------



## fishmeister

Death rate depends on age. Very low if you are young, higher if you are older. Cases of young people with the virus are under reported because the symptoms are mild. Older, especially with respiratory issues, was about 2.5% a couple of weeks ago. 
But note that those numbers are based largely on reporting from China, so it is tough to tell. 
My opinion only, better to be safe than sorry. But that doesn't mean to be hysterical about it....


----------



## bridgeman




----------



## Saugeye Tom

Im2spooky said:


> Is there an election in Italy this year, how about Iran,


Yes there is elections in iran and Italy...welcome to ogf


----------



## Burkcarp1




----------



## cheezemm2




----------



## Shad Rap

Pooka said:


> Well boys, if you think it is no big deal, go out and getcha some.


Already had it...stuffy nose, slight fever and a cough...lasted about two weeks.
That brings up a point...I saw where you can be injected with Covid-19 and be paid like $4500...so you can be a guinea pig...tempting.


----------



## c. j. stone

Hand sanitizers are not available in grocery or big box stores! Seems "speculators" are buying it all whenever shelves get stocked to resale on internet for 5X retail! At local Giant Eagle yesterday, checkout lady said their last 400 plus bottles were bought by One woman who "bragged" to anyone who would listen that the virus will make her RICH!(Hope she "gets it", and I don't mean rich!)


----------



## Burkcarp1




----------



## Nauti cat

make your own sanitizer alcohol+aleo


----------



## Specwar

Far too many “Chicken Littles” in the world!!!


----------



## bobk

My wife works at a hospital. They have the sanitizer station that are on a floor mount. People are steeling the whole unit. Unbelievable what some people will do. Selfish toolboxes. I hope they get the virus for their evil acts.


----------



## hatteras1

My girlfriend works at a hospital too. People are crazy in their thinking. It won't be long until a fight breaks out and someone dies as a result....


----------



## loomis82

I'll say one thing I've never been a person worried of germs or anything like that, rarely wash hands or anything. Now that my daughter and I both have autoimmune diseases this is scary crap not gonna lie! If we were 100% healthy this wouldn't bother me a bit. Being on humeria we are both have compromised immune systems. So those of you that make a big deal about some people nervous or scared you should think twice about people like my daughter and myself.


----------



## Redheads

For those keeping score

https://www.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6


----------



## mas5588

My previous favorite thread on OGF was the recent 9mm blanks thread. 

I do believe this one beats it.

Sides are being taken, lines drawn....lol heaven forbid someone gets a cold. Anyone under 60 has nothing to worry about other than passing it on to someone with a compromised immune system or some much older. 

If you're north of 60 or 70 the mortality rate is such that you're still much more likely to survive then not. The highest I've seen is the 80-90+ at 15%. However, the mortality rates have to be overstated because many people get it and don't think much of it. 

There is an article on Fox8 about a guy in Portage County that caught it on that first cruise ship and was hospitalized in Japan....BUT, he said it was nothing more than a little cough in the morning and a slight fever. Dude is 60+. Had he not been on that cruise ship and in the midst of all the pandemonium, would anyone have known he had it? 

The denominator is not correct with these mortality rates.

This is so freaking bizarre. I'm looking at super cheap flights to Miami or somewhere with great fishing!


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers




----------



## Shad Rap

mas5588 said:


> My previous favorite thread on OGF was the recent 9mm blanks thread.
> 
> I do believe this one beats it.
> 
> Sides are being taken, lines drawn....lol heaven forbid someone gets a cold. Anyone under 60 has nothing to worry about other than passing it on to someone with a compromised immune system or some much older.
> 
> If you're north of 60 or 70 the mortality rate is such that you're still much more likely to survive then not. The highest I've seen is the 80-90+ at 15%. However, the mortality rates have to be overstated because many people get it and don't think much of it.
> 
> There is an article on Fox8 about a guy in Portage County that caught it on that first cruise ship and was hospitalized in Japan....BUT, he said it was nothing more than a little cough in the morning and a slight fever. Dude is 60+. Had he not been on that cruise ship and in the midst of all the pandemonium, would anyone have known he had it?
> 
> The denominator is not correct with these mortality rates.
> 
> This is so freaking bizarre. I'm looking at super cheap flights to Miami or somewhere with great fishing!


If the airlines don't shut down...lol...just drive I guess.


----------



## KaGee

Pooka said:


> Well boys, if you think it is no big deal, go out and getcha some.


Nice... Wish sickness or death on those who would disagree. Bad form dude.

Meanwhile we are destroying the economy and restricting our rights.


----------



## jrose

Flathead76 said:


> Face to face classes are suspended at Ohio State, Ohio University, Akron, and the University of Toledo until March 30th. Athens city schools have also cancelled classes.


Do they get a refund? Pretty expensive online schools.


----------



## Shad Rap

jrose said:


> Do they get a refund? Pretty expensive online schools.


No...they just do whatever they can online...thats it.


----------



## BuckeyeFishinNut

jrose said:


> Do they get a refund? Pretty expensive online schools.


I was seeing in some articles that these were going to happen after their spring break and they were told to take their belongings with them and not return until they were told to. Room and board isnt cheap either


----------



## Rooster

KaGee said:


> Meanwhile we are destroying the economy and restricting our rights.


I’m not any more worried about Covid-19 than the flu. But, this scares the hell out of me!


----------



## cement569

I have a question, a few days ago fox 8 news reported 3 cases in cuy. county. were their names released? if not, why not? suppose people had contact with them and don know it. something fishy is going on here


----------



## Rooster

I don't think that their names can legally be released (*HIPAA* Privacy Rule)?


----------



## fastwater

^^^Four now.
Latest...just announcedd...male in Stark Co...mid 50's...in Mercy Hosp.
Has not traveled outside US and has no known close contact with anyone that's been out of US but all contacts are currently under further investigation.


----------



## JamesF

I just heard of the guy at Mercy.


----------



## Dovans

shelves were filled this morning... took these at noon. One is lysol wipes, the other is toidy paper


----------



## BuckeyeFishinNut

Humans are such lemmings, really is kinda sad.


----------



## JamesF

BuckeyeFishinNut said:


> Humans are such lemmings, really is kinda sad.


Common sense has gone out the window. My brother just got fired for having the flu and missing work. He's been to the hospital twice, not covid-19,just another nasty flu that has been going around.


----------



## MIGHTY

Anyone have the latest on the peace talks with Afghanistan? No ones talking about it..... I don’t get all the panic/canceling flights/cruises/the Arnold because people from 80 countries attend. What’s the big deal?!? Oh someone might get sick boo hoo... (sarcasm off)


----------



## Snakecharmer

One Lawyer in NYC has spread the virus to 50 people. his family, the guy who took him to the hospital, his law partner, some people at a party he attended.....


----------



## Snakecharmer

MIGHTY said:


> Anyone have the latest on the peace talks with Afghanistan? No ones talking about it..... I don’t get all the panic/canceling flights/cruises/the Arnold because people from 80 countries attend. What’s the big deal?!? Oh someone might get sick boo hoo... (sarcasm off)


See above....What if he attended the Arnold...


----------



## glacier_dropsy

Hysteria helps no one.

If this virus is able to spread to large numbers of vulnerable people in a short period of time, it will overwhelm the healthcare system. I am in favor of efforts trying to limit the spread of the virus in the community at this time. I work in multiple ICUs, a bad flu season can already spread resources pretty thin. This will be a disaster if no measures are taken to prevent rapid spread.


----------



## garhtr

glacier_dropsy said:


> This will be a disaster if no measures are taken to prevent rapid spread.


 What are your suggestions to stop the spread of this virus ?
Good luck !


----------



## MIGHTY

Snakecharmer said:


> See above....What if he attended the Arnold...


 I mentioned the sarcasm..... it’s almost like it’s a good idea to be leery of people coming here.


----------



## TomC

Hey I'm sorta excited I wont have to wait in line at kings island for the front seat this year. Maybe the Lakes will be empty on the weekend too!


----------



## Muddy

glacier_dropsy said:


> Hysteria helps no one.
> 
> If this virus is able to spread to large numbers of vulnerable people in a short period of time, it will overwhelm the healthcare system. I am in favor of efforts trying to limit the spread of the virus in the community at this time. I work in multiple ICUs, a bad flu season can already spread resources pretty thin. This will be a disaster if no measures are taken to prevent rapid spread.


That makes sense to me. The only way to beat a virus is isolation. You have to get ahead of it to beat it with isolation. There’s no time to waste, it might already be too late. I’d rather get ahead of it, even if it doesn’t end up being the pandemic of all pandemics, then get caught with our pants down.


----------



## jbo

Muddy said:


> That makes sense to me. The only way to beat a virus is isolation. You have to get ahead of it to beat it with isolation. There’s no time to waste, it might already be too late. I’d rather get ahead of it, even if it doesn’t end up being the pandemic of all pandemics, then get caught with our pants down.


Agree that’s the point get ahead of it so it doesn’t spread, than people can joke about what a waste of time it is closing everything down, schools the Arnold ect. 
On the other hand People will blame goverment if they ignore it and do nothing and it spreads everywhere.


----------



## FSHNERIE

hatteras1 said:


> This site is in real time, and it's scary
> 
> https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/


Wow....
Unless you live in a second or third world country you will be fine.

If you live in the United States and are 60+ years old , you may have a problem. 
No different then the common flu. Older people are at risk, just like the flu. 

My Daughter is a Doctor, she keeps us up to date on real time.

Relax.

Have a beer.

Stop listening to the liberal media.

Also.....

Oil prices have nothing to do with coronavirus. Ask Russia 

Have a beer.

Coronavirus and Lime disease go together.


----------



## Pooka

fastwater said:


> ^^^Four now.
> Latest...just announcedd...male in Stark Co...mid 50's...in Mercy Hosp.
> Has not traveled outside US and has no known close contact with anyone that's been out of US but all contacts are currently under further investigation.


This is the scary part. We don't yet know what we are dealing with. Might be "nothing", might be a big something. And lets not forget, viruses can mutate rather quickly.

Buying all the toilet paper in a store might be silly but the thought out precautions are certainly warranted. 
Looks like our current admin picked a bad time to gut our pandemic response, don'tcha know. Likely also a bad time for the government to be running huge deficits.


----------



## Pooka

KaGee said:


> Nice... Wish sickness or death on those who would disagree. Bad form dude.
> 
> Meanwhile we are destroying the economy and restricting our rights.


Ah but that is not what I did , now is it? Why would you tell a tale like that?


----------



## Burkcarp1

Pooka said:


> Ah but that is not what I did , now is it? Why would you tell a tale like that?


Yes you did....


----------



## Pooka

Burkcarp1 said:


> Yes you did....


No, I did not.


----------



## Pooka




----------



## tracker_80

loomis82 said:


> I'll say one thing I've never been a person worried of germs or anything like that, rarely wash hands or anything. Now that my daughter and I both have autoimmune diseases this is scary crap not gonna lie! If we were 100% healthy this wouldn't bother me a bit. Being on humeria we are both have compromised immune systems. So those of you that make a big deal about some people nervous or scared you should think twice about people like my daughter and myself.


I am in a similar situation, I'm 32 and was diagnosed with MS a few months ago. Otherwise, pretty healthy and always have been. But, having a suppressed / compromised immune system has been the game changer. Especially with a 2 yr. old and a 3 month old @ home.


----------



## Burkcarp1

Pooka said:


> No, I did not.


Same as. Do you actually think we’re all stupid?


----------



## Specwar

Someone, anyone PLEASE tell me why the hoarding of toilet paper for Christ sake!!!! Does this virus supposedly make you **** yourself to death????
What a bunch of dip dinks!!!!


----------



## Misdirection

The mortality rate here in the US will start to go down due to the fact that more people will start to be tested. Up until now, the only people being tested were by the CDC when there was a strong reason to believe they had contracted the virus; like they were really sick. 

Now your physician can order testing and alot of the commercial and non-profit labs can conduct testing. So many people who were likely positive, but not tested will be.

There is certainly cause for concern as none of us have any immunity at this juncture. But once new infections start to level off like they did in Wuhan, China, we'll be over the worst of it.

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


----------



## Snakecharmer

FSHNERIE said:


> Wow....
> Unless you live in a second or third world country you will be fine.
> 
> If you live in the United States and are 60+ years old , you may have a problem.
> No different then the common flu. Older people are at risk, just like the flu.
> 
> My Daughter is a Doctor, she keeps us up to date on real time.
> 
> Relax.
> 
> Have a beer.
> 
> Stop listening to the liberal media.
> 
> Also.....
> 
> Oil prices have nothing to do with coronavirus. Ask Russia
> 
> Have a beer.
> 
> Coronavirus and Lime disease go together.


I don't think Italy is a 3rd world country.....


----------



## lawrence1

The great pumpkin is going to give us all the skinny on this tonight. Stay tuned.


----------



## mas5588

Snakecharmer said:


> I don't think Italy is a 3rd world country.....


10,000 cases so far in Italy. 600 deaths, or 6%, which is about double the global average. 60.5M ppl in the country. Is 10,000 a lot? Sure. Is 0.165% a lot? Not really.

Additionally, as others is thave stated, that 10,000 number is WAY low. Their lax initial response was a big part of their problem. 

Also, no breakdown by age that I saw at quick glance. Globally the trend is sub-60 youre fine. 60-80, be wary. Over 80, take serious precaution.


----------



## FSHNERIE

Snakecharmer said:


> I don't think Italy is a 3rd world country.....


Correct.

Closer to a second world country. And the land mass is small. if you break Italy down its about the size of California.

Thanks .


----------



## M R DUCKS

Italy 
12464 cases, climbing rapidly


----------



## 1basshunter




----------



## FSHNERIE

M R DUCKS said:


> Italy
> 12464 cases, climbing rapidly


Ok , Ill play.

look at a map of the countries surrounding Italy. Look at their immigration and travel.

Its really not the hard to figure out.

Geography and Government were my favorites.


----------



## loomis82

I'm not old either only 37. I just got diagnosed with Behcet's which is pretty rare and our older daughter is 20 and she has crohns We are both on humeria. People don't realize what autoimmune diseases do unless you have dealt with it first hand or know someone who has one. We look like nothing is wrong but just because you don't see doesnt mean it's not there. She goes to Michigan and she's scared there of this disease


tracker_80 said:


> I am in a similar situation, I'm 32 and was diagnosed with MS a few months ago. Otherwise, pretty healthy and always have been. But, having a suppressed / compromised immune system has been the game changer. Especially with a 2 yr. old and a 3 month old @ home.


----------



## buckeyebowman

FSHNERIE said:


> Correct.
> 
> Closer to a second world country. And the land mass is small. if you break Italy down its about the size of California.
> 
> Thanks .


Exactly. I spent two week there in the 80's. We were at some place outdoors and I needed to use the restroom. Our host pointed me toward a tall set of hedges. Inside those hedges was a mostly flat porcelain plate embedded in the ground with a hole in it. Molded into it were two shoe prints that showed you where you should put your feet, which gave you a chance of hitting the hole in case you were a guy who had to go #2!

Next to it was a stake with a hood to keep the rain off of a roll of the thinnest toilet paper I have ever seen! You could read a newspaper through it! Wash your hands? Yeah, right! Even in places with inside facilities, people don't flush their toilet paper. It goes in the wastebasket! The plumbing can't take it.

Believe me when I tell you. Europe is NOT like the United States!


----------



## JamesF

lawrence1 said:


> The great pumpkin is going to give us all the skinny on this tonight. Stay tuned.


I love it! "The great pumpkin "!


----------



## Pooka

Burkcarp1 said:


> Same as. Do you actually think we’re all stupid?


I reckon some folks read what they want to hear.


----------



## JamesF

And the flushable wipes, don't break down fast enough, causing sewage drains to clog. Saw that on the news, a four to six foot sewer pipe with a huge turd. I'm not hungry anymore.


----------



## Burkcarp1

Pooka said:


> I reckon some folks read what they want to hear.


Maybe you could explain what you meant?? For us dumb people. Please?


----------



## Pooka

tracker_80 said:


> I am in a similar situation, I'm 32 and was diagnosed with MS a few months ago. Otherwise, pretty healthy and always have been. But, having a suppressed / compromised immune system has been the game changer. Especially with a 2 yr. old and a 3 month old @ home.


Wait until they start school. There was a time when I had one in elementary, one in Jr High, and one in High, if it was going around anywhere, they brought it home and I caught it.


----------



## Pooka

Burkcarp1 said:


> Maybe you could explain what you meant?? For us dumb people. Please?


I meant exactly what I said, and nothing more.


----------



## jbo

Specwar said:


> Someone, anyone PLEASE tell me why the hoarding of toilet paper for Christ sake!!!! Does this virus supposedly make you **** yourself to death????
> What a bunch of dip dinks!!!!


Toilet paper is in need in mass quantities, 1 persons sneezes and 4 people shiz themselves,,,


----------



## jbo

jbo said:


> Toilet paper is in need in mass quantities, 1 persons sneezes and 4 people shiz themselves,,,


----------



## Burkcarp1

Pooka said:


> I meant exactly what I said, and nothing more.


Umm ok..


----------



## Snakecharmer

mas5588 said:


> 10,000 cases so far in Italy. 600 deaths, or 6%, which is about double the global average. 60.5M ppl in the country. Is 10,000 a lot? Sure. Is 0.165% a lot? Not really.
> 
> Additionally, as others is thave stated, that 10,000 number is WAY low. Their lax initial response was a big part of their problem.
> 
> Also, no breakdown by age that I saw at quick glance. Globally the trend is sub-60 youre fine. 60-80, be wary. Over 80, take serious precaution.


Sounds like having HBP and the virus really increases the chance of death.


----------



## ezbite

It's hit my home town....

https://www.wfmj.com/story/41883042...XMPZ64psArwEwbEA6_H9afa1UhNqQwipNO1mO2coGLeRs


----------



## DHower08

ezbite said:


> It's hit my home town....
> 
> https://www.wfmj.com/story/41883042...XMPZ64psArwEwbEA6_H9afa1UhNqQwipNO1mO2coGLeRs


The only place to hide from it is on the lake . Better hook up the boat


----------



## jbo

I’m in Seattle tourism down by min 50%, nice for us much bad on the people depending on it. Went to Pike Place a famous market on 7 floors normally packed elbo to elbo. Instead of 1000s of people in a day maybe hundreds. I talked to a fish bender asking if the market will be shut down, he said for now the City is leaving it open cause it is being self regulated from people staying away. He said with being so few people they are separated by several feet so like if someone sneezes your not trapped in the spray.


----------



## Pooka

DHower08 said:


> The only place to hide from it is on the lake . Better hook up the boat


And when the fish police show up you just start coughing and mentioning your recent trip to China.


----------



## Pooka

Can't find any masks to buy?? Your wife has you covered!

Not sure why that does not show. It does show in the edit post box.

Anywho, it is a man with a maxipad stuck to his face.


----------



## KaGee

Walmart in Fremont about 6 PM tonight. Picture shot by a friend of mine.


----------



## 9Left

bobk said:


> My wife works at a hospital. They have the sanitizer station that are on a floor mount. People are steeling the whole unit. Unbelievable what some people will do. Selfish toolboxes. I hope they get the virus for their evil acts.


Ha!! That's funny you mention it Bob… The hospital I work at has removed every hand sanitizer station at the entryways and at the elevators so they don't get stolen ... silly isnt it?


----------



## fastwater

KaGee said:


> Walmart in Fremont about 6 PM tonight. Picture shot by a friend of mine.
> 
> View attachment 346415


On the bright side...Dope dealers in the hood have stopped dealin oxy's and fentanyl and are now dealin Charmin.


----------



## Im2spooky

NBA just suspended season due to Utah player testing positive for coronavirus, they would not flush billions away if this was not serious, people down paying this and not preparing for this pandemic will be sorry, you might survive but by the time this is all said and done everyone will know someone who didn't survive this.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> KaGee, I can never tell if your being sarcastic or not, except when you’re about ready to ban me.  But that very well could be. They were really protesting there for awhile. They probably figure it’s better than running them over with tanks and shooting them on the spot like a few years back. The majority of those infected are in China so.. Terrible. Then it makes you wonder if they sent those people out on travels to spread it. It’s definitely an eye opener now. Someone needs to step up and halt all international travel to the US. To quote a good movie, there’s something rotten in Denmark.


Well I see my POTUS stopped all travel coming from Europe. Hell
To The Yea!


----------



## hatteras1

I read where Tom Hanks and his wife were tested positive. They're currently in Australia


----------



## UNCLEMIKE

ezbite said:


> It's hit my home town....
> 
> https://www.wfmj.com/story/41883042...XMPZ64psArwEwbEA6_H9afa1UhNqQwipNO1mO2coGLeRs


I am a cancer patient getting treatment at St. joes. Was there last Friday. Due to go back next month for a CT scan. May cancel that depending on how widespread this gets in our area. With my past chemo and being 64 years old I don't like my odds if I get this bug.


----------



## Bluewalleye

Im2spooky said:


> NBA just suspended season due to Utah player testing positive for coronavirus, they would not flush billions away if this was not serious, people down paying this and not preparing for this pandemic will be sorry, you might survive but by the time this is all said and done everyone will know someone who didn't survive this.


That is a way over reaction. And not even close to what the truth will be. Their is coming a day when true tribulation will be all over the earth. But this isn't it.


----------



## Im2spooky

Bluewalleye said:


> That is a way over reaction. And not even close to what the truth will be. Their is coming a day when true tribulation will be all over the earth. But this isn't it.


Can you will me your fishing stuff


----------



## Bluewalleye

Im2spooky said:


> Can you will me your fishing stuff


NOPE it will just go to waste if you have it. I am going fishing tomorrow and going to live life. I am guessing that you're just going to stay all locked up in your humble abode for the for seeable future.


----------



## cheezemm2

I hope everyone is right because I don't want people to die. Predictions of 50 million people getting sick and 10%-20% requiring hospital care would be a major strain on our roughly 1 million hospital beds, which as has been said are largely occupied because of other illness. Slowing the spread is a smart move to not overwhelm the facilities. That's why you're seeing these reactions, the capacity isn't there if this took off exponentially.


----------



## fishingful

Walmart in chardon 5pm
Saw a guy with 30 lbs of rice.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER




----------



## Im2spooky




----------



## JamesF

Let's allow cooler heads to prevail. I stocked up some. But the consensus is, the incubation period being two weeks, a lot of people can be infected and not know it.


----------



## thistubesforu

Trouble is we live in a me first world!! To take and run with something Mike Gundy said I’m a man I’m 40 if I get corona I’ll survive!! Well that’s great for you but what about your parents probably in there 60’s?? Oh wait are grandparents around most likely in their 80’s?? Yea seems cool right you get it infect your loved ones and they die?? Isn’t even about my loved ones but everyone else’s as well. Doesn’t seem very legit to me but I guess even though I am a heartless bastard I still care about the welfare of all humans. I see no problem with trying to slow the progress of this pandemic and not overwhelm the hospitals or urgent care facilities.


----------



## fastwater

Well said thistubesforu.

Many will be keyboard comando's laughing and joking about all this all the while cussing about the 'over reactions' of the preventative, inconvenient restrictions such as crowded events being canceled...until it hits close to home.


----------



## Snakecharmer

NBA suspended season. Rudy Gobert tested positive.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nb...sitive-for-coronavirus/ar-BB114mFQ?li=BBnb7Kz


----------



## Snakecharmer

Tom Hanks and wife too..

https://www.msn.com/en-us/movies/ce...e-for-coronavirus/ar-BB114bBX?ocid=spartandhp


----------



## 1more

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> View attachment 346423


And now we are going to run out of paper towels!


----------



## bobberbucket

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## bobk

9Left said:


> Ha!! That's funny you mention it Bob… The hospital I work at has removed every hand sanitizer station at the entryways and at the elevators so they don't get stolen ... silly isnt it?


Silly and sad. The hospital chose to not keep putting more stations out since they keep stealing them. This is the environment my wife now gets to work in.


----------



## bobk

UNCLEMIKE said:


> I am a cancer patient getting treatment at St. joes. Was there last Friday. Due to go back next month for a CT scan. May cancel that depending on how widespread this gets in our area. With my past chemo and being 64 years old I don't like my odds if I get this bug.


I wish you well Mike.


----------



## $diesel$

This is not a political fight, gentlemen. Can we throw politics out the window for a momement?
All this is going to do is get the post shut down. I don't want this to happen as some of our guys wives are nurses and such, and their information can be valuable. Some of our guys on here are nurses, techs, and other such healthcare workers with good advice.
We have this viral problem, that no matter how you feel about, some people need to vent about it. Call it fear or cowardess or what ever else you tuff guys call it, some of us are taking these precautions seriously.
I'm 63 and have high blood pressure. I know, this is not a death notice for me, but it does give me cause for concern. And i will stay vigilant and take precautions that I deem necessary no matter what you call me or who you want to blame for it.
But i do promise not to buy all the T/P.


----------



## Pop B

hatteras1 said:


> This site is in real time, and it's scary
> 
> https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/


More people get the flue


----------



## Specwar

No where have I read or heard what medical practices or procedures are used to treat the virus. Just the continued info on how many have been infected thus far.
I am 69 and in good health and am not overly concerned for myself, however I do care about my family and fellow man. Just want that to be clear.


----------



## UNCLEMIKE

bobk said:


> I wish you well Mike.


Thanks Bob! All of us may be impacted in some way over time. I have a sister and two step daughters that work in hospitals, as well as my wife. Hospitals are the front line in this fight. My prayers to all the healthcare workers. Sure hope it does not get out of hand.


----------



## CoonDawg92

The nursing home in Avon my mother is in just implemented a no visitation policy last night (except for emergency type situations). I went and had lunch with her yesterday as I figured this would be coming. 

I think its probably the right time for the restrictions to happen for senior facilities as we will soon be at the point where many of us could be carriers and not know it yet.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

UNCLEMIKE said:


> I am a cancer patient getting treatment at St. joes. Was there last Friday. Due to go back next month for a CT scan. May cancel that depending on how widespread this gets in our area. With my past chemo and being 64 years old I don't like my odds if I get this bug.


You hang in there bud. Same boat here. My oncologist tells me if I get the flu I will need to be hospitalized. I pray your CT goes well. My next one is next month also. With me I don’t know what’s worse. Risking the center for the scan or the anxiety or worry of not knowing where I’m at by not having the scan done. Hopefully by the time we are suppose to get them , they will have some sort of handle on it or it will have ran most of its course. Stay strong brother.


----------



## Lewis

I find absolutely no humor at all with this virus.
I too am age 63 with HBP, wife has COPD and my mother age 95 lives in our home.
Lots of folks comparing the CV to the flu, saying the flu kills way more people.
True...so far, but:
Even if only 4% of the US population gets the virus, and even if only 1% of those die, that's 130,000 lives lost, which is over double what the flu kills each year. (and the actual mortality rate so far is at least double, possibly triple the 1% used in this example)

Bump that up to a mere 15% of the population getting the virus with a 1% death rate, and you are at a half a million Americans dead!!! No joking matter.
It could get much, much worse if this spreads to 50% of the population!

These are just facts, not predictions.


----------



## bobberbucket

Infected NBA player ignorantly slapping all those microphones 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## johnboy111711

https://medium.com/@tomaspueyo/coronavirus-act-today-or-people-will-die-f4d3d9cd99ca

Very insightful article I found. I know many of you are on the fence, but this is a real issue. If you only take one thing away from this, please consider social distancing yourself. Stop the spread. The real killer of this will be a lack of medical resources.


----------



## johnboy111711

watch the first few minutes, stay longer if you please...


----------



## Saugeye Tom

On the lighter side...
View attachment 346511


----------



## AmericanEagle

johnboy111711 said:


> https://medium.com/@tomaspueyo/coronavirus-act-today-or-people-will-die-f4d3d9cd99ca
> 
> Very insightful article I found. I know many of you are on the fence, but this is a real issue. If you only take one thing away from this, please consider social distancing yourself. Stop the spread. The real killer of this will be a lack of medical resources.


This article gave me a better understanding of what is involved. Thanks for posting!


----------



## LEfriend

R


Lewis said:


> I find absolutely no humor at all with this virus.
> I too am age 63 with HBP, wife has COPD and my mother age 95 lives in our home.
> Lots of folks comparing the CV to the flu, saying the flu kills way more people.
> True...so far, but:
> Even if only 4% of the US population gets the virus, and even if only 1% of those die, that's 130,000 lives lost, which is over double what the flu kills each year. (and the actual mortality rate so far is at least double, possibly triple the 1% used in this example)
> 
> Bump that up to a mere 15% of the population getting the virus with a 1% death rate, and you are at a half a million Americans dead!!! No joking matter.
> It could get much, much worse if this spreads to 50% of the population!
> 
> These are just facts, not predictions.


Well said. I am in risk group too and have daughter in law who administers chemo. Getting the virus is death sentence to many of her patients. And the real problem is when the hospitals fill up with the older high risk folks even the “I’m healthy it’s a hoax rambos” on here are screwed if they have a heart attack or car accident or sudden blood clot because when they go to the hospitals there may be no place to put them nor health care workers to tend to them. Time we took this serious and listened to the health experts who have studied and took paths to keep us safe.


----------



## 1MoreKast

johnboy111711 said:


> https://medium.com/@tomaspueyo/coronavirus-act-today-or-people-will-die-f4d3d9cd99ca
> 
> Very insightful article I found. I know many of you are on the fence, but this is a real issue. If you only take one thing away from this, please consider social distancing yourself. Stop the spread. The real killer of this will be a lack of medical resources.


Insightful indeed - data doesn't lie. The graphs are scary. Showing how exponentially the cases grow but how we can flatten the curve by being proactive.


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## c. j. stone

I haven't read all 18 pages of this but one thing I don't take lightly is the Economic Impact! I live on SS and an annuity I bought when I retired for monthly income and I'm sure there a millions like me(many worse off than me!) In the past TWO WEEKS, my investments have dropped TWENTY PERCENT! If this decline stopped today, the "recovery" in our economy could take "years". Being a senior citizen, I might not have those "years" to wait for it, not to mention, if I contact this virus, "I" won't need it! Had hoped to pass what's left over on to my heirs but at this rate, there won't be anything left!


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## Pooka

Neighbors, as outdoors folks we play with dangerous toys, and we often do it in dangerous places and conditions that many others would be scared of. 
We don't fear, we respect the dangers and know how to weigh the risks, and know how to take a situation seriously while still joking about it. 

We know how this is done. Awareness, knowledge, preparation.


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## johnboy111711

fastwater said:


> Well said thistubesforu.
> 
> Many will be keyboard comando's laughing and joking about all this all the while cussing about the 'over reactions' of the preventative, inconvenient restrictions such as crowded events being canceled...until it hits close to home.


This is correct, BUT it HAS hit home. considering spread rate and the number of people and who could be exposed, I would estimate the number of people in Ohio that are infected to be in the hundreds or possibly over 1,000. With the Cavaliers possibly being infected, this number may be higher.


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## johnboy111711

Pooka said:


> Neighbors, as outdoors folks we play with dangerous toys, and we often do it in dangerous places and conditions that many others would be scared of.
> We don't fear, we respect the dangers and know how to weigh the risks, and know how to take a situation seriously while still joking about it.
> 
> We know how this is done. Awareness, knowledge, preparation.


While I understand your point of view, Weighing the risks is a selfish point of view. You may not be at risk of dying, it is the at risk population that we all have contact with that will suffer the consequences of our actions. 

Also, you are naive with the assumption that "we all know how this is done" People do not understand the severity of this situation and most do not have knowledge or preparation. Do not rely on others for your safety and security. We, as a country have not dealt with a pandemic on our soil since the spanish flu which killed 100's of thousands world wide. I repeat, there is not a protocol in place to stop the spread. The time for being proactive is gone. We can only mitigate the inevitable outcome.


----------



## hatteras1

Latest from WHO,CDC, Ohio Dept of Health.

(The coronavirus COVID-19 is affecting 125 countries and territories around the world and 1 international conveyance (the_ Diamond Princess _cruise ship harbored in Yokohama, Japan).


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## johnboy111711

! person being treated in Warren and the Hospitals understand the severity of the situation. better to be ready when the patients stream in.
https://www.wkbn.com/news/local-news/tents-going-up-outside-er-at-st-es-in-youngstown/


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## bobk

UNCLEMIKE said:


> Thanks Bob! All of us may be impacted in some way over time. I have a sister and two step daughters that work in hospitals, as well as my wife. Hospitals are the front line in this fight. My prayers to all the healthcare workers. Sure hope it does not get out of hand.


Indeed the healthcare workers are a large concern. I worry for my wife. If you get down to the Wayne area this spring for turkey season send me a pm and I’ll see if we can work something out for a hunt at my place. You take care!


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## hatteras1

bobk said:


> Indeed the healthcare workers are a large concern. I worry for my wife. If you get down to the Wayne area this spring for turkey season send me a pm and I’ll see if we can work something out for a hunt at my place. You take care!


My Girlfriend and her daughter both work in hospitals, different ones.


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## Pooka




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## Saugeye Tom

Yes, I worry for my wife too. It will probably be the end for her if she gets it. I spoke with her about a upcoming trip to Florida. She Said: Everyone is gonna die. If god wants me now do it In Florida I'M GOING TO FLORIDA


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## Saugeye Tom

Yes, I worry for my wife too.


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## hatteras1

I worry about my family especially my parents. Myself, I'm not worried about a virus, more afraid of the drive to work!!


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## Pooka

Saugeye Tom said:


> Yes, I worry for my wife too. It will probably be the end for her if she gets it. I spoke with her about a upcoming trip to Florida. She Said: Everyone is gonna die. If god wants me now do it In Florida I'M GOING TO FLORIDA


Last evening my mother's Oncologist and golf buddy phoned her and told her to severely limit her social interactions, no church, no shopping, no eating out, then made a Sunday golf date with her. LOL


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## mas5588

As we move into spring there is really only one question worth answering....


Will this make the lakes & rivers more or less crowded?

Maybe I'll take a canoe out and put a big sign on it that says something about me having the Corona so people will stay away from my spots lol.


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## STRONGPERSUADER

Just a little from the other side of the coin.

From Dr Abdu Sharkawy. 
I'm a doctor and an Infectious Diseases Specialist. I've been at this for more than 20 years seeing sick patients on a daily basis. I have worked in inner city hospitals and in the poorest slums of Africa. HIV-AIDS, Hepatitis,TB, SARS, Measles, Shingles, Whooping cough, Diphtheria...there is little I haven't been exposed to in my profession. And with notable exception of SARS, very little has left me feeling vulnerable, overwhelmed or downright scared. 

I am not scared of Covid-19. I am concerned about the implications of a novel infectious agent that has spread the world over and continues to find new footholds in different soil. I am rightly concerned for the welfare of those who are elderly, in frail health or disenfranchised who stand to suffer mostly, and disproportionately, at the hands of this new scourge. But I am not scared of Covid-19.

What I am scared about is the loss of reason and wave of fear that has induced the masses of society into a spellbinding spiral of panic, stockpiling obscene quantities of anything that could fill a bomb shelter adequately in a post-apocalyptic world. I am scared of the N95 masks that are stolen from hospitals and urgent care clinics where they are actually needed for front line healthcare providers and instead are being donned in airports, malls, and coffee lounges, perpetuating even more fear and suspicion of others. I am scared that our hospitals will be overwhelmed with anyone who thinks they " probably don't have it but may as well get checked out no matter what because you just never know..." and those with heart failure, emphysema, pneumonia and strokes will pay the price for overfilled ER waiting rooms with only so many doctors and nurses to assess. 

I am scared that travel restrictions will become so far reaching that weddings will be canceled, graduations missed and family reunions will not materialize. And well, even that big party called the Olympic Games...that could be kyboshed too. Can you even 
imagine?

I'm scared those same epidemic fears will limit trade, harm partnerships in multiple sectors, business and otherwise and ultimately culminate in a global recession. 

But mostly, I'm scared about what message we are telling our kids when faced with a threat. Instead of reason, rationality, openmindedness and altruism, we are telling them to panic, be fearful, suspicious, reactionary and self-interested.

Covid-19 is nowhere near over. It will be coming to a city, a hospital, a friend, even a family member near you at some point. Expect it. Stop waiting to be surprised further. The fact is the virus itself will not likely do much harm when it arrives. But our own behaviors and "fight for yourself above all else" attitude could prove disastrous. 

I implore you all. Temper fear with reason, panic with patience and uncertainty with education. We have an opportunity to learn a great deal about health hygiene and limiting the spread of innumerable transmissible diseases in our society. Let's meet this challenge together in the best spirit of compassion for others, patience, and above all, an unfailing effort to seek truth, facts and knowledge as opposed to conjecture, speculation and catastrophizing.

Facts not fear. Clean hands. Open hearts.
Our children will thank us for it.

#washurhands #geturflushot #respect #patiencenotpanic


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## Muddy

Good luck to everyone, especially to the older members and those in the health care industry. This is going to be hard in many ways. Do what you can to be ready.


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## Burkcarp1

I totally get it that we should be concerned however This one seemed to be much worst but it wasn’t hyped up as much.


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## hatteras1

Most of the public do not know the facts, but prefer to follow the herd.


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## Pooka

johnboy111711 said:


> While I understand your point of view, Weighing the risks is a selfish point of view. You may not be at risk of dying, it is the at risk population that we all have contact with that will suffer the consequences of our actions.
> 
> Also, you are naive with the assumption that "we all know how this is done" People do not understand the severity of this situation and most do not have knowledge or preparation. Do not rely on others for your safety and security. We, as a country have not dealt with a pandemic on our soil since the spanish flu which killed 100's of thousands world wide. I repeat, there is not a protocol in place to stop the spread. The time for being proactive is gone. We can only mitigate the inevitable outcome.


I am not sure that you did understand. As outdoors folks mitigation is our bread and butter. Engine fires, snakes, weather, waves, hang fires, sketchy boat ramps, .... We do it all the time.

This is indeed a serious situation, I am not making light of it but I am not hiding in a bunker either. I am doing what I can do, educating myself, being more aware, taking reasonable precautions, and then going about my life. Much the same as I have learned to do with my outdoor passions. --And other situations I have found myself in over the many decades.

We do know how to do this, there is reason for concern but no reason to panic (or to ignore), we deal with challenging situations for fun, we can deal with this one too.

More than a couple of us here are children of the cold war, we grew up expecting to be nuked, perhaps we view risks a bit differently than others?


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## Gottagofishn

Wash your hands... I don’t want whatever you have.


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## fastwater

I too have 4 family members that work in hospitals...d-n-l, sister-n-law and two nieces. All 4 working in ER's with 2 working in very major inner city hospitals (Henry Ford-Detroit, Grant-Cols) that see an extremely large amount of patience.
Naturally I'm concerned for much of my immediate, as well as extended family. And concerned for all working in the medical field as well as their extended families.

Have no doubt, like others in the past, this virus too will level off. And we will learn more as time goes on...maybe even come up with a vaccine. But at the rate it is spreading versus the rate we are learning about it...I look for some hard times between now and then. And I just don't think our hospitals will be able to keep up with the influx of patience if we don't do our part in helping to slow it down a bit. Eespecially since these infected patience, regardless of age, have to be quarantined with what seems to be an average time of at least 2wks. And many of those will require breathing machines during their quarantine.
If things kick off real ugly, that's a lot of hospital space and most likely more breathing machines than we have available.

Panic...'lil chicken syndrome'(the sky is falling)???
I don't think so!

Concern...you betcha!
Cause at the extremely rapid rate this virus has proven to spread, and the fact that even middle aged people can become infected, be a carrier and infect everyone they come in contact with, obviously including their own loved ones...just seems like common sense not to be concerned and do everything we can to slow this virus down as much as we can.


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## PapawSmith

johnboy111711 said:


> We, as a country have not dealt with a pandemic on our soil since the spanish flu which killed 100's of thousands world wide. I repeat, there is not a protocol in place to stop the spread. The time for being proactive is gone. We can only mitigate the inevitable outcome.


Actually it killed almost 700,000 in the United States alone and upwards of 50 million worldwide.


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## bridgeman

Humanity has endured plagues that have run rampant through civilizations, in this day and age it's impossible to contain something like this. It'll pass, someone will come up with a vaccine. Gotta be thousands of facilities all over the world working on it.


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## Misdirection

There are some positives out of this. As the market turns bearish, it's a great time to take advantage of doing a Roth conversion. I'm holding out a little longer before I personally pull the trigger.

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## johnboy111711

Pooka said:


> I am not sure that you did understand. As outdoors folks mitigation is our bread and butter. Engine fires, snakes, weather, waves, hang fires, sketchy boat ramps, .... We do it all the time.
> 
> This is indeed a serious situation, I am not making light of it but I am not hiding in a bunker either. I am doing what I can do, educating myself, being more aware, taking reasonable precautions, and then going about my life. Much the same as I have learned to do with my outdoor passions. --And other situations I have found myself in over the many decades.
> 
> We do know how to do this, there is reason for concern but no reason to panic (or to ignore), we deal with challenging situations for fun, we can deal with this one too.
> 
> More than a couple of us here are children of the cold war, we grew up expecting to be nuked, perhaps we view risks a bit differently than others?


I'm with you, it's always the usage of we where clarity is lost. It's the cynic in me, but I just don't have faith in others as much as myself. I'm not a doomsdayer, but i can't nor would i ever want to count on anyone else to be able to handle any drastic situation. The masses just aren't prepared or even taking the seriousness of the matter into account. I am completely with you not panicking, but this is not a situation I want to deal with.



bridgeman said:


> Humanity has endured plagues that have run rampant through civilizations, in this day and age it's impossible to contain something like this. It'll pass, someone will come up with a vaccine. Gotta be thousands of facilities all over the world working on it.


There are developments with treating and vaccinating hourly across the globe, but the reality is, with testing, a mass produced product is still 9-18 months away. We can not count on a medical bail out on this one. People need to be pro-active when dealing with something that could explode at anytime, not deciding where is the cheapest vacation destination and returning to spread the virus.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Misdirection said:


> There are some positives out of this. As the market turns bearish, it's a great time to take advantage of doing a Roth conversion. I'm holding out a little longer before I personally pull the trigger.
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


That's a good idea especially since you heirs need to take the money over 10 years or less now.


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## Misdirection

Snakecharmer said:


> That's a good idea especially since you heirs need to take the money over 10 years or less now.


Or my wife will go from the best tax bracket (married) to the worst (single filer) when I'm gone!

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## Lil' Rob

johnboy111711 said:


> https://medium.com/@tomaspueyo/coronavirus-act-today-or-people-will-die-f4d3d9cd99ca
> 
> Very insightful article I found. I know many of you are on the fence, but this is a real issue. If you only take one thing away from this, please consider social distancing yourself. Stop the spread. The real killer of this will be a lack of medical resources.


Very informative...thanks.


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## Pooka




----------



## bobberbucket

Schools closed Staring Monday 3 weeks minimum. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## cheezemm2

bobberbucket said:


> Schools closed Staring Monday 3 weeks minimum.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I hope people start understanding what's going on. We can't overwhelm the healthcare system...It's for good reason.


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## johnboy111711

https://www.wtol.com/article/news/h...irus/512-f0e3b7de-9fa4-4767-a927-f1ae748a7f59


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## DavidRK

Remember that old Twilight Zone episode "The Monsters Are Do On Maple Street"?


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## Rooster

Fear erodes liberty


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## ress

cement569 said:


> I have a question, a few days ago fox 8 news reported 3 cases in cuy. county. were their names released? if not, why not? suppose people had contact with them and don know it. something fishy is going on here


hippa


----------



## REEL GRIP

bobberbucket said:


> Schools closed Staring Monday 3 weeks minimum.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Mogadore Schools closed today 3 week minimum


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## 1basshunter

cheezemm2 said:


> I hope people start understanding what's going on. We can't overwhelm the healthcare system...It's for good reason.


I work for a big school system in Columbus we knew school was going to be closing at least two weeks ago but we were under a gag order to not spread panic. The school systems are going to be doing A very deep cleaning of the schools and some kids are very sensitive to the chemicals that are going to be used!!!!!!!! And it is mostly To help calm her fears of the general public.


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## mountainbikingrn

Ress you hit the nail on the head. In case anybody wonders what your response means: HIPAA, Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act. Nothing fishy, federal law that is followed by all healthcare facilities across the country!


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## 9Left

Welp… I guess **** is getting real now… My kids school just got closed for an entire month...


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## 1basshunter

cheezemm2 said:


> I hope people start understanding what's going on. We can't overwhelm the healthcare system...It's for good reason.


My wife is a doctor at OSU medical Right now she is in Florida Doing conferences about the pandemic and they were going to have do is called a command and control hospital Osu medical and Cleveland clinic are two of them... I was told that in case a very bad pandemic in central Ohio or Cleveland area they have The ability to use hotels to use as Quarantine hospitals it may seem a little too much to SOME!! But they really need to get a handle on this before it gets out of control and that is what they’re trying to do to the best of their abilities


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## Saugeye Tom

1basshunter said:


> My wife is a doctor at OSU medical Right now she is in Florida Doing conferences about the pandemic and they were going to have do is called a command and control hospital Osu medical and Cleveland clinic are two of them... I was told that in case a very bad pandemic in central Ohio or Cleveland area they have The ability to use hotels to use as Quarantine hospitals it may seem a little too much to SOME!! But they really need to get a handle on this before it gets out of control and that is what they’re trying to do to the best of their abilities


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## hatteras1

ress said:


> hippa


They are quarantined until they are cleared or admitted


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## 1basshunter

Saugeye Tom said:


> View attachment 346567


Tom, I’m not saying what a low death rate it has compared to others but there has to be more to it just my opinion!!! No other Virus has created such a panic than this one that I can think of other than maybe the black plague of Europe. And I wasn’t live Back then to prove it


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## 1basshunter

Now to talk about stupidity my school system is going to have us come in Friday to start doing cleaning deep cleaning and into the weekend. Here is the kicker the kids and staff are coming back Monday And have one full day of school before They let them go for spring break extended break. I think it’s counterproductive to work all weekend and then have them come back to start over again


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## 9Left

1basshunter said:


> Now to talk about stupidity my school system is going to have us come in Friday to start doing cleaning deep cleaning and into the weekend. Here is the kicker the kids and staff are coming back Monday And have one full day of school before They let them go for spring break extended break. I think it’s counterproductive to work all weekend and then have them come back to start over again


You know I think this whole thing is rather overrated… However… I can understand that there is some level of concern due to the lack of knowledge of this virus...So I guess I would rather have them take action now and close all gathering places, like schools, rather than leave them open and have a bunch of pissed off parents with sick kids later on…


----------



## 1basshunter

9Left said:


> You know I think this whole thing is rather overrated… However… I can understand that there is some level of concern due to the lack of knowledge of this virus...So I guess I would rather have them take action now and close all gathering places, like schools, rather than leave them open and have a bunch of pissed off parents with sick kids later on…


 That’s exactly what it is in my opinion also and as you probably know the kids are more of a carrier of this virus then actually being hit hard byit and they’re are ones that mostly pass it on From my understanding and I’m not trying to act like an expert I’m not I’m just going on what my wife Has said and her other coworkers.

I believe they’re doing it to stop the Mass hysteria. Such as buying a lifetime supply of toilet paper for a virus that will quarantine you and your family for about three weeks or so


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## fishless

1basshunter said:


> That’s exactly what it is in my opinion also and as you probably know the kids are more of a carrier of this virus then actually being hit hard byit and they’re are ones that mostly pass it on From my understanding and I’m not trying to act like an expert I’m not I’m just going on what my wife Has said and her other coworkers.
> 
> I believe they’re doing it to stop the Mass hysteria. Such as buying a lifetime supply of toilet paper or a virus that will quarantine you and your family for about three weeks or so


Tuscarwas county schools closing after tomorrow. Draw back is ??? You know where the kids are going ? To my house while mom and dad go to work.You know who is at risk ? My wife and I both over 65 yrs old


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## 1basshunter

Saugeye Tom said:


> View attachment 346567


Tom your numbers are correct on that chart except for one factor the other ones have killed children as well please come up with another chart that will take the child deaths out of the equation!!!!


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## 1basshunter

fishless said:


> Tuscarwas county schools closing after tomorrow. Draw back is ??? You know where the kids are going ? To my house while mom and dad go to work.You know who is at risk ? My wife and I both over 65 yrs old


I was listening to a radio station I believe yesterday and they said that closing schools and closing colleges and then bringing them back together is almost like being on a cruise ship right now... That may very well come true I don’t know and I can’t do anything about it


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## 1basshunter




----------



## UNCLEMIKE

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> You hang in there bud. Same boat here. My oncologist tells me if I get the flu I will need to be hospitalized. I pray your CT goes well. My next one is next month also. With me I don’t know what’s worse. Risking the center for the scan or the anxiety or worry of not knowing where I’m at by not having the scan done. Hopefully by the time we are suppose to get them , they will have some sort of handle on it or it will have ran most of its course. Stay strong brother.


Thank you... You stay strong as well. My mother liked to say "this too shall pass"


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## Redheads

Things have just gone to the next level for me. The news was reporting this evening that some county jails will be releasing inmates because of the virus.......WTF


----------



## buckeyebowman

The hoarders were out in force today! All I needed was a gallon of milk and some paper towels. I went to Aldi's and the place was packed! Oddly enough, I got checked out in record time. It seemed like most other people were stalking the aisles piling their carts to the sky! 

They're closing everything around here. Schools, church groups, library programs, spaghetti and fish dinners.


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## Saugeye Tom

montagc said:


> show us that chart next year at this time...


Yu . Corona will be at the bottom


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## loomis82

This was the store here in Michigan today. Nuts that's all I can say. And yeah we got a ton of stuff too. Why not? Would rather have it then not.


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## MIGHTY

Redheads said:


> Things have just gone to the next level for me. The news was reporting this evening that some county jails will be releasing inmates because of the virus.......WTF


 see earlier posts about election year.


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## Snakecharmer

loomis82 said:


> This was the store here in Michigan today. Nuts that's all I can say. And yeah we got a ton of stuff too. Why not? Would rather have it then not.


Think that Is bad...….Went to Dicks and all the guns and ammo were cleared out...….

LOL.....…...


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## loomis82

I'm glad I have plenty of both snakecharmer!


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## snag

A friend sent me this..










Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## DHower08

Schools are closed starting monday
My son doesn't have school till april after tomorrow


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## Bluewalleye

Hey don't worry people, cause UPS will continue delivering all the packages that you order. And if one of us get the virus, we will spread it like a wild fire. I will sneeze into my hands then touch pkgs without even thinking of it. Or I will pick up a pkg that has been sneezed on and get it that way. UPS drivers meet lots of people all day long and we can get things from others ( I have gotten many colds from having people sign for things with colds ), but don't worry we will do whatever it takes to keep making money. lol


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## glacier_dropsy

This virus will continue to spread. The measures being put into place are trying to slow an inevitable spread. Because slowing the rate of spread could save millions of lives. lol?


----------



## cement569

yes through all this panic and fear I will still be fishing tomorrow, that's something they cant close....yet


----------



## c. j. stone

fishless said:


> Tuscarwas county schools closing after tomorrow. Draw back is ??? You know where the kids are going ? To my house while mom and dad go to work.You know who is at risk ? My wife and I both over 65 yrs old


AMEN!Think we're going to be in that boat, also!


----------



## snag

Read that about the schools closing for at least three weeks in Kentucky and Ohio and Maryland. My grandsons have a extra long spring break few in Ohio and two in Kentucky. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## glacier_dropsy

Good time to take our kids out for some spring fishing for the folks that get a chance. My kids are off the next three weeks starting Monday.


----------



## wildman

If you want some good info on this 

Listen to the Joe Rogan experience podcast with Michael Osterholm. It the newest one I believe.. it's very informative. Just an FYI


----------



## 1basshunter

I was just thinking about that when I go fishing I’ll just put a mask on and tell everyone that you can go ahead and fish next to me at your owe risk Then I will cough


----------



## Bluewalleye

montagc said:


> 1. If you get sick stay home.
> 2. I won’t get sick from touching something contaminated because I wash my dam hands.
> 
> pretty basic stuff.


You can carry the virus for up to 2 weeks without even having any symptoms. So how does that work for your 1st point. And While you may wash your hands, doesn't mean everyone else is going to. How about if the pkg that was delivered gets touched by someone else in your home that doesn't wash their hands so often? I was just told by another driver that he heard that the virus can last on a cardboard box for up to 9 days. I wouldn't be ordering anything over the internet for the next month or 2. Just giving advice. Cause UPS doesn't care about it at all. The bottom line is all they care about. It would take a Presidential decree for UPS to ever care about the health of their employees or the public. Sadly to say


----------



## bobk

wildman said:


> If you want some good info on this
> 
> Listen to the Joe Rogan experience podcast with Michael Osterholm. It the newest one I believe.. it's very informative. Just an FYI


The link is a couple pages back. Very interesting info. I hope the guy is wrong!


----------



## bobk

Bluewalleye said:


> You can carry the virus for up to 2 weeks without even having any symptoms. So how does that work for your 1st point. And While you may wash your hands, doesn't mean everyone else is going to. How about if the pkg that was delivered gets touched by someone else in your home that doesn't wash their hands so often? I was just told by another driver that he heard that the virus can last on a cardboard box for up to 9 days. I wouldn't be ordering anything over the internet for the next month or 2. Just giving advice. Cause UPS doesn't care about it at all. The bottom line is all they care about. It would take a Presidential decree for UPS to ever care about the health of their employees or the public. Sadly to say


I’d be using nitrile gloves all day!


----------



## fastwater

hatteras1 said:


> Most of the public do not know the facts, but prefer to follow the herd.


But the medical professionals know more facts than the public and are advising our leaders as what to do(I.E. Cancelling crowded events etc) and a lot of the public are still complaining saying that the media is sensationalizing all this just because every time the public hears more info on the virus, it's through the TV(news media)

How else is info supposed to be passed to the public if not the media(mainly TV)?

Have watched a gang of announcements/news briefs by Gov. Dewine and have yet to see one in which he didn't have medical professional there with him substantiating everything he said.
He actually said in one update that, 'I'm not a doctor. I am following the advice of the leading medical professionals in making these decisions.'

We all know the media has a long,long history of sensationalizing.
And I for one am an avid fan of doubting media output due to the agendas I feel they often have.
But when leading Doctors(that have more facts than I)are speaking themselves using the media as nothing more than a format/platform to try and educate the public...and they are also working with leaders advising them of things that should be done to at least try and slow the virus down...and again, the media is used to relay that info. I hardly think that in any way that that is media sensationalism.


----------



## bobk

montagc said:


> Gloves are useless for this kinda thing. Still have to use your hands to eat, blow your nose, wipe your brow, and would need to change the gloves as often as you’d have to wash your hands. Gloves work for illnesses that are bloodborne and can pass into breaks in the skin. You may have noticed that while doctors wear gloves at checkup time, they still wash their hands after they take them off.


Yep, but they still wear them. I would wear them too.


----------



## glacier_dropsy

Over the next few months, many of us are going to get this. Do your neighbor and your nation a favor and try not to spread it quickly at the head of the wave.


----------



## glacier_dropsy

bobk said:


> Yep, but they still wear them. I would wear them too.


They are supposed to wear them after washing, and take them off before leaving the room and washing again. They wear them to prevent room to room transfer.


----------



## fishingful

Work shut down today. Only essential staff and they dont need to be there other than to check on things. I am off till the end of the month at least. Working from home "if the need arises".

Got enough food already in the freezer. Just stoped at the store for a few things. It was crazy, All kinds of stuff was gone already. I can make it a a while and never leave the house.

Unless I run out of beer....should have refilled the keg o rator last week. 

Home renovation projects to get done. Hopefully don't get sick or already been exposed. The wife still has to go to work kind of. She can work remotely as of this past week.


----------



## Pooka




----------



## MIGHTY

I just bought up all the toilet plungers in my city.....


----------



## glacier_dropsy

Children's Hospital in Cincinnati, one of the top 3 pediatric hospitals in the world for as long as I can remember, is making room for adult overflow from UC.


----------



## acklac7

I came down with a fever last night (confirmed with multiple thermometers). I'll be self-quarantining for the next 14 days. 

I have a strong immune system, and overall I'm not feeling horrid. 

That said,

It's not a Joke anymore.


----------



## acklac7

cement569 said:


> yes through all this panic and fear I will still be fishing tomorrow, that's something they cant close....yet


That's precisely the attitude I took last night, Fishing in the rain no less. Ended up getting soaked.

Things only got worse from there.


----------



## acklac7

Stay Strong Everyone. 

Stay Strong.


----------



## Redheads

DHower08 said:


> Schools are closed starting monday


Yep Monday.Why not immediately if its so bad.....just askin


----------



## fastwater

Redheads said:


> Yep Monday.Why not immediately if its so bad.....just askin


Even though at this point school closings shouldnt be a huge news flash cause as much as two weeks ago the governor and medical professionals said it may come to this and to be prepaired in case it did, my thought as to why Monday is to give working parents at least a couple days notice to make child care arrangements.


----------



## 1basshunter




----------



## fastwater

acklac7 said:


> I came down with a fever last night (confirmed with multiple thermometers). I'll be self-quarantining for the next 14 days.
> 
> I have a strong immune system, and overall I'm not feeling horrid.
> 
> That said,
> 
> It's not a Joke anymore.
> 
> View attachment 346631


acklac,
Keep an eye on that temp throughout the day today.
According to this...at 99.4 you may not have a fever:
https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/323819


----------



## acklac7

1basshunter said:


> View attachment 346633


Not to be a dick, but 24 hours ago I was laughing right along with you.

Now I’m sick.

A whole bunch of people are about to die.

A whole bunch of people are about to lose everything they have.

It’s time for the memes to end.


----------



## acklac7

fastwater said:


> acklac,
> Keep an eye on that temp throughout the day today.
> According to this...at 99.4 you may not have a fever:
> https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/323819


I have other symptoms. I'm sick.

Nothing life-threatening. But still.


----------



## fastwater

acklac7 said:


> *I have other symptoms. I'm sick.*
> 
> Nothing life-threatening. But still.


You are doing the right thing then.
Are you in need of anything from the store?


----------



## doegirl

acklac7 said:


> I have other symptoms. I'm sick.
> 
> Nothing life-threatening. But still.


https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/about/steps-when-sick.html


----------



## acklac7

fastwater said:


> You are doing the right thing then.
> Are you in need of anything from the store?


Prior to the first symptoms I spent nearly an hour at the store stocking up. That's what has me worried...


----------



## acklac7

doegirl said:


> *https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/about/steps-when-sick.html*


Read it cover-to-cover.


----------



## Saugeyefisher

1basshunter said:


> View attachment 346633


Lol


----------



## fastwater

acklac7 said:


> Prior to the first symptoms I spent nearly an hour at the store stocking up. That's what has me worried...


Okay!
Hope you get feeling better...and keep us posted.


----------



## bailey's boss

Could be blown out of proportion to steal our annuities and pensions. There all tanking.


----------



## acklac7

bailey's boss said:


> Could be blown out of proportion to steal our annuities and pensions. There all tanking.


The NCAA Tournament has been canceled.


----------



## TomC

I have a case of toilet paper I'll trade for a case of 5.56!


----------



## Lewzer

bailey's boss said:


> Could be blown out of proportion to steal our annuities and pensions. There all tanking.


Good because I’m buying. Watching to see what my boss Warren Buffet is doing with his 128billion in cash.


----------



## Snakecharmer

fishingful said:


> Work shut down today. Only essential staff and they dont need to be there other than to check on things. I am off till the end of the month at least. Working from home "if the need arises".
> 
> Got enough food already in the freezer. Just stoped at the store for a few things. It was crazy, All kinds of stuff was gone already. I can make it a a while and never leave the house.
> 
> Unless I run out of beer....should have refilled the keg o rator last week.
> 
> Home renovation projects to get done. Hopefully don't get sick or already been exposed. The wife still has to go to work kind of. She can work remotely as of this past week.


I hear Holden is free but the guest center and climbing towers are closed to visitors.


----------



## Shad Rap

acklac7 said:


> I came down with a fever last night (confirmed with multiple thermometers). I'll be self-quarantining for the next 14 days.
> 
> I have a strong immune system, and overall I'm not feeling horrid.
> 
> That said,
> 
> It's not a Joke anymore.
> 
> View attachment 346631


Me and the wife had it over a month ago...you'll be fine.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER




----------



## acklac7

PapawSmith said:


> I recommend you head to a walk-in clinic and get flu tested. Flu is VERY prevalent right now and it starts with a low grade temp like you have. If you go in and get tested within 48 hours of the first fever symptom, and test positive, they will prescribe Tamiflu which will cut the duration of the illness by 50%. If you test negative they can decide from there if you have something else but I would NOT speculate yourself on what you might have. I had Type A Flu three weeks age, for two weeks, first time getting the flu in my 59 years. Go get tested, do it right.


Nope. That's not what "I'm" supposed to do right now.

I'm a healthy young(ish) person, I'm staying home.

I can't fault you for seeking treatment, but that's not my prescription per the cdc


----------



## acklac7

Shad Rap said:


> Me and the wife had it over a month ago...you'll be fine.


Yeah, I'm not worried.


----------



## acklac7

What I AM worried about? Spreading it to others...Others that are vulnerable.


----------



## Shad Rap

acklac7 said:


> What I AM worried about? Spreading it to others...Others that are vulnerable.


Yeah that's the main thing...me and the wife didn't even know what we had at the time but looking back now it had to be Covid-19...wife got it worse than I did...supposedly it hits people with hypertension a little harder.


----------



## Shad Rap

PapawSmith said:


> I recommend you head to a walk-in clinic and get flu tested. Flu is VERY prevalent right now and it starts with a low grade temp like you have. If you go in and get tested within 48 hours of the first fever symptom, and test positive, they will prescribe Tamiflu which will cut the duration of the illness by 50%. If you test negative they can decide from there if you have something else but I would NOT speculate yourself on what you might have. I had Type A Flu three weeks age, for two weeks, first time getting the flu in my 59 years. Go get tested, do it right.


Most doctors don't advise this...you just stay home and get on some type of ibuprofen, tylenol, fluids regimen...unless of course things get out of hand...just called a few weeks ago for my daughter...and if you have something more serious than just the flu you don't wanna be out anywhere(even the ER) spreading it...


----------



## DHower08

acklac7 said:


> Prior to the first symptoms I spent nearly an hour at the store stocking up. That's what has me worried...


I also don't think that within an hour your going to all of a sudden have the Corona.


----------



## UNCLEMIKE

bobk said:


> Indeed the healthcare workers are a large concern. I worry for my wife. If you get down to the Wayne area this spring for turkey season send me a pm and I’ll see if we can work something out for a hunt at my place. You take care!


Thanks Bob. I will do that if it looks like I will make a trip down to the Wayne.


----------



## Shad Rap

acklac7 said:


> That's precisely the attitude I took last night, Fishing in the rain no less. Ended up getting soaked.
> 
> Things only got worse from there.


My guess is you just got sick from being out in the chilly weather and rain...but you still gotta treat it as such.


----------



## fastwater

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> View attachment 346661


Good point SP.
Thinkin that with all the rest of the public announcements, warnings and cautions with the virus and being quarantined, there should also be an added public announcement that reads:
'if'n ya can't feed em...don't breed em.'


----------



## acklac7

Shad Rap said:


> My guess is you just got sick from being out in the chilly weather and rain...but you still gotta treat it as such.


Exactly.


----------



## PapawSmith

acklac7 said:


> Yeah, I'm not worried.


Not saying you should worry at all but odds are much greater right now that you might have flu, and why the hell would you want to have it twice as long as necessary? Tamiflu greatly reduces the impact of the flu virus and no one has recommended that folks don't seek treatment. Get well.


----------



## Lewis

Meanwhile a friend of mine is presently at his home with a 103 fever and dry hacking cough after he worked all day yesterday around countless people. This thing is going to spread. The best thing we can do as a nation for our fellow Americans is to be very vigilant in our sanitary practices. God be with us if our hospitals wind up like Italy's at over 200% capacity with not near enough ventilators. I've read many reports that they are being forced to make war like decisions on who gets treatment as they come into the hospitals. If you are over 60...too bad! They are not even treating heart attacks, strokes and other emergencies. They are that overwhelmed.


----------



## CoonDawg92

glacier_dropsy said:


> This virus will continue to spread. The measures being put into place are trying to slow an inevitable spread. Because slowing the rate of spread could save millions of lives. lol?


I think it’s about slowing the spread so that the health care system doesn’t get overwhelmed all at once. They can handle it better over a period of time. 

my take-away from the govt actions over the last 24 hours is it’s all about not crashing the health care providers.

I assume we are all going to get exposed to this at some point over the next few months.


----------



## bobk

Come on you guys. This never has a good ending. Believe me I know. Ignore the person or go to pm’s


----------



## Lewis

Lighten up guys. OGF, don't close this. Just deal with those that get out of line. Threads like these will be valuable to keep each other informed as this thing spreads.


----------



## yonderfishin

Not to downplay the seriousness of this virus but are you all noticing the public panic and empty store shelves ? When people panic things get crazy , people get crazy. I was told once that a zombie apocalypse situation will happen eventually , only the " zombies " wont be the undead , they will be people who were unprepared trying to take what you have. I dont think we are there yet and I hope the economy can handle this and rebound , but we dont know what the long term economic and social effects of this will be. I am concerned though , that this hysteria and panic could potentially lead to a situation where we wind up needing to worry about the actions and intentions of other people more than the virus. Maybe thats overreaction , but keep it in mind and be safe


----------



## johnboy111711

yonderfishin said:


> Not to downplay the seriousness of this virus but are you all noticing the public panic and empty store shelves ? When people panic things get crazy , people get crazy. I was told once that a zombie apocalypse situation will happen eventually , only the " zombies " wont be the undead , they will be people who were unprepared trying to take what you have. I dont think we are there yet and I hope the economy can handle this and rebound , but we dont know what the long term economic and social effects of this will be. I am concerned though , that this hysteria and panic could potentially lead to a situation where we wind up needing to worry about the actions and intentions of other people more than the virus. Maybe thats overreaction , but keep it in mind and be safe


Not over reaction. be prepared and stay safe. It isn't panic if you are staying calm and preparing for the worst.


----------



## BuckeyeFishinNut

We have a teacher work-day today (no students) to get our plan of action for online assignments for the students to do during the "extended spring break". The students are supposed to come monday, which I doubt very many will, and no staff will be allowed in the building after monday until we return on April 6th. 

We were told that a deep clean will be done a few days prior to the students coming back. Although a number of the administration believe that this 3 weeks might just be he beginning for school closures. Would not shock me to see it extended until Easter break is over, considering ours starts on April 9th-13th. Depending on the spread, some think its not unfathomable that the school year may be done. With ODE asking that assignments be posted online, students doing work from home, and being given grades to finish out the 4th 9-weeks.

Who knows, things are changing so rapidly, its hard to keep up with everything.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

yonderfishin said:


> Not to downplay the seriousness of this virus but are you all noticing the public panic and empty store shelves ? When people panic things get crazy , people get crazy. I was told once that a zombie apocalypse situation will happen eventually , only the " zombies " wont be the undead , they will be people who were unprepared trying to take what you have. I dont think we are there yet and I hope the economy can handle this and rebound , but we dont know what the long term economic and social effects of this will be. I am concerned though , that this hysteria and panic could potentially lead to a situation where we wind up needing to worry about the actions and intentions of other people more than the virus. Maybe thats overreaction , but keep it in mind and be safe


That’s what I was saying back on page 6. I’m not so much worried about the virus than iam people. I also here that it’s too the point people are bulk buying and trying to resale at much higher prices and a lot of stores are putting limits on things now. These are the people you have to watch out for once it’s reached this point. It can only get worse. Again, awareness is key with the entire situation.


----------



## bobk

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> View attachment 346697
> 
> That’s what I was saying back on page 6. I’m not so much worried about the virus than iam people. I also here that it’s too the point people are bulk buying and trying to resale at much higher prices and a lot of stores are putting limits on things now. These are the people you have to watch out for once it’s reached this point. It can only get worse. Again, awareness is key with the entire situation.


Those kind of people need beat severely with a shovel and buried immediately.


----------



## UNCLEMIKE

I hope they start getting the word out not to go to the hospital to seek treatment if this takes off just because you have a fever and cough thinking you have the virus. Bottom line if it is or isn't the virus you don't need medical care for just those symptoms. There is no cure and your most likely not gonna die or even be very very sick. Unless you are having difficulty breathing they will treat the fever and send you home. In the mean time you will have spread it in the waiting room if you have it or you may get it in the waiting rom if you did not have it. I feel this message needs to be pushed in order to avoid spread of this if we end up with lots of infected people. Stay home if sick unless symptoms get severe. Most will do fine without treatment just like a cold. This potential panic just makes it worse.


----------



## johnboy111711

https://www.clevescene.com/scene-an...-of-covid-19-in-first-day-of-internal-testing

5 news cases identified in the cleveland clinic. They are now approved for in house testing and can test 500 per day with hopes to be a 1,000 per day by next week.


----------



## MIGHTY

Just out of curiosity and not trying to step on any toes, someone posted a picture of all the other viruses in the past that popped up and caused a scare. I’m only 33 but some of you older fellas that can remember these instances, was the panic like this? I mean back before social media and everyone had a cell phone glued to their hand to see the latest social media posts of people at their local grocery store hoarding toilet paper. SARS and swine flu and that kind of stuff. Was it like this back then?


----------



## Specwar

Personally I have never seen the stupidity ( I’m 69) we are experiencing today.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Specwar said:


> Personally I have never seen the stupidity ( I’m 69) we are experiencing today.


Nor I. I did see bread and milk fly off the shelf’s during the blizzard of 78 but nothing like this craziness. My daughter just called and told me she went to Marcs today and people are yelling and screaming at each other. A sad sight. Little kids with masks on. I was told to stay home due to my chemo but I feel I’m going to have to escort the squeeze to sams, giant eagle or marcs.


----------



## MIGHTY

I’ve seen your posts strong about your troubles but never wanted to say anything. I don’t personally know you but i hope for the best for you man. 


STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Nor I. I did see bread and milk fly off the shelf’s during the blizzard of 78 but nothing like this craziness. My daughter just called and told me she went to Marcs today and people are yelling and screaming at each other. A sad sight. Little kids with masks on. I was told to stay home due to my chemo but I feel I’m going to have to escort the squeeze to sams, giant eagle or marcs.


----------



## snag

Went to giant eagle early this morning for a few basics and shelves were stocked up, the Clorox cleaning stuff was low but that’s the panic buyers hoarding up, saw on tv the big lines at a Costco that’s just crazy, I’m in and out in 15 no farting around ,wipe off cart then hands in truck, get home and wash hands off. Daughter said acme and Costco were out of tp and hand cleaners on Thursday.










Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## bobk

UNCLEMIKE said:


> I hope they start getting the word out not to go to the hospital to seek treatment if this takes off just because you have a fever and cough thinking you have the virus. Bottom line if it is or isn't the virus you don't need medical care for just those symptoms. There is no cure and your most likely not gonna die or even be very very sick. Unless you are having difficulty breathing they will treat the fever and send you home. In the mean time you will have spread it in the waiting room if you have it or you may get it in the waiting rom if you did not have it. I feel this message needs to be pushed in order to avoid spread of this if we end up with lots of infected people. Stay home if sick unless symptoms get severe. Most will do fine without treatment just like a cold. This potential panic just makes it worse.


Down here they have told people that. Don’t just go to the facility. Call first!! Let them be prepared before you walk in.


----------



## bobk

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Nor I. I did see bread and milk fly off the shelf’s during the blizzard of 78 but nothing like this craziness. My daughter just called and told me she went to Marcs today and people are yelling and screaming at each other. A sad sight. Little kids with masks on. I was told to stay home due to my chemo but I feel I’m going to have to escort the squeeze to sams, giant eagle or marcs.


You should stay home.


----------



## BuckeyeFishinNut

Specwar said:


> Personally I have never seen the stupidity ( I’m 69) we are experiencing today.


My dad is 69 also (turns 70 this year), said the same exact thing when we were at the gym this morning. His exact quote "We survived Polio, a disease that could cripple or kill you, and people are running around like idiots because of a flu virus"


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Hey thanks mighty. I appreciate that very much.


----------



## icebucketjohn

Anti-Coronvirus Clothing: Browns Apparel. You won't catch anything wearing it.


----------



## yonderfishin

Some people were freaking out about the SARS virus , there was a little panic then but nothing like they are now. But the lack of panic in the other situations was probably due to government officials and media NOT enciting fear and panic , they stood together working to keep panic from happening but that is not the case this time around. ( refer to the forum rules about what is not to be discussed before expanding on the topic of government officials , it is enough to say that some have been feeding fear and panic and let that be it ) And the thing about social media is its notorious for disinformation and a breeding ground for fear and paranoia. Public panic is harder to deal with when rumors , bad information , and opinions are shared and discussed 24/7 .....you would think instant information and discussion is a good thing but thats not always the case. Freedom of speech is great but that dont make it always positive.


----------



## 21938

Yep, what yonder said.


----------



## Pooka

MIGHTY said:


> Just out of curiosity and not trying to step on any toes, someone posted a picture of all the other viruses in the past that popped up and caused a scare. I’m only 33 but some of you older fellas that can remember these instances, was the panic like this? I mean back before social media and everyone had a cell phone glued to their hand to see the latest social media posts of people at their local grocery store hoarding toilet paper. SARS and swine flu and that kind of stuff. Was it like this back then?



SARs: When I landed in Kuwait in '03 the authorities lined us all up and did some sort of eyeball scan before we were allowed to process into the country. 
That was also where I got the sickest I ever remember being. Whatever that bug was there was a point where I thought I might die, and was so sick that I didn't really care. 
Interesting side note: I did not catch so much as a cold for 10 years after that. I joke that I might have had the "everything". LOL


----------



## Pooka

bobk said:


> Down here they have told people that. Don’t just go to the facility. Call first!! Let them be prepared before you walk in.


Any other time if you call about a symptom you are told to come in and see the Doc. lol
That drives me nuts, simple question, easy to answer over the phone, Nope, make an appt.


----------



## jrose

If any of you guys need whiskey, you better get there before me!!! I'm hoarding!!


----------



## bobk

0


jrose said:


> If any of you guys need whiskey, you better get there before me!!! I'm hoarding!!


Did that yesterday.


----------



## Row v. Wade

Our daughter just received a text for University of Toledo where she is a student. We need to pack up all of her belongings from her dorm by the Sunday 3-23. Face to face classes are done for the year. She will need to finish them online.


----------



## Dovans

Been pure hell at grocery store. If I had dollar for every time customer wanted to know if I was holding water in the back room..... How many times I wanted to say, well, just turn your faucet on. By noon today the produce section was wiped out. Milk was gone. Canned meals.. like spaghetti O's Gone. Bread gone. things I think you should buy we have plenty. Like Pedialyte..Gatorade. Soda Pop was also flying out the door. At 6am there were close to 50 people waiting for the store to open. 
I got phone call from work after being home for couple hours letting me know they were starting a overtime schedule. In which case I can or will be scheduled overtime in my store or any other store that is short handed due to the "virus". Said no to working at other stores. If they are short cause of the virus Im staying away from that store.. 
People shopping, some most, were frantic..I put something on the shelf, they'd take it. Other people were almost like in a daze. Surprisingly, The Little Clinic not busy. 
Store yesterday was 100,000.00 dollars over budget. 
Has been incredibly nuts this week.


----------



## Pooka

Dovans said:


> ... How many times I wanted to say, well, just turn your faucet on. .


I wonder if they will all dehydrate if they can't get bottled water? LOL


----------



## doegirl

Dovans said:


> Been pure hell at grocery store. If I had dollar for every time customer wanted to know if I was holding water in the back room..... How many times I wanted to say, well, just turn your faucet on. By noon today the produce section was wiped out. Milk was gone. Canned meals.. like spaghetti O's Gone. Bread gone. things I think you should buy we have plenty. Like Pedialyte..Gatorade. Soda Pop was also flying out the door. At 6am there were close to 50 people waiting for the store to open.
> I got phone call from work after being home for couple hours letting me know they were starting a overtime schedule. In which case I can or will be scheduled overtime in my store or any other store that is short handed due to the "virus". Said no to working at other stores. If they are short cause of the virus Im staying away from that store..
> People shopping, some most, were frantic..I put something on the shelf, they'd take it. Other people were almost like in a daze. Surprisingly, The Little Clinic not busy.
> Store yesterday was 100,000.00 dollars over budget.
> Has been incredibly nuts this week.


I'm utilizing curb side pickup from my local wally world. No way I'm wading through the hordes to fight over soup and soap. I would encourage others to do the same.


----------



## KaGee

Alright, alright alright! We have heard you. 
Back open! 
The thread has been cleaned up and sorry to say a couple of guys are on the sidelines right now. 

Keep it on topic. Two points to remember:
1) Keep your politics to yourself. There is no place here for that. (Even veiled references)
2) If you disagree with someone... just walk away from the keyboard.


----------



## fastwater

Thanks KaGee!


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

I’m reading China’s new cases have really backed way down. Anyone else hearing it?


----------



## Snakecharmer

Thanks! 

Everybody please play nice!


----------



## Snakecharmer

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> I’m reading China’s new cases have really backed way down. Anyone else hearing it?


Go to post 1. 11 new cases for China..


----------



## bruce

Thanks Kgee. Stay on topic every one. Joker stay a way.


KaGee said:


> Alright, alright alright! We have heard you.
> Back open!
> The thread has been cleaned up and sorry to say a couple of guys are on the sidelines right now.
> 
> Keep it on topic. Two points to remember:
> 1) Keep your politics to yourself. There is no place here for that. (Even veiled references)
> 2) If you disagree with someone... just walk away from the keyboard.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Snakecharmer said:


> Go to post 1. 11 new cases for China..


Yea I reading the “growth factor”, anything above a 1 could mean substantial growth. Anyone have the latest USA charts?


----------



## cement569

thanks kagee, there are people on here from all over the state and beyond and its good to hear first hand accounts instead of having to watch the news


----------



## cheezemm2

Watched an interesting piece on China and the fact that quarantine at home was helpful but then spread continued amongst family. Most effective way isolating individuals away from the family unit at local recovery centers.


----------



## Muddy

Thank you. We can all help each other.
Edit:keep negative vibes to yourself! This will be a long ride. We need to work together.


----------



## CFIden

Pooka said:


> SARs: When I landed in Kuwait in '03 the authorities lined us all up and did some sort of eyeball scan before we were allowed to process into the country.
> That was also where I got the sickest I ever remember being. Whatever that bug was there was a point where I thought I might die, and was so sick that I didn't really care.
> Interesting side note: I did not catch so much as a cold for 10 years after that. I joke that I might have had the "everything". LOL


Thanks for your service Sharks.


----------



## Muddy

My free advice, which is worth nothing, would be to get over the counter medications ASAP for you and anyone that lives with you that needs them, or could need them. Don’t buy the entire shelf, buy what you need. Everyone that panic buys is behind the game. You need to be ahead of the game. Per people that I know that are out (friends/neighbors) shopping today, over the counter meds are still readily available today while most “Panic” items are sold out.


----------



## Muddy

Dovans- do you see any issues with shipping, store stock, or employees coming down the road?


----------



## Dovans

Muddy said:


> Dovans- do you see any issues with shipping, store stock, or employees coming down the road?


Our non perishable truck arrived about an hour before I left. it was approximately 4000 pieces. Normal truck is ~700-1100. Very little water, very little TP. What TP we got in went right out and then went right out the door. Water same thing. We are suppose to limit purchase to three of each. They dont pay me enough to enforce that. I know I ordered water.. quite a bit. I got one pallet of 32s..(60 to a pallet) I ordered 8 pallets. half pallet of 24s. (78/pallet) Ordered 4 pallets. Manager ordered 4-5 pallets of Toilet Paper. All said we got like ten to 15 cases. ( Employees I hang with our not really taking the precautions they should. When I walk the store or stocking, I have can of lysol. you walk by me and Im suspicious I spray. Not trying to insult or offend anyone. the younguns are the worse.. When they sneeze or cough they dont cover. 
I just read on CNN where grocery stores are starting to change hours. Kroger has not.. I dont think they will be far behind though. Most employees I talked to said they did not agree to the overtime scheduling. I am not going to work 80 some hours and lower my bodys immune from fatigue. I know of at least one Kroger store that has had to "spider" the hand sanitizers in the vestibule, these are basically alarms. Store stock is going to be a issue for few weeks. We always have issues with employees..( I have to do what for a paycheck?) Perishable trucks have been outrageously late. (meat, dairy,produce) Today as yesterday, hardly any fresh produce, Meat counter spotty, gallon milk and eggs non-existent. Our scheduled delivery for perishable is between 5a and 7a. I left at noon and it had not been dispatched yet from delaware. Bread has also been issue. Bread Vendors have been telling me that the company(s) are only focusing on Bread..not buns muffins bagels etc, So those type of products will always be short. When you see someone walking out with bascart full of toilet paper you can not always assume its for hording.. I know some are getting for parents or their children. In my store we try to stay Positive and smile. 
I do find it amazing there is plenty of Pepsi, Coke, and Beer.


----------



## Dovans

just happened


----------



## M R DUCKS

I receive news updates on my phone
Giant Eagle announced store hour change- I believe 7-10
Taco Bell drive through only
About an hour ago, Kroger, Columbus area, starting tomorrow
7-10


----------



## Muddy

Dovans-thank you. Gods speed brother.


----------



## Muddy

I hope so. I have a family member in management for shipping across a broad industry. Ports are not moving at the normal pace right now, if at all. I don’t know what goods the delay at ports will impact, or what domestic production can keep up with.


----------



## M R DUCKS

Walmart nationwide joining with the shorter hours 6-11


----------



## bobk

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> I’m reading China’s new cases have really backed way down. Anyone else hearing it?


I don’t know what to believe. I read that some people there have tested positive again.


----------



## CoonDawg92

Tonight Giant Eagle in Avon Lake: Produce section very well stocked, only exception was potatoes were out. Very little chicken or ground beef. Plenty pork chops and loins, and beef cuts such as roasts. Very little TP, they had just put out one case of the good Northern kind and there was some left. Bread was gone except the strange expensive kind and believe it or not plenty of hamburger buns.

Cabela's in Avon all out of handgun ammo except .22 and some uncommon calibers.


----------



## fastwater

bobk said:


> I don’t know what to believe. I read that some people there have tested positive again.


Agree...especially since China has the reputation of not being the most transparent country in the world when it comes to sharing important info./Intel with the rest of the world.
And with down playing number of cases until the virus became an epidemic there...seems they weren't at the onset of this whole Corona outbreak either.


----------



## Muddy

bobk said:


> I don’t know what to believe. I read that some people there have tested positive again.


That is one of my concerns. Some virus’s stay in your system. What s the long term effect of this virus? No one knows.


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

I read all this but just not seeing it yet. Everywhere I go plenty of stock, shelves are full, everything seems as usual. I’ve been in Gatlinburg since Thursday and it’s packed like usual. Dinner show we attended Friday sold out, traffic heavy, sidewalks packed, 1-2 hr wait to eat, etc. 

I sure hope things don’t get crazy but so far pretty much business as usual everywhere I see.


----------



## hailtothethief

Pneumonia supposedly doubles the risk of depression. Means you’ll have to fish twice as much if u get it.


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

Did see they postponed Dollywood and the dinner show we attended is closed two weeks.

Sure no shortages of goods or food though. Likely the lag and that will come later


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

Also one of my coworkers tested positive Thursday. I’m out of town but the department of health said we should absolutely not close. The company paid Servpro to do a deep cleaning today but everybody is reporting to work Monday. The information in the email from the health department has a lot of good information.

The co worker is perfectly fine and luckily a healthy 30 year old male. He is expected to have no complications but must be treated.


----------



## Snakecharmer

26 cases in Ohio...11 in Cuyahoga County


----------



## fastwater

Fish-N-Fool said:


> Also one of my coworkers tested positive Thursday. I’m out of town but the department of health said we should absolutely not close. The company paid Servpro to do a deep cleaning today but everybody is reporting to work Monday. The information in the email from the health department has a lot of good information.
> 
> The co worker is perfectly fine and luckily a healthy 30 year old male. He is expected to have no complications but must be treated.


So he is one of the 26 confirmed cases in Ohio?

If so...is there any protocol that's being followed where you work with other employees that may have had close contact with the person that tested positive?
Has the state health department been in contact with co workers and positive persons friends investigating if any of them have been out of the country...or made contact with any known person that has been out of the country.
From what I understand, there have been very intense,lengthy investigations into all known contacts of those that are confirmed positive for corona.


----------



## Snakecharmer

fastwater said:


> So he is one of the 26 confirmed cases in Ohio?
> 
> If so...is there any protocol that's being followed where you work with other employees that may have had close contact with the person that tested positive?


* Cuyahoga County - 11 cases.

* Butler - 4 cases.

* Stark - 3 cases.

* Belmont - 2 cases.

* Trumbull - 2 cases.

* Summit - 2 cases.

* Franklin - 1 case.

* Lorain - 1 case.


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## twistedcatfish1971

...it sets...then up it comes up...TIME.

...it don't stop...can't control...only adapt. 

Life is something that comes and goes...the times/challenge that it brings are times of good/bad. Now with what is going on...sure a pain/hard time...slow down and live the moment...use best judgment and be vigilant with today's misfortune. 

...footsteps OGF...look out for one another. 

Stay safe.

Don.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

Well....I recall upper respiratory infections In October thru December. I just wonder how long this has been around. Could this have been misdiagnosed? I think I even had a short bout with coughing and breathing in November. Any thoughts.???


----------



## fishingful

Ahhhhhh its all around me!.....

I am in Geauga County, went to the store Wednesday and all the tp was gone. Still had most of the stuff. Milk, eggs, chicken, ramon, pasta, bread, papet towles and water was almost gone.

Went Thursday to get a few things I forgot and all that stuff was gone. Luckily I don't need a bunch. Freezer is full, including the chest freezer and I still have a bunch of can goods from the garden. Probably 8 months to a year of food depending on how I ration. Then I would just fish my pond and go into survival mode. The only extras I picked up were some night and day quill (because we did not have any left) and some shotgun shells. 

My work shut down till the end of the month at least. So I am off work untill at least the 31st. The wife can work on the computer from home. But as of right now her office is still open and she feels bad that her secutary has to be at the office by herself. She works in an office building that has the county health department in it. So encouraging her to stay home.

Yesterday was my birthday so we drove up to wineries to stock up. They are doing call, order and load your car. But once we got there they all were empty. So went in and had the entire place to ourselves. Went to 4 wineries and they all had mostly employees.

Yea, I like wine and beer lol

Sticking at home for now working on finishing some projects on the house. Need some supplies for remodel projects so may hit home depot but not sure its worth it. May hit the river for walleye or steelhead. At least I can practice my "social distancing".

I am not one to believe a bunch of stuff. But I am also not a idiot either. I have been watching this since it started in China and spread across the world. I am healthy and we are in the prime of life. I only wory about my parents that are still out like nothing is going on and my sister that works in a county jail.

I am going to throw some money in the stock market.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kellyp...--tax-credits-to-lessen-impact-of-coronavirus


----------



## Saugeye Tom

Great read above


----------



## robertj298




----------



## JamesF

i understand that it is already here. And people are going around places that may put not just themselves at risk but many more than they can imagine. The idea that a subset of people haven't a clue that they are carriers.I have been trying to talk some common sense into my son... he just gets defensive,and this all revolves around his asinine girlfriend, who feels this is some kind joke,or just doesn't get it.I am at risk along with my wife. She fills his head with utter nonsense,like not telling us that they went out to dinner and a movie today. Duh!!! this mindset is so infuriating, that I just lose it when I have to worry about him,and ourselves, just because of some control freak! Most of the people that are crowding the stores ,restaurants and many other places,should just stay home.Sorry to say this, but I have always viewed a lot of people as, ignorant, filthy, and a very disgusting lot. These are the ones that are going about and bringing this now, community virus right to our door step. Reminds of the panic stricken weasel ass Draft dodgers. Race riots in Harlem and Watts. A different kind of virus was at the heart of those panic situations. Fueled by the Media.The first live daily war that gave insight to fear.


----------



## hailtothethief

30 million people go to the grocery store everyday. Its bound to get around. Gonna have to go back to gardening.


----------



## FOWL BRAWL

Saugeye Tom said:


> Well....I recall upper respiratory infections In October thru December. I just wonder how long this has been around. Could this have been misdiagnosed? I think I even had a short bout with coughing and breathing in November. Any thoughts.???


Agree for sure.
Been there had that got the go take some over the counter meds and let it run its course ,you should be fine in 10 days, if not return for anther bill


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## bobberbucket

Here’s my thoughts on this speculation that’s going around that we already had in in January & February. 

I highly doubt it. Maybe there was some of that going around I cannot say for sure I guess. But The virus that was going around in January and February was definitely affecting children. 

They were closing schools because of the flu in January and early February. I highly doubt that this is the same. My 2 cents.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Fish-N-Fool

Yep he is one of the 26. His last day in the office was Thursday morning. I work for a very large employer with 9 locations in 3 states. We have an entire department of HR folks and we’re getting daily updates weeks ago before the first person ever hit the states with it. 

Our firm has protocol and every govt entity is involved. We are told there is no risk everybody report to work Monday. That is the short answer. I have pages of emails from or HR Director as well as govt info he sent to us all. Bottom line they see zero threat by Monday and all virus on any surface will be dead.


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

And FYI he hasn’t left Ohio nor been in contact with anybody that has been out of the country. He’s been in Dayton / Cinci area the entire time. They have no idea where and how he picked it up


----------



## BuckeyeFishinNut

The 2 in Belmont County were at the conference in Washington D.C. with the original cases from Cuyahoga County. 

The local Walmart, Kroger, and Reisbeck have all been packed for most of the week. Lots of reports of empty TP and water aisles. I have also been told that Aldi has been getting hit hard too. Check your Dollar General though, have had a couple different people tell me they still had hand sanitizer, disinfectant wipes, milk, eggs, etc. I am sure it varies by location.

We are set here, plenty of food in the freeze and dry goods in the cupboards, so we don't need to deal with the madness of grocery shopping. Our only issue is we are running low on coffee (we cannot run out of coffee!), gonna hit up Sam's Club this morning.


----------



## bobk

BuckeyeFishinNut said:


> The 2 in Belmont County were at the conference in Washington D.C. with the original cases from Cuyahoga County.
> 
> The local Walmart, Kroger, and Reisbeck have all been packed for most of the week. Lots of reports of empty TP and water aisles. I have also been told that Aldi has been getting hit hard too. Check your Dollar General though, have had a couple different people tell me they still had hand sanitizer, disinfectant wipes, milk, eggs, etc. I am sure it varies by location.
> 
> We are set here, plenty of food in the freeze and dry goods in the cupboards, so we don't need to deal with the madness of grocery shopping. Our only issue is we are running low on coffee (we cannot run out of coffee!), gonna hit up Sam's Club this morning.


Thanks for the info on the 2 in Belmont county. I have to spend 3 days there this week. When I saw Friday that there were 2 new cases there I must admit,I’m not too thrilled to go there. Visiting 10-12 retail stores a day isn’t on my happy list right now. Many of the owners of these stores are not from this country. They are always having family that is traveling into this county so the potential is greater. I usually stay in a hotel when I travel. I’m debating making the 2.5 drive there and back every day.


----------



## bobk

Muddy said:


> That is one of my concerns. Some virus’s stay in your system. What s the long term effect of this virus? No one knows.


I just read that there are 2 strains of the virus and you can get the other strain but they don’t “think” you can get the first one again.


----------



## BuckeyeFishinNut

bobk said:


> Thanks for the info on the 2 in Belmont county. I have to spend 3 days there this week. When I saw Friday that there were 2 new cases there I must admit,I’m not too thrilled to go there. Visiting 10-12 retail stores a day isn’t on my happy list right now. Many of the owners of these stores are not from this country. They are always having family that is traveling into this county so the potential is greater. I usually stay in a hotel when I travel. I’m debating making the 2.5 drive there and back every day.


Yeah, I saw that on the local news the other day. I am pretty sure they said they self-quarantined when they heard about the people in Cuyahoga county. They didn't say what part of the county they are from though to protect their identity. That would have been somewhat helpful because if it was somewhere like Barnesville, Morristown, or Shadyside, I don't frequent those areas. But if it was St. Clairsville, Bridgeport, or Martins Ferry, I am there all the time. Stay safe Bobk!


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## AmericanEagle

Here is a link to a news story and video from the hospital of one of the Trumbull county cases.

https://www.wfmj.com/story/41895986/warren-man-with-coronavirus-talks-about-his-experience


----------



## stormfront

Reading the shortage reports online and being my wife and I are early risers, we decided to go to our local WM, Giant Eagle, and Marc's long before sun up. Yep, no TP, distilled water, Ramen noodles and so on. Canned food stocks were down significantly. Panic is upon us.


----------



## stormfront

Jack Ma, the richest billionaire in China, is donating 1,000,000 masks and 500,000 test kits to the U.S. Lots of questions and thoughts going through my head but I'll keep my opinions to myself.


----------



## cheezemm2

All the citizens getting back into the country are clogging up customs and waiting in huge lines. If you think this week is scary, wait until more testing and numbers start coming out after everyone was standing in these petri dishes right next to each other. I think domestic travel will be curtailed soon.


----------



## bridgeman

My daughter really did a good job of explaining a lot of this to me, all of these efforts are meant to flatten the curve in an attempt to not have thousands flooding hospitals. The rate of spread is inevitable in this day and age. Hypochondriacs are really gonna be a big problem, the vast majority will remain calm I'm sure but theres a buncha morons out there that'll take this to a state of panic I'm sure. Won't be long and a lot of us will be able to self quarantine ourselves with a boat under our feet lol


----------



## Misdirection

Day 2 with out sports. Found this lady sitting on my couch. She seems pretty nice and says she's my wife 

My wife read the above on Facebook and thought she would share with me...

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## mas5588

Company I work for sources a few items from China and we have a sourcing/engineer there. At the beginning, he let us know it was much worse than what was being communicated.

However, he sent another note last week and indicated things were MUCH better there now. Most factories were back to work and society was approaching normal.

I'm all about being positive thru this. Anybody near the 'boro want to go fish!?!?


----------



## bobk

Italy is a real mess. It’s comforting to see the families on their balconies singing their national anthem. They have lost an incredible amount of people quickly.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

I still think to a point, the media is overstating the entire issue. Is there a virus? Yes. Is it going to be as devastating as the media is trying to portray it to be? I don’t think so imo. “Think” being the key word here as I can’t seem to recall our government going through all the cautionary steps over a virus like they are with this one so either it’s really bad or they are just doing a very good job being preventative which is a good thing also. I think if we just use common sense and precautions we will be fine. From what I’ve been reading, most deaths seem to be of those with current heath issues with their immune system and 70+ yrs of age. The cruise ship scenario was just that. Apparently any kids or toddlers that has been diagnosed have not died due to very healthy immune systems. The media preaching death death death everyday is causing all this panic. Is it justifiable, I’m just not sure yet. But I still think we should use common sense to try and avoid the virus just as we would the pneumonia, flu, and the common cold as they are all spread the same way. What’s more important, if you have a compromised immune system, stay home or at least avoids crowds. There are 26 confirmed cases in Ohio. Doubled the amount from Friday. 12 women, 14 men from 31-86 yrs old with 7 hospitalized. One of these, a 49 yr old man was on a cruise to Mexico. I’m sure there are many more unknown infected cases in Ohio and I hope people get through this.


----------



## Buster24

Just arrived in HH last night...went to the store and no water, tp, paper towels and a few other options....I really cannot figure peoples take on this virus....went to a Rite Aid before I left and felt like I had the plague as everyone stayed clear of one another...down here it seems business as usual ......shopping malls, restaurants, businesses were very crowded....people everywhere acting like there there is no concern.....wife and I are trying to stay clear of all....staying to ourselves and cooking in.....just shocked when I saw the attitudes of others and wonder if this is a hoax!!!!!


----------



## Specwar

^^ what he said. During my early morning outing to pick up a few grocery and pet items I noticed most restaurants were busy with the Sunday morning breakfast crowd. Most shoppers except one who must have a family case of diarrhea cause her buggy was full of Charmin, were acting and normal.
Oh yeah, you can bet we will be ordering our customary Sunday afternoon pizza from our favorite shop when our girls and their significant others come to visit as we do every Sunday. Life goes on.


----------



## Buster24

Might also reply that one older gent......say maybe in his mid 50’s had 10 cases of Bud Light and many bags of potato chips.....the true necessities!!!!!!


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

I say photoshopped..


----------



## 1basshunter

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> I say photoshopped..
> 
> View attachment 346983


Without a doubt


----------



## cement569

yep, went to about 5 stores and no tp. sure glad I saved all my sears catalogs and old phone books.....should be in good shape


----------



## loves2fishinohio

stormfront said:


> Jack Ma, the richest billionaire in China, is donating 1,000,000 masks and 500,000 test kits to the U.S. Lots of questions and thoughts going through my head but I'll keep my opinions to myself.


He is TRYING to, the US won't let him.


----------



## stormfront

loves2fishinohio said:


> He is TRYING to, the US won't let him.


SMH. We currently don't have enough masks or tests in this country and they're denying help from the outside? Unreal. Guess our companies here want all the profit for themselves?


----------



## loves2fishinohio

It's just a matter of time before we go into full shutdown as France has done. The governor has already stated he is considering closing restaurants and bars (source, thehill.com). 

I'd rather look back on this in a month or 2 and say we did too much, rather than we didn't do enough.


----------



## loves2fishinohio

stormfront said:


> SMH. We currently don't have enough masks or tests in this country and they're denying help from the outside? Unreal. Guess our companies here want all the profit for themselves?


You know it, man.


----------



## stormfront

loves2fishinohio said:


> It's just a matter of time before we go into full shutdown as France has done. The governor has already stated he is considering closing restaurants and bars (source, thehill.com).
> 
> I'd rather look back on this in a month or 2 and say we did too much, rather than we didn't do enough.


You're a very wise man.


----------



## Burkcarp1

stormfront said:


> SMH. We currently don't have enough masks or tests in this country and they're denying help from the outside? Unreal. Guess our companies here want all the profit for themselves?


I have some thoughts about that one. I wouldn’t wear any from that source..call me paranoid..don’t care.


----------



## fastwater

^^^Same here!!!


----------



## stormfront

loves2fishinohio said:


> You know it, man.


Wall Street is getting an infusion of up to $1.5 trillion and we can't get enough masks for our healthcare providers or tests for those who may be sick. I sure hope this isn't true but........


----------



## Shad Rap

loves2fishinohio said:


> He is TRYING to, the US won't let him.


Because China probably tainted the masks and the vaccines for all we know...they were already hiding this disease a month before it even became known...dating back to early November now...probably even earlier than that.


----------



## DiverDux

Check this out. Good, solid information from a highly respected medical professional.


----------



## Misdirection

DiverDux said:


> Check this out. Good. solid information from a highly respected medical professional.


This is probably why infection rates in Africa and Australia are low. Our winter is their Summer.

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## Specwar

I personally have to remove myself from any further activity on this thread. I’ve never read so much “ the sky is falling” BS in my life.
I’ll see those of you who “survive” at the lake.


----------



## Lewis

Here is a case from the Akron area...Summit County. This not me! This is lady from the Akron area.
https://www.facebook.com/abdriscoll1?__tn__=,dlCH-R-R&eid=ARB_ZjJ78hLTLv_9XriDQj3_npDLivGYG6fh81auk9iDKE8H0mFDJH25ALIbNEfF4qOFrS8yW5So9QR7&hc_ref=ARQ8IM3ztrvMxPo-b0pQhBOoCqYrCglXTGW7UlsYRtJS3AG4T4PTA3lu-vrqg2zmu7Q
Amy Brock is feeling grateful.
17 hrs


So for all the non believers and those who are not taking this seriously, if you need to to KNOW someone who has been diagnosed with the covid-19, well if you are reading this you know me. I am Summit County case#2.

I became sick quickly Wednesday afternoon. I felt run down and feverish. By the time I got home I had a fever of 99.2. I was uncomfortable, headache, and a cough that was heavy but not producing anything. I fell asleep and woke at 3 am. My heart was racing. I had trouble catching my breath and my chest felt tight every time I coughed. I contacted a great nurse I know...she said go in, but call first. I called the ER, told them my symptoms and the had me call a closed ohio dept of health number. I was clearly in distress so my nurse called them back and said I was coming in. It's a good thing I did. My BP was very low and my heart rate was very high. These are not good signs on top of fever and cough. They admitted me and I was tested for every single other thing and then they ran the covid test.

I am the face of this infection. It is brutal and I'm a healthy 48 year old with no underlying conditions. I'm not 100% better but I'm home resting. Please take this seriously. People you love, their lives may depend on it.

I'm happy to answer any questions in between naps and hydration.

*****update...edit
My ex was in Germany the week before I became ill. He has no symptoms. My children have no symptoms. Per the Summit County Health Department we are all being monitored. My test was POSITIVE. I was in patient at Ahuja from early Thursday till today. Fluids and pain meds and fever meds were all they could give me. My highest fever was 102.
My son did not go to school from the moment I became ill. Prior to my becoming ill...I was at work and he was at school...because we were not ill and had no reason to suspect we were exposed in any way.
We do NOT know where the exposure came from.


----------



## bobberbucket

https://fox8.com/news/coronavirus/g...sed-if-schools-didnt-reopen-this-school-year/


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

I thinks it’s more about population geography speaking. Like Italy, with most virus cases being in northern Italy, is smaller than the state of California but Italy has almost double the population with about 60.5 million. With the entire US population 333 million and China with about 1.5 billion. The virus is going to spread much faster in densely populated area’s especially in areas with little to no heath care, and malnutrition issues. Again we just need to be diligent with precautionary practices and we will be fine.


----------



## Legend killer

Misdirection said:


> This is probably why infection rates in Africa and Australia are low. Our winter is their Summer.
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


Tom Hanks and wife are there


----------



## Misdirection

Legend killer said:


> Tom Hanks and wife are there


Yes, but they are likely around people who have traveled from other countries. As of this morning Australia had 10% of the positive cases the US did.

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## Shad Rap

I believe this has been going around the US for approximately 2 months now...possibly longer...just my opinion...almost certain this is what me and my wife had over a month ago...same exact symptoms, no way to test for it and no way to know at the time...wasn't even considered because we were never to China or even out of the country.


----------



## Big Chief

People are diagnosed with terminal medical conditions on a daily basis and those illnesses will kill many more this year than the corona will. All we can do is try to avoid those things in life that cause them and people do that every day.
The panic that this is causing is uncalled for.
The stock market will all but crash tomorrow and then we’re all in a world of sheeeit


----------



## AmericanEagle

Lewis said:


> Here is a case from the Akron area...Summit County.
> I am Summit County case#2.
> 
> I became sick quickly Wednesday afternoon. I felt run down and feverish. By the time I got home I had a fever of 99.2. I was uncomfortable, headache, and a cough that was heavy but not producing anything.


The case in Trumbull County I posted about on page 28 also described a dry cough.

This morning I received this in an email from a ham radio operator in Czechoslovakia.

"Coronavirus infection does not cause cold symptoms with wet nose or
cough with cold, but dry and rough cough, this is its simplest
distinguishing symptom"

It may be a symptom to keep in mind.


----------



## JamesF

I watched a woman last night talking about self quarantine. What she said was plain and simple. Start doing the to do list around the house, playing games with the kids. And get creative 
There are plenty of things to be done at home. And don't go out into public places if you don't have to. She was very at ease, and she is a health specialist in infectious diseases.


----------



## bobk

Speedy recovery Lewis!


----------



## Saugeyefisher

bobk said:


> Speedy recovery Lewis!


Ditto... an glad to here your at home getting rest,and sounds like you handled it the way it should be handled.


----------



## Shad Rap

AmericanEagle said:


> The case in Trumbull County I posted about on page 28 also described a dry cough.
> 
> This morning I received this in an email from a ham radio operator in Czechoslovakia.
> 
> "Coronavirus infection does not cause cold symptoms with wet nose or
> cough with cold, but dry and rough cough, this is its simplest
> distinguishing symptom"
> 
> It may be a symptom to keep in mind.


There are several symptoms and you don't have to have all the symptoms...runny nose is in fact a symptom...a cough also is...it says nothing about a 'dry' cough...body aches and pains weren't initially a symptom either...after communicating with people who've had covid, body aches and pains are most certainly a symptom...not everyone is gonna display the same stuff...some people won't display any symptoms at all throught the duration of the disease...kind hard to read...this has been going around for at least a couple months in the states...a whole lot of people have already had it, gotten over it and never even realized what they had...


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

Update: just pulled into the house at Ohio after the Gatlinburg spring break trip.

mourn same office has a second confirmed employee. Nobody is to report to work. Everybody they have been in close contact with has a mandatory 14 day quarantine (7 more employees). 

Not from the state or CDC but my firm has decided to self quarantine every employee working this entire west wing office (about 40 people). The in charge just sent communication verifying the 2nd employee plus names of all in close contact (all of our people freely consented to sharing their info to be transparent and try our best to stop transmission).

as we stand at the moment I will not be back in that office for min 14 days. 
Nobody that has been in contact with either employee personally or professionally is showing any symptoms at present.


----------



## Shad Rap

Bars and restaraunts closing tonight at 9......what the...


----------



## Redheads

Shad Rap said:


> Bars and restaraunts closing tonight at 9......what the...


Crazy....stopped on the way home from picking up some ammo and at the local watering hole for lunch and refreshments....no lines or waiting at either place


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Shad Rap said:


> Bars and restaraunts closing tonight at 9......what the...


Yep. Except take out places. You can also return any liquor/alcohol that was purchased in the last 30 days for people who had stocked up for st pats day. Crazy times.


----------



## Shad Rap

Shutting down the state for 37 people I guess...they gonna do this every year during flu season??


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Shad Rap said:


> Shutting down the state for 37 people I guess...they gonna do this every year during flu season??


With no deaths knock on wood. With 26 confirmed this morning, I’m beginning to think that a lot people has had it already going back to February 1 and just thought they had the flu.


----------



## PapawSmith

There is something to this that they just are not sharing with us, the move today to close PRIVATE business is a real game changer. Maybe this did not really impact too much of us all yesterday, but just watch how it changes your life next week. I’m pissed to say the least.


----------



## JamesF

Just listened to Ohio's Governor's live online address. Sounds depressing. I think that my brother may have it,he's been sick for about 4 or 5 weeks, and was fired from his job for missing too much work. He doesn't have a phone, or a car. The wife is going to check on him, she's a nurse, and I am at more risk than her. This whole thing is getting out control fast. The health department's are reporting that the infection rate is now being measured by the hours. If anyone is out of work for this, unemployment is available, with no waiting week. So payments can start sooner. A lot of information is available at ohio.gov


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

PapawSmith said:


> There is something to this that they just are not sharing with us, the move today to close PRIVATE business is a real game changer. Maybe this did not really impact too much of us all yesterday, but just watch how it changes your life next week. I’m pissed to say the least.


I think they are just trying to do what Italy, Iran, and Spain did not do to try and stay ahead of the game. Italy has already come out and said they handled it The wrong way from the onset.


----------



## OptOutside440

Travel will be next, they are releasing these precautions slowly as to not scare the public as much as possible. This is only the beginning. Shtf is happening


----------



## Pooka

Here is a kick, despite being careful I have somehow picked up a head cold. Now everyone is looking at me funny. LOL

Yes, it is just a head cold, nothing but an annoyance.


----------



## Pooka

OptOutside440 said:


> Travel will be next, they are releasing these precautions slowly as to not scare the public as much as possible. This is only the beginning. Shtf is happening


No it isn't. But I bet there will be some good yard sales in a couple months.-- TP and Mac 'n' Cheese at fire sale prices ;P


----------



## Pooka

CFIden said:


> Thanks for your service Sharks.



Well, thank you. But while I worked for the DoD, I was not in the Military. 
It's OK to show some love for our Contractors though, its not often that we get a back pat.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Better safe than sorry....


----------



## Pooka

Snakecharmer said:


> Better safe than sorry....


If you are talking about me, I am a couple days in, no dying from this one, just a sore nose from blowing.


----------



## EnonEye

now I know why Dad always wore that hat "If you're not part of the solution you're part of the problem.!" My favorite hat, "think deeeeper.!"


----------



## Snakecharmer

Please keep the politics out of this thread, Its a good place to share info. Please....


----------



## crittergitter

Everyone that I know that is a nurse or a doctor are SUPER concerned!!! This stuff aint no joke folks!!


----------



## LoneWolfNoPack

Why did my post get deleted? Which rule did it violate?


----------



## Buster24

This isn’t a joke....daughter-in-law works for state of Ohio HD in Cubs and is close to this situation and Dewine and says this is for real....I believe her, but many people are treating this as a joke!!!!


----------



## Muddy

My 11 year old daughter is sick. Coughing, upper chest congestion, and sore throat. I first heard her coughing around 5 am. She’s been in bed most of the day. She’s sleeping now after a dose of cough medicine. We live in a rural area and don’t go out much. Whatever she has came from school more than likely.


----------



## LoneWolfNoPack

Buster24 said:


> This isn’t a joke....daughter-in-law works for state of Ohio HD in Cubs and is close to this situation and Dewine and says this is for real....I believe her, but many people are treating this as a joke!!!!


Can you define what you mean by people treating it as a joke? I don't know anyone treating it as a joke. I do know many people including myself who respect the magnitude of the situation but choose not to overreact to a problem that certainly will pass. This isn't the first nor the last serious virus we have faced. By effectively temporarily shutting down our state's economy and crashing the stock market, society has lost its reasoning and made this delicate situation even worse. Its absolutely ridiculous that i cant even buy my family toilet paper right now. If last week you would have told me the series of events that are currently unfolding I wouldn't believe it in a million years.


----------



## Snakecharmer

LoneWolfNoPack said:


> Why did my post get deleted? Which rule did it violate?


Politics


----------



## Row v. Wade

A friend of mine shared this letter. I hesitated sharing because I am not in the medical field. If anyone in the medical field can hit on some of the points, Id appreciate it. I have found a few points in here helpful. Here goes.

From A doctor I know from Russia works in a hospital in Shenzhen, he transferred to study the Wuhan pneumonia virus sent me this ....

If you have a runny nose and sputum from a cold, you cannot be a carrier of a coronavirus infection. Coronavirus pneumonia is a dry cough without a runny nose. This is the easiest way to determine. Please tell your friends, if you understand, about identification and prevention.

The Wuhan virus is not heat-resistant and dies at a temperature of 26-27 degrees. So drink more hot water. More often and longer under the sun. Hot water is not a medicine, it is useful for health, it is effective for all viruses. 

Doctor's advice on coronavirus:

1. The virus is quite large in size (the cell diameter is about 400-500 nm), so the usual honey mask can in principle filter out. If the infected person sneezes in front of you or passes at a distance of up to 3 meters from you, the infection will simply fall to the ground, it will not be able to fly.

2. If the virus gets on the surface of the metal, it will live at least 12 hours. Therefore, if you come into contact with any metal surface, wash your hands thoroughly with soap and water.

3. The virus can remain active on the tissue for 6-12 hours. Regular Laundry detergent should kill the virus. Winter clothing, enough to dry in the sun to kill the virus.

About symptoms of the disease itself-pneumonia caused by coronavirus:

1. After penetration into the throat, dryness of the throat may appear, which is found in angina. It will last 3-4 days

2. Then the virus will merge with the nasal fluid, get into the trachea, and then into the lungs, causing inflammation of the lungs. This process will take from 5 to 6 days.

3. With coronavirus pneumonia, a high temperature and difficulty breathing appear. Nasal congestion is not like normal congestion, you get the feeling that you are drowning in water. In this case, you should immediately consult a doctor.

About prevention:

1. The most common way to get infected is to touch people, so you need to wash your hands often. 

2. In addition to frequent hand washing, you can gargle with Betadine to eliminate or minimize the effects of bacteria while they are still in the throat (before they get into the lungs..). 

Be extremely careful and careful, drink more heated water.


----------



## LoneWolfNoPack

Snakecharmer said:


> Politics


 There is a post 3 up from this one which mentions Dewine, which is what mine did as well. It's impossible to talk about the developing situation without mentioning politics.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

stormfront said:


> Jack Ma, the richest billionaire in China, is donating 1,000,000 masks and 500,000 test kits to the U.S. Lots of questions and thoughts going through my head but I'll keep my opinions to myself.


He can keep em


----------



## CoonDawg92

bobk said:


> Speedy recovery Lewis!





Saugeyefisher said:


> Ditto... an glad to here your at home getting rest,and sounds like you handled it the way it should be handled.


Just to clarify, I do not think Lewis is sick. He was reposting info from Facebook, my wife had told me about this today.

Lewis - if I am wrong, forgive me and take care!


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## Burkcarp1

Saugeye Tom said:


> He can keep em


I don


Saugeye Tom said:


> He can keep em


yes sir!! I wouldn’t touch them!


----------



## Buster24

LoneWolfNoPack said:


> Can you define what you mean by people treating it as a joke? I don't know anyone treating it as a joke. I do know many people including myself who respect the magnitude of the situation but choose not to overreact to a problem that certainly will pass. This isn't the first nor the last serious virus we have faced. By effectively temporarily shutting down our state's economy and crashing the stock market, society has lost its reasoning and made this delicate situation even worse. Its absolutely ridiculous that i cant even buy my family toilet paper right now. If last week you would have told me the series of events that are currently unfolding I wouldn't believe it in a million years.


lone wolf..
Maybe not as a joke, but many are not given it the respect that DeWine thinks it deserves....Hmong....I am sorry with your current situation and hope you make it through this.....I don’t go along how the governor is handling this as I feel it is hurting many of our citizens.....with thought maybe something else could have been done....for Dewine’s sake, This better be the right decision because his neck is on the line...good luck to you and your family!!!!!


----------



## Row v. Wade

Muddy said:


> My 11 year old daughter is sick. Coughing, upper chest congestion, and sore throat. I first heard her coughing around 5 am. She’s been in bed most of the day. She’s sleeping now after a dose of cough medicine. We live in a rural area and don’t go out much. Whatever she has came from school more than likely.


God bless your family Muddy. She’s in our Prayers


----------



## PolkRunKid

I decided today that I can not visit my parents this week. I might change mind next week. They are both old. I can drop off stuff & talk via phone. Before restaurant news.


----------



## M R DUCKS

Shad rap:
Thought:
IF you don’t do enough....and things worsen, you should have done more
IF you do too much, ..and things improve quickly, oh ! You over reacted.... it’s a lose-lose for a leader
....it may not kill many ( but it might) but what is trying to be avoided is overwhelming our hospitals.
There is a limited number of ventilators for the serious!

Here’ a bowl of M&Ms, only 1 is poisonous..... do you want to take the chance?


----------



## BuckeyeFishinNut

We needed a few things from the store today, not 500 rolls of TP but normal, every day food stuff. Went to Walmart at around 9am, light crowd but that store was hit. No TP, no eggs, very little milk, and no bottled water. Rice gone, dried beans gone, most canned veggies gone, noodles gone, and spaghetti sauce mostly gone. Bread, buns, rolls, burrito shells, all gone. Luckily I didn't need any of that.

When my wife got home from church, which she said was a very light crowd, we went to Sams Club. We needed coffee, Advil, and a couple other things. All of their chicken was gone (frozen and fresh) except for chicken wings, along with most of their beef (fresh and frozen) besides higher end steaks and most of their pork. TP gone, bottled water gone, eggs gone, milk gone, all bread products gone, and most of their cheese.

We need a little bit of meat for the freezer. I am gonna just head to a local butcher, a little more expensive but better quality and he should have stock.

This stuff is out of control and this was before DeWine closed restaurants. I got a feeling there are gonna be a lot of people with a **** load of spoiled food and wasted money. Its amazing how irrational some people are from fear.


----------



## ICENUT

Wait a month the stores will be even more bare if open at all.It will get crazy!!!


----------



## M R DUCKS

Iran reported 113 new deaths, today
Italy reported 368 new deaths in 24 hrs. Greater than a 7% death rate


----------



## Muddy

My daughter is pretty sick. All the exact symptoms of Covid 19. We were a week late on isolation. We have everything that we need to take care of her, and she’s a trooper. This is a parents worst night mare.


----------



## Saugeye Tom




----------



## PapawSmith

Muddy said:


> My daughter is pretty sick. All the exact symptoms of Covid 19. We were a week late on isolation. We have everything that we need to take care of her, and she’s a trooper. This is a parents worst night mare.


Prayers Brother.


----------



## Saugeyefisher

Muddy said:


> My daughter is pretty sick. All the exact symptoms of Covid 19. We were a week late on isolation. We have everything that we need to take care of her, and she’s a trooper. This is a parents worst night mare.


Here's to a fast recovery for her!


----------



## KaGee

LoneWolfNoPack said:


> There is a post 3 up from this one which mentions Dewine, which is what mine did as well. It's impossible to talk about the developing situation without mentioning politics.


This thread was closed once already because certain folks had to interject politics.
I find no such post you describe even going back a page. And simply mentioning the governors name does not in and of itself insert politics.

At least two others took your comment as political... one who's reply was also deleted.
So, we can, we have since the reopen and will continue to keep politics out of here. Not just this thread, but any. There are a million and one forums out there that you can comment on politics until your keyboard is wore out. _*OGF*_ is not one of them.

K


----------



## CoonDawg92

Praying for your family Muddy.


----------



## BuckeyeFishin07

Muddy said:


> My daughter is pretty sick. All the exact symptoms of Covid 19. We were a week late on isolation. We have everything that we need to take care of her, and she’s a trooper. This is a parents worst night mare.


Prayers for your daughter and the rest of the family!


----------



## bobberbucket

Muddy said:


> My daughter is pretty sick. All the exact symptoms of Covid 19. We were a week late on isolation. We have everything that we need to take care of her, and she’s a trooper. This is a parents worst night mare.


Prayers  


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## 1more

Saugeye Tom said:


> View attachment 347067


Why isn’t Russia on the list????


----------



## Snakecharmer

1more said:


> Why isn’t Russia on the list????


They have 63...look at post 1....


----------



## 1more

Snakecharmer said:


> They have 63...look at post 1....


Sorry I was looking at ST post and didn’t see it..


----------



## cement569

muddy, she looks like a very tough little trooper, hope you and your family weather this storm....im more than sure you will


----------



## fastwater

Muddy,
Like others have stated, your daughter and family have our prayers...


----------



## Shad Rap

Anyone heard of a 14 day national lockdown coming up?..everything closed except hospitals and care centers pretty much.


----------



## loweman165

Shad Rap said:


> Anyone heard of a 14 day national lockdown coming up?..everything closed except hospitals and care centers pretty much.


I just read an insider text from a UH hospital employee that claims its coming in 48-72 hours. I don't know if I believe it but alot is happening I never thought would.


----------



## yonderfishin

Shad Rap said:


> Anyone heard of a 14 day national lockdown coming up?..everything closed except hospitals and care centers pretty much.


Im not sure I believe it yet but a coworker just told me she is related to someone in the house of representatives and it was confirmed to her that this is in fact coming. Another source said more national guard troops are prepping for activation. There is so much disinformation out there that none of this could be true for all I know but this sure seems like the next step , whether its actually warranted or not so I cant totally write it off.


----------



## ditchdigger

Just my thought, why is the President and Vice President standing together when addressing our nation? Shouldn’t they always be separated during this time? Just my opinion!


----------



## LoneWolfNoPack

KaGee said:


> This thread was closed once already because certain folks had to interject politics.
> I find no such post you describe even going back a page. And simply mentioning the governors name does not in and of itself insert politics.
> 
> At least two others took your comment as political... one who's reply was also deleted.
> So, we can, we have since the reopen and will continue to keep politics out of here. Not just this thread, but any. There are a million and one forums out there that you can comment on politics until your keyboard is wore out. _*OGF*_ is not one of them.
> 
> K


You better re-read if that's the case. I've seen several posts mention Dewine, but none of them were offensive. I actually respect the no politics rule and hate speaking politics myself. My post however was not arguing politics, rather stating a fact about Dewine....same as other posts on this threat that were not deleted.

I was a member of GofishOhio since early 2000's and was one of the first members of OhioGameFishing under a different name (traphunter) when it was first created. Most all the originals are no longer active in this site and I'm quickly remembering why I stopped being active on this site as well. I'll quit posting now and go back to just lurking like I have done the past 10 years. Im sure this post will be deleted too. Have a good one folks.


----------



## Redheads

MUDDY...Prayers sent Buddy,stay strong for you and your family


----------



## Redheads

With the shutting down of private business and the talk of a 14 day lock down im guessing the military will be patrolling....Does this mean the president will be declaring marshal law ?


----------



## $diesel$

Many prayers for child, muddy.


----------



## $diesel$

I am noticing some of the "don't get excited" guys posts are a little more serious now and i'm glad of that.
All the stuff you guys can't find, is all up on Amazon except for "name brand" T/P and paper towels.
I went the extra mile yesterday and bought the roll towels and despenser as i figure this is going to last for a while.
I also want to pass out sour grapes to all the knuckleheads buying the grocers out of product thinking they're gonna make money later by gouging others.
A last thought, i'm curious as to the many, many, infected folks who swear they've had no contact with others who may be infected.
Perhaps as of late, if not for a while now, this virus may becoming air bourn? Maybe it was from the beginning.
I've never seen a virus so aggressively infect the many people so quickly.
And as far as the pros know, it hasn't mutated yet. Lord knows what type of monster will be set upon us once it does.
Good luck everyone, stay sanitary. 

Just some of my thoughts, no fear intended.


----------



## Lewis

WHOA!!! I have to clear something up! I am not sick at all nor is any member of my family. I was just sharing a post from a woman named Amy Brock in Summit County who made the facebook post that I shared!


----------



## Lundy

Lewis said:


> WHOA!!! I have to clear something up! I am not sick at all nor is any member of my family. I was just sharing a post from a woman named Amy Brock in Summit County who made the facebook post that I shared!


Lewis. I knew it wasn't about you when the poster said they were 48 and mentioned their husband


----------



## threeten

Lundy said:


> Lewis. I knew it wasn't about you when the poster said they were 48 and mentioned their husband


That weirded me out a bit too!


----------



## Shad Rap

M R DUCKS said:


> Shad rap:
> Thought:
> IF you don’t do enough....and things worsen, you should have done more
> IF you do too much, ..and things improve quickly, oh ! You over reacted.... it’s a lose-lose for a leader
> ....it may not kill many ( but it might) but what is trying to be avoided is overwhelming our hospitals.
> There is a limited number of ventilators for the serious!
> 
> Here’ a bowl of M&Ms, only 1 is poisonous..... do you want to take the chance?


Like I said...I've already had Covid-19 (99% sure) along with thousands of other people, over a month ago...so did my wife...and you can't get it again...so yes...I'll eat all those M&M's.
It's been around for awhile...the US is late.


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

Shad Rap said:


> Like I said...I've already had Covid-19 (99% sure) along with thousands of other people, over a month ago...so did my wife...and you can't get it again...so yes...I'll eat all those M&M's.
> It's been around for awhile...the US is late.


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

Here is an official email coming from our internal HR lead direct from the head of Communicable Disease Reporting for Public Health (slightly edited for privacy):

I have been in contact with Communicable Disease Reporting for Public Health. They were notified earlier today by the Butler County Health Department that one of our employees tested positive for COVID-19. 

According to their contact investigation, all of our employees in the office fall into the *low risk exposure* category. Low risk exposure is defined as being in the same indoor environment (e.g. a classroom, hospital waiting room, office space) with a confirmed case for a prolonged period of time.

Recommendations from the health department for management of Low Risk Contacts:

*No Restriction on movement*
Self-observation (means people should remain alert for symptoms of COVID-19; fever, cough, difficulty breathing. If they develop any of these symptoms they should limit contact with others and seek advice by telephone from a healthcare provider to determine if medical evaluation is needed.
They also define *medium risk exposure* as employees that had *close contact* with the confirmed case. Close contact is defined as being within approximately 6 feet of a confirmed case for a prolonged period of time (further defined as face-to-face interaction for a minimum one hour or more). Close contact can occur while caring for, living with, or sharing a room with a case. Medium risk exposure contacts must undergo a 14-day self-isolation/quarantine. 

Of course, as the firm President communicated earlier, if someone feels they should “self-quarantine” for 14 days they should do that. We understand and will support the decisions of employees in the firm if they are uncomfortable working within the office and would prefer to work at home.

Please let me know if you have any additional questions or concerns.

Thank you for your patience and understanding as we work together to meet these challenging times.


----------



## Shad Rap

Stars-n-Stripers said:


> View attachment 347113


Think what you want with your silly memes if it makes you feel better...I could care less.
I know what I went through and I know what my wife went through...it's not a coincidence bud...this virus has been here since the new year...possibly even before then.


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

My entire team is planning to just work at home until we know everybody is healthy - so for awhile. We know it will be disruptive, but we are planning to take it serious. Everybody is going to self quarantine for the safety mostly of others - we have nobody in the high risk (I'm the old guy a healthy 41 yr old and nobody smokes so all good lungs). 

And we had our IT vendors working 2 weeks ago to check and see what would happen if our entire firm worked VPN at home, etc. Luckily we were fine, but we where wanting to be prepared for the worst from a business perspective and now here we are everybody working at home, etc.!


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

Shad Rap may be rubbing a few the wrong way, but I agree and I think this will bare to be the case. The more we learn, the more it certainly appears that this has been in the states since 2019. Another reason arguing over "stats" is just silly - we don't have good stats on this thing. 

What we all know is it is very contagious, strong, can mask symptoms for a period of time, and it can be deadly to those with compromised immune systems, seniors, and anybody with respiratory issues. 

Look, I hate to sound arrogant, but I'm not concerned about myself. I'm still young and healthy with a very strong immune systems. I'm not in a high risk group. Heck we talked last night and we EXPECT to catch this at some point in the cycle. We are not worried...we expect to get real sick (like the flu) and get over it. 

I am concerned about all my neighbors in their 70s & 80s, my father at 70 fighting cancer with a weak system, my buddy down in Perry cty only 27 years old been fighting cancer and has breathing issues. These people are high risk and I'm not so confident how any would react to this. So yea it all sucks, but if we all need to pen ourselves up for 2-3 weeks so be it.


----------



## Outasync

Theres already been documented cases of an infected person that had recovered getting it again so i wouldnt be so sure


----------



## UNCLEMIKE

Have not heard this asked nor answered.... are they working on a test to tell if you have already had it and recovered?


----------



## cement569

i agree. back in January my 2 sons came down with something horrible, both are over 21 my oldest had it so bad he visited the e.r 3 times. he had a bad cough and high fever they told him he had type a flu. he was sick for 2 weeks missed 6 days work, my youngest had it for week but he is a non smoker, so yes America is a day late and a dollar short on this one....they dropped the ball


----------



## Misdirection

UNCLEMIKE said:


> Have not heard this asked nor answered.... are they working on a test to tell if you have already had it and recovered?


I believe most laboratories and hospital systems are focusing on bringing capacity on line to test if someone is currently positive for Covid-19. Not sure anyone is focusing on if someone had already been exposed. But they are using antibodies from previously confirmed positive cases in researching vaccines.

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## bobberbucket

Live update on the Ohio channel coming at 10 AM


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Fish-N-Fool

Things are moving fast and I am not trying to be annoying, but rather the info I am sharing is direct from the gov't authorities.

Communicated moments ago all employees of my firm must daily report to the HR Director. He must report daily by 4pm to Public Health:

All Associates,

As communicated yesterday, due to the two confirmed cases of COVID-19 in our office, Public Health has directed *that all employees *must monitor for fever, cough, and/or shortness of breath *and report to a designated individual* who will need to report by 4:00pm daily to Public Health. *I am that designated individual.*

To implement this directive, until further notice I am asking all employees *to immediately report to me via email or call if they are experiencing fever, cough, and/or shortness of breath*. According to the Public Health directive, I am to report the names of individuals experiencing symptoms for follow up investigation by Public Health officials.

I will periodically send out reminders (_like we need a reminder_!). This action is necessary due to current COVID-19 containment protocol in place due to the declared national emergency.

Let’s stay strong and vigilant in these uncertain and unsettling times, and do our part to help containment. We will certainly make it through this together.


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## Lundy

cement569 said:


> i agree. back in January my 2 sons came down with something horrible, both are over 21 my oldest had it so bad he visited the e.r 3 times. he had a bad cough and high fever they told him he had type a flu. he was sick for 2 weeks missed 6 days work, my youngest had it for week but he is a non smoker, so yes America is a day late and a dollar short on this one....they dropped the ball


Not diminishing what your sons had at all but we do have flu every year in this country and causes coughing and high temperatures. That doesn't mean they had Covid 19. I think people much smarter than you or me would be required to figure that one out.


----------



## fastwater

Thinkin we need to be very careful not to fall into the 'rumor mill' category by spreading non-factual...or non proven, good or bad info that we read off the net. If we do this...we are doing more harm than good and guilty of 'sensationalizing' just like we accuse media of doing.
Talking with my Dr the other day and asking him many questions, he answered many and supported his answers with what research has actually proven beyond doubt. Then there were those questions he answered with "research is leaning towards(submit answer)...but has not yet proven to be 100% factual at this point" category.
Then there were the, "we just don't know yet cause this being a new virus, there are various things developing almost daily and research is getting upgraded all the time" answers.

FWIW...when Dr was asked whether you can contract the virus more than once, his answer fell into the second category of...
"research is leaning towards 'no'...but has not yet proven to be 100% factual at this point" category.
He added that the best answer to the above question at this point was, "it's early in the game with this virus and until more definitive answers from research developed, only time will tell".


----------



## icebucketjohn

Looks like EVERYTHING is gonna get real nasty before it gets better. As Betty Davis once said: " Hold on Fellas. It's gonna be a Bumpy Ride."


----------



## crittergitter

ICENUT said:


> Wait a month the stores will be even more bare if open at all.It will get crazy!!!


Wrong. You are further inciting panic. This is senseless. Please stop!! Most food products are produced domestically. That production won't cease. The stores will have more in stock as the panic dies down in a week or so.


----------



## Lewis

Must watch!
Here is a very level headed explanation on why the current precautions are being taken.

https://www.linkedin.com/posts/will...-PzjB3Ir34zyE7pCWhikzpxLucWDUZx0KLmzhYHc9JPTk


----------



## FOWL BRAWL

Things will improve and get better and we will all learn from this

USA ROCKS


----------



## Legend killer

Illinois has barred use of national/state parks. People were forced off lakes yesterday.


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## loves2fishinohio

We got word this morning that we are to work from home, no going to the office, no branch meetings, if we need supplies from the branch, a manager will deliver them to us, and to plan on this for at least 8 weeks.

I work for a company that has over 12,000 employees.


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## Saltfork

crittergitter said:


> Wrong. You are further inciting panic. This is senseless. Please stop!! Most food products are produced domestically. That production won't cease. The stores will have more in stock as the panic dies down in a week or so.


 I’m not trying to promote fear what so ever. These are just my thoughts as a spectator. Right now we have 37 confirmed cases in Ohio. Look at the frenzy and the stores conditions. Now we are starting to test a lot more numbers are going to sky rocket on confirmed.

This is not going to calm people down.Total opposite and yes it’s sad yet true in my mind. (We’ll see) So I think the stores will be worse if it continues as it has. Then we have the first of the month coming. People on fixed income people on welfare will be hitting the stores seeing some maybe most have not had the funds to go yet. How is that going to be for them? What problems will that cause?

I don’t see this calming down till the spike till people know someone or has someone in their own family that has had it and recovered then I think we will be over the hump.

Honestly tho the frenzy hasn’t even started in my mind. Agin I hope I’m wrong. Wish the best for everyone.


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## icebucketjohn




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## cheezemm2

Imagine your local launch ramp with 3 bass tournaments, a catfish tournament, and 4x the amount of pleasure boaters. Now imagine launching in the middle of that pack and forgetting your drain plug and your motor unable to start. That's what the healthcare system and government is trying to avoid.


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## doegirl

Legend killer said:


> Illinois has barred use of national/state parks. People were forced off lakes yesterday.


Absolutely ridiculous. Complete over reaction on par with hoarding toilet paper. 
Good hand hygiene-ok. Avoid large groups of people-makes sense. Stay home if sick. But what exactly are we doing here closing down lakes and parks?


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## berkshirepresident

cheezemm2 said:


> Imagine your local launch ramp with 3 bass tournaments, a catfish tournament, and 4x the amount of pleasure boaters. Now imagine launching in the middle of that pack and forgetting your drain plug and your motor unable to start. That's what the healthcare system and government is trying to avoid.


and when, exactly, has that EVER happened?
the absurdity of your post unintentionally highlights the absurdity of the gub mint's decision on the ramps.
with the exception of labor day, memorial day, and july 4th weekends, the ramps do NOT have the population density to merit a shut down....IMHO.
tournaments would be cancelled for a multitude of other reasons.


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## lmbchckn

crittergitter said:


> Wrong. You are further inciting panic. This is senseless. Please stop!! Most food products are produced domestically. That production won't cease. The stores will have more in stock as the panic dies down in a week or so.


I,think the real problem is, we already face a large labor shortage in this country, much larger than most realize. If these people become sick, quarantined, whatever, its not really going to mater whats produced domestically. The bread truck wont arrive if theres no one to drive it.


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## STRONGPERSUADER

I had to be rushed to the hospital this morning and just got home. Believe me I didn’t want to go but was in some serious pain all night. But anyway, there was no crowds, no body wearing masks, nothing crazy going on. Lots of empty beds in the ER. The charge nurse told me they had no corona cases as of yet. So maybe that’s why they they were being like just another day at the job. I did have to wear one in the ambulance and I was good with that. This was at an East Cleveland suburb hospital by the way. Seems as tho nothing chaotic is going on yet other than the healthy people doing their nutty things while out and about shopping. Let’s hope it stays this way.


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## cheezemm2

berkshirepresident said:


> and when, exactly, has that EVER happened?
> the absurdity of your post unintentionally highlights the absurdity of the gub mint's decision on the ramps.
> with the exception of labor day, memorial day, and july 4th weekends, the ramps do NOT have the population density to merit a shut down....IMHO.
> tournaments would be cancelled for a multitude of other reasons.


My post was an analogy to someone having a cardiac emergency in the middle of a jam packed hospital. 

I see no reason to shut down launch ramps.


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## Had a Bite

cement569 said:


> i agree. back in January my 2 sons came down with something horrible, both are over 21 my oldest had it so bad he visited the e.r 3 times. he had a bad cough and high fever they told him he had type a flu. he was sick for 2 weeks missed 6 days work, my youngest had it for week but he is a non smoker, so yes America is a day late and a dollar short on this one....they dropped the ball





Lundy said:


> Not diminishing what your sons had at all but we do have flu every year in this country and causes coughing and high temperatures. That doesn't mean they had Covid 19. I think people much smarter than you or me would be required to figure that one out.



Most of the rapid flu test we give are for flu A or Flu B. There have been many times that we have admitted someone to the hospital and then we run a full respiratory panel, which sucks to have done, I feel bad. But when we get the results back it turns out to be a different type flu just not one tested for in the rapid test in the ER. Which then sucks after they have been coughing all over and exposing us for hours the flu or whatever other gross stuff they had. 

Long story short, even if you test negative on the rapid flu test, you could still have the flu.


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## jrose

M R DUCKS said:


> Shad rap:
> Thought:
> IF you don’t do enough....and things worsen, you should have done more
> IF you do too much, ..and things improve quickly, oh ! You over reacted.... it’s a lose-lose for a leader
> ....it may not kill many ( but it might) but what is trying to be avoided is overwhelming our hospitals.
> There is a limited number of ventilators for the serious!
> 
> Here’ a bowl of M&Ms, only 1 is poisonous..... do you want to take the chance?


If it means 99% of people can go back to their normal productive lives and I can buy toilet paper, I'll eat the whole bowl!!


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## Lewis

This is record time to be testing on humans!
https://apnews.com/76b614811eef3295...AP&utm_source=Twitter&utm_campaign=SocialFlow


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## Muddy

My daughter is doing better today. Thanks for the kind words, thoughts, and prayers. As anyone with kids know, it sucks seeing your kids sick. She has more energy today and less coughing. The over the counter cough medicine helped quite a bit.


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## Pooka

A bit of fun and instant karma from the hording/profiteering front--


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## bobk

Muddy said:


> My daughter is doing better today. Thanks for the kind words, thoughts, and prayers. As anyone with kids know, it sucks seeing your kids sick. She has more energy today and less coughing. The over the counter cough medicine helped quite a bit.


Good news Muddy.


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## Dovans

Shad Rap said:


> Anyone heard of a 14 day national lockdown coming up?..everything closed except hospitals and care centers pretty much.


Heard Rumor nothing to substantiate it though.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Muddy said:


> My daughter is doing better today. Thanks for the kind words, thoughts, and prayers. As anyone with kids know, it sucks seeing your kids sick. She has more energy today and less coughing. The over the counter cough medicine helped quite a bit.


Good to hear Mud. She’ll be back to bossin ya around in no time. I can relate, I have 3 girls myself.


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## Outasync

Wolf just announced 14 days every nonessential buisness closure for 14 days in pa


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## bobk

Outasync said:


> Wolf just announced 14 days every nonessential buisness closure for 14 days in pa


The whole state or select counties?


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## STRONGPERSUADER

Dovans said:


> Heard Rumor nothing to substantiate it though.


Big rumor going around that he was going to invoke a lockdown.!But all fake news.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.th...afford-act-national-quarantine-misinformation


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## Outasync

https://www.wkbn.com/news/pennsylvania/governor-orders-covid-19-shutdown-across-pennsylvania/


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## BuckeyeFishin07

Love how these people think this country will survive without businesses running! It is almost hilarious


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## Rooster

The “precautions” that are being taken are far more pernicious than the virus itself.

I’m sure that Ohio will follow suit in the next few days….or hours. These wackos are trying to out-do each other at this point.


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## doegirl

BuckeyeFishin07 said:


> Love how these people think this country will survive without businesses running! It is almost hilarious


Just as funny as the solution that everyone can work from home. As if everyone is a white collar worker. 
And everyone can find childcare for however long the schools are closed.
And certainly everyone has more than enough savings that missing a paycheck or two won't hurt, right?
We're so hyper focused on the disease that we completely lost sight on the very real hardships all these restrictions will cause. First do no harm.


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## snag

News conference on now about canceling Election Day till June 2, still can abstinee vote till June. I’m sure there will be more to come.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Saugeye Tom

I still know. Noone that has been diagnosed


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## Saugeye Tom

A d trump said no 2 week shutdown of the country


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## hatteras1

It's also flu season but if in doubt, they said to call your dr, but don't go to the hospital without a dr request or they may not let you in. Heath (Licking memorial) is supposed to have drive thru testing (In Veh.. about 15 min) May be other places too.


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## Shad Rap

No nationwide lockdown btw...thank god...don't believe the hype.


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## Snakecharmer

Sounds like Ohio dental offices will be closed except for emergencies. Good idea although my wife will be without pay for 2 weeks.


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## JamesF

Legend killer said:


> Illinois has barred use of national/state parks. People were forced off lakes yesterday.


Why the lakes? Are we going to infect the fish?


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## Shad Rap

JamesF said:


> Why the lakes? Are we going to infect the fish?


That's gotta be BS...more misinformation...state parks closed, yes...all the lakes?..I highly doubt that.


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## Fish-N-Fool

It is going to smack a lot of us. The lucky ones will be using up PTO and sick time, etc. Many will be going without pay. Hopefully many have saved a few dimes back and have well stocked cupboards. Some won't be so fortunate. I just saw where a customer left a unanimous$2500 tip at a place because they knew the servers were going to go without. 

My wife hit Meijer today (we have been on vacation before this thing got crazy and had run out of many mostly non essential things before returning yesterday.) They didn't have any TP, just a little pork or chicken (a few packages), zero ground beef or steak out, they did have a few beef roasts (she bought one), plenty of brats, and some seafood. Other than that they were well stocked. She had no trouble loading up the usual stuff including bottled water, millk, bread, etc. 

Luckily we have a well stocked deep freezer so we don't really need any meat, etc. and aren't out looking for those items. I do have family not so well prepared and they live paycheck to paycheck. I already texted an older brother to let him know I had plenty of canned goods, soups and meat if he needs anything. Looks like he will be out of a paycheck the next couple weeks and he still has one young kid to feed. 

I would encourage those of us with well stocked cupboards to think of loved ones who may need a few meals. Remember to extend an olive branch even if just a real informal offer of a meal or canned goods. None of us want to ask for help. It is a lot easier if somebody offers you help to accept it.


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## 1more

Canada just closed its borders.


----------



## Snakecharmer

1more said:


> Canada just closed its borders.


Open for USA citizens


----------



## Freedomfisher

Muddy said:


> My daughter is pretty sick. All the exact symptoms of Covid 19. We were a week late on isolation. We have everything that we need to take care of her, and she’s a trooper. This is a parents worst night mare.


has she been diagnosed?


----------



## Freedomfisher

Legend killer said:


> Illinois has barred use of national/state parks. People were forced off lakes yesterday.


that's a bridge too far. but I'm expecting it to happen here


----------



## Freedomfisher

loves2fishinohio said:


> We got word this morning that we are to work from home, no going to the office, no branch meetings, if we need supplies from the branch, a manager will deliver them to us, and to plan on this for at least 8 weeks.
> 
> I work for a company that has over 12,000 employees.


i work for a ware house that gets its goods from....china and Washington State


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## johnwells

a friend of mine sent me this from the army corps.









Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk


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## bobberbucket

Snakecharmer said:


> Sounds like Ohio dental offices will be closed except for emergencies. Good idea although my wife will be without pay for 2 weeks.


Good thing Governor Dewine made unemployment compensation instantly available for those effected. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Burkcarp1

bobberbucket said:


> Good thing Governor Dewine made unemployment compensation instantly available for those effected.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Not really, but I’ll keep my opinion to myself!


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## JamesF

My Dentist has been closed except for emergency, by the Governor. I was told that Ohio's health department had a part in that.


----------



## bobberbucket

Burkcarp1 said:


> Not really, but I’ll keep my opinion to myself!


It’s not a good thing to be setting fire to all this money but it’s kinda already in motion now. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## JamesF

Burkcarp1 said:


> Not really, but I’ll keep my opinion to myself!


That decision hasn't been approved as yet. Just have to wait to find out. Meanwhile, my brother hasn't a clue. Been to the hospital and they didn't test him, but he's poo,pooing it as just the flu. He looks like crap. I told him to file for unemployment, and got the same thing, I'm not going to bother with that . He lost his part time job for being too sick to work. But I think he just quit because they got on him about it.
Not to be mean, but if you look up Dumbass in the dictionary, you'll see his face .


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## MIGHTY

I stopped at vances on my way home from work at 6:30 and an employee told me in the parking lot the city (obetz) shut them down. He said they’ll be open tomorrow at 10am unless other wise posted. Wanted to stock up on fishing supplies if a lock down happens


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## Burkcarp1

JamesF said:


> That decision hasn't been approved as yet. Just have to wait to find out. Meanwhile, my brother hasn't a clue. Been to the hospital and they didn't test him, but he's poo,pooing it as just the flu. He looks like crap. I told him to file for unemployment, and got the same thing, I'm not going to bother with that . He lost his part time job for being too sick to work. But I think he just quit because they got on him about it.
> Not to be mean, but if you look up Dumbass in the dictionary, you'll see his face .


All I’m saying is that its not a good idea to rely on our government for hand outs.... like I said just my opinion. I have my reasons....


----------



## LEfriend

Lewis said:


> Here is a case from the Akron area...Summit County. This not me! This is lady from the Akron area.
> https://www.facebook.com/abdriscoll1?__tn__=,dlCH-R-R&eid=ARB_ZjJ78hLTLv_9XriDQj3_npDLivGYG6fh81auk9iDKE8H0mFDJH25ALIbNEfF4qOFrS8yW5So9QR7&hc_ref=ARQ8IM3ztrvMxPo-b0pQhBOoCqYrCglXTGW7UlsYRtJS3AG4T4PTA3lu-vrqg2zmu7Q
> Amy Brock is feeling grateful.
> 17 hrs
> 
> 
> So for all the non believers and those who are not taking this seriously, if you need to to KNOW someone who has been diagnosed with the covid-19, well if you are reading this you know me. I am Summit County case#2.
> 
> I became sick quickly Wednesday afternoon. I felt run down and feverish. By the time I got home I had a fever of 99.2. I was uncomfortable, headache, and a cough that was heavy but not producing anything. I fell asleep and woke at 3 am. My heart was racing. I had trouble catching my breath and my chest felt tight every time I coughed. I contacted a great nurse I know...she said go in, but call first. I called the ER, told them my symptoms and the had me call a closed ohio dept of health number. I was clearly in distress so my nurse called them back and said I was coming in. It's a good thing I did. My BP was very low and my heart rate was very high. These are not good signs on top of fever and cough. They admitted me and I was tested for every single other thing and then they ran the covid test.
> 
> I am the face of this infection. It is brutal and I'm a healthy 48 year old with no underlying conditions. I'm not 100% better but I'm home resting. Please take this seriously. People you love, their lives may depend on it.
> 
> I'm happy to answer any questions in between naps and hydration.
> 
> *****update...edit
> My ex was in Germany the week before I became ill. He has no symptoms. My children have no symptoms. Per the Summit County Health Department we are all being monitored. My test was POSITIVE. I was in patient at Ahuja from early Thursday till today. Fluids and pain meds and fever meds were all they could give me. My highest fever was 102.
> My son did not go to school from the moment I became ill. Prior to my becoming ill...I was at work and he was at school...because we were not ill and had no reason to suspect we were exposed in any way.
> We do NOT know where the exposure came from.


God bless and I wish you a full recovery. Thanks for sharing. I still can’t believe with all the pictures stories and facts in the news that any studious person needs to be convinced this is real and not over blown


----------



## Dovans

MIGHTY said:


> I stopped at vances on my way home from work at 6:30 and an employee told me in the parking lot the city (obetz) shut them down. He said they’ll be open tomorrow at 10am unless otherwise posted. Wanted to stock up on fishing supplies a lock down happens


fishing supplies? ah huh...suuuuurrree


----------



## buckeyebowman

Burkcarp1 said:


> All I’m saying is that its not a good idea to rely on our government for hand outs.... like I said just my opinion. I have my reasons....


I don't look at unemployment compensation as a government handout. Especially when it's the government causing your unemployment! Welfare is a government handout!


----------



## LEfriend

Saugeye Tom said:


> He can keep em


Actually our daughter-in-law who is treating chemo patients at a major Columbus hospital says they are out of them and she would not be too proud to have them. She is putting her life at risk!


----------



## MIGHTY

Dovans said:


> fishing supplies? ah huh...suuuuurrree


 lol no I’m serious. I’ve always got a decent supply of ammo. I noticed yesterday while I was out my supply of senkos and hooks were dwindling


----------



## Muddy

Freedomfisher said:


> has she been diagnosed?


No. Pediatrician said to stay home as long as she continues to improve.


----------



## threeten

Muddy said:


> No. Pediatrician said to stay home as long as she continues to improve.


So glad to hear your daughter is doing better today.


----------



## KaGee




----------



## PapawSmith

Burkcarp1 said:


> All I’m saying is that its not a good idea to rely on our government for hand outs.... like I said just my opinion. I have my reasons....


I have been working for 45 years, unemployment insurance has been deducted from my check every working week of my life, and I have never collected any. I have now long been an employer and pay unemployment insurance every week on a pretty good size group of employees that most of which never need to collect. We are a just small example of thousands of companies and workers that function the same, how in the hell do you consider all of these surplus funds to be “handouts”? That’s what this money is for, and that’s why it is available and should be used.


----------



## $diesel$

Real glad to hear that, muddy.


----------



## TomC

Was at rural king, sold out of ammo except for odd rifle sizes, I bought the last personal defense 450 bushmaster box!


----------



## Burkcarp1

PapawSmith said:


> I have been working for 45 years, unemployment insurance has been deducted from my check every working week of my life, and I have never collected any. I have now long been an employer and pay unemployment insurance every week on a pretty good size group of employees that most of which never need to collect. We are a just small example of thousands of companies and workers that function the same, how in the hell do you consider all of these surplus funds to be “handouts”? That’s what this money is for, and that’s why it is available and should be used.


I understand.It is being said that people can get it if they paid in or not that’s what I’m talking about.


----------



## fastwater

MIGHTY said:


> lol no I’m serious. *I’ve always got a decent supply of ammo.* I noticed yesterday while I was out my supply of senkos and hooks were dwindling


Not me!
Took all my ammo and hardware and voluntarily turned it all in many moons ago.
Should a kept it and traded it for toilet paper.


----------



## JamesF

MIGHTY said:


> lol no I’m serious. I’ve always got a decent supply of ammo. I noticed yesterday while I was out my supply of senkos and hooks were dwindling


Something fishy, going on around here!


----------



## JamesF

I have worked and paid into unemployment insurance, through my employer. And have collected benefits many times. Being layed off lessened the financial costs for a business. On another note, I was FFF in North Canton on Friday. The cashier said that Thursday, that store alone, sold $30k of ammo. I never had a reason to go and buy ammo in bulk. I reload all that I would ever need . I have a powder safe,that is from a military complex, bought at their auction when they replaced some older stuff. My friend says, I should turn it into a humidor . Not gonna happen! Insurance company wouldn't cover anything if it was in the house.  . Meanwhile back on farm , I've worried about a lightning strike. Not much in the barn worth anything, but what a sight it would be! I think the powder would just burn bright. When you open the lid and it stinks, time burn some out of service powder.


----------



## hailtothethief

Puerto rico is on lockdown. No one is allowed to leave home. With exceptions for groceries or to go to the doctor. Coming to the states soon


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## icebucketjohn




----------



## Redheads




----------



## $diesel$

I was on line for two hours yesterday trying to find plain 9mm ammo. Unless you want to buy a 2-3 hundred dollar case, forget it.


----------



## BuckeyeFishinNut

Just a heads up if you live in Eastern Ohio and are looking for meat, Jacob and Sons in Martins Ferry has tons of meat. They are a wholesaler and sell to many local restaurants(that are now closed) but also sell to the general public. I stopped in there yesterday to pick up some chicken, a couple steaks, and some sausage. The girl said they have plenty of meat, but its taking them some time to package it so I would call ahead or make an online order and pick it up. I only waited like 10 minutes, so it wasn't a big deal.


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## Fish-N-Fool

Diesel - AimSurplus in Monroe has copious amounts of ammo including new brass 9mm starting at just over $8 box. You can order and pickup.

I buy all my 9mm and .40 ammo here. I can never find a better price anywhere. I just stopped down picked up 6 used 50 cal ammo cans and 2,000 rounds 9mm. They have a warehouse full of skids of ammo


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

Ohio State built a website that is updated by the minute with information and information specific to Ohio:

https://wexnermedical.osu.edu/featu...pJobID=1664148695&spReportId=MTY2NDE0ODY5NQS2


----------



## $diesel$

Fish-N-Fool said:


> Diesel - AimSurplus in Monroe has copious amounts of ammo including new brass 9mm starting at just over $8 box. You can order and pickup.
> 
> I buy all my 9mm and .40 ammo here. I can never find a better price anywhere. I just stopped down picked up 6 used 50 cal ammo cans and 2,000 rounds 9mm. They have a warehouse full of skids of ammo[/QUOTE
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you, my friend.


----------



## $diesel$

Thank you.


----------



## Saltfork

doegirl said:


> Just as funny as the solution that everyone can work from home. As if everyone is a white collar worker.
> And everyone can find childcare for however long the schools are closed.
> And certainly everyone has more than enough savings that missing a paycheck or two won't hurt, right?
> We're so hyper focused on the disease that we completely lost sight on the very real hardships all these restrictions will cause. First do no harm.


Very well stated!


----------



## Rooster

Official estimate of infections in Ohio on 3/12 = 100,000

Confirmed case in Ohio on 3/17 = 50

Confirmed deaths in Ohio = 0

Individuals subjected to financial insecurity over providing for their families in Ohio = Millions


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## bridgeman

We're definitely in uncharted territory here, hopefully things will level out. Kinda worried about peeps who are blowing this off and not at least making some preparations to hunker down and let things stabilize. I was directed to stay home and work remotely yesterday, I know the majority of us don't have that luxury and need to go to work to keep the wolf from the door. Hopefully some middle ground can be reached with lenders and such so it doesn't damage peeps that aren't fortunate enough to have the funds to get em through this. Time will tell


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## Saltfork

I figured I would post this here. By no way or means is this meant to be political due to the name of the site. Anyhow it’s basically a report from regular people living across the country on what’s going on in there towns there grocery stores and the article is pretty good as well. Anyhow for those interested even if you don’t read the article just click on the comment section. Pretty interesting . If this is out of line please delete.

https://theconservativetreehouse.co...l-stocked-is-your-neighborhood-grocery-store/


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## bobberbucket

Here’s a link for those who don’t use Facebook to watch the governor live at 2 today. 





Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## EnonEye

the worst in people is beginning to come out, we'll soon see how evil this "me and only me" society really is, this is not how we should be, sad, may be time to break out that joint I've been saving since my chemo lol 

double post - mods delete this post if you have time please tanx


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## EnonEye

went grocery shopping today with intent of stopping to vote in way home. No TP, no sanitizing wipes, no paper plates, no tissues, no paper towels and no open voting polls. The worst in people is beginning to come out, we'll soon see how evil this "me and only me" society really is. This is not how we should be, sad, may be time to break out that joint I've been saving since my chemo


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## mas5588

Rooster said:


> Official estimate of infections in Ohio on 3/12 = 100,000
> 
> Confirmed case in Ohio on 3/17 = 50
> 
> Confirmed deaths in Ohio = 0
> 
> Individuals subjected to financial insecurity over providing for their families in Ohio = Millions



I came here to post something like this, but on a national scale. Just read that we have 5,000 confirmed cases. Using the 80% of cases are mild symptoms, that means there are 1,000 in the United States hospitalized right now (give or take) due to this virus. Probably less, because even the moderate symptoms don't require hospitalization. 

For the record, that is 0.0003% of the population. or, 3 in 1,000,000...or, 999,997 out of every million people are not seriously affected by this. For the 1,000 in hospitals is it serious? Heck yeah!

Italy is considered the absolute worst case scenario....Italy has something like 26,000 cases out of 60,500,000 people. That is 0.04% of the population. Or 9,996 out of 10,000 are unaffected. 

This is serious. Agree. Social distancing and the likely will help. Agree. 

Should we be panic buying entire grocery stores? Nah. 

Have enough food to get you through a couple weeks should there be a lockdown. You should obviously have more on hand, but 2-wks is a good starting point. Ration a bit if necessary. 

Have fun with the fam. Go on walks. Go fishing. Have a cocktail. Make babies...

Imagine how busy OBs will be come December. Coronials...I've heard they will be called. 

Relax a bit. We'll get thru this!


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## Misdirection

mas5588 said:


> I came here to post something like this, but on a national scale. Just read that we have 5,000 confirmed cases. Using the 80% of cases are mild symptoms, that means there are 1,000 in the United States hospitalized right now (give or take) due to this virus. Probably less, because even the moderate symptoms don't require hospitalization.
> 
> For the record, that is 0.0003% of the population. or, 3 in 1,000,000...or, 999,997 out of every million people are not seriously affected by this. For the 1,000 in hospitals is it serious? Heck yeah!
> 
> Italy is considered the absolute worst case scenario....Italy has something like 26,000 cases out of 60,500,000 people. That is 0.04% of the population. Or 9,996 out of 10,000 are unaffected.
> 
> This is serious. Agree. Social distancing and the likely will help. Agree.
> 
> Should we be panic buying entire grocery stores? Nah.
> 
> Have enough food to get you through a couple weeks should there be a lockdown. You should obviously have more on hand, but 2-wks is a good starting point. Ration a bit if necessary.
> 
> Have fun with the fam. Go on walks. Go fishing. Have a cocktail. Make babies...
> 
> Imagine how busy OBs will be come December. Coronials...I've heard they will be called.
> 
> Relax a bit. We'll get thru this!


The math on Italy is a little off. 26000/60500000=0.0004 of the population. Granted, if your one of those unlucky people, I'm sure it's bad. 

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## mas5588

Misdirection said:


> The math on Italy is a little off. 26000/60500000=0.0004 of the population. Granted, if your one of those unlucky people, I'm sure it's bad.
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


Completely agree and I tried to state it above. I'm all about taking it serious, but I don't know that we need to be freaking out. 

And 0.0004 is 0.04%, no? Anywho...doesn't matter. EVERYONE!!!!!.....be good to one another and try to enjoy the little things in the coming months. Wash your dang hands and stop pickin' ur nose!


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## mas5588

Oh, and starting tomorrow I have ZERO reason to leave the house. 

Working from home, kiddo is doing school at home, wifes at home, freezers are stocked pretty good and a good supply of TP. I'm happy this is happening after daylight savings too. Allows for walks and maybe a quick fishing trip in the evenings.

Anyone is welcome to reach out here (or on the grams) to fish. I bet we could stay >6ft apart, especially if wading or walking the bank!


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## Misdirection

mas5588 said:


> Completely agree and I tried to state it above. I'm all about taking it serious, but I don't know that we need to be freaking out.
> 
> And 0.0004 is 0.04%, no? Anywho...doesn't matter. EVERYONE!!!!!.....be good to one another and try to enjoy the little things in the coming months. Wash your dang hands and stop pickin' ur nose!


I stand corrected, your math is impeccable my friend. Mine on the other hand seems rusty! 

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## Steelheader88

My opinion only, but I am glad science and precaution is being exercised by our Ohio government and medical officials, and, that they are being fairly transparent in their decision making and expectations of the pandemic. No sugar coating or extraneous promises. Yes, scientific models are just that, models based on estimates which are guesses etc. But they also stated it's going to be bad and we are undersupplied- sounds honest. I know what is in the hearts of most people here, that we can enjoy the spring sunshine and fishing responsibly and while healthy.


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## loves2fishinohio

Now if the government comes through and starts sending out checks like they are saying they want to do, I'll stay at home as long as they want. All our friends know we are here, all our neighbors know we are willing to run errands and store trips for them, and we are enjoying each other in our family and making the most of it. 

We also have plenty of food, plenty of ammo, and a big ass dog.


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## BuckeyeFishinNut

Had to do some stuff around the house today. Ran out to get some gas because I had a quarter tank. Stopped at the grocery store to pick up a couple things to make chili this weekend. Upset I couldn't go vote today, halting our democratic process was an over reach IMO. Personally, I am tired of the daily updates from the state and federal officials. Cases are going to go up, don't need a daily update to find out 10 more people tested positive for it in Ohio. I almost feel it does more harm than good and incites panic. Hell, he brings up the topic of the Ohio National Guard helping with medical needs and instantly people think we are going to go into martial law. My TV has been off most of the day, other than when I was watching some fishing shows on the sportsman's channel. It will probably stay that way for a while.

I am going fishing tomorrow all day, I hope some of you are as well. Be safe and use common sense.


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## Legend killer

Why are people so worried about ammo?


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## BuckeyeFishin07

Legend killer said:


> Why are people so worried about ammo?


They are worried about people breaking into their houses to steal things.


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## Dovans

I have a killer pig that for what it is, is extremely fast. Still shocks me how fast she moves. I am hoping to fish tomorrow as well. Unless they call and beg my butt to come into work.


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## ress

Y2K. Lol

Sent from my LGLS990 using Tapatalk


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## Slatebar

I am retired now, but worked for over 45 years in Ohio, WV, and Ga. and I don't remember ever having unemployment ins. deducted from any of my pay checks. I thought that fell on the employers turf..


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## Burkcarp1

loves2fishinohio said:


> Now if the government comes through and starts sending out checks like they are saying they want to do, I'll stay at home as long as they want. All our friends know we are here, all our neighbors know we are willing to run errands and store trips for them, and we are enjoying each other in our family and making the most of it.
> 
> We also have plenty of food, plenty of ammo, and a big ass dog.


Go ahead and rely on the government...I’ll pass!


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## JamesF

It usually does. Depends on what your employer offers. We didn't pay for unemployment for years, then, we were offered better medical insurance, by paying part of unemployment. Could have gone the other way, but most of us have reached a point in life, that medical was a better solution. Then in 2008/09,most of us were laid off, and the company picked up the payments.


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## TomC

Hey fyi if you want to treat yourselfs to a good meal while all this lockdown is going on flemings at the greene is having a killer special. They are doing 40 off 100.00 order, and on Tuesday for 125.00 you get a 38oz tomahawk ribeye, 2 salads, 2 sides and 2 deserts and they are doing delivery to your car. Figured I'd pass this on. Me and the wife just ate great and, well they load up the portions as well, so we got 4 meals out of this special.


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## Fish-N-Fool

I'm with you slatebar - I believe employers pay unemployment premiums and employees shelter no cost there.

I just stopped at Gordons to get a 3.5 gallon jug of peanut oil as we are all out and it's time to fry fish tonight! No fresh meat, but plenty of everything else. I grabbed a half dozen nice looking tomatoes. They were unpacking fresh produce by the case - broccoli, lettuce, tomatoes, yellow onions and potatoes. Tons of frozen meats and goodies; mostly fully stocked shelves. It was busy but what I would expect at 5:15.

Since I was there I picked up some cheese sticks, onion rings and a few lbs of breaded okra

The only things that seems scarce is TP!!!! I saw a Restaurant giving away a free roll of TP with pickup orders over $30!LOL


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## FSHNERIE

Slatebar said:


> I am retired now, but worked for over 45 years in Ohio, WV, and Ga. and I don't remember ever having unemployment ins. deducted from any of my pay checks. I thought that fell on the employers turf..


Take my word. 

Employees Do Not pay Unemployment. 

Unemployment is a Tax . Employers pay a percentage of their payroll as a tax.

As a Employer, I added to the cost of goods. ITS overhead.

Passed on to the consumer. 
No Employee ever pays into Unemployment. 

Period.


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## PapawSmith

Slatebar said:


> I am retired now, but worked for over 45 years in Ohio, WV, and Ga. and I don't remember ever having unemployment ins. deducted from any of my pay checks. I thought that fell on the employers turf..


Unemployment insurance is not deducted from your paycheck, it is paid on your behalf, in your name, by your employer and it is paid every week until a specified value is reached in a calendar year, like social security, but not near as high a number. I would think that most folks have more contributions made on their behalf than they ever collect.


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## multi species angler

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/sylvia-browne-coronavirus/


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## Freedomfisher

Fish-N-Fool said:


> I'm with you slatebar - I believe employers pay unemployment premiums and employees shelter no cost there.
> 
> I just stopped at Gordons to get a 3.5 gallon jug of peanut oil as we are all out and it's time to fry fish tonight! No fresh meat, but plenty of everything else. I grabbed a half dozen nice looking tomatoes. They were unpacking fresh produce by the case - broccoli, lettuce, tomatoes, yellow onions and potatoes. Tons of frozen meats and goodies; mostly fully stocked shelves. It was busy but what I would expect at 5:15.
> 
> Since I was there I picked up some cheese sticks, onion rings and a few lbs of breaded okra
> 
> The only things that seems scarce is TP!!!! I saw a Restaurant giving away a free roll of TP with pickup orders over $30!LOL


ive been looking since Thursday fonally hit some at CVS


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## bruce

We have what we need as always. No running to the store.


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## Rooster

67 cases in Ohio....

My company laid-off 3x that number today at 3pm (including me). 50 years old, and first time being unemployed.

Guess we were not lucky enough to be in the group that these measures are protecting. Just a few hundred more in collateral damage in the war to save us from the flu.


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## BuckeyeFishin07

Rooster said:


> 67 cases in Ohio....
> 
> My company laid-off 3x that number today at 3pm (including me). 50 years old, and first time being unemployed.
> 
> Guess we were not lucky enough to be in the group that these measures are protecting. Just a few hundred more in collateral damage in the war to save us from the flu.


Sorry to hear this Rooster!


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## berkshirepresident

Rooster said:


> 67 cases in Ohio....
> 
> My company laid-off 3x that number today at 3pm (including me). 50 years old, and first time being unemployed.


For as long as this lasts, remember that this is NOT your fault. Companies are overreacting to a lot of this stuff. Things will likely be different...and better...in a few months.
BTW: There is both FEDERAL and STATE Unemployment Tax. The Employer pays both. The Employee doesn't pay either.


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## floater99

I stopped to buy some split shots n hooks at FFF store was full and they started to let people in from a line outside as others were leaving so I got some ammo while I was waiting 20 deep at chk out line Look out ZOMBIES Both my granddaughters laid off as of today also


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## Fish-N-Fool

Rooster - I'm sorry to hear this and your situation is the big problem with all this. If it was as simple as everybody huddle at home for a month it wouldn't be a big deal. Real life just ain't that simple!

Millions of American workers are going to go without a paycheck for a period of time. Many don't have PTO and sick time to use, many have not saved money back for rainy days. When the worker cannot earn a paycheck to support themselves and family what do we do? Life isn't fair, but all these hard working American families are going to be in a tough spot. And even if this is a "blip" and last a month or so then back to work those families are in a hole to dig out of.

I wish I had all the answers. We are all going to suffer because of this. I believe this has kicked off the next recession period personally and there is not much the world will be able to do about it short term. 

Add up all the taxes you pay....once you start making decent money of any kind you get angry real fast. I know I am constantly unhappy viewing the monthly net amount of tax I pay.....and watching what happens with all my hard earned money. I do what I can....vote - when we have elections!!!!!!


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## JamesF

I am hoping that this will pass, and not linger over into the summer. This is going to impact just about every one in ways that we can only guess at. Cabin Fever is one my weakness, since my desire for the outdoors, in the winter took a nosedive. Getting some home projects, to pass the time.


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## ress

X2


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## Redheads

$diesel$ said:


> I was on line for two hours yesterday trying to find plain 9mm ammo. Unless you want to buy a 2-3 hundred dollar case, forget it.


Are you completely out or are you looking to add ?


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## Rooster

Thanks everyone!

I'm good, just mad that the weather is not going to be conducive to fishing this week.

More angry about my co-workers that may not be in the same situation.


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## buckeyebowman

PapawSmith said:


> I have been working for 45 years, unemployment insurance has been deducted from my check every working week of my life, and I have never collected any. I have now long been an employer and pay unemployment insurance every week on a pretty good size group of employees that most of which never need to collect. We are a just small example of thousands of companies and workers that function the same, how in the hell do you consider all of these surplus funds to be “handouts”? That’s what this money is for, and that’s why it is available and should be used.


OMG, you've done it! You have produced the "20 like" post!


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## bruce

Yes the Employer pays it but if the employee is not present it will not be paid. Present lower wage so yes the the employee dose pay.


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## Saugeye Tom

bruce said:


> We have what we need as always. No running to the store.


Bruce If you need anything call...Tom


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## FSHNERIE

Fish-N-Fool said:


> Rooster - I'm sorry to hear this and your situation is the big problem with all this. If it was as simple as everybody huddle at home for a month it wouldn't be a big deal. Real life just ain't that simple!
> 
> Millions of American workers are going to go without a paycheck for a period of time. Many don't have PTO and sick time to use, many have not saved money back for rainy days. When the worker cannot earn a paycheck to support themselves and family what do we do? Life isn't fair, but all these hard working American families are going to be in a tough spot. And even if this is a "blip" and last a month or so then back to work those families are in a hole to dig out of.
> 
> I wish I had all the answers. We are all going to suffer because of this. I believe this has kicked off the next recession period personally and there is not much the world will be able to do about it short term.
> 
> Add up all the taxes you pay....once you start making decent money of any kind you get angry real fast. I know I am constantly unhappy viewing the monthly net amount of tax I pay.....and watching what happens with all my hard earned money. I do what I can....vote - when we have elections!!!!!!



Stop.......

Why must people put Their own opinion and political beliefs during a time of panic ??

My quarterly taxes are more then most people pay in a year.

Really, this is a bump in the road. WE will survive.

relax, Drink a beer.

No one has the answers.

Yes , some but not all hard working people will be layed off due to the outbreak.

Paranoid people are starting to piss me off. no wonder there has been a run on ammo.

relax people.

please, its not good for your well being or health.


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## fishing pole

I've run statistics my whole life. From what I can gather, and I've run the numbers quite a bit here is the whole thing in a nutshell

The flu kills about 12,000 people in the U.S. each year, but they say the coronavirus is 10 times more deadly than the flu."

Skewed numbers. The flu mortality rate is based on estimated cases, which, in '18-'19, was 180 times that of *confirmed *cases. There were 220,000 *confirmed* flu cases and 22,000 deaths, which makes the flu mortality rate 10%.

Carona virus mortality is based on *confirmed* cases only, and in the US is 1%. If there are ten people who have it with no symptoms, mild symptoms, etc, who won't get tested, for every confirmed case - a ratio of 10:1, and that could be a lot higher - then the Carona virus mortality rate is .1% or less, more in line with the flu. Which means we've been played.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

FSHNERIE said:


> Stop.......
> 
> Why must people put Their own opinion and political beliefs during a time of panic ??
> 
> My quarterly taxes are more then most people pay in a year.
> 
> Really, this is a bump in the road. WE will survive.
> 
> relax, Drink a beer.
> 
> No one has the answers.
> 
> Yes , some but not all hard working people will be layed off due to the outbreak.
> 
> Paranoid people are starting to piss me off. no wonder there has been a run on ammo.
> 
> relax people.
> 
> please, its not good for your well being or health.


Well said.....but.....I have higher taxes too. 6k every quarter...next year I found a way to knock em down


----------



## FSHNERIE

bruce said:


> Yes the Employer pays it but if the employee is not present it will not be paid. Present lower wage so yes the the employee dose pay.




Yes the employer pays said taxes due to the state as unemployment tax based on employee rate of pay.

If i have no employees i do not pay tax.

If i employ you , and you agree to said salary , I pay your unemployment tax. Also 1.5 percent of your Social Security .

You really don't want to go down this road with me.


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## FSHNERIE

Saugeye Tom said:


> Well said.....but.....I have higher taxes too. 6k every quarter...next year I found a way to knock em down



I feel your pain.

I sold my business last year. My tax bill is outrageous .


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## FSHNERIE

montagc said:


> So you guys pay a lot of taxes because you make a lot of money. Of course you aren’t worried. It’s the paycheck to paycheck crowd that is gonna hurt.


Wrong

As employers our best interest is our employees. I had 5 employees and my wife has 12. We have always taking good care of our employees and they have a liveable income. 

FYI......Livable income is $42,000 a year


----------



## Saugeye Tom

montagc said:


> So you guys pay a lot of taxes because you make a lot of money. Of course you aren’t worried. It’s the paycheck to paycheck crowd that is gonna hurt.


Yes sir we make better money but don't we all live within our means ? I have worked my butt off to get to where I am today...no collage..free ride, etc . From 3 paper routes at 11 years old to a tooling manager at 58 with zero help...brother I earned it. Supporting a 4 person family ain't cheap so yes...if there is a stimulus check....at my age I guarantee you I will put every penny back into our economy...Tom


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## 1more

Well said!


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## Saugeye Tom

FSHNERIE said:


> I feel your pain.
> 
> I sold my business last year. My tax bill is outrageous .


I also sold a rental....gonna cost me a pretty penny next year....someone else's stimulus I guess


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## Saugeye Tom

Ya know, I have helped few people over the years, some I do believe really appreciated it. Some maybe not. But I truly feel very good right now


----------



## Saugeye Tom

montagc said:


> I also sold a rental property. Not looking forward to that on the return.


Wait till ya see the deprecation re coup if you filed deprecation over the years. Plus capital gains if you have will bump you up too


----------



## Saugeye Tom

So. I am proud of our government doing what they are trying to do. I hope everyone gets help


----------



## CoonDawg92

fishing pole said:


> I've run statistics my whole life. From what I can gather, and I've run the numbers quite a bit here is the whole thing in a nutshell
> 
> The flu kills about 12,000 people in the U.S. each year, but they say the coronavirus is 10 times more deadly than the flu."
> 
> Skewed numbers. The flu mortality rate is based on estimated cases, which, in '18-'19, was 180 times that of *confirmed *cases. There were 220,000 *confirmed* flu cases and 22,000 deaths, which makes the flu mortality rate 10%.
> 
> Carona virus mortality is based on *confirmed* cases only, and in the US is 1%. If there are ten people who have it with no symptoms, mild symptoms, etc, who won't get tested, for every confirmed case - a ratio of 10:1, and that could be a lot higher - then the Carona virus mortality rate is .1% or less, more in line with the flu. Which means we've been played.


It will be very interesting to see what the data shows after all this has matured a bit. Your theory may very well prove correct.

Regardless, the panic and fear of the unknown has driven the world down this current path of hysteria.

I feel for Rooster, his coworkers, and all the others whose jobs and income are already being affected by this. I think his statistics on current cases vs. job losses speak volumes right now. However both political parties and all govt leaders are in a situation where they have to pull out all the stops and err on the side of overreacting. The panicking population has helped put them in that position.


----------



## JamesF

There are so many people that are doing what they have to do, because these are the first responders, and care takers, for each and everyone of us. It pains me to hear that others are taking what ever they can. Because it's the all about me attitude. I cannot begin to count the people that I have helped, along with my wife. Both of us have never asked or assumed to paid back or even thanked. That has never been a part of us. My wife is a nurse, I was a Navy Corpsman, and a Certified medical assistant. People need to help each other when times are difficult. It has been hard for me, to,Not be able to volunteer as I have in the past. To know that some of these people are going to possibly be out of a job, due to becoming ill ,by helping others, with out the proper equipment necessary is a sad feeling of failure to manufacture what the every day person doesn't give a thought to. Taking these things for granted is a fairly common problem in the past years. Working in a steel mill I challenged my supervisors to provide every employee with the, not just what they can get by with, but what was necessary according to the MSDA,and other safety standards. What ever the cost. My argument was, you can replace a piece of equipment, but you cannot replace a life. As for myself, I can say ,that I have been helped by some of the best people, that briefly touched my life. One, for certain was the amazing Cardiothoracic Surgeon that,wouldn't accept our money. Just one of those type of people who are doing what they're passionate about. God bless us all in this time of crisis.


----------



## BuckeyeFishinNut

Rooster said:


> 67 cases in Ohio....
> 
> My company laid-off 3x that number today at 3pm (including me). 50 years old, and first time being unemployed.
> 
> Guess we were not lucky enough to be in the group that these measures are protecting. Just a few hundred more in collateral damage in the war to save us from the flu.


Rooster, that sucks man! A lot of businesses are over reacting currently. 

My wife came home yesterday, almost in tears, because she was told by her office manager that they might get laid off. She works in WV and they don't even have a confirmed case yet. She works for a company that rents apartments, 20+ complexes around the state. She does various accounting and finance work for them. She is the only one at her company who knows how to do every part of her job. She was told she wouldn't be laid off but have her hours cut to 2-3 days I week. I told her to tell them you either get paid for your full-time hours or you will take a lay-off. She would make more from unemployment than a reduced work schedule. See how well the business runs when there is nobody there to pay the bills, make the deposits, and send reports to the investors. 

The owner is a paranoid guy to begin with and he thinks nobody is gonna pay their rent, even though nothing has happened to the contrary. Also, a lot of their rents are subsidized by HUD and other assistance programs. He also thinks that nobody is gonna be looking for housing, even though yesterday they had 5 new tenants register. This is just an example of how this panic is creeping into all business sectors. The fallout to the normal American is going to be much worse than maybe contracting a 14 day virus. 

We are lucky enough that we have put some money aside and could weather the storm for a few months, not everybody is so lucky. We are not what I would consider "well-to-do" either. It has taken us a number of years to put a nice savings together, would hate to see it disappear in a few months.


----------



## $diesel$

Talking about who pays what for property tax and how much one makes means what?
Someone stated earlier about living within ones means, and i believe that. 
I'm retired going on 8 years now and i'm no wealthy man financially. But i still feel wealthy with plenty of good friends and family and my health.
A wise man once said, " the greatest asset i have in my life, are my family and friends".
I also believe this whole heartedly and live by this mantra daily.


----------



## Saugeyefisher

To the parents with young kids....
Most schools are doing "to go" packed lunches for the kiddos right now. I'm not to proud,my wife has been taking our kids. And it's something that gets them exciited.
I also herd tim hortons is doing free 1/2 grilled cheese Sammy's an a couple sides for kids 12 an under during select lunch hours. 
There are plenty of people not panicking and trying to make it easier on familys with kids.... 
I realize they are hoping to get some additional sales out of it. But it's nice to see!


----------



## loves2fishinohio

Saugeyefisher said:


> To the parents with young kids....
> Most schools are doing "to go" packed lunches for the kiddos right now. I'm not to proud,my wife has been taking our kids. And it's something that gets them exciited.
> I also herd tim hortons is doing free 1/2 grilled cheese Sammy's an a couple sides for kids 12 an under during select lunch hours.
> There are plenty of people not panicking and trying to make it easier on familys with kids....
> I realize they are hoping to get some additional sales out of it. But it's nice to see!


Yeah man, I really feel for all my service industry friends who aren't working, but the fact that restaurants are still able to offer carryout and delivery is encouraging. Once that stops, that's the freak out point in my book.


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## KaGee

We have a forum for gun and ammo conversation and this one ain't it.

Stay on topic please.


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## loves2fishinohio

Saugeye Tom said:


> So. I am proud of our government doing what they are trying to do. I hope everyone gets help


I hope so as well. Not surprisingly, they didn't have any news about financial relief as of this afternoon's update from their presser. Sending Americans a check is going to take a certain level of political bickering before it is approved, that's for sure.


----------



## Outasync

Buckeyefishingnut if they cut your wifes hours down like that she should be eligible for partial unemployment. Ive collected myself when my hours were cut from 40 a week to 24. But that was years ago. Just an avenue to look into


----------



## Steelheader88

For those who can, perhaps tune into the Presidents addresses or governor Dewines addresses to get a little more up to date info, and see a brief explanation of the science and reasoning behind actions that are being taken by Ohio and federally. Any person who is grateful for their country or veterans may soon realize that they have a duty to themselves, family and fellow americans to help this great country through what is likely going to be a very difficult time.


----------



## JamesF

For those out of work and filing for unemployment. How is that going? My son hasn't been able to get through, online or on the phone, since Monday morning. Just trying to get a feel about it. Thanks.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

JamesF said:


> For those out of work and filing for unemployment. How is that going? My son hasn't been able to get through, online or on the phone, since Monday morning. Just trying to get a feel about it. Thanks.


James, he should probably just go down and try to get signed up if he got laid off. Would save him a lot of time I bet imo.


----------



## roundbadge

FSHNERIE said:


> Yes the employer pays said taxes due to the state as unemployment tax based on employee rate of pay.
> 
> If i have no employees i do not pay tax.
> 
> If i employ you , and you agree to said salary , I pay your unemployment tax. Also 1.5 percent of your Social Security .
> 
> You really don't want to go down this road with me.


The EMPLOYER PAYS around .008 FUTA, about 3% SUTA, and 7.65% Fica and Medicare
The Employee pays no payroll taxes
The employee also contributes to their SSA at 7.65%, all the remaining tax withholdings are trust taxes against their current tax liability
The employee does NOT pay to unemployment


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

JamesF said:


> For those out of work and filing for unemployment. How is that going? My son hasn't been able to get through, online or on the phone, since Monday morning. Just trying to get a feel about it. Thanks.


https://www.yahoo.com/news/state-unemployment-websites-crash-applications-150200792.html


----------



## AmericanEagle

JamesF said:


> For those out of work and filing for unemployment. How is that going? My son hasn't been able to get through, online or on the phone, since Monday morning. Just trying to get a feel about it. Thanks.


My granddaughter was able to sign up online around 10:00 pm Monday night. I'm not sure if she had any issues trying to do so.


----------



## EnonEye

JamesF said:


> For those out of work and filing for unemployment. How is that going? My son hasn't been able to get through, online or on the phone, since Monday morning. Just trying to get a feel about it. Thanks.


James, couple of the Navy hospital ships are staging off NY and Cali coast. I was the eastern Saudi IDMT in Gulf War and they staged there also but wasn't really needed thankfully. Let's pray they aren't needed this time either. My daughter lost both her jobs (besides Uber) she also worked as a bartender and ran a food catering business in Columbus for large gatherings. She's a go getter though, she'll be fine. Hope your son gets registered for unemployment.


----------



## JamesF

Things are gonna be tight for a while. Just hang on say a prayer for everyone.


----------



## Snakecharmer

State just closed Dental offices except for emergencies....Dental Hygienists don't have many emergencies so my wife is laid off.


----------



## JamesF

Sitting out side, while my son is having a root canal. Caused by a lazy dentist, left an air pocket under the filling. Won't be seeing him again. Bad thing is, we can't get our out of pocket money back. He closed his doors, but I don't think he owns the practice.


----------



## bruce

You Must look out for your own. We can weather this Storm. Just hold tight.


----------



## 9Left

JamesF said:


> There are so many people that are doing what they have to do, because these are the first responders, and care takers, for each and everyone of us. It pains me to hear that others are taking what ever they can. Because it's the all about me attitude. I cannot begin to count the people that I have helped, along with my wife. Both of us have never asked or assumed to paid back or even thanked. That has never been a part of us. My wife is a nurse, I was a Navy Corpsman, and a Certified medical assistant. People need to help each other when times are difficult. It has been hard for me, to,Not be able to volunteer as I have in the past. To know that some of these people are going to possibly be out of a job, due to becoming ill ,by helping others, with out the proper equipment necessary is a sad feeling of failure to manufacture what the every day person doesn't give a thought to. Taking these things for granted is a fairly common problem in the past years. Working in a steel mill I challenged my supervisors to provide every employee with the, not just what they can get by with, but what was necessary according to the MSDA,and other safety standards. What ever the cost. My argument was, you can replace a piece of equipment, but you cannot replace a life. As for myself, I can say ,that I have been helped by some of the best people, that briefly touched my life. One, for certain was the amazing Cardiothoracic Surgeon that,wouldn't accept our money. Just one of those type of people who are doing what they're passionate about. God bless us all in this time of crisis.


...OK, you got my attention, what did a cardiothoracic surgeon do and not accept money for?


----------



## Dovans

Just little update on my grocery store...First hour was pretty crazy afterwards it seemed to slow way down. I was also told that our store would be getting an extra truck this week of Non-Perishables.( canned goods, paper towels, TP..) Hearing that about the extra truck I think maybe the warehouses might be catching up with the demand and perhaps the panic buying will slow down once the shelves are full stocked. Also, The Brock Foundation purchased 25 dollar gift cards for everyone that was in the store. EVERYONE. Hats off to this Foundation.


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

Need supplies hit Costco:

I had to go to Columbus for a work commitment. I stopped at Costco to fill up on gas and decided to go in to see if they had any shrimp. First, they only had small count shrimp not the 12-14 to a lb so I didn't get any shrimp! However, they were well stocked on everything! They had a wall of TP, bottled water, plenty of meat and produce fresh and frozen. Pretty much like usual. No limits on canned and most frozen items including seafood and meat. I picked up 5 lbs of gorgeous Ribeye steaks (limit 1)!

Here were the changes:

Entrance and Exits were modified to route traffic away and avoid any face-to-face movement. You can only enter and exit on opposite sides. 

The total # of people inside the store including workers is being monitored and limited. At the exit they had 2 people just counting the folks leaving; same at the entrance. (I believe the sign said 400 total - could be wrong).

At the entrance were hand sanitizer, hand towels, and a couple employee to squirt your hands if desired.

They had a limit on many items - TP, fresh meat, bottled water, bulk butter, etc. Signs would tell you if it was 1 or 2 available per membership. (they would remove extra items form cheaters - unfortunately saw it 3 times in my line alone although one couple was very foreign and didn't speak English so I believe likely just an honest mistake).

Of course no samples, but the pizza and food bar was shut down also.

So while some of the stores are low or out of things, and amazon sellers want $3-$5 roll for TP, Costco has everything and prices are not inflated. Everybody was being mindful and keeping a safe distance. 

Hopefully what I saw there and reports like Dovans curb the "panic" buyers. I did see several people I thought obviously buying in panic - 3-4 carts slammed full of canned and dry goods and frozen food. Guy in front of me and his wife paid $1,141 (not being nosy heard her say it and they had 4 carts). They are not limiting frozen, dry or canned goods. Perhaps I should not judge and they have 14 children...who knows. It does tell me Costco must believe these goods are not a restock issue or they would place the limits.


----------



## KaGee

Dovans said:


> Just little update on my grocery store...and perhaps the panic buying will slow down once the shelves are full stocked.


I mean how much TP can a household stock anyway?


----------



## PapawSmith

buckeyebowman said:


> OMG, you've done it! You have produced the "20 like" post!


Haha, is that some kind of milestone? Does this mean I have to pick up the bar tab at the next OGF get together?


----------



## Burkcarp1

KaGee said:


> I mean how much TP can a household stock anyway?


I think the best answer right now would be ..you would be surprised!lol


----------



## M R DUCKS

REMINDER:
15 DAYS TO SLOW THE SPREAD

Social distancing
No Social Gatherings
Use driv-thru, pickup, or delivery options
Avoid Discretionary travel, shopping trips, social visits
Do not visit nursing homes, etc.


----------



## fastwater

PapawSmith said:


> Haha, is that some kind of milestone? *Does this mean I have to pick up the bar tab at the next OGF get together?*


After taking a pole of those that attend the get together....the unanimous answer to your question was a resounding YES.


----------



## MagicMarker

Anybody remember the story when they were young about the boy always crying Wolf


----------



## M R DUCKS

Tap water still works
cows need to be milked twice a day
Chickens lay eggs daily...or close to it 
Pigs, cows,chickens, goats, sheep-( sorry Sherm)
Are still being raised
I think the food supply is ok
The rush/panic has depleted local supplies
Transportation / Logistics might’ve messed up a bit, but once everyone fills their freezers and pantries and basements and bunkers 
I hope, hope stores return to normal supplies
Dovans might have a better insight on this


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

MagicMarker said:


> Anybody remember the story when they were young about the boy always crying Wolf


Yes, why?


----------



## 1basshunter

"fastwater, post: 2858911, member: 50401"]After taking a pole of those that attend the get together....the unanimous answer to your question was a resounding YES.[/QUOTE]
He should pay for the next two of them!!! But if he can track down Sherman he said that he would Reimburse him good luck with that one though


----------



## loweman165

Snakecharmer said:


> State just closed Dental offices except for emergencies....Dental Hygienists don't have many emergencies so my wife is laid off.


That sucks. Mines a preschool teacher so she got the lay off today.


----------



## MagicMarker

Stars-n-Stripers said:


> Yes, why?


There’s too many people out there that have lost any sign of reason and are crying wolf


----------



## Saugeye Tom

I had to


----------



## SConner

[QUOTE="Does this mean I have to pick up the bar tab at the next OGF get together?[/QUOTE]
Yes


----------



## 1basshunter

SConner said:


> [QUOTE="Does this mean I have to pick up the bar tab at the next OGF get together?


Yes[/QUOTE]
Yes most definitely. The good news is I don’t drink very much


----------



## buckeyebowman

KaGee said:


> I mean how much TP can a household stock anyway?


My Brother called me yesterday about this and said he saw a guy coming out of a store with a buggy full of milk! What's he going to do with all that? Make butter and cheese?



PapawSmith said:


> Haha, is that some kind of milestone? Does this mean I have to pick up the bar tab at the next OGF get together?


I saw a post on OGF a little while ago that had the tagline, "In search of the 20 like post!" And yes, you have to buy a round!


----------



## Hatchetman

1basshunter said:


> Yes


Yes most definitely. The good news is I don’t drink very much[/QUOTE]

But I do....


----------



## Muddy

I’m glad that supplies are better. Just be careful out there. This virus is taking off. I’m personally assuming that most public areas are a hot zone from here on out. My daughters illness may or may not be related to Corona. She is still coughing, but otherwise in good spirits. We have been holed up just to be safe so we don’t spread anything around. Good luck to everyone. Thank you Dovans and people like you that are helping America get through this.


----------



## Misdirection

PapawSmith said:


> Haha, is that some kind of milestone? Does this mean I have to pick up the bar tab at the next OGF get together?


Just another bottle of Jack. Might be empty before this is all over!

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


----------



## fasteddy

Saugeye, I love it, I can't stop laughing, I think I'm having the big one.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

1basshunter said:


> Yes


Yes most definitely. The good news is I don’t drink very much[/QUOTE]
Lies


----------



## JamesF

I remember freezing milk, and powdered milk! Also even harder times than right now. Not down playing this at all. I feel that several generations will have a better understanding of how to deal with whatever comes at them. I must admit that I am concerned. Into the Unknown is always disconcerting.


----------



## Evinrude58

This is a serious situation going on and I know a lot of people will be hurt financially but sometimes a chuckle is needed. Saturday our local Walmart had been without TP for a couple days. My wife and daughter witnessed there was a run started on women's underwear. Said they seen a couple women grabbing multiple packs and the section was pretty empty. The only thing I could think of was They wanted backups incase they ran out of TP.


----------



## twistedcatfish1971

...I'm not the smartest guy around and have always taken the hard road with most things in life...hard work/good times/self taught with alot of things.

I joked as most have with what's going on in <world> right now...but in back of head always was thinking about it. Crazy now...crazier it will get. Its reel and its here as we all know...for me just love OGF and the connection we all have...props to mods/runners of site...much appreciated with OGF.

...stay safe/look out for each other...

...sometimes I wish I was camping on hickory island out at westbranch...just to get away...

Twistedcatfish71.


----------



## JamesF

9Left said:


> ...OK, you got my attention, what did a cardiothoracic surgeon do and not accept money for?


He performed a new bypass procedure, I had a triple bypass. The advantage was,the scar is hardly noticeable, and I can't feel it. The recovery was short term. Most of the injury was repaired and healed well. I should have been able to go home the morning of my third day. But, since I had an injury to my right lung, I stayed until my o2 levels were stable. Dr. Michael Firstenberg. He teaches this procedure, at Michigan state, and in Ohio. I was referred to him by a surgeon, Cardiology One,that failed to schedule me due to a conflict of interest. His staff couldn't handle the number of patients they had. Like I was on backorder. The day of my surgery Cardiology One was subpoenaed to the state court. But that wasn't the reason. He stated that I was dying and have been for close to three days. He said, he wouldn't be comfortable taking money from a dead man. My injuries prevented me from doing the full cardio rehab. It was a rough four months. That was 2015. I had three operations by the end of that year. I really did recover well, despite the setbacks. In 2016 I ran an eleven minute half mile! That was a milestone for me...


----------



## JamesF

And I was 65 years old in 2015.


----------



## Muddy

Sometimes life works in mysterious ways. You probably gained a lot of insight on what life’s priorities really are after that. I’m glad that you’re still here!


----------



## 1basshunter

*Drinking bleach will not kill the Virus but it will confirm without a doubt you’re an idiot!!!*


----------



## JamesF

Well... Maybe I didn't recover that well after all! As I was looking through some pictures, it turns out, that I actually had my surgery in 2014!! October, four day's prior to surgery. I didn't have a clue!! Should I have been fishing? Hell yeah!! I got onto a hot perch bite two days before. Those were all over 13". I was tired. We spoke about that afterwards, said I may not have helped matters, but I came through with great color. I couldn't tell, because I was hallucinating from low blood sugars. Christmas presents floating around a television!!


----------



## twistedcatfish1971

...crazy on how PERCH is on the cover of Ohio regulations this year haha...

...thought was funny.

Don.


----------



## fastwater

JamesF said:


> *I remember freezing milk, and powdered milk!* Also even harder times than right now. Not down playing this at all. I feel that several generations will have a better understanding of how to deal with whatever comes at them. I must admit that I am concerned. Into the Unknown is always disconcerting.


Remember some of those times...and more as well.
Waiting on Pres. Trump to bring out that good gubment cheese.
Searching hard for the bright side of all of this...maybe those that have never experienced those kind of times will be more thankful for many things we take for granted every day. Seems this country has become very spoiled in many ways turning 'wants' into 'needs'.


----------



## 1basshunter

Christmas presents floating around a television!![/QUOTE]


I’ve had nights like that before


----------



## hatteras1




----------



## JamesF

Who needs TP?


----------



## JamesF

BMV, closed. Need boat and trailer stickers. Looks like the post office is my best bet. Probably could get by but best keep everyone safe, I can wait on the mail.


----------



## Pooka

fastwater said:


> Remember some of those times...and more as well.
> Waiting on Pres. Trump to bring out that good gubment cheese.


Folks joke about that but the Cheddar was excellent. In my younger days I would buy it and resell to people who loved it but were too "fancy" admit where it originated. 
Seems that gubberment help is coming back in style. LOL

On a personal note I seem to be over the hump and on the mend with my head cold. I have mostly been a good boy and stayed in so as not to scare folks but I did have to go to wally world once and cleared out a whole aisle with a quick cough from the drain. lol


----------



## JamesF

Real, government cheese was always free! That's the best kind.


----------



## $diesel$

FW, you reminded me of an old govt. cheese story you won't believe.
Back in the late 60's, i believe, the tiny town i live in used to pick up the hard trash in a dump truck. (for you younger guys, we were allowed to burn soft trash) Most everyone used old 55 gallon steel drums for that trash.
Now the village had your every day dump truck one would see all over back then, and a crew of 4, one to drive the truck, one on the ground, and two in the dump bed.
Ya......1 on the ground. This fine man was about 6' 5", over 300 pounds, and mildly retarded.
He was so strong, he would throw those full 55 gal. drums onto the back of the dump where it took 2 guys just to turn it over to empty it. 
Anyway, he actually ate his 5 lb. block of govt. American cheese at 1 sitting.
They had to take him, by ambulance, to the local hospital in Youngstown, to open him up.
I can imagine them calling in the dynamiters from the local limestone quarry.
I sure felt sorry for the poor hospital workers that got that job......LOL
True story.


----------



## Doboy

$diesel$ said:


> Anyway, he actually ate his 5 lb. block of govt. American cheese at 1 sitting.
> They had to take him, by ambulance, to the local hospital in Youngstown, to open him up.
> *I can imagine them calling in the dynamiters from the local limestone quarry.*
> I sure felt sorry for the poor hospital workers that got that job......LOL
> True story.


LMBO,ol,,,,,,, Crack me up!
Been-There-Done-That! (NOT EXACTLY TO THAT EXTENT though! ;>)

*I have 2 of those cheese BRICKS in the fridge right now!
When you guys get that cheese, It's VERY IMPORTANT to mix it with salsa, rotel, & or HOT PEPPERS in oil! Break it down,,,, use it as a hot dip.
or
YOU EVER HEAR OF A BARIUM ENEMA?*


----------



## Doboy

*FLASH!?

I just got a call,,,,, A fishing nut / friend of mine is on his way back from Texas,,,, 'updating' on Facebook.
HE JUST READ THAT THE DNR JUST SHUT DOWN ALL OF THE STATE MAINTAINED RAMPS,,,, THE LAKES ARE NOW CLOSED!??????
*
*Somebody, QUICK,,,,, find out if that is true?*
*Did I miss something?*


----------



## Lundy

I believe your friend to be mistaken in his information at this time.


----------



## bulafisherman

My opinion. We are being played people.... problem, corona virus... Reaction. Exactly what's happening....a global economical crash. solution. We have yet to see what all they are going to offer us besides a 1000 dollar check. A society of sheep?


fishing pole said:


> I've run statistics my whole life. From what I can gather, and I've run the numbers quite a bit here is the whole thing in a nutshell
> 
> The flu kills about 12,000 people in the U.S. each year, but they say the coronavirus is 10 times more deadly than the flu."
> 
> Skewed numbers. The flu mortality rate is based on estimated cases, which, in '18-'19, was 180 times that of *confirmed *cases. There were 220,000 *confirmed* flu cases and 22,000 deaths, which makes the flu mortality rate 10%.
> 
> Carona virus mortality is based on *confirmed* cases only, and in the US is 1%. If there are ten people who have it with no symptoms, mild symptoms, etc, who won't get tested, for every confirmed case - a ratio of 10:1, and that could be a lot higher - then the Carona virus mortality rate is .1% or less, more in line with the flu. Which means we've been played.


----------



## fastwater

Not seeing anything on ODNR website pertaining to the ramps/lakes being closed.
Their site that was updated 3/18/2020:
http://ohiodnr.gov/odnr-operations-during-coronavirus-outbreak


----------



## 1more

Doboy said:


> *FLASH!?
> 
> I just got a call,,,,, A fishing nut / friend of mine is on his way back from Texas,,,, 'updating' on Facebook.
> HE JUST READ THAT THE DNR JUST SHUT DOWN ALL OF THE STATE MAINTAINED RAMPS,,,, THE LAKES ARE NOW CLOSED!??????
> *
> *Somebody, QUICK,,,,, find out if that is true?*
> *Did I miss something?*


They are closing park headquarters, visitor centers and park stores today at noon.


----------



## Lundy

bulafisherman said:


> We have yet to see what all they are going to offer us besides a 1000 dollar check.


What is it you would like them to do for you that you have not or can not do for yourself?


----------



## bulafisherman

Lundy said:


> What is it you would like then to do for you that you have not or can not do for yourself?


 I want nothing from anyone...I see through the smokescreen, thanks for allowing me to clarify that.


----------



## fastwater

bulafisherman said:


> I want nothing from anyone...I see through the smokescreen,


Then you are not 'being played', have nothing to worry about...so...it puzzles me as to why you would bring up what the government is going to do for people in the first place.
Too, if you are sent anything from the government, *please* do the right thing and send it back.
There are some that are going to need it worse than you.


----------



## cheezemm2

I am very sorry to hear about the economic trouble this is causing so many, but I also think you're about to see exponential acceleration in the number of cases now that mobile testing is in place. It's very hard to wrap your head around when you can't see the problem, but it's a slow burn.

I'm also trying to figure out how if we're one of the most aggressive states in prevention, how that plays out with other states that aren't doing the same. What if their hospital systems become overloaded? Do we offer our capacity?

Also, for anyone who cares, shutting down elective surgery is a HUGE deal. It's the financial engine for hospitals.


----------



## fishing pole

The more people we test the more people who have it?????
The more people we test for anything the more people we will find have it...heart disease, Hypertension...etc


----------



## fishing pole

Paraphrased article - 

For the older generation (of which I am approaching) there was nothing unusual about pandemics Mumps, measles, chicken pox, and German measles swept through entire schools and towns; I have Aunts, Uncles and Cousin who were stricken by these. Polio took a heavy annual toll, leaving thousands of people (mostly children) paralyzed or dead. There were no vaccines. Growing up meant running an unavoidable gauntlet of infectious disease. For children growing up in the 50's, the Asian flu was a familiar hurdle on the road to adulthood. For everyone older, the flu was a familiar foe. There was no possibility of working at home. You had to go out and face the danger. 

Today, thanks to vaccines, fewer and fewer people remember what it was like to survive a succession of childhood diseases. Is the unfamiliar threat of serious sickness making us more afraid of COVID-19 than we need to be? Does a society that relies more on politics than faith now find itself in an uncomfortable bind, unable to lecture, browbeat, intimidate, or evade the incorrect behavior of a dangerous microbe?


----------



## crappiedude

Doboy said:


> *HE JUST READ THAT THE DNR JUST SHUT DOWN ALL OF THE STATE MAINTAINED RAMPS,,,, THE LAKES ARE NOW CLOSED!??????*


Before posting something like this why wouldn't you find out if it's true or not. Seems to me it's just adding to all the panic and bad info that's floating around.
For the record it's not true, I was just at East Fork Lake to take a walk and the park and the ramps are all open.
Just sayin


----------



## Nauti cat

I have to laugh Asian flu is where it came from and that's what we called it. Chinese flu is a no no it started in China but don't call it that, had the Asiatic flew just saying.


----------



## BrandonMiller526

Watch Dewine at 3, have a friend high up in Kroger. She was told businesses are being shut down for the weekend starting at 6 Friday to Monday AM. Don't take this as a fact but I'd definitely be watching.


----------



## Shad Rap

More fake news...book it...maybe to deep clean the stores???..that would be the only reason I could see...wouldn't have anything to do with a lockdown...just my opinion.


----------



## 1more

Just Kroger's or all businesses?


----------



## Burkcarp1

Calm down everyone! Never ever ever! Panic!!!!


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

Burkcarp1 said:


> Calm down everyone! Never ever ever! Panic!!!!


----------



## Southernsaug

Here you go...all you need to know


----------



## Pooka

Burkcarp1 said:


> Calm down everyone! Never ever ever! Panic!!!!



Oh come on, I can't take off all my clothes and run down the street screaming and waving my arms? 
You just take all the fun out of a pandemic you killjoy you. ;P


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

_If you want a moment of humor go out to youtube and watch George Carlins "Germs and Immune System" or "fear of Germs". For adults only (language), but hilarious.

You know why I didn't get COVID 19....Because I swam in raw sewage that's right! I can hear him now._


----------



## Saugeye Tom

News from a reliable source....WE WILL MAKE IT THROUGH THIS. we have learned valuable lessons. We have learned there are still selfish people in the world. Hopefully we learn compassion. TOM


----------



## Burkcarp1

Saugeye Tom said:


> News from a reliable source....WE WILL MAKE IT THROUGH THIS. we have learned valuable lessons. We have learned there are still selfish people in the world. Hopefully we learn compassion. TOM


Thanks brother!


----------



## bulafisherman

montagc said:


> Oh man! Thanks for solving this for all of us!! Obviously China, Italy and the rest of the world, along with everyone in the governement and medical industry in the US has conspired against you!
> 
> That was sarcasm. I feel like I needed to clarify that for you. My eyes rolled so hard when I read your comment my glasses flew off.


 feel free to react as you wish, no offense taken. Healthy discussions and debates are always welcome. Have to take a step back and look at the bigger picture, facts. Our government and people supposedly in charge don't have our best interest in mind. The elite one percent are the ones calling the shots, have been for sometime. IAM not saying this virus isn't serious but it's been spun to evoke a reaction (FEAR AND DIVISION) in addition to an economy in crisis which is to come.... look around it's obvious everywhere. Now let's offer a solution by overstepping the boundaries, taking control beyond what's necessary. There are some out there with good intentions but in a nutshell this will cause us to lose some of our freedom and most are blind to it. There is no turning this thing around. The virus will fade away from the limelight but the repercussions will be lasting. I have been watching this thing since January before it left China. It's sad that there are people dying from but mind boggling so many people are oblivious to the spin that's be put on it.


----------



## bulafisherman

montagc said:


> :facepalm
> 
> Some people need to learn the difference between facts, rumor, and opinion.
> 
> I'll just leave this here, if it offends you, well...
> 
> "The fundamental cause of trouble in the world today is that the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt" -B. Russell


 couldn't agree more


----------



## fastwater

bulafisherman said:


> feel free to react as you wish, no offense taken. Healthy discussions and debates are always welcome. Have to take a step back and look at the bigger picture, facts. Our government and people supposedly in charge don't have our best interest in mind. The elite one percent are the ones calling the shots, have been for sometime. IAM not saying this virus isn't serious but it's been spun to evoke a reaction (FEAR AND DIVISION) in addition to an economy in crisis which is to come.... look around it's obvious everywhere. Now let's offer a solution by overstepping the boundaries, taking control beyond what's necessary. There are some out there with good intentions but in a nutshell this will cause us to lose some of our freedom and most are blind to it. There is no turning this thing around. The virus will fade away from the limelight but the repercussions will be lasting. I have been watching this thing since January before it left China. It's sad that there are people dying from but mind boggling so many people are oblivious to the spin that's be put on it.


This begs the question:
' In your opinion, what incentive would the government possibly have to dismantle an economy that was more healthy than it had been since the 70's?

Stock market booming, industry booming, more $ in working class pockets creating more purchasing of goods...which ='s jobs and record low unemployment...and if I understand what you're trying to imply...the government just up and said...'lets tear this puppy down?' 

If that's your implication....with your implication, you owe an explanation as to 'why' our government would want to abruptly destroy unprecedented success it's built over the last few years that we've all benefitted from.


----------



## fastwater

Burkcarp1 said:


> Calm down everyone! Never ever ever! Panic!!!!


WHERE'S MY GUBMENT CHEESE?


----------



## kycreek

Saugeye Tom said:


> News from a reliable source....WE WILL MAKE IT THROUGH THIS. we have learned valuable lessons. We have learned there are still selfish people in the world. Hopefully we learn compassion. TOM


Good post...


----------



## bulafisherman

fastwater said:


> This begs the question:
> ' In your opinion, what incentive would the government possibly have to dismantle an economy that was more healthy than it had been since the 70's?
> 
> Stock market booming, industry booming, more $ in working class pockets creating more purchasing of goods...which ='s jobs and record low unemployment...and if I understand what you're trying to imply...the government just up and said...'lets tear this puppy down?'
> 
> If that's your implication....with your implication, you owe an explanation as to 'why' our government would want to abruptly destroy unprecedented success it's built over the last few years that we've all benefitted from.


 I want to agree with you in the worse way, everything that you just said points towards a healthy and robust economy to this point. Problem is there is Shadow government that wants totalitarianism, New world order. Take our emotions out of the equation and look at all the evidence thus far ,the emerging technology the potential behind it and the evidence is undeniable. Nothing new, it's be prophesied for centuries.


----------



## Dovans

fastwater said:


> WHERE'S MY GUBMENT CHEESE?


That is a vivid memory.. Really did not know any better thought it was just fine cheese. Made good grilled cheese sandwiches.


----------



## SConner

Spotted by me this evening in the entrance to local grocery. Odd thing to promote as you walk in the door.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

montagc said:


> More of the same, stay isolated, stay home, etc. No additional request for isolation or closures that I heard, but I did miss a few minutes of it.


Closed internet cafes


----------



## fastwater

bulafisherman said:


> I want to agree with you in the worse way, everything that you just said points towards a healthy and robust economy to this point. Problem is there is Shadow government that wants totalitarianism, New world order. Take our emotions out of the equation and look at all the evidence thus far ,the emerging technology the potential behind it and the evidence is undeniable. Nothing new, it's be prophesied for centuries.


So this 'Shadow government' did this to the entire world?
And who has prophesized this for centuries?


----------



## FOWL BRAWL

fastwater said:


> This begs the question:
> ' In your opinion, what incentive would the government possibly have to dismantle an economy that was more healthy than it had been since the 70's?
> 
> Stock market booming, industry booming, more $ in working class pockets creating more purchasing of goods...which ='s jobs and record low unemployment...and if I understand what you're trying to imply...the government just up and said...'lets tear this puppy down?'
> 
> If that's your implication....with your implication, you owe an explanation as to 'why' our government would want to abruptly destroy unprecedented success it's built over the last few years that we've all benefitted from.


Im guessing nobody wants to reply for the fact of keeping politics out of this thread

Think about a donkey with stars and red white and blue colors.


----------



## KaGee

In my best parent-like loud voice...
"DON'T MAKE ME CLOSE THIS THREAD AGAIN!"
"IF YOU KIDS CAN'T BEHAVE.......I'M GOING TO CALL YOUR PARENTS!"

We all don't agree on everything. Walk away when you don't. Personal attacks lead to the time-out chair.

Get back on topic... we have strayed again. What does COVID19 have to do with cheese?
Nothing!
The topic for those who seemed to have forgotten is *Corona-Live-Update*


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## Redheads

This is the exact reason why our government doesn't tell us about UFO's

Can you imagine how everyone would react about that !!


----------



## fastwater

My apologies for cutting up about the 'gubment cheese'.

Agree with earlier posts that with more testing, it's a given there will be more 'positive' diagnosis.
Remember when Ohio had only 5 confirmed cases and Amy Acton stated then that with the number of positive cases, versus number tested, versus total Ohio population that there could very easily be 100,000 people walking around in Ohio that would test positive.


----------



## buckeyebowman

Got to hear a real MD, based in Cali, interviewed on the radio today. Apparently, highly respected in the LA area, since he had occasion to call out the Mayor, who had advised people to "shelter in place"! He was interviewed on local media and asked if the Mayor had any idea what the term actually means. The Mayor corrected his statement to mean basically, "don't go out unless you really need to".

He said that basically there's been a lot of irresponsible rhetoric going around on social media, and from politicians and media talking heads! As for Italy's situation, he made perfectly clear that "we are NOT Italy!" They have freely admitted that they were woefully unprepared, and their medical establishment is nowhere near as sophisticated as ours. I, and another member addressed this in a couple of posts that are now back quite a ways. Also, the average age of Italy's population is the oldest in Europe. Seeing how this virus works, and the fact that they were asleep at the switch, it kind of makes sense that they'd get hit pretty hard.

And, as for China, I mentioned a few pages back the the Chinese and South Korean pro basketball leagues are back up and running! Didn't hear if they were playing in front of fans, or if it's for TV only, but it is interesting.




Fish-N-Fool said:


> _If you want a moment of humor go out to youtube and watch George Carlins "Germs and Immune System" or "fear of Germs". For adults only (language), but hilarious.
> 
> You know why I didn't get COVID 19....Because I swam in raw sewage that's right! I can hear him now._


Reminds me of an episode of _Married With Children_ I watched back in the day. In it Al Bundy attempts to explain to his wife Peg why cockroaches will outlive the human race.

"Peg, you see that cockroach?"
"That one over there?"
"No. That one over there!"
"What about it"
"You know that cockroaches will be here after human are all gone?"
"Really, Al?"
"Yeah Peg. And do you know why?"
"No, why Al?"
'BECAUSE THEY EAT CRAP! THAT'S WHY!"


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## $diesel$

fastwater said:


> WHERE'S MY GUBMENT CHEESE?


Just don't eat too much at one time, FW. Wouldn't want to see you have to get dynamited.


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## fishing pole

Redheads said:


> This is the exact reason why our government doesn't tell us about UFO's
> 
> Can you imagine how everyone would react about that !!


If you only knew


----------



## fastwater

$diesel$ said:


> Just don't eat too much at one time, FW. Wouldn't want to see you have to get dynamited.


We better get this one back on topic before the thread gets dynamited.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

montagc said:


> Thanks Tom. Being a tech guy, I wonder how all these low income students with no internet at home are going to get their work done without free WiFi from all these places that have closed, like libraries and such.


Spectrum has free internet I'll try to find the number


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## Saugeye Tom

Spectrum #


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## Big Chief

Let’s face the facts fellas........it’s not going away for awhile. Do what you can now not later.
The second Great Depression is almost here..........


----------



## Shad Rap

Big Chief said:


> Let’s face the facts fellas........it’s not going away for awhile. Do what you can now not later.
> The second Great Depression is almost here..........


I believe it's gonna be under control a lot sooner than what they say or think...and our economy will rebound quickly after that...but I'm an optimist...it's the USA...you can't hold us down.


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## Slatebar

oops


----------



## One guy and a boat

In my wildest dreams I would've never thought I would need to implement procedures on how to keep my crew working and sheltered from a virus. Sanitize frequently touched surfaces and equipment daily. Lock building and limit public interaction. Latex gloves and hand sanitizer. Taking people's temperature. Crazy times for sure. Still early but all still working and really busy. Apparently panic buyers need plywood also. Hope there not substituting plywood for toilet paper lol

Sent from my Pixel 3a XL using Tapatalk


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## fastwater

^^^Hopefully most of this sanitizing will continue after corona has run its course. Maybe there won't be near as many cases of the flu.


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## ErieRider

Please heed the advice that everyone has been telling us for the last few weeks..... wife more than me (nurse) (and myself) are on the frontlines of this. We are losing our childcare provider tomorrow, have to apply with the state to be granted essential worker status to be allowed to go to a state designated child care. It's turning so many lives upside down and inside out. The kids are all out of sorts leaving their comfort and friends first from school, then one all day care facility to another.... all in less than 2 weeks time. grateful to be working but get really frustrated when I see people just doing things like nothing is even happening. Talked tonight with wife about it. Sucks for sure but we both signed up for it. Keep in mind the people working, the stress they are under and the people suffering with this illness. Seen charts tonight and we are on the exact same curve as Italy, just a few weeks behind. It's going to get worse. Think about it when you "need" that scratch off or something for around the house. You could be making someone sick, causing stress or hardship to someone and you don't know it! Please think what's important?? Wife shared this pic with me and thought it's worth another share! My best wishes are also with the unemployed in this whole thing. Talked to a worker at a local restaurant today with a baby on the way who was walking out the door for the last time.... much more brave than I could be but you could tell it was weighing heavy on him and it about killed me!! Sorry for rambling, here's the picture I promised and heed the damn warnings and advisories for the greater good of all!!!









Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## Had a Bite

So, as a nurse who works in the surgery department, I have suddenly found myself with a little extra "free" time on my hands. For now anyway, with no elective surgeries. (Its for the best)

Watching the news tonight I saw where they were talking about closing beaches in Florida, and a real "winner" was running his mouth about nothing stopping him from going out to party, so I thought I'd share a few of my thoughts.

I drove through town just to be out of the house. I know this will not be the most popular opinion, but I just shook my head as I saw how full the store parking lots were, like black friday out there. So much for social isolation. I understand people need things, but this is all defeating the purpose I think. I wish they would commit to a full shut down for a few days or a week. Slowing the spread is critical when it comes to this virus. Maybe a lock down isn't the answer, but who knows? (Answer is--- no one knows the 100% right answer for this)
But just look at what happened in Italy, being so overwhelmed, no one wants to deal with that here. Having to deal with such an overload of sick patients all at once and either not having room for them or the life saving equipment to help them. What we're trying to do here is at least slow it down give us a chance to help as many people as we can. Sure, not everyone will make it, that's life, but we at least want to have a opportunity to try.

One of the other main reasons we need to slow the spread is because eventually the nurses and doctors will get exposed and get sick. (Has already happened in some places I'm sure) example- 1 nurse on the shift gets sick with this, they will have exposed the rest of the shift and then all of a sudden you have an entire group of nurses that cant come to work. Who takes care of our friends and family then??? 

And for those who think this is not big deal, your right, 80ish% of the time it is just like a cold or flu, no hospitalization needed. But its that other 20% that will get you. It's kinda like what my uncle always said to people about why he goes to church, I could be wrong, and if I am, it's alright, but if your wrong, your screwed.


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## loomis82

We are crazy busy here too, never seen anything like it! I live in Michigan and work at a tile distribution center, been there awhile and never seen us this busy. You'd think tile was toilet paper! Everyone must be home bored thinking of remodeling!


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## loves2fishinohio

I'd invite you to consider the last time in the past week you've heard anything not related to the coronavirus on the news. Even the NBC nightly news last night, there was not one single report not related to the coronavirus. I can't remember that ever happening, not even during 9/11 or the Gulf Wars.

My point is, the media doesn't have anything else to report on right now apparently, and they are helping to stir this panic. 

Stores remain open. Heck, Kroger is looking to hire 10K workers nationwide. Supply lines are not disrupted, if anything they are stronger with the receive drops in fuel prices. Food is not in short supply, they just can't get it to the shelves fast enough because everyone is caught in this "OMG the world is about to end" mode.

Much has been made about the announcements in CA about orders for people to shelter in place over the past 12 hours. Those orders don't include going outside, going to the grocery store, etc..

Everyone needs to take a freakin chill pill. Food has and will remain available. Even in Italy, the country hardest hit by this virus, people aren't starving.


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## BuckeyeFishinNut

Here is my perspective so far. We pretty much know the media as a whole doesn't tell the entire truth. They report on the part of the story that suits the networks agenda, this goes for both sides. This also goes for their contributors too, I have heard over the last few days from doom and gloom doctors and optimistic doctors. The truth is somewhere in between I am sure.

I know where I live people seem to be heeding the warnings. Traffic is substantially less, grocery stores have people in them but are not packed, don't see anyone at the parks, etc. Yesterday, I did see a number of people outside their homes, doing yard work, playing with their kids, cleaning out the garage, etc. This is what needs to happen for the time being. Stay away from crowds but don't put your life on hold. Hang out with your family, go fishing, get some honey-do stuff done when the weather is decent. 

Most people aren't in fear of the virus, its the fear of the uncertainty and the disruption to their everyday lives. This won't last forever, we just need to weather the storm for the time being. Things will bounce back and we will be stronger than ever.


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## Southernsaug

deleted


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## ErieRider

BuckeyeFishinNut said:


> Here is my perspective so far. We pretty much know the media as a whole doesn't tell the entire truth. They report on the part of the story that suits the networks agenda, this goes for both sides. This also goes for their contributors too, I have heard over the last few days from doom and gloom doctors and optimistic doctors. The truth is somewhere in between I am sure.
> 
> I know where I live people seem to be heeding the warnings. Traffic is substantially less, grocery stores have people in them but are not packed, don't see anyone at the parks, etc. Yesterday, I did see a number of people outside their homes, doing yard work, playing with their kids, cleaning out the garage, etc. This is what needs to happen for the time being. Stay away from crowds but don't put your life on hold. Hang out with your family, go fishing, get some honey-do stuff done when the weather is decent.
> 
> Most people aren't in fear of the virus, its the fear of the uncertainty and the disruption to their everyday lives. This won't last forever, we just need to weather the storm for the time being. Things will bounce back and we will be stronger than ever.


And we can get back to normal life much more quickly if we do exactly what you said to do in the last post. Everyone's decisions today affect how long this new "normal" is going to last. 
One thing I forgot to add in my last post. Labor pools are being created at many hospitals to prepare for an influx of patients and not enough medical staff. When the time comes they will be basically having all hands on deck for this crisis. I'm saying that they will be pulling whoever's still standing, not away with their own issues regardless of their background. So in reality, you could have a plastic surgeon making decisions concerning infectious disease. Granted there would be some guidance from field experts but still not what I would want. I'm fine with people scrambling last weekend but just follow the guidelines of your officials and get stuff in order around the house so hopefully when this subsides we all can enjoy our normal routines again

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## BuckeyeFishinNut

One last thing and then I got stuff to do. I am also one of those people who are in the camp that this has been here for a little while and was never identified. Beginning of January, my wife came down with flu like symptoms. She had a terrible headache, fever that would spike, break, and then come back again a couple days later, tightness in her chest and some mild breathing issues but no real congestion. She got tested for the flu and it was negative, but the doctor said there was a respirator bug going around. Told her to take cold and flu medicine and drink fluids. She got better in about a week to 10 days, was very sluggish and low energy for about another week. There was also a women I worked with at school who had the same exact thing, again tested negative for the flu, got the same respirator bug story, she was out sick for about 10 days.

I am well aware that there are many, many strains of the flu and that the flu test only tests for a couple. I am also aware that the doctors knew that something was going around that had flu like symptoms but was more respiratory in nature. I did not get sick but I saw what my wife had and it checked a number of boxes for symptoms of COVID-19. Maybe it was, maybe it wasn't but it doesn't seem like a coincidence.


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## BuckeyeFishin07

BuckeyeFishinNut said:


> Here is my perspective so far. We pretty much know the media as a whole doesn't tell the entire truth. They report on the part of the story that suits the networks agenda, this goes for both sides. This also goes for their contributors too, I have heard over the last few days from doom and gloom doctors and optimistic doctors. The truth is somewhere in between I am sure.
> 
> I know where I live people seem to be heeding the warnings. Traffic is substantially less, grocery stores have people in them but are not packed, don't see anyone at the parks, etc. Yesterday, I did see a number of people outside their homes, doing yard work, playing with their kids, cleaning out the garage, etc. This is what needs to happen for the time being. Stay away from crowds but don't put your life on hold. Hang out with your family, go fishing, get some honey-do stuff done when the weather is decent.
> 
> Most people aren't in fear of the virus, its the fear of the uncertainty and the disruption to their everyday lives. This won't last forever, we just need to weather the storm for the time being. Things will bounce back and we will be stronger than ever.


Thank you for this, I needed this thought this morning. With all the uncertainty of our jobs and this virus, I was beginning to get very depressed. But with all the things you said here I got a little gleam of hope back in my soul. Thank you


----------



## Pooka

Making the rounds with Walmart store employees. I reckon it is true. LOL


----------



## Bluewalleye

Fishinnut, my wife and our youngest grandson ( 3 ) had very similar illness that you are talking about back in beginning of Feb. As contagious as this virus has been portrayed to be, non of the rest of us ( 5 total in house ) got what they had. So I am not sure if it was the virus that is effecting the entire world right now just cause of that fact. But just another ugly type of flu that was going around. My wife never misses work, but she missed 3 days with what she had. And she shouldn't have went back when she did in my mind. But she is bull headed about some things. lol


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## icebucketjohn




----------



## Outasync

I had the same thing a week ago and was over it in 4 days the wifes had it for going on 8 days now. Doubtful its the virus just a nasty flu going around. Everyone seems to want to blame everything on the virus now


----------



## fishless

Outasync said:


> I had the same thing a week ago and was over it in 4 days the wifes had it for going on 8 days now. Doubtful its the virus just a nasty flu going around. Everyone seems to want to blame everything on the virus now


Sister had real bad cough and just sleep pretty much for 3 days.Went to stat care checked for flu.It wasn't It was bronchial bacterial infection.Antibiotics and she is feeling better


----------



## Specwar

I previously stated I would stay away from this thread but have found it difficult to do so. 
I have however kept an open mind to all input here whether I found it to be believable or personal hype from disenchanted contributors.
I am attaching an email that I received from a very well education Chinese National that worked for me there when I was still traveling between the U.S. and China installing Steel Industry equipment a few years ago.
I can only assume that China appears to be past the critical stage of this virus based on his closing statement that things are now better there.
His home is very close to Wuhan.


----------



## Outasync

My 8 month old brought it home to us. She ended up with an ear infection and a cough. My 3 year old has been immune from it all luckily. Worst part is im still suffering some pain from my hernia surgery 4 weeks ago because of all the coughing.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

Like I said Keep Calm And enjoy the spring bite!! Everything will be fine health wise by June or July. The economy will be rough for a while but our Great Country will bounce back Fast !!!!


----------



## cheezemm2

Here's a really good interactive graphics page from Reuters:

https://graphics.reuters.com/CHINA-HEALTH-MAP/0100B59S39E/index.html


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## cheezemm2

Here's the exponential aspect of spread...


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## BuckeyeFishin07

Specwar said:


> View attachment 347535
> I previously stated I would stay away from this thread but have found it difficult to do so.
> I have however kept an open mind to all input here whether I found it to be believable or personal hype from disenchanted contributors.
> I am attaching an email that I received from a very well education Chinese National that worked for me there when I was still traveling between the U.S. and China installing Steel Industry equipment a few years ago.
> I can only assume that China appears to be past the critical stage of this virus based on his closing statement that things are now better there.
> His home is very close to Wuhan.
> View attachment 347535
> View attachment 347535


Thank you for this, something I think we all needed to see.


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## dcool

The end of the world is coming soon. If you don't believe me, go to the grocery store!


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## Bluewalleye

dcool said:


> The end of the world is coming soon. If you don't believe me, go to the grocery store!


I just got back from the grocery store and they had pretty much everything I was looking for. The only thing they didn't have was the Aquafina water that I like to drink. Had to buy the crappy so called spring water that they had. I really don't believe it is real spring water. At least it doesn't taste like any pure spring water I have ever had. lol


----------



## loves2fishinohio

dcool said:


> The end of the world is coming soon. If you don't believe me, go to the grocery store!


Pretty crappy misinformation. I was at my local Kroger at 10am this morning. Some things were still out, namely paper products and flour, but everything they were out of earlier in the week was restock. That included bread, chicken, all meats, eggs, milk, even ramen noodles. And they were still stocking up. 

There are no food shortages - there are panicked people buying up everything in sight before the supply chain can replenish. 

I saw some woman pushing around a full cart of 5lb bags of sugar, there had to be at least 30 bags in her cart. I felt like asking her if she was brewing up a batch of Rum. I checked the shelf and it was all gone. THAT'S the problem with what is going on in the stores.


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## Specwar

Selfish indignant bastards make up a large number of our population, very unfortunate and sad.


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## BuckeyeFishin07

loves2fishinohio said:


> Pretty crappy misinformation. I was at my local Kroger at 10am this morning. Some things were still out, namely paper products and flour, but everything they were out of earlier in the week was restock. That included bread, chicken, all meats, eggs, milk, even ramen noodles. And they were still stocking up.
> 
> There are no food shortages - there are panicked people buying up everything in sight before the supply chain can replenish.
> 
> I saw some woman pushing around a full cart of 5lb bags of sugar, there had to be at least 30 bags in her cart. I felt like asking her if she was brewing up a batch of Rum. I checked the shelf and it was all gone. THAT'S the problem with what is going on in the stores.


Should have reached in the cart and said Don't mind if I do, and walked to the register!!!


----------



## fishing pole

Average age of deaths = 80.3
Number of health related issues of those succumbing to virus = 2.7

No death is a good death but it isn't doomsday. Just keep following the piper. 
Stay off the Corona News Network and also stay off Corona Broadcasting Network, Nothing But Corona...you get my point. 

Chances are some of us already had it and didn't know any better. I was very sick (all the symptoms) 3 weeks ago and it took me about 10 days to recover fully. I run 2-3 miles a day. I could not run because I had no lungs. But hard headed me never missed a day of work in 40 years kept right on ticking. RELAX


----------



## Shad Rap

montagc said:


> Following up on my comment to Shad Rap a few pages back, since it seems that a few others think they already had C19 as well.
> 
> For all who say it has been around, I think we would have known. We would have heard of mass hospitalizations, it would have hit a nursing home or three and caused a lot of death, those things that we all know the media loves to report. Also, remember not all media is gov't or company owned, we also have social media, so everyone can spread news and info to those they know. We would have seen individual reports of health care workers dealing with these cases, as they told their family, friends, and followers about it. Same as we are seeing now.
> 
> So no, I do not think it was C19 that you had. Take a step back, and look at the big picture. Lots of other viruses are getting harder to kick as they mutate, and none of us are getting any younger. If you had a bad illness recently, I really hope you don't get Corona. *I really can't stress enough, If the flu or another bug knocked you on your butt for a week or more, this one could be much, much worse for you. *


People have had it and it's been here since the new year...I myself have already had it and it didn't knock me on my butt for a week (and no I'm not claiming to be a tough guy)...my wifes version was full blown and it knocked her out for a week to 10 days...my suggestion would be to educate yourself more about the disease, who it affects and how it affects them...examples are- it's killing men more than women, it's associated with high blood pressure, associated with underlying health conditions, associated with older adults as far as being deadly, and not everyone even shows symptoms, some symptoms are shown less than others, it's even assicated with a certain blood type...type A.
And your theory about people dying earlier if it was here earlier or hearing more about it?..not necessarily true at all...the disease just wasn't very pronounced yet here in the states...the first case in the US goes back to like Jan.20th...and thats the first tested and documented person in the US...this was here in December or earlier...all signs are pointing to it.
Me and my wife had it the first week of February.
Just FYI I am in no way dismissing this disease...I just want that to be clear...I'm doing everything this country is asking...just because it affected me not severely, it obviously does affect some people severely...and that's a problem.


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

Update: Both of my co-workers have sent messages and updated their well-being. Both were very early confirmed cases (the one was the first confirmed case in SW OH). They are on day 11 and day 7 of quarantine respectively. Both are fine. The first confirmed case says he feels 100% already.

One of these individuals one was very "close" to being considered high risk due to age and a health condition. Especially good to hear how quickly she is feeling better.

Hopefully that helps ease the mind of anybody who knows somebody non-high risk that has contacted it. I know we are all very happy for this news around the office.


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

Southernsaug said:


> Earlier I saw a post that was supposed to be from Stanford U and England with a *list of corona virus facts* and symptoms......these are fake news. Here is a link from Fox news
> https://www.foxnews.com/us/stanford-disowns-breathing-test-claim-for-coronavirus-as-misinformation


Sorry, I can't find the "fake news" you reference. 

Your link is in regards to a bogus breathing test, as it indicates right in the link.

I can't find anything relating to facts and symptoms. Your post says "and England", you may be referring to a post with information from a study provided by the New England Journal of Medicine?

Here is a link to the New England Journal of Medicine, with facts regarding the virus and the viability (how long the virus stays active in air and on surfaces), They have only been around since 1812, so they may not really know what they're talking about, 

I have to say I was quite surprised at some of it. I did hear a doctor dispute the "droplets staying active in air" which I was happy to hear, the NEJM indicated staying active 3 hours in the air. He said that test was done with a nebulizer which injects air into the test, whereas someone coughing won't have near the same effect. 

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMc2004973?query=featured_home

If you have information to dispute their findings, I would be more than happy to read it.

As i was filling up at the gas station today, I watched a guy put the pump back in the holder, put the cap on his gas tank, and then rub around his eyes and nose.  Keep your hands away from your face everyone. I'm quite worried about my own father, he's terrible at this, at his age and with an already bad smokers cough, this would more than likely kill him.


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## fishing pole

NEJM
Wrong about Pancreatic Cancer caused by Diabetes
Wrong about Vioxx
Most people are afraid to say anything about the New England Journal because they’re afraid they won’t get something published there.
They have purposely held out articles that went against certain pharmaceutical companies drugs.

Yes they are credible but they are not a mandate.

We have grown so soft as a society!!


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## lawrence1

The old people I know are running scared on this. They're being bombarded by the media at every turn of the channel.


Certain people need to quit eating things (bats) that have historically been proven to cause mass illness,,,,,,, China...

 Like Reply
Report


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## Dovans

Bluewalleye said:


> I just got back from the grocery store and they had pretty much everything I was looking for. The only thing they didn't have was the Aquafina water that I like to drink. Had to buy the crappy so called spring water that they had. I really don't believe it is real spring water. At least it doesn't taste like any pure spring water I have ever had. lol


if its Kroger spring water I agree.... Horrible stuff


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## JOSH gets2fish

Fyi several years ago I switched away from bottled water and purchased a Berkey water filter. Its a simple stainless steel canister that works using gravity. Filters last up to 5 years. Water tastes good IMO. And it pays for itself in a few months once you stop buying bottles. Its kinda a pain to have to keep manually refilling it but, cheap and easier than hauling bottles home from the store.

Also its good to be aware that seasonal allergies are ramping up quickly. So dont be to surprised if alot of people are coughing sneezing etc. Down in southern Ohio today I had a reaction as soon as I stepped outside.


----------



## Killbuckian

They just kicked out all visitors at Akron General hospital. My wife was there with her dad that is in ICU. For the last couple days it has been a one visitor policy. As of just a couple hours ago they made everyone leave and said they could not come back until further notice. She is in full melt down. So sad.


----------



## Saugeyefisher

Killbuckian said:


> They just kicked out all visitors at Akron General hospital. My wife was there with her dad that is in ICU. For the last couple days it has been a one visitor policy. As of just a couple hours ago they made everyone leave and said they could not come back until further notice. She is in full melt down. So sad.


That is awfull to here,and I do not blame her one bit at all....


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Still no TP at Sams but what is more concerning is no canned goods at all and Sam’s stocks a lot of bulk canned goods. But the Tp thing. What is up? Why tp? I seen where some are trying to resell it but damn... all of them can’t be. People are freaking stupid, let alone selfish and inconsiderate.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Still no TP at Sams but what is more concerning is no canned goods at all and Sam’s stocks a lot of bulk canned goods. But the Tp thing. What is up? Why tp? I seen where some are trying to resell it but damn... all of them can’t be. People are freaking stupid, let alone selfish and inconsiderate.


She said they are out of all meats also.


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> She said they are out of all meats also.


Mansfield Sams had plenty of meats earlier today, granted some items were listed as 1 per person. Picked up a big ol butt for the smoker. 

Best thing was gas @ $1.75.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Stars-n-Stripers said:


> Mansfield Sams had plenty of meats earlier today, granted some items were listed as 1 per person. Picked up a big ol butt for the smoker.


They must be all hoarders up here in NE Ohio. I get to Mansfield often. I will have to stop there sometime.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Dewine’s lockdown is coming I think. Next thing to martial law. Has anyone heard anything?


----------



## Burkcarp1

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Dewine’s lockdown is coming I think. Next thing to martial law. Has anyone heard anything?


Just rumors,all rumors so far. I’ve been hearing that for a week. Not sure why people want to panic people.What happens,happens..


----------



## fastwater

Had to hit Kroger in Lancaster yesterday.
Found most everything needed other than TP. Ended up finding it at Dollar General.
There were some items not available...no water with the exception of some Kroger brand stacked on the floor and all shelves empty with exception of about 30 8pks(I think) of flavored water that was actually on sale at buy one...get one free. Watched as a lady bought up better than half of that flavored water.
She sent her husband up to get an additional cart...assuming for the rest of her groceries.
Packaged Fresh Meats...surely not the amount or variety as usual.
Beef...fairly well picked over but was able to pick up a nice roast and if I had needed burger,steaks etc.there was some to select from.
Chicken was almost gone with only about 10pks of chicken tenders left. No legs,breast etc.
Pork...less than normal...zero sausage but did pick up a few PK's of chops.
Dairy...no problem
Vegetables...no problem
No TP,paper towels, aerosol sanitizing sprays or wipes. No rubbing alcohol and bleach was very low.
Canned goods/soups were very selective with no chicken soup available. 
Some of the dry goods...flour,sugar etc very low.

All in all...as I walked through the store and stock was surely on the lower side from the norm...I was reminded just how Blessed I am to be in this country. And that even though our shelves weren't stocked like we might be used to seeing, they are most likely still stocked better than the shelves of many markets in other country's on their best days.


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

Good point fastwater! I have co-workers from Urkraine and they laugh hard....now keep in mind as children they had to walk the Forrest in Ukraine to gather mushrooms not to go without food. I chatted today with one and she said our stores have far more than a typical day in Ukraine - her mother and father still live there.

her sister lives in Turkey and things are not so great for her a lot of the time.

“rough” times here are considered fantastic by most of the world


----------



## Dovans

I am wondering how Kroger is going to police the senior shopping only policy they just started.. This morning we put out Pallet of TP, (6 pack) and two pallets of water. 7:10 pallet of TP was gone. 8am water was gone. 

I happened to be up at the doors when they were unlocked.. about 75 people flowed in.. They had one goal. Hit the TP aisle. I dont know if anyone has ever seen line of ants going from a food source to there nest, but thats what it reminded me of.


----------



## fastwater

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> *Dewine’s lockdown is coming I think*. Next thing to martial law. Has anyone heard anything?


Especially if the people that are off work and the kids that are out of school don't stay at home like all the time off was designed to do.
I had to go in town to the grocery store yesterday in the middle of the day to do our monthly shopping. Surely didn't want to but we were at that point grocery wise.
Figured since it was a week day with many working and people not really supposed to be out, traffic would be minimal.
Nope, way more traffic out and about than normal. 
Moms/Dads hitting some of the small nikknak shops in town with kids in tow like it's just another day.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Burkcarp1 said:


> Just rumors,all rumors so far. I’ve been hearing that for a week. Not sure why people want to panic people.What happens,happens..


Well there is no panic here. Rumors.. maybe. IL and CT just jumped on the bandwagon with NY and CA. And after Dewine’s presser I can see us next in line. But no. No panic here. But I am thinking it’s going to get worse before it gets better. It’s funny that you are hearing more and more about lockdowns, bringing in the NG, martial law, ect. And less and less about the virus itself. Preparing the masses isn’t always a good thing. And Kumbya only last for so long.


----------



## Southernsaug

stars -n-stripers, I do not see either of the two post I was referring to now either. They must of been deleted. I am sorry I offended you, I was just trying to help.

I deleted the text in my post


----------



## Redheads

I went to a couple of stores today for a few things in case the shutdown hits soon...No problem getting everything i needed.
Stain for the barn, some dirt for the raised beds and planters along with fertilizer and of course beer and whiskey.


----------



## fastwater

^^^Guys...just a respectful reminder that staff is not playin with this thread as far as stayin on topic.
Guilty of not doing so myself awhile back feeding into posts I didn't agree with, we were given another strong warning about staying on topic and not bickering with those with different opinions. 

Being a topic that has/will touch each of us before it's over in unforeseen, unprecedented ways...As we read some of these post/opinions, it's really easy to get dragged into a pee'ing contest with someone we don't agree with, Especially as all this corona thing escalates.
Please...if someone posts something that's not agreeable, just move on.
If someone is getting on our nerves...move on to the next post...or maybe take a break from the thread a few days.
While this thread has a different level of meaning to each of us, there are some here that it is very important to and do not want it closed.
Again, before getting into a conflict here in this thread, please consider those that may want to keep it open more than others might want to.


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

Southernsaug said:


> stars -n-stripers, I do not see either of the two post I was referring to now either. They must of been deleted. I am sorry I offended you, I was just trying to help.
> 
> I deleted the text in my post


No apology necessary, and no offense taken my friend!


----------



## Burkcarp1

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Well there is no panic here. Rumors.. maybe. IL and CT just jumped on the bandwagon with NY and CA. And after Dewine’s presser I can see us next in line. But no. No panic here. But I am thinking it’s going to get worse before it gets better. It’s funny that you are hearing more and more about lockdowns, bringing in the NG, martial law, ect. And less and less about the virus itself. Preparing the masses isn’t always a good thing. And Kumbya only last for so long.


I wasn’t saying that you are panicking..but people saying stuff that isn’t true at the time causes some other people to panic..


----------



## Southernsaug

Being in the high risk group, 65, heart disease and asthma, I very much want to keep up on any information anyone has. I have learned a few things from this thread so please keep it open


----------



## cement569

i never bought into that bottled water thing, I just take tap water and boil it and put it into containers and stick in the fridge. tastes wet and cold and no plastic bottles to pollute our envirement.....and you save money


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## Saugeyefisher

Even during a "statewide shut down" grocery stores will still be open. 
The state has been posting any and all updates,and shooting down rumors as they come...


----------



## buckeyebowman

Had a Bite said:


> So, as a nurse who works in the surgery department, I have suddenly found myself with a little extra "free" time on my hands. For now anyway, with no elective surgeries. (Its for the best)
> 
> But just look at what happened in Italy, being so overwhelmed, no one wants to deal with that here. Having to deal with such an overload of sick patients all at once and either not having room for them or the life saving equipment to help them. What we're trying to do here is at least slow it down give us a chance to help as many people as we can. Sure, not everyone will make it, that's life, but we at least want to have a opportunity to try.


If you haven't read it, go back to page 46 and read my prior post #906. It addresses the Italy situation, and my source was a MD from Cali that was interviewed on the radio. Heard part of it replayed today. He said he was very frustrated with uninformed people trying to establish Italy as OUR benchmark!


----------



## MIGHTY

I’ll chime back in after seeing some post from Dovans. I work for a small family business that’s been around since the 1800’s. Used to do everything from slaughtering hogs and cattle to all of the processing, cooking, and shipping. We’ve been swamped with orders. We can’t keep beef in stock. Also our breakfast sausage, bratwurst, and Italian sausage sales have really gone up. City BBQ is a customer that we make 4-6k pounds of sausage for a week has us on hold for the time being and a place called G&R tavern that buys a lot of bologna from us weekly is up in the air for next week being they are restaurants and no one can sit down and eat. The Krogers on high/front street really upped their orders lately. All the other mom and pop shops that we deliver to around the state seem to be hanging in there.


----------



## Bluewalleye

We live in the greatest country on the face of the earth. My sister in law grew up in communist east germany. When my brother ( army ) brought her here to live for good, she was amazed at all the food choices we have. She grew up where they had 2 flavors of cereal, and not having much of a choice in general when it came to food. We are so spoiled in this country that some people don't know how to act in times of trouble like this. I would say that most people are pleasant while waiting in line at the store. And where I shop their is still plenty of paper towels and TP on the shelves. Mostly the frozen food section is picked thru though.


----------



## aquaholic2

Bluewalleye said:


> We live in the greatest country on the face of the earth. My sister in law grew up in communist east germany. When my brother ( army ) brought her here to live for good, she was amazed at all the food choices we have. She grew up where they had 2 flavors of cereal, and not having much of a choice in general when it came to food. We are so spoiled in this country that some people don't know how to act in times of trouble like this. I would say that most people are pleasant while waiting in line at the store. And where I shop their is still plenty of paper towels and TP on the shelves. Mostly the frozen food section is picked thru though.


 We are retired and able to watch the press state and national briefings most days...I have to say we feel better informed after our state press conferences than those from Washington. While I don't agree with everything coming from Columbus, what I hear Dwine saying is we have to " work harder" to further reduce contact with each other. He has made this "suggestion" several times. Today....near the end of his talk, he said real clear, that while he was not ready to impose travel restrictions...this contact has to stop "one way or another". The clear translation is, if folks don't get it, he will be doing so.....probably like a level 3 snow/road emergency, where you can be cited if you travel without an emergency. Sheriff, SP,local PD, and ONG could all enforce rule....


----------



## JamesF

I was thinking of the early shopping hours, but if 75 people are gathering and storming the aisles, count me out! There is a voice of reason, that people should listen to. Around here, the early hours start Monday. The whole reason for this, is to clean and restock the store, for us Geezers that Want to limit exposure.


----------



## Lewis

What protective measures are you guys taking on shopping trips? Are you seeing anyone wearing masks and gloves or wearing them yourselves?


----------



## Saugeyefisher

Lewis said:


> What protective measures are you guys taking on shopping trips? Are you seeing anyone wearing masks and gloves or wearing them yourselves?


I have seen a couple masks. I am not touching anything I dont have to touch. I disinfect the cart,use my sleeves to open anything,and heavy doses of sanatizer.


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## MIGHTY

I heard a doctor on the radio yesterday discuss that very topic Lewis. He said that the masks aren’t very useful for people that aren’t already sick? Also he hinted towards what saugeyefisher said. If there’s people with the virus shopping you should be more worried about them being around products that you’re buying and transmitting it onto them. He discussed how long they think it can survive on different types of surfaces like glass, cardboard, paper, steel etc. 


Lewis said:


> What protective measures are you guys taking on shopping trips? Are you seeing anyone wearing masks and gloves or wearing them yourselves?


----------



## Muddy

I have stayed out of stores. If/when I do go to the store I will wear a Tyvek suite, shoe covers, latex gloves, and a respirator with full face shield. Right now we are content to stay away from everyone outside of our immediate family unit. We have been using the phone a lot to stay in contact with family and friends.


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## Muddy

Groceries shouldn’t be brought straight into your home. I would clean any plastic packaging that you can and leave everything in the garage, spare fridge, or cooler for as long as possible before putting in the kitchen fridge. Setting items out in the sun for as long as possible will allow the UV light to help kill the virus.


----------



## Pooka

Lewis said:


> What protective measures are you guys taking on shopping trips? Are you seeing anyone wearing masks and gloves or wearing them yourselves?


I was out to Wally yesterday morning, have seen a couple masks, a few older folks wearing gloves, some cashiers wearing gloves and folks sani-wiping everything. 

I have done more sani-wiping but that is really about it. In truth I have not changed much in my life, maybe a bit more aware of wear my hands are going and using hand sanitizer more. My biggest move has been to not hug my elderly mother and keeping a distance from her. --That sucks.


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## cement569

I take the same precautions as saugeye, was at acme yesterday and walking down the isle this lady came walking towards me coughing and had a red nose. anyone recall the old benny hill show when they sped the camera up to fast motion? that's what I looked like, wife said she hasent seen me move that fast in a while......in other words if your sick STAY HOME


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## Saugeyefisher

cement569 said:


> I take the same precautions as saugeye, was at acme yesterday and walking down the isle this lady came walking towards me coughing and had a red nose. anyone recall the old benny hill show when they sped the camera up to fast motion? that's what I looked like, wife said she hasent seen me move that fast in a while......in other words if your sick STAY HOME


Lol you where cough shaming ....


----------



## PolkRunKid

Benny Hill, nice! Good story. My first laugh of day.


----------



## AmericanEagle

I am wearing latex exam gloves when I shop. It helps me not to touch my face. I remove them in my garage and wash my hands when I enter the house.

I have a box of surgical masks I bought and did not use from the H1N1 virus in 2009. I will wear them when the virus peaks. I don't believe surgical masks are 100% effective but do think they help protect you. Among other things done to prevent the virus from spreading in places like Taiwan or Hong Kong which have not been overrun COVID-19 many people wear masks . My understanding is they are now telling medical professionals to use scarfs or bandannas if masks aren't available, so anything is more effective than nothing.


----------



## Shad Rap

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Dewine’s lockdown is coming I think. Next thing to martial law. Has anyone heard anything?


Nope...no lockdown...how are you gonna lock down when the necessary supplies to do so aren't available?..all the left wants to do is keep talking lockdown...they definitely aren't happy it hasnt happened yet...oops.
3/4 of the people are already locked down on their own anyway...that in itself should have a great affect on this virus...Columbus and the cities surrounding it have been ghost towns for about a week now...HUGE DIFFERENCE.


----------



## Lewis

One thing I am paying particular attention to is my mail. I am treating it like hazardous waste...lol This virus can live on some surfaces for quite a while. Think about how the mailman touches every mailbox lid that is also touched by every homeowner on his route. Then he handles your mail. I spray down all mail with either Lysol or a bleach water solution.


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## Muddy

Lewis said:


> One thing I am paying particular attention to is my mail. I am treating it like hazardous waste...lol This virus can live on some surfaces for quite a while. Think about how the mailman touches every mailbox lid that is also touched by every homeowner on his route. Then he handles your mail. I spray down all mail with either Lysol or a bleach water solution.


Yep, mine goes in a 5 gallon bucket to sit for several days before I touch it.


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## Misdirection

Muddy said:


> Yep, mine goes in a 5 gallon bucket to sit for several days before I touch it.


You know, I'm reading OGF via Tapatalk with the preview pane on, so with out opening the thread all I saw was what's posted above with no context. I'll be honest and say your mail isn't the first thing that came to mind

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


----------



## Saugeyefisher

Shad Rap said:


> Nope...no lockdown...how are you gonna lock down when the necessary supplies to do so aren't available?..all the left wants to do is keep talking lockdown...they definitely aren't happy it hasnt happened yet...oops.
> 3/4 of the people are already locked down on their own anyway...that in itself should have a great affect on this virus...Columbus and the cities surrounding it have been ghost towns for about a week now...HUGE DIFFERENCE.


I agree,we wont see any lockdowns imo...
I'm not sure how true this is but I was told both ohio an Louisiana had its first case around the same time,ohio has set stricter rules surrounding the virus compared to Louisiana like carry out only and the shut downs. Ohio has a much larger population then Louisiana, but the cases in ohio are under 200 an in Louisiana there close to hitting the 500 mark. 
I'm happy with the decisions made bye the gov


----------



## Hatchetman

Lewis said:


> One thing I am paying particular attention to is my mail. I am treating it like hazardous waste...lol This virus can live on some surfaces for quite a while. Think about how the mailman touches every mailbox lid that is also touched by every homeowner on his route. Then he handles your mail. I spray down all mail with either Lysol or a bleach water solution.



I tried to spray down my mail but it ruined my computer screen !!


----------



## UNCLEMIKE

What is the exit strategy? It would seem the idea to flatten the curve makes sense until we realize it will take more than a few weeks.

Hearing now some talk now that the economy can't shut down for two months or more without severe long term damage. Think depression.

Options include lock down of only high risk people.

We may face the terrible choice of economic ruin vs many many deaths.

What is the value of a human life?

We may need to accept loss of life just as in war.

Would we better have surrendered in world war 2 to avoid all the deaths.

We are going to have to make a tough decision in the next few weeks.


----------



## Burkcarp1

aquaholic2 said:


> We are retired and able to watch the press state and national briefings most days...I have to say we feel better informed after our state press conferences than those from Washington. While I don't agree with everything coming from Columbus, what I hear Dwine saying is we have to " work harder" to further reduce contact with each other. He has made this "suggestion" several times. Today....near the end of his talk, he said real clear, that while he was not ready to impose travel restrictions...this contact has to stop "one way or another". The clear translation is, if folks don't get it, he will be doing so.....probably like a level 3 snow/road emergency, where you can be cited if you travel without an emergency. Sheriff, SP,local PD, and ONG could all enforce rule....


I watched Wednesday state briefing and I think for the first 15 min Our governors wife was speaking about her program for books for kids and how to make noodles, I was like WHAT??? We have a crisis on our hands and talking about that??Really??


----------



## Southernsaug

I become more confused everyday on what to believe. what I do believe is that much of the reaction has been emotionally driven and not rational or fact driven. The panic buying is not from fear of the virus but fear of what our government will do to us. I think one factor that has not been calculated is, where is the greater harm? Which harms our society more in the big picture, radically aggressive immobilization of all our social structure or the infection of the population. We will never know now if perhaps we should have left social mandates alone and simply managed the disease. Our politicians have promptly positioned themselves to be Heroes, no matter what happens. What if from the beginning we had only mobilized forces to manage sanitation, infection screening and increased medical care. Since it is likely we will see mobilization of military personnel in the future, why didn't we set up field hospitals where we had outbreaks and only isolate and treat the infected. Yes we could have limited and isolated the high risk people. Why not put wash stations and temperature checks at the entrance to every school instead of closing them. Incentivize business to do same. Move quickly on the infected and let the rest move as normal. Don't let specific scientist dictate the policy, but use specific facts to do this. I have found that the medical research field can be guilty of "crying wolf". I think private sector knowledge should have been deployed sooner. How many companies would have jumped on a big government contract to provide treatment and sanitation services. Let the great think-tanks determine a managed risk and damage plan. Now we have a wrecked economy and an epidemic, perhaps we could have had only the epidemic in a smaller proportion. What do I know I'm only a peasant .


----------



## Saltfork

Lmao lots of good stuff on here. Thing about Dewine’s wife talking about baking pies and yada yada. Yup I was watching to. I just kept laughing thinking how can anyone be this dumb. Nobody right now is watching this to hear about your pies. 

People want the meat and potatoes not who’s who and how Bobs wife has some extra flower and how Jenny got a new puppy. Disclaimer I wouldn’t give two craps weather it was a Democrat’s or Republicans wife. 

Anyhow I’m surprised an executive order has not been placed on cell phone companies for throttling data for those that have unlimited data. A lot of employees are working at home right now. I think something may be done soon about that dunno.

Not here to spread fear either. But for those of you certain that a lock down isn’t going to happen I wouldn’t bet the boat on that. It’s not if it’s when. 

Lockdown meaning stay home from work. May not mean you cannot go anywhere. Some states ya can just not to work. 

Dewine is taking a leading position in this fight state wise. I would expect him to follow suit with others in the very “near”future.

State and government workers have now worked a week from home. They have not quit worked out all the bugs but the infrastructure has been put in place.

Wishing the best for all.


----------



## 9Left

I agree with saugeyfisher's post....While the reaction to this may be somewhat appropriate… As far as being preventive goes… This reaction is simply not economically sustainable ...Things are going to get interesting


----------



## CFIden

Lewis said:


> What protective measures are you guys taking on shopping trips? Are you seeing anyone wearing masks and gloves or wearing them yourselves?


Mt Gilead Kroger's. Some people with masks some with gloves some with both. Most with nothing and standing around talking to each other like everything is fine. I put on nitryl gloves before I leave the house and wear them until I am finished shopping and am back at the car. Then I remove them by turning them inside out. Then when I get into my car I take a Clorox wipe get out wipe down the door handle then get back inside and wipe down everything I touch while driving.


----------



## OptOutside440

The beginning of the end and all are arguing about money


----------



## Dovans

One person at my store wheres a mask.. she is immune deficiency something...I made the mistake of saying she looks better in it then with out it. ahh... you'd think I'd learn not say things..


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Wonder why this isn’t all over the news... 
https://www.rochesterregional.org/news/2020/01/flu-season-2020


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Or why this wasn’t considered a pandemic in the making? 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/fox5sa...t-week-bring-local-flu-death-total-to-39/amp/


----------



## cement569

this damn virus has wreaked havoc on a lot of small business and has millions of people on high alert, a lot of people off work because of it. one has to wonder how it will affect the fishing industry such as charters, marinas, and camp grounds. cant wait till this thing is just a memory......stay safe and positive everyone


----------



## Misdirection

I received an email today that the boat launch is still on starting April 1st at the boat club where I dock.

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## ditchdigger

cement569 said:


> this damn virus has wreaked havoc on a lot of small business and has millions of people on high alert, a lot of people off work because of it. one has to wonder how it will affect the fishing industry such as charters, marinas, and camp grounds. cant wait till this thing is just a memory......stay safe and positive everyone


I would think the head boats won’t be running in the near future!


----------



## TheKing

It appears that we have a hot spot in the Dayton area. 
https://www.daytondailynews.com/new...ion-troy-nursing-home/W2Yz5vd12fhPpzBg06nw4I/


----------



## ress

Saw that on the nightly news.


----------



## EnonEye

oBOY x3


----------



## Pooka

OptOutside440 said:


> The beginning of the end and all are arguing about money


Beginning of the end?
Unless you are planning on jumping off the boat with an anchor tied to your leg, I don't reckon I would quit paying the bills just yet. 
Might want to hold off on telling the wife exactly what you think about her too. LOL


----------



## Saugeyefisher

Hit the grocery tonight. Was denied a loaf of bread had 1 loaf white 1 loaf wheat 1 pack hot dog buns 1 pack of burger buns... uhh sir we got a 3 item limit on bread... so I put back the burger bun, an stopped at the dollar store for burger buns.. shoot my brother is feeding four teenagers he can go thru a loaf a day.
Oh well. I didnt find everything I wanted exactly but compromised,instead of a pork butt I got a couple packs baby backs,instead of ground chuck I got Turkey burger, etc.etc.
Giant eagle had tp.
Stores weren't to crowded,but I imagine there will be another rush at the 1st of the month...


----------



## bulafisherman

I have two sons in the military, one is overseas, they have been on lockdown for over a week, can't even get their mail. The other one is in the Corps at camp Pendleton and they seem to be able to move around more freely. What's the stats with others whole have loved ones stationed around the world?


----------



## hatteras1

I was just told they plan on releasing prisoners because of food shortages. First I've heard this...


----------



## hatteras1

KaGee said:


> In my best parent-like loud voice...
> "DON'T MAKE ME CLOSE THIS THREAD AGAIN!"
> "IF YOU KIDS CAN'T BEHAVE.......I'M GOING TO CALL YOUR PARENTS!"
> 
> We all don't agree on everything. Walk away when you don't. Personal attacks lead to the time-out chair.
> 
> Get back on topic... we have strayed again. What does COVID19 have to do with cheese?
> Nothing!
> The topic for those who seemed to have forgotten is *Corona-Live-Update*






__ https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=326899601603271



I don't know about the rest of you, but I like what this guy says.


----------



## BuckeyeFishin07

hatteras1 said:


> I was just told they plan on releasing prisoners because of food shortages. First I've heard this...


No they have been talking about this for at least a week or so now! I have a different opinion about this situation but I will just keep it to myself.


----------



## hatteras1

BuckeyeFishin07 said:


> No they have been talking about this for at least a week or so now! I have a different opinion about this situation but I will just keep it to myself.


I heard something a few days ago, but just a remark I overheard spoken in the background. Just curious if anyone has heard this.


----------



## bulafisherman

hatteras1 said:


> I was just told they plan on releasing prisoners because of food shortages. First I've heard this...


 My daughter is an administrative assistant at one of the local prisons here, they are releasing some of their prisoners early but still going through the usual procedures. She did not mention anything about food shortages.


----------



## $diesel$

hatteras1 said:


> __ https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=326899601603271
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know about the rest of you, but I like what this guy says.


I believe a tremendous amount of todays youth are, quite frankly, incapable of understanding the consequences of what is afoot here. I'm 63 years old and i don't understand it all. When people in the know tell me to stay in, i stay in. 
But kids will be kids.
My ole lady found out Friday that she will work a week on and a week off, to her dismay, this girl is a working machine. I'm glad though, she is the receptionist at a cancer clinic and faces these folks with devastated immune systems daily. I don't want to sound cold hearted, but i wish she would just stay home. She says she can't breath with i mask on (B.S.) and refuses to wear gloves.
Oh well, i try, but you guys know women.

Your video, hatteras, was very good. I wish it would hit the social media circuit and allow these young'ns to see it.


----------



## fishingful

I will say,
All is well in Geauga County. My work shut down as soon aa the governor shut down schools. I have been off for 8 days and the wife is telecommuting from home.

I went to the store before I was off work and a couple times after. We have got more than we need in the house. At least enough to last 6 months with the 2 of us. I wasn't greedy, we already had most of it, I like to have a full freezer (we have 16 rolls of tp left that we bought last July at Sam's club lol) but got a few can goods and other non perishable foods

Weird vibe at the stores. Everyone looking around and staying away from each other but some don't care. We have enough now to not go out. Not going to unless something changes.I have a pond with fish if it gets bad.

Things I have thought about and stocked up on,
Caned goods, Pasta, and potatoes
Seeds for summer garden
Gas - car and truck are full with reserve cans
Bait (worms, magots and wax worms)

Haven't gone crazy. We have a well. So I don't have cases of water laying around. Not much other than being prepared if we have to. We are wilderness survival trained and have outdoor education jobs so we are in good shape 

I don't give a crap about anything in my house. Except the people. If I have to bug out I can survive.


----------



## BuckeyeFishinNut

My current worry is that besides schools, all of the things that have been shut down are open ended. What is it gonna take for restaurants and bars to start doing dine-in service again, barber shops and gyms to open back up? 1 new case a week, no new cases a week, no cases for a month? How long before the general pubic feels this has slowed enough to go back to "normal" life but our government doesn't feel so? This is when you will see things start to get nasty. 

My county has 2 cases, the original 2 they had a week ago, many counties have no cases. The "hot spots" are where you would expect to find them, around the populous centers. The Cleveland area has more cases than the rest of the entire state. Wouldn't be surprised if the next step becomes localized lockdowns but not the entire state.


----------



## bobk

montagc said:


> in countries with social healthcare, costs are lower. Would you rather keep paying your current healthcare costs or much less?


Come on. You’re bringing up an old post and making it political again. No need for it. Then people get pissed when the mods close the thread. How much babysitting should they have to do?


----------



## dcool

Wife and I needed some things from the store so I went really early this morning and there was only about 5 people in the whole store. That was great for me because both me and the wife are in the upper age group with health problems. Store was well stocked and had most everything we needed. Who knows how long this thing is going to last. There are countries that are in their summer months, and new cases are showing up every day, so who knows. All I can say is to take this virus serious and try to keep your family and yourself healthy and safe. Good luck to all!


----------



## cheezemm2

I still can't understand why it's so hard to understand... If the hospital becomes full, care is not available for other health emergencies. I'd really like to see mortality rates of other health emergencies correlated to times of peak demand during covid19. Maybe that would help the public understand this is not just a corona issue...


----------



## Snakecharmer

Cases are still climbing rapidly. It's going to be worse before it gets better.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

cheezemm2 said:


> I still can't understand why it's so hard to understand... If the hospital becomes full, care is not available for other health emergencies. I'd really like to see mortality rates of other health emergencies correlated to times of peak demand during covid19. Maybe that would help the public understand this is not just a corona issue...


Everyone who contacts this virus is not going to be hospitalized.


----------



## cheezemm2

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Everyone who contacts this virus is not going to be hospitalized.


I do not see how this is relevant to my post. Please explain.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Maybe I don’t understand? Are you a saying that your not sure if overwhelmed hospitals are going to affect the care of others with other issues? And curious if there have been any deaths from other illnesses related to this?


----------



## ress

Snakecharmer said:


> Cases are still climbing rapidly. It's going to be worse before it gets better.


First case here in Hancock County confirmed. 21 yrs old.


----------



## cheezemm2

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Maybe I don’t understand? Are you a saying that your not sure if overwhelmed hospitals are going to affect the care of others with other issues? And curious if there have been any deaths from other illnesses related to this?


Correct on #1. I'm not even sure if data is available yet to show your chances of survival with a medical emergency (heart attack, stroke, pulmonary embolism) other than complications from covid19 in covid stricken areas.

#2, I have no idea. I don't think US hospitals are at capacity yet.

My concern in Ohio. If you have 11,000,000 people and 50% contract it, you're at 5,500,000. If of that 5 million, 1% have complications, you're at 50,000. If those 50,000 are spread out over 4 months, you're at 12,500 people requiring critical care per month. I don't know the capacity of the collective ICUs/beds in Ohio so have no idea what that means towards capacity, but it sure seems like a lot of people on top of the ones that are already occupying beds for tons of other unrelated covid reasons.


----------



## JamesF

I think that question should be answered by the statistical research being developed by the doctors and hospitals. I have heard some numbers a few days ago. The question was similar. But I don't recall any of the information. I understand what your saying. Part of the equation may have something to do with less people being out and about, than normally. I could be totally wrong, but I do notice a difference.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

From what I be been reading and researching, this virus, just like the flu virus, will have a more grave affect on those with compromised immune systems. I’m not sure if any of the illnesses you listed affect the immune system to that point or not. But I do know that 580 were hospitalized in Ohio in one week just last week alone from the flu. And that 200,000 are hospitalized annually in Ohio along with 20,000 deaths. A lot of these could have been avoided with the flu vaccine. Now these are real numbers. The only difference in the flu virus and the covid19 is that we have a vaccine for the flu. But not everyone takes it so it’s kinda irrelevant in the equation here. Another plus is that 10’s of thousands are beating the virus requiring no hospitalization at all just like the flu virus. I hope I’m right but IMO I think our hospitals/care will be fine. This Coronavirus is going to do way more damage economically. Please read the link below. It might answer a lot of questions and cool down some of the panic.
https://patch.com/ohio/cleveland/seasonal-flu-bigger-threat-coronavirus-ohio


----------



## Outasync

I dont think an article from february 9 is relevant to todays happenings.


----------



## Snakecharmer

We have to hope the coronavirus is seasonal. Doesn't look like it is, as its rampant in Australia.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Outasync said:


> I dont think an article from february 9 is relevant to todays happenings.


It’s the numbers. Those flu numbers are even greater on March 22nd. They don’t just go away. You’re missing the point here.


----------



## Snakecharmer

USA went from 25,000 cases to 38,000 overnight.


----------



## Outasync

Yeah and the flu numbers cover alot larger area than thia virus. Were still in the beginning stages. Also with the resteictions and closures the flu numbers should also take a big hit and die off also.


----------



## Outasync

From the WHO 

COVID-19 causes more severe disease than seasonal influenza.

While many people globally have built up immunity to seasonal flu strains, COVID-19 is a new virus to which no one has immunity. That means more people are susceptible to infection, and some will suffer severe disease.

Globally, about 3.4% of reported COVID-19 cases have died. By comparison, seasonal flu generally kills far fewer than 1% of those infected.


----------



## Shad Rap

Outasync said:


> From the WHO
> 
> COVID-19 causes more severe disease than seasonal influenza.
> 
> While many people globally have built up immunity to seasonal flu strains, COVID-19 is a new virus to which no one has immunity. That means more people are susceptible to infection, and some will suffer severe disease.
> 
> Globally, about 3.4% of reported COVID-19 cases have died. By comparison, seasonal flu generally kills far fewer than 1% of those infected.


Those numbers are skewed though...


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Numbers as of March 20...
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.us...c-overshadows-a-deadly-flu-season?context=amp


----------



## Snakecharmer

montagc said:


> Looks like a stay at home order has been issued...anyone have the particulars? News sites don’t have it up yet


It's on TV..Effective Monday Night 11:59...No work no travel.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

montagc said:


> Looks like a stay at home order has been issued...anyone have the particulars? News sites don’t have it up yet


I hear it starts at Monday night at midnight. Does this mean people can’t go to work? If so, Here comes the worse economic hit we have seen since the Great Depression. This is not a good thing.


----------



## Snakecharmer

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> I hear it starts at Monday night at midnight. Does this mean people can’t go to work? If so, Here comes the worse economic hit we have seen since the Great Depression. This is not a good thing.


Only essential industries.


----------



## KaGee

Snakecharmer said:


> It's on TV..Effective Monday Night 11:59...No work no travel.


Please source that... I see nothing on Twitter from news media.


----------



## Bluewalleye

Snakecharmer said:


> USA went from 25,000 cases to 38,000 overnight.


The more people that get tested means the more people that are going to have it. They're still people who are walking around with it that haven't been tested. And they don't even know they have it..


----------



## JamesF

On 19 news now. Stay at home.mandate.Tune in to local news.


----------



## Legend killer

https://www.cincinnati.com/story/ne...ine-sunday-update-states-response/2894473001/


----------



## Snakecharmer

KaGee said:


> Please source that... I see nothing on Twitter from news media.


----------



## Legend killer

Playgrounds closed, hopefully no boat ramps.


----------



## Specwar

Sorry but I just heard the governor himself say “that they still want people to get outside and exercise including enjoying our State Parks “ during this new order. So that should certainly include fishing.


----------



## KaGee

apparently, Ohio State gaining a new tailback is more important that a complete shutdown.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Snakecharmer said:


> Only essential industries.


List
https://www.wfmj.com/story/41925519...esses-after-stay-at-home-order-signed-in-ohio


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Man I hope the entire country doesn’t follow suit.


----------



## Bluewalleye

He also said that if you need to get supplies from store, go get them. I think more businesses that have stayed open, may choose to shut their doors for the 2 weeks. But grocery stores and stores like that do need to stay open. And it sounds like they will. 
I am going fishing tomorrow, after the rain the ends around noon over by the islands. I will most likely not talk to one person the entire time. Maybe on the radio on the lake, but that is about it.


----------



## Redheads

KaGee said:


> apparently, Ohio State gaining a new tailback is more important that a complete shutdown.


OGF has a sports talk forum and this isnt it....please stay on topic

we don't want this thread shut down AGAIN


----------



## KaGee

I get a tweet from a Columbus sports writer about the stay at home... and still nothing from local news.


----------



## Redheads

Our local news JUST now are reporting it starting 11:59 tomorrow stay ay home order


----------



## Redheads

montagc said:


> now that is funny, but I know poking the mods usually ends poorly lol
> 
> we appreciate you Kagee!


who's poking ? 
We all need a little guidance every once in a while

much appreciated mods !


----------



## KaGee

Thanks fellas.


----------



## BuckeyeFishin07

KaGee said:


> apparently, Ohio State gaining a new tailback is more important that a complete shutdown.


I think you need to get your priorities straight!. Of course commitments to the Buckeyes are more important news!


----------



## bruce

Good for you


KaGee said:


> Thanks fellas.


----------



## SConner

If we are going to fault other countries hospital systems, it is always better to have facts rather than opinions. Here are the facts on hospital beds per 1000 population:
South Korea 12.3
China 4.3
Italy 3.2
USA 2.8
The fact is, if we don’t follow social distancing and flatten the curve, we will overwhelm hospitals in the US. Be safe, follow guidelines!

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bu...ds-per-capita-us-south-korea-italy-2020-3?amp


----------



## laguna21

The list of essential is pretty broad, construction, electrical, plumbing all in there.


----------



## AmericanEagle

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Wonder why this isn’t all over the news...
> https://www.rochesterregional.org/news/2020/01/flu-season-2020


I am posting this link again which does an excellent job of documenting what is going on and what will happen in the future.

https://medium.com/@tomaspueyo/coronavirus-act-today-or-people-will-die-f4d3d9cd99ca

If you watch the Ohio State press conferences everyday at 2:00 pm you will hear Dr, Acton say they know what is coming, She will say we want to be like St Louis not like Philadelphia in the 1918 Spanish flu pandemic. The above link explains why.

Here is an additional link for your consideration.

https://medium.com/@tomaspueyo/coronavirus-the-hammer-and-the-dance-be9337092b56


----------



## Rooster

That is the same doctor Acton that made the wildly inaccurate estimated of 100,000 infected in Ohio 10 days ago. And, the same one that greatly limited the liberty of 11 million today, with a total of 351 confirmed cases.


----------



## SConner

Rooster said:


> That is the same doctor Acton that made the wildly inaccurate estimated of 100,000 infected in Ohio 10 days ago. And, the same one that greatly limited the liberty of 11 million today, with a total of 351 confirmed cases.


Just a guess, but if testing were widely available the documented cases would be higher.


----------



## Rooster

SConner said:


> Just a guess, but if testing were widely available the documented cases would be higher.


Sure, but if 100, 000 was accurate, the deaths would be about 1000 times higher. The expert calling the shots was wildly inaccurate.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

AmericanEagle said:


> I am posting this link again which does an excellent job of documenting what is going on and what will happen in the future.
> 
> https://medium.com/@tomaspueyo/coronavirus-act-today-or-people-will-die-f4d3d9cd99ca
> 
> If you watch the Ohio State press conferences everyday at 2:00 pm you will hear Dr, Acton say they know what is coming, She will say we want to be like St Louis not like Philadelphia in the 1918 Spanish flu pandemic. The above link explains why.


No offense but.. When I looked at post the first time you posted it I googled the author of the post. No medical background or history whatsoever. The links I post aren’t mine. They are from the cdc or other reliable sources. This guy you speak of is also the author of these links below. Among many more non medical info. All from your link. Just sayin...
I believe it’s coming also. It’s already here. With a high survival compared to death ratio Let’s hope what the government is rolling out will make that survival number go up.

https://forge.medium.com/how-to-deliver-your-funny-speech-eddab77dc6a6

https://medium.com/@tomaspueyo/what-the-rise-of-skywalker-can-teach-about-storytelling-42b69ef367d

https://medium.com/swlh/what-i-learned-building-a-horoscope-that-blew-up-on-facebook-41f0184c48af


----------



## SConner

Rooster said:


> Sure, but if 100, 000 was accurate, the deaths would be about 1000 times higher. The expert calling the shots was wildly inaccurate.


incubation period of 2 weeks. She could still be correct. Do the math on where we are in Ohio today on known confirmed cases. In Ohio cases have been doubling every 1.5 days. Start with whatever number you choose to believe and extrapolate out 2 weeks. Let me know what you come up with.


----------



## RedJada

Rooster said:


> Sure, but if 100, 000 was accurate, the deaths would be about 1000 times higher. The expert calling the shots was wildly inaccurate.


 Well, as of March 16th there were 4 new cases same number for Tuesday. Wednesday the 18th. 21 new cases, Thursday 31, Friday 50 new cases. Saturday 78 new cases and 3 deaths. Today 104 new cases. So I would say she is on track.


----------



## FOWL BRAWL

The way she speaks and how she says things really doesn't sit well with me,it seems to me like she is not telling the whole story.


----------



## Rooster

On track? She said 100,000 10 days ago. If she was accurate....then the mortality rate of Covid-19 would have to be only a fraction of the common flu. Thursday will be 2 weeks, and will demonstrate just how wildly inaccurate her estimate was.


----------



## MIGHTY

Redheads said:


> OGF has a sports talk forum and this isnt it....please stay on topic
> 
> we don't want this thread shut down AGAIN


 x’s 1000


----------



## laguna21

RedJada said:


> Well, as of March 16th there were 4 new cases same number for Tuesday. Wednesday the 18th. 21 new cases, Thursday 31, Friday 50 new cases. Saturday 78 new cases and 3 deaths. Today 104 new cases. So I would say she is on track.


And, according to most, we still don't have all the tests we need


----------



## 9Left

SConner said:


> If we are going to fault other countries hospital systems, it is always better to have facts rather than opinions. Here are the facts on hospital beds per 1000 population:
> South Korea 12.3
> China 4.3
> Italy 3.2
> USA 2.8
> The fact is, if we don’t follow social distancing and flatten the curve, we will overwhelm hospitals in the US. Be safe, follow guidelines!
> 
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-hospital-beds-per-capita-us-south-korea-italy-2020-3?amp


I work as a nurse in a southwest Ohio hospital… What I can tell you is that Ohio hospitals are definitely preparing for the worst… Several units have been cleared out and we are currently putting a hold on those bed.. Not admitting patients into them As they are Dedicated beds for the pandemic...Hospitals are not overrun yet… Just the other night I was called off because our census is so low… We have discharged most all the patients that are healthy enough to go home, clean the beds and rooms, and dedicated it for what's coming...Going into work tonight… Wish me luck!


----------



## SConner

9Left said:


> I work as a nurse in a southwest Ohio hospital… What I can tell you is that Ohio hospitals are definitely preparing for the worst… Several units have been cleared out and we are currently putting a hold on those bed.. Not admitting patients into them As they are Dedicated beds for the pandemic...Hospitals are not overrun yet… Just the other night I was called off because our census is so low… We have discharged most all the patients that are healthy enough to go home, clean the beds and rooms, and dedicated it for what's coming...Going into work tonight… Wish me luck!


My hope for you and all those in this great nation is that we do the math, learn what it means to flatten the curve and slow this down. Based on some comments on this thread I have concerns we are not up to the task and that sacrifice for the common good appears to be a foreign concept. I sincerely hope I am wrong!


----------



## lmbchckn

The essential buissness list is pretty large. I see few things closing. Trades, manufacturing, grocerys and gas stations, pharmacies, tech. I think there leaving wiggle room for buissnesses to say we will or wont close. I work in a small machine shop, I'm told life as usual this week.


----------



## burnsj5

SConner said:


> My hope for you and all those in this great nation is that we do the math, learn what it means to flatten the curve and slow this down. Based on some comments on this thread I have concerns we are not up to the task and that sacrifice for the common good appears to be a foreign concept. I sincerely hope I am wrong!


Getting gas yesterday watched a guy finish eating his gas station food, threw it away, lick 3 of his fingers like he just ate ribs and then slick down his goatee, pretty sure people have no idea what they shouldn't be doing. Just imagine what he touched before and after.


----------



## AmericanEagle

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> No offense but.. When I looked at post the first time you posted it I googled the author of the post. No medical background or history whatsoever. The links I post aren’t mine. They are from the cdc or other reliable sources. This guy you speak of is also the author of these links below. Among many more non medical info. All from your link. Just sayin...
> I believe it’s coming also. It’s already here. With a high survival compared to death ratio Let’s hope what the government is rolling out will make that survival number go up.
> 
> https://forge.medium.com/how-to-deliver-your-funny-speech-eddab77dc6a6
> 
> https://medium.com/@tomaspueyo/what-the-rise-of-skywalker-can-teach-about-storytelling-42b69ef367d
> 
> https://medium.com/swlh/what-i-learned-building-a-horoscope-that-blew-up-on-facebook-41f0184c48af


No offense at all taken but I was not aware that a medical background or being associated with the CDC are requirements to analyze data sets. It would be helpful to me if instead of attacking the messenger you would attack the message. If you or someone else can point out errors in the data or logic in these articles I would love to see it. I am always open to changing my mind. As my wife likes to tell me I have been wrong before


----------



## Murfdog21

hatteras1 said:


> This site is in real time, and it's scary
> 
> https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/


Thanks for the link, crazy


----------



## mkalink




----------



## SConner

mkalink said:


> View attachment 347817


Thank you, laughter does help in times stress. This lightened my mood for the moment.


----------



## cheezemm2

We're still being reactive...gotta get out ahead of this and isolate like South Korea did.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

AmericanEagle said:


> No offense at all taken but I was not aware that a medical background or being associated with the CDC are requirements to analyze data sets. It would be helpful to me if instead of attacking the messenger you would attack the message. If you or someone else can point out errors in the data or logic in these articles I would love to see it. I am always open to changing my mind. As my wife likes to tell me I have been wrong before


Hey I know how ya feel, I’m attacked as the messenger often. But don’t think I was attacking you personally. How could we attack someone over something that not theirs, something that we’re just repeating. Just comparing the two posts all the way around is all. Imo, the logic would be where they originated. Consider the sources. I’m not saying you pencil whipped the numbers. I’m kinda saying his numbers we’re already pencil whipped. Again IMO. Nothing personal as none of these are ours per say.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

All I’m going to do moving forward is stay hunkered down, just watch and hope for the best.


----------



## SConner

I will give a few more stats then bow out as there are some minds not open to change and I have no time or patience for those that choose ignorance over fact.

If you start with a positive test of 1 on day one of an epidemic and the total doubles each day, it takes exactly 21 days for the total to exceed 1 million people. At this point VP Pence said in address to the nation we have only conducted 254,000 test nation wide (this is 7/100th percent of US population). Spin however you choose, the lack of testing makes us blind to the real numbers and the math is very simple. We either do what is being asked and slow the curve or we are a few weeks away from crisis. The final outcome depends entirely on each of you to do what is being asked to prevent the spread or don’t. Math in 3 other countries says this is a fact, not opinion. Don’t believe.... watch NYC over the next 2 weeks. What happens there is our future if you choose to ignore the shelter in place guidelines.


----------



## buckeyebowman

Bluewalleye said:


> We live in the greatest country on the face of the earth. My sister in law grew up in communist east germany. When my brother ( army ) brought her here to live for good, she was amazed at all the food choices we have. She grew up where they had 2 flavors of cereal, and not having much of a choice in general when it came to food. We are so spoiled in this country that some people don't know how to act in times of trouble like this. I would say that most people are pleasant while waiting in line at the store. And where I shop their is still plenty of paper towels and TP on the shelves. Mostly the frozen food section is picked thru though.


Some years back my Great Aunt came from Poland to visit. She stayed with my Mom for a while. They went to the supermarket so my Mom could get some stuff to put on a get together for her. When they were in the store my Great Aunt told my Mom, "You people live in paradise, and you don't even realize it!"



STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Or why this wasn’t considered a pandemic in the making?
> 
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/fox5sa...t-week-bring-local-flu-death-total-to-39/amp/


Two good posts SP! Nobody seems to get excited about the flu, even though it IS a killer! But, it's just the flu. Yet, call COVID-19 "the flu", and you're some kind of monster, even though that's exactly what it is!

Remember the H1N1 swine flu pandemic of 2009-2010? It has been estimated that about 1 Billion people were infected worldwide and up to 575,000 died. 55 Million were infected in the U.S. alone! Do you remember anything closing? I don't, and neither do you. Know why? Because nothing did! BTW, there is still no vaccine for H1N1!

Also, I dispensed some incorrect info in a former post. Heard on the radio that the Chinese and South Korean pro Bball leagues were back up and running. Not quite yet. Heard today that the China Bball Association is planning to be back up and running by April 15.

Either this is a severe overreaction, or there is something they are not telling us!


----------



## FOWL BRAWL

cheezemm2 said:


> We're still being reactive...gotta get out ahead of this and isolate like South Korea did.


What about North Korea what have they done differently than south Korea ?


----------



## SConner

FOWL BRAWL said:


> What about North Korea what have they done differently than south Korea ?


I have no facts to answer this, if I had to guess I would say they test nobody and report what they choose.... or they are so isolated from the rest of the world they have avoided issue. My money is on the former rather than the later.


----------



## fastwater

9Left said:


> I work as a nurse in a southwest Ohio hospital… What I can tell you is that Ohio hospitals are definitely preparing for the worst… Several units have been cleared out and we are currently putting a hold on those bed.. Not admitting patients into them As they are Dedicated beds for the pandemic...Hospitals are not overrun yet… Just the other night I was called off because our census is so low… We have discharged most all the patients that are healthy enough to go home, clean the beds and rooms, and dedicated it for what's coming...Going into work tonight… Wish me luck!


Good luck 9left!!!

Here's an email from sister-n-law working in Detroit Hosp. ER that services Detroit Metro and Wayne Co.
Guess with the already normally crazy amount of patients... plus the additional virus cases, it has caused them to work some insane hours...and they are expecting it to get much worse. She stated in an earlier email that it was really sad cause more of the admitted patients were in there teens to about mid 50's and if there's a big influx of more senior people in which the virus is more fatal that they can foresee a sure shortage of respiratory equip.

Her email:

_'It's crazy: a month ago I saw images of nurses in China and the bruises on their faces from their masks. It is surreal to see the same marks in my own face now. We already don't have enough supplies. In the other picture I am wearing the protection I need. I have goggles that I bought myself and an N95 mask donated by the community as well as a cloth mask made by ladies in the community. The cloth mask protects my real mask since they are never meant to be used for as long as we will wear them or to be re-used. It is so cool to see the community pulling together to help out when we so desperately need it
So keep praying for me. We have cases and they are expecting the worst of it to hit us in the next week or two. It is very scary. Pray for me to stay brave and to stay healthy.'_

Obviously, I did not post pics she sent but her and fellow nurses there have raw spot on their cheek bones from wearing their surgical masks for so many hours. She looked absolutely rung out and exhausted.

Continued prayer out to all medical personnel....


----------



## cheezemm2

SConner said:


> I will give a few more stats then bow out as there are some minds not open to change and I have no time or patience for those that choose ignorance over fact.
> 
> If you start with a positive test of 1 on day one of an epidemic and the total doubles each day, it takes exactly 21 days for the total to exceed 1 million people. At this point VP Pence said in address to the nation we have only conducted 254,000 test nation wide (this is 7/100ths of US population). Spin however you choose, the lack of testing makes us blind to the real numbers and the math is very simple. We either do what is being asked and slow the curve or we are a few weeks away from crisis. The final outcome depends entirely on each of you to do what is being asked to prevent the spread or don’t. Math in 3 other countries says this is a fact, not opinion. Don’t believe.... watch NYC over the next 2 weeks. What happens there is our future if you choose to ignore the shelter in place guidelines.


----------



## HeaVyMeTaLFiSHinGFiEnD

buckeyebowman said:


> Some years back my Great Aunt came from Poland to visit. She stayed with my Mom for a while. They went to the supermarket so my Mom could get some stuff to put on a get together for her. When they were in the store my Great Aunt told my Mom, "You people live in paradise, and you don't even realize it!"
> 
> 
> 
> Two good posts SP! Nobody seems to get excited about the flu, even though it IS a killer! But, it's just the flu. Yet, call COVID-19 "the flu", and you're some kind of monster, even though that's exactly what it is!
> 
> Remember the H1N1 swine flu pandemic of 2009-2010? It has been estimated that about 1 Billion people were infected worldwide and up to 575,000 died. 55 Million were infected in the U.S. alone! Do you remember anything closing? I don't, and neither do you. Know why? Because nothing did! BTW, there is still no vaccine for H1N1!
> 
> Also, I dispensed some incorrect info in a former post. Heard on the radio that the Chinese and South Korean pro Bball leagues were back up and running. Not quite yet. Heard today that the China Bball Association is planning to be back up and running by April 15.
> 
> Either this is a severe overreaction, or there is something they are not telling us!


I wonder how many millions wouldn't of died from h1n1 if they would of taken the precautions they are now.


----------



## Pooka

I was out about about 3 times today, had to jump the river and drive into Ohio land to do some business and a couple times running my wife back and forth to work. Looks like it has finally dawned on folks, traffic was down a good 75%. 
It was kind of spooky but I have to say enjoyed motoring around with plenty of room to run. Seemed to be a lack of police as well.


----------



## bruce

Thank YOU Nine left for being on the front line. As for the rest of you that do not need to go out do not. Stay home stay safe.


9Left said:


> I work as a nurse in a southwest Ohio hospital… What I can tell you is that Ohio hospitals are definitely preparing for the worst… Several units have been cleared out and we are currently putting a hold on those bed.. Not admitting patients into them As they are Dedicated beds for the pandemic...Hospitals are not overrun yet… Just the other night I was called off because our census is so low… We have discharged most all the patients that are healthy enough to go home, clean the beds and rooms, and dedicated it for what's coming...Going into work tonight… Wish me luck!


----------



## ErieRider

cheezemm2 said:


> View attachment 347843


What countries graphs look closest to the graphs shown by the Ohio health director a few weeks back?? Our current trajectory shows us much more along the lines of taxing the health system vs. slowing the spread. It's about identical to what they said would happen if we didn't take precautions seriously and way off from slowing the spread. 

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


----------



## fishing pole

Average age of death from Corona in Italy 80/.3

Life expectancy in Italy 80

It doesn't add up


----------



## yonderfishin

The stay at home order didn't really change anything for the majority of us.

So much of us that I kinda think its pointless. That's still millions all going about nearly normal day to day life.....work , shopping for essentials , etc. I don't see how its gonna make any real difference. The definition of " essential employees " is way too broad.


----------



## fastwater

One thing I think we can safely say about all these stats whether they be right or wrong.
The stats, either way won't ease the pain of the family/friends of a loved one that gets the virus and passes from it.
Guaranteed that these stats everyone's arguing over won't mean squat when the time comes this virus hits close to home...or the medical personnel have to take a needed respirator/ventilator off a middle aged loved one and put on an older person to better save the older persons life cause there aren't enough respirators to go around.
Maybe we should start running stats on the growing number of those being hospitalized to the number of various equipments we have on hand necessary to handle what's going on. Or running stats on how many of our hospital personnel will be infected before this is over and if there will be enough of them left able to take care infected patience that got infected cause they didn't believe original stats that were put out and got the virus cause they thought all this was over blown.


----------



## bruce

The stay home is not for some it is for all. If you are not a first responder or a medical provider. Stay home!!!!!


yonderfishin said:


> The stay at home order didn't really change anything for the majority of us.
> 
> So much of us that I kinda think its pointless. That's still millions all going about nearly normal day to day life.....work , shopping for essentials , etc. I don't see how its gonna make any real difference. The definition of " essential employees " is way too broad.


----------



## lmbchckn

bruce said:


> The stay home is not for some it is for all. If you are not a first responder or a medical provider. Stay home!!!!!



Thats incorrect . Read the complete order. Its very broad, unless you sell shoes in the mall, most industrys will be kept open. Face mask and ventilators and sanitation supplys are not going to grow on trees, these manufacturers need to stay open. Its been reported GM,ford, and tesla are partnering to make ventilators, are you going to demand those employees stay home also? What about go-jo? Joanne fabrics just volunteered to train and supply materials for people to make mask and gowns. Should these people stay home too? Unfortunately locking the door and shutting down for 3 weeks isnt going to work. Unless your willing to rely on another country to bail us out.


----------



## yonderfishin

bruce said:


> The stay home is not for some it is for all. If you are not a first responder or a medical provider. Stay home!!!!!



Not only can you legally go to the store , nearly every grocery hardware...home improvement....pharmacy , etc. for needed items but to the bank and drive through restaurant. Very few employees are actually affected , except some small retail....the ones most hurt by the order. Meanwhile nearly every manufacturing , distribution , trucking , factory , large chain retail and grocery employee....will be going to work in close contact with up to hundreds of others just as they have been. The definition of " essential employee or service " , the ones who will still be going to work , is so broad that the non-essential ones are just a relatively small group. So this is killing small business and putting many out of work , yet I really don't see how it can be effective at slowing the virus with so many out and about doing their thing because they are considered essential. This is futility. Essentially a stay at home order for only like about 15% of the state


----------



## dcool

Italy reported another 651 deaths in the last 24 hrs. This virus is for real. If people don't head the warnings now, there will be no stopping this virus.


----------



## loweman165

bruce said:


> The stay home is not for some it is for all. If you are not a first responder or a medical provider. Stay home!!!!!


You wrong. If that's the case than that's how it should be worded. And how does it make sense that my minor sons are expected to go to Giant Eagle and work so it strays open just so you and the rest of ohio can legally go out and get your groceries that should have ben got last week? If they don't go and put up with hundreds of customers a night they get fired...for 10 bucks an hour. Thier lockdown is bulls#!t. Get over it.


----------



## Byg

I wish I could stay home and hunker down, but I have to go to work (airport). I believe a lot of people would shelter in but have no choice. Also a big thanks to all
health care givers for there service and sacrifice


----------



## Freedomfisher

I think I mentioned before but I have been wondering....we store product from china and during late November early December we had thier reps visit us....in early January I came down with a fever and cough that lasted about two weeks.. .i remember commenting to my wife that I've never had a cough like that before...


but it was probably just a stubborn sinus infection. that kept draining and making me cough


----------



## loves2fishinohio

Freedomfisher said:


> I think I mentioned before but I have been wondering....we store product from china and during late November early December we had thier reps visit us....in early January I came down with a fever and cough that lasted about two weeks.. .i remember commenting to my wife that I've never had a cough like that before...
> 
> 
> but it was probably just a stubborn sinus infection. that kept draining and making me cough


I had the same symptoms, had that crud the entire month of January and February. 3 rounds of antibiotics, and it's still not completely gone, but nowhere like it was.


----------



## Specwar

Our oldest daughter went to the doctor in mid January thinking she had the flu. Dr. concluded it was not the flu although she had all symptoms with a lot of drainage and persistent cough for several weeks. Fine now so who really knows. It’s all guess work prior to March.


----------



## bruce

I have all the food and supplies


loweman165 said:


> You wrong. If that's the case than that's how it should be worded. And how does it make sense that my minor sons are expected to go to Giant Eagle and work so it strays open just so you and the rest of ohio can legally go out and get your groceries that should have ben got last week? If they don't go and put up with hundreds of customers a night they get fired...for 10 bucks an hour. Thier lockdown is bulls#!t. Get over it.


we need. Have not ben out since March 13 and will not go out.


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

My company is on the essential business list and we must continue working. However, close to 90% of of workforce is at home working from the house. Our locations are not closed, however they are only open for drop off and pick up. We are not allowed to have any physical contact with any clients for now. 

For employees that must be in the office (sounds like grade school I know) you have to report to the office manager upon arrival every day. They do digital scan temp reading and confirm you have no symptoms before you work each day. Each office manager has to document all in-office employees were screened. 

I'm going to feel like I started a new job whenever we get back to the office. I haven't been there since March 9th and won't be until at some point after this April 6th date. Never in my life have I gone more than a couple weeks without being inside my employment buildings. 

My wife and son have been staying up playing board games & cards and watching TV so they sleep in. Makes it nice as I get the first few hours of silence to knock out some work. We are settled into a routine now and I have figured out how to make it work out of the house with little interruption.


----------



## Saugeyefisher

We have not had any of our customers shut there doors. Locally we supply a fire truck manufacturer, mobile medical units,a creeper manufacturer, a couple sign builders,and Stanley steamer where they put together the trucks. 
Nationally ,we have had a few customers shut down but not alot.


----------



## Southernsaug

I truly believe our officials are doing what they feel is right to protect us all. I just think they are wrong. I hope I am wrong and we are all thankful when this passes and their strategic approach was right. However, if they are wrong they have created one of the greatest man made disasters ever. It seems to me that the medical officials are doing the governing and not the elected officials, people like Amy Acton and Dr Fauci. They are undoubtedly brilliant people, but are they skilled in public administration, business, logistics, military and transportation, I doubt it. They are just one piece of the puzzle. I think we can all agree this disease is bad and we should have a strategy to deal with it, but what we are doing in these early stages seems like scorched earth policy. If you have a rat in the house do you burn down the house? We will all be exposed eventually and they want to string it out to reduce care loads. Flattening the curve may just burn down the house. What ever happen to the creed "do less harm then good" in treatment. Maybe we should have just taken the hit. I am in the high risk category and I realize that I could suffer more than most, but my soul and faith lies with Jesus and not the elected officials, where is thy sting oh death. I think we may be doing more harm than good. Did this panic all start just because of the rhetoric coming from public media and officials? Controlled reaction and disaster management does not include invoking panic.


----------



## $diesel$

I just heard Dr. Oz on Fox News say he thinks they found a way to stop this. 
A French doctor used Z-pack and malaria drug (quinine?) on 36 infected patients at 100% viral. In 7 days, all 36 tested negitive at 0%.
I just wonder how long the FDA will jack around before aproving this treatment, at least, on folks with no other options?


----------



## Saugeyefisher

$diesel$ said:


> I just heard Dr. Oz on Fox News say he thinks they found a way to stop this.
> A French doctor used Z-pack and malaria drug (quinine?) on 36 infected patients at 100% viral. In 7 days, all 36 tested negitive at 0%.
> I just wonder how long the FDA will jack around before aproving this treatment, at least, on folks with no other options?


I also herd this late last week on a radio show...


----------



## $diesel$

Saugeyefisher said:


> I also herd this late last week on a radio show...


I sure hope it's true, brother.
Of course, i'm quite sure when the FDA gets involved, it will slow the availibility of these drugs dramatically.


----------



## BuckeyeFishin07

$diesel$ said:


> I sure hope it's true, brother.
> Of course, i'm quite sure when the FDA gets involved, it will slow the availibility of these drugs dramatically.


I am pretty sure I read a couple days ago that Doctors in Ohio were already writing prescriptions for family members for the Malaria medicine so they could hoard it for family and friends! I may have read it wrong so don't take my post as a absolute, but if that is the case those doctors need to be stripped of their license for sure, and thrown in jail!!! Again I may have read it wrong!!!


----------



## Saugeyefisher

BuckeyeFishin07 said:


> I am pretty sure I read a couple days ago that Doctors in Ohio were already writing prescriptions for family members for the Malaria medicine so they could hoard it for family and friends! I may have read it wrong so don't take my post as a absolute, but if that is the case those doctors need to be stripped of their license for sure, and thrown in jail!!! Again I may have read it wrong!!!


I "herd" that since this has come out,prescriptions for the meds have gone up. I agree,if caught doing this it's pretty messed up. 
On top of being a medicine you take to prevent malarial it is also given to people with rheumatoid arthritis.


----------



## LEfriend

Outasync said:


> I dont think an article from february 9 is relevant to todays happenings.


Right on outasync. Articles like that (outdated), lack of advance preparation, and lots of its a hoax attitudes expressed here got us where we are. The curve could have been so much lower and economic loss so much less, had we started sooner. We are paying now for negligence.

We have a daughter nurse who treats chemo patients and they have no masks, protective equipment, etc. Hospital is saving what little they have for critical ill. She has been exposed to person who appeared with symptoms. Even that is not enough to get her one of the few tests. So now she waits and sees and continues to try to help patients and hope she isn't infecting our grandchildren. 

Have a nephew who is a radiologist. Same thing...no protective equipment was available. He was exposed to patient who then tested positive. Developed symptoms and negative for flue, negative for strep. So now he has been tested and is holed up in a bedroom trying not to pass it to his wife and child. Gets test results today. If positive they will have to track down all those patients he treated. Some of them will likely have compromised health issues. Some may say its okay, they are old and are gonna die anyway. I hope I never ever become that jaded.

This is all about keeping the hospitals from being over run, so when the "I'm healthy and never gonna get it" folks are in a car accident or have a heart attack or blood clot or broken leg...the health system will be able to treat you.


----------



## cheezemm2

LEfriend said:


> This is all about keeping the hospitals from being over run, so when the "I'm healthy and never gonna get it" folks are in a car accident or have a heart attack or blood clot or broken leg...the health system will be able to treat you.


WINNER! WINNER!


----------



## Pooka

$diesel$ said:


> I just heard Dr. Oz on Fox News say he thinks they found a way to stop this.
> A French doctor used Z-pack and malaria drug (quinine?) on 36 infected patients at 100% viral. In 7 days, all 36 tested negitive at 0%.
> I just wonder how long the FDA will jack around before aproving this treatment, at least, on folks with no other options?


Dr Oz and Faux News? Yeah, I don't think I would bet the farm on that just yet.


----------



## BFG

$diesel$ said:


> I just heard Dr. Oz on Fox News say he thinks they found a way to stop this.
> A French doctor used Z-pack and malaria drug (quinine?) on 36 infected patients at 100% viral. In 7 days, all 36 tested negitive at 0%.
> I just wonder how long the FDA will jack around before aproving this treatment, at least, on folks with no other options?


I've heard about 9 Docs refute this study, given that there were so few patients and there was not at 100% cure rate. While promising, I don't think it's a cure all Folks with chronic diseases cannot take the anti-malarial. Most of those dying have one or more chronic diseases. Bayer donated 3 million doses of the pill. 

Toledo Doctor just said "80% of those infected will require no treatment." Which sounds good until you realize Ohio has 11.4 million people, and if 25% of those folks get infected, we are still looking at 2.5 million infections, and 20% of that is roughly 450,000 requiring treatment. 

Stay home. Period.


----------



## jrose

BFG said:


> I've heard about 9 Docs refute this study, given that there were so few patients and there was not at 100% cure rate. While promising, I don't think it's a cure all Folks with chronic diseases cannot take the anti-malarial. Most of those dying have one or more chronic diseases. Bayer donated 3 million doses of the pill.
> 
> Toledo Doctor just said "80% of those infected will require no treatment." Which sounds good until you realize Ohio has 11.4 million people, and if 25% of those folks get infected, we are still looking at 2.5 million infections, and 20% of that is roughly 450,000 requiring treatment.
> 
> Stay home. Period.


There has only been 377,000 cases in the world! I doubt that Ohio will have a fraction of that. Wash your hands and hope you don’t get the flu.


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## Pooka

Looks like I am grounded now too. WV on lock down.

http://media.graytvinc.com/documents/Governor's+Stay+At+Home+Order+3-23.pdf


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## Fish-N-Fool

Yea that is THE issue...we are trying to avoid over running the capacity we have to treat those requiring a hospital. We have right about 1 million hospital beds in the US. We have the military with medical ships staged off each coast, a plan to create temporary treatment "tents", and a contingency plan to use college dorms nearby major hospitals (like OSU). What we are trying to accomplish with all this isolation and shut down is *NOT *testing this capacity. 

Expect the count of infected folks to continue to rise...it will for now. Another 9,200 yesterday.


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## ditchdigger

I’m surprised with the shortage of thermometers and all the high tech companies out there that no one has come up with an app/device that takes you temperature with your phone! Your earbuds could take your temperature in your ear and transmit it to your phone! If someone takes off with this idea fell free to compensate me with this idea!! Lol!


----------



## Pooka

Fish-N-Fool said:


> Yea that is THE issue...we are trying to avoid over running the capacity we have to treat those requiring a hospital. We have right about 1 million hospital beds in the US. We have the military with medical ships staged off each coast, a plan to create temporary treatment "tents", and a contingency plan to use college dorms nearby major hospitals (like OSU). What we are trying to accomplish with all this isolation and shut down is *NOT *testing this capacity.
> 
> Expect the count of infected folks to continue to rise...it will for now. Another 9,200 yesterday.



"ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country." 

If no new cases happened the number will still continue to rise. We were way, way, behind in testing. This has been a FUBAR from the get-go.


----------



## PapawSmith

Pooka said:


> "ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country."
> 
> If no new cases happened the number will still continue to rise. We were way, way, behind in testing. This has been a FUBAR from the get-go.


Damn, if only you would have been in charge. Did you know the answer to all of this **** back in December or are you just now figuring it out now since it is behind us? I will guess the latter.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

So...I have refrained posting here...amazing what I see. Everyone has opinions....stats, etc...who is sure what to believe. I'm told I'm essential. What if I pick it up and give it to my wife...at risk wife and she dies.....someone tell me what to do


----------



## Shad Rap

Pooka said:


> "ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country."
> 
> If no new cases happened the number will still continue to rise. We were way, way, behind in testing. This has been a FUBAR from the get-go.


Death rate going down in Italy...it's working...their curve is flattening...in 2 weeks or less we are gonna be business as usual in the US...book it...but yeah, we were behind.


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## JamesF

There is some truth about certain people hoarding medicine. Pharmaceutical companies are being held accountable to report all prescription drugs, that are under investigation as a possible link to help fight this virus. As people panic, they will do whatever they think they are entitled to do, to protect themselves mostly.


----------



## Pooka

Saugeye Tom said:


> So...I have refrained posting here...amazing what I see. Everyone has opinions....stats, etc...who is sure what to believe. I'm told I'm essential. What if I pick it up and give it to my wife...at risk wife and she dies.....someone tell me what to do


Tough call. Got a garage you can live in for a while? Seriously. 
I am in a similar situation, my wife works at a grocery store so I reckon I am at high risk and not much I can do about it.


----------



## bobk

Saugeye Tom said:


> So...I have refrained posting here...amazing what I see. Everyone has opinions....stats, etc...who is sure what to believe. I'm told I'm essential. What if I pick it up and give it to my wife...at risk wife and she dies.....someone tell me what to do


Fmla?


----------



## ErieRider

PapawSmith said:


> Damn, if only you would have been in charge. Did you know the answer to all of this **** back in December or are you just now figuring it out now since it is behind us? I will guess the latter.


Not an exact answer on this exact issue but let me ask this. I thought we would be prepared in this country for something like this. We were supposed to be ready for any biological, radiological, chemical or explosive attack since 9-11. Planning for the next big national emergency to be ready to prevent such casualties. But it's now here and don't even have enough PPE ready to distribute. It's not a political thing it's 19 years of smoke and mirrors

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## Specwar

Trained in nuclear, chemical and biological warfare in the service in 1969, but not trained in what good old Mother Nature can throw at you.


----------



## Dovans

bobk said:


> Fmla?


long process to get approved...by the time he gets it approved or disapproved we'll be through the worst of it


----------



## Dovans

Specwar said:


> Trained in nuclear, chemical and biological warfare in the service in 1969, but not trained in what good old Mother Nature can throw at you.


If you believe this is a natural occuring virus... Im not on that boat


----------



## UNCLEMIKE

ErieRider said:


> Not an exact answer on this exact issue but let me ask this. I thought we would be prepared in this country for something like this. We were supposed to be ready for any biological, radiological, chemical or explosive attack since 9-11. Planning for the next big national emergency to be ready to prevent such casualties. But it's now here and don't even have enough PPE ready to distribute. It's not a political thing it's 19 years of smoke and mirrors
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


I managed a hospital supply warehouse for years until I retired a year ago. The past five years were all about just in time inventory to keep costs down. Some pandemic supplies were kept but never at levels needed for something like this. It was always about the cost of non moving inventory


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## Specwar

Dovans said:


> If you believe this is a natural occuring virus... Im not on that boat


Are you insinuating it was created by man and thrust upon us?? Perhaps from North Korea??


----------



## Redheads

Dovans said:


> long process to get approved...by the time he gets it approved or disapproved we'll be through the worst of it


FMLA is the first step and one i would start immediately if you have concerns. Its approved much quicker than one would think. I have had a bunch of employees over the years sign up for it and get approved quickly even though i thought it was a bunch of BS

Good Luck with your decision


----------



## CoonDawg92

Saugeye Tom said:


> So...I have refrained posting here...amazing what I see. Everyone has opinions....stats, etc...who is sure what to believe. I'm told I'm essential. What if I pick it up and give it to my wife...at risk wife and she dies.....someone tell me what to do


Tom, I have heard from two folks in the medical field that they strip their clothes at the door and shower immediately when arriving home to try and avoid infecting the family. Clothes into the washer right away.

I would say try to isolate as much as your home layout will allow you to if you are concerned about it. Avoid sharing things that you might not normally think of. My wife is wiping down doorknobs, light switches, remote control regularly.


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## 8 gold medals

Specwar said:


> Are you insinuating it was created by man and thrust upon us?? Perhaps from North Korea??


"How about looking toward Harvard University?"


----------



## ErieRider

Specwar said:


> Trained in nuclear, chemical and biological warfare in the service in 1969, but not trained in what good old Mother Nature can throw at you.


Im not saying this is man made but falling under the biological category to me 

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## PapawSmith

ErieRider said:


> Not an exact answer on this exact issue but let me ask this. I thought we would be prepared in this country for something like this. We were supposed to be ready for any biological, radiological, chemical or explosive attack since 9-11. Planning for the next big national emergency to be ready to prevent such casualties. But it's now here and don't even have enough PPE ready to distribute. It's not a political thing it's 19 years of smoke and mirrors
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


Erie, you have to be realistic about what a society, of 330,000,000 can possibly be prepared for. We have hurricanes, serious ones like Katrina, every decade or so in some location and we are NEVER prepared for either the storm or the recovery. We have never been fully prepared for the many earthquakes that have devastated this country over the last century, not even close. What if an earthquake occurs off the Pacific coast and causes a massive tidal wave that impacts the west coast, we are not at all prepared. What if we have a volcano eruption in the Pacific Northwest, and there are several up there, that impacts a large percentage of the east, we are not prepared. We are not properly prepared to assist Puerto Rico, not even our own mainland, when they had a weather disaster. How about the fires seemingly every summer on the west coast and the subsequent heavy rains and landslides to follow, or the tornados and floods every single spring in the Mississippi Delta region, we seem to NEVER be prepared for these almost annual occurrences. Point is, how the hell is a society the size of ours supposed to be prepared for any of the many tragedies that can befall us at any given time? We can’t, because we can’t be properly be prepared for the things we can almost predict, and we certainly can’t be prepared for viruses originating out of foreign countries that no one can predict. It’s not political at all, it’s impossible.


----------



## Big Chief

I hate to say this but nobody will be right when this is over. there will be those who say “not many passed” some will say “it could have been worse” there is no right or wrong, but the bottom line is it will destroy the economy for many years.
There’s 65 pages on this forum dedicated to this, and we all still have our opinions. Is the president right? Is the governor right? Is Fauci right?
We are in uncharted waters and only one thing is certain, the economy cannot survive the way things are today.


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## Hambo

DHower08 said:


> 14,000 deaths from the flu for 2019- 2020
> 
> 3,168 from Corona virus.
> 
> People are freaking out because it's something new


This is just beginning, and if we follow the Governor's plan, we just might have less deaths than 2019-2020 flu season. That's the reason we're going through this right now.


----------



## Bluewalleye

PapawSmith said:


> Damn, if only you would have been in charge. Did you know the answer to all of this **** back in December or are you just now figuring it out now since it is behind us? I will guess the latter.


I would push the like button 5000 times if it was allowed. Some people are experts at being an expert in their own minds. 
Maybe Madonna can give us more expert advice from her bathtub. LOL


----------



## Freedomfisher

BuckeyeFishinNut said:


> My current worry is that besides schools, all of the things that have been shut down are open ended. What is it gonna take for restaurants and bars to start doing dine-in service again, barber shops and gyms to open back up? 1 new case a week, no new cases a week, no cases for a month? How long before the general pubic feels this has slowed enough to go back to "normal" life but our government doesn't feel so? This is when you will see things start to get nasty.
> 
> My county has 2 cases, the original 2 they had a week ago, many counties have no cases. The "hot spots" are where you would expect to find them, around the populous centers. The Cleveland area has more cases than the rest of the entire state. Wouldn't be surprised if the next step becomes localized lockdowns but not the entire state.


from what im seeing on social media and the people I talk to day to day I tho k it'll be the opposite. the people will want to stay lockdown while the government starts easing restrictions


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## Bluewalleye

PapawSmith said:


> Erie, you have to be realistic about what a society, of 330,000,000 can possibly be prepared for. We have hurricanes, serious ones like Katrina, every decade or so in some location and we are NEVER prepared for either the storm or the recovery. We have never been fully prepared for the many earthquakes that have devastated this country over the last century, not even close. What if an earthquake occurs off the Pacific coast and causes a massive tidal wave that impacts the west coast, we are not at all prepared. What if we have a volcano eruption in the Pacific Northwest, and there are several up there, that impacts a large percentage of the east, we are not prepared. We are not properly prepared to assist Puerto Rico, not even our own mainland, when they had a weather disaster. How about the fires seemingly every summer on the west coast and the subsequent heavy rains and landslides to follow, or the tornados and floods every single spring in the Mississippi Delta region, we seem to NEVER be prepared for these almost annual occurrences. Point is, how the hell is a society the size of ours supposed to be prepared for any of the many tragedies that can befall us at any given time? We can’t, because we can’t be properly be prepared for the things we can almost predict, and we certainly can’t be prepared for viruses originating out of foreign countries that no one can predict. It’s not political at all, it’s impossible.


This is by far the best post on all of this. It is impossible to predict or to be totally prepared for something like this. The entire world wasn't prepared for this. lol


----------



## LEfriend

Bluewalleye said:


> This is by far the best post on all of this. It is impossible to predict or to be totally prepared for something like this. The entire world wasn't prepared for this. lol


Yes, fair point. But that doesn't excuse that the intelligence agency reports were blinking full code red on this in January and early Feb and were ignored... Nor that it was obvious what was happening in other countries and we had a 2 month advance window to get prepared and our highest level ignored it. Did nothing. Because of that I have 2 family members who were exposed putting their life on the line on the front line of treating patients. One is awaiting test results and the other thinks she has it to. Because of lack of masks, gowns and testing they are mortified that even through no fault of their own, they may have passed it on to immune compromised patients. We couldn't have predicted this but sure as hell had enough notice to get masks, gowns, and testing ready. We didn't. Now my loved ones are at risk. When yours are too, it will get personal. All the best and safe passage to all of you that have loved ones out there on the front lines of health care. They are this days heroes.


----------



## Shad Rap

LEfriend said:


> Yes, fair point. But that doesn't excuse that the intelligence agency reports were blinking full code red on this in January and early Feb and were ignored... Nor that it was obvious what was happening in other countries and we had a 2 month advance window to get prepared and our highest level ignored it. Did nothing. Because of that I have 2 family members who were exposed putting their life on the line on the front line of treating patients. One is awaiting test results and the other thinks she has it to. Because of lack of masks, gowns and testing they are mortified that even through no fault of their own, they may have passed it on to immune compromised patients. We couldn't have predicted this but sure as hell had enough notice to get masks, gowns, and testing ready. We didn't. Now my loved ones are at risk. When yours are too, it will get personal. All the best and safe passage to all of you that have loved ones out there on the front lines of health care. They are this days heroes.


The problem was with how the Chinese handled it...not us...we were the most prepared country to deal with this in the world and we still are...just wait and watch how it unfolds...quit watching the corona news network with all the doom and gloom...try looking at a different side...I understand you have family that are on the frontlines...so do I...my wife and I had this virus the first week of February.


----------



## ICENUT

Less time on impeachment and investigations maybe huh they could have prepared for this instead of that!!!!!!


----------



## TomC

me and my wife are both first responders in this. We also have a 4 week old at home. my wife while on maternity leave, got a work email saying they reassigned her work position. Once she goes back to work in a few weeks she is assigned to the Covid-19 floor of one of the big local hospitals. Me, I work in one the biggest county jails in ohio, where we still have 550 inmates. Yeah our population is down from 750, but we still are getting 15-40 new residents a day that may have this crap.

I just wish people would quit hoarding crap so I could get some things from the store. Tried the Kroger click it and they are scheduled at least two weeks out.


----------



## hatteras1

Byg said:


> I wish I could stay home and hunker down, but I have to go to work (airport). I believe a lot of people would shelter in but have no choice. Also a big thanks to all
> health care givers for there service and sacrifice











On another note..


----------



## Shad Rap

Death numbers seem to be dropping...US and worldwide.


----------



## jrose

LEfriend said:


> Yes, fair point. But that doesn't excuse that the intelligence agency reports were blinking full code red on this in January and early Feb and were ignored... Nor that it was obvious what was happening in other countries and we had a 2 month advance window to get prepared and our highest level ignored it. Did nothing. Because of that I have 2 family members who were exposed putting their life on the line on the front line of treating patients. One is awaiting test results and the other thinks she has it to. Because of lack of masks, gowns and testing they are mortified that even through no fault of their own, they may have passed it on to immune compromised patients. We couldn't have predicted this but sure as hell had enough notice to get masks, gowns, and testing ready. We didn't. Now my loved ones are at risk. When yours are too, it will get personal. All the best and safe passage to all of you that have loved ones out there on the front lines of health care. They are this days heroes.


Sorry to hear about your loved ones possibly getting the virus, but there is a 98% chance that they will be perfectly fine.


----------



## hatteras1

Within the last 5 minutes.


----------



## Shad Rap

hatteras1 said:


> View attachment 348151
> 
> 
> Within the last 5 minutes.


US has had 14 deaths in the last 24 hours...that number is already lower than it has been...something like 834 deaths worldwide in the last 24 hours...that number is also lower...you can't look at the picture as a whole...you'll miss how it's developing and changing over time.


----------



## BuckeyeFishinNut

My dad and myself were talking about the numbers this morning while we were working out at his house since the gyms are closed. All the media does is tell you how many new cases there are daily and the total number of reported cases. We rarely hear how many have recovered or the day over day increase %. By tacking onto the total number daily, the media makes it sound like its spreading out of control, but if you dive into the numbers thats not true. 

Pay attention to what the media is feeding you. Its always the person who got knocked on their ass by it, never the person who had very mild symptoms (which most would) and got over it in a couple days. Its always some arbitrary statistic to make things sound way worse. "The deaths in Ohio doubled!" It went from 3 to 6, I bet more than 3 people died yesterday in car accidents in Ohio or house fires, or from a heart attacks. You can always set up statistics to make your point.


----------



## hatteras1

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/coronavirus-cases/
*Sources*

Novel Coronavirus (2019-nCoV) situation reports - World Health Organization (WHO)
2019 Novel Coronavirus (2019-nCoV) in the U.S. -. U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC)


----------



## ErieRider

PapawSmith said:


> Erie, you have to be realistic about what a society, of 330,000,000 can possibly be prepared for. We have hurricanes, serious ones like Katrina, every decade or so in some location and we are NEVER prepared for either the storm or the recovery. We have never been fully prepared for the many earthquakes that have devastated this country over the last century, not even close. What if an earthquake occurs off the Pacific coast and causes a massive tidal wave that impacts the west coast, we are not at all prepared. What if we have a volcano eruption in the Pacific Northwest, and there are several up there, that impacts a large percentage of the east, we are not prepared. We are not properly prepared to assist Puerto Rico, not even our own mainland, when they had a weather disaster. How about the fires seemingly every summer on the west coast and the subsequent heavy rains and landslides to follow, or the tornados and floods every single spring in the Mississippi Delta region, we seem to NEVER be prepared for these almost annual occurrences. Point is, how the hell is a society the size of ours supposed to be prepared for any of the many tragedies that can befall us at any given time? We can’t, because we can’t be properly be prepared for the things we can almost predict, and we certainly can’t be prepared for viruses originating out of foreign countries that no one can predict. It’s not political at all, it’s impossible.


My whole point on this was covered in the post concerning masks and healthcare supplies. Two months ago me and the wife saw happenings around the globe, didn't go crazy but got what we needed to make it through a family quarantine due to both of us being in high public contact positions. If some regular working dude got on alert why couldn't production of this stuff ramp up 2 months ago. 
Other point being, back in about 2006 (13 years ago) I was sent to Fort McClellan, Alabama for COBRA training (chemical, ordinance, biological, radiological) training for my job. Upon completion of that training, I was given an entire response kit due to anticipation potential attacks or issues just like this in the community. I will entertain guesses on how much of that equipment is now outdated or sitting in their packages now unusable and expired. Issues were seen up to minimum 13 years ago, training was given and addressed but never readdressed after that. So we can't plan for exact scenarios but the country ran hundreds of what ifs but didn't have current supplies to respond. We are a few weeks into this and from the start facilities were saying what dont have this, this and that! Crazy to me. 






Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## cement569

I just hope and pray that we can get a hold on this thing, it puts a lot of stress on people mostly the elderly. I have washed my hands so many times in the last 2 weeks that this morning I touched the mirror and realized I no longer had finger prints


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## AmericanEagle

A loss of a sense of smell or taste may be a symptom of COVID-19, medical groups representing ear, nose and throat specialists have warned.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...navirus-symptoms-loss-smell-taste/2897385001/


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## JamesF

I saw that on the news. Loss of senses is a possibility. And not a good sign. Although this can be caused by several factors, it is a warning sign. I know a few people that have had this happen, due to chemicals. And I recall having the same thing when I had the flu years ago.


----------



## 9Left

LEfriend said:


> Yes, fair point. But that doesn't excuse that the intelligence agency reports were blinking full code red on this in January and early Feb and were ignored... Nor that it was obvious what was happening in other countries and we had a 2 month advance window to get prepared and our highest level ignored it. Did nothing. Because of that I have 2 family members who were exposed putting their life on the line on the front line of treating patients. One is awaiting test results and the other thinks she has it to. Because of lack of masks, gowns and testing they are mortified that even through no fault of their own, they may have passed it on to immune compromised patients. We couldn't have predicted this but sure as hell had enough notice to get masks, gowns, and testing ready. We didn't. Now my loved ones are at risk. When yours are too, it will get personal. All the best and safe passage to all of you that have loved ones out there on the front lines of health care. They are this days heroes.


This makes no sense ... Yes they could've known that there was a possibility of a virus spreading… But until it actually got here, no one knew anything about it… Including shelflife, transmission, or exactly what precautions would be needed for it, whether it's airborne, droplet,… None of that was really known… So please stop trashing people because you think They should pull unknown information Regarding a global pandemic out of their ass two months early...And if you think US sucks that bad....take a trip to another country… I'm sure the responses are much better... In my opinion, our hospitals are doing everything necessary and so is the CDC....Because right now I work in a pretty large hospital and we have zero… Let me just repeat ....zero cases... But I guess that's because of our poor response… And poor planning  Stay at home, wash your hands, and be a part of the solution


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## LEfriend

9Left said:


> This makes no sense ... Yes they could've known that there was a possibility of a virus spreading… But until it actually got here, no one knew anything about it… Including shelflife, transmission, or exactly what precautions would be needed for it, whether it's airborne, droplet,… None of that was really known… So please stop trashing people because you think They should pull unknown information Regarding a global pandemic out of their ass two months early...And if you think US sucks that bad....take a trip to another country… I'm sure the responses are much better... In my opinion, our hospitals are doing everything necessary and so is the CDC....Because right now I work in a pretty large hospital and we have zero… Let me just repeat ....zero cases... But I guess that's because of our poor response… And poor planning  Stay at home, wash your hands, and be a part of the solution


On Feb 5 US announced it was going to began shipping its test kits. One day later World Health Organization had already shipped 250,000 test kits to more than 50 labs around the world! In February little ole South Korea was testing 12,000 people a day. By end of Feb, U.S. had tested all of 350 people the entire month of February.... a whopping 12 per day! Meanwhile we were being told as late as 3 weeks ago _"It was all gonna wash away" _and _"There would be millions and millions of masks"_. (can cue the tapes if you want) Well our daughter in law is still waiting. Doesn't take a rocket scientist to see how much precious time was fiddle farted away denying this was coming. As for staying home, I have only been out of house 4 times in 32 days and each of those was solely a doctor/hospital visit. And as for being part of the solution, our family is right now sewing masks by hand based on the info CDC put out. Our other daughter in law put on Facebook that she would be making and donating them to heath care workers that needed them. Ink wasn't even dry before nurses started calling her for them... Best of luck, stay safe, and hope your hospital stays patient free. Thank you for your service.


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## 9Left

Well… I appreciate your efforts… But hand sewn masks from the general public is the last thing I want in the hospital… That movement is more of a unification of people that they are doing something… And I say go for it… But don't send those things to my hospital.Contrary to popular believe… There are adequate supplies


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## ress

FMLA is no joke. I have recurring A-Fib. It has given me insurance that my job is safe. It may cost 20.00 to get filed but for sure a good thing. My wife is in HR and has seen a few filed by doctors who are prone to hand them out like candy but most are legit. Most are complete in 5 to 10 days.

Sent from my LGLS990 using Tapatalk


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## Dovans

9Left said:


> Well… I appreciate your efforts… But hand sewn masks from the general public is the last thing I want in the hospital… That movement is more of a unification of people that they are doing something… And I say go for it… But don't send those things to my hospital.Contrary to popular believe… There are adequate supplies


My wife has made quite a few and the nurses she gave them too are using them to cover the one they are wearing.. Kind of like a book cover if you will?


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## Dovans

ress said:


> FMLA is no joke. I have recurring A-Fib. It has given me insurance that my job is safe. It may cost 20.00 to get filed but for sure a good thing. My wife is in HR and has seen a few filed by doctors who are prone to hand them out like candy but most are legit. Most are complete in 5 to 10 days.
> 
> Sent from my LGLS990 using Tapatalk


FMLA certainly are no joke. It did take longer the 5-10 days for the one I filed so I could miss work to take care of my mother. The Dr. also did not fill it out right, but due to my understanding employer things are good without me having to get it refilled.


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## Redheads

Funny how everyone here is all about numbers but arent talking about the stock market....That should be one of the biggest concerns right now


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## JamesF

Our economy is in sad shape. Financial institutions are scrambling to make sense out the situation. This how the virus is virtually effecting every aspect of our lives. People are eager to pin the blame on whatever donkey happens to be in their cross hairs. There still seems to be people in high positions that are wanting to quibble over the details and add to the fire, aspects, that have been holding back issues in the past. This is not the time to interject unnecessary baggage. I feel that this is biased and petty. You can make a name for yourself later. If you deem this political, then go ahead and delete. You won't hurt my feelings. Thanks


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## ICENUT

This eventually will pass its not the end of the world yes there is pain,loss of jobs and sadly lives but in the end it will pass. When it ends can you imagine the pent up economy when people start to travel and go about their business after being pent up for weeks or more.There will be new industry created because of this hopefull appreciate health care and making our own diagnostic equipment not to mention traing and schools for people to work in these new fields. Manufacturing our own antibiotics and medicines. People taking vacations.air travel ect. Buying automobiles,boats campers ect.Our country will have learned a lot because of this hopefully we've learned our lessons.


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## Southernsaug

ICENUT said:


> This eventually will pass its not the end of the world


But maybe it is the end of the world....


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## hatteras1

Southernsaug said:


> But maybe it is the end of the world....


Only if you don't have toilet paper!!


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## Snakecharmer

We had more new confirmed cases today than anywhere else in the world.


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## JamesF

Some new information about the signs and symptoms. Besides aches and pains, fever, cough, Fatigue, Gi upset, and Headaches. Have been added. If any of you in the medical field have any thoughts on this. I would like to hear. Some of this may come as second hand news.


----------



## Shad Rap

Snakecharmer said:


> We had more new confirmed cases today than anywhere else in the world.


We're testing more and more people though...we've already tested more people than south korea did in 2 months.


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## Saugeye Tom

Redheads said:


> Funny how everyone here is all about numbers but arent talking about the stock market....That should be one of the biggest concerns right now


Ummmm. Up 2000


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## Shad Rap

Southernsaug said:


> But maybe it is the end of the world....


Bet you $500 it's not...


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## Saugeye Tom

Shad Rap said:


> Bet you $500 it's not...


Today it was


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## Shad Rap

Saugeye Tom said:


> Today it was


Why is that?


----------



## buckeyebowman

UNCLEMIKE said:


> I managed a hospital supply warehouse for years until I retired a year ago. The past five years were all about just in time inventory to keep costs down. Some pandemic supplies were kept but never at levels needed for something like this. It was always about the cost of non moving inventory


This thought occurred to me today as well. Everybody's bitching at the government about lack of supplies, but aren't hospitals culpable as well? The modern business model seems to be "run everything on the cheap, pay nobody what they're really worth, so the big shots at the top can rake it in with both hands! 



ICENUT said:


> Less time on impeachment and investigations maybe huh they could have prepared for this instead of that!!!!!!


Absolutely great OP/ED piece in the Youngstown Vindicator today by Erick Erickson pointing out the political and media hypocrisy. Go to vindy.com and maybe you can pull it up.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

Shad Rap said:


> Why is that?


2000 plusto be precise. Why is that..getting ready to hit the top of the roller coaster. Plus other things I will not mention. No political stuff from me


----------



## Saugeye Tom

Shad Rap said:


> Why is that?


Thought you was talking about the stock market..lmao...end of the world crap I ignore


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## Shad Rap

Saugeye Tom said:


> Thought you was talking about the stock market..lmao...end of the world crap I ignore


Nope...thought you were saying the end of the world was today...


----------



## ErieRider

buckeyebowman said:


> This thought occurred to me today as well. Everybody's bitching at the government about lack of supplies, but aren't hospitals culpable as well? The modern business model seems to be "run everything on the cheap, pay nobody what they're really worth, so the big shots at the top can rake it in with both hands!
> 
> 
> 
> Absolutely great OP/ED piece in the Youngstown Vindicator today by Erick Erickson pointing out the political and media hypocrisy. Go to vindy.com and maybe you can pull it up.


Can someone post a link to the actual story? Looked on the mobile page and it's not showing who wrote the articles. Just showing Editorials from the 23rd 

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## JamesF

Saugeye Tom said:


> Thought you was talking about the stock market..lmao...end of the world crap I ignore


But! It is the end of the world!!OMG! The sky is falling.


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## Buster24

Stay positive.....as a nation we will beat this thing....I feel the key to this whole mess is we do not have a medicine to put this virus in its place....if we did, it would settle this panic down...it will come...hopefully soon!!!


----------



## glacier_dropsy

Stay positive, the rate of rise seems flat, but our testing seems to be at its limit. I wonder what the percent positive looks like on a daily basis. I suspect we are getting positive testing nobody wants to report on a daily basis. Stay home, be safe, eat well.


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## Legend killer

Between my wife and I we will be getting 2900$ soon. Two adults and a dependent.


----------



## Redheads

Saugeye Tom said:


> Ummmm. Up 2000


Certainly a start......


----------



## 1more

Legend killer said:


> Between my wife and I we will be getting 2900$ soon. Two adults and a dependent.


When you get your money be sure to spend your money locally!


----------



## TomC

State odnr marinas shut down. Um..... looks like alternative boat launching is now in effect


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## loves2fishinohio

Legend killer said:


> Between my wife and I we will be getting 2900$ soon. Two adults and a dependent.


I wouldn't count on "soon". Despite government claims last week of having money to people by April 6th, the media articles I've been reading say that the IRS once again will be handling distributions of payment. Last time they did this, it took 6-8 weeks on average. The media is reporting even if this is completely signed, sealed, and delivered today, don't expect to see a check until the middle or end of May.

Granted, it's coming from CNN, and it's all speculation, but it makes sense:

https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/25/politics/senate-deal-stimulus-checks-coronavirus/index.html


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

Anybody expecting a check better check the phase outs.......

Plus, the IRS announced already tax refunds would be delayed 6-8 weeks; if you are getting a check I'd bet it won't come rapidly unfortunately. I won't be surprised if many are back to work when they cash their check - hope so!


----------



## fishless

Fish-N-Fool said:


> Anybody expecting a check better check the phase outs.......
> 
> Plus, the IRS announced already tax refunds would be delayed 6-8 weeks; if you are getting a check I'd bet it won't come rapidly unfortunately. I won't be surprised if many are back to work when they cash their check - hope so!


I got my tax refund from Feds and state two days ago


----------



## Hatchetman

JamesF said:


> I saw that on the news. Loss of senses is a possibility. And not a good sign. Although this can be caused by several factors, it is a warning sign. I know a few people that have had this happen, due to chemicals. And I recall having the same thing when I had the flu years ago.


Unfortunately, another sense that's being lost is the "Common" one....


----------



## Freedomfisher

Rooster said:


> That is the same doctor Acton that made the wildly inaccurate estimated of 100,000 infected in Ohio 10 days ago. And, the same one that greatly limited the liberty of 11 million today, with a total of 351 confirmed cases.


preach


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

fishless - that means you filed prior to the shutdowns. Everything processed stayed in the works so refunds have been being deposited. IRS stated last week for returns submitted at current expect the delay in processing. 

I certainly am not in charge of issuing these checks....just trying to be helpful and realistic for anybody expecting one that it may not come for some time. If I were receiving a check I would not be counting on it to help with even April expenses. Hopefully I am wrong and all the families receiving checks get the money sooner than later.

These plans don't really help improve the overall situation that much anyway if the past is any indicator; just rings up more national debt.


----------



## Rooster

On 3/12, Amy Acton estimated 100,000 infected in Ohio.

13 days later, only 704 confirmed cases, and 10 deaths in Ohio.

The data clearly indicates that her estimate was wildly exaggerated. 

Her misinformation is responsible for record unemployment claims. The exact number cannot be determined as the website has crashed, and they are no longer reporting the daily unemployment numbers. But, it was over 200,000 within only two days this week.


----------



## 9Left

Mods… Why the heck would you delete my post about a 401(k)?


----------



## Southernsaug

http://www.ohiodnr.gov/odnr-operations-during-coronavirus-outbreak

here is the latest from ODNR


----------



## 9Left

... Well can you at least answer the question? That post was not political in any way shape or form…


----------



## Specwar

Rooster said:


> On 3/12, Amy Acton estimated 100,000 infected in Ohio.
> 
> 13 days later, only 704 confirmed cases, and 10 deaths in Ohio.
> 
> The data clearly indicates that her estimate was wildly exaggerated.
> 
> Her misinformation is responsible for record unemployment claims. The exact number cannot be determined as the website has crashed, and they are no longer reporting the daily unemployment numbers. But, it was over 200,000 within only two days this week.


For what it’s worth, today she stated that “ 40% of every family in Ohio will be sickened with it”. Don’t know a thing about her, nor do I have the right to judge her, but she is surely a horrible public speaker, and seems like she is always about to break into tears. Just my opinion.


----------



## buckeyebowman

ErieRider said:


> Can someone post a link to the actual story? Looked on the mobile page and it's not showing who wrote the articles. Just showing Editorials from the 23rd
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


The only link I know of is vindy,com. The OP/ED I reference appeared on 3/24, so keep checking. I don't know how fast they get this stuff uploaded.


----------



## KaGee

9Left said:


> Mods… Why the heck would you delete my post about a 401(k)?


I normally wouldn't answer this here, however,
What does your 401k have to do with Covid live update?
What does tax returns have to do with Covid live update?
You all were given multiple notices and now you want to get in a bunch?


----------



## KaGee

9Left said:


> ... Well can you at least answer the question? That post was not political in any way shape or form…


We can't be here 24-7 monitoring. We have jobs and a life. You were answered in an hour forty five.


----------



## KaGee

Rooster said:


> On 3/12, Amy Acton estimated 100,000 infected in Ohio.
> 
> 13 days later, only 704 confirmed cases, and 10 deaths in Ohio.
> 
> The data clearly indicates that her estimate was wildly exaggerated.
> 
> Her misinformation is responsible for record unemployment claims. The exact number cannot be determined as the website has crashed, and they are no longer reporting the daily unemployment numbers. But, it was over 200,000 within only two days this week.


Just curious, what did Ohio do that other states haven't either prior to or after the shut down?


----------



## johnboy111711

checking back in after a week and a half. Glad I haven't missed anything!


----------



## Snakecharmer

Ohio is either lucky or doing a better job than most states especially looking at our population..
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/


----------



## JamesF

Haven't missed much,except that, we now are having a Coronavirus flare up.


----------



## 9Left

KaGee said:


> I normally wouldn't answer this here, however,
> What does your 401k have to do with Covid live update?
> What does tax returns have to do with Covid live update?
> You all were given multiple notices and now you want to get in a bunch?


Well… There's this thing called a global pandemic going on right now… And it's sort of directly affecting the economy… So it has everything to do with a comment about a 401(k) and retirement plan… What about that do you not understand?? Please stop Deleting posts because it doesn't personally make sense to you and you can't add the two together and make sense of it…


----------



## Freedomfisher

BFG said:


> I've heard about 9 Docs refute this study, given that there were so few patients and there was not at 100% cure rate. While promising, I don't think it's a cure all Folks with chronic diseases cannot take the anti-malarial. Most of those dying have one or more chronic diseases. Bayer donated 3 million doses of the pill.
> 
> Toledo Doctor just said "80% of those infected will require no treatment." Which sounds good until you realize Ohio has 11.4 million people, and if 25% of those folks get infected, we are still looking at 2.5 million infections, and 20% of that is roughly 450,000 requiring treatment.
> 
> Stay home. Period.


we won't get that many.


----------



## CFIden

9Left said:


> Well… There's this thing called a global pandemic going on right now… And it's sort of directly affecting the economy… So it has everything to do with a comment about a 401(k) and retirement plan… What about that do you not understand?? Please stop Deleting posts because it doesn't personally make sense to you and you can't add the two together and make sense of it…


Why don't you poke the bear dude.


----------



## twistedcatfish1971

If I'm not mistaken...ohio is 7th largest population wise? And from beginning or at least a few short weeks ago our governor set in motion steps that the country followed with schools/restaurants...what have you...shutting down. For me it was kinda fun n games...3 weeks ago ish...since then I've shifted gears and have been somewhat of a pain in rear with work/friends/family...got to be vigilant and adjust to this virus. 

You know that stupid saying..."it is what it is"

Freaking hate it!!! 

Deal with what is going on and adapt...be strong for family/friends/and those who need it...text/email...whatever to people who you may have not had contact with...or had hard times with. Everyone needs someone right now OGF.

...much appreciated for everyone's posts/feelings...

...stay strong stay twisted. 

Don.


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## ErieRider

Im just wondering what essential task would require a person to be out in public wearing pajamas.... whatever it was it must really be essential!!! Yup...I was at work, legally out and seen this twice.... stay home people 

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## Had a Bite

Snakecharmer said:


> Ohio is either lucky or doing a better job than most states especially looking at our population..
> https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/





Rooster said:


> On 3/12, Amy Acton estimated 100,000 infected in Ohio.
> 
> 13 days later, only 704 confirmed cases, and 10 deaths in Ohio.
> 
> The data clearly indicates that her estimate was wildly exaggerated.
> 
> Her misinformation is responsible for record unemployment claims. The exact number cannot be determined as the website has crashed, and they are no longer reporting the daily unemployment numbers. But, it was over 200,000 within only two days this week.





Specwar said:


> For what it’s worth, today she stated that “ 40% of every family in Ohio will be sickened with it”. Don’t know a thing about her, nor do I have the right to judge her, but she is surely a horrible public speaker, and seems like she is always about to break into tears. Just my opinion.



Honestly, she is probably not far off. We have basically stopped testing. So I wouldnt take to much stock in the number of positive cases, because we have a frightening amount of unconfirmed cases that will never be tested. Were not even testing people who have symptoms or have known exposure to a positive person unless it's for a healthcare worker or something along those lines. So as a nurse its depressing to not know the answers. Not to join the conspiracy theory crew, but I dont think they want the true numbers to be public knowledge, like they are afraid of the truth, who knows?


----------



## One guy and a boat

9Left said:


> Well… There's this thing called a global pandemic going on right now… And it's sort of directly affecting the economy… So it has everything to do with a comment about a 401(k) and retirement plan… What about that do you not understand?? Please stop Deleting posts because it doesn't personally make sense to you and you can't add the two together and make sense of it…


Sent from my Pixel 3a XL using Tapatalk


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## 9Left

Case in point...








why are you posting pictures of empty grocery store shelves? What does that have to do with a live update?
... i'm not trying to be smart Kagee...But your post about empty grocery selves is something that is "affected"by this whole virus deal… and my 401(k) is something that is "affected"by this whole virus deal...So unless you want to start deleting your own posts… I don't see anything wrong with people having a conversation about how things are being affected by this. Thank you and have a nice day....sir


----------



## thistubesforu

Rooster 

The numbers will never show what is really going on in this state. WE DONT HAVE THE TESTS!!! Yes a certain someone keeps saying we have them but they are not there. I personally know 5 people that have all the symptoms called the drs went in got tested for the flu negative by the way. Told them they didn’t fall into the old/comprised category and sent them all home to self quarantine for 14 days. Told them more than likely yes you have it but we don’t have enough tests to waste one on you since you will more than likely be fine. Feel however you want about the numbers but they are not telling true reality of what’s going on. If anything now that they are testing some more people I feel that they are skewing them show how drastically it goes up. Not by tons but enough to make it interesting. Bottom line to everyone not just you turn off the left and right radio stations tune into the drs and scientist to get your info from please. I mean think about it would you search out a mechanic to build you a house?? Yes I know some could but what I’m getting at is I don’t give a god damn what a politician has to say about medical emergencies!! What the word now is from the top got to make that money man!! Open the country back up economy is number one!! Regardless of lives lost don’t agree with that one bit. But hey it’s America we can all feel however we want that’s the beauty of it. Just do me one favor and actually open your eyes and ears to the situation see it from all angles not just the one you want to hear it from. Be safe and stay healthy my friends.


----------



## roundbadge

This bug is aggressive, spreads very easily


----------



## Freedomfisher

Big Chief said:


> I hate to say this but nobody will be right when this is over. there will be those who say “not many passed” some will say “it could have been worse” there is no right or wrong, but the bottom line is it will destroy the economy for many years.
> There’s 65 pages on this forum dedicated to this, and we all still have our opinions. Is the president right? Is the governor right? Is Fauci right?
> We are in uncharted waters and only one thing is certain, the economy cannot survive the way things are today.


best comment yet


----------



## Freedomfisher

Hambo said:


> This is just beginning, and if we follow the Governor's plan, we just might have less deaths than 2019-2020 flu season. That's the reason we're going through this right now.


that kimd of scares me in a way...if its thst successful I can see them trying to lock us down every year for the flu


----------



## Freedomfisher

Had a Bite said:


> Honestly, she is probably not far off. We have basically stopped testing. So I wouldnt take to much stock in the number of positive cases, because we have a frightening amount of unconfirmed cases that will never be tested. Were not even testing people who have symptoms or have known exposure to a positive person unless it's for a healthcare worker or something along those lines. So as a nurse its depressing to not know the answers. Not to join the conspiracy theory crew, but I dont think they want the true numbers to be public knowledge, like they are afraid of the truth, who knows?


if they arent being tested then it makes it seem LESS frightening to me....just makes the percentage of hospitilazations and deaths that much lower


----------



## Freedomfisher

thistubesforu said:


> Rooster
> 
> The numbers will never show what is really going on in this state. WE DONT HAVE THE TESTS!!! Yes a certain someone keeps saying we have them but they are not there. I personally know 5 people that have all the symptoms called the drs went in got tested for the flu negative by the way. Told them they didn’t fall into the old/comprised category and sent them all home to self quarantine for 14 days. Told them more than likely yes you have it but we don’t have enough tests to waste one on you since you will more than likely be fine. Feel however you want about the numbers but they are not telling true reality of what’s going on. If anything now that they are testing some more people I feel that they are skewing them show how drastically it goes up. Not by tons but enough to make it interesting. Bottom line to everyone not just you turn off the left and right radio stations tune into the drs and scientist to get your info from please. I mean think about it would you search out a mechanic to build you a house?? Yes I know some could but what I’m getting at is I don’t give a god damn what a politician has to say about medical emergencies!! What the word now is from the top got to make that money man!! Open the country back up economy is number one!! Regardless of lives lost don’t agree with that one bit. But hey it’s America we can all feel however we want that’s the beauty of it. Just do me one favor and actually open your eyes and ears to the situation see it from all angles not just the one you want to hear it from. Be safe and stay healthy my friends.


if they arent bad enough to need a test then it really doesn't matter does it? I think we all know someone that has it or has had it.....theres a 50 percent chance I has it back in january


----------



## glacier_dropsy

Ugh. Over 100 of the near 150 positive cases last day were healthcare workers. There has to be some sampling bias there since we are rationing the testing, but healthcare is going to get hit hard by this. Makes you wonder if some of the PPE rationing now is in hopes of getting more of the health care workers immune before the biggest waves hit. Having those folks immune and not shedding would really shift some predictive models.


----------



## Rooster

Well, if that 100,000 estimate was correct the two week mortality rate for Covid-19 would be .01%.....A small fraction of the common flu mortality rate.

So, the estimate of the top health official in Ohio was wildly exaggerated, or the mortality rate is wildly exaggerated. BOTH cannot be correct, despite insufficient tests.


----------



## cheezemm2

Checks into thread... Day 2 of stay at home order... Realizes we have another MONTH to go. 

Begins writing down Zombieland style rules for survival...


----------



## glacier_dropsy

We've done a really good job so far of walling off the nursing homes. It is more prevalent in the community than the positive testing indicates. If we can keep the incident cases showing up at this rate, we'll be alright. But it looks like Michigan is doubling at an alarming rate, some of that is going to leak over. Our healthcare providers are good, when not swamped, they could probably keep this near 1% mortality. If we had no restrictions in place...it would be bodies stacking up and quickly.


----------



## Rooster

The loss of any Human life is no trivial matter. But, neither is forcing 100,000s of people out of work.

In reporting the current numbers vs the estimate, my Point is, why would you continue to trust an “expert” that has been proven to be so wildly inaccurate? It was preposterous when issued (almost equal to the GLOBAL cases at the time), and now that the data is in, the estimate is demonstrably inaccurate.

People (reportedly 200000 in just two days) have been forced out of work, worried about how they are going to support their families. I think that sweeping measures that impact so many, so much, should be based on accurate information from experts that have a record of trustworthiness.


----------



## glacier_dropsy

If you feel so strongly about this position, go volunteer at your local hospital.

And I understand about the bitterness and frustration this pandemic is causing


----------



## JamesF

This, Pandemic is having a financial effect on so many people that a lot of people don't know how hard they are being hit. I for one, personally feel a little lucky. My financial advisor, had the sense to move the majority of my assets into a trust, therefore locking my account from being traded. I still have lost a good deal of money. I have no other means of an income. We are,and have been living on a budgetary path. Like a lot of people we are concerned about the economy of our household. I hope this passes through, but how long will that be. This is having a negative impact on everyone of us. Let us be able to enjoy our community. I have been on OGF for quite a while now, and I do look forward to hearing from each and every one you. Rant ,rave,but,look at us as part of a society that we can have at least have an escape online. Be safe. Am I off topic?


----------



## laguna21

KaGee said:


> Just curious, what did Ohio do that other states haven't either prior to or after the shut down?


ohio took action before we became NY, the only difference basically


----------



## icebucketjohn

Looks like my retirement "nest egg" is taking a hit. Don't know how bad, but it'll probably postpone/delay my retirement date


----------



## threeten

icebucketjohn said:


> Looks like my retirement "nest egg" is taking a hit. Don't know how bad, but it'll probably postpone/delay my retirement date


I’m right there with you IBJ!
Rounded third- headed for home and then home plate evaporated! 
Hope it bounces back by January. That was my plan.............


----------



## icebucketjohn

Originally, I was looking at March 2021 to hang up my spurs., not so sure now.


----------



## DLarrick

Heart definitely goes out to you guys that are close or in retirement. Being 32 I still have time left in the market to rebound. But for some the impact of all this is a lot more dire. Hang in there fellas and stay strong.


----------



## $diesel$

icebucketjohn said:


> Looks like my retirement "nest egg" is taking a hit. Don't know how bad, but it'll probably postpone/delay my retirement date


Don't feel bad, John. I've lost 40% so far and i believe i will never get it all back.


----------



## $diesel$

icebucketjohn said:


> Looks like my retirement "nest egg" is taking a hit. Don't know how bad, but it'll probably postpone/delay my retirement date


Don't feel bad, John. I've lost 40% so far and i believe i will never get it all back.


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## icebucketjohn

Thursday morning 3/26/ 20k infected/1k dead in the U.S.
The herd is getting thinned.


----------



## JamesF

Retirement, for a lot of us is,living on a budgeted lifestyle. Definitely an adjustment period. Hoping all goes well for you.


----------



## $diesel$

First off, i don't consider myself to be a conspiracy theorist.
I also try very hard to look at the bright side of things.
However, some of the events taking place recently do not add up to what we are being told.

Just some observations from staying current on these events;
I have never seen any virus spread at the speed this one has,
i have never seen 2nd and 3rd world countrys out respond to any incident faster than the USA,
and, i never seen the shear panic being displayed by most everyone. (rightly so?)
I am starting to honestly believe this virus was intensionally released by someone, after manipulating it's leathality and contagiousness values, via gene structure or DNA or something else i do not understand.
IMO, the authorities are definitly not being honest with us.
I understand a sailor at sea, has contracted covid-19. Now you sailors on here help me please, aren't these sailors on ship for months at a time? Do they have shore leave while on these long stints at sea?
Along with this incident, many others who have caught this virus, claim no contact with others.
Now Occam's Razor says the simplest explanation to a thing, is more times than not, the correct explanation. No?
Thats telling me this thing is airborne. Now thats something that is TERRIBLY frightening.
I believe this may turn into the great "reset" we've heard about for so long.

Again, just some of my thoughts. No intent to offend anyone, especially the mods.


----------



## LEfriend

Rooster said:


> The loss of any Human life is no trivial matter. But, neither is forcing 100,000s of people out of work.
> 
> In reporting the current numbers vs the estimate, my Point is, why would you continue to trust an “expert” that has been proven to be so wildly inaccurate? It was preposterous when issued (almost equal to the GLOBAL cases at the time), and now that the data is in, the estimate is demonstrably inaccurate.
> 
> People (reportedly 200000 in just two days) have been forced out of work, worried about how they are going to support their families. I think that sweeping measures that impact so many, so much, should be based on accurate information from experts that have a record of trustworthiness.


_"I think that sweeping measures that impact so many, so much, should be based on accurate information from experts that have a record of trustworthiness." _ 

I agree 100%. That's why I trust the hundreds and hundreds of physicians, researchers, health care experts, medical workers - who have devoted their lives to go to graduate school, study and research these things, to keeping us safe and healthy serving on the front lines of health care - and who are interviewed daily. If you listen, read, and get your facts from anything besides faux news or internet chat boards, nearly all of these experts are singing from the same sheet of music, they are all saying the same things as "Amy". They all say if we don't continue to do what we are doing thousands more will die. They all can show you charts, graphs, data of what has been learned in other countries that supports their advice.

As for Amy, you go girl. Thank goodness she and governor have done what they have done, painful as it is. Had they not, Cleveland, Cincinnati, or Columbus could be like Detroit or New York (and soon to be New Orleans) where all the hospital beds are full, people are dying in the ER waiting for a hospital bed, standing in lines in the streets for hours for treatment, where they are right now bringing in portable morgues and the number of sick is skyrocketing. Or we could be like Louisiana where they did nothing, had Mardi Gras, and the numbers now show that within a week or so their hospitals and morgues will be overflowing too. And after that Atlanta is coming and likely Florida. Not to mention State of Washington or California.

I feel for the businesses and especially charters, because they have a short season. Don't accuse me of not. Believe me I understand, because our daughter-in-law has had to close her one person store during the season of her peak business. It is costing her family serious loss. But I don't think any individuals right to fish trumps someone's right to live. The fish aren't going anywhere and we can fish all summer... provided folks heed the warnings and advice, so the virus doesn't take your life before then.


----------



## JamesF

Sailors,do have shore leave,or port calls in foreign countries. That is where they are more likely to become infected. And once aboard, it's bound to spread.
I am having thoughts about the origin of this now(disease). Talk on the telly,is,that this may become much like any influenza and come back around in a year. The way this super virus is basically morphing and symptoms changing daily, gives reason to be skeptical.
Many physicians are also saying that every day something new about this virus shows that it is still in the early stages, almost like a hurricane,and could swing back around as the flu virus seldom does. I have my doubts, that people will stay home,by falling into a false sense of security. As stated Mardi Gra was held and now comes the backlash!


----------



## multi species angler

I too believe this was created in a lab. And if it wasn't, it will be.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

I find it strange that the CDC isn’t outspoken or as involved on the country’s task force. They are always leading the way in with new virus pandemics except this one. It’s usually the potus, or someone he assigns, cdc, and 4 or 5 contagious disease people. You can get factual numbers on their website from this virus but nothing public.


----------



## BuckeyeFishinNut

Rooster said:


> On 3/12, Amy Acton estimated 100,000 infected in Ohio.
> 
> 13 days later, only 704 confirmed cases, and 10 deaths in Ohio.
> 
> The data clearly indicates that her estimate was wildly exaggerated.
> 
> Her misinformation is responsible for record unemployment claims. The exact number cannot be determined as the website has crashed, and they are no longer reporting the daily unemployment numbers. But, it was over 200,000 within only two days this week.


I am with you on this, its the self fulfilling prophecy. If you make a claim high enough, you can't be wrong. If it hits the number, they can say it would have been way worse if the actions weren't taken. If it stays well below the number, then the actions were completely justified. Understand, Dr. Acton is a political appointee, meaning her views are in line with DeWines. I am sure she is doing what she thinks is best for the general public, but don't get it twisted, she is in a politically appointed position, this makes her a politician all the same.

This also does not make her the most qualified person in this situation, just that she has similar views on public health that our Governor has.


----------



## Shad Rap

laguna21 said:


> ohio took action before we became NY, the only difference basically


Ohio was never gonna become new york regardless...we don't have nearly the amount of people and we don't have a subway to pass the virus to pretty much everyone...


----------



## BuckeyeFishin07

Most of New York cases are in New York City, because they are jammed in like sardines. The main reason upstate NY has the cases they do is because people from the city couldn't stay home like they were supposed to. I am not saying that upstate NY wouldn't have gotten it sooner than later but the folks from New York City not heeding warnings and traveling put way more people at risk in the state than needed to be!


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

LEfriend said:


> _"I think that sweeping measures that impact so many, so much, should be based on accurate information from experts that have a record of trustworthiness." _
> 
> I agree 100%. That's why I trust the hundreds and hundreds of physicians, researchers, health care experts, medical workers - who have devoted their lives to go to graduate school, study and research these things, to keeping us safe and healthy serving on the front lines of health care - and who are interviewed daily. If you listen, read, and get your facts from anything besides faux news or internet chat boards, nearly all of these experts are singing from the same sheet of music, they are all saying the same things as "Amy". They all say if we don't continue to do what we are doing thousands more will die. They all can show you charts, graphs, data of what has been learned in other countries that supports their advice.
> 
> As for Amy, you go girl. Thank goodness she and governor have done what they have done, painful as it is. Had they not, Cleveland, Cincinnati, or Columbus could be like Detroit or New York (and soon to be New Orleans) where all the hospital beds are full, people are dying in the ER waiting for a hospital bed, standing in lines in the streets for hours for treatment, where they are right now bringing in portable morgues and the number of sick is skyrocketing. Or we could be like Louisiana where they did nothing, had Mardi Gras, and the numbers now show that within a week or so their hospitals and morgues will be overflowing too. And after that Atlanta is coming and likely Florida. Not to mention State of Washington or California.
> 
> I feel for the businesses and especially charters, because they have a short season. Don't accuse me of not. Believe me I understand, because our daughter-in-law has had to close her one person store during the season of her peak business. It is costing her family serious loss. But I don't think any individuals right to fish trumps someone's right to live. The fish aren't going anywhere and we can fish all summer... provided folks heed the warnings and advice, so the virus doesn't take your life before then.





LEfriend said:


> _"I think that sweeping measures that impact so many, so much, should be based on accurate information from experts that have a record of trustworthiness." _
> 
> I agree 100%. That's why I trust the hundreds and hundreds of physicians, researchers, health care experts, medical workers - who have devoted their lives to go to graduate school, study and research these things, to keeping us safe and healthy serving on the front lines of health care - and who are interviewed daily. If you listen, read, and get your facts from anything besides faux news or internet chat boards, nearly all of these experts are singing from the same sheet of music, they are all saying the same things as "Amy". They all say if we don't continue to do what we are doing thousands more will die. They all can show you charts, graphs, data of what has been learned in other countries that supports their advice.
> 
> As for Amy, you go girl. Thank goodness she and governor have done what they have done, painful as it is. Had they not, Cleveland, Cincinnati, or Columbus could be like Detroit or New York (and soon to be New Orleans) where all the hospital beds are full, people are dying in the ER waiting for a hospital bed, standing in lines in the streets for hours for treatment, where they are right now bringing in portable morgues and the number of sick is skyrocketing. Or we could be like Louisiana where they did nothing, had Mardi Gras, and the numbers now show that within a week or so their hospitals and morgues will be overflowing too. And after that Atlanta is coming and likely Florida. Not to mention State of Washington or California.
> 
> I feel for the businesses and especially charters, because they have a short season. Don't accuse me of not. Believe me I understand, because our daughter-in-law has had to close her one person store during the season of her peak business. It is costing her family serious loss. But I don't think any individuals right to fish trumps someone's right to live. The fish aren't going anywhere and we can fish all summer... provided folks heed the warnings and advice, so the virus doesn't take your life before then.


But what Amy and the governor are failing to tell us is that is how they dropped ball in 19 with 2400 deaths in Ohio by a very short flu season. With no stay at home orders, quarantines, no people out of work. No market drops. I wonder how many lives they could have saved if they did do these things? Was it just them? No it was the entire country. Meanwhile, 1400 deaths in one week alone nationally. 32,000 die with 350,000 hospitalized in this country by the time the flu season is over with.


----------



## loves2fishinohio

I think, unless this thing takes a major league climb, that they are going to be pressured to start letting people back to work soon.


----------



## SConner

Interesting read, video is heart breaking. Just hope we keep taking this serious in Ohio to avoid this scenario.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/25/nyregion/nyc-coronavirus-hospitals.html


----------



## Snakecharmer

SConner said:


> Interesting read, video is heart breaking. Just hope we keep taking this serious in Ohio to avoid this scenario.
> https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/25/nyregion/nyc-coronavirus-hospitals.html
> https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/25/nyregion/nyc-coronavirus-hospitals.html


Thanks Scott....That video is so sad. My daughter-in-law is having trouble getting masks at Southwest General in Cleveland.


----------



## Snakecharmer

BuckeyeFishinNut said:


> This also does not make her the most qualified person in this situation, just that she has similar views on public health that our Governor has.


Maybe the Governor has the same views as the Doctor now....


----------



## Snakecharmer

New York has more case than France. USA is catching up with Italy and China.


----------



## Dovans

Just a update.... Krogers was open two and half hours today before we ran out of toilet paper. There is plenty of Bread and Meat.

Three days ago, everything been sold out 30 mins. of opening.


----------



## Saugeyefisher

Dovans said:


> Just a update.... Krogers was open two and half hours today before we ran out of toilet paper. There is plenty of Bread and Meat.
> 
> Three days ago, everything been sold out 30 mins. of opening.


I was at giant eagle down just down the road yesterday,they was also stocked up on meat and everything else I walked bye. I did not look at the tp section tho....


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Had a fever of 100.8 last night along with a few other mild flu symptoms. I called the answering service for my oncologist and he tells me to go to the hospital due to my cancer and treatments. He calls ahead and they admit me. Flu test came back negative but I will have to wait anytime up to 10 days just for the Covid test to come back. I don’t think it’s Covid, I think it’s a side affect of my last treatment along with obeying the protocol from the state. I also feel great now and haven’t had a temp since I got here. Apparently they Already have a few cases here.


----------



## Snakecharmer

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Had a fever of 100.8 last night along with a few other mild flu symptoms. I called the answering service for my oncologist and he tells me to go to the hospital due to my cancer and treatments. He calls ahead and they admit me. Flu test came back negative but I will have to wait anytime up to 10 days just for the Covid test to come back. I don’t think it’s Covid, I think it’s a side affect of my last treatment along with obeying the protocol from the state. I also feel great now and haven’t had a temp since I got here. Apparently they Already have a few cases here.


Stay safe!


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Snakecharmer said:


> Stay safe!


I’m in isolation big time. Not even family is aloud to visit. The staff seem to be doing a pretty good job safety wise. All that come in, dr’s and nurses are all decked out in a yellow jump suit sort of thing, shield, mask, and gloves. They all seem pretty laid back and not stressed which is good for me I guess.


----------



## 3 dog Ed

Why would somebody or a country create a virus that predominantly kills humans over 65yrs old? Wouldn’t you create something that would cripple the viable population?


----------



## ress

Power of prayer folks. Power of prayer! Pray for our leaders. Pray for service workers. 

Sent from my LGLS990 using Tapatalk


----------



## JamesF

Prayers can't hurt one bit. Especially for the caregivers.


----------



## AmericanEagle

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Had a fever of 100.8 last night along with a few other mild flu symptoms. I called the answering service for my oncologist and he tells me to go to the hospital due to my cancer and treatments. He calls ahead and they admit me. Flu test came back negative but I will have to wait anytime up to 10 days just for the Covid test to come back. I don’t think it’s Covid, I think it’s a side affect of my last treatment along with obeying the protocol from the state. I also feel great now and haven’t had a temp since I got here. Apparently they Already have a few cases here.


Hope they get you out of the hospital ASAP. I'll be praying for you.


----------



## bruce

Sorry to hear Brian prayers sent. Get well soon and stay safe.


STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Had a fever of 100.8 last night along with a few other mild flu symptoms. I called the answering service for my oncologist and he tells me to go to the hospital due to my cancer and treatments. He calls ahead and they admit me. Flu test came back negative but I will have to wait anytime up to 10 days just for the Covid test to come back. I don’t think it’s Covid, I think it’s a side affect of my last treatment along with obeying the protocol from the state. I also feel great now and haven’t had a temp since I got here. Apparently they Already have a few cases here.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Snakecharmer said:


> New York has more case than France. USA is catching up with Italy and China.


Passed China today...Getting ugly especially NY


----------



## fastwater

ress said:


> Power of prayer folks. Power of prayer! Pray for our leaders. Pray for service workers.
> 
> Sent from my LGLS990 using Tapatalk


X2...Worth repeating!

Praying for you SP.


----------



## bruce

Pray for all. We are all in harms way.


----------



## JamesF

Ugly! Very concerned for sure.


----------



## Specwar

There is little doubt that we are currently dealing with something new and corruptive, however we live in a truly great and capable country and will sooner than later rise above it.
Until that time it would be beneficial if _everyone _including those here would view our glassEd as half FULL, rather than half empty.
There is far too much negativity here and in the media.


----------



## ccc

3 dog Ed said:


> Why would somebody or a country create a virus that predominantly kills humans over 65yrs old? Wouldn’t you create something that would cripple the viable population?[/QUOTE affecting a lot of younger people all should pay attention!!!!


----------



## JamesF

I'm out of words, about all of this. 
Just feeling vulnerable.


----------



## ccc

affecting a lot of younger people as well all should pay attention


----------



## Hatchetman

Got a call from my brother in Florida Tuesday evening that our brother in northern California fell at home. He hit on his butt and it broke the ball off his leg in his hip socket, he's 85. Now in the hospital, should be getting the surgery for hip replacement this evening, they had to wait for the blood thinner to get out of his body. His wife was not allowed in the hospital and no visitors, Talked on the phone and sounds good but is thoroughly pissed, all alone for several days, just hope the hip replacement goes well....


----------



## buckeyebowman

Snakecharmer said:


> Ohio is either lucky or doing a better job than most states especially looking at our population..
> https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/


Heard on the radio today that NYC, Westchester Co., and Long Island account for a little better than 50% of the total COVID-19 cases in the U.S. What do we know about that area? It's CROWDED! Much like Italy, which crams 65 Million people into an area about the size of the state of Michigan, it's nearly impossible to practice social distancing unless you stay home!

I had to go out for a few things today, and people seem to be taking this seriously. They kept their distance, would turn their heads (including me) if we had to pass in the aisle so we wouldn't even breathe toward each other. One store I went to had yellow tape stripes 6' from all counters. I washed my hands before heading out, and used the sanitizer at each stop to disinfect the cart handle and my hands. I used sanitizer as soon as I got home as well. Took a nice hot shower with lots of soap in the afternoon.

And, since I like to sip a little Bourbon of an evening, and alcohol kills viruses, I'm looking on that as a prophylactic measure.


----------



## slipsinker

there is more to this than we know..?


----------



## multi species angler

3 dog Ed said:


> Why would somebody or a country create a virus that predominantly kills humans over 65yrs old? Wouldn’t you create something that would cripple the viable population?


 I would say it has crippled all the population.


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

2 Hours ago from CDC:

Summary
What is already known about this topic?

Early data from China suggest that a majority of coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19) deaths have occurred among adults aged ≥60 years and among persons with serious underlying health conditions.

What is added by this report?

This first preliminary description of outcomes among patients with COVID-19 in the United States indicates that fatality was highest in persons aged ≥85, ranging from 10% to 27%, followed by 3% to 11% among persons aged 65–84 years, 1% to 3% among persons aged 55-64 years, <1% among persons aged 20–54 years, and no fatalities among persons aged ≤19 years.

You can see it is very dangerous to high risk groups. That is why we must all do our best to stay away from anybody in this group and take all these extra precautions. Anybody in a high risk group should isolate.


----------



## 1more

buckeyebowman said:


> Heard on the radio today that NYC, Westchester Co., and Long Island account for a little better than 50% of the total COVID-19 cases in the U.S. What do we know about that area? It's CROWDED! Much like Italy, which crams 65 Million people into an area about the size of the state of Michigan, it's nearly impossible to practice social distancing unless you stay home!
> 
> I had to go out for a few things today, and people seem to be taking this seriously. They kept their distance, would turn their heads (including me) if we had to pass in the aisle so we wouldn't even breathe toward each other. One store I went to had yellow tape stripes 6" from all counters. I washed my hands before heading out, and used the sanitizer at each stop to disinfect the cart handle and my hands. I used sanitizer as soon as I got home as well. Took a nice hot shower with lots of soap in the afternoon.
> 
> And, since I like to sip a little Bourbon of an evening, and alcohol kills viruses, I'm looking on that as a prophylactic measure.


If that’s the case I am not a very good host for this virus!


----------



## laguna21

Was at a gas station in Canton yesterday filling the truck ($1.37), couldn't believe how many people are pumping gas while on there phones, no gloves on. So now, wouldn't you need to not only disenfect your hands but also your phone, steering wheel, shifter etc.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Yea the high risk is what you have to watch out for. Still no news on my test but the nice nurses told me nobody has tested positive that has been in this room as of yet. Room 16 by the way! I don’t know if it’s a good thing or not but I’m thinking positive and it definitely lifted spirits. On a side note people, every time someone comes in this room or any of these rooms, all the safety equipment goes into my trash can. That’s a lot of gowns, hats, Shields, masks, ect. My nurse also told me they are down to using the masks and coveralls from Ollie’s believe it or not and the quality isn’t as good obviously but kudos’ to them for stocking up In the area. Good luck all.


----------



## 1more

Hang tough PS you look in good spirits!
Where do they dispose of all the waste?


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

1more said:


> Hang tough PS you look in good spirits!
> Where do they dispose of all the waste?


Thanks. Have no ideal, I’m not even allowed to open my door. I would imagine an incinerator maybe or just a dumpster.


----------



## Legend killer

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> View attachment 348547
> Yea the high risk is what you have to watch out for. Still no news on my test but the nice nurses told me nobody has tested positive that has been in this room as of yet. Room 16 by the way! I don’t know if it’s a good thing or not but I’m thinking positive and it definitely lifted spirits. On a side note people, every time someone comes in this room or any of these rooms, all the safety equipment goes into my trash can. That’s a lot of gowns, hats, Shields, masks, ect. My nurse also told me they are down to using the masks and coveralls from Ollie’s believe it or not and the quality isn’t as good obviously but kudos’ to them for stocking up In the area. Good luck all.


You should be wearing a surgical mask to protect others from your droplets, IMO.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Legend killer said:


> You should be wearing a surgical mask to protect others from your droplets, IMO.


They have them and thats protocol. I asked the same thing when they told me not to wear it?


----------



## Legend killer

They are wearing n95's, face shields and gowns. If the patient has on a mask that would reduce droplets that may get on a health care worker. Have no idea why hospitals dont have the patient wear a surgical mask. 

Hope you get out soon


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Legend killer said:


> They are wearing n95's, face shields and gowns. If the patient has on a mask that would reduce droplets that may get on a health care worker. Have no idea why hospitals dont have the patient wear a surgical mask.
> 
> Hope you get out soon


Thanks, I would imagine because always taking meds, temps, breakfast lunch dinner. Drs coming constantly. I’m not sure but once you remove them you can’t put it back on regardless and they are in short supply. That would be my guess. If I remember I will ask the exact reasons .


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Another thing fellas fwiw. They test all samples from NE Ohio at the Cleveland clinic. Apparently that’s once of the reasons it takes anywhere from 10 hrs to 3-4 days to get your results back. And obviously, as the girls pointed out they are going to do theirs first but it’s all good, I’m ok with that as I’m going to test negative. I hope!


----------



## JamesF

We are all rooting for you! You look good, but then, looks aren't everything. I'd like it better if you were at home.


----------



## 9Left

Legend killer said:


> They are wearing n95's, face shields and gowns. If the patient has on a mask that would reduce droplets that may get on a health care worker. Have no idea why hospitals dont have the patient wear a surgical mask.
> 
> Hope you get out soon


because it is a respiratory virus… They are already having a hard enough time breathing...
..If for some reason we have to transport the patient… Say to get an x-ray or an MRI or something like that… Then the patient wears a mask during the transport..


----------



## fastwater

JamesF said:


> We are all rooting for you! You look good, but then, looks aren't everything. I'd like it better if you were at home.


Speak for yourself JamesF.
Though I've never seen him in person...SP is just as ugly as he is in his avatar. 
Stay strong SP...we are all prayin for you


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

9Left said:


> because it is a respiratory virus… They are already having a hard enough time breathing...
> ..If for some reason we have to transport the patient… Say to get an x-ray or an MRI or something like that… Then the patient wears a mask during the transport..


That’s right as I did wear one the second I walked through the emergency room door, on the gurney all the way to the room.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

fastwater said:


> Speak for yourself JamesF.
> Though I've never seen him in person...SP is just as ugly as he is in his avatar.
> Stay strong SP...we are all prayin for you


Haha! I represent that remark. Hey ask Bruce. He said I was handsome


----------



## JamesF

My wife is now working from home. This is about to get more than ugly! I guess money trump's HIPAA. It will be fine, after all it's a non violent crime. A first for everything! I haven't heard much about the crime rate, things seem quite on that aspect.


----------



## 9Left

JamesF said:


> My wife is now working from home. This is about to get more than ugly! I guess money trump's HIPAA. It will be fine, after all it's a non violent crime. A first for everything! I haven't heard much about the crime rate, things seem quite on that aspect.


Quite a few people from my hospital are working from home… The hospital just sends them through a quick tutorial For using a program on how to encrypt before they send or receive....No privacy violations


----------



## fastwater

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Haha! I represent that remark. Hey ask Bruce. He said I was handsome


Yea but Bruce didn't have his glasses on when he was around you.


----------



## TRIPLE-J

Rooster said:


> The loss of any Human life is no trivial matter. But, neither is forcing 100,000s of people out of work.
> 
> In reporting the current numbers vs the estimate, my Point is, why would you continue to trust an “expert” that has been proven to be so wildly inaccurate? It was preposterous when issued (almost equal to the GLOBAL cases at the time), and now that the data is in, the estimate is demonstrably inaccurate.
> 
> People (reportedly 200000 in just two days) have been forced out of work, worried about how they are going to support their families. I think that sweeping measures that impact so many, so much, should be based on accurate information from experts that have a record of trustworthiness.


another one that just doesnt get it


----------



## TRIPLE-J

SP sorry to hear you are in there...get well soon... hope you have your phone charger with you...
soooooooooooo still think this is just a bunch of hype??????


----------



## JamesF

9Left said:


> Quite a few people from my hospital are working from home… The hospital just sends them through a quick tutorial For using a program on how to encrypt before they send or receive....No privacy violations


My wife was just explaining that to me. Thanks.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

TRIPLE-J said:


> SP sorry to hear you are in there...get well soon... hope you have your phone charger with you...
> soooooooooooo still think this is just a bunch of hype??????


I do to an extent like I did before but that doesn’t matter. Too many people are still dying from the flu and this virus. So it really doesn’t matter what I think. I’m just putting this out there as a lot of frustration and questions are out there thinking it might help someone.


----------



## fastwater

Here is the very reason it is impossible for our Governor to ask people to do common sense things such as social distancing and expect them to do it.
This sickening pic was taken earlier today (3/26/2020), downtown Cols., Ohio. Basketball courts right across from Children's Hosp.:








When Governor is forced to 'order' places closed instead of asking because people won't social distance when ask, people gripe. Because of selfish, 'everything's about me', sickening attitudes of the people in this pic. it's very possible that before all this is over that Marshall Law will be ordered.
When it does, before we throw knives at the Gov., maybe we ought to reflect back on this pic and throw the knives at the ones who have helped cause it.
The people in this pic are examples of the very people that will make Cols.,Ohio...and city's just like it the next corona hotspots. They are the ones that will rampantly spread this virus, possibly end up taking up extremely valuable hospital space and ventilators from those that have done their best to keep from getting the virus...and worse...will increase the risk giving the virus to some poor hospital employee that has to help their dumb ass.
Beyond sickening...


I did not take this pic. It was sent to me. CPD was called and pic sent to them as well right when it was taken. Person calling was told that that was a park and that parks were open and there was nothing they can do about it.
Pic will be sent to Mayor Ginther as well as Gov. Dewine in the A.M.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Ok guess what I was just told!


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER




----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Anyone want this for good luck?


----------



## JamesF

That is sickening! Looks like the thinning the herd mentality is going to pay out in spades!


----------



## JamesF

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Anyone want this for good luck?
> View attachment 348625


Great news! Whatever you had, I hope you never get it again.


----------



## fastwater

That's GREAT SP!
Very glad you are headed home.
Continued prayer...


----------



## dcool

Seen that the U.S. has more cases than any other nation in the world. Thats scary!


----------



## bobk

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Ok guess what I was just told!


----------



## firemanmike2127

Good to see that you've dodged the Covid-19 threat SP. I certain my hope that everyone here on OGF, their families, & friends all stay safe & healthy during this current situation. There was another member on here that got sick about 10 days ago. It's a long thread but I think it was Allbraid (?). Please correct me if I've not remembered the right person. Anybody heard how he's doing ? Mike


----------



## icebucketjohn

Friday morning 3/27:
World: 500k Cases
World: 20k Deaths

U.S. 83k Cases
U.S. 1200 Deaths

Ohio: 867 Cases
Ohio :15 Deaths

Ohio could peak at 6k-8k new cases per day
40%-60% of Ohioans expected to contract the virus

U.S. is now the most infected nation...more than China
Mexico wants Americans crossing the border tasted
China closes all borders to foreigners


----------



## cheezemm2

Please stay home. Please keep your six feet. Please stay safe. We're going to all need to rise above all the division in the coming weeks.


----------



## TRIPLE-J

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> View attachment 348623


awesome take it since shes standing there with no ppe on and giving you a thumbs up you are good to go...
glad you dont have it SP


----------



## MIGHTY

Glad to hear it strong!


----------



## BuckeyeFishinNut

What I found most disturbing yesterday was the amount of old folks out at Walmart. I ran in real quick to pick up some nightcrawlers and almost every person I saw was 70+. These are the most at risk people and they are not even staying home. Didn't see a single one that would have something in their cart that I would consider "essential" either, just a bunch of odds and ends. Knowing how this seems to effect the elderly, don't know if I would risk it for a quart of oil and a camo t-shirt.


----------



## jrose

icebucketjohn said:


> Friday morning 3/27:
> World: 500k Cases
> World: 20k Deaths
> 
> U.S. 83k Cases
> U.S. 1200 Deaths
> 
> Ohio: 867 Cases
> Ohio :15 Deaths
> 
> Ohio could peak at 6k-8k new cases per day
> 40%-60% of Ohioans expected to contract the virus
> 
> U.S. is now the most infected nation...more than China
> Mexico wants Americans crossing the border tasted
> China closes all borders to foreigners


The world has 500k cases and according to your numbers we, here in Ohio, will have 5 to 6 million cases? doubt it!


----------



## ICENUT

Risk your life for nite crawlers???????


----------



## KaGee

ICENUT said:


> Risk your life for nite crawlers???????


AND question others at the same time. SMH


----------



## TomC

if a majority wont even get it or even die from it, I don't think he was risking his life for em. Some say nightcrawlers are essential others would say not. I got plent of shad in the freezer so I know I wont have to run out and get bait. The flu has a killed more than this virus has. Me and my wife are both on the front lines of this stuff. I can say im actually enjoying the fact that most people are not out. I can get to and from work in less than 15min, theres not much traffic, no ones at the lake. Work is slooooow, to say the least. When only 15 or so a day are getting arrested it makes for one boring day. 

On a side note we all got issued our first n95 mask and paper bag the other day. I just laughed and was like um... thanks I guess.


----------



## cheezemm2




----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Glad to be home finally. When the hospitalist which is a position I haven't heard before came in the room to tell me she ok’ed me going home said that please stay in because we haven’t seen the worst yet. Just a heads up.


----------



## ironman172

cheezemm2 said:


> Please stay home. Please keep your six feet. Please stay safe. We're going to all need to rise above all the division in the coming weeks.


I do my part either at home in the recliner or I will sneak to the cabin to work in the woods before the temps bring out to much that is in full swing, at least the starting stage (bugs/insects)....giving the new bar and chain a test drive ..... eating it up


----------



## Southernsaug

A couple decent looking logs there ironman. Do you have a way to drag them out, I'd had to drag them out to sell whole. My woods is still pretty wet, but we drug out some blow-down loggs and cut 7 high grade and veneer trees last fall. Paid for a new outbuilding for my boat to set in.


----------



## cheezemm2

That's a nice setup Ironman! If I had a cabin in the woods with internet, I would've bugged out a long time ago and worked out of it as far away from people as possible.


----------



## Hatchetman

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> View attachment 348547
> Yea the high risk is what you have to watch out for. Still no news on my test but the nice nurses told me nobody has tested positive that has been in this room as of yet. Room 16 by the way! I don’t know if it’s a good thing or not but I’m thinking positive and it definitely lifted spirits. On a side note people, every time someone comes in this room or any of these rooms, all the safety equipment goes into my trash can. That’s a lot of gowns, hats, Shields, masks, ect. My nurse also told me they are down to using the masks and coveralls from Ollie’s believe it or not and the quality isn’t as good obviously but kudos’ to them for stocking up In the area. Good luck all.



I will go along with Fastwater....I knew no virus could live on something that looks like that 
Just kiddin.....Hang in there SP, I'm pullin for ya....


----------



## Muddy

This stay at home order isn’t working. Everyone just calls themselves “essential”. Our business park still has lots of full parking lots everyday. Our company is running business as usual. Employees are getting sick.


----------



## EnonEye

trolled Krogers today got TP, tissues, paper towels, (no hand sanitizer), 0830 but no GPS coordinates here in Springfield 
p.s. welcome back S.P.


----------



## M R DUCKS

IS it the stay at home order that isn’t working?
OR the blatant disregard for the safety of others?


----------



## loves2fishinohio

cheezemm2 said:


> That's a nice setup Ironman! If I had a cabin in the woods with internet, I would've bugged out a long time ago and worked out of it as far away from people as possible.


Agreed.


----------



## ironman172

Southernsaug said:


> A couple decent looking logs there ironman. Do you have a way to drag them out, I'd had to drag them out to sell whole. My woods is still pretty wet, but we drug out some blow-down loggs and cut 7 high grade and veneer trees last fall. Paid for a new outbuilding for my boat to set in.


Sure don't (a real shame) just in splitting size pieces for future wood stove burning.... trying out the new bar and chain..... ate it up , best money I've spent recently.... got a few others that need taken care of


----------



## bobk

M R DUCKS said:


> IS it the stay at home order that isn’t working?
> OR the blatant disregard for the safety of others?


Yes. I’m getting more and more disappointed in people. Selfish, inconsiderate and reckless.


----------



## $diesel$

Dam, Brian. You can scare a hungry dog off a meat truck with that mug!.......LOL
Hang in there, my friend, i know everything is going to be alright for ya, bro.
You, much like me, are to hard headed to let anything take you out.

Stay sanitary, stay strong.


----------



## fishing pole

Just in!!!
You won't see this in the news.
Dr. Anthony Fauci, a key member of the White House Coronavirus Task Force, co-authored an article published Thursday in the New England Journal of Medicine predicting the fatality rate for the coronavirus will turn out to be like that of a "severe seasonal influenza."


----------



## jdl447

.


----------



## TomC

Well they say 6ft rule if your out wash your hands and sanitize things. So if you follow those and just basically stay away from people, why not go outside? I mean heck go to the lake just keep to yourself and stay away from others. Simple


----------



## hatteras1

ICENUT said:


> Risk your life for nite crawlers???????


They do the same for us!!


----------



## jrose

Muddy said:


> This stay at home order isn’t working. Everyone just calls themselves “essential”. Our business park still has lots of full parking lots everyday. Our company is running business as usual. Employees are getting sick.


No offense, but consider yourself lucky if your working. You will be one less strain on the economy. And on the”stay at home” order, it was simply to slow the spread of the virus, not to stop it. We needed the time to make sure we don’t overwhelm the hospitals, so the small percentage of people that need medical treatment can get it. As the virus runs its course, we can start easing back in to normal day to day operations. Some people will get sick, some will need medical attention, a very small few will succumb but a high percentage will be just fine. Wash your hands and if you think your getting sick, stay home.


----------



## Patricio

Some things to consider. Milan has a large Chinese population living there from Wuhan. Many of them returned from China after the Chinese New year celebrations. On top of this, Florence issued a Hug a Chinese person day on Feb. 1st. 
New York City has the largest chinese population outside Asia. Then this.
https://www.ohiogamefishing.com/att...7/?temp_hash=907c31c5550fa1342df7b9a2ffb5de5c


----------



## Shad Rap

hatteras1 said:


> They do the same for us!!


Night crawlers risk their lives for us?..I guess they do, you're right.


----------



## buckeyebowman

Patricio said:


> Some things to consider. Milan has a large Chinese population living there from Wuhan. Many of them returned from China after the Chinese New year celebrations. On top of this, Florence issued a Hug a Chinese person day on Feb. 1st.
> New York City has the largest chinese population outside Asia. Then this.
> https://www.ohiogamefishing.com/att...7/?temp_hash=907c31c5550fa1342df7b9a2ffb5de5c


What a bunch of dummies! They deserve whatever they get.


----------



## JamesF

bobk said:


> Yes. I’m getting more and more disappointed in people. Selfish, inconsiderate and reckless.


X 10!


----------



## 1basshunter




----------



## 1basshunter




----------



## BuckeyeFishinNut

KaGee said:


> AND question others at the same time. SMH


I absolutely will because aren't these the people we are supposed to be saving with the stay-at-home order? People want to complain about kids playing basketball or people fishing too close, they aren't the at-risk group, these people are. If they weren't out, they wouldn't contract it.

I am not even remotely close to the high risk group (40, excellent health, and extremely minimal contact with anyone) Were they essential, probably not. But If I was to get sick I would quarantine at home, not need to go to the hospital or get tested, not need an ICU bed, ventilator, etc. and put an increased strain on our medical centers. 

The whole point is the vast majority will get nothing but sick from this, recover at home, and go about their life. The elderly and those with health issues are at the highest risk to become ill to the point of need hospitalization and possibly dying. They have zero business being out other than for what is absolutely essential.

I am over all of this. I have stayed at home for 2 weeks, only going out to go fishing by myself or to run to the store quickly. I have watched my wife panic because she got laid off a week ago and seen the uncertainty and fear she has of when she will go back to work. If those most at risk can't follow the simplest of directions and help themselves, then what are we doing this for? Quite honestly, I would rather take my chances with the virus than what we have going on right now.


----------



## jrose

BuckeyeFishinNut said:


> I absolutely will because aren't these the people we are supposed to be saving with the stay-at-home order? People want to complain about kids playing basketball or people fishing too close, they aren't the at-risk group, these people are. If they weren't out, they wouldn't contract it.
> 
> I am not even remotely close to the high risk group (40, excellent health, and extremely minimal contact with anyone) Were they essential, probably not. But If I was to get sick I would quarantine at home, not need to go to the hospital or get tested, not need an ICU bed, ventilator, etc. and put an increased strain on our medical centers.
> 
> The whole point is the vast majority will get nothing but sick from this, recover at home, and go about their life. The elderly and those with health issues are at the highest risk to become ill to the point of need hospitalization and possibly dying. They have zero business being out other than for what is absolutely essential.
> 
> I am over all of this. I have stayed at home for 2 weeks, only going out to go fishing by myself or to run to the store quickly. I have watched my wife panic because she got laid off a week ago and seen the uncertainty and fear she has of when she will go back to work. If those most at risk can't follow the simplest of directions and help themselves, then what are we doing this for? Quite honestly, I would rather take my chances with the virus than what we have going on right now.


I would push like twice if it would let me!!!!!


----------



## Specwar

^^ So since I am 69 and in the endangered group I have no right to do anything other than hunker inside my home 24/7? 
I am healthier than most people half my age , work out 7 days a week, and am cognizant of the governor’s current order and my surroundings.
Please don’t categorize me.


----------



## Lewis

A point to the young healthy people who would probably survive this or show no symptoms at all.
You can still carry this to others as you go about your "essential" daily activities, and you just might kill someone's parents or grandparents in the process.
Sad that at this stage people need reminded of this.
Why turn your community into what NYC is experiencing? Don't be lulled into a false sense of security that this is only an old people disease. Many healthy 30 year olds have died too.


----------



## Saugeyefisher

Good news; I went to the grocery store yesterday. They had everything except tp,paper towels,antibacterial soap, and lysol wipes. 
And they was not crowded at all. I figured they would be since it was Friday after work. 
I could of gone to a second store down the road for tp an paper towels. But I still have enough for a couple weeks. 
If any of ya need some items from the grocery I'd suggest going in the next few days. I'm not sure but I think the stores will get another run of people at the first of the month for those who get paid monthly. 
I'm hitting the lake today/tonight hoping to find so e eyes an crappies. Then taking the kids tomarrow to ride bikes and fish with dad.


----------



## ovrecheck

Lewis said:


> A point to the young healthy people who would probably survive this or show no symptoms at all.
> You can still carry this to others as you go about your "essential" daily activities, but you might kill someone's parents or grandparents in the process. Sad that at this stage people need reminded of this. Why turn your community into what NYC is experiencing? Don't be lulled into a false sense of security that this is only an old people disease. Many healthy 30 year olds have died too.


----------



## ovrecheck

Government is paying me to stay home so i stay home. lost my sixty hour a week job last Friday


----------



## HeaVyMeTaLFiSHinGFiEnD




----------



## Misdirection

My brother bought me these for Xmas one year, I bet he's jealous now.









Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


----------



## ironman172

I felt guilty leaving the house and drive 62 miles to our cabin..... but by myself not around anyone , did get gas but used dog poop bag when holding the nozzle, both for me and the next guy..... eat in.... when not outside Watch movies since no tv or internet..... unless I walk to the bottom of the drive to use the neighbors(they offered the password) ..... should talk to the other I actually have a signal inside the cabin.....other wise I have to go on top the hill to get a signal both phone or internet

.
I probably have twice this many dvd's now


----------



## ICENUT

BuckeyeFishinNut said:


> I absolutely will because aren't these the people we are supposed to be saving with the stay-at-home order? People want to complain about kids playing basketball or people fishing too close, they aren't the at-risk group, these people are. If they weren't out, they wouldn't contract it.
> 
> I am not even remotely close to the high risk group (40, excellent health, and extremely minimal contact with anyone) Were they essential, probably not. But If I was to get sick I would quarantine at home, not need to go to the hospital or get tested, not need an ICU bed, ventilator, etc. and put an increased strain on our medical centers.
> 
> The whole point is the vast majority will get nothing but sick from this, recover at home, and go about their life. The elderly and those with health issues are at the highest risk to become ill to the point of need hospitalization and possibly dying. They have zero business being out other than for what is absolutely essential.
> 
> I am over all of this. I have stayed at home for 2 weeks, only going out to go fishing by myself or to run to the store quickly. I have watched my wife panic because she got laid off a week ago and seen the uncertainty and fear she has of when she will go back to work. If those most at risk can't follow the simplest of directions and help themselves, then what are we doing this for? Quite honestly, I would rather take my chances with the virus than what we have going on right now.


----------



## ICENUT

Might want to reconsider This virus affects all ages all,the rich the poor you name it.In new York reported yesterday 57% of the hospitalized patients (that's the ones that are really sick) are in the age group 19 to 49!.They may recover but some will suffer serious health after and if they do. Yes the older and sicker with issues will succumb but so will a lot of people in all age groups.


----------



## BuckeyeFishinNut

Specwar said:


> ^^ So since I am 69 and in the endangered group I have no right to do anything other than hunker inside my home 24/7?
> I am healthier than most people half my age , work out 7 days a week, and am cognizant of the governor’s current order and my surroundings.
> Please don’t categorize me.


I am not telling you to do anything. You have free will, do what you want. Some of the self-righteous keyboard doctors may tell you to hunker down 24/7, my post was just making a point. If we are all supposed to be hunkered down, why are some of the most vulnerable still out running around? We all know our own bodies, do what you think is best for you. Honestly, I could give a rats ass what most people are doing. Everyday, I do what I think is best for my family, to pay bills, to keep a stable household, to get through this thing. 

They say we are all in this together, we are not. For a lot of people, they aren't missing paychecks, they aren't worried about paying bills, or how long their workplace may be shut down. Life goes on as normal. Their biggest inconvenience is some items being sold out at the store or worrying about maybe getting sick. My wife and me have been together 12 years and have never been on unemployment or without a job. These fears are real and the uncertainty is worse. A combined $2400 from the feds doesn't even make a paycheck for either of us and the 50% pay from unemployment is going to make things really tight around here, for who knows how long. If people don't like how I look at things or my options, thats fine, just move along. When you're paying my bills and responsible for my duties, then to can tell me what to do.


----------



## jrose

Lewis said:


> A point to the young healthy people who would probably survive this or show no symptoms at all.
> You can still carry this to others as you go about your "essential" daily activities, and you just might kill someone's parents or grandparents in the process.
> Sad that at this stage people need reminded of this.
> Why turn your community into what NYC is experiencing? Don't be lulled into a false sense of security that this is only an old people disease. Many healthy 30 year olds have died too.


A 30 year old sickly person is probably in the same group/ category of “high risk” as the elderly with underlying health issues. Yes a very few heathy, younger people have succumbed to the virus. Life is not fair. It’s full of risk. Car wrecks, tornadoes, hurricanes. We still drive, live in Kansas and vacation at the beach. This will pass. Wash your hands and do what you think is necessary to stay healthy.


----------



## jamesbalog

Misdirection said:


> My brother bought me these for Xmas one year, I bet he's jealous now.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


I also have some of these stashed away!


----------



## loves2fishinohio

Saugeyefisher said:


> If any of ya need some items from the grocery I'd suggest going in the next few days. I'm not sure but I think the stores will get another run of people at the first of the month for those who get paid monthly.


This is what the guy at the meat counter at my local Kroger expects too.


----------



## loves2fishinohio

Wow, just wow. To all those spring break partiers that just didn't give a [email protected] about the rest of us.

https://twitter.com/TectonixGEO/sta...-map-coronavirus-potential-spread-from-travel

Pretty amazing software too.


----------



## Burkcarp1

Do we still have passenger planes flying?


----------



## Lil' Rob

Burkcarp1 said:


> Do we still have passenger planes flying?


I know of three of my co-workers who are scheduled to be on a plane come Monday, all leaving from different parts of the country. We support/fix infrastructure for Verizon and ATT systems. I have not been told to travel anywhere yet.


----------



## Shad Rap

Burkcarp1 said:


> Do we still have passenger planes flying?


Of course.


----------



## Burkcarp1

Shad Rap said:


> Of course.


So we can have people fly from New York City to wherever and that’s ok but we get yelled at for going fishing?Hmmm...OK


----------



## laguna21

My aunt and uncle are wintering down there, saying the governor is trying to quarantine them as they come in, I say good luck with that but he's trying. Referring to NY to Florida


----------



## fishing pole

jdl447 said:


> Link?


https://yournews.com/2020/03/27/1532786/dr-fauci-concedes-coronavirus-death-rate-like-very-bad-flu/


----------



## fishing pole

Howard Galganov
Going Back – Just To September 1939 – Virtually . . . The Entire World Was At War.

My Dad Signed-Up To Fight The Nazis in 1939. His Brothers – (My Uncles) Also Signed-Up To Fight The Nazis . . . And so Did MILLIONS UPON MILLIONS of Other Fathers, Uncles, Brothers, Cousins, Relatives, Friends, Neighbors & People no one who Went Overseas to Fight the Nazis Knew, or would ever Know.

MILLIONS of People from Every Walk of Life, Including Men, Women & Boys over the Age of 18-Years, left their Jobs, Schooling and Comfort to Face a Global Enemy, Because It Was The Right & Brave Thing To Do.

MILLIONS OF CITIZEN-SOLDIERS STORMED THE BEACHES:
I’m Going to Juxtapose the Lives of Millions of North Americans through the Eyes & Memory of my Father. When my Dad Stormed-Off the Landing-Craft at Sicily, Months before the D-Day Invasion . . . He had no Idea if he would even Reach the Shore before being Cut-Down by Enemy Gunfire, Drowned in the Ocean Waters Laden-Down by his Backpack, Rifle & Ammunition, only to be Shot on Shore . . . But He Did It Anyway.

BETWEEN CANADA & THE USA . . . 17-MILLION CITIZEN SOLDIERS SERVED:
Over 150,000 Allied Soldiers Stormed The Beaches At Normandy . . . Knowing they Might be Killed at Sea, before even Storming the Beaches. Hundreds of Thousands of Americans Along with their Allies Fought by Land, Sea & Air in the Asia/Pacific War Against Japan.

THEIR ONLY GOAL WAS VICTORY:
Here’s The Rub . . . None of Those Brave Men, Women & Youngsters who Went Overseas to Fight – Knew if they would Survive. My Dad was Wounded at Monte Casino. And while Fighting his way Through Italy towards the Netherlands, France, Belgium & Germany . . . He Suffered from Malaria – But He . . . Like Millions Of Other Citizen Soldiers Fighting Worldwide – Fought-On Nonetheless, Never Knowing when they Might be Killed, Wounded or Crippled For Life – But They Fought-On.

OURS IS NOT TO REASON WHY . . . OURS IS BUT TO DO & DIE:
TENS OF MILLIONS . . . Allied Soldiers Lost their Lives Fighting the Nazis. There were No Safe Spaces . . . and There Were No Conscientious Objectors on the Battlefield.

ON OCTOBER 25, 1854 – DURING THE CRIMEAN WAR . . .
A Blunder Of Orders Commanded Slightly More Than 600-British Cavalry Soldiers, Armed Only With Lances, Light Guns & Sabers . . . To Assault The Russian High Ground In Balaclava, Across An Expanse Of Open Fields, Where The High Ground Was Defended By Rows Of Russian Cannon.

Half A League, Half A League, Half A League Onward,

All In The Valley Of Death Rode The Six Hundred.

“Forward, The Light Brigade! Charge For The Guns!” He Said.

Into The Valley Of Death Rode The Six Hundred.

IT WAS A SLAUGHTER . . . The British Were Cut-Down from the Get-Go – But the Charge Never Relented, because it was their Duty to Fight a War, even though they Didn’t Understand the Tactics, and had No Idea that this Would be One of the Greatest Military Disasters of all Time.

But Even Though The Light Brigade Was Destroyed – Their Legend Will Never Die, Because Their “Victory” Was Sacrifice Through Ultimate Courage.

TAKE ALL THE PRECEDING AS A MESSAGE:
Americans, Canadians, Brits, Aussies & Other Assorted Allies have for Centuries Faced the most Implacable Foes During many Regional Wars, Two World Wars, Korea, Vietnam, Communism, Islamism & Whatever Else Faced-Us . . . We Never Shied Away From Doing What Must Be Done.

AND NOW IT’S TIME FOR ALL OF US TO SOLDIER-UP:
My Understanding is that Most North Americans “Could” get the Coronavirus. Of those Infected, Most will Hardly be Incapacitated. Many of us won’t even Know we have it. Some of us will get Pretty Sick. And Fewer than 2%, much of whom will be the Most Auto-Immune Compromised Amongst us Will Die.

No One Is Asking Us To Storm The Beaches . . . Or Charge The High Ground. We Don’t have to Swim for Shore Laden Down with Supplies, Duck Bullets, And Pray just to Live Another Day Thousands of Miles from Home.

So Let’s Do Our Best . . . to Take Care of the Most Vulnerable within our Societies (Canada and the USA), And Let The Rest Of Us Get Back To Work – NOW!

If We Let Our Industries Die . . . There Will Be No Salvation – We Will Have Crossed The Rubicon.

As Soon As My Quarantine Period Comes To An End . . . I will Do Whatever I Can to Get Into the Fight, No Matter how Important or how Trivial. As President Trump Says . . . “We’re At War”.

And I’ll Be Damned If I’m Going To Go Down Without A Fight.


----------



## threeten

Burkcarp1 said:


> So we can have people fly from New York City to wherever and that’s ok but we get yelled at for going fishing?Hmmm...OK


I get not overwhelming the health care facilities but I don’t want to spend my last healthy days on the earth coward down in my house scared of dying. I’ll do what I can to distance myself from others and respect their fears and beliefs, but we’re probably going to get exposed at some point(40-60% will) and if my destiny is to die from this so be it. I got called back to work next week because concrete is an essential business I guess so the rules are left to be interpreted to individual opinions. If I want to fish with the trusted people in my life I will do that. I might distance myself from this site for awhile too I guess.


----------



## Lewis

Paychecks can be replaced. Lives cannot. We are all in this together. We need to look out for our fellow American's health, not just our own. If everyone does not take precautions there very well could be many unknown, faceless victims that the careless are responsible for.


----------



## albionsteelheader

ironman172 said:


> I felt guilty leaving the house and drive 62 miles to our cabin..... but by myself not around anyone , did get gas but used dog poop bag when holding the nozzle, both for me and the next guy..... eat in.... when not outside Watch movies since no tv or internet..... unless I walk to the bottom of the drive to use the neighbors(they offered the password) ..... should talk to the other I actually have a signal inside the cabin.....other wise I have to go on top the hill to get a signal both phone or internet
> 
> .
> View attachment 348865
> 
> I probably have twice this many dvd's now
> View attachment 348889




My brother and his family did the same....went to our 16 year old remote, modest modified shed-to-cabin. (We have 6 deadbolts and locks on the doors, and black iron pipe about 5 inches apart in windows to deter vandals)

Guess we didn't plan for the pry bar and sledghammer approach, tho. Disgusted and disappointed, life goes on,














we guess....


----------



## LEfriend

Worth a read.... https://www.washingtonpost.com/nati...-partners-death-from-coronavirus/?arc404=true

One Indiana man's experience losing his partner. Wrenching story.


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## loweman165

albionsteelheader said:


> My brother and his family did the same....went to our 16 year old remote, modest modified shed-to-cabin. (We have 6 deadbolts and locks on the doors, and black iron pipe about 5 inches apart in windows to deter vandals)
> 
> Guess we didn't plan for the pry bar and sledghammer approach, tho. Disgusted and disappointed, life goes on,
> View attachment 348895
> View attachment 348897
> we guess....


I've seen this more than a few times. Its impossible to keep determined idiot thieves out. I feel for ya, disheartening.


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## threeten

Sorry for that brother!!SUCKS!!
What area?
Looks like they didn’t take everything. Used to be horrible in noble county. Know some guys that sold off their places because of it. I had a few small problems and loaded up with game cams then passed around some picks of the kids to the neighbors to get the word out. Luckily haven’t had any more issues


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## Lewis

A scared face from the frontlines in Michigan.
https://twitter.com/BamaStephen/status/1243304668446539779


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## M R DUCKS

It didntwork


----------



## Shad Rap

Burkcarp1 said:


> So we can have people fly from New York City to wherever and that’s ok but we get yelled at for going fishing?Hmmm...OK


Anyone coming from new york is supposed to quarantine for 14 days but yeah...I think...don't quote me on this though...lol.


----------



## M R DUCKS

https://twitter.com/RexChapman/status/124393567489560576

Try this ?!
If it works, quite appropriate for some on here!


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## Misdirection

My wife saw this one on FB and thought it was pretty funny.









Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## JamesF

So many mixed reports from every outlet. I am trying to make some sense of all of this. I went to get some things we needed. I see people just going to the stores for no real reason. There were several people just wandering about, like freakin zombies, and seeing many leaving with out buying anything. I was not enthusiastic about being in the same place with people who may be carrying the virus, whether sick or not. My wife told me that, these are the same people that, do this every day. So nothing out of the normal for them.


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## fishing pole

....This suggests that the overall clinical consequences of Covid-19 may ultimately be more akin to those of a severe seasonal influenza (which has a case fatality rate of approximately 0.1%) or a pandemic influenza (similar to those in 1957 and 1968) rather than a disease similar to SARS or MERS, which have had case fatality rates of 9 to 10% and 36%, respectively. (https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMe2002387)


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

fishing pole said:


> ....This suggests that the overall clinical consequences of Covid-19 may ultimately be more akin to those of a severe seasonal influenza (which has a case fatality rate of approximately 0.1%) or a pandemic influenza (similar to those in 1957 and 1968) rather than a disease similar to SARS or MERS, which have had case fatality rates of 9 to 10% and 36%, respectively. (https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMe2002387)


Not to mention all you see are how many have this virus and how many has died. News Networks aren’t showing survival numbers.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

H1N1 virus pandemic in the USA under a totally different “task force” in 2009..

From April 12, 2009 to April 10, 2010, CDC estimated there were 60.8 million cases (range: 43.3-89.3 million), 274,304 hospitalizations (range: 195,086-402,719), and 12,469 deaths in the US.

CV as of today. Total cases: 103,321 Total deaths: 1,668.

Let’s hope this virus runs its course soon or better yet, find a vaccine and doesn’t end up as bad as H1N1.


----------



## JamesF

My mother passed away from pneumonia, that was from complications of influenza. She did have a compromised immune system. The flu has claimed many lives over the years. Yet, we don't freak out like this. I had a flu shot earlier in the fall. But I think it only helps so much. Better safe than sorry.


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## ress

The 3 cases in Hancock county are all under 31 yrs old.

Sent from my LGLS990 using Tapatalk


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## fastwater

M R DUCKS said:


> https://twitter.com/RexChapman/status/124393567489560576
> 
> Try this ?!
> If it works, quite appropriate for some on here!


Sadly...as has even been expressed by some here...the only thing that will change attitudes of some is this whole thing hitting them very close to home.
Like with anything else, there are some people that just have to feel to learn....


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## loomis82

Not a bad idea!


----------



## Snakecharmer

M R DUCKS said:


> https://twitter.com/RexChapman/status/124393567489560576
> 
> Try this ?!
> If it works, quite appropriate for some on here!


Sad but the ones that need to hear that message don't think it applies to them.


----------



## ICENUT

I personally believe in 3 to 4 weeks some us on this forum will eat crow and then some on here will be very sad if loved ones are lost.I pray im wrong but it will get worse and I hope and pray treatments are found even if you get it and recover there may be serious health issues for many and that's not just for seniors all ages with exception of the very young


----------



## ironman172

albionsteelheader said:


> My brother and his family did the same....went to our 16 year old remote, modest modified shed-to-cabin. (We have 6 deadbolts and locks on the doors, and black iron pipe about 5 inches apart in windows to deter vandals)
> 
> Guess we didn't plan for the pry bar and sledghammer approach, tho. Disgusted and disappointed, life goes on,
> View attachment 348895
> View attachment 348897
> we guess....


That sure sucks, been lucky so far..... good neighbors helps, did have a scraper clean me out one July after bad storms rolled through and a lot of damage in the area..... my absent after got me


----------



## Snakecharmer

albionsteelheader said:


> My brother and his family did the same....went to our 16 year old remote, modest modified shed-to-cabin. (We have 6 deadbolts and locks on the doors, and black iron pipe about 5 inches apart in windows to deter vandals)
> 
> Guess we didn't plan for the pry bar and sledghammer approach, tho. Disgusted and disappointed, life goes on,
> View attachment 348895
> View attachment 348897
> we guess....


Did they get your TP? Thieves are the worst.


----------



## M R DUCKS

Strongpersuader..not sure if these are the numbers your looking for,
World wide
But, last update I see...accuracy who knows !?
Total confirmed cases 660064
Dead. 30641
Recovered 141464
New York City
Nearly 30000 cases
517 dead
Using memory...info, coming and going so fast...7000 hospitalized...700 ICU. Not sure of these last 2 numbers, the info is out there if you care to look.
Heck of a time to have a heart attack/stroke/etc. in NY city..huh?


----------



## fastwater

Lewis said:


> A scared face from the frontlines in Michigan.
> https://twitter.com/BamaStephen/status/1243304668446539779


I wish there was a way people here on OGF had to watch this vid before they ever posted on this...or any other covid19 threads on OGF.
With family working in Detroit area Hosp. and ER, I assure you this vid is straight up what is going on.
Sadly, I believe here in most parts of Ohio that this is only the calm before the storm for our hospitals well.


----------



## Specwar

Then there are those that don’t share your sentiments that it will get that bad, and some that realize it could, and some that just get sick and tired of all the Eeyore types that continue to preach nothing but doom and gloom. Characters are surely coming to light during this issue.
I will reserve my opinion for now.


----------



## buckeyebowman

BuckeyeFishinNut said:


> I absolutely will because aren't these the people we are supposed to be saving with the stay-at-home order? People want to complain about kids playing basketball or people fishing too close, they aren't the at-risk group, these people are. If they weren't out, they wouldn't contract it.
> 
> I am not even remotely close to the high risk group (40, excellent health, and extremely minimal contact with anyone) Were they essential, probably not. But If I was to get sick I would quarantine at home, not need to go to the hospital or get tested, not need an ICU bed, ventilator, etc. and put an increased strain on our medical centers.


You sound a lot like a guy here in my county. Low 40's, excellent health, non-smoker, etc. He got sick and wound up in the hospital. Pneumonia and raging fever. Positive for COVID-19. His Brother granted an interview to the local paper. The guy had been in the hospital for 3 days, and they couldn't break his fever!

I believe the guy is dead now.


----------



## yonderfishin

People are gonna do what people are gonna do , but anybody who resents being told they should stay home and not go anywhere have only themselves to blame if they go out and get sick or worse. Then they may also have brought it home to their families , and yes even pets since they now know it can spread to them. Even if you dont die from it , who wants to get sick....even a mild case ? Nobody is asking us to do anything all that difficult , just catch up on work around the house or something for a few weeks.


----------



## billy4prez

buckeyebowman said:


> You sound a lot like a guy here in my county. Low 40's, excellent health, non-smoker, etc. He got sick and wound up in the hospital. Pneumonia and raging fever. Positive for COVID-19. His Brother granted an interview to the local paper. The guy had been in the hospital for 3 days, and they couldn't break his fever!
> 
> I believe the guy is dead now.


----------



## billy4prez

Source please? And Thank you in advance


----------



## firemanmike2127

Those of us that work as health care professionals are taking this seriously. I don't live or work in a highly populated area but the risk of exposure is here. I have a great deal of regard for the hospital employees, lab technicians, first responders, nurses, doctors, & our government officials that are trying to arrest the growth spread of this virus. Patients that contract COVID-19 can get seriously ill w/o having any previous underlying medical issues. Mike http://www.sisna.org/blog-detail/stunning. From a NYC trauma surgeon.


----------



## Southernsaug

I deeply respect all of you who work on the front lines. Health care workers, medics, firemen, police and anyone else who is putting their own well being on the line. Tough times bring out the best in our society, but sadly it also brings out the worse too. Some are strong and just up their game and some just aren't prepared for what they find themselves dealing with, but they do it anyway. I tip my hat to you all. 
Speaking of the younger generation, I'll vent. I am high risk and staying on my own property unless it's for food or medicine. So today the neighbors decide to have an ATV party, I don't know how many people were over there, but a bunch and mostly kids. All day they rode there damn ATVs and dirt bikes with no mufflers all around my property (they know better than to ride on me). Not one ounce of consideration for anyone else. I'm sure if they thought they could they'd have rode right up to me and talked/breathed all over me. 
In the beginning I admit I thought it ws most likely overblown hype, but I'm reconsidering that opinion now. It's just I got so used to not believing the media


----------



## ovrecheck

Southernsaug said:


> I deeply respect all of you who work on the front lines. Health care workers, medics, firemen, police and anyone else who is putting their own well being on the line. Tough times bring out the best in our society, but sadly it also brings out the worse too. Some are strong and just up their game and some just aren't prepared for what they find themselves dealing with, but they do it anyway. I tip my hat to you all.
> Speaking of the younger generation, I'll vent. I am high risk and staying on my own property unless it's for food or medicine. So today the neighbors decide to have an ATV party, I don't know how many people were over there, but a bunch and mostly kids. All day they rode there damn ATVs and dirt bikes with no mufflers all around my property (they know better than to ride on me). Not one ounce of consideration for anyone else. I'm sure if they thought they could they'd have rode right up to me and talked/breathed all over me.
> In the beginning I admit I thought it ws most likely overblown hype, but I'm reconsidering that opinion now. It's just I got so used to not believing the media


----------



## cheezemm2

Exponential growth...


----------



## ovrecheck

last friday went to work and was told someone was tested. Job was shut down i dont know if i was infected or not. staying home just in case i may have it Called work no one picks up never bothered to tell me who it was or if my coworker tested positive. this is no joke


----------



## Flathead76

bobk said:


> Yes. I’m getting more and more disappointed in people. Selfish, inconsiderate and reckless.


People have no idea how bad this will get by May.


----------



## glacier_dropsy

Detroit Hospitals are about to be full in the next few days, some of the folks that can drive will go to Toledo Hospitals, and when they are full it will be be Fostoria, Defiance, Bowling Green.


----------



## ovrecheck

glacier_dropsy said:


> Detroit Hospitals are about to be full in the next few days, some of the folks that can drive will go to Toledo Hospitals, and when they are full it will be be Fostoria, Defiance, Bowling Green.


----------



## ovrecheck

good point getting close to my home town


----------



## jrose

Flathead76 said:


> People have no idea how bad this will get by May.


Exactly! Nobody knows.


----------



## Saugeyefisher

I'm in a hope for the best prepare for the worst mode. When I do get groceries I am buying 2 weeks worth at a time. Only get gas when needed ,carry sanatizing wipes an sanatizer on me. Keeping my distance from everyone. 
I'm working and fishing. But we have a 3 man crew. Ones working from home the other is doing our deliveries(critical only) and I'm running the warehouse bye myself with the doors locked an having truckers sign for me an leave my paper work. Wash my hands after all encounters and after touching most anything someone else might touch. 
Disinfecting everything that gets touched and all cooking/eating surfaces. I have enuff waxworms for a few trips. And will use the 1000's of artificial lures I have and not go buy any like i usually do. 
Stay away from other fishermen,witch i prefer anyways. 
Try to help out any way i can for anybody in a worst situation then mine. Hoping mine dont get worst. 
Sitting back reading both sides on here has been interesting. Everybody stay safe I'm gonna back out of this one an observe from here out. And keep doing what I've been doing hoping not to get or spread this virus...
Fyi the fish have been biting fairly well. Spring has snuck up on us in a hurry with everything else going on,get out and soak it in why its here! Good luck everyone.


----------



## glacier_dropsy

This is a global issue, anyone that thinks this is just a New York or Detroit or big city issue, does not understand the selfishness of viral spread. The only protection we have ever had from viruses is immunity. And here we got one that is novel to every immune system that sees it, can turn you into a virus shedding factory while you may never have symptoms, and is killing vulnerable people at an alarming rate. I know it sucks, but stay at home, it is our only weapon.


----------



## hailtothethief

My family left the food lines in poland for opportunity in the u.s. It boggles my mind people are willing to sacrafice the economy to fight a virus that will spread anyway. This is not short term. This is going to go on for ten or 20 years. Every one should be prepared for the harshest circumstances. Everyone needs to understand millions of people are going to be brutally killed by this virus. It’s not going to be gone tomorrow. Saving the economy kills millions more, shutting down the economy will leave hundreds of millions poorer. Job losses. Millions of bankruptcies. Governments going broke.

It doesnt mean you lose faith we come out on top in the end. We will, but right now and for the forseeable future we are fucked.


----------



## glacier_dropsy

I'm going to consider your advice, and cast it off. This country has been hit with worse, and found a way back.


----------



## glacier_dropsy

https://twitter.com/Dodgers/status/1243611262732210176


----------



## hailtothethief

Broken hearts kill more people than every virus’ death toll combined. Its the people who think the summer will come and everything will be normal that are not going to get through this.


----------



## ovrecheck

hailtothethief said:


> Broken hearts kill more people than every virus’ death toll combined. Its the people who think the summer will come and everything will be normal that are not going to get through this.


----------



## ovrecheck

Its sunny in L.A and warm in flordia still people are dying summer wont fix this one


----------



## Patricio

ovrecheck said:


> Its sunny in L.A and warm in flordia still people are dying summer wont fix this one


the major outbreaks have happened all along about the same latitudes. this virus is not heat resistant. stop spreading fake crap and trying to scare people. 

in other news, about 3 times as many people have died in car wrecks in the u.s. since the outbreak of the virus than the virus itself.


----------



## thedudeabides

I live in Northern Kentucky. I've been voluntarily quarantining myself since March 11. I've been watching this since the outbreak. Watching China's reaction was telling in the beginning. When they closed all travel in and out Wuhan that's when it made my hair stand up on the back of my neck. Wuhan is the size of Chicago. My wife is luckily still working. She's an essential animal care worker in a controlled environment. I was in a building with 2k people. We assessed the risk. Mine greater, i get sick, gets her sick, we're both out of work. I'm not even going back to my job. I'm being optimistic but this is going to be ugly for a long time until somebody can make clear, quick and concise decisions for this country. As of today March 29, the majority of people in this city don't believe, don't care what's going on. People still going about their daily lives like normal. I've been prepared mentally for something like this for a long time. I have many a hobbies. The majority of Americans are clueless unfortunately. I don't see eye to eye with those majority but i actually care for them and worry.
Thanking those in the front lines of this. Thanking those in the package/grocery/warehouse workers. They are in high risk environments. Would love to see a united front on this pandemic by our government leaders.. People are moving around way too much. We need to get out in front of this. Way far behind at this point.


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## Southernsaug

I'm going to share a thought that will probably get me some criticism, but it's entered my mind so I'll share. Maybe we have gotten too good at keeping people alive until their very last viable breath. In our not to far past our grandparents or at least great-grandparents died when they developed serious health issues. Today they keep people alive who are seriously compromised. These are also the people who are dying of covid -19 at the highest rate. The world just is getting so densely populated that a pandemic virus is introduced into a perfect environment to spread. When you find yourself in exceptional circumstances you have to react with extreme actions. So here is a question, Is there an acceptable death count? Are we setting ourselves up for disaster by keeping everyone alive at all cost and expense.
I am 65 with heart disease and Asthma, and I don't want to get covid-19. Yet if I do I do not want heroic methods used to keep me alive. I am alive in Christ Jesus, death in this life is only gain in the next. I think a lot of older people feel this way and think they have had a good life. That's why you see them out and about. If given a choice I would take the virus and die from it if my kids, who are young and have a long productive life ahead, could live without it. I am nearing the end of my journey here and if that end is nearer than I think then I only have one comment....hello Jesus, thank you for dying for me. He died for his children and if called to I will die for mine!
This does not mean I am ignoring social distancing, I am not. I have more respect for the community around me then to be a vector of doom.


----------



## BuckeyeFishinNut

ovrecheck said:


> Its sunny in L.A and warm in flordia still people are dying summer wont fix this one


Then why hasn't the outbreak in NYC been mirrored in LA, San Diego, Phoenix, Las Vegas, Houston, Dallas, etc? These are also very densely populated metropolitan areas. Lots of close contact, big office buildings, and large apartment complexes. Just like the flu, some still get it in the warmer months, its just not a prevalent.


----------



## thedudeabides

Southernsaug said:


> I'm going to share a thought that will probably get me some criticism, but it's entered my mind so I'll share. Maybe we have gotten too good at keeping people alive until their very last viable breath. In our not to far past our grandparents or at least great-grandparents died when they developed serious health issues. Today they keep people alive who are seriously compromised. These are also the people who are dying of covid -19 at the highest rate. The world just is getting so densely populated that a pandemic virus is introduced into a perfect environment to spread. When you find yourself in exceptional circumstances you have to react with extreme actions. So here is a question, Is there an acceptable death count? Are we setting ourselves up for disaster by keeping everyone alive at all cost and expense.
> I am 65 with heart disease and Asthma, and I don't want to get covid-19. Yet if I do I do not want heroic methods used to keep me alive. I am alive in Christ Jesus, death in this life is only gain in the next. I think a lot of older people feel this way and think they have had a good life. That's why you see them out and about. If given a choice I would take the virus and die from it if my kids, who are young and have a long productive life ahead, could live without it. I am nearing the end of my journey here and if that end is nearer than I think then I only have one comment....hello Jesus, thank you for dying for me. He died for his children and if called to I will die for mine!
> This does not mean I am ignoring social distancing, I am not. I have more respect for the community around me then to be a vector of doom.


I've heard the same from someone of that age. It's killing the young just as well. The older, just a little easier. Having that mentality can be damaging. The olderl think they don't care to die. Becoming more relaxed about it, possibly acquire the virus and spread it. A 90 year old woman lived thru COVID 19. Men are the highest fatality rate. Why? Being a tough guy.


----------



## Southernsaug

thedudeabides said:


> I've heard the same from someone of that age. It's killing the young just as well. The older, just a little easier. Having that mentality can be damaging. The olderl think they don't care to die. Becoming more relaxed about it, possibly acquire the virus and spread it. A 90 year old woman lived thru COVID 19. Men are the highest fatality rate. Why? Being a tough guy.


There was no part of my post that said is was ok to ignore the social distancing, in fact I said I was not ignoring out of concern for others. Those who are ignoring the preventative measures no matter what age are wrong....culpability has no age.


----------



## crappiedude

Southernsaug said:


> So here is a question, Is there an acceptable death count? Are we setting ourselves up for disaster by keeping everyone alive at all cost and expense.


Some of you guys may be ready to check out but not me. I just put a new trolling motor on my boat and I plan on getting plenty of use out of it over the next 20 years or so.


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## KaGee

No press conference today unless serious breaking news.


----------



## 1more

Turn on the Discovery channel now!


----------



## fishing pole

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Not to mention all you see are how many have this virus and how many has died. News Networks aren’t showing survival numbers.


It doesn't fit the narrative. Bad news sells. It seems people love to have a bit of misery.We (they) are a hysteria news network. Even the weather looks at worst case scenarios.


----------



## M R DUCKS

Guess what...press conference HAS been announced....
Has to do with FDA and Battelle’s mask sterilization work


----------



## BuckeyeFishin07

hailtothethief said:


> My family left the food lines in poland for opportunity in the u.s. It boggles my mind people are willing to sacrafice the economy to fight a virus that will spread anyway. This is not short term. This is going to go on for ten or 20 years. Every one should be prepared for the harshest circumstances. Everyone needs to understand millions of people are going to be brutally killed by this virus. It’s not going to be gone tomorrow. Saving the economy kills millions more, shutting down the economy will leave hundreds of millions poorer. Job losses. Millions of bankruptcies. Governments going broke.
> 
> It doesnt mean you lose faith we come out on top in the end. We will, but right now and for the forseeable future we are fucked.


Well if this is going to last ten to twenty years then I am going to the bedroom and putting the 9mm to my temple because this is no way to live!


----------



## hailtothethief

The world isn’t coming to an end, it is just slowing down. A slow down has domino effects. Bankruptcies lead to more bankruptcies. It will be an awakening for the snowflakes. People aren’t taking this serious yet.


----------



## Specwar

Just curious so we looked it up and in 2018 over 2,000,000 people died in the United States. 
Our and our children’s homes realize there is definitely a current crisis, and we will act with due diligence until the orders are lifted as should everyone.
Hell I was one that had the Hong Kong flu in 1968.


----------



## JamesF

yonderfishin said:


> People are gonna do what people are gonna do , but anybody who resents being told they should stay home and not go anywhere have only themselves to blame if they go out and get sick or worse. Then they may also have brought it home to their families , and yes even pets since they now know it can spread to them. Even if you dont die from it , who wants to get sick....even a mild case ? Nobody is asking us to do anything all that difficult , just catch up on work around the house or something for a few weeks.


I used to hear many guys at work complain about not having enough time to get things done around the house.


----------



## billy4prez

thedudeabides said:


> I've heard the same from someone of that age. It's killing the young just as well. The older, just a little easier. Having that mentality can be damaging. The olderl think they don't care to die. Becoming more relaxed about it, possibly acquire the virus and spread it. A 90 year old woman lived thru COVID 19. Men are the highest fatality rate. Why? Being a tough guy.


I think men are are more susceptible to dying because of cardiovascular disease. Men are more likely to have cardiovascular disease, therefore more likely to die from Covid19.


----------



## AmericanEagle

fishing pole said:


> https://yournews.com/2020/03/27/1532786/dr-fauci-concedes-coronavirus-death-rate-like-very-bad-flu/


U.S. virus deaths could reach 200,000, Fauci warns as medical supplies run short

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...s-millions-of-cases-fauci-warns-idUSKBN21G0ME


----------



## kycreek

crappiedude said:


> Some of you guys may be ready to check out but not me. I just put a new trolling motor on my boat and I plan on getting plenty of use out of it over the next 20 years or so.


Amen brother.


----------



## laguna21

Malone University ''virtual choir'' at the end of DeWine daily update today really cool, how'd they do that? Done beautifully!


----------



## Shad Rap

I didn't think there was an update today?...thought they were taking Sunday off...that's what they said yesterday.


----------



## killingtime

Southernsaug said:


> I'm going to share a thought that will probably get me some criticism, but it's entered my mind so I'll share. Maybe we have gotten too good at keeping people alive until their very last viable breath. In our not to far past our grandparents or at least great-grandparents died when they developed serious health issues. Today they keep people alive who are seriously compromised. These are also the people who are dying of covid -19 at the highest rate. The world just is getting so densely populated that a pandemic virus is introduced into a perfect environment to spread. When you find yourself in exceptional circumstances you have to react with extreme actions. So here is a question, Is there an acceptable death count? Are we setting ourselves up for disaster by keeping everyone alive at all cost and expense.
> I am 65 with heart disease and Asthma, and I don't want to get covid-19. Yet if I do I do not want heroic methods used to keep me alive. I am alive in Christ Jesus, death in this life is only gain in the next. I think a lot of older people feel this way and think they have had a good life. That's why you see them out and about. If given a choice I would take the virus and die from it if my kids, who are young and have a long productive life ahead, could live without it. I am nearing the end of my journey here and if that end is nearer than I think then I only have one comment....hello Jesus, thank you for dying for me. He died for his children and if called to I will die for mine!
> This does not mean I am ignoring social distancing, I am not. I have more respect for the community around me then to be a vector of doom.


One of the best posts in this thread. I am only 51 years old but feel the same way. I by no means want to leave this earth anytime soon but I have lived a good life and only because of our Lord and Savior. Me and my wife have raised our kids to be good Christians and live with Jesus in their hearts and things will be ok good or bad. Our responsibilities with this virus is mostly common sense so let’s all do our part and get through this.


----------



## fastwater

Country music singer Joe Diffie dead of covid-19
https://tasteofcountry.com/joe-diffie-dead-coronavirus/


----------



## DJA

SIL was headed south to North Carolina. She said it's No wonder there is so few cases in WVA cause the roads are empty! Evidently the Residents in WVA, listen to authorities, when they are told to stay home- they do what they're told


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Presser is on if anyone is interest.


----------



## fishing pole

AmericanEagle said:


> U.S. virus deaths could reach 200,000, Fauci warns as medical supplies run short
> 
> https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...s-millions-of-cases-fauci-warns-idUSKBN21G0ME


That's interesting. Here is a video from someone I know who lives in NYC. https://www.pscp.tv/w/1YpJkQqgRLoKj Do your own research people. Run the numbers, do the math.


----------



## Hatchetman

hailtothethief said:


> The world isn’t coming to an end, it is just slowing down. A slow down has domino effects. Bankruptcies lead to more bankruptcies. It will be an awakening for the snowflakes. People aren’t taking this serious yet.



It is wonderful to see all of your uplifting posts here on the virus issue. Do you have a dark cloud over your head or in your mind all the time or just on here? The virus is serious but it's not the end of civilization....


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## Stars-n-Stripers

Country music fans will know this name. 
https://variety.com/2020/music/news/joe-diffie-coronavirus-country-star-died-dead-1203548295/


----------



## Lewis

For those that don't take this serious.. flame away
Make no mistake. When loved ones are removed from your home by ambulance because the virus has hit them hard, you are not going to be able to follow them there, sit by their hospital bed and hold their hand. You are not going to be able to pop in at 7.00 pm for visiting hours. They are going to have no one other than exhausted and brave hospital staff to see them through days or weeks of barely breathing through a ventilator until they either die or recover. They are not going to be well enough to text you.

You are not going to be able to phone the ward to check in on them regularly (staff will be too busy for that). During that time, they will be completely alone, while you sit at home waiting to hear whether they have made it through.

Imagine that person is someone you love dearly. Because it's going to be a reality for many in the coming weeks.

And if that person in hospital happens to be you, going through that ordeal completely alone, it would be nothing less than terrifying.

Please stay home and only go out if absolutely necessary. Social distancing is imperative right now for your family and mine.


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## loves2fishinohio

Lewis said:


> For those that don't take this serious.. flame away
> Make no mistake. When loved ones are removed from your home by ambulance because the virus has hit them hard, you are not going to be able to follow them there, sit by their hospital bed and hold their hand. You are not going to be able to pop in at 7.00 pm for visiting hours. They are going to have no one other than exhausted and brave hospital staff to see them through days or weeks of barely breathing through a ventilator until they either die or recover. They are not going to be well enough to text you.


True words Lewis. So many Americans are simply dying alone in their isolation with nobody around them except overworked caregivers. Well said man.


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## Patricio

Hatchetman said:


> It is wonderful to see all of your uplifting posts here on the virus issue. Do you have a dark cloud over your head or in your mind all the time or just on here? The virus is serious but it's not the end of civilization....


He's a hack who has been spreading misinformation in an attempt to scare people.


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## asiu118

everyone needs to stay calm this will pass


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## fishing pole

Corona virus bill = 2,200,000,000.

If Every American were to get a cut of that, which is not true, only those who filed taxes get it, then we should each get 2,200,000,000 / 327,000,000 (population of USA) = $6723.71 

If we take the roughly 165,000,000 who will receive a check we should each get $13,333.33

Money for museums, a college...etc.


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## Lundy

Right or wrong, Doctors on task force, predicted today during press conference, that even with the mitigation directives from Washington extended now through April 30 that around 120,000 people will die in the US before this is over

I really hope they are wrong


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## Snakecharmer

fishing pole said:


> Corona virus bill = 2,200,000,000.
> 
> If Every American were to get a cut of that, which is not true, only those who filed taxes get it, then we should each get 2,200,000,000 / 327,000,000 (population of USA) = $6723.71
> 
> If we take the roughly 165,000,000 who will receive a check we should each get $13,333.33
> 
> Money for museums, a college...etc.


Math is a little off...using your numbers $6.73


----------



## One guy and a boat

fishing pole said:


> Corona virus bill = 2,200,000,000.
> 
> If Every American were to get a cut of that, which is not true, only those who filed taxes get it, then we should each get 2,200,000,000 / 327,000,000 (population of USA) = $6723.71
> 
> If we take the roughly 165,000,000 who will receive a check we should each get $13,333.33
> 
> Money for museums, a college...etc.


The bill was trillion not billion.

Sent from my Pixel 3a XL using Tapatalk


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## Lewis

This video is pretty empowering and full of common sense advice. A must watch.


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## buckeyebowman

billy4prez said:


> Source please? And Thank you in advance


As I wrote in my post, it was an article in the local paper. The Youngstown Vindicator.


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## fishing pole

Snakecharmer said:


> Math is a little off...using your numbers $6.73


yep I forgot three zeros when i was typing It still works out. off by $4


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## fishing pole

One guy and a boat said:


> The bill was trillion not billion.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3a XL using Tapatalk


Thanks. Typing error.


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## 1basshunter




----------



## AmericanEagle

1more said:


> Turn on the Discovery channel now!


Thanks for the heads up 1more. I wasn't able to watch it this morning but tonight I watched Pandemic : COVID-19 on Discovery on demand. It is an interesting documentary.


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## Muddy

Lundy said:


> Right or wrong, Doctors on task force, predicted today during press conference, that even with the mitigation directives from Washington extended now through April 30 that around 120,000 people will die in the US before this is over
> 
> I really hope they are wrong


The algorithms that I’ve looked at that parallel our current numbers paint a grimmer picture than 120,000. I hope that they are wrong.


----------



## Big Chief

The more I read this thread the more I’m SMH! Many things in this world kill more people on a daily basis year in and year out. Has the world stopped because of the flu, heart disease, cancers.......nope


----------



## Southernsaug

Lewis is right about one thing, dying alone sucks. I feel like I can comment on this as I have been in that situation. I was in an accident out of state and critically injured, I crashed 10 minutes after I arrived in the ER and was life flighted to a trauma center. I was on my own and knew every moment I might be dying. The thoughts that were in my mind and foremost to me was I wish I could see my wife and girls. I was able to talk briefly with my wife on the phone before they put me on a helicopter and all she could do was sob and moan out I love you....I wouldn't wish it on anyone. Yet with that said, I will accept whatever comes my way. I think having faced it once we both know how we feel and it's ok. If you've never had the conversation about how you feel and saying goodbye will be then I recommend you do. Things you wish you would have said if you ever find yourself in this position should be said....why aren't you sharing with those you love.


----------



## fishingful

I have been off since March 13 (my birth day) I have had no contact with people other than my wife in 10 days. We have been at a few parks. Walking and not comeing into contact with anyone. Really missing takeout food. We just don't trust it. Taking precautions with the mail. Only geting it 2 times a week. Most is trash.

Wife did accept an Amazon package today and brought it in the house without thinking. Was ordered before we had all this stuff happen. Hopefully thats not my down fall. Got it out as fast as I could. Guy was wearing gloves.
She has not been out in 2 weeks. She knows that she does not or is able to make conscious decisions. She touches something then her face.

May have to make a store run in a week or so. Only have 78 beer's left lol.

Not sure what to believe but I don't want to be sick. We are in our 30's and 40's so we would probably be fine but don't want to take the chance.

Dewine and the rest of them are doing a bang up job for the state. I love Amy she is so down to earth. I liked how he said "screw it I am calling Trump" today. Interesting on the federal level. I am watching a day to day crap show.

It will be interesting to see what happens. I don't know, we will see. I am in Geauga County. First cases were up this way. I would rather have people coming at me with guns than trying to fight something I can not see.

There may be many things in this world that can kill us. But the stupid people that don't take precautions will be the losers. I actually have seen my family more now than before. We are using viedo calling and an app called houseparty.


----------



## homebrew

Big Chief said:


> The more I read this thread the more I’m SMH! Many things in this world kill more people on a daily basis year in and year out. Has the world stopped because of the flu, heart disease, cancers.......nope


What few seem to understand is that all the other health issues mentioned are still there. Flu season stresses our healthcare system's capacity as it is. Adding this pandemic on top of that overwhelms the system. There aren't enough hospital beds, supplies and personnel to handle the EXTRA volume. And if projections of 100,000 to 200,000 deaths are accurate this will far surpass deaths from the flu. This is not a hoax and armchair epidemiologists are potentially adding to the death toll by pretending it is.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


----------



## 1more

AmericanEagle said:


> Thanks for the heads up 1more. I wasn't able to watch it this morning but tonight I watched Pandemic : COVID-19 on Discovery on demand. It is an interesting documentary.


Carl, to tell you the truth it scared the sh—t out of me and I had to turn it off. Hope to see you after all this is over and have some of Janice homemade ice cream!


----------



## firemanmike2127

This is a longer article but I found it an interesting read. It sure made me think about high exposure settings & what should be adopted as routine daily precautions to help prevent the spread of this virus. Stay safe & healthy....had trouble getting a link to copy & paste from my not so smart phone this morning. The article I mentioned was in the Los Angeles Times. The title was: Airborne coronavirus suspected in choir deaths. It was on my Yahoo news feed this morning. Mike


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

Reading this thread and others I'm just glad we are not afraid of death in my house....not one bit. And so we will not spend our time worrying about any of this. We will continue to enjoy life every day while practicing as much common sense safety as possible.

I'd hate to go through life scared of dying.


----------



## dcool

Got out to the store at 6 a.m. this morning. Surprised that there were only 7 people in the whole store. Got everything we need including toilet paper, and should be good for at least a month. Now I am ready to hunker down and not leave the house for at least a month. Hopefully this will pass in the near future and we can all get on with our normal lives. Good luck to all.


----------



## BuckeyeFishinNut

Was listening to a podcast yesterday and they had a medical doctor on from Stanford University. He basically said the numbers are terribly skewed and that the number of deaths are the number of deaths, but he feels the percentage of deaths from COVID-19 will actually be lower than the percentage of deaths from the flu.

The reason for this is pure statistics. We get told about the people who die vs. total number of confirmed cases. There are plenty of cases where people are staying at home sick and not getting tested, have very mild symtoms or are asymptomatic. Until they start doing antibody testing to see who has developed an immunity to it, the true numbers of those infected won't be known, hence the number being grossly misrepresented on a percentage basis.


----------



## multi species angler

I'm sure people that have lost loved ones to this virus don't give a sh!t about the numbers being skewed. I know I don't. One person dead is one too many when it is someone you love.


----------



## loves2fishinohio

Lundy said:


> Right or wrong, Doctors on task force, predicted today during press conference, that even with the mitigation directives from Washington extended now through April 30 that around 120,000 people will die in the US before this is over
> 
> I really hope they are wrong


I hope Dr. Acton is wrong. She's saying this thing isn't going to peak until mid MAY. So far, the lady has been spot on. If she's right, the death toll will be much higher than 120K.

Either way, it's just too high. I'm glad that fishing starts to heat up in April, so I can get out and practice social distancing with a line in the water, and try to forget about all this for a few hours a day.


----------



## Saugeyefisher

Fish-N-Fool said:


> Reading this thread and others I'm just glad we are not afraid of death in my house....not one bit. And so we will not spend our time worrying about any of this. We will continue to enjoy life every day while practicing as much common sense safety as possible.
> 
> I'd hate to go through life scared of dying.


I'm not at all scared of dieing. I'm scared of leaving my young kids with out a father. 
It happened to me,at 13,my sister 10,an brother 21. It sucked,ya life goes on, but not in the same way it would if he was still around.


----------



## Southernsaug

I agree, test for antibodies. This may be more or just as important as testing infected. Those people can be released to work, volunteer and be the hands and feet of society. You can be tested as negative today and tomorrow be infected, that is why many places are only testing severely ill. By testing severely ill you know how to treat them in the hospital, or to quarantine. If test were unlimited then test everyone, but if not use them wisely. Test a person today and then release them to mingle and you may have just wasted a test. I imagine we'll soon see enough test being made to randomly test, but we're not there yet. I have done a lot of disease screening in my life with animals. We tested randomly sampled production lots just to find if disease was present in the given population. when diseased groups were found the whole population was isolated. It has been done effectively for years. The problem with people is free-will and cognoscente decision making choices. That is what creates a pandemic, choice to comply or not. I am not advocating subjugation of the population, I'm just saying this is what complicates control....people just will not chose to do the responsible thing, they prefer to have their own way, even at the cost of dying. It all started in a place called Eden.


----------



## Saugeyefisher

loves2fishinohio said:


> I hope Dr. Acton is wrong. She's saying this thing isn't going to peak until mid MAY. So far, the lady has been spot on. If she's right, the death toll will be much higher than 120K.
> 
> Either way, it's just too high. I'm glad that fishing starts to heat up in April, so I can get out and practice social distancing with a line in the water, and try to forget about all this for a few hours a day.


Its slowly heating up now! Get out there! It has been great medicine to help get you head off things.


----------



## texasrig

It's interesting how many people loose all rationale when the media hype it as much as they are. More people die each year from falls and bike accidents. If you weren't jacked up about it being flu season and people dying, kinda hard to understand why you would get all jacked up about this. Dead is dead. Oh well, we'll see where the dust settles after it's over.


----------



## Rooster

loves2fishinohio said:


> I hope Dr. Acton is wrong. She's saying this thing isn't going to peak until mid MAY. So far, the lady has been spot on. If she's right, the death toll will be much higher than 120K.


18 days ago she estimated that there were at least 100,000 cases in Ohio. Either she was wildly inaccurate, or Covid-19 is far less deadly and far less transmissible than the flu.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

I refuse to listen to Dr Acton Don't believe her numbers. Way more should a died in China if her numbers are right


----------



## loves2fishinohio

Rooster said:


> 18 days ago she estimated that there were at least 100,000 cases in Ohio. Either she was wildly inaccurate, or Covid-19 is far less deadly and far less transmissible than the flu.


What she estimated on March 12 was that 1% of the population of Ohio is carrying the virus, which is just over 100K people. The numbers we are reporting are people that have been tested, and we know they haven't tested the entire state, only a small fraction.


----------



## Rooster

loves2fishinohio said:


> What she estimated on March 12 was that 1% of the population of Ohio is carrying the virus, which is just over 100K people. The numbers we are reporting are people that have been tested, and we know they haven't tested the entire state, only a small fraction.


Okay, if she was accurate, then the 18 day mortality rate (with zero new transmission) for Covid-19 would be .03% (less than a third of the flu).


----------



## BuckeyeFishinNut

multi species angler said:


> I'm sure people that have lost loved ones to this virus don't give a sh!t about the numbers being skewed. I know I don't. One person dead is one too many when it is someone you love.


Just sharing some information from a very respected doctor. The numbers being skewed is important, because they are making it sound much deadlier than it actually is. Unless something has changed that I am unaware of, people die everyday, right or wrong, its the cycle of life. Unpredictable accidents, flu, cancer, heart disease, drug addiction, etc. My Aunt died in her early 50's because of early on-set Alzheimer's. Is that fair? No, but thats life. Do you not drive because you might get in a car accident and die? Spare me the one life is too many bit.


----------



## BuckeyeFishinNut

Saugeye Tom said:


> I refuse to listen to Dr Acton Don't believe her numbers. Way more should a died in China if her numbers are right


I have said the same thing. The modeling they are using is inaccurate because the statistics they are using aren't accurate. This is what my previous post about the Stanford doctor was getting at. Its like putting together a puzzle and only having half the pieces. 

Its actually pretty simple, make the projections really high and people will stay home out of fear. Its much easier to control people through fear than rational thought. Sadly, a number of people are unable, or unwilling, to think for themselves and need to be told what to do.


----------



## Legend killer

People with guns think they know more than educated doctors. Once again, you can't make this crap up.


----------



## polebender

Saugeye Tom said:


> I refuse to listen to Dr Acton Don't believe her numbers. Way more should a died in China if her numbers are right


I believe that it’s better to err on the side of caution than to drastically underestimate. Although her numbers are high I also believe that it will make Ohioans more aware and make better preparation and judgement to curtail the amount of cases. The only way we are going to know for sure is when this virus runs it’s course and is done. Hopefully her estimates are way off!


----------



## bobk

Legend killer said:


> People with guns think they know more than educated doctors. Once again, you can't make this crap up.


Your life must suck bad.


----------



## Burkcarp1

Legend killer said:


> People with guns think they know more than educated doctors. Once again, you can't make this crap up.


Yup, somehow these DRs know everything about this virus in one month....


----------



## Lewis

Saugeye Tom said:


> I refuse to listen to Dr Acton Don't believe her numbers. Way more should a died in China if her numbers are right


I trust Dr. Acton. No way do I trust the numbers coming out of China.


----------



## texasrig

What's going to happen the next pandemic, are people going to listen or treat it like the boy who called wolf. That's kinda of what's happening here, y2k, bird flu, all the other flus that didn't materialize. Things got jacked up because China didn't cooperate with the true numbers. Then there are those that can't let a good pandemic go to waste. They have to try and scare the crap out of everyone. Or is it real, with the numbers I'm seeing, not so much.


----------



## Saugeyefisher

I want to thank the mods on here again. They have really had there hands full on here lately. Thanks for moderating these posts and not just shutting them down. 
I dont come here for critical info. But do come here to read what is on the minds of others that share the same passions I do.
It has been very interesting.


----------



## Bluewalleye

Lewis said:


> I trust Dr. Acton. No way do I trust the numbers coming out of China.


This is a very common sense post. LOL at anyone who believes anything coming out of that hole in the wall country. They're still blaming the U.S. army for this virus.


----------



## fastwater

BuckeyeFishinNut said:


> I have said the same thing. The modeling they are using is inaccurate because the statistics they are using aren't accurate. This is what my previous post about the Stanford doctor was getting at. Its like putting together a puzzle and only having half the pieces.
> 
> Its actually pretty simple, make the projections really high and people will stay home out of fear. Its much easier to control people through fear than rational thought. Sadly, a number of people are unable, or unwilling, to think for themselves and need to be told what to do.


At this stage of the game, at the alarming rate at which people are filling hospitals, some hospitals already overwhelmed and more reaching that point on a daily basis, coupled with this virus has not begun to peak yet...don't think it takes 'projections', guesstimates,charts or even Doctors 'trying to instill fear' for a rational...sane person to realize the seriousness of what's going on.

Add in the multiplying frontline hospital personnel that have...and will continue to come down with the virus not being able to work...then we will have...

cases growing at an alarming daily rate...until peak

hospitals overwhelmed with not enough equipment/supplies...some at that point already and it's only going to get worse

not enough medical personnel to care for the daily increasing continual flow of patients.

Again, don't need anyone's %'s, charts, graphs ,fear mongering or crystal balls to see how all this is going. The ever increasing numbers admitted to the hospitals daily is enough for me.


----------



## Bluewalleye

Also fastwater add on the people who are still having heart attacks, strokes and getting diagnosed with other horrible things, that can't get the proper care they need with the hospitals getting over run with the virus people. That is why they wanted people to stay home and not come in contact with the virus. Cause it screws up the entire system for all who are sick. 
They sent the ship to NY city to help out with the people who don't have the virus. If I heard it right, they have over 4000 beds in that Navy ship hospital. That is amazingly huge. But needed


----------



## Saugeye Tom

Legend killer said:


> People with guns think they know more than educated doctors. Once again, you can't make this crap up.


YOU MAKE NO SENSE


----------



## MagicMarker

Saugeye Tom said:


> YOU MAKE NO SENSE


Someone who doesn’t have any sense usually doesn’t


----------



## loweman165

Lewis said:


> I trust Dr. Acton. No way do I trust the numbers coming out of China.


I dont trust anyone that says "UM" every third word. Doesn't come across very intelligent I don't care what degree she has. Just my opinion.


----------



## icebucketjohn

Predictions they're gonna be alot of shovel work in the next 90 days. Hope we don't lose any OGF'ers or their families.


----------



## miked913

Sure it's nothing more than the normal flu? It's totally normal to have more emergency calls than on 9/11, set up hospital tents in Central Park, send a hospital boat with thousands of beds, line up refrigerated semi trucks for morgues, yep nothing new that we haven't seen in any other year. Jack Asses!

Sent from my moto z3 using Tapatalk


----------



## Burkcarp1

fishing pole said:


> That's interesting. Here is a video from someone I know who lives in NYC. https://www.pscp.tv/w/1YpJkQqgRLoKj Do your own research people. Run the numbers, do the math.


Interesting video. Thanks


----------



## jrose

homebrew said:


> What few seem to understand is that all the other health issues mentioned are still there. Flu season stresses our healthcare system's capacity as it is. Adding this pandemic on top of that overwhelms the system. There aren't enough hospital beds, supplies and personnel to handle the EXTRA volume. And if projections of 100,000 to 200,000 deaths are accurate this will far surpass deaths from the flu. This is not a hoax and armchair epidemiologists are potentially adding to the death toll by pretending it is.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


We have 2,112 deaths in all 50 states, District of Columbia, Puerto Rico, Guam, Northern Marianas and Virgin Islands. Been going at this since January. Should peak soon. We have medical supplies at the ready and a better understanding on how to treat this (No cure, but some promising treatments) Please don't buy into the hype. Those numbers are worst case scenarios and over an extended time period ( if the virus cycles 2 or 3 times thru the population) This will pass. Wash your hands, don't play in the traffic and apply your sunblock liberally and often!


----------



## jrose

multi species angler said:


> I'm sure people that have lost loved ones to this virus don't give a sh!t about the numbers being skewed. I know I don't. One person dead is one too many when it is someone you love.


Sorry about your loss, but that could be said about the flu, cancer, car wrecks, plane crashes, abortion, suicide...... not everything is preventable.


----------



## Snakecharmer

texasrig said:


> What's going to happen the next pandemic, are people going to listen or treat it like the boy who called wolf. That's kinda of what's happening here, y2k, bird flu, all the other flus that didn't materialize. Things got jacked up because China didn't cooperate with the true numbers. Then there are those that can't let a good pandemic go to waste. They have to try and scare the crap out of everyone. Or is it real, with the numbers I'm seeing, not so much.


What numbers are you seeing that you don't think Covid -19 is real? Have you seen any of the Hospital Videos?


----------



## jrose

fastwater said:


> At this stage of the game, at the alarming rate at which people are filling hospitals, some hospitals already overwhelmed and more reaching that point on a daily basis, coupled with this virus has not begun to peak yet...don't think it takes 'projections', guesstimates,charts or even Doctors 'trying to instill fear' for a rational...sane person to realize the seriousness of what's going on.
> 
> Add in the multiplying frontline hospital personnel that have...and will continue to come down with the virus not being able to work...then we will have...
> 
> cases growing at an alarming daily rate...until peak
> 
> hospitals overwhelmed with not enough equipment/supplies...some at that point already and it's only going to get worse
> Is enough for you to do what? Self huddle in your house until it's safe to come out? If they tell you to do this for 6 more months, that be will adequate for you? Just asking.
> not enough medical personnel to care for the daily increasing continual flow of patients.
> 
> Again, don't need anyone's %'s, charts, graphs ,fear mongering or crystal balls to see how all this is going. The ever increasing numbers admitted to the hospitals daily is enough for me.


----------



## Snakecharmer

jrose said:


> We have 2,112 deaths in all 50 states, District of Columbia, Puerto Rico, Guam, Northern Marianas and Virgin Islands. Been going at this since January. Should peak soon. We have medical supplies at the ready and a better understanding on how to treat this (No cure, but some promising treatments) Please don't buy into the hype. Those numbers are worst case scenarios and over an extended time period ( if the virus cycles 2 or 3 times thru the population) This will pass. Wash your hands, don't play in the traffic and apply your sunblock liberally and often!


Deaths are at 2616. Growing at about 15% per day.


----------



## Legend killer

jrose said:


> We have 2,112 deaths in all 50 states, District of Columbia, Puerto Rico, Guam, Northern Marianas and Virgin Islands. Been going at this since January. Should peak soon. We have medical supplies at the ready and a better understanding on how to treat this (No cure, but some promising treatments) Please don't buy into the hype. Those numbers are worst case scenarios and over an extended time period ( if the virus cycles 2 or 3 times thru the population) This will pass. Wash your hands, don't play in the traffic and apply your sunblock liberally and often!


This is the reason we may have 100,000 deaths or more and the country shutdown.


----------



## jrose

Snakecharmer said:


> Deaths are at 2616. Growing at about 15% per day.


1000 people a day for three months straight (Just in the U.S) would have to die to get to 100,000, the minimum Guestimate so far.


----------



## Buster24

miked913 said:


> Sure it's nothing more than the normal flu? It's totally normal to have more emergency calls than on 9/11, set up hospital tents in Central Park, send a hospital boat
> 
> with thousands of beds, line up refrigerated semi trucks for morgues, yep nothing new that we haven't seen in any other year. Jack Asses!
> 
> Sent from my moto z3 using Tapatalk


stay classy!!!!


----------



## Rooster

A little perspective:

Covid-19 related deaths in US to date: 2,616

Average deaths in US per day (all causes): 7,500

Deaths (all causes) in the US in last 30 days (since first Covid-19 death) based on average: 225,000


----------



## dcool

After reading everything in this thread, all I can say to you all is it is going to get a lot worse before it gets any better. Stay safe, stay home, and take care of the ones you love.


----------



## fastwater

jrose said:


> We have 2,112 deaths in all 50 states, District of Columbia, Puerto Rico, Guam, Northern Marianas and Virgin Islands. *Been going at this since January. Should peak soon. We have medical supplies at the ready and a better understanding on how to treat this (No cure, but some promising treatments*) Please don't buy into the hype. Those numbers are worst case scenarios and over an extended time period ( if the virus cycles 2 or 3 times thru the population) This will pass. Wash your hands, don't play in the traffic and apply your sunblock liberally and often!


Lol!!!
Thank you for your expert, educated observation Dr jrose.
I'm sure you've made it using every ounce of your extensive medical knowledge.
You might want to start calling all hospitals letting them know...especially about having all needed medical at the ready.
Then, please call the POTUS and have him call back those un-needed floating hospitals he has deployed.

P.S. ...have you taken your temp lately? Somethings surely causing you to have a bad case of delirium!

...and to answer your question when you quoted my earlier post.
I will do what it takes to survive. And as always, Im smart enough to know I'm not an authority on everything so I'll listen to those more versed than I am in areas I'm not schooled in. Since I don't have Dr in front of my name...you get my point.
That's how I've lived to be as old as I am.


----------



## Hatchetman

Legend killer said:


> People with guns think they know more than educated doctors. Once again, you can't make this crap up.



Where the hell did that come from !!?? Very intelligent....NOT


----------



## jrose

fastwater said:


> Lol!!!
> Thank you for your expert, educated observation Dr jrose.
> I'm sure you've made it using every ounce of your extensive medical knowledge.
> You might want to start calling all hospitals letting them know...especially about having all needed medical at the ready.
> Then, please call the POTUS and have him call back those un-needed floating hospitals he has deployed.
> 
> P.S. ...have you taken your temp lately? Somethings surely causing you to have a bad case of delirium!


Once again, your hooked on the worst case scenario. Stay thirsty my friend!


----------



## fastwater

Hatchetman said:


> Where the hell did that come from !!?? Very intelligent....NOT


Was wondering the same.


----------



## BeerBatter

All of April now for a lot of people
People are gonna get stir crazy and go further in debt than before

Anyone who’s been in jail have saw people just can’t handle certain things but the CO’s and cages are there for em

This whole deal worldwide smells awful fishy to me

Govt control of people

Don’t know why 
No stats or evidence just a feeling
I’m sure will find out in the future

should have just stayed out of this comment crap but it’s ruining a business I’ve built over the last 17 years 

Can’t believe our awesome overpaid government wasn’t more prepared for something like this
DUH

A lot of us little people are prepared
Good luck all
Try and be positive
Hope I didn’t piss anybody off


----------



## texasrig

The real math doesn't lie. I understand your all concerned, why wouldn't you be with all the hype on tv and in the news. They're saying one thing and the numbers say something else. I'll watch the numbers, you can listen to the hype.


----------



## fastwater

jrose said:


> Once again, your hooked on the worst case scenario. Stay thirsty my friend!


Nope...just happen to have several people around me that actually work in the medical field and I watch as they work endless hours risking themselves and family tryin to keep many alive while there are some that the virus hasn't caught up with 'yet' on a personal level and don't know what they're talking about but keep bumping their gums as if they do.
Maybe you ought to spend a day with one of them and you'll have a better understanding of what you speak.
FWIW...again, at this point, we're past the graphs,charts and guess's. They don't mean a thing at this point and will mean less in the days to come.


----------



## jrose

fastwater said:


> Nope...just happen to have several people around me that actually work in the medical field and I watch as they work endless hours risking themselves and family tryin to keep many alive while there are some that the virus hasn't caught up with yet on a personal level and don't know what they're talking about but keep bumping their gums as if they do.
> Maybe you ought to spend a day with one of them and you'll have a better understanding of what you speak.
> FWIW...again, at this point, we're past the graphs,charts and guess's. They don't mean a thing at this point and will mean less in the days to come.


More power to them. The sick need help and the 98% of the rest will heal at home.


----------



## bobk

Hatchetman said:


> Where the hell did that come from !!?? Very intelligent....NOT


He just made the crap up.


----------



## Snakecharmer

jrose said:


> 1000 people a day for three months straight (Just in the U.S) would have to die to get to 100,000, the minimum Guestimate so far.


We'll be at 100,000 in 26 days at the present pace of 15%


----------



## jrose

Snakecharmer said:


> We'll be at 100,000 in 26 days at the present pace of 15%


On April 25, I guess we'll know.


----------



## Had a Bite

jrose said:


> We have 2,112 deaths in all 50 states, District of Columbia, Puerto Rico, Guam, Northern Marianas and Virgin Islands. Been going at this since January. Should peak soon. We have medical supplies at the ready and a better understanding on how to treat this (No cure, but some promising treatments) Please don't buy into the hype. Those numbers are worst case scenarios and over an extended time period ( if the virus cycles 2 or 3 times thru the population) This will pass. Wash your hands, don't play in the traffic and apply your sunblock liberally and often!



Please bring your "supplies at the ready" to my hospital and your wealth of knowledge. Love to have you on board to help with this and let you see what is really going on. Anyone who thinks this is not a big deal I would just love to give some of you a look inside of the hospitals dealing with it because it would certainly help pull your head out of the clouds.

FYI. You should hear all the nurses and Drs laughing at those of you calling this no worse than the flu. I don't mean to insult anyone because I'm no smarter than anyone else and certainly dont think I'm better than anyone else, but wow, ignorate people should keep their opinions to themselves and stop spreading their nonsense. 

Who knows, I've been wrong before. 

Thanks for letting me vent, I feel better now. Sorry for any hurt feelings. Stay safe out there!!


----------



## miked913

Had a Bite said:


> Please bring your "supplies at the ready" to my hospital and your wealth of knowledge. Love to have you on board to help with this and let you see what is really going on. Anyone who thinks this is not a big deal I would just love to give some of you a look inside of the hospitals dealing with it because it would certainly help pull your head out of the clouds.
> 
> FYI. You should hear all the nurses and Drs laughing at those of you calling this no worse than the flu. I don't mean to insult anyone because I'm no smarter than anyone else and certainly dont think I'm better than anyone else, but wow, ignorate people should keep their opinions to themselves and stop spreading their nonsense.
> 
> Who knows, I've been wrong before.
> 
> Thanks for letting me vent, I feel better now. Sorry for any hurt feelings. Stay safe out there!!


I applaud you for all you do and especially for using "clouds" instead of the word you should have! Good luck and good health to you and your family!

Sent from my moto z3 using Tapatalk


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## fastwater

Had a Bite...Thank You...and all working on the front lines of this.
Bless you...and stay safe.


----------



## Snakecharmer

miked913 said:


> I applaud you for all you do and especially for using "clouds" instead of the word you should have! Good luck and good health to you and your family!
> 
> Sent from my moto z3 using Tapatalk


I was thinking the sane thing.


----------



## AmericanEagle

Those curious about the data out of China may find this interesting.

WUHAN COVID-19 DEATH TOLL MAY BE IN TENS OF THOUSANDS, DATA ON CREMATIONS AND SHIPMENTS OF URNS SUGGEST

https://www.newsweek.com/wuhan-covi...ata-cremations-shipments-urns-suggest-1494914


----------



## One guy and a boat

I seen these articles over the weekend. There actual death total won't come out for a few years. 

Sent from my Pixel 3a XL using Tapatalk


----------



## fastwater

One guy and a boat said:


> I seen these articles over the weekend. There actual death total won't come out for a few years.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3a XL using Tapatalk


If it ever does.


----------



## Shad Rap

fastwater said:


> If it ever does.


The actual death toll will NEVER be known...it's impossible...Wuhan is telling Chinese officials they are full of shlt...at least it's not just us that think the numbers are fake...they have 3 billion people there...and we surpass them???..I'm not buying it...


----------



## jrose

Had a Bite said:


> Please bring your "supplies at the ready" to my hospital and your wealth of knowledge. Love to have you on board to help with this and let you see what is really going on. Anyone who thinks this is not a big deal I would just love to give some of you a look inside of the hospitals dealing with it because it would certainly help pull your head out of the clouds.
> 
> FYI. You should hear all the nurses and Drs laughing at those of you calling this no worse than the flu. I don't mean to insult anyone because I'm no smarter than anyone else and certainly dont think I'm better than anyone else, but wow, ignorate people should keep their opinions to themselves and stop spreading their nonsense.
> 
> Who knows, I've been wrong before.
> 
> Thanks for letting me vent, I feel better now. Sorry for any hurt feelings. Stay safe out there!!


No hurt feelings here. Nobody likes being sick. I have full confidence in our medical personal, maybe that’s why I’m not overly concerned with what’s going around. I’ll continue to practice hand washing and avoiding people, doing my part.


----------



## miked913

jrose said:


> No hurt feelings here. Nobody likes being sick. I have full confidence in our medical personal, maybe that’s why I’m not overly concerned with what’s going around. I’ll continue to practice hand washing and avoiding people, doing my part.


What about being a statistician and a general smart a$$? Little different when you have to open your eyes to what is actually happening to real people.

Sent from my moto z3 using Tapatalk


----------



## jrose

miked913 said:


> What about being a statistician and a general smart a$$? Little different when you have to open your eyes to what is actually happening to real people.
> 
> Sent from my moto z3 using Tapatalk


Sorry, didn’t know I was dealing with experts. My bad. Maybe we should just listen to you.


----------



## Shad Rap

As of now...30 new cases in China...2nd wave?..or just people getting it that hadn't gotten it yet would be my guess...


----------



## CoonDawg92

The Chinese government has given their own people and the rest of the world a tremendous screwing over and should be called on the carpet for it. Sucks that hurting their government would mostly end up hurting their people. In the end the people with support from free countries will have to bring the change.


----------



## fished-out

Saugeye Tom said:


> I refuse to listen to Dr Acton Don't believe her numbers. Way more should a died in China if her numbers are right


Way more did die. The Chinese govt is lying. Just read an article on this very topic. Most Chinese are cremated. The funeral homes in that area have ordered and are ordering thousands more urns than normal; most folks wait to handle/bury/honor the ashes until this time of year. Bottom line, alot more died than the govt there will admit. Remember, this is the same govt. that lied about both the virus and its impact from the onset. Why would you trust their numbers now?


----------



## jray

Why do some of you seem so personally offended by people who are choosing to see a better case scenario than you? Do you somehow feel that if they don’t wallow in sorrow with you things won’t get better? It would be different if they were engaged in dangerous behavior and some people are but most that you have attacked are taking the same precautions as you are. To this point their viewpoints are supported by the hard numbers and yours are only supported by guesses. Yes models are educated guesses, but you also have to understand that they are being used to scare the general public into halting their normal lives. Is that bad? Is it wrong? Do the ends justify the means? Maybe I don’t know time will tell. My wife’s hospital is basically empty with lots of nurses on call. Yes we are rural and I’m glad they have taken the precautions such as cancelling electives and such until this is over. If she doesn’t get a full paycheck again until this deal is over I’ll thank the Lord every day for it and I’m fine with being over cautious given the circumstances. Just don’t ask me to sit here and cry about the sky falling a month from now because a computer at Ohio state said it would. I’ve got my hard hat ready, and so should everyone but I don’t believe we will need it.


----------



## loomis82

Just read schools here in Michigan are going to be done for the year. I understand but man it's gonna be hard for some people especially if they have to work!


----------



## Saugeye Tom

fished-out said:


> Way more did die. The Chinese govt is lying. Just read an article on this very topic. Most Chinese are cremated. The funeral homes in that area have ordered and are ordering thousands more urns than normal; most folks wait to handle/bury/honor the ashes until this time of year. Bottom line, alot more died than the govt there will admit. Remember, this is the same govt. that lied about both the virus and its impact from the onset. Why would you trust their numbers now?


LOOK ALL, something is happening, the numbers are not right as of now and it WILL NOT BE AS BAD AS EVERYONE THINKS!!!


----------



## Saugeye Tom

WE HAVE DEALT WITH WORSE THAN THIS BEFORE


----------



## jrose

jray said:


> Why do some of you seem so personally offended by people who are choosing to see a better case scenario than you? Do you somehow feel that if they don’t wallow in sorrow with you things won’t get better? It would be different if they were engaged in dangerous behavior and some people are but most that you have attacked are taking the same precautions as you are. To this point their viewpoints are supported by the hard numbers and yours are only supported by guesses. Yes models are educated guesses, but you also have to understand that they are being used to scare the general public into halting their normal lives. Is that bad? Is it wrong? Do the ends justify the means? Maybe I don’t know time will tell. My wife’s hospital is basically empty with lots of nurses on call. Yes we are rural and I’m glad they have taken the precautions such as cancelling electives and such until this is over. If she doesn’t get a full paycheck again until this deal is over I’ll thank the Lord every day for it and I’m fine with being over cautious given the circumstances. Just don’t ask me to sit here and cry about the sky falling a month from now because a computer at Ohio state said it would. I’ve got my hard hat ready, and so should everyone but I don’t believe we will need it.


Very well said.


----------



## hailtothethief

The government just did a 2 trillion dollar stimulus bill. The virus is a small part of this disaster.


----------



## homebrew

The problem is you have no idea what you are talking about. Let me try to explain in terms you might understand...you are going to get dinner at Golden Corral and you see a tour bus unloading to go in just as you pull up. So you decide to go somewhere else to eat. But every restaurant you go to has a school bus unloading in front of you. Now imagine this is what is happening to hospitals and you might be able to figure it out. Downplaying this will cost lives. Your opinion is actually harmful. 


jray said:


> Why do some of you seem so personally offended by people who are choosing to see a better case scenario than you? Do you somehow feel that if they don’t wallow in sorrow with you things won’t get better? It would be different if they were engaged in dangerous behavior and some people are but most that you have attacked are taking the same precautions as you are. To this point their viewpoints are supported by the hard numbers and yours are only supported by guesses. Yes models are educated guesses, but you also have to understand that they are being used to scare the general public into halting their normal lives. Is that bad? Is it wrong? Do the ends justify the means? Maybe I don’t know time will tell. My wife’s hospital is basically empty with lots of nurses on call. Yes we are rural and I’m glad they have taken the precautions such as cancelling electives and such until this is over. If she doesn’t get a full paycheck again until this deal is over I’ll thank the Lord every day for it and I’m fine with being over cautious given the circumstances. Just don’t ask me to sit here and cry about the sky falling a month from now because a computer at Ohio state said it would. I’ve got my hard hat ready, and so should everyone but I don’t believe we will need it.


----------



## jrose

homebrew said:


> The problem is you have no idea what you are talking about. Let me try to explain in terms you might understand...you are going to get dinner at Golden Corral and you see a tour bus unloading to go in just as you pull up. So you decide to go somewhere else to eat. But every restaurant you go to has a school bus unloading in front of you. Now imagine this is what is happening to hospitals and you might be able to figure it out. Downplaying this will cost lives. Your opinion is actually harmful.


Why?


----------



## billy4prez

Snakecharmer said:


> What numbers are you seeing that you don't think Covid -19 is real? Have you seen any of the Hospital Videos?


Some hospital videos stay up, other hospital videos get taken down.


jrose said:


> Why?


Jrose, my sister is in the same boat. She is an NP and worried about getting laid off.


----------



## All Eyes

Everyone's personal opinion aside, 39 deaths in Ohio with only 1,933 total cases is crazy.


----------



## Redheads

We are going to have learn to live with this virus sooner or later, Its not just going to go away.


Although i do hope im wrong


----------



## jrose

montagc said:


> The death numbers will be rising behind the case numbers as well. even then 2% death rate is nothing to laugh at.
> 
> No one is wallowing in sorrow. We are trying to avoid just that, by ensuring we do what we can to keep this thing at bay. I’m always in a great mood until I read some of the ridiculous theories some deniers put on here.
> 
> Again on numbers, who is saying follow the numbers? If you look at them, the trends matched Italy for a while then our cases started increasing faster than theirs. So yeah, the numbers don’t lie.
> 
> Btw, just got confirmation, 10 days after testing positive, my friends coworker is still in icu. No change in condition. This is one reason why death numbers still remain low. Lots of care before you succumb.


Stay positive!


----------



## birdcrazy

All Eyes said:


> Everyone's personal opinion aside, 39 deaths in Ohio with only 1,933 total cases is crazy.


I changed my tune when I found out 3 people I no tested positive. I was not around them but heard first hand what it was like. All are recovering at home. And doing much better. The big tuff guy told me it kicked his butt and you don't want to get it.
On another note if I was a non-essential business that was shut down by the state, I would be smoken hot that the state allows thousands of people to go out and play STATE lottery everyday some twice a day!!
That many more people touching doors, counters, ect. But you better cut your hair at home.


----------



## jrose

montagc said:


> that’s what I said I was doing! Lol making the most of stay-at-home. Just ate a burger on homemade bun and two grilled chicken thighs. Had the last of the Christmas beer. Life is good!


Sounds delicious!!


----------



## Southernsaug

I was one of the skeptics at first, but I am willing to admit I was most likely wrong. The more I hear and see the more I am convinced this is a serious virus and the actions being taken are indeed necessary and proper. I think back to my career and I can see some parallels. I done my job day in day out and even built a national reputation for some of my work. I even was a co-investigator on an internationally published paper. Yet it was not unusual for someone to tell me I didn't know what I was doing or I wasn't doing what they wanted or thought should be done. Now these people usually had zero experience or education in the field. They just knew I was wrong. I done my job every day, every year for many years. I knew what I was talking about, but of course there was always new things to learn. So I ask, why are we questioning the people who have done this a lifetime and have done it every day and year. Why do we think they are suddenly idiots. Will they make mistakes, yes, but they are far better to make the decisions then the untrained layperson. I once had a young man who challenged my decisions every year. So one year I gave him a whole production lot to do as he pleased. Three weeks in his lot had completely failed and he had zero production, zilch. Suddenly the old fart in the office didn't seem so dumb. It's time to trust those who can possibly save some of us....life can change in a moment. Who do you want by your bedside when your gasping for breath, an opinionated fisherman or a well educated and experienced Doctor?


----------



## texasrig

Southernsaug said:


> I was one of the skeptics at first, but I am willing to admit I was most likely wrong. The more I hear and see the more I am convinced this is a serious virus and the actions being taken are indeed necessary and proper. I think back to my career and I can see some parallels. I done my job day in day out and even built a national reputation for some of my work. I even was a co-investigator on an internationally published paper. Yet it was not unusual for someone to tell me I didn't know what I was doing or I wasn't doing what they wanted or thought should be done. Now these people usually had zero experience or education in the field. They just knew I was wrong. I done my job every day, every year for many years. I knew what I was talking about, but of course there was always new things to learn. So I ask, why are we questioning the people who have done this a lifetime and have done it every day and year. Why do we think they are suddenly idiots. Will they make mistakes, yes, but they are far better to make the decisions then the untrained layperson. I once had a young man who challenged my decisions every year. So one year I gave him a whole production lot to do as he pleased. Three weeks in his lot had completely failed and he had zero production, zilch. Suddenly the old fart in the office didn't seem so dumb. It's time to trust those who can possibly save some of us....life can change in a moment. Who do you want by your bedside when your gasping for breath, an opinionated fisherman or a well educated and experienced Doctor?


I understand what you are saying, and most of us would gladly follow along. But here's the rub, on one hand you have what the experts are saying. Most of which on it's face sounds good, and is something most of us would like to follow. (Info on the virus, how its spread, how to keep from getting it, and so on.) On the other hand, there are the numbers. First off, since most people who get it show no symptoms of having it, and there is no across the board testing, its impossible to say how many actually have it. Without knowing how many have it, you can't make predictions about anything about it. The only thing you can say is that it's out there and some are going to get really sick from it and die. I'll buy that information. If you didn't get excited about flu season and people dying, your being hypocritical about people dying from this. Granted loved ones dying is never a good thing, especially if it's your loved one. But were looking at the big picture here. Last year approximately 60000 people died from the flu in the US. Right now we're at 2600 ish, we have a long ways to go to get it to the flu standard. 
You don't have to be a rocket scientist or Doctor to follow the numbers, just good with math. The problem is the numbers aren't matching up with the dire warnings we are getting. There are some of us who remember all the other things the experts have warned us about in the past that never happened. You know the list. 
We get why your scared and concerned, who wouldn't be with what we've been told day in and day out. Well there are a few of us who don't always jump when were told to. (More than a few is my guess, but they don't want the hassle of being bullied by the rest of you, so they don't speak up.) We aren't going to change your mind and your not going to change ours. The only thing that will change ours, is to have everything make sense and add up correctly. This doesn't mean we don't care, and that we want people to die, but quite to the contrary we want what's best for our communities. We just aren't convinced the sky is really falling, maybe it's just some low hanging fruit.


----------



## dcool

Saugeye Tom said:


> WE HAVE DEALT WITH WORSE THAN THIS BEFORE


I am 68 years old and in my lifetime I don't remember any of our hospitals being occupied beyond their capacity, putting tents up to handle more patients, or bringing in hospital ships in to handle more patients. so if we have dealt with worse than this, please fill me in, cause in my lifetime I have never seen anything like it.


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## crappiedude

texasrig said:


> The only thing that will change ours, is to have everything make sense and add up correctly. This doesn't mean we don't care, and that we want people to die, but quite to the contrary we want what's best for our communities. We just aren't convinced the sky is really falling


I get what you guys (the naysayers) are saying and honestly can't say I agree or disagree. For sure the numbers aren't aligning at this point with what we are being told but that's only at this point. Only after this is over is anyone ever going to know the true numbers of what happened but what won't be understood is how much those numbers got skewed downward because of all the actions that have been taken to separate the masses.
I'm hoping the numbers are way off...on the good side.


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## OptOutside440

#filmyourhospital


----------



## ditchdigger

I don’t trust what the government is telling us. How can we trust what they are saying when they say face masks aren’t effective for us but they are essential for the health care workers! Doesn’t make sense!


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## bobk

ditchdigger said:


> I don’t trust what the government is telling us. How can we trust what they are saying when they say face masks aren’t effective for us but they are essential for the health care workers! Doesn’t make sense!


Many have changed their opinion on face masks.


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## BuckeyeFishinNut

At this point a number of lessons are being learned.

First, China can not be trusted in any way, shape, or form. They have lied at almost every turn during this pandemic. Their numbers are complete B.S. and by lying to the rest of the world, it has made their data irrelevant. Free Asia Radio has reported that a single crematory in Wuhan has performed at least 40,000 cremations since the outbreak. This is so all the dead can be honored at a celebration that is coming up this week. The supplies they are sending to the EU to help fight the spread of Covid19 are garbage. Tests that don't work, masks that leak, PPE that don't work. A number of countries have sent their crap back to them and wont accept anymore. Almost feels like when the Europeans gave the Native Americans blankets infected with small pox. They was supposed to be a ban on exotic animal markets but they are still open, and in Wuhan no less! When this is done, I hope our country and others distance themselves from China and become more self-sufficent.

Second, you can't trust anything come out of any of the world organizations. They are so far in bed with China that they are hold them up as the model of what should be done. The model is actually the way Taiwan and a few other countries handled it but the WHO refuses to even acknowledge them because of China.

Lastly, I am really impressed with the response from the United States. What our military has been able to do with the Naval hospitals, the Army Corp. of Engineers building makeshift hospital in a matter of days, the distribution and logistics being done by Army and Air Force. Private companies like Abbott creating a rapid response test, Battelle creating a way to sterilize PPE, and many other companies converting their manufacturing to make masks, ventilators, face shields, gowns, etc. Some of these places made pillows, mattresses, sporting apparel, etc. but they have thrown their capabilities behind this battle. Hell, Yum brand even started making hand sanitizer instead of bait scent. Only in the United States could this undertaking take place and in such a short period of time. This is why we live in the greatest country in the world, regardless of what the mainstream media wants to tell you.


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## 1more

Well said!


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## Burkcarp1




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## Saugeyefisher

BuckeyeFishinNut said:


> At this point a number of lessons are being learned.
> 
> First, China can not be trusted in any way, shape, or form. They have lied at almost every turn during this pandemic. Their numbers are complete B.S. and by lying to the rest of the world, it has made their data irrelevant. Free Asia Radio has reported that a single crematory in Wuhan has performed at least 40,000 cremations since the outbreak. This is so all the dead can be honored at a celebration that is coming up this week. The supplies they are sending to the EU to help fight the spread of Covid19 are garbage. Tests that don't work, masks that leak, PPE that don't work. A number of countries have sent their crap back to them and wont accept anymore. Almost feels like when the Europeans gave the Native Americans blankets infected with small pox. They was supposed to be a ban on exotic animal markets but they are still open, and in Wuhan no less! When this is done, I hope our country and others distance themselves from China and become more self-sufficent.
> 
> Second, you can't trust anything come out of any of the world organizations. They are so far in bed with China that they are hold them up as the model of what should be done. The model is actually the way Taiwan and a few other countries handled it but the WHO refuses to even acknowledge them because of China.
> 
> Lastly, I am really impressed with the response from the United States. What our military has been able to do with the Naval hospitals, the Army Corp. of Engineers building makeshift hospital in a matter of days, the distribution and logistics being done by Army and Air Force. Private companies like Abbott creating a rapid response test, Battelle creating a way to sterilize PPE, and many other companies converting their manufacturing to make masks, ventilators, face shields, gowns, etc. Some of these places made pillows, mattresses, sporting apparel, etc. but they have thrown their capabilities behind this battle. Hell, Yum brand even started making hand sanitizer instead of bait scent. Only in the United States could this undertaking take place and in such a short period of time. This is why we live in the greatest country in the world, regardless of what the mainstream media wants to tell you.


Thankyou for pointing out the positives there in the end. NOBODY is saying ANYTHING about the positives on here. Most of it is both the guy that doesnt agree with you. It's getting rediculous.


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## STRONGPERSUADER

Burkcarp1 said:


> View attachment 349235


The media uses this tactic quite often in any scenario.


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## Southernsaug

Sometimes the experts are right and sometimes they are wrong, a year from now we will have a good idea who was right. I hope all of us survive to banter then. All in all debate is good as it helps maintain balance, but there are times everyone needs to join the charge. 

I truly believe we need to do our best at following social distancing. I have been reluctant to reveal my past career, but I feel I should because I can relate a scenario that may help with understanding and maybe save a life. I retired from the Ohio Division of Wildlife as a Fish Hatchery Manager. 

I raised fish in intensive culture, which mean tanks and raceways at high densities. Disease management was a crucial part of this type of culture. Fish were more likely to get ill as they became more crowded in the tanks. The primary focus of culture was to maintain as good an environment as possible and plenty of food. Disease was inevitable, and needed to be monitored daily. If you found a few parasites, you didn't worry because they were common and could be easily controlled. You may lose a few fish to them, but it wouldn't wreck your whole production. Now if you found a disease like columnaris (Flexibacter Columnaris -https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columnaris) you knew you better act fast and strong. Here's how it would play out unchecked. 

Day 1- You see 25 dead fish and some weak ones swimming around with open lesions
Day 2- You find 150 dead and more weak infected fish
Day 3- You find 1000 dead
Day 4 - you can't even count the dead, and it looks like most of your fish are sick and none will eat
Day 5- You still can't count the dead and they die faster than you can clean them out
Day6 - The death count falls dramatically, simply because you don't have many fish left
Day 7- 20% of your fish are left alive and none look good. 
You finish your season with may 5-10% of your lot to stock. 
Here is the proper approach:
Day one you see the outbreak. You immediately put your fish on a drug therapy and remobve all sick looking fish. You may even add air or more flow. 
Day two- You should see the dead count stay about the same maybe up a little. You treat again
Day three- death counts drop , you treat again and you move half your fish into another unit to separate them (social distance). You may treat again
Day four - everything is close to normal and your fish are feeding
Day five - Your chugging along again and everything is going smooth

Had I and every other manager had not learned how to respond I promise you all you would have a hell of a lot less fish to catch. So don't get caught up in the numbers so much, these experts understand the numbers and their wild predictions come from experience, by the time they make sense you may be dead. Social distancing is what we need to do until we can treat. If I had sick fish with no known treatment I would have taken them to large ponds from troughs so they would have the greatest distance apart. Then they would only mildly be exposed and most would develop resistance. You crowd species up you increase the disease loading. 

Sorry for the long post


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## DQnit

Thought I would share some positivity in light of this pandemic. I have coworker who’s step dad went into the hospital 2 weeks ago diagnosed with Coronavirus, he was given 2 days, TWO DAYS, to live. He was put on a ventilator and put into an induced coma to allow the ventilator and medication to do their jobs. Three days ago he was given an experimental drug to combat the virus. Today he is off the ventilator, awake, and in stable condition. There is hope folks!! We still live in the best country on God’s green earth, and with his help we’ll figure this out and get threw this.


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## Lewis

I understand why some might be skeptical.The sky is not falling in Ohio yet. The numbers aren't too scary as of right now and lets hope they never get that way.
However the sky is really falling in New York, New Jersey and other areas around the country. Those are the numbers to look at and very well could be our future if we don't take this seriously.


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## PatSea

DQnit said:


> Thought I would share some positivity in light of this pandemic. I have coworker who’s step dad went into the hospital 2 weeks ago diagnosed with Coronavirus, he was given 2 days, TWO DAYS, to live. He was put on a ventilator and put into an induced coma to allow the ventilator and medication to do their jobs. Three days ago he was given an experimental drug to combat the virus. Today he is off the ventilator, awake, and in stable condition. There is hope folks!! We still live in the best country on God’s green earth, and with his help we’ll figure this out and get threw this.


DQnit, thank you for the uplifting real life story. We need more of that!


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## jray

It kind of appears this debate has run its course, I think we can agree to disagree and all hope for the best. We should all be doing everything we can to shut this bug down and I think most of us are. I’ll share a positive too, my company is doing a lot of really amazing things for people right now. We had a small 3 month lay off but they are still getting payed insurance and the company is continuing to give a pay check until unemployment kicks in. They also chose by seniority (which is basically by lowest salary) and all that put together means those people shouldn’t even really see much of a pay cut. A lot of companies are doing this and I have a friend that is on paid leave right now even though they don’t even normally have paid vacation time. It’s great to see companies helping people when times are tough.


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## loves2fishinohio

At the end of all of this, I hope we can say we did too much rather than we didn't do enough to prevent deaths. 

The GF was laid off when retail shut down. I've been working from home for the past 3+ weeks. I have to say it has been nice - we both were so busy and kept different hours so we only had about a day together per week. Having dinners every night, walking the dogs, watching movies in the evenings, it's been nice. We are trying to make the most out of a difficult time. 

Shut off the news on the TV. Binge watch on Netflix. Look outside and see that there is no mushroom shaped cloud in the sky. We will see this through. It will get harder before it gets better, but we will see this through.


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## Rooster

In Ohio, the ratio of Covid-19 deaths to unemployed exceeds 1:10000.

I’m not going to trivialize a single death, but 10,000 people that are being deprived of their ability to provide for their family should not be trivialized either. They may not be in the hospital, but they are very much struggling to survive. The Covid-19 numbers are reported daily, but the unemployment numbers are no longer being reported.

Covid-19 is a serious threat (Yes, more serious than the Flu for the at-risk groups), and I personally continue to take great precautions to protect my family. However, I don’t see the actions taken by the Ohio health officials as being proportional to the threat. The workplace closures are unreasonable and arbitrary. Millions have made the ultimate sacrifice to secure our freedom, and I don’t see the current threat justifying the suspension of our civil liberties.


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## Saugeyefisher

jray said:


> It kind of appears this debate has run its course, I think we can agree to disagree and all hope for the best. We should all be doing everything we can to shut this bug down and I think most of us are. I’ll share a positive too, my company is doing a lot of really amazing things for people right now. We had a small 3 month lay off but they are still getting payed insurance and the company is continuing to give a pay check until unemployment kicks in. They also chose by seniority (which is basically by lowest salary) and all that put together means those people shouldn’t even really see much of a pay cut. A lot of companies are doing this and I have a friend that is on paid leave right now even though they don’t even normally have paid vacation time. It’s great to see companies helping people when times are tough.


Ya we got one guy at home on call mon and tuesday,getting paid for it to. The boss is supposed to be working from home but she keeps popping in,an isnt needed. It's starting to tick me off a bit. But she thinks shes helping... 
She can do everything she is doing here from home. Oh well. Just gonna keep my distance an let her know she doesnt need to be here. We could of layed off the other guy,but tring to keep him from missing out on his full 40 hrs a week


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## jray

Saugeyefisher said:


> Ya we got one guy at home on call mon and tuesday,getting paid for it to. The boss is supposed to be working from home but she keeps popping in,an isnt needed. It's starting to tick me off a bit. But she thinks shes helping...
> She can do everything she is doing here from home. Oh well. Just gonna keep my distance an let her know she doesnt need to be here. We could of layed off the other guy,but tring to keep him from missing out on his full 40 hrs a week


Same here our owner is over 70 and he keeps showing up I guess to show solidarity or instill confidence that everything will be ok. I wish he would crawl into a bunker and keep signing checks. Lol


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## AmericanEagle

I read an interview with Bravo TV personality Andy Cohen who has had coronavirus and whose doctor told him to use a fingertip pulse oximeter. These are inexpensive devices that indicate heart rate and oxygen levels in the blood.. I had a quadruple bypass last summer and after attending cardiac rehab purchased an elliptical machine and a pulse oximeter to use at home. I record my heart rate before and after workouts but going forward will also record my oxygen level.

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment...oms-get-tylenol-pulse-oximeter-183239742.html


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## cheezemm2

The front line is healthcare and other service workers. 

https://www.nbc4i.com/community/health/coronavirus/osu-wexner-employee-dies-due-to-coronavirus/


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## cheezemm2




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## Saugeye Tom

On the lighter side


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

montagc said:


> Certain posters use the tactic of posting out of context info quite often too.
> 
> The numbers don't lie. Our confirmed cases are rising just as fast as Italy's did. If you really believed the numbers, then you'd realize that this is indeed as bad as the experts say.


This wasn’t directed at you. Besides, any numbers that I posted in this thread came from solid sources, CDC, WHO, or the numbers we see posted all over our TV’s. I’m practicing everything the state expects us to because none of us really know what’s going on including yourself, and I fall into high risk. But we certainly aren’t going to turn to you for the facts. At least I’m not so stay in your lane.


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## cincinnati

There's an old saying in journalism, "If it bleeds, it leads." Keep this in mind when you're watching extended coverage of reporters screeching death totals & dire predictions. 

I'm not downplaying the seriousness of the contagion, ESPECIALLY for the high risk groups, but it's obvious to me that the news media is very self-serving in many circumstances. We've all seen the weather guy, w/his jacket off & sleeves rolled up, who breaks in during the 4th quarter of a game, & yells potential  WHITE DEATH!!! for the next 90 minutes.


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## loomis82

The dogs are really stressing over the stay at home order!


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## loweman165

Dwine talks at 2:00. Supposed to possibly shutting down parks because people there aren't practicing " social distancing ". We'll see.


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## TomC

So anyone heard anything out of china? Seems they have gone dark the last few weeks. I did see north korea saings they have no cases yet are asking for all sorts of help on medical supplies all of a sudden.


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## STRONGPERSUADER

Just a heads up if you didn’t already know. Showtime movie channel is free during this stay at home order.


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## hailtothethief

People are getting more optimistic with spring underway. Got a stock market rally, a record 2 trillion dollar stimulus package despite the virus count rising 35 times the amount of people there were infected 2 weeks ago. The virus will make you very sick but is mostly killing people with underlying conditions that are going to die anyway so shutting down the economy hasn’t gained us anything.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Apparently fwiw, the potus is going to have a presser in like 20 mins with internet service providers and other leaders in the industry due to a strain on bandwidth. Students at home, workers at home among other reasons for overloading.


----------



## 1basshunter




----------



## cheezemm2

hailtothethief said:


> People are getting more optimistic with spring underway. Got a stock market rally, a record 2 trillion dollar stimulus package despite the virus count rising 35 times the amount of people there were infected 2 weeks ago. The virus will make you very sick but is mostly killing people with underlying conditions that are going to die anyway so shutting down the economy hasn’t gained us anything.


Underlying conditions does not equal "die anyway"


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## TomC

ive noticed the last two weeks speeds have dropped so slow. all them young wiper snappers playing games online im sure are using a chunk of that internet.

Im a diabetic so im high risk, my youngest has all sorts of breathing issues and hes at risk. Nothing better than being on the front lines and being high risk.


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## HeaVyMeTaLFiSHinGFiEnD

This really hits home right now


----------



## 1basshunter




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## 1basshunter




----------



## One guy and a boat

hailtothethief said:


> People are getting more optimistic with spring underway. Got a stock market rally, a record 2 trillion dollar stimulus package despite the virus count rising 35 times the amount of people there were infected 2 weeks ago. The virus will make you very sick but is mostly killing people with underlying conditions that are going to die anyway so shutting down the economy hasn’t gained us anything.


WOW

Sent from my Pixel 3a XL using Tapatalk


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## loomis82

Here's two


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## glacier_dropsy




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## dcool

hailtothethief said:


> People are getting more optimistic with spring underway. Got a stock market rally, a record 2 trillion dollar stimulus package despite the virus count rising 35 times the amount of people there were infected 2 weeks ago. The virus will make you very sick but is mostly killing people with underlying conditions that are going to die anyway so shutting down the economy hasn’t gained us anything.


And to think that this mentality walks amongst us. WOW!!!!


----------



## Misdirection

hailtothethief said:


> People are getting more optimistic with spring underway. Got a stock market rally, a record 2 trillion dollar stimulus package despite the virus count rising 35 times the amount of people there were infected 2 weeks ago. The virus will make you very sick but is mostly killing people with underlying conditions that are going to die anyway so shutting down the economy hasn’t gained us anything.


But it has, by social distancing were flattening the curve.

Say we end up with 5 million positive cases, 250K of which require hospitalization. As long as those 250K are spread out enough we wont overwhelm the healthcare system. If those 250K do happen in a short period of time, there are more people than available beds and people to treat them and a higher mortality rate.

Pick and choose the numbers you want to use above, but the underlying premise is the same.

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


----------



## ovrecheck

montagc said:


> https://www.foxnews.com/media/cbs-n...owded-nyc-hospital-that-was-actually-in-italy


Fake News again That not a mistake


----------



## loomis82

Well bc people cant follow the new rules about social distancing the Tippy Dam site here in Michigan has been shut down by DNR


----------



## AmericanEagle

Here is the link to the Harvard Business Review article Lessons from Italy’s Response to Coronavirus that Dr. Acton referenced in the governor's press conference today.

https://hbr.org/2020/03/lessons-from-italys-response-to-coronavirus

I found the section on "Recognize your cognitive biases" very interesting.


----------



## loves2fishinohio

This really kills me. Most states have ordered everyone to stay at home. And yet here are all of these aluminum tube shaped Petri dishes flying all over the country.

https://www.flightradar24.com/SWA205/244d5017


----------



## Saugeyefisher

loves2fishinohio said:


> This really kills me. Most states have ordered everyone to stay at home. And yet here are all of these aluminum tube shaped Petri dishes flying all over the country.
> 
> https://www.flightradar24.com/SWA205/244d5017


Ya I've thought of that to. But I would imagine a bulk of that are goods shipping. 
I herd an airlines guy say yesterday they are taking advantage of the empty seating by strapping cargo onto it,to move more stuff with less flights. If things keep going the way they are I could see most airlines grounding most all of there passenger planes. It's getting to the point its costing more to run an maintain the planes then they are making. It's gone from millions of travelers a day to just a couple hundred thousand I think.


----------



## loves2fishinohio

Saugeyefisher said:


> Ya I've thought of that to. But I would imagine a bulk of that are goods shipping.
> I herd an airlines guy say yesterday they are taking advantage of the empty seating by strapping cargo onto it,to move more stuff with less flights. If things keep going the way they are I could see most airlines grounding most all of there passenger planes. It's getting to the point its costing more to run an maintain the planes then they are making. It's gone from millions of travelers a day to just a couple hundred thousand I think.


I seriously doubt most airlines, especially budget airline companies, are moving cargo.


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## KaGee

Save the memes for Facebook... or the derailer thread. Not here.


----------



## KaGee

Save the memes for Facebook... or the derailer thread. Not here.


----------



## bobk

loves2fishinohio said:


> I seriously doubt most airlines, especially budget airline companies, are moving cargo.


Yes, companies are moving cargo now. They need to utilize the cost of the flight.


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## Saugeyefisher

loves2fishinohio said:


> I seriously doubt most airlines, especially budget airline companies, are moving cargo.


Ya,I seriously dont know. But the guy ran a fairly large operation. But I do know,there are not many people on those planes. Compared to a month ago.


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## CoonDawg92

I read where the airlines have to continue operating their flights at some airports, with or without passengers, in order to keep their slots. Wasteful rules in this case that should be changed based on the emergency.


----------



## REEL GRIP

Spirit announced today they are discontinuing flights
in and out of 5 different airports in and around New York.


----------



## hailtothethief

https://www.wbur.org/hereandnow/2020/03/27/epidemiologist-larry-brilliant

Larry brilliant, the smallpox vaccine guy says it could infect a billion people. Says people getting it will become immune and hopefully in 12 to 18 months they will have a vaccine for future cases. He’d rather sacrafice the economy and save more people now in the hope down the road they’ll have a vaccine that will save more people overall.


----------



## buckeyebowman

birdcrazy said:


> I changed my tune when I found out 3 people I no tested positive. I was not around them but heard first hand what it was like. All are recovering at home. And doing much better. The big tuff guy told me it kicked his butt and you don't want to get it.
> On another note if I was a non-essential business that was shut down by the state, I would be smoken hot that the state allows thousands of people to go out and play STATE lottery everyday some twice a day!!
> That many more people touching doors, counters, ect. But you better cut your hair at home.


My buddy thinks he had it. He had his wife take him to the hospital because he couldn't breathe. Said he felt like he was drowning. Turned out he had double pneumonia. They administered the test for the 2 dominant flu strains running around this year, and he tested negative for both! They admitted him, and eventually he got well. Said he went through hell though!

Another buddy called me today and wanted to go play golf on Saturday. Supposed to be nice, and it would be good to get out and blow the stink off. His wife is a nurse at a local hospital, and when he talked to her about it she freaked out! She comes home from work freaked out generally! She has 20 people on her floor and 12 of them are there for COVID-19. A couple of them are in the process of dieing. She begged him not to go, saying the virus is peaking here right now, and there's a body of thought at the hospital that thinks it's gone airborne. 

So, he texted me back saying he wasn't going to go.


----------



## AmericanEagle

BuckeyeBowman I live in Mahoning county too. I don't understand why we have 153 cases and almost half of them (70) are hospitalized. I emailed WFMJ this weekend and asked them to ask the local health officals why? I never received a reply to my email.

Mahoning county also has 9 deaths which is more than any other county. Cuyahoga has 527 cases 129 hospitalizations, and 6 deaths. Why so many deaths in Mahoning? My stats are from the dashboard on Coronavirus.ohio.gov


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## lawrence1

Allegedly, China has reopened their wet markets.


----------



## bobk

AmericanEagle said:


> BuckeyeBowman I live in Mahoning county too. I don't understand why we have 153 cases and almost half of them (70) are hospitalized. I emailed WFMJ this weekend and asked them asked the local health officals why? I never received a reply to my email.
> 
> Mahoning county also has 9 deaths which is more than any other county. Cuyahoga has 527 cases 129 hospitalizations, and 6 deaths. Why so many deaths in Mahoning? My stats are from the dashboard on Coronavirus.ohio.gov


Those are some odd numbers for sure. With the hippa laws they might not be permitted to answer your questions.


----------



## $diesel$

AmericanEagle said:


> BuckeyeBowman I live in Mahoning county too. I don't understand why we have 153 cases and almost half of them (70) are hospitalized. I emailed WFMJ this weekend and asked them to ask the local health officals why? I never received a reply to my email.
> 
> Mahoning county also has 9 deaths which is more than any other county. Cuyahoga has 527 cases 129 hospitalizations, and 6 deaths. Why so many deaths in Mahoning? My stats are from the dashboard on Coronavirus.ohio.gov


I seen that last night as well. I also live in MC and my girl friend works at the blood and cancer center on 224 and tippy. I'm worried sick for her and me, especially with those crazy numbers.
Gotta be some reason why the #'s are so skewed? I'm high risk, but i worry more about her facing those very sick people every day.


----------



## Redheads

With all the numbers and predictions being thrown around im surprised nobody has brought up Nostradamus and his 2020 predictions


----------



## justbobber

It’s based on testing being done. If you aren’t testing you don’t have positive test results. Still plenty of cases out there. Stay safe everyone.


----------



## 9Left

buckeyebowman said:


> My buddy thinks he had it. He had his wife take him to the hospital because he couldn't breathe. Said he felt like he was drowning. Turned out he had double pneumonia. They administered the test for the 2 dominant flu strains running around this year, and he tested negative for both! They admitted him, and eventually he got well. Said he went through hell though!
> 
> Another buddy called me today and wanted to go play golf on Saturday. Supposed to be nice, and it would be good to get out and blow the stink off. His wife is a nurse at a local hospital, and when he talked to her about it she freaked out! She comes home from work freaked out generally! She has 20 people on her floor and 12 of them are there for COVID-19. A couple of them are in the process of dieing. She begged him not to go, saying the virus is peaking here right now, and there's a body of thought at the hospital that thinks it's gone airborne.
> 
> So, he texted me back saying he wasn't going to go.


Well some of that is Mis-information buckeye Bowman... Every hospital has been ordered to isolate several units and dedicate them only to coronavirus patients...So there is absolutely no way a hospital is going to co-hort covid patients with other patients on the same floor.. If there is a hospital doing otherwise… Then they are in violation of an ethical order.
I work on a separate floor at my hospital… If any patient, on any other floor besides the Covid floor, is suspect of infection… Like fever, flu symptoms, respiratory symptoms, then the test is ordered… We do not even wait for the test results to come back… The patient is immediately isolated, masked and transported to the Covid floor To specifically designated beds away from the patients that tested positive on that floor...If they test negative… Then they can return to the original floor that they came from… Using a specific travel route in the hospital… The hospitals are doing one hell of a great job


----------



## jray

bobk said:


> Those are some odd numbers for sure. With the hippa laws they might not be permitted to answer your questions.


I am very confused about this right now. I was under the impression that hippa or at least portions of it were suspended due to the state of emergency could be wrong but I thought that’s what I heard. But my work for instance is still saying they will not notify us if there is a confirmed case here due to hippa. I can understand keeping the names private obviously but it seems like common courtesy that we should get to know if someone we share equipment with tests positive.


----------



## bobk

jray said:


> I am very confused about this right now. I was under the impression that hippa or at least portions of it were suspended due to the state of emergency could be wrong but I thought that’s what I heard. But my work for instance is still saying they will not notify us if there is a confirmed case here due to hippa. I can understand keeping the names private obviously but it seems like common courtesy that we should get to know if someone we share equipment with tests positive.


That could be that they have suspended parts of it. I’d have to ask my wife. I know that when she gets home from the hospital each night I ask questions that she doesn’t answer. Seems to be a fine line between public safety and people’s privacy right now.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

9Left said:


> Well some of that is Mis-information buckeye Bowman... Every hospital has been ordered to isolate several units and dedicate them only to coronavirus patients...So there is absolutely no way a hospital is going to co-hort covid patients with other patients on the same floor.. If there is a hospital doing otherwise… Then they are in violation of an ethical order.
> I work on a separate floor at my hospital… If any patient, on any other floor besides the Covid floor, is suspect of infection… Like fever, flu symptoms, respiratory symptoms, then the test is ordered… We do not even wait for the test results to come back… The patient is immediately isolated, masked and transported to the Covid floor To specifically designated beds away from the patients that tested positive on that floor...If they test negative… Then they can return to the original floor that they came from… Using a specific travel route in the hospital… The hospitals are doing one hell of a great job


Great info. I can attest to this personally.


----------



## Shad Rap

Right now we are at 12 deaths per 1,000,000 people...still haven't reached the swine flu level of 39 deaths per 1,000,000 people...just thought I'd throw that out there...not downplaying anything, I just thought those numbers were interesting as of yet...


----------



## Im2spooky

Coronavirus testing is a joke, if your sick and go see your doctor, your doctor's response will be yes you have many symptoms of the coronavirus and you probably have it but unless you have traveled out of country to a place that has an epidemic or contact with a know coronavirus individual they wont test you unless your already in critical condition and need to go in ICU. The stats say ohio has about 2000 confirmed cases but in reality millions of ohioans have it untested. There is only one cure for coronavirus and that is for all of us to catch it, recover from it, then while we all have immunity from it the virus will die off due to lack of viable hosts. They know this they are keeping sick numbers down to prevent panic, most of us will or have it and hardly know it, some will get it more severe and some of them wont survive it. Social distancing is only ment to slow it down so the hospitals dont get dumped on at once but the odds of not catching it at all are very slim unless you live on top of a mountain alone. If you got it and recovered or recovering with no serious health issues your lucky because you dont need to worry about getting it again unless your immunity runs out before this ends. Also people getting it later could be fighting a strain that has changed and can fight of our immune systems more so causing more people to reach serious levels.


----------



## fastwater

Im2spooky said:


> ..... *There is only one cure for coronavirus and that is for all of us to catch it, recover from it, then while we all have immunity from it the virus will die off due to lack of viable hosts. .....
> 
> ......If you got it and recovered or recovering with no serious health issues your lucky because you dont need to worry about getting it again unless your immunity runs out before this ends. Also people getting it later could be fighting a strain that has changed and can fight of our immune systems more so causing more people to reach serious levels*.


Is what I've emboldened in your post that you have stated to be fact something new that medical professionals have announced?

Please provide medical documentation for what you have stated in reference to not being able to contract corvid19 more than once.

Also, please provide medical documentation of a changed 'strain' of corvid19 you've referred to that medical professionals have found.


----------



## outbackmac

Spooky some of what you say might be true. but i know for a fact the testing statement is not 100% true. my sister in law was tested and she was not out of the country, nor in the icu. she had many symptoms and was tested. now been a week and no results back, unacceptable.


----------



## loomis82

Ontario shut down marinas and boat launches. Kinda unclear if you can fish or not. From what I see you still can just from shore??

https://www.citywindsor.ca/Newsroom/Pages/COVID-19-Update-Outdoor-Recreational-Amenities-Closed.aspx


----------



## Killbuckian

Just got an email from work. We are now shut down until April 20th. And we are a big company in auto industry. 2000 employees.

I am assuming the governor is going to announce an extension of the stay at home order today at 2pm.


----------



## loves2fishinohio

Killbuckian said:


> Just got an email from work. We are now shut down until April 20th. And we are a big company in auto industry. 2000 employees.
> 
> I am assuming the governor is going to announce an extension of the stay at home order today at 2pm.


Uh, he did that a couple of days ago...


----------



## Killbuckian

Still April 6 from what I see. Not extended yet. I have been home since my back surgery so not going anywhere anyways.


----------



## billy4prez

fastwater said:


> Is what I've emboldened in your post that you have stated to be fact something new that medical professionals have announced?
> 
> Please provide medical documentation for what you have stated in reference to not being able to contract corvid19 more than once.
> 
> Also, please provide medical documentation of a changed 'strain' of corvid19 you've referred to that medical professionals have found.





fastwater said:


> Is what I've emboldened in your post that you have stated to be fact something new that medical professionals have announced?
> 
> Please provide medical documentation for what you have stated in reference to not being able to contract corvid19 more than once.
> 
> Also, please provide medical documentation of a changed 'strain' of corvid19 you've referred to that medical professionals have found.


Fastwater, if I knew how to copy a link to this page I would. But he is correct for the most part. As far as- your body develops an immunity to a virus once it decides you make a great host. Your body fights it off and remembers who you are and how to kick your butt. Now if the same virus comes back your body can fight it off even better because of the last fight between your body and the virus. It doesn't hurt you as bad in the second round. The vaccine for covid19 will either be a dead virus or just parts of the virus injected into your body so it can learn how to kick its butt only in its weaker form. As far as mutations, thats nothing new. The mutations are not that significant at this point. I think that is why sometimes the flu shot doesn't help much. The try to predict what strain of the flu will be prevalent in the winter. Sometimes they get it right, sometimes they get it wrong.


----------



## bobk

Dewine will put more restrictions on tomorrow. Personally I hope he puts the hammer down on the groups that are not taking this serious. There’s no more time for people to be selfish.


----------



## Im2spooky

fastwater said:


> Is what I've emboldened in your post that you have stated to be fact something new that medical professionals have announced?
> 
> Please provide medical documentation for what you have stated in reference to not being able to contract corvid19 more than once.
> 
> Also, please provide medical documentation of a changed 'strain' of corvid19 you've referred to that medical professionals have found.


Google" herd immunity covid 19," American heart association did an article on it plus there are others too, this virus like others once your body defeats it you will gain a temporary immunity to, with this being a new strain on coronavirus its unclear how long it could last but if you use other viruses as a model that time frame can be 6 months to 2 years but impossible to say for sure on a virus that has only been known for 100 days


----------



## Rooster

bobk said:


> Dewine will put more restrictions on tomorrow. Personally I hope he puts the hammer down on the groups that are not taking this serious. There’s no more time for people to be selfish.


Why do you want more restriction on your freedom? You are a free man, and can avoid all contact with other humans (if that is your choice).


----------



## Saugeyefisher

bobk said:


> Dewine will put more restrictions on tomorrow. Personally I hope he puts the hammer down on the groups that are not taking this serious. There’s no more time for people to be selfish.


Ya he made that clear after the lady asked about hobby lobby being open. 
Imo the order will be at a minumum,extended to may. And maybe place stricter guidelines to the order in place,possibly shutting down state parks and boat ramps. 
But this is just my opinion. I dont want the state park thing to happen,but like alot are saying. The few are ruining it for the rest of us.


----------



## bobk

Rooster said:


> Why do you want more restriction on your freedom? You are a free man, and can avoid all contact with other humans (if that is your choice).


I’m not playing your game rooster. My wife works at a hospital. I’m damn nervous for her safety. That’s all I’m going to say.


----------



## bobk

Saugeyefisher said:


> Ya he made that clear after the lady asked about hobby lobby being open.
> Imo the order will be at a minumum,extended to may. And maybe place stricter guidelines to the order in place,possibly shutting down state parks and boat ramps.
> But this is just my opinion. I dont want the state park thing to happen,but like alot are saying. The few are ruining it for the rest of us.


Yep, he wrote that name down. They will be closed pronto I’m thinking.


----------



## allwayzfishin




----------



## billy4prez

Im2spooky said:


> Google" herd immunity covid 19," American heart association did an article on it plus there are others too, this virus like others once your body defeats it you will gain a temporary immunity to, with this being a new strain on coronavirus its unclear how long it could last but if you use other viruses as a model that time frame can be 6 months to 2 years but impossible to say for sure on a virus that has only been known for 100 days


Good info, I will have to look into that. I didn't think immunitie was temporary.


----------



## Row v. Wade

They're trying plasma transfusions from a person who beat CV in an ill patient to see if that would jump start the ability of the sick persons body to heal itself better.


----------



## Lewis

After reading this, I admire Dr. Acton even more.

The story of Doctor Amy Acton 
written in 2019 by Todd Franko in the Youngstown Vindicator which has closed. She comes from Youngstown ...

Dr. Amy Acton had no expectation last winter to be picked by Gov. Mike DeWine as the director of the Ohio Department of Health.

She had never met DeWine. She says she’s as nonpolitical as they come. And she smiles when politely dodging who she voted for – which says she either didn’t vote or voted for the other guy.

So when he called her about the vacancy, she let it all out about what was wrong with Ohio public health care and what needed to be done differently – after all, she wasn’t going to get the job. Well, she got the job.

What she must have said was surely powerful. But how she said it was probably more powerful. She unloaded on me about vital Ohio health needs for 30 minutes nonstop. Then I asked her my second question.

It comes from a passionate soul. It comes from a feisty spirit.

But mainly, it comes from Youngstown

Abused, abandoned, neglected, working a gig life before there was a name for it, figuring it out on her own and making up rules as she needed to. She did this not just for her, but also for her younger brother. And it started at age 3.

“My parents met at a theater party for YSU and got pregnant unexpectedly ...” is how Amy starts. It does not get better for a long, long time.

It was the 1960s. Her mom was an artist; dad talked mom into marriage; a younger brother came in; and then came divorce when Amy was 3.

“It got out of control. Custody [back then] always went to the mom. My dad tried to get custody of us,” she said.

“Out of control” meant 18 or so homes in her first 12 years scattered around the North Side – mom, brother, Amy and many, many pets. One place literally was a basement – bare walls, sump pump, boxes and a bed.

More troublesome than the nomadic lifestyle were the men in mom’s life. Amy calls them a “cast of characters.”

At one point in childhood, they moved to California. Mom got into a fight with whoever was the man at that time. So they traveled back home. They got as far as Nebraska. Mom got a job to earn money; she met a guy; she put her kids – age 8 and 5 – on a bus alone back to here to live with relatives. Three months later, mom, too, was home, and the cycle continued.

“I have so many crazy stories. ... I spent so much time being scared as a kid, but also navigating the adult world,” Amy said.

One guy finally hung around for marriage. That’s when Amy’s life got worse. She was between age 9 and 12.

The guy had accusations of molestation events in his past, she said. With his abuse of Amy, there was finally enough evidence that officials were called in and criminal charges were filed.

It was winter, and the family was living in a tent in a campground outside Youngstown.

“I was lucky that it got bad enough, because it got me out of there.”

She was finally able to move in with her dad and his relatives. Her Liberty life kicked in, and it would be a better life. Money was always tight. But they were safe and there was food. She eventually would become Liberty homecoming queen – Class of 1984.

But no one ever knew her story.

“It’s hard to tell people about this because it makes kids uncomfortable,” she said about her younger years. “So you just keep it all in.”

She’s more at ease talking about it as an adult. But the tears still come as if it were yesterday.

Her dad, Jerry, died a few years ago. Her brother lives in Colorado.

She hasn’t seen or heard from her mom since a day in court after that long-ago arrest.

“In the courthouse after they were charged, I went to give her a kiss, and she just turned her cheek away. That was the last time I ever saw her.”

Out on bond, mom and her husband skipped town and have not been heard from since.

Amy’s medical interest grew from a hospital visit as a child. She wanted to be nice and nurturing like the staff. In that dank North Side basement, she heard on radio about a medical school attached to Youngstown State University. It became her obsession.

“My dad always told me I could be in life whatever I wanted to be.”

And now with the state of Ohio’s health as her job description, she is set to go. With Youngstown first, she said.

DeWine visited The Vindicator newsroom one last time Thursday. On his way out, I asked him about his hire – Dr. Acton.

He looked up through his blue-framed glasses and offered this with a wry smile:

“She’s special, isn’t she?”

Amy’s tale is likely my last one as a daily newsroom editor – which I’ve been since 1989. I wanted to end with a story like Amy’s.
(From me
This is last story ever printed in the Youngstown Vindicator. No one could foresee what is happening today but I am so glad that Ohio has Doctor Amy Acton along with Governor DeWine trying desperately to stop the spread of Covid 19 to save countless lives.)
______________________________________


----------



## Specwar

Nice successful story, however I still don’t particularly care for her.


----------



## buckeyebowman

AmericanEagle said:


> BuckeyeBowman I live in Mahoning county too. I don't understand why we have 153 cases and almost half of them (70) are hospitalized. I emailed WFMJ this weekend and asked them to ask the local health officals why? I never received a reply to my email.
> 
> Mahoning county also has 9 deaths which is more than any other county. Cuyahoga has 527 cases 129 hospitalizations, and 6 deaths. Why so many deaths in Mahoning? My stats are from the dashboard on Coronavirus.ohio.gov





bobk said:


> Those are some odd numbers for sure. With the hippa laws they might not be permitted to answer your questions.


I think our numbers are skewed because, in general, our population's average age is higher than a lot of places around the state. Saw some numbers in the paper the other day, and the youngest to die was in his 60's, several were in their 80's. 

As far as violating hipaa laws, I think that would only happen if names were revealed. I think it would be a public service to reveal age, length of illness, and pre-existing conditions, both for those who die and those who recover.


----------



## mountainbikingrn

At times like these I am happy that we have a medical doctor with a masters in public health as our director of the Ohio Department of Health!


----------



## Deadeyedeek

Specwar said:


> Nice successful story, however I still don’t particularly care for her.


I think she is a great compliment to DeWines staff..can you Imagine the amount of food she has on her plate!! Gotta give her that respect JMO


----------



## LEfriend

Well


bobk said:


> I’m not playing your game rooster. My wife works at a hospital. I’m damn nervous for her safety. That’s all I’m going to say.


Well said Bobk. Our daughter-in-law is a nurse and you are spot on. Ironic isn’t it. They are heroes risking their lives and their families lives to save others, much like firemen running into the burning building. Quite a contrast to those whining about missing a few weeks fishing. 

Kind thoughts and safe wishes to your wife.


----------



## Burkcarp1

LEfriend said:


> Well
> 
> 
> Well said Bobk. Our daughter-in-law is a nurse and you are spot on. Ironic isn’t it. They are heroes risking their lives and their families lives to save others, much like firemen running into the burning building. Quite a contrast to those whining about missing a few weeks fishing.
> 
> Kind thoughts and safe wishes to your wife.


FYI fishing is legal.. just be smart about it


----------



## Rooster

LEfriend said:


> Well
> 
> 
> Well said Bobk. Our daughter-in-law is a nurse and you are spot on. Ironic isn’t it. They are heroes risking their lives and their families lives to save others, much like firemen running into the burning building. Quite a contrast to those whining about missing a few weeks fishing.
> 
> Kind thoughts and safe wishes to your wife.


LOL, whining about missing a few weeks of fishing?

Try complaining about the State of Ohio and Amy 100,000 Acton depriving me (along with at least 420,000 others) the ability to provide for my family. Your DIL still has the option NOT to work. At least 420,000 (they will not even report the current numbers) had the option of working taken away. 420,000 that don’t know how they are going to pay the bills, and put food on their table for their children. I guess that it is easy to trivialize that hardship when YOU know where YOUR next meal is coming from?

Oh, and I will still be fishing, I’m a free man. Kim Jong-Dewine cannot nullify the Constitution of the United Sates. The frightened sheep so eager to give-up their (and everyone’s) freedom do not deserve the liberty gained by the blood of our ancestors.


----------



## Workingman

It's not just about the fishing, I wish it was. It's about giving up rights, liberty and freedom. Our government is telling us where we can and can't go. Taking away people's ability to go earn for their families, putting hardworking entrepreneurs out of business possibly, etc etc.


----------



## Specwar

Deadeyedeek said:


> I think she is a great compliment to DeWines staff..can you Imagine the amount of food she has on her plate!! Gotta give her that respect JMO


I respect yours and any others approval of her, as I assume you respect mine. It’s all subjective.


----------



## cheezemm2

It'll be very interesting to see Ohio versus Florida (stay at home issued today) or other states that have not shut down at all and compare human and economic toll after this is all said and done.


----------



## cheezemm2




----------



## fishless

cheezemm2 said:


> View attachment 349725


I miss my grandkids !


----------



## $diesel$

loomis82 said:


> Ontario shut down marinas and boat launches. Kinda unclear if you can fish or not. From what I see you still can just from shore??
> 
> https://www.citywindsor.ca/Newsroom/Pages/COVID-19-Update-Outdoor-Recreational-Amenities-Closed.aspx


Damn, Loomis, no fishing and no golf,......might as well be dead, brother.


----------



## bobk

LEfriend said:


> Well
> 
> 
> Well said Bobk. Our daughter-in-law is a nurse and you are spot on. Ironic isn’t it. They are heroes risking their lives and their families lives to save others, much like firemen running into the burning building. Quite a contrast to those whining about missing a few weeks fishing.
> 
> Kind thoughts and safe wishes to your wife.


Nothing but safe times ahead for your daughter in law. It’s disappointing what many are complaining about.


----------



## SConner

Rooster said:


> LOL, whining about missing a few weeks of fishing?
> 
> Try complaining about the State of Ohio and Amy 100,000 Acton depriving me (along with at least 420,000 others) the ability to provide for my family. Your DIL still has the option NOT to work. At least 420,000 (they will not even report the current numbers) had the option of working taken away. 420,000 that don’t know how they are going to pay the bills, and put food on their table for their children. I guess that it is easy to trivialize that hardship when YOU know where YOUR next meal is coming from?
> 
> Oh, and I will still be fishing, I’m a free man. Kim Jong-Dewine cannot nullify the Constitution of the United Sates. The frightened sheep so eager to give-up their (and everyone’s) freedom do not deserve the liberty gained by the blood of our ancestors.


Well it is clear you are a constitutional scholar complete with law degree. The logical next step would be to file charges against DeWine and the state of Ohio. Let us know how it goes.

serious question, if you were given the choice 2 months ago which would you choose?

1) You will lose job for a period of 3 months, but you are guaranteed nobody in your immediate family will die.

2) your job is guaranteed safe, but someone in you immediate family must die.

I am really curious because you seem rather callous about the value of a human life.

From a personal point of view (I am not a constitutional scholar, nor do I play one on websites), my right to expect others to not put my life or my families life at risk superceeds your right to do whatever you please and ignore the law.


----------



## Specwar

I agree with most of the measures that have been implemented in Ohio to slow, and or modify the curve.
We know that as of today there has been 2547 confirmed cases, 679 have been hospitalized, and unfortunately 65 have died. What the state officials cannot tell us is how many of those confirmed cases have recovered, and how many of those hospitalized have since been discharged. 
Dr. Acton states these numbers are unknown. How can that be?


----------



## crappiedude

SConner said:


> From a personal point of view (I am not a constitutional scholar, nor do I play one on websites), my right to expect others to not put my life or my families life at risk supersedes your right to do whatever you please and ignore the law.


His right to have a different opinion than others doesn't put yours or anyone's life in danger, it's just an opinion.
FWIW I don't agree with him but if that's how he sees it so be it.
I'm just glad I'm not in NY


----------



## loweman165

Specwar said:


> I agree with most of the measures that have been implemented in Ohio to slow, and or modify the curve.
> We know that as of today there has been 2547 confirmed cases, 679 have been hospitalized, and unfortunately 65 have died. What the state officials cannot tell us is how many of those confirmed cases have recovered, and how many of those hospitalized have since been discharged.
> Dr. Acton states these numbers are unknown. How can that be?


Because recovery numbers wont scare anyone. Almost every other state discloses recovery numbers, except Ohio of course.


----------



## SConner

crappiedude said:


> His right to have a different opinion than others doesn't put yours or anyone's life in danger, it's just an opinion.
> FWIW I don't agree with him but if that's how he sees it so be it.
> I'm just glad I'm not in NY


If he ignores the orders because he is a “free man” he most certainly is putting my life in danger. You do understand how this spreads correct?


----------



## Burkcarp1

Why do people assume that if someone posts that they aren’t hysterical about this that they aren’t practicing the proper procedure s???


----------



## Snakecharmer

jrose said:


> We have 2,112 deaths in all 50 states, District of Columbia, Puerto Rico, Guam, Northern Marianas and Virgin Islands. Been going at this since January. Should peak soon. We have medical supplies at the ready and a better understanding on how to treat this (No cure, but some promising treatments) Please don't buy into the hype. Those numbers are worst case scenarios and over an extended time period ( if the virus cycles 2 or 3 times thru the population) This will pass. Wash your hands, don't play in the traffic and apply your sunblock liberally and often!


Added 3,000 deaths since you posted this Monday 12:40PM. Scary


----------



## Shad Rap

montagc said:


> his opinion won’t hurt anyone but his actions might...


Yours might too...everyday or any day...pandemic or not...unless, of course, you are perfect...


----------



## KPI

Rooster there are places hiring amazon dollar general,giant eagle,instead of fishing maybe go online and fill out some applications or if you got laid off you could collect unemployment!!See what comes about from it I know if I had no money and was worried about not eating I would not be going fishing and wasting money to travel to the lake put gas in my boat buy bait or tackle I would be selling my boat and gear so my family was taken care of just my two cents it is a horrible time in the economy but people moms dads brothers and sisters are dying so you can not be that shallow and think government is out to hurt you they are doing the best they can let’s just come together and not get politics into this please 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## johnboy111711

Doing my weekly check in. Just throwing out a few I told you so's (sadly). And I see there are still people not taking it serious, but the majority of people are, which is great! Please stay safe. No one knows where the virus might be...


----------



## crappiedude

SConner said:


> my right to *expect others to not put my life or my families life at risk* superceeds your right to do whatever you please and ignore the law.





SConner said:


> *You do understand how this spreads correct*?


We aren't talking about me but it's a typical response I guess. If someone doesn't agree with you then let's go after them. *I guess you didn't read where I said I don't agree with him?*
I'm just pointing out he has every right to have his opinion. His opinion isn't causing life or death. It doesn't even describe his actions.

Like you have a right to your opinion (overstated drama), others do too.
FWIW I erased about half of my response.


----------



## fastwater

Im2spooky said:


> Google" herd immunity covid 19," American heart association did an article on it plus there are others too, this virus like others once your body defeats it you will gain a temporary immunity to, with this being a new strain on coronavirus its unclear how long it could last but if you use other viruses as a model that time frame can be 6 months to 2 years but impossible to say for sure on a virus that has only been known for 100 days


If this is the article you are referring to:
https://www.heart.org/en/news/2020/03/25/covid-19-science-understanding-the-basics-of-herd-immunity
That's a great article...and makes very clear the general process of 'herd immunity', coupled with antibiotics and vaccines that history has shown that we can become immune to virus's. And like the article clearly states, it could takes months to years for immunity to develope depending on the specific virus's specifications. The article states that the specifics of corvid19 are not yet known at this time.
In other words it's to early to say if this virus will follow the path of other virus's...and if it does, until the specifics of the virus is known, plus realiable antibiotics coupled with vaccines, only time will tell how long it will be until there is herd immunity with it....if that ever happens.
The article surely DOES NOT state as you did that once you have contracted, and recouped from covid 19 you can never get it again.


----------



## hailtothethief

Larry brilliant said you if live you are immune.


----------



## hailtothethief

Burkcarp1 said:


> Why do people assume that if someone posts that they aren’t hysterical about this that they aren’t practicing the proper procedure s???


Quarantine is for people that are sick or are immune compromised and susceptible. Masks and gloves are for doctors working on patients. Most healthy people sitting at home are a waste of good resources. China is opening businesses and restaurants back up. The economy must go on.


----------



## glacier_dropsy

Saw where some of the Henry Ford hospitals around Detroit are already at capacity. Toledo area already has more cases than Cincinnati area with far less hospital beds.

The testing issue is improving but needs to keep pushing for more and faster. The ODH testing has usually been good for about 48 hours to results, but they could only process a few per day so hospitals started sending samples that got refused by ODH to the national companies, and some are still 7+ days out with no response. That's 7+ days using isolation equipment that might be wasted if the patient is negative.

Now that the primers are available, the university labs are running RT-PCR testing with 1-2 days turn around time. We need more of that and hopefully a point of care test with a really low false negative rate.


----------



## Had a Bite

Alright, I'll try and post a few updates here and there as we get more into this fun time. I have some good friends working in other area hospitals, so I'll make sure everything is first hand or a confirmed reliable source. 

The confirmed positive cases is up a fair amount from Tuesday, you smart people can do the math to figure out what that average could be here in a few weeks.

A few of the health care systems had made certain hospitals dedicated covid facilities, some are near their maximum compacity before they start filling up the main hospitals. The original plan was to try and keep the covid separate, wont last much longer. Could be a few hours to a day or so.

Seeing a uptick in people coming from out of state, so when you see the total ohio cases, in the hospital and in the icu, I was told those are not counted, but cant say for sure. So were caring for more than are on that 1400 Gov Dewine briefing. 

Even with ohio having the ability to clean the used n95 mask, I have friends working with the covid patients and they are only given one N95 mask and told to keep it in their paper bag to reuse shift after shift. So a mask that we're told has an 8hr life, is magically good for multiple 12 hour shifts?

Lots of questions that just dont have answers at this time. 

For everyone upset by being out of work, I hope and pray at the end of this you can all call the govenor and tell him how he screwed up and took your freedom, money and he should have left you go wherever you wanted because he was wrong. Personally, it probably should be a thank you call.
Honestly, this is a scary, miserable death for these people. Enough on that though. 

General nursing moral-- scared, very scared, confused, angry, excited, and we'll get through this.


----------



## JamesF

Just praying for those who work in the middle of these emotionally charged times. Staying positive is crucial. Be safe .


----------



## ICENUT

fishless said:


> I miss my grandkids !


Im with you I MISS my grandkids I don't care how much money I lose not being with them and seeing them is driving me crazy!!!!!!!!


----------



## jrose

SConner said:


> Well it is clear you are a constitutional scholar complete with law degree. The logical next step would be to file charges against DeWine and the state of Ohio. Let us know how it goes.
> 
> serious question, if you were given the choice 2 months ago which would you choose?
> 
> 1) You will lose job for a period of 3 months, but you are guaranteed nobody in your immediate family will die.
> 
> 2) your job is guaranteed safe, but someone in you immediate family must die.
> 
> I am really curious because you seem rather callous about the value of a human life.
> 
> From a personal point of view (I am not a constitutional scholar, nor do I play one on websites), my right to expect others to not put my life or my families life at risk superceeds your right to do whatever you please and ignore the law.


Just FYI, we are just slowing the spread by self quarantine, you still have a good chance you will get it. We all won’t get sick at the same time, and overwhelm the hospitals. That’s a good thing. The bad thing is, unless there is a cure or people just stop getting sick, our economy is gonna tank if we stay quarantined for three more months. At some point we have to break this cycle of doing nothing and get back to normal. I’m not being callous here, but the needs of many far exceeds the needs of a few. Take care.


----------



## SConner

jrose said:


> Just FYI, we are just slowing the spread by self quarantine, you still have a good chance you will get it. We all won’t get at the same time, and overwhelm the hospitals. That’s a good thing. The bad thing is, unless there is a cure or people just stop getting sick, our economy is gonna tank if we stay quarantined for three more months. At some point we have to break this cycle of doing nothing and get back to normal. I’m not being callous here, but the needs of many far exceeds the needs of a few. Take care.


I agree with every word you said. But don’t think prior to the peak is time to lift restrictions. I also believe many are taking this way to casual and their reckless behavior is dangerous for everyone.


----------



## $diesel$

Being a millrat for 37 years, i have absolutely no idea how virus's work or how you medical folks deal with this kind of thing.
That being said, i've been putting my eggs in the baskets of the folks who know a helluva more than me.
My big question right now is, "is this virus airbourn"? I haven't heard much about this and it seems as though it may be. Too many folks getting sick too fast, IMO, to be contact in initiated.
Again, i am erring on the safe side. I wear my mask and gloves when i leave my home just in case.
Making fun of or laughing at me rolls off me like water off a ducks back. I'm just not ready to throw in the towel yet.
I know, a little off topic again, but i feel better saying this.

Can any of you guys in the field shed any light on the probability of this virus being airbourn?


----------



## BuckeyeFishinNut

Hey, I want to play this self-righteous game too. The game where everyone not conforming to my thought process is putting my family, my friends and myself in danger.

I think since the largest metro areas in the state have the largest amount of cases, they should shut those areas down completely. Allowing these people to even go out on their porch is putting everyone elses life in danger. Shut em down completely for 2 weeks, no stores, not gas station, no banking, no outdoors, etc. Just sit at your window and look outside. My county has very few cases, we don't need these city folk infecting our good rural communities.

Thats a really bad take, but thats what some on here sound like. 

I really do feel for our front line medical folks. I have some friends and family who work at various surrounding hospitals. Its like my friend told me, who is a RN, "its exhausting, but this is what we signed up for, and I couldn't see myself doing anything else."

My hope is when this is over, people have a better appreciation for those that take care of our needs. From ALL the people working in our hospitals to grocery store employees, teachers to truck drivers and everyone in between. We often take people for granted until we are forced to appreciate what they do for us and our families on a daily basis.


----------



## Shad Rap

Had a Bite said:


> Alright, I'll try and post a few updates here and there as we get more into this fun time. I have some good friends working in other area hospitals, so I'll make sure everything is first hand or a confirmed reliable source.
> 
> The confirmed positive cases is up a fair amount from Tuesday, you smart people can do the math to figure out what that average could be here in a few weeks.
> 
> A few of the health care systems had made certain hospitals dedicated covid facilities, some are near their maximum compacity before they start filling up the main hospitals. The original plan was to try and keep the covid separate, wont last much longer. Could be a few hours to a day or so.
> 
> Seeing a uptick in people coming from out of state, so when you see the total ohio cases, in the hospital and in the icu, I was told those are not counted, but cant say for sure. So were caring for more than are on that 1400 Gov Dewine briefing.
> 
> Even with ohio having the ability to clean the used n95 mask, I have friends working with the covid patients and they are only given one N95 mask and told to keep it in their paper bag to reuse shift after shift. So a mask that we're told has an 8hr life, is magically good for multiple 12 hour shifts?
> 
> Lots of questions that just dont have answers at this time.
> 
> For everyone upset by being out of work, I hope and pray at the end of this you can all call the govenor and tell him how he screwed up and took your freedom, money and he should have left you go wherever you wanted because he was wrong. Personally, it probably should be a thank you call.
> Honestly, this is a scary, miserable death for these people. Enough on that though.
> 
> General nursing moral-- scared, very scared, confused, angry, excited, and we'll get through this.


There is an extended n95 mask that is good for 20 days of use...so yes, it can be used for 20 - 12 hour shifts...your friend or whoever you are getting this info from is wrong or you are getting misinformation...I take your knowledge with a grain of salt just like you take mine.


----------



## TomC

We only get 1 mask where I work. Being in a jail setting we already have individuals on quarantine and one entire 10 man cell on it as well. Im not scared but for me its just a matter of when ill get exposed to it. Me and the wife already have a plan set up to quarantine me if we catch it. I guess its one of the small perks of living in a 4000sf house. 

From looking at the US numbers, there is no way that the numbers from china and other countries are even remotely accurate. We did hear that the gov was trying to get some sort of hazard pay for all the first responders, medical and other essential workers during this time, don't know how true that is.


----------



## loves2fishinohio

Shad Rap said:


> There is an extended n95 mask that is good for 20 days of use...so yes, it can be used for 20 - 12 hour shifts...your friend or whoever you are getting this info from is wrong or you are getting misinformation.


I'd really like to see a source on this. My half-face respirator has 2 replaceable cartridges, and our company guidance is to replace the cartridges after 40 hours of use, or until you find it difficult to breathe, whichever comes first.


----------



## Shad Rap

montagc said:


> I never said otherwise. Bold assumption on your part.


Not a bold assumption at all...it's life dude...deal with it.
You made the statement like you thought otherwise.


----------



## Shad Rap

loves2fishinohio said:


> I'd really like to see a source on this. My half-face respirator has 2 replaceable cartridges, and our company guidance is to replace the cartridges after 40 hours of use, or until you find it difficult to breathe, whichever comes first.


Key word there is 'company guidance' I guess...some of the nursing home facilities are using the extended use N95 mask...it's good for 20 work days or 20 days of use...this may be a new directive with the shortage.


----------



## glacier_dropsy

BuckeyeFishinNut said:


> I think since the largest metro areas in the state have the largest amount of cases, they should shut those areas down completely. Allowing these people to even go out on their porch is putting everyone elses life in danger. Shut em down completely for 2 weeks, no stores, not gas station, no banking, no outdoors, etc. Just sit at your window and look outside. My county has very few cases, we don't need these city folk infecting our good rural communities.


We have already seen that won't work. You tell people in one area they have to stay home, and people will flee to stay with friends and family in areas that are not locked down, and spread the infection there. As this thread illustrates, people don't like to be told what to do. The only type of partial quarantine that works with this virus is when we can identify the infected people, lock down them and test all of their contacts to see who else needs to quarantine as well. We have too many infected and too little testing to come close to doing that right now.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

CANT WE ALL GET ALONG? WE ARE ALL IN THIS TOGETHER BROTHERS AND SISTERS


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## ErieRider

hailtothethief said:


> Quarantine is for people that are sick or are immune compromised and susceptible. Masks and gloves are for doctors working on patients. Most healthy people sitting at home are a waste of good resources. China is opening businesses and restaurants back up. The economy must go on.


China is slowly reopening after suffering since Dec. 2019!!! It's not like they closed down for a week and opened up. Not being condescending but covid 19 name came from (communist China... more on that in a minute) COrona VIrus December 19 meaning this particular coroavirus was first discovered in December 19. We all know that it originated in Wuhan, China. So, point is communist China is showing small signs 3 1/2 months later of getting back on their feet and starting things back up. So yes, the economy must go on but it's going to be a very slow process. 
Also, it was 2 1/2 months in a communist country that locked down quicker and has much more strict rules and orders against their citizens. With us I think it's going to be longer because the US can't lock us down like china did and people aren't taking it serious. Heck, China now have a smartphone app that shows it you are green, good to travel, yellow, in contact with infected or red, locked down. You scan a barcode while out and are allowed to enter areas or not and are tracked on your phone. Is this what you want? My suggestion to everyone is do this voluntarily or get used to even more restrictions for a longer period of time. China got ahead somewhat because they were extremely strict, way more than us. heck they were using drones to intercept people and order them to secure at home. 

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


----------



## Shad Rap

glacier_dropsy said:


> We have already seen that won't work. You tell people in one area they have to stay home, and people will flee to stay with friends and family in areas that are not locked down, and spread the infection there. As this thread illustrates, people don't like to be told what to do. The only type of partial quarantine that works with this virus is when we can identify the infected people, lock down them and test all of their contacts to see who else needs to quarantine as well. We have too many infected and too little testing to come close to doing that right now.


Thats an awful lot of un-needed testing...we need the tests for people showing symptoms...that's all.
You get yourself into a pickle testing everybody and their brother...then supplies run out.


----------



## Rooster

SConner said:


> Well it is clear you are a constitutional scholar complete with law degree. The logical next step would be to file charges against DeWine and the state of Ohio. Let us know how it goes.
> 
> serious question, if you were given the choice 2 months ago which would you choose?
> 
> 1) You will lose job for a period of 3 months, but you are guaranteed nobody in your immediate family will die.
> 
> 2) your job is guaranteed safe, but someone in you immediate family must die.
> 
> I am really curious because you seem rather callous about the value of a human life.
> 
> From a personal point of view (I am not a constitutional scholar, nor do I play one on websites), my right to expect others to not put my life or my families life at risk superceeds your right to do whatever you please and ignore the law.


Fortunately, the Constitution of the United States is not reserved solely for scholars, it is for we the people….including an ignorant hillbilly like me.

Live Free or Die

Don’t Tread on Me

Molon Labe

They are more than bumper stickers to some people. You can sell your liberty for whatever false sense of safety you like, but don’t expect me to willingly give up mine.

But, to answer your question….. If I was given a choice, I would choose #1.

However, that is not really the way it works is it? The primary objective of the shut-down is NOT even to save a significant number of lives, the objective is to slow-down and spread-out the death so that an inadequate health care system can better cope with the volume.

Now a purely rhetorical question for you…

Around 40,000 traffic deaths every year

Around 40,000 gun related deaths every year

Are you willing to give-up your liberty (and everyone else’s) in the name of public safety to help prevent those deaths? If not, are you callous about the value of human life?

For me, liberty supersedes life (life is meaningless without liberty). The willingness of people to give-up their liberty in the name of public safety scares me more than Covid-19, or Ebola for that matter. You are free to make your own choices.

Either way, I sincerely hope that you and your family (and all of us) stay safe and Covid-19 free.


----------



## Shad Rap

Saugeye Tom said:


> CANT WE ALL GET ALONG? WE ARE ALL IN THIS TOGETHER BROTHERS AND SISTERS


We're all getting along!..just a friendly debate since we're pretty much all stuck in this together...folks have to vent somewhere...


----------



## ErieRider

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.usatoday.com/amp/2938374001

I love the title of this article! Looking forward to thoughts 
Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


----------



## Shad Rap

Rooster said:


> Fortunately, the Constitution of the United States is not reserved solely for scholars, it is for we the people….including an ignorant hillbilly like me.
> 
> Live Free or Die
> 
> Don’t Tread on Me
> 
> Molon Labe
> 
> They are more than bumper stickers to some people. You can sell your liberty for whatever false sense of safety you like, but don’t expect me to willingly give up mine.
> 
> But, to answer your question….. If I was given a choice, I would choose #1.
> 
> However, that is not really the way it works is it? The primary objective of the shut-down is NOT even to save a significant number of lives, the objective is to slow-down and spread-out the death so that an inadequate health care system can better cope with the volume.
> 
> Now a purely rhetorical question for you…
> 
> Around 40,000 traffic deaths every year
> 
> Around 40,000 gun related deaths every year
> 
> Are you willing to give-up your liberty (and everyone else’s) in the name of public safety to help prevent those deaths? If not, are you callous about the value of human life?
> 
> For me, liberty supersedes life (life is meaningless without liberty). The willingness of people to give-up their liberty in the name of public safety scares me more than Covid-19, or Ebola for that matter. You are free to make your own choices.
> 
> Either way, I sincerely hope that you and your family (and all of us) stay safe and Covid-19 free.


X's 20...couldn't have said it better.


----------



## Shad Rap

ErieRider said:


> https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.usatoday.com/amp/2938374001
> 
> I love the title of this article! Looking forward to thoughts
> Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


I don't believe it...I hope you don't either...they blatantly hid the disease from the world for 2 months and now they are better than us at how they went about treating it?...I don't care if we ever associate with China again...screw them...bunch of communist liars that have cost thousands of lives around the world...


----------



## AmericanEagle

A severe lock down along with testing and contact tracing can work. This is what the Chinese did to control the outbreak in Wuhan.

Another important variable is time. This disease spreads exponentially so the sooner you get on top of it the better your results.

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-00741-x


----------



## Outasync

The difference is those death numbers are for an entire year. At the peak we are looking at those numbers in a matter of days not an entire year. And with a pandemic EVERY healthcare facility is inadequate because or the volume of patients needing assistance


----------



## Buster24

$diesel$ said:


> Being a millrat for 37 years, i have absolutely no idea how virus's work or how you medical folks deal with this kind of thing.
> That being said, i've been putting my eggs in the baskets of the folks who know a helluva more than me.
> My big question right now is, "is this virus airbourn"? I haven't heard much about this and it seems as though it may be. Too many folks getting sick too fast, IMO, to be contact in initiated.
> Again, i am erring on the safe side. I wear my mask and gloves when i leave my home just in case.
> Making fun of or laughing at me rolls off me like water off a ducks back. I'm just not ready to throw in the towel yet.
> I know, a little off topic again, but i feel better saying this.
> 
> Can any of you guys in the field shed any light on the probability of this virus being airbourn?


Diesel....everything I am hearing is that this virus is not airborne....granted, you can get it if someone coughs or sneezes, but as of now, you cannot contract this virus from being outside in the fresh air!!!!


----------



## HeaVyMeTaLFiSHinGFiEnD

allwayzfishin said:


> View attachment 349611


Lmfao. Watch the OGF wardens dont get ya. They must be really bored lately


----------



## Hatchetman

Saugeye Tom said:


> CANT WE ALL GET ALONG? WE ARE ALL IN THIS TOGETHER BROTHERS AND SISTERS


Agree.....but wishful thinking....


----------



## Had a Bite

Shad Rap said:


> There is an extended n95 mask that is good for 20 days of use...so yes, it can be used for 20 - 12 hour shifts...your friend or whoever you are getting this info from is wrong or you are getting misinformation...I take your knowledge with a grain of salt just like you take mine.


Sorry bud, the information on the mask is 100% true. But if you can get you hands on those extended use mask, 20 day masks, let me know cause I know where you can get rich off selling them. 

Now maybe your thinking that the company, Battelle I think, that will clean the mask and send back can do so up to 20 times. So if that what you mean, I apologize because then each mask can be used for 20 days. Just not all in a row.


----------



## bad luck

Rooster said:


> Fortunately, the Constitution of the United States is not reserved solely for scholars, it is for we the people….including an ignorant hillbilly like me.
> 
> Live Free or Die
> 
> Don’t Tread on Me
> 
> Molon Labe
> 
> They are more than bumper stickers to some people. You can sell your liberty for whatever false sense of safety you like, but don’t expect me to willingly give up mine.
> 
> But, to answer your question….. If I was given a choice, I would choose #1.
> 
> However, that is not really the way it works is it? The primary objective of the shut-down is NOT even to save a significant number of lives, the objective is to slow-down and spread-out the death so that an inadequate health care system can better cope with the volume.
> 
> Now a purely rhetorical question for you…
> 
> Around 40,000 traffic deaths every year
> 
> Around 40,000 gun related deaths every year
> 
> Are you willing to give-up your liberty (and everyone else’s) in the name of public safety to help prevent those deaths? If not, are you callous about the value of human life?
> 
> For me, liberty supersedes life (life is meaningless without liberty). The willingness of people to give-up their liberty in the name of public safety scares me more than Covid-19, or Ebola for that matter. You are free to make your own choices.
> 
> Either way, I sincerely hope that you and your family (and all of us) stay safe and Covid-19 free.



Very well put! Using the exact same reasoning for vehicle deaths as they are using for this flu, people would only be allowed to drive for the next 2 weeks to work/necessity only. Due to Neighbors “tattling” on each other/state seeing too many abuses of people un-necessarily driving, it would then be deemed that driving needs to be reduced even more, for an indefinite period of time, maybe just shut down all together ....the state will deliver the items THEY deem that are actually needed.... thus we have Flattened the curve on vehicle related deaths!


----------



## icebucketjohn

Betty Davis prediction:

Watch "Fasten Your Seatbelts" on YouTube


----------



## loomis82

Schools closed for the rest of the year here in Michigan

They need to start worrying about people's mental health state with this. Unfortunately going to be a lot of suicides in the coming months


----------



## Rooster

LOL, the wife & I watch All about Eve a few night ago (for the 10 time probably)….they don’t make them anymore like they did back in the golden age!


----------



## joel_fishes

cheezemm2 said:


> View attachment 349725


Graphs can be very good for conveying data in an easy to digest format. By looking at the map, what % of the US population has tested positive? You might guess 10% to 25% or even higher.

Using the current cases of 217,000 and a population of 350,000,000, that is 0.00062 or 0.062% of the population with confirmed cases. 

The point of my post is that the graph does not seem to paint the same picture that the data supports, but instead paints a much worse picture. Again, I'm not saying things can't and won't get worse, just use a cautious eye with the information you get.


----------



## joel_fishes

The numbers are on the map, but my point is the use of the different size circles covers much more than 0.062% of the area of the map making it seem more widespread. The biggest circle for the number of cases in New York covers Pennsylvania to Maine including parts of Canada and the Atlantic Ocean.

New York has a population of 19,000,000. The 83,000 cases are 0.44% of the population, but the whole northeastern seaboard is completely covered with those circles.


----------



## fastwater

Rooster...and all that think your rights are currently being stepped on...you clearly are not either old enough, or didn't live around areas affected by some of the riots back in the 60's.
If you think your rights are being stepped on now...you would have thought you were in prison back then.
Lockdowns and curfews in hotspots were the norm in various city's at different times for different things. Race riots and protests/riots pertaining to the Vietnam War cropped up all over the US during that era.
Speaking specifically of Cols., Ohio since that's what I'm most familiar with...if you got caught traveling(either walking or driving)within certain 'hotspot' parameters set by LE, there was no tickets or warnings given. Your butt went to jail. If you lived within the hotspot and got caught on the street during daylight, non-curfew hours, you better be a medical emergency or you were headed straight to the grocery store.
All Business's in many of those areas were forced to close. And yes, these businesses were first asked to close as rioting continued but didn't...they were then forced to. If you worked in those areas...too bad. Better not be caught in the area.
And I can tell you for certain, those business's nor their workers got any compensation from the government.
Why did all these emergency laws go into affect?
For the same reason the current emergency orders are in place now...for the safety and welfare of ALL people.
And just like back then...today, there are a certain percentage of people that still aren't adhering to the current lenient orders. 
Watch and see, before it's over those orders WILL be ramped up, especially in hotspots and will start to be more strictly enforced as they should have been all along.


----------



## cheezemm2

Rooster said:


> However, that is not really the way it works is it? The primary objective of the shut-down is NOT even to save a significant number of lives, the objective is to slow-down and spread-out the death so that an inadequate health care system can better cope with the volume.


I don't disagree with the balancing of liberties and response, but this part is false.


----------



## crappiedude

SConner said:


> You do understand how this spreads correct?





crappiedude said:


> *I guess you didn't read where I said I don't agree with him?*


Not to beat a dead horse but one thing I haven't mentioned is the fact that I get my information from my son who has a degree in biology and works for one of the bigger county health departments.
He is still working and his position considered to be front line therefore he is required to go into work everyday. I probably get info and opinions on safe protocol that others don't see.
I'm hoping this whole thing passes without much of an impact on all of Ohio and I do stay optimistic but it is a real threat not to be taken lightly. I just hope we all come out of this with okay with maybe only our feelings hurt a little bit because we all don't agree on every point being made.
Just sayin...


----------



## SConner

Rooster said:


> Fortunately, the Constitution of the United States is not reserved solely for scholars, it is for we the people….including an ignorant hillbilly like me.
> 
> Live Free or Die
> 
> Don’t Tread on Me
> 
> Molon Labe
> 
> They are more than bumper stickers to some people. You can sell your liberty for whatever false sense of safety you like, but don’t expect me to willingly give up mine.
> 
> But, to answer your question….. If I was given a choice, I would choose #1.
> 
> However, that is not really the way it works is it? The primary objective of the shut-down is NOT even to save a significant number of lives, the objective is to slow-down and spread-out the death so that an inadequate health care system can better cope with the volume.
> 
> Now a purely rhetorical question for you…
> 
> Around 40,000 traffic deaths every year
> 
> Around 40,000 gun related deaths every year
> 
> Are you willing to give-up your liberty (and everyone else’s) in the name of public safety to help prevent those deaths? If not, are you callous about the value of human life?
> 
> For me, liberty supersedes life (life is meaningless without liberty). The willingness of people to give-up their liberty in the name of public safety scares me more than Covid-19, or Ebola for that matter. You are free to make your own choices.
> 
> Either way, I sincerely hope that you and your family (and all of us) stay safe and Covid-19 free.


Thank you for the well wishes, I hope you and yours are all ok as well. To answer you hypothetical, I do believe there is much that could be done to reduce gun violence and I think it should be done. There are few on this site who would agree and that is fine. I do not wish to derail this thread on a separate topic. I do appreciate your candid response, we will have to agree to disagree.


----------



## Burkcarp1

https://medium.com/the-mission/why-coronavirus-should-be-the-least-of-your-worries-d6ed6abe75bc


----------



## cheezemm2

To Rooster's point, the virus is a problem, but so is this...There are no good answers. We're all going to have to keep an open mind on opposing points of view.

https://graphics.reuters.com/USA-ECONOMY/rlgpdlyopoj/index.html


----------



## jrose

A question.... will there be more unemployed people in Ohio at the end of April than COVID 19 cases?


----------



## Rooster

3ish% or 3000ish% increase in Ohio?

https://www.npr.org/sections/corona...n-file-for-unemployment-another-dismal-record

Comparing The Past 2 Weeks To The Previous 2 Weeks

Ohio 468,438 13,591 +454,847 +3,347%


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

jrose said:


> A question.... will there be more unemployed people in Ohio at the end of April than COVID 19 cases?


Your point being?

Maybe we should cease all efforts to confine and stop the spread of this disease that have currently been enacted, wait that would likely result in many more deaths. But hey, then there would be more jobs available right JRose? 

Would that appease you?


----------



## laguna21

The good news is they aren't going to stop us from fishing, until they decide we aren't being careful enough. This will work if everyone is patient at the ramps and docks. The governor just mentioned that they are watching


----------



## Snakecharmer

jrose said:


> A question.... will there be more unemployed people in Ohio at the end of April than COVID 19 cases?


I hope so


----------



## bulafisherman

This thread has been a source of nonstop entertainment for me, amusing to put it mildly. I see numbers and quotes being thrown around like they are the gospel by our self made panel of OGF experts that can't stand being called out if they are wrong or questioned. No need to call them out because they will most likely be the ones to quote this post and reply thus calling themselves out


----------



## jrose

Stars-n-Stripers said:


> Your point being?
> 
> Maybe we should cease all efforts to confine and stop the spread of this disease that have currently been enacted, wait that would likely result in many more deaths. But hey, then there would be more jobs available right JRose?
> 
> Would that appease you?


A plan!!! One that doesn’t use scare tactics to keep people conforming to a worst case scenario situation. Nobody wants to get sick, and nobody wants to go broke. The way things are going both are going to happen. We can go back to work wearing mask, social distancing and using common sense. If you don’t want to participate in the work force do to health reasons, age, mental health, whatever... stay home, self huddle and file a form to let the government support you. Fine with me. But let the rest of us get back to some normalcy and try to make a living. There has to be some middle ground.


----------



## Saugeyefisher

There is a long list of people hiring


----------



## Southernsaug

We can debate endlessly over all this. I truly think that our government officials are doing what they think is best, if we are in the midst of a conspiracy then it's not just our elected officials it's global. I do not think there is a conspiracy. Could they be wrong in how to treat it, yes, but let's hope they are right. I do have a fair knowledge base on how disease works, and I feel like their approach is reasonable logic. If they were simply trying to take our freedoms it is doubtful this is how it would happen. Look at all the history of oppression, it happened by force. This is a disease that we're fighting, how will arguing among ourselves cure it. Worry will not change anything. We're not loosing our liberty they are trying to preserve it.


----------



## Rooster

montagc said:


> As many have said, look at the numbers carefully. What you see on the news might not be the big picture.


I agree 100% (NOT limited to unemployment numbers).

But, it seems like a pretty reasonable metric for measuring an increase in unemployment numbers over time caused by a specific event. Just as reasonable as reporting the % increase in Covid-19 cases by day.

Given your metric, you can say that the measures taken to slow Covid-19 has resulted in 4% of the people of Ohio being unemployed. But, it would still not be accurate to say that it is a 4% increase…..it would be a 133% increase given your metric.

But, I get your point. Statistics are the propagandist plaything.

Now, using your metric, confirmed Covid-19 cases in Ohio stand at around .027%


----------



## Rooster

Saugeyefisher said:


> There is a long list of people hiring


It is going to be hard to fill those $15/hr jobs……..max unemployment + $600 from the feds = $27/hr to not work in Ohio.


----------



## laguna21

Rooster said:


> It is going to be hard to fill those $15/hr jobs……..max unemployment + $600 from the feds = $27/hr to not work in Ohio.


Just curious, has anyone here got the new unemployment benefits yet? Was thinking they would add to your benefits to make them close to what you normally make? Scheeeez, that's alot of money if you're right


----------



## laguna21

montagc said:


> Where are you getting the $600 federal number?


Federal government is adding to the unemployment benefits for 4 months but not sure how much.


----------



## Misdirection

montagc said:


> Where are you getting the $600 federal number?


The Cares Act added a provision of $600 added to unemployment. 

https://www.hallrender.com/2020/03/...nt-benefits-for-workers-affected-by-covid-19/

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


----------



## jrose

I heard $600 also (federal gov.)


----------



## multi species angler

Rooster said:


> The willingness of people to give-up their liberty in the name of public safety scares


 Couple things:
1. The restrictions aren't STRICT ENOUGH.
2. People shouldn't have to be scared into doing the right thing. People should do it because it's the RIGHT thing to do.


----------



## laguna21

Eligible employees, now what does that mean? I'm not eligible for unemployment but this seems like a helluva good deal!


----------



## laguna21

multi species angler said:


> Couple things:
> 1. The restrictions aren't STRICT ENOUGH.
> 2. People shouldn't have to be scared into doing the right thing. People should do it because it's the RIGHT thing to do.


Are you saying that alot of people won't be real motivated to get back to work? (Sarcasm)


----------



## Rooster

Just an FYI for anyone in need, the max Ohio unemployment without dependents is $480 according to this:

https://unemployment.ohio.gov/PDF/Benefits_Estimator.pdf

But, I see $424 widely reported, and cannot confirm either number.


----------



## Saugeyefisher

Imagine how packed the barber shops are going to be after the shut down allows them back to work.... 

I had to stop bye the store after work for a few fresh items I cant really stock up on. 
I was dreading it,after the gov gave stores the authority to determine how many shoppers are allowed at a time. 
Thinking it might send more panic shoppers. 
It was pretty relaxed. The only items my groveport krogers was lacking was absolutely no tp,no paper towels,and no sanatizing spray or wipes,and no sanatizer. I was able to find a couple bottles of soft hand soap. But not much to choose from. And no rubbing alcohol either. 

I really all both sides of this debate. No I dont think it's a control think bye either the state or federal governments, but I will listen to the guy who thinks it might be, within reason. From my observation to me it seems like the vast majority are doing what they can to help prevent spread. Even the guys on here who are skeptical of the decisions being made bye our government,and dont agree with them. Most have started there posts with "I'm trying to do my part, but....." or "I appreciate what you or your family are doing being on the front lines of this,but...".
I personally think the right thing is being done here on a state level.  And it seems to me to governor is trying not to piss anybody off,and it really seems to hurt him to have to make these tuff decisions, that quite frankly I'm happy I dont have to make. 
Me getting on here and whining about if they were to shut down state parks an public fishing/hunting in no way reflects how I feel about all of those out in front fighting this. It will upset me to see people deliberately doing what the state has asked us not to do why I'm out there. Because in my opinion the state is doing this to protect us. An like said,as been more lenient then they could be. 
I hope everyone stays safe and healthy. This has been the most interesting post ever on ogf for me.


----------



## hailtothethief

They said the virus will spread. Now or later millions of people are gonna die unless they come up with a vaccine. We’ll need to repopulate and i’ll be happy to help.


----------



## buckeyebowman

bobk said:


> I’m not playing your game rooster. My wife works at a hospital. I’m damn nervous for her safety. That’s all I’m going to say.


My buddy's wife is a nurse. She cries every night! And he is scared out of his mind! 



SConner said:


> Well it is clear you are a constitutional scholar complete with law degree. The logical next step would be to file charges against DeWine and the state of Ohio. Let us know how it goes.
> 
> serious question, if you were given the choice 2 months ago which would you choose?
> 
> 1) You will lose job for a period of 3 months, but you are guaranteed nobody in your immediate family will die.
> 
> 2) your job is guaranteed safe, but someone in you immediate family must die.
> 
> I am really curious because you seem rather callous about the value of a human life.
> 
> From a personal point of view (I am not a constitutional scholar, nor do I play one on websites), my right to expect others to not put my life or my families life at risk superceeds your right to do whatever you please and ignore the law.


Might seem nit-picky, but I see a big miss here. You're going to talk about "guarantees" in a situation like this? I realize it's hypothetical, but you framed it as a "serious" question. The fact is both could happen, neither could happen, or one or the other could happen. 

What am I saying? I just violated my own logic! Both CANNOT happen. See what you get with hypotheticals? I still go out to get essentials, and I'm careful. But, I'm also retired and didn't have a job that I depended on!


----------



## Buster24

Tight fitting goggles and mask for people working until we get a cure....pretty simple!!!!


----------



## loomis82

About to inject myself. I hate being on this stuff with everything going on bc it weakens your immune system!! I'm not old and if you saw me you'd think I was perfectly healthy.


----------



## Dovans

Saugeyefisher said:


> There is a long list of people hiring


Kroger is begging people..Bet it wont be long they will be offering hiring bonus..


----------



## Saugeyefisher

loomis82 said:


> About to inject myself. I hate being on this stuff with everything going on bc it weakens your immune system!! I'm not old and if you saw me you'd think I was perfectly healthy.


I feel lucky I havnt had to have my ra infusions in a few years now. 
I still take methotrexate ,but I was on both at one time.... 
Be careful, wash those hands!! And goodluck!


----------



## Saugeye Tom

montagc said:


> Where are you getting the $600 federal number?


They upped it brother


----------



## Saugeye Tom

hailtothethief said:


> They said the virus will spread. Now or later millions of people are gonna die unless they come up with a vaccine. We’ll need to repopulate and i’ll be happy to help.


Lord no. Not u


----------



## hailtothethief

Imagine tom having sex. Lol 

I read the virus can be spread through fecal matter. So practice safe hovering if you use public restrooms.


----------



## $diesel$

hailtothethief said:


> They said the virus will spread. Now or later millions of people are gonna die unless they come up with a vaccine. We’ll need to repopulate and i’ll be happy to help.


Hahahaha.......LMAO

It's good to see that some guys can find something to laugh about when 95% of the others are so staunch and dire.

Good post thief.


----------



## hailtothethief

People wanna bitch and whine about now but with all the infrastructure and school spending we’ll be in a renaissance eventually. It may take 5 10 or 20 years depending how bad the reaction is to this but when they were talking about making america great again they put 2 trillion to fix every bridge dam drinking water every school. When America gets backed into a corner they inevitably surge past everybody and this virus will be no different.


----------



## BuckeyeFishinNut

I was under the impression the $600 additional to unemployment was tossed out because the Dems wanted it to go to everyone on unemployment, not just those who lost their job to the Chinese Corona Virus. I thought what got put in was the Feds would subsidize the difference from your unemployment benefits and your full paycheck to make sure you got full pay for up to 4 months. Understand, this money will help pay rent/mortgage, bills, get groceries, but it isn't gonna do a damn thing for the economy, BECAUSE EVERYTHING IS SHUT DOWN! No consumers, no economy.

This has been bungled on so many levels. The after effects of the virus will be far more ranging than this virus will ever have been. Some economists are predicting a possible 30% unemployment rate when this is done, thats 100 million people out of work who were working prior to this. That number is probably high, but is it any higher than some of the bogus numbers that have been floated in these models of infections and deaths? 

There are so many questions that need to be answered. Why wasn't the national stockpile replenished after H1N1 in 08-09? Why did NY waste money on bogus projects (100s of millions of tax payer dollars) when they knew they had a short fall of medical supplies and were warned various times? Now we have people snitching on other people to various levels of government if they feel someone isn't adhering to the rules.

There is a reason prisons use solitary confinement as a punishment, humans aren't meant to be isolated. At best, a vaccine won't be green lighted until the end of this year, more than likely this time next year though. We can't just stay in our homes for 6 months to a year while we wait on a vaccine. Looks like antibody testing has been given the go ahead and will be a point of care type service, so results will be known very quickly. Once this rolls out, hopefully those with an immunity can go back to normal lives.


----------



## Southernsaug

Well, there's a bright side to everything. Some are looking forward to repopulating the country (yeah that ship sailed a few years ago), old farts are just happy to think they might be able to have sex again , politicians are positioning themselves to be heroes, heck you young guys will have less of us old retired farts getting to the fishing hole first. Please don't take the above comments as serious....I just wanted to lighten it up a little

Hopefully we survive and learn a lot for the future.


----------



## Deadeyedeek

Southernsaug said:


> Well, there's a bright side to everything. Some are looking forward to repopulating the country (yeah that ship sailed a few years ago), old farts are just happy to think they might be able to have sex again , politicians are positioning themselves to be heroes, heck you young guys will have less of us old retired farts getting to the fishing hole first. Please don't take the above comments as serious....I just wanted to lighten it up a little
> 
> Hopefully we survive and learn a lot for the future.


I have been following this from beginning..all I can say is I need a drink!!


----------



## crappiedude

This thread kind of reminds me of the white snapper thread.
Nothing new is ever said and very little useful information but I just can't stop reading it.


----------



## fiveeyes

crappiedude said:


> This thread kind of reminds me of the white snapper thread.
> Nothing new is ever said and very little useful information but I just can't stop reading it.


curiosity killed the cat


----------



## Shad Rap

Had a Bite said:


> Sorry bud, the information on the mask is 100% true. But if you can get you hands on those extended use mask, 20 day masks, let me know cause I know where you can get rich off selling them.
> 
> Now maybe your thinking that the company, Battelle I think, that will clean the mask and send back can do so up to 20 times. So if that what you mean, I apologize because then each mask can be used for 20 days. Just not all in a row.


The extended use N95 can be worn for 20 days or 20 shifts, this is straight from the Ohio nursing home facilities...unless of course they get soiled or breathing gets restricted...they keep them in a paper bag at the facility...my wife runs 7 nursing homes across the state...now maybe these are different than what you can get your hands on, I don't know.
BTW, I'm not saying you're wrong about your mask or what your company requests.
We did have two big boxes of hundreds of masks at the house but the wife has since went around to the facilities and passed them out...these weren't the extended use though.
Maybe this is just a nursing home directive about the extended use...I don't know...I'll ask her.


----------



## Shad Rap

crappiedude said:


> This thread kind of reminds me of the white snapper thread.
> Nothing new is ever said and very little useful information but I just can't stop reading it.


If you're looking for useful information about the virus on OGF then theres your first problem...


----------



## Shad Rap

fastwater said:


> Rooster...and all that think your rights are currently being stepped on...you clearly are not either old enough, or didn't live around areas affected by some of the riots back in the 60's.
> If you think your rights are being stepped on now...you would have thought you were in prison back then.
> Lockdowns and curfews in hotspots were the norm in various city's at different times for different things. Race riots and protests/riots pertaining to the Vietnam War cropped up all over the US during that era.
> Speaking specifically of Cols., Ohio since that's what I'm most familiar with...if you got caught traveling(either walking or driving)within certain 'hotspot' parameters set by LE, there was no tickets or warnings given. Your butt went to jail. If you lived within the hotspot and got caught on the street during daylight, non-curfew hours, you better be a medical emergency or you were headed straight to the grocery store.
> All Business's in many of those areas were forced to close. And yes, these businesses were first asked to close as rioting continued but didn't...they were then forced to. If you worked in those areas...too bad. Better not be caught in the area.
> And I can tell you for certain, those business's nor their workers got any compensation from the government.
> Why did all these emergency laws go into affect?
> For the same reason the current emergency orders are in place now...for the safety and welfare of ALL people.
> And just like back then...today, there are a certain percentage of people that still aren't adhering to the current lenient orders.
> Watch and see, before it's over those orders WILL be ramped up, especially in hotspots and will start to be more strictly enforced as they should have been all along.


Thank god this is 2020...you will NEVER get 100% participation on what the state wants nowadays...you can't...I'm not disagreeing with you that in hot spots shlt needs to be ramped up...fortunately, that's not us.


----------



## Patricio

Reminder: this state is letting criminals go free...
A paddleboarder was arrested in Malibu Thursday after ignoring lifeguards’ orders to get out of the ocean amid social distancing rules, authorities said.
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/of...er-for-flouting-state-stay-at-home-order/amp/


----------



## Rooster

Patricio said:


> Reminder: this state is letting criminals go free...
> A paddleboarder was arrested in Malibu Thursday after ignoring lifeguards’ orders to get out of the ocean amid social distancing rules, authorities said.
> https://ktla.com/news/local-news/of...er-for-flouting-state-stay-at-home-order/amp/


Welcome to the Police State

Next up for the "Land of the Free":

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...ont-tolerate-lockdown-violators-idUSKBN21K0AY


----------



## Misdirection

I have an employee out in NJ who went into the hospital Wednesday evening, tested positive for Covid-19. I'm pretty worried about him. He's 70, with a history of cardiovascular issues...

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


----------



## BuckeyeFishin07

Misdirection said:


> I have an employee out in NJ who went into the hospital Wednesday evening, tested positive for Covid-19. I'm pretty worried about him. He's 70, with a history of cardiovascular issues...
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


Will say a prayer for this gentleman!


----------



## glacier_dropsy

One thing is for sure, this virus is not like any flu I have ever seen. The rate at which people go from walking and talking but a bit short of breath to failing on max ventilator settings is not good. The thought of taking care of hospitals full of people like that with large numbers of new patients showing up every day is beyond intimidating. I don't care if you call it the Chinese virus, or the Wuhan coronavirus, or even the 'rona, just don't call it a flu, because that aint no flu.


----------



## Mr. Map

So, any critique of the current administrations handling of the virus gets deleted from this thread? 
Goodbye forever from another Ohio fisherman.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Mr. Map said:


> So, any critique of the current administrations handling of the virus gets deleted from this thread?
> Goodbye forever from another Ohio fisherman.


I doubt if you'll be missed. There are rules about politics. Try to follow them.


----------



## CoonDawg92

Never even heard of you.


----------



## Mr. Map

Snakecharmer said:


> I doubt if you'll be missed. There are rules about politics. Try to follow them.


As more of us leave, as will the advertisers.


----------



## Dovans

I can honestly say upon hearing my wife was not allowed to enter her work place because of a elevated temp, I felt like puking. (thurs) I had some mild depression and panic attacks as well following the revelation, . She of course is calm. Because she is deemed medical personal she was tested (today, Fri) and the results are to be expedited. Still probably will not know till Monday. She does not feel like she is ill. She was surprised to hear she had a temp. (99.7) 

She does not have a temp today. Taken numerous times. I have not had a temp.

She and I am also coming to the belief that perhaps Mt. Carmel's thermometer might be FU. Hope so. They did do two readings. with the average being 99.6. 

When she went for the test, she was one of four cars. She went to Mt. Carmel and they had a drive through set up. Did not take long.

She is living like a queen right now. She has been making masks for her nurse friends.


----------



## Specwar

Just saying but my normal temp is and has been around 99.3 or so for my entire life. Not all are equal from what I have been told by a Dr. or two in the past.


----------



## crappiedude

Mr. Map said:


> So, any critique of the current administrations handling of the virus gets deleted from this thread?
> Goodbye forever from another Ohio fisherman.


Goodbye
Thank you mods...I hate seeing politics on here.
I'd turn on the TV if I wanted to see that.


----------



## Saugeyefisher

crappiedude said:


> Goodbye
> Thank you mods...I hate seeing politics on here.
> I'd turn on the TV if I wanted to see that.


Here here


----------



## BuckeyeFishin07

Dovans said:


> I can honestly say upon hearing my wife was not allowed to enter her work place because of a elevated temp, I felt like puking. (thurs) I had some mild depression and panic attacks as well following the revelation, . She of course is calm. Because she is deemed medical personal she was tested (today, Fri) and the results are to be expedited. Still probably will not know till Monday. She does not feel like she is ill. She was surprised to hear she had a temp. (99.7)
> 
> She does not have a temp today. Taken numerous times. I have not had a temp.
> 
> She and I am also coming to the belief that perhaps Mt. Carmel's thermometer might be FU. Hope so. They did do two readings. with the average being 99.6.
> 
> When she went for the test, she was one of four cars. She went to Mt. Carmel and they had a drive through set up. Did not take long.
> 
> She is living like a queen right now. She has been making masks for her nurse friends.


Praying for good results for you folks! I made my wife quit her job this week because I felt she was no longer safe. She was not happy with me at the moment but she is understanding more as she looks past the first emotions! That paycheck is not her or my life. Neither of us were sleeping, she was worried she would bring it home to me, I have asthma, and I was just waiting for that phone call of her saying I don't feel good and have a fever! So just felt it was the right decision, prayed on that one a lot!


----------



## Lundy

Mr. Map said:


> So, any critique of the current administrations handling of the virus gets deleted from this thread?
> Goodbye forever from another Ohio fisherman.


I did not delete any posts by you and can’t find any posts by you that have been 
deleted by anyone. I could have missed it I guess but don’t see anything. That said if you did or do make a political post it would, will be deleted.

As to whether you stay or go that is entirely up to you, at this time


----------



## Muddy

Dovans said:


> I can honestly say upon hearing my wife was not allowed to enter her work place because of a elevated temp, I felt like puking. (thurs) I had some mild depression and panic attacks as well following the revelation, . She of course is calm. Because she is deemed medical personal she was tested (today, Fri) and the results are to be expedited. Still probably will not know till Monday. She does not feel like she is ill. She was surprised to hear she had a temp. (99.7)
> 
> She does not have a temp today. Taken numerous times. I have not had a temp.
> 
> She and I am also coming to the belief that perhaps Mt. Carmel's thermometer might be FU. Hope so. They did do two readings. with the average being 99.6.
> 
> When she went for the test, she was one of four cars. She went to Mt. Carmel and they had a drive through set up. Did not take long.
> 
> She is living like a queen right now. She has been making masks for her nurse friends.


I hope she is OK. Thanks again to you for keeping the food flowing. You are a good American. We found that thermometers can vary widely. We took multiple temps of our family members using the same thermometer to create a baseline for each family member and recorded the data. That way we can use the same thermometer to determine if any of us have a variance from the baseline average.


----------



## Rooster

This thread gets bashed for not containing any information. Guarantee that there is something in these links that you didn’t already know. The information we do know is dwarfed by what we don't know. The SARS-CoV-2 was only discovered a little over 100 days ago, and by definition there cannot possibly be any "experts" on this particular virus. However, there are certainly some very knowledgeable people out there. Just some links that I found interesting (and creditable):



Evidence from preliminary studies and field reports that SARS-CoV-2 is spreading in aerosols is mixed.

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-00974-w



Q: Does the weather or indoor temperature affect the survival of the COVID-19 virus on surfaces?

A: There is no evidence one way or the other. The virus's viability in exposure to heat or cold has not been studied.

https://hub.jhu.edu/2020/03/20/sars-cov-2-survive-on-surfaces/



Incredible amount of information here:

https://www.globalhealthnow.org/2020-02/coronavirus-expert-reality-check#graham


----------



## Snakecharmer

Checked with the wife and the state has started paying her unemployment. She's a dental hygienist and DeWine has closed dental offices except for emergencies to save on PPE so she been out of work.


----------



## ditchdigger

Buster24 said:


> Tight fitting goggles and mask for people working until we get a cure....pretty simple!!!!


I agree, let’s wear those tight fitting goggles/masks/rubber gloves for now and get America working again before it’s too late!


----------



## 1more

Snakecharmer said:


> Checked with the wife and the state has started paying her unemployment. She's a dental hygienist and DeWine has closed dental offices except for emergencies to save on PPE so she been out of work.


Don’t all dentist office have ventilators? Why not send a few where needed till this is over???
Just a thought.


----------



## Snakecharmer

1more said:


> Don’t all dentist office have ventilators? Why not send a few where needed till this is over???
> Just a thought.


Just verified her office doesn't have any ventilators.


----------



## yonderfishin

Just a couple thoughts I had.....

This is no longer a disease only the weak or elderly have to be concerned about , there are people of all ages being infected and even dying from it , regardless of age or health related circumstances.

The elephant in the room nobody wants to mention is that without a vaccination , when we eventually ease the restrictions and open back up again there is very likely to be atleast one more round of contagion surge. The virus will still be out there being passed around unknowingly and if we try to resume life as normal again how can we not expect a repeat ? Everyone is planning where they will go and who they will visit once the restrictions are lifted , but the smart thing to do would be to carry on as we are right now for quite a while afterwards. 

My intention here is not to spread negativity , just careful thought about future potential risks. Nobody wants to go through all this to wind up with the virus the day after restrictions are lifted and we sure dont want to run right over to visit loved ones and wind up bringing it to them , thinking all must be well if the restrictions are lifted.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

Mr. Map said:


> So, any critique of the current administrations handling of the virus gets deleted from this thread?
> Goodbye forever from another Ohio fisherman.


A member for 8 years and 61 posts....huh...the mods here have a tough job and they are not compensated . I'm sure that they may have removed a post of mine..maybe 2..I probably deserved it


----------



## glacier_dropsy

yonderfishin said:


> Just a couple thoughts I had.....
> 
> This is no longer a disease only the weak or elderly have to be concerned about , there are people of all ages being infected and even dying from it , regardless of age or health related circumstances.
> 
> The elephant in the room nobody wants to mention is that without a vaccination , when we eventually ease the restrictions and open back up again there is very likely to be atleast one more round of contagion surge. The virus will still be out there being passed around unknowingly and if we try to resume life as normal again how can we not expect a repeat ? Everyone is planning where they will go and who they will visit once the restrictions are lifted , but the smart thing to do would be to carry on as we are right now for quite a while afterwards.
> 
> My intention here is not to spread negativity , just careful thought about future potential risks. Nobody wants to go through all this to wind up with the virus the day after restrictions are lifted and we sure dont want to run right over to visit loved ones and wind up bringing it to them , thinking all must be well if the restrictions are lifted.



I agree with much of what you said, but I still see a partial path out before the vaccine. If we can get the number of active infections down and the testing ramped up, we can do what epidemiologists do best, track and isolate. That may be assisted by a slower expansion rate because the population will have at least some immunity, so not every contact is at risk to catch and spread. 

This thing caught us with our pants down. We found ourselves in a war with an enemy we could not see and had no weapons with which to fight back. Our only option was a bloody retreat, that is crushing the economy and lots of hard working people. Italy showed us what happens if you let this virus spread unchecked. Isolation was our only tool. That has bought us time. Now we can ramp up the testing. Now we can ramp up production of the supplies the healthcare providers need. Now we can make more temporary hospital beds, and in some places temporary morgues. Pretty soon we will lift some restrictions and take our best shot at this, it wont be clean, but it will be better than if we tried to fight it where it found us


----------



## fishingful

I am currently off work till at least may 3. That was extended from March 31. Luckily I am still geting paid and that's not the case for everyone. My wife is working remotely from home. We are in a fortunate possition that we could pay bills and continue living for better than a year even without pay. We have made conscious decisions and considerable sacrifices to put ourselves in a possition to be where we are.

I have not gone out to a store in 14 days untill yesterday. I went to Home Depot and Walmart. Really weird being out and I saw everything from people not careing to full respirators. Not many peopls in parks around me so we enjoy walks during weekdays. Too many people out on weekends.

I looked at the Cleveland area cases and right now the most reported cases are the upper class areas of Cuyahoga County. 2 reasons I can think of....increased acess to testing and people thinking that they have a felling of being untouchable.

I don't know of anyone that has contacted the virus yet. I hope I don't.


----------



## glacier_dropsy

fishingful said:


> I am currently off work till at least may 3. That was extended from March 31. Luckily I am still geting paid and that's not the case for everyone. My wife is working remotely from home. We are in a fortunate possition that we could pay bills and continue living for better than a year even without pay. We have made conscious decisions and considerable sacrifices to put ourselves in a possition to be where we are.
> 
> I have not gone out to a store in 14 days untill yesterday. I went to Home Depot and Walmart. Really weird being out and I saw everything from people not careing to full respirators. Not many peopls in parks around me so we enjoy walks during weekdays. Too many people out on weekends.
> 
> I looked at the Cleveland area cases and right now the most reported cases are the upper class areas of Cuyahoga County. 2 reasons I can think of....increased acess to testing and people thinking that they have a felling of being untouchable.
> 
> I don't know of anyone that has contacted the virus yet. I hope I don't.


Much of the initial spread of this virus in the US was by people that had the means to travel. Lots of nodes in affluent area codes.


----------



## fishingful

True! We have no kids and we travel a bunch. Mexico in December and Caribbean in January. Luckily not overseas.


----------



## jdl447

.


----------



## fishingful

Thats a estimated world population page. Its great and all but basically I don't care about who is being born. I don't have kids or will have kids. I do care about childern all that is telling me is that more people are being born then dieing. 

Wait till the baby boomers start droping. Not that I am wanting that. But look at the current age and population numbers.


----------



## jdl447

.


----------



## fishingful

I will have what he is having!


----------



## Patricio

crappiedude said:


> Goodbye
> Thank you mods...I hate seeing politics on here.
> I'd turn on the TV if I wanted to see that.


BINGO!


----------



## yonderfishin

glacier_dropsy said:


> I agree with much of what you said, but I still see a partial path out before the vaccine. If we can get the number of active infections down and the testing ramped up, we can do what epidemiologists do best, track and isolate. That may be assisted by a slower expansion rate because the population will have at least some immunity, so not every contact is at risk to catch and spread


Hopefully this will make a difference , but the thing still spreads before anybody knows they are spreading it. Add to that , hundreds of thousands to millions may still have no immunity. Thats about like playing russian roulette except in reverse , one chamber empty instead of all but one. I hope I am wrong but in any case , if you or your family have not been exposed to it yet then its not going back to the way things were before.


----------



## crappiedude

fishingful said:


> We are in a fortunate possition that we could pay bills and continue living for better than a year even without pay. We have made conscious decisions and considerable sacrifices to put ourselves in a possition to be where we are.


More people should try to put themselves into this position. For some it's not an easy place to get to but I do believe it is possible for most people to achieve.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Interesting none the less..


----------



## glacier_dropsy

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Interesting none the less..


Thanks for that, good stuff. The part near the beginning where the hard hitting citizen investigator asked the first responder, "How do you know they had coronavirus, did you guys test them in the ambulance?"


----------



## bulafisherman

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Interesting none the less..


 thanks for sharing. The thing that should anger us more than anything is the mainstream media making a comparison recently were they said the corona virus death toll have now passed the 911 deaths, they should be boycotted for that, not even in the same ballpark! But I guess if you want to strike fear into the hearts and minds of the public that's one way to do it.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

bulafisherman said:


> thanks for sharing


I’m one who will follow the rules because I don’t want to get sick or get anyone sick if that’s the case. But at the end of the day, none of know what is really going on. I will say Big Pharm has a lot of control in this country. Both times I was in the hospital the last 3 weeks when I walked in... empty. When I was let out of my quarantined room during my 2nd visit, everyone on the floor didn’t have any masks on and I was on the “quarantine” floor. But when I tested negative, they moved me to another wing on the same floor. I don’t trust the mayor of NYC and I damn sure don’t trust the media. But like I said, don’t want to be one passing or getting a virus either. Do they have me where they want me or is this virus really as devastating as they tell us it is? Who knows.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Brought to you by the Tin-foil Hat Network...


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Snakecharmer said:


> Brought to you by the Tin-foil Hat Network...


Hopefully you have some answers but just curious if you have seen anything concrete either way or have you just been sitting in your recliner soaking up you some CNN? And I don’t want to hear from your brother’s neighbor’s cousin from a 2 marriage please.


----------



## glacier_dropsy

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> I’m one who will follow the rules because I don’t want to get sick or get anyone sick if that’s the case. But at the end of the day, none of know what is really going on. I will say Big Pharm has a lot of control in this country. Both times I was in the hospital the last 3 weeks when I walked in... empty. When I was let out of my quarantined room during my 2nd visit, everyone on the floor didn’t have any masks on and I was on the “quarantine” floor. But when I tested negative, they moved me to another wing on the same floor. I don’t trust the mayor of NYC and I damn sure don’t trust the media. But like I said, don’t want to be one passing or getting a virus either. Do they have me where they want me or is this virus really as devastating as they tell us it is? Who knows.


Most of the hospitals in Ohio are relatively empty right now. They have been sending people home sooner than usual to make room and get vulnerable people away from what we suspect is coming. And visitors are not allowed, so yeah, many hospitals are eerily quiet right now.


----------



## bulafisherman

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> I’m one who will follow the rules because I don’t want to get sick or get anyone sick if that’s the case. But at the end of the day, none of know what is really going on. I will say Big Pharm has a lot of control in this country. Both times I was in the hospital the last 3 weeks when I walked in... empty. When I was let out of my quarantined room during my 2nd visit, everyone on the floor didn’t have any masks on and I was on the “quarantine” floor. But when I tested negative, they moved me to another wing on the same floor. I don’t trust the mayor of NYC and I damn sure don’t trust the media. But like I said, don’t want to be one passing or getting a virus either. Do they have me where they want me or is this virus really as devastating as they tell us it is? Who knows.


 I agree 100 % some of these outlets need held accountable for what they put out there. Need to be able to see it for what it really is.


----------



## crittergitter

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Interesting none the less..


The NY part is interesting, but KY and Hawaii aren't exactly hotbeds for the virus. Let's not forget that YouTubers can edit video too!!


----------



## loweman165

I'm going to say something that might get me flamed BUT the majority of people I know that are all for shutting everything down are students and kids and retirees.


----------



## KaGee

According to the news this morning a lot of you are in trouble when it comes to this virus.
Two primary characteristics of those who have succumbed to the virus are: underlying chronic conditions and obesity. That's right, being fat makes you susceptible.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

crittergitter said:


> The NY part is interesting, but KY and Hawaii aren't exactly hotbeds for the virus. Let's not forget that YouTubers can edit video too!!


Well they supposedly have 34 deaths so far with a stay at home order like most of the country.


----------



## KaGee

loweman165 said:


> I'm going to say something that might get me flamed BUT the majority of people I know that are all for shutting everything down are students and kids and retirees.


I don't know anyone for it. Quite the opposite.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

KaGee said:


> According to the news this morning a lot of you are in trouble when it comes to this virus.
> Two primary characteristics of those who have succumbed to the virus are: underlying chronic conditions and obesity. That's right, being fat makes you susceptible.


Ok are you saying I’m a goner or are you really saying, you’re not fat?


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

loweman165 said:


> I'm going to say something that might get me flamed BUT the majority of people I know that are all for shutting everything down are students and kids and retirees.


Well I’m sure not for it. What are people going to do when they run out of funds? This is my biggest fear. She and I are both fortunate to still have income but I couldn’t stand around knowing, kid’s especially, have nothing to eat.


----------



## KaGee

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Ok are you saying I’m a goner or are you really saying, you’re not fat?


Ha!I'm saying most of us, me included, are in trouble if simply being overweight is a check mark against survivability.


----------



## loweman165

News this morning "claims" 75% of ohioans that had it did not need hospitalization. Elderly and underlying conditions did. Be less impact if the 25% quarantined themselves if they are a risk and let us healthy folks keep pumping money into the economy. If you think uncle sam has the funds for a two month shutdown I think your fooling yourself. We're feeling the economic effects of this for years to come.


----------



## AmericanEagle

I do not completely trust the government or the media. I don't believe that Oswald acted alone when he assassinated Kennedy or the body counts during the Vietnam war. I didn't believe the CDC when they said that an individual wearing a mask would not help prevent the spread of the coronavirus. All you had to do was look at Asia and see everyone wearing masks to know there was something wrong with that statement.

I firmly believe the coronavirus pandemic is real. I do not believe that all the governments in the world are creating a vast conspiracy. Every place that did nothing to stop the spread has had to eventually lock down with disastrous results. I don't believe that all the county coroners in the state of Ohio are lying when they say there are 91 dead. I believe it when Ohio hospitals say 895 people are hospitalized. Is there anyone who doubts that 7,469 Americans have died from COVID-19?

Anecdotally I believe the health care workers I know who are all taking this deadly serious. I felt that it was likely true early on when people in this forum posted that it was worse in China than we were being told. I can't recall any posts in this forum from health care workers that say they don't believe this is a deadly serious problem. Is there any one who believes the health care workers who post here are making this up?

The media sensationalizes stories but doesn't have to sensationalize this. It is what it is.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Cuomo on cnn now says they are still working under hospital capacity. Last week he was saying they were over run with not enough beds or equipment. Something just isn’t right.


----------



## whal

Agree


----------



## whal

Agree with loweman165


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

AmericanEagle said:


> I do not completely trust the government or the media. I don't believe that Oswald acted alone when he assassinated Kennedy or the body counts during the Vietnam war. I didn't believe the CDC when they said that an individual wearing a mask would not help prevent the spread of the coronavirus. All you had to do was look at Asia and see everyone wearing masks to know there was something wrong with that statement.
> 
> I firmly believe the coronavirus pandemic is real. I do not believe that all the governments in the world are creating a vast conspiracy. Every place that did nothing to stop the spread has had to eventually lock down with disastrous results. I don't believe that all the county coroners in the state of Ohio are lying when they say there are 91 dead. I believe it when Ohio hospitals say 895 people are hospitalized. Is there anyone who doubts that 7,469 Americans have died from COVID-19?
> 
> Anecdotally I believe the health care workers I know who are all taking this deadly serious. I felt that it was likely true early on when people in this forum posted that it was worse in China than we were being told. I can't recall any posts in this forum from health care workers that say they don't believe this is a deadly serious problem. Is there any one who believes the health care workers who post here are making this up?
> 
> The media sensationalizes stories but doesn't have to sensationalize this. It is what it is.


Don’t take my reply the wrong way please but this is a pretty broad statement. Most everything you stated aren’t really facts. I believe there is a virus also. Im just not sure it’s as bad or at least I hope not as it is portrayed. A lot of the Asian population has been wearing masks in public for years now. We have not seen actual cause of death records which could be pretty broad also. And nobody on this forum knows if the China numbers are real or not. And the heath care workers, god bless them, are doing a fine job which is what they are told to do. I’m not going to beat a dead horse with flu and vehicle accident death numbers, these numbers being facts, I understand you really cant compare with this virus due to there are no end results as of yet. Please don’t use the “ if it was someone you loved card” as I’ve been down that road already. A few times actually. We all are entitled to our opinions and hope for the best.


----------



## AmericanEagle

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Don’t take my reply the wrong way please but this is a pretty broad statement. Most everything you stated aren’t really facts. I believe there is a virus also. Im just not sure it’s as bad or at least I hope not as it is portrayed. A lot of the Asian population has been wearing masks in public for years now. We have not seen actual cause of death records which could be pretty broad also. And nobody on this forum knows if the China numbers are real or not. And the heath care workers, god bless them, are doing a fine job which is what they are told to do. I’m not going to beat a dead horse with flu and vehicle accident death numbers, these numbers being facts, I understand you really cant compare with this virus due to there are no end results as of yet. Please don’t use the “ if it was someone you loved card” as I’ve been down that road already. A few times actually. We all are entitled to our opinions and hope for the best.


No offense taken.

Are you saying that 91 dead and 895 hospitalized in Ohio are not facts?

Are you saying 7,469 Americans dead is not a fact?

Are you saying that every place that did nothing to stop the spread has had to eventually lock down with disastrous results is not a fact? If so please give me a example of a country who has let the virus run unchecked with good results?


----------



## Southernsaug

The video showing empty hospitals, did it have any time and date stamps. If you picked the right time to film 30 seconds of footage you can prove anything, that also applies to mainstream media and most forum arguments. Pick your time, data and limited facts and you can make a good case for any position. It all comes down to you either believe your officials or you don't until you see for yourself. I personally see no reason for them to lie from coast to coast....someone always rats out a fraud. Prudence says do as they say until you can unequivocally prove they're wrong.


----------



## Legend killer

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Don’t take my reply the wrong way please but this is a pretty broad statement. Most everything you stated aren’t really facts. I believe there is a virus also. Im just not sure it’s as bad or at least I hope not as it is portrayed. A lot of the Asian population has been wearing masks in public for years now. We have not seen actual cause of death records which could be pretty broad also. And nobody on this forum knows if the China numbers are real or not. And the heath care workers, god bless them, are doing a fine job which is what they are told to do. I’m not going to beat a dead horse with flu and vehicle accident death numbers, these numbers being facts, I understand you really cant compare with this virus due to there are no end results as of yet. Please don’t use the “ if it was someone you loved card” as I’ve been down that road already. A few times actually. We all are entitled to our opinions and hope for the best.


You can't make this crap up.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

AmericanEagle said:


> No offense taken.
> 
> Are you saying that 91 dead and 895 hospitalized in Ohio are not facts?
> 
> Are you saying 7,469 Americans dead is not a fact?
> 
> Are you saying that every place that did nothing to stop the spread has had to eventually lock down with disastrous results is not a fact? If so please give me a example of a country who has let the virus run unchecked this with good results?


C’mon you know I’m not saying those things. I said I believe there is a virus. And I guarantee if you read any of those poor people’s death certs that has lost their life, the cause of death isn’t going to be “Coronavirus”. I will read some sort of respiratory issue. Broad. Please don’t think that this virus is the only “heath issue” killing Ohio people, or people in the country for that matter. Because it’s not. Broad. Can you tell me if all of these lockdowns didn’t take place, that the numbers wouldn’t roughly be the same? No you can’t. You can of course hypothesize and have an opinion. Broad. It’s a bad situation for everyone for sure but I’m beginning to believe that the long term effects are going to be much worse economically.


----------



## loweman165

https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/china-oregon-sending-1100-ventilators-ny-cuomo-69977854
Omg are you kidding me? Who wants to use a ventilator from China. Thanks but no thanks.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Southernsaug said:


> The video showing empty hospitals, did it have any time and date stamps. If you picked the right time to film 30 seconds of footage you can prove anything, that also applies to mainstream media and most forum arguments. Pick your time, data and limited facts and you can make a good case for any position. It all comes down to you either believe your officials or you don't until you see for yourself. I personally see no reason for them to lie from coast to coast....someone always rats out a fraud. Prudence says do as they say until you can equivocally prove they're wrong.


Yea you could be right. Maybe all of New York was on their lunch break at the time. I mean we’re only talking about New York, the epicenter of the corona virus in the USA.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

montagc said:


> Hospitals are not doing elective surgeries, and are discharging patients that do not need intensive care. It’s prep work To open up resources for an expected surge in cases of the virus. But believe what you want. I’m getting info from healthcare workers, not some random YouTube video.


Expected being the key word here.. but there is nothing wrong with being prepared by no means. Hopefully it’s not what they expect.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

I do have a serious question for all of the experts on here. Where were you guys at from April 12 2009 to April 10 2010 when the H1N1 virus infected 60 mil of us and killed 13000 of us? We could have used you.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

montagc said:


> Also, I want to be clear. There is no fear mongering in my posts. I’m not afraid of this thing. I may be ok, or not, If I get it. I get that all people die eventually, and am not pulling my hair out with worry about Me or my loved ones. To me it’s not about death. It’s about life, and giving everyone the best chance to live out their days with their loved ones in a manner of their choosing. Isn’t that what we all want?


Well I for one hope you and your loved ones never get it. Stay safe.


----------



## glacier_dropsy

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> I do have a serious question for all of the experts on here. Where were you guys at from April 12 2009 to April 10 2010 when the H1N1 virus infected 60 mil of us and killed 13000 of us? We could have used you.


Im no expert, but I was in the hospital, caring for some of them. The level of public alarm seemed appropriate at the time for what we were dealing with, a really bad flu.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

glacier_dropsy said:


> I was there, in the hospital, caring for some of them. The level of public alarm seemed appropriate at the time for what we were dealing with, a really bad flu.


A really bad flu that killed thousands in this country alone correct? Also another question that you can maybe answer. Being that Coronavirus’s are very common in humans did H1N1 virus and SARS start out as a corona virus?


----------



## glacier_dropsy

H1N1 was a virulent form of influenza, the flu. The flu will probably never go away, because it can change out the stuff on its surface that our antibodies recognize, some forms more virulent than others. Read about antigenic shift and drift if you want to learn more about the flu. SARS was a deadly coronavirus that people were able to dig a moat around, and it went away. MERS was a similar virus. This SARS has escaped containment and is now a pandemic.


----------



## AmericanEagle

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> C’mon you know I’m not saying those things. I said I believe there is a virus. And I guarantee if you read any of those poor people’s death certs that has lost their life, the cause of death isn’t going to be “Coronavirus”. I will read some sort of respiratory issue. Broad. Please don’t think that this virus is the only “heath issue” killing Ohio people, or people in the country for that matter. Because it’s not. Broad. Can you tell me if all of these lockdowns didn’t take place, that the numbers wouldn’t roughly be the same? No you can’t. You can of course hypothesize and have an opinion. Broad. It’s a bad situation for everyone for sure but I’m beginning to believe that the long term effects are going to be much worse economically.


I have no idea how you think so I was pleased to see you do feel that the death and hospitalization statistics are facts. I have limited experience with death certificates but can tell you my fathers stated pneumonia not “some sort of respiratory issue”.

“Can you tell me if all of these lock downs didn’t take place, that the numbers wouldn’t roughly be the same?”

Thank you for asking.

People have no immunity to novel coronavirus is and it spreads exponentially. Every country that I am aware of where that let it run eventually was so horrified by the death totals that they instituted locked downs. I can not find one that let it run. Why did they lock down? They did so because there is solid scientific data that lock downs work to mitigate the death rate.

Consider St Louis and Philadelphia in the 1918 flu. If you read the link on St Louis you will see when they let up the lock down deaths went up and they had to reinstate .

https://www.influenzaarchive.org/cities/city-stlouis.html#

https://www.businessinsider.com/his...philadelphia-treated-1918-flu-pandemic-2020-4

In the words of George Santayana “Those that cannot learn from history are doomed to repeat it”

I am not trying to give you a hard time or disrespect you. I ask again respectfully, can you show me an example of a country that has let the coronavirus run with good results?


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

glacier_dropsy said:


> H1N1 was a virulent form of influenza, the flu. The flu will probably never go away, because it can change out the stuff on its surface that our antibodies recognize, some forms more virulent than others. Read about antigenic shift and drift if you want to learn more about the flu. SARS was a deadly coronavirus that people were able to dig a moat around, and it went away. MERS was a similar virus. This SARS has escaped containment and is now a pandemic.


Thanks! I understand somewhat how the flu works. A lot of factors involved for sure. I did read that SARS is killing people again also. Is there a vaccine for both SARS and MERS?


----------



## glacier_dropsy

This coronavirus that we are now dealing with is SARS CoV-2, and there is no vaccine for either form of SARS, and no vaccine for MERS


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

AmericanEagle said:


> I have no idea how you think so I was pleased to see you do feel that the death and hospitalization statistics are facts. I have limited experience with death certificates but can tell you my fathers stated pneumonia not “some sort of respiratory issue”.
> 
> “Can you tell me if all of these lock downs didn’t take place, that the numbers wouldn’t roughly be the same?”
> 
> Thank you for asking.
> 
> People have no immunity to novel coronavirus is and it spreads exponentially. Every country that I am aware of where that let it run eventually was so horrified by the death totals that they instituted locked downs. I can not find one that let it run. Why did they lock down? They did so because there is solid scientific data that lock downs work to mitigate the death rate.
> 
> Consider St Louis and Philadelphia in the 1918 flu. If you read the link on St Louis you will see when they let up the lock down deaths went up and they had to reinstate .
> 
> https://www.influenzaarchive.org/cities/city-stlouis.html#
> 
> https://www.businessinsider.com/his...philadelphia-treated-1918-flu-pandemic-2020-4
> 
> In the words of George Santayana “Those that cannot learn from history are doomed to repeat it”
> 
> I am not trying to give you a hard time or disrespect you. I ask again respectfully, can you show me an example of a country that has let the coronavirus run with good results?


Haha, I didn’t say that it would actually read “some sort of respiratory issue”. It would say something like exactly what you stated, pneumonia which is a respiratory issue or some other respiratory failure. I can’t answer your question about the lockdown because I’m not aware of any country that did or didn’t do it when they should have but I would think it would probably maybe get worse without one and I never said I was against a lockdown. You can’t compare this to the 1918 flu. Apples and oranges. Well you can I guess but then you have to accept the fact that the common flu has been way more deadly annually in this country than this current virus which is not a flu apparently. So do you see where I’m going with this? Nobody knows... and again, we all have our opinions.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

glacier_dropsy said:


> This coronavirus that we are now dealing with is SARS CoV-2, and there is no vaccine for either form of SARS, and no vaccine for MERS


Thanks. Ok so SARS CoV which was identified in 2003 is basically this same sever acute respiratory virus we have today, just a v2?


----------



## glacier_dropsy

It is similar enough that some people in the virology sphere saw fit to call it a version of SARS. It is not the same as the first version we encountered.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

glacier_dropsy said:


> It is similar enough that some people in the virology sphere saw fit to call it a version of SARS. It is not the same as the first version we encountered.


Thanks for answering my questions. It’s bittersweet to hear from someone with actual but unfortunate facts. Thanks also for being one of those out there on the front line.


----------



## glacier_dropsy

The hospital is not the front line, it is the last line of defense. The front line, for now, is public spaces. Stay at home as best you can, limit contact, don't send more sick people our way than need be.


----------



## lunder

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> I do have a serious question for all of the experts on here. Where were you guys at from April 12 2009 to April 10 2010 when the H1N1 virus infected 60 mil of us and killed 13000 of us? We could have used you.


That could be fair question for discussion or debate on April 10, 2021 but right now doesn't seem pertinent.


----------



## dcool

glacier_dropsy said:


> The hospital is not the front line, it is the last line of defense. The front line, for now, is public spaces. Stay at home as best you can, limit contact, don't send more sick people our way than need be.


Well said!


----------



## Saugeyefisher

glacier_dropsy said:


> The hospital is not the front line, it is the last line of defense. The front line, for now, is public spaces. Stay at home as best you can, limit contact, don't send more sick people our way than need be.


Thanks for dropping all this info for us.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

KaGee said:


> Ha!I'm saying most of us, me included, are in trouble if simply being overweight is a check mark against survivability.


I'm pleasantly plump


----------



## Saugeye Tom




----------



## buckeyebowman

I see the President advised folks to wear cloth masks when going out anywhere. I have no idea where to buy one. Any suggestions? Never seen them at a drugstore, of course I wasn't exactly looking for them either.


----------



## loweman165

buckeyebowman said:


> I see the President advised folks to wear cloth masks when going out anywhere. I have no idea where to buy one. Any suggestions? Never seen them at a drugstore, of course I wasn't exactly looking for them either.


I think alot of people are making them now. I forgot a had a hand full of m95s in a cabinet downstairs but I still don't wear them out. If my wife or kids want to go ahead.


----------



## Templeton

Lots of people are making the cloth masks at home with their sewing machines, the patterns vary from ones with pockets between the outer and inner layer, there are claims that vacuum bag materials and the blue paper shop towels can be cut to fit and enhance the filtering. Have also heard that a cloth handkerchief is better than nothing. All of the cloth ones have to be laundered after single use so I have heard. Not sure what is right or wrong these days, however I don't think you can over do the precautions especially if you are high risk or have someone at home who is.


----------



## Snakecharmer

buckeyebowman said:


> I see the President advised folks to wear cloth masks when going out anywhere. I have no idea where to buy one. Any suggestions? Never seen them at a drugstore, of course I wasn't exactly looking for them either.


How about a fishing gaiter? Look at the 5th photo...
https://www.cabelas.com/product/BASS-PRO-SHOPS-SUNSTOPPER/3555516.uts?slotId=2


----------



## hailtothethief

You can wear a hanky like the old westerns


----------



## Snakecharmer

hailtothethief said:


> You can wear a hanky like the old westerns


Saw a guy at the hardware store today... Thought he was a bank robber...


----------



## Hatchetman

Well, good old NYC did it big this time. Sent Coronavirus patients to the Navy Hospital Ship Comfort, may have contaminated the whole ship now. It was all over the news that NO virus patients were going to be treated there, just the regular type hospital patients to take the pressure off the city hospitals. How could this happen???!!!


----------



## Snakecharmer

Hatchetman said:


> Well, good old NYC did it big this time. Sent Coronavirus patients to the Navy Hospital Ship Comfort, may have contaminated the whole ship now. It was all over the news that NO virus patients were going to be treated there, just the regular type hospital patients to take the pressure off the city hospitals. How could this happen???!!!


NYC is F upped


----------



## ErieRider

buckeyebowman said:


> I see the President advised folks to wear cloth masks when going out anywhere. I have no idea where to buy one. Any suggestions? Never seen them at a drugstore, of course I wasn't exactly looking for them either.


https://kimkaps.com/product-category/kimkap-masks/

My wife got some from here. She buys the surgical caps when she is in surgery rooms... they are good quality.. she says the masks with elastic around your ears gets pretty painful after awhile. Said most prefer the tie mask when doing surgery for an extended time. So I figure if you have to wear it for long times go with the tie mask. 

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


----------



## yonderfishin

buckeyebowman said:


> I see the President advised folks to wear cloth masks when going out anywhere. I have no idea where to buy one. Any suggestions? Never seen them at a drugstore, of course I wasn't exactly looking for them either.



They arent hard to make and there are like a billion youtube videos on how to do it. You can even use a hot glue gun if you cant sew. I made one before work today with fabric from an old shirt.


----------



## ress

My wife has made around 40 so far. I wore one to wally world today. Felt really odd until I saw others wearing them.


----------



## loweman165

And heres the real problem:
https://nypost.com/2020/04/01/cbs-admits-to-using-footage-from-italy-in-report-about-nyc/
A mistake? Yeah tell me another one.


----------



## ovrecheck

loweman165 said:


> And heres the real problem:
> https://nypost.com/2020/04/01/cbs-admits-to-using-footage-from-italy-in-report-about-nyc/
> A mistake? Yeah tell me another one.


fake news Wonder how many times they dont get caught


----------



## allwayzfishin




----------



## jrose

allwayzfishin said:


> View attachment 350341


Guaranteed there are Tennessee plates on that!!!!


----------



## loves2fishinohio

Hatchetman said:


> Well, good old NYC did it big this time. Sent Coronavirus patients to the Navy Hospital Ship Comfort, may have contaminated the whole ship now. It was all over the news that NO virus patients were going to be treated there, just the regular type hospital patients to take the pressure off the city hospitals. How could this happen???!!!


Haven't heard this in the news but it wouldn't surprise me. 

And it is no small wonder hospitals in NYC aren't able to handle this type of situation. Given the size and population of the city, the healthcare system there down right sucks. I sure as heck wouldn't want to be a sick person needing any type of hospitalization in NYC.


----------



## loweman165

And your also going to tell me this was a mistake? 
https://www.foxnews.com/us/coronavirus-patients-delivered-comfort-ship-new-york-mistake
Someone should be whipped.


----------



## Burkcarp1

This folks is BS!


----------



## Hatchetman

loweman165 said:


> And your also going to tell me this was a mistake?
> https://www.foxnews.com/us/coronavirus-patients-delivered-comfort-ship-new-york-mistake
> Someone should be whipped.


I don't see any way you can justify this as an accident....Someones rear end should be in a BIG sling. On the news for a week "No Cov19 patients on this ship". Hope this doesn't screw the whole works up onboard the Comfort


----------



## Snakecharmer

Shad Rap said:


> Right now we are at 12 deaths per 1,000,000 people...still haven't reached the swine flu level of 39 deaths per 1,000,000 people...just thought I'd throw that out there...not downplaying anything, I just thought those numbers were interesting as of yet...


Up to 29 per million as of today...…..Big change in 4 days.


----------



## Shad Rap

Snakecharmer said:


> Up to 29 per million as of today...…..Big change in 4 days.


I believe it's still under 29...around 25 and some change as of right now...at least my sources say...it grew yes, but that was to be expected...and it will still grow more...


----------



## 9Left

montagc said:


> Hospitals are not doing elective surgeries, and are discharging patients that do not need intensive care. It’s prep work To open up resources for an expected surge in cases of the virus. But believe what you want. I’m getting info from healthcare workers, not some random YouTube video.


This is exactly correct… And it is exactly what we are doing in the hospital that I work at


----------



## Saugeye Tom

Good news...cases are dropping in new York and they are releasing more from the hospitals. Fox news


----------



## fishless

Saugeye Tom said:


> Good news...cases are dropping in new York and they are releasing more from the hospitals. Fox news


That is good news.How many of people on here are going to wear a mask in public now that it is a recommendation


----------



## Snakecharmer

I don't think NY has peaked yet. 10% more cases yesterday.

Most of Europe has over 100 deaths per million. -France Italy Spain Belgium Netherlands


----------



## cincinnati

Templeton said:


> Lots of people are making the cloth masks at home with their sewing machines, the patterns vary from ones with pockets between the outer and inner layer, there are claims that vacuum bag materials and the blue paper shop towels can be cut to fit and enhance the filtering. Have also heard that a cloth handkerchief is better than nothing.


Grocery shopping today, a handful of people wearing "masks." My favorite, a guy was wearing a bandana made from the backside of his red plaid boxers. Used the waistband to tie them behind his head. His mask reached down to his chest. Hope he washed them, before wearing. Wish I'd had a camera....

Keep in mind, this was NOT Walmart.


----------



## CoonDawg92

I’ll probably do the cowboy thing with a bandana. Wife refuses.


----------



## cincinnati

CoonDawg92 said:


> I’ll probably do the cowboy thing with a bandana. Wife refuses.


Just be sure you wash those boxers first!


----------



## Shad Rap

Snakecharmer said:


> I don't think NY has peaked yet. 10% more cases yesterday.
> 
> Most of Europe has over 100 deaths per million. -France Italy Spain Belgium Netherlands


NY deaths were on a decline for the first time today...thats gotta mean something...they are thinking they MAY have plateaued as far as deaths...lets hope...another day or two and we'll know for sure.


----------



## CoonDawg92

Ha, you can bet mine won’t be made out of my drawers!


----------



## Snakecharmer

Shad Rap said:


> NY deaths were on a decline for the first time today...thats gotta mean something...they are thinking they MAY have plateaued as far as deaths...lets hope...another day or two and we'll know for sure.


I'd tell the Governor one day isn't a trend....and the day isn't over yet.


----------



## polebender

Templeton said:


> Lots of people are making the cloth masks at home with their sewing machines, the patterns vary from ones with pockets between the outer and inner layer, there are claims that vacuum bag materials and the blue paper shop towels can be cut to fit and enhance the filtering. Have also heard that a cloth handkerchief is better than nothing. All of the cloth ones have to be laundered after single use so I have heard. Not sure what is right or wrong these days, however I don't think you can over do the precautions especially if you are high risk or have someone at home who is.


Sounds like a good time for turtleneck shirts to make a comeback! I have 4-5 gaiters and Buffs that work well.


----------



## Shad Rap

Snakecharmer said:


> I'd tell the Governor one day isn't a trend....and the day isn't over yet.


Their positive percent dropped too for the first time today.


----------



## Burkcarp1

I know of a guy that had the virus and he only has 1 lung because of having lung cancer. He’s home now and doing good...


----------



## Im2spooky

I have covid 19, I'm required to self quarantine until 4-18-20. My temperature is 102.8 , I have diarrhea very bad and my bodies feels like I was in an auto accident. I sleep entire days away with very little relief and my symptoms are considered mild, stay safe people .


----------



## Snakecharmer

Burkcarp1 said:


> View attachment 350369
> This folks is BS!


Please explain?


----------



## buckeyebowman

hailtothethief said:


> You can wear a hanky like the old westerns


Except I don't have hankies. Never have. Just don't understand blowing a wad of snot in a rag, folding it up and putting it back in your pocket!



Burkcarp1 said:


> View attachment 350369
> This folks is BS!


Exactly! These folks are supposed to make assumptions now?! Sounds like an exercise in control to me! And for those who are reading or hearing 25-29 deaths per million, go back one page and look at the attachment to this post! And Snake, look at the part he highlighted in red. Those determining cause of death are now supposed to "assume" that it was cause by COVID-19 if it was any respiratory cause! Sorry! Bogus! 



Hatchetman said:


> I don't see any way you can justify this as an accident....Someones rear end should be in a BIG sling. On the news for a week "No Cov19 patients on this ship". Hope this doesn't screw the whole works up onboard the Comfort


Yep! Heard that on the news the day the ship sailed! I figure all they can do now is convert the ship to COVID-19 patients and use the Javits Center for regular patients.


----------



## Burkcarp1

Snakecharmer said:


> Please explain?


Buckeyebowman nailed it...


----------



## Snakecharmer

buckeyebowman said:


> Exactly! These folks are supposed to make assumptions now?! Sounds like an exercise in control to me! And for those who are reading or hearing *25-29 deaths per million*, go back one page and look at the attachment to this post! And Snake, look at the part he highlighted in red. Those determining cause of death are now supposed to "assume" that it was cause by COVID-19 if it was any respiratory cause! Sorry! Bogus! .


From that website...… 29/ million USA...Read much?


----------



## Snakecharmer

Im2spooky said:


> I have covid 19, I'm required to self quarantine until 4-18-20. My temperature is 102.8 , I have diarrhea very bad and my bodies feels like I was in an auto accident. I sleep entire days away with very little relief and my symptoms are considered mild, stay safe people .


Take care! Hope you get better soon.


----------



## Burkcarp1

montagc said:


> please explain why you think so. It’s pretty plain that there is nothing wrong with that.


Seriously? They are supposed to assume???


----------



## Snakecharmer

Burkcarp1 said:


> Seriously? They are supposed to assume???


Here is more guidance in completing the death certificate.....
https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvss/vsrg/vsrg03-508.pdf

Certifying deaths due to COVID–19
If COVID–19 played a role in the death, this condition should be specified on the death certificate. In many cases, it is likely that it will be the UCOD, as it can lead to various lifethreatening conditions, such as pneumonia and acute respiratory distress syndrome (ARDS). In these cases, COVID–19 should be reported on the lowest line used in Part I with the other conditions to which it gave rise listed on the lines above it.
Generally, it is best to avoid abbreviations and acronyms, but COVID–19 is unambiguous, so it is acceptable to report on the death certificate.
In some cases, survival from COVID–19 can be complicated by pre-existing chronic conditions, especially those that result in diminished lung capacity, such as chronic obstructive pulmonary disease (COPD) or asthma. These medical conditions do not cause COVID–19, but can increase the risk of contracting a respiratory infection and death, so these conditions should be reported in Part II and not in Part I.
When determining whether COVID–19 played a role in the cause of death, follow the CDC clinical criteria for evaluating a person under investigation for COVID–19 and, where possible, conduct appropriate laboratory testing using guidance provided by CDC or local health authorities. More information on CDC recommendations for reporting, testing, and specimen collection, including postmortem testing, is available from: https://www. cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-nCoV/hcp/clinical-criteria.html and https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/hcp/guidancepostmortem-specimens.html. It is important to remember that death certificate reporting may not meet mandatory reporting requirements for reportable diseases; contact the local health department regarding regulations specific to the jurisdiction.
In cases where a definite diagnosis of COVID–19 cannot be made, but it is suspected or likely (e.g., the circumstances are compelling within a reasonable degree of certainty), it is acceptable to report COVID–19 on a death certificate as “probable” or “presumed.” In these instances, certifiers should use their best clinical judgement in determining if a COVID–19 infection was likely. However, please note that testing for COVID–19 should be conducted whenever possible.
Common problems
Common problems in cause-of-death certification include: 1. reporting intermediate causes as the UCOD (i.e., on the lowest line used in Part I), 2. lack of specificity, and 3. illogical sequences. Intermediate causes are those conditions that typically have multiple possible underlying etiologies and thus, a UCOD must
be specified on a line below in Part I. For example, pneumonia is an intermediate cause of death since it can be caused by a variety of infectious agents or by inhaling a liquid or chemical. Pneumonia is important to report in a cause-of-death statement but, generally, it is not the UCOD. The cause of pneumonia, such as COVID–19, needs to be stated on the lowest line used in Part I.
Additionally, the reported UCOD should be specific enough to be useful for public health and research purposes. For example, a “viral infection” can be a UCOD, but it is not specific. A more specific UCOD in this instance could be “COVID–19.”
All causal sequences reported in Part I should be logical in terms of time and pathology. For example, reporting “COVID–19” due to “chronic obstructive pulmonary disease” in Part I would be an illogical sequence as COPD cannot cause an infection, although it may increase susceptibility to or exacerbate an infection. In this instance, COVID–19 would be reported in Part I as the UCOD and the COPD in Part II. While there can be reasonable differences in medical opinion concerning a sequence that led to a particular death, the causes should always be provided in a logical sequence from the immediate cause on line a. back to the UCOD on the lowest line used in Part I.
Manner of death
The manner of death, sometimes referred to as circumstances of death, is also reported on death certificates. Natural deaths are due solely or almost entirely to disease or the aging process (8). In the case of death due to a COVID–19 infection, the manner of death will almost always be natural


----------



## Lundy

Im2spooky said:


> I have covid 19, I'm required to self quarantine until 4-18-20. My temperature is 102.8 , I have diarrhea very bad and my bodies feels like I was in an auto accident. I sleep entire days away with very little relief and my symptoms are considered mild, stay safe people .


Sorry to hear of your situation. Do you have any idea how you may have been exposed or how long ago?

How long from when you noticed systems to you being able to get a test and get results?

is a typical self quarantine doctor directive 14 days?

Educate us please


----------



## Snakecharmer

I saw an average of 1 death certificate a month for the past 20 years (handled death claims for my deceased clients). It is common for death certificates to list 3 or 4 chronic conditions which lead to the death of the deceased. 95 % never have autopsies so the certifier assumes that the death was caused by a chronic condition unless there are other circumstances that leads him in a different direction..


----------



## Brutus Bluegill

Now COVID-19 is jumping from humans to animals. I hope it doesn't start coming back the other way!

https://abc6onyourside.com/news/nation-world/tiger-at-bronx-zoo-test-positive-for-covid-19


----------



## AmericanEagle

Mahoning county has 15 deaths more than any other county in Ohio. The majority of these cases and deaths look to involve long term care facilities.

https://www.wfmj.com/story/41974801...ases-deaths-involve-long-term-care-facilities


----------



## Im2spooky

Lundy said:


> Sorry to hear of your situation. Do you have any idea how you may have been exposed or how long ago?
> 
> How long from when you noticed systems to you being able to get a test and get results?
> 
> is a typical self quarantine doctor directive 14 days?
> 
> Educate us please


I believe I got it from my wife who also has it , she is in health care, once a member of your household has it its likely everyone will due to the fact once you start to show symptoms you have been infected from anywhere from 3-14 days. 14 day quarantine is the standard for mild cases typically most will beat it and no longer be contagious in 7 to 10 days post diagnosis. Testing is crazy at those drive up places you get an appointment time but when you get their there is 400 people in front of you and it's a stupid wait, test results come 2-5 days with 2 being most common.


----------



## KPI

Prayers sent  to you and your wife 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Lundy

Thank you for your response. So many on here have strongly held opinions yet they are just that, opinions 

I believe it is beneficial for all to hear from someone with first hand experience. While I am really sorry you and your family are going through this I am truly appreciative of your willingness to share your experience and maybe educate us all a little.


----------



## ovrecheck

Im2spooky said:


> I believe I got it from my wife who also has it , she is in health care, once a member of your household has it its likely everyone will due to the fact once you start to show symptoms you have been infected from anywhere from 3-14 days. 14 day quarantine is the standard for mild cases typically most will beat it and no longer be contagious in 7 to 10 days post diagnosis. Testing is crazy at those drive up places you get an appointment time but when you get their there is 400 people in front of you and it's a stupid wait, test results come 2-5 days with 2 being most common.


stay strong u can beat it


----------



## MIGHTY

Im2spooky said:


> I believe I got it from my wife who also has it , she is in health care, once a member of your household has it its likely everyone will due to the fact once you start to show symptoms you have been infected from anywhere from 3-14 days. 14 day quarantine is the standard for mild cases typically most will beat it and no longer be contagious in 7 to 10 days post diagnosis. Testing is crazy at those drive up places you get an appointment time but when you get their there is 400 people in front of you and it's a stupid wait, test results come 2-5 days with 2 being most common.


 location?


----------



## Shad Rap

Snakecharmer said:


> From that website...… 29/ million USA...Read much?
> View attachment 350469


This is the covid 19 spreadsheet I saw...updated today.


----------



## Buster24

Found out last week that my daughter also has the coronavirus.....she got it from her mother who is fighting cancer...her father visited her and family not knowing he was carrying it.....she was tested and found out the next day that she was positive...only tested her that quick because of her mother....she is in isolation until Thursday....never had a high fever...had nausea, headache, weakness, very tired and lost of taste and smell....if you feel any symptoms and hospital does not want to test you, contact your local health dept!!!!


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Buster24 said:


> Found out last week that my daughter also has the coronavirus.....she got it from her mother who is fighting cancer...her father visited her and family not knowing he was carrying it.....she was tested and found out the next day that she was positive...only tested her that quick because of her mother....she is in isolation until Thursday....never had a high fever...had nausea, headache, weakness, very tired and lost of taste and smell....if you feel any symptoms and hospital does not want to test you, contact your local health dept!!!!


Prayers for you and your’s.


----------



## Im2spooky

MIGHTY said:


> location?


Streetsboro


----------



## MIGHTY

Get well soon man


----------



## Snakecharmer

Shad Rap said:


> This is the covid 19 spreadsheet I saw...updated today.
> View attachment 350517


Not sure what your formula uses....9616 deaths / 331 million = 29


----------



## Misdirection

Snakecharmer said:


> Not sure what your formula uses....9616 deaths / 331 million = 29


I'm not sure of the math either, but the WorldOMeter website Hatteras1 posted to start this thread lists the same 29 deaths per million population for the USA.

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


----------



## Shad Rap

Snakecharmer said:


> Not sure what your formula uses....9616 deaths / 331 million = 29


It's the global data website for Covid-19...updated yesterday/daily so I'll assume it's right...25 and some change...as you can see, the number I reported awhile back of being 12 people per million was correct so I don't see why all the sudden this would be wrong...I have a feeling there's more to it than just a simple math formula...
Now that I look again, the number is at 29 and some change today...I would think that website would be more current, but who knows...they must only update it through the night...I was under the impression it was somewhat of a 'real' time update...or at least updated sometime throughout the day...


----------



## Misdirection

Yea, the math looks something like this...

US Population (327,000,000) x X /1,000,000 = Total deaths rounded to a whole number.

So in this case:

327,000,000 x X / 1,000,000 = 9620

X = 29.41 or rounded down to 29

At least I made that math work in my head 

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## Patricio

This is the most overhyped thing since y2k and Segway.


----------



## Im2spooky

Misdirection said:


> Yea, the math looks something like this...
> 
> US Population (327,000,000) x X /1,000,000 = Total deaths rounded to a whole number.
> 
> So in this case:
> 
> 327,000,000 x X / 1,000,000 = 9620
> 
> X = 29.41 or rounded down to 29
> 
> At least I made that math work in my head
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


USA has already passed the number you came up with


----------



## Snakecharmer

Shad Rap said:


> Their positive percent dropped too for the first time today.


Deaths and new cases up for NY today.


----------



## Misdirection

Im2spooky said:


> USA has already passed the number you came up with


That's because the number of deaths increased. 

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


----------



## Shad Rap

Snakecharmer said:


> Deaths and new cases up for NY today.


Still having new cases in China too...


----------



## Shad Rap

montagc said:


> For the visual folks like me, I put those spreadsheet numbers on a chart (18 is an estimate as it was covered in the picture.). I didn't format this well, but the bottom in days, the left numbers are deaths/million. Doubles every 3.5ish days, so around April 9 your numbers should be about 50/million
> 
> View attachment 350597


All of this is already spreadsheeted and charted...ourworldindata.org.
All the charts, spreadsheets and visuals one could ever want...


----------



## SConner




----------



## buckeyebowman

Snakecharmer said:


> From that website...… 29/ million USA...Read much?
> View attachment 350469


You're right. I misread it.



montagc said:


> Snake charmer, thanks for that.


That was a bit more detail than the "assume" document I quoted. 



AmericanEagle said:


> Mahoning county has 15 deaths more than any other county in Ohio. The majority of these cases and deaths look to involve long term care facilities.
> 
> https://www.wfmj.com/story/41974801...ases-deaths-involve-long-term-care-facilities


Plus, our population demographic kind of skews a bit older than a lot of places in Ohio.


----------



## the_waterwolf

montagc said:


> For the visual folks like me, I put those spreadsheet numbers on a chart (18 is an estimate as it was covered in the picture.). I didn't format this well, but the bottom in days, the left numbers are deaths/million. Doubles every 3.5ish days, so around April 9 your numbers should be about 50/million
> 
> View attachment 350597



How about this for a visual. When is enough, enough?


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## cincinnati

The people running the show, are REALLY enjoying running the show. Not going to step off the stage eagerly.


----------



## Shad Rap

the_waterwolf said:


> How about this for a visual. When is enough, enough?
> View attachment 350745


It's been enough for awhile now...ridiculous.


----------



## Shad Rap

Patricio said:


> This is the most overhyped thing since y2k and Segway.


You know it.


----------



## bad luck

As this tapers off, will be interesting to see how slow “the powers that be” loosen things up in the name of “your well being”....


----------



## Burkcarp1

https://www.cleveland.com/coronavir...this-week-without-overwhelming-hospitals.html


----------



## Hatchetman

Went to Kroger this morning at 7A to get some food for the wife and I. Went over to the bread/buns area and this older lady with a mask on in one of those electric shopping carts was parked in front of the bread blocking my access, so in keeping with the the social distancing I politely waited for her to pick up her bread and leave. But....not so fast, she proceeded to pick up and squeeze at least six different loaves. Couldn't stand it so I, as politely as I could, asked her why she was handling all the bread, said she wanted fresh, I said how many people do you want to kill by spreading the virus you may be carrying??. She gave me a pissed off look and motored away. I told the check out person about the bread but don't think anything was done about it.


----------



## BuckeyeFishin07

Hatchetman said:


> Went to Kroger this morning at 7A to get some food for the wife and I. Went over to the bread/buns area and this older lady with a mask on in one of those electric shopping carts was parked in front of the bread blocking my access, so in keeping with the the social distancing I politely waited for her to pick up her bread and leave. But....not so fast, she proceeded to pick up and squeeze at least six different loaves. Couldn't stand it so I, as politely as I could, asked her why she was handling all the bread, said she wanted fresh, I said how many people do you want to kill by spreading the virus you may be carrying??. She gave me a pissed off look and motored away. I told the check out person about the bread but don't think anything was done about it.


Can't fix stupid, all of the bread for the most part is going to be fresh for awhile. Some people just think they are more important than others, and sadly when all this is over, those people will still not have learned a lesson from all this!!!


----------



## miked913

I have been to the store exactly 1 time since this all started. Last Friday I went to Walmart 1st drove through the parking lot, nope way too many people! Didnt even stop, So headed to Giant eagle. Suited up mask gloves and list wife gave me. I had exactly 1 thing I wanted, asparagus. So in I go there is a lady standing in front of the asparagus so like you I politely stand there at a safe distance, she picked up and put down 4 bunches!!! I just turned around and walked away I'm not sure how many more she picked up or if she even bought any. I got the rest of the stuff from the list and got the hell out of there! I thanked my wife for the few times she has gone to the store and I told her I am not going back anymore!

Sent from my moto z3 using Tapatalk


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## loves2fishinohio

Wear gloves in the stores. You can't fix stupid. 

If she wanted fresh bread she should have gone to the bakery section. That bread on the shelf was all made at the same time and has so many preservatives that it will last a week or more at least.


----------



## Dovans

Bread is made months before hand then Froze. The bread your getting today is probably the freshest you'll ever get due to everyone wiping out the supply and bakery having to scramble. My store gets in over two hundred loaves each a day of three or four different varities.. so its all going to be the same date. If you saw how this bread was made, Youd spend the money on the name brand custom breads? I guess you'd call it. Or go to a private baker. Yeast is not as important as you think in the mass production of bread.


----------



## Misdirection

For those of you not taking this seriously, my employee who was admitted to the hospital last Wednesday evening and tested positive for Covid-19 was doing better yesterday. I got a call from his son this morning saying he passed away over night.

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## Snakecharmer

Misdirection said:


> For those of you not taking this seriously, my employee who was admitted to the hospital last Wednesday evening and tested positive for Covid-19 was doing better yesterday. I got a call from his son this morning saying he passed away over night.
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


Sorry for your loss...


----------



## PapawSmith

Misdirection said:


> For those of you not taking this seriously, my employee who was admitted to the hospital last Wednesday evening and tested positive for Covid-19 was doing better yesterday. I got a call from his son this morning saying he passed away over night.
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


Damn John, the impact is real when it hits close to home. Prayers for this Man and his Family, and sorry for your loss of a co-worker/friend.


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## Misdirection

PapawSmith said:


> Damn John, the impact is real when it hits close to home. Prayers for this Man and his Family, and sorry for your loss of a co-worker/friend.


Thanks Brad....very close to home. I've worked with this person for over 25 years and just talked to him the other day....

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## AmericanEagle

Here is a link to the IMHE model referenced to in the Cleveland.com article.

https://covid19.healthdata.org/united-states-of-america/ohio

Dr. Birx uses the IMHE model.

http://www.healthdata.org/acting-da...ting-model-otherwise-known-chris-murray-model


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## devildog49

If you have to wear gloves and a mask to the store - or are worried about someone touching the bread or asparagus, you should probably stay home or at the least have your groceries delivered to your car.


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## miked913

devildog49 said:


> If you have to wear gloves and a mask to the store - or are worried about someone touching the bread or asparagus, you should probably stay home or at the least have your groceries delivered to your car.


Just trying to follow the guidelines developed by people smarter than you!

Sent from my moto z3 using Tapatalk


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## ICENUT

There are many videos on u tube by doctors telling us not to wear gloves to supermarkets.Unless you change after each touch of something you are loading up your gloves with more and more germs and or virus!!!!!! then you inadvertinly touch your face,steering wheel or whatever.You can also create an aerosol when you remove the gloves.


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## Burkcarp1

Misdirection said:


> For those of you not taking this seriously, my employee who was admitted to the hospital last Wednesday evening and tested positive for Covid-19 was doing better yesterday. I got a call from his son this morning saying he passed away over night.
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


Sorry about your loss. Did he have any health issues?


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## Misdirection

He was 68 (not 70 as I previously thought) and had cardiovascular issues (a stent put in about 10 years ago and a mild heart attack last year) but in overall good but not great health.

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## laguna21

Misdirection said:


> For those of you not taking this seriously, my employee who was admitted to the hospital last Wednesday evening and tested positive for Covid-19 was doing better yesterday. I got a call from his son this morning saying he passed away over night.
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


Sorry for your loss, awful


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## $diesel$

Damn, MD, sorry about your friend and employee. 
This is the craziest thing i've ever seen. 
I guess the Lord decided theres just too darn many of us critters on his good earth. Shame.


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## Saltfork

It’s hard to even post here. I know there is no politics allowed here. Yet you can tell who’s who etc. short jabs every where. I feel for anyone that loses a loved one regardless of how or what.

People can have their own opinions on things. Stay at home go out etc. Yet people need to realize life choices before this has made more people susceptible to this virus. It’s not all about the now. Keep that in mind.

Yet after this is over. China is going to pay. I worry a little more about the after shock than what’s happening now.

I see people swearing people about leaving their home to go fishing/ anywhere .The same people talk about the trip to the store every 3 days. Yet the guy going fishing hasn’t been to the store in weeks? Same people are saying they are eating out. Guess what you don’t have no clue in the world who’s touching and serving your food. Just saying!!! REALLY...


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## Saltfork

What I know to be helpful. Do for your family. Live for your family. Do the best you can. Don’t depend on others. Perfect remedy! Then there is no blame!

Control the situation..


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## Fish-N-Fool

I was out today...I live in a county with a VERY low count. I had to go to Home Depot to pick up parts for our clothes dryer that quit last week. Since I was going out, my mother asked if I could go to Meijer and see if I could pick up items she would text me. It has been a bit since I have been to the store locally. 

I have a couple packs of N95 masks from home construction jobs so i took one with me. I felt self conscious about wearing the mask I can't lie (I'm not into looks, fashion, etc.), but I know it is important. I wore a ball cap and I wear eyeglasses so I kinda felt like a criminal would all hidden up! I would say it was right around 50/50 for both workers and customers wearing masks. Several people were wearing the throw away latex gloves as well. 

These items were going to my high risk mother (over 70 with underlying issues) whom takes care of elderly patients in her home. She now puts her bleach bottle (recipe on internet), paper towels, and plastic recycle container on the back porch. I unload everything on the back porch, spray and wipe it down and load into the container. I leave and she waits 10-15 minutes (even with milk, etc) and then brings inside. We know it isn't perfect, but that is the best we can do. If the virus gets inside that house it likely will be deadly.


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## ovrecheck

Misdirection said:


> For those of you not taking this seriously, my employee who was admitted to the hospital last Wednesday evening and tested positive for Covid-19 was doing better yesterday. I got a call from his son this morning saying he passed away over night.
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


got second hand info that co worker died saturday my employer never contacted anyone since the job was shut down two weeks ago. Nice of them they didnt tell me he was positive or he was sick for about a week before they shutdown .Its everyone for there selves.


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## Misdirection

ovrecheck said:


> got second hand info that co worker died saturday my employer never contacted anyone since the job was shut down two weeks ago. Nice of them they didnt tell me he was positive or he was sick for about a week before they shutdown .Its everyone for there selves.


My employees and I all work remote and he hasn't been into the office in almost a month. But I did pull my entire team together today and let them know.

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## Snakecharmer

NY has not peaked although thats what the Governor predicted. 10,468 new cases 731 new deaths.


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## Snakecharmer

Wife hasn't seen the $600 Federal unemployment check. She has been paid by Ohio twice now.


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## fastwater

Misdirection said:


> For those of you not taking this seriously, my employee who was admitted to the hospital last Wednesday evening and tested positive for Covid-19 was doing better yesterday. I got a call from his son this morning saying he passed away over night.
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


Very sorry for your loss Midirection.


----------



## hailtothethief

Old unhealthy people are dying but a lot of young healthy people are cleaning up their acts getting into better shape because of the virus. In the long run things will get better because of the belt tightening going on. You cant depend on a vaccine just gotta be the best you can be and a lot more of that is going on than there was two months ago.


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## $diesel$

The last time i was at the store was around 3 weeks ago.
I am basicly embarrass-proof, as i don't care if anyone doesn't like the way i look.
I HAD MY MASK ON as well as my ATV goggles and nitrile gloves. I didn't see anyone else in GE with a mask on and i don't give a s***.
You guys have heard me say over a month ago, i believe this thing to be airbourn, so i won't go out without my mask.
Folks can make fun of me all they want, but i'm high risk and i aim to protect myself at all cost.


----------



## Misdirection

Snakecharmer said:


> Wife hasn't seen the $600 Federal unemployment check. She has been paid by Ohio twice now.


I don't think the $600/week from the fed kicks in until the state unemployment runs out. My wife is still waiting for her first state check.

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## Shad Rap

They are claiming all these deaths as Covid deaths but really I don't think theres been one death from just Covid alone...everyone has had underlying issues that ALSO contributed to their death...just sayin...even Dr Birx is claiming this.


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## loves2fishinohio

Snakecharmer said:


> Wife hasn't seen the $600 Federal unemployment check. She has been paid by Ohio twice now.


If this changes, please post here. Not that we were expecting any federal government miracles, but the Mrs got her 2nd unemployment payment overnight, and of course no 600.00 supplement on it. On the bright side, she did start receiving benefits within 2 weeks of filing her claim. 

I don't expect any of us will see any of the stimulus money promised this month. That's just my opinion though. I always have to pay taxes so the IRS doesn't have my bank account information. I'm guessing I won't see a check before September at best.


----------



## Snakecharmer

loves2fishinohio said:


> If this changes, please post here. Not that we were expecting any federal government miracles, but the Mrs got her 2nd unemployment payment overnight, and of course no 600.00 supplement on it. On the bright side, she did start receiving benefits within 2 weeks of filing her claim.
> 
> I don't expect any of us will see any of the stimulus money promised this month. That's just my opinion though. I always have to pay taxes so the IRS doesn't have my bank account information. I'm guessing I won't see a check before September at best.


Yea I'll keep you updated....We always have to pay so the FED may not have direct deposit info on file for my wife either....


----------



## Snakecharmer

Shad Rap said:


> They are claiming all these deaths as Covid deaths but really I don't think theres been one death from just Covid alone...everyone has had underlying issues that ALSO contributed to their death...just sayin...even Dr Birx is claiming this.


I've see stories about people in their 30-40's with no medical history of problems dying. Of course they may have had problems, they just didn't know about them.


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## Shad Rap

Snakecharmer said:


> I've see stories about people in their 30-40's with no medical history of problems dying. Of course they may have had problems, they just didn't know about them.


Right...almost gaurantee they had unknown problems.
But that's always been an issue of mine...they claim all these deaths as covid, when actually if the person didn't have the underlying conditons, they would more than likely still be living...
All of us have unknown conditons we die from everyday...


----------



## Shad Rap

montagc said:


> That is the case with many diseases. HIV/AIDS doesn't kill anyone directly either, but it compromises your immune system and makes you very susceptible to common ailments.
> 
> In the worst cases, this virus causes major lower respiratory issues that lead to severe pneumonia, which ends up killing you. You basically drown in your own mucus. It is not just hitting those with previous conditions, but it is hitting them harder.
> 
> 4 confirmed cases in my extended family, dad's first cousin passed away. Two others still on the mend, one recovered.


Right...and my point is a lot of those people die rather than recover...me and my wife had this the first week of february.
All I'm saying is if you have HIV and you get coronavirus and then die...it goes down as corona virus being the cause...that's how they are tallying this up.
If you have mutliple things wrong with and you get covid and die, it goes down as a covid death...that's not 100% accurate IMO.


----------



## Snakecharmer

montagc said:


> That is the case with many diseases. HIV/AIDS doesn't kill anyone directly either, but it compromises your immune system and makes you very susceptible to common ailments.
> 
> In the worst cases, this virus causes major lower respiratory issues that lead to severe pneumonia, which ends up killing you. You basically drown in your own mucus. It is not just hitting those with previous conditions, but it is hitting them harder.
> 
> 4 confirmed cases in my extended family, dad's first cousin passed away. Two others still on the mend, one recovered.


So sorry for you loss. Hopefully the other two will recover.


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## Shad Rap

montagc said:


> Go
> 
> 
> These people would not be dying right now if they didn't get the virus. Lots of life left in these people.
> 
> Go get tested if you think you had it. There is a test for antibodies now. Put your money where your mouth is.


You're missing my point...it's not about putting anyones money where their mouth is...I'm not saying anyone deserves to die!
I don't need a test to determine what I had or what my wife had...I know for a fact what it was...if you think this affects only you, your family and circle of friends you're mistaken.


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## Snakecharmer

Here's a link to the FED unemployment benefit. Looks like it will be paid through the Ohio system hopefully next week.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/states-could-receive-federal-funding-124809604.html


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## Snakecharmer

montagc said:


> Thank you, though I hadn't seen my dad's cousin in 30 years. He lived next to my great grandmas farm where we visited often as kids. Haven't been there since she passed and it was sold many years ago. Dad is pretty upset though, and worried about the others who have it.


Are the sick ones part of the deceased family?

It certainly makes the virus more personal when it hits that close to home.


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## Shad Rap

montagc said:


> No you don't. Go get a test. If you have the antibodies, think about donating blood if you are able.


Yes I do...exact same symptoms...it's not a coincidence man...step out of your perfect world.


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## PapawSmith

Shad Rap said:


> Yes I do...exact same symptoms...it's not a coincidence man...step out of your perfect world.


I don't know you Shad at all and you may well be a fine individual. That said, right now it is folks like you that you that think you know everything about something you actually know nothing about that are contributing to this prolongation of this problem. Too many believe that they know too much and totally blow off all of the important information provided by those that actually do know.


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## STRONGPERSUADER

Meanwhile still no media attention on this killer although it’s out there killing many. Why? Because it’s become acceptable every year. Why is that you think? Why does this seem acceptable to some of you? I only ask because I would think the same people who are judging others or pointing fingers would feel the same way about the flu virus. Should we not be up in arms about the, up to 50000 Americans it kills every year? I’ve taken the flu shot the last five years but even though I’m high risk I will not take an unproven cv vaccine. 
https://www.npr.org/sections/health...u-s-flu-season-beginning-to-ease-modelers-say


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## Specwar

Everyone here has another forum for information, tv, radio, etc. yet many continue to come here and feel like they have to report to everyone the information we certainly all already know. Saddens me to see this.
Listen to the professionals, follow the orders, and I’ll see you all when this is past.
Everyone wants to be a journalist today ☹☹


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## loves2fishinohio

If I don't go fishing soon I'm going to lose my $hit!!! 

Calm down people, we all are getting fed up and stir crazy, no need to start flaming each other.


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## Patricio

Misdirection said:


> I don't think the $600/week from the fed kicks in until the state unemployment runs out. My wife is still waiting for her first state check.
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


In an effort to fill the gap between the average paycheck and state unemployment benefits, the CARES Act will provide eligible employees an extra $600 per week in unemployment benefits in addition to what they are eligible for under existing state programs

https://www.hallrender.com/2020/03/...nt-benefits-for-workers-affected-by-covid-19/

I'm guessing it'll take a few weeks or a month


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## STRONGPERSUADER

montagc said:


> Does the seasonal flu spread like wildfire, and cause overflows in hospitals and a shortage of ventilators? No, it doesn't and those who die of the flu in a hospital got every chance they could at fighting it. Comparing this to the flu is just ridiculous at this point. The good news is that all these measures taken should decrease flu transmission this year as well, so there's that.


I just posted some facts but the main reason of my post was asking the questions pertaining to those facts which people seem to avoid although legitimate. Also, Maybe you didn’t read the facts...
“Of that number, about half were ill enough to seek medical care, and between 300,000 to 500,000 people required hospitalization.” Nobody is comparing. Yes the flu spreads much faster as of now. I haven’t seen any evidence that people has died in this country because of lack of equipment or overcrowded hospitals. So far the flu has been much more deadly. I hope it doesn’t catch up with flu numbers, if so we are in big trouble.


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## Patricio

Someone just told me you have to reapply for the $600 on a weekly basis. Waiting for the hammer to drop here. Probably next week.


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## STRONGPERSUADER

Seen this one coming..
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/bi...avirus-as-covid-19-deaths-regardless-of-cause


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## texasrig

Official numbers for flu deaths last year right around 60k. We have a long way to go to get near those numbers.


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## STRONGPERSUADER

I get what your saying, I’m aware of the the CV numbers. But again... the only thing I’m “basing” on the flu is questions pertaining to the flu death numbers. Also, cv has been infecting people, some experts say going back to Nov. and the fact that some causes of death back in Nov, Dec, Jan May have been attributed to exiting conditions instead of CV as it should have been because it wasn’t as known as it is now.


----------



## Snakecharmer

texasrig said:


> Official numbers for flu deaths last year right around 60k. We have a long way to go to get near those numbers.


Probably less than a month...I'd guess 2-3 weeks


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## Snakecharmer

Shad Rap said:


> Right now we are at 12 deaths per 1,000,000 people...still haven't reached the swine flu level of 39 deaths per 1,000,000 people...just thought I'd throw that out there...not downplaying anything, I just thought those numbers were interesting as of yet...


We'll pass swine flu today...


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## Snakecharmer

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Meanwhile still no media attention on this killer although it’s out there killing many. Why? Because it’s become acceptable every year. Why is that you think? Why does this seem acceptable to some of you? I only ask because I would think the same people who are judging others or pointing fingers would feel the same way about the flu virus. Should we not be up in arms about the, up to 50000 Americans it kills every year? I’ve taken the flu shot the last five years but even though I’m high risk I will not take an unproven cv vaccine.
> https://www.npr.org/sections/health...u-s-flu-season-beginning-to-ease-modelers-say


Well we do have a flu shot to help to keep it in check. We have nothing for the Corona virus. Even with the flu shot 1 in 10 people got the flu this season and of those getting the flu 1 in 1000 died.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

montagc said:


> You can't base anything of the flu. Flu is a known quantity and we deal with it the best we can. We are still in the midst of the spread of a disease that we know little about, so we can't make decisions based on past perceptions of a completely different disease. I bet C19 has taken more than a few people who may have fallen to the flu this year as well, and C19 and flu deaths will continue to climb. Gonna be a lot of data and research to sort through when this is all done.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not so sure that the flu spreads faster, it has been here longer (article states it picked up around thanksgiving) so you have more cases over time, we have a vaccine, and its more widespread and established.
> 
> 20-63K flu deaths over about 6 months, vs 12k C19 deaths in just over a month.
> 
> The *bold italicized* part is important. Other countries have had that happen.
> 
> EDIT: that was an old article posted early March. Updated flu numbers


What other countries has that happened in where you have proof.?Hearsay? Maybe your talking about the video that main stream
Media put out claiming to be Italy, Spain, nyc ect all rolled up into one. Is that your proof? Seems as tho anyone who might post something shedding maybe a positive view that it maybe not as bad as it seems a select few of you shoot it down. I’m not talking about my last few posts but others have chimed in with possible, positive, views or experiences and the doomer’s want no part of it. All of a sudden their experiences or facts aren’t the gospel, only yours is. Shad’s posts for example, he’s only trying to shed some light on the situation imo, he’s not out running around defying protocol. Yet he’s responded to like he is or wants people to die, or doesn’t care about what’s going on. One response to a post of his was someone telling him it’s his fault this has been going on as long as it has. That’s crazy. I just don’t get the “ if it’s something maybe positive we don’t want to hear it” mentality.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Snakecharmer said:


> Well we do have a flu shot to help to keep it in check. We have nothing for the Corona virus. Even with the flu shot 1 in 10 people got the flu this season and of those getting the flu 1 in 1000 died.


I don’t think 50000 dead is keeping it in check but that’s just my opinion. But yea, we need to pray that this virus don’t reach those numbers.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Patricio said:


> Someone just told me you have to reapply for the $600 on a weekly basis. Waiting for the hammer to drop here. Probably next week.


You shouldn't have to apply for the $600..The state gets the money from the Fed and then passes it on to you if you are eligible. Not everybody that is on unemployment will get it. So just do what the Dept of Jobs and Family Services tells you to do.


----------



## Snakecharmer

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> I don’t think 50000 dead is keeping it in check but that’s just my opinion. But yea, we need to pray that this virus don’t reach those numbers.


They didn't have the right mix on the Flu vaccine this year so it wasn't as effective. Plus I don't know if they have stats on how many of the 50,000 didn't get the vaccine. I know I didn't.....I see CVS has a hi-dosage flu vaccine. I would imagine it is better than their run-of -the-mill flu vaccine.


----------



## fishless

Snakecharmer said:


> They didn't have the right mix on the Flu vaccine this year so it wasn't as effective. Plus I don't know if they have stats on how many of the 50,000 didn't get the vaccine. I know I didn't.....I see CVS has a hi-dosage flu vaccine. I would imagine it is better than their run-of -the-mill flu vaccine.


The high dose flu vaccine is for people over 65.I was 64 and 9 months and my Dr said they weren't allowed to give it to me because I wasn't 65


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

Shad Rap said:


> Right...almost gaurantee they had unknown problems.
> But that's always been an issue of mine...they claim all these deaths as covid, when actually if the person didn't have the underlying conditons, they would more than likely still be living...
> All of us have unknown conditons we die from everyday...


So, in other words..,..the Covid killed them.



Shad Rap said:


> You're missing my point...it's not about putting anyones money where their mouth is...I'm not saying anyone deserves to die!
> I don't need a test to determine what I had or what my wife had...*I know for a fact what it was*...if you think this affects only you, your family and circle of friends you're mistaken.


Thankfully I have you on ignore, so I don't see most of your non-sensical ramblings. I've let the other 4 or 5 times that you said you had it go by, not this time. First time you were 99% sure, then the next time you posted you were 100%, what was that 1% that took you over the top Dr. Rap? Hell, you've said it on two separate posts on this page alone. You're seriously one misguided individual. Now you know for a *FACT,* your words, just how do you know without testing?! Take him up on his offer tough guy. 

Take your "almost guarantees" and "just sayin's" to a conspiracy site.

And back on ignore.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Snakecharmer said:


> They didn't have the right mix on the Flu vaccine this year so it wasn't as effective. Plus I don't know if they have stats on how many of the 50,000 didn't get the vaccine. I know I didn't.....I see CVS has a hi-dosage flu vaccine. I would imagine it is better than their run-of -the-mill flu vaccine.


I can only comment on my experience with it. I started taking it in 2014 because my oncologist told me I had to because if I got it I would have to be hospitalized with a lot of complications. I haven’t got the flu since but I got it every year like clock work prior. I do know it doesn’t work for everyone but people should get it just for the numbers alone especially elder folks and people with underlying issues. The problem is we are months of not years behind a vaccine for this virus. So as I said before if if it gets flu proportions we are in big trouble.


----------



## cincinnati

fishless said:


> The high dose flu vaccine is for people over 65.I was 64 and 9 months and my Dr said they weren't allowed to give it to me because I wasn't 65


I was 64 & 11 months & couldn't get it, either! Even my Lovely Bride, who is a painful stickler for RULES, thought that was crazy. 

So I was very careful for another 6 weeks & then went back.


----------



## Patricio

Snakecharmer said:


> You shouldn't have to apply for the $600..The state gets the money from the Fed and then passes it on to you if you are eligible. Not everybody that is on unemployment will get it. So just do what the Dept of Jobs and Family Services tells you to do.


In Minnesota you do. And you have to reapply every week.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

montagc said:


> Like I've stated before, I have a great outlook on this. Ohio has done a pretty good job and i have seen many folks go above and beyond to help and keep things moving forward. I just cant stand people talking in absolutes about things they know nothing about, saying their opinion is a "fact", disregarding info that doesn't meet their agenda, taking a single anecdote and using it to devalue hundreds of educated experts or peer reviewed studies, etc. In my opinion, that is no better than all these other sources of misinformation and conspiracy theories we have been seeing referenced here.


Right! And I’ve had those same feelings towards some of your and others posts also. But at least we agree on the first sentence of your post. So we all have to agree to disagree on some of the issues involved with this thing. We can’t post our facts and opinions without expecting others to do the same. But at the end of the day I think we all want the same result and that’s for this thing to be taken care of and over with with as less harm done as possible.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

I’m going to the hospital for an MRI here in a few. I will try and see if anything seems out of the ordinary.


----------



## Saltfork

Snakecharmer said:


> You shouldn't have to apply for the $600..The state gets the money from the Fed and then passes it on to you if you are eligible. Not everybody that is on unemployment will get it. So just do what the Dept of Jobs and Family Services tells you to do.



Everyone who is on unemployment will get the 600 dollars. The state will be issuing the 600 dollar add on in about a week.

People will get back pay of 600 dollars from date bill was singed. If you were unemployed then. You will have to call in for benefits once a week. To be able to receive that week of benefits. Once you are approved for unemployment.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Saltfork said:


> Everyone who is on unemployment will get the 600 dollars. The state will be issuing the 600 dollar add on in about a week.
> 
> People will get back pay of 600 dollars from date bill was singed. If you were unemployed then. You will have to call in for benefits once a week. To be able to receive that week of benefits. Once you are approved for unemployment.


I thought the $600 was only for people laid off during the crisis. If you were on unemployment b4 that you're out of luck.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Patricio said:


> In Minnesota you do. And you have to reapply every week.


So you have to apply twice for unemployment benefits in Mn.?


----------



## SConner

Everyone one is entitled to an opinion, but facts are just that and should not be open to interpretation. Perhaps if both sides of discussion would preface with “in my opinion” when it is an opinion and cite a reputable source when stating as fact, this conversation would be less contentious. Food for thought.


----------



## Saltfork

Snakecharmer said:


> I thought the $600 was only for people laid off during the crisis. If you were on unemployment b4 that you're out of luck.


No it’s retroactive from January. Everyone will get it it’s pretty much a bonus. Even people who made minimum wage will get the 600 A week.They will be making more in a week than what they made in two weeks. Of course the 600 is only from date bill was signed. Also the state added 13 extra weeks for people to file. Probably due to the people who were already on unemployment I imagine. The 600 is going to stop in July as of now.

I think Patrico was saying you have to call in each week to receive benefits. Just like Ohio. It’s part of the system to basically tell the state your still unemployed. It’s all automated call. I could be wrong tho.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Saltfork said:


> No it’s retroactive from January. Everyone will get it it’s pretty much a bonus. Even people who made minimum wage will get the 600 A week.They will be making more in a week than what they made in two weeks. Of course the 600 is only from date bill was signed. Also the state added 13 extra weeks for people to file. Probably due to the people who were already on unemployment I imagine. The 600 is going to stop in July as of now.


So if you were laid off last year you're out of luck? Or are you saying they will pay you for 4 months starting January?


----------



## Misdirection

Saltfork said:


> No it’s retroactive from January. Everyone will get it it’s pretty much a bonus. Even people who made minimum wage will get the 600 A week.They will be making more in a week than what they made in two weeks. Of course the 600 is only from date bill was signed. Also the state added 13 extra weeks for people to file. Probably due to the people who were already on unemployment I imagine. The 600 is going to stop in July as of now.
> 
> I think Patrico was saying you have to call in each week to receive benefits. Just like Ohio. It’s part of the system to basically tell the state your still unemployed. It’s all automated call. I could be wrong tho.


I can not find anything saying its retroactive to January, only that it's for up to 13 weeks ending July 31st, 2020. That is leading me to believe it is only effective from when the CARES Act was signed into law.

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## Saltfork

Snakecharmer said:


> So if you were laid off last year you're out of luck?
> 
> Not necessarily. They added an additional 13 weeks .
> 
> All depends on how much time you worked etc. but say you were on unemployment already and you were on your last week of unemployment. You would get an additional 13 weeks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Or are you saying they will pay you for 4 months starting January?



Basically they say you can or will be paid if you were unemployed in January till today’s date but you would only get half your wages you made. It also counts as weeks of unemployment. That’s sorta how the scale is in Ohio .” You made 800 a week they give you 400 a week unemployment” 

you wouldn’t get the bonus 600 from January till now. The 600 is just from the date the bill was signed. 


I’m not sure about the automated calls weekly. That’s how it was 10 years ago when I filled the one and only time. It was a major pain in the a..


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## Saltfork

Misdirection said:


> I can not find anything saying its retroactive to January, only that it's for up to 13 weeks ending July 31st, 2020. That is leading me to believe it is only effective from when the CARES Act was signed into law.
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


 Yes the 600 is only 13 weeks.


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## Saltfork

LIMA — We’re now three weeks into a new era of mass unemployment caused by the novel coronavirus pandemic, but questions regarding the federal stimulus package — the Coronavirus Aid, Relief and Economic Security (CARES) Act — and the new unemployment programs it created persist.

Here, The Lima News took some of your most pressing questions to the Ohio Department of Job and Family Services. Answers were provided through a spokesperson and the agency’s overview of these unemployment programs, found here.

*The CARES Act was supposed to increase my weekly unemployment compensation by $600, but I haven’t seen it yet. What’s going on?*

Those payments are delayed because Ohio is still programming its system to include the additional $600 per week promised by the CARES Act. It is not clear when Ohioans will start seeing that money.

But the program is retroactive, so anyone who was eligible for unemployment between March 29 and July 31 should eventually see those benefits.

Why the delay? Bret Crow, a spokesperson for the Ohio Department of Job and Family Services, said the agency’s focus thus far has been “to handle the crush of claims and process payments as fast as we can.” He said the agency has paid out more than $97 million in the last three weeks alone. That number will continue to grow as more claims are processed.

And Ohio Department of Job and Family Services, which administers unemployment programs, is still waiting for clarification from the federal Department of Labor on how some of the coronavirus-related programs will be administered.

*I was unemployed prior to the coronavirus mass layoffs. Am I eligible for the additional $600 per week too?*

Yes, this benefit will be available to all Ohioans who collect unemployment between March 29 and July 31, when the emergency benefit expires. That includes anyone who was unemployed prior to the passage of the CARES Act. These benefits will not be available after July 31 unless Congress decides to extend them in another stimulus package.

You’ll also be eligible for the 13-week unemployment extension after you exhaust your state benefits, even if you were unemployed prior to the coronavirus-inspired layoff wave. But this extension is only good through Dec. 31.

*When will the self-employed and independent contractors be eligible for unemployment?*

It is not clear when the new federal unemployment programs will be available in Ohio. But the CARES Act did make the self-employed, independent contractors, gig workers, part-timers and others with limited work histories eligible for what is called pandemic unemployment assistance.

Ohio is now working to create a new 1099 system to process these claims, which will be handled separately from basic unemployment claims the state normally deals with. If you’re self-employed and can no longer work, you’ll have to wait until this new system is built before you can apply.

This program is also retroactive to Jan. 27 and will be available through Dec. 31. But just like traditional unemployment, there are restrictions on how long you can receive benefits. In this case, you’ll only be able to draw benefits for 39 weeks. Your weekly benefits will be calculated in a similar way to traditional jobless claims, which are about 50% of your average weekly wage plus the extra $600.


Lol this is better than me trying to explain.


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## BeerBatter

So
If you get your normal 400 plus the 600
You will get more than if you had been working?
Whose gonna wanna go back to work till they get all they get
As a small business owner this just doesn’t make sense
I cannot believe that we need a bailout so bad already
No one saves and everyone in debt to the hilt
No one prepares for being off work for even a couple months 
It’s scary


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## BeerBatter

I heard they want the tax money on the 600 out of it now
Or if not you will have to pay tax on it next year


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## Saltfork

BeerBatter said:


> So
> If you get your normal 400 plus the 600
> You will get more than if you had been working?
> Whose gonna wanna go back to work till they get all they get
> As a small business owner this just doesn’t make sense
> I cannot believe that we need a bailout so bad already
> No one saves and everyone in debt to the hilt
> No one prepares for being off work for even a couple months
> It’s scary



Basically you would get half your weekly wages plus 600 if there wasn’t the 600 Ohio unemployment would be half what you make weekly.

If your a small business owner. I highly advise you to check out the SBA loan. You get 10 k to keep people employed as long as you use it to pay wages and some other things . it is forgiven.

I know a few people with small business that are using the loan to give bonuses and such.


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## BeerBatter

Yea I want to take out a loan from the government 
They sayyy you won’t have to pay back as long as you pay employees to be home doing nothing

what do I pay unemployment for
My employees are gonna be better off on employment and the 600 extra than if I was paying them praying I won’t have to pay loan back


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## fastwater

SConner said:


> Everyone one is entitled to an opinion, but facts are just that and should not be open to interpretation. *Perhaps if both sides of discussion would preface with “in my opinion” when it is an opinion and cite a reputable source when stating as fact, * this conversation would be less contentious. Food for thought.


Wow!!!
What a great post worth repeating.
Especially the emboldened areas.
Thank you for a very wise post SConner.


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## laguna21

BeerBatter said:


> So
> If you get your normal 400 plus the 600
> You will get more than if you had been working?
> Whose gonna wanna go back to work till they get all they get
> As a small business owner this just doesn’t make sense
> I cannot believe that we need a bailout so bad already
> No one saves and everyone in debt to the hilt
> No one prepares for being off work for even a couple months
> It’s scary


I said the same thing on here about a week ago, still haven't heard of anyone who has got the extra $600


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## loweman165

I hear the argument that alot of people won't go back to work because thier making more on unemployment BUT when thier employer calls them back thier also supposed to let unemployment know. The weekly claims asks "did you refuse work", if you answer NO then your not getting paid. Happens all the time in construction; boss calls s guy back and they got plans that week doing something else because they expected to be off. Following week thier weekly claim gets denied. 
I hope this stands true with the stimulus unemployment as well.


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## Patricio

Saltfork said:


> .
> 
> I think Patrico was saying you have to call in each week to receive benefits. Just like Ohio. It’s part of the system to basically tell the state your still unemployed. It’s all automated call. I could be wrong tho.


Pretty sure that's it. We will find out soon enough. I got lucky. I live in Wisconsin but work in Minneapolis. And Minnesota is very generous with their unemployment. And according to what I've read, I file in Minnesota.


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## Patricio

laguna21 said:


> I said the same thing on here about a week ago, still haven't heard of anyone who has got the extra $600


Someone at work whose wife was laid off got it.so it's there.


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## Snakecharmer

Patricio said:


> Someone at work whose wife was laid off got it.so it's there.


what state?


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## Patricio

Snakecharmer said:


> what state?


Minnesota.


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## laguna21

Patricio said:


> Someone at work whose wife was laid off got it.so it's there.


So got $600 on top of the normal benefits she would have been eligible for? Trying to wrap my head around this.


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## Saugeye Tom

I ran some numbers. 11,700000 people in ohio...200 deaths. .0000654. Same number of people 5500 cases. .000547 per


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## BMustang

Saugeye Tom said:


> I ran some numbers. 11,700000 people in ohio...200 deaths. .0000654. Same number of people 5500 cases. .000547 per


And then deduct the number of deaths of persons 80 years old with underlying issues, and suddenly the king has no clothes!

In the old days I would tell Tom to take care of himself because there is a flu going around. 
Now ..........................


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## multi species angler

The shame of it is that some people considered essential employees are making far less than the people on unemployment. The ones that are putting their life on the line for the rest of us should get a $600.00 bonus a week. There are lots of jobs to be had but nobody is going off unemployment to make less money. There are several things wrong with this system ( IN MY OPINION)


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## Snakecharmer

Patricio said:


> Minnesota.


OK Minn. I don think Ohio will pay until next week hopefully.


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## laguna21

multi species angler said:


> The shame of it is that some people considered essential employees are making far less than the people on unemployment. The ones that are putting their life on the line for the rest of us should get a $600.00 bonus a week. There are lots of jobs to be had but nobody is going off unemployment to make less money. There are several things wrong with this system ( IN MY OPINION)


Almost like paying them extra to stay home, I could see making up some of the difference in lost wages but this is like a bonus to not work in MY OPINION. A friend of our daughters works the register at a local grocery store and you guys might be shocked to hear some of the stories, she deserves the bonus IMO, afraid for her and not only for getting sick, some people are acting damn crazy!


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## OptOutside440

Does anyone else feel like this feels like a dream or something? How surreal it feels. Like I'm in a Ray Bradbury novel. Soon we'll all be living in our own personal bio-domes.


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## Fish-N-Fool

In my opinion we should not be giving an extra $600 a week blanket *bonus.* It is a bonus - you as a worker didn't pay for it nor did your employer. It is no different than if I pay $100 monthly to an insurer for disability insurance slated to pay me $3500 monthly if I become disabled...but instead they decide to pay me $4,500 a month - the math just doesn't work. 

The area of Ohio I live most workers here make $9-$16 an hour. All my adult nephews and nieces (my sister) work full-time jobs and none make over $14. So, I work 40 hours and gross $500.....is this correct that under this program I now receive $250 + $600 per week? Hell no.....totally agree give the money to those essential employees working with the public as a bonus if we are going to spend it. 

Should have been some sort of phase in and out like the checks. Going the other direction what if I make $4k a week......should we really be providing this person an extra $600 weekly? In my opinion...no!

It can't be undone, but I'm sitting here thinking of just my own family members and the thousands of dollars in "extras" they are receiving between stimulus checks and $600 extra per week........2020 will be their highest earning year which doesn't seem quite right to me...in my opinion. No wonder my nephew who is out of work just ordered a new $850 firearm....he is making more now than ever!

I'm not sure this is what Roosevelt had in mind back in 1935....wish he was around to ask.


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## Misdirection

Fish-N-Fool said:


> In my opinion we should not be giving an extra $600 a week blanket *bonus.* It is a bonus - you as a worker didn't pay for it nor did your employer. It is no different than if I pay $100 monthly to an insurer for disability insurance slated to pay me $3500 monthly if I become disabled...but instead they decide to pay me $4,500 a month - the math just doesn't work.
> 
> The area of Ohio I live most workers here make $9-$16 an hour. All my adult nephews and nieces (my sister) work full-time jobs and none make over $14. So, I work 40 hours and gross $500.....is this correct that under this program I now receive $250 + $600 per week? Hell no.....totally agree give the money to those essential employees working with the public as a bonus if we are going to spend it.
> 
> Should have been some sort of phase in and out like the checks. Going the other direction what if I make $4k a week......should we really be providing this person an extra $600 weekly? In my opinion...no!
> 
> It can't be undone, but I'm sitting here thinking of just my own family members and the thousands of dollars in "extras" they are receiving between stimulus checks and $600 extra per week........2020 will be their highest earning year which doesn't seem quite right to me...in my opinion. No wonder my nephew who is out of work just ordered a new $850 firearm....he is making more now than ever!
> 
> I'm not sure this is what Roosevelt had in mind back in 1935....wish he was around to ask.


I'm not sure about Ohio, but over here in PA, unemployment only pays up to 50% of wages with a cap. For many, that's not enough to cover rent, groceries, and other necessities. That $600 a week can and will make a big difference. In my opinion, the Govt took this route this time since during the crash of 08, too many people ended up losing their homes. Hopefully not so much this time.

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## Saltfork

Fish-N-Fool said:


> In my opinion we should not be giving an extra $600 a week blanket *bonus.* It is a bonus - you as a worker didn't pay for it nor did your employer. It is no different than if I pay $100 monthly to an insurer for disability insurance slated to pay me $3500 monthly if I become disabled...but instead they decide to pay me $4,500 a month - the math just doesn't work.
> 
> The area of Ohio I live most workers here make $9-$16 an hour. All my adult nephews and nieces (my sister) work full-time jobs and none make over $14. So, I work 40 hours and gross $500.....is this correct that under this program I now receive $250 + $600 per week? Hell no.....totally agree give the money to those essential employees working with the public as a bonus if we are going to spend it.
> 
> Should have been some sort of phase in and out like the checks. Going the other direction what if I make $4k a week......should we really be providing this person an extra $600 weekly? In my opinion...no!
> 
> It can't be undone, but I'm sitting here thinking of just my own family members and the thousands of dollars in "extras" they are receiving between stimulus checks and $600 extra per week........2020 will be their highest earning year which doesn't seem quite right to me...in my opinion. No wonder my nephew who is out of work just ordered a new $850 firearm....he is making more now than ever!
> 
> I'm not sure this is what Roosevelt had in mind back in 1935....wish he was around to ask.



I agree with most of what ya said. I think it should have been based on a pay check. 

The flip side of the coin is say you make 800 a week. You cannot work due to the covid, Place of work shut down by no choice of your own. 

But the government didn’t do anything. You use the old scale unemployment. Soo 800 turns to 400. Your monthly income of 3200 just turned to 1600. Compound that if both wife and husband lost work because of the covid. No fault of their own. 

People shouldn’t be making more than they did before that’s for sure. 100percent.


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## Redheads

multi species angler said:


> The shame of it is that some people considered essential employees are making far less than the people on unemployment. The ones that are putting their life on the line for the rest of us should get a $600.00 bonus a week. There are lots of jobs to be had but nobody is going off unemployment to make less money. There are several things wrong with this system ( IN MY OPINION)


Not only putting their life on the line what about their family members as well.

My guys are getting "hazard pay", no were not on the front line but considered essential. This will continue until there is no money left to do it


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## Fish-N-Fool

Misdirection - we also passed legislation addressing housing and other notes folks have. You can defer payment without penalty. You can not pay rent and you aren't going anywhere. 

If you look at the consumer driven US economy, the 50% is a good number. MOST Americans spend 50% of their income on non-essential consumption. Look at the formulas used by banks and credit institutions. If looking at gross income, total all debt including mortgage, credit cards, car payments, etc. should be no more than 36% MAX. And that 36% is the peak; ideally it should be about 20% or less. Even if you are not the best at managing your finances and are at the top of that range, you should have no trouble making it 60-90 days on 50% of your normal income; especially in light of the penalty free deferment programs. 

Look hard times are meant to be hard times....not to maintain your lifestyle you had during good times. Cable, internet, $1200 cell phones, expensive cars, entertainment, dining out - that should all go out the window. In my opinion, we are rewarding those that live above their pay grade and do not properly handle finances. Some will be offended...well because they know they are in this category. Instead of folks in this category having hard times for 90 days we prop them up and reward poor financial behavior. I drove by the local food bank line the time before last when I left the house.....most vehicles were much newer than the 12 year old car I own (let alone the Lincolns, caddys, and 60k+ SUVs). 

Look I get it - life is hard. Like many I came up with nothing....zero. As a kid I bounced from rental to rental, had whatever free clothes I could get, and most of my years until late teens I lived in a crappy trailer I would currently deem a tool shed. I got free lunch at school, got made fun of (kids are kids), coach bought my gear for sports so I could play and I sure never had cable, AC, vacations, etc. I didn't even get anything for my birthday most years. I'm not sitting here in my McMansion looking down at people....I am representative of the people and their are millions like me. And no I'm not 90 years old telling tales from the depression. 

If you cannot live within your means and save some money back for a rainy day in this country I just don't know what to tell you. You wouldn't have a prayer of making it in most other parts of the world. I'd just prefer folks actually have to experience "hard" times if they have not prepared....my opinion is we should have much more personal accountability in this country it is just sad.


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## loweman165

As far as the $600 "bonus" as some call it goes, I feel if a government of any state or country tells me I can't go to work they should pay up. Never thought I'd live to see the day people are forced NOT to work.


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## texasrig

Fish-N-Fool said:


> The area of Ohio I live most workers here make $9-$16 an hour. All my adult nephews and nieces (my sister) work full-time jobs and none make over $14. So, I work 40 hours a week and gross $500.


I don't understand this. Why are people satisfied making these kinds of wages. Where I work we can't find reliable people to fill good paying jobs. Off the street you start off at $15/ hour. 6 mo. you get a raise, at 2 years you make at least $18/ hour and its not hard work. We have jobs that we will train you to do that pay $20+/ hour. The guys on those lines make 80000 to 100000 with over time. All you have to do is show up for work every day and be productive. 98% of the people who come into out plant only last a few days, or they get to where they will be hired full time and they can't pass the drug test. Most all the factories in our area are begging for good workers. 
When this all passes I'm sure it will be the same way. Don't let the fear of change hold you back.


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## crittergitter

Why do we have a doctor in NY who has treated 700 people who had tested postive for Covid-19 and has a 100% recovery rate and very, very low inpatient record and the media is squelching the story!!!

This should be blasted across every news station there is! 

What the HELL is wrong with people??? 

No politics! No more people dieing! That's what matters most!!!


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## ovrecheck

loweman165 said:


> As far as the $600 "bonus" as some call it goes, I feel if a government of any state or country tells me I can't go to work they should pay up. Never thought I'd live to see the day people are forced NOT to work.


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## Burkcarp1

crittergitter said:


> Why do we have a doctor in NY who has treated 700 people who had tested postive for Covid-19 and has a 100% recovery rate and very, very low inpatient record and the media is squelching the story!!!
> 
> This should be blasted across every news station there is!
> 
> What the HELL is wrong with people???
> 
> No politics! No more people dieing! That's what matters most!!!


Because it doesn’t fit the agenda..


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## Hatchetman

montagc said:


> No you don't. Go get a test. If you have the antibodies, think about donating blood if you are able.
> 
> EDIT: If you come back as having had it, I'll pay you for your testing cost.



What is your problem with someone saying they had this virus and recovered? Do you think for one minute that everyone that's had this virus has been tested? What planet do you live on. Don't sit here and call someone a liar or insinuate they don't know what they are talking about. Don't know what makes you so much of an expert, you act like the guys that say about fish stories, no pics, didn't happen. As far as I'm concerned you are going over board on this "I know what I'm talking about and you don't"! My heart goes out to everyone who has suffered from this virus or has lost friends or family....Just my opinion


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## Saugeyefisher

Shew I wish I could save a months worth or income for times like these. I try. Trust me. I save a couple ways for retirement. Everytime I think I'm getting somewhere something comes up,like new roof, fridge brakes,hot water tank goes out, vehicle repairs,keeping my kids fed an entertained with out help from the government (well except a couple child credits come tax time). 
And I mean it is always something taking chunks out of our savings. 
I wish I was a mechanic that would help,but still... and I'm not complaining. I love my life,but life is expensive. I have 0 credit card dept,one car payment the others payed off,and a house payment. Now I do try to prepare bye putting up 6 months worth of house psyments at a time(a fully good thru January as of now,buy my monthly payment is very low compared to most). 
We live within out means,but we still try to live. Ya I could get financed for a nice boat,but I make due paying cash for kayaks,we would love to go to disney for a week but make due with a couple days at kings island. 
Saving money is alot easier said then done.


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## Meerkat

I found this recently and this is the sad norm of our society. I am not the author, but I wish I was:

“We are seeing the most draconian measures enforced at all levels of government that we've ever seen in our lifetimes, and yet rather than being alarmed by the things going on, we applaud.

People are being arrested for spending too much time outside, and we applaud. Pastors are being arrested for daring to hold church services, and we applaud. A child's birthday party is raided by police, and we applaud. A young woman is ticketed for going on a leisurely drive alone because it's deemed "non-essential travel", and we applaud. A parade of school teachers and administrators who wanted to drive through neighborhoods and wave at children is busted up by cops because they were "nonessential," and we applaud. A lone paddle boarder in the ocean on a beach without any other people around is arrested because he's violating quarantine orders, and we applaud.

Businesses are beings forcibly closed and padlocked and owners arrested for refusing to shut down, and we applaud.

We're being told to use hotlines and online forms provided by our local governments to report our neighbors who don't obey, and we comply. We scold people day after day for not obeying government edicts, and if any of us dare to question what's happening, we lecture about how they're a danger to society and they just don't care about people dying.

We've somehow managed to convince ourselves that the people whose lives are affected by a virus are MUCH more important than the people whose lives are being destroyed by the effects of a worldwide economic shutdown and impending worldwide depression the likes of which no one has ever seen before.

At what point will we start QUESTIONING what's going on? How far does the government have to push before we're jolted awake from our slumber? How far are we willing to go with this?

If they told us to load our families onto train cars so that we could be taken to Virus Protection Facilities for our own safety, would we do it?

Yes, we would. That much has become painfully obvious to me. And the whole time, we'd be shaking our finger and yelling at those of us who refused, accusing them of being "a danger to society" and "not caring if people die."

But they don't have to load us onto train cars and take us to Virus Protection Facilities, or force us to comply, because we do that voluntarily. They control our mind. They control us through fear. They control us by convincing us that the world is a scary dangerous place, but they're here to protect us, care for us, and keep us safe, just as long as we OBEY.

They know that as long as we're locked inside our comfortable home with Netflix, Hulu, Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, and a cell phone, while dangling a $1200 check in front of us like a carrot on a stick, we'll comply. No force is necessary for the majority of the herd.

We are imprisoned, willingly, and we're too blind to see it.”


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## Misdirection

Fish-N-Fool said:


> Misdirection - we also passed legislation addressing housing and other notes folks have. You can defer payment without penalty. You can not pay rent and you aren't going anywhere.
> 
> If you look at the consumer driven US economy, the 50% is a good number. MOST Americans spend 50% of their income on non-essential consumption. Look at the formulas used by banks and credit institutions. If looking at gross income, total all debt including mortgage, credit cards, car payments, etc. should be no more than 36% MAX. And that 36% is the peak; ideally it should be about 20% or less. Even if you are not the best at managing your finances and are at the top of that range, you should have no trouble making it 60-90 days on 50% of your normal income; especially in light of the penalty free deferment programs.
> 
> Look hard times are meant to be hard times....not to maintain your lifestyle you had during good times. Cable, internet, $1200 cell phones, expensive cars, entertainment, dining out - that should all go out the window. In my opinion, we are rewarding those that live above their pay grade and do not properly handle finances. Some will be offended...well because they know they are in this category. Instead of folks in this category having hard times for 90 days we prop them up and reward poor financial behavior. I drove by the local food bank line the time before last when I left the house.....most vehicles were much newer than the 12 year old car I own (let alone the Lincolns, caddys, and 60k+ SUVs).
> 
> Look I get it - life is hard. Like many I came up with nothing....zero. As a kid I bounced from rental to rental, had whatever free clothes I could get, and most of my years until late teens I lived in a crappy trailer I would currently deem a tool shed. I got free lunch at school, got made fun of (kids are kids), coach bought my gear for sports so I could play and I sure never had cable, AC, vacations, etc. I didn't even get anything for my birthday most years. I'm not sitting here in my McMansion looking down at people....I am representative of the people and their are millions like me. And no I'm not 90 years old telling tales from the depression.
> 
> If you cannot live within your means and save some money back for a rainy day in this country I just don't know what to tell you. You wouldn't have a prayer of making it in most other parts of the world. I'd just prefer folks actually have to experience "hard" times if they have not prepared....my opinion is we should have much more personal accountability in this country it is just sad.


During 08 I watched both of my neighbors get foreclosed on. Both continued to work but at reduced wages. While large banks and financial firms got bailouts. Its much better to see that money go back into the economy from the ground up. 

It takes a while for unemployment to kick in and actually send money to people and at the end of the year they need to claim that money on their taxes; many do not realize this.

Yes banks and lending institutions are allowing people to defer house and mortgage payments, but other costs still add up. Many are in positions where they need to spend more than 36% of their pay on essentials because they dont make very much.

I'm very fortunate to be in the financial position I'm in and haven't always been there throughout my life, but many aren't that fortunate thru no fault of their own. 



Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## Fish-N-Fool

texasrig you are preaching to the choir.......where I live you can buy a decent family home in town for 60-75k. Lots of people (including much of my family) just don't want more. They are perfectly content to live here around town, work locally, make low wages and get by. I was driving 75 miles each way to Columbus when I turned 16 working in Obetz at a shipping plant by the air field. Why? I made $15 an hour and that is when people in my town made $6.75-$9 an hour tops. Kept that job and it paid my way through OSU, all living expenses, 2 degrees and bought me a decent used car. When I quit I made more than most around my area as a college student. I have all but begged my nephews to just move to Columbus...they work hard, don't do drugs and would easily make 20 something an hour immediately. Nothing keeping them where they are (young and single). Nope won't happen! I drive 30k miles a year for employment for that very reason; they all think I am crazy. To each their own.

And I won't lecture anybody on finances because it is none of my business how people spend their money. I know how life treats us all and there is always unexpected and unwelcome expenses. Saving can be really difficult. My only advice is the easiest way to save is not to see your money. Even if you must open a second savings account and put a little each pay (this works well for many). Once you don't see it you won't spend it. And if you cannot pay for items out of money on hand (not out of savings) don't buy it...and you likely don't need it. Ask is this a want, or a need? And it certainly is ok to treat yourself now and then especially once you build a nice cushion. I'm not THAT guy eating cat food or something. 

Maybe this situation will get more people in the mode to save and prepare for bad times when we recover....we haven't seen a real downturn in many years. If history tells us anything that won't be the case (many years of consecutive increases in US consumer spending with the *average* american spending well over $60k last year). I would hedge my bet we keep on spending as a nation and that should help the recovery after this shock. I have seen projections saying a net loss of 10% in GDP for 2020. That is with an expected large rebound in 4th quarter so let's all hope the 4th quarter of the year is booming and we are all back to work.


----------



## SConner

Meerkat said:


> I found this recently and this is the sad norm of our society. I am not the author, but I wish I was:
> 
> “We are seeing the most draconian measures enforced at all levels of government that we've ever seen in our lifetimes, and yet rather than being alarmed by the things going on, we applaud.
> 
> People are being arrested for spending too much time outside, and we applaud. Pastors are being arrested for daring to hold church services, and we applaud. A child's birthday party is raided by police, and we applaud. A young woman is ticketed for going on a leisurely drive alone because it's deemed "non-essential travel", and we applaud. A parade of school teachers and administrators who wanted to drive through neighborhoods and wave at children is busted up by cops because they were "nonessential," and we applaud. A lone paddle boarder in the ocean on a beach without any other people around is arrested because he's violating quarantine orders, and we applaud.
> 
> Businesses are beings forcibly closed and padlocked and owners arrested for refusing to shut down, and we applaud.
> 
> We're being told to use hotlines and online forms provided by our local governments to report our neighbors who don't obey, and we comply. We scold people day after day for not obeying government edicts, and if any of us dare to question what's happening, we lecture about how they're a danger to society and they just don't care about people dying.
> 
> We've somehow managed to convince ourselves that the people whose lives are affected by a virus are MUCH more important than the people whose lives are being destroyed by the effects of a worldwide economic shutdown and impending worldwide depression the likes of which no one has ever seen before.
> 
> At what point will we start QUESTIONING what's going on? How far does the government have to push before we're jolted awake from our slumber? How far are we willing to go with this?
> 
> If they told us to load our families onto train cars so that we could be taken to Virus Protection Facilities for our own safety, would we do it?
> 
> Yes, we would. That much has become painfully obvious to me. And the whole time, we'd be shaking our finger and yelling at those of us who refused, accusing them of being "a danger to society" and "not caring if people die."
> 
> But they don't have to load us onto train cars and take us to Virus Protection Facilities, or force us to comply, because we do that voluntarily. They control our mind. They control us through fear. They control us by convincing us that the world is a scary dangerous place, but they're here to protect us, care for us, and keep us safe, just as long as we OBEY.
> 
> They know that as long as we're locked inside our comfortable home with Netflix, Hulu, Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, and a cell phone, while dangling a $1200 check in front of us like a carrot on a stick, we'll comply. No force is necessary for the majority of the herd.
> 
> We are imprisoned, willingly, and we're too blind to see it.”


Who is “they”? What would be their endgame?


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

Hatchetman said:


> What is your problem with someone saying they had this virus and recovered? Do you think for one minute that everyone that's had this virus has been tested? What planet do you live on. Don't sit here and call someone a liar or insinuate they don't know what they are talking about. Don't know what makes you so much of an expert, you act like the guys that say about fish stories, no pics, didn't happen. As far as I'm concerned you are going over board on this "I know what I'm talking about and you don't"! My heart goes out to everyone who has suffered from this virus or has lost friends or family....Just my opinion


Problem is that's an awfully bold and careless statement to make, in his case repeatedly, for something this serious. Here was a thoughtful reply @Lundy made to a similar post many pages ago:

↑
_i agree. back in January my 2 sons came down with something horrible, both are over 21 my oldest had it so bad he visited the e.r 3 times. he had a bad cough and high fever they told him he had type a flu. he was sick for 2 weeks missed 6 days work, my youngest had it for week but he is a non smoker, so yes America is a day late and a dollar short on this one....they dropped the ball
_
Not diminishing what your sons had at all but we do have flu every year in this country and causes coughing and high temperatures. That doesn't mean they had Covid 19. I think people much smarter than you or me would be required to figure that one out.


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## Meerkat

SConner said:


> Who is “they”? What would be their endgame?


"They" would be "Government". It has been said that: "Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely." We are getting dangerously close to absolute power.


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## hailtothethief

The problem is morals have been completely eroded in the united states. People depend on big brother to know what’s best for them. People are less individually responsible. Individuals instead of being protected from coercion by the state are being coerced by the state. Its been going on a long time. As this snowball rolls downhill it builds steam becomes rather large and mows down everyone in its path. Its inevitable the u.s. will be locked down like a prison. The virus is a part of the problem. But this is such a broad issue coming to a head. There is a contagious virus, a credit bubble, a police state, all of this is smashing the individual financially, healthwise, and free will wise. Millions of americans are hitting unemployment, will i get paid with the economy shutting down? Where’s the state getting the money? Most americans are over weight and unhealthy, and what happens if an overall sickly group of old people get a new virus? And then you have to worry whether the police are going to jump you if you leave your house or stand too close to someone. 

The world is much different.


----------



## Meerkat

Meerkat said:


> I found this recently and this is the sad norm of our society. I am not the author, but I wish I was:
> 
> “We are seeing the most draconian measures enforced at all levels of government that we've ever seen in our lifetimes, and yet rather than being alarmed by the things going on, we applaud.
> 
> People are being arrested for spending too much time outside, and we applaud. Pastors are being arrested for daring to hold church services, and we applaud. A child's birthday party is raided by police, and we applaud. A young woman is ticketed for going on a leisurely drive alone because it's deemed "non-essential travel", and we applaud. A parade of school teachers and administrators who wanted to drive through neighborhoods and wave at children is busted up by cops because they were "nonessential," and we applaud. A lone paddle boarder in the ocean on a beach without any other people around is arrested because he's violating quarantine orders, and we applaud.
> 
> Businesses are beings forcibly closed and padlocked and owners arrested for refusing to shut down, and we applaud.
> 
> We're being told to use hotlines and online forms provided by our local governments to report our neighbors who don't obey, and we comply. We scold people day after day for not obeying government edicts, and if any of us dare to question what's happening, we lecture about how they're a danger to society and they just don't care about people dying.
> 
> We've somehow managed to convince ourselves that the people whose lives are affected by a virus are MUCH more important than the people whose lives are being destroyed by the effects of a worldwide economic shutdown and impending worldwide depression the likes of which no one has ever seen before.
> 
> At what point will we start QUESTIONING what's going on? How far does the government have to push before we're jolted awake from our slumber? How far are we willing to go with this?
> 
> If they told us to load our families onto train cars so that we could be taken to Virus Protection Facilities for our own safety, would we do it?
> 
> Yes, we would. That much has become painfully obvious to me. And the whole time, we'd be shaking our finger and yelling at those of us who refused, accusing them of being "a danger to society" and "not caring if people die."
> 
> But they don't have to load us onto train cars and take us to Virus Protection Facilities, or force us to comply, because we do that voluntarily. They control our mind. They control us through fear. They control us by convincing us that the world is a scary dangerous place, but they're here to protect us, care for us, and keep us safe, just as long as we OBEY.
> 
> They know that as long as we're locked inside our comfortable home with Netflix, Hulu, Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, and a cell phone, while dangling a $1200 check in front of us like a carrot on a stick, we'll comply. No force is necessary for the majority of the herd.
> 
> We are imprisoned, willingly, and we're too blind to see it.”


Just to be clear, I am not suggesting for one minute that the Corona Virus is not real but there are people who will and are using this crisis to further their own ends. For example, if you get admitted to hospital for a head wound, they will test you for Corona Virus. If you subsequently die of the head wound and you tested positive for Corona Virus they will list you as a Corona Virus death. Both deaths _from_ Corona Virus and deaths _with_ Corona Virus are listed as Corona Virus deaths. That is misleading, intentional or otherwise.


----------



## Misdirection

Meerkat said:


> Just to be clear, I am not suggesting for one minute that the Corona Virus is not real but there are people who will and are using this crisis to further their own ends. For example, if you get admitted to hospital for a head wound, they will test you for Corona Virus. If you subsequently die of the head wound and you tested positive for Corona Virus they will list you as a Corona Virus death. Both deaths _from_ Corona Virus and deaths _with_ Corona Virus are listed as Corona Virus deaths. That is misleading, intentional or otherwise.


True, but there are also alot of deaths occurring (up to 200/day) with in residences in NY that they can no longer keep up with and if they can't confirm Covid-19, that does not go on the death certificate. So there is some under reporting occurring as well.

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## AmericanEagle

I know the ventilators used in hospitals are way more sophisticated than these devices but it sure would be wonderful if they could save some lives in a worst case scenario.

www.kxl.com/mississippi-doctor-makes-100-ventilator-using-garden-hose-electronic-valve-lamp-timer/

www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/engineers-hope-to-solve-ventilator-shortage-with-breast-pumps-220210835.html


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## texasrig

Misdirection said:


> True, but there are also alot of deaths occurring (up to 200/day) with in residences in NY that they can no longer keep up with and if they can't confirm Covid-19, that does not go on the death certificate. So there is some under reporting occurring as well.
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


So your saying that people are getting sick and are refusing to go to the hospital, the these people are dying of the virus. What person would be really sick and refuse to get medical aid. I don't by it. I don't buy it that the hospitals in NY cannot keep up. That's not what they are reporting. 
I won't say it didn't happen once, but it's not adding to under reporting. Not even close to to the number being over reported. 
To many things aren't adding up, people are getting fed up with the BS. I give it a week or so, then things will start to hit the fan.


----------



## AmericanEagle

Meerkat said:


> Just to be clear, I am not suggesting for one minute that the Corona Virus is not real but there are people who will and are using this crisis to further their own ends. For example, if you get admitted to hospital for a head wound, they will test you for Corona Virus. If you subsequently die of the head wound and you tested positive for Corona Virus they will list you as a Corona Virus death. Both deaths _from_ Corona Virus and deaths _with_ Corona Virus are listed as Corona Virus deaths. That is misleading, intentional or otherwise.


This link explains why covid-19 deaths are reported the way they are and makes the case that they are under reported.

www.yahoo.com/news/fauci-dismisses-conspiracy-theories-to-spin-the-coronavirus-death-toll-132059427.html


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## hailtothethief

texasrig said:


> So your saying that people are getting sick and are refusing to go to the hospital, the these people are dying of the virus. What person would be really sick and refuse to get medical aid. I don't by it. I don't buy it that the hospitals in NY cannot keep up. That's not what they are reporting.
> I won't say it didn't happen once, but it's not adding to under reporting. Not even close to to the number being over reported. .


Hospitals are expensive. People arent going to be hospital until they are at rock bottom and by then it can be too late.


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## cheezemm2

texasrig said:


> So your saying that people are getting sick and are refusing to go to the hospital, the these people are dying of the virus. What person would be really sick and refuse to get medical aid. I don't by it. I don't buy it that the hospitals in NY cannot keep up. That's not what they are reporting.
> I won't say it didn't happen once, but it's not adding to under reporting. Not even close to to the number being over reported.
> To many things aren't adding up, people are getting fed up with the BS. I give it a week or so, then things will start to hit the fan.


What exactly do you think will happen in a week? I'm genuinely curious.


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## Dovans

multi species angler said:


> The shame of it is that some people considered essential employees are making far less than the people on unemployment. The ones that are putting their life on the line for the rest of us should get a $600.00 bonus a week. There are lots of jobs to be had but nobody is going off unemployment to make less money. There are several things wrong with this system ( IN MY OPINION)


Very true. Damn that ruined my day.


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## STRONGPERSUADER

When I was at the hospital yesterday it was pretty quiet, not busy at all, no chaos at all. There are few differences since I was there the last two times in a month. They are now taking temps as soon as you walk in. Everyone had masks on but I found it odd they didn’t offer me one when I got there. I was the only person in radiology waiting for my turn in the tube. A custodial worker was disinfecting every chair in that waiting room which were quite a few chairs, never seen that before. Also they were not offering their valet parking which is a good thing. That’s about all I noticed different as a patient walking in. I talked to a few techs that said they have a few CV “in”patients on the floors but not as many as expected and their feeling was that a lot of people are staying home and riding it out if they get it.


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## Dovans

Saugeyefisher said:


> Shew I wish I could save a months worth or income for times like these. I try. Trust me. I save a couple ways for retirement. Everytime I think I'm getting somewhere something comes up,like new roof, fridge brakes,hot water tank goes out, vehicle repairs,keeping my kids fed an entertained with out help from the government (well except a couple child credits come tax time).
> And I mean it is always something taking chunks out of our savings.
> I wish I was a mechanic that would help,but still... and I'm not complaining. I love my life,but life is expensive. I have 0 credit card dept,one car payment the others payed off,and a house payment. Now I do try to prepare bye putting up 6 months worth of house psyments at a time(a fully good thru January as of now,buy my monthly payment is very low compared to most).
> We live within out means,but we still try to live. Ya I could get financed for a nice boat,but I make due paying cash for kayaks,we would love to go to disney for a week but make due with a couple days at kings island.
> Saving money is alot easier said then done.


I betcha it has taken me thirty years to save for 6 months of living expenses.. Right now I am looking at a new furnace.. Sticker shock for sure.


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## Misdirection

texasrig said:


> So your saying that people are getting sick and are refusing to go to the hospital, the these people are dying of the virus. What person would be really sick and refuse to get medical aid. I don't by it. I don't buy it that the hospitals in NY cannot keep up. That's not what they are reporting.
> I won't say it didn't happen once, but it's not adding to under reporting. Not even close to to the number being over reported.
> To many things aren't adding up, people are getting fed up with the BS. I give it a week or so, then things will start to hit the fan.


Scroll down to the April 6th update at the bottom. Straight from the Chair of the New York Health Committee.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

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## Saugeyefisher

Dovans said:


> I betcha it has taken me thirty years to save for 6 months of living expenses.. Right now I am looking at a new furnace.. Sticker shock for sure.


Lol that makes me feel a little better. We have been married 10 years. Will get there on day...


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## Misdirection

Misdirection said:


> Scroll down to the April 6th update at the bottom. Straight from the Chair of the New York Health Committee.
> 
> https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


Another source New York Fire Department...

https://time.com/5818062/new-york-doctor-coronavirus-death-toll/

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## Misdirection

Misdirection said:


> Another source New York Fire Department...
> 
> https://time.com/5818062/new-york-doctor-coronavirus-death-toll/
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


Another source, this time quoting the Mayor of NY.

https://www.latimes.com/world-nation/story/2020-04-08/coronavirus-national-states-pandemic

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## spikeg79

The only post I will make about this is (and I hope it doesn't get deleted) I hope every United Nations country Leader comes together and gives China an ultimatum to clean their (act) up or else. I don't know about the rest of you but I am sick and tired of new virus pandemics coming out of that country every 5 to 10 years now. /end rant



multi species angler said:


> The shame of it is that some people considered essential employees are making far less than the people on unemployment. The ones that are putting their life on the line for the rest of us should get a $600.00 bonus a week. There are lots of jobs to be had but nobody is going off unemployment to make less money. There are several things wrong with this system ( IN MY OPINION)


Couldn't have said it better myself. Every worker that's considered essential right now should at least be getting a $600 a week paycheck as well till this is over not just the unemployed.


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## loomis82

I sure enjoy working while other are on unemployment and soon to get a extra $600 Not saying it's their choice to be on unemployment but why dont regular workers the have to work because we are "essential " get something out of it


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## STRONGPERSUADER

Just some NYC population facts to put out there. 

New York City has the highest population density of any major city in the United States, with over 27,000 people per square mile.

About 1 in every 38 people living in the United States resides in New York City.

New York City has more people than 40 of the 50 U.S. states.

Of course the death toll numbers will be higher....


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## Misdirection

texasrig said:


> So your saying that people are getting sick and are refusing to go to the hospital, the these people are dying of the virus. What person would be really sick and refuse to get medical aid. I don't by it. I don't buy it that the hospitals in NY cannot keep up. That's not what they are reporting.
> I won't say it didn't happen once, but it's not adding to under reporting. Not even close to to the number being over reported.
> To many things aren't adding up, people are getting fed up with the BS. I give it a week or so, then things will start to hit the fan.


And I never said anyone was refusing to go to the hospital nor did I say that hospitals in NY couldnt keep up. Those were your words. I said that there were people dying at home that they could no longer keep up with testing to confirm Covid-19 that are now not being counted as dying from Covid-19.

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## Burkcarp1

I know a nurse that filled out 2 different death certificates. One was a heart attack and the other one was a stroke. Put it on the desk and later looked at them again and cause of death was changed to corona...


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## Legend killer

Burkcarp1 said:


> I know a nurse that filled out 2 different death certificates. One was a heart attack and the other one was a stroke. Put it on the desk and later looked at them again and cause of death was changed to corona...


Calling bs.


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## texasrig

cheezemm2 said:


> What exactly do you think will happen in a week? I'm genuinely curious.


Don't hold me to exactly a week, but people will start to say screw these rules and the supposed experts. They will stop staying home and will rebel against the system. I figure it will take that long for everyone to catch on to the fact that the experts have no idea what they are talking about, as far as this thing being worse than the flu. It maybe different, but the death toll is the same or less. People will see that the king has no clothes. Just saying. 
Step back, look at some of the news stories being put out. It's starting to form.


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## Snakecharmer

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Just some NYC population facts to put out there.
> 
> New York City has the highest population density of any major city in the United States, with over 27,000 people per square mile.
> 
> About 1 in every 38 people living in the United States resides in New York City.
> 
> New York City has more people than 40 of the 50 U.S. states.
> 
> Of course the death toll numbers will be higher....


And the death rate for NY state is 360 per million which is higher than Italy Spain or France. I imagine in the city its 500 per million.


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## Burkcarp1

Legend killer said:


> Calling bs.


Ok,suit your self.


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## bridgeman

30 cases in my county. One death, patient had severe dementia. This is tough on everyone the whole country is shut down based on the rate if occurrence in densely populated areas. Only problem is how do you keep people from going into the hotspots and carrying to small town USA.


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## texasrig

Misdirection said:


> True, but there are also alot of deaths occurring (up to 200/day) with in residences in NY that they can no longer keep up with and if they can't confirm Covid-19, that does not go on the death certificate. So there is some under reporting occurring as well.
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


So you said up to 200 per day are dying at home. That's a lot of deaths at home. Why are they dying at home, there has to be a reason. Either they refuse to get medical attention, or there is no room for them at the inn. I don't buy those numbers. Form those number and the numbers reported on the news, that would make 1/5 of the people who are dying. That's not reported anywhere else. Hummm. How many die at home regularly, so the want to pad the numbers by including those now. People who were dying from whatever they were dying from in the first place. People with terminal diseases that we're going to die anyhow.

I looked up your source, it does say that. Bad numbers. It says it's an estimate. Why are they dying at home and not seeking medical care.


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## Southernsaug

Has anyone gone fishing? Dang this is a fishing forum.....What if our Government had just said, "let this run it's course and ignored it" and then it blew up into a catastrophe, would everyone be demanding the heads of our officials? Our officials are in no win positions. They are the people of this country just like you and me and sure a few have agendas, but most are doing their honest best to help us. They're not trying to become dictators they are being servants. They are listening to those who know how disease works, I wouldn't hire a cook to build my house. Sure he might have some skills, but I want the guy who has built 1,000 houses. Hey, anyone can run for office. Next election get your petitions together and apply to run for office. if you think it's broke and you know how to fix it, step up! I guarantee you it's not as easy as it seems. A million people with no expertise and very little information know more about how to do (enter any public official's name) than he or she. If they screw it up remember them come election time, for now be part of the help not part of the problem.


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## Buster24

I do not want to sound like a complete dip $hit here, but I am approaching a age that I hope many of you attain....people spoke about how tough the 2008 ordeal was, and are now talking about this coronavirus as being the worst thing ever....1980-1982....We finally elected a smart man...Ronald Reagan....I don’t want this to sound political, but we had 18% inflation, 16% unemployment, and 18% interest rates...nothing today can compare to that....Carter as President created this mess and Reagan brought us out of it...we as a nation are not as bad off now and we will make it back...come on people....many of you have not been out of work for no more than 4 weeks and I feel for you, but I really struggled in 80-82 and survived....this nation is really soft at this point....might be time to toughen up...I am sure I have offended some and apologize, but we as a nation will never exist bailing everyone Putin time of a crisis....good luck to all!!!!


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## johnboy111711

Weekly check in. Some people still don't get it. Feel free to start at the beginning of this thread and tag/quote people who didn't think this was a big deal as worldwide and US death rates soar. Kudos to Ohio for staying ahead of the curve. Reading these threads, I see a jump in deaths and cases from the wanton acts of others... See you all in a week to say I told you so!


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## loweman165

https://fox8.com/news/coronavirus/p...tatehouse-during-gov-dewines-news-conference/
People are only going to comply for so long.


----------



## Shad Rap

texasrig said:


> Don't hold me to exactly a week, but people will start to say screw these rules and the supposed experts. They will stop staying home and will rebel against the system. I figure it will take that long for everyone to catch on to the fact that the experts have no idea what they are talking about, as far as this thing being worse than the flu. It maybe different, but the death toll is the same or less. People will see that the king has no clothes. Just saying.
> Step back, look at some of the news stories being put out. It's starting to form.


It's already starting...protesting at the statehouse today...gonna have to end this by the end of April...or sooner...people are losing everything they have...dewine and acton haven't seen anything yet...they've handled this ok (other than predicting outrageous numbers)..but they can really blow it here in the end...


----------



## Snakecharmer

loweman165 said:


> https://fox8.com/news/coronavirus/p...tatehouse-during-gov-dewines-news-conference/
> People are only going to comply for so long.


I wonder why the guy thought he needed his AR-15? Anti Corona bullets?


----------



## 9Left

Fish-N-Fool said:


> In my opinion we should not be giving an extra $600 a week blanket *bonus.* It is a bonus - you as a worker didn't pay for it nor did your employer. It is no different than if I pay $100 monthly to an insurer for disability insurance slated to pay me $3500 monthly if I become disabled...but instead they decide to pay me $4,500 a month - the math just doesn't work.
> 
> The area of Ohio I live most workers here make $9-$16 an hour. All my adult nephews and nieces (my sister) work full-time jobs and none make over $14. So, I work 40 hours and gross $500.....is this correct that under this program I now receive $250 + $600 per week? Hell no.....totally agree give the money to those essential employees working with the public as a bonus if we are going to spend it.
> 
> Should have been some sort of phase in and out like the checks. Going the other direction what if I make $4k a week......should we really be providing this person an extra $600 weekly? In my opinion...no!
> 
> It can't be undone, but I'm sitting here thinking of just my own family members and the thousands of dollars in "extras" they are receiving between stimulus checks and $600 extra per week........2020 will be their highest earning year which doesn't seem quite right to me...in my opinion. No wonder my nephew who is out of work just ordered a new $850 firearm....he is making more now than ever!
> 
> I'm not sure this is what Roosevelt had in mind back in 1935....wish he was around to ask.


Hmmm....Last time I looked at a paycheck… The employer paid a lot more than just what you see in the upper right hand corner… Dental, vision, and medical premiums, 401(k) matching, vacation hours, etc...
But yeah, that's a noble idea… Let's just not give people anything more than what they only need to buy some bread and milk and eggs… And toilet paper . That $600 extra it's probably a lifesaver for a whole lot of people… When you think about it, what it really means is that government realizes that unemployment pay is actually never enough to even barely get by


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## 9Left

Meerkat said:


> Just to be clear, I am not suggesting for one minute that the Corona Virus is not real but there are people who will and are using this crisis to further their own ends. For example, if you get admitted to hospital for a head wound, they will test you for Corona Virus. If you subsequently die of the head wound and you tested positive for Corona Virus they will list you as a Corona Virus death. Both deaths _from_ Corona Virus and deaths _with_ Corona Virus are listed as Corona Virus deaths. That is misleading, intentional or otherwise.


no... That's really not true at all… We now have plenty of testing for Covid available in our hospital… And we will absolutely not test unless there are respiratory symptoms or a high fever… If someone comes in with an unrelated wound… It absolutely does not relate to a coronavirus test.


----------



## Misdirection

texasrig said:


> So you said up to 200 per day are dying at home. That's a lot of deaths at home. Why are they dying at home, there has to be a reason. Either they refuse to get medical attention, or there is no room for them at the inn. I don't buy those numbers. Form those number and the numbers reported on the news, that would make 1/5 of the people who are dying. That's not reported anywhere else. Hummm. How many die at home regularly, so the want to pad the numbers by including those now. People who were dying from whatever they were dying from in the first place. People with terminal diseases that we're going to die anyhow.
> 
> I looked up your source, it does say that. Bad numbers. It says it's an estimate. Why are they dying at home and not seeking medical care.


My original post was to point out that there are cases of death associated with Covid-19 that are not being attributed to it, with a daily number attributed to that. 

Your the one challenging that number and questioning why. I provided the reference from which I read it and shared a few others from reputable sources. If you choose not to believe or care, great for you.



Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


----------



## JamesF

I feel that a lot of people and businesses are stepping up to try and get testing and better treatment for people. There is definitely a learning curve for the coronavirus. On a side note, my spell check now recognizes coronavirus.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

145 people on average die a day in NYC pre virus... 109 per day cv death average. I wonder how many of the 145 are now being counted as cv deaths moving forward as been reported as happening for some time now. Unfortunately we will never know the true numbers as they will always be skewed to suit whoever’s agenda. Be it for political gain, local governments financial assistance, ect.


----------



## laguna21

9Left said:


> Hmmm....Last time I looked at a paycheck… The employer paid a lot more than just what you see in the upper right hand corner… Dental, vision, and medical premiums, 401(k) matching, vacation hours, etc...
> But yeah, that's a noble idea… Let's just not give people anything more than what they only need to buy some bread and milk and eggs… And toilet paper . That $600 extra it's probably a lifesaver for a whole lot of people… When you think about it, what it really means is that government realizes that unemployment pay is actually never enough to even barely get by


Most people would probably agree that unemployment benefits needed to go up, but to give more than people make when they are working is just plain wasteful


----------



## Hatchetman

Stars-n-Stripers said:


> Problem is that's an awfully bold and careless statement to make, in his case repeatedly, for something this serious. Here was a thoughtful reply @Lundy made to a similar post many pages ago:
> 
> ↑
> _i agree. back in January my 2 sons came down with something horrible, both are over 21 my oldest had it so bad he visited the e.r 3 times. he had a bad cough and high fever they told him he had type a flu. he was sick for 2 weeks missed 6 days work, my youngest had it for week but he is a non smoker, so yes America is a day late and a dollar short on this one....they dropped the ball
> _
> Not diminishing what your sons had at all but we do have flu every year in this country and causes coughing and high temperatures. That doesn't mean they had Covid 19. I think people much smarter than you or me would be required to figure that one out.


What is bold and careless? My post or Shad Raps? He firmly believes his family had the virus, as do probably thousands of people that were never tested at that time, just simply talk to the Dr., get a scrip for a Zpack and and it helped, thought it was the flu but then found out the symptoms matched C19. Or is the fact that someone that doesn't know or never met the individual tells them in writing they don't know what they are talking about, just like you did in the above post? You should go by the last sentence of your post. No need to throw stones at someone because you, in your opinion don't agree with there's....


----------



## Hatchetman

montagc said:


> I am no more an expert than Shad Rap. The point is that there are a million things he could have had, and he can't say for certain without a test. Without one, it is just a guess. Just like no one knows how big their fish is without a ruler or scale...


I don't remember seeing anywhere that S R said he was an expert, only you said he was. But at that lets just leave it at that. Maybe someday we can sit down and have a drink and talk about fishin....
Ok ?


----------



## bulafisherman

Meerkat said:


> I found this recently and this is the sad norm of our society. I am not the author, but I wish I was:
> 
> “We are seeing the most draconian measures enforced at all levels of government that we've ever seen in our lifetimes, and yet rather than being alarmed by the things going on, we applaud.
> 
> People are being arrested for spending too much time outside, and we applaud. Pastors are being arrested for daring to hold church services, and we applaud. A child's birthday party is raided by police, and we applaud. A young woman is ticketed for going on a leisurely drive alone because it's deemed "non-essential travel", and we applaud. A parade of school teachers and administrators who wanted to drive through neighborhoods and wave at children is busted up by cops because they were "nonessential," and we applaud. A lone paddle boarder in the ocean on a beach without any other people around is arrested because he's violating quarantine orders, and we applaud.
> 
> Businesses are beings forcibly closed and padlocked and owners arrested for refusing to shut down, and we applaud.
> 
> We're being told to use hotlines and online forms provided by our local governments to report our neighbors who don't obey, and we comply. We scold people day after day for not obeying government edicts, and if any of us dare to question what's happening, we lecture about how they're a danger to society and they just don't care about people dying.
> 
> We've somehow managed to convince ourselves that the people whose lives are affected by a virus are MUCH more important than the people whose lives are being destroyed by the effects of a worldwide economic shutdown and impending worldwide depression the likes of which no one has ever seen before.
> 
> At what point will we start QUESTIONING what's going on? How far does the government have to push before we're jolted awake from our slumber? How far are we willing to go with this?
> 
> If they told us to load our families onto train cars so that we could be taken to Virus Protection Facilities for our own safety, would we do it?
> 
> Yes, we would. That much has become painfully obvious to me. And the whole time, we'd be shaking our finger and yelling at those of us who refused, accusing them of being "a danger to society" and "not caring if people die."
> 
> But they don't have to load us onto train cars and take us to Virus Protection Facilities, or force us to comply, because we do that voluntarily. They control our mind. They control us through fear. They control us by convincing us that the world is a scary dangerous place, but they're here to protect us, care for us, and keep us safe, just as long as we OBEY.
> 
> They know that as long as we're locked inside our comfortable home with Netflix, Hulu, Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, and a cell phone, while dangling a $1200 check in front of us like a carrot on a stick, we'll comply. No force is necessary for the majority of the herd.
> 
> We are imprisoned, willingly, and we're too blind to see it.”


 That says it all.....


----------



## Snakecharmer

Burkcarp1 said:


> I know a nurse that filled out 2 different death certificates. One was a heart attack and the other one was a stroke. Put it on the desk and later looked at them again and cause of death was changed to corona...


Hmmm….I would think the state would want less corona deaths to prove they were doing a good job with the quarantine....


----------



## 9Left

Snakecharmer said:


> Hmmm….I would think the state would want less corona deaths to prove they were doing a good job with the quarantine....


...The only other thing I can say is that I have been a nurse for going on 17 years now, I have never in my entire career had to fill out a death certificate… That's the coroner's job.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Snakecharmer said:


> Hmmm….I would think the state would want less corona deaths to prove they were doing a good job with the quarantine....


Hidden agendas.. just depends on what state..... that’s why. I will say no more as it would have to get political.


----------



## Southernsaug

johnboy111711 said:


> tag/quote people who didn't think this was a big deal


You would find that I was one of those people, but I have in fact pondered upon the evidence as I have seen reported and changed my mind. I am not above saying I was wrong. Maybe I'm just being fooled too. I do believe patience is still in order, if this turns out to be a major cluster muck then we'll have learned something for the future. We have survived world wars, depressions, civil war and natural disasters....we are a resilient people and it may hurt but we'll get through this. Either that or it's God's judgement and we will be at his mercy.


----------



## Snakecharmer

9Left said:


> ...The only other thing I can say is that I have been a nurse for going on 17 years now, I have never in my entire career had to fill out a death certificate… That's the coroner's job.


Sometimes people under hospice care at home will end up with a nurse certification but I have never seen one from the death at a hospital with a nurse signature.


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

9left - my point was the additional $600 weekly was funded or planned by nobody. I'm well aware of all employer costs as you are now speaking in my wheelhouse and how I have made a living two decades. The gov't borrowed the money for 30 years at a little under a 2% rate. It is a good time all factors considered for the gov't to borrow (inflation flat and the terms above), but a poor way to spend those dollars imo. 

Frankly, all these stories about finances have a single root cause.....over spending and lack of savings. Americans on average live and spend well beyond their means. We spend more on vacations and entertainment than we save for retirement (and way more time planning for vacation than retirement). The vast majority of Americans over age 50 have little to no savings and are woefully under prepared to pay their own healthcare expenses let alone retire. We have all learned our behavior from them. It will take something major to reshape the behavior in this country we are built to overspend and our economy is based on this model. None of us like hearing it and rationalize why we didn't save or even worse couldn't save. 

However, paying people more than they make actively working full-time plus stimulus bonuses doesn't make sense. 

Heck if we are going to borrow and dish out all this money to take care of Americans why not make it real simple and fair. Give every single man, woman and child the $6,700 each. Family of 4 gets almost $27 grand. That is how much we are spending at current. I mean I think we can all agree that would make everybody feel more optimistic and free up a lot more cash to spend on the recovery. I realize this won't work, but it does put into perspective how much $$$ we are borrowing here. 

The money all must come from somewhere...bye bye historically low tax rates after they expire (or sooner now). And if you look at percentage of gov't spending the big hitters make up over 4/5 of our spending: Medicare and Medicaid 28%, SS 24%; Defense and all foreign aide and operations 21%; welfare just under 9%. At the same time the interest payments to service our national debt will double in the next 10-12 years reducing another 3% of current spending to these categories. Where do cuts come from? What category will we hit? Safe to assume defense won't be reduced nor welfare. We can generate more revenue with higher tax rates, but I think we should all expect the taxable wage base to increase for SS, higher tax rates period, and here is the biggie - an overhaul of Medicare and Medicaid. Expect to pay higher premiums and get reduced coverage ...this is why the gov't is encouraging HSA accounts and LTC options. If you are retiring now and going onto Medicare you better be prepared to pay more and more as time goes by and receive less and less....it is going to happen.

This virus won't kill us off, but it very well may help bankrupt us! Remember we all have short memories - the US only became the richest nation in the world after WW II. We established the largest economy during the 20s, but Germany had more wealth. Things in this world can and do change drastically in the course of a few decades. Maybe the world should ban together to default on notes owed to the Chinese gov't since they caused this worldwide issue.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

I quoted the face shields that dewine talked about today. I was asked to quote 4000..for the first run. I sent a quote and he came on and said.. the state is doing 1 million with a company in Cleveland. So much for small businesses. Never had the opportunity to quote a million....


----------



## crappie4me

9Left said:


> The only other thing I can say is that I have been a nurse for going on 17 years now


and that is exactly why your opinion is one of the few i value


----------



## cheezemm2

Let's watch Florida compared to Ohio and in the end we'll do the math to see if our early shutdown was worth it.

https://www.wpbf.com/article/almost...9-in-florida-371-deaths-in-the-state/32099616


----------



## Snakecharmer

cheezemm2 said:


> Let's watch Florida compared to Ohio and in the end we'll do the math to see if our early shutdown was worth it.
> 
> https://www.wpbf.com/article/almost...9-in-florida-371-deaths-in-the-state/32099616


Or Michigan or Indiana....For our population Ohio is doing well....


----------



## jrose

Hatchetman said:


> What is bold and careless? My post or Shad Raps? He firmly believes his family had the virus, as do probably thousands of people that were never tested at that time, just simply talk to the Dr., get a scrip for a Zpack and and it helped, thought it was the flu but then found out the symptoms matched C19. Or is the fact that someone that doesn't know or never met the individual tells them in writing they don't know what they are talking about, just like you did in the above post? You should go by the last sentence of your post. No need to throw stones at someone because you, in your opinion don't agree with there's....


I think a lot of us may have had it and didn’t know it, and that’s a good thing! But since you can’t hardly get a test when you do have it, what’s the odds of getting a test to see if you have had it? Live long and prosper someone once said!!


----------



## jrose

Snakecharmer said:


> Hmmm….I would think the state would want less corona deaths to prove they were doing a good job with the quarantine....


Then how would you control the masses without fear?


----------



## Snakecharmer

loweman165 said:


> https://fox8.com/news/coronavirus/p...tatehouse-during-gov-dewines-news-conference/
> People are only going to comply for so long.


Yea women want to get to the beauty shops and nail salons.


----------



## jrose

Saugeye Tom said:


> I quoted the face shields that dewine talked about today. I was asked to quote 4000..for the first run. I sent a quote and he came on and said.. the state is doing 1 million with a company in Cleveland. So much for small businesses. Never had the opportunity to quote a million....


Ask.


----------



## Dovans

Last couple days has been very busy. We were slowed down to normal shopping crowds. One of the major changes I am seeing are that customers are mostly all wearing face masks. That is really the only reason I see why we are getting overly crowded again.
I am worried that the general public is believing that they are safe now that they are wearing Face Masks. I am also coming to the belief just from the last two days that people think is is now socially acceptable to wear a mask and they have to get out to prove they have a designed mask. So will we see an increase in coronavirus because people are thinking hey we got a mask lets get out.

Please make a list of what you want...then get the hell out. Dont pick up items to read the labels, you pick it up you buy it. I dont care if you have a mask on. Dont try and come up to me and thank me, I am there as I have bills to pay. Not there to be a hero. We have two doors... Entrance and Exit. Please use them that way. There is a reason. If you come in the exit you will be asked to leave.


----------



## jrose

Snakecharmer said:


> Yea women want to get to the beauty shops and nail salons.


I need a hair cut bad!


----------



## Snakecharmer

Dovans said:


> Last couple days has been very busy. We were slowed down to normal shopping crowds. One of the major changes I am seeing are that customers are mostly all wearing face masks. That is really the only reason I see why we are getting overly crowded again.
> I am worried that the general public is believing that they are safe now that they are wearing Face Masks. I am also coming to the belief just from the last two days that people think is is now socially acceptable to wear a mask and they have to get out to prove they have a designed mask. So will we see an increase in coronavirus because people are thinking hey we got a mask lets get out.
> 
> Please make a list of what you want...then get the hell out. Dont pick up items to read the labels, you pick it up you buy it. I dont care if you have a mask on. Dont try and come up to me and thank me, I am there as I have bills to pay. Not there to be a hero. We have two doors... Entrance and Exit. Please use them that way. There is a reason. If you come in the exit you will be asked to leave.


Does your store limit the number of customers in it? Have you gone to 1 way aisles?


----------



## Buster24

Is anyone else sick of listening to this Cuomo character!!!!


----------



## fishless

Buster24 said:


> Is anyone else sick of listening to this Cuomo character!!!!


Yep and I finally left the wife cut my hair.Just couldn't do the long hair thing like when I was 18


----------



## laguna21

Snakecharmer said:


> Or Michigan or Indiana....For our population Ohio is doing well....


How's about Louisiana


----------



## Burkcarp1




----------



## crappiedude

Dovans said:


> Please make a list of what you want...then get the hell out. *Dont pick up items to read the labels, you pick it up you buy it.* I dont care if you have a mask on. Dont try and come up to me and thank me, I am there as I have bills to pay. Not there to be a hero. We have two doors... Entrance and Exit. Please use them that way. There is a reason. If you come in the exit you will be asked to leave.


I agree. I was amazed at how many people were going through the store touching and sorting through various items. Not only is it a waste of time but no one wants your cooties. The Kroger's I go to seems to be fairly well stocked so everyone should just get what you want and get out of the store.


----------



## Redheads

crappiedude said:


> I agree. I was amazed at how many people were going through the store touching and sorting through various items. Not only is it a waste of time but no one wants your cooties. The Kroger's I go to seems to be fairly well stocked so everyone should just get what you want and get out of the store.


I agree, While at the grocery store today i "accidentally" touched 4 cases of beer and felt obligated to buy them all.... my wife just shook her head when i told her that story 

Tomorrow the State store


----------



## Dovans

Redheads said:


> I agree, While at the grocery store today i "accidentally" touched 4 cases of beer and felt obligated to buy them all.... my wife just shook her head when i told her that story
> 
> Tomorrow the State store


God bless you. 
Not to be argumentative or offensive, but why is there plenty of beer available. One other thing I find laughable, the State has deemed it necessary to open the state store two hours early three days a week so the seniors and disabled can buy liquor. What?


----------



## Snakecharmer

Burkcarp1 said:


> View attachment 351063


So you're saying the lockdowns in Utah and Wyoming are working?


----------



## jrose

Dovans said:


> God bless you.
> Not to be argumentative or offensive, but why is there plenty of beer available. One other thing I find laughable, the State has deemed it necessary to open the state store two hours early three days a week so the seniors and disabled can buy liquor. What?


If you have to ask.....


----------



## Redheads

Not sure why there is plenty available.....but I'm thankful it is. I did see where Carona was ordered to quit making beer because they were considered non-essentual workes, im assuming its made in Mexico.
The local beverage /state store in town told me when i was in there 3 weeks ago that the previous week the surpassed sales in just one week than they did the entire past holiday season.
By no means is this a large town so go figure


----------



## Snakecharmer

Redheads said:


> Not sure why there is plenty available.....but I'm thankful it is. I did see where Carona was ordered to quit making beer because they were considered non-essentual workes, im assuming its made in Mexico.
> The local beverage /state store in town told me when i was in there 3 weeks ago that the previous week the surpassed sales in just one week than they did the entire past holiday season.
> By no means is this a large town so go figure


Bars are closed and some people have nothing to do but drink.


----------



## Snakecharmer

On March 4, the day Trump boasted that “we have a very small number” of infected people in the United States, Ohio’s Republican governor, Mike DeWine, shut down a weekend fitness expo expected to draw 60,000 people a day to a Columbus convention center. There were no identified coronavirus cases in the state at the time.

Now, Ohio may be realizing the benefits of early intervention in the pandemic by its government and medical community. With about 5,100 covid-19 cases, *it has fewer than a third the number of people with the novel coronavirus in three comparably sized states — Michigan, Pennsylvania and Illinois. And Ohio has just a small fraction of the deaths reported in those states*


----------



## Snakecharmer

Detroit has it bad...Paitents beds are in hallways and they are dying.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/d...g-covid-19-crisis/ar-BB12mSqe?ocid=spartanntp


----------



## laguna21

Louisiana with 4.7 million people had Mardi Gras and now has over 18000 cases, around 800 deaths, Ohio social distance rules seem to be working


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

There have been very many who’s had it and recovered and very many who’s had it and didn’t seek treatment and recovered.


----------



## hailtothethief

limited sample size. Ohio may be dragging out the pandemic where other states will get through it quicker have more people resistant to the virus and spread it less longterm. The terminator said judgement day is inevitable. You can put it off but everyone gonna get it eventually.


----------



## Snakecharmer

hailtothethief said:


> limited sample size. Ohio may be dragging out the pandemic where other states will get through it quicker have more people resistant to the virus and spread it less longterm. The terminator said judgement day is inevitable. You can put it off but everyone gonna get it eventually.


You do know the Terminator is fiction.


----------



## AmericanEagle

Did Ohio get it right?

www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/did-ohio-get-it-right-early-intervention-preparation-for-pandemic-may-pay-off/ar-BB12oQtl?ocid=spartanntp


----------



## jrose

montagc said:


> There are test available now for the antibodies. You can get one if you think you’ve already had it, even if you have since recovered.


I’m sure you can just walk in and get the test..... right?


----------



## 9Left

Maybe we did... Because I will give you the current update of the hospital I work at in South Ohio...

22 NURSES..... laid off or furloughed

Yep that's right, we followed the state orders and cleared out enough beds to wait on this "wave of cases"
...Any and all elective surgeries have been canceled… Only emergent cases
... Any patient well enough to be at home… Discharged
... I think it's somewhere in the neighborhood of 75 beds that were cleared and rooms sterilized and are currently on hold for Covid.
...And the current number of cases in the hospital?… Still in the single digits
So they are laying off or furlough nurses because our patient census is so low


----------



## 9Left

crappie4me said:


> and that is exactly why your opinion is one of the few i value


Could not care less what you value... and it's not an opinion... it's a fact... jack


----------



## crappie4me

9Left said:


> Could not care less what you value... and it's not an opinion... it's a fact... jack


uh i should have worded that better i guess cause i meant that sincerely ..i have all the respect in the world for most medical professionals especially nurses. my mom was one in a state mental hospital for 30 years..sorry if it came out wrong.


----------



## laguna21

9Left said:


> Maybe we did... Because I will give you the current update of the hospital I work at in South Ohio...
> 
> 22 NURSES..... laid off or furloughed
> 
> Yep that's right, we followed the state orders and cleared out enough beds to wait on this "wave of cases"
> ...Any and all elective surgeries have been canceled… Only emergent cases
> ... Any patient well enough to be at home… Discharged
> ... I think it's somewhere in the neighborhood of 75 beds that were cleared and rooms sterilized and are currently on hold for Covid.
> ...And the current number of cases in the hospital?… Still in the single digits
> So they are laying off or furlough nurses because our patient census is so low


.......''any patient who is well enough to go home is being discharged''? I would certainly hope so


----------



## 9Left

crappie4me said:


> uh i should have worded that better i guess cause i meant that sincerely ..i have all the respect in the world for most medical professionals especially nurses. my mom was one in a state mental hospital for 30 years..sorry if it came out wrong.


Oh lord... sorry! The picture of the little guy rolling his eyes made it come across as sarcastic…


----------



## 9Left

laguna21 said:


> .......''any patient who is well enough to go home is being discharged''? I would certainly hope so


Right...In a lot of cases… a Patient is well enough to go home but could sometimes benefit from one more night of observation in the hospital… They're just not observing it "one more night" anymore...


----------



## Saugeye Tom

jrose said:


> Ask.


Lol they tell US what they want


----------



## crappiedude

9Left said:


> Right...In a lot of cases… a Patient is well enough to go home but could sometimes benefit from one more night of observation in the hospital… They're just not observing it "one more night" anymore...


That's a shame, that one more night at the hospital can be very reassuring to the patient at a time of real need.


----------



## 9Left

crappiedude said:


> That's a shame, that one more night at the hospital can be very reassuring to the patient at a time of real need.


True...The Hospital won't fight it tho if the attending physician insists on it.


----------



## JamesF

9Left said:


> True...The Hospital won't fight it tho if the attending physician insists on it.


I was given an extra two days, after my triple bypass. It made a big difference for me, and my wife, who is a nurse, (forty years).


----------



## Saugeyefisher

montagc said:


> Article on wcpo about higher grocery prices, yeah prices have gone up a bit but maybe, just don’t buy the soda?! You’d save $5.49!!
> 
> .
> View attachment 351155


Lol right. It gives the individual sale price on the tag as well...


----------



## bulafisherman

montagc said:


> Article on wcpo about higher grocery prices, yeah prices have gone up a bit but maybe, just don’t buy the soda?! You’d save $5.49!!
> 
> .
> View attachment 351155


 We are just at the beginning stages of a global food shortage. I am taking it serious. Have 17 ac's and plan on putting in more effort than ever to grow the garden, can food ECT. I feel for those that don't have the land or resources.


----------



## lmbchckn

Saugeye Tom said:


> I quoted the face shields that dewine talked about today. I was asked to quote 4000..for the first run. I sent a quote and he came on and said.. the state is doing 1 million with a company in Cleveland. So much for small businesses. Never had the opportunity to quote a million....



At least youve gotten something to quote, we reached out multiple times and nothing more than a phone call saying theyd put us in touch with someone, never heard another word. Your absolutely right, so much for helping the small buissnesses.


----------



## RedJada

Saugeye Tom said:


> I quoted the face shields that dewine talked about today. I was asked to quote 4000..for the first run. I sent a quote and he came on and said.. the state is doing 1 million with a company in Cleveland. So much for small businesses. Never had the opportunity to quote a million....


 It's actually 19 Ohio manufacturers doing this, not just one.

https://fox8.com/news/coronavirus/1...partner-to-make-up-to-1-million-face-shields/

This thread was good when if first started, now its a pandemic in it's own. Too many posts with no facts, just opinions and commenting on real news that is taken out of context (see quote)


----------



## hailtothethief

I agree a food shortage is coming and ‘tough on crime’ is picking up. The president of the philipines duterte said to the police if there is any trouble with the lock down shoot them dead.


----------



## fastwater

hailtothethief said:


> I agree a food shortage is coming and ‘tough on crime’ is picking up. The president of the philipines duterte said to the police if there is any trouble with the lock down shoot them dead.


Have a friend that he and his new Philippino bride did not make it out of the Philipines before the lockdown and has been there for several weeks. And will be there until the lockdown is lifted.
Lockdown was put in place there weeks ago followed by a mandatory curfew. He has been told by wife's extended family and locals to strictly adhere to the rules because LE there does not play like here in the states. Especially with enforcing the curfew. If there is an after curfew emergency that requires you to leave home, you have to call LE and get escorted unless you are being transported by an ambulance for medical reasons.
All others caught out are severely dealt with.


----------



## 9Left

hailtothethief said:


> I agree a food shortage is coming and ‘tough on crime’ is picking up. The president of the philipines duterte said to the police if there is any trouble with the lock down shoot them dead.


I think I would have to disagree on this one… Chickens are still laying eggs and cows are still making milk… The only difference now is that people are restricted on the amount they can buy at one time while in the store…It's probably going to be the opposite of a shortage


----------



## 9Left

If you're talking about factory workers being unemployed in plants shutting down… Then the only shortages would be shortages of processed foods like Doritos, soda, etc...
And if that's what happens… From a nursing standpoint… It's about time this country started fighting against obesity and diabetes...lol


----------



## hailtothethief

India is having food shortages due to social distancing. Some of are food is product of india. Its already happening. Dont know how severe it will get but its already happening.


----------



## BeerBatter

Time will tell on the food shortage’s
Milk is getting dumped
Food is rotting on the ground
Crops are not getting put out
Worldwide
And a lot of our food comes from all over

I think it will be pricey
I hope not for anyone’s sake
I know all our agriculture around my area is still going


----------



## Redheads

Have a very good friend who is a food purveyor and said beef is starting to be tricky to get in the large amounts he needs...for what its worth


----------



## Killbuckian

Wow, Wayne county only has 30 cases but 5 deaths already. Sounds like there may be another nursing home hot spot.


----------



## Lundy

This is not the Cowrona virus.

There may very well not be as much processed beef available today but the cattle aren't gone, there are not less cattle now that 8 weeks ago, actually there are more now than 8 weeks ago.

They'll get cut up soon.


----------



## cheezemm2

[QUOTE="RedJada, post:
This thread was good when if first started, now its a pandemic in it's own. Too many posts with no facts, just opinions and commenting on real news that is taken out of context (see quote)[/QUOTE]

Post of the day! I'm glad this site is primarily a hunting/fishing forum. The lounge is purely for entertainment and should be read as such.


----------



## fastwater

Lundy said:


> This is not the Cowrona virus.
> 
> There may very well not be as much processed beef available today but the cattle aren't gone, there are not less cattle now that 8 weeks ago, actually there are more now than 8 weeks ago.
> 
> They'll get cut up soon.


Bingo!
And more than likely, with the current lockdowns of various countries, we may be eating more homegrown beef than usual instead of eating some tuff imported steer that's been raised on an Argentinian hillside.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

9Left said:


> If you're talking about factory workers being unemployed in plants shutting down… Then the only shortages would be shortages of processed foods like Doritos, soda, etc...
> And if that's what happens… From a nursing standpoint… It's about time this country started fighting against obesity and diabetes...lol


And...carl.. what if they try to get our beer


----------



## fastwater

Saugeye Tom said:


> And...carl.. what if they try to get our beer


Get ahead of the game and order home brew kits ASAP!!!
Brewery's now making hand sanitizer.


----------



## CoonDawg92

My local Marcs store had lifted restrictions on milk this morning when I picked up groceries. Hopefully other stores are doing the same and will help with the wasted milk.

also no restrictions on bread today like earlier this week.


----------



## Eastside Al

Wait for picked veg's especially from california. Lock down, no pickers.
Price and avail will be affected.


----------



## buckeyebowman

Redheads said:


> Not sure why there is plenty available.....but I'm thankful it is. I did see where Carona was ordered to quit making beer because they were considered non-essentual workes, im assuming its made in Mexico.
> The local beverage /state store in town told me when i was in there 3 weeks ago that the previous week the surpassed sales in just one week than they did the entire past holiday season.
> By no means is this a large town so go figure


Is it anywhere near a state line? Stopped at the local liquor agency last Saturday, and it was bedlam! A lot of folks were coming over from PA. where the liquor stores are all closed. Never again on the weekend! 

Also, some local WalMarts are closing down "non-essential" departments.


----------



## yonderfishin

montagc said:


> A Belief is different from a fact.
> 
> a z pack does nothing against a virus...



z pack dont kill a virus but its contents have antiviral qualities , it also does treat the secondary bacterial infections that are common with the virus


----------



## 9Left

yonderfishin said:


> z pack dont kill a virus but its contents have antiviral qualities , it also does treat the secondary bacterial infections that are common with the virus


Which is about the same as buying a waterproof mop...Has all the qualities to clean the floor… But it ain't going to do crap


----------



## yonderfishin

Burkcarp1 said:


> I know a nurse that filled out 2 different death certificates. One was a heart attack and the other one was a stroke. Put it on the desk and later looked at them again and cause of death was changed to corona...



But were they tested as positive for corona ? I did some research about the danger to people with hypertension since this affects me. Multiple trusted sources say covid 19 puts a tremendous strain on the heart and circulatory system , and many of those who die from it are due to heart failure or stroke which in this case are secondary effects of the coronavirus. Having high blood pressure or heart problems puts you at greater risk. So if these people were positive for the virus it is very likely they were coronavirus deaths.


----------



## twistedcatfish1971

...just a thought.

Maybe I missed something with this...other day at work I saw someone using water fountain filling up an empty water bottle. I said I wouldn't do that. I can honestly say I've used a water fountain only a handful of times in many years...would rather drink from a puddle in road.

...its just that i have not heard/read/or seen anything about using water fountains???

...be vigilant/stay safe.

Don.


----------



## yonderfishin

9Left said:


> Which is about the same as buying a waterproof mop...Has all the qualities to clean the floor… But it ain't going to do crap



Using your analogy , in this case a lot of people mopped the floor with this " waterproof mop " with very good results. 

Its wise not to believe everything you hear or read , but if multiple sources make the claim they just might know something we dont. That atleast puts the claim into the category of a solid " maybe ". 

I would put my trust in people who experienced it or doctors who prescribed it. There are more than enough of both.


----------



## Lil' Rob

I wonder whether the lock downs/stay at home restrictions we and others in this country are currently under will do anything to reduce the number of our youth from starting/continuing bad habits like smoking/vaping...seeing they should be, to some degree, less likely and able to get these products on their own. Just something I thought about while seeing a commercial for vaping the other day.


----------



## Snakecharmer

*New Michigan Restrictions:*

*Boating/Harbors*

Non-motorized boating, such as canoeing, kayaking and sailing, falls within the outdoor activities permitted under the "Stay Home, Stay Safe" Executive Order. However, *the use of a motorboat, jet ski or similar watercraft is not permitted for the duration of the Executive Order*, which is currently set to expire at 11:59 p.m. April 30. 

Any outdoor activity, including boating, must be done in a manner consistent with social distancing, and individuals should use only their own equipment to prevent the transmission of the virus through the touching of shared surfaces. In addition, persons not part of a single household may not boat together.

State harbors are closed through at least May 15. There are no services available, including bathroom buildings, electrical, fuel, pumpouts, etc. and no slip reservations can be made.


----------



## Snakecharmer

I told you the Governor of NY was all wet when he said the virus had peaked in NY earlier this week...


----------



## yonderfishin

montagc said:


> A few studies have been done on it but it is not prescribed as an antiviral nor is it marketed as one as the results of those studies only brought up more questions. A z pack does treat secondary infections but won’t help you breathe.



Quote:



Pfizer has announced positive data for the use of its azithromycin (Zithromax) drug, along with hydroxychloroquine, in a coronavirus (Covid-19) clinical trial performed in France.

The trial was conducted to assess anti-malarial drug hydroxychloroquine in 20 patients, six of which were also administered with azithromycin.

Compared with 16 controls, the proportion of participants who achieved virologic cure following six days of treatments was observed to be higher in the 20 patients treated with hydroxychloroquine.

In addition, the rate of cure was highest in people who received hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin. : End Quote

There are also plenty of trusted sources describing the antiviral qualities of this particular antibiotic in the z pack.

You are correct , however the results do speak for themselves. Or they appear to anyway , the studies are ongoing.


----------



## Redheads

buckeyebowman said:


> Is it anywhere near a state line? Stopped at the local liquor agency last Saturday, and it was bedlam! A lot of folks were coming over from PA. where the liquor stores are all closed. Never again on the weekend!
> 
> Also, some local WalMarts are closing down "non-essential" departments.


No, not near the PA line.....I bet it was a mess.
Im surprised they aren't monitoring people crossing the line a little better.I thought that was one of the governor's last requests of nonresident crossing state for non-essentual business.....Yea i get it that it can be essential to some


----------



## 9Left

.


----------



## 9Left

yonderfishin said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Pfizer has announced


Yep… And if I was the one making and selling a drug, I would release a study that tells people exactly what they want to hear also


----------



## OptOutside440

https://www.google.com/amp/s/nypost...avirus-dead-on-hart-island-potters-field/amp/


----------



## hailtothethief

I was reading a study that 80 percent of people that are infected are unaffected so they never bother to get tested. Actual cases are 5x higher or more than are tested. 20 percent of people infected get real sick and of those cases 1 percent of people die. Those are the elderly or immune compromised people with heart/lung conditions obese etc. It read like pareto’s law.


----------



## yonderfishin

montagc said:


> Yes, I saw that earlier, that one study gets thrown about a lot, but there are other papers on the subject. Still too early in the research period though to call it a sure thing. 36 people including control is not a large enough group to make definite assumptions.



I agree. But there is enough to say maybe we shouldnt dismiss the idea. There is no basis for implying someone is an idiot for wanting to try it.

There is an active denial going on right now about the effectiveness of hydroxychloroquine too , but there is a growing number of people who were prescribed it and in their own words it was very effective. Atleast one of them is a government representative from Michigan.


----------



## yonderfishin

9Left said:


> Yep… And if I was the one making and selling a drug, I would release a study that tells people exactly what they want to hear also



Ok Dr. 9Left , glad you shared your expert knowledge with us simplefolk LOL


----------



## fastwater

yonderfishin said:


> Ok Dr. 9Left , glad you shared your expert knowledge with us simplefolk LOL


Seein how his occupation has been in the medical field working in hospitals for many years, I'd say his 'expert knowledge' is of more value than most posting here.


----------



## yonderfishin

fastwater said:


> Seein how his occupation has been in the medical field working in hospitals for many years, I'd say his 'expert knowledge' is of more value than most posting here.



I wasnt aware of that. If so , being unaware of azithromyacin inducing an antiviral response especially in human bronchial cells ( of interest in covid cases ) , according to the US national library of medicine , must just be an accidental oversight. As well as it showing anti zika virus activity as reported by the American society for microbiology , and anti inflamatory affects reported by both.

No problem , we all overlook things sometimes.


----------



## 9Left

hailtothethief said:


> I was reading a study that 80 percent of people that are infected are unaffected so they never bother to get tested. Actual cases are 5x higher or more than are tested. 20 percent of people infected get real sick and of those cases 1 percent of people die. Those are the elderly or immune compromised people with heart/lung conditions obese etc. It read like pareto’s law.


Now that is something I completely agree with…My personal feelings are that 95% of Ohio has already onloaded this virus and recovered from it with with very little to no symptoms. And no, I can't scientifically back that up... But I personally feel that it's just not possible to ACCURATELY track this many people. States do their best with reporting and I do not doubt that... In my experience, I have seen other versions of not so harmful viruses sweep through communities… Like a stomach bug or something of that sort… It pretty much covers most everybody before people start realizing it's a problem.


----------



## Southernsaug

The facts that these drugs had properties and effectiveness for conditions that were not registered uses does not surprise me. It reveals a serious flaw in FDA policy on labeling and use. Hopefully some of those policies will be revamped now. It cost drug companies millions and millions of dollars to label a drug for a specific pathogen. It doesn't matter that you know it is safe and effective, if it's not a labeled use the only option is to do an off label extension. This puts a lot of liability on the Drs and hospitals. Before anyone gets their panties in a bunch and questions my credentials, I have extensive experience with registering drugs with the FDA. They were for animal use but it's the same process. I held and worked on INADs ( Investigational New Animal Drug ) permits for years. The FDA requires data on many parameters such as Safe use, environmental safety, effectiveness, application, dosing, etc. If you do it for say a streptococcus, but you want it for Aeromonas also you have to either list it in the original application or amend it. Even then every test done for one has to be repeated for the other, it is a long and tedious process. If they would just let some of the data move through the studies it would speed things up. Once you know a drug is safe and and effective for certain classes of pathogens then the process should be streamline to add labeling. That is why you see the FDA waiving label uses now. It needs fixed


----------



## 9Left

yonderfishin said:


> Ok Dr. 9Left , glad you shared your expert knowledge with us simplefolk LOL


Well let me address a couple issues…
#1 I absolutely do not think I am any better or any smarter than anyone else here… But when I have a plumbing question, and I need good advice, I would be less likely to take that advice From an electrician that said he googled the answer.

#2 ( and i will not consider any other perspective on this one). Big Pharma are the most disgusting, vile, ruthless, selfish, money hoarding people that exist in this universe.


----------



## polebender

Jim Bakker sued by the state of Missouri for selling fake Coronavirus cure! 
Imagine that!


----------



## M R DUCKS

I agree not all cases are reported, I believe there are also false test results. * Also, many differing symptoms and severity of affliction*. I know of 9 coworkers and/or their family members who have tested positive. At this time, none had to be hospitalized, I hope this trend continues, Because of our job, approx. 25 people at my location had to be “quarantined” for 2 weeks+/-. (My last count was over 70... job wise)

Hailtothechief...not sure what numbers you use,
Yesterday’s Ohio report
5878 cases
1755 hospitalized
231/234 dead

I get 29.86% of the cases reported hospitalized
13.16% of those die
3.93% die of total cases reported

It’s been many years since a statistic class, but I think I remember it being said...you can make statistics say about whatever you want....something like that.


----------



## CoonDawg92

So if only half the cases are reported, and I think that is a high estimate, fatality rate would be around 2%.

Hard to tell with so many asymptomatic cases. One thing from my experience, if you have the flu, you know you have the freaking flu.


----------



## bulafisherman

I have to echo....why do we keep quoting statistics like they are factual? Unless it's to make people feel a curtain way, not everyone that's positive is being tested, not all tests are accurate so just how factual are these numbers? No one can say for sure, good entertainment though....


----------



## LEfriend

AmericanEagle said:


> This link explains why covid-19 deaths are reported the way they are and makes the case that they are under reported.
> 
> www.yahoo.com/news/fauci-dismisses-conspiracy-theories-to-spin-the-coronavirus-death-toll-132059427.html


Good link and good article


----------



## LEfriend

jrose said:


> I need a hair cut bad!


my wife did mine. I thought I should be nice and then offered to reciprocate and cut hers. WRONG THING TO SUGGEST!


----------



## Shad Rap

bulafisherman said:


> I have to echo....why do we keep quoting statistics like they are factual? Unless it's to make people feel a curtain way, not everyone that's positive is being tested, not all tests are accurate so just how factual are these numbers? No one can say for sure, good entertainment though....


The numbers you hear are pushed for fear...nothing else.


----------



## bulafisherman

Shad Rap said:


> The numbers you hear are pushed for fear...nothing else.


 you said it not me...be careful your going to get flamed for being a conspiracy theorist and derailing the topic by the righteous posse!


----------



## Shad Rap

bulafisherman said:


> you said it not me...be careful your going to get flamed for being a conspiracy theorist and derailing the topic by the righteous posse!


The numbers don't lie...especially from what they were predicting...waaaaaaaaaaay off...even before the restrictions came out...you could go through all these threads on OGF and about 98% of them have not stayed on topic...at least we're still talking about the virus.


----------



## bulafisherman

I for one have to agree. Not that hard to see but fear forces most people to narrow their focus and not be able to see the bigger picture. IAM just happy to see that people are waking up. Hopefully it's not to late!


----------



## allwayzfishin

loomis82 said:


> I sure enjoy working while other are on unemployment and soon to get a extra $600 Not saying it's their choice to be on unemployment but why dont regular workers the have to work because we are "essential " get something out of it


This right here is the best statement I’ve read in this thread.


----------



## Dovans

twistedcatfish1971 said:


> ...just a thought.
> 
> Maybe I missed something with this...other day at work I saw someone using water fountain filling up an empty water bottle. I said I wouldn't do that. I can honestly say I've used a water fountain only a handful of times in many years...would rather drink from a puddle in road.
> 
> ...its just that i have not heard/read/or seen anything about using water fountains???
> 
> ...be vigilant/stay safe.
> 
> Don.


The one we have at Kroger has been turned off and wrapped in plastic


----------



## crappiedude

9Left said:


> Now that is something I completely agree with…*My personal feelings are that 95% of Ohio has already onloaded this virus and recovered from it with with very little to no symptoms.* And no, I can't scientifically back that up... But I personally feel that it's just not possible to ACCURATELY track this many people. States do their best with reporting and I do not doubt that... In my experience, I have seen other versions of not so harmful viruses sweep through communities… Like a stomach bug or something of that sort… It pretty much covers most everybody before people start realizing it's a problem.


Now there is something I can agree with. I doubt that it's as high 95% but I do believe it's a lot higher than we would realize. I often wondered if the severity of the disease for most healthy people is directly related to the amount of exposure with an infected person. Meaning someone who say spent 8 or 10 hours with an infected person would be more severely affected than say someone who made casual contact with an infected person in passing.
Thanks for sharing your insight 9Left


----------



## AmericanEagle

9Left said:


> Now that is something I completely agree with…My personal feelings are that 95% of Ohio has already onloaded this virus and recovered from it with with very little to no symptoms. And no, I can't scientifically back that up... But I personally feel that it's just not possible to ACCURATELY track this many people. States do their best with reporting and I do not doubt that... In my experience, I have seen other versions of not so harmful viruses sweep through communities… Like a stomach bug or something of that sort… It pretty much covers most everybody before people start realizing it's a problem.


Dr Acton is putting together a program to randomly test Ohioans to see how widespread the virus is.

https://www.thedenverchannel.com/ne...-testing-of-general-population-in-near-future


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

AmericanEagle said:


> Dr Acton is putting together a program to randomly test Ohioans to see how widespread the virus is.
> 
> https://www.thedenverchannel.com/ne...-testing-of-general-population-in-near-future


I wonder how they would randomly test? Especially the Amish community? I know if they came to my door there won’t be any amateur epidemiologists recently trained checking me. The CDC will never go for it IMO.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

They are really collecting dna samples and implanting chips in all ogf members. Be careful out there


----------



## Shad Rap

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> I wonder how they would randomly test? Especially the Amish community? I know if they came to my door there won’t be any amateur epidemiologists recently trained checking me. The CDC will never go for it IMO.


Amy Acton is a joke.


----------



## fastwater

Saugeye Tom said:


> They are really collecting dna samples and implanting chips in all ogf members. Be careful out there


Hmmm...I wondered why after my last Dr visit I pick up out of state radio stations in my head.


----------



## burnsj5

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> I wonder how they would randomly test? Especially the Amish community? I know if they came to my door there won’t be any amateur epidemiologists recently trained checking me. The CDC will never go for it IMO.


Sounds like surveillance testing but then I read the article and it seemed weird. The way they use the phrase about training amateur epidemiologist and why the testing of the Amish. Sounds more like their own research project vs real surveillance testing which I would think provide better data to serve the state.


----------



## 9Left

Shad Rap said:


> The numbers you hear are pushed for fear...nothing else.





Shad Rap said:


> Amy Acton is a joke.


Well obviously we need Shadrap to be running the show…


----------



## 9Left

CoonDawg92 said:


> So if only half the cases are reported, and I think that is a high estimate, fatality rate would be around 2%.
> 
> Hard to tell with so many asymptomatic cases. One thing from my experience, if you have the flu, you know you have the freaking flu.


No I think you're going the wrong way on your math…
First...All death cases are reported… that's a fact… Hospitals are required to do so ...But not all "cases" are reported Or discovered
Let's say we have a total of 100 cases… and let's say 2 of those died...(reported) Which means a 2% death rate.
NOW... Let's hypothetically say the real number of "cases" was magically discovered ...And we found out it was Actually more like 10,000...So the real statistic would be 2 out of 10,000 died...Way less than 2%
...Just a hypothetical example… But you went the wrong way on your math


----------



## Snakecharmer

Shad Rap said:


> Amy Acton is a joke.


I hear you wrote this song for Amy...


----------



## LEfriend

For those that want some facts, here is link to a good and thorough Detroit Free Press interview with an epidemiologist. Well done and explains in plain and understandable talk the science, and the challenges of deciding when to open things back up and consequences of various different approaches/decisions. 

https://www.freep.com/story/opinion...st-says-pandemic-till-early-stage/5135106002/

Same paper has tonight article that 5 grocery workers in Detroit have died of the virus. Prayers and safe wishes for all the health care and other service workers on the front lines.


----------



## buckeyebowman

9Left said:


> Now that is something I completely agree with…My personal feelings are that 95% of Ohio has already onloaded this virus and recovered from it with with very little to no symptoms. And no, I can't scientifically back that up... But I personally feel that it's just not possible to ACCURATELY track this many people. States do their best with reporting and I do not doubt that... In my experience, I have seen other versions of not so harmful viruses sweep through communities… Like a stomach bug or something of that sort… It pretty much covers most everybody before people start realizing it's a problem.


I have to agree. My buddy works for Fedex and his wife is a nurse. They both think they've already had it and recovered. He said he had a persistent headache and cough for about 2 weeks, and low energy. One day he woke up to go to work, and could barely drag himself out of bed! He called off and basically laid in bed for 2 days. On the third morning he woke up feeling fine. Been working ever since. 

His wife lost her sense of smell and taste for a while, and I've heard that can happen with COVID-19. Plus the fact that her hospital is full of people with the stuff, and she's under a lot of stress. My buddy said she looks like she's aged 10 years in the last month! 

They've started some "drive by" testing locally, but it's hardly random. You have to display symptoms. If you are asymptomatic, you cannot get the test. If random testing does come around, I'd want it. I'd like to know if I've had it or not.


----------



## cheezemm2

fastwater said:


> Hmmm...I wondered why after my last Dr visit I pick up out of state radio stations in my head.


Funny, after I went to the doctor, every time the microwave comes on, I pee myself. Just call me cousin Eddie!


----------



## CoonDawg92

9Left said:


> No I think you're going the wrong way on your math…
> First...All death cases are reported… that's a fact… Hospitals are required to do so ...But not all "cases" are reported Or discovered
> Let's say we have a total of 100 cases… and let's say 2 of those died...(reported) Which means a 2% death rate.
> NOW... Let's hypothetically say the real number of "cases" was magically discovered ...And we found out it was Actually more like 10,000...So the real statistic would be 2 out of 10,000 died...Way less than 2%
> ...Just a hypothetical example… But you went the wrong way on your math



MR Ducks calculated that the death rate to be around 4% of reported cases. I simply said if the “real” (read unknown) number of cases is actually 2x what is reported (in other words only half are reported), then the “real” fatality would be half of 4%, or 2%. Nothing wrong with that math.

The big question is, how many cases are really out there? If the real number as you state in your hypothetical example is actually 100x the reported number, then obviously the real death rate is much much lower than 2%.


----------



## fastwater

LEfriend said:


> For those that want some facts, here is link to a good and thorough Detroit Free Press interview with an epidemiologist. Well done and explains in plain and understandable talk the science, and the challenges of deciding when to open things back up and consequences of various different approaches/decisions.
> 
> https://www.freep.com/story/opinion...st-says-pandemic-till-early-stage/5135106002/
> 
> Same paper has tonight article that 5 grocery workers in Detroit have died of the virus. Prayers and safe wishes for all the health care and other service workers on the front lines.


That is an excellent article LEfriend.
Cuts through all the thousands of rumors of 'for sure' immunity, peaks, tests count etc and tells it like it is with vaccines while keeping politics completely out of the pic.
I hate to say it but I feel just like he does about what's going to eventually happen.


----------



## hailtothethief

The article i read calculated mortality rate at 0.2% for actual cases.


----------



## hailtothethief

Co-morbidities also raise the risk of dying from Covid-19. China CDC’s analysis of 44,672 patients found that the fatality rate in patients who reported no other health conditions was 0.9%. It was 10.5% for those with cardiovascular disease, 7.3% for those with diabetes, 6.3% for people with chronic respiratory diseases such as COPD, 6.0% for people with hypertension, and 5.6% for those with cancer

— here a piece of an article on china. The big problem in the u.s. is people are old, have diabetes, and have heart disease. You guys gotta get urself’s together or you gonna have 10% death risk.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Geez I wish I could reverse time and be young.


----------



## JamesF

I just heard a report, that the coronavirus is starting to re emerge in China, and probably Italy. I hope that isn't true.


----------



## hailtothethief

Of course its true. The virus has peaks and troughs. It might slow down for a month but it’ll be back next month. It’ll get the people it didn’t get eventually. The experts said it takes a vaccine or herd immunity or both to overcome the virus. With no vaccine in sight for two years it comes down to the strong surviving and the weak quarantining away from everyone else indefinately until there is a vaccine.


----------



## OSUdaddy

JamesF said:


> I just heard a report, that the coronavirus is starting to re emerge in China, and probably Italy. I hope that isn't true.


https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/italy/

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/china/


----------



## JamesF

That is a lot to digest. I think it's a wait and see deal. Despite the fact that we haven't peaked as forecast. There is, the Unknown factor that concerns me.


----------



## Wow

I can't believe the attitudes expressed here, and the denial. Politicizing a pandemic makes no sense at all.
We are *all* going to suffer the same consequences. If we are not *all in* this together, things will continue on and on. Covid 19 doesn't care what you want to believe.

This guy was clueless:

https://www.cleveland.com/coronavir...onavirus-cases-and-three-deaths-cdc-says.html

I will be protecting myself and anybody I can. 
All of the daily deaths we read about were spread by a clueless carrier, weeks ago.

Does it really matter if they're old, sick or young.
Somebody's mom, dad, aunt, uncle, grandma, grandpa or immune deficient sibling are at risk. 
Are you going to do anything about it? Are you a carrier? You really don't know for sure. 
This is no joke.....No hoax. 

I hope all of you and your extended families get through this in 2020 and beyond. --Tim


----------



## hailtothethief

Guy in houston tested positive that went to my sisters church. She’s in uproar. Glad im a degenerates i dont go to church.


----------



## BuckeyeFishinNut

I walked away from this thread about a week ago, just spent some time reading through what I missed. I haven't watched much much news the last week, and surely haven't watched the daily Mike and Amy Show. A few thoughts from what I have read and what I have seen. Call em my opinions, experiences, whatever ya want.

1st, if you think the first case showed up in Ohio on March 9th, you are either naive or have your head in the sand. A very good friend of mine is a nurse at a V.A. hospital in Ohio. My wife and myself social distanced with her and her husband around a fire last weekend with a couple beverages. She said they had cases dating back to January. They didn't know it was Covid-19, just a respirator illness at the time. Nobody died, but some people were pretty sick exhibiting all the symptoms we now know as Covid-19. She believes she had it in early February. Missed almost 2 weeks of work; headache, fever, dry persistent cough, low energy, etc. She has been a nurse for 25 years working everywhere from emergency rooms, to ICU, to doctors offices. I believe her 100%, she has way more knowledge on this than me.

2nd, this is a pay me now, pay me later scenario. With a vaccine not likely being available until this time next year, you are either going to have to remain shacked up or get exposed to it at some point. The lockdown was never to protect people, it was to keep the healthcare system from collapsing due to overburden. Cases are not going to go to zero. At some time you need to open back up. When that happens, it would probably be best if Mike and Amy canceled their day time talk show and quit reporting the numbers. Who knows what the actual unemployment number are but last I saw Ohio had almost 200,000 new unemployment claims (i am sure that has increased), for 6,200 sick. Those numbers don't jive, and the harm to people will extend far beyond this virus. I want to see the suicide numbers and domestic violence numbers when this is over. Both exponentially increase when people are in financial ruin and will far eclipse those who pass from this virus. Every life is important, whether people die from getting sick or loss of hope.

3rd, I want to go back to work! I am a teacher, I would happily wear a hazmat suit everyday and put kids in a bubble if I could teach in my classroom. This distance learning isn't working. Many of my students don't have internet, computers, or tablets at home to do their work or even print off assignments. Our campus is completely shut down, nobody in for any reason, even to use the community stuff. I spend most of my days answering parents or students emails who are frustrated. Many parents don't know the material (how many remember 7th grade science or math, especially the way the state has changed things) and students are used to instant gratification to their questions and they aren't getting that need met. I worry what the longterm damage to student learning will be when they end up with almost 7 months away from a structured classroom. I find it very unlikely that they open schools back up for 3 weeks. I feel sorry for seniors who won't have a graduation, and for some its the only graduation they will have. 

Lastly, like many of you, I find myself becoming increasingly frustrated. For me, its mainly the lack of control. This is mainly why I quit posting here for a week and quit watching the news. I consider myself pretty openminded, I fact check a lot of information (the scientist in me), and I formulate my my idea based on information. Every model and projection has been wrong and grossly wrong. Numbers were way inflated and policy was made based on that. Now we are stuck with no real exit strategy and no real end in sight. This is where the frustration mounts from and why I have quit watching the news and press conferences. I think they had the best of intentions, but in the end I feel lied to because the numbers they fed us, the projections, have been patiently false.

The effects from this will be wide ranging and some will be long term. The road to hell is paved with good intentions, remember that. Sorry for the long post. Stay safe, go fishing, enjoy the sunshine, and Happy Easter.


----------



## Specwar

^^ very well said..


----------



## Saugeyefisher

Specwar said:


> ^^ very well said..


Ya I'm with ya


----------



## bulafisherman

BuckeyeFishinNut said:


> I walked away from this thread about a week ago, just spent some time reading through what I missed. I haven't watched much much news the last week, and surely haven't watched the daily Mike and Amy Show. A few thoughts from what I have read and what I have seen. Call em my opinions, experiences, whatever ya want.
> 
> 1st, if you think the first case showed up in Ohio on March 9th, you are either naive or have your head in the sand. A very good friend of mine is a nurse at a V.A. hospital in Ohio. My wife and myself social distanced with her and her husband around a fire last weekend with a couple beverages. She said they had cases dating back to January. They didn't know it was Covid-19, just a respirator illness at the time. Nobody died, but some people were pretty sick exhibiting all the symptoms we now know as Covid-19. She believes she had it in early February. Missed almost 2 weeks of work; headache, fever, dry persistent cough, low energy, etc. She has been a nurse for 25 years working everywhere from emergency rooms, to ICU, to doctors offices. I believe her 100%, she has way more knowledge on this than me.
> 
> 2nd, this is a pay me now, pay me later scenario. With a vaccine not likely being available until this time next year, you are either going to have to remain shacked up or get exposed to it at some point. The lockdown was never to protect people, it was to keep the healthcare system from collapsing due to overburden. Cases are not going to go to zero. At some time you need to open back up. When that happens, it would probably be best if Mike and Amy canceled their day time talk show and quit reporting the numbers. Who knows what the actual unemployment number are but last I saw Ohio had almost 200,000 new unemployment claims (i am sure that has increased), for 6,200 sick. Those numbers don't jive, and the harm to people will extend far beyond this virus. I want to see the suicide numbers and domestic violence numbers when this is over. Both exponentially increase when people are in financial ruin and will far eclipse those who pass from this virus. Every life is important, whether people die from getting sick or loss of hope.
> 
> 3rd, I want to go back to work! I am a teacher, I would happily wear a hazmat suit everyday and put kids in a bubble if I could teach in my classroom. This distance learning isn't working. Many of my students don't have internet, computers, or tablets at home to do their work or even print off assignments. Our campus is completely shut down, nobody in for any reason, even to use the community stuff. I spend most of my days answering parents or students emails who are frustrated. Many parents don't know the material (how many remember 7th grade science or math, especially the way the state has changed things) and students are used to instant gratification to their questions and they aren't getting that need met. I worry what the longterm damage to student learning will be when they end up with almost 7 months away from a structured classroom. I find it very unlikely that they open schools back up for 3 weeks. I feel sorry for seniors who won't have a graduation, and for some its the only graduation they will have.
> 
> Lastly, like many of you, I find myself becoming increasingly frustrated. For me, its mainly the lack of control. This is mainly why I quit posting here for a week and quit watching the news. I consider myself pretty openminded, I fact check a lot of information (the scientist in me), and I formulate my my idea based on information. Every model and projection has been wrong and grossly wrong. Numbers were way inflated and policy was made based on that. Now we are stuck with no real exit strategy and no real end in sight. This is where the frustration mounts from and why I have quit watching the news and press conferences. I think they had the best of intentions, but in the end I feel lied to because the numbers they fed us, the projections, have been patiently false.
> 
> The effects from this will be wide ranging and some will be long term. The road to hell is paved with good intentions, remember that. Sorry for the long post. Stay safe, go fishing, enjoy the sunshine, and Happy Easter.


 one of the most accurate depictions of the situation yet I feel. Thanks


----------



## 9Left

BuckeyeFishinNut said:


> I walked away from this thread about a week ago, just spent some time reading through what I missed. I haven't watched much much news the last week, and surely haven't watched the daily Mike and Amy Show. A few thoughts from what I have read and what I have seen. Call em my opinions, experiences, whatever ya want.
> 
> 1st, if you think the first case showed up in Ohio on March 9th, you are either naive or have your head in the sand. A very good friend of mine is a nurse at a V.A. hospital in Ohio. My wife and myself social distanced with her and her husband around a fire last weekend with a couple beverages. She said they had cases dating back to January. They didn't know it was Covid-19, just a respirator illness at the time. Nobody died, but some people were pretty sick exhibiting all the symptoms we now know as Covid-19. She believes she had it in early February. Missed almost 2 weeks of work; headache, fever, dry persistent cough, low energy, etc. She has been a nurse for 25 years working everywhere from emergency rooms, to ICU, to doctors offices. I believe her 100%, she has way more knowledge on this than me.
> 
> 2nd, this is a pay me now, pay me later scenario. With a vaccine not likely being available until this time next year, you are either going to have to remain shacked up or get exposed to it at some point. The lockdown was never to protect people, it was to keep the healthcare system from collapsing due to overburden. Cases are not going to go to zero. At some time you need to open back up. When that happens, it would probably be best if Mike and Amy canceled their day time talk show and quit reporting the numbers. Who knows what the actual unemployment number are but last I saw Ohio had almost 200,000 new unemployment claims (i am sure that has increased), for 6,200 sick. Those numbers don't jive, and the harm to people will extend far beyond this virus. I want to see the suicide numbers and domestic violence numbers when this is over. Both exponentially increase when people are in financial ruin and will far eclipse those who pass from this virus. Every life is important, whether people die from getting sick or loss of hope.
> 
> 3rd, I want to go back to work! I am a teacher, I would happily wear a hazmat suit everyday and put kids in a bubble if I could teach in my classroom. This distance learning isn't working. Many of my students don't have internet, computers, or tablets at home to do their work or even print off assignments. Our campus is completely shut down, nobody in for any reason, even to use the community stuff. I spend most of my days answering parents or students emails who are frustrated. Many parents don't know the material (how many remember 7th grade science or math, especially the way the state has changed things) and students are used to instant gratification to their questions and they aren't getting that need met. I worry what the longterm damage to student learning will be when they end up with almost 7 months away from a structured classroom. I find it very unlikely that they open schools back up for 3 weeks. I feel sorry for seniors who won't have a graduation, and for some its the only graduation they will have.
> 
> Lastly, like many of you, I find myself becoming increasingly frustrated. For me, its mainly the lack of control. This is mainly why I quit posting here for a week and quit watching the news. I consider myself pretty openminded, I fact check a lot of information (the scientist in me), and I formulate my my idea based on information. Every model and projection has been wrong and grossly wrong. Numbers were way inflated and policy was made based on that. Now we are stuck with no real exit strategy and no real end in sight. This is where the frustration mounts from and why I have quit watching the news and press conferences. I think they had the best of intentions, but in the end I feel lied to because the numbers they fed us, the projections, have been patiently false.
> 
> The effects from this will be wide ranging and some will be long term. The road to hell is paved with good intentions, remember that. Sorry for the long post. Stay safe, go fishing, enjoy the sunshine, and Happy Easter.


Yes, nicely said... you said that the unemployment numbers related to cases does not jive… The number of unemployment cases has absolutely nothing to do with the amount of sick people…If 1 million people got sick or 100 people got sick… Either way thousands of restaurant workers and food service people are still out of a job.(Haven't even mentioned all of the other occupations out of work)So the number of unemployment claims, related to the number of businesses that were shut down, that number totally jives


----------



## loves2fishinohio

BuckeyeFishinNut said:


> Stay safe, go fishing, enjoy the sunshine, and Happy Easter.


Well said man. I'm with you, I got sick on December 31st, had a cough and a fever off/on for over *2* months, into the first part of March. The doctors diagnosed a strong sinus infection. Three rounds of antibiotics later (including a 5 day Z-Pak and 10 days of one of the strongest antibiotics after that), I still wasn't much better. And the other guys at my PT job had all the same symptoms in January. 

It finally ran its course and I feel better. I'm hoping I can get tested sometime soon to see if I had it and I have the antibody.


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## loves2fishinohio

OSUdaddy said:


> https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/italy/
> 
> https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/china/


The flaw with all of these scales is that they aren't showing the number of people tested over the same time period. The number of people affected versus the number of people tested at the same time frame needs to be reported. Otherwise, this data is pretty meaningless. This isns't a dig at your links OSUdaddy, it's the problem with the reporting of cases overall across the media. Everyone has a graph, everyone has a model. 

Ohio's case rate seems to have slowed, and I'm willing to bet that the testing rate has increased at the same time. If we were testing 5000 people 2 weeks ago, and are testing 10000 today, the rate of new cases reported would be very good news now compared to 2 weeks ago.


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## Saugeyefisher

Guess I'll share our sick story. Last week of Feb my wife gets in a car wreck,brakes a couple ribs,internal bleeding. Stayed over nite at ohio health. Examined bye numerous doctors in 24 hours,gets sent home the next day. 2 weeks later she goes in for follow up. Had a bad cough no smell or taste. Tge cough really hurt her bad but we thought it was the broken ribs. They check her oxygen an b.p. oxygen low BP hi. She was on teyonal so at the time of her follow up the fever did not show. But she soaked thru bed sheets a couple nites with a fever.

I thought she had a common cold,so did she. We still dont know. But she THINKS she MIGHT of had it. I was taking vitamins an airborne an zinc like crazy like I always do when someone in my house is sick. My kids where already keeping there distance cause she was in pain anyways. But my kids did both get coughs a week later,and I had mild symptoms of a cold for 3 days. So it prolly wasnt covid 19,but we dont know for sure. 
It took 2 weeks for taste an smell to come back an 3 weeks for her cold symptoms to go away....


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## 9Left

Sorry to hear that saugeye... Hope
Your wife recovers from her injuries and glad to hear that your family didn't require hospitalization for any sickness


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## SConner

Saugeyefisher said:


> Guess I'll share our sick story. Last week of Feb my wife gets in a car wreck,brakes a couple ribs,internal bleeding. Stayed over nite at ohio health. Examined bye numerous doctors in 24 hours,gets sent home the next day. 2 weeks later she goes in for follow up. Had a bad cough no smell or taste. Tge cough really hurt her bad but we thought it was the broken ribs. They check her oxygen an b.p. oxygen low BP hi. She was on teyonal so at the time of her follow up the fever did not show. But she soaked thru bed sheets a couple nites with a fever.
> 
> I thought she had a common cold,so did she. We still dont know. But she THINKS she MIGHT of had it. I was taking vitamins an airborne an zinc like crazy like I always do when someone in my house is sick. My kids where already keeping there distance cause she was in pain anyways. But my kids did both get coughs a week later,and I had mild symptoms of a cold for 3 days. So it prolly wasnt covid 19,but we dont know for sure.
> It took 2 weeks for taste an smell to come back an 3 weeks for her cold symptoms to go away....


My wife had exact symptoms as your wife in early March and I also got cold like symptoms 4 days after she first got sick. Thankfully, she recovered quickly from whatever it was. My cold subsided per normal. I would love to have her tested for antibodies, but am understanding the testing for this is not in full swing yet. Happy to hear you are both ok.


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## Southernsaug

Good post Buckeyefishinut, I think this thread has been therapeutic if for no other reason than to let people vent frustration. we are all searching for answers and hope. I for one put my Hope in Jesus, especially on this Easter. I am not advocating what anyone else should do only stating my feelings. As a former man of science myself, I agree I have seen too much of the research fields models. Most of the time they don't work out and are not proved. Most of the trouble is because data is manipulated towards a desired answer, anytime you hear the word "weighed", suspect bias. I want to see real data analysis and let the curve fall where it may. The sad part is real data can only come after the fact. So the best our scientist can do is look at historically similar data and occurrences. There is quite a bit out there, but I fear it's been ignored


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## bulafisherman

So I keep reading the same theme over and over again on here and from people outside of this forum, they seem to experience most of symptoms that mimic the virus well before it was believed to be as widespread as it is now. According to the WHO and the experts that claim to be tracking this and are on top of the spreading of it,this can't possibly be the case. But if all these people experiencing these classic symptoms have in fact had the virus and they have passed it on, a whole lot more people are carrying it. We all know the numbers are way off due to the lack of testing. We could very well be farther along with herd immunity than what we realize. One thing is for sure with everyday that this lockdown continues the more devastating it will be to our economy and the longer before we recover. I would love to be a fly on the wall behind the scenes with our government officials making the decisions. We are in uncharted territory.


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## laguna21

Add me to the ''was sick'' list. Had all the symptoms, fever and chills for 3 days. Hadn't heard anyone else say they had blurry vision in one eye until I saw an interview with Chris Cuomo on TV. Took at least 2 weeks to get taste and smell back. I'm 54 and no underlying health problems eat right get plenty of exercise. Not sure of what that flu was but can see how someone older and less healthy would be devastated by it. Stay safe and healthy everyone!


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## Specwar

Tell me what governing body wouldn’t attempt to use a situation like the one we are currently experiencing to take back for lack of better words, the freedoms that they feel could be threatening to them. Just think about it.


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## Hatchetman

loves2fishinohio said:


> Well said man. I'm with you, I got sick on December 31st, had a cough and a fever off/on for over *2* months, into the first part of March. The doctors diagnosed a strong sinus infection. Three rounds of antibiotics later (including a 5 day Z-Pak and 10 days of one of the strongest antibiotics after that), I still wasn't much better. And the other guys at my PT job had all the same symptoms in January.
> 
> It finally ran its course and I feel better. I'm hoping I can get tested sometime soon to see if I had it and I have the antibody.


Well, here we go, finally some sense coming to this thread. How many people have had it and were not diagnosed with it because there was no diagnoses for it? I know of at least 4 different couples that swear they had this and were treated for flu or just a bad cold. Now we have a lot more coming out believing they had it. Saw a Dr on tv state that 3 months ago they didn't have a good diagnoses for the east coast strain which was slightly different from the original one in Washington State. The one on the East coast came from Europe and had apparently changed from the original strain from China. The deniers of this can say what they want but I do believe this was miss diagnosed for a good while. I think Buckeye's post was one of the best since this thread started but I'm sure the other side will find time to rip him like they have done to others on here....Hang in and stay safe....


----------



## SConner

bulafisherman said:


> So I keep reading the same theme over and over again on here and from people outside of this forum, they seem to experience most of symptoms that mimic the virus well before it was believed to be as widespread as it is now. According to the WHO and the experts that claim to be tracking this and are on top of the spreading of it,this can't possibly be the case. But if all these people experiencing these classic symptoms have in fact had the virus and they have passed it on, a whole lot more people are carrying it. We all know the numbers are way off due to the lack of testing. We could very well be farther along with herd immunity than what we realize. One thing is for sure with everyday that this lockdown continues the more devastating it will be to our economy and the longer before we recover. I would love to be a fly on the wall behind the scenes with our government officials making the decisions. We are in uncharted territory.


In most cases, symptoms closely mimic the common flu. Please do not interpret my post as saying my wife did or did not have this in early March. Only saying symptoms match what most people experience. The reason I would like my wife tested is simply so her antibodies can be harvested to be used therapeutically and know for certain if she has some degree of immunity, at least in the short term. I will leave the rest to qualified medical professionals to study and determine appropriate response.


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## loves2fishinohio

Hatchetman said:


> Well, here we go, finally some sense coming to this thread.


Thank you Hatchetman. As of yesterday, there were just under 6,200 "confirmed" cases in Ohio. This Sunday also marks a month that restaurants and bars were ordered shut down. 3 weeks ago Dr. Acton predicted by now we would be reporting 6000-8000 new cases per *day*. I would like to think the actions by our Gov helped prevent this, but I also feel like it's time to start reopening. Millions out of work in Ohio for these kind of case numbers do not support this kind of shutdown, again, just my opinion.


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## Rooster

Specwar said:


> Tell me what governing body wouldn’t attempt to use a situation like the one we are currently experiencing to take back for lack of better words, the freedoms that they feel could be threatening to them. Just think about it.


l

They didn't have to "take" our freedom, most willingly relinquished their freedom out of fear. But, 100% agree that this is the perfect blueprint to exert additional controls on our freedom.


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## Patricio

Specwar said:


> Tell me what governing body wouldn’t attempt to use a situation like the one we are currently experiencing* to take back for lack of better words, the freedoms* that they feel could be threatening to them. Just think about it.


scary. freedoms were never theirs to give. i do think they using the shanghai shivers to see how far they can push. for future reference. i hope people are watching closely and learning. or maybe people like being told what they can buy and when theyre aloud to buy it.


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## 9Left

Rooster said:


> l
> 
> They didn't have to "take" our freedom, most willingly relinquished their freedom out of fear. But, 100% agree that this is the perfect blueprint to exert additional controls on our freedom.


rooster...For a guy that posts some pretty sensible fishing reports that I have enjoyed reading over the years… Your conspiracy posts are just coming out of left field… I don't understand 'em


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## 9Left

Rooster said:


> l
> 
> They didn't have to "take" our freedom, most willingly relinquished their freedom out of fear. But, 100% agree that this is the perfect blueprint to exert additional controls on our freedom.


And if you haven't seen it lately… you still have a signed permission slip to go fishing, go to the store, leave your house, go to the park, take a walk, mow your lawn...here's a pic of your permission slip…








Good luck and good fishing to you this year rooster… I look forward to your posts


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## JamesF

I don't feel that most people just gave up their rights. Most of the people are just wanting to be safe, I sure don't believe that I have given up anything. And knowing that I am at risk, I am taking precautions, at least I think I am. This is definitely something very different from anything that we have experienced. Influenza comes in many forms. Morphing into a stronger strain was predicted by some researchers a few years ago. A vaccine for the past influenza strains took quite a while, and probably will be the same for this one. I think that some, just want to stir the pot,or maybe, partaking in excess!?


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## Snakecharmer

JamesF said:


> I don't feel that most people just gave up their rights. Most of the people are just wanting to be safe, I sure don't believe that I have given up anything. And knowing that I am at risk, I am taking precautions, at least I think I am. This is definitely something very different from anything that we have experienced. Influenza comes in many forms. Morphing into a stronger strain was predicted by some researchers a few years ago. A vaccine for the past influenza strains took quite a while, and probably will be the same for this one. I think that some, just want to stir the pot,or maybe, partaking in excess!?


Agree James! They're stirring the pot or wearing their tin foil hats.


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## JamesF

I have coat hanger antennas, on my foil cap. Use the heavy duty stuff.


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## Hatchetman

I have noticed a slow change of the tone of people on this site as to the restrictions that are being put on us by varying authorities. D


Specwar said:


> Tell me what governing body wouldn’t attempt to use a situation like the one we are currently experiencing to take back for lack of better words, the freedoms that they feel could be threatening to them. Just think about it.


You don't think there are some people in Washington that aren't paying attention to how we are reacting to various things being taken away or suggestions that we do this or that? I think that most are acting in what they feel is right but some, are paying very close attention to public opinion. I never thought I would ever think something like that but yet, here I am. I've noticed the opinions on here are starting to gradually shift also, in what I consider a good way. This is far to great a country that I proudly served to have a comparatively few people screw it up....God Bless The USA....


----------



## Rooster

9Left said:


> rooster...For a guy that posts some pretty sensible fishing reports that I have enjoyed reading over the years… Your conspiracy posts are just coming out of left field… I don't understand 'em



Just to be clear, I don’t see any conspiracy. I see my freedom curtailed by an overreaction predicated on the estimates (based on assumptions) of experts as actual facts. Denying individuals the ability to earn a living in itself is no trivial matter. I’ve lost thousands (time can never be recovered) during the last few weeks, and I still consider myself as someone being only minimally impacted. The “cure” is simply more pernicious than the disease. Further, the willingness of individuals to give-up their freedom in the face of a perceived threat will NOT go unnoticed by powers that want to further curtail our freedoms. That is, further limiting freedom on the basis of public safety. All of this is just my OPINION, and I certainly will never limit my fishing buddies based on their opinions…..even if they vastly differ from mine....I would fish with Fidel Castro, if he could put me on the crappie. 

Now, I’m convinced that there is a HUGE conspiracy to limit good ice in Ohio, and prevent me from ever catching BIG crappie. I’m seriously considering lining my fishing hat with tin foil.


----------



## ErieRider

Snakecharmer said:


> On March 4, the day Trump boasted that “we have a very small number” of infected people in the United States, Ohio’s Republican governor, Mike DeWine, shut down a weekend fitness expo expected to draw 60,000 people a day to a Columbus convention center. There were no identified coronavirus cases in the state at the time.
> 
> Now, Ohio may be realizing the benefits of early intervention in the pandemic by its government and medical community. With about 5,100 covid-19 cases, *it has fewer than a third the number of people with the novel coronavirus in three comparably sized states — Michigan, Pennsylvania and Illinois. And Ohio has just a small fraction of the deaths reported in those states*


Read that section of that story from the Washington post I believe... it was interesting for me to read. I've posted the full story snakecharmer quoted... what do you guys think??

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.wa...a-9bee-c5bf9d2e3288_story.html?outputType=amp

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## STRONGPERSUADER

BuckeyeFishinNut said:


> I walked away from this thread about a week ago, just spent some time reading through what I missed. I haven't watched much much news the last week, and surely haven't watched the daily Mike and Amy Show. A few thoughts from what I have read and what I have seen. Call em my opinions, experiences, whatever ya want.
> 
> 1st, if you think the first case showed up in Ohio on March 9th, you are either naive or have your head in the sand. A very good friend of mine is a nurse at a V.A. hospital in Ohio. My wife and myself social distanced with her and her husband around a fire last weekend with a couple beverages. She said they had cases dating back to January. They didn't know it was Covid-19, just a respirator illness at the time. Nobody died, but some people were pretty sick exhibiting all the symptoms we now know as Covid-19. She believes she had it in early February. Missed almost 2 weeks of work; headache, fever, dry persistent cough, low energy, etc. She has been a nurse for 25 years working everywhere from emergency rooms, to ICU, to doctors offices. I believe her 100%, she has way more knowledge on this than me.
> 
> 2nd, this is a pay me now, pay me later scenario. With a vaccine not likely being available until this time next year, you are either going to have to remain shacked up or get exposed to it at some point. The lockdown was never to protect people, it was to keep the healthcare system from collapsing due to overburden. Cases are not going to go to zero. At some time you need to open back up. When that happens, it would probably be best if Mike and Amy canceled their day time talk show and quit reporting the numbers. Who knows what the actual unemployment number are but last I saw Ohio had almost 200,000 new unemployment claims (i am sure that has increased), for 6,200 sick. Those numbers don't jive, and the harm to people will extend far beyond this virus. I want to see the suicide numbers and domestic violence numbers when this is over. Both exponentially increase when people are in financial ruin and will far eclipse those who pass from this virus. Every life is important, whether people die from getting sick or loss of hope.
> 
> 3rd, I want to go back to work! I am a teacher, I would happily wear a hazmat suit everyday and put kids in a bubble if I could teach in my classroom. This distance learning isn't working. Many of my students don't have internet, computers, or tablets at home to do their work or even print off assignments. Our campus is completely shut down, nobody in for any reason, even to use the community stuff. I spend most of my days answering parents or students emails who are frustrated. Many parents don't know the material (how many remember 7th grade science or math, especially the way the state has changed things) and students are used to instant gratification to their questions and they aren't getting that need met. I worry what the longterm damage to student learning will be when they end up with almost 7 months away from a structured classroom. I find it very unlikely that they open schools back up for 3 weeks. I feel sorry for seniors who won't have a graduation, and for some its the only graduation they will have.
> 
> Lastly, like many of you, I find myself becoming increasingly frustrated. For me, its mainly the lack of control. This is mainly why I quit posting here for a week and quit watching the news. I consider myself pretty openminded, I fact check a lot of information (the scientist in me), and I formulate my my idea based on information. Every model and projection has been wrong and grossly wrong. Numbers were way inflated and policy was made based on that. Now we are stuck with no real exit strategy and no real end in sight. This is where the frustration mounts from and why I have quit watching the news and press conferences. I think they had the best of intentions, but in the end I feel lied to because the numbers they fed us, the projections, have been patiently false.
> 
> The effects from this will be wide ranging and some will be long term. The road to hell is paved with good intentions, remember that. Sorry for the long post. Stay safe, go fishing, enjoy the sunshine, and Happy Easter.


Here here!


----------



## yonderfishin

In reply to some of the conspiracy theories , the Federal government did not take away any of your rights or civil liberties , they have simply asked that you please observe reccomended giudelines set out by the CDC and administered by your state and local governments. As amendment10 to the US constitution says , ................all powers not granted to the US government are reserved for the states. This should address your questions of constitutionality of what has been happening , assuming you have a legal grasp on what that means. Your constitutional rights are not being violated , civil liberties just temporarily suspended by the state under the authority the US constitution gives them with the 10th amendment. Which is also why there is no nationwide stay at home order and it is up to the governors of each state to decide what measures to take. Disagree with me all you want but its right there in the constitution you claim is being violated.

Could this situation be hijacked and used for malicious purposes ? .... Absolutely , and thats why we have the 2nd amendment.


----------



## buckeyebowman

OSUdaddy said:


> https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/italy/
> 
> https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/china/


Yeah, but does anybody really believe the numbers from China? I sure as hell don't! 



Wow said:


> I can't believe the attitudes expressed here, and the denial. Politicizing a pandemic makes no sense at all.


True! How about you tell that to Joe Biden and Nancy Pelosi?


----------



## Deep Trouble

yonderfishin said:


> In reply to some of the conspiracy theories , the Federal government did not take away any of your rights or civil liberties , they have simply asked that you please observe reccomended giudelines set out by the CDC and administered by your state and local governments. As amendment10 to the US constitution says , ................all powers not granted to the US government are reserved for the states. This should address your questions of constitutionality of what has been happening , assuming you have a legal grasp on what that means. Your constitutional rights are not being violated , civil liberties just temporarily suspended by the state under the authority the US constitution gives them with the 10th amendment. Which is also why there is no nationwide stay at home order and it is up to the governors of each state to decide what measures to take. Disagree with me all you want but its right there in the constitution you claim is being violated.
> 
> Could this situation be hijacked and used for malicious purposes ? .... Absolutely , and thats why we have the 2nd amendment.


I beg to differ. “Temporarily suspended” isn’t an exception to our constitutional rights. Nor does the 10th amendment supercede all the rest. Govt power under the 10th amendment is subject to the limitations contained in the other amendments. And remember the first 10 amendments are the bill of rights applicable to the PEOPLE. They don’t grant government power. They are a limitation on government power. There’s a lot of gray area around what is going on now from a constitutional perspective. I don’t know the answer but it’s not clear cut by any means. For the record, I’m not a practicing attorney but I do have a JD (law degree) from Case Western.


----------



## KaGee

*I'm hitting the reset button. This is like the fourth time, but the final time. We're off topic and getting personal and some still can't resist the politics.

The topic is "Corona (Live Update)".*


----------



## crappiedude

KaGee said:


> *I'm hitting the reset button. This is like the fourth time, but the final time. We're off topic and getting personal and some still can't resist the politics.
> 
> The topic is "Corona (Live Update)".*


You've got a lot of patience...I thought this thread should have died a long time ago.


----------



## Buster24

Most people are really tired of this virus bs and want to get on with their lives, but in the same sense they don’t want to contract this virus.....and, at this time you can’t have both....my concern is when they open the gates many people will be cautious and take it careful while others will go full bore, but will this coronavirus come back with a vengeance.....no one knows...stay safe!!!!


----------



## JamesF

I'm not very sure about how long this virus is going to hang around, or come out of the closet again. I'm hearing many guessing, and many modeling about this subject. I had to venture out to get a few items today, most every place was closed (Easter). Had to hit Walmart, I did that as quickly as possible. People are really starting to drop their guard. Seeing packs of five/six,kids running rampant, like God @$#×÷= wild idiot's, while the parents just wonder about like sheep. And like I said before, this kind of ignorance is sure to help this virus swing back around and slap us even harder. It's these people that just don't care. I'm much better off by staying home and not seeing these people, because, these are the ones that are going to cause the death of some other people. I know that it's Easter Sunday, but in my neighborhood I absolutely know many of my neighbors. Most don't have many family members visiting on a regular basis. But today,...five to eight vehicles, and twenty five people. I know the whole family, and this was Not social distancing. Six immediate family members and the rest from school. When ever I go out,I can't help but think of Clint Eastwood " do you feel lucky...punk?)


----------



## Lewis

I've been wondering how in the hell did China's largest cities almost completely avoid Covid-19?
Beijing pop. 19 million, Shanghai pop. 23 million


----------



## loves2fishinohio

Lewis said:


> I've been wondering how in the hell did China's largest cities almost completely avoid Covid-19?
> Beijing pop. 19 million, Shanghai pop. 23 million


Good question, but again, I wouldn't put any stock in any numbers coming out of China. They were ground zero for this virus. You hardly hear any news of any sort coming out of China to begin with, and given the potential liability, you are going to hear even less about actual virus numbers.


----------



## loves2fishinohio

It's been just over a month since Ohio shut down restaurants and bars, and 3 weeks since basically everything else deemed non-essential has also shut down. I don't have the numbers for the number of people out of work, but I do question the need to keep a state over close to 11.2M people basically shut down for 6,518 cases of Coronavirus. A time comes when the cure is more damaging than the virus. 

If they extend the stay at home order past May 1, this state won't be the only one to do it, and I would really hate to see what it would do to many of our businesses.


----------



## Dovans

One of the countrys largest pork producers just shut down as employees sick. Hopefully Cargill does not follow suit.. We'll all be vegans again..


----------



## texasrig

A BRIDGE TOO FAR:
122000 Signatures have been collected so far to recall Michigan's Governor since she ordered that boats with motors could not be used. (FOX NEWS) others as well. There are other items in the order that can't be sold that help add to the angst over it. This is why i believe our govenor has declined to take that extra step. That and the fact that it does nothing to stop the spread of the virus. We will see how far this goes.


----------



## garhtr

Lewis said:


> I've been wondering how in the hell did China's largest cities almost completely avoid Covid-19?
> Beijing pop. 19 million, Shanghai pop. 23 million


Imo --- Because the Chinese people do what they are told to do, no question. They were ordered to stay at home or be arrested...
I saw pics of trucks in China driving down empty streets spaying(only god knows what) chemicals from fire truck type vehicles.
We aren't going to do that in America , instead we have to take the backboards down in local parks to keep people from playing basketball and large groups have Corona parties, spring break on beaches and some are still attending church-- things like that just don't happen in communist countries.
I'm glad we have the freedoms we have but those freedoms come with high costs.
Good luck


----------



## bulafisherman

The longer this goes on the more people are searching for answers. It's up to each and everyone of us to draw our own conclusions not based on fear but logic and common sense. I personally haven't felt threatened but this whole thing besides what it's doing to the economy. But that's just me. IAM in my 50s with no heath issues and eat clean. I have however been keeping my eye on mainstream news and as many other views and opinions from other sources, medical doctors ECT and just trying to keep an open mind. If you search Dr Andrew Kuafman, he gives an interesting prospective in an unbiased way. Not saying he is right but he does have medical credentials and might be on to something.


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## multi species angler

We are in a damned if you do and damned if you don't situation. And I'll be damned if I would open the country back up and have the attitude of let those die that will die and let those strong enough to survive , survive. We need some form of control over the contagiousness of this virus first or all this time in shelter at home was for nothing, many many more WILL die and it could be your child or mother.


----------



## Southernsaug

I don't think there are any good answers right now and even the experts are just speculating. Sooner or later I think they will start opening up the economy, because it's getting the point of choosing which evil is worse. Living in a rural area I have been able to stay away from the hotspots, but when the gates are open I think we'll see more spread to people in areas like mine. That is a concern that there's a lot of people still who could be exposed. Sooner or later I think we just take the hit and move on. Moderators- I see my earlier post was deleted, I apologize. I really didn't think it was a political statement, but I guess I was wrong.


----------



## loves2fishinohio

Guessing the Gov will declare schools to remain closed for the rest of the school year today, it is mid-April. That probably will set the bar on the other May 1st deadline to be extended.


----------



## goolies

bulafisherman said:


> The longer this goes on the more people are searching for answers. It's up to each and everyone of us to draw our own conclusions not based on fear but logic and common sense. I personally haven't felt threatened but this whole thing besides what it's doing to the economy. But that's just me. IAM in my 50s with no heath issues and eat clean. I have however been keeping my eye on mainstream news and as many other views and opinions from other sources, medical doctors ECT and just trying to keep an open mind. If you search Dr Andrew Kuafman, he gives an interesting prospective in an unbiased way. Not saying he is right but he does have medical credentials and might be on to something.


Thanks, but I think I’ll listen to the experts in epidemiology instead of a psychiatrist.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## Ryan woodgeard

BuckeyeFishinNut said:


> I walked away from this thread about a week ago, just spent some time reading through what I missed. I haven't watched much much news the last week, and surely haven't watched the daily Mike and Amy Show. A few thoughts from what I have read and what I have seen. Call em my opinions, experiences, whatever ya want.
> 
> 1st, if you think the first case showed up in Ohio on March 9th, you are either naive or have your head in the sand. A very good friend of mine is a nurse at a V.A. hospital in Ohio. My wife and myself social distanced with her and her husband around a fire last weekend with a couple beverages. She said they had cases dating back to January. They didn't know it was Covid-19, just a respirator illness at the time. Nobody died, but some people were pretty sick exhibiting all the symptoms we now know as Covid-19. She believes she had it in early February. Missed almost 2 weeks of work; headache, fever, dry persistent cough, low energy, etc. She has been a nurse for 25 years working everywhere from emergency rooms, to ICU, to doctors offices. I believe her 100%, she has way more knowledge on this than me.
> 
> 2nd, this is a pay me now, pay me later scenario. With a vaccine not likely being available until this time next year, you are either going to have to remain shacked up or get exposed to it at some point. The lockdown was never to protect people, it was to keep the healthcare system from collapsing due to overburden. Cases are not going to go to zero. At some time you need to open back up. When that happens, it would probably be best if Mike and Amy canceled their day time talk show and quit reporting the numbers. Who knows what the actual unemployment number are but last I saw Ohio had almost 200,000 new unemployment claims (i am sure that has increased), for 6,200 sick. Those numbers don't jive, and the harm to people will extend far beyond this virus. I want to see the suicide numbers and domestic violence numbers when this is over. Both exponentially increase when people are in financial ruin and will far eclipse those who pass from this virus. Every life is important, whether people die from getting sick or loss of hope.
> 
> 3rd, I want to go back to work! I am a teacher, I would happily wear a hazmat suit everyday and put kids in a bubble if I could teach in my classroom. This distance learning isn't working. Many of my students don't have internet, computers, or tablets at home to do their work or even print off assignments. Our campus is completely shut down, nobody in for any reason, even to use the community stuff. I spend most of my days answering parents or students emails who are frustrated. Many parents don't know the material (how many remember 7th grade science or math, especially the way the state has changed things) and students are used to instant gratification to their questions and they aren't getting that need met. I worry what the longterm damage to student learning will be when they end up with almost 7 months away from a structured classroom. I find it very unlikely that they open schools back up for 3 weeks. I feel sorry for seniors who won't have a graduation, and for some its the only graduation they will have.
> 
> Lastly, like many of you, I find myself becoming increasingly frustrated. For me, its mainly the lack of control. This is mainly why I quit posting here for a week and quit watching the news. I consider myself pretty openminded, I fact check a lot of information (the scientist in me), and I formulate my my idea based on information. Every model and projection has been wrong and grossly wrong. Numbers were way inflated and policy was made based on that. Now we are stuck with no real exit strategy and no real end in sight. This is where the frustration mounts from and why I have quit watching the news and press conferences. I think they had the best of intentions, but in the end I feel lied to because the numbers they fed us, the projections, have been patiently false.
> 
> The effects from this will be wide ranging and some will be long term. The road to hell is paved with good intentions, remember that. Sorry for the long post. Stay safe, go fishing, enjoy the sunshine, and Happy Easter.


Definitely that's how I keep safe is by fishing and enjoying life


----------



## threeten

All is not what we’re led to believe!
Keep an open mind


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## jrose

9Left said:


> And if you haven't seen it lately… you still have a signed permission slip to go fishing, go to the store, leave your house, go to the park, take a walk, mow your lawn...here's a pic of your permission slip…
> View attachment 351491
> 
> Good luck and good fishing to you this year rooster… I look forward to your posts


Tell that to the people in Michigan.


----------



## AmericanEagle

Dovans said:


> One of the countrys largest pork producers just shut down as employees sick. Hopefully Cargill does not follow suit.. We'll all be vegans again..


Yep, they also closed Freshmark in Salem, Ohio.

https://www.wfmj.com/story/41997082/fresh-mark-in-salem-temporarily-closes-over-covid19-concerns

The food processors and farms use lots of immigrant labor.

https://www.wfmj.com/story/40682467/cover-story-salem-one-year-after-fresh-mark-immigration-raid

I have heard stories of multiple immigrant families living in a single house. It would be very hard to stop the spread in those conditions.


----------



## cheezemm2

KaGee said:


> *I'm hitting the reset button. This is like the fourth time, but the final time. We're off topic and getting personal and some still can't resist the politics.
> 
> The topic is "Corona (Live Update)".*


Please just kill it.


----------



## jrose

multi species angler said:


> We are in a damned if you do and damned if you don't situation. And I'll be damned if I would open the country back up and have the attitude of let those die that will die and let those strong enough to survive , survive. We need some form of control over the contagiousness of this virus first or all this time in shelter at home was for nothing, many many more WILL die and it could be your child or mother.


We are that way now, this just adds one more thing to watch out for.


----------



## One guy and a boat

cheezemm2 said:


> Please just kill it.


She's been warming up for a while now 

Sent from my Pixel 3a XL using Tapatalk


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## Saugeyefisher

Edited... nevermind. It dont matter,and off topic.


----------



## multi species angler

loves2fishinohio said:


> but I do question the need to keep a state over close to 11.2M people basically shut down for 6,518 cases of Coronavirus. A time comes when the cure is more damaging than the virus.


 If it wasn't closed that number would probably be closer to 60,000 than 6000.


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## Lundy

I realize it is difficult today to not bring politics into these discussions but I am growing weary of needing to delete scores of posts everyday and it is impossible to catch every violating post spread across all of the forums

it will much easier going forward to just delete repeat offenders user accounts than just keep deleting all of their posts. Call it invoking the war powers act on OGF. Patience is quickly running out and you will be sent into forced isolation.


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## Misdirection

Since we see food processing plants closing shop, at least for the short term, much wife and I just ordered a 1/4 side of beef (minus some ground meat as we have more than enough). Now if I could just restock my depleted walleye supply we'd be in great shape!



Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## Southernsaug

Lundy said:


> it will much easier going forward to just delete repeat offenders user accounts than just keep deleting all of their posts. Call it invoking the war powers act on OGF. Patience is quickly running out and you will be sent into forced isolation.


I'm sorry that it has become that burdensome Lundy. People are just hurting and want to vent and release some frustrations. I hope I haven't caused some of this anguish. I have enjoyed my time here and I actually think I have a lot to offer this community with my background. However with that said just count me as a victim of corona and go ahead and delete my account. I think your being heavy handed. I am logging off, bye friends.


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## Lewis

Hmmmm?
https://www.kmov.com/why-did-21-mil...utbreak/article_80456379-e8af-52a8-9366-f8af6


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## texasrig

Just for a clarification, I think we know it you mentioned dems and GOP, but does that include comments in ref of certain politicians and how they are doing. Example: said Governor is a bonehead because he or she did this in regard to the virus. Just trying to understand. Thanks.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Lewis said:


> Hmmmm?
> https://www.kmov.com/why-did-21-mil...utbreak/article_80456379-e8af-52a8-9366-f8af6


Broken link...Maybe China made it disappear?


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## Lewis

Snakecharmer said:


> Broken link...Maybe China made it disappear?


Maybe...lol


----------



## Lewis

Try this one...
https://www.kmov.com/why-did-21-mil...cle_80456379-e8af-52a8-9366-f8af64b45fd1.html


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## Specwar

Just read that New York is one of 6 states planning on slowly reopening. Cuomo says this weekends decline in cases proves they are past the worst part. Gotta question this guys sanity!!


----------



## Snakecharmer

Specwar said:


> Just read that New York is one of 6 states planning on slowly reopening. Cuomo says this weekends decline in cases proves they are past the worst part. Gotta question this guys sanity!!


I think he is clueless....He said over a week ago that the cases were dropping based on one day… They have gone up ever since for the most part. Plus they really need to coordinate with Connecticut and New Jersey.


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## Specwar

They are coordinating with New Jersey, Connecticut , Rhode Island and two others I cannot remember.


----------



## Misdirection

I think there will be a spike of new cases with in the next two weeks from all the people who didnt practice social distancing during Easter. 

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## hailtothethief

https://news.google.com/articles/CA...AowjuuKAzCWrzwwt4QY?hl=en-US&gl=US&ceid=US:en

Interesting article on navy issues


----------



## goolies

Specwar said:


> Just read that New York is one of 6 states planning on slowly reopening. Cuomo says this weekends decline in cases proves they are past the worst part. Gotta question this guys sanity!!


I thinks there’s a difference in starting to plan the reopening and actually reopening. I think they are only starting to plan.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Lundy

Southernsaug said:


> I'm sorry that it has become that burdensome Lundy. People are just hurting and want to vent and release some frustrations. I hope I haven't caused some of this anguish. I have enjoyed my time here and I actually think I have a lot to offer this community with my background. However with that said just count me as a victim of corona and go ahead and delete my account. I think your being heavy handed. I am logging off, bye friends.


I don’t recall mentioning you or anyone else by name. Venting is not against the rules. Political statements are not permitted. I’m guessing it is possible to do one without the other. There is a bunch of discussion that has been left up in various threads that is borderline and probably would not have been permitted previously. In light of the times we Find ourselves in the benefit of the doubt has been given to provide MUCH more flexibility than normal. You certainly get to choose if you elect to stay or go, but overt political posts will be removed, repeat offenders, will be removed.


----------



## laguna21

Lundy said:


> I don’t recall mentioning you or anyone else by name. Venting is not against the rules. Political statements are not permitted. I’m guessing it is possible to do one without the other. There is a bunch of discussion that has been left up in various threads that is borderline and probably would not have been permitted previously. In light of the times we Find ourselves in the benefit of the doubt has been given to provide MUCH more flexibility than normal. You certainly get to choose if you elect to stay or go, but overt political posts will be removed, repeat offenders, will be removed.


Plus, we can still buy booze, use motors on our boats.


----------



## SConner

The rules are in place to prevent needless bickering on a outdoorsman forum and are absolutely needed as politics are very personal and tend to provoke a response. This is particularly true when a post is clearly degrading of another party and appears to be to serve one purpose.... troll for a response. Is it that difficult to stay away from politics and not blatantly insult other members? Give the moderators a break, they do this out of the goodness of their hearts so that we may all enjoy a peaceful place to talk fishing. I can’t figure why this is so difficult for some.


----------



## hailtothethief

Fishing is heavily regulated. Very little gets posted that does not involve politics. Cant post a fish with out someone questioning the size or how many you caught. Or whether you were tresspassing to get them. Or were you licensed. I could go on but there is about nothing on here that is not politicking. Anything that makes money is heavily politicized.


----------



## KaGee

texasrig said:


> Just for a clarification, I think we know it you mentioned dems and GOP, but does that include comments in ref of certain politicians and how they are doing. Example: said Governor is a bonehead because he or she did this in regard to the virus. Just trying to understand. Thanks.


If you really want educated, go back and read the Terms of Service that YOU agreed to 7 years ago.


----------



## Saltfork

If ya don’t like the channel your watching. Choose to turn it off! Don’t cry about it! We are all men, are we not? 

Yet I see people, crying and choosing. Skip over what you don’t like! Stop playing moderator. This should be **** down etc.. Debate is one of the spices of life. Without it. It’s worthless.


----------



## Snakecharmer

hailtothethief said:


> Fishing is heavily regulated. Very little gets posted that does not involve politics. Cant post a fish with out someone questioning the size or how many you caught. Or whether you were tresspassing to get them. Or were you licensed. I could go on but there is about nothing on here that is not politicking. Anything that makes money is heavily politicized.


What?


----------



## buckeyebowman

Lewis said:


> I've been wondering how in the hell did China's largest cities almost completely avoid Covid-19?
> Beijing pop. 19 million, Shanghai pop. 23 million





Lewis said:


> Try this one...
> https://www.kmov.com/why-did-21-mil...cle_80456379-e8af-52a8-9366-f8af64b45fd1.html


Interesting! And as I said before, does anyone really believe the numbers coming out of China? I sure as hell don't!


----------



## Saltfork

buckeyebowman said:


> Interesting! And as I said before, does anyone really believe the numbers coming out of China? I sure as hell don't!


 Lol without hurting feelings has any numbers been right anywhere?

Up to date!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Change my mind.


----------



## Meerkat

AmericanEagle said:


> Did Ohio get it right?
> 
> www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/did-ohio-get-it-right-early-intervention-preparation-for-pandemic-may-pay-off/ar-BB12oQtl?ocid=spartanntp


MSN? Fake news alert!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Misdirection

So, I had to run out to my local Ace Hardware this evening...the clean out on my sand mound got snapped off by some jerk on his tractor....so anyways, after I put the tractor back in the pole barn, I headed out to Ace.

They have an area under roof and enclosed in the front. You walk in, tell them what you need, they send someone to go fill your order, pay right there, and your on your way. Keeps people from gathering in the store. Heck they even carry TP and have it all ready to go, limit 3 rolls. 

Boy I really like my local ACE vs the big box stores.

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## Snakecharmer

Meerkat said:


> MSN? Fake news alert!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


It was from the Washington Post if you looked at the article!


----------



## Wow

I respect the opinions of everyone here , because you are all fellow Ohioans.

I don't care about conspiracy theories, misinformation or China. *this is about us. *Here and now.*
We are being"spoon fed" the facts.*
If you read between the lines, you'll notice that they give us the bad and the good news every day. ........It goes something like this: this many new infected.....this many dead....
here's what we're doing about it........and here's when we are considering to create a task force to plan a return to normalcy.
If you've noticed, it's all *"wait and see"*.
Until we can gain control with testing,tracking and hospitalizations, the curve will even out but not end.
Without a vaccine, we will flounder with regular infections and body counts.

Summer customarily slows down viruses, only to come down hard again in the fall.

Ohio's health expert, Dr. Amy Acton, predicts a long road.:
https://www.cleveland.com/coronavir...next-year-to-protect-against-coronavirus.html

Yep, she's an expert.
https://odh.ohio.gov/wps/portal/gov/odh/about-us/executive-bios/odh-executive-001

I respect her opinion far greater than any fisherman.

People everywhere, around the state, need to abide by the recommendations to improve the situation.
We may see the light next fishing season,in 2021, but only if all Ohioans work for it.
It's no time for whining. Remember "work", we are good at that here in Ohio--Tim


----------



## Burkcarp1

Snakecharmer said:


> It was from the Washington Post if you looked at the article!


Still fake news!


----------



## bruce

Take your ball and go home. This site is for Sportsmen. Not the Self righteous. Politics is NOT aloud...……………… Buy the way I liked most of your post.


Southernsaug said:


> I'm sorry that it has become that burdensome Lundy. People are just hurting and want to vent and release some frustrations. I hope I haven't caused some of this anguish. I have enjoyed my time here and I actually think I have a lot to offer this community with my background. However with that said just count me as a victim of corona and go ahead and delete my account. I think your being heavy handed. I am logging off, bye friends.


----------



## Burkcarp1

Wow said:


> I respect the opinions of everyone here , because you are all fellow Ohioans.
> 
> I don't care about conspiracy theories, misinformation or China. *this is about us. *Here and now.
> *We are being"spoon fed" the facts.*
> If you read between the lines, you'll notice that they give us the bad and the good news every day. ........It goes something like this: this many new infected.....this many dead....
> here's what we're doing about it........and here's when we are considering to create a task force to plan a return to normalcy.
> If you've noticed, it's all *"wait and see"*.
> Until we can gain control with testing,tracking and hospitalizations, the curve will even out but not end.
> Without a vaccine, we will flounder with regular infections and body counts.
> 
> Summer customarily slows down viruses, only to come down hard again in the fall.
> 
> Ohio's health expert, Dr. Amy Acton, predicts a long road.:
> https://www.cleveland.com/coronavir...next-year-to-protect-against-coronavirus.html
> 
> Yep, she's an expert.
> https://odh.ohio.gov/wps/portal/gov/odh/about-us/executive-bios/odh-executive-001
> 
> I respect her opinion far greater than any fisherman.
> 
> People everywhere, around the state, need to abide by the recommendations to improve the situation.
> We may see the light next fishing season,in 2021, but only if all Ohioans work for it.
> It's no time for whining. Remember "work", we are good at that here in Ohio--Tim


Sorry not a fan


----------



## Wow

Burkcarp1 said:


> Sorry not a fan


I still respect your opinion.--Tim


----------



## glacier_dropsy

I worked at a hospital over the Easter weekend that is a dedicated COVID facility for a large hospital system. I got there around 7pm, which was apparently shift change. I only recognized one person, the secretary. He told me this time of evening is now always a cluster, because they never know who is going to be there until they got there. It was a bunch of young nurses and techs, wearing masks, trying to act like this was normal. Felt like the early scenes in Vietnam movies.


----------



## fastwater

Wow said:


> ....
> 
> 
> *Until we can gain control with testing,tracking and hospitalizations, the curve will even out but not end.
> Without a vaccine, we will flounder with regular infections and body counts.*
> 
> Summer customarily slows down viruses, only to come down hard again in the fall.
> 
> Ohio's health expert, Dr. Amy Acton, predicts a long road.:
> https://www.cleveland.com/coronavir...next-year-to-protect-against-coronavirus.html
> 
> Yep, she's an expert.
> https://odh.ohio.gov/wps/portal/gov/odh/about-us/executive-bios/odh-executive-001
> 
> I respect her opinion far greater than any fisherman.
> 
> People everywhere, around the state, need to abide by the recommendations to improve the situation.
> We may see the light next fishing season,in 2021, but only if all Ohioans work for it.
> It's no time for whining. Remember "work", we are good at that here in Ohio--Tim


Sentiments mirrored by Dr Fauci as well.
He has also commented on the notion of setting a specific date and opening up business as usual all over is a sure way to cause a quick resurgence in cases most likely causing spikes in deaths that were first anticipated. His comments were that we will continue to have more cases until a vaccine is found and that we must control the 'spikes'.
Guess when two experts in the field agree, one being almost a legend in the study of infectious diseases (Dr Fauci)and people still doubt, I guess they'll just have to feel before they get it.
But that's ok...whether we believe the experts in these fields or not...corvid19 is here...and seems it's gonna be around until that magical vaccine is developed.
In the mean time, if we choose to act like it isn't and go completely back to normal, we need to buy a lot of body bags. And if that happens, I hope every one of my family members that works in hospitals find other careers. I know that's what I'll strongly be encouraging them to do.
Absolutely no since in them...or any other medical personnel risking their and their families lives for anyone not wanting to fight for themselves.


----------



## hailtothethief

99% of americans will not die from covid 19. Healthy working americans can go on with their lives. The people who need sheltered are the elderly, and immune compromised. If the healthy people get back to work they can easily provide everything the sheltered need. Forcing quarantine on everyone means mostly healthy people are out of work. Estimates are economic activity will drop 30 percent in quarter 2. The government has decided stimulus checks will cover being out of work but losing economic activity is a loss and will have its own consequences.


----------



## Patricio

fastwater said:


> Sentiments mirrored by Dr Fauci as well.
> .


friendly reminder, that idiot has been 100% wrong in every aspect of the coronavirus. his track record makes weathermen feel good about their abilities.


----------



## bad luck

200,000 dead if we do exceptionally well....that was the news reported as fact 10 days ago...


their (media/govt) using horrible models and under-reporting the pre-existing conditions of the unfortunate folks —god bless them—but majority are over 60 AND OBESE AND typically 1 of many other conditions (diabetes, cancer survivor, etc...) 

AND 

over-reporting the exceptions who pass away (healthy, marathon running 30 year olds). 

here are risks the govt is willing to allow you to take, knowing TENS OF THOUSANDS OR MORE WILL DIE ANNUALLY FROM
-Is it worth banning all tobacco due to lung or lip cancer 
-driving of motor vehicles?
-alcohol?
-16 year olds and over 65 year olds driving
-potato chips?
-soda pop...


This is an infinite list ....


Lastly, my assumption is that most who are ok “staying home”, have not lost their paychecks (retirement, weekly pay, pension, etc.....I didn’t say investments....)


----------



## bdawg

Some good news for our state. I heard there were no new cases in Ohio yesterday. Hopefully, we are at a turning point. The social distancing has worked and reduced the surge more than expected. That is something to celebrate! Its given businesses time to adjust and figure out how to work while still keeping their workers and the public safe. I'm very proud of our governor and health director for their open and honest handling of this situation. They jumped on the problem and used all their available resources to solve it. I think this outbreak will linger until we get a vaccine. All we can do is wash our hands and wear masks, and hope we don't get it. It may only kill 1-2% of the people it infects, but I don't want to be the 1. Nor, do I want my family members to be one of the 1-2%. 

I've already had 1 distant relative hospitalized by this virus. She is in recovery and doing well. Another brother of a friend who is in their 40s is currently hospitalized on a ventilator. This disease is something to take seriously, not because of the death rate, but because of how fast it can spread through asymptomatic people and how many people are hospitalized because of it. An overwhelmed hospital system is not good for anyone.


----------



## Lewis

Interesting plan. Watch from the 26 minute mark.


----------



## Shad Rap

Snakecharmer said:


> It was from the Washington Post if you looked at the article!


Washington Post?..fake news too man!


----------



## Shad Rap

fastwater said:


> Sentiments mirrored by Dr Fauci as well.
> He has also commented on the notion of setting a specific date and opening up business as usual all over is a sure way to cause a quick resurgence in cases most likely causing spikes in deaths that were first anticipated. His comments were that we will continue to have more cases until a vaccine is found and that we must control the 'spikes'.
> Guess when two experts in the field agree, one being almost a legend in the study of infectious diseases (Dr Fauci)and people still doubt, I guess they'll just have to feel before they get it.
> But that's ok...whether we believe the experts in these fields or not...corvid19 is here...and seems it's gonna be around until that magical vaccine is developed.
> In the mean time, if we choose to act like it isn't and go completely back to normal, we need to buy a lot of body bags. And if that happens, I hope every one of my family members that works in hospitals find other careers. I know that's what I'll strongly be encouraging them to do.
> Absolutely no since in them...or any other medical personnel risking their and their families lives for anyone not wanting to fight for themselves.


We're succeptable to virus's in everyday life...corona or not...and this is what people in the medical field signed up for...they are potentially exposed to disease EVERYDAY...corona or not...I know several medical personnel who have turned into complete pansies over this ordeal and it makes me seriously upset...people not showing up to work, calling off...this is what you signed up for...this is the time we need ya...deal with it...if not, find another career....


----------



## Burkcarp1

https://www.nationalreview.com/2020/04/coronavirus-response-sweden-avoids-isolation-economic-ruin/


----------



## Buster24

I can see things are slowly starting to unravel.....I see it my hometown of only 8 thousand people and from what I read and hear it can only be worse in the more populated areas...people need and want to get back to work, to get out, to socialize, to go to church....we all feel that we are losing our freedoms and to a certain extent we are...hell, we have been losing freedoms for years....little by little, but most don’t even notice....I don’t know if we can stay enclosed in our homes until May 1....fear and panic created this mess and China has really put a hurt on the whole world, but we will survive....I am one of these old farts and have went through more economic suffering in 80, 81, and 82 so I know how hard it is to want to work and can’t....I feel terrible for you people....my only hope is that the president and governors arrive at a safe period to open things up because it will still take some time because of all the panic and fear instilled in the past....good luck to all when the day arrives and we can return to our lives as we once knew them!!!


----------



## LEfriend

hailtothethief said:


> 99% of americans will not die from covid 19. Healthy working americans can go on with their lives. The people who need sheltered are the elderly, and immune compromised. If the healthy people get back to work they can easily provide everything the sheltered need. Forcing quarantine on everyone means mostly healthy people are out of work. Estimates are economic activity will drop 30 percent in quarter 2. The government has decided stimulus checks will cover being out of work but losing economic activity is a loss and will have its own consequences.


The fact that it only affects the elderly and immune compromised is proven total BS. Our daughter in law is a nurse on the front lines risking her life every day with inadequate and lacking protective equipment still. These folks are the real heroes and too many already have given their lives. They don’t need more cases on their doors and we need to listen to the medical professionals who are all saying we can lose all our gain if we give it up too soon.


----------



## LEfriend

Shad Rap said:


> We're succeptable to virus's in everyday life...corona or not...and this is what people in the medical field signed up for...they are potentially exposed to disease EVERYDAY...corona or not...I know several medical personnel who have turned into complete pansies over this ordeal and it makes me seriously upset...people not showing up to work, calling off...this is what you signed up for...deal with it...if not, find another career....


Get back to me when you yourself have young kids and day after day you are in a hospital doing 12 hour shifts and you are treating Covid infected patients without protective adequate equipment. You may have room to post such total BS then


----------



## cheezemm2

LEfriend said:


> The fact that it only affects the elderly and immune compromised is proven total BS. Our daughter in law is a nurse on the front lines risking her life every day with inadequate and lacking protective equipment still. These folks are the real heroes and too many already have given their lives. They don’t need more cases on their doors and we need to listen to the medical professionals who are all saying we can lose all our gain if we give it up too soon.


Thank you to your daughter.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Burkcarp1 said:


> https://www.nationalreview.com/2020/04/coronavirus-response-sweden-avoids-isolation-economic-ruin/


Very good read. It will be interesting to keep an eye on this and compare day to day, week to week, ect.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Burkcarp1 said:


> https://www.nationalreview.com/2020/04/coronavirus-response-sweden-avoids-isolation-economic-ruin/


Yes, Sweden is doing great (NOT)...Their coronavirus deathrate per million residents is 4 times Ohio's...114 deaths yesterday 1033 total deaths. Yes its working, if you're a funeral home director...

You need to find better information...


----------



## cheezemm2

Ohio:
https://covid19.healthdata.org/united-states-of-america/ohio

Florida:
https://covid19.healthdata.org/united-states-of-america/florida


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

LEfriend said:


> Get back to me when you yourself have young kids and day after day you are in a hospital doing 12 hour shifts and you are treating Covid infected patients without protective adequate equipment. You may have room to post such total BS then


The thing about it is, some can show you more cases where this is not happing all over the country for every case that you present. Hospitals in the US are not overrun by this virus. Now that being said, I’m sure a lot of hospitals have their protocol for this virus that may call for extra hrs, extra procedures, ect. But if you know anything about the nursing profession you should know that their was a huge shortage of nurses in this country way before this virus happened. Maybe you should turn the blame on the health care facilities that some of these nurses work for. There was a previous shortage of nurse care and it’s not the existing workings nurses fault nor people’s fault that are dealing with the fallout of this virus either. It’s not fair of you to call someone out just because they have a different view and want this thing over as much as you do.


----------



## Snakecharmer

bdawg said:


> Some good news for our state. I heard there were no new cases in Ohio yesterday.


Unfortunately we had 371 new cases and 21 deaths.


----------



## Shad Rap

LEfriend said:


> Get back to me when you yourself have young kids and day after day you are in a hospital doing 12 hour shifts and you are treating Covid infected patients without protective adequate equipment. You may have room to post such total BS then


Theres plenty of PPE to go around...like I said...find another career...it's daily.
That doesn't mean you just don't show up to work to treat people that you made the career move to do...who takes care of these people then?..or anyone who has a virus???


----------



## Shad Rap

LEfriend said:


> The fact that it only affects the elderly and immune compromised is proven total BS. Our daughter in law is a nurse on the front lines risking her life every day with inadequate and lacking protective equipment still. These folks are the real heroes and too many already have given their lives. They don’t need more cases on their doors and we need to listen to the medical professionals who are all saying we can lose all our gain if we give it up too soon.


No one ever said it ONLY affects elderly and immune compromised...but thats about 98% of the cases...you can't hype that any other way.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Shad Rap said:


> Washington Post?..fake news too man!


Did you read it?


----------



## Shad Rap

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> The thing about it is, some can show you more cases where this is not happing all over the country for every case that you present. Hospitals in the US are not overrun by this virus. Now that being said, I’m sure a lot of hospitals have their protocol for this virus that may call for extra hrs, extra procedures, ect. But if you know anything about the nursing profession you should know that their was a huge shortage of nurses in this country way before this virus happened. Maybe you should turn the blame on the health care facilities that some of these nurses work for. There was a previous shortage of nurse care and it’s not the existing workings nurses fault nor people’s fault that are dealing with the fallout of this virus either. It’s not fair of you to call someone out just because they have a different view and want this thing over as much as you do.


Not only that...nursing homes across the state (my wife runs 7 of them) are now being told to cut staff because of census being low...her company is down about 300 residents across the board...


----------



## Shad Rap

Snakecharmer said:


> Unfortunately we had 371 new cases and 21 deaths.


Still having new cases in China too.


----------



## Burkcarp1

Snakecharmer said:


> Yes, Sweden is doing great (NOT)...Their coronavirus deathrate per million residents is 4 times Ohio's...114 deaths yesterday 1033 total deaths. Yes its working, if you're a funeral home director...
> 
> You need to find better information...


I just thought it was interesting given that everyone should be dead (according to some)because it wasn’t shutdown. Not exactly sure what you meant by better information but ok


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Burkcarp1 said:


> I just thought it was interesting given that everyone should be dead (according to some)because it wasn’t shutdown. I exactly sure what you meant by better information but ok


That’s called someone imposing their thoughts on you, putting words in your mouth, trying to tell you what your thinking. That’s all. If some people don’t have your same thought process they feel they need to put theirs out there to try an cover all bases and try to make you look uninformed at the same time. I wouldn’t sweat it.


----------



## Shad Rap

Snakecharmer said:


> Did you read it?


Nope...don't care to...Ohio did get it right, but they can blow it here in the end!..they can go from hero to zero real quick if stuff doesn't open back up come May 1st...it's ridiculous now.
Long after this virus is gone, and it will be, the resulting financial devastation will remain and lives will continue to be upside down. Have pity on all them as well.


----------



## TheKing

"There's plenty of PPE to go around" is a myth. My daughter is a hospital doctor. She anguishes over being forced to send nurses and residents to covid ER without PPE and it has been that way for a month.


----------



## Lewzer

I have two sisters that are RN. One in Philadelphia area and the other in a local Canton hospital. The Canton one is out of work. No patients so they shut her floor down. stupid.


----------



## M R DUCKS

NO! There is NOT plenty of PPE....
1st hand experience.
If there is plenty, it is sitting in storage somewhere, because
We don’t have it readily available.


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## miked913

Talked with a family member yesterday who is a nurse in Columbus, when the get to work for a shift they have their temperature taken, if they don't have a fever they are issued 1 regular mask not an n-95 but the crappy old school nurses mask that they use the entire shift. So if you think there is plenty of good ppe to go around get out of your bubble, there is NOT! 

Sent from my moto z3 using Tapatalk


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## CoonDawg92

The PPE thing has me scratching my head...where is it? Hoarded by private or public entities in warehouses? Lack of supply from China? US manufacturers should be going 24/7 making this stuff. Was ALL of it imported?

Some hospitals overrun, but certainly not all. Cancelling elective procedures and sending people home early should free up PPE for people treating Coronavirus patients?

Too many health care workers testimonies have convinced me that the virus is real and can have ugly effects. Yet there is part of me that still feels like we are all being had in some ways. 

Many lessons still to learn. Less dependence on other countries for critical items among the first.


----------



## Misdirection

CoonDawg92 said:


> The PPE thing has me scratching my head...where is it? Hoarded by private or public entities in warehouses? Lack of supply from China? US manufacturers should be going 24/7 making this stuff. Was ALL of it imported?
> 
> Some hospitals overrun, but certainly not all. Cancelling elective procedures and sending people home early should free up PPE for people treating Coronavirus patients?
> 
> Too many health care workers testimonies have convinced me that the virus is real and can have ugly effects. Yet there is part of me that still feels like we are all being had in some ways.
> 
> Many lessons still to learn. Less dependence on other countries for critical items among the first.


My brother works at a small rural hospital just inside the PA line. Gets issued a 95N mask at the start of every shift.

In my opinion, I suspect that availability depends upon how a given health system managed their inventory. If they were an order "just in time" to reduce costs, they were probably caught short. Likewise their suppliers were probably caught off guard by large orders and unable to fill everything. 

Hopefully we'll all learn something from this.



Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## cement569

ok folks heres my opinion, and you know what opinions are like. they keep telling us they have no idea when the peak is comming, why we ask? because the flu is a winter virus and if you look at the countries weather three quarters of it is below normal. so im thinking and hoping that when we get warm weather this virus will ease up. I mean we are just now getting our march weather.... so theres my opinion and stay safe my friends


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## bridgeman

This all has to come down to take care of yourself if you're having some respiratory health issues. Healthy people have little to fear from this bug but they better fear the fact that the government is gonna trash em financially if this charade keeps up. For all we know this thing blew through the whole country infecting everybody, some without a good immune system took it hard while others wondered why they sneezed three times that day.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Misdirection said:


> My brother works at a small rural hospital just inside the PA line. Gets issued a 95N mask at the start of every shift.
> 
> In my opinion, I suspect that availability depends upon how a given health system managed their inventory. If they were an order "just in time" to reduce costs, they were probably caught short. Likewise their suppliers were probably caught off guard by large orders and unable to fill everything.
> 
> Hopefully we'll all learn something from this.
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


Good points. I would think the lack of PPE could be mostly blamed on the given facility. These places have budgets and unfortunately it’s all about being in the black even in the heath care business. If heath care workers are getting overwhelmed, sick, lack PPE, whose fault is that? I would say their employers would hold most of the blame.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Shad Rap said:


> Nope...don't care to...Ohio did get it right, but they can blow it here in the end!..they can go from hero to zero real quick if stuff doesn't open back up come May 1st...it's ridiculous now.
> Long after this virus is gone, and it will be, the resulting financial devastation will remain and lives will continue to be upside down. Have pity on all them as well.


Well if you would have read it, they said DeWine did it right.


----------



## Hatchetman

bridgeman said:


> This all has to come down to take care of yourself if you're having some respiratory health issues. Healthy people have little to fear from this bug but they better fear the fact that the government is gonna trash em financially if this charade keeps up. For all we know this thing blew through the whole country infecting everybody, some without a good immune system took it hard while others wondered why they sneezed three times that day.


I worry every time I go out. For some reason even, if I just clear my throat let alone cough, I sneeze 3 times, not once, not twice, but three times. This has been going on for about 5-6 years. If I did it in Kroger's I would probably clear the store out....


----------



## Snakecharmer

Burkcarp1 said:


> https://www.nationalreview.com/2020/04/coronavirus-response-sweden-avoids-isolation-economic-ruin/


https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidn...y-has-failed-as-deaths-top-1000/#244316b87b6c


----------



## 9Left

Shad Rap said:


> We're succeptable to virus's in everyday life...corona or not...and this is what people in the medical field signed up for...they are potentially exposed to disease EVERYDAY...corona or not...I know several medical personnel who have turned into complete pansies over this ordeal and it makes me seriously upset...people not showing up to work, calling off...this is what you signed up for...this is the time we need ya...deal with it...if not, find another career....


Yikes... Not quite sure how to respond to that
... first off, you're welcome.
Second… Been doing this a long time and I know a lot of people… I have yet to run across Multiple nurse friend that are afraid of what's going on. I do know several people that have called off of work… But the reason is not because they're afraid… The reason is because a lot of nurses are being furloughed because hours are not available to work. Like I said earlier, hospitals have followed the state orders and cleared out at least half of their census to prepare for this… And the current update at my hospital ....Is a whopping 3 positive cases.....3. I know of one person that has basically stepped down… And that is because she has two young babies and a chronically ill husband at home… Everyone I know fully supported her and her decision... Including myself…
...So when you tell nurses to "step up or find another career "....Please watch your words my friend… Because you more than likely have no idea what you're talking about


----------



## 9Left

TheKing said:


> "There's plenty of PPE to go around" is a myth. My daughter is a hospital doctor. She anguishes over being forced to send nurses and residents to covid ER without PPE and it has been that way for a month.


This is a true statement


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

Snakecharmer said:


> https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidn...y-has-failed-as-deaths-top-1000/#244316b87b6c


C'mon Snake, haven't you yet learned, if it ain't Fox it's fake.


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

9Left said:


> Yikes... Not quite sure how to respond to that
> ... first off, you're welcome.
> Second… Been doing this a long time and I know a lot of people… I have yet to run across Multiple nurse friend that are afraid of what's going on. I do know several people that have called off of work… But the reason is not because they're afraid… The reason is because a lot of nurses are being furloughed because hours are not available to work. Like I said earlier, hospitals have followed the state orders and cleared out at least half of their census to prepare for this… And the current update at my hospital ....Is a whopping 3 positive cases.....3. I know of one person that has basically stepped down… And that is because she has two young babies and a chronically ill husband at home… Everyone I know fully supported her and her decision... Including myself…
> ...So when you tell nurses to "step up or find another career "....Please watch your words my friend… Because you more than likely have no idea what you're talking about


Unfortunately, it will only let me like once. Thanks for what you do.


----------



## 9Left

Shad Rap said:


> Theres plenty of PPE to go around...like I said...find another career...it's daily.
> That doesn't mean you just don't show up to work to treat people that you made the career move to do...who takes care of these people then?..or anyone who has a virus???


And obviously… I haven't been working at the hospital that you apparently work at, nor have I been dealing with the Covid patients that you have been dealing with( from your post, I'm guessing that you're right up there on the front line with the best of them)... What are your teammates responses to whats going on?
The vast majority of my colleagues have this response…








...And I still gladly walk right next to them, wading through blood, feces, and vomit...Just to bring a patient glass of ice water they requested. One last thing, do you know any place that is having sales on shoes… Because I have personally gone through four pair in the last six weeks


----------



## 9Left

Misdirection said:


> My brother works at a small rural hospital just inside the PA line. Gets issued a 95N mask at the start of every shift.
> 
> In my opinion, I suspect that availability depends upon how a given health system managed their inventory. If they were an order "just in time" to reduce costs, they were probably caught short. Likewise their suppliers were probably caught off guard by large orders and unable to fill everything.
> 
> Hopefully we'll all learn something from this.
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


So this is how it works(at least in my hospital) The PPE equipment, the good stuff, is sitting in a clean storage room on the several units that we have cleared out and designated… Supposedly, when we get this "wave" of cases...The designated staff working on the covid units, will need every bit of that equipment when the time comes. So the rest of us get to wear a cheap little half paper, half cloth mask ... Which we actually have to "sign out" at the beginning of each shift. And if your brother is getting issued a N 95 mask eachshift… That's awesome… I haven't seen one of those yet. The reason we're doing this is because one single nurse will typically go through 15 to 20 masks in a 12 hour shift… Taking care of one single patient. And a typical assignment for a nurse is anywhere from 5 to 6 patients each shift.So if we don't sparingly use this equipment… It will be gone in a heartbeat and we won't have it when we really need it.


----------



## One guy and a boat

9Left said:


> Yikes... Not quite sure how to respond to that
> ... first off, you're welcome.
> Second… Been doing this a long time and I know a lot of people… I have yet to run across Multiple nurse friend that are afraid of what's going on. I do know several people that have called off of work… But the reason is not because they're afraid… The reason is because a lot of nurses are being furloughed because hours are not available to work. Like I said earlier, hospitals have followed the state orders and cleared out at least half of their census to prepare for this… And the current update at my hospital ....Is a whopping 3 positive cases.....3. I know of one person that has basically stepped down… And that is because she has two young babies and a chronically ill husband at home… Everyone I know fully supported her and her decision... Including myself…
> ...So when you tell nurses to "step up or find another career "....Please watch your words my friend… Because you more than likely have no idea what you're talking about


With all the work stress you and other front line people are dealing with, you handled that apathetic statement better that I would've. Well done and thank you for what you do.

Sent from my Pixel 3a XL using Tapatalk


----------



## jrose

fastwater said:


> Sentiments mirrored by Dr Fauci as well.
> He has also commented on the notion of setting a specific date and opening up business as usual all over is a sure way to cause a quick resurgence in cases most likely causing spikes in deaths that were first anticipated. His comments were that we will continue to have more cases until a vaccine is found and that we must control the 'spikes'.
> Guess when two experts in the field agree, one being almost a legend in the study of infectious diseases (Dr Fauci)and people still doubt, I guess they'll just have to feel before they get it.
> But that's ok...whether we believe the experts in these fields or not...corvid19 is here...and seems it's gonna be around until that magical vaccine is developed.
> In the mean time, if we choose to act like it isn't and go completely back to normal, we need to buy a lot of body bags. And if that happens, I hope every one of my family members that works in hospitals find other careers. I know that's what I'll strongly be encouraging them to do.
> Absolutely no since in them...or any other medical personnel risking their and their families lives for anyone not wanting to fight for themselves.


"Get busy living or get busy dying" Been working this whole time, wash hands, self distance, go home and work around the house or go shopping. Getting the boat ready for fishing (really should be fishing by now but a little behind). Been doing a lot of scouting for this upcoming turkey season (Can't wait). Your gonna have to come out sometime or be left behind! Life is to short. Be smart, take precaution when necessary. There is a lot of things in life to worry about and you have to prioritize which ones make your life more enjoyable/carefree. This virus is on my list but not at the top. It's probably not time to start packing yourself into bars just yet but it is time to get back to work. Common sense is king right now not fear. This is just a hick-up for most people and we'll get through it.


----------



## TomC

My wife will be working the covid floor here in two weeks. They have a lot of stuff under lock and key because staff has been stealing the PPE. They have one entrance in and one out. When they get there they put on the hospital scrubs( not their own). Once the shift is complete, they change out of those scrubs, shower and then put their own personal clothing on. Two months before this all started, one of the major local hospitals had individuals in ICU with covid and the nursing staff was not gowning up and going full ppe with masks or anything for them.

The hospital told them that it was the American version of the virus and there was nothing to worry about. Something must be going on out there when 1 in 5 infected are in the medical field in the US. My work is aware of my wife who we just had a baby is assigned to that floor once she returns. My work gave us n95 masks, I already took mine home to give to to use, my work also gave me some "extra" masks to take to her as well. We are thankful that so far out of 475 inmates we have had no cases in here as yet even thought other county jails and prisons are scrambling because they have confirmed cases. Am I worried at work nope, im more worried bout the wife. I don't let her know that shes stressed enough for the both of us.


----------



## hailtothethief

A lot of nurses are immune compromised. People with problems tend to be more inclined to be doctors, psychologists, etc. My moms gastroenterologist has colon issues himself. People that need help tend to be more willing to help.


----------



## 9Left

hailtothethief said:


> A lot of nurses are immune compromised.


Scratching my head on that post...It's the exact opposite.


----------



## TomC

Don't they have more of a built up immune system due to being exposed to so much stuff? we say that here in the jail we are immune to anything due to everything we are exposed to. The only thing that gets us is the cancer which we all think is linked to the building here.


----------



## AmericanEagle

Meerkat said:


> MSN? Fake news alert!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


The article in the Washington Post poses the question did Ohio get it right. I did not see anything in the article I would consider fake. I would love to hear from anyone who can specifically point out what is inaccurate. I am open to changing my mind.

This was published April 9th so all the data would apply to that date. The article starts by describing some actions Ohio took early on.

On 2/26/20 before there were any identified covid-19 cases in Ohio the Cleveland Clinic announces it can free up 1,000 beds should the need arise.

On 03/04/20 before there were any identified covid-19 cases in Ohio the governor shutdown the Arnold an international sports festival expected to draw 60,000 people a day to the Columbus Convention Center.

The following 4 paragraphs are quoted directly from the article

"Now, Ohio may be realizing the benefits of early intervention in the pandemic by its government and medical community. With about 5,100 covid-19 cases, it has fewer than a third the number of people with the novel coronavirus than in three comparably sized states — Michigan, Pennsylvania and Illinois. And Ohio has just a small fraction of the deaths reported in those states.

But an early look at Ohio’s preparations and decision-making shows they reflect textbook recommendations for the way to handle an outbreak. Identify it early. Plan for the worst, hope for the best. Move swiftly because disease expansion will be exponential, not linear. In the absence of testing, assume the virus is spreading through the community. Communicate with the public clearly, and keep the message consistent.

Through Thursday’s report, Ohio had 5,148 positive cases and 193 deaths from covid-19, according to the COVID Tracking Project, a small group of journalists and others amassing data from public sources. The state had performed more than 53,000 tests.

In Pennsylvania, there were 16,239 cases and 309 deaths after nearly twice as many tests. Illinois has seen 15,478 cases and 462 deaths, after testing 75,000 people. Michigan, which has a smaller population than those three states, had 20,346 cases and 959 deaths after conducting the same number of tests as Ohio.”

The link to the whole article is here _www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/did-ohio-get-it-right-early-intervention-preparation-for-pandemic-may-pay-off/ar-BB12oQtl?ocid=spartanntp_


----------



## OptOutside440

The President is making an announcement today that is supposed to be in conjunction with all governor's. I wonder what it will be?


----------



## Snakecharmer

AmericanEagle said:


> The article in the Washington post poses the question did Ohio get it right. I did not see anything in the article I would consider fake. I would love to hear from anyone who can specifically point out what is inaccurate. I am open to changing my mind.
> 
> This was published April 9th so all the data would apply to that date. The article starts by describing some actions Ohio took early on.
> 
> On 2/26/20 before there were any identified covid-19 cases in Ohio the Cleveland Clinic announces it can free up 1,000 beds should the need arise.
> 
> On 03/04/20 before there were any identified covid-19 cases in Ohio the governor shutdown the Arnold an international sports festival expected to draw 60,000 people a day to the Columbus Convention Center.
> 
> The following 4 paragraphs are quoted directly from the article
> 
> "Now, Ohio may be realizing the benefits of early intervention in the pandemic by its government and medical community. With about 5,100 covid-19 cases, it has fewer than a third the number of people with the novel coronavirus than in three comparably sized states — Michigan, Pennsylvania and Illinois. And Ohio has just a small fraction of the deaths reported in those states.
> 
> But an early look at Ohio’s preparations and decision-making shows they reflect textbook recommendations for the way to handle an outbreak. Identify it early. Plan for the worst, hope for the best. Move swiftly because disease expansion will be exponential, not linear. In the absence of testing, assume the virus is spreading through the community. Communicate with the public clearly, and keep the message consistent.
> 
> Through Thursday’s report, Ohio had 5,148 positive cases and 193 deaths from covid-19, according to the COVID Tracking Project, a small group of journalists and others amassing data from public sources. The state had performed more than 53,000 tests.
> 
> In Pennsylvania, there were 16,239 cases and 309 deaths after nearly twice as many tests. Illinois has seen 15,478 cases and 462 deaths, after testing 75,000 people. Michigan, which has a smaller population than those three states, had 20,346 cases and 959 deaths after conducting the same number of tests as Ohio.”
> 
> The link to the whole article is here _www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/did-ohio-get-it-right-early-intervention-preparation-for-pandemic-may-pay-off/ar-BB12oQtl?ocid=spartanntp_


His mind is made up, don't confuse him with the facts.


----------



## Burkcarp1

We got some really good trollers on here.....


----------



## Rooster

Snakecharmer said:


> His mind is made up, don't confuse him with the facts.


Just an FYI.....it is an OPINION piece, not factual news.


----------



## joel_fishes

Snakecharmer said:


> https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidn...y-has-failed-as-deaths-top-1000/#244316b87b6c


I think it is too early to say whether Sweden took the wrong approach. The article sites 22 scientists who say they are doing it wrong, but you can be certain Sweden has a few scientists advising who think they are doing it right. 

By some measures, they have more cases and deaths now. To summarize another article I read - Sweden was confident its hospital system would not be overloaded (not trying to "flatten the curve") and it could treat the patients as needed. Sweden quarantined the sick, recommended at-risk groups self-quarantine, banned groups of 50 or more and told people to stay home if they have symptoms. Sweden basically wanted the lower risk groups (children, college age etc) to be exposed to develop herd immunity which it is felt will slow the spread long-term. The fear with quarantining the healthy is once the quarantine is over, you can be right back in the same position because there is no immunity.

Sweden makes the case that they are following standard procedures for virus control while the mandated lockdowns are actually the experimental approach. 

Quote from the article - The problem with lockdowns is that “you tire the system out,” Anders Tegnell, Sweden’s chief epidemiologist, told the _Guardian_. “You can’t keep a lockdown going for months — it’s impossible.” He told Britain’s _Daily Mail_: “We can’t kill all our services. And unemployed people are a great threat to public health. It’s a factor you need to think about.”

Until this is all over, I don't think we can make the judgment as to who took the right path. It will be interesting to compare the results.


----------



## fastwater

Shad Rap said:


> Nope...don't care to...Ohio did get it right, but they can blow it here in the end!..they can go from hero to zero real quick if stuff doesn't open back up come May 1st...it's ridiculous now.
> Long after this virus is gone, and it will be, the resulting financial devastation will remain and lives will continue to be upside down. Have pity on all them as well.


So...you think you're all that that you are gonna dictate to this pandemic/virus and give it a deadline of May1?
Yep...come May1 lets just open everything back up and let the chips fall where they may.
Just for giggles...and given the fact that Ohio has done a good job and...with best case scenario,until a vaccine is developed,there WILL be a resurgence...you may want to check out the percentage of medical personnel currently infected. 
You dictate to this virus, set a deadline date for it and open everything back up, I don't think you'll have to worry about the 'pansy' medical personnel not being at work. When the resurgence happens, it won't be long before there won't be enough medical personnel not infected to take care of the sick.
It happened in both China and Italy. They had such a shortage of medical personnel that they were working while they were infected with the virus.
The level of ignorance and total falsehoods in your last several posts is just mind boggling.
Lastly...I seriously doubt that there's a nurse or Dr out there that needs you to remind them what they signed up for.
Let me remind you that not one of them signed up for a pandemic situation in which they jeopardize there lives and the lives of their loved ones everyday if the actions of the leading medical professionals from around the world are advising to do one thing but their knowledge and professional position on the subject of how to best fight the pandemic to save more lives is not headed by those less qualified to be making the decisions and they are setting definite dates as if that means something to the pandemic.
You said "we need these medical personnel".
I say you are right!
But don't expect our medical personnel to be any more of a sacrificial lamb than you and yours are willing to be.


----------



## Snakecharmer

More than 9,000 health care workers across the U.S. contracted COVID-19 as of last week and at least 27 died, according to a report released Tuesday by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

Of the 9,282 health care personnel confirmed between Feb.12 and April 9 with the disease caused by the new coronavirus, more than half, 55%, reported only having contact with COVID-19 patients within the health care setting. About 73% of the workers who provided personal information were women, and the median age of those infected was 42 years old.


----------



## jrose

joel_fishes said:


> I think it is too early to say whether Sweden took the wrong approach. The article sites 22 scientists who say they are doing it wrong, but you can be certain Sweden has a few scientists advising who think they are doing it right.
> 
> By some measures, they have more cases and deaths now. To summarize another article I read - Sweden was confident its hospital system would not be overloaded (not trying to "flatten the curve") and it could treat the patients as needed. Sweden quarantined the sick, recommended at-risk groups self-quarantine, banned groups of 50 or more and told people to stay home if they have symptoms. Sweden basically wanted the lower risk groups (children, college age etc) to be exposed to develop herd immunity which it is felt will slow the spread long-term. The fear with quarantining the healthy is once the quarantine is over, you can be right back in the same position because there is no immunity.
> 
> Sweden makes the case that they are following standard procedures for virus control while the mandated lockdowns are actually the experimental approach.
> 
> Quote from the article - The problem with lockdowns is that “you tire the system out,” Anders Tegnell, Sweden’s chief epidemiologist, told the _Guardian_. “You can’t keep a lockdown going for months — it’s impossible.” He told Britain’s _Daily Mail_: “We can’t kill all our services. And unemployed people are a great threat to public health. It’s a factor you need to think about.”
> 
> Until this is all over, I don't think we can make the judgment as to who took the right path. It will be interesting to compare the results.


I rather be on Sweden’s path, but they are a much smaller country. Wonder how they handle travel across their border? Lots of variables to deal with.


----------



## BeerBatter

I guess this was in the plain dealer today
Along with an article that made a lot of sense by Michael atnip


----------



## BeerBatter

Well on 4-10 sorry


----------



## Snakecharmer

BeerBatter said:


> I guess this was in the plain dealer today
> Along with an article that made a lot of sense by Michael atnip


That was in the Plain News an Amish/ Mennonite Newsletter or Newspaper from State College PA. Interesting Read


----------



## laguna21

Just a thought, alot of Ohio references in the federal government coronavirus daily briefings, in a positive way. Good to be a Buckeye


----------



## Saugeye Tom

so, I'm watching the president and i think he is going to open up some states with some rules. We do need to open up or it will be years before we ever become healthy as a whole. The governors will need to be on board and MORE IMPORTANT we need to be on board. Follow guidelines, save our country!!!! Stay safe folks get out work fish and love!!!!! Tom


----------



## yonderfishin

Should we have shut down the state or country considering the death rate was so much less than they thought it could be ? ..... Lets not forget that shutting it down is very likely the reason things have not been as bad as they could have been. Your temporary lack of the comfort and liberties we all are so used to are likely the sole reason things dont look as bad as predicted. That means it worked , that dont mean it wasnt necessary. But complainers will complain , they always do. Conspiracy nuts will see conspiracies , they always do.


----------



## OptOutside440

During these times I imagine it's an excellent opportunity to fish Lake Rockwell!


----------



## Snakecharmer

Unfortunately today was the USA'a highest death toll, almost 2300 at 7:30.


----------



## Snakecharmer

OptOutside440 said:


> During these times I imagine it's an excellent opportunity to fish Lake Rockwell!


Sounds like a plan.


----------



## buckeyebowman

Saltfork said:


> Lol without hurting feelings has any numbers been right anywhere?
> 
> Up to date!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> Change my mind.


Our numbers are as accurate as they can be at the time. China's are a bald faced lie, and commie propaganda. 

The only way they can be accurate is this. And get ready for a real "tin foil hat" conspiracy theory here! This was something cooked up in a Chinese lab, with a control developed along with it. They let a little out to see what would happen, killed off a little more than 3 thousand of their citizens, then applied the control. 

There! How's that? 

Also heard today that China may be starting to experience an infection rebound.


----------



## SConner

buckeyebowman said:


> Our numbers are as accurate as they can be at the time. China's are a bald faced lie, and commie propaganda.
> 
> The only way they can be accurate is this. And get ready for a real "tin foil hat" conspiracy theory here! This was something cooked up in a Chinese lab, with a control developed along with it. They let a little out to see what would happen, killed off a little more than 3 thousand of their citizens, then applied the control.
> 
> There! How's that?
> 
> Also heard today that China may be starting to experience an infection rebound.


Incompetence seems more likely than a nefarious plot. Read the article linked. Evidence is circumstantial, but compelling that a Wuhan lab simply had bad protocol. I am not sure we will ever know since Chinese gov’t seems to have all information locked down tight.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opin...GM11lJbIEMQppdrf9mQYrxcv0fg2CeYIA4GnJ1Ik_PC8M


----------



## acklac7

acklac7 said:


> Not to be a dick, but 24 hours ago I was laughing right along with you.
> 
> A whole bunch of people are about to die.
> 
> A whole bunch of people are about to lose everything they have.
> 
> It’s time for the memes to end.


God, I hate it when I'm right.

Back from my little one-month vacation, stress got the best of me, doesn't happen very often...Last (and only) time I got banned was like a decade ago by misfit himself! He passed before I lived-out my 30 days  (never got the chance to get back on and forgive him for simply doing what he did best: being one amazing mod) I hope you're doing well up there buddy!

It has been horrid the last month without you all, I won't lie...


----------



## acklac7

Oh, and I never did officially come down with the 'rona, at least I don't think? My fever went away after a day or so.

I have had horrid (sinus) allergies ever since, though(?) (now that I think about it they cleared up about 4 or 5 days ago) I never, ever have allergy problems outside of mid-may??


----------



## Burkcarp1

https://www.businessinsider.com/americans-dont-need-masks-pence-says-as-demand-increases-2020-2


----------



## $diesel$

montagc said:


> Standard unemployment is for those between jobs. There are no new jobs popping up right now, and it will take time for unemployment rates to turn around. This isn't the usual situation where someone getting laid off can go find similar work easily. If this wasn't supposed to be so short term, I'd say bring back the WPA...our parks could use some new structures and whatnot...
> 
> Another thought I had with the extra cash is to give people money to spend not so much to bolster their unemployment income, but to continue to sustain other businesses through regular transactions. Basically propping up the economy indirectly by keeping the money flowing, rather than dumping cash where it might be saved rather than spent. As mentioned above, lower income families tend to spend all their money month to month, when given extra cash it tends to be spent as well. (I'm not knocking low income families, I was there once like many of us were. I still eat the week old leftovers so not to waste lol.) Hopefully, this extra money gets spent somewhere where it helps local economies, rather than going in a big corporate pocket.
> 
> Maybe this extra cash also keeps the people happy during a time where emotions are running high, and having a large number of angry broke people could be a disaster.
> 
> I don't know. Just spitballin.


montagc, you stole my thunder. I agree with you on your point.
Our top gov. officials are not as dumb as so many on this site seem to think they are. No politics intended, our president came from a business background and was a C.O. as well. He is smart enough to surround himself with very good people in they're respective fields. The things he knows nothing about are filled with professionals that do.
And yes, as montagc stated, i firmly believe the bonus money was distributed so as all folks would tend to spend rather than save. This, i believe to be a well thought out GOOD manoeuvre.
I'm not intending to insult anyones opinion, it's just my take on this.
Personnally, i am in a fairly good financial situation because i receive a pension and s.s. as long as they don't take any of that away.
And i will do my part for the economy when i get my check. I intend to replace a 20 year plus reclining chair thats been shot for 7 years.


----------



## crittergitter

This pandemic was no accident. I promise you that! That's all I'm going to say about that.


----------



## Hatchetman

Just remember.....China is you friend....


----------



## OptOutside440

crittergitter said:


> This pandemic was no accident. I promise you that! That's all I'm going to say about that.


It's interesting how this came From China just as a new trade deal had been made with them.


----------



## Snakecharmer

acklac7 said:


> God, I hate it when I'm right.
> 
> Back from my little one-month vacation, stress got the best of me, doesn't happen very often...Last (and only) time I got banned was like a decade ago by misfit himself! He passed before I lived-out my 30 days  (never got the chance to get back on and forgive him for simply doing what he did best: being one amazing mod) I hope you're doing well up there buddy!
> 
> It has been horrid the last month without you all, I won't lie...


Welcome back.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Burkcarp1 said:


> https://www.businessinsider.com/americans-dont-need-masks-pence-says-as-demand-increases-2020-2


Yep that's what the CDC told him. We know more a month later.


----------



## Burkcarp1

https://annals.org/aim/fullarticle/...sks-blocking-sars-cov-2-controlled-comparison. Here is a more recent one.


----------



## JamesF

Something I saw on the news . Cleveland first responders are told to treat a cardiac arrest at the scene, and after twenty minutes, Stop. And do not transport to the hospital. If this happens to you... well... your as good as dead!? Is this what our country is coming to?
WTF??


----------



## fastwater

JamesF please turn the volume up on your TV.


----------



## JamesF

Am I missing something? This is in Cleveland. The news showed the order,as, if someone has the Corona virus,and or suspected of having it. Have you heard different?


----------



## ShakeDown

OGF Members,

Times have changed, and it happened overnight. Everyone is on edge, angry, frustrated and quite possibly dealing with more idle time on our hands than ever before. We get it, and are dealing with the same.

However the site has gotten over the top with political posts lately, and to protect the integrity of the site this unfortunate message has to be announced. We've been more than lenient with what we've let slide, but we're now at a saturation point. We're not a political site, never will be and have maintained that goal quite respectfully for 16 years...that's not going to change under the current circumstances.

The amount of moderation due to the political posts is unprecedented, and quite frankly shouldn't be necessary. For most of us this is the only socialization we'll get for a while but rules are rules. If you need a refresher, here's our TOS https://www.ohiogamefishing.com/threads/ogfs-terms-of-service-tos-link.222375/

Moving forward, our tolerance for political posts has hit its max. We're not opposed to put repeat TOS violators in time-out until the dust settles, but don't want to. 

So please do us all a favor and respect the rules, your fellow members and everyone's struggle going through this. Keep the integrity of the site you joined and use on your radar. We'll get through it, just don't make it harder than it needs to be.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Thank you Shakedown and the MODS in this difficult time. I can understand your frustration.


----------



## hailtothethief

VIX closed back up over 40. SHTF soon again. And its snowing. People gonna get cabin fever this weekend and trash the site.


----------



## Hatchetman

Not for long they won't....


----------



## buckeyebowman

SConner said:


> Incompetence seems more likely than a nefarious plot. Read the article linked. Evidence is circumstantial, but compelling that a Wuhan lab simply had bad protocol. I am not sure we will ever know since Chinese gov’t seems to have all information locked down tight.
> 
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/opin...GM11lJbIEMQppdrf9mQYrxcv0fg2CeYIA4GnJ1Ik_PC8M


Very interesting article, and thanks for posting. I can believe what our people saw as incompetence and lack of preparedness. 

BTW, did you see the earlier post of a vid of one of the Wuhan "wet markets"? Absolutely disgusting! Those people will eat anything! Bats, rats, cats, dogs, you name it! Kak! Gug!


----------



## JamesF

I don't understand why they would. It's the fault of the site,and hopefully not the members. However long this lasts, we should show respect for everyone. Of course, there will always be bone heads. They will weed themselves out, eventually.


----------



## AmericanEagle

JamesF said:


> Something I saw on the news . Cleveland first responders are told to treat a cardiac arrest at the scene, and after twenty minutes, Stop. And do not transport to the hospital. If this happens to you... well... your as good as dead!? Is this what our country is coming to?
> WTF??


Here is a link to what you saw.

https://fox8.com/news/coronavirus/i...s-not-rushed-to-cleveland-er-due-to-covid-19/


----------



## EnonEye

I see there is a lot of talk of when to open the country back up. Here's my thing. I can easily spend another 2 weeks hunkered down since I am in that high risk group and you all go back to work but... are you willing to risk your childrens lives that you're correct? I mean they have to go back to school for the masses to go back to work correct? Just sayin


----------



## Specwar

I too can comfortably endure another two or three weeks. However, based on the daily 2:00 pm news conference I regrettably believe we are in for a much longer period of sheltering in place. Testing everyone in the state, and others also is a no win situation for us.
Eventually the state and country will have to be opened up and the chips will have to fall where they fall.


----------



## spikeg79

I see Menards in Toledo has roped some areas off, when I stopped to look an associate approached me and told me not to grab anything out of the roped off areas in the store. It's the only store in the area I've been too that has areas of merchandise roped off so I'm guessing it's just a Menards company thing.

I say let the stores open back up just make every employee wear a mask and limit the number of people allowed in like we are currently doing with the essential businesses. Let restaurants continue on with Carryout or Delivery orders till maybe end of May and revisit opening them up then.


----------



## Specwar

Suspected but only now coming to light.


----------



## 9Left

Specwar said:


> Suspected but only now coming to light.
> View attachment 352261


Did ya miss the big long post by the mods?


----------



## Specwar

Yes I did. I do not believe the information I posted is political.


----------



## hailtothethief

What is ogf definition of politics?


----------



## JamesF

TOS


----------



## acklac7

hailtothethief said:


> What is ogf definition of politics?


If you swing hardcore to either side, you'll surely find out, and find out but-quick (judging from today's announcement) - Even if you try and be coy.

I'm not going to speak for Brandon, but Historically: One post that swings hardcore to either side, even without mentioning a Politician's name? Acceptable at one point: Not acceptable any longer.

You all know who you are...


----------



## Shad Rap

9Left said:


> Did ya miss the big long post by the mods?


What was wrong with what he posted?


----------



## acklac7

Shad Rap said:


> What was wrong with what he posted?


Find me 5 other major news sites that are posting a similar story-line?

Like, everyone is reporting on the decline in Oil prices. That's legit news.

I do not consider a Fox-News article (Or a CNN news-article!) that hasn't been widely picked up by other major sources to be trustworthy, non-politically-motivated, News.

Again, you all know who you are. Just chill?


----------



## hailtothethief

Tos just said politics with exception with a vague reference to sportsmen rights discussion opening the door for wanna be game wardens to target posters.


----------



## acklac7

hailtothethief said:


> Tos just said politics with exception with a vague reference to sportsmen rights discussion opening the door for wannabe game wardens to target posters.


Hit-pieces from individual News organizations that haven't been picked up by anyone else, despite repeated mention (in various forms of media), from said News organization over the past month?

Politics. No question.


----------



## Shad Rap

acklac7 said:


> Find me 5 other major news sites that are posting a similar story-line?
> 
> Like, everyone is reporting on the decline in Oil prices. That's legit news.
> 
> I do not consider a Fox-News article (Or a CNN news-article!) that hasn't been widely picked up by other major sources to be trustworthy, non-politically-motivated, News.
> 
> Again, you all know who you are. Just chill?


Are you like a spokesperson for the site or something now??...key words in your response are 'I dont consider'...thats called an opinion...what he posted was news about the coronavirus...fact or not...are we really gonna go through and fact check stuff now???..you made it political...lol...well...now it became political!


----------



## acklac7

Shad Rap said:


> Are you like a spokesperson for the site or something now??...key words in your response are 'I dont consider'...thats an opinion...what he posted was news about the corona virus...fact or not...you made it political...lol...well...now it became political!


I've been a member of the site since the early days of GFO.

No, I take that back, I've been a member of the site since "Net" started his Yahoo Group in the late '90's


----------



## acklac7

At any rate, I'll leave it to Brandon or Mitch from here on out. I feel sorry for them, they have a lot on their plate right now...


----------



## JamesF

acklac7 said:


> At any rate, I'll leave it to Brandon or Mitch from here on out. I feel sorry for them, they have a lot on their plate right now...


So true.


----------



## yonderfishin

I do believe we are on the verge of large scale civil unrest. People are wound up tight and have limited ways to release that energy. The next few weeks could get really scary for some.


----------



## hailtothethief

acklac7 said:


> If you swing hardcore to either side, you'll surely find out, and find out but-quick (judging from today's announcement) - Even if you try and be coy.
> 
> I'm not going to speak for Brandon, but Historically: One post that swings hardcore to either side, even without mentioning a Politician's name? Acceptable at one point: Not acceptable any longer.
> 
> You all know who you are...


I dont vote, so i never got into the left or right. Cnn censors right wingers and fox prob vice versa. Just seems there’s potential for right wing mods to censor left wing posters and left wing mods to focus on censoring right wing posters. Jmo but id like to see a definition of politics if they start banning posters for politics. Only seems fair to avoid targeting. Obviously there’s always bias.


----------



## acklac7

yonderfishin said:


> I do believe we are on the verge of large scale civil unrest. People are wound up tight and have limited ways to release that energy. The next few weeks could get really scary for some.


I don't agree.

The first weeks of everything, like how we went from memes to mayhem in 7 days? That was utterly terrifying.

A good portion of the population received their stimulus checks today: The sense of relief, for lack of a better word, is overwhelming.

Couple that with the fact we're on the verge of gaining the upper hand on this thing? (Hopefully?)

We just all have to stick together.


----------



## acklac7

hailtothethief said:


> I dont vote, so i never got into the left or right. Cnn censors right wingers and fox prob vice versa. Just seems there’s potential for right wing mods to censor left wing posters and left wing mods to focus on censoring right wing posters. Jmo but id like to see a definition of politics if they start banning posters for politics. Only seems fair to avoid targeting. Obviously there’s always bias.


Except for the fact our "Founding Fathers" addressed that aspect from the beginning. From day-1, its always been a theme here: No Politics.

I fully trust our Mod team. Always have, always will. (That's coming from someone who is 24 hours out of a well-deserved 30-day ban...)


----------



## hailtothethief

Yes but lately there’s an elephant in the room. And people are discussing the elephant. And it snowballed. So no politics has not been consistently enforced. If it hasnt been enforced recently and consistently its not right to ban people today for discussing the elephant if u weren’t banning people yesterday. Jmo


----------



## acklac7

hailtothethief said:


> Yes but lately there’s an elephant in the room. And people are discussing the elephant. And it snowballed. So no politics has not been consistently enforced. If it hasnt been enforced recently and consistently its not right to ban people today for discussing the elephant if u weren’t banning people yesterday. Jmo


And Shakedown stepped in and layed the Law Down.

Brandon is the most respectable person on this site. (Not to mention the most Senior) Only second to Misfit. Ever. For all the right reasons.

There's not a lot of people I implicitly trust: He is one of them. (And no, I've never met him in person, he is not one of my "friends")


----------



## acklac7

_"Times have changed, and it happened overnight. Everyone is on edge, angry, frustrated and quite possibly dealing with more idle time on our hands than ever before. We get it, and are dealing with the same.

However the site has gotten over the top with political posts lately, and to protect the integrity of the site this unfortunate message has to be announced. We've been more than lenient with what we've let slide, but we're now at a saturation point. We're not a political site, never will be and have maintained that goal quite respectfully for 16 years...that's not going to change under the current circumstances.

The amount of moderation due to the political posts is unprecedented, and quite frankly shouldn't be necessary. For most of us this is the only socialization we'll get for a while but rules are rules. If you need a refresher, here's our TOS https://www.ohiogamefishing.com/threads/ogfs-terms-of-service-tos-link.222375/

Moving forward, our tolerance for political posts has hit its max. We're not opposed to put *repeat* TOS violators in time-out until the dust settles, but don't want to.

So please do us all a favor and respect the rules, your fellow members and everyone's struggle going through this. Keep the integrity of the site you joined and use on your radar. We'll get through it, just don't make it harder than it needs to be._"


----------



## 9Left

hailtothethief said:


> I dont vote


... and finally… The problem surfaces...


----------



## acklac7

9Left said:


> ... and finally… The problem surfaces...


Everybody out there: VOTE!

Just for the love of God, don't discuss who you voted for, or why you voted for them, or why you like them, or think they're right or blah blah blah, don't discuss it here, not now, please!

This site has always been safe. Safe from all that.

Personally, I need this place to escape, escape from all of that...


----------



## acklac7

Night.


----------



## bobk

hailtothethief said:


> What is ogf definition of politics?


Are you really that dense? Why do you have to continually push the envelope? Much of this thread has turned into nothing but chest beating. It’s actually pretty pathetic that some seem to think their opinion is the only one that matters and they have to continue to post it over and over again. Go outside and enjoy the day!! Safely of course.


----------



## bad luck

Safe spaces....


----------



## Hatchetman

acklac7 said:


> Hit-pieces from individual News organizations that haven't been picked up by anyone else, despite repeated mention (in various forms of media), from said News organization over the past month?
> 
> Politics. No question.


You just got back and now your a moderator? Don't think so....


----------



## acklac7

Hatchetman said:


> You just got back and now your a moderator? Don't think so....


I consider basically everybody who joined (started) this site in 2004 a Moderator (more-or-less). Yourself included.


----------



## $diesel$

Guys, we better chill, were kind of running the edge of the mods criteria, seriously.

On a brighter note, i'm very happy to see the critical numbers start to edge down and hope that continues on a rapid pace.
I've been so wrapped up in all this mess mentally, i haven't even got my boat ready yet. I know, shame on me, cuz this weekend isn't look'n real bad.
I need to fish immediately if not sooner.
Hope to see you guys out there soon.


----------



## dcool

Amazing that this thread started out about the Coronavirus, then turned political, now people beating up on each other. Whats next?


----------



## One guy and a boat

Hatchetman said:


> You just got back and now your a moderator? Don't think so....


It doesn't take a moderator to know the terms of service or to be civil in a conversation. Speaking of terms of service I'll get back on topic. I've been encouraged the last week with our medical people finding better ways to treat covid 19. Plasma transfusions, proning, less ventilator treatment etc. With a vaccine possibly one to two years off finding efficient ways to treat would do a lot to relieve the stress in both the healthcare system and individuals also.

Sent from my Pixel 3a XL using Tapatalk


----------



## PapawSmith

acklac7 said:


> Find me 5 other major news sites that are posting a similar story-line?
> 
> Like, everyone is reporting on the decline in Oil prices. That's legit news.
> 
> I do not consider a Fox-News article (Or a CNN news-article!) that hasn't been widely picked up by other major sources to be trustworthy, non-politically-motivated, News.
> 
> Again, you all know who you are. Just chill?


Not posting to disagree with you or your position, but this narrative is now being carried by most all credible news outlets. It is the consensus of the science and intelligence communities and has been adopted by the current Administration as the most probable source. I too wish to keep politics out but news is important, and all news does not necessarily pose a political slant simply due to the cited source.


----------



## crappiedude

$diesel$ said:


> I've been so wrapped up in all this mess mentally, i haven't even got my boat ready yet. I know, shame on me, cuz this weekend isn't look'n real bad.
> I need to fish immediately if not sooner.


Some of you guys need to separate from all this...during this time I fish maybe 5 times per week. I don't always fish for long periods but it's good to get out of the house and away from the TV. You can get all the news and updates you need in 15 minutes or less, everything else is a repeat.
Right now I'm fishing solo in my boat and I do miss having company but it beats sitting around the house watching TV.
Fish are biting, sun is shining, it's time to get outside and enjoy the day. You'll end the day with a better perspective after being outside for a while.
PS...my wife says that she hasn't noticed whether I fish any more than usual since I usually fish most days for a few hours anyway.


----------



## Saugeye Tom




----------



## BuckeyeFishinNut

Guess I am a glutton for punishment as I just read the 10 pages I missed since my last post Sunday morning. A buddy came down from Central Ohio yesterday to do some fishing. It was cold, windy, and water was high but caught a couple fish. Saw very few people out, they must all be fair weather fishermen...LOL. He was going stir-crazy from all this and most of the areas he likes to fish being unfishable due to high water. It was nice to talk fishing, whats going on with the family, and other goings on, besides this corona virus stuff. I think many of us need that.

A couple of things that I have been thinking about lately. Mainly being stuck inside has given me a lot of time to reflect on things.

1st, prior to teaching, I worked for a number of years in the science field ( I have a biology degree from OSU and an education degree from OU). I worked for a major biotech company in California, a few different chemical companies in Ohio, and even worked for a company growing algae for biofuel. I have done many models in my time. Models for scale up in production, models for increased oil production, models of how different chemicals could effect desired growth rates, etc. Many of my models were very accurate, some were not, but I was always held accountable for my models, my numbers, and my research. This is where we are at today in this process. The public wants accountability for these false models and these false numbers that were used to make many of the decisions we are living with today. Someone needs to answer for this false data and why it was so grossly miscalculated. We can speculate all we want, but they got their numbers from somewhere. We know the China numbers were a farce, but if thats what they used, we should have miscalculated on the lower side, not grossly over calculated. This is why so many have become skeptical of a lot of the data. Ohio isn't even using confirmed cases anymore, they are using presumed cases. So anyone who they "think" has it gets thrown in the case load. This is just bad science and a statistical nightmare.

2nd, something my wife and me were talking about last night, if media outlets and government officials weren't giving daily updates on this virus, would the average person even know what was going on? Unless you are plugged into the medical community and someone told you there was a nasty virus going around, would the average person know, would they care? If you got sick and got over it in a few days, would you just think you had the flu or a bad cold? Yes, this is a serious virus, and deadly for some, but so are a number of diseases and viruses. If not for the hysteria that has followed this virus, would you have thought or known any different? Just some food for thought.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

Saugeye Tom said:


> View attachment 352323


TAKE HEED BROTHERS WE ARE ALL IN THIS TOGETHER. all WILL BE FINE SOON ENOUGH


----------



## bridgeman

Saugeye Tom said:


> TAKE HEED BROTHERS WE ARE ALL IN THIS TOGETHER. all WILL BE FINE SOON ENOUGH



Please please let it be before May 9th, I'm selfish and wanna go to North Carolina and kill some yellowfin tuna. My freezer is painfully lacking tuna steaks


----------



## jrose

bridgeman said:


> Please please let it be before May 9th, I'm selfish and wanna go to North Carolina and kill some yellowfin tuna. My freezer is painfully lacking tuna steaks


I've got a trip planned for Michigan June 13th ( For a week) I would go in a heart beat if they "open" up Michigan to fishing again. But it looks bleak at this time.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Saugeye Tom said:


> TAKE HEED BROTHERS WE ARE ALL IN THIS TOGETHER. all WILL BE FINE SOON ENOUGH


What you wanted to say..


----------



## Misdirection

bridgeman said:


> Please please let it be before May 9th, I'm selfish and wanna go to North Carolina and kill some yellowfin tuna. My freezer is painfully lacking tuna steaks


New Yorks stay at home order was just extended thru May 15th. I hope for you, NC doesn't follow suit.

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


----------



## loves2fishinohio

I am glad to see in Dewine's presser that they are not extending the deadline and talking about implementing a plan to start opening the state back up instead. They didn't say anything specifically about what would be opening up May 1, simply that they are working on a plan, but they feel they need to start getting us back up economically. So that's encouraging.

I suspect they will start to reopen in the reverse steps that they used to shut businesses down, retail being among the first to reopen.


----------



## NCbassattack

Hope you folks are all healthy up there. All our Wildlife boat ramps are open currently. Fresh water that is. Not sure about the coast..


----------



## yonderfishin

And just like that , the winternet became the coronanet.


I got thinking last night , those of us who like television shows are probably gonna have a non existent season of our favorite shows. They arent filming and might not be for some time. Not that it is important mind you , its not , but that is part of the persistent effects of this virus. 

I am a lot more concerned about war being a result of this pandemic. The world has changed right before our eyes. Economic struggle and changing world views usually have drastic lingering consequences. Between China and its apparent culpability in this mess and the oil market , together with a worldwide economic trainwreck we may just see some things that will blow our minds in the months ahead.


----------



## BuckeyeFishin07

Misdirection said:


> New Yorks stay at home order was just extended thru May 15th. I hope for you, NC doesn't follow suit.
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


I am sure I have said this before, but they base the whole state of New York decisions on that cesspool they call NYC. Which is sad!


----------



## bad luck

NCbassattack said:


> Hope you folks are all healthy up there. All our Wildlife boat ramps are open currently. Fresh water that is. Not sure about the coast..


Nope, community by community has them closed....state ramps are opened, but southport/oak island parks/ramps closed....hit/miss on docks being closed, ones with "live aboards" are mostly open, but at some, if you had a boat in dry dock....it will stay dry.....


----------



## NCbassattack

Assume you are talking about our saltwater..


----------



## UNCLEMIKE

yonderfishin said:


> And just like that , the winternet became the coronanet.
> 
> 
> I got thinking last night , those of us who like television shows are probably gonna have a non existent season of our favorite shows. They arent filming and might not be for some time. Not that it is important mind you , its not , but that is part of the persistent effects of this virus.
> 
> I am a lot more concerned about war being a result of this pandemic. The world has changed right before our eyes. Economic struggle and changing world views usually have drastic lingering consequences. Between China and its apparent culpability in this mess and the oil market , together with a worldwide economic trainwreck we may just see some things that will blow our minds in the months ahead.


I also thought that all this has increased the risk of war all over the world. If china decided to stop sending PPE to us what would be our response?


----------



## Specwar

^^^ manufacture it here like we should have been doing.


----------



## ccc

dcool said:


> Amazing that this thread started out about the Coronavirus, then turned political, now people beating up on each other. Whats next?


 pistols at dawn!!!!


----------



## buckeyebowman

acklac7 said:


> Find me 5 other major news sites that are posting a similar story-line?
> 
> Like, everyone is reporting on the decline in Oil prices. That's legit news.
> 
> I do not consider a Fox-News article (Or a CNN news-article!) that hasn't been widely picked up by other major sources to be trustworthy, non-politically-motivated, News.
> 
> Again, you all know who you are. Just chill?





acklac7 said:


> Hit-pieces from individual News organizations that haven't been picked up by anyone else, despite repeated mention (in various forms of media), from said News organization over the past month?
> 
> Politics. No question.


Perhaps you missed SConners link to a Washington Post article that said the same thing! And the Post could hardly be considered conservative.


----------



## jrose

UNCLEMIKE said:


> I also thought that all this has increased the risk of war all over the world. If china decided to stop sending PPE to us what would be our response?


We made China. They are nothing without the us.


----------



## fishless

jrose said:


> We made China. They are nothing without the us.


Now that Dewine is going to start opening things up in stages...was it not as bad as they made it out to be ? Too much pressure to get the economy going again ? Is it as bad as they thought and its going to take off again.I get so many mixed signals I don't know what to beleive !


----------



## laguna21

I think you hit it on the head when you mentioned the pressure of getting the economy going again. He's held off on cancelling school for the rest of the year, but I don't see there's any chance of them going back til fall at the earliest, can't imagine kids in class wearing masks. And now what happens to the kids whose parents may be called back to work? Daycare doesn't seem like a safe option. So many things to consider


----------



## 9Left

laguna21 said:


> I think you hit it on the head when you mentioned the pressure of getting the economy going again. He's held off on cancelling school for the rest of the year, but I don't see there's any chance of them going back til fall at the earliest, can't imagine kids in class wearing masks. And now what happens to the kids whose parents may be called back to work? Daycare doesn't seem like a safe option. So many things to consider


Hint: when they say they're canceling school for the rest of the year… That means this June… The next "school year" will be starting in the fall


----------



## laguna21

Has that been announced and I didn't catch it? Wife is a teacher, usually keeps me caught up


----------



## Lundy

laguna21 said:


> Has that been announced and I didn't catch it? Wife is a teacher, usually keeps me caught up


I believe what 9left was pointing out is that when the Governor says "this year" he means this school year, which ends in June, not the calendar year of 2020.


----------



## laguna21

Lundy said:


> I believe what 9left was pointing out is that when the Governor says "this year" he means this school year, which ends in June, not the calendar year of 2020.


But did he cancel the rest of this "academic" year? If he did I missed it?


----------



## hailtothethief

fishless said:


> Now that Dewine is going to start opening things up in stages...was it not as bad as they made it out to be ? Too much pressure to get the economy going again ? Is it as bad as they thought and its going to take off again.I get so many mixed signals I don't know what to beleive !


As far as ashtabula goes people live pay check to pay check. People are sitting out in there cars. Unclear whether they are watching what time people leave there houses to set up robberies or whether their wife kicked em out. Poor people cant be out of work long before the looting starts.


----------



## CoonDawg92

He has not officially cancelled the remainder of the school year yet. Not sure why he is waiting.


----------



## hailtothethief

My friend went to mexico for a week for a death in the family and now is in quarantine for 14 days.


----------



## glacier_dropsy

Its a pandemic, that's how responsible people interact with other responsible people. Sucks.


----------



## EnonEye

hailtothethief said:


> As far as ashtabula goes people live pay check to pay check. People are sitting out in there cars. Unclear whether they are watching what time people leave there houses to set up robberies or whether their wife kicked em out. Poor people cant be out of work long before the looting starts.


yea and with gas as cheap as it is they can drive out and back a long ways from there, outlying areas, rural, etc, good neighbors help a little bit


----------



## acklac7

buckeyebowman said:


> Perhaps you missed SConners link to a Washington Post article that said the same thing! And the Post could hardly be considered conservative.


I just saw it mentioned on the nightly news. I recant my comment(s).

I’m sorry, but the thought of this virus originating from a State-sponsored bio-weapons program?

That is beyond scary.


----------



## Specwar

No harm no foul in my opinion. I’ve never posted anything here that I considered disrespectful or malicious.


----------



## buckeyebowman

fishless said:


> Now that Dewine is going to start opening things up in stages...was it not as bad as they made it out to be ? Too much pressure to get the economy going again ? Is it as bad as they thought and its going to take off again.I get so many mixed signals I don't know what to beleive !


I think we've done a pretty good job of flattening the curve. Here in Youngstown, they were planning on turning the Covelli Center, a concert and sports arena, into a temporary hospital to hand the overflow from our local hospitals. Saw in the paper yesterday that the work is at a standstill because it's not needed now. The National Guard is still in town in case it does become necessary, and the Mahoning Valley has been one of the harder hit areas in the state. 

And this is still just the planning stage, which is very necessary. Better that than have no plan at all, do something precipitous, and risk screwing it up. Even Pres. Trump said yesterday that this is going to be a slow, phased in, restart. 



Specwar said:


> No harm no foul in my opinion. I’ve never posted anything here that I considered disrespectful or malicious.


Same here. It's all good.


----------



## LEfriend

PapawSmith said:


> Not posting to disagree with you or your position, but this narrative is now being carried by most all credible news outlets. It is the consensus of the science and intelligence communities and has been adopted by the current Administration as the most probable source. I too wish to keep politics out but news is important, and all news does not necessarily pose a political slant simply due to the cited source.


It is not yet established science that the virus originated in the lab. Politically, some would like to make it that, but conversely some scientists have a different view. Even Sec of Defense has disputed some of the lab origin reporting. In time the truth will be known as to who is right and we will know for sure where it came from. For now here three interesting articles with various slants:

https://abcnews.go.com/Health/scien...avirus-originated-naturally/story?id=70207409

https://www.usnews.com/news/nationa...gineered-according-to-majority-of-assessments

https://www.theblaze.com/coronavirus-origin-date-location-cambridge-study


----------



## Lundy

They may or may not ever definitively identify the exact origin of the virus. I believe that would require cooperation from China that I doubt will be forthcoming.

A few facts that are undisputed. The virus originated in China. China lied about the severity of the virus. The WHO was incompetent or covered up the facts for China

Lab, wet market, to me it is all the same. Accountability clearly is on China and the WHO for the spread to 184 countries world wide


----------



## 1more

Well said!


----------



## BuckeyeFishin07

Lundy said:


> They may or may not ever definitively identify the exact origin of the virus. I believe that would require cooperation from China that I doubt will be forthcoming.
> 
> A few facts that are undisputed. The virus originated in China. China lied about the severity of the virus. The WHO was incompetent or covered up the facts for China
> 
> Lab, wet market, to me it is all the same. Accountability clearly is on China and the WHO for the spread to 184 countries world wide


Wish I could give this post more than one like!!!


----------



## acklac7

yonderfishin said:


> And just like that , the winternet became the coronanet.
> 
> 
> I got thinking last night , those of us who like television shows are probably gonna have a non existent season of our favorite shows. They arent filming and might not be for some time. Not that it is important mind you , its not , but that is part of the persistent effects of this virus.
> 
> I am a lot more concerned about war being a result of this pandemic. The world has changed right before our eyes. Economic struggle and changing world views usually have drastic lingering consequences. Between China and its apparent culpability in this mess and the oil market , together with a worldwide economic trainwreck we may just see some things that will blow our minds in the months ahead.


Oh, the Rabbit hole goes much deeper than that, my Friend.

Without the slightest bit of reprieve, _Cabin _Fever jumped straight into the (100x worse) _Corona_ Fever. Across the board.

I mean, to be hit with a 1-2 punch like that. (Save the conspiracy theories, guys, it's too creepy...)


----------



## Lundy

Yes, I believe the failings of the WHO are pretty obvious. Beyond many statements that seem suspect the one that stands out to me was the criticism they expressed in very explicit terms about the travel restrictions from China to the USA. They were proven blatantly wrong with their assertion that there was no need for the travel restriction which they attributed to an act of racism. So again, either incompetent or intentionally covering the true facts. Either way they fail at their intended service that we pay for. To think otherwise would be denying the facts as they exist.


----------



## Lundy

You are implying the example I cited on the travel ban and the expressed WHO position on it is not factual?


----------



## yonderfishin

Well the WHO sure does seem to be deflecting and covering for China. I dont know if thats cooperation or somebody just not paying attention but somebody sure doppped the ball. Covering for China when all evidence points straight to them is not just foolhardy its flat out criminal at this point. I remember seeing videos smuggled out of China back in Janurary or maybe even December ? ....where guys in respirators and bio suits were chasing people down and throwing them in metal boxes and taking them away kicking and screaming , I couldnt tell if it was real even let alone become a pandemic.... with all the threat of pandemics coming out of China over the years its hard to believe the WHO was not all over this from the start. Until proven otherwise , it sure looks like they chose to look the other way and pretend it wasnt happening.....for some reason. It dont make sense , which is why its so convincing that the WHO , through coersion or incompetence , played a big part in the charlie foxtrot.


----------



## LEfriend

montagc said:


> I disagree. You are an expressing an opinion, not facts. No one was saying this stuff about the WHO back when the statements were made back in January, but the narrative sure has changed lately. The statements on travel bans were made after we already had confirmed cases in this country and we weren’t doing any tracing to find the source of cases anyway. That is not the fault of the WHO.


Well stated. WHO is not perfect. China not been transparent. But if you want to see where the ball was dropped google and read the “Red Dawn email threads”. No denying those show where this was all known here early in January and the advice and red lights and sirens we’re ignored at our very top. Attacking WHO now is attempt to deflect their own blame by ignores


----------



## fish sandwich

I doubt we stopped funding to the WHO for no apparent reason


----------



## Lundy

LEfriend said:


> Well stated. WHO is not perfect. China not been transparent. But if you want to see where the ball was dropped google and read the “Red Dawn email threads”. No denying those show where this was all known here early in January and the advice and red lights and sirens we’re ignored at our very top. Attacking WHO now is attempt to deflect their own blame by ignores


So a failing of the USA caused this spread through 184 countries?


----------



## bad luck

It’s high time for UN & WHO to go out to pasture with League of Nations & try it again. Their both funded primarily by democratic nations (USA) and ran by the few remaining communist ones


just in the last 6 mos, the UN Human Rights Council, praised Iran. That’s like praising Stalin for how well his people could use a shovel. Or Castro for how well he taught reading...or Kim Jongun for the artistry of his culture based on the school kids required paintings of him.


----------



## bad luck

Lundy said:


> So a failing of the USA caused this spread through 184 countries?


Well stated. 
I need to learn from you how to “hit it” in so few words!


----------



## LEfriend

Lundy said:


> So a failing of the USA caused this spread through 184 countries?


No, Lundy, Respectively, I am not saying that at all. You make good points. But it was inevitable it would spread. What wasn't inevitable was that lack of preparation here would make it longer and worse and even today (lack of testing) delay our ability to reopen. I'm saying the attacks on the World Health are an attempt to deflect from those things. Think Bill Gates agrees with me.

It has been reported that.... "_15 officials from the US administration were embedded with the WHO in Geneva, working full time, hand-in-glove with the organization on the virus from the very first day China disclosed the outbreak to the world, Dec. 31... In the weeks that followed, they and other U.S. government scientists engaged in all major deliberations and decisions at the WHO on the novel coronavirus, had access to all information, and contributed significantly to the world body’s conclusions and recommendations. Everything that the WHO knew, the US knew — in real time."_


----------



## Specwar

The same Bill Gates that is heavily embedded in pharmaceuticals manufactured in China?


----------



## ovrecheck

yonderfishin said:


> Well the WHO sure does seem to be deflecting and covering for China. I dont know if thats cooperation or somebody just not paying attention but somebody sure doppped the ball. Covering for China when all evidence points straight to them is not just foolhardy its flat out criminal at this point. I remember seeing videos smuggled out of China back in Janurary or maybe even December ? ....where guys in respirators and bio suits were chasing people down and throwing them in metal boxes and taking them away kicking and screaming , I couldnt tell if it was real even let alone become a pandemic.... with all the threat of pandemics coming out of China over the years its hard to believe the WHO was not all over this from the start. Until proven otherwise , it sure looks like they chose to look the other way and pretend it wasnt happening.....for some reason. It dont make sense , which is why its so convincing that the WHO , through coersion or incompetence , played a big part in the charlie foxtrot.


I remember the early news clips you seen . I have been wondering why the media quit showing them. Clearly a cover up by someone.


----------



## Lundy

montagc said:


> Well said.
> 
> And.... there are two US citizens on the WHO leadership team. Food for thought.


Yep, you win, hahahahaha

Personal bias is terrible thing to waste


----------



## SConner

World population = 7.594 billion
US population = 328.2 million
US % of world pop = 4.32%

Source is cited below for COVID deaths.
World COVID deaths = 154,350
US COVID deaths = 32,823
US % of COVID deaths = 21.26%

I will let all the geniuses draw their own conclusions, but it certainly appears to me the US was grossly unprepared to handle a pandemic. We have been reactive, always several steps behind.

Ohio is 3.56% of US population and represents 1.27% of the US COVID deaths. While still a reactive response, Ohio reacted sooner and it appears to have had an impact.

It is my sincere hope we study what went wrong and implement a solid fact based plan for the next pandemic. Currently it would appear we could learn much from Taiwan..... they have not had to resort to massive shutdowns.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:2019–20_coronavirus_pandemic_data


----------



## LEfriend

Specwar said:


> The same Bill Gates that is heavily embedded in pharmaceuticals manufactured in China?


Might be. Not sure?

The Bill Gates I am talking about is the one that is giving millions and millions and millions of his own money to improve the health of impoverished people around the world. The Bill Gates I am talking about is working to save lives in developing countries, to partner to deliver proven tools—including vaccines, drugs, and diagnostics—as well as discover path breaking new solutions that saves peoples lives and wipes out diseases.

I think that is pretty admirable and makes each of us safer.

Is that the Bill Gates you are talking about?

Having shared my thoughts in this and other posts, I am chilling out and last I will post here for a while. Everyone stay safe! Fair winds and following seas to all.


----------



## bad luck

Opinion here....

the money bill gate$ made from Microsoft will be like morsels compared to what a vaccine will pay him. 

if he likes the WHO so much, then why doesn’t he close up his new shop and just fund it himself? It would literally be like me digging coins out of the couch ...


----------



## Specwar

Same Bill Gates.


----------



## roundbadge

The Denominator will become much clearer. Based on Iceland, then the Santa Clara serology testing, and even the Cincy 500 test..............multiply published infections by an average of 75x

Ohio as of yesterday had 9000 positives, mostly based on symptoms/guideline tests............9000x75 or, 675,000 Ohioans had or has the virus, and these 666,000 are either asymptomatic or mild cases, or the sickness you had months ago maybe..... not qualifying test-worthy under the guidelines or no test existed back when you felt ill

Iceland random testing revealed roughly a 4% infection rate

12mm Ohioans x .04 is around 500,000 plus/minus assumed infected, adjusted for proximity/population versus Iceland to maybe the 675k mentioned above

These are examples of why 100% testing, both for the virus and antibody is REQUIRED

Stay Home...............the stealth spreaders outnumber the symptomatic about 75-1..............based on the recent serology tests


----------



## Specwar

100% testing is a pipe dream and is impossible.
They say we are at war with this virus?
In any war I’ve been involved in, you get absolutely NOWHERE if you allow the enemy to keep you stationary and pinned down. 
You have to counter, and in this case it’s by slowly reopening and recovering economically, and emotionally. Hiding under your bed gains you zilch...,


----------



## roundbadge

An interesting study was done with SARS and "Viral Dosage"

It states the amount/exposure to a virus matters in terms of severity..............other than the elderly, who aren't soldiers in your war, nor the sick or immuno-compromised, who make up a large portion of the bad cases, the next hit the hardest are the doctors and nurses, who are getting bombarded daily with viral dosage............FWIW


----------



## Specwar

Studies are done on paper or a computer with “what if’s and estimated figures”.
Certainly you can’t expect this country to stay locked down until everyone is tested.
I respect everyone in the medical professions tenacity, however most had to know when they entered that field they could encounter such issues.


----------



## CoonDawg92

roundbadge said:


> The Denominator will become much clearer. Based on Iceland, then the Santa Clara serology testing, and even the Cincy 500 test..............multiply published infections by an average of 75x


9Left and I were discussing this earlier in the thread, what is the real multiplier. And I have been coming to the same conclusion over the last few days, around 85x. Same order of magnitude.

If my math is right, drops the published fatality rate of 4% down to around 0.05%.


----------



## CoonDawg92

SConner said:


> World population = 7.594 billion
> US population = 328.2 million
> US % of world pop = 4.32%
> 
> Source is cited below for COVID deaths.
> World COVID deaths = 154,350
> US COVID deaths = 32,823
> US % of COVID deaths = 21.26%


I agree we were not as prepared as we could have been given the vast wealth and resources of our country compared to others.

However I take these numbers with a grain of salt. There are many other factors that could affect spread of the virus in the US. The one that comes to mind is we have extreme freedoms of travel and the resources to do it, international travel and travel within our borders. This would support the spread more than countries with severe travel restrictions due to government oppression or lack of resources (millions living in squalor).


----------



## SConner

CoonDawg92 said:


> I agree we were not as prepared as we could have been given the vast wealth and resources of our country compared to others.
> 
> However I take these numbers with a grain of salt. There are many other factors that could affect spread of the virus in the US. The one that comes to mind is we have extreme freedoms of travel and the resources to do it, international travel and travel within our borders. This would support the spread more than countries with severe travel restrictions due to government oppression or lack of resources (millions living in squalor).


Read the entire post and go read up on Taiwan, they have contained this almost entirely without shutting down by mobilizing the testing, quickly identifying and isolating small groups of people for a couple weeks. They have the model to combat this without shutting down the economy. We either learn from it and adapt or continue to do poorly on deaths and still trash our economy. Right now we are losing on both metrics.


----------



## loves2fishinohio

Lundy said:


> Lab, wet market, to me it is all the same. Accountability clearly is on China and the WHO for the spread to 184 countries world wide


Good post. I've been saying for weeks now we should send China our bill. I can't imagine what this will wind up costing us as a country, not that we would have any real way of putting an actual dollar figure on it.


----------



## Misdirection

I also think this event shows that we need to move manufacturing back to the good old USA, or at least North America. We need to have the capacity to build ventilators, masks, and whatever else we need right here at home.

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


----------



## SConner

Misdirection said:


> I also think this event shows that we need to move manufacturing back to the good old USA, or at least North America. We need to have the capacity to build ventilators, masks, and whatever else we need right here at home.
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


Agreed, this would have to be part of a proactive plan to deal with future pandemics. The ability to quickly shift domestic production to needed , masks, testing, etc would insure a strong supply chain.


----------



## CoonDawg92

Definitely lessons we should learn from other countries that have been more successful and definitely gaps to fix on our response. 

Just be aware that, particularly in Taiwan, some of the measures taken including digital tracking and government control of movement would be (and to some extent already are) railed against as an attack on our freedoms over here.


----------



## bad luck

So now stories are coming out 1 after another (Iceland, Ca, MA...) that rate of people who have it or have had it and were asymptomatic appears to be many times higher than originally thought.

Which will put the death rate of this down in the flu range.....


----------



## poeq

"random testing" The virus spreads exponentially which makes particular spaces dangerous and others basically safe. I don't see how you can do random testing across a population when we do know the certain cities that make up the population have a much higher growth rate than others. It's not random if the people doing the testing have information that directly impacts the outcome.

It seems really irresponsible at this point in the pandemic to be announcing this is like the same as the flu or the death rates are much lower than we initially thought. Maybe you're right - and that would be great - but we're still in a the early stages of understanding this virus and we don't really know the exact literal number of people infected and people who have died.

It's also worth noting there's information that directly contradicts what you're saying and suggests the death rate is actually higher than we assume

"Last week, two researchers from northern Italy made this point forcefully when looking at Nembro, a small town near Bergamo that has been very severely hit by the outbreak. Writing in Italian newspaper Corriere della Sera they found there had been 158 deaths in the town in 2020 so far, as opposed to 35 on average in the previous five years. They noted that Nembro had only counted 31 deaths from Covid-19, which looks like an underestimate."
I can't post the link but I got this from a bloomberg article. You can probably just google the text I'm quoting if you want context.

I'm not saying the mortality rate is definitely higher than we're estimating but I am saying there are a lot of factors that we may not immediately realize that go into establishing the death rate and number of infected accurately. WE should continue being cautious in how we respond to the virus for now.


----------



## SConner

CoonDawg92 said:


> Definitely lessons we should learn from other countries that have been more successful and definitely gaps to fix on our response.
> 
> Just be aware that, particularly in Taiwan, some of the measures taken including digital tracking and government control of movement would be (and to some extent already are) railed against as an attack on our freedoms over here.


Maybe we as a nation need to have a more rational response to temporary restriction during a time of emergency. In history class studying WWII, I do not remember reading the citizens back home whined like little babies b/c they had to make sacrifices for the greater good. I have to say I am disappointed with how people have reacted to this. Some people don’t seem to be capable of thinking of anyone but themselves. The term United States should mean something during these times, it used to.

btw this is not directed at you, I am just frustrated that we seem incapable as a nation to put aside petty differences during a crisis and work toward a common goal.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

LEfriend said:


> No, Lundy, Respectively, I am not saying that at all. You make good points. But it was inevitable it would spread. What wasn't inevitable was that lack of preparation here would make it longer and worse and even today (lack of testing) delay our ability to reopen. I'm saying the attacks on the World Health are an attempt to deflect from those things. Think Bill Gates agrees with me.
> 
> It has been reported that.... "_15 officials from the US administration were embedded with the WHO in Geneva, working full time, hand-in-glove with the organization on the virus from the very first day China disclosed the outbreak to the world, Dec. 31... In the weeks that followed, they and other U.S. government scientists engaged in all major deliberations and decisions at the WHO on the novel coronavirus, had access to all information, and contributed significantly to the world body’s conclusions and recommendations. Everything that the WHO knew, the US knew — in real time."_


Of course he does. Funny how he says nothing about his involvement. He is WHO. He has a lot of controlling influence in the organization. He has given billions to WHO under his foundation and another that he runs. The Gates Foundation, consisting of Bill, his wife, and Warren Buffet of all people, is the biggest funder of WHO since the USA just pulled out. I wouldn’t put any trust or faith into Bill Gates.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.vox.com/platform/amp/2015/6/10/8760199/gates-foundation-criticism

https://msfaccess.org/gavi-should-stop-awarding-special-funds-pfizer-and-gsk-pneumonia-vaccine


----------



## $diesel$

Ya know, this thread is becoming laughable, absolutely inane.

>>> Just ignore the thread and move on...


----------



## Specwar

One time not so long ago in another regime China was the cats ass. We owe them $$$$$$$$ because of that time. 
It’s now time to tell them to Phque off and not give them a dime.


----------



## roundbadge

When you combine test results from Iceland, Santa Clara, and little Cincy, Ohio, it proves there are vast unaccounted for "former positives" that recovered and are now negative with trace antibodies.

Would not be a surprise if US citizens started becoming infected before 2020, so instead of calculating rates in detail, the number 4% from Serology is an average finding.

Just applying that factor to the reported US "for cause" positive infections, or the 80x factor, then well over 6MM US citizens already had the virus and recovered...............

BASED ON SEROLOGY


----------



## EnonEye

poeq said:


> "random testing" The virus spreads exponentially which makes particular spaces dangerous and others basically safe. I don't see how you can do random testing across a population when we do know the certain cities that make up the population have a much higher growth rate than others. It's not random if the people doing the testing have information that directly impacts the outcome.
> 
> It seems really irresponsible at this point in the pandemic to be announcing this is like the same as the flu or the death rates are much lower than we initially thought. Maybe you're right - and that would be great - but we're still in a the early stages of understanding this virus and we don't really know the exact literal number of people infected and people who have died.
> 
> It's also worth noting there's information that directly contradicts what you're saying and suggests the death rate is actually higher than we assume
> 
> "Last week, two researchers from northern Italy made this point forcefully when looking at Nembro, a small town near Bergamo that has been very severely hit by the outbreak. Writing in Italian newspaper Corriere della Sera they found there had been 158 deaths in the town in 2020 so far, as opposed to 35 on average in the previous five years. They noted that Nembro had only counted 31 deaths from Covid-19, which looks like an underestimate."
> I can't post the link but I got this from a bloomberg article. You can probably just google the text I'm quoting if you want context.
> 
> I'm not saying the mortality rate is definitely higher than we're estimating but I am saying there are a lot of factors that we may not immediately realize that go into establishing the death rate and number of infected accurately. WE should continue being cautious in how we respond to the virus for now.


I can't overstate how concerned I am with sending our children back to school too soon


----------



## Shad Rap

EnonEye said:


> I can't overstate how concerned I am with sending our children back to school too soon


Not gonna go back til the fall more than likely...that's plenty of time...and not too soon...schools can't even open up til mid May...by that time, only two weeks left...what's the point?


----------



## Shad Rap

roundbadge said:


> When you combine test results from Iceland, Santa Clara, and little Cincy, Ohio, it proves there are vast unaccounted for "former positives" that recovered and are now negative with trace antibodies.
> 
> Would not be a surprise if US citizens started becoming infected before 2020, so instead of calculating rates in detail, the number 4% from Serology is an average finding.
> 
> Just applying that factor to the reported US "for cause" positive infections, or the 80x factor, then well over 6MM US citizens already had the virus and recovered...............
> 
> BASED ON SEROLOGY


Death rate turns out to be like .001 percent or something like that...they are saying the infected rate could be as much as 85 times higher in some areas than whats reported...they are finding this out with antibody testing...


----------



## ovrecheck

Shad Rap said:


> Death rate turns out to be like .001 percent or something like that...they are saying the infected rate could be as much as 85 times higher in some areas than whats reported...they are finding this out with antibody testing...


I wish there was somewhere to get a test.It will be nice to know if you were already infected


----------



## crappiedude

$diesel$ said:


> Ya know, this thread is becoming laughable, absolutely inane.
> Whos pointing fingers at US responce and preparedness, whos pointing at the WHO?
> Your all wrong, in my opinion. We should be pointing fingers at the TRUE VILLAIN,..... China.
> The WHO, the US responce time, Italy, and all the rest should be putting the blame where it belongs, on the Chinese military industial complex.
> What the h*ll were they doing p*ssing around in a biotech lab weaponizing the common cold.
> This is where all the blame goes.
> These boys have been bad actors for as long as i can remember.
> The arguing and finger pointing needs to stop, by us and the media.
> We need to grow a pair and start kicking the sh*t out of these trouble makers, and the first thing that needs to go are their lying top dogs.
> All these horrific deaths don't happen if we take these clowns out. How many more threats do we have to hear from them, how many more pandemics must we go thru, how many more Americans have to die til we get smart and erase these prehistoric thinking morons?


Wow you need to step back away from all this...take a day and go out fishing or something.


----------



## AmericanEagle

roundbadge said:


> The Denominator will become much clearer. Based on Iceland, then the Santa Clara serology testing, and even the Cincy 500 test..............multiply published infections by an average of 75x
> 
> Ohio as of yesterday had 9000 positives, mostly based on symptoms/guideline tests............9000x75 or, 675,000 Ohioans had or has the virus, and these 666,000 are either asymptomatic or mild cases, or the sickness you had months ago maybe..... not qualifying test-worthy under the guidelines or no test existed back when you felt ill
> 
> Iceland random testing revealed roughly a 4% infection rate
> 
> 12mm Ohioans x .04 is around 500,000 plus/minus assumed infected, adjusted for proximity/population versus Iceland to maybe the 675k mentioned above
> 
> These are examples of why 100% testing, both for the virus and antibody is REQUIRED
> 
> Stay Home...............the stealth spreaders outnumber the symptomatic about 75-1..............based on the recent serology tests


I applied your math to New York state and it does not make sense to me.

The world meter web site shows 241,041 cases. I multiplied 241,041 X 75 = 18,078,075. Wikipedia lists the population of New York state as 19,453,561. I do not believe 93% of the people in the state of New York have been infected.

If I misunderstood how you calculated total infections please point out my error.


----------



## 9Left

ovrecheck said:


> I wish there was somewhere to get a test.It will be nice to know if you were already infected


My thoughts on testing… I think it should be attacked from two different angles… I think testing for a positive or negative infection of antiGENS is appropriate… So you can be isolated… But we also have the means to test for the antiBODIES... A positive test for antibodies basically means you've been exposed, recovered, your immune system has developed the memory and you now have the ability to fight it off… I think testing for the antibodies would be a good measure to find out the percentage of heard immunity, And where we really are as a nation in the recovery process.

And as far as blaming what caused the spread of this… I think the root cause and enemy is the length of the incubation period...


----------



## garhtr

9Left said:


> A positive test for antibodies basically means you've been exposed, recovered, your immune system has developed the memory and you now have the ability to fight it off


 Is there any estimate of the number of people in Ohio that have had Corona ? 
I believe once antibody test becomes prevalent we will find out a far greater % of people have had it and recovered. In early March (first week) I think I had this virus along with several others I know. I had a headache for days (very rare for me) body aches mostly my legs, stuffed nose and a mild cough but no mucus or flem, I also suspected I had a fever but at that time I had no reason to check my temp, hopefully I had it already along with the majority of individuals in our area.
I guess only time will tell and we'll see.
Good luck


----------



## Burkcarp1

LEfriend said:


> Might be. Not sure?
> 
> The Bill Gates I am talking about is the one that is giving millions and millions and millions of his own money to improve the health of impoverished people around the world. The Bill Gates I am talking about is working to save lives in developing countries, to partner to deliver proven tools—including vaccines, drugs, and diagnostics—as well as discover path breaking new solutions that saves peoples lives and wipes out diseases.
> 
> I think that is pretty admirable and makes each of us safer.
> 
> Is that the Bill Gates you are talking about?
> You must be talking about the one that has to stand trial in India for poisoning millions of children??? Paralyzing children? The guys an idiot! Isn’t a doctor or anything? Yeah, we’re talking about the same guy.
> 
> [/


----------



## roundbadge

AmericanEagle said:


> I applied your math to New York state and it does not make sense to me.


not my math, ask the experts, but the State of NY is repping 1/3 of the total US positives

so, 19mm of 348mm have 1/3 of the cases............that is crazy
so, 5 and 1/2 percent of the US Pop have 33% of the cases


----------



## roundbadge

garhtr said:


> Is there any estimate of the number of people in Ohio that have had Corona ?
> 
> I guess only time will tell and we'll see.
> Good luck


using 75x Serology, maybe 750,000


----------



## AmericanEagle

roundbadge said:


> not my math, ask the experts, but the State of NY is repping 1/3 of the total US positives
> 
> so, 19mm of 348mm have 1/3 of the cases............that is crazy


Well I hope the experts look at New York state because in a few days if if you multiply their cases by 75 there will be more people infected than there are in the state.

Good luck and stay safe.


----------



## roundbadge

AmericanEagle said:


> Well I hope the experts look at New York state because in a few days if if you multiply their cases by 75 there will be more people infected than there are in the state.
> 
> Good luck and stay safe.


positive 240k over 600k tests for a positive rate of 40% for NY

that is crazy

Ohio rate is around 10%


----------



## 9Left

roundbadge said:


> positive 240k over 600k tests for a positive rate of 40% for NY
> 
> that is crazy
> 
> Ohio rate is around 10%


The percentage is completely based on the amount of testing done though…


----------



## yonderfishin

Everyone is talking about and comparing death rates and that is understandable , but there is something going on that apparently nobody on the planet really understands. A certain percentage of young and otherwise healthy people end up dying. The best theory on it so far is that genetic differences are the reason. If that is the case then atleast two , if not more death rates should be considered....general public as a whole , and then the group of outliers who have a genetic disposition for extreme sickness and/or fatality even though they may be young and healthy. The latter group is the one we all should be concerned with the most because we may fall into that category....but as of yet there is no way to know who those individuals may be or how many they may be. Even if the death rate for the population as a whole were like .02% , that would theoretically mean nothing to you if you had the genetic disposition toward fatality. Any one of us could be part of that unfortunate reality so we shouldnt get caught up in any sense of comfort by the general publics fatality rate. If there is a genetic component , for most healthy people being infected could mean a .02 or less chance of fatality while others could be 50% or higher and no amount of testing will straighten that mess out short of identifying a genetic disposition and testing for that. 

But it seems like the more we know the less we know lately. Im about at the point where I just want to say screw it , open everything up and let God sort us out but then I think about friends and family and that brings me back to concern.


----------



## buckeyebowman

LEfriend said:


> It is not yet established science that the virus originated in the lab. Politically, some would like to make it that, but conversely some scientists have a different view. Even Sec of Defense has disputed some of the lab origin reporting. In time the truth will be known as to who is right and we will know for sure where it came from. For now here three interesting articles with various slants:
> 
> https://abcnews.go.com/Health/scien...avirus-originated-naturally/story?id=70207409
> 
> https://www.usnews.com/news/nationa...gineered-according-to-majority-of-assessments
> 
> https://www.theblaze.com/coronavirus-origin-date-location-cambridge-study


The Washington Post story that was linked to on this thread, basically said that the lab in China was studying coronavirus in bats that can be transmitted to humans. Not surprising since the Chinese seem to have a taste for bat! Good grief! U.S. inspectors were at the lab and were horrified at the lack of medical and overall security! It is thought that the bug got loose from there.



CoonDawg92 said:


> I agree we were not as prepared as we could have been given the vast wealth and resources of our country compared to others.
> 
> However I take these numbers with a grain of salt. There are many other factors that could affect spread of the virus in the US. The one that comes to mind is we have extreme freedoms of travel and the resources to do it, international travel and travel within our borders. This would support the spread more than countries with severe travel restrictions due to government oppression or lack of resources (millions living in squalor).


I figure if you want the believe the "world COVID-19 deaths" number, then you have to believe the numbers reported by China, and I certainly do not! And this isn't the first time they've kind of "screwed over"' the world with disinformation. They never want to accept blame for anything. Their arrogance is astounding! 



9Left said:


> My thoughts on testing… I think it should be attacked from two different angles… I think testing for a positive or negative infection of antiGENS is appropriate… So you can be isolated… But we also have the means to test for the antiBODIES... A positive test for antibodies basically means you've been exposed, recovered, your immune system has developed the memory and you now have the ability to fight it off… I think testing for the antibodies would be a good measure to find out the percentage of heard immunity, And where we really are as a nation in the recovery process.
> 
> And as far as blaming what caused the spread of this… I think the root cause and enemy is the length of the incubation period...


I have to agree. I once heard, or read, that if you start coming down with a cold or the flu to remember where you were 72 hours prior to the onset of symptoms, because that was the incubation period for those viruses, and that would tell you where you caught it. 

They've started doing random, in car testing locally, but you have to tell them you have some symptoms. I could go lie, but I won't do that because I might deny the test to someone who really needs it. I am completely asymptomatic. 

Yes, we need much more testing because I would like to know my status. And, if it was determined that I had developed antibodies, I would consider donating blood for transfusion therapy.


----------



## crappiedude

garhtr said:


> I believe once antibody test becomes prevalent we will find out a far greater % of people have had it and recovered


My friend, my wife and myself have all had dry hacking coughs.
My friend had it at the end of January. I hadn't seen him in a while and called to make sure he was doing okay and that's when he told me about it, he said he coughed so much he hurt.
My wife came up with a dry cough in February, couldn't shake it. I was concerned because it went on all day and night. I knew she had to exhausted.
I came up with it to no surprised after se had it. Mine was bad enough I wouldn't go to the Y because I didn't want to give it to anyone there.
All of us had this before "the breakout." I had a few other symptoms and in general felt like crap.
We all wish we could be tested, did we have it...did we not have it? We wish we knew.


----------



## MagicMarker

Shad Rap said:


> Not gonna go back til the fall more than likely...that's plenty of time...and not too soon...schools can't even open up til mid May...by that time, only two weeks left...what's the point?


They ought to open up then stay open through summer to make up list time


----------



## hailtothethief

WHO was talking about removing sick people from homes including children. There’s no intention of returning to school. There’s thought going into further social distancing at the family level.

https://www.tweaktown.com/news/7170...er-homes-and-remove-family-members/index.html


----------



## garhtr

hailtothethief said:


> WHO was talking about removing sick people from homes


 Guess what --- No one in America cares what The WHO says.
Good luck and good fishing !


----------



## hailtothethief

I read china censored tracing the origins of the coronavirus. In order to publish research on tracing the origins of the corona virus you must have government approval. Lmao


----------



## slipsinker

hailtothethief said:


> WHO was talking about removing sick people from homes including children. There’s no intention of returning to school. There’s thought going into further social distancing at the family level.
> 
> https://www.tweaktown.com/news/7170...er-homes-and-remove-family-members/index.html


fake news


----------



## slipsinker

hailtothethief said:


> I read china censored tracing the origins of the coronavirus. In order to publish research on tracing the origins of the corona virus you must have government approval. Lmao


keep on believing that social media hype!


----------



## Shad Rap

MagicMarker said:


> They ought to open up then stay open through summer to make up list time


Teachers will never go for it...


----------



## Wow

Back to earth! .........................................
Back to Ohio!........................................................
Back to your family!.........................................................

This thing is peaking here *right now*! At least this phase of it.
We did the right thing here in Ohio.
The peak could last a couple of weeks.

From what I see,the economy is running at 30 -40 % , everything is available to me.
Groceries, beer, home improvement,gas, and a whole online shopping mall.

Wanna' open anything up? .....Here's the conditions:

Test all of the people, you send back to work. 
Everybody wears a mask
Any symptoms?........... Two weeks quarantine and follow up test.
All distancing measures stand as they are.

The opening of enterprises will correspond with an equal bump of infections and death, 
in the 3-5 weeks following. 

Yes, things will look better this summer, but get much worse in the fall.

Throughout this time, people will be dying. ............In an unprecedented way.

Demand safety for all citizens.

Take care of your families.--Tim


----------



## ovrecheck

crappiedude said:


> My friend, my wife and myself have all had dry hacking coughs.
> My friend had it at the end of January. I hadn't seen him in a while and called to make sure he was doing okay and that's when he told me about it, he said he coughed so much he hurt.
> My wife came up with a dry cough in February, couldn't shake it. I was concerned because it went on all day and night. I knew she had to exhausted.
> I came up with it to no surprised after se had it. Mine was bad enough I wouldn't go to the Y because I didn't want to give it to anyone there.
> All of us had this before "the breakout." I had a few other symptoms and in general felt like crap.
> We all wish we could be tested, did we have it...did we not have it? We wish we knew.


sane here just want to know


----------



## Hatchetman

Wow said:


> Back to earth! .........................................
> Back to Ohio!........................................................
> Back to your family!.........................................................
> 
> This thing is peaking here *right now*! At least this phase of it.
> We did the right thing here in Ohio.
> The peak could last a couple of weeks.
> 
> From what I see,the economy is running at 30 -40 % , everything is available to me.
> Groceries, beer, home improvement,gas, and a whole online shopping mall.
> 
> Wanna' open anything up? .....Here's the conditions:
> 
> Test all of the people, you send back to work.
> Everybody wears a mask
> Any symptoms?........... Two weeks quarantine and follow up test.
> All distancing measures stand as they are.
> 
> The opening of enterprises will correspond with an equal bump of infections and death,
> in the 3-5 weeks following.
> 
> Yes, things will look better this summer, but get much worse in the fall.
> 
> Throughout this time, people will be dying. ............In an unprecedented way.
> 
> Demand safety for all citizens.
> 
> Take care of your families.--Tim



Now that's what I call a real feel good post....


----------



## ICENUT

Without the tests nothing is going to change.Its going to take many weeks and maybe months to have enough testing on hand to test millions of americans.And perhaps a year or 2 for a vaccine that will work before things can remotely get back to whatever normal was.You need the test kits along with enough reagents and controls and healthy people to administer and run the test along with the necessary lab equipment to do it rapidly not one test every 15 minutes or 4 an hour,My God it will take 20 years to test enough folks at that rate.
IMHO social distancing and cooping us all up for who knows how long is just moving the curve to a later date,when people start moving about by being isolated nobody is getting immune and this virus will pop up again with avengence down the road.


----------



## Specwar

Get over it!!


----------



## ICENUT

I have ive come to the conclusions that most including myself don't have a clue but I know what ive said above is true,and if you believe that by end of april all will be well and everyone will be tested your dreaming. Mitigation has slowed and worked to this point BUT it just prolonging the crisis to a later date. Its going to be a long while.


----------



## multi species angler

ICENUT said:


> IMHO social distancing and cooping us all up for who knows how long is just moving the curve to a later date,when people start moving about by being isolated nobody is getting immune and this virus will pop up again with avengence down the road.


 Yea, let's just open the country back up so the people can die sooner than later


----------



## Specwar

Total testing is improbable if not an Impossible condition of reopening the economy. 
I’ll take my chances while continuing to know who, what, and where I can touch and feel. 
Cowering under the couch is not within my makeup.
Let’s open it up, cautiously and carefully.


----------



## ICENUT

didn't say that but in your opinion how long are you going to stay isolated and out of work,and whats going to be left if you go back to work.I just stated its going to be awhile a lot longer than most people believe Nothing said above isn't true Heck im 70 with issues I don't want to die either I want to see my grandkids terribly But how long can we continue like this.Ive never said totally reopen but many thing can if you can go to Walmart and stand in line you can do most other things also,if you can get booze and play lotteries,buy weed you can other thins safely use the masks keep distance but ease some of the stupid restrictions.


----------



## Specwar

69 here and led a very active and fulfilling life myself. Survived things some will never experience, and hope most never do. 
I follow protocol as necessary and will continue to do so. Not ready to die, but certainly not ready to yet.
With that being said, nothing to be gained by cowering from it.


----------



## Specwar

Meant to say not afraid to die.


----------



## cheezemm2

Sunday update: 

TP has had 4 delivery exceptions on the FedEx truck, pretty sure it's not coming, went to Kroger and got TP everyone physically distancing and masked.

Had a Home Depot pickup scheduled: 3 employees standing around talking to one another (ages between 25-65) well w/in 6 feet, roughly about 50% of people masked going in and out of the store.

For everyone who has compared this thing to driving, I'm beginning to feel that it's not so much the responsible ones we're going to have to worry about...I'm more worried about the guy/girl barreling down the shoulder in a mini-van with 3 kids in the car trying to make it home in time to catch the Bachelor/Bachelorette.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Ohio has had 10% more confirmed new cases for the last 2 days...1,115 Sat and 1,380 today...11,602 since this started...We're not out of the woods yet.


----------



## Burkcarp1

Hospitalizations are going down..


----------



## Snakecharmer

Burkcarp1 said:


> Hospitalizations are going down..


In Ohio or the USA?


----------



## Burkcarp1

Ohio


----------



## Shad Rap

Snakecharmer said:


> In Ohio or the USA?


I would imagine the USA also...


----------



## Shad Rap

Snakecharmer said:


> Ohio has had 10% more confirmed new cases for the last 2 days...1,115 Sat and 1,380 today...11,602 since this started...We're not out of the woods yet.


I'm wondering if thats just how the numbers come in...delayed...and then bunched together...I don't know...for awhile there it looked like 50 people were dying a day when in fact they weren't...


----------



## fshnmaster

Marion prison is mostly responsible for all the new cases the past 2 days. It now has the most cases in a single county. Not a good situation at al . I hope and pray that this mess is gone in a month or two but I'm not sure it will be.


----------



## Snakecharmer

fshnmaster said:


> Marion prison is mostly responsible for all the new cases the past 2 days. It now has the most cases in a single county. Not a good situation at al . I hope and pray that this mess is gone in a month or two but I'm not sure it will be.


Glad I don't live in Marion any longer. Has to be scary for the residents.


----------



## 9Left

Snakecharmer said:


> Ohio has had 10% more confirmed new cases for the last 2 days...1,115 Sat and 1,380 today...11,602 since this started...We're not out of the woods yet.


Like I said already… That's completely based on the availability of testing… The more people tested… The more cases that are going to come up.


----------



## Snakecharmer

9Left said:


> Like I said already… That's completely based on the availability of testing… The more people tested… The more cases that are going to come up.


Looks like about 1100 are due to the prison outbreak, 100 workers 1000 inmates

_The surge in cases in Marion County - which had 103 positive cases on Tuesday - is almost wholly driven by an outbreak at one of the two local state prisons._

_As of late Saturday afternoon, there were 1,057 inmates at Marion Correctional with the disease and 103 staff members. Pickaway Correctional Institution had the second most number of cases in a prison with 202 inmates infected and 64 staff. Gov. Mike DeWine on Friday said 60 prisoners in one dorm who were not showing symptoms tested posi_tive_ for COVID-19 at MCI._


----------



## Snakecharmer

I'm hoping my ARD ( Acute Respiratory Disease) that I caught in Basic training in 72 gives me some immunity. Probably not. It did knock me on my ass back then.


----------



## Legend killer

For the # of positive confirmed cases in the US, 18% die.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Legend killer said:


> For the # of positive confirmed cases in the US, 18% die.


That seems pretty high. Where did you get that number or what is the math?


----------



## Legend killer

I think my math was off. Its nearly 6%.


----------



## Specwar

I will certainly not waste a prayer for anyone in Marion or any other penal institute.


----------



## roundbadge

prisoners, healthcare workers and nursing homes, police stations, etc

confined area equals

AIRBORNE

and no "expert" will admit that


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

Specwar said:


> I will certainly not waste a prayer for anyone in Marion or any other penal institute.


How very Christian like of you.


----------



## buckeyebowman

crappiedude said:


> My friend, my wife and myself have all had dry hacking coughs.
> My friend had it at the end of January. I hadn't seen him in a while and called to make sure he was doing okay and that's when he told me about it, he said he coughed so much he hurt.
> My wife came up with a dry cough in February, couldn't shake it. I was concerned because it went on all day and night. I knew she had to exhausted.
> I came up with it to no surprised after se had it. Mine was bad enough I wouldn't go to the Y because I didn't want to give it to anyone there.
> All of us had this before "the breakout." I had a few other symptoms and in general felt like crap.
> We all wish we could be tested, did we have it...did we not have it? We wish we knew.


A friend and his wife both believe they have had it and recovered. He's a driver for FedEx, and she is a nurse at a local hospital. He told me he had a persistent cough and sore throat for about 2 weeks. Also, low energy. He said he couldn't drag himself out of bed for a couple of days and called off. He just laid in bed and on the third morning, felt fine. But, he called off that day too just to check himself. By evening he felt 100%, and went back to work the next day. 

My Brother tried to chalk that up to the regular flu. He's kind of a COVID denier. I said come on! What flu have you ever had where you had a sore throat for 2 weeks?! 2-3 days. 4 tops! Give a normal flu 10 days and you've kicked it.

Here in Mahoning Co. a little over 50% of the deaths have been people from nursing homes. We have a ton of them! Plus, the surge may have been a little bit ago, given how long it takes death certificates to be processed. This past Friday some deaths that occurred on March 30th were first reported locally.


----------



## TomC

well I work at one of the largest county jails and Ohio. Due to the outbreaks at a majority of the prisons in oh, CRC Reception Center in Columbus and the reception Center in Cleveland we are not sending any inmates out to any as well as we are not taking inmates that are coming back from any prisons for trials or any resentencing. We use to have 800 to 1100 inmates in the jail. When I left friday we had 446, lowest I have ever seeing it in the 15 years that I work there. I wouldn't say that it is are born per se but if one inmate gets sick they are so clustered together that it's pretty much a guarantee that any cell will get it and it will spread like wildfire. It still sucks that people on unemployment still are making more than those on the front lines dealing with this crap everyday.


----------



## Saugeye Tom




----------



## fish sandwich

ICENUT said:


> Without the tests nothing is going to change.Its going to take many weeks and maybe months to have enough testing on hand to test millions of americans.And perhaps a year or 2 for a vaccine that will work before things can remotely get back to whatever normal was.You need the test kits along with enough reagents and controls and healthy people to administer and run the test along with the necessary lab equipment to do it rapidly not one test every 15 minutes or 4 an hour,My God it will take 20 years to test enough folks at that rate.
> IMHO social distancing and cooping us all up for who knows how long is just moving the curve to a later date,when people start moving about by being isolated nobody is getting immune and this virus will pop up again with avengence down the road.


moving the curve to a later date is the entire reason for doing this. It gives more time for hospitals to prepare and for us to manufacture more supplies ect. stretching it out keeps hospitals from exceeding capacities


----------



## loves2fishinohio

Wow, just wow, no wonder the 350B in loans set aside for small business has run out. 

I just read that Shake Shack is returning the $10M loan they received. Shake Shack, how in the heck do they qualify as a small business? They are a publicly-traded company, with over 208 locations in several countries, and a current market value of $1.63B.

Makes ZERO sense they would give them a loan as a small business.


----------



## Cobe24

Fear is a powerful thing! We are going to have a heck of a time opening back up with the number of terrified people in our country. Then, throw in the number of people making more to stay home than to work?!?! Opening up isn’t going to be easy.


----------



## TomC

I will say and have always said history always repeats its self. Has anyone looked at the 1919 flu and the curve on it? It wasn't just 1 wave and done.


----------



## crappiedude

I doubt that's it's really fear that will limit people from opening back up. I would more think it is caution, there's a big difference.
I'm not afraid but I am cautious.


----------



## Buster24

Slippery slope here....open the country up and coronavirus probably comes back....possibly worse......leave it shut and economy may never come back creating significant hardships for everyone....who can make the right decision and yet people are so anxious to blame someone!!!!!


----------



## fastwater

Obviously the country is going to have to open back up.
The more obvious bigger question is 'how that's going to be done'?
IMO...at this point...one size does not fit all when opening up states, or even counties in states where there are hotspots versus areas that have little virus.
We flip the switch and open it up like it was pre-corona...everything we've accomplished as far as preventing overwhelming hospitals/staff and massive die off was all for not.
Would be very asinine and irresponsible to do it that way.
No vaccine...or even 100% known treatment as of yet, there ARE gonna be future spikes with more deaths. Most likely even a few more hotspots popping up. As we start opening,Auditing/monitoring those numbers closely and reacting accordingly with reclosing things in those areas is gonna have to happen. 
Also, open schools back up this coming school year with nothing more to combat corona than what we currently have and that's a sure recipe for disaster.


----------



## laguna21

fastwater said:


> Obviously the country is going to have to open back up.
> The more obvious bigger question is 'how that's going to be done'?
> IMO...at this point...one size does not fit all when opening up states, or even counties in states where there are hotspots versus areas that have little virus.
> We flip the switch and open it up like it was pre-corona...everything we've accomplished as far as preventing overwhelming hospitals/staff and massive die off was all for not.
> Would be very asinine and irresponsible to do it that way.
> No vaccine...or even 100% known treatment as of yet, there ARE gonna be future spikes with more deaths. Most likely even a few more hotspots popping up. As we start opening,Auditing/monitoring those numbers closely and reacting accordingly with reclosing things in those areas is gonna have to happen.
> Also, open schools back up this coming school year with nothing more to combat corona than what we currently have and that's a sure recipe for disaster.


Governor supposed to announce today what his plans are for the schools, I heard it may go to a 2 days on and 3 off every other week type thing. We'll see


----------



## KaGee

multi species angler said:


> How many of you would open the country back up now if you knew for a fact you would be dead within a week. It's easy to say you're not afraid of dying when death is not staring you in the face. Just like it's easy to say you're going to quit smoking while you have one lit up.


How many of you will keep the country closed if you knew for a fact that continued closure would insure the collapse of our economy. Are you willing to state you are not afraid of personal financial collapse and inability to feed your family? Keep a roof over their head? Are you?


----------



## Cobe24

If 9 people on a 10 Person panel say to “cautiously” open a company/business back up and 1 person fears it is too dangerous, do you think those companies open up? I predict many will not.


----------



## Legend killer

KaGee said:


> How many of you will keep the country closed if you knew for a fact that continued closure would insure the collapse of our economy. Are you willing to state you are not afraid of personal financial collapse and inability to feed your family? Keep a roof over their head? Are you?


I am ok with keeping the country closed till there is more testing. The second larger wave would destroy the economy more than keeping it the way it is now IMO.


----------



## Cobe24

Another concern of mine is the number of friends that have told me they don’t mind being laid off because they are still getting paid and they now have a lot more time to fish. Thankfully, I am still working and I am truly fearful of having to rely on my fellow citizen to support me. I can’t get over the people acting like being out of work is an okay situation right now.


----------



## Patricio

Cobe24 said:


> Another concern of mine is the number of friends that have told me they don’t mind being laid off because they are still getting paid and they now have a lot more time to fish. Thankfully, I am still working and I am truly fearful of having to rely on my fellow citizen to support me. I can’t get over the people acting like being out of work is an okay situation right now.


hell, i volunteered! we have so little going on at work, theres no reason for other managers who have to be there to not do my job for me. im bringing in $1240 a week. im maxed out. still not near what i was earning, but close enough.


----------



## laguna21

Schools closed for the rest of the academic year, still no decision about returning in the fall.


----------



## Specwar

Cobe24 said:


> Another concern of mine is the number of friends that have told me they don’t mind being laid off because they are still getting paid and they now have a lot more time to fish. Thankfully, I am still working and I am truly fearful of having to rely on my fellow citizen to support me. I can’t get over the people acting like being out of work is an okay situation right now.


The current situation certainly exposes the true character of most.


----------



## BuckeyeFishin07

KaGee said:


> How many of you will keep the country closed if you knew for a fact that continued closure would insure the collapse of our economy. Are you willing to state you are not afraid of personal financial collapse and inability to feed your family? Keep a roof over their head? Are you?


I have been working this whole time, and I leave the house every morning wondering if that will be the day. But I have responsibilities to take care of, I was taught at a young age not to depend on others especially the government to live. I will not sit in my house and let my house go into foreclosure, I will not let my wife worry about not being able to pay bills, I will put food on my table. I have asthma and am overweight, I know I am at greater risk, but I will not lose everything I have worked for in my life. This is my opinion and my opinion alone, I am not belittling anyone that doesn't want to venture out in this, this is the way I was raised and that is my work ethic. I will do what I can to take care of my own, I am following the rules though. I am not taking any extra risks after work, I go home, and if the weather is suitable (which has not been the case lately) I will go fishing. So I guess my long winded post here is saying I am not willing to let my house go and my family go hungry because I am scared of this stuff, I am scared of this stuff and am at greater risk but I am not depending on others to take care of me.


----------



## multi species angler

I'm more afraid of my 80 yr old mother contracting this and dying even though she hasn't left the house since this started. It seems to get around easily.


KaGee said:


> How many of you will keep the country closed if you knew for a fact that continued closure would insure the collapse of our economy. Are you willing to state you are not afraid of personal financial collapse and inability to feed your family? Keep a roof over their head? Are you?


----------



## multi species angler

Cobe24 said:


> If 9 people on a 10 Person panel say to “cautiously” open a company/business back up and 1 person fears it is too dangerous, do you think those companies open up? I predict many will not.


 It depends on who that one person is.


----------



## 9Left

BuckeyeFishin07 said:


> I have been working this whole time, and I leave the house every morning wondering if that will be the day. But I have responsibilities to take care of, I was taught at a young age not to depend on others especially the government to live. I will not sit in my house and let my house go into foreclosure, I will not let my wife worry about not being able to pay bills, I will put food on my table. I have asthma and am overweight, I know I am at greater risk, but I will not lose everything I have worked for in my life. This is my opinion and my opinion alone, I am not belittling anyone that doesn't want to venture out in this, this is the way I was raised and that is my work ethic. I will do what I can to take care of my own, I am following the rules though. I am not taking any extra risks after work, I go home, and if the weather is suitable (which has not been the case lately) I will go fishing. So I guess my long winded post here is saying I am not willing to let my house go and my family go hungry because I am scared of this stuff, I am scared of this stuff and am at greater risk but I am not depending on others to take care of me.


Sounds like you are taking caution to not step in the grave... but your pride is preventing you from seeing that your other foot is on a land mine.


----------



## multi species angler

BuckeyeFishin07 said:


> I am scared of this stuff and am at greater risk but I am not depending on others to take care of me.


 I am guessing since you're still working you must be an essential employee. Did you have a choice to work or be laid off?


----------



## hailtothethief

I picked a good time to get my fat ass in shape. Dropped 70 pounds last year. I can see my side abs. Got a little baby fat on my front abs. You guys should be doing the same. Time to trim the fat physically and financially. No more burger king and binge eating. I think eating too much really effected my health. Havent been sick this year. I notice on saturdays when i eat extra meals i am extra tired.


----------



## BuckeyeFishin07

multi species angler said:


> I am guessing since you're still working you must be an essential employee. Did you have a choice to work or be laid off?


No I did not have a choice because I have bills to pay so I have to work! That is the only choice to make!


----------



## BuckeyeFishin07

9Left said:


> Sounds like you are taking caution to not step in the grave... but your pride is preventing you from seeing that your other foot is on a land mine.


Always has to be the one guy that can't see the other side huh? I am not bashing people that want to stay home, but that is not the way I was taught. And yeah my pride does get in my way, but at least I know when it all comes to an end I did my best!


----------



## multi species angler

BuckeyeFishin07 said:


> No I did not have a choice because I have bills to pay so I have to work! That is the only choice to make!


 You never answered, are you considered an essential employee, if not how can you still be working. Lot's of people laid off because they weren't considered essential, not because they didn't want to work.


----------



## BuckeyeFishin07

Yeah I am why would I still be working if not considered an essential employee! I never said people were laid because they didn't want to work, and I guess I wasn't clear. Sorry about that.


----------



## multi species angler

That was my thoughts exactly.


----------



## ICENUT

What a lot of the guys on hear are saying that they want to wait for more testing? At the current rate it will be months before there will be enough tests esp tests that are reliable. The antibody testing is not quite a success yet and the about test is 4 per hour WOW take around 20 years to get tested. Again mitigation has flattened the curve for now bot the virus will still be out there How long are you going to stay at home. I said this earlier if you can stand in long lines at grocery store,walmart,weed store beer store ,ect then open up keep distance wear masks and hopefull enough will build up immunity. If every American stayed inside for months and came out quess what the virus will still be there.What you then?


----------



## roundbadge

The researchers, in collaboration with the University of Southern California, estimated that 221,000 to 442,000 adults in L.A. county had been infected based on drive-through tests conducted on April 10 and 11. Given the study’s margin of error, this represents between 2.8 and 5.6% of the population — which is also 28 to 55 times what county officials recorded around that time: about 8,000 confirmed cases.

Just take Ohio 12K so far at 50x FWIW

600,000 maybe already had the virus, and every new case reported may have 49 other asymptomatic or mild cases


----------



## Dovans

9Left said:


> Sounds like you are taking caution to not step in the grave... but your pride is preventing you from seeing that your other foot is on a land mine.


this quote belongs in the "sayings" thread now.. wow.. what a great saying..just saying


----------



## Dovans

Just read in a CNN report (take that for whats its worth) how China is having a resurgence because of nationals coming back from Russia.


----------



## Hatchetman

Cobe24 said:


> If 9 people on a 10 Person panel say to “cautiously” open a company/business back up and 1 person fears it is too dangerous, do you think those companies open up? I predict many will not.


Boy, I wish there was a Bul.$h.. button on here


----------



## bulafisherman

I'am all for opening up the country and I think most Americans are, I personally place absolutely no merit on anything that comes out of China. For those of you out there that have an open mind like I do and are always trying to balance out your prospective search Dr Rashid Buttar on YouTube he shares some good insight. For anyone that wants to come back on me with negativity for throwing this out there, I have no need to respond besides getting a good chuckle out of what you might have to say


----------



## Burkcarp1

We have to remember that the reason we shutdown was because so we don’t overwhelm the hospitals (not to save us)and that hasn’t happened here in Ohio.


----------



## Workingman

I feel like the government should inform and advise and then we as citizens should be able to make our choices on what we are comfortable with (or not).
If you're nervous, feel free to stay inside away from people.


----------



## bridgeman

Sorry if this offends but its all going to have to come down to if your health is compromised then its gonna have to be up to you to be responsible for taking the precautions necessary to sustain yourself. 


Workingman said:


> I feel like the government should inform and advise and then we as citizens should be able to make our choices on what we are comfortable with (or not).
> If you're nervous, feel free to stay inside away from people.


----------



## Muddy

I’ve been working non stop. I am constantly aware of my surroundings, I am vigilant about cleanliness, and I social distance as much as possible. I don’t go anywhere except straight from home to work and then back home. I don’t stop to get food or drinks during the day, I bring food and drinks in the truck with me. I wear a mask and gloves when I feel that it is needed. If everyone makes smart decisions we can work and be as safe as possible. This disease isn’t going away, and the country can’t shut down forever. You gotta get back on the horse and ride at some point. Be smart and be safe out there.


----------



## EnonEye

Muddy said:


> I’ve been working non stop. I am constantly aware of my surroundings, I am vigilant about cleanliness, and I social distance as much as possible. I don’t go anywhere except straight from home to work and then back home. I don’t stop to get food or drinks during the day, I bring food and drinks in the truck with me. I wear a mask and gloves when I feel that it is needed. If everyone makes smart decisions we can work and be as safe as possible. This disease isn’t going away, and the country can’t shut down forever. You gotta get back on the horse and ride at some point. Be smart and be safe out there.


I commend you Muddy for being an adult during a tense adult situation and sincerely thank you for working to keep me safe. I sure wish all the knuckleheads at Lowes the other day buying grills and cabinet doors and holding parking lot family reunions with no masks to be seen anywhere, it's those who need to mature past the pre-puberty stage


----------



## fishless

EnonEye said:


> I commend you Muddy for being an adult during a tense adult situation and sincerely thank you for working to keep me safe. I sure wish all the knuckleheads at Lowes the other day buying grills and cabinet doors and holding parking lot family reunions with no masks to be seen anywhere, it's those who need to mature past the pre-puberty stage


Speaking of Lowes...I went to Lowes in New Philadelphia on Sunday.I went in one door and back out the other.Jam packed and only a few with mask


----------



## twistedcatfish1971

Lowe's has been packed with people from beginning...like everyone has no other place to go.


----------



## LEfriend

fishless said:


> Speaking of Lowes...I went to Lowes in New Philadelphia on Sunday.I went in one door and back out the other.Jam packed and only a few with mask


Similar experience here. Went to a big greenhouse to drop off a fairly large order for curbside pickup later. Sat in my car, handed it through window, to nice young employee standing outside their entry, and drove off. No other contact with anyone. Will go back again later, they will have it all ready for me on carts, I will load in isolated place, mask and gloves, no other contact , and be out of there.

As I sat in the car by the door for a couple minutes people were streaming out, very close side by side but were obviously not related or family... they were bumping into each other, breathing on each other, and all that. I would say less than 40% were wearing a mask. Some were obviously high risk - elderly and carrying way too many pounds (I confess, no room to talk here...)

People are fricking crazy and irresponsible. People like that and those out protesting in big groups with no protective equipment...well they are part of the reason we can't safely open sooner....


----------



## Muddy

Yea, the guys that work the commercial service desk at our local Lowe’s are hating life. They said that almost everyday is as busy as a Saturday in spring. They said that entire families are coming in and just wandering around. The guys working at Lowe’s are just trying to keep their jobs through all of this, and hopefully not take the virus home to their loved ones. I won’t go in the store, too many people for me. Luckily Lowe’s lets us call our orders in and they pull the material for us.


----------



## multi species angler

LEfriend said:


> People are fricking crazy and irresponsible. People like that and those out protesting in big groups with no protective equipment


Exactly. And if they act like that with the restrictions we have, how bad is going to be when the restrictions are loosened. And as stated, what one person does affects us all. We are all in this together, whether we like it or not.


----------



## roundbadge

Some say "eventually", 50-70% of the population will get the virus.

If the 4-5% Serology ends up true, then just using 70x, Ohio purportedly would have about 800,000 recoveries already, as either asymptomatic or mild...............that leaves another 11mm Ohioans exposed to hit that estimate of infections, say 6mm more positives or so, before any type of herd immunity

the lockdown buys time for a vaccine or better treatments, but using the status quo, and the rising rate of infections in Ohio based on their charts, this could go on until 2021............

As far as commerce, the workforce must start with the Serology positives, not the tested negatives............


----------



## Specwar

Best thing anyone can do when going out after businesses start reopening is to follow protocol. It’s really common sense. 
If you choose not to go out after the reopening, then don’t. It’s personal choice.


----------



## JamesF

I feel that, as time goes on, we will have to adapt, and adjust to a new model of doing business. It will take time. Hopefully some breakthroughs in medicine will help. But the people who feel that they can have gatherings in a time when everyone is susceptible, aren't helping others. I had an intestinal bug today,I know it was just that,and I feel like my immune system is definitely compromised. So... I'll stay away from the people that have found new gathering places, despite common sense.


----------



## bad luck

LEfriend said:


> Similar experience here. Went to a big greenhouse to drop off a fairly large order for curbside pickup later. Sat in my car, handed it through window, to nice young employee standing outside their entry, and drove off. No other contact with anyone. Will go back again later, they will have it all ready for me on carts, I will load in isolated place, mask and gloves, no other contact , and be out of there.
> 
> As I sat in the car by the door for a couple minutes people were streaming out, very close side by side but were obviously not related or family... they were bumping into each other, breathing on each other, and all that. I would say less than 40% were wearing a mask. Some were obviously high risk - elderly and carrying way too many pounds (I confess, no room to talk here...)
> 
> People are fricking crazy and irresponsible. People like that and those out protesting in big groups with no protective equipment...well they are part of the reason we can't safely open sooner....



So all of us have been reading the same “horror” stories for the last month, many times a day, from many posters ....


So wouldn’t it stand to reason, if this is as deadly/bad as the govt has said, there would be huge breakouts NOW from the LOWES customers?

OR


the most recent studies out of CA are correct, there is already at least 40-50 times the known cases out there, and the death rate is in turn that much less.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Unfortunately we will never know the true numbers. Many deaths that didn’t have anything to do with the virus have been blamed on the virus. Some of these state leaders are nuts.


----------



## dcool

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Unfortunately we will never know the true numbers. Many deaths that didn’t have anything to do with the virus have been blamed on the virus. Some of these state leaders are nuts.


Source of your information?


----------



## cincinnati

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/bi...avirus-as-covid-19-deaths-regardless-of-cause


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

dcool said:


> Source of your information?


Source from you that they haven’t?
If you don’t think they have you are being naive IMO.


----------



## Misdirection

dcool said:


> Source of your information?


Under the worldometers website that started this whole post, click on the good old USA link and its published right there...










Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## AmericanEagle

Both the CDC and the state of Ohio show the probable deaths, and total deaths so it is easy to see how many people died who were tested positive for the virus and probable deaths who were not tested.

https://coronavirus.ohio.gov/wps/portal/gov/covid-19/home

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/cases-updates/cases-in-us.html

The following two paragraphs following are quoted from the CDC page:

“CDC does not know the exact number of COVID-19 illnesses, hospitalizations, and deaths for a variety of reasons. COVID-19 can cause mild illness, symptoms might not appear immediately, there are delays in reporting and testing, not everyone who is infected gets tested or seeks medical care, and there may be differences in how states and territories confirm numbers in their jurisdictions.”

“A confirmed case or death is defined by meeting confirmatory laboratory evidence for COVID-19. A probable case or death is defined by i) meeting clinical criteria AND epidemiologic evidence with no confirmatory laboratory testing performed for COVID-19; or ii) meeting presumptive laboratory evidence AND either clinical criteria OR epidemiologic evidence; or iii) meeting vital records criteria with no confirmatory laboratory testing performed for COVID19.”

The probable deaths are used to account for situations like NYC where on an average day 20 to 25 people die at home but with the virus peaking that number is now 200 a day. It is not possible for them to test these deaths. How do you account for such a large increase in deaths if not COVID-19?

https://gothamist.com/news/surge-nu...ls-suspect-undercount-covid-19-related-deaths

The CDC admits the data is not exact. They have been very transparent about the number of probable deaths and the criteria used to determine them. I see nothing nefarious going on. These are doctors and scientists are trying to gather as much information on COVID-19 as they can.


----------



## Snakecharmer

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Unfortunately we will never know the true numbers. Many deaths that didn’t have anything to do with the virus have been blamed on the virus. Some of these state leaders are nuts.





Misdirection said:


> Under the worldometers website that started this whole post, click on the good old USA link and its published right there...
> In accordance with *new CDC guidelines*:
> 
> 
> *New York*: the numbers shown below include probable deaths (and, consequently, probable cases for the same number) as reported by New York City
> *Maryland*: includes probable deaths, as reported by the  Department of Health (Section: "COVID-19 Statistics in Maryland")
> *Wyoming*: includes probable cases, as reported by the  Department of Health
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


There is a difference between nothing to do with the virus and probably caused by the virus.


----------



## Misdirection

Snakecharmer said:


> There is a difference between nothing to do with the virus and probably caused by the virus.


But there will be a margin of error in both directions.

In epidemiology they use statistics to determine infection rate, mortality, etc...they will not be exact numbers, but directionally correct. Similar to the estimates and mortality rates of influenza every year.

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


----------



## Snakecharmer

Misdirection said:


> But there will be a margin of error in both directions.
> 
> In epidemiology they use statistics to determine infection rate, mortality, etc...they will not be exact numbers, but directionally correct. Similar to the estimates and mortality rates of influenza every year.
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


Yep it isn't an exact science. The only thing exact is that the person is dead or alive. And it only a matter of time before the live person will be dead.


----------



## Specwar

Predictions, estimates, guesstimates, woulda, coulda, shoulda, etc.. 
Yes we have a new virus and an antiquated healthcare system. 
WHY, is healthcare system in such a shambled state?? 
Final “correct” numbers will never be known just like the flu numbers are not 100% accurate, mostly presumptions.
Follow protocol, get the country opened back up, and get on with your life. Or cower in place if you so choose.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Snakecharmer, I like the 8 “probables” and your “probably” in your post.  Hence exactly what I said. We will never know the true numbers and they have been skewed.


----------



## roundbadge

"At Marion, only 105 of the individuals who were tested were showing symptoms at the time of testing as of Sunday, Smith stated. Approximately 95 percent(2011 total) of the positive cases are asymptomatic."

Sounds airborne............and the stealth percentage so high sort of corroborates the Serology initial results of so many folks walking around infected and not realizing it.............

Imagine if they only tested the symptom inmates? The other 1900 would have went unnoticed and a month later, probably become negatives with antibodies

Therefore, 100% TESTING for the virus as well as Serology is the only way................previous Serology averaged 5% HAD's, and if that number keeps growing, as it should, it would be the gauge for herd immunity

Marion spread like wildfire, but 95% asymptomatic is more than 50% asymptomatic as experts claim................sounds like 80/20 may be the split...............


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Misdirection, I meant to quote SC’s. Post. Sorry about that.


----------



## buckeyebowman

bad luck said:


> So all of us have been reading the same “horror” stories for the last month, many times a day, from many posters ....
> 
> 
> So wouldn’t it stand to reason, if this is as deadly/bad as the govt has said, there would be huge breakouts NOW from the LOWES customers?
> 
> OR
> 
> 
> the most recent studies out of CA are correct, there is already at least 40-50 times the known cases out there, and the death rate is in turn that much less.





STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Unfortunately we will never know the true numbers. Many deaths that didn’t have anything to do with the virus have been blamed on the virus. Some of these state leaders are nuts.


Oddly enough, heard this on the Colin Cowherd radio sportstalk show. California governor Gavin Newsome say that Cali may not have live sports of any kind until 2021! He also said something about herd immunity. Cowherd asked how is herd immunity supposed to develop when "the herd" is not functioning! This seems to have been the strategy the Swedes followed. 

Also, there is a great op-ed piece by Walter E. Williams in today's Youngstown Vindicator. It probably won't be on their website until tomorrow, but you can find it at vindy.com. In it he quotes Dr Knut Wittkowski, formerly the head of the Department of Biostatistics, Epidemiology, and Research Design at Rockefeller University in NYC. He makes the same argument. That the lock down is delaying the development of the desired herd immunity. He says that properly developed herd immunity could prevent the "second wave" that is widely predicted. 

The elderly, and people with comorbidities should be sheltered during the time needed to develop the immunity, which he estimated at about 4 weeks!


----------



## hailtothethief

Lock downs led to 2nd and 3rd waves of the black death. Cant prevent the 2nd wave, can only postpone it.


----------



## Misdirection

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Misdirection, I meant to quote SC’s. Post. Sorry about that.


No worries!

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## hailtothethief

My old neighbor had panic attacks today. Shes used to being around a whole slew of people. She cant go to church and she can’t volunteer at the hospital. She cant stand not being around people. She just had heart surgery and her husband passed away. She’s a very nervous person. Must be a lot of people like her out there now.


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## multi species angler

buckeyebowman said:


> The elderly, and people with comorbidities should be sheltered during the time needed to develop the immunity, which he estimated at about 4 weeks!


 Yea, that has worked for the prisons and nursing homes.


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## Hatchetman

Just talked to our daughter in California. My son-in-law, who is a CBP officer at San Diego has tested positive for the Chinese Virus 19. Presently in quarantine and has very slight symptoms. He is in excellent health but with his job you can imagine some of the people he has to deal with. I guess several agents tested positive, I was kinda waiting to hear this from them because of his job....Say a prayer please....


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Hatchetman said:


> Just talked to our daughter in California. My son-in-law, who is a CBP officer at San Diego has tested positive for the Chinese Virus 19. Presently in quarantine and has very slight symptoms. He is in excellent health but with his job you can imagine some of the people he has to deal with. I guess several agents tested positive, I was kinda waiting to hear this from them because of his job....Say a prayer please....


Prayers sent my man.


----------



## Redheads

Hatchetman said:


> Just talked to our daughter in California. My son-in-law, who is a CBP officer at San Diego has tested positive for the Chinese Virus 19. Presently in quarantine and has very slight symptoms. He is in excellent health but with his job you can imagine some of the people he has to deal with. I guess several agents tested positive, I was kinda waiting to hear this from them because of his job....Say a prayer please....


Prayers sent


----------



## Specwar

Prayers from our family HM.


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## JamesF

hailtothethief said:


> My old neighbor had panic attacks today. Shes used to being around a whole slew of people. She cant go to church and she can’t volunteer at the hospital. She cant stand not being around people. She just had heart surgery and her husband passed away. She’s a very nervous person. Must be a lot of people like her out there now.


My neighbor across the street, is basically in the same position, her children live too far away, and she is in the early stages of dementia.


----------



## fastwater

Hatchetman said:


> Just talked to our daughter in California. My son-in-law, who is a CBP officer at San Diego has tested positive for the Chinese Virus 19. Presently in quarantine and has very slight symptoms. He is in excellent health but with his job you can imagine some of the people he has to deal with. I guess several agents tested positive, I was kinda waiting to hear this from them because of his job....Say a prayer please....


Praying for your s-n-l, daughter and your family.

Edited to add:
I read and responded to Hatchetman's post above about 30 mins. ago.
Since then, received a call from a very good friend of mine that his son(which is a dear friend also) who works for OBC is sick(103 temp.) and has tested positive as well. He has lost his sense of both smell and taste.


----------



## PolkRunKid

I went to Jungle Jim's on Sunday. Beautiful day out. Bought food for quarantined parents. Trying to be upbeat. I go to pay & hear bottles breaking. I look over and they are bottles of Corona! Can not make this up. I feel for all. I am single & it can be lonely. Married friends have tough stretches as well. Grass greener on other side. Lol. Stay strong all.


----------



## yonderfishin

We are getting more and better information now than just a couple weeks ago. Things could have been much worse , but seems the situation is not as bad as it was once thought to be. Time for everyone to go back to work. Some will get sick , may even die but that happened anyway before. There is another bug out there , one of what were already many.


----------



## cheezemm2

Time for everyone to go back to work under extremely different circumstances... 

Wait until you go to the doc's office for a check up, a surgery, etc. The new normal will be vastly different for employees/employers too.

Airline unions are looking at mandatory masking for flight attendants and are seeking it for passengers...

I wouldn't be surprised if guidance comes out for new maximums in terms of square footage compared to people in the building.


----------



## Killbuckian

My company in Wayne county, an automotive supplier, is starting back to work on Monday. Will be checking everyone's temp upon entering and everyone has to wear a mask on company property. Not a small company either.


----------



## glacier_dropsy

Some local nursing homes in counties with only a few cases lost a lot of patients recently, once it gets in those settings, you cant fix it.
Early antibody testing in New York seems to suggest that they have a 10-15% exposure rate, which is way higher than their confirmed infection rate. This virus is probably far more contagious than we planned for, but less deadly on the first pass as well.


----------



## Patricio

Killbuckian said:


> My company in Wayne county, an automotive supplier, is starting back to work on Monday. Will be checking everyone's temp upon entering and everyone has to wear a mask on company property. Not a small company either.


Im going back to work Monday as well. Kinda disappointed. I was hoping for two months off. I got a week. I think things may be premature. I'm guessing one of the other managers doesn't want to do my job. I'll be twittling my thumbs I guess. I suspect the economy is ready to roar. Or people are hopeful thats it's an illusion. Interesting time.


----------



## dcool

It will be interesting to see what happens when things open back up. I am glad to see people back to work, but I think it will be a whole different workplace than it was before. Just read yesterday that a lot of the meat packing plants are closing down because of many employees coming down with the virus. On top of everything else, our country don't need this to happen.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Over 50,000 deaths in the USA so far and it will be over 50,000 for just April in a couple days.

In my opinion, we still know so little about the disease and whether you get immunity once you have had it, whether you are at risk to giving it to your pets or getting it from your pets. Until they come up with a easy way to continuously test people, they won't be able to stop people without symptoms from spreading the disease.

It is going to be a new normal which will be hard to adjust to for some people. Hopefully in time there will be a vaccine and this nightmare can end.


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## loves2fishinohio

Time to go back to work. If we had proper testing we would find the death rate to be much much lower than what it is. It seems we have become "used" to deaths due to the flu, and we have a freaking vaccine for the flu. Last year, the CDC estimated 35.5M people became sick, almost a half-million were hospitalized, and over 34,000 people lost their lives. We don't shelter in place for the flu.

And I don't care what anyone says, I do feel the warmer weather will slow this thing down. Look at the numbers in Florida and southern California compared to the northeastern US. Florida went through a massive spring break, and arguably has the greatest population of senior citizens in our country.

I hope Dewine doesn't take a turtle's pace when it comes to opening us back up, but I guess we won't know what his plan is until Monday.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

loves2fishinohio said:


> Time to go back to work. If we had proper testing we would find the death rate to be much much lower than what it is. It seems we have become "used" to deaths due to the flu, and we have a freaking vaccine for the flu. Last year, the CDC estimated 35.5M people became sick, almost a half-million were hospitalized, and over 34,000 people lost their lives. We don't shelter in place for the flu.
> 
> And I don't care what anyone says, I do feel the warmer weather will slow this thing down. Look at the numbers in Florida and southern California compared to the northeastern US. Florida went through a massive spring break, and arguably has the greatest population of senior citizens in our country.
> 
> I hope Dewine doesn't take a turtle's pace when it comes to opening us back up, but I guess we won't know what his plan is until Monday.


Depending on what you read the estimate is 30,000 to 70,000 that the flu will kill this year. Nationwide, you have to wonder how many flu deaths were deemed covid deaths. We already know that the covid number has been pretty much pencil whipped, by how much I don’t know.
What worries me also is how easily we were controlled by fear through our TV sets and the media. I mean it wasn’t like “stay in your house or else”. But that’s how it always starts isn’t it? I do believe this was no accident. China of all places with under 5000 deaths... yea right. If that’s the case, our numbers have been beat with a pencil.


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## Shad Rap

Heres the plan...starts May 1st with phase 1, then phase 2 starts middle of May, and then phase 3 starts beginning of June...only gonna take a month.


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## bridgeman

China lies like a rug, who knows how many croaked over there. The only logical thing to do with this mess is let it run its course. People with decent health get through it with little difficulty, those that have issues need to lay low till things improve. What Sweden is doing really is interesting, I'm hoping against hope they pull through. Looks like they're going through a third spike. I read that they're starting to put a lot of emphasis on sheltering those that are more susceptible to adverse reaction to this. They already said they should have done so earlier.


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## loves2fishinohio

Shad Rap said:


> Heres the plan...starts May 1st with phase 1, then phase 2 starts middle of May, and then phase 3 starts beginning of June...only gonna take a month.
> View attachment 353637


Source for this "plan"?


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

loves2fishinohio said:


> Source for this "plan"?


Dewine and company.


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## Shad Rap

loves2fishinohio said:


> Source for this "plan"?


No source...it's something I just made up


----------



## Shad Rap

loves2fishinohio said:


> Source for this "plan"?


It was released about a week ago man...it goes in phases, with each phase starting two weeks after the last...starts May 1st with phase 1...it'll take about a month to get to phase 3...then there may be more phases to come but I doubt it...who knows.


----------



## loves2fishinohio

Shad Rap said:


> It was released about a week ago man...it goes in phases, with each phase starting two weeks after the last...starts May 1st with phase 1...it'll take about a month to get to phase 3...then there may be more phases to come but I doubt it...who knows.


I still don't see it anywhere in the media, and Dewine said yesterday the State's plan for reopening would be covered during the presser next Monday.


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## Shad Rap

loves2fishinohio said:


> I still don't see it anywhere in the media, and Dewine said yesterday the State's plan for reopening would be covered during the presser next Monday.


I didn't make it up I promise.


----------



## bridgeman

we've had 70 cases and 3 deaths in my county that has a population of 190,000. Our brilliant governor decided to divide the state into 6 portions, the SW part has Allegheny county (Pittsburgh) that had the bulk of the cases in the area. The way he has it set up it'll be a long time before anything gets even close to normal, people literally live on top of each other there. Cases will keep occurring dragging the whole area down. Gonna be a long long rough road ahead for businesses.


----------



## Shad Rap

loves2fishinohio said:


> I still don't see it anywhere in the media, and Dewine said yesterday the State's plan for reopening would be covered during the presser next Monday.


Very quick google search found this...
https://www.wkyc.com/article/news/h...acton/95-087154b2-a9cd-489b-8e88-d36101ed7981
I stopped watching the dewine acton show a long time ago...how long are they gonna have these pressers???


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## whal

That looks like Pennsylvania's plan from Gov.Wolf.


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## Muddy

According to that plan and your timeline schools can re-open in mid May. The governor already shut schools down for the rest of the academic year. That plan and timeline doesn’t fit with the current order in place.


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## ErieRider

My understanding of all that I have read and follow is that the phasing steps are fluid and to change based on what transpires from now until May 1. After phase 1 kicks in, a determination will be made when phase 2 would begin based on how we adhere to the regulations and what occurs during the given phase. Not saying that as gospel, just my understanding.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


----------



## Shad Rap

Muddy said:


> According to that plan and your timeline schools can re-open in mid May. The governor already shut schools down for the rest of the academic year. That plan and timeline doesn’t fit with the current order in place.


Yes it does...that's because dewine just made the announcement about schools after the plan was rolled out...the earliest they were gonna open was mid May...that's all that means...they had to make a decision about the school year before then obviously but if he made the decision to finish out the school year, they wouldn't have started til mid May...understand?


----------



## Shad Rap

ErieRider said:


> My understanding of all that I have read and follow us that this phasing steps are fluid and to change based on what transpires from now until May 1. After phase 1 kicks in, a determination will be made when phase 2 would begin based on how we adhere to the regulations and what occurs during the given phase. Not saying that as gospel, just my understanding.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


My understanding was it was two weeks in between phases but yes they can change it or modify the rules along the way...what I posted was the original plan...they had to have something in place...but I don't see much changing on it either...


----------



## Hatchetman

loves2fishinohio said:


> I still don't see it anywhere in the media, and Dewine said yesterday the State's plan for reopening would be covered during the presser next Monday.


What do you need, a registered letter??


----------



## glacier_dropsy

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Depending on what you read the estimate is 30,000 to 70,000 that the flu will kill this year. Nationwide, you have to wonder how many flu deaths were deemed covid deaths. We already know that the covid number has been pretty much pencil whipped, by how much I don’t know.
> What worries me also is how easily we were controlled by fear through our TV sets and the media. I mean it wasn’t like “stay in your house or else”. But that’s how it always starts isn’t it? I do believe this was no accident. China of all places with under 5000 deaths... yea right. If that’s the case, our numbers have been beat with a pencil.


I understand the comparisons to the flu, but this virus is not the flu. There are always multiple versions of the flu filtering through society, and they can kill people. But that death is not usually a runaway train in the hospital. It is most often an elderly person, over a week on the vent, stable but making no progress, family chooses conservative measures. This one is different. Like the difference between hooking up with a sheepshead or goby when perching. For the people that it hits the hardest, we can see it coming, start caring for them early, and it still wrecks our best efforts, their lungs become useless, incapable of gas exchange.


----------



## yonderfishin

glacier_dropsy said:


> I understand the comparisons to the flu, but this virus is not the flu. There are always multiple versions of the flu filtering through society, and they can kill people. But that death is not usually a runaway train in the hospital. It is most often an elderly person, over a week on the vent, stable but making no progress, family chooses conservative measures. This one is different. Like the difference between hooking up with a sheepshead or goby when perching. For the people that it hits the hardest, we can see it coming, start caring for them early, and it still wrecks our best efforts, their lungs become useless, incapable of gas exchange.



The elderly , people with underlying conditions , and the real kicker......young healthy fit people who happen to have the terrible luck of an unidentified genetic inability to fight this particular virus ( any one of us could fall into that group ). For all these people the virus is much worse than the flu , the way it ravages their body is just pure wicked.


----------



## cincinnati

Disturbing food for thought....

https://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/lo...-mask-wearing-for-all-starting-may-1/2312707/


----------



## buckeyebowman

One question. Exactly where can you buy face masks? I've asked at every drug store in my area and no go! They don't have hand sanitizer, rubbing alcohol or face masks. They are basically useless!


----------



## Saugeyefisher

buckeyebowman said:


> One question. Exactly where can you buy face masks? I've asked at every drug store in my area and no go! They don't have hand sanitizer, rubbing alcohol or face masks. They are basically useless![/QUOTE
> 
> Look around online. At work we ordered a bunch of SA face shields. U can find them at the SA fishing website. One of our other branches found a bunch of spray able hand sanatizer and spray able disinfects on line somewhere


----------



## MagicMarker

cincinnati said:


> Disturbing food for thought....
> 
> https://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/lo...-mask-wearing-for-all-starting-may-1/2312707/





cincinnati said:


> Disturbing food for thought....
> 
> https://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/lo...-mask-wearing-for-all-starting-may-1/2312707/


This whole nonsense has went far enough. Count me out


----------



## fastwater

cincinnati said:


> Disturbing food for thought....
> 
> https://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/lo...-mask-wearing-for-all-starting-may-1/2312707/


IMO, surprised it took this long.
Thinking many city's will follow suit.


----------



## fastwater

buckeyebowman said:


> One question. Exactly where can you buy face masks? I've asked at every drug store in my area and no go! They don't have hand sanitizer, rubbing alcohol or face masks. They are basically useless!


https://safishing.com/


----------



## Snakecharmer

buckeyebowman said:


> One question. Exactly where can you buy face masks? I've asked at every drug store in my area and no go! They don't have hand sanitizer, rubbing alcohol or face masks. They are basically useless!


You can get a neck gaiter at Cabelas.


----------



## loweman165

cincinnati said:


> Disturbing food for thought....
> 
> https://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/lo...-mask-wearing-for-all-starting-may-1/2312707/


What a loke. I absolutely would not.


----------



## hailtothethief

What should the consequences be for not wearing a mask? Spankings? Public shaming? May be forced to wear a bear suit and sing.


----------



## Legend killer

You can make anything into a mask


----------



## laguna21

buckeyebowman said:


> One question. Exactly where can you buy face masks? I've asked at every drug store in my area and no go! They don't have hand sanitizer, rubbing alcohol or face masks. They are basically useless!


I'm going to be making some masks, I'll post some pics when I get some ready and I'll have some extras


----------



## AmericanEagle

hailtothethief said:


> What should the consequences be for not wearing a mask? Spankings? Public shaming? May be forced to wear a bear suit and sing.


In the 1918 Spanish Flu pandemic in San Francisco you would get fined 5 dollars.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/po...918-flu-under-control-then-it-lifted-n1191141


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## hailtothethief

Thats like 500 bucks in todays dollars. A candy bar was a nickel back in the day


----------



## Bent Rod

fastwater said:


> https://safishing.com/


SA fishing
Use promo code:
deal15

5 of the 'face shield' tubular bandana/gaiter Buy 1 get 4 free
less than $10 shipped with the code


----------



## fastwater

Just got this email from Kroger:

_" Health, Safety & Store Updates
Dear XXXXX,

Our top priority is the safety of our associates and customers. And now, more than ever, it’s important to take care of yourself. It can be easy to forget to do this when you’re busy and managing home life and workplace responsibilities, but nothing is more important than your health and safety.

Although it feels different because we aren’t used to it, I remind myself to keep the proper physical distance when I’m in our stores and around other people. I also wear a mask when I’m in our stores, and I encourage you to do so as well. We’ve provided masks for all of our store associates to wear, and starting this Sunday, we’ll be requiring our associates to wear them, in locations where they’re not already mandated. Our associates are also welcome to bring their own suitable masks or facial coverings to work, if they prefer.

We recognize that some associates, due to medical reasons or other circumstances, may not be able to wear a mas_k. _We’re sourcing face shields to provide for those associates, and we’ll also explore other potential options as needed.

We’ve learned and continue to learn a lot while keeping our stores open to serve our customers during the pandemic. Earlier this week, we published the first installment of Sharing What We've Learned: A Blueprint for Businesses, a resource guide to help other companies – both big and small – create their plans to reopen safely. This tool provides our recommendations, learnings and downloadable materials. Learn more at KrogerBlueprint.com.

Thank you for shopping with us, and for being a loyal customer.

Sincerely,








Rodney McMullen
Chairman and CEO








Mandatory Face Masks for Associates "_

Again, thinking many business's will follow suit and eventually...may require customers to do the same...


----------



## fastwater

Bent Rod said:


> SA fishing
> Use promo code:
> deal15
> 
> 5 of the 'face shield' tubular bandana/gaiter Buy 1 get 4 free
> less than $10 shipped with the code


Actually ordered several last year for g-son to fish in.
Ordered a few camo patterned for myself for hunting.
Excellent deal!
Like em and they are washable.


----------



## Patricio

in minnesota, more than half the deaths are in long term care facilities. here in wisonsin, theyre not releasing that info.


----------



## hailtothethief

Saybrook landing facility had 26 cases in ashtabula. 6 are staff members. 

https://www.starbeacon.com/news/cor...cle_6e4b0a33-e748-5cbf-b318-d7a386cbac26.html


----------



## loves2fishinohio

Bent Rod said:


> SA fishing
> Use promo code:
> deal15
> 
> 5 of the 'face shield' tubular bandana/gaiter Buy 1 get 4 free
> less than $10 shipped with the code


Damn man, thanks, it comes in under 10 bucks shipped for 5. Heck of a dealio.


----------



## crappiedude

So I was at Kroger's the other day and about 1/2 the people have face masks on. As I'm shopping I can't help but notice that a large portion of those people wearing masks, they were constantly fidgeting with them. In fact I started to notice the only people touching their faces were the people wearing masks, my wife included. I thought well that seems pointless.
I'm won't be surprised to see face masks being mandated but at this point I don't wear one myself. We do have some masks we've made but they aren't comfortable. My niece is sending us some masks she's made, hopefully these are better.


----------



## cincinnati

hailtothethief said:


> What should the consequences be for not wearing a mask? Spankings? Public shaming? May be forced to wear a bear suit and sing.


According to the article, $1000 or 6 months in jail. Probably stout enough to force a lot of non-believers in to compliance.


----------



## cincinnati

crappiedude said:


> So I was at Kroger's the other day and about 1/2 the people have face masks on....seems pointless.


Checking out @ my Kroger, & notice my bagger is the only person near checkout w/o a mask. Suddenly, a cashier from a couple aisles away, starts yelling @ him. Muffled by her mask, so it was kinda comical. He won't even acknowledge her, so still yelling, she bustles down to confront him. When she reaches him, not properly "distanced," she pulls down her mask & yells "YOU may be sent home!!"

He tilts his head slightly toward her & responds calmly, "Yeah, yeah, Karen. Got it. Whatever."

Hands me my bag & says enthusiastically "Have a GREAT day, sir!"


----------



## AmericanEagle

Coronavirus: Has Sweden got its science right?

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-52395866


----------



## ICENUT

There letting people molesters and rapists out of jails and many have no job without incomes and their going to fine you for not wearing a mask.It has been ststed numerous times Do Not Touch your mask it is contaminated But you cannot help touching it. I understand the logic behind the mask but at same time I question its effectiveness if not fitted properly and constantly touching it. Also watched a video about wearing gloves you just keep touching products and accumulating virus or germs on the gloves then you remove them and guess what you touched them also creating an aerosol.


----------



## laguna21

Fits good, I copied a pattern off the web and tweaked it, bad thing is the pattern kinda looks like a freaking bat........yeuuuuck


----------



## multi species angler

Whenever I try to wear a mask and glasses, the glasses will fog up. Anyone else have that issue?


----------



## M R DUCKS

Yes....sucks...
I sure miss my days of No glasses....had such good eye-sight


----------



## Legend killer

multi species angler said:


> Whenever I try to wear a mask and glasses, the glasses will fog up. Anyone else have that issue?


It's air escaping from top of mask. You can wear an n95 and no air will escape onto your glasses.


----------



## laguna21

Legend killer said:


> It's air escaping from top of mask. You can wear an n95 and no air will escape onto your glasses.


Hard to get a tight fit without the metal nose piece


----------



## Dovans

fastwater said:


> Just got this email from Kroger:
> 
> _" Health, Safety & Store Updates
> Dear XXXXX,
> 
> Our top priority is the safety of our associates and customers. And now, more than ever, it’s important to take care of yourself. It can be easy to forget to do this when you’re busy and managing home life and workplace responsibilities, but nothing is more important than your health and safety.
> _
> 
> _Thank you for shopping with us, and for being a loyal customer.
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Rodney McMullen
> Chairman and CEO
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mandatory Face Masks for Associates "_
> 
> Again, thinking many business's will follow suit and eventually...may require customers to do the same...


Oh its such a joy when you have to throw a case a minute to the shelves wearing these GD Masks. Im ready to get fired for not wearing one. I dont care anymore.


----------



## multi species angler

Legend killer said:


> It's air escaping from top of mask. You can wear an n95 and no air will escape onto your glasses.


 I donated all of my n95 mask to my local hospital.


----------



## EnonEye

I'll be trying out a new early summer color called orange faux hand towel (found at HarborFreight) this coming week during my weekly venture into... ya know, out there. Hoping I can breath through that material over-top a regular face mask. It can only kill me. Hoping the orange lets others notice to NOT GET CLOSE TO ME!


----------



## KaGee

Interesting read here...
https://www.realclearmarkets.com/ar...omic_suicide_and_get_back_to_work_490025.html


----------



## polebender

crappiedude said:


> So I was at Kroger's the other day and about 1/2 the people have face masks on. As I'm shopping I can't help but notice that a large portion of those people wearing masks, they were constantly fidgeting with them. In fact I started to notice the only people touching their faces were the people wearing masks, my wife included. I thought well that seems pointless.
> I'm won't be surprised to see face masks being mandated but at this point I don't wear one myself. We do have some masks we've made but they aren't comfortable. My niece is sending us some masks she's made, hopefully these are better.


I just use the fishing gaiters. You can cover your whole face if you want just leaving your eyes exposed. Plus they are comfortable and great to use when you’re fishing!


----------



## Hatchetman

KaGee said:


> Interesting read here...
> https://www.realclearmarkets.com/ar...omic_suicide_and_get_back_to_work_490025.html



X10....


----------



## multi species angler

Doubt that it'll be over for the people that it affects the most until a vaccine or at least a treatment is available.


----------



## cincinnati

EnonEye said:


> Hoping the orange lets others notice to NOT GET CLOSE TO ME!


If they start getting too close to me, I just cough & they scatter like roaches.


----------



## bulafisherman

KaGee said:


> Interesting read here...
> https://www.realclearmarkets.com/ar...omic_suicide_and_get_back_to_work_490025.html


 people are finally waking up and seeing it for what it really is. Took long enough follow the money and you will know the agenda.


----------



## buckeyebowman

multi species angler said:


> Whenever I try to wear a mask and glasses, the glasses will fog up. Anyone else have that issue?


I have a camo neck gaiter that I have used for turkey hunting, but the same thing happens when I'm up and about moving around the store. Still, so far so good.


----------



## KPI

The opening phases that shad rap posted are federal guidelines not the governor dewines plan you can see the same photo on this article below https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...ald-Trump-tells-governors-open-states-up.html


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Shad Rap

KPI said:


> The opening phases that shad rap posted are federal guidelines not the governor dewines plan you can see the same photo on this article below https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...ald-Trump-tells-governors-open-states-up.html
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


The article I sourced clearly says Dewines plan to reopen is VERY CONSISTENT with the federal phasing...these words were from Dewine himself...he's not gonna change much if anything at all...
What you're looking at is 'for the most part' Dewines plan...
And the phasing is 14 days for phase 1, 14 days for phase 2...with phase 3 beginning right around June 1st...all of this is left open for modification though...


----------



## KPI

Do you have the link I would love to read it not saying I question it but I can not find a reopening plan for Ohio on the Ohio board of health or on the states pages covering covid -19


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

Well....this has to be the record for longest thread at this point I'd imagine.


----------



## LEfriend

KaGee said:


> Interesting read here...
> https://www.realclearmarkets.com/ar...omic_suicide_and_get_back_to_work_490025.html


I kept looking for the authors medical credentials but couldn’t find any.

I have had two friends diagnosed and die from the disease already. A third is right now fighting for his life in OSU hospital with lung issues. My lifelong and close fishing buddy was a strapping healthy guy until recently when he was in Mayo Clinic for 22 days with lung issues. He is now home on oxygen 24 hours a day. His life is basically a long tube tethered to machine and a whole table full of pills. He has been making progress, but his doctor recently told him he would be confined to home with no visitors until a vaccine is developed....which we all know is a year or more away. So I find that article BS.


----------



## JamesF

This whole thread is twisted six ways from Sunday! Along with just about everything you hear about the coronavirus. All I can say, is, be safe out there. I believe that there are many people working hard to fight this. Time is the enemy, and so are the ignorant. These are the ones that will, and are passing it on, like the plague.


----------



## Treble

- and then panic ensued...……………….


----------



## bad luck

What’s longest thread / most responses ?


----------



## Saugeye Tom

bad luck said:


> What’s longest thread / most responses ?


the de railer!!!!~!!


----------



## KaGee

Fish-N-Fool said:


> Well....this has to be the record for longest thread at this point I'd imagine.


Not even close.


----------



## laguna21

Georgia is going to be the guinea pig, the outcome of them reopening everything is going to say a lot


----------



## hailtothethief

Georgia is poor. Pretty sure they were the worst performing economy when i did that work. They can afford a shut down the least. Trillions of dollars worldwide were wipe out with the shut down not to mention censorship and loss of freedom reaching record highs.


----------



## 9Left

hailtothethief said:


> Georgia is poor. Pretty sure they were the worst performing economy when i did that work. They can afford a shut down the least. Trillions of dollars worldwide were wipe out with the shut down not to mention censorship and loss of freedom reaching record highs.


Well I guess that's a problem you can fix… But…


hailtothethief said:


> I dont vote,


----------



## whal

Georgia's economy is ranked #11 in the United States and #9 for fiscal stability. Resource: U.S. News and World Report.


----------



## Burkcarp1




----------



## Hatchetman

Burkcarp1 said:


>


More and more Dr's are saying basically the same thing these two are saying....


----------



## Shad Rap

JamesF said:


> This whole thread is twisted six ways from Sunday! Along with just about everything you hear about the coronavirus. All I can say, is, be safe out there. I believe that there are many people working hard to fight this. Time is the enemy, and so are the ignorant. These are the ones that will, and are passing it on, like the plague.


The plague?..hardly not.


----------



## Shad Rap

KPI said:


> Do you have the link I would love to read it not saying I question it but I can not find a reopening plan for Ohio on the Ohio board of health or on the states pages covering covid -19
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I posted it.


----------



## hailtothethief

Hotlanta sucks the life out of the rest of georgia. And the neighboring states dont do so well. Louisiana is another one that is least able to survive a shutdown.


----------



## laguna21

So everyone should infect themselves to build a strong immunity? How does one social distance in a tattoo parlor?


----------



## AmericanEagle

Burkcarp1 said:


>


Sweden and Norway do not have similar results when you compare deaths per million of population.

From the Worldmeter web site Norway has 38 deaths per million while Sweden has 233 and Finland has 36.

Norway and Finland are clearly doing better at this point in time.


----------



## ICENUT

laguna21 said:


> So everyone should infect themselves to build a strong immunity? How does one social distance in a tattoo parlor?


It's easy You just don't go to a tattoo parlor


----------



## laguna21

X10 lol!


ICENUT said:


> It's easy You just don't go to a tattoo parlor


----------



## BFG

KaGee said:


> Not even close.


Dude...I miss the Great White Snapping Turtle thread.....


----------



## ditchdigger

I’m not a doctor but was told by one that it is not good to be wearing a mask and breathing in all your CO2. Especially the people with a compromised immune system!


----------



## Snakecharmer

Dog gets corona virus from sick family...Maybe you shouldn't kiss your dog, let it lick your food plates or let it sleep with you when you got the corona virus.
https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2020/apr/28/first-known-coronavirus-infected-dog-north-carolin/


----------



## Saugeyefisher

ditchdigger said:


> I’m not a doctor but was told by one that it is not good to be wearing a mask and breathing in all your CO2. Especially the people with a compromised immune system!


I've heard similar. But mostly for those wearing them all day long. Not for store runs and stuff.
It's going to be hot soon. And I know I'm not gonna like anything covering my face when I'm working in the heat.
We bought the sa fishing face sheilds for the employees at work. We are hoping there a little more breathable. But still be "compliant".... plus I'll use them for winter time fishing .....


----------



## twistedcatfish1971

I'm just saying...I see people doing the elbow thing with greeting/saying goodbye...

Aren't we suppose to cough/sneeze into those elbows???

All I know is ... this whole pandemic has crippled the world and all we know as <normal> is not so much and very will be for some time. Me personally I've been pretty dam good from beginning with the washing of hands/not touching face/constantly cleaning high touch areas at work/home. Found my rythm and comfort zone so speak...now it's a waiting game and being vigilant and preaching to who is around me/close.

Stay safe and wash your hands.

Twistedcatfish1971.


----------



## Burkcarp1

Snakecharmer said:


> Dog gets corona virus from sick family...Maybe you shouldn't kiss your dog, let it lick your food plates or let it sleep with you when you got the corona virus.
> https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2020/apr/28/first-known-coronavirus-infected-dog-north-carolin/


Shouldn’t do that regardless..


----------



## JamesF

BFG said:


> Dude...I miss the Great White Snapping Turtle thread.....


That was a great thread!


----------



## multi species angler

Burkcarp1 said:


>



Well you would think the older you are the better your immune system should be since we start with no immune system as a child and develop one as we make contact with germs as we get older, according to the above video. Seems children would be the ones at risk and the older people less affected.


----------



## yonderfishin

multi species angler said:


> Well you would think the older you are the better your immune system should be since we start with no immune system as a child and develop one as we make contact with germs as we get older, according to the above video. Seems children would be the ones at risk and the older people less affected.



The immune system starts to decline at some point.


----------



## JamesF

We start in our teens, and peak around mid twenties. After that, things begin a downward spiral. There are quite a few people that are able to stay physically fit well into their 50's. The saying rings true about military aged people, being the perfect example of fitness.


----------



## mountainbikingrn

ditchdigger said:


> I’m not a doctor but was told by one that it is not good to be wearing a mask and breathing in all your CO2. Especially the people with a compromised immune system!


Maybe the doctor you spoke to said that wearing a mask could impact someone with compromised lung function? The average person is not going to have any deleterious effects from wearing a cloth mask (N95 would be a different story). If someone has an impaired immune system with no respiratory disease then they would have no increased risk wearing a mask. Hospitals routinely place masks on neutropenic patients (low white blood cell counts, aka immune compromised) when transporting throughout the hospital. Many patients undergoing chemo wear masks in public as an added layer of protection from common contagions.


----------



## dcool

ditchdigger said:


> I’m not a doctor but was told by one that it is not good to be wearing a mask and breathing in all your CO2. Especially the people with a compromised immune system!


Was at the doctor yesterday and everybody working in the office was wearing masks. Sign on the door said you could not enter office without a mask.


----------



## cheezemm2

News out of Germany isn't good...

https://www.france24.com/en/20200428-german-virus-spread-worsens-as-lockdown-eases

I'm shocked that a virus spreads when people are in contact, SHOCKED!


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

No more mask mandate. Dewine reversed it after he got a lot of complaints and calls that making people wear a mask everywhere is going to far. Businesses will have the option to require mask if you enter their place of business.


----------



## Shad Rap

ditchdigger said:


> I’m not a doctor but was told by one that it is not good to be wearing a mask and breathing in all your CO2. Especially the people with a compromised immune system!


I've talked to several people who have to wear them all day at work and they do, in fact, give you a sore throat...even a swollen/weird feeling tongue...and that's the reason too...the air you are exhaling isn't escaping the mask before it's inhaled again...


----------



## multi species angler

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> No more mask mandate. Dewine reversed it after he got a lot of complaints and calls that making people wear a mask everywhere is going to far. Businesses will have the option to require mask if you enter their place of business.


 Yea the ball was dropped on this one. It is said that mask are used to protect others, not the one wearing the mask. So the people refusing to wear one while out in public close to others are just showing how irresponsible they are and that they don't give a sh!t about others.


----------



## Shad Rap

multi species angler said:


> Yea the ball was dropped on this one. It is said that mask are used to protect others, not the one wearing the mask. So the people refusing to wear one while out in public close to others are just showing how irresponsible they are and that they don't give a sh!t about others.


How long do you think we are gonna keep this virus from one another?..it's impossible man...it's not because people don't give a ****...the virus isn't going away...you gonna wear a mask forever?..even people that wear masks and PPE are coming down with this virus...feel free to stay inside if you don't like the actions of others...it's a vicious world out there...and yes, I'm one of the irresponsible ones that doesn't wear a mask...call me an a$$hole I guess...


----------



## Legend killer

Shad Rap said:


> How long do you think we are gonna keep this virus from one another?..it's impossible man...it's not because people don't give a ****...the virus isn't going away...you gonna wear a mask forever?..even people that wear masks, PPE are coming down with this virus...feel free to stay inside if you don't like the actions of others...it's a vicious world out there...and yes, I'm one of the irresponsible ones that doesn't wear a mask...call me an a$$hole I guess...


Again, masks are used to protect others. SMH


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

multi species angler said:


> Yea the ball was dropped on this one. It is said that mask are used to protect others, not the one wearing the mask. So the people refusing to wear one while out in public close to others are just showing how irresponsible they are and that they don't give a sh!t about others.


Well I don’t think that’s true. I thought the ideal was that everyone wears a mask, the odds of catching the virus go way down. Also, it up to the businesses whether you are allowed in without a mask. Maybe you should do all of your business in those places. You are welcome to wear one which will help your odds more than the guy who doesn’t so have at it. It’s your choice. Unfortunately nothing can keep you from getting it unless maybe you isolate yourself and your family and then if your lucky. Who’s fault will it be then? You wouldn’t know, just like you wouldn’t if we were all ordered to wear masks. Myself, I haven't been inside a public place since this started because my health is already jeopardized other than Dr visits and I wore masks. She goes shopping and she wears a mask. If we happen to get it, I’m not gonna call a person out who didn’t wear a mask, It will be because there isn’t an antivirus for it yet.


----------



## JamesF

I wore many types of masks, working in the steel mill. The masks without the one way valves are the ones that dry your mouth fast. After years of wearing the N95's, I get dry mouth and nasal congestion. I prefer the respirator types with cartridge filters. 
I heard that the virus will more than likely come back in the fall, with the regular flu. I feel that most of the people who are giving up information about this,are just uncertain about what little is known about this virus.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

JamesF said:


> I wore many types of masks, working in the steel mill. The masks without the one way valves are the ones that dry your mouth fast. After years of wearing the N95's, I get dry mouth and nasal congestion. I prefer the respirator types with cartridge filters.
> I heard that the virus will more than likely come back in the fall, with the regular flu. I feel that most of the people who are giving up information about this,are just uncertain about what little is known about this virus.


Some are better than others for sure. The problem is, where can you find any masks? You can’t find them anywhere. And wearing one 15 times is a joke. Just another reason why you can’t force someone to wear one. I bet that guy who has a handle on a batch won’t give it up to others but will complain that you aren’t wearing any.


----------



## laguna21

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Some are better than others for sure. The problem is, where can you find any masks? You can’t find them anywhere. And wearing one 15 times is a joke. Just another reason why you can’t force someone to wear one. I bet that guy who has a handle on a batch won’t give it up to others but will complain that you aren’t wearing any.


I was making some masks, using a very old sewing machine that belonged to my grandpa, he made sails for a living. Had a part break that I ordered but still waiting on, going to put some on the marketplace when things get rolling again, hopefully by early next week. I posted a couple pics a few days ago, they are washable, should be able to use many times


----------



## BeerBatter

https://www.dhgate.com/product/astronaut-spacesuits-mascot-inflatable-space/528629488.html

soon we’ll be wearing these babies
Lol
Just crazy
You just can’t keep running from a bully
Gotta face the dragon and be smart about it


----------



## 1more

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Some are better than others for sure. The problem is, where can you find any masks? You can’t find them anywhere. And wearing one 15 times is a joke. Just another reason why you can’t force someone to wear one. I bet that guy who has a handle on a batch won’t give it up to others but will complain that you aren’t wearing any.


I just received 2000 of the single use medical face mask and I paid 62.00 per 50 but I have 60 plus guys in the field and getting ready to place another order.


----------



## Dovans

Shad Rap said:


> How long do you think we are gonna keep this virus from one another?..it's impossible man...it's not because people don't give a ****...the virus isn't going away...you gonna wear a mask forever?..even people that wear masks, PPE are coming down with this virus...feel free to stay inside if you don't like the actions of others...it's a vicious world out there...and yes, I'm one of the irresponsible ones that doesn't wear a mask...call me an a$$hole I guess...


I have to wear a mask. Makes me unbelievably angry. Crock of crap. I see people all day long wearing masks beneath their nose.. Or they have to get fresh air so they take it of for few minutes. My favorite and no disrespect for those that have one, are people wearing these fishing gaiters. Cloth bandanas are another one of my favorites.. Love it when people think they can intrude my 6' space because they have a mask on. 
99% of customers have been great to work with. I tell you those 1% can really ruin your day.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Shad Rap said:


> How long do you think we are gonna keep this virus from one another?..it's impossible man...it's not because people don't give a ****...the virus isn't going away...you gonna wear a mask forever?..even people that wear masks, PPE are coming down with this virus...feel free to stay inside if you don't like the actions of others...it's a vicious world out there...and yes, I'm one of the irresponsible ones that doesn't wear a mask...call me an a$$hole I guess...


OK


----------



## bulafisherman

The whole mask situation is almost comical, it's a debacle. You hit the nail in the head with what you see when masks or anything so called protective is worn. People wearing them with them beneath their nose, adjusting them periodically, touching their face in the process, yet people still believe that it helps because authoritarian people say it's so. First they say don't wear them, them they say it's imperative we do, I wouldn't be a bit surprised if in the near future we are suddenly told stop, for whatever reason it's not beneficial. I don't buy it, everyone claims to be an expert. As long as the sheep follow because we have your best in mind.


----------



## PapawSmith

multi species angler said:


> It is said that mask are used to protect others, not the one wearing the mask.


I keep hearing this narrative that seems to have originated and has been pushed by the Governor, but since when have these masks been designed to protect others? We use a wide array of masks in our industry, for various disciplines, and not a single one is designed to protect anyone but the wearer. They are designed to protect you and you alone and have zero design intention to protect anyone around you. Same as the masks worn by first responders and medical personnel, they are to protect them, not you. They are designed to allow them to help you without them getting whatever it is you have that necessitates the help. A surgeon wears a mask during your surgery to keep you, your germs, and your bodily fluids the hell out of his system and that's all. Not too sure where "the masks are designed for protecting the other guy" crap came from, because they certainly are not. If you want to wear a mask to protect yourself, God bless you please wear one. But If I do not wear one I'm only risking my well being, not yours.


----------



## Legend killer

PapawSmith said:


> I keep hearing this narrative that seems to have originated and has been pushed by the Governor, but since when have these masks been designed to protect others? We use a wide array of masks in our industry, for various disciplines, and not a single one is designed to protect anyone but the wearer. They are designed to protect you and you alone and have zero design intention to protect anyone around you. Same as the masks worn by first responders and medical personnel, they are to protect them, not you. They are designed to allow them to help you without them getting whatever it is you have that necessitates the help. A surgeon wears a mask during your surgery to keep you, your germs, and your bodily fluids the hell out of his system and that's all. Not too sure where "the masks are designed for protecting the other guy" crap came from, because they certainly are not. If you want to wear a mask to protect yourself, God bless you please wear one. But If I do not wear one I'm only risking my well being, not yours.


SMH


----------



## Saugeyefisher

This might not be the longest thread on ogf,but it certainly is one of the most interesting.


----------



## multi species angler

A person wearing a mask and has a cough or sneeze are reducing the distance those virus carrying droplets are going. If some of you can't see that's helping protect others in the vicinity therefore it is protecting the other people around and not themselves. Any makeshift mask in that case is better than nothing. If you can't understand that then there is no use in discussing it any further.


----------



## ICENUT

If the masks and gloves really protected the wearer or the patient then why do doctors ,nurses,and other lab people keep getting sick with a lot of them dying also????soner or later you have to remove them and you touch them and guess what you just touched a infected piece of ppe. I guess we must do what they tell us but those folks in asia been wearing those masks seems like forever and there just as sick as we are from this maybe evn more so.


----------



## multi species angler

No, the virus isn't going away until there is a vaccine, that's why it so important to wear mask while out in close contact with people so as to help reduce the spreading of the virus. If we had of all been wearing mask from the very beginning there wouldn't be near as many people dead. Again the ball was dropped when we were told we didn't need to wear mask.


----------



## Snakecharmer

multi species angler said:


> A person wearing a mask and has a cough or sneeze are reducing the distance those virus carrying droplets are going. If some of you can't see that's helping protect others in the vicinity therefore it is protecting the other people around and not themselves. Any makeshift mask in that case is better than nothing. If you can't understand that then there is no use in discussing it any further.


+ 1....


----------



## PapawSmith

multi species angler said:


> A person wearing a mask and has a cough or sneeze are reducing the distance those virus carrying droplets are going. If some of you can't see that's helping protect others in the vicinity therefore it is protecting the other people around and not themselves. Any makeshift mask in that case is better than nothing. If you can't understand that then there is no use in discussing it any further.


it’s not a matter of “understanding” anything about any makeshift masks or what they might do. They are claiming that the masks are for protecting others and they simply are not, and every mask manufacturer will tell you that. If you sneeze or cough into your mask, the point blank nature of that action will cause the mask to push away from contact to your skin and release a significant amount of the particles expressed. It will certainly catch a good bit of it, and reduce the projection, but it will still be put there airborne and just after you sneezed you would remove the mask anyway. They claim that this is NOT an airborne virus and, if that is true, the most effective means of spread is thru contact, not inhalation of airborne particles. (Unless someone sneezes in your face, a whole different story). I have zero problem with anyone that wants to wear a mask wearing a mask but it is largely a waste of effort for everyone to wear the IMO, and a lot of medical professionals agree. You not getting that neither makes me ignorant nor you smart and if you don’t want to discuss it any further I’m good with that. It’s actually quite simple, all of these masks are designed solely for the protection of the wearer, period.


----------



## PapawSmith

Legend killer said:


> SMH


Maybe if your head didn’t shake so damn much your head would clear up enough for you to formulate a worthwhile contributive post.


----------



## ccc

Legend killer said:


> Again, masks are used to protect others. SMH


we from the retail world really like people who wear a mask


----------



## laguna21

Droplets, this virus is spread through droplets, 3-4 layers of a filtering fabric helps to keep us from inhaling, swallowing, sneezing or coughing these droplets and making airborne for someone else to.......... you got it, inhale or swallow


----------



## polebender

There are some people who are a-symptomatic who have the virus and probably don’t even realize it. How many? Who knows? They will never know unless they are tested. So if you go somewhere where there is likely to be more people than normal, i.e. a grocery store, it’s probably a good idea to wear a mask. My opinion. When I’m out fishing or somewhere where there’s not a good chance to come in contact with someone I don’t wear a mask.


----------



## PapawSmith

ccc said:


> well if the shoe fits....spoken from the world of retail... hope you dont ask for any help


Those are my words, not his. I believe he agrees with your position and deserves your compassion, not your contempt.


----------



## multi species angler

One last attempt:

A *surgical mask* is used inside the operating room or within other sterile *procedure* areas to protect the patient environment from contamination. ... A *procedure mask* is used for performing patient *procedures*, or when patients are *in* isolation to protect them from potential contaminants.

In the above instances the mask are used to protect the patient. It not the same as someone wearing a mask to protect themselves from chemical fumes or dust particles.

Just as there are many different mask there are many different reasons for wearing one.


----------



## aquaholic2

multi species angler said:


> One last attempt:
> 
> A *surgical mask* is used inside the operating room or within other sterile *procedure* areas to protect the patient environment from contamination. ... A *procedure mask* is used for performing patient *procedures*, or when patients are *in* isolation to protect them from potential contaminants.
> 
> In the above instances the mask are used to protect the patient. It not the same as someone wearing a mask to protect themselves from chemical fumes or dust particles.
> 
> Just as there are many different mask there are many different reasons for wearing one.


 Very interesting to go back to the OP, and see what has happened in less than two months. What a shame that current leaders in DC have decided to use this just like all other important issues to fuel the divide between us. Early March, few infections and fewer deaths in US, leaders said they had this under control, would be over quickly. Here we are less than two months later and over 60,000 Americans have died from the virus they had under control.
What I read here, see in my limited interactions with public, and continue to hear in national print and talks media, is plain and simple. There are two groups of people...those who continue to minimize the seriousness of this pandemic and protest safeguards, though guys who don't need to wear a mask...and buy into leaders who keep looking for miracle cures and quick fixes. And then there are those who understand that this is the most serious situation of our lifetimes, and we should trust the advice of the best medical agencies not political folks who only care about their next election. And the mask is the defining factor, while you can debate how much protection it provides to the wearer or others, nobody can deny that it reduces germ flow. Wearing a mask in public if nothing else, demonstrates that you want to be a part of the solution ....


----------



## Snakecharmer

PapawSmith said:


> I keep hearing this narrative that seems to have originated and has been pushed by the Governor, but since when have these masks been designed to protect others? We use a wide array of masks in our industry, for various disciplines, and not a single one is designed to protect anyone but the wearer. They are designed to protect you and you alone and have zero design intention to protect anyone around you. Same as the masks worn by first responders and medical personnel, they are to protect them, not you. They are designed to allow them to help you without them getting whatever it is you have that necessitates the help. A surgeon wears a mask during your surgery to keep you, your germs, and your bodily fluids the hell out of his system and that's all. Not too sure where "the masks are designed for protecting the other guy" crap came from, because they certainly are not. If you want to wear a mask to protect yourself, God bless you please wear one. But If I do not wear one I'm only risking my well being, not yours.


So you have been tested, and are not a carrier?


----------



## laguna21

aquaholic2 said:


> Very interesting to go back to the OP, and see what has happened in less than two months. What a shame that current leaders in DC have decided to use this just like all other important issues to fuel the divide between us. Early March, few infections and fewer deaths in US, leaders said they had this under control, would be over quickly. Here we are less than two months later and over 60,000 Americans have died from the virus they had under control.
> What I read here, see in my limited interactions with public, and continue to hear in national print and talks media, is plain and simple. There are two groups of people...those who continue to minimize the seriousness of this pandemic and protest safeguards, though guys who don't need to wear a mask...and buy into leaders who keep looking for miracle cures and quick fixes. And then there are those who understand that this is the most serious situation of our lifetimes, and we should trust the advice of the best medical agencies not political folks who only care about their next election. And the mask is the defining factor, while you can debate how much protection it provides to the wearer or others, nobody can deny that it reduces germ flow. Wearing a mask in public if nothing else, demonstrates that you want to be a part of the solution ....


Amen brother


----------



## Snakecharmer

aquaholic2 said:


> Very interesting to go back to the OP, and see what has happened in less than two months. What a shame that current leaders in DC have decided to use this just like all other important issues to fuel the divide between us. Early March, few infections and fewer deaths in US, leaders said they had this under control, would be over quickly. Here we are less than two months later and over 60,000 Americans have died from the virus they had under control.
> What I read here, see in my limited interactions with public, and continue to hear in national print and talks media, is plain and simple. There are two groups of people...those who continue to minimize the seriousness of this pandemic and protest safeguards, though guys who don't need to wear a mask...and buy into leaders who keep looking for miracle cures and quick fixes. And then there are those who understand that this is the most serious situation of our lifetimes, and we should trust the advice of the best medical agencies not political folks who only care about their next election. And the mask is the defining factor, while you can debate how much protection it provides to the wearer or others, nobody can deny that it reduces germ flow. Wearing a mask in public if nothing else, demonstrates that you want to be a part of the solution ....


+1 ..If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem!


----------



## crappiedude

Saugeyefisher said:


> This might not be the longest thread on ogf,but it certainly is one of the most interesting.


No way this thread beats the white snapper....no way
Just sayin


----------



## AmericanEagle

multi species angler said:


> No, the virus isn't going away until there is a vaccine, that's why it so important to wear mask while out in close contact with people so as to help reduce the spreading of the virus. If we had of all been wearing mask from the very beginning there wouldn't be near as many people dead. Again the ball was dropped when we were told we didn't need to wear mask.


+1 I agree that if everyone wore masks from the git go we would have had a better outcome.

IMHO the 2 big failures the USA made were the CDC not recommending everyone wear a mask and the inability of the CDC and the FDA to produce an adequate amount of tests to allow us to test, trace, and isolate those that were infected at the beginning of the outbreak.

I look at wearing a mask the same way I do wearing a seat belt in a car. A seat belt is not 100% effective but it puts the odds of surviving a wreck in your favor. A mask does the same thing with the virus.

The Asians wear masks and if you look at the deaths per million numbers on worldmeter
you see the USA at 186, Spain at 519, Italy at 458, South Korea at 5, Japan at 3, and Taiwan at .3.

Masks by themselves will not defeat the coronavirus but they are one part of the solution.


----------



## buckeyebowman

yonderfishin said:


> The immune system starts to decline at some point.


As does a lot of other stuff. 



STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Some are better than others for sure. The problem is, where can you find any masks? You can’t find them anywhere. And wearing one 15 times is a joke. Just another reason why you can’t force someone to wear one. I bet that guy who has a handle on a batch won’t give it up to others but will complain that you aren’t wearing any.


BINGO! Just the other day I made yet another stop at a drugstore, and rather than waste time wandering the aisles, I just asked the first employee the following questions. "Do you have masks?" "No." "Do you have rubbing alcohol?" "No." "Do you have hand sanitizer?" "I think we have one bottle left behind the front counter." "Do you have Aloe Vera gel?" "I think so. It's over here." They had a whole 2 tubes left. I bought a bottle of Everclear at the liquor store I (which seem to be remarkably well stocked), and have a recipe to make hand sanitizer from it and the gel. 



Dovans said:


> I have to wear a mask. Makes me unbelievably angry. Crock of crap. I see people all day long wearing masks beneath their nose.. Or they have to get fresh air so they take it of for few minutes. My favorite and no disrespect for those that have one, are people wearing these fishing gaiters. Cloth bandanas are another one of my favorites.. Love it when people think they can intrude my 6' space because they have a mask on.
> 99% of customers have been great to work with. I tell you those 1% can really ruin your day.


Was buying groceries last week and the guy behind me line seemed to be in a hurry! I was at the ATM terminal paying, and he was bringing his items right up to the end of belt. I turned to him and said, "Dude! You're crowding me!" He said, "Yeah? So what?!" I said, "Get to your line, or I'll rip both our masks off and give you a big wet kiss!" He got behind his line and glared at me the whole time! The cashier was losing it!


----------



## Burkcarp1

AmericanEagle said:


> +1 I agree that if everyone wore masks from the git go we would have had a better outcome.
> 
> IMHO the 2 big failures the USA made were the CDC not recommending everyone wear a mask and the inability of the CDC and the FDA to produce an adequate amount of tests to allow us to test, trace, and isolate those that were infected at the beginning of the outbreak.
> 
> I look at wearing a mask the same way I do wearing a seat belt in a car. A seat belt is not 100% effective but it puts the odds of surviving a wreck in your favor. A mask does the same thing with the virus.
> 
> The Asians wear masks and if you look at the deaths per million numbers on worldmeter
> you see the USA at 186, Spain at 519, Italy at 458, South Korea at 5, Japan at 3, and Taiwan at .3.
> 
> Masks by themselves will not defeat the coronavirus but they are one part of the solution.


The problem with the CDC recommending masks earlier was there wasn’t enough for the front lines and if they would have recommended them earlier there would have been a lot less.. remember the TP issue? Common sense..


----------



## PapawSmith

Snakecharmer said:


> So you have been tested, and are not a carrier?


What would your question have to do with anything, at all?


----------



## Snakecharmer

PapawSmith said:


> What would your question have to do with anything, at all?


If you not risking my well being you must have been tested and no virus...


----------



## PapawSmith

Snakecharmer said:


> If you not risking my well being you must have been tested and no virus...


if your well being is at risk then you need to stay home. This may sound cold but the whole world cannot stay under wraps because a minority of others are at risk. I want no harm for you, or anyone else, whatsoever, but we cannot shut down an entire nations collective social existence for the security of a few. This virus has proven to be somewhat more communicable, but less deadly, than the Flu. It needs to be treated accordingly and the nation does not need to suffer as a whole in order to accommodate it.


----------



## percidaeben

A surgeon and assistants don’t wear masks to protect themselves. It’s to protect the patient from their bacteria and in some instant viruses from invading the wound. Why do you think they scrub up Before a surgery? I was just a Vet assistant and always sanitized everything in the surgical room.


----------



## fastwater

There are those here that say they have heard Dr's stating the masks are to protect the mask wearer.
I have not heard that from any of the Doctors I've heard speak about wearing them.
The ones I have heard have all stated the masks...along with social distancing protects those around the person wearing the mask.
Not so much the mask wearer themselves. And yes, these doctors are stating that even a bandana is better than nothing.

One thing we all feel the same about is we are all tired of the havoc and torment this virus has put the whole world through.
Obviously, some have had the ultimate horrible torment with the death of a loved one or friend. Heck...a few have lost several family members including children from the same family.
Some have been laid off...maybe even lost their jobs.
Some may have lost their houses and even more that haven't lost their homes are in financial straights.
Then their are the least tormented and those are the ones that are surviving as good or better than most but are restricted to where they can go due to closings and whether we have to wear masks or not if we go outside or around places like the grocery store that has a good number of people in one area.

IMO, this mask wearing business is just more of the same when it comes to opinions on everything society has had from the onset of covid19. Everyone's got their own opinion and for the most part, unless they are forced to do something, they just aren't going to do what is suggested even if it's suggested they should do it from the best medical professionals in the world.
So all the useless arguing back in forth is just that useless arguing.

Sooo...we are in the middle of trying to open the country back up.
Most every medical professional has stated they feel it's to early to do so.
We have decided to do it in segments anyway.
But from the POTUS on down, all have stated they will be keeping an eye out for increasing cases or potential new 'hotspots' and will make adjustments as needed.
Guess it really doesn't matter which side of the mask wearing fence we are sitting on. It's been highly advised by top medical professionals that again, feel we are opening things up to soon, to wear masks. On the advice of these medical professionals, it's been strongly suggested by leaders that we wear them when going out and about plus mandatory social distancing and sanitizing as we have been doing.
If we don't and things stay the same...or maybe go up just a tad...GREAT!
If we don't and things spike, things will be ordered to start shutting down again in the troubled areas.

Wear a mask or not...Don't think it's really any more complicated then that....

One thing that's a 100% guarantee though...as long as OGF is still here and this thread is open, there will be more internet Doctor opinions, griping and false statements going on than with any other thread on OGF.


----------



## cheezemm2

fastwater said:


> ....
> 
> One thing that's a 100% guarantee though...as long as OGF is still here and this thread is open, there will be more internet Doctor opinions, griping and false statements going on than with any other thread on OGF.


This X1000. There is some palpable trolling going on from some others and I have for the first time ever, since the gofishohio days, have prescribed myself 100mg of the ignore button. 

Well stated Fastwater!


----------



## Patricio

In my county, Pierce county Wisconsin, we've had 4 cases 0 deaths. In Minnesota, 78% of deaths have been at old people homes, 99% have had underlying Illnesses. Wisconsin isnt releasing that info. In Wisconsin, 6500 cases, 300 deaths. In Minnesota, 4600 cases about the same deaths. Minnesota never shut down parks, they encouraged people to get out. Ugh.


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## loves2fishinohio

My son graduates from high school this year. I think his attitude about all this puts things in perspective. He's going to miss a graduation ceremony and senior prom. He told me yesterday, "At least I'm not going to Vietnam like my uncle had to following his senior year."


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

45% of my clients are physicians. I work with every type and every practice area. I’m personal friends with more than a dozen. I speak with them every day; often several per day.

I can say listening to them every day and reading this thread most people don’t have a clue.


----------



## Redheads

I agree, the mask wearing should have been pushed heavily or mandated early on

Putting a mask on now is like putting on a condom after shes already pregnant. Sure it may protect you against somethings but the damage is done.


----------



## Burkcarp1




----------



## multi species angler

Redheads said:


> I agree, the mask wearing should have been pushed heavily or mandated early on
> 
> Putting a mask on now is like putting on a condom after shes already pregnant. Sure it may protect you against somethings but the damage is done.


 No, but putting that condom on can prevent another person from getting pregnant.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Burkcarp1 said:


> View attachment 354765


Wow...Less than 9,000 total cases in the USA. We're having that many corana deaths in the USA in 4 days.
https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6911a3.htm#T2_down


----------



## Burkcarp1




----------



## Saugeyefisher

He said,she said,they said. That's what I got out of that. I have a hard time believing someone that cant speak for themselves, and calling people cowards through someone else.


----------



## Lewis

I ordered n95 masks recently from this company at a decent price. Received them in about 5 days. https://www.snowjoe.com/pages/search-results?q=mask


----------



## Shad Rap

multi species angler said:


> No, but putting that condom on can prevent another person from getting pregnant.


Not necessarily...that's irrelevant anyway...you can wear all the PPE and masks all you want...you ARE NOT gonna avoid this...I've seen it firsthand numerous times...good luck though.
Either you're gonna get it, or you're not!
As stated...mandating masks now is stupid...but IMO, this whole process has been stupid so it really wouldn't surprise me...
And guess what happens when the condom comes off?...yep, she's pregnant...have fun wearing a mask and PPE the rest of your life.


----------



## Shad Rap

Snakecharmer said:


> Wow...Less than 9,000 total cases in the USA. We're having that many corana deaths in the USA in 4 days.
> https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6911a3.htm#T2_down


Thats because the numbers are lagged and the numbers aren't even accurate...we're not having 9,000 people die in 4 days from corona...never have.


----------



## backlashed

hatteras1 said:


> The numbers are changing every 30 minutes and 81 areas/countries are listed. The cure is said to be a year to a year and a half away. My girlfriend works in a hospital, so i'm taking this one serious.


Hey, good to see a Fish Militia refugee on this site. Never trust a dead shark.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Shad Rap said:


> Thats because the numbers are lagged and the numbers aren't even accurate...we're not having 9,000 people die in 4 days from corona...never have.


9000 in 4 days... absurd. I guess you gotta get that death toll to rise one way or the other.


----------



## backlashed

Burkcarp1 said:


> View attachment 354765



Maybe this is why. From the CDC. 

"In 2017, the most recent data available, 515 deaths in the United States were attributed to TB. This is a decrease from 528 deaths attributed to TB in 2016."

Less than 10,000 cases in 2018.

Antibiotics fight TB. You're not going to get TB from a trip to the grocery on any given day.


----------



## backlashed

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> 9000 in 4 days... absurd. I guess you gotta get that death toll to rise one way or the other.


You need to check the numbers again.


----------



## bad luck

What’s the big deal.....masks ARE NOT required by law. If a store wants to require them—it’s their right (no shirt - no shoes - no dice )

if a person is so concerned about this, that they go above/beyond law, and where a mask, so be it——BUT DONT JUDGE OTHERS FOR BEING LEGAL....

if a person feels so strongly that the thought of possibly running into somebody w/o a mask ignites strong emotions.....then there is a logic & simple solution— don’t leave your house. 

makes me think of the militant former smokers....the mere scent of cigarette smoke in the public (pardon the pun...) gets them all lit up.


----------



## Saugeyefisher

So just went to Wendy's for lunch. Wanted a double stack. We are not selling double stacks. Ok give me 2 cheeseburgers. 
Got them, asked why there not selling double stacks? Because there experiencing a beef shortage.... lol ok so will sell u 2 singles but not one double.... 
Just thought it was funny


----------



## EnonEye

This thread is getting more and more fake news every day but gotta say it's been entertaining. BTW, N95 masks are intended for front line workers only, not the general public. Unless I'm unaware of some new declaration that front line workers have a gluttony of N95 masks now. No biggie , front line workers are only risking their life to save yours. Let's see if we can completely overwhelm them with sick people refusing to follow a few basic temporary hygiene steps


----------



## Saugeye Tom

MASKS AND CONSTANT SANITIZING WILL LOWER YOUR IMMUNITY TO ALL SICKNESS. YOUR BODY NEEDS TO BUILD UP ITS IMMUNE SYSTEM


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

backlashed said:


> You need to check the numbers again.
> View attachment 354797


Again, absurd. These numbers are for the fear mongers. If you can prove that those are all from Coronavirus I might believe it. Might..


----------



## multi species angler

Saugeye Tom said:


> MASKS AND CONSTANT SANITIZING WILL LOWER YOUR IMMUNITY TO ALL SICKNESS. YOUR BODY NEEDS TO BUILD UP ITS IMMUNE SYSTEM


 Well until they come out with something that just kills the corona virus, what to do what to do. Dying lowers your immune system quicker.


----------



## Specwar

You’re talking a healthcare system that has no cure for the common cold, the flu, has been taking in trillions of $$ searching for a cure for cancer, was unprepared for a new flu like strain, and on and on. Give me a frickin break!!
Things don’t change, people change. Perhaps the wrong people are in power in this field.
Test this, test that, test whatever you want. Statistics done create immunity.
Once the stay in place orders are rescinded and people crawl out from under their hiding places then nature can take its course.


----------



## bulafisherman

Burkcarp1 said:


>


 i have heard of this type of thing going on from other sources, have to ask yourself what would these people have to gain by just making up these types of lies? There are a number of doctors also out there trying to expose the lies and getting censored putting it out there! Unless you look for it your not going to find this information because the mainstream media has control on what gets put out there. If we apply common sense, look at what's going on, there is no way this makes sense! To many things don't add up! We the people need to wake up! We Come together and not allow this to divide us as people, I have said this before and I will say it again, follow the money and you will know the agenda, it's that simple. Not all is as it seems. All I'am saying is open your minds and allow yourselves to look at the bigger picture.


----------



## bobk

bulafisherman said:


> i have heard of this type of thing going on from other sources, have to ask yourself what would these people have to gain by just making up these types of lies? There are a number of doctors also out there trying to expose the lies and getting censored putting it out there! Unless you look for it your not going to find this information because the mainstream media has control on what gets put out there. If we apply common sense, look at what's going on, there is no way this makes sense! To many things don't add up! We the people need to wake up! We Come together and not allow this to divide us as people, I have said this before and I will say it again, follow the money and you will know the agenda, it's that simple. Not all is as it seems. All I'am saying is open your minds and allow yourselves to look at the bigger picture.


Exactly what would be the agenda for wanting to wreck the economy and to willingly let people die in the hospital?


----------



## bulafisherman

I would also like to add, just the fact that these people including doctors that are experiencing censorship, should be a huge red flag to all of us, it should be our sovereign fundamental right to freely express ourselves without censorship and be our choice as to what we want to believe and not believe without persecution or censorship. Throw politics and religion aside! We should have that basic right!


----------



## Burkcarp1

bobk said:


> Exactly what would be the agenda for wanting to wreck the economy and to willingly let people die in the hospital?


That’s easy to answer but not here.


----------



## bulafisherman

bobk said:


> Exactly what would be the agenda for wanting to wreck the economy and to willingly let people die in the hospital?


 that is up to each and every individual to decide once they seek out the truth, make your informed decision than, IAM not the one to tell you that.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Saugeye Tom said:


> MASKS AND CONSTANT SANITIZING WILL LOWER YOUR IMMUNITY TO ALL SICKNESS. YOUR BODY NEEDS TO BUILD UP ITS IMMUNE SYSTEM


Source?


----------



## Snakecharmer

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Again, absurd. These numbers are for the fear mongers. If you can prove that those are all from Coronavirus I might believe it. Might..


And Apollo didn't land on the moon, Right?


----------



## EnonEye

ya know I think the earth really is flat, rats were completely innocent of the bubonic plague, and a few leeches strategically placed on an open wound is good for you, science is nuts huh? Now where'd my maluminum top hat go


----------



## bobk

Burkcarp1 said:


> That’s easy to answer but not here.


I’m not wanting it to go political. That’s for sure. I’m just not sure what there is to gain by wrecking so much financially and physically. I have to admit though, I’m not watching the news or any videos on it anymore. It was too depressing. My attitude has been much better the last 3 weeks. I was in a funk from watching the news and knew I needed to stop. Heck I’ve even avoided this thread for a while.


----------



## Snakecharmer

*Face Covering Requirements*
To protect our members and employees, effective May 4, all Costco members and guests must wear a face covering that covers their mouth and nose at all times while at Costco. This requirement does not apply to children under the age of 2 or to individuals who are unable to wear a face covering due to a medical condition.

The use of a face covering should not be seen as a substitute for social distancing. Please continue to observe rules regarding appropriate distancing while on Costco premises. Thank you for your understanding and cooperation.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Snakecharmer said:


> And Apollo didn't land on the moon, Right?


You said that, I didn’t. But it means nothing to the bs of your post.


----------



## cement569

heres something to ponder, my friend has a sister who works at cleve. clinic. she told him they sealed off one whole floor for corona patients and as of last week there were 9 patients, it makes one wonder why there are no visiters allowed on that floor. ive known tom for many years and he has never ever bullsh**ted me, so if hes lying im lying


----------



## multi species angler

Specwar said:


> Once the stay in place orders are rescinded and people crawl out from under their hiding places then nature can take its course.


 Why go to a DR. for any medical condition, just let nature take it's course. I'll bet there isn't a single person on here that hasn't went to a DR. for some type of ailment instead of just letting nature take it's course. And if some of you have been fortunate enough to avoid all DR's I'll bet you have taken a family member. We are all wanting the same thing, STAY ALIVE AS LONG AS WE CAN. DO ALL WE CAN AND HOPE FOR A VACCINE AND A RELIABLE TREATMENT. Yes a lot of us are going to get this virus and some us will die with it. But to just throw all caution to the wind is just plain STUPID.


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

Company update this morning. Our policies until further notice:

We are still being told to work at home if at all possible - only come to the office spaces if necessary. No guests or clients in our office spaces. No unessential business travel. All out of state travel must be approved in advance by management. Essential work requiring travel out of state, or anybody that comes in contact with others outside family units should work at home and self quarantine 14 days. Everybody is required to self check daily - if you have any thought you are ill stay at home. Supplies are in all work areas. If you into the office you are required to sanitize your work area every day. You are required to stay 6 ft from others and wear a mask in all common areas, cubicles, etc. The only exception to wearing a mask is if you are working on a large space alone. You must still have a mask in any and all common areas. No vacations out of state without notification. You can take vacation, but you must quarantine for 14 days after returning and the company wants to monitor this. 

President asked about timeline - "until further notice, but certainly expect to follow these guidelines through May". Sounds like it is "hermit life 2020" for me.


----------



## burnsj5

cement569 said:


> heres something to ponder, my friend has a sister who works at cleve. clinic. she told him they sealed off one whole floor for corona patients and as of last week there were 9 patients, it makes one wonder why there are no visiters allowed on that floor. ive known tom for many years and he has never ever bullsh**ted me, so if hes lying im lying


You wonder why they don't want visitors on an active covid unit or with person's of interest they suspect may have covid? 
Guys, it's all clear; covid is a front, it's all crisis actors, why you ask? Let me tell you, my cousin's, friends, sister's yellow lab works at NASA and he said that they need everyone inside while they set up the 5G substations. The new 5G wireless will kill and make some people sick but will then be able to blame covid for the new illnesses when it was 5G the whole time!!! That's straight from the golden retrievers mouth and they are a trustworthy breed, he has a YouTube channel coming out too but scared he might lose his job, just be sure to like and subscribe before it gets demonetized from people who are trying to keep the truth from being spread to the public.


----------



## lawrence1

Hey man, its true about that 5G man, it like spins up the electrons man. They want a new world order and stuff man. The blue helmets will be like coming down your street soon man to collect your guns man. They want to suppress your thoughts man, don't let them man. Its like you know what I'm sayin and stuff. Just make sure you're like on the winning team man.


----------



## Specwar

multi species angler said:


> Why go to a DR. for any medical condition, just let nature take it's course. I'll bet there isn't a single person on here that hasn't went to a DR. for some type of ailment instead of just letting nature take it's course. And if some of you have been fortunate enough to avoid all DR's I'll bet you have taken a family member. We are all wanting the same thing, STAY ALIVE AS LONG AS WE CAN. DO ALL WE CAN AND HOPE FOR A VACCINE AND A RELIABLE TREATMENT. Yes a lot of us are going to get this virus and some us will die with it. But to just throw all caution to the wind is just plain STUPID.


I don’t recall stating anything about not going to a Doctor. What I said was the healthcare system is inadequate.
Nature taking its course is the bodies ability to develop immunity to diseases. Lighten up guy.


----------



## laguna21

Ya know, the local news shows the long lines at the food bank every day, record numbers of meals those people are handing out. My question is what were these people eating before all of this? If you were layed off from a full time job your now getting more than half of your salary in unemployment plus $600 plus stimulus money? Some pretty nice newer expensive cars in that long line!


----------



## MagicMarker

Offer it and they will come


----------



## bobk

laguna21 said:


> Ya know, the local news shows the long lines at the food bank every day, record numbers of meals those people are handing out. My question is what were these people eating before all of this? If you were layed off from a full time job your now getting more than half of your salary in unemployment plus $600 plus stimulus money? Some pretty nice newer expensive cars in that long line!


We have created a new breed of leeches with all this free money. This will be a big problem when companies start calling people back. Many are going to just laugh and stay home.


----------



## cement569

bobk, I played the unemployment game for 32 years working construction and being seasonal. if you refuse work or a call back to work your claim is terminated, and if they don't catch it right away and you continue collecting you have to pay that money back....they don't play games


----------



## crappiedude

multi species angler said:


> No, but putting that condom on can prevent another person from getting pregnant.


But not if they're 6' away...that's why its called* social distancing.
*


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

Saugeyefisher said:


> So just went to Wendy's for lunch. Wanted a double stack. We are not selling double stacks. Ok give me 2 cheeseburgers.
> Got them, asked why there not selling double stacks? Because there experiencing a beef shortage.... lol ok so will sell u 2 singles but not one double....
> Just thought it was funny


That IS funny, remember the good ol days when the double stacks were only $1. I think I was part of the reason they raised the price.


----------



## Muddy

laguna21 said:


> Ya know, the local news shows the long lines at the food bank every day, record numbers of meals those people are handing out. My question is what were these people eating before all of this? If you were layed off from a full time job your now getting more than half of your salary in unemployment plus $600 plus stimulus money? Some pretty nice newer expensive cars in that long line!


I’ve noticed the nice cars, SUV’s, and trucks in those lines as well. Almost all of them are way newer and nicer than my truck. It’s amazing how many Americans finance away every dollar that they make.


----------



## JamesF

Muddy said:


> I’ve noticed the nice cars, SUV’s, and trucks in those lines as well. Almost all of them are way newer and nicer than my truck. It’s amazing how many Americans finance away every dollar that they make.


That goes way back to the 60's.
It's called Welfare! People learned how to play the game just as it was under way. Before the plan was completed a certain person who designed the program didn't live long enough to finish the completion process. And it's still stuck in Limbo!! If this is not, acceptable to the TOS ,Please remove it.


----------



## cheezemm2

Want to fly? Better wear a mask. 

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...facial-coverings-on-u-s-flights-idUSKBN22C3QZ


----------



## cement569

nope, don't choose to fly never did. I feel if I was meant to fly I would have been born with wings. that was my grandfathers saying, he was full blooded native american


----------



## EnonEye

bobk said:


> We have created a new breed of leeches with all this free money. This will be a big problem when companies start calling people back. Many are going to just laugh and stay home.


guy on local news tonight, has under $100 left to his name, layed off, family, says "I just don't know what to do". Next news item is the thousands of jobs open here in the area. I don't know what to do??? I yai eye!


----------



## burnsj5

bobk said:


> We have created a new breed of leeches with all this free money. This will be a big problem when companies start calling people back. Many are going to just laugh and stay home.


The $600 extra is only a temporary measure. Once it ends one would think those millions of folks out of work will probably want to return to work.
In the same breath as those complaining about such benefits I could easily say how do folks not have at least 12 months of savings in case no income situation, what losers wouldn't have that type of money saved, I mean doesnt everyone save like I do?! Who even use any type of social assistance? Is there a difference between people who financed nice cars and lost their jobs living pay check to pay check and the people who don't have 12 months saved up in case of an emergency?


----------



## Dovans

EnonEye said:


> guy on local news tonight, has under $100 left to his name, layed off, family, says "I just don't know what to do". Next news item is the thousands of jobs open here in the area. I don't know what to do??? I yai eye!


saw that... Dont recall what his job was.


----------



## buckeyebowman

cement569 said:


> nope, don't choose to fly never did. I feel if I was meant to fly I would have been born with wings. that was my grandfathers saying, he was full blooded native american


My reply to that old saying is, if God didn't intend for man to fly, he wouldn't have given us the brains to figure out how to build airplanes.

Now to COVID. We have to start coming out of our foxholes at some point. We just have to take it slow and keep an eye out. Read an article in the paper today that was headlined *"One day Valley death toll hits new high of 19"*. The reporter did some digging and found this out. Of those 19 deaths 8 have occurred from Sunday through Wednesday, so 2 per day. The other 11 happened last week or before. Further analysis revealed that the deadliest day in this area was 4/15. Next deadliest was 4/14, and third was 4/16. So, our worst patch was right in the middle of the month, and we've been on a downhill track since. One reason the numbers are all jacked up is because these news reports are dependent on when the death certificates come back from the DOH. 

And for the poster who asked if any had NEVER been to the doctor for an illness, I can put my hand up. At least since I've been responsible for my own health care. That's not to say I've never been to a doctor in that time. I needed a doctor to cast my broken ankle, remove my wisdom teeth, and repair my torn ACL. I've gone for injury, never illness. Genetics may have something to do with it. My Mom lived to 86 years old, and took zero prescriptions!


----------



## MagicMarker

buckeyebowman said:


> My reply to that old saying is, if God didn't intend for man to fly, he wouldn't have given us the brains to figure out how to build airplanes.
> 
> Now to COVID. We have to start coming out of our foxholes at some point. We just have to take it slow and keep an eye out. Read an article in the paper today that was headlined *"One day Valley death toll hits new high of 19"*. The reporter did some digging and found this out. Of those 19 deaths 8 have occurred from Sunday through Wednesday, so 2 per day. The other 11 happened last week or before. Further analysis revealed that the deadliest day in this area was 4/15. Next deadliest was 4/14, and third was 4/16. So, our worst patch was right in the middle of the month, and we've been on a downhill track since. One reason the numbers are all jacked up is because these news reports are dependent on when the death certificates come back from the DOH.
> 
> And for the poster who asked if any had NEVER been to the doctor for an illness, I can put my hand up. At least since I've been responsible for my own health care. That's not to say I've never been to a doctor in that time. I needed a doctor to cast my broken ankle, remove my wisdom teeth, and repair my torn ACL. I've gone for injury, never illness. Genetics may have something to do with it. My Mom lived to 86 years old, and took zero prescriptions!


I recently retired from driving a truck for 35 years only times I went to doctor was getting was getting my health card renewed every two years to be legal to drive. I missed work 3 days in all those years


----------



## Burkcarp1

I was to the doctor twice in the last 25 yrs. and it was for a skin condition that I needed a scrip for


----------



## Saugeye Tom

Snakecharmer said:


> Source?


Ask any doctor. My dr explained this to me


----------



## Burkcarp1

Saugeye Tom said:


> Ask any doctor. My dr explained this to me


Also common sense


----------



## bulafisherman

explains it for those that can't see the the bigger issue and direction this is headed in.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Saugeye Tom said:


> Ask any doctor. My dr explained this to me


Are you one of the guys that doesn't wash his hands after using the toilet to build up immunity?


----------



## All Thumbs

burnsj5 said:


> In the same breath as those complaining about such benefits I could easily say how do folks not have at least 12 months of savings in case no income situation, what losers wouldn't have that type of money saved, I mean doesnt everyone save like I do?!


over 50% of americans live from paycheck to paycheck and it is stressful for us losers. i am thankful that there are some folks like you that have their sh%t together. 
plus in your situation and people like kanye west have the opportunity to become pompous a%%es and degrade us poor losers but luckily you all don't do that


----------



## bulafisherman

Snakecharmer said:


> Are you one of the guys that doesn't wash his hands after using the toilet to build up immunity?


 that's some funny stuff!


----------



## Saugeye Tom

Snakecharmer said:


> Are you one of the guys that doesn't wash his hands after using the toilet to build up immunity?


Hopefully your kidding


----------



## Burkcarp1

Saugeye Tom said:


> Hopefully your kidding


He’s trolling, Some people can’t stand it that some of us aren’t living in fear..


----------



## dcool

I don't know why anyone would read the paper or watch the news about this virus when they can read this thread everyday and get all the expert advice they need to know.


----------



## burnsj5

Burkcarp1 said:


> He’s trolling, Some people can’t stand it that some of us aren’t living in fear..


"I guess some just don't want to live forever" 
---Dwight Schrute


----------



## AmericanEagle

This article analyzes deaths from the flu vs covid-19. It points out that the 25,000 to 69,000 deaths per year from the flu statistic is an estimate. It is not confirmed deaths. The confirmed deaths from the flu in the last six seasons ranged from 3,448 to 15,620.

https://blogs.scientificamerican.co...u-deaths-is-like-comparing-apples-to-oranges/


----------



## backlashed

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Again, absurd. These numbers are for the fear mongers. If you can prove that those are all from Coronavirus I might believe it. Might..


Since this article came out the Brits have admitted they are under-counting to the tune of 41% or more. The Chinese admitted they under-counted. NY realized they are under-counting. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...about-the-uks-coronavirus-death-toll-is-wrong

Why would you say absurd? What proof do you have that the numbers are not good? Pushing the numbers up supports an argument for shutting economies down, not opening them up.


----------



## Lewzer

https://www.theguardian.com/books/2...t-plague-literature-tells-us-about-our-future


----------



## burnsj5

All Thumbs said:


> over 50% of americans live from paycheck to paycheck and it is stressful for us losers. i am thankful that there are some folks like you that have their sh%t together.
> plus in your situation and people like kanye west have the opportunity to become pompous a%%es and degrade us poor losers but luckily you all don't do that


Just to be clear I was saying that tongue in cheek as I felt people were being overly judgemental in regards to folks trying to get help. Your not a loser and no one else is for how much money a person has or doesn't have. Most of us are all one or 2 tragedies away from being in the poor house. It takes one spouse getting terminally ill or natural disaster and you could have years of expected bills saved yet burn through it in a few months. That was part of my point, one reason you see nice cars is the middle American is getting hit hardest right now with so many out of work. The car payment that was easily afforded no longer is and now are trying to keep their head above water. 
It's wrong to judge other people, we don't know their story and its easy to blame people for being in the predicament until you get put in the same. 
Also, sorry for going off covid thread topic, got carried away a bit.


----------



## Burkcarp1

Last night while we were sleeping unelected Acton extended the stay at home order again for another month.


----------



## ICENUT

bobk said:


> We have created a new breed of leeches with all this free money. This will be a big problem when companies start calling people back. Many are going to just laugh and stay home.


do you understand that when unemployed and your company or place of employment calle you back to work your unemployment ends you cant fool them if you take the money after that they will get you so your 600 bonanza ends. Just b/c someones on unemployment there not living a life of riley it ENDS.People are not losers its thru no fault of there own in most cases if you never been on it consider yourself fortunate


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

backlashed said:


> Since this article came out the Brits have admitted they are under-counting to the tune of 41% or more. The Chinese admitted they under-counted. NY realized they are under-counting. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...about-the-uks-coronavirus-death-toll-is-wrong
> 
> Why would you say absurd? What proof do you have that the numbers are not good? Pushing the numbers up supports an argument for shutting economies down, not opening them up.[/]
> Fake news... You have your opinion, I have mine.


----------



## Specwar

Burkcarp1 said:


> Last night while we were sleeping unelected Acton extended the stay at home order again for another month.


Not defending her, however she is merely a puppet and does what is told of her.
For someone in her position she so a very , um , um poor spokesperson.


----------



## Specwar

Estimates 


STRONGPERSUADER said:


> [/QUOTE


----------



## bobk

ICENUT said:


> do you understand that when unemployed and your company or place of employment calle you back to work your unemployment ends you cant fool them if you take the money after that they will get you so your 600 bonanza ends. Just b/c someones on unemployment there not living a life of riley it ENDS.People are not losers its thru no fault of there own in most cases if you never been on it consider yourself fortunate


First, I didn’t call anyone a loser for being on unemployment. Yes, I understand how it works and have been on it myself. I also understand how much the whole system that’s setup to “help” people is abused.


----------



## fastwater

ICENUT said:


> do you understand that when unemployed and your company or place of employment calle you back to work your unemployment ends you cant fool them if you take the money after that they will get you so your 600 bonanza ends. Just b/c someones on unemployment there not living a life of riley it ENDS.People are not losers its thru no fault of there own in most cases if you never been on it consider yourself fortunate


Have not read one of bobk's post in which he's called anyone a loser or even hinted that the size of their bank account determined if they were a loser or not.


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

I'll tell you one thing I wish that virus would kill................................this thread.


----------



## ICENUT

fastwater said:


> Have not read one of bobk's post in which he's called anyone a loser or even hinted that the size of their bank account determined if they were a loser or not.


Ok wrong word how about leeches


----------



## Dovans

https://www.cnn.com/2020/05/01/health/flu-vs-coronavirus-deaths/index.html


----------



## OptOutside440

Open up our State and shut down this thread!


----------



## burnsj5

OptOutside440 said:


> Open up our State and shut down this thread!


Whether right or wrong I'm at this point 100% Had to get some dog food so only caught the question and answer portion of today's daily briefing for Ohio. There are so many unknowns and unanswered questions, brought up by many in a joking manner about your average Joe should be leading the way if they know everything, it feels they might as well sometimes. When listening today, example; certain county has high death rate and low infection rate compared to other counties, why? Answer, 3-5 minutes of irrelevant info with the conclusion, scientifically I can't answer that. Ok, well then save the time and say that from the start. The question about when will camp grounds open, openly states it's easy to social distance in such settings, acknowledges summer is coming up and people are antsy to camp, gives non specific answer about a group looking into it and within the next several weeks. I'm usually at work when these are on and seems I'm not missing much. Off today and thought with states opening up a bit this month would hear something new, wasn't the case. If I missed something would love to hear from others.


----------



## multi species angler

For ALL of you that want this thread killed. IGNORE IT, DONE!!


----------



## burnsj5

multi species angler said:


> For ALL of you that want this thread killed. IGNORE IT, DONE!!


Fair enough, I don't mean to say I want the thread killed, simply the scenario that created it. Grilling out and have time to kill as no friends or family to come over with this going on, easy way to kill time.


----------



## cincinnati

If you watched the Factless Briefing today, they're already setting the stage for this to continue through the Summer.


----------



## Specwar

Actually they said they will continue to layout plans for further reopening over the next several weeks.
I would like it to open quickly, but that just isn’t gonna happen. I can adjust as what I do is basically up to me. 
The only questions I would really like answered is how many of the current 1002 deaths in Ohio were actually _*caused by the covd19, not attributed to by it, and how many of the 18,743 confirmed cases have those that had it gotten over it? *_Those numbers are never given, and are more than likely unknown.
If you’re gonna use statistics you better show them all.


----------



## multi species angler

cincinnati said:


> If you watched the Factless Briefing today, they're already setting the stage for this to continue through the Summer.


 It's going to continue longer than that and thousands more are going to die. People seem to be willing to bet their life that if they do get the virus it won't kill them. Just look at the crowds on some of these beaches. This is going to go on until there is a vaccine or reliable treatment. These protesters as well as the beach goers and all who are not practicing social distancing are risking their lives as well as anyone they or their bodily fluids come in contact with if they are caring the virus. Opening up too soon is going to guarantee another shut down.


----------



## Legend killer

multi species angler said:


> It's going to continue longer than that and thousands more are going to die. People seem to be willing to bet their life that if they do get the virus it won't kill them. Just look at the crowds on some of these beaches. This is going to go on until there is a vaccine or reliable treatment. These protesters as well as the beach goers and all who are not practicing social distancing are risking their lives as well as anyone they or their bodily fluids come in contact with if they are caring the virus. Opening up too soon is going to guarantee another shut down.


Someone with some sanity


----------



## ICENUT

this is going to be a long process the more they test the more positive cases and the more infected.As things open up and they have to we cant stay confined forever there saying a year at least till a vaccine and even then perhaps only 30 million vaccines not even counting even after get vaccine takes weeks to develop any immunity if at all that there not even sure of.Its is unfortunate but it is the world we live in the world as we know it will be quite a bit different.There is a lot we can do to keep the misery down but as the doctors and experts say its the virus that's calling the shots not us.I just hope as a country we keep our wits about us say some prayers help each other as much as we can and hopefully come out of this thing better!!!!


----------



## AmericanEagle

In watching the daily briefings this week on restarting Ohio I am hopeful that the plan to starve the coronavirus could work. The virus can only exist if it can keep infecting new people. A system of testing, isolation, contact tracing, and quarantine could starve the virus and keep it from spreading. 

Ohio would need to do rapid testing of any suspect case, immediate isolation of anyone who was a confirmed or suspected case, and then contact trace all the close contacts and quarantine them for 14 days so that they could figure out if any of them were infected.

Taiwan, South Korea, and Hong Kong have shown this can work. It remains to be seen if we can execute successfully.


----------



## fishless

AmericanEagle said:


> In watching the daily briefings this week on restarting Ohio I am hopeful that the plan to starve the coronavirus could work. The virus can only exist if it can keep infecting new people. A system of testing, isolation, contact tracing, and quarantine could starve the virus and keep it from spreading.
> 
> Ohio would need to do rapid testing of any suspect case, immediate isolation of anyone who was a confirmed or suspected case, and then contact trace all the close contacts and quarantine them for 14 days so that they could figure out if any of them were infected.
> 
> Taiwan, South Korea, and Hong Kong have shown this can work. It remains to be seen if we can execute successfully.


Sounds like we still don't have enough test available


----------



## Dovans

fishless said:


> Sounds like we still don't have enough test available


My understanding is that we have the tests, it's the processing of the tests.


----------



## Misdirection

Starting Monday, the company I work for us offering the serology testing for Covid-19. That will tell you if you currently have it, previously had it, and if you have antibodies to it. I plan on scheduling my tests. Takes 3-4 days from the blood draw to get the results. Will be interested in what it says.

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


----------



## yonderfishin

Im kinda late getting in on the mask part of the discussion but if virus is in moisture or droplets in the air there is a good chance it will stick to the outside of mask fabric even though the virus itself is small enough to get through. Not saying this as a doctor or expert , its just physics really. When moisture touches dry fabric it sticks , usually wicks right into the fibers. That is atleast " potential " protection for the wearer. Anything is better than nothing right ?

But anything we do is really just to slow the infection rate , that has been the point since the beginning. With vaccination still so far away , all or most of us will be exposed at some point , its unrealistic to think we can avoid something for so long that many are unaware they are spreading. And a lot of us wont get the vaccination either because we dont trust it and/or we know whats in them ( preservatives , disinfectants , mercury , ....look it up , and with the rush job put on development could be worse ) the only logical outcome would be immunity by infection.


----------



## Legend killer

If the gentleman screaming at the officer is wearing a mask, the mask would keep his droplets to himself.


----------



## fastwater

Doesnt look as though he worries about social distancing either.


----------



## loves2fishinohio

Well, for what it is worth the Mrs went back to work yesterday. She works at a motorcycle superstore, and they were cleared to open. She said it was the busiest day she's ever had in the 3+ years she has worked there. So I take that as a VERY good sign and gives me hope for when other retailers open. And I cannot wait to be able to go out to eat somewhere.


----------



## Patricio

Today, 73 and sunny. I'll be out trout fishing in a few. And I know a nice watering hole in the sticks that has 'carry out', carry it out to my table on the patio that is.


----------



## cincinnati

Legend killer said:


> If the gentleman screaming at the officer is wearing a mask, the mask would keep his droplets to himself.
> View attachment 355149


Nice job, Captain Obvious.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Specwar said:


> Actually they said they will continue to layout plans for further reopening over the next several weeks.
> I would like it to open quickly, but that just isn’t gonna happen. I can adjust as what I do is basically up to me.
> The only questions I would really like answered is how many of the current 1002 deaths in Ohio were actually _*caused by the covd19, not attributed to by it, and how many of the 18,743 confirmed cases have those that had it gotten over it? *_Those numbers are never given, and are more than likely unknown.
> If you’re gonna use statistics you better show them all.


We will never know the true numbers. Unfortunately we will all get eventually. It’s just a matter of pay me now or pay me later. It wouldn’t matter if there was a 20’ distance rule. Some of these people think social distancing is a cure and treat people as so. Like some of you who encouraged people to go get infected and see if it will kill them or making statements like “I hope they get it, its their fault it’s spreading” while you wallow in your self righteousness. Only because they didn’t agree with you... This pandemic has sure opened a lot of eyes to a lot of things other than death. No certain group of people is giving us this virus. We are going to get it because we aren’t immune. Ohio has done a pretty good job of slowing it down and that’s it. Along with probably some bad repercussions to our economy. IMO we should be able to bounce back with the economy but if not, what are you willing to do? Give up a benefit or two, take pay cuts, to get the economy back on top?


----------



## fastwater

Specwar said:


> Actually they said they will continue to layout plans for further reopening over the next several weeks.
> I would like it to open quickly, but that just isn’t gonna happen. I can adjust as what I do is basically up to me.
> The only questions I would really like answered is how many of the current 1002 deaths in Ohio were actually _*caused by the covd19, not attributed to by it, and how many of the 18,743 confirmed cases have those that had it gotten over it? *_Those numbers are never given, and are more than likely unknown.
> If you’re gonna use statistics you better show them all.


Like SP stated, we will never know the answer. 
Buddy of mine went into OSU hospital second week of March diagnosed with pneumonia. Buried him about three weeks ago.
According to his wife, he was never tested for covid19.
She has repeatedly asked why...has yet to get an answer.


----------



## Hatchetman

cincinnati said:


> If you watched the Factless Briefing today, they're already setting the stage for this to continue through the Summer.


The only reason the Mike and Amy show said extend till the end of the month is the general population, including me, would be screaming bloody murder if he said till end of June or July. As long as we make it to the stated end and THEN he says just a couple more weeks and then does it again most people accept it. It's like, well, made this far, just a couple more weeks etc etc etc....


----------



## Legend killer

fastwater said:


> Like SP stated, we will never know the answer.
> Buddy of mine went into OSU hospital second week of March diagnosed with pneumonia. Buried him about three weeks ago.
> According to his wife, he was never tested for covid19.
> She has repeatedly asked why...has yet to get an answer.


Would not have changed care route.


----------



## fastwater

Legend killer said:


> Would not have changed care route.


Probably not.
Just confirming SP's point that at this stage of the game, there just no way of getting correct figures + or - on the exact numbers of deaths caused by covid19.


----------



## Shad Rap

Legend killer said:


> Would not have changed care route.


How can you be so sure?..you here stories all the time of people on their death bed and then they are given a drug and then miraculously they beat the virus...if the person was given a test and confirmed the case, it most certainly could have changed the care...and the outcome...


----------



## fastwater

^^^Very possible SR.
It's hard telling!
Knowing this happened with him not ever being tested...and obviously there have most likely been others that have past with respiratory issues since the onset of corvid19 that were never tested, we will never know the correct numbers.


----------



## Shad Rap

fastwater said:


> ^^^Very possible SR.
> It's hard telling!
> Knowing this happened with him not ever being tested...and obviously there have most likely been others that have past with respiratory issues since the onset of corvid19 that were never tested, we will never know the correct numbers.


Most of these are going down as covid deaths too...if they show the symptoms, they count...even though they are never tested...


----------



## Legend killer

Shad Rap said:


> How can you be so sure?..you here stories all the time of people on their death bed and then they are given a drug and then miraculously they beat the virus...if the person was given a test and confirmed the case, it most certainly could have changed the care...and the outcome...


Its been shown hydroxychloriquine at the time was not a game changer. I work in health care. They treat the covid patients as a typical pneumonia patient. Plus at the time of the death, tests were more hard to come by


----------



## cincinnati

Hatchetman said:


> The only reason the Mike and Amy show said extend till the end of the month is the general population, including me, would be screaming bloody murder if he said till end of June or July. As long as we make it to the stated end and THEN he says just a couple more weeks and then does it again most people accept it. It's like, well, made this far, just a couple more weeks etc etc etc....


The old adage about boiling a frog = slowly raising the water temp, so the frog doesn’t jump out before he’s cooked.


----------



## laguna21

fastwater said:


> ^^^Very possible SR.
> It's hard telling!
> Knowing this happened with him not ever being tested...and obviously there have most likely been others that have past with respiratory issues since the onset of corvid19 that were never tested, we will never know the correct numbers.


Sorry to hear about your friend. Some members on here think the gov is trying to push the mortality numbers up, make this out to be worse than it really is. This case does NOT support that theory.SMH


----------



## bad luck

Their not reporting accurately the # of cases.....via random testing at grocery stores in NY area (just google it...) 1 in 5 people have already had it .....which means this rate of infection has been wildly over rated........


----------



## Dovans

Covid-19 is basically pneumonia in my simple mind.


----------



## mountainbikingrn

Dovans said:


> Covid-19 is basically pneumonia in my simple mind.


Pneumonia is typically caused by a bacteria. We can throw the assortment of antibiotics at it until a positive sputum culture results and then antibiotics can be tailored to the specific bacteria. Ventilator support and appropriate antibiotics can increase the likelihood of recovery/survival from severe pneumonia. Coronavirus is different because we don’t have an antiviral that is effective, so you have to rely on the patients immune system to ward it off. At the same time symptomatic treatment continues as other organ systems are impacted.


----------



## Snakecharmer

bad luck said:


> Their not reporting accurately the # of cases.....via random testing at grocery stores in NY area (just google it...) 1 in 5 people have already had it .....which means this rate of infection has been wildly over rated........


??? If 1 in 5 have it, it been wildly under reported.... 65 million cases in the USA?


----------



## Legend killer

mountainbikingrn said:


> Pneumonia is typically caused by a bacteria. We can throw the assortment of antibiotics at it until a positive sputum culture results and then antibiotics can be tailored to the specific bacteria. Ventilator support and appropriate antibiotics can increase the likelihood of recovery/survival from severe pneumonia. Coronavirus is different because we don’t have an antiviral that is effective, so you have to rely on the patients immune system to ward it off. At the same time symptomatic treatment continues as other organ systems are impacted.


Ventilators cause pneumonia in covid patients. Ever hear of VAP?


----------



## Burkcarp1

Snakecharmer said:


> ??? If 1 in 5 have it, it been wildly under reported.... 65 million cases in the USA?[/QUOTE





Snakecharmer said:


> ??? If 1 in 5 have it, it been wildly under reported.... 65 million cases in the USA?


so the survival rate would be much higher?


----------



## mountainbikingrn

Legend killer said:


> Ventilators cause pneumonia in covid patients. Ever hear of VAP?


Yes I am familiar with VAP. VAP has many causes beyond Coronavirus. When you exhaust all of your options you are left with ventilator support as a life saving measure.


----------



## Legend killer

mountainbikingrn said:


> Yes I am familiar with VAP. VAP has many causes beyond Coronavirus. When you exhaust all of your options you are left with ventilator support as a life saving measure.


Thus being on the ventilator to be oxygenated. Covid lungs are still very compliant, low plateau pressures etc. When on the vent, the vent helps contribute to pneumonia.


----------



## hailtothethief

Wendys dont have no burgers. I had to get grilled chicken. Speaking of the cowrona thread..


----------



## Snakecharmer

hailtothethief said:


> Wendys dont have no burgers. I had to get grilled chicken. Speaking of the cowrona thread..


They may have to go to frozen beef to maintain their supply of beef. Supply chains are wacko...Maybe there are burger hoarders...


----------



## laguna21

bad luck said:


> Their not reporting accurately the # of cases.....via random testing at grocery stores in NY area (just google it...) 1 in 5 people have already had it .....which means this rate of infection has been wildly over rated........


Number of deaths caused by COV


----------



## Saugeye Tom

In my tight knit little community of 38000....none


----------



## Saugeye Tom

As of may 2nd


----------



## Snakecharmer

Crazy how many husbands and wives are getting covid and dying within a day or two of each other. You don't hear about that with many other illnesses.


----------



## Snakecharmer

I used to live in Marion....That city isn't doing too well.


----------



## AmericanEagle

The 1 in 5 (20%) of the population testing positive is for the part of the survey done in New York City not the entire state of New York.

https://www.governor.ny.gov/news/am...-announces-results-completed-antibody-testing

The death rate for NYC can be determined by first determining the amount of people infected which equals 8,400,000 (NYC population) times 20% (% of the population which tested positive in the NYC survey) which equals 1,680,000. Then divide 13,365 (NYC Covid19 deaths) by 1,680,000 (NYC people infected) which gives a death rate of .00795.

So if the death rate is .00795.how many Americans must die to get to herd immunity? If 50% of the population has to be infected for herd immunity to occur then multiply 328,000,000 (USA population) times 50% which equals 164,000,000 and multiply this by .00795 (death rate) which equals 1,335,400 deaths to achieve herd immunity.

I don’t know how accurate the NYC survey is. If it is accurate, the path to herd immunity would come at a terrible price. Are 1.3 million deaths inevitable and we should let nature run its course? Should we keep the economy locked down to try and save as many lives as possible while destroying the economy waiting for a vaccine to be developed? Can we do two things at once as Governor DeWine suggests and keep most of the economy running while taking steps to mitigate the virus?


----------



## backlashed

Awww now don't be an ostrich. Failure to support your point means you have none.


----------



## cincinnati

Saugeye Tom said:


> In my tight knit little community of 38000....none
> View attachment 355331


Stop it, you covidenier, you! 

Just went out to walk the dogs & My Bride, complained that I might be hit by lightning. Told her not to worry, the lightning wouldn't kill me, but covid would.


----------



## Shad Rap

AmericanEagle said:


> The 1 in 5 (20%) of the population testing positive is for New York City not the entire state of new York.
> 
> https://www.governor.ny.gov/news/am...-announces-results-completed-antibody-testing
> 
> The death rate for NYC can be determined by first determining the amount of people infected which equals 8,400,000 (NYC population) times 20% which equals 1,680,000. Then divide 13,365 (NYC Covid19 deaths) by 1,680,000 (NYC people infected) which gives a death rate of .00795.
> 
> So if the death rate is .00795.how many Americans must die to get to herd immunity? If 50% of the population has to be infected for herd immunity to occur then multiply 328,000,000 (USA population) times 50% which equals 164,000,000 and multiply this by .00795 (death rate) which equals 1,335,400 deaths to achieve herd immunity.
> 
> I don’t know how accurate the NYC survey is. If it is accurate, the path to herd immunity would come at a terrible price. Are 1.3 million deaths inevitable and we should let nature run its course? Should we keep the economy locked down to try and save as many lives as possible while destroying the economy waiting for a vaccine to be developed? Can we do two things at once as Governor DeWine suggests and keep most of the economy running while taking steps to mitigate the virus?


Only problem is...none of those numbers are correct or even close to being correct...you painted a nice picture though...we have 66,000 deaths in the USA...it'll NEVER reach 1.3 million...herd immunity or not...NEVER...yes there may be a spike or a 2nd wave (because of the shelter in place)...but we're talking vaccine by October now...
You've been watching too much tv...mainly the Dewine and Acton show...


----------



## bulafisherman

Numbers numbers numbers, time for some of you boys to wake up! Unless you have your head buried in the sand or are in total denial you should know what's up by now, it's not that complicated, we just can't discuss it here


----------



## KaGee

Shad Rap said:


> Only problem is...none of those numbers are correct or even close to being correct...you painted a nice picture though...we have 66,000 deaths in the USA...it'll NEVER reach 1.3 million...herd immunity or not...NEVER...yes there may be a spike or a 2nd wave (because of the shelter in place)...but we're talking vaccine by October now...
> You've been watching too much tv...mainly the Dewine and Acton show...


The CDC has adjusted the death total to about half the number they been touting. 

Hmmm???


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

KaGee said:


> The CDC has adjusted the death total to about half the number they been touting.
> 
> Hmmm???


Yes they have! Rumor is they got caught and changed the total to a more logical number real quick.
https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid19/index.htm


----------



## backlashed

AmericanEagle said:


> The 1 in 5 (20%) of the population testing positive is for New York City not the entire state of new York.
> 
> https://www.governor.ny.gov/news/am...-announces-results-completed-antibody-testing
> 
> The death rate for NYC can be determined by first determining the amount of people infected which equals 8,400,000 (NYC population) times 20% which equals 1,680,000. Then divide 13,365 (NYC Covid19 deaths) by 1,680,000 (NYC people infected) which gives a death rate of .00795.


Oops, no. They didn't test everyone in NYC. 20% OF THOSE TESTED were positive. The 15,000 were across the state. It's a poor sample, it was those who went to the grocery or community center. If you are sick at home or at risk are you going out? Probably not. I agree, most of these numbers are wonky no matter how you want to argue them.

I could use this to argue from the other side. Those are this morning global stats.


----------



## JamesF

Results of covid 19 take time to determine. My wife is a nurse and says it takes about two weeks for results. And having the proper means to prove that it is covid 19 may be part of the results.


----------



## backlashed

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Yes they have! Rumor is they got caught and changed the total to a more logical number real quick.
> https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid19/index.htm



LOL, wrong again. Reading comprehension, it's so important.

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/briannasacks/coronavirus-death-toll-cdc-misinformation

I checked the AP, UPI and FOXNews, none of them carried the story.


----------



## AmericanEagle

backlashed said:


> Oops, no. They didn't test everyone in NYC. 20% OF THOSE TESTED were positive. The 15,000 were across the state. It's a poor sample, it was those who went to the grocery or community center. If you are sick at home or at risk are you going out? Probably not. I agree, most of these numbers are wonky no matter how you want to argue them.


I am aware that this was a survey and that not everyone in New York City was tested. Thanks for pointing out how that could be misinterpreted. I edited my original post to make it more clear.

I agree that this survey maybe inaccurate and said so in the last paragraph of my original post. As more antibody testing is done we will get a more accurate handle on the mortality rate of those infected. If the New York survey is accurate you get a morality rate of less than 1% but this still could lead to over a million deaths if we do nothing to mitigate or treat the virus.

IMHO there are many possible outcomes going forward and a many of them are affected by how well we do at mitigation and treatment.


----------



## Snakecharmer

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Yes they have! Rumor is they got caught and changed the total to a more logical number real quick.
> https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid19/index.htm


Fake news


----------



## Saugeye Tom

Chances are the lightning would. 10 fold at this time


cincinnati said:


> Stop it, you covidenier, you!
> 
> Just went out to walk the dogs & My Bride, complained that I might be hit by lightning. Told her not to worry, the lightning wouldn't kill me, but covid would.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

Chances are the lightning would. 10 fold at this time


cincinnati said:


> Stop it, you covidenier, you!
> 
> Just went out to walk the dogs & My Bride, complained that I might be hit by lightning. Told her not to worry, the lightning wouldn't kill me, but covid would.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

Snakecharmer said:


> Fake news


You never did answer me


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

backlashed said:


> LOL, wrong again. Reading comprehension, it's so important.
> 
> https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/briannasacks/coronavirus-death-toll-cdc-misinformation
> 
> I checked the AP, UPI and FOXNews, none of them carried the story.


Keep reading your Buzzfeed News lmao. My post came straight from cdc.gov. Fear mongers.. wow.


----------



## hailtothethief




----------



## Wow

KaGee said:


> The CDC has adjusted the death total to about half the number they been touting.
> Hmmm???





STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Yes they have! Rumor is they got caught and changed the total to a more logical number real quick.
> https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid19/index.htm



This is called a provisional Death count. 
Note: Provisional death counts are based on death certificate data received and coded by the National Center for Health Statistics as of May 1, 2020. Death counts are delayed and may differ from other published sources (see Technical Notes). Counts will be updated periodically. Additional information will be added to this site as available.



STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Keep reading your Buzzfeed News lmao. My post came straight from cdc.gov. Fear mongers.. wow.


Buzzfeed does make it clear:
https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/briannasacks/coronavirus-death-toll-cdc-misinformation

Do you even stop for one second to read the details?

Keep laughing. *A strongpersuader you are not! You're the one that got caught.*
The latest CDC report calls BS. Fake news and misinformation.
What internet are *you* using?

The latest CDC report from 5-3-2020: Any questions?:

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/cases-updates/cases-in-us.html

Total Deaths 65,735, 1,452 New Deaths*

--Tim


----------



## Legend killer

JamesF said:


> Results of covid 19 take time to determine. My wife is a nurse and says it takes about two weeks for results. And having the proper means to prove that it is covid 19 may be part of the results.


When we first started testing it was sent out and took around a week. Now in house its around 24hrs or now they have a rapid test thats roughly two hrs.


----------



## cincinnati

This should clear everything up!


----------



## bdawg

Weather the actual death rate is 0.25% or 2.5%, a lot of people will die from this virus. We really could reach 1 million deaths in the next couple of years. Right now, there are no approved drugs and no vaccine. If no vaccine or treatment drug is developed fast, this thing will continue for a few years until herd immunity is achieved. It could take 6 months or 6 years for a working vaccine to be developed. Please take this seriously. You don't want to be one of the statistics. We have flattened the curve with social distancing. It makes a big difference, especially in urban areas. This thing is highly contagious if you don't follow the social distancing guidelines. 

The lockdown orders were needed to give us time to manufacture enough PPE so hospitals could have all the equipment they needed and everyone in the US could have a mask. This will reduce the transmission, but won't stop it. Now, we can all go back to work with new, safer business practices and masks. This is gonna be the norm for the next 2 years at least.


----------



## Treble

As it's turning out, there's been a quarter million worldwide deaths from the Covid virus, in a world with a population of 7.8 Billion. That's 7,800,000,000 with 250,000 succumbing to the virus. 

Let that sink in...……...


----------



## Muddy

cincinnati said:


> This should clear everything up!


That was the best post so far in this thread, and about the only thread that made any kind of sense at all. It cleared up a lot of confusion. Thanks!


----------



## Burkcarp1




----------



## jrose

AmericanEagle said:


> The 1 in 5 (20%) of the population testing positive is for the part of the survey done in New York City not the entire state of New York.
> 
> https://www.governor.ny.gov/news/am...-announces-results-completed-antibody-testing
> 
> The death rate for NYC can be determined by first determining the amount of people infected which equals 8,400,000 (NYC population) times 20% (% of the population which tested positive in the NYC survey) which equals 1,680,000. Then divide 13,365 (NYC Covid19 deaths) by 1,680,000 (NYC people infected) which gives a death rate of .00795.
> 
> So if the death rate is .00795.how many Americans must die to get to herd immunity? If 50% of the population has to be infected for herd immunity to occur then multiply 328,000,000 (USA population) times 50% which equals 164,000,000 and multiply this by .00795 (death rate) which equals 1,335,400 deaths to achieve herd immunity.
> 
> I don’t know how accurate the NYC survey is. If it is accurate, the path to herd immunity would come at a terrible price. Are 1.3 million deaths inevitable and we should let nature run its course? Should we keep the economy locked down to try and save as many lives as possible while destroying the economy waiting for a vaccine to be developed? Can we do two things at once as Governor DeWine suggests and keep most of the economy running while taking steps to mitigate the virus?


Fortunately, 99% of the U.S. is not NYC (one of the most densely populated cities on earth) you might as well use the infection rates in Nursing homes as a predictor.


----------



## Specwar

I am amused of all the posts here that repeat something someone else has already said day after day after day.


----------



## buckeyebowman

cincinnati said:


> This should clear everything up!


OMG! That is brilliant! Reminds me of the Mike & Amy Show!



jrose said:


> Fortunately, 99% of the U.S. is not NYC (one of the most densely populated cities on earth) you might as well use the infection rates in Nursing homes as a predictor.


Yep! A lot of "vertical" living in NYC and that area. People living on top of each other. Many of them have to get into elevators just to get out of their building. Lots of mass transit with people crowded together! I couldn't imagine living anywhere like that!


----------



## KaGee

Specwar said:


> I am amused of all the posts here that repeat something someone else has already said day after day after day.


Pretty much the way things go in all of OGF, not limited to this thread. But it's like watching the Browns... you just can't help it! You just gotta click on that next thread.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

KaGee said:


> Pretty much the way things go in all of OGF, not limited to this thread. But it's like watching the Browns... you just can't help it! You just gotta click on that next thread.


Funny....like waiting for the Bengals to win a playoff game


----------



## MagicMarker

Specwar said:


> I am amused of all the posts here that repeat something someone else has already said day after day after day.


I am not amused. I’m going to live my life and to hell with everyone else trying to tell me how to live it


----------



## Dovans

Saugeye Tom said:


> Funny....like waiting for the Bengals to win a playoff game


The Bengals? what?


----------



## KPI

I heard am there was a replay today of the Bengals vs.the 49ers in a super bowl that Ickey woods is going to be good !!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## fastwater

Specwar said:


> I am amused of all the posts here that repeat something someone else has already said day after day after day.


I am amused of all the total positive...total positive that recovered...and total death rate due to covid19 statistics that keeps being hashed...and rehashed here every day when everyone knows(or should know) that there is absolutely no way they can't possibly be right. Especially since we here in the U.S. can't even positively say exactly when covid19 got here.


----------



## crappiedude

fastwater said:


> I am amused of all the total positive...total positive that recovered...and total death rate due to covid19 statistics that keeps being hashed...and rehashed here every day when everyone knows(or should know) that there is absolutely no way they can't possibly be right. Especially since we here in the U.S. can't even positively say exactly when covid19 got here.


I think the same thing.
The same few guys keep arguing that their numbers are correct and everyone knows that none of the numbers stated are even close to accurate.



MagicMarker said:


> I am not amused. I’m going to live my life and to hell with everyone else trying to tell me how to live it


That's fine and you should live as you want to...just be respectful of others and make sure you stay away from those who have more concern than you do


----------



## Hatchetman

Posted a couple weeks ago that my son-in-lawhad contracted the virus. He was quarantined at home and has now fully recovered. Says he's a little weak but feeling fine and ready to go back to work on our southern border. He says thanks for all the prayers....


----------



## JamesF

bdawg said:


> Weather the actual death rate is 0.25% or 2.5%, a lot of people will die from this virus. We really could reach 1 million deaths in the next couple of years. Right now, there are no approved drugs and no vaccine. If no vaccine or treatment drug is developed fast, this thing will continue for a few years until herd immunity is achieved. It could take 6 months or 6 years for a working vaccine to be developed. Please take this seriously. You don't want to be one of the statistics. We have flattened the curve with social distancing. It makes a big difference, especially in urban areas. This thing is highly contagious if you don't follow the social distancing guidelines.
> 
> The lockdown orders were needed to give us time to manufacture enough PPE so hospitals could have all the equipment they needed and everyone in the US could have a mask. This will reduce the transmission, but won't stop it. Now, we can all go back to work with new, safer business practices and masks. This is gonna be the norm for the next 2 years at least.


What about the recent commercials selling masks, on Bulbhead, copper fit,and Tommy copper? Extolling the effectiveness of copper, basically stating that copper is effective against bacteria. When it's widely known that copper holds develops many types of bacteria. Just look back at the virus life on substrates. Copper is number one or two on the list. And it sure didn't take these companies long switch to offering masks at an inflated price. Just my opinion.


buckeyebowman said:


> OMG! That is brilliant! Reminds me of the Mike & Amy Show!
> 
> 
> 
> Yep! A lot of "vertical" living in NYC and that area. People living on top of each other. Many of them have to get into elevators just to get out of their building. Lots of mass transit with people crowded together! I couldn't imagine living anywhere like that!


She is literally talking in circles. Or maybe speaking in tongues. Let me be perfectly clear ,I am at a loss for words, and so is she! I think that I now have a severe case of vertigo!
Is this from SNL?


----------



## bridgeman

He's weathered a bump in the road. Would be the same end result for better than 99 percent of us.


----------



## multi species angler

She is literally talking in circles. Or maybe speaking in tongues. Let me be perfectly clear ,I am at a loss for words, and so is she! I think that I now have a severe case of vertigo!
Is this from SNL?[/QUOTE]

It's a poor attempt as sarcasm.


----------



## coach76

Until we have testing and a vaccine things will not return to normal. I am over 70 and in the danger group of dying from this virus. Stats are showing in Ohio the largest number getting the virus is 50 to 65 age group. I dont have the answers but my wife and I are trying to stay safe. The hard part is no interacting with our 8 grand children.


----------



## bulafisherman

two very sensible prospectives, this kind of thinking and ideology will take us where we need to be in my humble opinion,


----------



## coach76

Its an interesting interview but not sure I buy into all they are saying. This becomes very complicated and that is why the states might be the best to decide how we open up. Believe me I want to hear news that will get us out and enjoying life as it was once before. But I am not going to risk a few days of joy and lose future years of our life. Just not easy to deal with all of this.


----------



## ICENUT

I hear you But do you want those few remaining years to be caged up without social contact Im not sure I do and ive run out of patience. It could be years without a good vaccine and this crap will be the new normal


----------



## coach76

I agree about caged up. I do boat and fish but not the same without my grand kids. Wife does enjoy a scenic boat ride. I doubt we can do what we are doing much longer.


----------



## jrose

ICENUT said:


> I hear you But do you want those few remaining years to be caged up without social contact Im not sure I do and ive run out of patience. It could be years without a good vaccine and this crap will be the new normal


Life is to short to hide from it! You could get struck by lightning, caught in a tornado, get hit by a bus, drown in your bath, die of a stroke.... I can do this all night, but I have things to do. Like, get my turkey hunting stuff together for the morning hunt, Mow the grass, wash the truck...... take precautions and don’t let fear keep you from living “your” life.


----------



## ICENUT

Im 70 also and have 2 grandkids one just shy of 3 the other 7 I couldn't stand not seeing them so we purchased a facebook 10 inch portal and it eased the pain somewhat but nothing like holding them.We call them on it and can talk and watch them for as long as we like works for us.


----------



## SConner




----------



## multi species angler

I'll bet that the 70,000+ that have died would like to have the chance to shelter in place.


----------



## Shad Rap

multi species angler said:


> I'll bet that the 70,000+ that have died would like to have the chance to shelter in place.


Most of them did...they had nowhere to go...they were in nursing homes or the hospital.


----------



## Shad Rap

ICENUT said:


> I hear you But do you want those few remaining years to be caged up without social contact Im not sure I do and ive run out of patience. It could be years without a good vaccine and this crap will be the new normal


It's not gonna be 'years' without a vaccine man...


----------



## Saugeye Tom

multi species angler said:


> I'll bet that the 70,000+ that have died would like to have the chance to shelter in place.


70000? Thought those numbers changed


----------



## jrose

SConner said:


> View attachment 355829


You know you can get cancer from the sun(seen it on the internet so it must be true) but do you give it one thought when you walk out the door?


----------



## fastwater

jrose said:


> You know you can get cancer from the sun(seen it on the internet so it must be true) but do you give it one thought when you walk out the door?


Yep!
But not cause I seen it on the net but because of a few spots on my skin that were caused by the sun.


----------



## jrose

fastwater said:


> Yep!
> But not cause I seen it on the net but because of a few spots on my skin that were caused by the sun.


And you still go outside. Isn’t life great!


----------



## Hambo

Over 72,000 deaths now. The curve is going higher and we're backing off cautionary practices. Why?


----------



## SConner

jrose said:


> You know you can get cancer from the sun(seen it on the internet so it must be true) but do you give it one thought when you walk out the door?


Yes I do and take appropriate actions to mitigate.


----------



## UNCLEMIKE

ICENUT said:


> I hear you But do you want those few remaining years to be caged up without social contact Im not sure I do and ive run out of patience. It could be years without a good vaccine and this crap will be the new normal


Likely gonna get worse as we reopen but we don't have much of a choice. I am 64 and high risk due to cancer and chemo etc. I have isolated till now but my wife works at a hospital so how safe am I ? Can't live like this. Going to start seeing the kids and grandkids at least. No restaurants or groups but no more isolation for me.


----------



## laguna21

Friend of ours lost both parents 3 days apart, both in their 70s. Another friends dad passed Saturday, mom has it and has been in the hospital twice now but seems to be improving again. They too were both in their 70s. My dad is 83 and has had heart trouble, cancer etc. and won't stay home for nothing. Chewing his arse has become a daily routine. This thing won't last forever, and everyone can get back to doing what they love, but only if you're still here


----------



## SConner




----------



## buckeyebowman

JamesF said:


> She is literally talking in circles. Or maybe speaking in tongues. Let me be perfectly clear ,I am at a loss for words, and so is she! I think that I now have a severe case of vertigo!
> Is this from SNL?


 It's a poor attempt as sarcasm.[/QUOTE]

I thought it was brilliant and saw it more as satire. 



Hambo said:


> Over 72,000 deaths now. The curve is going higher and we're backing off cautionary practices. Why?


There was a wonderful paragraph in an op-ed in the local paper today. I quote:

"On the flip side, while I think sheltering in place was the right idea, I think moving the goal posts from "flatten the curve" to "eliminate the virus before reopening is wrong. Americans did as they were told. We have flattened the curve. The virus is bad, but so, too, is economic devastation." 

BTW, also saw in the paper that a local lab has developed a COVID-19 test that gives results in less than an hour.


----------



## Dovans

My 92 year old mom been cooped up forever so today I drove her around cleveland looking at the boat ramps... Rocky River, Edgewater, Gordon Park, 72nd... I think it was wildwood. She was ready for home and a meal and then bed. Even though I grew up outside of cleveland Ive never been to these places. Thought the 72nd ramp was cool


----------



## Dovans

I also saw Meme that said the stay at home was being lifted as there is now room in the ICU's


----------



## coach76

I do things outside, cut the grass, weed, yard work with the wife. Take 2 mile walks everyday. I also boat and fish. The hard part is not sharing time in person with the grand kids and our three children. We just did face time with our 11 yr old and we did zoom last week with everyone. I know some of you are going to do more, just be safe.


----------



## SConner

Dovans said:


> My 92 year old mom been cooped up forever so today I drove her around cleveland looking at the boat ramps... Rocky River, Edgewater, Gordon Park, 72nd... I think it was wildwood. She was ready for home and a meal and then bed. Even though I grew up outside of cleveland Ive never been to these places. Thought the 72nd ramp was cool


Bless you for doing that for your mother. My mother is 88 and locked down in a retirement community. While I understand why they are locked down, it is so hard to be separated from loved ones.


----------



## SConner

Shad Rap said:


> It's not gonna be 'years' without a vaccine man...


Please site source for knowing a vaccine will not take years.


----------



## SConner

buckeyebowman said:


> It's a poor attempt as sarcasm.


I thought it was brilliant and saw it more as satire.



There was a wonderful paragraph in an op-ed in the local paper today. I quote:

"On the flip side, while I think sheltering in place was the right idea, I think moving the goal posts from "flatten the curve" to "eliminate the virus before reopening is wrong. Americans did as they were told. We have flattened the curve. The virus is bad, but so, too, is economic devastation."

BTW, also saw in the paper that a local lab has developed a COVID-19 test that gives results in less than an hour.[/QUOTE]
Where can I get his test in less than an hour. I would be so happy if this is true.


----------



## slipsinker

JamesF said:


> What about the recent commercials selling masks, on Bulbhead, copper fit,and Tommy copper? Extolling the effectiveness of copper, basically stating that copper is effective against bacteria. When it's widely known that copper holds develops many types of bacteria. Just look back at the virus life on substrates. Copper is number one or two on the list. And it sure didn't take these companies long switch to offering masks at an inflated price. Just my opinion.
> 
> 
> She is literally talking in circles. Or maybe speaking in tongues. Let me be perfectly clear ,I am at a loss for words, and so is she! I think that I now have a severe case of vertigo!
> Is this from SNL?


ummm,...ummmm,...ummm,what amy?


----------



## multi species angler

jrose said:


> You know you can get cancer from the sun(seen it on the internet so it must be true) but do you give it one thought when you walk out the door?


 Yes I do. I look stupid in my Gilligan hat but it protects my ears from the sun. They get burned and sore and I don't want to lose them from skin cancer, arms too.


----------



## Patricio

We're now putting people in jail for ignoring the stay at home order, but releasing sex offenders and murderers out. Some of which have gone on to kill and rape more women. God bless America. 

Are we still counting skydiving accidents as China flu deaths?
I didn't know memes we're now allowed...


----------



## multi species angler

Saugeye Tom said:


> 70000? Thought those numbers changed


 They have changed, they've gone higher and they are going much higher yet since restrictions are being loosened too soon in some places.


----------



## multi species angler

SConner said:


> View attachment 355867


 This post says it best.


----------



## Burkcarp1

multi species angler said:


> Yes I do. I look stupid in my Gilligan hat but it protects my ears from the sun. They get burned and sore and I don't want to lose them from skin cancer, arms too.


It must really suck to live in fear like that...


----------



## Patricio

multi species angler said:


> Yes I do. I look stupid in my Gilligan hat but it protects my ears from the sun. They get burned and sore and I don't want to lose them from skin cancer, arms too.


So buy a different hat and stop looking stupid.


----------



## JamesF

buckeyebowman said:


> It's a poor attempt as sarcasm.


I thought it was brilliant and saw it more as satire.



There was a wonderful paragraph in an op-ed in the local paper today. I quote:

"On the flip side, while I think sheltering in place was the right idea, I think moving the goal posts from "flatten the curve" to "eliminate the virus before reopening is wrong. Americans did as they were told. We have flattened the curve. The virus is bad, but so, too, is economic devastation."

BTW, also saw in the paper that a local lab has developed a COVID-19 test that gives results in less than an hour.[/QUOTE]
Maybe I didn't quite understand. You make a good point, in a different way. I agree that the economy is suffering each day that goes by. But I am noticing that more places are opening.


----------



## Wow

bulafisherman said:


> two very sensible prospectives, this kind of thinking and ideology will take us where we need to be in my humble opinion,


These guys are still hanging around?
Check this:
https://www.mercurynews.com/2020/04...go-viral-with-dubious-covid-test-conclusions/

They're still entitled to say whatever they want , just like anybody--Tim


----------



## Wow




----------



## crappiedude

Burkcarp1 said:


> It must really suck to live in fear like that...


Because someone takes precautions doesn't mean they're living in fear.
I use sun screen and wear my stupid Gilligan hat, I've had skin cancer. I have reoccurring spots I struggle to get rid of even though they get treat 2-3 time a year. Because of this I do use caution when I'm outside but I don't live in fear. Big, big difference.


----------



## Snakecharmer

crappiedude said:


> Because someone takes precautions doesn't mean they're living in fear.
> I use sun screen and wear my stupid Gilligan hat, I've had skin cancer. I have reoccurring spots I struggle to get rid of even though they get treat 2-3 time a year. Because of this I do use caution when I'm outside but I don't live in fear. Big, big difference.


Yep you're right. He probably feels the same about me who puts on a seat belt whenever I get in a car or for people that have there CCL.


----------



## Burkcarp1

crappiedude said:


> Because someone takes precautions doesn't mean they're living in fear.
> I use sun screen and wear my stupid Gilligan hat, I've had skin cancer. I have reoccurring spots I struggle to get rid of even though they get treat 2-3 time a year. Because of this I do use caution when I'm outside but I don't live in fear. Big, big difference.


I wasn’t talking about you but OK! I am also taking precautions but according to some people’s comments they sound scared. Js


----------



## Burkcarp1

Snakecharmer said:


> Yep you're right. He probably feels the same about me who puts on a seat belt whenever I get in a car or for people that have there CCL.


Wrong! I also put on a seatbelt every time.


----------



## crappiedude

Burkcarp1 said:


> I wasn’t talking about you but OK! I am also taking precautions but according to some people’s comments they sound scared. Js


I didn't think you were talking about me. I've just seen you (and others) talk about people living in fear. Some of these comments seem to try to excite some type of reaction. (trolling) Most of what I see are just people expressing concerns.
It makes sense for most of us older folks to use caution and not take any unnecessary chances on a lot of fronts.


----------



## cincinnati

SConner said:


> View attachment 355829


Prestigious doctor, making Wild-Ass-Guesses about Corona.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

Snakecharmer said:


> Yep you're right. He probably feels the same about me who puts on a seat belt whenever I get in a car or for people that have there CCL.


do you have a ccl??


----------



## Hatchetman

SConner said:


> Please site source for knowing a vaccine will not take years.


Please site source that it WILL take years for a vaccine....


----------



## Hatchetman

multi species angler said:


> This post says it best.



No it doesn't....


----------



## SConner

Hatchetman said:


> Please site source that it WILL take years for a vaccine....


That is unknown, which is my point. Neither you or I or ShadRAp has a clue when an effective vaccine will be mass produced and available to all. It sure sounded like he was making a definitive statement, so I thought he had seen an article I had not read. I hope he is correct, the faster we get past this virus, they better for us all.


----------



## meisjedog

Here are my two cents... Originally, the worst-case scenario was 70,000, correct me if I am wrong. We are now at 72,000 with a possible new prediction of 134,000 by August with no "mitigation." https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2020/05/06/coronavirus-update-us/

"It's a report with no mitigation,' the
president said at the White House of two new studies - based on government modeling - that show the daily virus death toll will hit 3,000 by June and another projects that over 134,000 people will die.
'We're doing a lot of mitigation,' Trump said. 'But that report is a no-mitigation report, and we are mitigating.' "

To me, "Mitigation" means "stay at home," The public must wear masks in public(most don't want to do this), proper testing by someone, employers following proper procedures to protect employees(yeah right!)

Not to mention a new possibly mutated, stronger, and deadlier strain of the virus here in the U.S(not confirmed.)
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/05/05/the...o-be-more-contagious-now-new-study-finds.html or https://www.latimes.com/california/...rus-has-emerged-more-contagious-than-original (disable javascript to get past the ad blocker)

Vaccines take months to a year(s) to develop, and as the virus mutates, it is nothing more than whack-a-mole. Vaccine, end of summer best scenario - what is the worst-case scenario?

I do not consider myself a pessimist, nor do I identify with either political party. I am a realist, and as a realist, I believe the curve flattened because everyone was in isolation, without a vaccine - what could possibly go wrong now that states are reopening?


----------



## multi species angler

How did people confined to nursing homes get the virus? Probably by some person contracting it and not knowing they had it then caring it to them. Which wearing a mask will help reduce this possibility.


----------



## Patricio

meisjedog said:


> Here are my two cents... Originally, the worst-case scenario was 70,000, correct me if I am wrong. We are now at 72,000 with a possible new prediction of 134,000 by August with no "mitigation." ]


No. Originally the worst case scenario was 2 million. It didn't hit 60k till they kept dropping the numbers. Now they're going through a backlog of deaths and contributing many of them to coronavirus.


----------



## Patricio

multi species angler said:


> How did people confined to nursing homes get the virus? Probably by some person contracting it and not knowing they had it then caring it to them. Which wearing a mask will help reduce this possibility.


In new York's case,. They knowingly sent old people with it into those homes. Instead of using facilities they already had on hand.


----------



## Specwar

Hospitals receive $37,000 for each patient that dies via covd19 while in their care. What else do we need to know.


----------



## cincinnati

Patricio said:


> No. Originally the worst case scenario was 2 million. It didn't hit 60k till they kept dropping the numbers. Now they're going through a backlog of deaths and contributing many of them to coronavirus.


The Jean Dixon School of Wild-Ass Guessing: If you make enough predictions, one will eventually be correct.


----------



## bridgeman

I keep trying to understand why about 80 percent of the population that still has a job are still out plugging away. No major spikes in infection rate. Time to put an end to this charade and get back in the game. +99% survival rate people!!


----------



## AmericanEagle

The original statement at the end of March by the task force was 100,000 to 240,000 deaths if Americans stay home and limit their contact with others. If there is no social distancing they predicted between 1.5 and 2.2 million deaths.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/white-house-issues-stark-coronavirus-death-toll-estimate-n1173716

On May 3rd Dr. Birx stood by their original forecast when she told host Chris Wallace that “our projections have always been between 100,000 and 240,000 American lives lost, and that’s with full mitigation and us learning from each other of how to social distance.” 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/poli...rd-in-trumps-coronavirus-response/ar-BB13xFuT


----------



## SConner

Specwar said:


> Hospitals receive $37,000 for each patient that dies via covd19 while in their care. What else do we need to know.


I had not seen this... could you link where I can read up on this?


----------



## burnsj5

SConner said:


> I had not seen this... could you link where I can read up on this?


You can't, since it doesn't exist, which is clear why you inquired. I would bet it comes from non sense that is related to cost Medicare pays out for certain conditions though varies from facility to facility. People were running with such numbers saying Medicare pays out x amount for certain conditions and diagnosis, which led to people saying hospitals were padding their numbers as they got reimbursed higher for covid diagnosis. The great thing is you can make any crazy claim, misquote, or half truth and other people have to prove you wrong. 

I think most numbers are pointless to argue and will be useless until after all this is said and done. When researchers can eventually go back over all the data. By the time folks are reading info to put on here to prove a point its already outdated. For the folks saying where are the numbers coming from regarding a year+ for a vaccine, here is a link from one of the four test sites in the country, which is in Ohio in fact. I worked in this program during college that's part of the research department of infectious disease at Children's Hospital in Cincinnati. Almost all we did was vaccine research 12 months a year, they are calling12-18 months for a vaccine, and are experts on this very topic. 
https://www.cincinnati.com/story/ne...-potential-covid-19-vaccine-study/3084655001/


----------



## Shad Rap

AmericanEagle said:


> The original statement at the end of March by the task force was 100,000 to 240,000 deaths if Americans stay home and limit their contact with others. If there is no social distancing they predicted between 1.5 and 2.2 million deaths.
> 
> https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/white-house-issues-stark-coronavirus-death-toll-estimate-n1173716
> 
> On May 3rd Dr. Birx stood by their original forecast when she told host Chris Wallace that “our projections have always been between 100,000 and 240,000 American lives lost, and that’s with full mitigation and us learning from each other of how to social distance.”
> 
> https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/poli...rd-in-trumps-coronavirus-response/ar-BB13xFuT


The thing that most don't know is those original numbers they used INCLUDED social distancing to an extent...social distancing was accounted for in the numbers of 1.5 to 2.2 million deaths...they don't tell you that now though because they wanna make it look like what they are saying is working...believe it or not I guess...


----------



## Shad Rap

burnsj5 said:


> You can't, since it doesn't exist, which is clear why you inquired. I would bet it comes from non sense that is related to cost Medicare pays out for certain conditions though varies from facility to facility. People were running with such numbers saying Medicare pays out x amount for certain conditions and diagnosis, which led to people saying hospitals were padding their numbers as they got reimbursed higher for covid diagnosis. The great thing is you can make any crazy claim, misquote, or half truth and other people have to prove you wrong.
> 
> I think most numbers are pointless to argue and will be useless until after all this is said and done. When researchers can eventually go back over all the data. By the time folks are reading info to put on here to prove a point its already outdated. For the folks saying where are the numbers coming from regarding a year+ for a vaccine, here is a link from one of the four test sites in the country, which is in Ohio in fact. I worked in this program during college that's part of the research department of infectious disease at Children's Hospital in Cincinnati. Almost all we did was vaccine research 12 months a year, they are calling12-18 months for a vaccine, and are experts on this very topic.
> https://www.cincinnati.com/story/ne...-potential-covid-19-vaccine-study/3084655001/


They are talking vaccine by the end of the year...possibly even as early as September...they have repeatedly said this is gonna be a shorter wait than other vaccines because of all the scientists working on it across the globe and the sense of urgency...they'll be a vaccine before the end of this year...book it...possibly even as early as the end of summer...


----------



## burnsj5

Shad Rap said:


> They are talking vaccine by the end of the year...possibly even as early as September...they have repeatedly said this is gonna be a shorter wait than other vaccines because of all the scientists working on it across the globe and the sense of urgency...they'll be a vaccine before the end of this year...book it...possibly even as early as the end of summer...


Who are they? Because one of the doctors at one of the only 4 sites doing the research says otherwise.
I could see the government trying to rush a vaccine out without proper testing but that's not what is happening right now.


----------



## Shad Rap

burnsj5 said:


> Who are they? Because one of the doctors at one of the only 4 sites doing the research says otherwise.
> I could see the government trying to rush a vaccine out without proper testing but that's not what is happening right now.


Only 4 sites in the world??..not hardly...who are who??..they are scientists...guess you'll have to wait and see...and the proper testing will be done.


----------



## burnsj5

Shad Rap said:


> Only 4 sites in the world??..not hardly...who are who??..they are scientists...guess you'll have to wait and see...and the proper testing will be done.


I said 1 of 4 test sites in the country not world. "They" are scientist saying less than a year according to you but I provided a link less than 24 hours old from a doctor, a scientist that is doing the research at one of the few sites in the country saying otherwise right now, but he is wrong.


----------



## cincinnati

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ore-covid-19-patients-coronavirus/3000638001/


----------



## TheKing

cincinnati said:


> https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ore-covid-19-patients-coronavirus/3000638001/


 Seems like a legit fact check. Left to its own, I don't see an issue. Added to a conspiracy theory and some see it as evidence/proof.


----------



## Burkcarp1

https://www.forbes.com/sites/lisett...ple-staying-at-home-not-traveling-or-working/


----------



## Specwar

SConner said:


> I had not seen this... could you link where I can read up on this?


Information came from a lady who’s close relative was admitted to the hospital with cancer and died. The patients cause if death was listed as covd19 which this lady and her family questioned. They were informed that any patient that died was being listed as dying from covd19. The $$ amount was disclosed during the hospital’s explaining to the family.
I didn’t wake up today and decide to make this **** up!!


----------



## bridgeman

More $$$ when they're placed on a ventilator too.


----------



## SConner

Specwar said:


> Information came from a lady who’s close relative was admitted to the hospital with cancer and died. The patients cause if death was listed as covd19 which this lady and her family questioned. They were informed that any patient that died was being listed as dying from covd19. The $$ amount was disclosed during the hospital’s explaining to the family.
> I didn’t wake up today and decide to make this **** up!!


Never said you made it up, just curious on source. I was always taught to follow the money and this seemed like the first plausible reason I have heard why a hospital would be incentized to fudge the numbers. I will search for another source, third hand accounts are generally not reliable. Thank you for the reply.


----------



## Specwar

No problem.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Specwar said:


> Information came from a lady who’s close relative was admitted to the hospital with cancer and died. The patients cause if death was listed as covd19 which this lady and her family questioned. They were informed that any patient that died was being listed as dying from covd19. The $$ amount was disclosed during the hospital’s explaining to the family.
> I didn’t wake up today and decide to make this **** up!!


How much do they get if the patient lives?


----------



## buckeyebowman

SConner said:


> Where can I get his test in less than an hour. I would be so happy if this is true.


It's just been developed, and a patent will be applied for, so don't expect it anytime soon. The first I read of it was yesterday in the paper. I wasn't even aware that there was a lab doing this kind of work anywhere in this area! Also heard that Abbott Labs is hard at work on a similar test. i'm waiting for testing to become widely available to the asymptomatic. I want to know! 



TheKing said:


> I don't see how to delete the duplicate...


That's because you can't. Only mods can do that, and they're busy enough that they usually don't bother.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Specwar said:


> Information came from a lady who’s close relative was admitted to the hospital with cancer and died. The patients cause if death was listed as covd19 which this lady and her family questioned. *They were informed that any patient that died was being listed as dying from covd1*9. The $$ amount was disclosed during the hospital’s explaining to the family.
> I didn’t wake up today and decide to make this **** up!!


So if a patient dies in a hospital from injuries suffered in a car wreck or a shooting ,the hospital llists them as dying from Covid? I find that very hard to believe.


----------



## AmericanEagle

Specwar said:


> Information came from a lady who’s close relative was admitted to the hospital with cancer and died. The patients cause if death was listed as covd19 which this lady and her family questioned. They were informed that any patient that died was being listed as dying from covd19. The $$ amount was disclosed during the hospital’s explaining to the family.
> I didn’t wake up today and decide to make this **** up!!


If fraud is involved I would hope your friends family would let their insurance company know they are being scammed.

If the deceased was on medicare or medicaid they could call CMS.

https://www.cms.gov/About-CMS/Components/CPI/CPIReportingFraud


----------



## bulafisherman

For those of you with an open mind, here is an interesting interview with Dr Judy Mikovits. Kind of confirms alot that's being said outside of the mainstream news. It will probably get censored and taken down pretty quickly.


----------



## KPI

What has changed to reopen just curious !!Only thing I am hoping is that cities leaders and hospitals get off there wallets and are more prepared for something like this again!!My theory is I would rather buy it and not use it then not buy it and need it pretty simple I thought 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## fastwater

Specwar said:


> Information came from a lady who’s close relative was admitted to the hospital with cancer and died. The patients cause if death was listed as covd19 which this lady and her family questioned. They were informed that any patient that died was being listed as dying from covd19. The $$ amount was disclosed during the hospital’s explaining to the family.
> I didn’t wake up today and decide to make this **** up!!


Thank you mods for keeping this thread open.
Where else can we go to get this kind of entertainment?

And Specwar...while I totally believe you didn't wake up one day and make this one up...and I totally believe you were actually told this...I also believe that somebody *DID *wake up and make this one up.


----------



## Patricio

Covid-19 test kits in Tanzania have raised suspicion after samples taken from a goat and a pawpaw fruit came back with positive results, as the president said there were “technical errors”.

President John Magufuli said during an event in the north west of Tanzania that the test kits were imported from overseas, but did not say where.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...-suspicion-goat-pawpaw-positive-a9501291.html


----------



## Specwar

This lady is a member of a local religious sect that I doubt would make this information up. I have no reason to disbelieve her.
Thanks for your confidence.


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

bulafisherman said:


> For those of you with an open mind, here is an interesting interview with Dr Judy Mikovits. Kind of confirms alot that's being said outside of the mainstream news. It will probably get censored and taken down pretty quickly.


Good Lord, now it's come to using Anti Vaccine Activists? Google her and see what pops up.

Bula, so obviously you have faith in her beliefs, do you have children? Do you have them vaccinated?


----------



## Saugeye Tom

At this point who knows whats true and whats not. I'm sure its all true......


----------



## bridgeman

Saugeye Tom said:


> At this point who knows whats true and whats not. I'm sure its all true......


These are surely trying times all brought upon us by a select few self proclaimed experts. IMO we all need to start acting like Americans and not a bunch of sheep. If you wanna hide under a rock you have the right to do so, have at it. Just quit mandating me to do stupid chit that has no effect on how this thing works.


----------



## cincinnati

Stars-n-Stripers said:


> Good Lord, now it's come to using Anti Vaccine Activists? Google her and see what pops up.
> 
> Bula, so obviously you have faith in her beliefs, do you have children? Do you have them vaccinated?


Did you actually watch the video? Or just read her profile on Wikipedia?


----------



## SConner

cincinnati said:


> Did you actually watch the video? Or just read her profile on Wikipedia?


Not sure about Stars and Stripes but I watched the video then researched her. She is a disgraced kook in her field and was arrested and charged with theft. Charges were later dropped. In the video she claimed she was never charged and she was very specific about being held with no charges. This is what led me to research her as being held with no charges seemed unlikely. So let’s add liar to her resume.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judy_Mikovits


----------



## bulafisherman

Stars-n-Stripers said:


> Good Lord, now it's come to using Anti Vaccine Activists? Google her and see what pops up. In this particular interview which as expected has now been taken down she stated she is not against vaccination.
> 
> Bula, so obviously you have faith in her beliefs, do you have children? Do you have them vaccinated?


 no we chose to exercise our freedom of choice and not vaccinate when they were young. I now have 5 healthy thriving adult children 3 of which are or have been serving in the United States military for yours and my freedom and liberties.


----------



## Shad Rap

bulafisherman said:


> no we chose to exercise our freedom of choice and not vaccinate when they were young. I now have 5 healthy thriving adult children 3 of which are or have been serving in the United States military for yours and my freedom and liberties.


I thought you needed shots to attend school??..maybe thats not the case I don't know...my kids are grown...I know when my kids were younger we got letters basically saying if you don't innoculate your child, he or she can't attend school...I know there were exceptions and that was 20 years ago...times may have changed...thanks for your kids' service!


----------



## bulafisherman

SConner said:


> Not sure about Stars and Stripes but I watched the video then researched her. She is a disgraced kook in her field and was arrested and charged with theft. Charges were later dropped. In the video she claimed she was never charged and she was very specific about being held with no charges. This is what led me to research her as being held with no charges seemed unlikely. So let’s add liar to her resume.
> 
> https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judy_Mikovits


 the powers that be will always ruin, tarnish and discredit people like her if they are seen as a threat, including censoring what they have to say. Can't get anymore obvious that that. She is one of the many out there speaking up.


----------



## bulafisherman

Shad Rap said:


> I thought you needed shots to attend school??..maybe thats not the case I don't know...my kids are grown...I know when my kids were younger we got letters basically saying if you don't innoculate your child, he or she can't attend school...I know there were exceptions and that was 20 years ago...times may have changed...thanks for your kids' service!


 My wife choose to homeschool them. They did go to highschool and at that time we followed the required guidelines.


----------



## SConner

bulafisherman said:


> the powers that be will always ruin, tarnish and discredit people like her if they are seen as a threat, including censoring what they have to say. Can't get anymore obvious that that. She is one of the many out there speaking up.


So are you saying she was never charged (her claim) and that the court records were manufactured later to help discredit her? Because the Wiki page was very specific about the charges and them being dropped once materials were returned. It even cited an Attorney General in Reno. So you are saying this Attorney General in Reno is in on the conspiracy to discredit her?


----------



## Patricio

SConner said:


> . She is a disgraced kook in her field and


Meanwhile Fauci who has been wrong everytime he opens his mouth is still considered a respectable authority.


----------



## SConner

Patricio said:


> Meanwhile Fauci who has been wrong everytime he opens his mouth is still considered a respectable authority.


He was not who we were discussing, whataboutism is not an effective defense of Dr Judy. If you have a credible source for wrong doing perpetrated by Dr Fauci, I will research that as well.


----------



## bulafisherman

SConner said:


> So are you saying she was never charged (her claim) and that the court records were manufactured later to help discredit her? Because the Wiki page was very specific about the charges and them being dropped once materials were returned. It even cited an Attorney General in Reno. So you are saying this Attorney General in Reno is in on the conspiracy to discredit her?


 you have your way of looking at it and your interpretation and I have mine, I respect that. In the bigger picture I try to look at who has the most to gain and the most to lose. Money equals power. Corruption usually follows. Bottom line is she and so many others are speaking out yet are getting censored. They should still have the right to freedom of speech. I(what our country was founded on) than let each of us make our own informed decision. Why is it so hard for some to see that we are losing that. If we don't question everything and demand accountability. We lose it all. I am not saying she right in all that she is saying but I give her credit for speaking out, she is one of the many that are saying the same thing. Shouldn't that be telling us something.


----------



## Patricio

SConner said:


> He was not who we were discussing, whataboutism is not an effective defense of Dr Judy. If you have a credible source for wrong doing perpetrated by Dr Fauci, I will research that as well.


WOOOOSSSHH!


----------



## SConner

Patricio said:


> WOOOOSSSHH!


 Did I miss sarcasm? If so sorry.


----------



## SConner

bulafisherman said:


> you have your way of looking at it and your interpretation and I have mine, I respect that. In the bigger picture I try to look at who has the most to gain and the most to lose. Money equals power. Corruption usually follows. Bottom line is she and so many others are speaking out yet are getting censored. They should still have the right to freedom of speech. I(what our country was founded on) than let each of us make our own informed decision. Why is it so hard for some to see that we are losing that. If we don't question everything and demand accountability. We lose it all. I am not saying she right in all that she is saying but I give her credit for speaking out, she is one of the many that are saying the same thing. Shouldn't that be telling us something.


I am not sure a doctor spreading misinformation on social media platforms is a 1st amendment issue... if I am not mistaken her post are being removed for violating TOS. They all have rules just like this site does and we agree to follow them when we join. So let me make sure I understand, the conspiracy against Dr Judy now includes Whittemore Peterson Institute, a Reno Attorney General, any social media platform that has removed her posts or post of others who re-posts her information? Have I missed anyone?


----------



## crappiedude

SConner said:


> Have I missed anyone?


Yes...you missed all the rich people. They are out there planning and plotting to find new ways to hold other people down.


----------



## crittergitter

Vaccines work great for some diseases. They don't work for the flu. Science has proven that. The pharmaceutical companies don't want you to know that!!

Also, this doctor was arrested and charged, but the charges were later dropped. I wonder why. Theft is pretty serious to me. So, either there was no evidence or there was no crime! Doesn't that at least make you think about what she is saying. Of course her reputation was smeered. Woooo, pretty slick detective work there! lol


----------



## SConner

Read the wiki page I linked, charges were dropped when she agreed to return the material stolen from Whittemore Peterson Institute. I believe these types of deals are struck all the time. It does not explain why she lies in her video about never having been charged. She was very specific about this point in her video.


----------



## Rooster

Patricio said:


> Meanwhile Fauci who has been wrong everytime he opens his mouth is still considered a respectable authority.


You can add Amy "100,000" Acton to that list!


----------



## crittergitter

SConner said:


> Read the wiki page I linked, charges were dropped when she agreed to return the material stolen from Whittemore Peterson Institute. I believe these types of deals are struck all the time. It does not explain why she lies in her video about never having been charged. She was very specific about this point in her video.


She said those materials were planted there.

I can make a video with inaccurate information about covid-19. I bet YouTube would leave it up forever. 

Funny, Dr Judy M video got taken down. People with very deep pockets wanted it to go away! 

I am not a conspiracy theory guy, and I usually think stuff like this is crap. However, this all makes way to much sense to be circumstantial. Where there's smoke there is fire, and there is a LOT of smoke around this Fauci guy!! I'd think his pants would be on fire by now!!!


----------



## bulafisherman

SConner said:


> I am not sure a doctor spreading misinformation on social media platforms is a 1st amendment issue... if I am not mistaken her post are being removed for violating TOS. They all have rules just like this site does and we agree to follow them when we join. So let me make sure I understand, the conspiracy against Dr Judy now includes Whittemore Peterson Institute, a Reno Attorney General, any social media platform that has removed her posts or post of others who re-posts her information? Have I missed anyone?


 some people just have to be right at all costs regardless of circumstances. Its rather amusing, you can have your opinion and I have mine. Doesn't change the fact that the COVID 19 is being used against us and some still don't get that. But I think most eventually will or at least I hope so.


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

bulafisherman said:


> no we chose to exercise our freedom of choice and not vaccinate when they were young. I now have 5 healthy thriving adult children 3 of which are or have been serving in the United States military for yours and my freedom and liberties.


This is going to be quick I'm on lunch break.

So, you're saying your children have had NONE of these vaccines?
https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/schedules/hcp/imz/child-adolescent.html

Also, I AM grateful for their service.


----------



## Rooster

Stars-n-Stripers said:


> This is going to be quick I'm on lunch break.
> 
> So, you're saying your children have had NONE of these vaccines?
> https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/schedules/hcp/imz/child-adolescent.html
> 
> Also, I AM grateful for their service.


Being in the military, unless things have changed, I bet they have been vaccinated for some of those. I know that they gave me a ton of shots in the Army, and I don’t remember it being optional.

But, the military is a very different situation. You willingly give-up a lot of personal freedom/rights when joining the military, and are pretty much government property.

While I acknowledge the benefit of many vaccines, I 100% support the right of anyone to refuse them. I cannot think of a more egregious violation of personal liberty than forcing someone to be vaccinated.


----------



## bulafisherman

Stars-n-Stripers said:


> This is going to be quick I'm on lunch break.
> 
> So, you're saying your children have had NONE of these vaccines?
> https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/schedules/hcp/imz/child-adolescent.html
> 
> Also, I AM grateful for their service.


 As I stated before they are all healthy thriving adults now. I got suckered into bringing them into the discussion a few comments ago and this is were I draw the line....this is not about them and I will NOT discuss or debate about them anymore. I would hope that you can respect that.


----------



## bulafisherman

Rooster said:


> While I acknowledge the benefit of many vaccines, I 100% support the right of anyone to refuse them. I cannot think of a more egregious violation of personal liberty than forcing someone to be vaccinated.


 x2


----------



## AmericanEagle

427 deaths / 1 million population in Michigan
279 deaths / 1 million population in Pennsylvania
232 deaths / 1 million population in Illinois
213 deaths / 1 million population in Indiana
105 deaths / 1 million population in Ohio

IMHO Ohio has done better under Dr. Acton than comparable states but then again I find life preferable to death.

Stats are from Worldmeter.


----------



## SConner

bulafisherman said:


> some people just have to be right at all costs regardless of circumstances. Its rather amusing, you can have your opinion and I have mine. Doesn't change the fact that the COVID 19 is being used against us and some still don't get that. But I think most eventually will or at least I hope so.


I tried to keep my post extremely fact based and intentionally avoid my opinion other than to call her a kook. I cited sources for every assertion I made. In is not my opinion, it is fact...everything I cited I back up with fact. If you want to believe every conspiracy site on the web, we have nothing left to discuss as you will not accept the facts presented.


----------



## Burkcarp1

Buddy sent me this that lives in pa. Interesting


----------



## cincinnati

SConner said:


> Read the wiki page I linked, charges were dropped when she agreed to return the material stolen from Whittemore Peterson Institute. I believe these types of deals are struck all the time. It does not explain why she lies in her video about never having been charged. She was very specific about this point in her video.


Not saying I'm all in w/her story, but you should do better than Wikipedia, the People's Encyclopedia. Anyone can post or edit. A good place to shape history. 

My Wiki page would say that I caught & released a 28# smallie & a 70# musky, in a public golf course pond, on a Banjo Minnow. (What a Honey Hole!!) Pictures lost in a tragic boating accident. And it would all be true because it's on the Internet....unless my detractors found & "edited" it.


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

Rooster said:


> Being in the military, unless things have changed, I bet they have been vaccinated for some of those. I know that they gave me a ton of shots in the Army, and I don’t remember it being optional.
> 
> But, the military is a very different situation. You willingly give-up a lot of personal freedom/rights when joining the military, and are pretty much government property.
> 
> While I acknowledge the benefit of many vaccines, I 100% support the right of anyone to refuse them. I cannot think of a more egregious violation of personal liberty than forcing someone to be vaccinated.


You stole my thunder that's where I was going with my point.


bulafisherman said:


> As I stated before they are all healthy thriving adults now. I got suckered into bringing them into the discussion a few comments ago and this is were I draw the line....this is not about them and I will NOT discuss or debate about them anymore. I would hope that you can respect that.


I certainly respect your position. I was only questioning your statement of choosing not to vaccinate, when my understanding was there was some type of requirement for military service.


----------



## SConner

cincinnati said:


> Not saying I'm all in w/her story, but you should do better than Wikipedia, the People's Encyclopedia. Anyone can post or edit. A good place to shape history.
> 
> My Wiki page would say that I caught & released a 28# smallie & a 70# musky, in a public golf course pond, on a Banjo Minnow. (What a Honey Hole!!) Pictures lost in a tragic boating accident. And it would all be true because it's on the Internet....unless my detractors found & "edited" it.


https://news.google.com/articles/CA...GCAowrqkBMKBFMMGBAg?hl=en-US&gl=US&ceid=US:en

https://www.medpagetoday.com/blogs/zdoggmd/86351
https://www.medpagetoday.com/blogs/zdoggmd/86351
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.syracuse.com/coronavirus/2020/05/youtube-removes-plandemic-video-with-coronavirus-claims-by-dr-judy-mikovits.html?outputType=amp
https://www.medpagetoday.com/blogs/zdoggmd/86351
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/scientist-vaccine-jailed/
https://www.medpagetoday.com/blogs/zdoggmd/86351
https://www.sciencemag.org/news/201...drome-researcher-fired-amidst-new-controversy
https://www.medpagetoday.com/blogs/zdoggmd/86351
https://www.reddit.com/r/CovIdiots/comments/gezery/plandemic_documentary_debunked/
https://www.medpagetoday.com/blogs/zdoggmd/86351
https://medium.com/charlatanwatch/judy-mikovits-charlatanwatch-74cf4d103317
https://www.medpagetoday.com/blogs/zdoggmd/86351
https://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/07/...igue-syndrome-retraction-is-far-and-wide.html

https://www.google.com/amp/s/abcnews.go.com/amp/Health/Wellness/chronic-fatigue-researcher-jailed-controversy/story?id=15076224

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ch...igue-scientist-arrest-20111122-story,amp.html


----------



## bridgeman

I wouldn't be surprised if the overwhelming majority of these unfortunate deaths were people that already had underlying medical issues. Good people are going to suffer irreparable damage from this charade. Aint gonna be long till all will band together and say enough is enough.


----------



## JamesF

bulafisherman said:


> no we chose to exercise our freedom of choice and not vaccinate when they were young. I now have 5 healthy thriving adult children 3 of which are or have been serving in the United States military for yours and my freedom and liberties.


I may be wrong, but upon entering the U. S.military,vaccination is mandatory. Meaning they are now the property of the United States of America,end of subject,according to the government, that is the protection of U.S. property.


----------



## bulafisherman

JamesF said:


> I may be wrong, but upon entering the U. S.military,vaccination is mandatory. Meaning they are now the property of the United States of America,end of subject,according to the government, that is the protection of U.S. property.


 you are correct, I said when they were young, at 18 they choose to enlist and with that came the mandatory vaccination. Their choice


----------



## JamesF

I received more than my share of shots in the Navy. I didn't know it at the time, but when I enlisted, I was put on their drug testing program .


----------



## Dovans

JamesF said:


> I received more than my share of shots in the Navy. I didn't know it at the time, but when I enlisted, I was put on their drug testing program .


polly wog?


----------



## jrose

Did anybody catch when Dewine was asked about schools opening in late August and he said he didn't think so. Maybe some sort of 2 days a week for half the students (Monday/ Wed.) 2 days for the other half (Tues./Thur.) to keep social distancing. This is insane!


----------



## JamesF

Dovans said:


> polly wog?


Twice. First time was kind of weird. Very different experience.


----------



## fastwater

jrose said:


> Did anybody catch when Dewine was asked about schools opening in late August and he said he didn't think so. Maybe some sort of 2 days a week for half the students (Monday/ Wed.) 2 days for the other half (Tues./Thur.) to keep social distancing. *This is insane!*


Sure it is...

https://www.npr.org/sections/health...e-in-kids-and-teens-likely-linked-to-covid-19

Since there is not one Doctor or Scientist in the world that knows enough about covid19 to predict the viruses long term affect and total outcome of just who all it affects...and since they all openly admit they are still learning more every day, what kind of question is it to even ask at this stage of the game if school is going to be open in August? 
IMO, asking that question now and expecting an answer is what's 'insane'!


----------



## jrose

fastwater said:


> Sure it is...
> 
> https://www.npr.org/sections/health...e-in-kids-and-teens-likely-linked-to-covid-19
> 
> Until more is learned/known about covid19, don't think I'd be sending my kids back to school regardless if he opened them or not.


Just curios, how long do you wait?


----------



## jrose

fastwater said:


> Sure it is...
> 
> https://www.npr.org/sections/health...e-in-kids-and-teens-likely-linked-to-covid-19
> 
> Until more is learned/known about covid19, don't think I'd be sending my kids back to school regardless if he opened them or not.


I read the article and it ended with “ it’s pure speculation at this point” so.......?


----------



## fastwater

jrose said:


> I read the article and it ended with “ it’s pure speculation at this point” so.......?


'So' if it proves to be more than just speculation then what?
Again...to even bring something up as far in the future as August at this stage is ridiculous.
But so is about 2/3's of what we read and hear...including the numbers/stats that everyone here loves to quote.
But that hasn't slowed the quoting of them down any.

Far as 'how long do we wait?'
IMO, again, until we're sure the virus isn't going to wreak some kind of unknown havoc on kids/teens in a way we haven't seen yet. Obviously it's not up to me...but if I'm Dewine...come August, if I didn't have some concrete proof it was safe to open schools up...you can bet they wouldn't open.


----------



## hailtothethief

bulafisherman said:


> you are correct, I said when they were young, at 18 they choose to enlist and with that came the mandatory vaccination. Their choice


Dunno in world war 2 you were drafted. My dad always complained about not getting a choice. He said if they said you go than you went. He struck gold getting stationed in palm beach florida. Back then they called it the air force, it was not called the army.


----------



## Burkcarp1

fastwater said:


> Sure it is...
> 
> https://www.npr.org/sections/health...e-in-kids-and-teens-likely-linked-to-covid-19
> 
> Since there is not one Doctor or Scientist in the world that knows enough about covid19 to predict the viruses long term affect and total outcome of just who all it affects...and since they all openly admit they are still learning more every day, what kind of question is it to even ask at this stage of the game if school is going to be open in August?
> IMO, asking that question now and expecting an answer is what's 'insane'!


And who answered that question?Whoever answered that question ain’t the sharpest tool in the shed at this point.


----------



## BeerBatter

I
Heard the browns were gonna win the super bowl


----------



## fastwater

Burkcarp1 said:


> And who answered that question?Whoever answered that question ain’t the sharpest tool in the shed at this point.


As you know...it was Dewine.
But his answers to the question was clearly stating possible options that have been discussed with school Superintendents...not anything positively planned.

http://local12.com/news/local/dewine-says-learning-may-look-a-lot-different-next-school-year


----------



## Burkcarp1

fastwater said:


> As you know...it was Dewine.
> But his answers to the question was clearly stating possible options that have been discussed with school Superintendents...not anything positively planned.
> 
> http://local12.com/news/local/dewine-says-learning-may-look-a-lot-different-next-school-year


Ok,I didn’t watch it today. Wasn’t sure who answered it.


----------



## JamesF

So many uncertainties with this virus, it's day to day about how it effects people. I haven't heard about any real breakthroughs, unless I have missed something. I'm like most people, anxious to get through this.


----------



## KaGee

Burkcarp1 said:


> Ok,I didn’t watch it today. Wasn’t sure who answered it.


Nobody watched it today... they were dark until Monday.


----------



## fastwater

KaGee said:


> Nobody watched it today... they were dark until Monday.


Yep...believe Dewine statements concerning question asked about schools reopening were made this past Wed.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Those reporters disprove the old adage" that there are no stupid questions".


----------



## Saugeye Tom

so no middle ground one way or the other....lets roll the dice


----------



## jdl447

Saugeye Tom said:


> so no middle ground one way or the other....lets roll the dice


Pretty much what they did in ‘68.

https://www.aier.org/article/woodstock-occurred-in-the-middle-of-a-pandemic/


----------



## Specwar

Unfortunately I had the Hong Kong flu in 1968. Junior in high school and missed 2-1/2 weeks of school. I cannot recalling ever being that sick again since.


----------



## Shad Rap

jrose said:


> Did anybody catch when Dewine was asked about schools opening in late August and he said he didn't think so. Maybe some sort of 2 days a week for half the students (Monday/ Wed.) 2 days for the other half (Tues./Thur.) to keep social distancing. This is insane!


He's definitely not the sharpest tool in the shed...this is the same guy that wants to open restaurant seating outside (which hardly any restaurants have) and then seating inside a week later...lol...huh????..already canceling 4th of july?..the whole summer is gonna be canceled...how about waitng til we're a litte closer to events instead of canceling stuff now?..at this rate, the 2021 school year is gonna be delayed at the beginning of June...hell, maybe while we're at it we can just cancel absolutey everything the rest of this year right now!


----------



## hailtothethief

Its all about the benjamins. Self employed are now eligible to collect unemployment and were going to drain the rest of the state unemployment funds asap. The state had no choice but to open up or pay.Money talks.


----------



## 9Left

hailtothethief said:


> Its all about the benjamins. Self employed are now eligible to collect unemployment and were going to drain the rest of the state unemployment funds asap. The state had no choice but to open up or pay.Money talks.


Well...there are ways to have your opinion and voice truly heard, but.....



hailtothethief said:


> I dont vote,


----------



## MagicMarker

Open up everything now. This whole thing has been a waste of time and money


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## luredaddy

I could have worn out a "DISLIKE" button on this thread.


----------



## loves2fishinohio

MagicMarker said:


> Open up everything now. This whole thing has been a waste of time and money


I've said all along I would rather look back on this and said we did too much than not enough. It's time to get back to business and give the media something else to find a story on.


----------



## KPI

I have one question why are people so against vaccines it seems crazy to me!!why would there be protests about covid-19 vaccine would that nit help us during a time like this 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Saugeye Tom

KPI said:


> I have one question why are people so against vaccines it seems crazy to me!!why would there be protests about covid-19 vaccine would that nit help us during a time like this
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Chips included or Bill Gates and Fauci making money


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## KPI

Explain not sure what you mean chips included or people making money 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## cement569

ok, here it goes. i know i will ruffel some feathers, do i think there is a virus out there? yes there is a strange flu going on that attacks the elderly and those with pre-existing health problems. what i am going to say is not politlical but just stand back and take a good look its called socialisim and its unfolding right before our eyes.....thanks to some group. thank you and goodnight


----------



## Burkcarp1

KPI said:


> Explain not sure what you mean chips included or people making money
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Do some research...


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## KPI

Seems far fetched!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## cincinnati

For your consideration.
https://www.conservativereview.com/...s-epidemic-outside-nursing-homes-essentially/


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## Saugeye Tom

KPI said:


> Seems far fetched!!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Nothing seems far fetched anymore


----------



## SConner

KPI said:


> I have one question why are people so against vaccines it seems crazy to me!!why would there be protests about covid-19 vaccine would that nit help us during a time like this
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance


----------



## KPI

I have to say what would anyone want to chip everyone in the United States ???this is the most Ridiculous things I have ever heard so let me get this straight they created a virus to come up with a vaccine to micro chip everyone do you know how crazy this sounds !!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Burkcarp1

If someone told me the whole world is shutting down couple months ago I would have thought the same thing. As far as why? Follow the money.


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## cement569

i would still like to know why everyone was sent a census form in the mail right about the time the virus started? and it said if not submitted by a certian date you would be fined and jail time,l folks there is something very strange going on


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## JamesF

I have only had one census, and that was done by real people. The way it was explained to me, is that it's similar to jury duty. Obligated by law. There is more to a census than what people think. It has an impact on voting districts, demographic regions that are in distress, and a lot more, that includes Federal funding on many levels. Google; census, there will be more information than just what people think of it.


----------



## OptOutside440

Wearable biometrics is real and in all seriousness it will happen in the near future.

https://techcrunch.com/2020/05/04/n...d-offer-early-warnings-for-covid-19-patients/

https://www.biometricupdate.com/202...metrics-from-wearables-with-motiv-acquisition

https://findbiometrics.com/research-team-biometric-contact-lenses-treat-monitor-diabetes-050406/

https://www.biometricupdate.com/202...op-wearable-biosensors-to-monitor-vital-signs

If anything wearable biometrics will be a reality in the future. People talk about being chipped but what is amusing is that we all already are so blind that we're chipped already through smart devices like a phone. They are tracking us. You can turn your phone off and onto airplane mode and it IS still saving your location. They did a story about that on dateline or 20/20 years ago. If you want to get even more paranoid about what all we agree with, watch the documentary that is free on YouTube called "Terms and Conditions May Apply". We blindly give up privacy when we sign up for a Gmail account or Facebook etc. How many of you have read the terms and conditions? That's right none of you, it would take months to read.

_"It would take 76 work days (8 hours a day) for the average person to read the Terms and Conditions they agree to in a year. If you're like most people, terms and conditions are scrolled past, as if on autopilot, and agreed to without much thought."
_
Germaphobia is what will come from this. Mark my words it will be used for a cashless society. You want to spend money, you'll need a phone or wearable biometric device soon. Hope everyone who makes money under the table is prepared when this hits because there won't be any cheating on taxes when this hits. Oh yeah... criminal on the run? You won't get far without being able to pay and with geo tracking on. They will just cut off your access to the spending money. It will all be done in the guise of safety or exactly what is happening now. You'll see. They all laughed when I said The Patriot Act allowed this. No one was laughing after Snowden blew the whistle. Then everyone says well I don't have anything to hide. It's coming.


----------



## KPI

Cash will never be gone companies will not want to pay all the transaction fees associated with 100 card payments !!!I sure hope cash will not be done away with because I will not put stuff on a card I just won’t if people want to pay me with a card I have to call corporate to get it ok d because we are only allowed to take $2500 on a card sometimes I am picking up 8-10,000 upwards of $40,000 cod when jobs are completed and we have to take a cashiers check or bank check because imagine what the card company would be charging on that transaction 


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## mountainbikingrn

cement569 said:


> i would still like to know why everyone was sent a census form in the mail right about the time the virus started? and it said if not submitted by a certian date you would be fined and jail time,l folks there is something very strange going on



It was sent out because it is a decennial census (years ending in zero are census years). The US Census has always been “required” for everyone who qualifies. First census was actually conducted by US Marshalls! 

https://www.census.gov/newsroom/blogs/director/2010/01/why-is-the-census-mandatory.html

Beyond that I have no comment on conspiracy theories.


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## hailtothethief

I dont think there used to be penalty for not doing the census. A lot of people like there privacy and wouldnt share information anymore than they would there social security number.


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## mountainbikingrn

If you do a quick google search or read the attachment (first paragraph from The Census Act of 1790) their always has been a penalty attached to not completing it. Not arguing with you, just stating facts.


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## hailtothethief

Yes but have they ever punished anyone for not filling out the census? yes you can threaten to punish someone for not fill out the census but is it a good use of tax payer money to jail someone for not fill out the census, and has is actually happened? There’s a lot of ornery people who stand by their right to privacy. Got to think one person didnt fill it out. I never heard of anyone going to jail for failing to fill out the census or being fined.


----------



## cement569

well please explain why my wife and i recieved one. im 62 years old and have lived in the same house for 30 plus years and this is our first ever


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## MagicMarker

A number of years ago I refused to fill one out. Eventually they sent someone to my door to get it filled out. All I would tell them was the number of us living here and they went away. Never heard from them again. As far as I’m concerned I’m not answering any of their other questions


----------



## JamesF

Many illegal immigrants have gone to jail, before a hearing,and deportation. If necessary. And anyone harboring fugitives. In 1900 eleven illegal immigrants were arrested in North Canton. This happened at the Speedway on Eberhard. They were renting an apartment nearby, and stealing from the Speedway. They did the twenty dollar bill trick, while the others stuffed their pockets. After I told the cashier about it, she was shocked and didn't want to believe it. She checked the register and a few other things. Two days later, they were arrested at Speedway.


----------



## JamesF

I filled out a census that year. The apartment complex had census takers go through, and I don't know what, or if anything happened there.


----------



## EnonEye

wow has this thread taken a turn... well, I feel like I'm a character in the film Children of the Corn and I'm too old to keep alive... from what I read on here and see locally seems like we've hit our saturation point of dealing with this virus and we're near every man for himself and to hell with us that are susceptible, vulnerable and get a death ticket if we catch this virus... good way to get me off the government payroll... 2 restaurants I got take out from this weekend, neither had workers wearing masks... never thought I'd see the day when our children wants to throw us out with the bathwater... now where's my aluminum headgear and bug scanner at, they're watching me


----------



## MagicMarker

I hit my saturation point the 1st week


----------



## luredaddy

When those living on the fringe in the country, question the authority of the government taking a ten year census, it is really questionable. Article I, Section 2, Clause 3, of the Constitution gives Congress the power to conduct a census, every ten years. The Constitution is the law of the land, and has held the country together since our independence. The Constitution has changed over the years by amendments, usage, supreme court interpretation, etc...but it is still the law of the land.


----------



## KPI

I have to say there are so many conspiracy theories out there where does this come from why the heck would government wanna track me I am not that important!!who shot JFK and is Elvis alive and are there aliens people the government is there to help us not to take our freedom away and hide stuff from us unless it is national security like the desks going in somewhere or military is up to something that is above my pay grade and I trust they make the right decisions !!!just live your life and enjoy your time here not thinking people are always out to scam or take advantage of you 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## buckeyebowman

KPI said:


> I have one question why are people so against vaccines it seems crazy to me!!why would there be protests about covid-19 vaccine would that nit help us during a time like this
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Why? Because there are a lot of members of the "keepers of odd knowledge society" out there! If you've never heard the expression "keepers of odd knowledge society" before, just consider the anagram it creates, and you will understand.



hailtothethief said:


> Yes but have they ever punished anyone for not filling out the census? yes you can threaten to punish someone for not fill out the census but is it a good use of tax payer money to jail someone for not fill out the census, and has is actually happened? There’s a lot of ornery people who stand by their right to privacy. Got to think one person didnt fill it out. I never heard of anyone going to jail for failing to fill out the census or being fined.


Talk about keepers of odd knowledge, some of those "ornery" people certainly qualify! In my life I've found that the main reason for their overweening concern about privacy is that many of them are kind of shady! They don't want their activities coming to the attention of the authorities.

I've never heard of anyone being jailed over failure to partake in the census, but it only happens every 10 years, so it's not like the news is filled with those kinds of stories.

Also, the Founding Fathers were also concerned with privacy. They wrote the Constitution and enacted the Bill of Rights with that in mind. They also understood that knowing how many people we had, and where they were, was vitally important considering how representation was laid out in the Constitution.


----------



## JamesF

There are many secret societies. Some well known, and others that are not so much known. Many have been around for a very long time, without revealing their true purpose. I never gave this much thought. Until I I actually met a guy that was so paranoid about big brother, that, he seriously avoided people. He was a great machinist, but only worked midnight's. I talked to him off the on. One night, he gave me a newspaper. It was really spooky, reading about the group's involvement with many different types of like minded societies and associations. This comes from people that are highly intelligent and on different level. I came to understand that their intelligence is what they fear the most. And this Pandemic, just fuels their fire. Not to be too far off topic, but Google Bill Rhodes. As in Rhodes scholar. I know that everyone wants this to be over with. And without the understanding of this virus, the unknown is what a lot of people fear the most. Hopefully it will fade away, but the memories will remain.


----------



## Wow

I appreciate all of you who are protecting your families, friends and neighbors.
You are the ones being responsible and taking the long term view.
You are the true patriots here and deserve respect for it.

We read the arguments of the trolls, the malcontents and the self-proclaimed mavericks who would tell you something different.
Maybe they are young and feel invincible or they have an agenda they are trying to push.

Conspiracies are popping up everywhere, by those who have found a weak-minded audience and crave their 15 minutes of fame.


*Speculation is understandable, since we have never been here before.* The best experts in the world can only speculate based on there experience and knowledge from decades of studies. 

What we do know is what has transpired in the last 10 weeks, infections, death, and the exponential rise around the country and the world. (A number that is widely believed to be undercounted).

Leadership has taken many forms, all of which have claimed to be looking out for the lives of Americans. Some apparently are, while others are following the will of their political bases. All of them have positioned themselves to be blameless when the story unfolds and hard facts reveal themselves.
Have you noticed the optimism of their plans with nothing but hope to follow?

Our best projections are coming from the most worthy sources, while we try to “kill the messengers” and diminish their reputations.

The only good news I see is that a majority of Americans want to take the long road and the right road. We need to get this right.

Opening up the economy is the right road if we do it the right way. With the cooperation of all Americans we can will this to happen, fight this on two fronts.
Without cooperation, I fear a feeble outcome. 

The loudest voices, of those who want to open the economy, appear to be the least likely to take the precautions that are needed. 
You may be willing to “Cut off your nose to spite your face”, but a third of Americans will not be persuaded to venture out to buy your products, dine at your facility or visit your establishment if your precautions are not adequate.

I’m heartened by those of you here at OGF, who have a plan to fight this in your own way.
Stay cautious, stay steadfast and bless all of you. --Tim


----------



## TheStinger

bulafisherman said:


> For those of you with an open mind, here is an interesting interview with Dr Judy Mikovits. Kind of confirms alot that's being said outside of the mainstream news. It will probably get censored and taken down pretty quickly.





bulafisherman said:


> For those of you with an open mind, here is an interesting interview with Dr Judy Mikovits. Kind of confirms alot that's being said outside of the mainstream news. It will probably get censored and taken down pretty quickly.


----------



## TheStinger

Reading Judy's book Plague right now. Looks like the Medical Swamp is just as bad as the DC Swamp.


----------



## yonderfishin

KPI said:


> I have one question why are people so against vaccines it seems crazy to me!!why would there be protests about covid-19 vaccine would that nit help us during a time like this
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Because its looking like the vaccination will be mandatory with possible fines or worse , and inability to go to work without it. That is not freedom it is control. 

As it is , existing vaccines contain fetal cells , mercury , preservatives , etc. and no matter how " safe " they are claimed to be , people are right to question what they are putting into their body and to object to it if they choose. With the mention of databases kept of who is immune and who has been vaccinated , the system is ripe for abuse and the biggest power grab in history. The flu vaccine does not even work and its been in development for decades , many people putting that crap into their body every year. 

Next thing ya know , an implanted microchip will be mandatory , so they can track you and be assured that you have been vaccinated......does contact tracing sound familiar ?

Look up HR 6666 , a house resolution in congress dealing with immunization and contact tracing. Details in the resolution are vague enough that they can do whatever they want , even come into your home for enforcement if necessary. And that number ought to haunt everyone who sees it atleast a little.

Conspiracy theory ? ...... or maybe just the ability to read the writing on the wall in this case ?


----------



## bulafisherman

yonderfishin said:


> the system is ripe for abuse and the biggest power grab in history


 my thoughts exactly, IAM holding on to the hope that they jumped the gun a little to prematurely and enough people will wake up and protest before it's to late. Think we might still have a chance. https://www.businessinsider.com/deborah-birx-cdc-comments-coronavirus-task-force-meeting-2020-5?amp


----------



## meisjedog

A new study shows thatCovid-19 can transmit through the eyes - makes total sense.


----------



## mountainbikingrn

From a RN who suits up and cares for anyone with Covid 19 in my ICU, I hope that you all stay safe and get out and fish. To my fellow health care workers stay safe and better times are ahead! Signing off the thread!


----------



## fastwater

mountainbikingrn said:


> From a RN who suits up and cares for anyone with Covid 19 in my ICU, I hope that you all stay safe and get out and fish. To my fellow health care workers stay safe and better times are ahead! Signing off the thread!


Thank You for what you do mountainbikingrn.
To show you(and all other medical workers) my appreciation, I will do my best to do what I can to prevent myself from getting this virus as to not add to your work load.


----------



## bad luck

It's now been a few weeks, but where are all the reports of all the bodies resulting from....
***WI primary voting....
***spring break and beaches of FL (and GA the last few weeks)
*** all of the HORROR stories of people not socially distancing for the last few months at Lowes, HD, grocery stores....
**GA....they completely opened back up 2 weeks ago and had their lowest total in the hospital admissions this past weekend.....trending DOWN since opening back up....


----------



## bridgeman

All a giant mistake because we blindly followed a bunch self proclaimed experts. Lowes and Home Depot around here had the 100 person limit for about a week. I was there Friday and the parking lot was full, walked right in. They must said screw it we're in business to make money. They aint gonna risk having people walk away because they didnt wanna stand in line for an hour.


----------



## SConner

bad luck said:


> It's now been a few weeks, but where are all the reports of all the bodies resulting from....
> ***WI primary voting....
> ***spring break and beaches of FL (and GA the last few weeks)
> *** all of the HORROR stories of people not socially distancing for the last few months at Lowes, HD, grocery stores....
> **GA....they completely opened back up 2 weeks ago and had their lowest total in the hospital admissions this past weekend.....trending DOWN since opening back up....


I guess you think 80,000 dead and climbing is nothing but cannon fodder.


----------



## Dovans

Was looking for a link, but I read that Ga. has had a 40% increase covid-19 cases since the reopening. Does not matter that I cant find the link, as either your dead set against hearing how bad it is or your not. Your going to believe what you want. 
I think we need to get open and I think more people are going to get sick and die because we are opening but we are headed for one hell of a depression.


----------



## bad luck

SConner said:


> I guess you think 80,000 dead and climbing is nothing but cannon fodder.


since you brought up 80,000.....

**that wasn’t for the last 2 weeks, that’s the total from the 1st death recorded in Feb....
**of that , a very high % are from nursing homes....not many Lowe’s shoppers or beach goers .....

**for reference, this is not on the pace of annual cancer deaths.....cancer claimed over 600K Americans last year 

** it’s also not on the pace of smoking related deaths, at 480,000 per year, I don’t see our economy getting shut down over the use of cigarettes and chewing tobacco


All numbers I provided can easily be googled (CDC & ACS)


----------



## bridgeman

Taken right off the Georgia covid19 site:

+/- 5000 cases since may 4th

Pennsylvania covid19 site:

+/- 7000 cases since may 4th


----------



## Snakecharmer

bad luck said:


> since you brought up 80,000.....
> 
> 
> **for reference, this is not on the pace of annual cancer deaths.....cancer claimed over 600K Americans last year
> 
> 
> 
> All numbers I provided can easily be googled (CDC & ACS)


 I didn't know cancer was contagious.....


----------



## goolies

bridgeman said:


> All a giant mistake because we blindly followed a bunch self proclaimed experts. Lowes and Home Depot around here had the 100 person limit for about a week. I was there Friday and the parking lot was full, walked right in. They must said screw it we're in business to make money. They aint gonna risk having people walk away because they didnt wanna stand in line for an hour.


But the fact that these companies are willing to put their employees at risk tells you all you need to know about them. I'll be spending my money at Menards.


----------



## ICENUT

bad luck said:


> since you brought up 80,000.....
> 
> **that wasn’t for the last 2 weeks, that’s the total from the 1st death recorded in Feb....
> **of that , a very high % are from nursing homes....not many Lowe’s shoppers or beach goers .....
> 
> **for reference, this is not on the pace of annual cancer deaths.....cancer claimed over 600K Americans last year
> 
> ** it’s also not on the pace of smoking related deaths, at 480,000 per year, I don’t see our economy getting shut down over the use of cigarettes and chewing tobacco
> 
> You don't get cancer from touching hand rails door knobs,your caryour mail,from your groceries I could go on and on,You don't catch cancer from hugging your grandkids or your wife or visiting your parents.Stating and comparing those statisitics is idiotic to say the least.Really!!!!!
> All numbers I provided can easily be googled (CDC & ACS)


----------



## laguna21

Any info on Georgia? They had the aggressive reopening of everything?


----------



## laguna21

Just noticed the numbers in the post above on Georgia, my mistake


----------



## Snakecharmer

laguna21 said:


> Any info on Georgia? They had the aggressive reopening of everything?


Cases up 45% since they re-opened according to ABC news tonight.


----------



## laguna21

I saw that also on NBC nightly news just now, sending the makeshift hospital materials there. The numbers above don't support that?


----------



## Snakecharmer

laguna21 said:


> I saw that also on NBC nightly news just now, sending the makeshift hospital materials there. The numbers above don't support that?



https://www.bing.com/search?q=Coronavirus+trend+in+Georgia&tf=U2VydmljZT1HZW5lcmljQW5zd2VycyBTY2VuYXJpbz1Db3JvbmFWaXJ1c01MIFBvc2l0aW9uPVRPUCBSYW5raW5nRGF0YT1UcnVlIEZvcmNlUGxhY2U9VHJ1ZSBQYWlycz1zY246Q29yb25hVmlydXNNTDtjb3VudHJ5Q29kZTpVU0E7c3RhdGVDb2RlOkdBO2ludGVudDpDaGVja0Nvcm9uYVRyZW5kO2Fib3ZlbmV3czpUcnVlOyB8&hs=UAXQgKsA+8qVRQRd/G+BXSGPJGatFkrR5L8cJmQFdnw=&FORM=COVIDR


----------



## M R DUCKS

Stopped at Menards today, saw 2 people turn around and leave when they saw that a mask was required!


----------



## KaGee

"During a task force meeting Wednesday, a heated discussion broke out between Deborah Birx, the physician who oversees the administration’s coronavirus response, and Robert Redfield, the director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. Birx and others were frustrated with the CDC’s antiquated system for tracking virus data, which they worried was inflating some statistics — such as mortality rate and case count — by as much as 25 percent, according to four people present for the discussion or later briefed on it. Two senior administration officials said the discussion was not heated.

“There is nothing from the CDC that I can trust,” Birx said, according to two of the people."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...024fe6-9149-11ea-a9c0-73b93422d691_story.html


----------



## Legend killer

KaGee said:


> "During a task force meeting Wednesday, a heated discussion broke out between Deborah Birx, the physician who oversees the administration’s coronavirus response, and Robert Redfield, the director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. Birx and others were frustrated with the CDC’s antiquated system for tracking virus data, which they worried was inflating some statistics — such as mortality rate and case count — by as much as 25 percent, according to four people present for the discussion or later briefed on it. Two senior administration officials said the discussion was not heated.
> 
> “There is nothing from the CDC that I can trust,” Birx said, according to two of the people."
> 
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...024fe6-9149-11ea-a9c0-73b93422d691_story.html


So we should trust politicians?


----------



## SConner

Snakecharmer said:


> Cases up 45% since they re-opened according to ABC news tonight.


That can’t be right, a hand full of posts ago we were told it had no impact /s.


----------



## billy4prez

Legend killer said:


> So we should trust politicians?


No we shouldn't trust politicians. Im not really sure how you can trust "experts" either. Thats kinda where I am at, I don't trust anyone. The only thing I will say is I trust people that said they have had this already and health professionals that said there was an upper respiratory virus going around this winter. Other than that its a bunch of bs and "they" are gonna spin the info to fit "thier" narrative.


----------



## Patricio

Snakecharmer said:


> Cases up 45% since they re-opened according to ABC news tonight.


CORONAVIRUS IN GEORGIA: State tests 110,000 for virus, doubles tested within last 10 days

https://www.wsbtv.com/news/local/co...ot/ATRNLCW5PFC7HE2DFLYITLHRAQ/?outputType=amp

It's because of increase testing there. Same as pretty much everywhere.


----------



## jdl447

.


----------



## fastwater

bad luck said:


> since you brought up 80,000.....
> 
> **that wasn’t for the last 2 weeks, that’s the total from the 1st death recorded in Feb....
> **of that , a very high % are from nursing homes....*not many Lowe’s shoppers or beach goers .....*
> 
> **for reference, this is not on the pace of annual cancer deaths.....*cancer claimed over 600K Americans last year *
> 
> ** *it’s also not on the pace of smoking related deaths, *at 480,000 per year, I don’t see our economy getting shut down over the use of cigarettes and chewing tobacco
> 
> 
> All numbers I provided can easily be googled (CDC & ACS)


***How do you know...prove your point there weren't many Lowes shoppers or beach goers or Kroger shoppers or restaurant goers(before closures) or hospital workers...

***Cancer not contagious so asinine to bring up those deaths when talking about covid19 deaths...

***Same with deaths by smoking...doesn't enter into the equation...smoking is elective.
Same as death by auto accident, motorcycle riding, skydiving or death by getting shot while robbing a bank or death by siucide. All elective deaths and don't enter into the equation either.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/05/05/us/coronavirus-death-toll-us.html


----------



## Rooster

Exercising your FREEDOM is elective. No one is advocating that individuals should be forced to leave their home, and it would be asinine to claim otherwise. Some individuals have weighed ALL the risks, and just want to reclaim the freedom to provide for their families.


----------



## bad luck

It’s fairly easy math. 
**80,000 was a mistake....more like 60K...see Dr Birx 
***about 30K nursing home deaths nationwide 
**theres 50%
** figure in diabetics, obese, cancer survivor, etc...
** now your looking at real world odds ...
**doubt Lowes/HD going out of business due to no masks ..

all numbers above re:COVID mirror the 2018 flu death numbers...


Myself/co-workers travel CONUS for work, over 150 flights/yr/each-all travel separately, up until Mid March. None of us have been deathly ill, etc....1/2 are considered “at risk” (choose 1 or more of fat, old, pre-existing some condition) ....all have had some sort of “stomach bug” or cold or flu like symptoms once or twice in last few years....so we all probably already were either exposed (sharing flights with international travelers) or already had it. And all are still working remotely, none have gotten it. 

Point is, we all take a chance leaving our homes everyday. I got in a bad car wreck thru no fault of my own last year, but still leave to fish, shoot, work, shop, etc....Govt shouldn’t be stopping anybody from exercising their rights


----------



## Burkcarp1

fastwater said:


> ***How do you know...prove your point there weren't many Lowes shoppers or beach goers or Kroger shoppers or restaurant goers(before closures) or hospital workers...
> 
> ***Cancer not contagious so asinine to bring up those deaths when talking about covid19 deaths...
> 
> ***Same with deaths by smoking...doesn't enter into the equation...smoking is elective.
> Same as death by auto accident, motorcycle riding, skydiving or death by getting shot while robbing a bank or death by siucide. All elective deaths and don't enter into the equation either.
> 
> https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/05/05/us/coronavirus-death-toll-us.html


So you’re saying the a car accident is done on purpose? Or am I reading that wrong?


----------



## Lewzer

A guy I work with had his step dad pass away April 27th. overweight, congestive heart failure and diabetic. 
The hospital tested him and his wife when she was finally allowed into the hospital to ID the body (he died at home). she tested negative. The state (Indiana) lost his test and stated it was “inconclusive”.
The death certificate came back last week with “covid 19” listed as cause of death. 
Wife [email protected]& off called the hospital. Their explanation was well he had respiratory issues. No data. No proof but still listed as cause of death. He was cremated by order of the state (don’t understand that. They are burying bodies in Ohio) so cannot do a retest.
A lot of false info out there. Even cause of deaths aren’t accurate.


----------



## fastwater

Burkcarp1 said:


> So you’re saying the a car accident is done on purpose? Or am I reading that wrong?


No...not done on purpose. But we make a choice to drive or not to drive.


----------



## fastwater

bad luck said:


> It’s fairly easy math.
> **80,000 was a mistake....more like 60K...see Dr Birx
> ***about 30K nursing home deaths nationwide
> **theres 50%
> ** figure in diabetics, obese, cancer survivor, etc...
> ** now your looking at real world odds ...
> **doubt Lowes/HD going out of business due to no masks ..
> ....
> 
> Why are you so willing to accept Dr Birx lower numbers as fact over several other Doctors numbers that happen to be higher?
> 
> Better question...why is anybody willing to accept... or quote any of these numbers(high or low)as 'totals' and fact when there's no possible way any of them can be correct?
> 'Fact' is, we don't know the correct 'to date' totals and never will get it exact.
> Again, we don't even know for certain when covid19 got here to the U.S. much less the correct total off test positive cases or total number of covid19 deaths.


----------



## cincinnati

Lengthy, but interesting.
https://www.thenewamerican.com/usne...-senate-contradicts-medias-covid-19-narrative


----------



## roundbadge

The Denominator will answer questions

2100 jailed positive, 100 with symptoms, 2000 asymptomatic

how many of the initial 100 were hospitalized?
how many of the 2000 other positives developed symptoms after they were tested?

this obviously spreads like wildfire, but the Ohio jail case plus all the Serology tests nationally should eventually add to that Denominator

what makes this bug scary is how it affects most people with mild to nothing and a few it destroys.............why?

The news is only reporting from the "front", like in a war, all the bad stuff


----------



## buckeyebowman

Burkcarp1 said:


> So you’re saying the a car accident is done on purpose? Or am I reading that wrong?





fastwater said:


> No...not done on purpose. But we make a choice to drive or not to drive.


I took it to mean that we put our lives at risk whenever we leave our home. And sometimes even when we stay home. If you use knives, grinders, drills, saws and some other tools. Life entails risk. You just have to judge how much risk you are willing to face. 



cincinnati said:


> Lengthy, but interesting.
> https://www.thenewamerican.com/usne...-senate-contradicts-medias-covid-19-narrative


That was interesting. Thanks for posting. It seems that far too many people are getting hung up on some sort of "perfect" solution for this. Like "we can't open up until there's a vaccine". That will be the end of this country! Perfect does NOT exist!


----------



## cincinnati

Link to CDC, updated yesterday. Nationwide deaths in steady decline since mid April....?

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid19/index.htm


----------



## buckeyebowman

Been following the number in my local area, and mid-April was definitely our worst stretch!


----------



## JamesF

I'm trying to be optimistic about all of this. And hoping for the best. I heard that some companies are going to have people working from home permanently. My would be happy to. But a lot of jobs aren't suited for that. Or maybe most jobs. It's tough, trying to some of the things I like, getting the material is a bit $#. Most places are closed, or the big box stores want an arm and a leg. I'll think of something.


----------



## Dovans

JamesF said:


> I'm trying to be optimistic about all of this. And hoping for the best. I heard that some companies are going to have people working from home permanently. My would be happy to. .


Oh good lord no. I am so ready for my wife to go back to a building to work.


----------



## 1more

I am tired of working 54hrs a week since October starting Friday going to 46hrs till next October!


----------



## bad luck

Bait & Switched is what happened to us...

-we went from “flatten the curve”
To
-“we need to find a vaccine”


----------



## cincinnati

The New Normal?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=2&v=wfGAktuU93s&feature=emb_logo&disable_polymer=true


----------



## bdawg

KaGee said:


> "During a task force meeting Wednesday, a heated discussion broke out between Deborah Birx, the physician who oversees the administration’s coronavirus response, and Robert Redfield, the director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. Birx and others were frustrated with the CDC’s antiquated system for tracking virus data, which they worried was inflating some statistics — such as mortality rate and case count — by as much as 25 percent, according to four people present for the discussion or later briefed on it. Two senior administration officials said the discussion was not heated.
> 
> “There is nothing from the CDC that I can trust,” Birx said, according to two of the people."
> 
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...024fe6-9149-11ea-a9c0-73b93422d691_story.html


The expert in the administration, Dr. Fauci was fired a week or so ago. This Dr. Birx who was appointed by the administration to replace him is a puppet that is saying what the administration wants her to say. The CDC has been in the business of tracking viruses and health data for decades. I'm sure they know how to count.

I am glad they temporarily shut down businesses and restricted large gatherings long enough to flatten the curve and get new regulations in place to make it safer for people to go to work and shop. The experts have been giving out the best advice they could given the data they had. As they got more data on how bad the virus was and how well social distancing was working, they revised that data weekly to give the best advice based on the new data. Modeling is not a perfect science. It is a projection. 

Hopefully, the economy will bounce back quickly.


----------



## Shad Rap

Lewzer said:


> A guy I work with had his step dad pass away April 27th. overweight, congestive heart failure and diabetic.
> The hospital tested him and his wife when she was finally allowed into the hospital to ID the body (he died at home). she tested negative. The state (Indiana) lost his test and stated it was “inconclusive”.
> The death certificate came back last week with “covid 19” listed as cause of death.
> Wife [email protected]& off called the hospital. Their explanation was well he had respiratory issues. No data. No proof but still listed as cause of death. He was cremated by order of the state (don’t understand that. They are burying bodies in Ohio) so cannot do a retest.
> A lot of false info out there. Even cause of deaths aren’t accurate.


Big answer here...MONEY...covid deaths pay out $$$$$...should be insurance fraud...this same stuff is happening from nursing home doctors too...families getting covid 19 as cause of death when the person was never even tested or tested negative, then the nursing home is left trying to explain to the families that they had nothing to do with the cause of death on the certificate...I have a feeling we'll see plenty of lawsuits down the road from this...


----------



## Legend killer

bdawg said:


> The expert in the administration, Dr. Fauci was fired a week or so ago. This Dr. Birx who was appointed by the administration to replace him is a puppet that is saying what the administration wants her to say. The CDC has been in the business of tracking viruses and health data for decades. I'm sure they know how to count.
> 
> I am glad they temporarily shut down businesses and restricted large gatherings long enough to flatten the curve and get new regulations in place to make it safer for people to go to work and shop. The experts have been giving out the best advice they could given the data they had. As they got more data on how bad the virus was and how well social distancing was working, they revised that data weekly to give the best advice based on the new data. Modeling is not a perfect science. It is a projection.
> 
> Hopefully, the economy will bounce back quickly.


This^


----------



## Snakecharmer

Shad Rap said:


> Big answer here...MONEY...covid deaths pay out $$$$$...should be insurance fraud...this same stuff is happening from nursing home doctors too...families getting covid 19 as cause of death when the person was never even tested or tested negative, then the nursing home is left trying to explain to the families that they had nothing to do with the cause of death on the certificate...I have a feeling we'll see plenty of lawsuits down the road from this...


I would think nursing homes would want anything but covid-19 on the death certificate to avoid lawsuits where they may be held responsible.


----------



## Shad Rap

Snakecharmer said:


> I would think nursing homes would want anything but covid-19 on the death certificate to avoid lawsuits where they may be held responsible.


It's the doctor, not the nursing home...doctors visit various nursing homes.


----------



## Shad Rap

Snakecharmer said:


> I would think nursing homes would want anything but covid-19 on the death certificate to avoid lawsuits where they may be held responsible.


And you're right...this is even a shock to the nursing homes that Covid is being listed as cause of death...they're not happy about it.


----------



## AmericanEagle

Lewzer said:


> A guy I work with had his step dad pass away April 27th. overweight, congestive heart failure and diabetic.
> The hospital tested him and his wife when she was finally allowed into the hospital to ID the body (he died at home). she tested negative. The state (Indiana) lost his test and stated it was “inconclusive”.
> The death certificate came back last week with “covid 19” listed as cause of death.
> Wife [email protected]& off called the hospital. Their explanation was well he had respiratory issues. No data. No proof but still listed as cause of death. He was cremated by order of the state (don’t understand that. They are burying bodies in Ohio) so cannot do a retest.
> A lot of false info out there. Even cause of deaths aren’t accurate.


If your co-worker's step dad had respiratory issues he may have met the criteria of a covid 19 death. Here is a link to the criteria. You may disagree with the criteria but if met there would be no fraud involved.

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvss/vsrg/vsrg03-508.pdf

Both the flu and covid 19 count presumed deaths. The vast majority of deaths from the flu do not involve a confirmed test for the flu.

This article analyzes deaths from the flu vs covid-19. It points out that the 25,000 to 69,000 deaths per year from the flu statistic is an estimate. It is not confirmed deaths. The confirmed deaths from the flu in the last six seasons ranged from 3,448 to 15,620.

https://blogs.scientificamerican.co...u-deaths-is-like-comparing-apples-to-oranges/

I would encourage anyone who suspects fraud to notify their insurance company or CMS if on medicare or medicaid.


----------



## Shad Rap

AmericanEagle said:


> If your co-worker's step dad had respiratory issues he may have met the criteria of a covid 19 death. Here is a link to the criteria. You may disagree with the criteria but if met there would be no fraud involved.
> 
> https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvss/vsrg/vsrg03-508.pdf
> 
> Both the flu and covid 19 count presumed deaths. The vast majority of deaths from the flu do not involve a confirmed test for the flu.
> 
> This article analyzes deaths from the flu vs covid-19. It points out that the 25,000 to 69,000 deaths per year from the flu statistic is an estimate. It is not confirmed deaths. The confirmed deaths from the flu in the last six seasons ranged from 3,448 to 15,620.
> 
> https://blogs.scientificamerican.co...u-deaths-is-like-comparing-apples-to-oranges/
> 
> I would encourage anyone who suspects fraud to notify their insurance company or CMS if on medicare or medicaid.


But how much money does a flu death get compensated?..I really have no Idea...my guess is it wouldn't be much, if any at all...follow the money...you're talking somewhere around $40,000 per covid death...


----------



## fastwater

bad luck said:


> Bait & Switched is what happened to us...
> 
> -we went from “flatten the curve”
> To
> -“we need to find a vaccine”


^^^Fake news^^^
NO 'BAIT AND SWITCH' HAS EVER HAPPENED AND IS NOT HAPPENING NOW!

If you have followed briefings from the onset, the intentions have always clearly been three fold:
1)flatten the curve to not overrun our hospitals
2)buy us time for to develope meds to treat covid19
3)work on a vaccine.

Far as a vaccine goes, it's never been a secret and was said from the onset over and over again that a vaccine...if developed was most likely anywhere from 1- 1 1/2 yrs off. Hopefully one will come sooner.
I'm sure when one is developed, it will be viewed by many as yet just another part of this huge 'conspiracy theory' that every leader of every country in the world got together and agreed to destroy all their own countries.


----------



## bridgeman

Look at our Pennsyvania governor and his staff practicing social distancing, they must have some kind of new high tech face masks on too. Photo supposedly taken yesterday


----------



## cincinnati

bridgeman said:


> View attachment 357181
> 
> 
> Look at our Pennsyvania governor and his staff practicing social distancing, they must have some kind of new high tech face masks on too. Photo supposedly taken yesterday


Have a family member w/long ties to PA. Her friends are telling her that your Guv will use the National Guard to enforce his rules.


----------



## Snakecharmer

bridgeman said:


> View attachment 357181
> 
> 
> Look at our Pennsyvania governor and his staff practicing social distancing, they must have some kind of new high tech face masks on too. Photo supposedly taken yesterday


Taken March 12,2020 before PA social distancing rules were in place. FAKE NEWS.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Shad Rap said:


> But how much money does a flu death get compensated?..I really have no Idea...my guess is it wouldn't be much, if any at all...follow the money...you're talking somewhere around $40,000 per covid death...


To nursing homes?


----------



## bobk

Snakecharmer said:


> To nursing homes?


Not to nursing homes or hospitals.


----------



## cincinnati

Bait & switch?


----------



## Saugeye Tom

open up lets see what happens...I think we'll be fine....a small spike if any. flood the market with tests and of course we'll see a spike


----------



## jrose

SConner said:


> I guess you think 80,000 dead and climbing is nothing but cannon fodder.


People die everyday.


----------



## jrose

fastwater said:


> ***How do you know...prove your point there weren't many Lowes shoppers or beach goers or Kroger shoppers or restaurant goers(before closures) or hospital workers...
> 
> ***Cancer not contagious so asinine to bring up those deaths when talking about covid19 deaths...
> 
> ***Same with deaths by smoking...doesn't enter into the equation...smoking is elective.
> Same as death by auto accident, motorcycle riding, skydiving or death by getting shot while robbing a bank or death by siucide. All elective deaths and don't enter into the equation either.
> 
> https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/05/05/us/coronavirus-death-toll-us.html


Ok, How about getting struck by lighting? There is a greater chance that you will get struck by lighting than die from corona. Time to get back to work.


----------



## jrose

fastwater said:


> ^^^Fake news^^^
> NO 'BAIT AND SWITCH' HAS EVER HAPPENED AND IS NOT HAPPENING NOW!
> 
> If you have followed briefings from the onset, the intentions have always clearly been three fold:
> 1)flatten the curve to not overrun our hospitals
> 2)buy us time for to develope meds to treat covid19
> 3)work on a vaccine.
> 
> Far as a vaccine goes, it's never been a secret and was said from the onset over and over again that a vaccine...if developed was most likely anywhere from 1- 1 1/2 yrs off. Hopefully one will come sooner.
> I'm sure when one is developed, it will be viewed by many as yet just another part of this huge 'conspiracy theory' that every leader of every country in the world got together and agreed to destroy all their own countries.


BS! It went from "3 weeks" to not opening schools in the fall! Do you think we would have shut down anything if we knew they would stretch this out indefinitely? There is no end to this crap right now (Shut down). It was a novel idea, it did what they wanted, now end it!


----------



## cincinnati

Maybe we've all been primed?

https://tomnikkola.com/prime/


----------



## Legend killer

I tend to listen to educated people....


----------



## jrose

cincinnati said:


> Maybe we've all been primed?
> 
> https://tomnikkola.com/prime/


Not all of us..... Baaaaaaaaaaaa but definitely some


----------



## SConner

jrose said:


> Ok, How about getting struck by lighting? There is a greater chance that you will get struck by lighting than die from corona. Time to get back to work.


So 80,000 + people in an 8 week span are hit by lightning strikes in the US???? Please cite your source for this data, it sounds patently false. Continuing to spread false information does nothing to advance our fight against this pandemic.


----------



## Burkcarp1

Legend killer said:


> I tend to listen to educated people....


Oh? You must be talking about Highly Educated DR Amy Acton when she said 6000 to 10000 cases per day? That’s just one example. The problem with most highly educated people is there’s no such thing as common sense.


----------



## Shad Rap

Snakecharmer said:


> To nursing homes?


Nope...not to nursing homes.


----------



## jrose

SConner said:


> So 80,000 + people in an 8 week span are hit by lightning strikes in the US???? Please cite your source for this data, it sounds patently false. Continuing to spread false information does nothing to advance our fight against this pandemic.


It's actually been five months.


----------



## SConner

jrose said:


> It's actually been five months.


Source for the lightning strike please. Interesting you now think it has been 5 months, just 9 short weeks ago many seemed certain there were only 15 cases that would be zero in weeks. Sounds like the scientist and medical experts may have been more right than wrong. They have certainly learned much in the past 2 months and with more data comes more accuracy of modeling. I will continue to listen to experts in their field not conspiracy web sites.


----------



## cement569

why do you think they opened up these testing stations? to pad the stats, if you test positive they just tell you to go home and take care of yourself. biggest scam ever handed down to the american people.....socialism, take a minute and look it up, brought to us by you know who


----------



## Shad Rap

jrose said:


> It's actually been five months.


Actually a little over 3 months isn't it?


----------



## jrose

Shad Rap said:


> Actually a little over 3 months isn't it?


January - May?


----------



## jrose

SConner said:


> Source for the lightning strike please. Interesting you now think it has been 5 months, just 9 short weeks ago many seemed certain there were only 15 cases that would be zero in weeks. Sounds like the scientist and medical experts may have been more right than wrong. They have certainly learned much in the past 2 months and with more data comes more accuracy of modeling. I will continue to listen to experts in their field not conspiracy web sites.


I just checked, there hasn't been one death reported from lighting strikes since the shut down? odd....


----------



## Snakecharmer

jrose said:


> I just checked, there hasn't been one death reported from lighting strikes since the shut down? odd....


Cause people are staying at home...


----------



## Shad Rap

jrose said:


> January - May?


I thought we were talking since the first confirmed case death in the US...wasn't that early February?..I might be wrong...at any rate...January to May is 4 months...because we're not talking about the whole month of May and not the whole Month of January...


----------



## SConner

jrose said:


> I just checked, there hasn't been one death reported from lighting strikes since the shut down? odd....


Since you seem unwilling or unable to answer my question, I will do it for you. Over the last 20 years there is an average of 51 annual (12 months) deaths from lightning strikes in the US. They go on to say mortality rate is 10%. My quick math says this equates to 500 people in the US are struck every 12 months (source cited below). So this means your statement was wildly inaccurate. We are all entitled to our opinions, not our facts. The fact is there is a very vocal minority spreading Incredible amounts of false information regarding COVID 19 and presenting it as fact. This is counter productive and irresponsible. If you are going to make a claim, be prepared to back it with a credible source. In case you are unsure, Infowars is not a credible source.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lightning_strike#Epidemiology


----------



## SConner

cement569 said:


> why do you think they opened up these testing stations? to pad the stats, if you test positive they just tell you to go home and take care of yourself. biggest scam ever handed down to the american people.....socialism, take a minute and look it up, brought to us by you know who


Look it up where? Please cite you source. No I don’t know who? Who are you referencing. Is it possible this is a veiled attempt to interject your politics into discussion?


----------



## I Fish

There's 161 pages here, so please forgive me if I missed it, but can anyone tell me how or where to find how many recoveries there have been in Ohio? I've been emailing the Ohio dept of Health off and on the last 3 weeks, and I have yet to get an answer.

It just seems odd to me that they are not reporting info on recoveries. Unless I missed it, it is nowhere to be found on the Covid-19 dashboard, or anywhere else for that matter. I bugs me because it makes the info on the dashboard seem way worse than it is. Not only have they not reported recoveries, they also have not reported how many have been released from the hospitals or ICU's. That all seems strange to me for some reason. Are there actually 25,000 cases right now, or have say 50% of them recovered, meaning there is actually 12,500 right now? Nobody seems to know.


----------



## Rooster

Does Dr. Amy “100,000” Acton get a pass for being wildly inaccurate, and spreading false information about COVID 19?


----------



## cement569

sconner, my source....a dictionary pretty sure the word is in there. it has nothing to do with politics, its called real life


----------



## fastwater

jrose said:


> BS! *It went from "3 weeks" to not opening schools in the fall! * Do you think we would have shut down anything if we knew they would stretch this out indefinitely? There is no end to this crap right now (Shut down). It was a novel idea, it did what they wanted, now end it!


Again...more fake new!!!
Clearly, if you monitored any of the updates from the onset, there has never been a definite 'shut down' time of 'three weeks' or any other length of time that has ever been set in stone. The shut down times have always been set up as an adjustable period of time that would be monitored as things developed.

If by fall there's not a clear cut proven Med to at least help fight covid19 once tested positive, it would be complete insanity to open schools back up. Especially since we still aren't 100% positive some of these new health issues popping up in children that are putting them in the hospital isn't directly related to covid19.


----------



## SConner

Rooster said:


> Does Dr. Amy “100,000” Acton get a pass for being wildly inaccurate, and spreading false information about COVID 19?


I would say we still don’t know the answer on this but you were absolutely correct on the death rate being off early on. We now have known cases in Ohio going back to early January, so it is still very possible the 100,000 was correct since a majority seem to have been asymptomatic. Either way, it was a guess based on information available at the time, not a plot to make the US communist IMHO. The experts are getting more and more accurate each day and I applaud what they are trying to do to minimize our risk as we open the economy back up. I just hope people are intelligent enough to do it responsibly and safely.


----------



## SConner

cement569 said:


> sconner, my source....a dictionary pretty sure the word is in there. it has nothing to do with politics, its called real life


You looked up “brought to you by you know who” in the dictionary? Who did it say that was?


----------



## cement569

no its not in the book but over half of americans know who you know who is but cant say it on the site...use your imagination


----------



## SConner

cement569 said:


> no its not in the book but over half of americans know who you know who is but cant say it on the site...use your imagination


Hence why I said a thinly veiled effort to inject your politics into discussion. I appreciate the admission it was done knowingly.


----------



## fastwater

SConner said:


> I would say we still don’t know the answer on this but you were absolutely correct on the death rate being off early on. *We now have known cases in Ohio going back to early January, *so it is still very possible the 100,000 was correct since a majority https://www.capitalcityonlineauction.com/cgi-bin/mndetails.cgi?ccoa416omatic. Either way, it was a guess based on information available at the time, not a plot to make the US communist IMHO. The experts are getting more and more accurate each day and I applaud what they are trying to do to minimize our risk as we open the economy back up. I just hope people are intelligent enough to do it responsibly and safely.


...again, the very reason the 'total' tested positive, recovery and death stats are inaccurate and ridiculous. All stats have to be higher since we now know covid19 was here at least a month before we even knew what covid19 was.
But just for giggles,using the 80,000 known cases to date divided by 4mos.(Feb-May) we've been testing, since it's now known covid19 was here at least a month prior, that makes Amy Actons figures fairly accurate to date.
Another 'but'...before this is over, the 100,000 figure will be small compared to the final tally's.


----------



## fastwater

cement569 said:


> no its not in the book but over half of americans know who you know who is but cant say it on the site...use your imagination


Yes...'you know who' has had the influence over every other country in the world that has chosen the same path we have to cause a world wide depression.
IT'S A GREAT CONSPIRACY OF THE WORLD conjured up by 'you know who' and strictly obeyed by all the rest of the world leaders!!!
Now that's funny...don't care who ya are.
It's no wonder whilst I was at Kroger the other day there wasn't any aluminum foil on the shelves. It's being bought up and made into hats.

P.S. Same as many state the covid19stats are really inflated, I think your stats when you say "*over half of Americans* know who you know who is" is hugely over inflated as well.


----------



## Legend killer

SConner said:


> Since you seem unwilling or unable to answer my question, I will do it for you. Over the last 20 years there is an average of 51 annual (12 months) deaths from lightning strikes in the US. They go on to say mortality rate is 10%. My quick math says this equates to 500 people in the US are struck every 12 months (source cited below). So this means your statement was wildly inaccurate. We are all entitled to our opinions, not our facts. The fact is there is a very vocal minority spreading Incredible amounts of false information regarding COVID 19 and presenting it as fact. This is counter productive and irresponsible. If you are going to make a claim, be prepared to back it with a credible source. In case you are unsure, Infowars is not a credible source.
> 
> https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lightning_strike#Epidemiology


No offense but quoting Wikipedia as a credible source is just as bad.


----------



## roundbadge

SConner said:


> We now have known cases in Ohio going back to early January, so it is still very possible the 100,000 was correct since a majority seem to have been asymptomatic.


Using a 10% Serology rate at 12mm Ohio Pop.............1,200,000 may have been positive at some point to-date.................divide that by 100 days for a daily rate of 12,000, if we all were tested


----------



## Shad Rap

I'm still waiting for the 10,000 new cases A DAY (in Ohio)...she was close...


----------



## SConner

Legend killer said:


> No offense but quoting Wikipedia as a credible source is just as bad.


Are you disputing any of the data in the link? It was a fast easy reference, unless you think the data presented is wrong for lightning strikes. I played this game last week when someone challenged wiki as a source and went on to cite a medical journal, a science publication and a handful of media sources. All said the same thing. Unless you think the lightning deaths are wrong, I will believe wiki on this stat. I will try not to use them as a source going forward to avoid this discussion.


----------



## SConner

roundbadge said:


> Using a 10% Serology rate at 12mm Ohio Pop.............1,200,000 may have been positive at some point to-date.................divide that by 100 days for a daily rate of 12,000, if we all were tested


I apologize, I am not sure what you are trying to convey. The 100,000 was not a daily rate it was a snapshot in time when Dr Amy Acton said it was possible that over 100,000 in Ohio had already been infected. Could you expand on what you are saying as I am not following. I think you are supporting this, but I am not sure.


----------



## jrose

Shad Rap said:


> I thought we were talking since the first confirmed case death in the US...wasn't that early February?..I might be wrong...at any rate...January to May is 4 months...because we're not talking about the whole month of May and not the whole Month of January...


I’ll gi


SConner said:


> Since you seem unwilling or unable to answer my question, I will do it for you. Over the last 20 years there is an average of 51 annual (12 months) deaths from lightning strikes in the US. They go on to say mortality rate is 10%. My quick math says this equates to 500 people in the US are struck every 12 months (source cited below). So this means your statement was wildly inaccurate. We are all entitled to our opinions, not our facts. The fact is there is a very vocal minority spreading Incredible amounts of false information regarding COVID 19 and presenting it as fact. This is counter productive and irresponsible. If you are going to make a claim, be prepared to back it with a credible source. In case you are unsure, Infowars is not a credible source.
> 
> https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lightning_strike#Epidemiology


ok, let me put it differently. You have less than 1% chance that you may die from covid. That is if you even contract the virus. We have 25,000 cases reported in Ohio at this time. 11,000,000 people reside in Ohio. The odds are in our favor, agree?


----------



## SConner

jrose said:


> I’ll gi
> 
> ok, let me put it differently. You have less than 1% chance that you may die from covid. That is if you even contract the virus. We have 25,000 cases reported in Ohio at this time. 11,000,000 people reside in Ohio. The odds are in our favor, agree?


Yes this seems accurate. I am not sure we are locked in on a mortality rate yet, but 1% seems in line with recent data I have seen.


----------



## fastwater

jrose said:


> I’ll gi
> 
> ok, let me put it differently. You have less than 1% chance that you may die from covid. That is if you even contract the virus. We have 25,000 cases reported in Ohio at this time. 11,000,000 people reside in Ohio. The odds are in our favor, agree?


The big question is 'how much has the shutdown been successful in reducing those numbers'?
Guess we will soon find out as things start opening up.

Being a communicable virus, think it's obvious there will be a spike in cases. How much of a spike...just like the full range of effects of the virus has yet to be learned....time will tell.
Just praying the spike is not large enough to overwhelm our hospitals as some doctors say will happen if we open up to quickly and most importantly...don't social distance or don't wear masks..
I'm just afraid that if the same % of the general publics opinion on social distancing and masks wearing mirrors that of what's been seen here on OGF, we may be in trouble as the second wave of covid19 hits.
And just think...with the National Guard already taking much of the load off our prisons cause prison staff/inmates have become seriously infected, knowing National Guard aren't immune to covid19...who's going to secure our prisons when the NG assets eventually runs out?
Mind you...there are currently prison staff that don't even go home.
They are staying in motels,in their vehicles etc. so to not go home around their families.

Who's going to staff our hospitals if and when our doctors/nurses staffing are sick. And if that spike happens, how long are the insurance companies going to be able to pay for those having to go to the hospital for treatment? Who's going to pay the bills at home for those laid up in the hospital for extended stays if the spike happens?

Again...praying that none of the unsupportive spike above happens. But it's a real possibility. And if it does, I hope those saying a 'hurried...open all the doors right now' is the answer, I hope you have the answers when that time comes. You might just end up in the hospital without anyone to take care of you...or...you might end up bankrupting your family, plus being laid up in the hospital...or ...at the very least, you'll be the one jumping up and down some more cause prisoners are being release from prison cause we can't staff the prisons.


----------



## jrose

SConner said:


> Yes this seems accurate. I am not sure we are locked in on a mortality rate yet, but 1% seems in line with recent data I have seen.


Back to the lightening. I have a less than 1% chance I’m going to get struck by lightning, should I go outside? Yes!!! And I should go to a restaurant and get a burger and a beer!!!


----------



## 1basshunter




----------



## jrose

fastwater said:


> The big question is 'how much has the shutdown been successful in reducing those numbers'?
> Guess we will soon find out as things start opening up.
> 
> Being a communicable virus, think it's obvious there will be a spike in cases. How much of a spike...just like the full range of effects of the virus has yet to be learned....time will tell.
> Just praying the spike is not large enough to overwhelm our hospitals as some doctors say will happen if we open up to quickly and most importantly...don't social distance or don't wear masks..
> I'm just afraid that if the same % of the general publics opinion on social distancing and masks wearing mirrors that of what's been seen here on OGF, we may be in trouble as the second wave of covid19 hits.
> And just think...with the National Guard already taking much of the load off our prisons cause prison staff/inmates have become seriously infected, knowing National Guard aren't immune to covid19...who's going to secure our prisons when the NG assets eventually runs out?
> Mind you...there are currently prison staff that don't even go home.
> They are staying in motels,in their vehicles etc. so to not go home around their families.
> 
> Who's going to staff our hospitals if and when our doctors/nurses staffing are sick. And if that spike happens, how long are the insurance companies going to be able to pay for those having to go to the hospital for treatment? Who's going to pay the bills at home for those laid up in the hospital for extended stays if the spike happens?
> 
> Again...praying that none of the unsupportive spike above happens. But it's a real possibility. And if it does, I hope those saying a 'hurried...open all the doors right now' is the answer, I hope you have the answers when that time comes. You might just end up in the hospital without anyone to take care of you...or...you might end up bankrupting your family, plus being laid up in the hospital...or ...at the very least, you'll be the one jumping up and down some more cause prisoners are being release from prison cause we can't staff the prisons.


That is a lot of “what if’s “. The virus is very contagious, people are going to catch this. A very small percentage are going to have to visit a hospital. An even smaller percentage may not make it. Be smart, take precautions but we have to start living, working and enjoying life. It’s way to short!


----------



## roundbadge

SConner said:


> I apologize, I am not sure what you are trying to convey. The 100,000 was not a daily rate it was a snapshot in time when Dr Amy Acton said it was possible that over 100,000 in Ohio had already been infected. Could you expand on what you are saying as I am not following. I think you are supporting this, but I am not sure.


sure, someone laughed at the 10000 new daily cases for Ohio as a prediction............IF
100% Testing, or subsequent Serology was performed, that may be accurate

If those prisoners were only tested who were showing symptoms, 100 positive, but rando testing showed 2100............2000 no symptoms

do the math


----------



## Patricio

Wisconsin is opened back up. yaaay! state supreme court kicked Evers in the gonads. another authoritarian democratic governor down. hes a one term wonder.

and for those whove not accepted reality, the states that have opened up have NOT seen a spike in cases as a result. if you google "(state here) coronovirus cases" theres an interactive graph thats updated daily.

tomorrow im taking off fishing then stopping by for a cold beer.


----------



## fastwater

jrose said:


> That is a lot of “what if’s “. The virus is very contagious, people are going to catch this. A very small percentage are going to have to visit a hospital. An even smaller percentage may not make it. Be smart, take precautions but we have to start living, working and enjoying life. It’s way to short!


Agree...that's a lot 'what ifs'. That's the problem.
At this point, there's so much unknown about covid19 that there are many 'what ifs' that most likely time will only tell.

Agree we have to start opening things back up.
And don't think this staying opened back up is really gonna be brain surgery.
If things do go too far south and spike bad, we'll see reclosing in those 'spiked areas. Especially if our hospitals start closing in on their max capacities.

Also strongly think that we should have a some sort of game plan if things go south. Never have been a fan of getting caught with my shorts down if I can help it.


----------



## lunder

cement569 said:


> no its not in the book but over half of americans know who you know who is but cant say it on the site...use your imagination


Voldemort!?


----------



## JamesF

Look into the 1968/69 Pandemic flu. I remember having onset stages as I flew home from Vietnam, through Europe. By the time I was on the drive home from Akron Canton airport, I was sick as a dog. And when I returned to Vietnam, so did the flu. It is recorded as having a second wave, deadlier than the first. One million people died around the world. You can crunch the numbers all you want, it isn't going to change a darn thing! Numbers only matter in how many rounds your weapon will hold!


----------



## JamesF

Some one mentioned a game plan!?
There is no game plan. My game plan is... take care of me first!! According to the Great Pumpkin! Oops! Did I just say that?! Never mind, nothing to see here, just move along.


----------



## EnonEye

Been on a waiting list since February for a plumber, thankful


JamesF said:


> Look into the 1968/69 Pandemic flu. I remember having onset stages as I flew home from Vietnam, through Europe. By the time I was on the drive home from Akron Canton airport, I was sick as a dog. And when I returned to Vietnam, so did the flu. It is recorded as having a second wave, deadlier than the first. One million people died around the world. You can crunch the numbers all you want, it isn't going to change a darn thing! Numbers only matter in how many rounds your weapon will hold!


thanx for your service x2


----------



## EnonEye

1basshunter said:


> View attachment 357245


I appreciate your humor basshunt, I need that right now. I'll assume it's tongue-in-cheek as the bandana and mask wearing in public is for my protection when you cough/sneeze near me not for the wearers protection (like the virologists you picture), just sayin


----------



## Snakecharmer

roundbadge said:


> sure, someone laughed at the 10000 new daily cases for Ohio as a prediction............IF
> 100% Testing, or subsequent Serology was performed, that may be accurate
> 
> If those prisoners were only tested who were showing symptoms, 100 positive, but rando testing showed 2100............2000 no symptoms
> 
> do the math


Just read that Ohio is the 4th LOWEST in tests performed per 100,000 people. IF we were testing more we would probably have a lot more cases..


----------



## Misdirection

Snakecharmer said:


> Just read that Ohio is the 4th LOWEST in tests performed per 100,000 people. IF we were testing more we would probably have a lot more cases..


Ohio is low 3rd lowest in tests per million population but in the top 10 for most overall tests performed in the in the US. Ohio simply has alot more people than other states. 

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


----------



## Snakecharmer

Misdirection said:


> Ohio is low 3rd lowest in tests per million population but in the top 10 for most overall tests performed in the in the US. Ohio simply has alot more people than other states.
> 
> Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


Looks like we're 14th in tests


----------



## Buster24

Tired of fake media.....I am moving on from this virus....I will not live in fear....I served this great nation and I refuse to live in fear that is being created by crooked liberal politicians and fake news media!!!!


----------



## bad luck

Maybe nobody will ever have to go to work or school again & the govt will simply take care of everybody until they find a vaccine .............I see more of that on here than I ever thought I would see! 

and anybody who wants to be 1st in line for a vaccine (or waiting for 1) obviously doesn’t recall what happened in the 70’s with the “be all end all vaccine “ for the swine flu.....just Google “you tube 60 minutes swine flu vaccine” to see what the CDC unleashed on America. 


If your at risk (like my dad, mother in law...), their either going to stay in for quite a while or eventually go out + roll the dice at some point; but the rest of us need to go on living. I know many at risk people who doesn’t want to see society stop for them.....


And yes ——we were bait and switched Hopefully our ELECTED politicians can ensure these non elected employees, can not wield this much power in future years.


----------



## Misdirection

Snakecharmer said:


> Looks like we're 14th in tests


Yea, I eyeballed it. But I was close!

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


----------



## bad luck

Snakecharmer said:


> Taken March 12,2020 before PA social distancing rules were in place. FAKE NEWS.


Wanna know what’s not fake news in PA....

-PA governor is now tracking COVID. By gender identity, sexual orientation or expression....and that has what to do with the flu? 

-state of PA FORCED nursing homes to take COVID patients (just like NY), but the State of PA Health Secty yanked her/his mom out of nursing home...of course that info wasn’t shared with other families til after fact


----------



## SConner

roundbadge said:


> sure, someone laughed at the 10000 new daily cases for Ohio as a prediction............IF
> 100% Testing, or subsequent Serology was performed, that may be accurate
> 
> If those prisoners were only tested who were showing symptoms, 100 positive, but rando testing showed 2100............2000 no symptoms
> 
> do the math


Thank you


----------



## SConner

jrose said:


> Back to the lightening. I have a less than 1% chance I’m going to get struck by lightning, should I go outside? Yes!!! And I should go to a restaurant and get a burger and a beer!!!


Now you are making false equivalence again. You chance of getting hit by lightning in US in a year is .000143% which is essentially zero. Chance of contracting COVID is thousands of times more likely. Math is fun, learn it. If enjoying a beer is what I saw in pictures and video from Wisconsin we are screwed. Demand all societal rights and accept none of the societal responsibility. It is exactly how children act.


----------



## cement569

sconner, i live my life as i see fit not how someone tells me to. if your that scared go to your basement and hunker down. and by the way how many people do you know who passed away from this virus? or better yet how many people under the age of 80?


----------



## SConner

cement569 said:


> sconner, i live my life as i see fit not how someone tells me to. if your that scared go to your basement and hunker down. and by the way how many people do you know who passed away from this virus? or better yet how many people under the age of 80?


And you are a danger to everyone around you. I do not understand why it is so difficult to ask people to do this safely by wearing masks and proper distancing so we can open the economy and keep it open. If you think economy is difficult now imagine if we fail to open correctly and have to shut down again. Why must people pretend this is not happening and ignore sound advice from medical professionals. Is wearing a mask that hard? Is stay physically apart in public that difficult? I have no explanation for the mental gymnastics people are going thru to pretend this is not real and there is a giant conspiracy to inflate the numbers.


----------



## cement569

like i said, go hunker down if your scared. if you want to be a sheep....expect to be eaten by wolves


----------



## SConner

cement569 said:


> like i said, go hunker down if your scared. if you want to be a sheep....expect to be eaten by wolves


Yes you are quite manly


----------



## cement569

not quite manly....just dont believe everything people tell me with no in person evidence. if you live your life on what people tell you, you are a robot


----------



## fastwater

SConner said:


> And you are a danger to everyone around you. I do not understand why it is so difficult to ask people to do this safely by wearing masks and proper distancing so we can open the economy and keep it open. If you think economy is difficult now imagine if we fail to open correctly and have to shut down again. Why must people pretend this is not happening and ignore sound advice from medical professionals. Is wearing a mask that hard? Is stay physically apart in public that difficult? I have no explanation for the mental gymnastics people are going thru to pretend this is not real and there is a giant conspiracy to inflate the numbers.





cement569 said:


> like i said, go hunker down if your scared. if you want to be a sheep....expect to be eaten by wolves


You throw around the word 'scared' or 'fear' just about as loosely as you seem to like to tell someone that doesn't share your opinion and has some common sense to go hide in their basement.
And all because SConner agrees...as many do, that wearing a mask and social distancing is a good thing...especially as things open back up.
You...my friend...are the very type that will do your best, and not even realize it, to cause a spike that will shut things down again. Cause you are just that much smarter than anyone else(doctors included), and for sure...no one is gonna tell you what to do...even if what you're doing is possibly harming others.
Bet one thing you did that you were told to do unless you were deemed essential, you didn't work during the shut down. And here's a news flash, if things shut down again, you won't be working then either.


----------



## I Fish

Everybody should be looking at the state of Georgia right now. They reopened 3 weeks ago, and all the talking heads said it would be catastrophic, and that all the state officials would have "blood on their hands!". Guess what, with a population of about 9.7 million, their numbers are in line with all the other "Locked down" states. Here, see for yourself:

https://dph.georgia.gov/covid-19-daily-status-report

It also appears they've also done about 50k more tests than Ohio, which may account for why they have a little higher case count. On the other hand, they have been mostly open for business the last 3 weeks, while we do what again?


----------



## bridgeman

Georgia's numbers are holding steady and quite comparable to those of the locked down states. Take a look at Sweden for another example. Yes this stuff is contagious and yes if your in poor health you will not fare well if you get it. Is it as bad as the so called experts claim it is?? Almost everybody was in for a two week stay at home to flatten the curve and obviously it did. Two weeks was probably a good idea, two to four months is insanity. Its gotta run its course, herd immunity is the only logical thing we can strive for now just like when the Spanish flu ran through the country in 1918 or thereabouts


----------



## Saugeye Tom

WAY TOO MUCH HATE ON THIS THREAD.


----------



## Saugeyefisher

Saugeye Tom said:


> WAY TOO MUCH HATE ON THIS THREAD.


I agree...


----------



## Snakecharmer

bad luck said:


> Wanna know what’s not fake news in PA....
> 
> -PA governor is now tracking COVID. By gender identity, sexual orientation or expression....and that has what to do with the flu?
> 
> -state of PA FORCED nursing homes to take COVID patients (just like NY), but the State of PA Health Secty yanked her/his mom out of nursing home...of course that info wasn’t shared with other families til after fact


Source please?


----------



## Buster24

Saugeye Tom said:


> WAY TOO MUCH HATE ON THIS THREAD.


I don’t know if ‘hate’ is the right word...people are getting antsy and fed up with what they hear from the media....Acton’s first words on the severity of this virus were so exaggerated and that really affected the thoughts of many people in Ohio....we as a nation are being fed bs from the media....I never know what to believe.....if you miss the news you feel uninformed yet if you watch the news you feel misinformed....I do think social distancing, no hands to face area are key measures....not completely sold on masks and the one reason for that is when wearing a mask just observe how many times your hands go to your face area for adjustments completely defeating the purpose....as I stated earlier....the media will not make me live in fear with all the lies that they spew!!!!!


----------



## cincinnati

Snakecharmer said:


> Source please?


https://whyy.org/articles/coronavir...tity-sexual-orientation-in-covid-19-tracking/


----------



## bobk

Are these type of face coverings ok to wear? I’ve been avoiding most of the news and I’m curious if they have gone over what is permitted. I have heard some businesses are requiring a face mask and would rather use these over a mask. 
The company I work for is making us wear a mask when we return to work in a week. Just planning ahead.


----------



## Snakecharmer

cincinnati said:


> https://whyy.org/articles/coronavir...tity-sexual-orientation-in-covid-19-tracking/


Thanks. I did see the news about the PA health secretary and her mother too.


----------



## Snakecharmer

bobk said:


> Are these type of face coverings ok to wear? I’ve been avoiding most of the news and I’m curious if they have gone over what is permitted. I have heard some businesses are requiring a face mask and would rather use these over a mask.
> The company I work for is making us wear a mask when we return to work in a week. Just planning ahead.
> 
> 
> View attachment 357331


S/b fine!


----------



## Saugeyefisher

bobk said:


> Are these type of face coverings ok to wear? I’ve been avoiding most of the news and I’m curious if they have gone over what is permitted. I have heard some businesses are requiring a face mask and would rather use these over a mask.
> The company I work for is making us wear a mask when we return to work in a week. Just planning ahead.
> 
> 
> View attachment 357331


That is what we ordered. But warning,we ordered ours a month ago and still have not seen them.


----------



## bobk

Saugeyefisher said:


> That is what we ordered. But warning,we ordered ours a month ago and still have not seen them.


I’ve got some that I’ve used on Erie. I did order another round of the promo that they offered. Just like you though,they have not shipped.


----------



## Shad Rap

roundbadge said:


> sure, someone laughed at the 10000 new daily cases for Ohio as a prediction............IF
> 100% Testing, or subsequent Serology was performed, that may be accurate
> 
> If those prisoners were only tested who were showing symptoms, 100 positive, but rando testing showed 2100............2000 no symptoms
> 
> do the math


Lol...she wasn't talking about people running around without symptoms...she was talking about 10,000 new cases a day...wasn't ever happening...plain and simple...hell if Ohio did nothing at all there wouldn't of been 10,000 new cases A DAY...that was a WILDLY innacurate statement that caused panic and fear...there's no way to sugarcoat it man...that was their objective...and yes, I'm a Doctor.


----------



## Meerkat

Ted Nugent expresses the growing frustration of many better than I can: 
“Why do I have to stay home just because you are scared? How about you stay home … you stay in your house indefinitely, you wear a mask, you socially distance yourself from me, you avoid restaurants, you avoid baseball games, you stay off the roads, you avoid malls and beaches and parks … I’m done playing your dumb game … I’m no longer going to be a prisoner of your fear. I’m no longer staying in my house or catering to you because you are scared … YOUR fear is not an excuse to destroy America. YOUR fear is not my fear and your fear does not have the right to interfere with my life, my job, my income or my future as a free American citizen.”


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## UNCLEMIKE

I predict that trying to lock us up a second time will not be so easy after restrictions have been loosened. I expressed concern for social unrest on this thread within the first few days of its start. Once people get a taste of freedom and due to the lack of trust now in our officials its gonna get ugly pretty fast if they try and backtrack. Limited, targeted actions will be found acceptable but statewide stuff will not fly unless hospitals are shown to be overrun. Lat week during his press conference DeWine was asked specifically what level of increase in cases it would take to cause another shutdown. He dodged the question. I have a feeling he realizes another statewide shutdown will not be tolerated by the people.


----------



## jrose

fastwater said:


> You throw around the word 'scared' or 'fear' just about as loosely as you seem to like to tell someone that doesn't share your opinion and has some common sense to go hide in their basement.
> And all because SConner agrees...as many do, that wearing a mask and social distancing is a good thing...especially as things open back up.
> You...my friend...are the very type that will do your best, and not even realize it, to cause a spike that will shut things down again. Cause you are just that much smarter than anyone else(doctors included), and for sure...no one is gonna tell you what to do...even if what you're doing is possibly harming others.
> Bet one thing you did that you were told to do unless you were deemed essential, you didn't work during the shut down. And here's a news flash, if things shut down again, you won't be working then either.





SConner said:


> Now you are making false equivalence again. You chance of getting hit by lightning in US in a year is .000143% which is essentially zero. Chance of contracting COVID is thousands of times more likely. Math is fun, learn it. If enjoying a beer is what I saw in pictures and video from Wisconsin we are screwed. Demand all societal rights and accept none of the societal responsibility. It is exactly how children act.


You have a less than 1% chance of dying from contracting covid. And just FYI .000143%. is Less than 1% last I checked. Your right, math is fun!


----------



## Hatchetman

Meerkat said:


> Ted Nugent expresses the growing frustration of many better than I can:
> “Why do I have to stay home just because you are scared? How about you stay home … you stay in your house indefinitely, you wear a mask, you socially distance yourself from me, you avoid restaurants, you avoid baseball games, you stay off the roads, you avoid malls and beaches and parks … I’m done playing your dumb game … I’m no longer going to be a prisoner of your fear. I’m no longer staying in my house or catering to you because you are scared … YOUR fear is not an excuse to destroy America. YOUR fear is not my fear and your fear does not have the right to interfere with my life, my job, my income or my future as a free American citizen.”
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk[/QUOTE
> 
> 
> 
> X10....I agree 100% with this. First off, I am 76 years old, have heart problems and border line diabetic and get around pretty damn good except for hearing and balance issues fro the military. The people in power keep moving the goal posts, "We must do this to survive, we must have a vaccine before opening up, etc etc etc. There is no effective vaccine for a Coronavirus, the flu vaccine is only 40-50% effective and no vaccine for the other strains, so how long do we wait for the CV19 vaccine, 1 year, 2 years, or forever? I did my part for the first couple weeks, now I'm done with it. Can't wear a mask, makes me feel like I can't breathe. They tell you to don't shake hands, cough or sneeze into your elbow and it's ok to bump elbows as a handshake substitute, makes sense to me  This thread is out of control. I just love the answers of some.."Whats your source?" or "I only talk to intelligent people", translation, people that agree with me. I do my best to respect other peoples opinions but that respect stops when my opinion doesn't count. At any rate, goin fishin and enjoy however many days, months or years I have left....


----------



## PapawSmith

bobk said:


> I’ve got some that I’ve used on Erie. I did order another round of the promo that they offered. Just like you though,they have not shipped.


Same here and ordered 6 for $20 about two weeks ago and they arrived Wednesday, I was surprised. I have so far not worn a mask anywhere but I put one of these in my pocket in case someone says I have to. Ordered the extras to hand out to others.


----------



## BuckeyeFishin07

Saugeyefisher said:


> That is what we ordered. But warning,we ordered ours a month ago and still have not seen them.


They are so far behind because SA gave all their inventory to frontline workers, there was a video I seen a video about the second week of all this crap where they were handing out stacks of these to police, and the medical field and EMS services. I am sure by now they may be getting some stock back in but then again the orders that were in at the beginning of this will be getting theirs first!


----------



## MagicMarker

Legend killer said:


> This^





Meerkat said:


> Ted Nugent expresses the growing frustration of many better than I can:
> “Why do I have to stay home just because you are scared? How about you stay home … you stay in your house indefinitely, you wear a mask, you socially distance yourself from me, you avoid restaurants, you avoid baseball games, you stay off the roads, you avoid malls and beaches and parks … I’m done playing your dumb game … I’m no longer going to be a prisoner of your fear. I’m no longer staying in my house or catering to you because you are scared … YOUR fear is not an excuse to destroy America. YOUR fear is not my fear and your fear does not have the right to interfere with my life, my job, my income or my future as a free American citizen.”
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Double like. That’s the way I’ve felt ever since this whole nonsense started


----------



## loves2fishinohio

Saugeyefisher said:


> That is what we ordered. But warning,we ordered ours a month ago and still have not seen them.


Same here, and I can almost guarantee they are coming in from China. If that's the case, I will burn the box when they get here.


----------



## bobk

loves2fishinohio said:


> Same here, and I can almost guarantee they are coming in from China. If that's the case, I will burn the box when they get here.


Seriously? I’ll buy them off you then.


----------



## bobk

PapawSmith said:


> Same here and ordered 6 for $20 about two weeks ago and they arrived Wednesday, I was surprised. I have so far not worn a mask anywhere but I put one of these in my pocket in case someone says I have to. Ordered the extras to hand out to others.


Good deal that yours arrived. I placed my order April 26th. Tick Tock.


----------



## loweman165

Meerkat said:


> Ted Nugent expresses the growing frustration of many better than I can:
> “Why do I have to stay home just because you are scared? How about you stay home … you stay in your house indefinitely, you wear a mask, you socially distance yourself from me, you avoid restaurants, you avoid baseball games, you stay off the roads, you avoid malls and beaches and parks … I’m done playing your dumb game … I’m no longer going to be a prisoner of your fear. I’m no longer staying in my house or catering to you because you are scared … YOUR fear is not an excuse to destroy America. YOUR fear is not my fear and your fear does not have the right to interfere with my life, my job, my income or my future as a free American citizen.”
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Where did you find this quote? I'd like to share it a thousand times .


----------



## Hatchetman

loweman165 said:


> Where did you find this quote? I'd like to share it a thousand times .



Post # 3267


----------



## Burkcarp1




----------



## KaGee

Saugeye Tom said:


> WAY TOO MUCH HATE ON THIS THREAD.





Saugeyefisher said:


> I agree...


TPTB have succeeded in pitting us against each other. It's no longer just disagreeing. It's become a "We vs. They".


----------



## jrose

KaGee said:


> TPTB have succeeded in pitting us against each other. It's no longer just disagreeing. It's become a "We vs. They".


Or right Verses wrong.


----------



## JamesF

TPTB?? I'm not good at acronyms, or sign language.


----------



## Patricio

Mel's is open!


----------



## Snakecharmer

Patricio said:


> Mel's is open!


Knock off work early?


----------



## Patricio

Snakecharmer said:


> Knock off work early?


Took the day off. Went trout fishing. Work is dead. We've been playing cards. Our company got some federal funds, so the feds are paying companies to have people do jack squat. Literally.


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

We have to wear a mask in all common areas if we must work in the offices. If you are alone in an office or cubical space with proper distance you can take it off. If you leave that work area you must wear a mask. We just bought several yards of cheap available fabric and turned some of our internal employees loose that were happy to help. We have right at 500 employees and luckily have a quilting and sewing club and some talented ladies. It didn't take them long to design and pattern out a super comfortable, cheap mask. There are boxes at the front and you have to grab one, or they put one on your desk with extra cleaning supplies for your work station.....many styles. The ladies know me well and placed a camouflage mask on my desk.

They actually made so many they went around handing them out a couple weeks ago at the groceries and fire houses. I believe they are still making about 40 per day (at least that was the pace)!


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

bobk - 50/50 chance I'll be driving by your place this weekend to go down to Wayne and try my last shot at a turkey hunt. You know where I go and my route. PM me your address again (I didn't keep from sending you an item before). If I make it down I'll stop by and leave you one of these in OSU red in your mailbox so you have it for work Monday. They are great and don't even fog up the glasses.


----------



## bobk

Fish-N-Fool said:


> bobk - 50/50 chance I'll be driving by your place this weekend to go down to Wayne and try my last shot at a turkey hunt. You know where I go and my route. PM me your address again (I didn't keep from sending you an item before). If I make it down I'll stop by and leave you one of these in OSU red in your mailbox so you have it for work Monday. They are great and don't even fog up the glasses.


Thank You PM sent


----------



## Snakecharmer

Patricio said:


> Took the day off. Went trout fishing. Work is dead. We've been playing cards. Our company got some federal funds, so the feds are paying companies to have people do jack squat. Literally.


The Beer looks cold and refreshing...


----------



## SConner

I Fish said:


> Everybody should be looking at the state of Georgia right now. They reopened 3 weeks ago, and all the talking heads said it would be catastrophic, and that all the state officials would have "blood on their hands!". Guess what, with a population of about 9.7 million, their numbers are in line with all the other "Locked down" states. Here, see for yourself:
> 
> https://dph.georgia.gov/covid-19-daily-status-report
> 
> It also appears they've also done about 50k more tests than Ohio, which may account for why they have a little higher case count. On the other hand, they have been mostly open for business the last 3 weeks, while we do what again?


It may be too early to declare this a success but it is very encouraging. I hope this trend continues.


----------



## KaGee

JamesF said:


> TPTB?? I'm not good at acronyms, or sign language.


The Powers That Be


----------



## backlashed

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Keep reading your Buzzfeed News lmao. My post came straight from cdc.gov. Fear mongers.. wow.


So NOW you like what the Government has to offer. LMFAO!


----------



## backlashed

AmericanEagle said:


> I am aware that this was a survey and that not everyone in New York City was tested. Thanks for pointing out how that could be misinterpreted. I edited my original post to make it more clear.
> 
> I agree that this survey maybe inaccurate and said so in the last paragraph of my original post. As more antibody testing is done we will get a more accurate handle on the mortality rate of those infected. If the New York survey is accurate you get a morality rate of less than 1% but this still could lead to over a million deaths if we do nothing to mitigate or treat the virus.
> 
> IMHO there are many possible outcomes going forward and a many of them are affected by how well we do at mitigation and treatment.


Stop looking at the %. Look at deaths. Now we have kids falling into this multisystem failure syndrome. We aren't over this thing by a long shot, its getting really bad in Brazil and it's early fall for them.


----------



## backlashed

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Keep reading your Buzzfeed News lmao. My post came straight from cdc.gov. Fear mongers.. wow.


And you didn't read it. Or you didn't understand it. Or both. I'm a big advocate that kids should have 4 years of science in high school and PASS those classes so 'they get it'. You don't. Sorry.


----------



## backlashed

Wow said:


> This is called a provisional Death count.
> Note: Provisional death counts are based on death certificate data received and coded by the National Center for Health Statistics as of May 1, 2020. Death counts are delayed and may differ from other published sources (see Technical Notes). Counts will be updated periodically. Additional information will be added to this site as available.
> 
> 
> 
> Buzzfeed does make it clear:
> https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/briannasacks/coronavirus-death-toll-cdc-misinformation
> 
> Do you even stop for one second to read the details?
> 
> Keep laughing. *A strongpersuader you are not! You're the one that got caught.*
> The latest CDC report calls BS. Fake news and misinformation.
> What internet are *you* using?
> 
> The latest CDC report from 5-3-2020: Any questions?:
> 
> https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/cases-updates/cases-in-us.html
> 
> Total Deaths 65,735, 1,452 New Deaths*
> 
> --Tim


You got it WOW right there. Reading comprehension, lost on so many.


----------



## multi species angler

Buster24 said:


> not completely sold on masks and the one reason for that is when wearing a mask just observe how many times your hands go to your face area for adjustments completely defeating the purpose.


 Once again, the mask aren't to protect the wearer, they are to protect people around the wearer. So the purpose hasn't been defeated by readjusting it.


----------



## UNCLEMIKE

KaGee said:


> TPTB have succeeded in pitting us against each other. It's no longer just disagreeing. It's become a "We vs. They".


I believe it becomes we they when one side tries to impose their will on the other. If folks in Michigan were free to make their own choices they could debate what they are going to do. Go out or stay home. When told what your gonna do it becomes we/they real quick. I do think there are those in power that want to keep us divided. Black white, rich poor, stay in or go out, dem, repub. We are all losers in this deal.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

KaGee said:


> TPTB have succeeded in pitting us against each other. It's no longer just disagreeing. It's become a "We vs. They".


Lol. Always a few but the tend to leave. I have a ton of respect for most people on here and I been shocked and awed by some. I just hope things get normal soon


----------



## Wow

I heard this on the radio today.
It means more to me now than ever. --Tim


----------



## JamesF

Saugeye Tom said:


> Lol. Always a few but the tend to leave. I have a ton of respect for most people on here and I been shocked and awed by some. I just hope things get normal soon


Brings out the best in them! I'm not so much shocked, as embarrassed by the pissing contests. I just won't go for the nasty comments, name calling, and institutions. Times are tough. But that doesn't mean we have to throw respect totally out the window...


----------



## PapawSmith

multi species angler said:


> Once again, the mask aren't to protect the wearer, they are to protect people around the wearer. So the purpose hasn't been defeated by readjusting it.


I can’t believe that the media has talked folks into believing this utter fallacy. We use several different kids of masks in our industry, depending on the discipline being performed, and several of these masks are being supported today as acceptable to protect “others” from the wearer, right down to cotton bandanas. Let me tell you this, these masks are made to protect the wearer and the wearer only from the specific irritant that they are designed to block, and that’s all. These masks are designed to block the target particle from the outside in, not the inside out, they protect the inhale function and allow for expulsion during exhale. There are medical masks out there designed to protect caregivers from patients but they are not common, not available to us, and not what people are wearing. The joke that we need to wear all of these mask types to protect others is just that, an utter joke. Now, if you sneeze and are wearing a mask it will certainly reduce the impact of your sneeze, but no better than your handkerchief or your arm. You are a big person, just don’t sneeze on folks. Masks are designed to protect the wearer, that’s it. If you feel safer wearing one then please, by all means, wear one but do not give me crap for not wearing one because I pose ZERO danger to you by not wearing a mask. If anyone is at danger by me not wearing a mask it is me, not you, and I don’t believe I am in danger either.


----------



## Meerkat

Amen Brother! At last some truth! Before I retired I had EHS responsibility for a major international company & you are absolutely correct.


----------



## multi species angler

Some just don't get it.


----------



## Legend killer

PapawSmith said:


> I can’t believe that the media has talked folks into believing this utter fallacy. We use several different kids of masks in our industry, depending on the discipline being performed, and several of these masks are being supported today as acceptable to protect “others” from the wearer, right down to cotton bandanas. Let me tell you this, these masks are made to protect the wearer and the wearer only from the specific irritant that they are designed to block, and that’s all. These masks are designed to block the target particle from the outside in, not the inside out, they protect the inhale function and allow for expulsion during exhale. There are medical masks out there designed to protect caregivers from patients but they are not common, not available to us, and not what people are wearing. The joke that we need to wear all of these mask types to protect others is just that, an utter joke. Now, if you sneeze and are wearing a mask it will certainly reduce the impact of your sneeze, but no better than your handkerchief or your arm. You are a big person, just don’t sneeze on folks. Masks are designed to protect the wearer, that’s it. If you feel safer wearing one then please, by all means, wear one but do not give me crap for not wearing one because I pose ZERO danger to you by not wearing a mask. If anyone is at danger by me not wearing a mask it is me, not you, and I don’t believe I am in danger either.


You can't make this crap up


----------



## cheezemm2

Legend killer said:


> You can't make this crap up


Agree 100%. I will never understand the downright refusal to believe science.

The Cleveland Clinic is not a conspiracy theory factory:
https://health.clevelandclinic.org/...h-mask-helps-fight-the-spread-of-coronavirus/


----------



## PapawSmith

cheezemm2 said:


> Agree 100%. I will never understand the downright refusal to believe science.


Who’s science? For every report like yours there is a at least one equally credible report that disputes it, entirely. So to settle the tie, why don’t you ask the mask manufacturers of the masks who they design their product to protect? You will get only one answer, every time, and that will be the wearer. If you want to wear a mask, and believe it protects you, then wear it. I am not your enemy, but your fear very well can be.


----------



## Burkcarp1




----------



## cincinnati

If masks work, why can't everybody get back to work?
If masks don't work, why are we wearing them?


----------



## fastwater

PapawSmith said:


> I can’t believe that the media has talked folks into believing this utter fallacy. We use several different kids of masks in our industry, depending on the discipline being performed, and several of these masks are being supported today as acceptable to protect “others” from the wearer, right down to cotton bandanas. Let me tell you this, these masks are made to protect the wearer and the wearer only from the specific irritant that they are designed to block, and that’s all. These masks are designed to block the target particle from the outside in, not the inside out, they protect the inhale function and allow for expulsion during exhale. There are medical masks out there designed to protect caregivers from patients but they are not common, not available to us, and not what people are wearing. The joke that we need to wear all of these mask types to protect others is just that, an utter joke. Now, if you sneeze and are wearing a mask it will certainly reduce the impact of your sneeze, but no better than your handkerchief or your arm. You are a big person, just don’t sneeze on folks. Masks are designed to protect the wearer, that’s it. If you feel safer wearing one then please, by all means, wear one but do not give me crap for not wearing one because I pose ZERO danger to you by not wearing a mask. If anyone is at danger by me not wearing a mask it is me, not you, and I don’t believe I am in danger either.


...and then there are some that should be wearing some kind of mask whether we are in the middle of a pandemic or not:


----------



## Rooster

I've been 100% against the lock-down since the very beginning, and still believe that it was a massive overreaction that will do far more harm than it prevented.

You can certainly debate the relative effectiveness of any particular mask, or even the necessity to prevent the spread of the virus among the healthy population, but it would be absurd to claim that ANY mouth covering does not offer some level of both protection and prevention.

Some light reading:

https://www.cambridge.org/core/jour.../476E32549012B3620D2452F30F2567F1/core-reader


----------



## yonderfishin

I cant believe there is still a debate going on about wether masks are effective. Besides catching much of the coughs and sneezes from the wearer , making the area safer to others.....anything airborne is gonna be present with moisture associated. While most masks cant effectively " filter out " a virus , if the virus is contained in a moisture droplet its still got a really good chance of sticking to the outside of dry fabric. Atleast temporarily keeping it out of the nose of the wearer. No special training or label required to deduce that , its simple physics. The tiny holes in a typical face mask are gigantic passages to a virus , but moisture containing a virus is wicked into dry fabric fibers like they are a sponge. Potentially the virus with it , stuck and held in place by the moisture. Very little protection , but its something. I wouldnt trust wearing a regular mask around someone I knew to be sick , but if you have to be around a bunch of unknowns its probably not a bad idea


----------



## cheezemm2

I guess I just don't get it. Physical distancing combined with hand hygiene and a face covering provide a cumulative protection factor for yourself and those around you. For me, it's doing the best I can do to protect myself and the people around me whether they're a stranger or not. Does that mean I'm going to call you out in public and harass you? Absolutely not. I just think we'd all like to think we're doing the best to avoid the situation we're in right now. If you have 14 packs of chicken breast and 144 rolls of toilet paper, that's another story...I might ask you if you're planning a BBQ with laxative cocktails.

I take exception to a statement that the masks only protects the wearer. That is certainly situational. By that logic, surgical teams wouldn't be wearing masks for your protection, only theirs. Most of the surgeons I have worked with are infinitely more worried about you! Then again, anyone who has spent significant time working in healthcare realizes their is a significant desire to serve for the greater good.

Ask nurses why they do what they do...the answers are humbling!

My real concern around here is when the humidity leaves and we go back to spending more time inside.

To close this out, I want to make thing one clear. Regardless of all the debate etc., I'd gladly fish with any one of you. Just because people don't agree on one point doesn't mean they have to go to different sides forever. 

Enjoy today, it's beautiful out, I'm headed to the lake!


----------



## multi species angler

Paw paw Smith says (If you want to wear a mask, and believe it protects you, then wear it.)

Proof, that some just don't get it.

Me wearing a mask helps protect YOU, You wearing a mask helps protect me.

Is wearing a mask 100%, NO nothing is but it will help.


----------



## crestliner TS

wearing a mask does not help unless it is a n95 AND fitted to your face! When you exhale and your breathe goes in your eyes it isnt helping. Just makes you feel good, that's all. The Surgeon General says the puvblic would be safer by NOT wearing masks. Glad you know better!


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

I’m not in the great mask debate. I’m not concerned about myself and have said so since day 1. Perhaps I’m over confident, but I have had zero fear of the virus because I’m a healthy young person.

Regardless of how I feel, the temporary new normal business protocols require a mask in public and common areas. Do I like it? No! Is it that big of deal to comply during this temporary period of unknown? No!

I get freedom of choice etc. I guess I just don’t understand all the pushback? What is the big deal? 

serious question not poking the bear:

Any of you in the I refuse to ever wear a mask crowd - would you quit a job or refuse work if you need a facial covering?

I’m just trying to understand the mindset. 

I’m not convinced masks are going to make a big difference but I’m not king and don’t make the rules everywhere I go. I’m willing to tolerate a small temporary inconvenience.


----------



## OptOutside440

I wish everyone would watch this.


----------



## Buster24

multi species angler said:


> Once again, the mask aren't to protect the wearer, they are to protect people around the wearer. So the purpose hasn't been defeated by readjusting it.


should have clarified that a bit better....one of the first things the health experts say is “keep your hands away from your face”.....that mask might be protecting everyone else, but could be harming the wearer!!!!


----------



## multi species angler

PapawSmith said:


> Who’s science? For every report like yours there is a at least one equally credible report that disputes it, entirely. So to settle the tie, why don’t you ask the mask manufacturers of the masks who they design their product to protect? You will get only one answer, every time, and that will be the wearer. If you want to wear a mask, and believe it protects you, then wear it. I am not your enemy, but your fear very well can be.





crestliner TS said:


> wearing a mask does not help unless it is a n95 AND fitted to your face! When you exhale and your breathe goes in your eyes it isnt helping. Just makes you feel good, that's all. The Surgeon General says the puvblic would be safer by NOT wearing masks. Glad you know better!


More proof.


----------



## Buster24

We all can have different opinions and that is what America is all about.....if I don’t agree with your opinion that doesn’t mean I am going to hate you....I respect all of my fellow men no matter what your opinion is....hate is a strong word that isn’t in my vocabulary!!!


----------



## multi species angler

OptOutside440 said:


> I wish everyone would watch this.


 Gosh, I wander who wrote her speech for her.


----------



## loves2fishinohio

It's going to be really interesting to see what happens over the next couple of weeks in terms of new cases. Lot's of bars here in CBus were assholes to elbows full last night, and I'm sure that was repeated across the state.


----------



## crestliner TS

Fish-N-Fool said:


> I’m not in the great mask debate. I’m not concerned about myself and have said so since day 1. Perhaps I’m over confident, but I have had zero fear of the virus because I’m a healthy young person.
> 
> Regardless of how I feel, the temporary new normal business protocols require a mask in public and common areas. Do I like it? No! Is it that big of deal to comply during this temporary period of unknown? No!
> 
> I get freedom of choice etc. I guess I just don’t understand all the pushback? What is the big deal?
> 
> serious question not poking the bear:
> 
> Any of you in the I refuse to ever wear a mask crowd - would you quit a job or refuse work if you need a facial covering?
> 
> I’m just trying to understand the mindset.
> 
> I’m not convinced masks are going to make a big difference but I’m not king and don’t make the rules everywhere I go. I’m willing to tolerate a small temporary inconvenience.


what new business protocals are you refering to? There is no mandate. It is up to the individual unless a business requires it to enter there establishment. Nothing about public place, that is not true.


----------



## crestliner TS

multi species angler said:


> More proof.


go to the surgeon generals website. BOOM< PROOF!


----------



## Rooster

Very few things in this world are black & white. A truly definitive answer in medicine is almost nonexistent. BOOM!

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/surgeon-general-against-masks/


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

My employer....not public places. I cannot work if I do not comply and wear a mask. Most professional firms have adopted this policy (for now at least). My peers I speak with are in the same boat - you wanna work you need a mask.

hence my question - would you walk off your job over a temporary mask policy?


----------



## ICENUT

How do you know its just temporary????? This can and go on for a long long time!!!!It appears it will be the new normal!!!!


----------



## cincinnati

Rooster said:


> Very few things in this world are black & white. A truly definitive answer in medicine is almost nonexistent. BOOM!
> https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/surgeon-general-against-masks/


That's why it's called "the practice of medicine."


----------



## SConner

Rooster said:


> Very few things in this world are black & white. A truly definitive answer in medicine is almost nonexistent. BOOM!
> 
> https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/surgeon-general-against-masks/


I applaud you sir, I have not agreed with everything you have posted on this thread (and that is ok), but you have never once misrepresented the facts to support your opinion. I wish I could say the same for all. Early on you questioned the math on the morbidity rates and I believe this was and is a valid observation with the information we had. Please continue to weigh in... I am ok with considering opinions I do not hold so long as they are fact based. I wish you and yours health as we all navigate thru difficult times. FYI - I am glad to see commerce open back up, just a little concerned with people choosing to ignore common sense guidelines.


----------



## bobk

Fish-N-Fool said:


> My employer....not public places. I cannot work if I do not comply and wear a mask. Most professional firms have adopted this policy (for now at least). My peers I speak with are in the same boat - you wanna work you need a mask.
> 
> hence my question - would you walk off your job over a temporary mask policy?


No, I would not walk off my job . There are always things in life we don't agree with. I like my paycheck. Could you imagine the potential lawsuits just waiting for employers if they didn't require you to wear a mask and then you got the crud. Somebody would sue.


----------



## roundbadge

A question that the answer would clear up the muddy waters

Its not whether you become immune after exposure, it is whether after your "recovery", that meaning a positive test result and/or a positive Serology test, that when you read negative afterwards...............

ARE YOU STILL A STEALTH SPREADER?

IMO, the key is reducing the number of spreaders. Math has stated 99% or so of anyone contracting this virus is/was either asymptomatic, or was a mild case requiring no health care assist.

You can use the term herd immunity all you want, but the reality is...............less spreaders equals less infections

The reported "flare ups" have a common theme............a bunch of people under a hot tin roof, like the senior living places, cop and fire stations, prisons, meat processing plants, nightclubs, etc etc

The Ohio jail where they random tested the people had 2100 positive cases, 100 showing symptoms, 2000 asymptomatic............if they only tested the 100 with symptoms, the other 2000 would have gone unnoticed and eventually become negative once they went through the "recovery" duration, whatever that # of days are

If those 2000, and the other 100 could never spread the virus again, well, you do the math

If you compile all these different Serology results and settled on an average infection rate timestamped, say 15%, then in theory, Ohio alone already has had 1.8mm people infected.

That percentage, in theory, should increase daily, and one would think that the infection rate would eventually disappear................

All citizens need the Serology test as soon as possible to answer the infection rate, and the EXPERTS then need to figure out the best way to answer the main question

Do you stop being a spreader after your recovery


----------



## Dovans

bobk said:


> No, I would not walk off my job . There are always things in life we don't agree with. I like my paycheck. Could you imagine the potential lawsuits just waiting for employers if they didn't require you to wear a mask and then you got the crud. Somebody would sue.


If I could make money showing people how not to catch fish, I'd leave my job in minute..


----------



## Shad Rap

cincinnati said:


> That's why it's called "the practice of medicine."


I guess that takes the saying 'practice makes perfect' and throws it out the window...perfect practice makes perfect...


----------



## Shad Rap

ICENUT said:


> How do you know its just temporary????? This can and go on for a long long time!!!!It appears it will be the new normal!!!!


Because we've delayed/prolonged it...believe me, there will be a day when coronavirus is long gone...trust me on this.


----------



## KaGee

multi species angler said:


> More proof.


Oh we get it. We get it plenty. 
I suggest you just ignore this thread going forward since you can't seem to discuss this with out making belittling comments towards those who disagree with you.


----------



## Patricio

I think it's pointless to argue. We're really dealing with different psychologies. I live in Wisconsin, where people mostly have a FU attitude towards things. I work in Minnescrotum where it's the opposite, people there are in step with what the government tells them. It's the same here, some people no longer care what people tell them, after all, the "expects" have been consistently wrong. And other have had enough of the bs. We confuse a political viewpoint with a difference in psychology.


----------



## PapawSmith

SConner said:


> just a little concerned with people choosing to ignore common sense guidelines.



You have made some very good points on this thread but it is very clear that your “common sense” is the only sense that you feel can be considered. There may well be folks here that know and understand some things much better than you, and they may also have a little different “common sense” that makes perfect sense to them. That’s a natural human balance you need to remember, you and your thoughts are not at the center of others universe. Your points and positions are respectable and appreciated, but they are simply part of your editorial on the subject, like everyone else’s. I appreciate reading them, whether I agree With them or not. When this thread started didn’t you have like 27 total posts?


----------



## SConner

PapawSmith said:


> You have made some very good points on this thread but it is very clear that your “common sense” is the only sense that you feel can be considered. There may well be folks here that know and understand some things much better than you, and they may also have a little different “common sense” that makes perfect sense to them. That’s a natural human balance you need to remember, you and your thoughts are not at the center of others universe. Your points and positions are respectable and appreciated, but they are simply part of your editorial on the subject, like everyone else’s. I appreciate reading them, whether I agree With them or not. When this thread started didn’t you have like 27 total posts?


As long as they are backed by facts and not unsubstantiated conspiracy theories I am very willing to listen to other points of view. Unfortunately, there is only one on this thread who’s opinion differs from my own that seems like they care what the facts are (Rooster. and for that I will always respect his opinion). Most just cut and paste from whatever source supports their point of view regardlesless if facts... and yes facts are knowable in time. We are still early in this pandemic and numbers are shifting, but that does not excuse blatant misrepresentation of facts, such as stating your chances of dying from corona are equivalent to being stuck by lightning. These ridiculous statements discredit all legitimate arguments. I am ok when we are looking at the same data points an disagree with how to proceed, I will never be ok with people intentionally misrepresenting fact that is actually fiction from some strange extreme ether world. Prove me wrong with actual facts and I have an open mind, claim ridiculous things as known and I will call you out and ask for your source. Facts matter, if we all used them this thread would be much shorter.


----------



## bridgeman

Let's see:

Live like a friggen rat under a rock or go back to normal knowing that even if you got this you have a better than 99% chance of survival. If your health is not so great I'd advise you to take the necessary precautions to sustain yourself. Don't get in my face and tell me I'm selfish for going out, tons of peeps have suffered way more than necessary going along with this charade. I'm over it


----------



## Hatchetman

SConner said:


> I applaud you sir, I have not agreed with everything you have posted on this thread (and that is ok), but you have never once misrepresented the facts to support your opinion. I wish I could say the same for all. Early on you questioned the math on the morbidity rates and I believe this was and is a valid observation with the information we had. Please continue to weigh in... I am ok with considering opinions I do not hold so long as they are fact based. I wish you and yours health as we all navigate thru difficult times. FYI - I am glad to see commerce open back up, just a little concerned with people choosing to ignore common sense guidelines.



Boy that makes me feel so good that actually approve of something without saying "Source please". We all know that what you say is factual and should not be questioned....Ya right.


----------



## ICENUT

I agree this can't go on forever 1st it was 14 days to flatten the curve,then another 30 days to flatten the curve.Well when does it end?The vaccine is months to years off if at all and by then it will mutate like the flu how long can we continue to shelter in place im fortunate im retired but I feel for people who have to feed a family and have lost their livelihood.I firmly believe if the politicans,the so called experts were to lose their paychecks this fiasco would have ended a long time ago.Im going to continue to live my life I will take the necessary precautions but im no longer going to hide in my home like a mole or a sheep being led by folks whom have had their chance but im no longer convinced they know any more than I do!!


----------



## bridgeman

Just think how much of an ego trip it must be to have hundreds of thousands of people waiting on your decision when obviously you have absolutely no idea how this thing works.


----------



## SConner

PapawSmith said:


> You have made some very good points on this thread but it is very clear that your “common sense” is the only sense that you feel can be considered. There may well be folks here that know and understand some things much better than you, and they may also have a little different “common sense” that makes perfect sense to them. That’s a natural human balance you need to remember, you and your thoughts are not at the center of others universe. Your points and positions are respectable and appreciated, but they are simply part of your editorial on the subject, like everyone else’s. I appreciate reading them, whether I agree With them or not. When this thread started didn’t you have like 27 total posts?


As long as they are backed by facts and not unsubstantiated conspiracy theories I am very willing to listen to other points of view. Unfortunately, there is only one (Rooster) on this thread who’s opinion differs from my own that seems like they care what the facts are.... and for that I will always respect his opinion. Most just cut and paste from whatever source supports their point of view regardlesless if facts... and yes facts are knowable. I apologize if this seems harsh but I sat on the sidelines for longer than I could tolerate while people stated opinion as fact, when they clearly were not. An example would be stating as fact that the likelyhood of passing from COVID had the same odds as being struck by lightning. When I provided facts that this was patently and demonstratebly false the poster turned to a predictable and childish response that I should hide in the basement if I was afraid. Predictable because it is common when people know they are wrong to attack something unrelated to the discussion. Opinions are welcome with me alternate facts are not.


----------



## SConner

[QUOTE="PapawSmith, post: 2914857,When this thread started didn’t you have like 27 total posts?[/QUOTE]
No I have thousands of posts, you must be thinking of someone else.


----------



## multi species angler

KaGee said:


> Oh we get it. We get it plenty.
> I suggest you just ignore this thread going forward since you can't seem to discuss this with out making belittling comments towards those who disagree with you.


  Anyone that doesn't want to read my post can hit the ignore button. You want to ban me for my opinion that a lot of people just don't get that we are being ask or told in some situations to wear a mask to help stop the spread of the virus, not to protect ourselves although it surely helps some if we don't fidget with the mask.


----------



## bulafisherman

SConner said:


> As long as they are backed by facts and not unsubstantiated conspiracy theories I am very willing to listen to other points of view. Unfortunately, there is only one on this thread who’s opinion differs from my own that seems like they care what the facts are.... and for that I will always respect his opinion. Most just cut and paste from whatever source supports their point of view regardlesless if facts... and yes facts are knowable,


 Have you ever considered that some of what you claim to be facts( if you go down the rabbit hole deep enough) end up being based on opinions from those that are supposedly working for us the tax payer. Who through manipulation have flipped the table on us and used it as form of control. If you want an example follow what's happening in with power drunk LA Mayor.


----------



## SConner

bulafisherman said:


> Have you ever considered that some of what you claim to be facts( if you go down the rabbit hole deep enough) end up being based on opinions from those that are supposedly working for us the tax payer. Who through manipulation have flipped the table on us and used it as form of control. If you want an example follow what's happening in with power drunk LA Mayor.


I have never commented on LA. If you feel I have incorrectly stated something as fact that is certainly opinion, feel free to point it out and I will gladly apologize for overstating my case.


----------



## EnonEye

Talked with my daughter today, she's back working (every other week from home) (catering business in Columbus) so off the unemployment now (actually made one check that was higher than a normal payday with that unemployment) but saying there are some employees who don't want to come back. She's ready, had enough of the home projects. Hit the DQ tonight, masks and gloves for them (clap, clap).


----------



## buckeyebowman

OptOutside440 said:


> I wish everyone would watch this.


I watched all 7 seconds of it, and it certainly was enlightening! I don't know what happened, but that's all that was available for me to play.

And I don't entirely buy PapawSmith's contention that masks are ONLY to protect the wearer. Can't it be a 2 way street? Depending on the application?

Consider: Why did everyone in the operating room wear a mask when I had my ACL reconstruction done? Was that to protect me from all of them, or to protect them from my "ACL germs"? I think it was the former. 

Consider: A person working with dangerous chemicals or gasses, and the job requires them to wear a "gas" mask. In that instance, the intent is obviously to protect the wearer!


----------



## PapawSmith

SConner said:


> [QUOTE="PapawSmith, post: 2914857,When this thread started didn’t you have like 27 total posts?


No I have thousands of posts, you must be thinking of someone else.[/QUOTE]

That post comment clearly went right over your head, as does a lot of this thread it seems. You rely on only the “facts” that you glean from sources you trust. There a heck of a lot of folks here that are quoting very reputable sources, that directly contradict your very reputable sources, and yet you seem to think only yours truly have credibility. Hate to break it to you but you are not “all right” like you seem to believe. If you encounter me in public and it bothers you that I’m not wearing a mask, I suggest you give me a wide berm because I’m coming thru. I have some of the most reputable medical professionals in the world backing me up on that. I also realize that you support some of the most reputable medical professionals saying I’m wrong. I appreciate your opinion but please quit playing the intellectual authority here, you are not it, by a long shot. That is not the personal blast that it appears, we all have the very same information available to us but we do NOT all trust the same. Some “truths” are digested differently by those of different means.
Late add to this thought, I truly appreciate and respect your opinion and believe that it is well thought out and intended. The fact that you seem to discard others as fodder is what strikes me to respond. We all want the same end to this but do not all see the same path, and those that do not follow your path are not necessarily fools.


----------



## Burkcarp1

X2


----------



## PapawSmith

buckeyebowman said:


> And I don't entirely buy PapawSmith's contention that masks are ONLY to protect the wearer. Can't it be a 2 way street? Depending on the application?


if you re-read my post you will see that I agree with you. I believe I clearly indicated that the medical industry has access to masks designed specifically to protect those in proximity of the wearer. I also said that these are NOT the masks that folks are wearing and relying on. These special masks are available only thru medical supply’s and were long gone before anyone ever thought a mask might be a good idea. The masks that are being worn, pretty much by everyone out there wearing them, are designed to protect the wearer only. That is a very simple and verifiable fact that anyone can find by going to the manufacture websites and read the specifications.


----------



## Burkcarp1

PapawSmith said:


> if you re-read my post you will see that I agree with you. I believe I clearly indicated that the medical industry has access to masks designed specifically to protect those in proximity of the wearer. I also said that these are NOT the masks that folks are wearing and relying on. These special masks are available only thru medical supply’s and we’re long gone before anyone ever thought a mask might be a good idea. The masks worn pretty much by everyone out there wearing them are designed to protect the wearer only. That is a very simple and verifiable fact that anyone can find by going to the manufacture websites and read the specifications.


Source?


----------



## TomC

Hey looks like first responders will be getting hazard and back pay!


----------



## Snakecharmer

OptOutside440 said:


> I wish everyone would watch this.


That's 7 seconds of my life that I'll never get back...


----------



## JamesF

Just another insight. Rev Danny Jones 4/19/20. Not necessarily my opinion, but, hey! My opinions are just that. I don't have to agree with anyone's opinion, idea's, or ideology.


----------



## hailtothethief

Cant be too bad if you’re a fisherman. If your not well..


----------



## hailtothethief

TomC said:


> Hey looks like first responders will be getting hazard and back pay!


Has it passed congress or the president yet? Or just the senate?


----------



## jdl447

.


----------



## Legend killer

PapawSmith said:


> if you re-read my post you will see that I agree with you. I believe I clearly indicated that the medical industry has access to masks designed specifically to protect those in proximity of the wearer. I also said that these are NOT the masks that folks are wearing and relying on. These special masks are available only thru medical supply’s and were long gone before anyone ever thought a mask might be a good idea. The masks that are being worn, pretty much by everyone out there wearing them, are designed to protect the wearer only. That is a very simple and verifiable fact that anyone can find by going to the manufacture websites and read the specifications.


----------



## billy4prez

We get it, stay home save lives. Anything else is construed as murder. Got it.


----------



## billy4prez

Maybe if I walked a mile in your shoes I would feel differently, but I have not. What I can tell you is my old lady works in a nursing home . She is one of those people, she can make a deaf mute smile, if you know what I mean. I couldn't do it but she can. She has seen more people pass away due to a "broken heart " than she has covid. Think about it, you cant leave the nursing home, no one can come see you, heck you are lucky if you can leave your room. Its time to get back to normal. There are a thousand ways to die. I don't think people should have to die alone.


----------



## PapawSmith

Legend killer said:


> View attachment 357639


This, being your level of understanding things, is the reason that you are not a serious part of the conversation.


----------



## crestliner TS

Rooster said:


> Very few things in this world are black & white. A truly definitive answer in medicine is almost nonexistent. BOOM!
> 
> https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/surgeon-general-against-masks/


https://www.foxnews.com/media/surgeon-general-explains-masks-public-coronavirus BOOM!!

Of the many preventative measures you can take to protect yourself from the new coronavirus, wearing a face mask is one of the most visible. But for members of the general public, health experts don't think it'll help much.

"There's little harm in it," Eric Toner, a scientist at Johns Hopkins Center for Health Security, told Business Insider. "But it's not likely to be very effective in preventing it."


----------



## crestliner TS

Dr. Anthony Fauci, a key member of the White House coronavirus task force, reinforced that notion in an appearance on CNN Thursday night.

"Given the fact that we know that asymptomatic people are clearly transmitting infection, it just makes common sense that it's not a bad idea to do that," he said about wearing masks. 

"not a bad idea" doesnt sound real important with that statement.


"Having a mask on physically keeps those droplets from coming out of your mouth and on to someone else," he told Savannah Guthrie. "I should emphasize that a mask doesn't mean you shouldn't social distance because if you're doing the proper social distancing, it's still not a problem, but we know not everybody's doing that." 

So stay away from others and dont sneeze on people. No mask needed


----------



## JamesF

I am seriously having some mixed feelings about this... I'm not sure what to make of this. Are the planets in alignment yet?! Stay home, wear a mask, don't wear a mask! Social gatherings of no more than ten people, work from home; may become a more permanent concept. Is this some type of a test? If so count me out, I was never a good student! Is it time to take off the rose tinted glasses? And were the old cartoons made just for kids? I recall the Flintstones, Fred,and Barney wanting to be members of the lodge, the secret handshakes. And trying real hard not to blow their chances to meet the Grand Pubha!?.


----------



## Snakecharmer

crestliner TS said:


> https://www.foxnews.com/media/surgeon-general-explains-masks-public-coronavirus BOOM!!
> 
> Of the many preventative measures you can take to protect yourself from the new coronavirus, wearing a face mask is one of the most visible. But for members of the general public, health experts don't think it'll help much.
> 
> "There's little harm in it," Eric Toner, a scientist at Johns Hopkins Center for Health Security, told Business Insider. "But it's not likely to be very effective in preventing it."


He has since changed his tune....OLD NEWS......Try to keep up.
https://hotair.com/archives/allahpu...n-general-heres-make-mask-no-sewing-required/


----------



## Hatchetman

Snakecharmer said:


> He has since changed his tune....OLD NEWS......Try to keep up.
> https://hotair.com/archives/allahpu...n-general-heres-make-mask-no-sewing-required/



And that is exactly the biggest part of the damn problem, changing his tune!! In Feb or early March he said a mask is not necessary for the public, it doesn't help, then in late March, early April he comes out with "Wear a Mask". He's been an employee of the NIH for almost 40 years and is supposedly a world renowned Virologist so why say what he did earlier and then all the sudden decided oops, I was wrong? Why the reversal of opinion? All that experience and he just remembered he was wrong earlier? BS !! I will do my part as I see fit to not infect anyone but I'll be darned if I am sitting at home, wringing my hands and condeming anyone that thinks different from me. At 76 I don't have a lot of days, months or years to go and I am not spending them in fear of something like this....


----------



## ICENUT

Amen to that also the doctor has changed his tune about everything depending on what channel he's on.


----------



## Skippy

I feel the same way Pete. The wife and I still go shopping once a week just like always and when were back in the truck we use the hand sanitizer BUT we "ALWAYS" did that even before all this BS started. 
I'm not one to go play out on the double yellow lines but I'll harden if I'll lock my self away.


----------



## cement569

gentlemen, its called the fear factor......if you dont face your fears head on, expect to live in fear the rest of your life


----------



## bridgeman

cement569 said:


> gentlemen, its called the fear factor......if you dont face your fears head on, expect to live in fear the rest of your life


The media finally figured out how to get our ear, they're gonna run this horse into the ground


----------



## WETSHIRT

If you are of European or Eurasian decent, you already have distant relatives that survived the black death plague during the mid fourteenth century. Death rates exceeded 33% and as high as 50% in many urban centers. Their less fortunate neighbors are probably rolling around in their mass graves at the way modern men are ( with the aid of modern science ) are cowering in abject fear at a pandemic with a death rate < 1%. A lot of whom already have doubled the life expectancy of their old relatives.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Hatchetman said:


> And that is exactly the biggest part of the damn problem, changing his tune!! In Feb or early March he said a mask is not necessary for the public, it doesn't help, then in late March, early April he comes out with "Wear a Mask". He's been an employee of the NIH for almost 40 years and is supposedly a world renowned Virologist so why say what he did earlier and then all the sudden decided oops, I was wrong? Why the reversal of opinion? All that experience and he just remembered he was wrong earlier? BS !! I will do my part as I see fit to not infect anyone but I'll be darned if I am sitting at home, wringing my hands and condeming anyone that thinks different from me. At 76 I don't have a lot of days, months or years to go and I am not spending them in fear of something like this....


IMO, I think his initial pronouncement was to insure that masks were available for healthcare workers and frontline workers. I believe (opinion) that he deliberately mislead the American public. I may be wrong.

There is much more information out there now about this virus that wasn't available 2 -3 months ago. Plus a lot of misinformation or information that over time has proven to be false.


----------



## bulafisherman

ICENUT said:


> Amen to that also the doctor has changed his tune about everything depending on what channel he's on.


 I think he has done quite a good job at proving he is a fraud going all the way back throughout his career. They have taken him out of the headlines because of his credibility. There are a few others from the house of cards that have managed to keep their credibility intact surprisingly enough. Just a matter of time....


----------



## Shad Rap

bulafisherman said:


> I think he has done quite a good job at proving he is a fraud going all the way back throughout his career. They have taken him out of the headlines because of his credibility. There are a few others from the house of cards that have managed to keep their credibility intact surprisingly enough. Just a matter of time....


He's buddy buddy with chris cuomo...nuff said...lol.


----------



## Shad Rap

Snakecharmer said:


> IMO, I think his initial pronouncement was to insure that masks were available for healthcare workers and frontline workers. I believe (opinion) that he deliberately mislead the American public. I may be wrong.
> 
> There is much more information out there now about this virus that wasn't available 2 -3 months ago. Plus a lot of misinformation or information that over time has proven to be false.


Basic ways to prevent/deter a virus haven't changed since day one though...way before corona was ever thought of...it's virology 101.


----------



## JamesF

I went to pick my brother up,this morning, not much going on. Took him home, and just about every place was packed! Ain't no social distancing going, that I saw. Business as usual. Not every place was open, being a Sunday.


----------



## multi species angler

JamesF said:


> Took him home, and just about every place was packed! Ain't no social distancing going, that I saw. Business as usual


 All the more reason a mask is needed. Yes we were told early that we didn't need mask so people wouldn't hoard them like they are toilet paper and had sanitizer. They wanted the mask available for health care workers.


----------



## bridgeman

Saw a vet this morning at Walmart.. had 2 prosthetic legs and a marine corps t-shirt on. Some jackass behind me bumped me in the back asking me why he didn't have a mask on. I said he fought for the right to not have to wear one. Guy up front heard me and just smiled. This circus has to end its long overdue


----------



## Hatchetman

multi species angler said:


> All the more reason a mask is needed. Yes we were told early that we didn't need mask so people wouldn't hoard them like they are toilet paper and had sanitizer. They wanted the mask available for health care workers.



That is NOT what Fouci(spel) said, he said no need for people to wear masks in public....Now it's wear one or you will kill everyone....


----------



## cincinnati

Snakecharmer said:


> He has since changed his tune....OLD NEWS......Try to keep up.
> https://hotair.com/archives/allahpu...n-general-heres-make-mask-no-sewing-required/


More Wild-Ass Guessing?


----------



## multi species angler

The first I heard that mask weren't needed was from the CDC.


----------



## Legend killer

bridgeman said:


> Saw a vet this morning at Walmart.. had 2 prosthetic legs and a marine corps t-shirt on. Some jackass behind me bumped me in the back asking me why he didn't have a mask on. I said he fought for the right to not have to wear one. Guy up front heard me and just smiled. This circus has to end its long overdue


Common courtesy is lacking these days.


----------



## JamesF

Common courtesy was the first act of the Fear Mongering,scene three,line six. Followed by the narrative of bickering about the numbers. The final act,ends with... What If!?? Insert( your thoughts). Encore; True, Wear a mask.False? Go out.Facts, Don't wear a mask Rumors? Old flu! New flu? Social distancing! I have questions!! Many of them. Does anyone else have questions? This is not Political! This is about our lives! Who is steering this ship?! And exactly where are we getting the real answers from?


----------



## cement569

well james, i could tell you but it would hinge on politics and i would get in trouble on this site so i just roll with the flow


----------



## bad luck

There are actually some people out there disappointed in the fact cases are decreasing in states that opened early......no repeats of NY in GA or FL...


I did see where FL banned rental homes to NY’ers, though locals wish they would have done this years ago ......


----------



## JamesF

There are many different people, with different agendas. And that's on them. I'm just trying to understand why, some of these decisions being made are justified. The virus is real, no doubting that. Like a lot of people I am conflicted about quite a few things, misspoken statements among the many.


----------



## bulafisherman

IAM just happy we aren't seeing the all the numbers being thrown around anymore,It took long enough for those that were to realize that no one knows for sure how much they were manipulated and spun to fit the narrative. There are still some that think the numbers are a true representation of what's going on. Thank God most of us can see it for what it really is now. That at least gives me hope that there aren't to many sheep and those of us that value what's left of our rights as sovereign human beings stand a chance.


----------



## multi species angler

crestliner TS said:


> So stay away from others and dont sneeze on people. No mask needed


 Not always true.
An asymptomatic person walking down an isle in a store expelling virus droplets into the air which can linger for minutes and then drop on products that someone else picks up. This person has now been exposed to the virus. If a mask had been worn most if not all of those droplets would have been contained in that mask not in the air for someone minutes later to inhale or touch something the droplets had landed on. The mask aren't being worn to prevent covid-19 but to reduce it's spread.


----------



## Legend killer

multi species angler said:


> Not always true.
> An asymptomatic person walking down an isle in a store expelling virus droplets into the air which can linger for minutes and then drop on products that someone else picks up. This person has now been exposed to the virus. If a mask had been worn most if not all of those droplets would have been contained in that mask not in the air for someone minutes later to inhale or touch something the droplets had landed on. The mask aren't being worn to prevent covid-19 but to reduce it's spread.


----------



## Burkcarp1

Round 2?


----------



## bad luck

The mask thing can easily be summed up.

*If u feel u need or want to wear a mask-do it.

*if not don’t

*if REQUIRED (not recommended or suggested-REQUIRED) in a store-either comply or don’t go there....It’s their business, so it’s their right to make rules ( we typically comply with no shirts/no shoes/no dice....)


*I personally choose to not wear Halloween garb, but comply when REQUIRED (sitting in a DR office now-it’s required...).


**And for all the “Karen’s” or “Mr Karen’s” out there who chastise others, hopefully your consistent and do the same when somebody is going 1+MPH over speed , Not using turn signals, not wearing seatbelts etc...............though those ARE actually breaking the law..................not wearing a mask is NOT breaking the law......


----------



## jrose

SConner said:


> As long as they are backed by facts and not unsubstantiated conspiracy theories I am very willing to listen to other points of view. Unfortunately, there is only one on this thread who’s opinion differs from my own that seems like they care what the facts are (Rooster. and for that I will always respect his opinion). Most just cut and paste from whatever source supports their point of view regardlesless if facts... and yes facts are knowable in time. We are still early in this pandemic and numbers are shifting, but that does not excuse blatant misrepresentation of facts, such as stating your chances of dying from corona are equivalent to being stuck by lightning. These ridiculous statements discredit all legitimate arguments. I am ok when we are looking at the same data points an disagree with how to proceed, I will never be ok with people intentionally misrepresenting fact that is actually fiction from some strange extreme ether world. Prove me wrong with actual facts and I have an open mind, claim ridiculous things as known and I will call you out and ask for your source. Facts matter, if we all used them this thread would be much shorter.


Your back to the lightening thing again. Let me put it in much more simple terms. Your not going to die from corona virus. You may think you are, but your not. There, no lightening.


----------



## ICENUT

I hate the mask thingy BUT I comply when needed to enter a store. I also understand that yes the virus or droplets stay on the mask for the most part BUT does that mask mysteriously take itself off by the person not touching it when you take it off you are putting the virus on your hands and then touching things correct. Including myself im constantly fiddling with the darn things Ive also seen the famous doctor constantly touching his face and mask on tv briefings.I will do what is required from me by keeping distance and using common sense but the mask thing is still nonsense in my humble opinion.Hand washing and social distancing is a partial solution the final one will be a vaccine some day!!


----------



## jrose

Legend killer said:


> View attachment 357639


Yes, but the guy behind you just walked through your puddle.


----------



## Legend killer

Let's sum it up a little easier. Do you still take firearms to places where it is unlawful like schools & hospitals cause its your right to bear arms?


----------



## Hatchetman

Legend killer said:


> Let's sum it up a little easier. Do you still take firearms to places where it is unlawful like schools & hospitals cause its your right to bear arms?



If it's unlawful, no I don't, if it's optional, yes I do. Seem's you have a problem with suggestions and laws....and no problem with urine....


----------



## Legend killer

A business makes the rules as its a private entity. If they say mask like Costco you simply wear one or don't shop there.


----------



## backlashed

Legend killer said:


> Let's sum it up a little easier. Do you still take firearms to places where it is unlawful like schools & hospitals cause its your right to bear arms?


Oh hell no. They have the weight of the law behind them. Take it into a school? You need a GOOD lawyer. The right to bear is vague and meant to be that way.


----------



## fastwater

bad luck said:


> The mask thing can easily be summed up...
> 
> .... *(sitting in a DR office now-it’s required...).*
> .


Required at all hospitals as well.
And that was going on long before the start of the 'reopening' process
Hmmm....wonder why that is?


----------



## Saugeyefisher

This has turned into quite the pissing contest over masks


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

Saugeyefisher said:


> This has turned into quite the pissing contest over masks


----------



## MagicMarker

Saugeyefisher said:


> This has turned into quite the pissing contest over masks


The whole thread is a pissing match


----------



## fastwater

Saugeyefisher said:


> This has turned into quite the pissing contest over masks


Apparently, with social distancing as well as things start reopening.

From Friday on, there has been live news media clips showing lines of people standing shoulder to shoulder waiting to get into restaurants/bars as if covid19 doesn't even exist.
Many clips from the short north/OSU campus area.

Guess we all have our own thoughts and are either going to do what's suggested to try and keep the next spike down or not. 'Spike' meaning very high increase in number of people actually going to the hospital with covid or getting admitted into hospitals...not numbers/stats from testing.
We can be assured, it's a fact that this virus could care less what any of our personal views are, or what side of the fence we are sitting on in any of this.

But I'd bet everything I own that if there is another spike(and I surely hope there isn't), that if it gets to a certain point of leaning towards overloading our hospitals/medical staffs...like it or not...there WILL be more reclosing. Especially in the hotspot areas.


----------



## Shad Rap

fastwater said:


> Apparently, with social distancing as well as things start reopening.
> 
> From Friday on, there has been live news media clips showing lines of people standing shoulder to shoulder waiting to get into restaurants/bars as if covid19 doesn't even exist.
> Many clips from the short north/OSU campus area.
> 
> Guess we all have our own thoughts and are either going to do what's suggested to try and keep the next spike down or not. 'Spike' meaning very high increase in number of people actually going to the hospital with covid or getting admitted into hospitals...not numbers/stats from testing.
> We can be assured, it's a fact that this virus could care less what any of our personal views are, or what side of the fence we are sitting on in any of this.
> 
> But I'd bet everything I own that if there is another spike(and I surely hope there isn't), that if it gets to a certain point of leaning towards overloading our hospitals/medical staffs...like it or not...there WILL be more reclosing. Especially in the hotspot areas.


In and around Columbus the hospitals weren't overloaded with the initial spike...they won't be overloaded on the 2nd spike if there is any...this may happen in some areas, but I doubt it...


----------



## JamesF

There's bound to be spikes, with the number of people, now going to places and bunching up in crowds. It's easy to fall into a false sense of normalcy. Yet with a sense of danger and apprehension. The herd mentality.


----------



## EnonEye

Good golly the hospital I must go to for tests once a week is like Ft Knox. Don't think I'll try getting in there without a mask. Heard from 2 restaurant owners when informed their employees were not wearing masks, the new go-to is if an employee has a health reason to not wear then don't have to do it... aaaaaachew! Wadda answer


----------



## fastwater

I hope you are right SR about no future overloads around Columbus...or any place in the US as far as that goes.
Though I have a few very good 'contacts' that I get some very good insight from, I'm not confident enough at this point to say one way or the other how things are going to go as far as if there's going to be a spike enough to re--spike old hotspots or create new ones.
Guess we'll all see in time...


----------



## roundbadge

If you guestimated the Serology averages based on population, say 5% Nationally, then about 17,500,000 US citizens may have been infected already versus the 1.5mm reported(symptoms allowed a test)

a step further, 1.5/19 is about 8%

Test of positive virus has show about 10% symptoms warranting health care, estimated

Ohio jail had 2000/2100 asymptomatic from random testing.............confined area, roughly 95% would waltzed around unknowingly

the calc above is 92% inverse

do the math


----------



## Specwar

What do all of you “the sky is falling “ people do when there’s nothing to fret about???


----------



## Dovans

How is it that first responders come in our store they do not wear a mask? Had patio installed other day by a First Responder, and he said they only wear masks when they are told the patient is possible covid-19. Otherwise then do not wear them. I have been turned in twice now for not wearing a mask. The temp checks are a joke. Everyday they take my temp its been off by 5-7 degrees. (91 through 98 take your choice) You may think its no big deal, but try restacking a pallet of 32's of water. Throwing twelve packs of pop.. We are still required to throw a case to the shelf in under a minute. Sometimes your breathing pretty hard and that mask makes it pretty hard to get fresh air. End of the day I have chapped nose as inside this mask for my health is very humid. Am I saving a life.. I doubt it. Am I hurting myself wearing one? More then likely. I am a big believer in Social Distancing.


----------



## bad luck

fastwater said:


> Required at all hospitals as well.
> And that was going on long before the start of the 'reopening' process
> Hmmm....wonder why that is?



No it wasn't....I was at a DR office in late Feb and no masks were required then.....


Again, if it's law, it's law--period. Just like using a turn signal is.
If a store REQUIRES it, if you wanna shop there.....then comply....if not, I take my business elsehwere....


----------



## JamesF

The next crack down is now going to be enforced. In my opinion, I don't see myself visiting these places anytime soon. Just a little too close for comfort.
After going out yesterday, and seeing all the people crowding their way through the stores and restaurants. Not for me...


----------



## cincinnati

Dovans said:


> I have been turned in twice now for not wearing a mask.


It’s the New Normal....& Karen is EVERYWHERE!


----------



## fastwater

bad luck said:


> *No it wasn't*....I was at a DR office in late Feb and no masks were required then.....
> 
> 
> Again, if it's law, it's law--period. Just like using a turn signal is.
> If a store REQUIRES it, if you wanna shop there.....then comply....if not, I take my business elsehwere....


*'No it wasn't'* what?

As far as Hospital and Dr's offices goes...or anywhere else in Ohio for that matter...it's not 'law' for visitors. It may be a policy of the employees of the business...and it may be the policy set by the business for the visitors to enter ...but it's not law.

If you took what I said as it was law, that was not my intention.

The hospitals/Dr's. offices in Ohio have never been ordered from the Gov. or POTUS to mandate masks when patients enter say the ER or Dr's office.
The hospitals/medical facilities themselves have mandated these rules as far as visitors/patients on their own. And like I said in prior post...this was being done long before the 'reopening'.
If your Dr's office doesn't require face mask for visitors...more power to him and you. If you have to go to your Doctors office again in the near future, you may want to call before going to see if mask is required. Heck, there are some medical facilities that have closed their waiting rooms altogether and have you sit in your vehicle until they come out and get you.
My last visits to my doctors office was at the onset of this covid19 crap I believe either the last of Feb or 1st of March. My first visit there...this was just before outbreak was announced, visit went normal with no one wearing masks. Two weeks later when I went back to review X-rays, everyone from the receptionist to the Dr was wearing them. I had to ask the nurse what was up with all the face masks.

Again...at this point, not even really interested in debating what people's stances are on anything pertaining to covid19.
Regardless of suggestions from medical professionals, unless something is made law, people are gonna do what they want to do anyway.
Forgetting all the mask drama...What would be nice as the reopening happens is for everyone to just look around and see how many people are at least actually social distancing.


----------



## Meerkat

The initial COVID impact modeling was scary and at that time it was prudent to take precautions. 

But here is a chart of CDC data showing total deaths in the first 16 weeks of the year from 2014 to 2020 where total deaths in 2020 are about the same as in the previous 6 years.









So if total deaths in 2020 are about the same as previous years, where is the COVID impact and why do our “leaders” continue with this fallacy? 

For the answer I quote from an article about the UK that applies equally to Ohio & to the US:
_“Politics, as opposed to science, does not reward the correction of mistakes, given that correcting a mistake also entails admitting to having made one. Worse, the bigger the mistake, the greater the political urgency of defending it at all costs. Our leaders are therefore obliged to keep justifying the lockdown, which means continuing to exaggerate the contagion’s risk to life, because to relax social distancing is also to suggest that maybe much social distancing was a mistake to begin with.”_


----------



## fastwater

Dovans said:


> How is it that first responders come in our store they do not wear a mask? Had patio installed other day by a First Responder, and he said they only wear masks when they are told the patient is possible covid-19. Otherwise then do not wear them. I have been turned in twice now for not wearing a mask. The temp checks are a joke. Everyday they take my temp its been off by 5-7 degrees. (91 through 98 take your choice) You may think its no big deal, but try restacking a pallet of 32's of water. Throwing twelve packs of pop.. We are still required to throw a case to the shelf in under a minute. Sometimes your breathing pretty hard and that mask makes it pretty hard to get fresh air. End of the day I have chapped nose as inside this mask for my health is very humid. Am I saving a life.. I doubt it. Am I hurting myself wearing one? More then likely. I am a big believer in Social Distancing.


I sure feel for you Dovans. That would be liken to working out with a face mask on.
Seems it's crazy something couldn't be done since many grocery stores are closed through the night that the majority of stocking, especially heavier items could be done at night and the employee wouldn't have to be around other employees while doing so.
Due to the nature of my job, we don't have to wear a face mask unless we are riding in a vehicle with another employee.
There was a stearn warning last week from our Director that any two employees caught in a vehicle without our PPE's were going to face severe disciplinary actions. There are plain clothes State employees cruising around insuring our guidelines as employees are being followed and that we are enforcing the social distancing and max group number of 10 policy's.
As temps rise, seems the max group policy is getting harder to enforce but we've already been told that if there are too many violations we will be closed down.


----------



## JamesF

I get the feeling that there are many people not willing to respect the safety of others. Of course that's just me. I at the grocery store and a lot of people have just walked up to me and try to reach in front of me... you know the feeling that you're being crowded, or maybe you don't. I have that problem all the time, it's nothing new to me. Kind of like my Spidey senses kicking in. This is not going to be easy, opening businesses that have been closed.


----------



## Patricio

ive come to believe, there are people here who honestly hope for a spike. i truly believe this.

unfortunately for them, georgia has been open for weeks.


----------



## Burkcarp1

Because of the shutdown there are more people than usual at some businesses like the barber etc


----------



## laguna21

Dovans said:


> How is it that first responders come in our store they do not wear a mask? Had patio installed other day by a First Responder, and he said they only wear masks when they are told the patient is possible covid-19. Otherwise then do not wear them. I have been turned in twice now for not wearing a mask. The temp checks are a joke. Everyday they take my temp its been off by 5-7 degrees. (91 through 98 take your choice) You may think its no big deal, but try restacking a pallet of 32's of water. Throwing twelve packs of pop.. We are still required to throw a case to the shelf in under a minute. Sometimes your breathing pretty hard and that mask makes it pretty hard to get fresh air. End of the day I have chapped nose as inside this mask for my health is very humid. Am I saving a life.. I doubt it. Am I hurting myself wearing one? More then likely. I am a big believer in Social Distancing.


I just got home from the store, had my mask on, feel for ya, can't imagine wearing that dam thing all day! 


Meerkat said:


> The initial COVID impact modeling was scary and at that time it was prudent to take precautions.
> 
> But here is a chart of CDC data showing total deaths in the first 16 weeks of the year from 2014 to 2020 where total deaths in 2020 are about the same as in the previous 6 years.
> View attachment 357973
> 
> 
> So if total deaths in 2020 are about the same as previous years, where is the COVID impact and why do our “leaders” continue with this fallacy?
> 
> For the answer I quote from an article about the UK that applies equally to Ohio & to the US:
> _“Politics, as opposed to science, does not reward the correction of mistakes, given that correcting a mistake also entails admitting to having made one. Worse, the bigger the mistake, the greater the political urgency of defending it at all costs. Our leaders are therefore obliged to keep justifying the lockdown, which means continuing to exaggerate the contagion’s risk to life, because to relax social distancing is also to suggest that maybe much social distancing was a mistake to begin with.”_


Are the numbers you posted considering the stay at home and social distancing everyone did during the same time?


----------



## Dovans

fastwater said:


> *'* to go to your Doctors office again in the near future, you may want to call before going to see if mask is required. Heck, there are some medical facilities that have closed their waiting rooms altogether and have you sit in your vehicle until they come out and get you.


Had to take my 92 old mother to the Dr. Last week. First he called to make sure it essential she had to be seen. Then he ok'd her to come in. When we got there, lady at door took my temp and asked me some questions about my health. Took my Mothers as well. Then put some kind of "safe" sticker on me and my mother. We went into the waiting room, got her comfy.. then I sat down whereupon the receptionist politely told me I had to get out of the building. Kind of miffed , I argued somewhat. My mom has to have walker and someone to hold her (she is kind of fragile). She told me they'd take care of it. Again the "get out now" So I sat in the car. More worried she was going to fall on the way to exam room. After ehh 15 20 minutes the Dr. came out of the side door and asked what were the issues. He wanted to make sure why she was there. Didnt mind that at all.. Was thankful actually. Ten minutes later mom comes out the front door. Dr. also made sure by the side door what diagnosis was and treatment.


----------



## JamesF

Yeah! I'm going to have to go to the doctor's office as soon as I can. Not the flu, but necessary for multiple health issues. The stuff that comes with getting older, but needs monitoring. It's a PIA,getting older. Used to be just call and make an appointment, or go in the same day. Nope! Not anymore. This whole deal with stay home and now open up,Let's go out and have a fricking party. Screw it! I just dealt with a few idiot's thinking it's ok to do whatever trips their trigger. Dumbasses!


----------



## multi species angler

Specwar said:


> What do all of you “the sky is falling “ people do when there’s nothing to fret about???


 Tell you what I didn't do " Worry if one of my loved ones was going to get this virus and die.


----------



## Hatchetman

multi species angler said:


> Tell you what I didn't do " Worry if one of my loved ones was going to get this virus and die.


----------



## Wow

Does this all sound familiar? Like when you raised your children?
They just didn’t want to do it. 
They just knew better than mom and dad. “do your homework before you go out and play”
We know that upbringing has struggled in recent years. And common courtesy has gone out the window. When I hear grown adult men whine like children , I just shake my head. Even old mature men. Have they lost their values?

When did Americans become so self absorbed? When did we lose our humanity toward the elderly and the weak? These aren’t the values I was taught.

I’m quite sure our veteran members fought for our constitution and to save American lives. These values are still intact among them. Many of them are on ventilators as we speak.

The Governor, *today,* had to crack down on the “opening” crowd, who refuse to comply with reasonable measures, to contain this virus in the long term. 
https://www.cleveland.com/coronavir...ocial-distancing-at-bars-and-restaurants.html
People are crowding together, ignoring precautions, and foregoing masks. 
………And all of this, because you’re desperate for that shot and beer?
Bars and restaurants will face fines and closings. How are you helping the economy and protecting Americans? By denying the obvious? I had a teenager like that, but he outgrew it .
You maybe free , but you’re not free of responsibility. Man up!

Wiser people than you are working to create a better future for all of us.
Please be part of the solution.

I thank all of you who are making the effort. --Tim


----------



## hailtothethief

Tony shaloub- monk- got the corona virus. Said it was a rough couple weeks. Bet no one shakes his hand anymore.


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## SConner

It is getting more and more difficult to know what numbers are accurate.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.latimes.com/opinion/story/2020-05-18/georgia-coronavirus-numbers-reopening-manipulated-data-brian-kemp?_amp=true

https://news.google.com/articles/CA...jsP_CjD2kPkCMMzt5wU?hl=en-US&gl=US&ceid=US:en


----------



## bad luck

could always be worse. 

WE can ALL be thankful for a few things:
-didn’t have to go to court like WI or OR to open back up
-Were not citizens of NYC, LA County



of course this will pose a new problem....people getting fed up and moving to “less restrictive” areas of the country, and then voting in the new areas like they did the old....thus re-creating what they left (pardon the pun) ...I don’t get it?


----------



## Shad Rap

laguna21 said:


> I just got home from the store, had my mask on, feel for ya, can't imagine wearing that dam thing all day!
> 
> Are the numbers you posted considering the stay at home and social distancing everyone did during the same time?


Actually, the original model #'s months ago included 'stay at home and social distancing' to an extent...they had to...it's part of the model and the process of a developing pandemic...don't let them fool ya...


----------



## Lewzer

I’ve been going to the docs office weekly for my allergy shots. No issue whatsoever. Last week was the first time they started requiring masks.


----------



## Lewzer

> NewIt is getting more and more difficult to know what numbers are accurate.


Did you ever hear the saying “there’s lies, damn lies and statistics”. Don’t believe everything you read. Data can be easily manipulated to fit a storyline.


----------



## JamesF

I don't pay close attention to the numbers game, as stated, they can be skewed. A lot of deaths caused by complications of pre existing conditions were counted as covid deaths, they should be not be attributed to covid. I can't recall where I read the protocols on this, but it did play a part of inaccurate information. Either the CDC, or the WHO, has a protocol about listing the exact cause of death. Influenza can exacerbate the preexisting health issues, thus contributing to the inability of the bodies immune system to fight off the virus. My mother passed away from pneumonia in the same manner. Her cause of death is listed as organ failure, due to pneumonia. There is a distinct difference, when a person's underlying health condition fails to fight off infections, by being too weak.


----------



## laguna21

Shad Rap said:


> Actually, the original model #'s months ago included 'stay at home and social distancing' to an extent...they had to...it's part of the model and the process of a developing pandemic...don't let them fool ya...


I question what those numbers would be without the extra things done to keep them down, and it's not over yet


----------



## KaGee

Lewzer said:


> Did you ever hear the saying “there’s lies, damn lies and statistics”. Don’t believe everything you read. Data can be easily manipulated to fit a storyline.


Figures don't lie... but liars can figure.


----------



## Burkcarp1




----------



## cement569

and most come from nurseing homes and health care facilities


----------



## Hatchetman

NBC News headline...."Senator John Glenn's wife of 73 years dies of Corona Virus....


----------



## Hatchetman

Oh....Further into the story they tell you that she was 100 years old...


----------



## Hatchetman

Then they also happen to mention that she contracted it in and died in a nursing home....


----------



## EnonEye

Burkcarp1 said:


> View attachment 358123


guess we know which airport the virus exited the plane


----------



## loves2fishinohio

Hatchetman said:


> NBC News headline...."Senator John Glenn's wife of 73 years dies of Corona Virus....


At the age of 100.


----------



## Burkcarp1

Hatchetman said:


> Then they also happen to mention that she contracted it in and died in a nursing home....


Amazing..Not


----------



## roundbadge

South Korea released the results that any trace germs in retested negatives to positives could not replicate, meaning not able to reinfect

Their conclusion is once you recover, you cannot spread, and you have some antibodies. They also state original SARS survivors still have corona antibodies from 9-17 years ago.

So, if Serology states Ohio may have had 10% recoveries at roughly a 12mm Pop, then the number of spreaders should decrease as time passes, assuming the infection rate remains constant and/or increases

In other words, if all Ohioans were tested at the same time, the results could show 10-20% of the Pop has had it and recovered


----------



## Misdirection

roundbadge said:


> South Korea released the results that any trace germs in retested negatives to positives could not replicate, meaning not able to reinfect
> 
> Their conclusion is once you recover, you cannot spread, and you have some antibodies. They also state original SARS survivors still have corona antibodies from 9-17 years ago.
> 
> So, if Serology states Ohio may have had 10% recoveries at roughly a 12mm Pop, then the number of spreaders should decrease as time passes, assuming the infection rate remains constant and/or increases
> 
> In other words, if all Ohioans were tested at the same time, the results could show 10-20% of the Pop has had it and recovered


I had my serology test drawn last week (I'm in PA). Came back negative for me. Didn't think I ever had it, but my employer offered the testing for free.

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


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## cement569

i still cant figure out the toilet paper thing, when this first started everyone freaked out and went out bought all the toilet paper they could find. i wasent aware the slides were apart of the virus.....hmm. then the meat shortage, the 3 butcher shops i deal with had all you wanted. again.....the fear factor


----------



## hailtothethief

The panic was more about the economy. The virus was a problem but the bigger problem is the economy and 10 straight good years will likely lead to 10 straight lean years. With the virus leading people to stay home that is catastrophic for much of the economy.


----------



## Snakecharmer

cement569 said:


> i still cant figure out the toilet paper thing, when this first started everyone freaked out and went out bought all the toilet paper they could find. i wasent aware the slides were apart of the virus.....hmm. then the meat shortage, the 3 butcher shops i deal with had all you wanted. again.....the fear factor


What about Wendy's?


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## buckeyebowman

hailtothethief said:


> The panic was more about the economy. The virus was a problem but the bigger problem is the economy and 10 straight good years will likely lead to 10 straight lean years. With the virus leading people to stay home that is catastrophic for much of the economy.


Or the government ordering businesses to close and people to stay home! 

Saw another article in the paper today about the local lab that has developed a quick, results in under an hour, COVID-19 test. A patent has been applied for, and it's been fast tracked, and they have developed an "at home" self administered test. It will probably be a while until it's available because of waiting on the patent. Plus, they're a small outfit and not set up for large scale production, so they'll have to license it out to labs that are. 

They started by developing tests for bacterial infections. What switched them to viruses was the Ebola outbreak in Africa in 2014. They've also been working with SARS and MERS, which they said gave them a good foundatin for going after COVID.

A thought occurred to me today. When we are "allowed" to have parties again and you're at a birthday party, how many of you will watch the birthday boy or girl blow out the candles, and then line up for a slice of that cake?! 

I think there's an invention there just waiting to be made.


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## cement569

snakecharmer, i dont consider fast food meat as real meat. way to many preservitives and additives in their products. my guess is their provider is suffering a down time right now, my butchers deal with ohio farmers and so far no problems


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## JamesF

cement569 said:


> and most come from nurseing homes and health care facilities


They are getting hit hard. But where can they go?


----------



## Big Chief

Figures can lie.........when the numbers used are false


----------



## bobk

cement569 said:


> snakecharmer, i dont consider fast food meat as real meat. way to many preservitives and additives in their products. my guess is their provider is suffering a down time right now, my butchers deal with ohio farmers and so far no problems


It’s still beef whether it’s up to
your standards or not. Your local butcher couldn’t possibly supply a national chain like Wendy’s. There have been shortages. Our Kroger had an almost empty meat case today.


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## cement569

and im glad they dont supply a national chain like wendys, more worried about the local people who choose not to eat from big national chains and support the local farmers


----------



## I Fish

roundbadge said:


> South Korea released the results that any trace germs in retested negatives to positives could not replicate, meaning not able to reinfect
> 
> Their conclusion is once you recover, you cannot spread, and you have some antibodies. They also state original SARS survivors still have corona antibodies from 9-17 years ago.
> 
> So, if Serology states Ohio may have had 10% recoveries at roughly a 12mm Pop, then the number of spreaders should decrease as time passes, assuming the infection rate remains constant and/or increases
> 
> In other words, if all Ohioans were tested at the same time, the results could show 10-20% of the Pop has had it and recovered


Interestingly, I got tired of sending the Ohio dept of Health messages through the "contact us" on the Covid 19 dashboard, asking how many in Ohio have recovered, after weeks of no reply, I called them. The lady tried to tell me that it was on the dashboard, so I asked her to walk me through to the info. She seemed genuinely surprised that it was no where to be found. So then, she told me I had to call my county health department for that answer, lol.

So, I called the county, and went through a near identical conversation with them, except they said I needed to call the state. The term circle jerk comes to mind.

The county said they have a conference call with the state a few times a week, and they would ask them then. I kinda chewed both of them because both admitted they had never thought to ask, and seemed genuinely surprised that info wasn't available. I mean, isn't recovery half of the equation?


----------



## AmericanEagle

I Fish said:


> Interestingly, I got tired of sending the Ohio dept of Health messages through the "contact us" on the Covid 19 dashboard, asking how many in Ohio have recovered, after weeks of no reply, I called them. The lady tried to tell me that it was on the dashboard, so I asked her to walk me through to the info. She seemed genuinely surprised that it was no where to be found. So then, she told me I had to call my county health department for that answer, lol.
> 
> So, I called the county, and went through a near identical conversation with them, except they said I needed to call the state. The term circle jerk comes to mind.
> 
> The county said they have a conference call with the state a few times a week, and they would ask them then. I kinda chewed both of them because both admitted they had never thought to ask, and seemed genuinely surprised that info wasn't available. I mean, isn't recovery half of the equation?


Ohio does list those who have recovered in the prison system data. Currently there have been 8,014 tested, 4527 positive, 3470 negative, with 17 pending. 4,075 have recovered (90.1% recovery rate of those infected). 2 probable Covid-19 deaths and 61 confirmed Covid-19 deaths (1.3% mortality rate of those infected). 389 or 8.6 % of those infected yet to be determined.

https://coronavirus.ohio.gov/static/DRCCOVID-19Information.pdf


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## Shad Rap

AmericanEagle said:


> Ohio does list those who have recovered in the prison system data. Currently there have been 8,014 tested, 4527 positive, 3470 negative, with 17 pending. 4,075 have recovered (90.1% recovery rate of those infected). 2 probable Covid-19 deaths and 61 confirmed Covid-19 deaths (1.3% mortality rate of those infected). 389 or 8.6 % of those infected yet to be determined.
> 
> https://coronavirus.ohio.gov/static/DRCCOVID-19Information.pdf


The recovery rate would be a lot higher in the general public as opposed to being locked up in a prison though...IMO...guessing it would be somewhere around 98-99% just because so many people have had it...even the folks who didn't go to the hospital, I would say only a very, very small percentage of those people died...


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## jrose

Snakecharmer said:


> What about Wendy's?


Where's the beef!!!


----------



## I Fish

AmericanEagle said:


> Ohio does list those who have recovered in the prison system data. Currently there have been 8,014 tested, 4527 positive, 3470 negative, with 17 pending. 4,075 have recovered (90.1% recovery rate of those infected). 2 probable Covid-19 deaths and 61 confirmed Covid-19 deaths (1.3% mortality rate of those infected). 389 or 8.6 % of those infected yet to be determined.
> 
> https://coronavirus.ohio.gov/static/DRCCOVID-19Information.pdf


Correct.
So, if we use the same data and apply it to the rest of the state using the current number of
28,952 cases, assuming 90% have recovered, leaves us with 2895 current cases.

So, why is the state reporting 28,952 as if that is the current number, when reality suggests
there's really only 1/10 of that? I would imagine the same would go for hospitalization and ICU numbers as well. I guess the 26,057 recoveries count for nothing? Seems legit.


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## roundbadge

what "they" are learning so far, for example, that infections may have started in late 2019, unknown to most everybody, is that the spread started when there were no lockdowns, or social distancing in place, and many of those infections were asymptomatic or mild, dismissed as cold or mild flu, and many could be "recoveries" where only Serology would answer that............

To get the math right, in theory, every Ohio household would need at least ONE Serology test kit sent to the front door, under the assumption the result of the one test extends to the family under that roof.............based on how this spreads so easily

So, the places doing random tests excluding clusters like the jailhouses which skew the numbers, have had varying positive antibody results..........higher in NYC versus the entire State, but 10% currently may be a solid guesstimate.............like NY State in general

That would mean about 1.2mm Ohioans had it and recovered, and according to the recent lab work done in South Korea, you are now a non-spreader..............the more non-spreaders makes the rate of infection decrease in theory...........

The Ohio jail scenario where 2100 positives occurred and 2000 asymptomatics shows what a cluster does, but it also tells you only 5% of those infected exhibited symptoms............

"They" still can't answer why the majority have no symptoms..........what is in the physiology of these people that shuts the door on the virus?


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## fastwater

To date...
...very small % of people in the state(including prison system)have been tested....
....Don't know how long covid19 has been here.
....Obviously...Don't know number of positive, positive recovered, positive deaths prior to knowledge of covid19 being here.

Again...all these stats floating around are NOT 'totals' of any aspect of covid19 other than the stats of the limited number of tests administered. 
Since we don't know all the factors needed to plug into the equation to compute 'totals'...we will never have them.


----------



## roundbadge

But a hospital study in New York City has found that out of hundreds of New Yorkers who thought they potentially had COVID-19 in the last three months but never received a confirmed clinical diagnosis, *only* 37% tested positive for COVID-19 antibodies, a sign the body was previously likely infected and fought the virus.

do the math


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## Specwar

I doubt there are very few here if any that knew what to do with the data on covd19 cases if it were laid in front of them.
Same people, same OH MY’s, same yada,yada, yada.
Get on with your lives, please!!


----------



## fastwater

Specwar said:


> I doubt there are very few here if any that knew what to do with the data on covd19 cases if it were laid in front of them.
> Same people, same OH MY’s, same yada,yada, yada.
> Get on with your lives, please!!


Agree with this due to the fact that the 'numbers' are still being passed around using the word 'totals' as if they actually mean something as far as real totals are concerned.
Really comical and redundant at this stage of the game. 
Seems the people still touting the numbers as 'totals' like to use them to support their own agenda/belief one way or the other and are trying to convince others to close their eyes and go along with said beliefs.


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## BFG

Recovery data, much like negative test result data, can be and is very difficult to locate. Finding how many tests have been administered is another number that is tough to find. Until the nursing home outbreaks, Ohio was running on average of 1 out of 10 tested were positive (i.e. 90% negative rate). Only the sickest of the sick were being tested at that time. Since those days, the testing was expanded to include front line workers, prison residents and staff, and long-term care residents and staff. The numbers jumped (all of them) with no big surprises, as prisons are no different than NYC in that folks live together in close quarters and are around each other for long periods of time in small spaces. 

A frustrating part of the data is that the cases, hospitalizations, ICU admissions, and deaths are additive numbers. Those numbers will never go down, only up. While some may feel it is important to note the totals, it would be much easier for most to look at it as a daily number, not necessarily a total number. While it is nice to see Dr. Acton discuss 7-day trends, it would much less alarming to the general public if they heard the data based off of actual current cases, hospitalizations, and ICU admissions. There seems to be no problem reporting the number of deaths from day to day though, as that number is depressing no matter how it is presented. 

This isn't the lottery, where people get excited when the numbers get bigger. I would like to know:

New positive cases (day to day)
Total tests administered
Total negative tests
Total positive tests
Current hospitalizations
Current ICU admissions
Day to day deaths

And for the antibody testing...

Total test
Total negative
Total positive

When you tell people that roughly 9/10 folks that get tested for COVID are negative (actually it is slightly higher now) they don't believe you. That's because the total negative test numbers aren't published.


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## multi species angler

roundbadge said:


> what is in the physiology of these people that shuts the door on the virus


 Good question, I've been thinking for a long time, they'er missing something.

And it kills some quickly.


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## multi species angler

BFG said:


> This isn't the lottery, where people get excited when the numbers get bigger


On the other side of the coin, the more cases listed the less the death rate looks. 4 million cases vs 100'000 deaths.

And assuming if they aren't listed as dead, they recovered or are recovering.


----------



## Meerkat

Ohio Court: Forced Closure of Gyms Unconstitutional. Health Department has no authority to close all business or create its own penalties

Painesville, OH – An Ohio Court of Common Pleas Wednesday morning enjoined the Ohio Governor and Director of the Department of Health from “imposing or enforcing penalties solely for non-compliance with the director’s order” against gymnasiums, health clubs, fitness centers, gyms, and workout facilities. 

The 1851 Center for Constitutional Law’s victory against Defendant Amy Acton comes on behalf of 35 independent gyms across the state, who moved to enjoin the Ohio Department of Health from continuing to enforce its criminalization of even safe gym operations, as implemented through the Director’s various Orders since March. 

The ruling by Judge Eugene Lucci of the Lake County Court of Common Pleas explains that private property rights are fundamental rights in Ohio, and that the Ohio Department of Health has both violated those rights and exceeded its own authority in “criminalizing lawful businesses, and imposing strict liability for violations, including severe criminal, civil, and equitable penalties”: “The director has no statutory authority to close all businesses, including the plaintiffs’ gyms . . . She has acted in an impermissibly arbitrary, unreasonable, and oppressive manner without any procedural safeguards.” 

The ruling further excoriates the Department of Health’s insistence that “one unelected individual could exercise such unfettered power to force everyone to obey impermissibly vague rules without any legislative guidance.” 

“Constitutions are written to prevent governments from arbitrarily interfering in citizens’ lives and businesses. On that front, the call to action is clear: the Governor and Health Director may no longer impose their own closures and regulations and write their own criminal penalties to enforce those regulations and closures,” explained 1851 Center Executive Director Maurice Thompson. “We remain available to serve those who are caught in the State’s tangled web of unlawful orders.”


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## fastwater

https://www.healthline.com/health-n...-syndrome-linked-to-covid-19-affects-children


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## cincinnati

So continuously cleaning everything w/sanitizing wipes & leaving your mail in the box for 72 hours was all for naught?

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...pread-easily-surfaces-objects-cdc/5232748002/


----------



## loves2fishinohio

cincinnati said:


> So continuously cleaning everything w/sanitizing wipes & leaving your mail in the box for 72 hours was all for naught?
> 
> https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...pread-easily-surfaces-objects-cdc/5232748002/


Interesting read. I see advertisements all the time on TV for disinfecting services for COVID-19. I know it doesn't last too long on most surfaces.


----------



## Shad Rap

cincinnati said:


> So continuously cleaning everything w/sanitizing wipes & leaving your mail in the box for 72 hours was all for naught?
> 
> https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...pread-easily-surfaces-objects-cdc/5232748002/


Took them 4 months to figure it out...lol.
First it didn't last long on surfaces, then it did...now it's back to it doesn't...shouldn't be that hard to figure out...we're just talking about how long it lives on the surface of things...


----------



## bad luck

the house of cards this sham was built upon falls just a little more each day. 

-death counts to COVID are now being changed daily
-we find out Acton illegally locked up the whole state of OH per the court case yesterday 
-now the cdc quietly states it doesn’t live long on surfaces...


----------



## cement569

i would have never believed this if i hadnt seen it with my own eyes. a week or so ago im watching fox 8 cleveland news early report in the morning and they were showing a clip from the hospital front line as they call it, there were doctors and nurses doin their work all with masks, shields and gloves and in the back ground was an elderly women on a hospital bed with a oxygen set up on her face being pushed into a room by a young orderly or male nurse and he was not wearing a mask or gloves. they quickly switched away from the clip and started showing the little red virus crystal. i tell my wife about it we watched the same news at 4 oclock because fox 8 shows the same news over and over, but they never showed that clip again. again......the fear factor


----------



## yonderfishin

multi species angler said:


> On the other side of the coin, the more cases listed the less the death rate looks. 4 million cases vs 100'000 deaths.
> 
> And assuming if they aren't listed as dead, they recovered or are recovering.



But there are more than one sets of data to consider. The death rate of the general healthy public , ....and the death rate of the elderly , or otherwise compromised.....which is much higher and is also the group many of our government representatives are in as well as parents and grandparents....in some cases our children. In other words , people whose lives we generally put a very high value on. These are the people driving the lockdowns , paranoia , and often overreaction. I dont know the death rate among this set of the population , but its much higher than that of the general population as a whole. People say there is a 98% survival rate but not among this segment of the population. 

The data and its implications are far more complex than some realize


----------



## BFG

yonderfishin said:


> But there are more than one sets of data to consider. The death rate of the general healthy public , ....and the death rate of the elderly , or otherwise compromised.....which is much higher and is also the group many of our government representatives are in as well as parents and grandparents....in some cases our children. In other words , people whose lives we generally put a very high value on. These are the people driving the lockdowns , paranoia , and often overreaction. I dont know the death rate among this set of the population , but its much higher than that of the general population as a whole. People say there is a 98% survival rate but not among this segment of the population.
> 
> The data and its implications are far more complex than some realize


The death rates of the elderly are already disproportionately high compared to the rest of the population without COVID. We die when we get old. It sucks. The fact that elderly are passing away in nursing homes is not a new phenomenon. What is not being reported is the number of elderly in nursing homes who have COVID yet are asymptomatic, and don't die from it. Most Americans don't live to see 80 years old. The average age of those who have passed in Ohio is over 70. In some counties, that age is over 75. If you have ever been to a long-term care facility, you will find that there are typically three tiers of residents:

1. New arrivals who are in reasonably good health but suffered an ailment (i.e. stroke, fall, MI, etc.) and need to recover and may/may not ever return home

2. 2-5 year residents who are never going home, relatively stable but most have difficulty with normal ADL's. Need assistance with showering, eating, etc. etc. They are never leaving that place, and as time wears on, their condition deteriorates rapidly and their vulnerability increases

3. 3+ year residents who have debilitating health conditions. These are the folks who require nearly 100% total care. Most are immobile, and modern medication is what is keeping them alive. Most in this category are 80+ years old. Extremely vulnerable. 

Category 1 and some of category 2 residents have a fighting chance against COVID. Category 3 have zero chance. Remember nearly ALL nursing home residents these days were adults in the 60's and 70's...a time during which nearly everyone smoked. If you are elderly, have COPD or emphysema and contract COVID, the odds are strongly stacked against you surviving it. 

Emotions run high when someone talks about their parents/grandparents dying. "Wear a mask so you don't kill my Nana" gained a helluva lot of press and popularity. Fear of causing such things is why people are donning masks and scrubbing everything in sight. Nobody wants to be responsible for the death of a loved one. Fear is what has driven the policy and regulations in this State and across the Country. 

Every week there seems to be a new narrative against going back to normal. As each day goes by, that narrative grows weaker and weaker. Georgia has been open for nearly a month. Yes, they have cases, but no, they haven't seen a death spike. San Francisco had TWO new cases yesterday. NYC had less than 250 new hospital admissions. 

This thing is slowly dying out....right in front of our eyes.


----------



## BFG

I will also point out that an elderly person in a nursing home with pre-existing conditions like heart disease, COPD, etc. etc. is also likely to perish from contracting the annual strain of flu. Even more die each year from complications resulting from dehydration.


----------



## Dovans

I thought of you all today.... Watched this person at work take off her mask so she could cough into her arm. Coulded help but laugh.


----------



## Wow

I couldn't care less how you get it, touching it or breathing it. It's extremely contagious!
you can't wish it away, as hard as you try.
In just one week 36,000 additional people died, because no-one was minding the store.It's unforgivable.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-52757150

Is Columbia University the next messenger to be crucified by you?


You've heard of the deep state, right? So let's call it the "ignorant state" that caused the additional 36,000 deaths. How long do you want to play this shell game with American lives.

61 Ohioans died yesterday and 326 died in the last week. We watch this pandemic peak, while we plan to prime it's escalation. Who, here, views this as a rational response?

Of course time will tell. ...........and when it does, what will your new excuse be?

Stay the course , be safe and bless you and your families. --Tim


----------



## Burkcarp1

Wow said:


> I couldn't care less how you get it, touching it or breathing it. It's extremely contagious!
> you can't wish it away, as hard as you try.
> In just one week 36,000 additional people died, because no-one was minding the store.It's unforgivable.
> 
> https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-52757150
> 
> Is Columbia University the next messenger to be crucified by you?
> 
> 
> You've heard of the deep state, right? So let's call it the "ignorant state" that caused the additional 36,000 deaths. How long do you want to play this shell game with American lives.
> 
> 61 Ohioans died yesterday and 326 died in the last week. We watch this pandemic peak, while we plan to prime it's escalation. Who, here, views this as a rational response?
> 
> Of course time will tell. ...........and when it does, what will your new excuse be?
> 
> Stay the course , be safe and bless you and your families. --Tim


Yesterday 47 died in Ohio not 61 according to the Ohio Covid website,and in the last 7 days 265 died. Not sure where you are getting those numbers..


----------



## Patricio

Wow said:


> I couldn't care less how you get it, touching it or breathing it. It's extremely contagious!
> you can't wish it away, as hard as you try.
> In just one week 36,000 additional people died, because no-one was minding the store.It's unforgivable.
> 
> https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-52757150
> 
> Is Columbia University the next messenger to be crucified by you?
> 
> 
> You've heard of the deep state, right? So let's call it the "ignorant state" that caused the additional 36,000 deaths. How long do you want to play this shell game with American lives.
> 
> 61 Ohioans died yesterday and 326 died in the last week. We watch this pandemic peak, while we plan to prime it's escalation. Who, here, views this as a rational response?
> 
> Of course time will tell. ...........and when it does, what will your new excuse be?
> 
> Stay the course , be safe and bless you and your families. --Tim


 the federal government cannot "lockdown" states or cities, it's against the law. Even then, we're seeing through courts it's against the law for states to lock themselves "down". Get over yourself. Stay in your basement please. You're safer there.


----------



## Shad Rap

BFG said:


> The death rates of the elderly are already disproportionately high compared to the rest of the population without COVID. We die when we get old. It sucks. The fact that elderly are passing away in nursing homes is not a new phenomenon. What is not being reported is the number of elderly in nursing homes who have COVID yet are asymptomatic, and don't die from it. Most Americans don't live to see 80 years old. The average age of those who have passed in Ohio is over 70. In some counties, that age is over 75. If you have ever been to a long-term care facility, you will find that there are typically three tiers of residents:
> 
> 1. New arrivals who are in reasonably good health but suffered an ailment (i.e. stroke, fall, MI, etc.) and need to recover and may/may not ever return home
> 
> 2. 2-5 year residents who are never going home, relatively stable but most have difficulty with normal ADL's. Need assistance with showering, eating, etc. etc. They are never leaving that place, and as time wears on, their condition deteriorates rapidly and their vulnerability increases
> 
> 3. 3+ year residents who have debilitating health conditions. These are the folks who require nearly 100% total care. Most are immobile, and modern medication is what is keeping them alive. Most in this category are 80+ years old. Extremely vulnerable.
> 
> Category 1 and some of category 2 residents have a fighting chance against COVID. Category 3 have zero chance. Remember nearly ALL nursing home residents these days were adults in the 60's and 70's...a time during which nearly everyone smoked. If you are elderly, have COPD or emphysema and contract COVID, the odds are strongly stacked against you surviving it.
> 
> Emotions run high when someone talks about their parents/grandparents dying. "Wear a mask so you don't kill my Nana" gained a helluva lot of press and popularity. Fear of causing such things is why people are donning masks and scrubbing everything in sight. Nobody wants to be responsible for the death of a loved one. Fear is what has driven the policy and regulations in this State and across the Country.
> 
> Every week there seems to be a new narrative against going back to normal. As each day goes by, that narrative grows weaker and weaker. Georgia has been open for nearly a month. Yes, they have cases, but no, they haven't seen a death spike. San Francisco had TWO new cases yesterday. NYC had less than 250 new hospital admissions.
> 
> This thing is slowly dying out....right in front of our eyes.


Yep...in one of my wifes nursing homes they tested all the residents...28 residents tested positive with absolutely no symptoms...they already had 19 covid positives and they had to create a new isolation unit at the nursing home...the ones who had no symptoms and were positive still aren't displaying symptoms and that was over 2 weeks ago...


----------



## buckeyebowman

Patricio said:


> the federal government cannot "lockdown" states or cities, it's against the law. Even then, we're seeing through courts it's against the law for states to lock themselves "down". Get over yourself. Stay in your basement please. You're safer there.


Exactly! After reading Chicken Little's post, I thought about it a while. Consider the source! Columbia University. Ivy League. Very liberal. Certainly no friend of Trump's. Kind of makes sense for them to cook up something to try to make him look bad! And the media would be only too happy to report it. Fake news, anyone?

And, they'll probably get away with it! Most folks don't think much in depth, or examine stuff like this very closely. They just take it at face value. And then they pass it on to their friends. The lack of critical thinking in this country is really kind of sad. When Trump went to visit that company in PA, there was pic in the paper of a demonstrator outside holding a sign that read, "Trump, open PA!" Well, he can't! He's not the one that closed it. The guy needs to put the PA governor's name on that sign! 

It will be interesting to see what kind of precedent that court decision sets!


----------



## MagicMarker

Wow said:


> I couldn't care less how you get it, touching it or breathing it. It's extremely contagious!
> you can't wish it away, as hard as you try.
> In just one week 36,000 additional people died, because no-one was minding the store.It's unforgivable.
> 
> https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-52757150
> 
> Is Columbia University the next messenger to be crucified by you?
> 
> 
> You've heard of the deep state, right? So let's call it the "ignorant state" that caused the additional 36,000 deaths. How long do you want to play this shell game with American lives.
> 
> 61 Ohioans died yesterday and 326 died in the last week. We watch this pandemic peak, while we plan to prime it's escalation. Who, here, views this as a rational response?
> 
> Of course time will tell. ...........and when it does, what will your new excuse be?
> 
> Stay the course , be safe and bless you and your families. --Tim


And your part of the closed minded stupid state that makes up all these phony numbers and try to pass them off as fact. Get over and live your life like a free American should


----------



## Workingman

In my opinion, this thing's gotta run its course. Some people will die, it sucks. But the quicker it runs its course the better, I'd rather not stretch it out any longer than necessary.


----------



## Wow

[QUOTE="BFG, post: 2919083, member: 5840 Georgia has been open for nearly a month. Yes, they have cases, but no, they haven't seen a death spike. San Francisco had TWO new cases yesterday. NYC had less than 250 new hospital admissions.
This thing is slowly dying out....right in front of our eyes.[/QUOTE]

I presume you never bothered to read this:

*Georgia’s corona-virus data made reopening look safe. The numbers were a lie *
https://www.amestrib.com/opinion/20...e-reopening-look-safe-but-he-numbers-were-lie

--Tim


----------



## Wow

MagicMarker said:


> And your part of the closed minded stupid *state that makes up all these phony numbers and try to pass them off as fact.* Get over and live your life like a free American should


You mean like the state of Georgia? --Tim


----------



## Burkcarp1

Wow said:


> [QUOTE="BFG, post: 2919083, member: 5840 Georgia has been open for nearly a month. Yes, they have cases, but no, they haven't seen a death spike. San Francisco had TWO new cases yesterday. NYC had less than 250 new hospital admissions.
> This thing is slowly dying out....right in front of our eyes.


I presume you never bothered to read this:

*Georgia’s corona-virus data made reopening look safe. The numbers were a lie *
https://www.amestrib.com/opinion/20...e-reopening-look-safe-but-he-numbers-were-lie

--Tim. Look where it came from


----------



## Wow

Burkcarp1 said:


> Yesterday 47 died in Ohio not 61 according to the Ohio Covid website,and in the last 7 days 265 died. Not sure where you are getting those numbers..



Right here, from Columbus.

https://www.cleveland.com/coronavir...s-29436-coronavirus-cases-updates-trends.html

1720 on Tuesday to 1781 on Wednesday. I added the weekly totals.
Please do your own research. The daily figures change from day to day.

--Tim


----------



## KaGee

Figures don't lie... but liars can figure.


----------



## Burkcarp1

Wow said:


> Right here, from Columbus.
> 
> https://www.cleveland.com/coronavir...s-29436-coronavirus-cases-updates-trends.html
> 
> 1720 on Tuesday to 1781 on Wednesday. I added the weekly totals.
> Please do your own research. The daily figures change from day to day.
> 
> --Tim


FYI I’m doing my research, I’ve been doing it since the beginning, I write the numbers down EVERY day https://coronavirus.ohio.gov/wps/portal/gov/covid-19/home


----------



## Wow

Burkcarp1 said:


> I presume you never bothered to read this:
> 
> *Georgia’s corona-virus data made reopening look safe. The numbers were a lie *
> https://www.amestrib.com/opinion/20...e-reopening-look-safe-but-he-numbers-were-lie
> 
> --Tim. Look where it came from


Is this better for you?
https://www.ajc.com/news/state--reg...-virus-test-count-000/2RG89mkuryApRMdQzblMgP/

"Some such as a death toll miscount could have been the result of typos. Others have repeatedly mislead Georgians to think new confirmed cases of the virus were dropping dramatically when they had plateaued."

It came from Georgia. --Tim


----------



## multi species angler

I have heard it said that hydroxychloroquine taken as a preventive drug doesn't work. But I also heard that people taking hydroxychloroquine as a maintenance drug for lupus aren't getting the virus. Any thoughts?


----------



## Patricio

multi species angler said:


> I have heard it said that hydrochloride taken as a preventive drug doesn't work. But I also heard that people taking hydroxychloroquine as a maintenance drug for lupus aren't getting the virus. Any thoughts?


youre being misled. when they say hydro doesnt work, theyre implying using hydro alone and usually leave out the part that it needs to be combined with zinc.


----------



## jdl447

hydrochloride , what? :^^^


----------



## Patricio

jdl447 said:


> hydrochloride , what? :^^^


hydroxychloroquine.


----------



## 9Left

Patricio said:


> hydroxychloroquine.


Plaquenil


----------



## 9Left




----------



## multi species angler

jdl447 said:


> hydrochloride , what? :^^^


 My mistake, I copied and pasted and didn't pay close enough attention to the spelling before posting.


----------



## Meerkat

Burkcarp1 said:


> FYI I’m doing my research, I’ve been doing it since the beginning, I write the numbers down EVERY day https://coronavirus.ohio.gov/wps/portal/gov/covid-19/home


Agree with do your own research! 

We have all these people supposedly dying of Corona Virus but the total number of deaths from all causes in the first 16 weeks of 2020 is actually lower than 4 of the past 7 years (CDC data). So I don't get it. All other things being equal, shouldn't the total number of deaths be higher in 2020 due to the Corona Virus pandemic? 

Or could somebody be playing games with Corona Virus death definitions so make us believe the Corona Virus threat is worse than it is? 

As KaGee said: "Figures don't lie... but liars can figure."


----------



## Shad Rap

Either they are trying to make it look worse than what it is, or it's nothing at all...or both.


----------



## Shad Rap

Wow said:


> Is this better for you?
> https://www.ajc.com/news/state--reg...-virus-test-count-000/2RG89mkuryApRMdQzblMgP/
> 
> "Some such as a death toll miscount could have been the result of typos. Others have repeatedly mislead Georgians to think new confirmed cases of the virus were dropping dramatically when they had plateaued."
> 
> It came from Georgia. --Tim


That also means the cases didn't rise...they leveled out...or 'flattened'.


----------



## AmericanEagle

Meerkat said:


> Agree with do your own research!
> 
> We have all these people supposedly dying of Corona Virus but the total number of deaths from all causes in the first 16 weeks of 2020 is actually lower than 4 of the past 7 years (CDC data). So I don't get it. All other things being equal, shouldn't the total number of deaths be higher in 2020 due to the Corona Virus pandemic?
> 
> Or could somebody be playing games with Corona Virus death definitions so make us believe the Corona Virus threat is worse than it is?
> 
> As KaGee said: "Figures don't lie... but liars can figure."


I would be very interested in seeing what CDC data you are referring to regarding excess deaths.

The data I see on their web page estimates between 84,891 – 113,139 excess deaths from February 1, 2020. You can see it by looking at dashboard 4 on their web page.

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid19/excess_deaths.htm


----------



## Meerkat

That is because they are playing games with definitions of Corona Virus deaths. Deaths in other years that would have been heart attack, stroke, cancer, etc are now being defined as Corona. These other causes of deaths (heart attack, etc.) are way down. 

The CDC definition of Corona virus death allows counting of deaths from Corona, with Corona, or suspected of being Corona related. If you don't believe me, look it up. Dr. Birx: Unlike Some Countries, "If Someone Dies With COVID-19 We Are Counting That As A COVID-19 Death"

Here is the CDC total death data:


----------



## cement569

fox 8 news cleveland this morning reports....70 per cent of deaths reported come from nurseing homes and long term health facilities, there is something strange going on with this virus that we might never know. its kinda strange it happens in an election year....hmm


----------



## Meerkat

cement569 said:


> fox 8 news cleveland this morning reports....70 per cent of deaths reported come from nurseing homes and long term health facilities, there is something strange going on with this virus that we might never know. its kinda strange it happens in an election year....hmm


For the most part people going to a nursing home or long term health facility do so when they are nearing the end of their life and according to a study by the University of California San Francisco: "Fifty-three percent of nursing home residents in the study died within six months." So it does not surprise me that 70% of deaths reported come from nursing homes and long term health facilities. With or without Corona virus you would probably have 70% of deaths reported coming from nursing homes and long term health facilities. And before you accuse me of not caring about the elderly, I am 72 years old.


----------



## Specwar

Meerkat, you nailed it!!!


----------



## SConner

Meerkat said:


> Agree with do your own research!
> 
> We have all these people supposedly dying of Corona Virus but the total number of deaths from all causes in the first 16 weeks of 2020 is actually lower than 4 of the past 7 years (CDC data). So I don't get it. All other things being equal, shouldn't the total number of deaths be higher in 2020 due to the Corona Virus pandemic?
> 
> Or could somebody be playing games with Corona Virus death definitions so make us believe the Corona Virus threat is worse than it is?


COVID deaths thru March were relatively small so the first 16 weeks seems like an inaccurate comparison to prior years. Also deaths from car accidents are down due to the reduction in people driving. While the total automobiles deaths are down, the deaths per miles driven are up. Lot’s of people driving too fast on empty highways. Everyone be safe!


----------



## joel_fishes

Sending the sick back to nursing homes or long term health facilities probably didn't help the situation.

https://apnews.com/5ebc0ad45b73a899...gwi8699ayT__KYxds2iuSIEWGWBdSf7FFB0jpxPV9JpEo


----------



## Shad Rap

joel_fishes said:


> Sending the sick back to nursing homes or long term health facilities probably didn't help the situation.
> 
> https://apnews.com/5ebc0ad45b73a899...gwi8699ayT__KYxds2iuSIEWGWBdSf7FFB0jpxPV9JpEo


Florida did it absolutely right...New York did it absolutely wrong.


----------



## Shad Rap

cement569 said:


> fox 8 news cleveland this morning reports....70 per cent of deaths reported come from nurseing homes and long term health facilities, there is something strange going on with this virus that we might never know. its kinda strange it happens in an election year....hmm


Nothing strange going on...it hammers the most vulnerable...and then once it's in a nursing home it absolutely wreaks havoc...I know firsthand.
Now what's strange is we knew this right off the bat with the nursing home in Washington State that got shell shocked by it back in early March or whenever it was....


----------



## joel_fishes

Shad Rap said:


> Florida did it absolutely right...New York did it absolutely wrong.


https://www.detroitnews.com/story/n...ng-homes-care-facilities-pandemic/5234163002/

Looks like Michigan was doing the same. This story from today is that they are adjusting to the policy to send them to only homes capable of isolating the patient (insert your own follow-up comment).


----------



## Shad Rap

joel_fishes said:


> https://www.detroitnews.com/story/n...ng-homes-care-facilities-pandemic/5234163002/
> 
> Looks like Michigan was doing the same. This story from today is that they are adjusting to the policy to send them to only homes capable of isolating the patient (insert your own follow-up comment).


Yep...that's the way it is now...nursing homes don't even want covid in their buildings...and I don't blame them one bit.


----------



## Meerkat

joel_fishes said:


> Sending the sick back to nursing homes or long term health facilities probably didn't help the situation.
> Yeah! No doubt!
> 
> https://apnews.com/5ebc0ad45b73a899...gwi8699ayT__KYxds2iuSIEWGWBdSf7FFB0jpxPV9JpEo


----------



## Meerkat

Yeah! No doubt!


----------



## Hatchetman

Well, here we go again. I'm to the point where I don't believe a word that comes out of Dr. Fauci's mouth. Said China was transparent...no they weren't, said no need to wear masks in public, now says yes we do, said we have to have a lock down till this thing ends...Thursday on MSNBC said lock downs can do much harm to people, said don't touch your face mask(the one you must or must not wear) and then stands behind the President, touches the outside of his mask then sticks his finger under the mask to scratch his nose !! So much for listening to science....


----------



## bad luck

Fauci and Birx will BOTH, Be drawing a paycheck from someone other than the United States government the day after the election (hopefully and deservedly so).....

i’m sure Birx will just go to work with her daughter, over at Bill Gates‘s company.......


----------



## Meerkat

bad luck said:


> Fauci and Birx will BOTH, Be drawing a paycheck from someone other than the United States government the day after the election (hopefully and deservedly so).....
> 
> i’m sure Birx will just go to work with her daughter, over at Bill Gates‘s company.......


And Fauci will go back to his Wuhan lab that was funded with our tax dollars! Don’t believe me? Look it up!


----------



## cincinnati

Just in case the fear is subsiding.... 
https://abc7ny.com/ravenous-rats-cdc-warns-of-aggressive-coronavirus-in-new-york-ny-cases/6209973/


----------



## buckeyebowman

cincinnati said:


> Just in case the fear is subsiding....
> https://abc7ny.com/ravenous-rats-cdc-warns-of-aggressive-coronavirus-in-new-york-ny-cases/6209973/


I think everyone would be well served to go back and read Michael Crichton's novel _State of Fear_. The main subplot is how governments employ fear to keep their people in line!


----------



## twistedcatfish1971

Wash hands...simple enough.

Maybe step back and think about whatever you think is right/wrong...all the bitchin/moaning about what's right or wrong...I got this freedom and nobody gonna tell me how to live/Express my life...

...head time. 

TIME...it changes and never stops...adjust and use head to adapt. 

...I have not posted on this coronavirus post much...but have followed it. Most is garbage of the back n forth know it alls.

...how about adaptation and leading by example...not calling anyone out...just saying.

Don.


----------



## BFG

AstraZeneca claiming to have the vaccine, piggy backing (or maybe just paying for) the work started at Oxford University sometime back. Company is so much invested that they are in full blown production of the vaccine while their 30,000 patient study proceeds very soon. USA is first in line to get 100 million doses on a timeline of September/October if it works. Attempt at a 10,000 patient study in the UK likely won't get to 10,000 patients because well....they don't have enough patients. 

Company claims to be able to produce more than a billion doses by the end of the 2021. If they have the magic nugget here...and even if half of America gets it, things could potentially get back to normal by early 2022 (socially and financially). Hopefully not for China....

DeWine says in presser yesterday that 63% of Ohio COVID deaths are from nursing homes. Read an article that claims that number is low, and may be as high as 79%. Average age of the deceased from COVID is greater than the average life span for Americans. Article also talked of "if you isolate the cases from prisons and nursing homes, roughly about 350 Ohioans have died from COVID." 

Interesting....


----------



## Rooster

Have not been keeping-up with this thread, but he is some interesting info:

https://www.wmfd.com/article/governor-dewine-suppresses-data-disproving-covid-19-policies/3899


----------



## bulafisherman

Seems like all the know it all's and people that were trembling with fear and isolating their homes must have gone underground in there bunkers or passed away because they aren't posting anymore. Or......just maybe they can see by now they have been played.


----------



## buckeyebowman

Rooster said:


> Have not been keeping-up with this thread, but he is some interesting info:
> 
> https://www.wmfd.com/article/governor-dewine-suppresses-data-disproving-covid-19-policies/3899


Wow! Now that is an article! Read about half of it. Will return to it tomorrow and finish it.


----------



## saugmon

Anyone hear about the boating accident at Indian Lake last weekend (memorial day weekend). A boat sank because the bilge pump went dead.They displayed their distress flag and a pontoon came up on them. People on the pontoon yelled at the sinking boat that none of them had a covid mask on.Meanwhile,nobody in the pontoon had a mask on.They made fun of the people nearly drowning and sped off.Luckily,another small boat showed up to save them.This is the day and age we're living in folks!!I thought I'd slip it into this thread instead of starting a new one. Tight Lines!!


----------



## Snakecharmer

saugmon said:


> Anyone hear about the boating accident at Indian Lake last weekend (memorial day weekend). A boat sank because the bilge pump went dead.They displayed their distress flag and a pontoon came up on them. People on the pontoon yelled at the sinking boat that none of them had a covid mask on.Meanwhile,nobody in the pontoon had a mask on.They made fun of the people nearly drowning and sped off.Luckily,another small boat showed up to save them.This is the day and age we're living in folks!!I thought I'd slip it into this thread instead of starting a new one. Tight Lines!!


Didn't hear about it. Way too many people only care about themselves.


----------



## bad luck

Rooster said:


> Have not been keeping-up with this thread, but he is some interesting info:
> 
> https://www.wmfd.com/article/governor-dewine-suppresses-data-disproving-covid-19-policies/3899


Thank you for finding this article!


only because it was ran in a small market, is it not getting more run, and more importantly, was actually even allowed to run on the news.


I have not yet seen an article that peels the onion back quite as good as this 



not only confirms what scam has been put on everybody, but also shows how those in power (regardless of political party) will grab as much power as they can when given the opportunity.

I called this out as a bait and switch a couple of weeks ago, and many of the “doomsdayers”jumped all over me for it.

apologies are accepted from all my OGF brethren’s.

we still haven’t seen these massive outbreaks from the Lowe’s and Home Depot‘s and Georgia’s and Florida’s of the world that many people appeared to be hoping for, and now we see, will never come


----------



## cement569

and this morning, dr. fauci says.....it appears we have avoided the second wave. in other words we have been played like a fiddle


----------



## All Thumbs

saugmon said:


> Anyone hear about the boating accident at Indian Lake last weekend (memorial day weekend). A boat sank because the bilge pump went dead.


didn't see that one but did see the kayak that overturned on saturday - he didn't have his vest on but was clutching it - immediately 2 nearby boats came and pulled him aboard a pontoon - then the pontoon towed the still overturned kayak slowly back to blackhawk - the fishing was on fire but they quit fishing just to help - there might still be hope


----------



## BFG

Meerkat said:


> That is because they are playing games with definitions of Corona Virus deaths. Deaths in other years that would have been heart attack, stroke, cancer, etc are now being defined as Corona. These other causes of deaths (heart attack, etc.) are way down.
> 
> The CDC definition of Corona virus death allows counting of deaths from Corona, with Corona, or suspected of being Corona related. If you don't believe me, look it up. Dr. Birx: Unlike Some Countries, "If Someone Dies With COVID-19 We Are Counting That As A COVID-19 Death"
> 
> Here is the CDC total death data:
> View attachment 358581


Hey Meerkat...did you find this or copy and paste from another place? I have been looking on the CDC website and a lot of other places and I cannot find that chart anywhere. Along with that, I have never seen a source listed other than "CDC."


----------



## multi species angler

bad luck said:


> Thank you for finding this article!
> 
> 
> only because it was ran in a small market, is it not getting more run, and more importantly, was actually even allowed to run on the news.
> 
> 
> I have not yet seen an article that peels the onion back quite as good as this
> 
> 
> 
> not only confirms what scam has been put on everybody, but also shows how those in power (regardless of political party) will grab as much power as they can when given the opportunity.
> 
> I called this out as a bait and switch a couple of weeks ago, and many of the “doomsdayers”jumped all over me for it.
> 
> apologies are accepted from all my OGF brethren’s.
> 
> we still haven’t seen these massive outbreaks from the Lowe’s and Home Depot‘s and Georgia’s and Florida’s of the world that many people appeared to be hoping for, and now we see, will never come





cement569 said:


> and this morning, dr. fauci says.....it appears we have avoided the second wave. in other words we have been played like a fiddle


 Over 100,000 dead, not enough to be a problem 
for some people.


----------



## JamesF

First thing, about the boaters and the pontoon. I believe that it's against the law to Not give aid to a boat in danger! Just about as ignorant as everything else going on these days. 
Second, I see many issues being abused by power hungry people. I'm not sure if this is going to get any better soon. Power hungry employers are definitely taking advantage of the situation, it gives them a platform for abuse, but ignorance is no excuse for breaking the law. Maybe some of this will shake out when, people start to realize how bad things are.


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

bulafisherman said:


> Seems like *all the know it all's* and people that were trembling with fear and *isolating their homes *must have gone underground in *there* bunkers or *passed away *because they aren't posting anymore. Or......just maybe they can see by now they have been played.


Well Bula, since you're trolling for a response I'll bite. This will be my last in this thread, as it went off the rails some time ago. But like a bad car wreck I keep coming back to take a look at the latest pearls of wisdom being deposited herein. I'm working on stopping. 

Before I continue, let me point out, since you remark about "all the know-it-alls", to me indicating you feel you yourself are quite intelligent, "_there_ bunkers" should be THEIR bunkers, that indicates an adjective relating to them as possessors. There is an adverb, like stand over there in your bunker. Isolating their homes? That should probably be isolating IN their homes? But I digress.

I take the lack of thread replies as of late, that the adults have pretty much left the room. As the old adage says "the lunatics are running the asylum", the asylum being this thread. Nothing anyone posts is going to change your mind, so why bother. Most now, with your post as an example, are just looking for an argument.

Oh, and the conspiracy theorists, don't forget them. Seriously, for those of you only partially eluding to conspiracies by your postings, embrace your belief, don't just put a small portion of it on your post so that nobody really know what the hell you are referring to. Examples like "Dr. Birx going to work with her daughter over at Bill Gates company", or "Fauci in his Wuhan lab". What? No, I don't need to look it up, just post exactly what you're referring to.

Much like me I wager a large portion of previous posters stop by to see the latest postings for a chuckle or a "wow". One of my faves is the poster that doesn't believe the virus information but DOES believe in Bigfoot. That is classic right there. 

It's unfortunate you seem to lack any empathy for your fellow man. Your snip of "or passed away" is just golden, people losing their lives is nothing to joke about. There are members here with friends or family that have in fact lost their lives to this disease. Try to have some respect.

I'm a healthy 58yr old. I live in Mansfield, thankfully there hasn't been much here regarding the virus, and other than being extremely vigilant about keeping my hands clean and not touching eyes nose or mouth, I'm not overly cautious. If I lived in a larger city, I would be much more concerned and careful. However, as to your remark of "trembling in fear" I don't begrudge ANYONE taking extra measures to protect themselves or loved ones. Perhaps THEY have serious underlying conditions, or a loved one fighting cancer or some other serious disease. You're GD right some are trembling in fear because were they to contract this there is a very high likelihood it would kill them. 

Over 100,000 deaths is being played? For those of you espousing numbers being exaggerated, lets's reduce that by 25%, is 75,000 acceptable? How about 50%, is 50,000?

I commend our Governor for his handling of this, I'm proud to see him touted on many different news organizations. Perhaps some things were too much, however it's better than not enough. This is coming from someone who was never a Dewine fan. I am now.

An old timer told me once "there are people that have to make tough decisions and do things, and then there are the people that, after having never had to make those tough decisions themselves, criticize those people and their decisions". An important thing for all you Monday morning quarterbacks and keyboard cowboys to remember is this is America. There is absolutely nothing stopping YOU from running for elected office. Please do, so you can then save us from ever being "played" or duped again. Don't waste your time and talent posting here on this thread, most of us obviously are just not smart enough to get it, get out there and start knocking on doors asking for votes. BULA 2020!!

I've tried not to be derogatory, I hope this post doesn't get deleted.

Stars OUT, for good! (at least I hope so......don't click on the Corona thread don't click on the Corona thread)


----------



## bulafisherman

Stars-n-Stripers said:


> I've tried not to be derogatory,


 all good, I needed some humor today and you provided


----------



## Snakecharmer

Stars-n-Stripers said:


> Well Bula, since you're trolling for a response I'll bite. This will be my last in this thread, as it went off the rails some time ago. But like a bad car wreck I keep coming back to take a look at the latest pearls of wisdom being deposited herein. I'm working on stopping.
> 
> Before I continue, let me point out, since you remark about "all the know-it-alls", to me indicating you feel you yourself are quite intelligent, "_there_ bunkers" should be THEIR bunkers, that indicates an adjective relating to them as possessors. There is an adverb, like stand over there in your bunker. Isolating their homes? That should probably be isolating IN their homes? But I digress.
> 
> I take the lack of thread replies as of late, that the adults have pretty much left the room. As the old adage says "the lunatics are running the asylum", the asylum being this thread. Nothing anyone posts is going to change your mind, so why bother. Most now, with your post as an example, are just looking for an argument.
> 
> Oh, and the conspiracy theorists, don't forget them. Seriously, for those of you only partially eluding to conspiracies by your postings, embrace your belief, don't just put a small portion of it on your post so that nobody really know what the hell you are referring to. Examples like "Dr. Birx going to work with her daughter over at Bill Gates company", or "Fauci in his Wuhan lab". What? No, I don't need to look it up, just post exactly what you're referring to.
> 
> Much like me I wager a large portion of previous posters stop by to see the latest postings for a chuckle or a "wow". One of my faves is the poster that doesn't believe the virus information but DOES believe in Bigfoot. That is classic right there.
> 
> It's unfortunate you seem to lack any empathy for your fellow man. Your snip of "or passed away" is just golden, people losing their lives is nothing to joke about. There are members here with friends or family that have in fact lost their lives to this disease. Try to have some respect.
> 
> I'm a healthy 58yr old. I live in Mansfield, thankfully there hasn't been much here regarding the virus, and other than being extremely vigilant about keeping my hands clean and not touching eyes nose or mouth, I'm not overly cautious. If I lived in a larger city, I would be much more concerned and careful. However, as to your remark of "trembling in fear" I don't begrudge ANYONE taking extra measures to protect themselves or loved ones. Perhaps THEY have serious underlying conditions, or a loved one fighting cancer or some other serious disease. You're GD right some are trembling in fear because were they to contract this there is a very high likelihood it would kill them.
> 
> Over 100,000 deaths is being played? For those of you espousing numbers being exaggerated, lets's reduce that by 25%, is 75,000 acceptable? How about 50%, is 50,000?
> 
> I commend our Governor for his handling of this, I'm proud to see him touted on many different news organizations. Perhaps some things were too much, however it's better than not enough. This is coming from someone who was never a Dewine fan. I am now.
> 
> An old timer told me once "there are people that have to make tough decisions and do things, and then there are the people that, after having never had to make those tough decisions themselves, criticize those people and their decisions". An important thing for all you Monday morning quarterbacks and keyboard cowboys to remember is this is America. There is absolutely nothing stopping YOU from running for elected office. Please do, so you can then save us from ever being "played" or duped again. Don't waste your time and talent posting here on this thread, most of us obviously are just not smart enough to get it, get out there and start knocking on doors asking for votes. BULA 2020!!
> 
> I've tried not to be derogatory, I hope this post doesn't get deleted.
> 
> Stars OUT, for good! (at least I hope so......don't click on the Corona thread don't click on the Corona thread)


Touche'


----------



## Saugeyefisher

I better start using spell/grammar check.....


----------



## MagicMarker

I said at the very beginning and I’ll say it again. This whole thing has been overplayed and been a total farce


----------



## Specwar

60,000 + flu deaths so far in USA in 2020. HMMMMMMM!!!


----------



## JamesF

I take this Coronavirus, very seriously. I happen to be in the position of, I won't survive, should I come down with it. My brother had it,and it cost him dearly... his job, his physical wellbeing,and his mental health. The effects of this virus, began in December, and still he is feeling poorly.


----------



## acklac7

Specwar said:


> 60,000 + flu deaths so far in USA in 2020. HMMMMMMM!!!




From the CDC (over _6-months_):


----------



## acklac7

MagicMarker said:


> I said at the very beginning and I’ll say it again. This whole thing has been overplayed and been a total farce


How is a virus that killed 100,000+ in less than 3 months somehow a farce?

Overplayed? Possibly. We had no other choice...


----------



## Snakecharmer

Flu usually in done by May. This virus is still going strong. Waiting for USA deaths to drop to a 100 /day instead of 1,000 a day.


----------



## jbo

JamesF said:


> I take this Coronavirus, very seriously. I happen to be in the position of, I won't survive, should I come down with it. My brother had it,and it cost him dearly... his job, his physical wellbeing,and his mental health. The effects of this virus, began in December, and still he is feeling poorly.[/QUOTE I doubt you would laugh at them and drive off. They could have stayed close by to offer life jackets or what not. Could off called 911 and put your distress flag out so they could be found quicker. Last thing to do is don’t drive off.


----------



## Shad Rap

acklac7 said:


> How is a virus that killed 100,000+ in less than 3 months somehow a farce?
> 
> Overplayed? Possibly. We had no other choice...


It's a farce the way it was handled...not because how many people have died from it...probably 65,000-70,000 of those deaths are from nursing homes...a whole lot of people are dying 'with' covid, not because of it...and no I'm not discrediting lives lost I'm just stating facts...hell, a good many folks were never even tested for it and they are included in that total, per doctors recommendation...


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## Saugeye Tom

It's all slowly going away


----------



## SConner

Shad Rap said:


> It's a farce the way it was handled...not because how many people have died from it...probably 65,000-70,000 of those deaths are from nursing homes...a whole lot of people are dying 'with' covid, not because of it...and no I'm not discrediting lives lost I'm just stating facts...hell, a good many folks were never even tested for it and they included in that total per doctors recommendation...


So people with health condition have no value and should not be part of the death count? +100,000 and counting... when is this no longer a joke to the flat earthers?


----------



## Meerkat

Meerkat said:


> Agree with do your own research!
> 
> We have all these people supposedly dying of Corona Virus but the total number of deaths from all causes in the first 16 weeks of 2020 is actually lower than 4 of the past 7 years (CDC data). So I don't get it. All other things being equal, shouldn't the total number of deaths be higher in 2020 due to the Corona Virus pandemic?
> 
> Or could somebody be playing games with Corona Virus death definitions so make us believe the Corona Virus threat is worse than it is?
> 
> As KaGee said: "Figures don't lie... but liars can figure."


I rest my case...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## MagicMarker

I’d lay dollars to doughnuts that if all deaths this year including covid was compared to the average deaths of other years total deaths there wouldn’t be much difference. Most deaths this year was blamed on covid instead of what really killed them


----------



## JamesF

Saugeye Tom said:


> It's all slowly going away


Not fast enough for me!


----------



## SConner

MagicMarker said:


> I’d lay dollars to doughnuts that if all deaths this year including covid was compared to the average deaths of other years total deaths there wouldn’t be much difference. Most deaths this year was blamed on covid instead of what really killed them


Please site source to back this claim.


----------



## Burkcarp1




----------



## SConner

Burkcarp1 said:


> View attachment 359761


100,000 dead, don’t care what the rate is


----------



## Burkcarp1

SConner said:


> 100,000 dead, don’t care what the rate is


Correct, the only problem with that is the 100,000 wasn’t because of Covid. Did you notice that the heart attack deathS have dropped dramatically? Stokes? Among other stuff. Covid is very real, the death rate Just isn’t as bad as they make it out to be.


----------



## multi species angler

acklac7 said:


> Overplayed? Possibly. We had no other choice...


 Actually it was under played. Thousands of deaths could have been prevented if mitigation had of started earlier.


----------



## SConner

100% of doctors I have heard say we are under reporting COVID deaths... and every flat earther with a GED say infowars tells them otherwise. I have no clue who to believe. Please help.


----------



## Burkcarp1

multi species angler said:


> Actually it was under played. Thousands of deaths could have been prevented if mitigation had of started earlier.


A lot of deaths could have been prevented if some governors wouldn’t have put Covid patients in nursing homes also.


----------



## cement569

sconner....source?


----------



## multi species angler

Burkcarp1 said:


> Did you notice that the heart attack deathS have dropped dramatically? Stokes?


 That's because the virus is killing them first. How many people died in rest homes the 3 months prior to this virus?


----------



## cincinnati

https://www.forbes.com/sites/theapo...the-u-s-population-43-of-u-s-covid-19-deaths/


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## Workingman

Death will not be prevented, only delayed
We're mortals!!!!


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## SConner

cement569 said:


> sconner....source?


 I started off with Fox News since I thought you may have heard of them. The rest are a collection of established news and medical journals. Please read them all and let me know. Still have not heard from last person I asked for source on a couple post ago. I guess when spreading conspiracy theories only the people who don’t buy into them are required to respond with actual facts.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.foxnews.com/health/nyc-coronavirus-deaths-underreported-cdc.amp

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna1201441
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.inquirer.com/health/coronavirus/pennsylvania-new-jersey-virus-death-undercount-statistics-20200526.html?outputType=amp
https://theappeal.org/covid-19-infe...time-for-state-health-departments-to-step-up/
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna1201441
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/04/21/world/coronavirus-missing-deaths.html
https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsa...y-higher-other-covid-stats-need-adjusting-too
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna1201441
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.miamiherald.com/news/coronavirus/article242654596.html
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna1201441
https://www.pharmaceutical-technology.com/comment/excess-deaths-pandemic-covid-19-fatalities/
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna1201441
https://www.google.com/amp/s/abcnew...eath-count-experts-off-tens/story?id=70385359
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna1201441
https://www.advisory.com/daily-briefing/2020/04/20/covid-count
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna1201441
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.fo...-of-covid-19-deaths-in-the-us-and-europe/amp/
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna1201441
https://247wallst.com/special-report/2020/05/27/how-covid-19-is-being-underreported-in-most-states/
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna1201441
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.foxnews.com/health/coronavirus-related-deaths-in-washington-state-likely-being-underreported-officials-say.amp10

+100,000 dead and you all think it is a joke, sad.


----------



## Meerkat

SConner said:


> Please site source to back this claim.


CDC data - I quoted it previously: Total deaths from all causes in first 16 weeks of 2020 are lower than total deaths for the same period in 4 of the last 7 years! QED!


----------



## jdl447

And experts say.......


----------



## SConner

Meerkat said:


> CDC data - I quoted it previously: Total deaths from all causes in first 16 weeks of 2020 are lower than total deaths for the same period in 4 of the last 7 years! QED!


And I have already responded to either you or someone else saying same thing. Feel free to go find it and dispute my statements in that post. Remember, facts and opinions are not the same. If stating as a fact we should cite source for our information.


----------



## Shad Rap

SConner said:


> I started off with Fox News since I thought you may have heard of them. The rest are a collection of established news and medical journals. Please read them all and let me know. Still have not heard from last person I asked for source on a couple post ago. I guess when spreading conspiracy theories only the people who don’t buy into them are required to respond with actual facts.
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.foxnews.com/health/nyc-coronavirus-deaths-underreported-cdc.amp
> 
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna1201441
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.inquirer.com/health/coronavirus/pennsylvania-new-jersey-virus-death-undercount-statistics-20200526.html?outputType=amp
> https://theappeal.org/covid-19-infe...time-for-state-health-departments-to-step-up/
> https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/04/21/world/coronavirus-missing-deaths.html
> https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsa...y-higher-other-covid-stats-need-adjusting-too
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.miamiherald.com/news/coronavirus/article242654596.html
> https://www.pharmaceutical-technology.com/comment/excess-deaths-pandemic-covid-19-fatalities/
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/abcnews.go.com/amp/Health/accurate-us-coronavirus-death-count-experts-off-tens/story?id=70385359
> https://www.advisory.com/daily-briefing/2020/04/20/covid-count
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.fo...-of-covid-19-deaths-in-the-us-and-europe/amp/
> https://247wallst.com/special-report/2020/05/27/how-covid-19-is-being-underreported-in-most-states/
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.foxnews.com/health/coronavirus-related-deaths-in-washington-state-likely-being-underreported-officials-say.amp10
> 
> +100,000 dead and you all think it is a joke, sad.


I don't think anyone said it's a joke...the virus is real...why do you consider the majority of peoples opinions here a joke?..or do you want a source for that too?..just scroll up.


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## cincinnati

https://ohiostatehousenews.com/2020/05/governor-dewine-suppresses-data-disproving-covid-19-policies/


----------



## cincinnati

Workingman said:


> Death will not be prevented, only delayed
> We're mortals!!!!


I've been dying for many years. It's just taking Mother Nature a while to finish the job.


----------



## Burkcarp1

SConner said:


> And I have already responded to either you or someone else saying same thing. Feel free to go find it and dispute my statements in that post. Remember, facts and opinions are not the same. If stating as a fact we should cite source for our information.


Some stuff that was supposedly facts earlier, aren’t facts anymore...hmmm


----------



## SConner

Burkcarp1 said:


> Some stuff that was supposedly facts earlier, aren’t facts anymore...hmmm


And some are. The medical profession is learning each day as data comes in and are doing their best to keep up and try to recommend the best recommendation at the time they have the data. Because more data means refinement of these recommendations does not invalidate their intent from the start. Politicians and extreme web sites (left and right) always have an agenda unrelated to your health and well-being. Listen to the people who have spent their lives trying to deal with these issues, they are closer to truth than a politician or extreme website will ever be. It is real, many more will die. The final count depends on each of us to open economy responsibly and follow advice of leaders in the medical field, not a politician, not a journalist and not me. Read multiple sources and open your mind to the possibility that thousands of kids in a Petri dish in ozarks this weekend was probably a bad idea based on what we know today. Be safe, stay apart. I wish everyone a safe and happy 2020.


----------



## Buster24

When your time is up, it is up....I have always felt that we have no control over when we will pass on....only God can control this....why live in fear when it is out of your control!!!!


----------



## SConner

Shad Rap said:


> I don't think anyone said it's a joke...the virus is real...why do you consider the majority of peoples opinions here a joke?..or do you want a source for that too?..just scroll up.


They have absolutely said loud and clear it is a joke. Go back to post starting at precisely 6:48 yesterday thru today at 3:40 and dispute what I have said. Many on this site think it is a joke and have made every effort to troll and demean anyone who disagrees. Meanwhile I try to educate while some offer “bet my bottom dollar” as their source. Please feel free to dispute my sources, with other data... at least this would be an honest debate on facts. My father used to say “ don’t argue with an idiot, they will drag you down to their level and have way more experience being an idiot”. I am done with this thread, I have come to realize you can’t enlighten those who refuse to see. Be safe, do your best to stay apart in public spaces and understand the mask you wear is for your mom/grandma, not for you.


----------



## bulafisherman

Some of you need to get the stick out of your azz.....lighten up a little. So self righteous, don't be so hard on yourselves.Humor goes a long way in alleviating stress, try it sometime.


----------



## M R DUCKS

Bula...
....Humor goes a long way.....
Cite sort please!


----------



## M R DUCKS

Had to do it


----------



## Meerkat

SConner said:


> And I have already responded to either you or someone else saying same thing. Feel free to go find it and dispute my statements in that post. Remember, facts and opinions are not the same. If stating as a fact we should cite source for our information.


Source is quoted. It is the CDC whose data says *total* deaths from all causes in the first 16 weeks of 2020 are actually lower than 4 of previous 7 years. You want to dispute that statistic, you look it up. I already did. That is what the CDC said.

But you did not dispute the total deaths, instead you have quoted a Corona death statistic of +100,000.

Now I am not disputing that reports are saying there are +100,000 Corona deaths. Rather my point is that there is a problem with definitions being used to assign deaths as Corona deaths because how can you have +100,000 additional deaths and yet the total number of deaths from all causes is actually down?

Those two statistics are in conflict unless deaths that in previous years would have been classified as heart attack, stroke, etc are now being classified as Corona deaths. 

As I pointed out in a previous post, Dr. Brix herself is on record as saying that she fears: "that the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention's data-tracking system was inflating coronavirus statistics like death rates and case numbers." https://www.businessinsider.com/deborah-birx-cdc-comments-coronavirus-task-force-meeting-2020-5

The media (Fox included) is hyping this whole thing because it sells news.


----------



## Legend killer

Meerkat said:


> Source is quoted. It is the CDC whose data says *total* deaths from all causes in the first 16 weeks of 2020 are actually lower than 4 of previous 7 years. You want to dispute that statistic, you look it up. I already did. That is what the CDC said.
> 
> But you did not dispute the total deaths, instead you have quoted a Corona death statistic of +100,000.
> 
> Now I am not disputing that reports are saying there are +100,000 Corona deaths. Rather my point is that there is a problem with definitions being used to assign deaths as Corona deaths because how can you have +100,000 additional deaths and yet the total number of deaths from all causes is actually down?
> 
> Those two statistics are in conflict unless deaths that in previous years would have been classified as heart attack, stroke, etc are now being classified as Corona deaths.
> 
> As I pointed out in a previous post, Dr. Brix herself is on record as saying that she fears: "that the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention's data-tracking system was inflating coronavirus statistics like death rates and case numbers." https://www.businessinsider.com/deborah-birx-cdc-comments-coronavirus-task-force-meeting-2020-5
> 
> The media (Fox included) is hyping this whole thing because it sells news.


You dont think Dr. Birx is feeling any pressure from her boss?


----------



## Snakecharmer

Meerkat said:


> Source is quoted. It is the CDC whose data says *total* deaths from all causes in the first 16 weeks of 2020 are actually lower than 4 of previous 7 years. You want to dispute that statistic, you look it up. I already did. That is what the CDC said.
> .


I think he wants a link to your CDC data. I would like it also. Where on CDC did you find it?


----------



## cincinnati




----------



## Meerkat

Legend killer said:


> You dont think Dr. Birx is feeling any pressure from her boss?


She worked for both Obama and Trump so I don't get your point about being pressured.


----------



## Legend killer

Meerkat said:


> She worked for both Obama and Trump so I don't get your point about being pressured.


Her boss now is out front of cameras everyday with her by his side. Never heard of her name with obama


----------



## cincinnati

Legend killer said:


> Her boss now is out front of cameras everyday with her by his side. Never heard of her name with obama


https://aslm.org/press-release/aslm...irx-as-united-states-global-aids-coordinator/


----------



## Chuck T Mechling

I agree this is not a joke, my best buddy got it very early on and dealt with symptoms for weeks. But the death toll is inflated for sure. The video above proves that.






And MSNBC was caught again, lying about how serious it is. Their faces say it all. I'm not going to live my life in fear, but also take precautions and not go party it up.


----------



## crestliner TS

SConner said:


> I started off with Fox News since I thought you may have heard of them. The rest are a collection of established news and medical journals. Please read them all and let me know. Still have not heard from last person I asked for source on a couple post ago. I guess when spreading conspiracy theories only the people who don’t buy into them are required to respond with actual facts.
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.foxnews.com/health/nyc-coronavirus-deaths-underreported-cdc.amp
> 
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna1201441
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.inquirer.com/health/coronavirus/pennsylvania-new-jersey-virus-death-undercount-statistics-20200526.html?outputType=amp
> https://theappeal.org/covid-19-infe...time-for-state-health-departments-to-step-up/
> https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/04/21/world/coronavirus-missing-deaths.html
> https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsa...y-higher-other-covid-stats-need-adjusting-too
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.miamiherald.com/news/coronavirus/article242654596.html
> All these links are from libearl sites (yes Fox is liberal since disney bought them) Maybe you didnt know that.
> https://www.pharmaceutical-technology.com/comment/excess-deaths-pandemic-covid-19-fatalities/
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/abcnews.go.com/amp/Health/accurate-us-coronavirus-death-count-experts-off-tens/story?id=70385359
> https://www.advisory.com/daily-briefing/2020/04/20/covid-count
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.fo...-of-covid-19-deaths-in-the-us-and-europe/amp/
> https://247wallst.com/special-report/2020/05/27/how-covid-19-is-being-underreported-in-most-states/
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.foxnews.com/health/coronavirus-related-deaths-in-washington-state-likely-being-underreported-officials-say.amp10
> 
> +100,000 dead and you all think it is a joke, sad.


All these links are from liberal sites (yes fox is liberal) You obviously dont knowthat but since disney bought them out they suck. Kind of discredits your post!


----------



## crestliner TS

SConner said:


> And I have already responded to either you or someone else saying same thing. Feel free to go find it and dispute my statements in that post. Remember, facts and opinions are not the same. If stating as a fact we should cite source for our information.


problem is, simply reciting liberal sites is not fact. Its propaganda.


----------



## Specwar

Do you realize who owns the major percentage of stock in Disney?
China.


----------



## acklac7

I'll just leave this here...

_OGF Members, Times have changed, and it happened overnight. Everyone is on edge, angry, frustrated and quite possibly dealing with more idle time on our hands than ever before. We get it, and are dealing with the same. However the site has gotten over the top with political posts lately, and to protect the integrity of the site this unfortunate message has to be announced. We've been more than lenient with what we've let slide, but we're now at a saturation point. *We're not a political site, never will be and have maintained that goal quite respectfully for 16 years.*..that's not going to change under the current circumstances. The amount of moderation due to the political posts is unprecedented, and quite frankly shouldn't be necessary. For most of us this is the only socialization we'll get for a while but rules are rules. If you need a refresher, here's our TOS https://www.ohiogamefishing.com/threads/ogfs-terms-of-service-tos-link.222375/ Moving forward, our tolerance for political posts has hit its max. We're not opposed to put repeat TOS violators in time-out until the dust settles, but don't want to. So please do us all a favor and respect the rules, your fellow members and everyone's struggle going through this. Keep the integrity of the site you joined and use on your radar. We'll get through it, just don't make it harder than it needs to be._


----------



## Specwar

A Shanghai business group, which of course is government managed owns *57% *of Disney.


----------



## Meerkat

Snakecharmer said:


> I think he wants a link to your CDC data. I would like it also. Where on CDC did you find it?


The source for the data is the CDC website. It is not nicely compiled. You have to compile it yourself. If you do you can create a graph like the one below. All the data is there by week, by year, by death type (influenza, heart attack, etc). 









As my stats prof used to beat into my head: "In God we trust, all others bring data!" 

This whole lockdown thing started when Prof Neil Ferguson of the Imperial College in London built a model (since discredited) that said there would be 500,000 deaths in the UK alone. Problem was nobody looked at his raw data. He was using data from Wuhan & Northern Italy, but those two places are drastically different from somewhere like Lincoln, Nebraska and his model is not transferable. 

https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/professor-lockdown-modeler-resigns-in-disgrace/

As a side-note, Ferguson was forced to resign when it came to light that he had violated the UK curfew by having his married girlfriend visit him twice. At the time of visiting him, girlfriend was living with her husband and children at a different location.


----------



## acklac7

crestliner TS said:


> All these links are from liberal sites (yes fox is liberal) You obviously dont knowthat but since disney bought them out they suck. Kind of discredits your post!





Specwar said:


> Do you realize who owns the major percentage of stock in Disney?
> 
> China.





Specwar said:


> A Shanghai business group, which of course is government managed owns *57% *of Disney.


I found that statement to be quite alarming, so I did some _research__:_ China owns a 57% stake in the _Shanghai Disney Resort_, *not* Disney INC.
_
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_Disney_Resort

The Walt Disney Company owns 43 percent of the resort; the majority 57 percent is held by Shanghai Shendi Group, a joint venture of three companies owned by the Shanghai government.[5]_


----------



## nooffseason

acklac7 said:


> I'll just leave this here...
> 
> _._


Thank you Acklac. As soon as I see someone even mention a political party, I stop reading whatever they have to say. Keep it to yourself, No One Cares! 

This country is getting more internally divisive every day. Is there no middle ground? Do we have no thoughts of ourselves? You have to pick a side and just agree with whatever that party says? No thanks! Guys, quit watching the news and go fishing!!


----------



## Saugeye Tom

acklac7 said:


> I'll just leave this here...
> 
> _OGF Members, Times have changed, and it happened overnight. Everyone is on edge, angry, frustrated and quite possibly dealing with more idle time on our hands than ever before. We get it, and are dealing with the same. However the site has gotten over the top with political posts lately, and to protect the integrity of the site this unfortunate message has to be announced. We've been more than lenient with what we've let slide, but we're now at a saturation point. *We're not a political site, never will be and have maintained that goal quite respectfully for 16 years.*..that's not going to change under the current circumstances. The amount of moderation due to the political posts is unprecedented, and quite frankly shouldn't be necessary. For most of us this is the only socialization we'll get for a while but rules are rules. If you need a refresher, here's our TOS https://www.ohiogamefishing.com/threads/ogfs-terms-of-service-tos-link.222375/ Moving forward, our tolerance for political posts has hit its max. We're not opposed to put repeat TOS violators in time-out until the dust settles, but don't want to. So please do us all a favor and respect the rules, your fellow members and everyone's struggle going through this. Keep the integrity of the site you joined and use on your radar. We'll get through it, just don't make it harder than it needs to be._


NARCO POLO


----------



## acklac7

Saugeye Tom said:


> NARCO POLO


----------



## jrose

SConner said:


> I started off with Fox News since I thought you may have heard of them. The rest are a collection of established news and medical journals. Please read them all and let me know. Still have not heard from last person I asked for source on a couple post ago. I guess when spreading conspiracy theories only the people who don’t buy into them are required to respond with actual facts.
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.foxnews.com/health/nyc-coronavirus-deaths-underreported-cdc.amp
> 
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna1201441
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.inquirer.com/health/coronavirus/pennsylvania-new-jersey-virus-death-undercount-statistics-20200526.html?outputType=amp
> https://theappeal.org/covid-19-infe...time-for-state-health-departments-to-step-up/
> https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/04/21/world/coronavirus-missing-deaths.html
> https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsa...y-higher-other-covid-stats-need-adjusting-too
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.miamiherald.com/news/coronavirus/article242654596.html
> https://www.pharmaceutical-technology.com/comment/excess-deaths-pandemic-covid-19-fatalities/
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/abcnews.go.com/amp/Health/accurate-us-coronavirus-death-count-experts-off-tens/story?id=70385359
> https://www.advisory.com/daily-briefing/2020/04/20/covid-count
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.fo...-of-covid-19-deaths-in-the-us-and-europe/amp/
> https://247wallst.com/special-report/2020/05/27/how-covid-19-is-being-underreported-in-most-states/
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.foxnews.com/health/coronavirus-related-deaths-in-washington-state-likely-being-underreported-officials-say.amp10
> 
> +100,000 dead and you all think it is a joke, sad.


I didn't see CNN.


----------



## jrose

SConner said:


> They have absolutely said loud and clear it is a joke. Go back to post starting at precisely 6:48 yesterday thru today at 3:40 and dispute what I have said. Many on this site think it is a joke and have made every effort to troll and demean anyone who disagrees. Meanwhile I try to educate while some offer “bet my bottom dollar” as their source. Please feel free to dispute my sources, with other data... at least this would be an honest debate on facts. My father used to say “ don’t argue with an idiot, they will drag you down to their level and have way more experience being an idiot”. I am done with this thread, I have come to realize you can’t enlighten those who refuse to see. Be safe, do your best to stay apart in public spaces and understand the mask you wear is for your mom/grandma, not for you.


I do agree with your dad...


----------



## Legend killer

When I meet someone out if they are not wearing a mask, I pull mine down till I pass them. They don't respect me, I don't respect them.


----------



## Burkcarp1

Legend killer said:


> When I meet someone out if they are not wearing a mask, I pull mine down till I pass them. They don't respect me, I don't respect them.


Good for you..


----------



## Snakecharmer

Specwar said:


> Do you realize who owns the major percentage of stock in Disney?
> China.


FAKE NEWS......
*The Walt Disney Company is a publicly traded corporation owned by its shareholders.* The Laurene Powell Jobs Trust, run by Steve Jobs' widow, is the largest stockholder, owning 7.27 percent of the shares.

The remaining top 10 stockholders in The Disney Company are Vanguard Group, Inc. with 4.59 percent, State Street Corp. with 4.22 percent, MFS Investment Management K.K. with 3.28 percent, BlackRock Fund Advisors with 2.98 percent, Fidelity Management and Research Company with 2.75 percent, State Farm Mutual Automobile Insurance Co. with 2.48 percent, Capital World Investors with 2.18 percent, Northern Trust Investments, N.A. with 1.52 percent and Wellington Management Company, LLP with 1.26 percent.


----------



## PapawSmith

Legend killer said:


> When I meet someone out if they are not wearing a mask, I pull mine down till I pass them. They don't respect me, I don't respect them.


The fact that 'they' have convinced folks like you to believe and act this way is truly what is most alarming about this entire "crisis". Every viral pandemic in history has come with varying increases in deaths, but this one came with so much more.


----------



## Specwar

Snakecharmer said:


> FAKE NEWS......
> *The Walt Disney Company is a publicly traded corporation owned by its shareholders.* The Laurene Powell Jobs Trust, run by Steve Jobs' widow, is the largest stockholder, owning 7.27 percent of the shares.
> 
> The remaining top 10 stockholders in The Disney Company are Vanguard Group, Inc. with 4.59 percent, State Street Corp. with 4.22 percent, MFS Investment Management K.K. with 3.28 percent, BlackRock Fund Advisors with 2.98 percent, Fidelity Management and Research Company with 2.75 percent, State Farm Mutual Automobile Insurance Co. with 2.48 percent, Capital World Investors with 2.18 percent, Northern Trust Investments, N.A. with 1.52 percent and Wellington Management Company, LLP with 1.26 percent.


You are correct. China owns 57% of the Shangi theme park. I made an error in my original search.


----------



## Meerkat

Legend killer said:


> When I meet someone out if they are not wearing a mask, I pull mine down till I pass them. They don't respect me, I don't respect them.


And the World Health Organization says unless you are sick or tending to someone who is sick you _*should not wear a mask*_. Go figure! So if the supposed experts cannot agree then I am not getting my panties in a wad over this mask issue.
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/...-still-says-you-probably-shouldnt-wear-a-mask


----------



## ICENUT

The who flips flops about as much as dr fauci he's like a fish laying on the bank 1 minute this 1 minute that and depending on what news channel he is on.


----------



## Legend killer

Meerkat said:


> And the World Health Organization says unless you are sick or tending to someone who is sick you _*should not wear a mask*_. Go figure! So if the supposed experts cannot agree then I am not getting my panties in a wad over this mask issue.
> https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/...-still-says-you-probably-shouldnt-wear-a-mask


You also have the comnon sense aspect.

Again:


----------



## cement569

heres something to ponder, every store ive been to all the cashiers and workers wear masks. but no gloves and they are taking money and giving back change and the workers are stocking shelves, so how is that being safe?


----------



## Legend killer

cement569 said:


> heres something to ponder, every store ive been to all the cashiers and workers wear masks. but no gloves and they are taking money and giving back change and the workers are stocking shelves, so how is that being safe?


They would have to change gloves after every transaction. Now they wash with alcohol. Pretty simple....


----------



## cement569

of all the stores i visit ive stood long lines and never once saw one clean thier hands, and the same goes for the stockers. if you dont believe it just go to any busy store and stand back and watch


----------



## Meerkat

Legend killer said:


> View attachment 359845
> 
> You also have the comnon sense aspect.
> 
> Again:


I am confused. I don't go around peeing on people & they don't pee on me. Maybe that is because I don't have my panties in a wad...


----------



## hailtothethief

Everyone grabs the mustard at work and the coffee pot and no one washes it. U can only be so much of a douche.


----------



## jrose

Legend killer said:


> When I meet someone out if they are not wearing a mask, I pull mine down till I pass them. They don't respect me, I don't respect them.


That would be unsafe.


----------



## Dovans

cement569 said:


> of all the stores i visit ive stood long lines and never once saw one clean thier hands, and the same goes for the stockers. if you dont believe it just go to any busy store and stand back and watch


I wash my hands on regular basis at work. Other folks carry around hand sanitizer. Have other things to do at work so I don't police my coworkers. It would be impossible to wash my hands every time I stocked an item. I got into quite a bit of trouble couple weeks ago when I told a customer if they didnt feel safe in my store go to another. Im telling you the same thing. I do whatever I can to be safe. I can not speak on behalf of the thousands of customers, or hundreds of employees in my store. Again, if you do not feel safe where your shopping, please leave the store.


----------



## cement569

oh i felt completely safe, that wasnt my point. my point was whatever you do you are not 100 percent safe and people need to realize this


----------



## slipsinker

Burkcarp1 said:


> Good for you..


x2


----------



## Dovans

cement569 said:


> oh i felt completely safe, that wasnt my point. my point was whatever you do you are not 100 percent safe and people need to realize this


My apologies for taking it wrong.


----------



## crestliner TS

Legend killer said:


> When I meet someone out if they are not wearing a mask, I pull mine down till I pass them. They don't respect me, I don't respect them.


So? Do you think I care? You dont need to be wearing it anyway.


----------



## cincinnati

Legend killer said:


> View attachment 359845
> 
> You also have the comnon sense aspect.
> 
> Again:


Seems like a terrible waste of medical school tuition....3 times, now.


----------



## Hatchetman

Legend killer said:


> Her boss now is out front of cameras everyday with her by his side. Never heard of her name with obama



You never heard of "Scum Frog" either according to your posts in the used car bitchin section and he's been here forever


----------



## Hatchetman

Legend killer said:


> When I meet someone out if they are not wearing a mask, I pull mine down till I pass them. They don't respect me, I don't respect them.



Now there is an impressive individual....not....


----------



## Legend killer

cincinnati said:


> Seems like a terrible waste of medical school tuition....3 times, now.


And I will keep it up till it sinks in....


----------



## Legend killer

Hatchetman said:


> You never heard of "Scum Frog" either according to your posts in the used car bitchin section and he's been here forever


I dont know him, haven't heard of him, but I hear he's a great guy.


----------



## buckeyebowman

multi species angler said:


> Actually it was under played. Thousands of deaths could have been prevented if mitigation had of started earlier.


You have absolutely no way of knowing that! 



SConner said:


> 100% of doctors I have heard say we are under reporting COVID deaths... and every flat earther with a GED say infowars tells them otherwise. I have no clue who to believe. Please help.


But have you heard this from 100% of all doctors? Of course not. Impossible. And why you think this is significant is beyond me. The doctors are the ones doing the reporting! Do you really expect them to point the finger at themselves? "Oh yeah, we're over reporting COVID-19 deaths like crazy!" 

The statistic that tells the tale for me is the total daily death rate for all causes in the U.S. is not very different during the pandemic when compared to the same period one year ago. Something was killing those people back then as well. 

And as far as trusting the numbers, you really have to decide which numbers to trust. The paper today reported on additional death from COVID-19 in the Mahoning Valley yesterday. The thing is, that death actually occurred on April 30! As far as COVID-19 goes, I don't think are any "real" numbers because nobody has any idea what the real numbers are!


----------



## multi species angler

buckeyebowman said:


> You have absolutely no way of knowing that!


 It's called common sense.


----------



## Brutus Bluegill

crestliner TS said:


> All these links are from liberal sites (yes fox is liberal) You obviously dont knowthat but since disney bought them out they suck. Kind of discredits your post!


Thank you for the laugh. I needed one after reading all this. 
1) Fox News is not liberal
2) Disney does NOT own Fox News

https://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ct-biz-disney-fox-deal-details-20190320-story.html


----------



## Legend killer

crestliner TS said:


> All these links are from liberal sites (yes fox is liberal) You obviously dont knowthat but since disney bought them out they suck. Kind of discredits your post!


You can't make this crap up


----------



## yonderfishin

multi species angler said:


> Actually it was under played. Thousands of deaths could have been prevented if mitigation had of started earlier.


I dont know how mitigation could have started earlier , mitigation policies started coming into existence in like late Jan.- Feb. and nobody knew what was really going on at the time. The WHO was still saying there was no problem. It wasnt until a hotspot started showing up in the US that it was realized something had made its way here and needed attention.


----------



## ICENUT

It wouldn't matter anyway midigation is only going to delay the final result. it keeps the health care systems from being overwelmed but sooner or later its lifted like now and quess what it spreading again.Places like china and south korea locked down reall hard but now it's back.Only a vaccine and immunity will stop it.That will take many months or even longer so lets stop kidding ourselves its not going away any time soon midigation,masks whatever till science comes up with that vaccine and then have enough of it and then convince the 50% who claim they wont take it!!!


----------



## roundbadge

It was stated, in Ohio, that this virus started circulating at least early January, which means 2 and 1/2 months before the mid-March "lockdown"

It has been stated that asymptomatic positive infections approximate 35-55% of all infections, they go unnoticed unless a random test program was used

The Ohio jail numbers, 2100 positives, 2000 asymptomatic reported a month ago show what a confined hotspot produces, but 95% with no symptoms in this "controlled setting" easily corroborates the US average noted above.

Until 100% Serology is performed, you will never know the denominator required to perform accurate calculations on spread and severity

You would think a leader would find a way, hook or crook, to get every citizen a Serology test of the most reliable type and seek that denominator, or a better version of it.


----------



## Burkcarp1

https://newsradiowrva.radio.com/blogs/jeff-katz/fauci-now-says-second-covid-19-wave-may-not-happen


----------



## hailtothethief

There’s no vaccine so there will be runs of high cases and low cases indefinately.


----------



## Meerkat

roundbadge said:


> It was stated, in Ohio, that this virus started circulating at least early January, which means 2 and 1/2 months before the mid-March "lockdown"
> 
> It has been stated that asymptomatic positive infections approximate 35-55% of all infections, they go unnoticed unless a random test program was used
> 
> The Ohio jail numbers, 2100 positives, 2000 asymptomatic reported a month ago show what a confined hotspot produces, but 95% with no symptoms in this "controlled setting" easily corroborates the US average noted above.
> 
> Until 100% Serology is performed, you will never know the denominator required to perform accurate calculations on spread and severity
> 
> You would think a leader would find a way, hook or crook, to get every citizen a Serology test of the most reliable type and seek that denominator, or a better version of it.


Well I for one would refuse your serology test and I certainly don’t want my leader wasting my tax dollars on such a test.


----------



## roundbadge

Meerkat said:


> Well I for one would refuse your serology test and I certainly don’t want my leader wasting my tax dollars on such a test.


why deny accuracy?


----------



## buckeyebowman

roundbadge said:


> why deny accuracy?


----------



## yonderfishin

roundbadge said:


> It was stated, in Ohio, that this virus started circulating at least early January, which means 2 and 1/2 months before the mid-March "lockdown"
> 
> It has been stated that asymptomatic positive infections approximate 35-55% of all infections, they go unnoticed unless a random test program was used
> 
> The Ohio jail numbers, 2100 positives, 2000 asymptomatic reported a month ago show what a confined hotspot produces, but 95% with no symptoms in this "controlled setting" easily corroborates the US average noted above.
> 
> Until 100% Serology is performed, you will never know the denominator required to perform accurate calculations on spread and severity
> 
> You would think a leader would find a way, hook or crook, to get every citizen a Serology test of the most reliable type and seek that denominator, or a better version of it.



Of course you know many for one reason or another, many wont comply right ?.....and cant legally be forced to...... they would never get 100%. Be very lucky to get 75%. Very likely that this has not been made a priority because it would ultimately be a waste of time and resources and wind up being still an incomplete study. The powers that be , obviously feel the cost and effort is better spent on developing immunization or treatments. I think thats the most realistic and beneficial path myself.


----------



## roundbadge

Inaccurate data alters a strategy 

For example, what if RELIABLE Serology concluded 50% of Ohio was already exposed as studies are leaning toward asymptomatics far outnumbering positives with any symptoms from mild to severe

That would give you a hypothetical denominator of 6mm in Ohio alone

Now, choose your numerators, such as hospitalizations, ICU's and sadly the demise of some

Those rates become much less, and decisions would then be based on better data re: risk/reward of getting back to some form of normal

Less spreaders means less new infections..............identifying "all recoveries" is your denominator

Basic math


----------



## Meerkat

The Cleveland Clinic converted their new education wing into an emergency ICU ward of 200 beds. They have yet to fill one bed!


----------



## cement569

and a month ago they only had 9, my friends sister is a nurse there and she told him


----------



## buckeyebowman

Meerkat said:


> Well I for one would refuse your serology test and I certainly don’t want my leader wasting my tax dollars on such a test.


Why? Do you wish to dwell in ignorance? if so, that's a great way to do it! I would welcome such a test if it were available. I want to know where I stand!


----------



## Meerkat

The whole damn thing is BS. Why.do I need a test to tell me I have the flu? And what am I going to do differently if I have the flu? I will stay home like I always do. But if I have a test (which by their own admission is wrong half the time) now the GOVENMENT is going to isolate me? I will take my chances thank you very much.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Meerkat said:


> The whole damn thing is BS. Why.do I need a test to tell me I have the flu? And what am I going to do differently if I have the flu? I will stay home like I always do. But if I have a test (which by their own admission is wrong half the time) now the GOVENMENT is going to isolate me? I will take my chances thank you very much.


----------



## Shad Rap

Meerkat said:


> The Cleveland Clinic converted their new education wing into an emergency ICU ward of 200 beds. They have yet to fill one bed!


NONE of the hospitals in Ohio were overloaded...no hospitals, except in one hotspot, were busy across the country...and even then, they weren't overloaded...this is straight from poeple who work them...it was a farse.


----------



## Shad Rap

the amount of false positives and negatives on these tests are outrageous...


----------



## Shad Rap

buckeyebowman said:


> Why? Do you wish to dwell in ignorance? if so, that's a great way to do it! I would welcome such a test if it were available. I want to know where I stand!


Good for you...but the test won't tell you a damn thing for sure...it'll tell you that you're negative, when you're actually positive...seen this happen a zillion times in the nursing home setting...bottom line is these tests just aren't accurate...so no thanks...
Even seen folks test positive then turn around and test negative, then test positive again...viscious cycle...


----------



## Shad Rap

roundbadge said:


> Inaccurate data alters a strategy
> 
> For example, what if RELIABLE Serology concluded 50% of Ohio was already exposed as studies are leaning toward asymptomatics far outnumbering positives with any symptoms from mild to severe
> 
> That would give you a hypothetical denominator of 6mm in Ohio alone
> 
> Now, choose your numerators, such as hospitalizations, ICU's and sadly the demise of some
> 
> Those rates become much less, and decisions would then be based on better data re: risk/reward of getting back to some form of normal
> 
> Less spreaders means less new infections..............identifying "all recoveries" is your denominator
> 
> Basic math


Your theory is VERY unrealistic...and it wouldn't even be reliable...not too mention the huge waste of funds.


----------



## roundbadge

Shad Rap said:


> Good for you...but the test won't tell you a damn thing for sure...it'll tell you that you're negative, when you're actually positive.
> Even seen folks test positive then turn around and test negative, then test positive again...viscious cycle...


the retested negatives back to positive were proven to be trace dead virus cells that can't infect others


----------



## roundbadge

Shad Rap said:


> Your theory is VERY unrealistic...and it wouldn't even be reliable...not too mention the huge waste of funds.


ask the 2000, or 95% of the Ohio jail population of 2100 positives

In other words, if they just tested the 100 symptom positives, the other 2000 would have gone unnoticed, would become "recoveries" outside the statistics, etc

Now apply that reality to 11.9mm or so Ohioans


----------



## Wow

Nothing has changed.

Ignore it at your own detriment......Or the detriment of others.
Leadership would love to ignore it. Let's just ignore it and deal with it later. That seams to be the Mo. Some hospitals are maxed out now. If you don't care, I'm certainly not going to explain it to you again. The economy is going nowhere, 'till it's fixed.

400 new cases last sunday.
https://www.cleveland.com/coronavir...p-more-than-400-in-one-day-sunday-update.html
--Tim


----------



## PapawSmith

Wow said:


> Nothing has changed.
> 
> 400 new cases last sunday.



Probably because there was 10,000 new folks getting tested last Friday, but that important stat doesn’t matter. Test more people, get more results, pretty simple. This whole debacle has gone way too far and is time to cut the bullshit and get back to life. I did not start out this person, but I’m also not an idiot, I learn.


----------



## Shad Rap

roundbadge said:


> ask the 2000, or 95% of the Ohio jail population of 2100 positives
> 
> In other words, if they just tested the 100 symptom positives, the other 2000 would have gone unnoticed, would become "recoveries" outside the statistics, etc
> 
> Now apply that reality to 11.9mm or so Ohioans


Still unrealistic no matter what way you look at it.


----------



## roundbadge

Shad Rap said:


> Still unrealistic no matter what way you look at it.


Ohio health has proven cases, and spread, started in early January
Ohio health declaration above confirms 10 weeks of spread occurred until lockdown 3/15
Only serology will identify those who were positive the 1st qtr 2020 who never went to a Med
Based on worldwide tracking and testing so far, silent spreaders/positives far outnumber symptomatic positives, which make up the majority of reported cases in the stats


----------



## 9Left

Lol...We're still talking about this?… Where is the 2020 riot thread?


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.di...g-trims-for-union-workers-too?template=ampart


----------



## Chuck T Mechling

9Left said:


> Lol...We're still talking about this?… Where is the 2020 riot thread?


Talking about what???


----------



## ICENUT

The riot thread would get locked just as the trying times thread did.


----------



## KaGee

Wow said:


> Nothing has changed.
> 
> Ignore it at your own detriment......Or the detriment of others.
> Leadership would love to ignore it. Let's just ignore it and deal with it later. That seams to be the Mo. Some hospitals are maxed out now. If you don't care, I'm certainly not going to explain it to you again. The economy is going nowhere, 'till it's fixed.
> 
> 400 new cases last sunday.
> https://www.cleveland.com/coronavir...p-more-than-400-in-one-day-sunday-update.html
> --Tim


https://time.com/5847226/wuhan-10-million-coronavirus-tests/ 

Nothing has changed... Lucas County in NW Ohio supposedly had more Covid deaths than any other county... However, being in death care, we don't see any surge of actual death counts.
Hospitals are not maxed out. In fact, the largest hospital network in NW Ohio, Promedica, just took the one campus where they shipped all the Covid patients to and returned it's status back to normal operations. 

There are many other things in the world that pose more of a detriment to me today.


----------



## JamesF

The post about employees, taking a pay cut doesn't make sense. Employees are taxed according to the amount of money they make. And the more money they make, is likely to be spent on taxable items.


----------



## cement569

i still dont agree with these testing stations, i feel they use these to pad the stats. if you test positive they tell you to go home for 14 days, just imagine staying at home for 2 weeks living in fear at every little ache or pain or sneeze or cough. to me that is torture


----------



## Wow

*ICU beds in Cuyahoga County occupied at highest rate since coronavirus outbreak began*

https://www.cleveland.com/news/2020...st-rate-since-coronavirus-outbreak-began.html

Don't forget, these are the sickest of the sick. Those with mild symptoms are sent home to rest.

*China Says It's Beating Coronavirus. But Can We Believe Its Numbers?*

https://time.com/5813628/china-coronavirus-statistics-wuhan/

Do you believe China's state controlled media? --Tim


----------



## cincinnati

Wow said:


> *ICU beds in Cuyahoga County occupied at highest rate since coronavirus outbreak began*
> 
> https://www.cleveland.com/news/2020...st-rate-since-coronavirus-outbreak-began.html
> 
> *China Says It's Beating Coronavirus. But Can We Believe Its Numbers?*
> 
> https://time.com/5813628/china-coronavirus-statistics-wuhan/
> 
> Do you believe China's state controlled media? --Tim


Your link is more than 2 weeks old.

Yesterday, out of Cleveland. https://www.news5cleveland.com/news...y-is-the-lowest-ohio-has-seen-in-over-a-month


----------



## bad luck

This thing is over and was never a threat to begin with to the general healthy population. 

I guess we'll find out in a few weeks....if all these rioters get thinned out due to flu, then it was real......but all of the sudden, the media sure doesn't seem concerned about the lack of social distancing for protests/riots......same with certain governors ....but both sure are still concerned about it when folks want to work, go to church, or go to sporting events......but I guess you don't get it while stealing TV's or spray painting buildings or throwing molotov cocktails at cops huh?


I guess there have also been zero deaths attributed to stroke, cancer, and heart disease since mid March of this year---wonder why?


----------



## percidaeben

cement569 said:


> i still dont agree with these testing stations, i feel they use these to pad the stats. if you test positive they tell you to go home for 14 days, just imagine staying at home for 2 weeks living in fear at every little ache or pain or sneeze or cough. to me that is torture


I was intubated last year for 30 days. That is torture. I’m still recovering and that was from February 2019 to March 2019. Not covid related. I would for sure rather to be “stuck” in home for 14 days


----------



## Wow

cincinnati said:


> Your link is more than 2 weeks old.
> 
> Yesterday, out of Cleveland. https://www.news5cleveland.com/news...y-is-the-lowest-ohio-has-seen-in-over-a-month


It was updated May 26. That's 8 days ago, not two weeks.
You can try to change the news by will, but people are wise to the truth.

And,..........If you bothered to* read, *It was about Cuyahoga county. Not The whole state.--Tim


----------



## Burkcarp1

Wow said:


> It was updated May 26. That's 8 days ago, not two weeks.
> You can try to change the news by will, but people are wise to the truth.
> 
> And,..........If you bothered to* read, *It was about Cuyahoga county. Not The whole state.--Tim


What about your previous post, you said that some are maxed out but THE article that you mentioned said they are in the 70%. Please explain....


----------



## Wow

Burkcarp1 said:


> What about your previous post, you said that some are maxed out but THE article that you mentioned said they are in the 70%. Please explain....


Again, if you read: 
*ICU beds in Cuyahoga County occupied at highest rate since coronavirus outbreak began --*Tim


----------



## bad luck

Wow said:


> It was updated May 26. That's 8 days ago, not two weeks.
> You can try to change the news by will, but people are wise to the truth.
> 
> And,..........If you bothered to* read, *It was about Cuyahoga county. Not The whole state.--Tim


That is correct, people are wise to the truth; most people are no longer worried nor paying attention to the "dangers" of the flu.....if people were truly this worried, there wouldn't be so many begging to go back to work, go get their haircuts, out to eat, loot stores, go on vacation (I live in a vacation community and can barely tell a difference in behaviors...)


----------



## Hatchetman

Well, here we go again. The group of researchers that found that Hydroxychloroquine was not effective for Covid 19 and was in fact dangerous to take....have retracted there article. The info they used was not complete, some facts held back so their article was NOT accurate. Don't you think that an article telling us that this drug was going to kill us if we took it should have been checked, rechecked, and checked again for accuracy? Or did it fit their opinions better the way it was published....Just another back track on the flu cases....


----------



## Saltfork

Hatchetman said:


> Well, here we go again. The group of researchers that found that Hydroxychloroquine was not effective for Covid 19 and was in fact dangerous to take....have retracted there article. The info they used was not complete, some facts held back so their article was NOT accurate. Don't you think that an article telling us that this drug was going to kill us if we took it should have been checked, rechecked, and checked again for accuracy? Or did it fit their opinions better the way it was published....Just another back track on the flu cases....



I believe I read somewhere the WHO was quote spoofed by a made up company Made up of model, a Sci fi person and a cartoon writer. 

That did the research.. 

Right now no matter which way ya lean. I would say the media is the biggest threat to America. I’d love to see it called straight down the line no matter what side if it’s corrupt call it. See actual true no biased, no agenda no fit it to a narrative. Just honest journalism.

On another side note. I love how the Governor of Michigan, totally through social distancing out the window to lead a Floyd march.People in Michigan have to be boiling right now.


----------



## roundbadge

Social change first requires a community to get its own house in order


----------



## Specwar

The only thing that “changes” are the people. Nothing else can or will ever change.


----------



## loves2fishinohio

Wow said:


> It was updated May 26. That's 8 days ago, not two weeks.
> You can try to change the news by will, but people are wise to the truth.
> 
> And,..........If you bothered to* read, *It was about Cuyahoga county. Not The whole state.--Tim


Why don't you help stop the spread of this sensationalism? 

This "report" is about overall hospital utilization. There is no mention of the percentage of beds being occupied by COVID patients.

Didn't doctors and hospitals just start doing elective surgeries again a short while ago? I would think that would drive up numbers hospitalization numbers.

Aren't most ICU patients on ventilators? You don't have to have COVID-19 to be on a ventilator.


----------



## Snakecharmer

loves2fishinohio said:


> Why don't you help stop the spread of this sensationalism?
> 
> This "report" is about overall hospital utilization. There is no mention of the percentage of beds being occupied by COVID patients.
> 
> Didn't doctors and hospitals just start doing elective surgeries again a short while ago? I would think that would drive up numbers hospitalization numbers.
> 
> Aren't most ICU patients on ventilators? You don't have to have COVID-19 to be on a ventilator.


I was in ICU for 5 days after my heart surgery - No ventilator. My 19 month old grandson was in ICU last week - No ventilator. So I would say most people in ICU are not on ventilators but maybe all people on ventilators are in ICU.


----------



## Patricio

So according to the great and wonderful WHO, asymptomatic people can't really spread it. Amazing. Not really.


----------



## KaGee

Patricio said:


> So according to the great and wonderful WHO, asymptomatic people can't really spread it. Amazing. Not really.


Right?
"Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain"


----------



## Saugeye Tom

It's the beginning of the end....covid flu is going away....mark my guess


----------



## Shad Rap

Patricio said:


> So according to the great and wonderful WHO, asymptomatic people can't really spread it. Amazing. Not really.


Go figure...they've already back tracked on that statement too...a whole day later...


----------



## bad luck

I notice all the “doom and gloom” - “world is going to end” “I’m staying in my house forever” —-“I believe every word the government tells me and will follow their orders no matter what” people, Have disappeared from this message board 


and 

hopefully are out fishing


And I’ve been fishing a lot, and it’s been great!


----------



## cement569

yep, i think people finally figured out that we have been taken for the ride of our lives. in march we were told that over 2 million people in the u.s would die from this flu, we are not even in the ball park of that number.....the fear factor and it worked on some people


----------



## Shad Rap

cement569 said:


> yep, i think people finally figured out that we have been taken for the ride of our lives. in march we were told that over 2 million people in the u.s would die from this flu, we are not even in the ball park of that number.....the fear factor and it worked on some people


And it's still working on some people as we speak...or type...lol...the 2nd wave is coming...


----------



## KaGee

Anybody heard of any Rona breakouts during the protesting and rioting?
Nah, me neither.


----------



## Snakecharmer

KaGee said:


> Anybody heard of any Rona breakouts during the protesting and rioting?
> Nah, me neither.


Here you go.....Austin Texas...I'm sure you can find more yourself if you look.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/a...sting-after-protests-memorial-day/ar-BB15guiu

Florida sets record.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/me...rus-cases-peak-at-7-775-in-a-week/ar-BB15fFvQ


----------



## Shad Rap

KaGee said:


> Anybody heard of any Rona breakouts during the protesting and rioting?
> Nah, me neither.


I had a rona in my hand just yesterday...


----------



## cement569

keep believing what they tell you, and plan on living in fear the rest of your life. sure the riots are over so now they have nothing to write about so back to the flu. for 2 weeks nothing about the flu WHY.....BECAUSE FEAR SELLS


----------



## KaGee

Snakecharmer said:


> Here you go.....Austin Texas...I'm sure you can find more yourself if you look.
> https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/a...sting-after-protests-memorial-day/ar-BB15guiu


"record numbers of people have been _*seeking out coronavirus tests*_, officials said Tuesday."
Big difference between seeking out tests and actually coming down with it.


----------



## Snakecharmer

KaGee said:


> "record numbers of people have been _*seeking out coronavirus tests*_, officials said Tuesday."
> Big difference between seeking out tests and actually coming down with it.


The update comes as Travis County has posted two days in a row with a *new record number of cases *- and Travis County residents are seeking out testing.

Reading is important...


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

bad luck said:


> I notice all the “doom and gloom” - “world is going to end” “I’m staying in my house forever” —-“I believe every word the government tells me and will follow their orders no matter what” people, Have disappeared from this message board
> 
> 
> and
> 
> hopefully are out fishing
> 
> 
> And I’ve been fishing a lot, and it’s been great!


You forgot the “ it’s your fault that people are dying because you don’t believe, you are the ones that are going to cause the millions to die and, You are killing people”. Well they were wrong... 
It must have been the tin foil hats that they accuse you of wearing...


----------



## cement569

your talking cases, how do they know so called cases when they dont know anything about this flu? so my advice .....stay at home and hunker down. not this ol cowboy, your only on this earth for a short time and i want to make every minute count. it is all one big scam brought on by you know who


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Man that’s a lot of “sharp spikes”. Must have been a lot of riots in that county last couple months. Record numbers?


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

No link..


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

https://www.google.com/search?hl=en...osSyzWME5vzSvpBJIFeXnAQWKSosVikEqAIjt1AbFAAAA


----------



## Shad Rap

Not sure, but I think I heard Ohio had 4 straight days of infections #'s declining (for what it's worth)..technically speaking, Franklin County should be seeing a spike already and they aren't...hospital census is STILL way down.


----------



## 9Left

With all the availability of testing now… Trying to track whether the virus is increasing or decreasing is probably the most in accurate measurement ever...


----------



## JamesF

9Left said:


> With all the availability of testing now… Trying to track whether the virus is increasing or decreasing is probably the most in accurate measurement ever...


Which tests are the most accurate? My wife works as a nurse for a very large and well known insurance company. This company is a private, and as of this date, all testing is still in the process of vetting. Try to get tested! Unless you work where testing is available, your more than likely to be told no! Testing is being done by demographics, the last my wife was told. I believe that not testing anyone that has all of the symptoms, is doing more harm than good, especially for the moral of those who believe they should be tested.


----------



## Burkcarp1

My Dad had the symptoms, made a call and someone came out and test at his house. Next day results. Easy peasy


----------



## buckeyebowman

Snakecharmer said:


> Here you go.....Austin Texas...I'm sure you can find more yourself if you look.
> https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/a...sting-after-protests-memorial-day/ar-BB15guiu
> 
> Florida sets record.
> https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/me...rus-cases-peak-at-7-775-in-a-week/ar-BB15fFvQ





KaGee said:


> "record numbers of people have been _*seeking out coronavirus tests*_, officials said Tuesday."
> Big difference between seeking out tests and actually coming down with it.


Beat me to it.

Besides, finding more cases after these kinds of activities, or after opening up states. should actually be expected! Why wouldn't it be? The important factor to be considered is how many are impacted so negatively that they cannot work, or become so ill that they die! Not to sound callous, but that's how immunity to disease works.

People NEED to become infected and recover! We seem to have that blueprint in hand as far as COVID-19 goes. We know that it doesn't really affect young people in good health very much. This is how you develop the "herd immunity" that many politicians like to talk about, but don't seem to understand how it occurs!


----------



## multi species angler

I was told that some testing places require a Dr. referral or prescription. I called a testing site that said they require that a person has at least 2 of the symptoms. So I guess it depends on the testing site. I know someone that is going in for a surgery and they are required to be tested before the surgery.


----------



## multi species angler

buckeyebowman said:


> People NEED to become infected and recover!


 Too bad the 114,000 that died weren't given that choice!


----------



## buckeyebowman

Yes it is! I have empathy for those folks, but they happen in any epidemic or pandemic! Sorry! That's just reality! It's just the way reality works! 

So sorry that it doesn't line up with your PC sensibilities! People get sick and they die! At least some of them. About 7,500 a day here in the U.S. Get a clue man!


----------



## multi species angler

multi species angler said:


> Too bad the 114,000 that died weren't given that choice!


 Actually over 400,000 worldwide. 
Need to get it, is a ridiculous statement. No one knows for sure if they will live or die with this virus.


----------



## bobk

Burkcarp1 said:


> My Dad had the symptoms, made a call and someone came out and test at his house. Next day results. Easy peasy


Hopefully all is good for Dad.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Well what’s the latest on this latest covid flu with the latest .25% death rate? Doom n gloomers? Doomsayers?


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Crickets..


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Corona Virus claims a black belt. Chuck Norris, Dead at 80.

Carlos Ray “Chuck” Norris, famous actor and fighter, died yesterday afternoon at his home in Northwood Hills, TX at the age of 80.

Chuck Starred in dozens of movies and Tv series which have, and continue to entertain millions of people.

He was also a master of martial arts, which was the cause of his initial fame in the movie industry.

However, after his minor inconvenience of death, Chuck has made a full recovery, and is reported to be doing quite well. 

It has also been reported that the Corona virus is in self isolation for 14 days due to being exposed to Chuck Norris.


----------



## 9Left

JamesF said:


> Which tests are the most accurate? My wife works as a nurse for a very large and well known insurance company. This company is a private, and as of this date, all testing is still in the process of vetting. Try to get tested! Unless you work where testing is available, your more than likely to be told no! Testing is being done by demographics, the last my wife was told. I believe that not testing anyone that has all of the symptoms, is doing more harm than good, especially for the moral of those who believe they should be tested.


Huh? I live in southwest Ohio and there's literally three different places you can "drive up "and get tested… You don't even have to get out of your car… At the hospital I work at, we test literally every single person that walks in to the ER… No matter what the diagnosis... What I'm saying about being inaccurate is that tons more people are being tested… So if someone reports that there is a "spike "in cases… I think that's total BS...The more you test… The more people come up positive…honestly, I think half of Ohio had this virus a month ago… But we just didn't test them...And most just recovered from it without problem


----------



## 9Left

multi species angler said:


> Actually over 400,000 worldwide.
> Need to get it, is a ridiculous statement. No one knows for sure if they will live or die with this virus.


No that's not a ridiculous statement at all… I can't stand all these people that all the sudden think "this is such a bad thing "… None of them understand how the immune system works… You are exposed to literally thousands and thousands of different bacteria and germs every single day...The reason you don't have a problem or get sick it's because your immune system works… That's exactly how immunity works and that is exactly why you are alive today… Because of your immune system...I get it though… Most people don't understand it… Germs and bacteria are actually "good "for your health


----------



## multi species angler

9Left said:


> Germs and bacteria are actually "good "for your health


 Yes they are, as long as you don't get so much it KILLS you.


----------



## Burkcarp1

bobk said:


> Hopefully all is good for Dad.


He’s ok.


----------



## Shad Rap

JamesF said:


> Which tests are the most accurate? My wife works as a nurse for a very large and well known insurance company. This company is a private, and as of this date, all testing is still in the process of vetting. Try to get tested! Unless you work where testing is available, your more than likely to be told no! Testing is being done by demographics, the last my wife was told. I believe that not testing anyone that has all of the symptoms, is doing more harm than good, especially for the moral of those who believe they should be tested.


What your wife is being told isn't true at all...you can drive up anywhere (pretty much) and get tested...some hospitals are even rapid result tests where you can get your results not long after the test is done...within minutes...members of my family have done it...nothing to do with demographics.


----------



## JamesF

Shad Rap said:


> What your wife is being told isn't true at all...you can drive up anywhere (pretty much) and get tested...some hospitals are even rapid result tests where you can get your results not long after the test is done...within minutes...members of my family have done it...nothing to do with demographics.


Figures, an insurance company wouldn't lie,now,would they?


----------



## buckeyebowman

multi species angler said:


> Actually over 400,000 worldwide.
> Need to get it, is a ridiculous statement. No one knows for sure if they will live or die with this virus.


Actually, we do! If you are young and healthy, with a robust immune system, you have very little problem. If you are over 60, with a less than efficient immune system, and other medical issues, you ARE at risk!

And no one knows for sure if ANYONE will survive with ANY virus!




Shad Rap said:


> What your wife is being told isn't true at all...you can drive up anywhere (pretty much) and get tested...some hospitals are even rapid result tests where you can get your results not long after the test is done...within minutes...members of my family have done it...nothing to do with demographics.


Well, not true yet here! I'm in the Mahoning Valley (Youngstown), and they had drive up testing downtown today. Read all about it in yesterday's paper. You still need to pre-register, and be symptomatic! Makes me wonder why Ohio lags so far behind! California has almost 40 million people, yet anyone who wants to can be tested at any time.

Response was reported as "steady, but light". Makes me wonder if there are too many asymptomatic folk out there!


----------



## 9Left

multi species angler said:


> Yes they are, as long as you don't get so much it KILLS you
> Getting a virus and having a health problem because of it has absolutely nothing to do with "how much " of it you were exposed to... If you have a healthy immune system… You can be exposed to that virus all day long… if you have health issues and a weak immune system… And are exposed to literally one single bacteria… Then you are gonna have a problem.


----------



## JamesF

montagc said:


> I'm still here, just got tired of talking to brick walls and conspiracy theorists, and didnt want to get banned
> 
> I will say that new data shows that it was likely here earlier than we thought, though there really isnt a way to prove it. I apologize to those I doubted, but still say get a test!
> 
> Brothers coworker had something in January and was in the hospital for weeks and on a ventilator at one point. Lost both of his feet and is learning to walk again in his 60s. Recently had the test and it showed he had the antibodies for Covid. So could be a coincidence, but who knows.


That is sad. I too am at risk, and the possibility of loosing my feet is very real. I have to get in to see my Endocrinologist, my feet have been swelling up lately. Due to being diabetic. Its got me worried. My numbers are going down, but other things may be going on.


----------



## yonderfishin

For the most part , cases are increasing because testing is increasing. So ......is it really more cases or is it just more detection ? 

More detection....


----------



## multi species angler

yonderfishin said:


> is it really more cases or is it just more detection ?


 It is being said that hospitalizations are increasing also, not just testing.


----------



## fastwater

multi species angler said:


> It is being said that hospitalizations are increasing also, not just testing.


IMO, the hospital admission stats for covid is one of the main stats to pay attention as far as gauging outbreaks in various areas of different states.


----------



## KaGee

multi species angler said:


> It is being said that hospitalizations are increasing also, not just testing.


Well, they are open for business now...


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Test all they want fellas. That .25% isn’t going to change. SMH.


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

I spoke to the CEO of our county hospital and they have only had two COVID positive patients in the last 3 weeks. 1 of the individuals was not even from our county


----------



## yonderfishin

multi species angler said:


> It is being said that hospitalizations are increasing also, not just testing.


How do we know those are actually covid hospitalizations ?

" Its being said "....... but thats been part of the problem all along. Hospitals have closed , or remained almost empty as reports " they " have said have people dropping like flies. Footage on television and pictures in the media , some have been debunked as borrowed from an earlier date from some other story. News footage has been literally staged , to look much worse than things are and they were caught at it. Reports of temporary morgues full and stacks of body bags , but has any of us actually seen any of this personally and verified whats going on ?

I guess my problem is a lot of what has been said has been untrue. Just how much though ?....10%.......50%.......98% ??? Why is there so much disinformation out there , whats really going on ?


----------



## jdl447

I know of one person here in Stark County that tested positive. A health care worker. He said he had a headache for two days. Was supposed to quarantine for fourteen, but after seven without symptoms they told him to report for work. His words “ Hell if I understand it “


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

I would imagine that a lot of them are from elective surgeries that the Nazi Nurse said we were not allowed to have. She was choosing what surgeries we were allowed to have at the time. It’s just that the doomsayers and other parties would love it if all those beds were filled with covid patients.


----------



## yonderfishin

The tests arent even 100% accurate , there are false positives/negatives.


----------



## bad luck

yonderfishin said:


> The tests arent even 100% accurate , there are false positives/negatives.


exactly....why get a test if u feel fine? Are the same people advocating we all get tests also run and go get HIV tests?


----------



## cement569

well during the protests there was no talk about the flu, as soon as they cooled down we are told that cases will spike. well this morning on fox 8 news cleveland they reported that experts say the month of june will see a drastic drop in cases.....have you ever felt like we have been played?


----------



## ICENUT

pretty much since dr faucichanged his mind on this about half dozen times.


----------



## AmericanEagle

I went to my doctor this week for a routine checkup. In the vestibule before you could enter the main building they had someone take your temperature and ask you a series of questions about whether you had any virus symptoms. They definitely were not as crowded usual and there were signs up about limiting visitors in the waiting area.

When I was in the examination room I asked the nurse who took my blood pressure if she thought the virus lock down was an overreaction, She said they had seen a lot of covid 19 patients and in her opinion the stay at home order worked to slow the spread and should have been extended another month which would have eradicated the virus altogether. She also said they handle two nursing homes as part of their practice and have been doing both of them via telemedicine.

The doctor came in along with a nurse practitioner he was training to join his practice. I asked him if he thought the virus lock down was an overreaction. He said it was absolutely necessary and it worked. He felt that without the lock down they would have run out of resources to treat patients and that during the peak the local hospitals were at close to full capacity,. The nurse practitioner was working in the ICU this spring and she talked about how poor the testing was at the start with many patients dying before they could get test results. She said some tests took as long as two weeks to get results.

The county I am in is Mahoning which has had 1586 cases and 214 deaths.


----------



## Shad Rap

AmericanEagle said:


> I went to my doctor this week for a routine checkup. In the vestibule before you could enter the main building they had someone take your temperature and ask you a series of questions about whether you had any virus symptoms. They definitely were not as crowded usual and there were signs up about limiting visitors in the waiting area.
> 
> When I was in the examination room I asked the nurse who took my blood pressure if she thought the virus lock down was an overreaction, She said they had seen a lot of covid 19 patients and in her opinion the stay at home order worked to slow the spread and should have been extended another month which would have eradicated the virus altogether. She also said they handle two nursing homes as part of their practice and have been doing both of them via telemedicine.
> 
> The doctor came in along with a nurse practitioner he was training to join his practice. I asked him if he thought the virus lock down was an overreaction. He said it was absolutely necessary and it worked. He felt that without the lock down they would have run out of resources to treat patients and that during the peak the local hospitals were at close to full capacity,. The nurse practitioner was working in the ICU this spring and she talked about how poor the testing was at the start with many patients dying before they could get test results. She said some tests took as long as two weeks to get results.
> 
> The county I am in is Mahoning which has had 1586 cases and 214 deaths.


Eradicated the virus all together??...funny that comment would even come from a health professionals mouth...we could've stayed locked down for 6 months...it wouldn't of mattered...you actually need the complete opposite to happen for eradification...not hide from it...the virus won't go anywhere...hence why there's spikes after re-opening in some areas at this very moment...I'll agree with you that the lockdowns MAYBE did slow down the hospital census...but that's all it did...I'm aware of health professionals all over Ohio who've said their hosptials have been no where near capacity through all of this...even in the mecca of it all, Franklin County...to this date, hospital census is still down across the state...


----------



## 9Left

montagc said:


> I'm still here, just got tired of talking to brick walls and conspiracy theorists, and didnt want to get banned
> 
> I will say that new data shows that it was likely here earlier than we thought, though there really isnt a way to prove it. I apologize to those I doubted, but still say get a test!
> 
> Brothers coworker had something in January and was in the hospital for weeks and on a ventilator at one point. Lost both of his feet and is learning to walk again in his 60s. Recently had the test and it showed he had the antibodies for Covid. So could be a coincidence, but who knows.


Please explain how the coronavirus leads to missing feet...?


----------



## buckeyebowman

AmericanEagle said:


> When I was in the examination room I asked the nurse who took my blood pressure if she thought the virus lock down was an overreaction, She said they had seen a lot of covid 19 patients and in her opinion the stay at home order worked to slow the spread and should have been extended another month which would have eradicated the virus altogether. She also said they handle two nursing homes as part of their practice and have been doing both of them via telemedicine.





Shad Rap said:


> Eradicated the virus all together??...funny that comment would even come from a health professionals mouth...we could've stayed locked down for 6 months...it wouldn't of mattered...you actually need the complete opposite to happen for eradification...not hide from it...the virus won't go anywhere...hence why there's spikes after re-opening in some areas at this very moment...I'll agree with you that the lockdowns MAYBE did slow down the hospital census...but that's all it did...I'm aware of health professionals all over Ohio who've said their hosptials have been no where near capacity through all of this...even in the mecca of it all, Franklin County...to this date, hospital census is still down across the state...


Beat me to it! I'm surprised a health care "professional" would say such a thing! You don't eradicate viruses, you develop vaccines and treatments for them. Also, herd immunity comes into play. COVID is here and it isn't going anywhere. We just have to be prudent in how we behave. I'm playing golf tomorrow. Just before I walk in to pay, the mask goes on. The instant I'm out the door, the mask comes off. I do much the same when going in any store. I pay with a debit card, to heck with cash! Then hand sanitizer. 

And yes, we flattened the curve so much that some hospitals were reduced to laying people off! Even in NYC the Navy hospital ship was barely used, and the field hospital set up in the Javits Center wasn't used at all. Here in Youngstown they sent in a bunch of equipment and had National Guard troops standing by to set up a field hospital in the Covelli Center. After a while it became obvious that it wouldn't be needed, so they sent all the stuff back and dismissed the troops!


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

It depends on who you’re talking to and what their platform is. My woman works out with a pharmacist and this lady was approached by the country about being interested in giving tests in their pharmacy. It was to be very lucrative and of course her husband seen dollar signs right off the bat. But then they also told her that the more positive cases that were found the more money would be distributed out to these places who usually wouldn’t do this sort of thing. They decided against it once they found out all of the hazmat equipment that they would have to invest in seeing how they constantly would have to change these suits per the rules change and throw away. A lot of incentive out there to lie and cheat the system and for those of you who think that this would never happen are very naive. I would also bet that not all follow the hazmat rules either.


----------



## Patricio

Well golly... 
Fauci says US might not see ‘second wave’ of Covid-19 cases
https://amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/jun/13/anthony-fauci-second-wave-coronavirus-cases


----------



## Burkcarp1

I find it amazing that people still listen to him......


----------



## cincinnati

Patricio said:


> Well golly...
> Fauci says US might not see ‘second wave’ of Covid-19 cases
> https://amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/jun/13/anthony-fauci-second-wave-coronavirus-cases


Amusing that Dr. Birx is not getting any camera time since she questioned the CDC’s data & said that death tally might be inflated by 25%.


----------



## SConner

https://www.usnews.com/news/health-...-rising-in-many-states-as-reopening-continues


----------



## Dovans




----------



## Camo tow

Where’d everybody go?


----------



## Workingman

Camo!!!!! What are you thinking???!!! This thing almost made it off the first page! I was hoping it would never be noticed again!!! Haha


----------



## Camo tow

Workingman said:


> Camo!!!!! What are you thinking???!!! This thing almost made it off the first page! I was hoping it would never be noticed again!!! Haha


Your right I wasn’t thinking


----------



## buckeyebowman

Well, here comes some actual good news. I posted earlier that a local outfit had developed a test to COVID that gave results in less than 1 hour. Article in the paper yesterday said it has been fast tracked for patent approval, so more testing can begin. They are also developing a home test kit. Their test also works with saliva, so no need for the deep nasopharyngeal swab!


----------



## Shad Rap

buckeyebowman said:


> Well, here comes some actual good news. I posted earlier that a local outfit had developed a test to COVID that gave results in less than 1 hour. Article in the paper yesterday said it has been fast tracked for patent approval, so more testing can begin. They are also developing a home test kit. Their test also works with saliva, so no need for the deep nasopharyngeal swab!


They've had a rapid test at Riverside Methodist Hospital and I'm sure other places as well, for almost 2 months now...you get resuts within an hour, sometimes a little longer depending on how backed up the labs are...


----------



## AmericanEagle

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ter-no-surge-in-coronavirus-cases/3208493001/


----------



## cheezemm2

If you haven't figured it out yet, anywhere there is a large gathering of people in an enclosed space is a high risk area. This is why colleges, schools and sports are having to reinvent themselves.

Stats I tend to care about:
1) ICU beds occupied (finite resource)
2) New cases (good for an overall trend, harder to argue now that testing has become much more available and can't be simply related to "just more tests" It's not perfect, but it helps give you an idea)
3) RO - probably a good indicator to gauge what, if any, new gov't measures will be put into place


Clipped from Reuters to avoid the political pieces:

In Arizona, 83% of intensive care beds are occupied, a record high, according to a state website here The outbreak has alarmed the hard-hit Navajo Nation. The Navajo reservation - overlapping parts of Arizona, Utah and New Mexico - reinstated a weekend-long curfew that closes even essential businesses like grocery stores and gas stations.

In Florida, some of the increase has been linked to newly reopened bars, making for easy virus transmission. In one case, 16 friends who celebrated a birthday at a bar without wearing masks all tested positive, according to media reports.

Texas has also pointed to bars as one cause of its current outbreak. 

In Oregon, over 200 new cases were tied to events at a single church.


----------



## cement569

the way the media keeps reporting all these new positive cases you would think people would just start dropping like flies. call me a heathen or what ever but i never bought into this virus, its just a flu and it just so happens it happened in an election year......get my point?


----------



## BFG

Ohio has tested roughly 550,000 folks with about 42,000 positives. I've been following the testing data the entire way, and it is unreal how from the beginning (even with the spikes caused by prison and nursing home outbreaks) the average continues to be for every positive test there are 10 (or now almost 12) negatives. I had the antibody test a few weeks back and was negative. I worked in and around a bunch of people who were COVID positive. I shared common space with a positive co-worker for extended periods of time, and I was fortunate to not get sick. 

Believe what you want, but the map above shouldn't surprise anyone. The green areas were the hot zones for many weeks, and now the more densely populated areas in the south and west are going to have their turn with this virus. However; those areas "should" be better prepared to deal with the outbreaks because they have had the time (and presumably adequate stockpiles of resources) to manage the outbreaks. 

It'll be interesting to see how hard the media has to work to drum up attention for outbreaks that occur in places like Texas, Alabama, and New Mexico. My guess is the focus will be on California, and the big cities there. I do find it interesting that we haven't seen huge spikes in places where the riots and protests took place. If the scariest story that can make the national news is one about 16 young professionals who went to a crowded bar and contracted COVID (Have not seen where any of them were hospitalized or not) is all they got.....and the riots are done...and the bad cops are gonna get what's coming to them....what is next?


----------



## buckeyebowman

Played golf today and there was a new guy in the group. Young, fit guy who could hit the ball a freaking mile! I introduced myself, temporarily lost my mind, and shook his hand! I guess I'm a dead man! Or he is!


----------



## Patricio

buckeyebowman said:


> Played golf today and there was a new guy in the group. Young, fit guy who could hit the ball a freaking mile! I introduced myself, temporarily lost my mind, and shook his hand! I guess I'm a dead man! Or he is!


You have a new man crush!


----------



## buckeyebowman

Patricio said:


> You have a new man crush!


Hell, the rest of us were impressed with how he could hit the ball. However, he didn't always know where it was going. 

When the courses first started opening up, we had to get used to not pulling the pin when we were putting! We'd walk up to the flagstick and extend our arm and then pull back! "What the hell am I doing?" Getting used to the new normal! 

I doubt I'll ever see him again. We had 2 groups out there today. Guys and ladies. This kid's Grandma is one of the ladies. She recruited him to fill out our foursome, since one guy had to work and couldn't get off. 

And I don't mind playing with younger people. It reminds you of what it's like to be strong and flexible, with joints that actually work properly!


----------



## Meerkat

From what I am reading we need to put people who are over 70 into protective isolation. Oh my goodness isn’t Dewine 72? Maybe he and I can be in isolation together and I can educate him. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## fishingful

Everyone can say it was a hoax or election year or whatever.... main thing was we were not prepared. We coild have been one of the countries that had to choose who not to help and let die. 

Same thing with our infrastructure falling apart. Lots of money being spent on helping other countries and services for people that cant help themselves. A lot of stuff is broken.


----------



## crappiedude

fishingful said:


> Everyone can say it was a hoax or election year or whatever...


I feel like a lot of opinions are driven by what area you live in of how the virus has affected people personally.
In sections of the state or the country where the numbers of cases are low, there's lots of tough guys who need to puff their chests and tell the world how it's a hoax. 
Put these same people in the hot spots like NYC and watch their message change.

It's unfortunate but there is no right or wrong for any government official on this. Do you stay open? Do you close everything? No one knows...not even the "experts" on OGF.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER




----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

About 9,000,000 people in New York with 17,000 deaths. Of course there is going to be more deaths there: That’s like putting 25 healthy people in a 50’X50’ room and then throwing a guy in there with the flu. Lots of people in that room are going to get the flu. And I’m not even a tough guy.
It’s kinda strange that none of these people who put these stats out never have a “recovered” number. Maybe All of the doomsayers/gloomsayers should go to Montana, put their head in the sand, see what it’s like, and wait it out...


----------



## crappiedude

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> It’s kinda strange that none of these people who put these stats out never have a “recovered” number. Maybe All of the doomsayers/gloomsayers should go to Montana, put their head in the sand, see what it’s like, and wait it out...


I'd much rather see all these tough guys on here move to NYC (go into an area in the height of this pandemic) and lick the same spoon. Then they could come back and report how bad the "flu" really was. Then they could back up their macho BS with real life facts. In my experience most of the these tough guys are only tough as long as they are living somewhere reasonably safe.

What I'm saying is my perspective from living in an area with only several hundred (reported) cases is going to be completely different than folks living in areas with thousands of cases.


----------



## Shad Rap

crappiedude said:


> I'd much rather see all these tough guys on here move to NYC (go into an area in height of this pandemic) and lick the same spoon. Then they could come back and report how bad the "flu" really was. Then they could back up there macho BS with real life facts. In my experience most of the these tough guys are only tough as long as they are somewhere reasonably safe.
> 
> What I'm saying is my perspective from living in an area with only several hundred (reported) cases is going to be completely different than folks living in areas with thousands of cases.


Dude calm down...it's just an internet forum...take a breath...people on here know first hand what this virus does as many of us know people who've had it...hell, some of US have even had it...can't get any more real than that, tough guy.


----------



## SConner

https://www.wyso.org/post/hundreds-infected-coronavirus-outbreak-dole-salad-plant


----------



## crappiedude

Shad Rap said:


> Dude calm down


It just gets old listening to the same few talking heads say how everyone (except them of course) is living in fear. I've said it before, being cautious and fearful are completely different. I doubt many people have felt true fear, while most people will act with caution.


----------



## loves2fishinohio

Yeah, now the media is running back to Coronavirus reporting. We need a good natural disaster or something for them to report on now, lol (KIDDING!)


----------



## Snakecharmer

Shad Rap said:


> Dude calm down...it's just an internet forum...take a breath...people on here know first hand what this virus does as many of us know people who've had it...hell, some of US have even had it...can't get any more real than that, tough guy.


----------



## JamesF

There was a guy from the New York city, who thought everyone was crying wolf. Until he too came down with the Coronavirus. I for one do,know what living in fear is!! And I am very vulnerable to any type of influenza virus. At times I want to believe the hype about the virus, however I know better. There are plenty of people and businesses taking advantage of this, in more ways than one. Now that Is,the hype I do believe in and it makes me just as angry as the next person.


----------



## Muddy

I will continue to social distance for the rest of my life. I’ve done it for my entire life, so why change now. I’m pretty good at it. And I would love to move to Montana, but my wife won’t do it.


----------



## Hatchetman

crappiedude said:


> It just gets old listening to the same few talking heads say how everyone (except them of course) is living in fear. I've said it before, being cautious and fearful are completely different. I doubt many people have felt true fear, while most people will act with caution.



You don't think people get tired of this same old garbage ??


----------



## cement569

nothing i said was politcal, is it against the rules to say you watched a documenty? sorry you took it the wrong way


----------



## buckeyebowman

Our mayor has been force to self isolate because a contact trace fingered him. He went out to dinner with his wife! As he put it, this is no time to start acting foolish. The virus is still out there and just as dangerous as ever!


----------



## UNCLEMIKE

buckeyebowman said:


> Our mayor has been force to self isolate because a contact trace fingered him. He went out to dinner with his wife! As he put it, this is no time to start acting foolish. The virus is still out there and just as dangerous as ever!


That would be the mayor of Youngstown. The main spokesman in the Youngstown areas medical field is a doctor from St. Elizabeth hospital. Can't recall his name. Has been commenting on the pandemic all along on local T.V. Not a fringe guy but a respected member of the medical community. Yesterday on local T.V. he noted that it seems the virus is not affecting most as severely as it was in the beginning. He is seeing less hospitalizations locally. My wife works at Boardman hospital and they are down to just a few patients with the virus. I would say it is still a dangerous illness but might think twice before saying it is as dangerous as ever.


----------



## crappiedude

I'm guessing that the medical staff and facilities have a better understanding of how to treat this virus. I'm sure a lot has been learned in the last few months and treatments are more effective.


----------



## fishingful

I just got back from Mohican. No one social distancing at all at the livery or campgrounds. Packed as ever.


----------



## buckeyebowman

UNCLEMIKE said:


> That would be the mayor of Youngstown. The main spokesman in the Youngstown areas medical field is a doctor from St. Elizabeth hospital. Can't recall his name. Has been commenting on the pandemic all along on local T.V. Not a fringe guy but a respected member of the medical community. Yesterday on local T.V. he noted that it seems the virus is not affecting most as severely as it was in the beginning. He is seeing less hospitalizations locally. My wife works at Boardman hospital and they are down to just a few patients with the virus. I would say it is still a dangerous illness but might think twice before saying it is as dangerous as ever.


My buddy's wife is a nurse there as well. At Mercy Health. He says her stress level has come down a lot recently. Back when it was roaring, she'd come home crying every night!


----------



## 9Left

buckeyebowman said:


> My buddy's wife is a nurse there as well. At Mercy Health. He says her stress level has come down a lot recently. Back when it was roaring, she'd come home crying every night!


I cannot get on board with this " back when it was bad "comment… This virus is still here and it's still the exact same level it ever was… The reason people think it's "dying down "is because the media is not talking about it anymore… I don't get how some people don't see how obvious this is… The media Is dangerous… This virus hasn't gone anywhere ,neither has measles, mumps,rubella or polio… Those viruses are all still here just like they were decades ago.
I do think that a large number of people have already been exposed to Covid and develop antibodies and recovered from it without problem… But it is here just as big as it was three months ago
...(Just to be clear, this isAbsolutely not an attack aimed at you buckeyebowman)


----------



## EnonEye

Picked up a take-out today @a local steak-mega-franchise, parking lot absolutely jampacked and no not one entering or exiting wore a mask. Our newest Ohio hotspots? Springfield, Fairborn, Dayton, Trotwood -I'm surrounded. In case anyone missed it on tonights sometimes fakenews newest research shows any simple mask such as a doubled up undershirt stops the virus droplets.


----------



## crestliner TS

EnonEye said:


> Picked up a take-out today @a local steak-mega-franchise, parking lot absolutely jampacked and no not one entering or exiting wore a mask. Our newest Ohio hotspots? Springfield, Fairborn, Dayton, Trotwood -I'm surrounded. In case anyone missed it on tonights sometimes fakenews newest research shows any simple mask such as a doubled up undershirt stops the virus droplets.


sure, so does a chain link fence if the droplets only land on the chain link.


----------



## cement569

was at an antique shop this morning, as i deal in antiques. well the owner was talking to a lady who was buying something and they knew each other she was from the youngstown area and she asked her about how the flu was hitting her hospital where she worked. her answer.....3 cases in 3 weeks. this from the horses mouth not the media


----------



## cheezemm2

crestliner TS said:


> sure, so does a chain link fence if the droplets only land on the chain link.


Running at about 2.0mph, 165' back?


----------



## Shad Rap

EnonEye said:


> Picked up a take-out today @a local steak-mega-franchise, parking lot absolutely jampacked and no not one entering or exiting wore a mask. Our newest Ohio hotspots? Springfield, Fairborn, Dayton, Trotwood -I'm surrounded. In case anyone missed it on tonights sometimes fakenews newest research shows any simple mask such as a doubled up undershirt stops the virus droplets.


That's weird because I heard the complete opposite...that a mask DOESN'T stop it...you can still contract it through a mask.


----------



## MagicMarker

The whole thing was overplayed and people are just getting over the hype and getting back to normal


----------



## KaGee

Shad Rap said:


> That's weird because I heard the complete opposite...that a mask DOESN'T stop it...you can still contract it through a mask.


 This from a box of masks supplied by my employer...


----------



## crestliner TS

KaGee said:


> This from a box of masks supplied by my employer...
> View attachment 363165


I was at Marcs yestaerday and the kid packing my bags took off his mask and said "I dont know why we have to wear these things, they dont even work and its hard to breathe." I said "thank your Governor" just wanted to share. It was a refreshing change from the stares and avoidance I get from mask wearers in the stores.


----------



## REEL GRIP

My wife is a RN at Summa, in maternity, post pardon, labor and delivery.
They have a wing set up for Covid patients only. They have had only 1 patient
since day 1.


----------



## SConner

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2020/06/21/880832213/yes-wearing-masks-helps-heres-why


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

SConner said:


> https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2020/06/21/880832213/yes-wearing-masks-helps-heres-why


Hell yea! Let’s all jump on this editor’s band wagon. She seems to have her hands in about everything and specializes in “puns”. Give me a break..

*Maria Godoy*
*Senior Editor, NPR Science Desk, and Host, The Salt*
Facebook Twitter 
Maria Godoy is a senior editor with NPR's Science Desk and the host of NPR's food blog, The Salt. Godoy covers the food beat with a wide lens, investigating everything from the health effects of caffeine to the environmental and cultural impact of what we eat.

Under Maria's leadership, The Salt was recognized as Publication of the Year in 2018 by the James Beard Foundation. With her colleagues on the food team, Godoy won the 2012 James Beard Award for best food blog. The Salt was also awarded first place in the blog category from the Association of Food Journalists in 2013, and it won a Gracie Award for Outstanding Blog from the Alliance for Women in Media Foundation in 2013.

Previously, Godoy oversaw political, national, and business coverage for NPR.org. Her work as part of NPR's reporting teams has been recognized with several awards, including two prestigious Alfred I. DuPont-Columbia University Silver Batons: one for coverage of the role of race in the 2008 presidential election, and another for a series about the sexual abuse of Native American women. The latter series was also awarded the Columbia Journalism School's Dart Award for excellence in reporting on trauma, and a Gracie Award.

In 2010, Godoy and her colleagues were awarded a Gracie Award for her work on a series exploring the science of spirituality. She was also part of a team that won the 2007 Nancy Dickerson Whitehead Award for Excellence in Reporting on Drug and Alcohol Issues.

Godoy was a 2008 Ethics fellow at the Poynter Institute. She joined NPR in 2003 as a digital news editor.

Born in Guatemala, Godoy now lives in the suburbs of Washington, DC, with her husband and two kids. She's a sucker for puns (and has won a couple of awards for her punning headlines).


----------



## Shad Rap

SConner said:


> https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2020/06/21/880832213/yes-wearing-masks-helps-heres-why


Help and prevent are two different things...bottom line is people are wearing masks and still contracting the virus...just like people in full PPE are contracting the virus too...the cloth facemasks stop absolutely nothing...and the surgical masks are basically a joke too.
They did a study awhile back and came to the conclusion that a 'shop towel' actually filtered the most microns compared to ANY mask...
The cloth masks that you see everyone and their brother wearing stopped nothing...


----------



## SConner

https://www.businessinsider.com/face-masks-effective-in-protecting-against-coronavirus-2020-6


----------



## SConner

https://www.healthaffairs.org/doi/10.1377/hlthaff.2020.00818


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Unfortunately for all of us SConner, we can all counter each other’s post all day long with different articles all over the Internet. Whoever is right or wrong we all need to hope everything clears up with all that is going on in the country right now. Actually IMO I feel we do have way more important things going on other than this virus. Lots of other killers out there if you think about it and unfortunately there are probably more to come. Either way... Stay safe and keep those eyes in the back of your head.


----------



## crestliner TS

So we have groups of scientists and health experts saying one thing and different groups of scientists and health experts saying the opposite. All about equally educated. How can that be? Do any of them know what they are talikng about? Are they just guessing? Do they want us all confused and feuding with each other for some reason? Is it political? Is the media not reporting fairly and accurately and why not? Is it really impossible for the advanced health care system in the USA and all the highly educated health experts to know if a mask of certain materials can keep us from getting a virus? A mask, a piece of cloth, how much of a scientist do you need to be to understand if cotton fibers can keep out a virus? Did they not cover that in medical school? Are we being played? hmmmmmmmmmm


----------



## OptOutside440

It looks like we all are still alive?! The sky wasn't falling like I thought it was back in April.


----------



## night vision

Google any three numbers followed by the words New Cases.


----------



## crestliner TS

night vision said:


> Google any three numbers followed by the words New Cases.


WTF? I did many combinations and all I can say is thats crazy! whats going on here with google?


----------



## cement569

crestliner ts, to answer your question ....are we being played?.....like a fiddle


----------



## KaGee

So, Fauci said last week that he lied about masks being useless.
Funny how you don't see any headlines "Fauci lied and people died".

Either he was lying then or he's lying now. Whatever, he's now a documented liar.
We can't believe anything he says here on out.


----------



## jrose

multi species angler said:


> Too bad the 114,000 that died weren't given that choice!


They died with covid, not necessarily from it.


----------



## cement569

kagee, you hit it right on the head. alot of these experts and doctors are back tracking on things they have said, guess they are running out of lies. kinda reminds me of the old gangster movies where the detectives would take a suspect into a dark room and shine a light in his eyes and ask him the same questions over and over again untill he cracked....lol


----------



## loves2fishinohio

None of these "experts" has a friggin clue. How many great scientists around the global have been working on this for half a year now and they still don't completely understand the virus, let alone are close to a cure.


----------



## Burkcarp1

loves2fishinohio said:


> None of these "experts" has a friggin clue. How many great scientists around the global have been working on this for half a year now and they still don't completely understand the virus, let alone are close to a cure.


And then some people hang on to every word they say as gospel....


----------



## SConner

OptOutside440 said:


> It looks like we all are still alive?! The sky wasn't falling like I thought it was back in April.


Except for the 120,000 that aren’t


----------



## bad luck

Burkcarp1 said:


> And then some people hang on to every word they say as gospel....


Exactly!! 

Great example was kindly provided right awahy...... "except for 120,000 who aren't...." 

Funny how during the time those 120K passed away, NOBODY died of cancer, heart disease, regular flu, etc..... during that time frame........quite frankly anything that COULD have caused a cough was chalked up as anything other covid ....gee, wonder if there is some sort of coincidence there or COULD nobody have really died from anything else in that time frame?


----------



## SConner

bad luck said:


> Exactly!!
> 
> Great example was kindly provided right awahy...... "except for 120,000 who aren't...."
> 
> Funny how during the time those 120K passed away, NOBODY died of cancer, heart disease, regular flu, etc..... during that time frame........quite frankly anything that COULD have caused a cough was chalked up as anything other covid ....gee, wonder if there is some sort of coincidence there or COULD nobody have really died from anything else in that time frame?


Last I knew the other diseases were not the topic of this thread.


----------



## Burkcarp1

SConner said:


> Last I knew the other diseases were not the topic of this thread.


Other diseases are Very much involved With the virus..


----------



## jrose

SConner said:


> Except for the 120,000 that aren’t


Approximately 900,000 people have died in the United States since February ( including the COVID deaths), all death is tragic.


----------



## Lewzer

Burkcarp1 said:


> Other diseases are Very much involved With the virus..



See my earlier post about a coworker’s f-I-l. Cause of death was listed as covid when his death had nothing to do with covid. No positive covid test either. $$$$$$$$$$


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Wife’s coworker’s brother has prostate cancer. He went in for the a surgery with a covid test prior and he was like, well what about the results of the covers test. They told him results aren’t back yet and the results didn’t matter, were going to do the surgery anyway.... $$$$$$$$


----------



## SConner

jrose said:


> Approximately 900,000 people have died in the United States since February ( including the COVID deaths), all death is tragic.


Agreed


----------



## Snakecharmer

$$$$$$$$ $ I'll raise you one.


----------



## CHOPIQ

With all the money the hospitals are getting for each positive covid diagnosis and covid death wait about 6 months after this is over and you’ll see a lot of new medical buildings going up.


----------



## multi species angler

REEL GRIP said:


> My wife is a RN at Summa, in maternity, post pardon, labor and delivery.
> They have a wing set up for Covid patients only. They have had only 1 patient
> since day 1.


 That's great. A very fortunate community indeed.


----------



## multi species angler

The head of the local health department in Springfield, Mo., reported that after two hair stylists tested positive for the coronavirus, none of the 140 clients and six co-workers potentially exposed came down with COVID-19. As _The Washington Post _reports, officials said the two hair stylists wore cloth masks.


----------



## buckeyebowman

cement569 said:


> was at an antique shop this morning, as i deal in antiques. well the owner was talking to a lady who was buying something and they knew each other she was from the youngstown area and she asked her about how the flu was hitting her hospital where she worked. her answer.....3 cases in 3 weeks. this from the horses mouth not the media


Yep! I check the COVID numbers every day in the paper. New cases are way down, and deaths are way down. Even in extended care facilities. The two problem areas seem to be the prisons in Elkton and Leavittsburg.


----------



## SConner

buckeyebowman said:


> Yep! I check the COVID numbers every day in the paper. New cases are way down, and deaths are way down. Even in extended care facilities. The two problem areas seem to be the prisons in Elkton and Leavittsburg.


Do you mind telling me what paper and what date you saw this, it is odd that it does don’t correspond with graph below showing cases on the rise with the highest daily total since May 1st, or were you just speaking of Ohio? There are many southern and western states with dramatic spikes. This has been somewhat offset by reduction in states hit hard early that took remedial actions and are doing better now than most states... Ohio included.


----------



## REEL GRIP

I heard on the news Saturday that Akron U started testing their
football players for up and coming season and 24 of 46 tested positive.
Thats scary!


----------



## Snakecharmer

REEL GRIP said:


> I heard on the news Saturday that Akron U started testing their
> football players for up and coming season and 24 of 46 tested positive.
> Thats scary!


It doesn't look good for college football IMO.


----------



## Wow

*Funny thing about facts*............you can deny them..........You can cry about them.........You can attack the source..........You can change the subject..........You can blow smoke.............You can make up your own to fit your opinion. 
But without reputable sources, *you can't change them.*

It's pathetic.


*Ohio’s 45,537 coronavirus cases; daily increase highest in a month*

Updated 3:34 PM; Today 3:33 PM 
https://www.cleveland.com/datacentr...-cases-daily-increase-highest-in-a-month.html

So, Ohio is on the rise again. No surprise here. ...........And we were one of the most careful states in the union. Except for the anti-maskers.
What do you think September is going to look like?

Please protect your families and neighbors--Tim


----------



## yonderfishin

PARANOIA .......and lies

Ive gone from being concerned about the virus to not being concerned at all. False test results are somewhat common , and considering the huge amout of people I work with or come in contact with not a single one has come down with covid or tested positive......not possible if the virus is what they say it is. If it looks like a duck , walks like a duck and sounds like a duck......its a duck , or a big scam ! Im not falling for it anymore. Health organizations and the media may not even realize it but they are perpetuating lies and false information. They are reciting a script , not facts ( truth ). The biggest and most costly HOAX in history.


----------



## Drake12321

it would be great to get back to work as soon as possible, I can’t go anywhere to go fishing


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## crestliner TS

multi species angler said:


> The head of the local health department in Springfield, Mo., reported that after two hair stylists tested positive for the coronavirus, none of the 140 clients and six co-workers potentially exposed came down with COVID-19. As _The Washington Post _reports, officials said the two hair stylists wore cloth masks.


Noone got infected because the infection rate is miniscule, regardless if they were wearing masks or not.


----------



## crestliner TS

SConner said:


> Do you mind telling me what paper and what date you saw this, it is odd that it does don’t correspond with graph below showing cases on the rise with the highest daily total since May 1st, or were you just speaking of Ohio? There are many southern and western states with dramatic spikes. This has been somewhat offset by reduction in states hit hard early that took remedial actions and are doing better now than most states... Ohio included.
> View attachment 363317


Because they are testing more people, you have to look at the % not the totals.


----------



## crestliner TS

REEL GRIP said:


> I heard on the news Saturday that Akron U started testing their
> football players for up and coming season and 24 of 46 tested positive.
> Thats scary!


How many showed symptoms? Did any get sick or did they just have and not even know it? The media never mentions this! (wonder why?)Do you know what Herd immunization is? The more people that get it and recover or just let it run through and show no symptoms the better. That is how society fights a virus, through the acclamation of Herd immunization. This is VERY important to know!


----------



## crestliner TS

Wow said:


> *Funny thing about facts*............you can deny them..........You can cry about them.........You can attack the source..........You can change the subject..........You can blow smoke.............You can make up your own to fit your opinion.
> But without reputable sources, *you can't change them.*
> 
> It's pathetic.
> 
> 
> *Ohio’s 45,537 coronavirus cases; daily increase highest in a month*
> 
> Updated 3:34 PM; Today 3:33 PM
> https://www.cleveland.com/datacentr...-cases-daily-increase-highest-in-a-month.html
> 
> So, Ohio is on the rise again. No surprise here. ...........And we were one of the most careful states in the union. Except for the anti-maskers.
> What do you think September is going to look like?
> 
> Please protect your families and neighbors--Tim


Again! Because of more testing! Why can't people understand this? Or are you just ignoring THIS fact?


----------



## bad luck

https://www.mercurynews.com/2020/06...us-new-study-suggests-lower-than-we-perceive/

Copy/pasted from article ..

_The study found a person in a typical medium to large U.S. county who has a single random contact with another person has, on average, a *1 in 3,836 chance of being infected without social distancing, hand-washing or mask-wearing.*

If that sounds like a tolerable risk, consider the odds of being hospitalized. The study found a *50-to-64-year-old person who has a single random contact has, on average, a 1 in 852,000 chance of being hospitalized or a 1 in 19.1 million chance of dying based on rates as of the last week of May.*_



Mind you, critics of this are also critical of other studies that have shown it as not as dangerous as advertised


----------



## SConner

crestliner TS said:


> Again! Because of more testing! Why can't people understand this? Or are you just ignoring THIS fact?


Go back and read post who I asked, he said nothing about the infection rate he said “new cases”.


----------



## Shad Rap

Wow said:


> *Funny thing about facts*............you can deny them..........You can cry about them.........You can attack the source..........You can change the subject..........You can blow smoke.............You can make up your own to fit your opinion.
> But without reputable sources, *you can't change them.*
> 
> It's pathetic.
> 
> 
> *Ohio’s 45,537 coronavirus cases; daily increase highest in a month*
> 
> Updated 3:34 PM; Today 3:33 PM
> https://www.cleveland.com/datacentr...-cases-daily-increase-highest-in-a-month.html
> 
> So, Ohio is on the rise again. No surprise here. ...........And we were one of the most careful states in the union. Except for the anti-maskers.
> What do you think September is going to look like?
> 
> Please protect your families and neighbors--Tim


What do you mean??..all the rioters and protesters had masks on...this is more than likely what's contributed to the spike also, if there was one...it's not just because Ohio is opened up...it's because of numerous things...
On a side note I hear the virus has seemed to lose steam in Italy...doctors are saying older people that get this virus recently aren't dying like they were a couple months ago...they are saying it's weakened...(no source)


----------



## Snakecharmer

CHOPIQ said:


> With all the money the hospitals are getting for each positive covid diagnosis and covid death wait about 6 months after this is over and you’ll see a lot of new medical buildings going up.


I doubt it... ( From 6/23/2020 Plain Dealer)


Cleveland Clinic is taking cost-reduction measures, including eliminating raises and delaying some capital projects, in reaction to more than $500 million in revenue shortfalls and increased expenses caused by the coronavirus pandemic, the health system said.

The Clinic also reduced operating costs by restricting travel and changing how it manages paid time off, the health system said.

''For the first time since the effects of the 2007–09 recession, the Cleveland Clinic has announced that it will not give pay raises in 2020,'' a Clinic statement said. ''Our priority is to preserve jobs and not reduce pay for our caregivers. This does not change or devalue the hard work of our caregivers and the commitment they have shown, especially during the COVID-19 pandemic.''

Cleveland Clinic reported an operating loss of $39.9 million in the first quarter of this year, which Clinic chief financial officer Steven Glass attributed ''entirely'' to COVID19, according to Crain's Cleveland Business. That loss compares with a $36.2 million net income for the same period last year.

Glass said he did not expect the Clinic — a non-profit institution — to return to profitability this year, according to Crain's.


----------



## Workingman

I'm not really concerned about "new cases". In fact it may be good because the virus can run its course and we get closer to "herd immunity ". As long as there aren't tons dying from it and health care is not overwhelmed I'd say things are working out. I guess headlines about new cases grab attention though.


----------



## SConner

bad luck said:


> https://www.mercurynews.com/2020/06...us-new-study-suggests-lower-than-we-perceive/
> 
> Copy/pasted from article ..
> 
> _The study found a person in a typical medium to large U.S. county who has a single random contact with another person has, on average, a *1 in 3,836 chance of being infected without social distancing, hand-washing or mask-wearing.*
> 
> If that sounds like a tolerable risk, consider the odds of being hospitalized. The study found a *50-to-64-year-old person who has a single random contact has, on average, a 1 in 852,000 chance of being hospitalized or a 1 in 19.1 million chance of dying based on rates as of the last week of May.*_
> 
> 
> 
> Mind you, critics of this are also critical of other studies that have shown it as not as dangerous as advertised


Interesting read, I look forward to peer review. There was one statistic I was struggling with fully grasping. The 1 in 3836 chance of contracting from a single random exposure. Based on confirmed cases, this would imply most have had a lot of exposures prior to contracting? I will have to do some further math, I am admittedly struggling with understanding the implication of this. Thank you for providing the information.


----------



## crestliner TS

Just got this email, https://mailchi.mp/361be50f4412/votevitale-4258772?e=7fb95f8388

OSHA, the Occupational Safety and Health Administration has declared both CLOTH and SURGICAL masks will “NOT PROTECT THE WEARER AGAINST AIRBORNE TRANSMISSIBLE INFECTIOUS AGENTS.”


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

So I had a follow up to my scan with my Oncologist this morning. Temp at the door, still have to wear a mask. One thing has changed at the cancer center, you’re now allowed to take one person with you to your appointments which is a good thing. I hope the hospitals are doing this now as the poor people that are sick and that have passed being alone has to be awful. But anyway doc comes in and I went to shake his hand, I was like ooops sorry about that. No gloves. He grabbed my hand and said don’t worry about it, it’s no big deal. FWIW.


----------



## bobk

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> So I had a follow up to my scan with my Oncologist this morning. Temp at the door, still have to wear a mask. One thing has changed at the cancer center, you’re now allowed to take one person with you to your appointments which is a good thing. I hope the hospitals are doing this now as the poor people that are sick and that have passed being alone has to be awful. But anyway doc comes in and I went to shake his hand, I was like ooops sorry about that. No gloves. He grabbed my hand and said don’t worry about it, it’s no big deal. FWIW.


I’ve caught myself putting my hand out to shake customers hands that I haven’t seen in 3 months. I met a member here during turkey season and I shook his hand. I felt bad after doing it not knowing his stance on the whole thing. It’s hard to break polite habits. Hope the doc visit was good news for ya.


----------



## Saugeyefisher

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> So I had a follow up to my scan with my Oncologist this morning. Temp at the door, still have to wear a mask. One thing has changed at the cancer center, you’re now allowed to take one person with you to your appointments which is a good thing. I hope the hospitals are doing this now as the poor people that are sick and that have passed being alone has to be awful. But anyway doc comes in and I went to shake his hand, I was like ooops sorry about that. No gloves. He grabbed my hand and said don’t worry about it, it’s no big deal. FWIW.


I was in a hospital from Monday morning at 8am to Tues about 3pm. I was also aloud one "support person" thru my procedure. She had to leave by 8 an was aloud back in at 8 the next morning. 
They took temps of everybody going in. Provided everybody with a facemask. Anytime I left my recovery room I had to have a face mask on. Half the doctors shook my hands the other half introduced themselves from a distance,but I was laying in bed recovering at this time,soooo.... 
It was quiet. They told me the covid area was a seperate wing of the hospital in an area that had it's own seperate heating/cooling and didnt share any venting or duct work,lol not sure how tru that was but have no reason to question them. 
They have made all my follow ups either in home care or at an office outside of the main hospital facility in columbus. 

The cafeteria was open to all. It was my first over night stay in a hospital, but from visiting the hospital pre covid days,it was different. 
My procedure did have to be approved. And I was told by my surgeon he is doing alot of surgeries the next few weeks. 

No real reason for posting this. Just kinda throwing it out there for anyone wondering. .


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Saugeyefisher said:


> I was in a hospital from Monday morning at 8am to Tues about 3pm. I was also aloud one "support person" thru my procedure. She had to leave by 8 an was aloud back in at 8 the next morning.
> They took temps of everybody going in. Provided everybody with a facemask. Anytime I left my recovery room I had to have a face mask on. Half the doctors shook my hands the other half introduced themselves from a distance,but I was laying in bed recovering at this time,soooo....
> It was quiet. They told me the covid area was a seperate wing of the hospital in an area that had it's own seperate heating/cooling and didnt share any venting or duct work,lol not sure how tru that was but have no reason to question them.
> They have made all my follow ups either in home care or at an office outside of the main hospital facility in columbus.
> 
> The cafeteria was open to all. It was my first over night stay in a hospital, but from visiting the hospital pre covid days,it was different.
> My procedure did have to be approved. And I was told by my surgeon he is doing alot of surgeries the next few weeks.
> 
> No real reason for posting this. Just kinda throwing it out there for anyone wondering. .


Hope all is well with ya bud.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Saugeyefisher said:


> I was in a hospital from Monday morning at 8am to Tues about 3pm. I was also aloud one "support person" thru my procedure. She had to leave by 8 an was aloud back in at 8 the next morning.
> They took temps of everybody going in. Provided everybody with a facemask. Anytime I left my recovery room I had to have a face mask on. Half the doctors shook my hands the other half introduced themselves from a distance,but I was laying in bed recovering at this time,soooo....
> It was quiet. They told me the covid area was a seperate wing of the hospital in an area that had it's own seperate heating/cooling and didnt share any venting or duct work,lol not sure how tru that was but have no reason to question them.
> They have made all my follow ups either in home care or at an office outside of the main hospital facility in columbus.
> 
> The cafeteria was open to all. It was my first over night stay in a hospital, but from visiting the hospital pre covid days,it was different.
> My procedure did have to be approved. And I was told by my surgeon he is doing alot of surgeries the next few weeks.
> 
> No real reason for posting this. Just kinda throwing it out there for anyone wondering. .


Thanks for the info. Hope you're on the way to recovery. My mother's primary care physician has his office within Hillcrest Hospital. Until 2 weeks ago, my 92 year old mother had to do it by herself as they wouldn't allow anyone outside of the patient to be in the his office area.


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## Saugeyefisher

All is great guys thanks...


----------



## yonderfishin

I also have a large family , all spread out in various states.....none of them have had or know anyone who has had covid , or tested positive. Michigan , North Carolina , Florida , Georgia , Kansas ,Texas. I myself come in contact with many truck drivers from nearly every state and work with hundreds locally. Between myself and all these family members there is no point of contact with the coronavirus or covid other than hearsay and second or third hand accounts. Where are all these people we hear about on tv and the internet ?


----------



## bobk

yonderfishin said:


> I also have a large family , all spread out in various states.....none of them have had or know anyone who has had covid , or tested positive. Michigan , North Carolina , Florida , Georgia , Kansas ,Texas. I myself come in contact with many truck drivers from nearly every state and work with hundreds locally. Between myself and all these family members there is no point of contact with the coronavirus or covid other than hearsay and second or third hand accounts. Where are all these people we hear about on tv and the internet ?


A large percentage are in nursing homes.


----------



## roundbadge

The numbers people have just concluded an 80x factor based on early undetected infections due to limited testing and asymptomatics as far back as January, mostly in March

That factor would put Ohio at nearly 4mm folks who have been exposed and once positive at some point or approx 1/3 of the Ohio pop

Keep in mind all Ohioans were living normally until Mid March 2020 when everyone went into their respective bunkers...........up until then, these 80x folks were business as usual, silent spreading, etc.

If these numbers have any merit, then Ohio is at the halfway point.............as much as Acton was unliked, her science may end up correct when she mentioned 50-70% will encounter the bug


----------



## multi species angler

Screwed up.


----------



## multi species angler

crestliner TS said:


> masks will “NOT PROTECT THE WEARER AGAINST AIRBORNE TRANSMISSIBLE INFECTIOUS AGENTS.”


 Once again, the point of wearing a mask is so asymptomatic people don't unknowingly spread the virus to others. But a mask will protect the wearer against the larger droplets.


----------



## SConner

This seems like reasonable common sense analysis/observations.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/how-ex..._CR2_lPEpoJkJAZ5HLFgUIepWDLlxmwndOPErNflRDJIA


----------



## PapawSmith

SConner said:


> This seems like reasonable common sense analysis/observations.
> 
> https://www.wsj.com/articles/how-ex..._CR2_lPEpoJkJAZ5HLFgUIepWDLlxmwndOPErNflRDJIA


Haha, a WSJ link, I love it. You might get it, I might get it, a thousand others here might get it, but are you going to pay $25K so each of our members can read it?


----------



## SConner

PapawSmith said:


> Haha, a WSJ link, I love it. You might get it, I might get it, a thousand others here might get it, but are you going to pay $25K so each of our members can read it?


So you are saying I lacked understanding of my audience? That is fair


----------



## cement569

lets see here, first it was zoo animals getting the flu, then came our family pets getting the flu and just 2 days ago atlantic salmon getting the flu. they are running out of lies.....fake pandemic


----------



## Snakecharmer

SConner said:


> So you are saying I lacked understanding of my audience? That is fair


When I clicked on the link, they want me to buy a subscription to read it.


----------



## SConner

Snakecharmer said:


> When I clicked on the link, they want me to buy a subscription to read it.


Try clearing your cache (browser history, cookies). It may give you a couple free articles by clearing out cookies.


----------



## buckeyebowman

SConner said:


> Do you mind telling me what paper and what date you saw this, it is odd that it does don’t correspond with graph below showing cases on the rise with the highest daily total since May 1st, or were you just speaking of Ohio? There are many southern and western states with dramatic spikes. This has been somewhat offset by reduction in states hit hard early that took remedial actions and are doing better now than most states... Ohio included.
> View attachment 363317


The numbers I was talking about were for the local, Mahoning valley area only! The paper did make note of the fact that Ohio cases are rising, and for some reason in SW Ohio in particular. I quoted a post about the local area and was agreeing with it.


----------



## SConner

buckeyebowman said:


> The numbers I was talking about were for the local, Mahoning valley area only! The paper did make note of the fact that Ohio cases are rising, and for some reason in SW Ohio in particular. I quoted a post about the local area and was agreeing with it.


Thank you for the info. The SW Ohio stats do not surprise me.... I live here and observationally think most don’t believe there is a virus, based on behavior (failure to take rational precautions in public). Also 225 + positives from one Dole plant in Springfield out of 869 employees tested tends to throw the weekly statistics out of whack. Which makes me wonder why people still believe it is almost impossible to get. Just get a few positives in confined workspace and it balloons quickly.


----------



## Snakecharmer

yonderfishin said:


> I also have a large family , all spread out in various states.....none of them have had or know anyone who has had covid , or tested positive. Michigan , North Carolina , Florida , Georgia , Kansas ,Texas. I myself come in contact with many truck drivers from nearly every state and work with hundreds locally. Between myself and all these family members there is no point of contact with the coronavirus or covid other than hearsay and second or third hand accounts. Where are all these people we hear about on tv and the internet ?


There is a member on here from Newark that had it for 2 weeks. It wasn't fun for him.


----------



## 1more

I work in a office with 12 others and we employ 67 employees. We are a fairly large plumbing company and do multi family, hotels remodels and service work. 6 weeks ago 1 of our multi family jobs was shut down because the elevator operator was tested positive for Covid. It shut the job down for 2 weeks and guess what no one else tested positive...it’s all back to normal here and not 1 employe has had any symptoms and we test temps daily!
Life goes on and enjoy it while we can.


----------



## yonderfishin

Snakecharmer said:


> There is a member on here from Newark that had it for 2 weeks. It wasn't fun for him.



Not trying to say I dont believe that , but we have all had the flu for a week or two and it wasnt fun for any of us. The tests give false positives , so .....just sayin I would consider that a maybe. If it was a bonafide case of covid then I can finally say that in the thousands of people I or my family have had some sort of contact with and talked to or had any connection to whatsoever , ....finally one person had it. Just saying if this was even half the virus they claim it to be , pretty much all of us would personally know one or more who had it.


----------



## cement569

i have enjoyed everybodys input on this flu so far good or bad. but this morning at daybreak i was wading the willows by the railroad bed at berlin, caught 7 eyes only 3 keepers 16 to 19 in. got home and upon further inspection found no virus on any of them.....thank you and goodnight


----------



## PapawSmith

Snakecharmer said:


> There is a member on here from Newark that had it for 2 weeks. It wasn't fun for him.


I know of literally hundreds of folks that have tested positive for this virus, but I know of zero people that have ever been sick. I personally had it, tested IGM POS on a blood test, and did the two week quarantine as directed. I never showed any symptoms whatsoever the entire time. 12 days into my quarantine the State Health Dept called me to tell me that I could go off quarantine because they had determined that if you did not have a fever, and we’re not coughing or sneezing, if you had no obvious symptoms, you ARE NOT CONTAGIOUS and a danger to no one! how do you like that? And it was the same health dept that Dr Amy Atkins heads up and, at the very same time she was on the radio every day telling everyone how contagious they are, even if you think you aren’t sick. What do you think of that? Exact same call went to one of our employees that tested positive also, about three days after me. This entire event has been a coordinated exercises in BULLSHIT in my opinion. I did not start out feeling that way, but the FACTS have convinced me that this is what it is. Since I was diagnosed as positive I spent a good bit of time really digging into the actual statistics of this event and it is VERY easy to determine that 80% or more of the deaths attributed to this virus were deaths that would have occurred anyway had this virus never been identified . This is not something that anyone of age with an existing significant respiratory illness wants to be exposed to, but for 99.9% of the folks in this country this is nothing more than total bullshit. Sorry, but that is the reality that I have come to understand. Do you want to see some real bullshit? Go to Google and type in any number you want, followed by “new cases” and see what happens. Type in 300 , 3,000, or 30,000, or 62,500, or 165,500, anything you want followed by “new cases” and see what your media shows you. They will show you the exact bullshit you are looking for, just try it.


----------



## crestliner TS

roundbadge said:


> The numbers people have just concluded an 80x factor based on early undetected infections due to limited testing and asymptomatics as far back as January, mostly in March
> 
> That factor would put Ohio at nearly 4mm folks who have been exposed and once positive at some point or approx 1/3 of the Ohio pop
> 
> Keep in mind all Ohioans were living normally until Mid March 2020 when everyone went into their respective bunkers...........up until then, these 80x folks were business as usual, silent spreading, etc.
> 
> If these numbers have any merit, then Ohio is at the halfway point.............as much as Acton was unliked, her science may end up correct when she mentioned 50-70% will encounter the bug


You dnot know what Herd Immunization is do you?


----------



## crestliner TS

multi species angler said:


> Once again, the point of wearing a mask is so asymptomatic people don't unknowingly spread the virus to others. But a mask will protect the wearer against the larger droplets.


 You can also accomplish that by not coughing or sneezing on people and social distancing. I did not capitalize that post, it came that way. Dont want you to think I am yelling. I just copied and pasted.


----------



## Snakecharmer

You do know how Google works don't you?


----------



## roundbadge

You dnot know what Herd Immunization is do you?

sure do, but you don't know if resultant antibodies remain effective

Nice try though..............be less caustic


----------



## crestliner TS

The seasonal flu mutates every year and I'm sure the China virus will also. But once we develop herd immunization as a society the only people that will need vaccines are the sick and elderly. That's how herd immunization works we all need to catch it first we don't worry about the effects of antibodies that we develop at the present time. Just so you know

Sent from my SM-N950F using Tapatalk


----------



## roundbadge

"That's how herd immunization works"

Please stop presuming things and trying to educate me

*Once it is determined* that recovered positives can't spread anymore, then the contagiousness declines

As of now, there is no proof that recoveries become immune............the key is less spreaders

One good piece of information was subsequent testing of recoveries and the virus remnants being shed were not alive/active, which experts hope makes them unable to spread it further

Has nothing to do with antibodies and becoming immune.............


----------



## BFG

I believe it was early last week where the guidance came forward whereby anyone in Ohio who wanted to get a COVID19 test could do so, symptomatic or not. That in itself will lead to an increase in cases as asymptomatic folks find out they have COVID, whereas otherwise they would have never known. This is a good thing, as those folks can keep to themselves for a few days to reduce the risk of incidentally spreading it. Ohio has seen an uptick in cases in the past week, but the fact remains that the data still shows 1 out of 10 tests is positive. That's a 90% negative test rate. We've had almost 4,000 new cases in the last week, but less than 400 hospitalizations. Once again..of the 10% that test positive, only 10% of them are hospitalized. The same data applies to the entire Country. That data was much higher for hospitalizations at the inception of the pandemic. Reason being, those who were being exposed were the most vulnerable in the population where the outbreaks were occurring. How many of the Dole vegetable plant employees have been hospitalized? Have any died? How many of the Marion prison inmates and staff were hospitalized? The last I knew of that data set only 2 had perished, but there may have been more. Nonetheless, it was THE news story for a few days in Ohio and across the Country. 

Here is an interesting chart to review: (Ohio)

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/testing/individual-states/ohio

And the entire USA:

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/testing/individual-states/usa

More than 28,000,000 tests have been performed in the United States. 2,300,000 positives, and 25,700,000 negatives (approximate on both but close). 8% positive rate. Those charts do not lie, and Johns Hopkins has been the leading source of data for all of this since day 1. Of the 2.3 million positives, we have approximately 120,000 deaths, which equates to a 5% death rate from infection. For every 10 positives, .5 of a person dies. Flip that to say, for every 10 positives, 9.5 of them survive. Which method draws more attention? Which method imparts more fear? Note which data is presented first (positive cases, increase in cases, hospital admissions), and which data you must dig to find (total tests, total negatives, death trends). There is definitely a narrative at work here, an it's far beyond "reporting the facts." 

Florida now has over 100,000 positive cases, more than twice that of Ohio, yet their deaths are less than 25% higher than Ohio. Why? I would like to see the data of the average age of the positives for Florida vs. Ohio. I would also like to see the hospitalization data as well. There is a huge difference between 10,000 positive tests among people ages 18-40 vs. 10,000 positives among people ages 55-90. If the vast majority (statistically speaking) who contract COVID19 recover from it, then why did we go to the lengths that we did? I can't answer that, but I'll guarantee you that if some semblance of a "second wave" of outbreaks occurs in the fall, there will be far less compliance from the general masses in regard to shutting things down. 

I feel for anyone who is affected by this virus. It is the ultimate nail in the coffin for many. To say things like "they would have died within the year anyway" is callous and insensitive. Having said that, I don't believe that we need to be walking around in cloth masks, as most folks aren't wearing them properly in the first place, nor are they social distancing. If this virus was truly as deadly for everyone as we have been lead to believe since March, there would be millions dead in this Country for the exact reason that I pointed out in the previous sentence. 

Trying to stay as apolitical as possible here, the virus was the perfect weapon to divide our Nation. Not saying the virus is not real, what I'm saying is that neighbors who were once friends now are at odds over wearing/not wearing a mask, going to a ballgame, or hanging out in the backyard. This virus has weakened the United States of America...unlike any other issue in our history.


----------



## multi species angler

crestliner TS said:


> You can also accomplish that by not coughing or sneezing on people and social distancing. I did not capitalize that post, it came that way. Dont want you to think I am yelling. I just copied and pasted.


The droplets can be spread just by breathing or talking.
And it's OK to yell at me, I'm hard of hearing.


----------



## cement569

i think BFG made a very good observation, the use of fear can divide and control people


----------



## multi species angler

If increased testing finds 1000 new positive cases it eventually will lead to lower infections by getting the new cases off the street thereby preventing them from causing 1000's of new cases.


----------



## multi species angler

I posted this in the thread County Fairs ( I wear a mask because ALL LIVES MATTER), I'm starting a movement.


----------



## KaGee

multi species angler said:


> I posted this in the thread County Fairs ( I wear a mask because ALL LIVES MATTER), I'm starting a movement.


Symbolism over Substance


----------



## jrose

BFG said:


> I believe it was early last week where the guidance came forward whereby anyone in Ohio who wanted to get a COVID19 test could do so, symptomatic or not. That in itself will lead to an increase in cases as asymptomatic folks find out they have COVID, whereas otherwise they would have never known. This is a good thing, as those folks can keep to themselves for a few days to reduce the risk of incidentally spreading it. Ohio has seen an uptick in cases in the past week, but the fact remains that the data still shows 1 out of 10 tests is positive. That's a 90% negative test rate. We've had almost 4,000 new cases in the last week, but less than 400 hospitalizations. Once again..of the 10% that test positive, only 10% of them are hospitalized. The same data applies to the entire Country. That data was much higher for hospitalizations at the inception of the pandemic. Reason being, those who were being exposed were the most vulnerable in the population where the outbreaks were occurring. How many of the Dole vegetable plant employees have been hospitalized? Have any died? How many of the Marion prison inmates and staff were hospitalized? The last I knew of that data set only 2 had perished, but there may have been more. Nonetheless, it was THE news story for a few days in Ohio and across the Country.
> 
> Here is an interesting chart to review: (Ohio)
> 
> https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/testing/individual-states/ohio
> 
> And the entire USA:
> 
> https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/testing/individual-states/usa
> 
> More than 28,000,000 tests have been performed in the United States. 2,300,000 positives, and 25,700,000 negatives (approximate on both but close). 8% positive rate. Those charts do not lie, and Johns Hopkins has been the leading source of data for all of this since day 1. Of the 2.3 million positives, we have approximately 120,000 deaths, which equates to a 5% death rate from infection. For every 10 positives, .5 of a person dies. Flip that to say, for every 10 positives, 9.5 of them survive. Which method draws more attention? Which method imparts more fear? Note which data is presented first (positive cases, increase in cases, hospital admissions), and which data you must dig to find (total tests, total negatives, death trends). There is definitely a narrative at work here, an it's far beyond "reporting the facts."
> 
> Florida now has over 100,000 positive cases, more than twice that of Ohio, yet their deaths are less than 25% higher than Ohio. Why? I would like to see the data of the average age of the positives for Florida vs. Ohio. I would also like to see the hospitalization data as well. There is a huge difference between 10,000 positive tests among people ages 18-40 vs. 10,000 positives among people ages 55-90. If the vast majority (statistically speaking) who contract COVID19 recover from it, then why did we go to the lengths that we did? I can't answer that, but I'll guarantee you that if some semblance of a "second wave" of outbreaks occurs in the fall, there will be far less compliance from the general masses in regard to shutting things down.
> 
> I feel for anyone who is affected by this virus. It is the ultimate nail in the coffin for many. To say things like "they would have died within the year anyway" is callous and insensitive. Having said that, I don't believe that we need to be walking around in cloth masks, as most folks aren't wearing them properly in the first place, nor are they social distancing. If this virus was truly as deadly for everyone as we have been lead to believe since March, there would be millions dead in this Country for the exact reason that I pointed out in the previous sentence.
> 
> Trying to stay as apolitical as possible here, the virus was the perfect weapon to divide our Nation. Not saying the virus is not real, what I'm saying is that neighbors who were once friends now are at odds over wearing/not wearing a mask, going to a ballgame, or hanging out in the backyard. This virus has weakened the United States of America...unlike any other issue in our history.


I won’t say it has weekend the U.S. as much at it has identified how many people like to be led through life without any type of critical thinking skills.


----------



## buckeyebowman

SConner said:


> Thank you for the info. The SW Ohio stats do not surprise me.... I live here and observationally think most don’t believe there is a virus, based on behavior (failure to take rational precautions in public). Also 225 + positives from one Dole plant in Springfield out of 869 employees tested tends to throw the weekly statistics out of whack. Which makes me wonder why people still believe it is almost impossible to get. Just get a few positives in confined workspace and it balloons quickly.


I've observed the same thing. Just because the state is opening up, some knuckleheads behave as if COVID has gone away, and few, or no, precautions need to be taken. Most seem to be younger folk who are sick and tired of being cooped up. I'm 67, so in a higher risk group. I wash my hands before heading to the store, wear a mask while in the store, and hit the hand sanitizer as soon as I'm back in the car. So far, so good!


----------



## 9Left

[QUOTE="PapawSmith, post: 2945143, member: 8553" I personally had it, ..... Exact same call went to one of our employees that tested positive also, about three days after me. [/QUOTE]

...yep...You had it… Three days later another employee had it… Sounds like you know what you're doing and you're not contagious…

Literally, the dumbest post I've seen on here yet


----------



## PapawSmith

9Left said:


> [QUOTE="PapawSmith, post: 2945143, member: 8553" I personally had it, ..... Exact same call went to one of our employees that tested positive also, about three days after me.


...yep...You had it… Three days later another employee had it… Sounds like you know what you're doing and you're not contagious…

Literally, the dumbest post I've seen on here yet[/QUOTE]

Sorry genius, I forgot to add, that the employee with the virus was about 400 miles away from me and I had not seen him in months. We have hundreds of folks working on our projects, and only two of us in our company ever had the virus. Love how folks create their own stories, thanks for being the dumbest post any of us have seen here yet.


----------



## 9Left

Well adding that the other employees 400 miles away might've been an important detail… Genius


----------



## Saugeye Tom

Now now boyz...its going away


----------



## 9Left

OK… I back down… Sorry for any offense


----------



## yonderfishin

There is motivation to collect positive test results , and besides that it makes an interesting news story. Add to that , the tests are not as accurate as many think they are. So I have to ask.....was your positive test result really even really positive ? .....or is it a desirable number to add to the statistics ? The world may never know if you truly were tested positive or not since you were " asymptomatic " ......a fancy term used for " you may not have had it at all " but they can call it whatever they want with impunity. 

Oh the horror stories of all the dead or dying from this terrible plague of plagues.....or so they said. * wink , wink * ... but its looking like more than 90% of the population even if they do test as so called positive , will never know because they wont have any symptoms. Seems like a clever way to cover up a huge lie to me. None of this virus episode has made any sense from the start.

Im glad I woke up , many more are starting to. Sad thing is , the damage is done


----------



## cincinnati

Walking in to the grocery yesterday & pass a guy who has just come out of the store, yanked his mask off 1 ear & is frantically gargling & spitting out bottled water. Tried not to stare too hard but it took every fiber of my being NOT to ask "WTF are you doing??" Was able to resist because I feared the answer would make my old brain explode. 

Maybe he had mistakenly licked the PIN pad while checking-out....?


----------



## bulafisherman

You boys still bickering over old news just put it down and live your lives, sun still rises in the east and sets in the west just like it has for thousands of years


----------



## bad luck

I have to rate this thread as an A + as it is certainly worth it’s weight in entertainment value alone, thanks to the mods for keeping it open!


----------



## percidaeben

So what’s happening now in Texas and Florida? Tia


----------



## buckeyebowman

A short time ago I posted about how our Mayor was fingered in a contact trace and would have to self isolate for a certain time. What do I see in the paper 2 days ago is a pic of a groundbreaking for a huge street project here, and there's the Mayor with a whole gang of folks with shovels full of dirt! Everybody was masked, but they were NOT socially distanced! I guess it's do as I say not as I do!


----------



## Burkcarp1

buckeyebowman said:


> A short time ago I posted about how our Mayor was fingered in a contact trace and would have to self isolate for a certain time. What do I see in the paper 2 days ago is a pic of a groundbreaking for a huge street project here, and there's the Mayor with a whole gang of folks with shovels full of dirt! Everybody was masked, but they were NOT socially distanced! I guess it's do as I say not as I do!


Yup, there’s been a lot of that since day one.


----------



## BFG

buckeyebowman said:


> Everybody was masked, but they were NOT socially distanced! I guess it's do as I say not as I do!


If you are socially distanced, you don't need a mask. If you can't socially distance, you need a mask.


----------



## garhtr

Give up on the info we're receiving and use common sense.
It's become a political weapon (both sides) and it's likely we will never get just the facts or the whole truth. We've become so corrupt it's going to take a larger disaster than a virus to straighten out our problems. Where is the USA ? ?
Good luck !


----------



## cement569

just caught a little of the press conf. they are saying the flu is now hitting younger people. my question is why didnt it hit them 4 months ago? my guess is the elderly and people with health conditions kinda petered out so on to a new scare tactic....unbelievable


----------



## luredaddy

cement569 said:


> just caught a little of the press conf. they are saying the flu is now hitting younger people. my question is why didnt it hit them 4 months ago? my guess is the elderly and people with health conditions kinda petered out so on to a new scare tactic....unbelievable


It is hitting younger people because the BARS have opened up, the younger people are shoulder to shoulder, no masks, having a grand old time. Florida just stopped serving alcohol TODAY in BARS and restaurants, because of a major jump to 9,000 new cases yesterday. It is not a scare tactic , it is the result of irresponsible people in the midst of a pandemic.


----------



## yonderfishin

percidaeben said:


> So what’s happening now in Texas and Florida? Tia



Increased testing ....


----------



## MIGHTY

You’re safe as long as you’re protesting it sounds like??? Makes total sense. Lol come on people


----------



## Burkcarp1

luredaddy said:


> It is hitting younger people because the BARS have opened up, the younger people are shoulder to shoulder, no masks, having a grand old time. Florida just stopped serving alcohol TODAY in BARS and restaurants, because of a major jump to 9,000 new cases yesterday. It is not a scare tactic , it is the result of irresponsible people in the midst of a pandemic.


Answer the question he asked. Why didn’t the young people get it earlier?


----------



## MagicMarker

They’ll say and do anything to keep the sheep in order


----------



## cement569

another question, this flu was here before anyone knew it, and at time frame there were children all across the country going to school and playing sports. why no outbreak then?


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

MIGHTY said:


> View attachment 363871
> View attachment 363873
> View attachment 363877
> View attachment 363875
> You’re safe as long as you’re protesting it sounds like??? Makes total sense. Lol come on people


Unfreaking believable. Sheep... but some in wolves clothing...


----------



## cement569

and while im on my soap box heres another, in april and may there were block parties and house parties across the country with thousands of young people. again why no outbreak?


----------



## luredaddy

Burkcarp1 said:


> Answer the question he asked. Why didn’t the young people get it earlier?


I did answer the question he asked. I was in Florida from January to May, the young people and everyone were locked out of the bars and restaurants from about the middle of March on. They were home reading classics like WAR AND PEACE, with the irresponsible re openings, they have put down their books and are herding into the establishments , drinking and cavorting, without masks. The young people have caught the virus since day one, but now in BIG numbers, just like the experts said they would.


----------



## BeerBatter

I love drinking and cavorting
Whatever cavorting is


----------



## Burkcarp1

luredaddy said:


> I did answer the question he asked. I was in Florida from January to May, the young people and everyone were locked out of the bars and restaurants from about the middle of March on. They were home reading classics like WAR AND PEACE, with the irresponsible re openings, they have put down their books and are herding into the establishments , drinking and cavorting, without masks. The young people have caught the virus since day one, but now in BIG numbers, just like the experts said they would.


Actually THE experts were saying back then that the young ones don’t get it.....


----------



## jerkaperch

I know three people personally that have contracted the virus. My brother was the first. He works in the prison system. It nearly killed him. He spent two weeks in OSU. He’s 50 and in great shape! 
Sunday, both of my parents tested positive. They contracted the virus at church. Both are now in OSU. They are the only people I know that have tested positive, unfortunately they are my family. If it had not effected my family directly, I’d think Covid 19 was a bunch of hogwash. 
Be careful, it is real.


----------



## multi species angler

jerkaperch said:


> I know three people personally that have contracted the virus. My brother was the first. He works in the prison system. It nearly killed him. He spent two weeks in OSU. He’s 50 and in great shape!
> Sunday, both of my parents tested positive. They contracted the virus at church. Both are now in OSU. They are the only people I know that have tested positive, unfortunately they are my family. If it had not effected my family directly, I’d think Covid 19 was a bunch of hogwash.
> Be careful, it is real.


 Will pray that your parents make a speedy recovery.


----------



## Wow

jerkaperch said:


> I know three people personally that have contracted the virus. My brother was the first. He works in the prison system. It nearly killed him. He spent two weeks in OSU. He’s 50 and in great shape!
> Sunday, both of my parents tested positive. They contracted the virus at church. Both are now in OSU. They are the only people I know that have tested positive, unfortunately they are my family. If it had not effected my family directly, I’d think Covid 19 was a bunch of hogwash.
> Be careful, it is real.


Hopefully, good genetics in your family will help them through it.--Tim


----------



## AmericanEagle

jerkaperch said:


> I know three people personally that have contracted the virus. My brother was the first. He works in the prison system. It nearly killed him. He spent two weeks in OSU. He’s 50 and in great shape!
> Sunday, both of my parents tested positive. They contracted the virus at church. Both are now in OSU. They are the only people I know that have tested positive, unfortunately they are my family. If it had not effected my family directly, I’d think Covid 19 was a bunch of hogwash.
> Be careful, it is real.


Hope your parents get out of OSU and back home ASAP.


----------



## Shad Rap

jrose said:


> I won’t say it has weekend the U.S. as much at it has identified how many people like to be led through life without any type of critical thinking skills.


There's a chunk of them on this forum too.


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

Shad Rap said:


> There's a chunk of them on this forum too.











What the deuce man, haven't you secured that Ohio Director of Public Health position yet?


----------



## buckeyebowman

Burkcarp1 said:


> Answer the question he asked. Why didn’t the young people get it earlier?


I believe he answered it quite well! I see examples of this around here! I haven't changed my behavior as far as being in public at all, while some seem to think that COVID has somehow "gone away" simply because the state is opening up! 



jerkaperch said:


> I know three people personally that have contracted the virus. My brother was the first. He works in the prison system. It nearly killed him. He spent two weeks in OSU. He’s 50 and in great shape!
> Sunday, both of my parents tested positive. They contracted the virus at church. Both are now in OSU. They are the only people I know that have tested positive, unfortunately they are my family. If it had not effected my family directly, I’d think Covid 19 was a bunch of hogwash.
> Be careful, it is real.


My Sister had it. She had felt poorly for the better part of 2 months, went to the doctor, got tested and was positive. She's been pronounced free and clear now, and recently invited my Brother and I up for the 4th of July. Today, she e-mailed to say that my Brother won't be coming. His doctor advised against it. Said it would be a bad idea for a person with COPD to be in close proximity to someone so recently infected. This now has me wondering!

First, how is it that he has COPD? He's 64 and has never smoked. I'm the guy who should have COPD, I'm 67 and I do smoke! And who knows? Maybe I do and just don't know it. Haven't been to a doctor in forever! 

And there's another consideration. These gatherings wind up with me driving home after dark. I do NOT drive at night any more! The eye doc says I need to have my cataracts taken care of sooner rather than later! 

I'd love to give my Bro, Sis and BIL a big hug! I love them all but this has me thinking about bowing out as well. This really sucks!


----------



## multi species angler

If you go, wear a mask and stay at least 6' away.

PS. I wouldn't go since you smoke and are older.


----------



## Snakecharmer

buckeyebowman said:


> And there's another consideration. These gatherings wind up with me driving home after dark. I do NOT drive at night any more! The eye doc says I need to have my cataracts taken care of sooner rather than later!
> 
> I'd love to give my Bro, Sis and BIL a big hug! I love them all but this has me thinking about bowing out as well. This really sucks!


I am in the midst of cataract surgery. Had one eye done on June 16 - now 20/20 with no glasses.. Getting the other eye on Jul 1st. Painless surgery. Could drive the next day. Have to take it easy for a week while the surgery heals. Your cataract isn't going to get better.


----------



## Muddy

jerkaperch said:


> I know three people personally that have contracted the virus. My brother was the first. He works in the prison system. It nearly killed him. He spent two weeks in OSU. He’s 50 and in great shape!
> Sunday, both of my parents tested positive. They contracted the virus at church. Both are now in OSU. They are the only people I know that have tested positive, unfortunately they are my family. If it had not effected my family directly, I’d think Covid 19 was a bunch of hogwash.
> Be careful, it is real.


Godspeed to you and your family. I hope that your parents can recover and move on. The virus is out there hunting every day. It never takes a day off, it never sleeps.


----------



## bountyhunter

get the eyes fixed painless and you can see like a 10yr old kid/ its amazing.


----------



## CharlieKelly

Behhhhhhhhhhh


----------



## Shad Rap

Stars-n-Stripers said:


> View attachment 363903
> 
> What the deuce man, haven't you secured that Ohio Director of Public Health position yet?


They said I was over-qualified..the sheep wouldn't follow me anyway...


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

You all watch out for those covid trackers. They are watching and you are being tracked. Don’t believe the hype.


----------



## meisjedog

It was thought from very early on that younger people could carry the virus and show no symptoms but then pass it on to older people. I remember thinking about this at my old job in mid-March because they employed a lot of young people who would then go out and drink together. I had an office with a door and a large glass window, so I kept the door shut and made them write notes so I could read them through the glass -heh! Yes, I realize I would still have likely caught it, I was just being a d**k.

Why is it showing up in younger people now? It likely mutated.

Where it takes only a week or so in an adult, maybe it takes months in someone who is younger. They were carriers and spread it around, but now it is their time. This would be a rather smart virus and a worst-case scenario.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Check your phones...


----------



## Snakecharmer




----------



## buckeyebowman

Snakecharmer said:


> I am in the midst of cataract surgery. Had one eye done on June 16 - now 20/20 with no glasses.. Getting the other eye on Jul 1st. Painless surgery. Could drive the next day. Have to take it easy for a week while the surgery heals. Your cataract isn't going to get better.





bountyhunter said:


> get the eyes fixed painless and you can see like a 10yr old kid/ its amazing.


Didn't know you could have one done at a time. Haven't been to converse with the cataract docs yet. It kind of scares me. But, my Mom had it done and was absolutely overjoyed with the results! Said she could see like she was a teenager!


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

montagc said:


> You have to manually activate that by downloading an app specifically for it.
> 
> Also, If any of you are seriously worried about being tracked by a Covid contact tracing app, you should realize you are already leaving a trail just by using any network connected device at all! Cameras are everywhere too...


Haha, so they say. They put it on there without most even knowing. So who knows. I don’t trust any of them even tho I need it like the rest of us.


----------



## Mattiba

Wow said:


> *Funny thing about facts*............you can deny them..........You can cry about them.........You can attack the source..........You can change the subject..........You can blow smoke.............You can make up your own to fit your opinion.
> But without reputable sources, *you can't change them.*
> 
> It's pathetic.
> 
> 
> *Ohio’s 45,537 coronavirus cases; daily increase highest in a month*
> 
> Updated 3:34 PM; Today 3:33 PM
> https://www.cleveland.com/datacentr...-cases-daily-increase-highest-in-a-month.html
> 
> So, Ohio is on the rise again. No surprise here. ...........And we were one of the most careful states in the union. Except for the anti-maskers.
> What do you think September is going to look like?
> 
> Please protect your families and neighbors--Tim


We are certain to have our numbers rise. The virus exists and we are reopening. That’s how it works. At this point The only way to get through this is exposure.


----------



## Mattiba

Snakecharmer said:


> I doubt it... ( From 6/23/2020 Plain Dealer)
> 
> 
> Cleveland Clinic is taking cost-reduction measures, including eliminating raises and delaying some capital projects, in reaction to more than $500 million in revenue shortfalls and increased expenses caused by the coronavirus pandemic, the health system said.
> 
> The Clinic also reduced operating costs by restricting travel and changing how it manages paid time off, the health system said.
> 
> ''For the first time since the effects of the 2007–09 recession, the Cleveland Clinic has announced that it will not give pay raises in 2020,'' a Clinic statement said. ''Our priority is to preserve jobs and not reduce pay for our caregivers. This does not change or devalue the hard work of our caregivers and the commitment they have shown, especially during the COVID-19 pandemic.''
> 
> Cleveland Clinic reported an operating loss of $39.9 million in the first quarter of this year, which Clinic chief financial officer Steven Glass attributed ''entirely'' to COVID19, according to Crain's Cleveland Business. That loss compares with a $36.2 million net income for the same period last year.
> 
> Glass said he did not expect the Clinic — a non-profit institution — to return to profitability this year, according to Crain's.


Not for profit means not profitable. They cannot make a profit ever, it’s against the rules of nonprofit statures.


----------



## cement569

kinda funny, we had a big spike heading into memorial day weekend. and now right ahead of 4th of july weekend another spike, i predict another big spike right around labor day weekend.


----------



## multi species angler

Yea it's hilarious  Let's see how funny it is when the state has to shut down again, mostly because of people refusing to wear a mask and social distance. It's a shame that something such as this has to be made a law just to get people to do what needs to be done.


----------



## Shad Rap

Won't happen...I'm sure another shutdown would put a smirk on some faces and an "I told ya so."..while we totally annihilate the ecomony, peoples lives, business's and jobs...sounds fun...lets do it every 2 months.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Mattiba said:


> Not for profit means not profitable. They cannot make a profit ever, it’s against the rules of nonprofit statures.


A second misconception is that nonprofit organizations may not make a profit. Although the goal of nonprofits isn't specifically to maximize profits, they still have to operate as a fiscally responsible business. They must manage their income (both grants and donations and income from services) and expenses so as to remain a fiscally viable entity. Nonprofits have the responsibility of focusing on being professional, financially responsible, replacing self-interest and profit motive with mission motive.[9]


----------



## Mattiba

Snakecharmer said:


> A second misconception is that nonprofit organizations may not make a profit. Although the goal of nonprofits isn't specifically to maximize profits, they still have to operate as a fiscally responsible business. They must manage their income (both grants and donations and income from services) and expenses so as to remain a fiscally viable entity. Nonprofits have the responsibility of focusing on being professional, financially responsible, replacing self-interest and profit motive with mission motive.[9]


Yes, but not for profit means what comes in goes out. You said profitable when talking about the Cleveland clinic and not for profit means exactly that. Sustainable would have been a better word and that’s a whole different ballgame.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Mattiba said:


> Yes, but not for profit means what comes in goes out. You said profitable when talking about the Cleveland clinic and not for profit means exactly that. Sustainable would have been a better word and that’s a whole different ballgame.


You said they could never make a profit, it was against the rules. Wrong... On a side note, I worked for a not-for-profit organization for 20+ years. We had to give our profits back to our members, non-profit organizations we supported and our communities. As long as we could prove that, we did not owe IRS taxes. Our profits allowed us to give $300 Million+ through our members and volunteers.


----------



## percidaeben

Shad Rap said:


> Won't happen...I'm sure another shutdown would put a smirk on some faces and an "I told ya so."..while we totally annihilate the ecomony, peoples lives, business's and jobs...sounds fun...lets do it every 2 months.


It’s happening in Texas and Florida. And I see nothing funny in this at all. Maybe just a lot of ignorance and arrogance.


----------



## yonderfishin

meisjedog said:


> It was thought from very early on that younger people could carry the virus and show no symptoms but then pass it on to older people. I remember thinking about this at my old job in mid-March because they employed a lot of young people who would then go out and drink together. I had an office with a door and a large glass window, so I kept the door shut and made them write notes so I could read them through the glass -heh! Yes, I realize I would still have likely caught it, I was just being a d**k.
> 
> Why is it showing up in younger people now? It likely mutated.
> 
> Where it takes only a week or so in an adult, maybe it takes months in someone who is younger. They were carriers and spread it around, but now it is their time. This would be a rather smart virus and a worst-case scenario.



Well when this all started it was winter , not much going on. But so far thats the only time frame we have for comparison. Now its summer , younger people are naturally out socializing and active more than they did back in February.


montagc said:


> You have to manually activate that by downloading an app specifically for it.
> 
> Also, If any of you are seriously worried about being tracked by a Covid contact tracing app, you should realize you are already leaving a trail just by using any network connected device at all! Cameras are everywhere too...



Of course , but now they arent just tracking you but


----------



## yonderfishin




----------



## multi species angler

After Ohio opened too fast and too soon we have went from green, good, to yellow, caution, to orange, bad. Next we will be in the red, OH SH!T. Then there will be more shutdowns and stay at home orders. And maybe they'll see that a lot of people can't be depended upon to do the right thing and wear a mask and social distance and they will mandate it. I heard one DR. say this is one of those viruses that people won't develop immunity too.


----------



## fastwater

Something to think about:





https://scitechdaily.com/bats-pango...tion-of-viral-genes-across-different-species/


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

montagc said:


> You have to manually activate that by downloading an app specifically for it.
> 
> Also, If any of you are seriously worried about being tracked by a Covid contact tracing app, you should realize you are already leaving a trail just by using any network connected device at all! Cameras are everywhere too...


If you say so...


----------



## Wow

As we have witnessed, there is little certainty with a new virus.
Only time will answer our questions.

Experience is our teacher and we *must learn the lessons*.

If you're waiting for immunity, you may have a long wait.

*"COVID-19 immunity may only last a few months"*

"*Antibodies few and short-lived, lung abnormalities found in asymptomatic carriers"
*
https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/asymptomatic-covid-19-1.5629172


Even if you are asymtomatic, you are not going unscathed.
For now, prevention, is our best course of action.--Tim


----------



## Workingman

A month from now they'll say something else! As for me, I'm getting on with my life!


----------



## cement569

3 days ago they said its affecting the young, yesterday the added 3 more symtoms. in other words they are making things up as they go, so it seems to me they are running out of lies


----------



## buckeyebowman

Mattiba said:


> Yes, but not for profit means what comes in goes out. You said profitable when talking about the Cleveland clinic and not for profit means exactly that. Sustainable would have been a better word and that’s a whole different ballgame.


I don't think the Cleveland Clinic needs to worry very much about money. They have an endowment that, I believe, is numbered in the billions of dollars! 



cement569 said:


> 3 days ago they said its affecting the young, yesterday the added 3 more symtoms. in other words they are making things up as they go, so it seems to me they are running out of lies


Think what you wish, but let me ask this question. We are confronted with a totally new, previously unknown virus. Who would you trust more. Health authorities who claim to know everything about it and know exactly what to do. Or those who say they're doing the best they can in the face of an unknown threat? 

You can phrase it the way you did, "they're making things up as they go". Or, you can phrase it differently, "they're learning as they go". Which is how most learning works.


----------



## cement569

well for the last month i have traveled the state from one end to another dealing in antiques, and talked to hundreds of people. and the flu is no. 1 topic. i met one lady who said she knew someone in her town who passed on from the flu and she was 79 years old. and why werent these symptons around when it first started? and why didnt it affect the young when it first started? im 62 years old and i dont plan on my last years living in fear......this is political warfare and nothing more, so if you do have at it


----------



## crappiedude

cement569 said:


> this is political warfare and nothing more


just can't pass up an opportunity to bring up politics...just sayin


----------



## Burkcarp1




----------



## crappiedude

Lack of complete and comprehensive stats has been the problem since day 1 of this virus.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Wow said:


> As we have witnessed, there is little certainty with a new virus.
> Only time will answer our questions.
> 
> Experience is our teacher and we *must learn the lessons*.
> 
> If you're waiting for immunity, you may have a long wait.
> 
> *"COVID-19 immunity may only last a few months"*
> 
> "*Antibodies few and short-lived, lung abnormalities found in asymptomatic carriers"*
> 
> https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/asymptomatic-covid-19-1.5629172
> 
> 
> Even if you are asymtomatic, you are not going unscathed.
> For now, prevention, is our best course of action.--Tim


H1N1 *flu causes unusual* damage to *lungs*: studies. WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The new pandemic H1N1 *flu* may *cause* blood clots and other *unusual*damage in the *lungs* and doctors need to be on the lookout, U.S. researchers reported on Thursday.Oct 15, 2009


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Summary: A protein in *influenza* virus that helps it multiply also damages *lung* epithelial cells, causing fluid buildup in the *lungs*, according to new research. ... In severe cases of *flu*, fluid accumulates in the *lungs*, making it difficult to breathe and preventing oxygen from reaching the blood stream.Jul 20, 2009


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Yep, been happening for awhile now.


----------



## buckeyebowman

cement569 said:


> well for the last month i have traveled the state from one end to another dealing in antiques, and talked to hundreds of people. and the flu is no. 1 topic. i met one lady who said she knew someone in her town who passed on from the flu and she was 79 years old. and why werent these symptons around when it first started? and why didnt it affect the young when it first started? im 62 years old and i dont plan on my last years living in fear......this is political warfare and nothing more, so if you do have at it


I'm not living in fear. I just take normal, common sense precautions. Heck played 18 holes of golf both on Saturday and Sunday. No mask when I'm outdoors. I only wear it when I'm in a store, and I put it on just before entering, and take it off as soon as I'm outside again. As soon as I'm back in the truck I hit the hand sanitizer. So far, so good.


----------



## cement569

crappiedude, that was not a political statement, that was an observation. sorry you took it the wrong way


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Well the same company that put asbestos in baby powder for years is working on a vaccine for Covid-19. Have at it fellas if you dare...


----------



## crappiedude

buckeyebowman said:


> I'm not living in fear. I just take normal, common sense precautions.


Most people I know feel pretty much the same, using caution makes sense.

It seems to me that some of the people on here not wearing masks when they go out seem like they are mad or pissed off about something. They keep saying the rest of us are afraid, I honestly don't know anyone living in fear. 
I'm guessing they keep saying it over and over cause it makes them feel tough or manly instead of sounding like they are stupid. I mean it's the same few people repeating it. 

For me I could care less what others do, it's a personal choice. Most people I see out and about don't wear masks and I'm okay with it. Just give me a little space is all I ask, it's all good.


----------



## multi species angler

It's the law that everyone has to wear a seatbelt and by not wearing one they are just putting their own life at risk. I don't like wearing a seatbelt or a mask but by not wearing a mask and social distancing other peoples lives are being put at risk not just ours. Ohio is now in the red thanks mostly to those that refuse to wear a mask and social distance. That is how this virus spreads most often. Things are going to get much worse than they have been. Then what?


----------



## Burkcarp1

multi species angler said:


> It's the law that everyone has to wear a seatbelt and by not wearing one they are just putting their own life at risk. I don't like wearing a seatbelt or a mask but by not wearing a mask and social distancing other peoples lives are being put at risk not just ours. Ohio is now in the red thanks mostly to those that refuse to wear a mask and social distance. That is how this virus spreads most often. Things are going to get much worse than they have been. Then what?


Source?


----------



## KaGee

Red state huh?

Local TV headline today.... "Lucas County sees spike in covid cases"
The "spike" was 42 cases over 3 days. No explanation other than the number of new cases.
Lucas County has over 420,000 population... Do the math. Spike? I think not. Just more scare tactics.

"Things are going to get much worse than they have been". You must be referring to the unchecked civil unrest because even Fauci isn't going that far.


----------



## multi species angler

COMMON SENSE.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

multi species angler said:


> It's the law that everyone has to wear a seatbelt and by not wearing one they are just putting their own life at risk. I don't like wearing a seatbelt or a mask but by not wearing a mask and social distancing other peoples lives are being put at risk not just ours. Ohio is now in the red thanks mostly to those that refuse to wear a mask and social distance. That is how this virus spreads most often. Things are going to get much worse than they have been. Then what?


Of course wearing a seatbelt is a law, 4.2 million motorist were injured last year with 40,000 resulting in death which is 1%. Somewhat higher than the kung flu’s death percentage.


----------



## Snakecharmer

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Of course wearing a seatbelt is a law, 4.2 million motorist were injured last year with 40,000 resulting in death which is 1%. Somewhat higher than the kung flu’s death percentage.


What are you trying to say? Are you saying wearing a seatbelt is more dangerous than Covid-19?


----------



## jrose

multi species angler said:


> After Ohio opened too fast and too soon we have went from green, good, to yellow, caution, to orange, bad. Next we will be in the red, OH SH!T. Then there will be more shutdowns and stay at home orders. And maybe they'll see that a lot of people can't be depended upon to do the right thing and wear a mask and social distance and they will mandate it. I heard one DR. say this is one of those viruses that people won't develop immunity too.


Wow!


----------



## Shad Rap

multi species angler said:


> It's the law that everyone has to wear a seatbelt and by not wearing one they are just putting their own life at risk. I don't like wearing a seatbelt or a mask but by not wearing a mask and social distancing other peoples lives are being put at risk not just ours. Ohio is now in the red thanks mostly to those that refuse to wear a mask and social distance. That is how this virus spreads most often. Things are going to get much worse than they have been. Then what?





multi species angler said:


> COMMON SENSE.


Unfortunately, it's not all that common...


----------



## Shad Rap

Snakecharmer said:


> What are you trying to say? Are you saying wearing a seatbelt is more dangerous than Covid-19?


You haven't seen yet?..they added 'wearing a seatbelt' as a symptom...the two coincide...


----------



## multi species angler

Shad Rap said:


> Unfortunately, it's not all that common...


 My thoughts exactly.


----------



## Snakecharmer

jrose said:


> I rather be on Sweden’s path, but they are a much smaller country. Wonder how they handle travel across their border? Lots of variables to deal with.


Still like Sweden's path?....Their death's per million is 532 compared to USA 395. Ours is nothing to write home about.


----------



## UNCLEMIKE

Snakecharmer said:


> Still like Sweden's path?....Their death's per million is 532 compared to USA 395. Ours is nothing to write home about.


I do like Swedens path. In hind sight …. My opinion is we should have done the same other than in the New York area. All we put the country thru and for what. As soon as we open we are back to square one. Protect the old and infirm and let the young and healthy create our herd immunity. Like it or not that is where we are headed anyway. Not a lot of options. Can't put the toothpaste back in the tube. The "experts" have lost their credibility and without it people will not be locked down again.


----------



## lunder

Does herd immunity always happen? How did that work out for the Native Americans between 1600-1700. Why did they get so excited about a polio vaccine back in the 1950's? Just needed some good 'ole herd immunity is all!


----------



## hailtothethief

Hard to compare malnourished native americans to modern day fat americans.


----------



## Burkcarp1

https://www.tcpalm.com/story/news/2...anipulate-covid-19-data-and-fired/5221921002/


----------



## Wow

Burkcarp1 said:


> https://www.tcpalm.com/story/news/2...anipulate-covid-19-data-and-fired/5221921002/


Funny how the people in power will mis-inform first.
If that doesn't work, they will dis-inform.

When somebody on their own staff calls them out, they kill the message, by killing the messenger.

We owe it to ourselves to let the truth reach the light of day, so we can judge for ourselves.

Wonder why things are getting worse instead of better?--Tim


----------



## Patricio

Snakecharmer said:


> Still like Sweden's path?....Their death's per million is 532 compared to USA 395. Ours is nothing to write home about.


Disingenuous. Every state has had their own way of dealing with it. You need to look closer.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

lunder said:


> Does herd immunity always happen? How did that work out for the Native Americans between 1600-1700. Why did they get so excited about a polio vaccine back in the 1950's? Just needed some good 'ole herd immunity is all!


One is a virus and one is a disease. Big difference


----------



## SConner

I believe polio is a virus. Like other viruses, they cause disease.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polio

Smallpox which killed so many native Americans was also a virus.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smallpox


----------



## Burkcarp1




----------



## KaGee

Burkcarp1 said:


>


Science deniers obviously... [\SARCASM]


----------



## UNCLEMIKE

SConner said:


> I believe polio is a virus. Like other viruses, they cause disease.
> https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polio
> 
> Smallpox which killed so many native Americans was also a virus.
> https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smallpox


Good info.... however there is no comparison between the potential impact of these two diseases and covid. If covid was as deadly to all as it is to the old and infirm then the comparison would be more accurate.


----------



## SConner

UNCLEMIKE said:


> Good info.... however there is no comparison between the potential impact of these two diseases and covid. If covid was as deadly to all as it is to the old and infirm then the comparison would be more accurate.


Was not claiming it is, just pointing out from post prior to mine that these are all viruses. Post prior seemed to imply one was not, or at least that is how I interpreted the post prior to mine


----------



## Shad Rap

Wow said:


> Funny how the people in power will mis-inform first.
> If that doesn't work, they will dis-inform.
> 
> When somebody on their own staff calls them out, they kill the message, by killing the messenger.
> 
> We owe it to ourselves to let the truth reach the light of day, so we can judge for ourselves.
> 
> Wonder why things are getting worse instead of better?--Tim


Thinga are getting worse because they have to before they will get better...all we did was delay the inevitable with the shutdowns.


----------



## Shad Rap

Snakecharmer said:


> Still like Sweden's path?....Their death's per million is 532 compared to USA 395. Ours is nothing to write home about.


Only difference is Sweden is pretty much past it now...we unfortunately aren't...thanks to our own doing.
Big population difference also...


----------



## Burkcarp1

https://technocracy.news/cdc-confirms-extremely-low-covid-19-death-rate/


----------



## multi species angler

Shad Rap said:


> Thinga are getting worse because they have to before they will get better...all we did was delay the inevitable with the shutdowns.


 Things didn't have to get worse before getting better. We have all those that refused to wear a mask and social distance to thank. Hell, things didn't need to get as bad from the get go. Too many warnings were ignored and are still being ignored.


----------



## multi species angler

Burkcarp1 said:


> https://technocracy.news/cdc-confirms-extremely-low-covid-19-death-rate/


 Well it's official, all of us idiots can quit being concerned now. And the 500,000 families that have lost loved ones should feel better.


----------



## BeerBatter

I’m so sick of people being scared of death.
Death happens everyday and the decay feeds the next generation of life in any life form and usually hopefully next generation stronger 
You can wear masks 
You can 6 foot distance 
You can go fishing
You can go riot
You can go to work 
Guess what 
You gonna die someday 
It’s inevitable
I see people in a big hurry and always tell them to go ahead 

I tell them what’s your big hurry 
Were all gonna end up in the same place in the end 
Fertilizer 
Yea and most of the so called loved ones ain’t gonna ?
I wish no one I’ll will
But life will go on


----------



## buckeyebowman

SConner said:


> I believe polio is a virus. Like other viruses, they cause disease.
> https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polio
> 
> Smallpox which killed so many native Americans was also a virus.
> https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smallpox


Exactly! Viruses CAUSE disease! 



Shad Rap said:


> Thinga are getting worse because they have to before they will get better...all we did was delay the inevitable with the shutdowns.





multi species angler said:


> Things didn't have to get worse before getting better. We have all those that refused to wear a mask and social distance to thank. Hell, things didn't need to get as bad from the get go. Too many warnings were ignored and are still being ignored.


Beat me to it!


----------



## Snakecharmer

Cleveland instituted a mandatory mask policy tonight. Probably going to be all of Cuyahoga County soon.


----------



## multi species angler

BeerBatter said:


> I’m so sick of people being scared of death.
> Death happens everyday and the decay feeds the next generation of life in any life form and usually hopefully next generation stronger
> You can wear masks
> You can 6 foot distance
> You can go fishing
> You can go riot
> You can go to work
> Guess what
> You gonna die someday
> It’s inevitable
> I see people in a big hurry and always tell them to go ahead
> 
> I tell them what’s your big hurry
> Were all gonna end up in the same place in the end
> Fertilizer
> Yea and most of the so called loved ones ain’t gonna ?
> I wish no one I’ll will
> But life will go on


 Unpreventable deaths are one thing, preventable another. 10's of thousands of these covid deaths were preventable and 10's of thousands of future deaths are preventable, but only if everyone works together to stop the spread. I just don't understand why some find it such a hardship to wear a mask and social distance to save lives. It needs to be made mandatory to wear a mask in any bldg. open to the public. Even if it only saved 1 life why not do what it takes to save that life. We are mandated to wear seat belts that will increase only our chances of living thru an accident, mask should be mandated to help increase the chances of saving thousands of others lives during covid 19.


----------



## Shad Rap

Snakecharmer said:


> Cleveland instituted a mandatory mask policy tonight. Probably going to be all of Cuyahoga County soon.


Won't be enforced...just like the Columbus mandate...


----------



## Shad Rap

multi species angler said:


> Unpreventable deaths are one thing, preventable another. 10's of thousands of these covid deaths were preventable and 10's of thousands of future deaths are preventable, but only if everyone works together to stop the spread. I just don't understand why some find it such a hardship to wear a mask and social distance to save lives. It needs to be made mandatory to wear a mask in any bldg. open to the public. Even if it only saved 1 life why not do what it takes to save that life. We are mandated to wear seat belts that will increase only our chances of living thru an accident, mask should be mandated to help increase the chances of saving thousands of others lives during covid 19.


All of this and I bet you don't even know one person who's had the virus...take away the nursing home environment my wife works in and I know ONE person who's had it...ONE.


----------



## multi species angler

Shad Rap said:


> All of this and I bet you don't even know one person who's had the virus...and I'm not gonna believe you if you say you do anyway...take away the nursing home environment my wife works in and I know ONE person who's had it...ONE.


 I'm wearing a mask and social distancing to protect YOU and your family, and I don't know YOU or your family. I'm wearing a mask to protect those I do know and those I don't. And I would like for them to do the same for me and my family.


----------



## cement569

yes there was a flu going around in jan. feb. and march. do you want the flu to go away? just quit listening to the media and news sources, they glorify doom and gloom, just ask any journalist and they will tell you FEAR SELLS. so there for i choose to not wear a diaper on my face because i can think for myself. dont need someone telling me what and how to think


----------



## EnonEye

Snakecharmer said:


> Cleveland instituted a mandatory mask policy tonight. Probably going to be all of Cuyahoga County soon.


Likewise in Dayton.


----------



## multi species angler

cement569 said:


> i choose to not wear a diaper on my face because i can think for myself. dont need someone telling me what and how to think


 That's the way most of us feel about wearing seat belts. If we want to take a chance on being killed in an accident who are they to tell us, we can't let you take that chance. I'll bet you wear yours. Most of us don't like paying fines, therefore mask wearing needs be be law, in all 50 states since one can travel from one to another At least until there is a reliable treatment to cure or a reliable vaccine to prevent.


----------



## cement569

i wear a seat belt because i know quite well what can happen, my father died in a auto crash when i was young so i never start the engine without being strapped in. and the media didnt have to tell me to i thought on my own


----------



## multi species angler

cement569 said:


> i wear a seat belt because i know quite well what can happen,


 And the scientist know quite well what can and has happen with this virus without wearing a mask and social distancing. We have went from one case that was being handled to over 2 million cases. And it has gotten much worse since reopening too fast and too soon. Before this is over we will most likely see things shut down again and much stricter guidelines mandated. And if the people want to refuse to follow those guidelines can stay home or get fined.


----------



## cincinnati

Yesterday, Cincinnati declared masks mandatory....beginning on July 9. So, everyone's safe in the interim but then gonna start dying on the 10th?


----------



## multi species angler

cincinnati said:


> Yesterday, Cincinnati declared masks mandatory....beginning on July 9. So, everyone's safe in the interim but then gonna start dying on the 10th?


 Got to give some people enough time to prepare for such a horrible task.


----------



## cincinnati

multi species angler said:


> Got to give some people enough time to prepare for such a horrible task.


NO!! If it's so flipping critical, it should start RIGHT NOW. But obviously, it's of dubious value so the Wild-Ass-Guessers made an arbitrary selection.


----------



## cement569

scientists huh? are these the same people who have been trying for many years to find a cure and vaccine for the common cold? and the regular flu?


----------



## Shad Rap

Over half of those who test positive don't ever get sick. Of those who do get sick, less than 10% require medical attention. Of those who require medical attention, 85% have additional underlying health issues. Of those, less than .01% die. 
You have a greater chance of dying from cancer.


----------



## Shad Rap

multi species angler said:


> I'm wearing a mask and social distancing to protect YOU and your family, and I don't know YOU or your family. I'm wearing a mask to protect those I do know and those I don't. And I would like for them to do the same for me and my family.


You don't need to do anything for me...I'm good...don't chastise me when I choose to not wear a mask because you're scared...sorry...stay home til theres a vaccine if you're that concerned...
And you pretty much answered my queation...you don't even know anyone personally who's had it...


----------



## M R DUCKS

Shad Rap said:


> All of this and I bet you don't even know one person who's had the virus...take away the nursing home environment my wife works in and I know ONE person who's had it...ONE.


what does it matter IF you know someone that has had it or has it? I came up with 14 people I know that have/had it ( took about :30 seconds, so there are probably more)
Only 2 were/are hospitalized. None have died. I’m sure they and their loved ones were concerned and stressed. Lasting effects/damage....who knows.
Is it Really a big deal to put a mask on While you run into a store ?
I do, out of courteously and/or being respectful towards others.
If...IF it helps even a little, all the better.
If it doesn’t, oh well....nothing harmed.
i don’t want to be the one that spreads it to someone else.
Plus, my place of employment says we are to wear mask.
My opinion, it should be optional. 
If a store requires it....their store, their rules, if you don’t like it go elsewhere.
IS it the fact that you are being told to wear one?


----------



## Shad Rap

M R DUCKS said:


> what does it matter IF you know someone that has had it or has it? I came up with 14 people I know that have/had it ( took about :30 seconds, so there are probably more)
> Only 2 were/are hospitalized. None have died. I’m sure they and their loved ones were concerned and stressed. Lasting effects/damage....who knows.
> Is it Really a big deal to put a mask on While you run into a store ?
> I do, out of courteously and/or being respectful towards others.
> If...IF it helps even a little, all the better.
> If it doesn’t, oh well....nothing harmed.
> i don’t want to be the one that spreads it to someone else.
> Plus, my place of employment says we are to wear mask.
> My opinion, it should be optional.
> If a store requires it....their store, their rules, if you don’t like it go elsewhere.
> IS it the fact that you are being told to wear one?


Theres only a few select stores that require it...even with the mandate...even with the mandate, you don't have to wear one.
Yes...the mask obstructs my breathing...any face covering does...just my opinion.


----------



## Panfisher1

I agree with Mr Ducks.
How are you hurt by wearing a mask ?


----------



## Shad Rap

M R DUCKS said:


> what does it matter IF you know someone that has had it or has it? I came up with 14 people I know that have/had it ( took about :30 seconds, so there are probably more)
> Only 2 were/are hospitalized. None have died. I’m sure they and their loved ones were concerned and stressed. Lasting effects/damage....who knows.
> Is it Really a big deal to put a mask on While you run into a store ?
> I do, out of courteously and/or being respectful towards others.
> If...IF it helps even a little, all the better.
> If it doesn’t, oh well....nothing harmed.
> i don’t want to be the one that spreads it to someone else.
> Plus, my place of employment says we are to wear mask.
> My opinion, it should be optional.
> If a store requires it....their store, their rules, if you don’t like it go elsewhere.
> IS it the fact that you are being told to wear one?


So...within the nursing home community I know at least 200 people who've had it...outside world (personally know)?..not so much.


----------



## M R DUCKS

I know of none in nursing homes.
The ones I know are family, co-workers ( friends) and their family members.


----------



## multi species angler

Shad Rap said:


> And you pretty much answered my queation...you don't even know anyone personally who's had it...


 Go back and read your post. You said there was no need to answer your question because you wouldn't believe me anyhow, so I didn't.


----------



## 9Left

Do you know what I think is dangerous?… All this hype about masks… Washing your hands is the single most effective preventative measure that you can take... if someone with coronavirus opens a door at the store, but they're wearing a mask, who cares… You're gonna follow right behind that person and touch the same door handle… But I guess you feel safe because you're wearing a mask… Then you're going to go back to your car, takeoff your mask, and touch your damn face anyway… I mean,If you're going to wear a mask and not wash your hands or sanitize your hands after you touch everything...(which means you should be washing your hands a round 25 to 30 times a day )..Doing one without doing the other is the equivalent of crapping your pants and then changing your shirt.


----------



## crappiedude

Since the employees are wearing masks in stores, I'll wear one too. 
If it helps great, if it doesn't no harm. I find wearing a mask is a little restrictive to my breathing but I've adjusted to wearing one after a few times. I have some heart issues but I'm pretty active and not overweight so odds are I'll be fine if I do get it. The county I live in has under 400 cases so it's not like I'm in a hot spot.
I use hand sanitizer as soon as I leave any public area and I think this is a good idea. A lot of times I'll use it before I go into a store and then again after I come out.
I really could care less if someone chooses not to wear a mask but I do wish they would respect me as I respect them and just give me a little space.

All these communities are wasting their time and their efforts passing these stupid laws telling people to wear masks. They can't enforce them and they know it going in, so why do it.

I was at the doctors office the other day and he said he only knew 4 people who tested positive and of those 4 only 1 was actually sick. I have to get tested in a few weeks myself. I guess I'll find out if that was a cold back in Feb/March that had me coughing non stop for 3 weeks.


----------



## cement569

i have a quick question maybe someone can answer, if masks can be effective how come you can be wearing underwear and pants and break wind everyone kinda knows it? thank you and goodnight


----------



## Snakecharmer

Shad Rap said:


> All of this and I bet you don't even know one person who's had the virus...take away the nursing home environment my wife works in and I know ONE person who's had it...ONE.


We all know you said you had it...


----------



## Snakecharmer

cement569 said:


> i have a quick question maybe someone can answer, if masks can be effective how come you can be wearing underwear and pants and break wind everyone kinda knows it? thank you and goodnight


They can see your brown stain...........


----------



## Dovans

Today I worked around 20 pallets of beer. Wearing a mask. It was not pleasant. You could almost wring my mask when I left for the day. Its required so i wear it. I've almost gotten into the habit of just wearing it when I go anywhere. I dont think Im saving anyone's life by wearing one. habit habit..


----------



## multi species angler

cement569 said:


> i have a quick question maybe someone can answer, if masks can be effective how come you can be wearing underwear and pants and break wind everyone kinda knows it? thank you and goodnight


 Gas is an odor. If you pass droplets that sh!t. And it stays in your mask, I mean underwear.


----------



## multi species angler

crappiedude said:


> All these communities are wasting their time and their efforts passing these stupid laws telling people to wear masks. They can't enforce them and they know it going in, so why do


 Let people see that there is a stiff fine and after some are charged and word gets out most will follow the guidelines.


----------



## multi species angler

crappiedude said:


> . I find wearing a mask is a little restrictive to my breathing


 So do I as I have a deviated septum. I have difficulty breathing without a mask. I had surgery to correct it but the surgeon didn't get it right.


----------



## multi species angler

crappiedude said:


> I use hand sanitizer as soon as I leave any public area and I think this is a good idea. A lot of times I'll use it before I go into a store and then again after I come out


 So do I, even though most doors are automatic. Still, one can't be too careful.


----------



## crappiedude

multi species angler said:


> Let people see that there is a stiff fine and after some are charged and word gets out must will follow the guidelines.


and here's the hitch, no one has a stiff fine and no one would pay it if they did. With everything going on in the world today do you really think the cops are going to go around writing a bunch of tickets for $25. 
My son who works for the health department says there is little they can actually do if someone doesn't follow the guidelines put out to businesses. Even if they show up they just try to advise the owners of what they should be doing and leave it at that.
If you're trying to convince people to wear a mask you're wasting your time


----------



## multi species angler

crappiedude said:


> and here's the hitch, no one has a stiff fine and no one would pay it if they did. With everything going on in the world today do you really think the cops are going to go around writing a bunch of tickets for $25


 I think this is going to get bad enough that fines will be imposed and people will have to pay. And they need to be much stiffer than $25.00. It is unfortunate that is what it will take to get people to follow the guidelines to stopping the spread of this virus. No one should have to die from something that is preventable It's not the people that know they are sick spreading this virus so much as it is the people who are asymptomatic and don't know they are spreading the virus everywhere they go if they aren't following the guidelines. What is the alternative, just let everyone that will die with this virus, die. Let the chips fall where they may. I for one just can't feel that way. LOVE THY NEIGHBOR AS THY SELF.


----------



## ICENUT

Their now claiming its AIRBORNE What NOW


----------



## MagicMarker

I don’t wear a seat belt when I drive a car. I don’t wear a helmet when I ride my bike and I dam well won’t wear a mask. It’s my choice how I live and I dam well don’t care if you do


----------



## crappiedude

MagicMarker said:


> I don’t wear a seat belt when I drive a car. I don’t wear a helmet when I ride my bike and I dam well won’t wear a mask. It’s my choice how I live and I dam well don’t care if you do


and you keep saying it over and over and over and over and over and over.....we know, we know.


----------



## REEL GRIP

My son was at a funeral Fri. I told him to take a mask, or you probably
won't be allowed in. Place was full of people, and he told me, no one
was wearing a mask. That was very surprising.


----------



## Lewis

In my small town of New Concord, Ohio the guy who cut my timber a few years back is currently hospitalized with Covid, as well as both of his parents. His wife is battling Covid pneumonia at home. Two of their teenage sons tested positive and are in quarantine. The local hardware store is closed because several employees tested positive and are sick. The barbershop is closed due to quarantine. So there is an outbreak around here.


----------



## overcheck

ICENUT said:


> Their now claiming its AIRBORNE What NOW


what happened to cleaning everything and hand sanitizer they make it up as it goes on next week it will be something else fake news.


----------



## bulafisherman

What I find interesting with the mask wearing charade is a good percentage of people I do see wearing masks out in public are wearing them with their nose exposed or so loosely that don't do a dam bit of good. I stopped at a dunkin donuts a few days ago and out of the 5 employees there, 4 of them had their masks below their noses and on so loosely that they were useless. Same thing with a recent visit to Lowe's. So just how much good is this mask wearing charade? We are all going to get it at some point.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

9Left said:


> Do you know what I think is dangerous?… All this hype about masks… Washing your hands is the single most effective preventative measure that you can take... if someone with coronavirus opens a door at the store, but they're wearing a mask, who cares… You're gonna follow right behind that person and touch the same door handle… But I guess you feel safe because you're wearing a mask… Then you're going to go back to your car, takeoff your mask, and touch your damn face anyway… I mean,If you're going to wear a mask and not wash your hands or sanitize your hands after you touch everything...(which means you should be washing your hands a round 25 to 30 times a day )..Doing one without doing the other is the equivalent of crapping your pants and then changing your shirt.


Correct! Other words they are just being brainwashed, taught to follow all of the other brainwashed sheep. Accomplished with the simple task of being told to wear a mask or you are going to die. Sure this virus is real and you should be able to choose to wear a mask. YOU! But being told to or else? Nah, that ain’t happening. This is still a free country last I heard. Do you think the powers to be that are trying to force you to wear one cares about you? Look around because you are sadly mistaken.


----------



## walleye willey

I’m sure it’s already been posted on this thread,and I’m pretty sure you have already seen or heard this. But let’s try again, you don’t wear a mask to protect yourself.....you wear it to protect OTHER PROPLE


----------



## multi species angler

walleye willey said:


> I’m sure it’s already been posted on this thread,and I’m pretty sure you have already seen or heard this. But let’s try again, you don’t wear a mask to protect yourself.....you wear it to protect OTHER PROPLE


 YES, it's been said many, many times. Some just don't care about others as much as they care about themselves, even their parents and grandparents apparently.


----------



## Burkcarp1

multi species angler said:


> YES, it's been said many, many times. Some just don't care about others as much as they care about themselves, even their parents and grandparents apparently.


We definitely know how you feel about it.. it’s been repeated over and over and over


----------



## multi species angler

Burkcarp1 said:


> We definitely know how you feel about it.. it’s been repeated over and over and over


 Yes, and it's worth repeating. Wear a mask and practice social distancing, wash your hands and follow the guidelines to stop spreading the virus and help save lives.


----------



## Burkcarp1

multi species angler said:


> Yes, and it's worth repeating. Wear a mask and practice social distancing, wash your hands and follow the guidelines to stop spreading the virus and help save lives.


Have at it.. if it makes you feel better


----------



## luredaddy

We really need a DISLIKE button.


----------



## Burkcarp1

Here’s another one. He must be protecting bugs so they won’t get it..


----------



## 9Left

MagicMarker said:


> I don’t wear a seat belt when I drive a car. I don’t wear a helmet when I ride my bike and I dam well won’t wear a mask. It’s my choice how I live and I dam well don’t care if you do


You probably missed the mark on needing a helmet…


----------



## whal

The weather's great and the fish are biting,everyone should go out and enjoy life it's short enough. Masks optional,plenty of distance between boats.


----------



## loves2fishinohio

Yeah, I had resigned myself to the fact that we weren't doing our FL trip in September, but fuggit, unless something changes between now and then, we are going.


----------



## MuskyFan

Masks don’t work unless they are the type the medical folks use, Which us common people shouldn’t be using so we use napkins, bandanas, neck gaiters, or thin paper masks. Every swinging d—k company is putting out some kind of mask to make a few $$$$ while they can but none of them stop viruses. Distancing is fine as is washing your hands, which you should be doing anyway. Mask, no. All the bs about being selfish is just that, bs. Don’t like me not wearing a mask? Stay the hell away from me like you should be doing. 

Anyway, I digress. We found a covid plant...probably planted by dewine to keep this panic going. It’s all a conspiracy to keep our attention away from the important stuff going on...


----------



## overcheck

MuskyFan said:


> Masks don’t work unless they are the type the medical folks use, Which us common people shouldn’t be using so we use napkins, bandanas, neck gaiters, or thin paper masks. Every swinging d—k company is putting out some kind of mask to make a few $$$$ while they can but none of them stop viruses. Distancing is fine as is washing your hands, which you should be doing anyway. Mask, no. All the bs about being selfish is just that, bs. Don’t like me not wearing a mask? Stay the hell away from me like you should be doing.
> 
> Anyway, I digress. We found a covid plant...probably planted by dewine to keep this panic going. It’s all a conspiracy to keep our attention away from the important stuff going on...
> View attachment 365347


the slogan is " were all in this together '' I think it should be '' Every one for themselves'' I WILL decide how to stay alive for myself not someone else its my life be smart and don't listen to fake news


----------



## jdl447




----------



## EnonEye

Sooo thought I'd enjoy a little peach ice cream at the local Dairy Mart, employees wearing masks and gloves, floor marked off with little social distancing standing marks, nice, a 3 or 4 people line, and I'm thinking "ya know the masses are beginning to understand." Then it starts, guy behind me creeps closer and closer until finally I ask him to please give me the required 6-feet space and he backs off. Get up to the counter and the server doesn't change gloves between the last customer and myself. Nope, nope, some, just don't get it and never will. Serenity Now! Vaccine hurry please! Peachy!


----------



## Snakecharmer

EnonEye said:


> Sooo thought I'd enjoy a little peach ice cream at the local Dairy Mart, employees wearing masks and gloves, floor marked off with little social distancing standing marks, nice, a 3 or 4 people line, and I'm thinking "ya know the masses are beginning to understand." Then it starts, guy behind me creeps closer and closer until finally I ask him to please give me the required 6-feet space and he backs off. Get up to the counter and the server doesn't change gloves between the last customer and myself. Nope, nope, some, just don't get it and never will. Serenity Now! Vaccine hurry please! Peachy!


I love me some peach ice cream. Can't get it too many places and not all the time.


----------



## AmericanEagle




----------



## buckeyebowman

cement569 said:


> scientists huh? are these the same people who have been trying for many years to find a cure and vaccine for the common cold? and the regular flu?


Yes, they have been trying and haven't had any success. And I don't know if you realize this, but there are no CURES for virally caused illnesses and diseases. There are only vaccines which kind of "trick" a person's immune system into producing antibodies against that particular virus. And I wonder if you know that the virus that causes the common cold is also a coronavirus?! If you're so smart, why don't you develop one?

I haven't changed my behavior since the lockdown ended. I still wear a mask and social distance when in public. Know why? It has nothing to do with protecting anyone else, it has to do with protecting me! If these procedures cause other people to be protected. that's great. But I have to take care of me! I'm 67, so could be thought of as high risk. I don't want to catch this crap. So far so good! 



EnonEye said:


> Sooo thought I'd enjoy a little peach ice cream at the local Dairy Mart, employees wearing masks and gloves, floor marked off with little social distancing standing marks, nice, a 3 or 4 people line, and I'm thinking "ya know the masses are beginning to understand." Then it starts, guy behind me creeps closer and closer until finally I ask him to please give me the required 6-feet space and he backs off. Get up to the counter and the server doesn't change gloves between the last customer and myself. Nope, nope, some, just don't get it and never will. Serenity Now! Vaccine hurry please! Peachy!


Good catch EE! My buddy's wife is a nurse at a local medical center. Back at the height of the first wave of hospitalizations here, she was stressed out like crazy! When the lockdown ended, my buddy took her out to dinner for a nice night, since it had been a while since they'd been out. She spotted the same thing, servers masked and gloved, but changing neither between serving tables. She asked, "What is wrong with these people? Don't they realize they are cross infecting everything?" 

Maybe they didn't. I don't know what instruction food servers in Ohio received, or if they are ignoring them to save money! 

And the same thing happened to me fairly early on in the lockdown. Some unmasked, overfed gomer kept crowding me in line. I finally had enough! I turned to him and, in my best "gay" voice, told him that if he didn't back off I'd rip my mask off and give him a big, wet, sloppy kiss on the lips! He backed off real quick!


----------



## cement569

buckeyebowman, didnt say i was smart. i am not a scientist, dont get paid for it. before you attack someone for their input you should just go back to your 2 page long winded boring posts....get my point?


----------



## multi species angler

Burkcarp1 said:


> View attachment 365203
> Here’s another one. He must be protecting bugs so they won’t get it..


 Maybe he's just trying to keep those bugs from getting in between his teeth, I used to ride a motorcycle and there were times I could have used a mask. Mask will do more than just help stop the spread of the virus.


----------



## Burkcarp1

https://justthenews.com/politics-po...e-losing-its-epidemic-status-us-according-cdc


----------



## loves2fishinohio

EnonEye said:


> Then it starts, guy behind me creeps closer and closer until finally I ask him to please give me the required 6-feet space and he backs off.


I have had to ask more than one person to back the F off me in the past couple of weeks. I do it politely of course, and have to admit, I'm kind of surprised I haven't encountered a jerk not willing to comply.


----------



## multi species angler

Burkcarp1 said:


> https://justthenews.com/politics-po...e-losing-its-epidemic-status-us-according-cdc


 That is great news. Most likely do to the fact that the majority of these new cases that are surging are younger people and most survive it.


----------



## jrose

Snakecharmer said:


> Still like Sweden's path?....Their death's per million is 532 compared to USA 395. Ours is nothing to write home about.


Obviously, both countries failed to stop the spread of this disease. Two different tactics, basically the same outcome. I don't follow Sweden's economy, but it might be interesting to see which economy bounces back quicker, ours or theirs.


----------



## jrose

lunder said:


> Does herd immunity always happen? How did that work out for the Native Americans between 1600-1700. Why did they get so excited about a polio vaccine back in the 1950's? Just needed some good 'ole herd immunity is all!


Did we shut the economy down for polio?


----------



## jrose

multi species angler said:


> Things didn't have to get worse before getting better. We have all those that refused to wear a mask and social distance to thank. Hell, things didn't need to get as bad from the get go. Too many warnings were ignored and are still being ignored.


You forgot to mention those damn people who leave their house........The horror!!!!


----------



## jrose

multi species angler said:


> Unpreventable deaths are one thing, preventable another. 10's of thousands of these covid deaths were preventable and 10's of thousands of future deaths are preventable, but only if everyone works together to stop the spread. I just don't understand why some find it such a hardship to wear a mask and social distance to save lives. It needs to be made mandatory to wear a mask in any bldg. open to the public. Even if it only saved 1 life why not do what it takes to save that life. We are mandated to wear seat belts that will increase only our chances of living thru an accident, mask should be mandated to help increase the chances of saving thousands of others lives during covid 19.


Once again, a mask does not stop the spread of this disease.


----------



## jrose

multi species angler said:


> And the scientist know quite well what can and has happen with this virus without wearing a mask and social distancing. We have went from one case that was being handled to over 2 million cases. And it has gotten much worse since reopening too fast and too soon. Before this is over we will most likely see things shut down again and much stricter guidelines mandated. And if the people want to refuse to follow those guidelines can stay home or get fined.


How about we do that in reverse. If you are afraid of contracting the virus, stay home.


----------



## jrose

ICENUT said:


> Their now claiming its AIRBORNE What NOW


It's obviously airborne, hence the mask debate.


----------



## EnonEye

airbornwe are all screwed


----------



## crappiedude

jrose said:


> How about we do that in reverse. If you are afraid of contracting the virus, stay home.


I was at Kroger's today. There was a sign that said they "request everyone to wear a mask". 
I told my wife I wish they would just make a statement one way or the other and enforce it.
Either say nothing or say mask required, I wouldn't give people the choice.

If they can say *no shoes, no shirt, no service *all they need to do is change it to *no shoes, no shirt, no mask, no service, NO EXCEPTIONS*. If people want to leave, let them.
Sure someone's going to cry and complain but people do that anyway.


----------



## multi species angler

jrose said:


> You forgot to mention those damn people who leave their house.


 You have to read between the lines. Those damn people leaving their house during shelter in place would be included in ignored the warnings.


----------



## multi species angler

jrose said:


> How about we do that in reverse. If you are afraid of contracting the virus, stay home.


 It's just the wife and I and she has copd. Someone has to get essentials. I'd rather take the risk than her. About all I leave the house for are the essentials and to go fishing alone. I'm willing to wear a mask when I go out so I'll be less likely to infect others should I become asymptomatic, how about you?


----------



## jrose

multi species angler said:


> It's just the wife and I and she has copd. Someone has to get essentials. I'd rather take the risk than her. About all I leave the house for are the essentials and to go fishing alone. I'm willing to wear a mask when I go out so I'll be less likely to infect others should I become asymptomatic, how about you?


Sounds like your in a pickle. Your wife, and yourself should take extra precautions. Maybe have the essentials delivered. If I were you, and was really concerned about contracting the virus (especially for your wife’s sake) I would avoid people as much as possible. And get masks that were fitted By a professional. 

But I’m not you. I’m healthy, live alone and and enjoy social distancing! This will pass. Stay safe.


----------



## overcheck

buckeyebowman said:


> Yes, they have been trying and haven't had any success. And I don't know if you realize this, but there are no CURES for virally caused illnesses and diseases. There are only vaccines which kind of "trick" a person's immune system into producing antibodies against that particular virus. And I wonder if you know that the virus that causes the common cold is also a coronavirus?! If you're so smart, why don't you develop one?
> 
> I haven't changed my behavior since the lockdown ended. I still wear a mask and social distance when in public. Know why? It has nothing to do with protecting anyone else, it has to do with protecting me! If these procedures cause other people to be protected. that's great. But I have to take care of me! I'm 67, so could be thought of as high risk. I don't want to catch this crap. So far so good!
> 
> 
> 
> Good catch EE! My buddy's wife is a nurse at a local medical center. Back at the height of the first wave of hospitalizations here, she was stressed out like crazy! When the lockdown ended, my buddy took her out to dinner for a nice night, since it had been a while since they'd been out. She spotted the same thing, servers masked and gloved, but changing neither between serving tables. She asked, "What is wrong with these people? Don't they realize they are cross infecting everything?"
> 
> Maybe they didn't. I don't know what instruction food servers in Ohio received, or if they are ignoring them to save money!
> 
> And the same thing happened to me fairly early on in the lockdown. Some unmasked, overfed gomer kept crowding me in line. I finally had enough! I turned to him and, in my best "gay" voice, told him that if he didn't back off I'd rip my mask off and give him a big, wet, sloppy kiss on the lips! He backed off real quick!


I am not quite ready to have a sit-down meal yet going to wait a little while


----------



## multi species angler

jrose said:


> Maybe have the essentials delivered.


 I do curb side pick-up as much as possible. A delivery person may bring the virus with them. Maybe during their off hrs they don't follow any of the guidelines Thanks for the concern.


----------



## multi species angler

I don't even like the idea of pick-up or delivery of prepared foods. Who's to say it wasn't coughed or sneezed on. Not scared but very cautious, and may still get it. We can never be 100% sure of anything.


overcheck said:


> I am not quite ready to have a sit-down meal yet going to wait a little while





overcheck said:


> I am not quite ready to have a sit-down meal yet going to wait a little while


----------



## SConner

jrose said:


> Once again, a mask does not stop the spread of this disease.


Source please


----------



## PapawSmith

SConner said:


> Source please


How about the mask manufacturers themselves? Just read every one of their boxes that the masks come in, Is the actual source good enough for you? I think probably not, I kind of feel that you are going to try to tell me that some doctor somewhere says that masks that are made by someone else will protect you from something that the mask maker swears it won’t, and that you are ‘more right’ than me. That’s how this entire discussion has gone, every position someone can take on this subject has a good supply of valid professionals that support their position which makes the entire debate futile from all angles. I have to say though, this entire mask thing is the biggest piece of horse crap so far and a very big indicator to me that this whole thing is horse crap all together.


----------



## SConner

My request was for a source, not your opinion. Do you have a scientific source to back claim mask do nothing or not? It is a simple request, I am open to scientific research that backs this claim.


----------



## jrose

SConner said:


> Source please


Common sense. Just ask someone with it. The ones grandma makes at home out of old t-shirts don’t cut it. Read the data on the package of the store bought ones.


----------



## SConner

jrose said:


> Common sense. Just ask someone with it. The ones grandma makes at home out of old t-shirts don’t cut it. Read the data on the package of the store bought ones.


Who needs science and peer review when it can be replaced by grandmas common sense? My grandma had lots of common sense and thought cod liver oil or Vick’s vapor rub would cure most anything. It may not have hurt us but had no therapeutic value in treating our many ailments. Again, please site Scientific source for masks doing nothing to stem the propagation of Covid, I am open to actual research.


----------



## jrose

SConner said:


> Who needs science and peer review when it can be replaced by grandmas common sense? Again, please site Scientific source for masks doing nothing to stem the propagation of Covid, I am open to actual research.


Didn’t say mask do nothing. But a piece of cloth over your face does nothing. Get a professionally fitted mask made with the proper media filter and now you have something. (Just FYI, I wouldn’t wear that either)


----------



## SConner

Show data where mask do not help. Many things are used for purposes they were not designed for, it does not mean it is not effective. Just site one study done in the past 2 months indicating masks do nothing and I am more than happy to review.... I don’t like wearing masks either, just know it is recommended by the people who do this for a living. I trust them more than a stranger on a fishing site.


----------



## SConner

jrose said:


> Didn’t say mask do nothing. But a piece of cloth over your face does nothing. Get a professionally fitted mask made with the proper media filter and now you have something. (Just FYI, I wouldn’t wear that either)


You did not need the FYI, I am aware you do not believe in science.


----------



## MIGHTY

Here’s some interesting reads by a anesthesiologist of 36 years... https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2020/06/what_good_do_the_masks_do_really.html 
And this one.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/20575920/ 
So if I’m reading this study right 800 and some odd people had surgery and they broke them up into groups. 46 people out of 411 in the group where everyone was fully masked contracted an infection, while 37 out of 410 in the group where no one wore a mask got some type of infection after a surgery. All the links in those articles and sources are pretty interesting. Couldn’t find and of that on google though, but on a different search engine it was easy to find. Kind of odd?


----------



## SConner

MIGHTY said:


> Here’s some interesting reads by a anesthesiologist of 36 years... https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2020/06/what_good_do_the_masks_do_really.html
> And this one.
> https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/20575920/
> So if I’m reading this study right 800 and some odd people had surgery and they broke them up into groups. 46 people out of 411 in the group where everyone was fully masked contracted an infection, while 37 out of 410 in the group where no one wore a mask got some type of infection after a surgery. All the links in those articles and sources are pretty interesting. Couldn’t find and of that on google though, but on a different search engine it was easy to find. Kind of odd?


Thank you, I will look at this.


----------



## MIGHTY

I clicked on all the highlighted “links” from the first article I linked in my post. Interesting reading for sure. People were discussing it at work


----------



## Burkcarp1

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/04/150422121724.htm


----------



## PapawSmith

SConner said:


> My request was for a source, not your opinion. Do you have a scientific source to back claim mask do nothing or not? It is a simple request, I am open to scientific research that backs this claim.


Seriously friend, just look at those that manufacture the masks, that is not my “opinion”, it is fact as so stated right on their product. While they are enjoying the sales of their devices, they are feverishly trying to be clear that their product DOES NOT assist in the prevention of Covid. You did exactly what I said and ignored the source in favor of an unnamed scientific opinion, but do you not realize that the mask makers are basing their disclaimers on solid scientific advice? You accuse others of opinion but are totally lost in your own.


----------



## SConner

MIGHTY said:


> Here’s some interesting reads by a anesthesiologist of 36 years... https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2020/06/what_good_do_the_masks_do_really.html
> And this one.
> https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/20575920/
> So if I’m reading this study right 800 and some odd people had surgery and they broke them up into groups. 46 people out of 411 in the group where everyone was fully masked contracted an infection, while 37 out of 410 in the group where no one wore a mask got some type of infection after a surgery. All the links in those articles and sources are pretty interesting. Couldn’t find and of that on google though, but on a different search engine it was easy to find. Kind of odd?


Interesting observations for sure and I agree most people wearing masks are not doing it correctly. Still does not replace actual studies for me, but at least it points out how pointless they are if not worn correctly. Thank you for providing this information, it will make me more vigilant in how/when I employ the mask. I agree how they are used matters.


----------



## SConner

PapawSmith said:


> Seriously friend, just look at those that manufacture the masks, that is not my “opinion”, it is fact as so stated right on their product. While they are enjoying the sales of their devices, they are feverishly trying to be clear that their product DOES NOT assist in the prevention of Covid. You did exactly what I said and ignored the source in favor of an unnamed scientific opinion, but do you not realize that the mask makers are basing their disclaimers on solid scientific advice? You accuse others of opinion but are totally lost in your own.


Please explain what opinion I asserted, my request was simple... provide source for mask being worthless. It was a request, not an opinion. For someone who has never met me you sure seem to have lots of thoughts on what is going thru my head. That was clear when you imagined some ill intent a week or so ago and went on a wild unfounded tirade. Not sure if it was deleted by you or moderators, but it was unfounded and without basis in fact.


----------



## MIGHTY

There was a study in the second link I posted though. When patients had an operation with a fully masked crew, 9 more people got some type of infection than the group where no one wore a mask... 46 compared to 37 out of 410 people in each group. Pretty close in comparison though. Jrose seems to be on to something by saying if the n95 masks arent specifically fitted to you, then it’s pretty much useless. The homemade cloth masks in the study stopped 3 parts out of 100. Almost a non factor


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

multi species angler said:


> I don't even like the idea of pick-up or delivery of prepared foods. Who's to say it wasn't coughed or sneezed on. Not scared but very cautious, and may still get it. We can never be 100% sure of anything.


Man.. you should just go and bug out somewhere. Sounds to me like you shouldn’t be doing anything to not get infected. Also sounds like no one can do anything for you that is good enough. Keep wearing that mask buddy, it sounds as it’s the only thing you believe in that will keep you from getting it. But you shouldn’t point fingers and judge the rest of us for not wearing one. We are all going to get it eventually, pretty much inevitable. Although being high risk also, I can be somewhat cautious but knowing I will get it, if I’m still around when it decides to grab ahold of me, I can’t fear a virus that has a 98.74% survival rate in this country. Stop judging people or bug out, you still have that right to do so.


----------



## SConner

Than


MIGHTY said:


> There was a study in the second link I posted though. When patients had an operation with a fully masked crew, 9 more people got some type of infection than the group where no one wore a mask... 46 compared to 37 out of 410 people in each group. Pretty close in comparison though. Jrose seems to be on to something by saying if the n95 masks arent specifically fitted to you, then it’s pretty much useless. The homemade cloth masks in the study stopped 3 parts out of 100. Almost a non factor


Thank you for the information.


----------



## PapawSmith

SConner said:


> Please explain what opinion I asserted, my request was simple... provide source for mask being worthless. It was a request, not an opinion.


There about 50 posts here with your opinion asserted. The source for the masks being worthless is already stated, the manufacturers. And you have it quite backwards, since that is their position on their own product, it becomes YOUR responsibility to prove that they are wrong, not their (or my) responsibility to prove they are right. YOU claim their device can do what they emphatically say it cannot, you need to provide proof of your assertion. Also, of interest I believe, you had replied in another post about proper application of the masks and I was astounded this morning to watch on the news a person from the Health Department suggest that “ silk, nylon, and cotton” were suitable materials for “effective” Home made masks. One of the most irresponsible and absurd statements I have so far seen and, to me, a clear example of just what a joke this whole discussion really is.


----------



## SConner

PapawSmith said:


> There about 50 posts here with your opinion asserted. The source for the masks being worthless is already stated, the manufacturers. And you have it quite backwards, since that is their position on their own product, it becomes YOUR responsibility to prove that they are wrong, not their (or my) responsibility to prove they are right. YOU claim their device can do what they emphatically say it cannot, you need to provide proof of your assertion. Also, of interest I believe, you had replied in another post about proper application of the masks and I was astounded this morning to watch on the news a person from the Health Department suggest that “ silk, nylon, and cotton” were suitable materials for “effective” Home made masks. One of the most irresponsible and absurd statements I have so far seen and, to me, a clear example of just what a joke this whole discussion really is.


what am I thinking now, please explain so I know how I should think. You seem like to have an inside track on everything me.


----------



## crappiedude

PapawSmith said:


> just what a joke this whole discussion really is.


Now there's a statement I can agree with.


----------



## MIGHTY

To those that do wear masks, remember to take them off and get some fresh air every once in a while. On the drive home people on the radio said a man in Tennessee I think it was, passed out while driving from breathing in too much c02 and crashed and died. +1 Covid death for sure though. I’m hearing more and more about people passing out or getting light headed. I understand he was probably just trying to protect everyone but don’t over do it.


----------



## multi species angler

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Keep wearing that mask buddy, it sounds as it’s the only thing you believe in that will keep you from getting it


 You seem to be confused, I'm wearing the mask to increase my chances of not spreading to others, should I become asymptomatic,not to keep from contracting it. It's others that need to wear the mask to help keep me from contracting the virus. You must have missed reading a few dozen threads where this has been stated.


----------



## jrose

SConner said:


> Show data where mask do not help. Many things are used for purposes they were not designed for, it does not mean it is not effective. Just site one study done in the past 2 months indicating masks do nothing and I am more than happy to review.... I don’t like wearing masks either, just know it is recommended by the people who do this for a living. I trust them more than a stranger on a fishing site.


----------



## jrose

SConner said:


> Show data where mask do not help. Many things are used for purposes they were not designed for, it does not mean it is not effective. Just site one study done in the past 2 months indicating masks do nothing and I am more than happy to review.... I don’t like wearing masks either, just know it is recommended by the people who do this for a living. I trust them more than a stranger on a fishing site.


Your the “source guy”,You look it up. I learned a long time ago, if you leave the zipper down on the tent, it will be full of mosquito’s by morning!


----------



## SConner

jrose said:


> Your the “source guy”,You look it up. I learned a long time ago, if you leave the zipper down on the tent, it will be full of mosquito’s by morning!


I know right... who needs facts when we can just make stuff up. Why is a request for data so insulting? One person provided it tonight and I was thankful for it. At the very least, I learned masks worn incorrectly are not as effective. If request for data is so insulting, perhaps the counter argument is not based in fact.


----------



## fishless

SConner said:


> I know right... who needs facts when we can just make stuff up. Why is a request for data so insulting? One person provided it tonight and I was thankful for it. At the very least, I learned masks worn incorrectly are not as effective. If request for data is so insulting, perhaps the counter argument is not based in fact.


----------



## fishless

Now guys . I don't think anyone will know the real answer for a long time if ever.Just do what you think is right for your thought and it will all come out eventually .If you keep your distance and stay out of crowds I think that is a simple thing to do for everyones side of the debate


----------



## Burkcarp1

SConner said:


> I know right... who needs facts when we can just make stuff up. Why is a request for data so insulting? One person provided it tonight and I was thankful for it. At the very least, I learned masks worn incorrectly are not as effective. If request for data is so insulting, perhaps the counter argument is not based in fact.


I didn’t need a scientific study to know that a mask has to be worn correctly to help,that’s just common sense


----------



## SConner

Burkcarp1 said:


> I didn’t need a scientific study to know that a mask has to be worn correctly to help,that’s just common sense


Me neither, but it was pointed out In the one and only attempt anyone made to site a source on the subject so it was worth noting. Doesn’t it make you crazy when kids in retail stores have it below the nose rendering it useless?


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

multi species angler said:


> You seem to be confused, I'm wearing the mask to increase my chances of not spreading to others, should I become asymptomatic,not to keep from contracting it. It's others that need to wear the mask to help keep me from contracting the virus. You must have missed reading a few dozen threads where this has been stated.


It’s a false sense of security. But you go boy.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

This is what a Virologist wears to keep from getting this virus. But don’t worry. Your little cloth masks with the smiley faces and butterflies, Amazon masks, and your bandanna will probably work too. Some of you fellas are lost and confused.


----------



## SConner

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> This is what a Virologist wears to keep from getting this virus. But don’t worry. Your little cloth masks with the smiley faces and butterflies, Amazon masks, and your bandanna will probably work too. Some of you fellas are lost and confused.
> View attachment 365535


So what I just heard... Covid is real (not a hoax) and only men in space suits should engage with Covid patients.  Sorry if I offended anyone, my humor is not for everyone. Kudos strongpersuader , you make a totally legit observation. It’s all about reducing the odds.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

SConner said:


> So what I just heard... Covid is real (not a hoax) and only men in space suits should engage with Covid patients.


I don’t think it’s a hoax either, it’s out there. If it was as bad as you think it is, there would be major quarantine everywhere and people dying in the streets, mass burials by the millions. (If you remember, they actually tried to use the mass burial thing and the 2,000,000 will die quote for a minute but then they knew they wouldn’t hold water). The Elite would be leaving the country in droves while at the same time not caring if you had a mask on or not. Trust me, there are protocols should these things happen, don’t think there isn’t. What a joke to compare a flu virus to the plague that happened in the 1800’s. Everyone should live their lives how they see fit and start minding there own business instead of treating those that decide not to wear a mask like they are a plague. We have all thrown numbers, models, and graphs on here but do we really know what the hell we are talking about, I don’t think we do. There comes a time to step back, re-evaluate, and start using common sense and just live our lives. You only have one.. I get it Connor, your an older fella like myself, god and country, USA USA, and all that like myself, but unfortunately that has been going away for some time now. All we have to do is turn on the tv to see that. Don’t believe the hype and more importantly don’t be a sheep. There are bigger fish to fry. This is all a friendly opinion and we know how that goes.


----------



## Lewis

Ok....so if a person infected with the Wuhan Flu sneezes all over the Campbells soup at Kroger....doesn't common sense tell you that the sneezer will expel far less droplets if they are wearing a face covering?


----------



## Muddy

Lewis said:


> Ok....so if a person infected with the Wuhan Flu sneezes all over the Campbells soup at Kroger....doesn't common sense tell you that the sneezer will expel far less droplets if they are wearing a face covering?


Yes, that is the common sense and science backed answer. People will still argue the point though until they feel like they won.


----------



## Buster24

Lewis said:


> Ok....so if a person infected with the Wuhan Flu sneezes all over the Campbells soup at Kroger....doesn't common sense tell you that the sneezer will expel far less droplets if they are wearing a face covering?


that would be impossible as not only Kroger, but all grocery stores in my area have not had Campbell’s soup since this virus arrived!!!!


----------



## multi species angler

Lewis said:


> Ok....so if a person infected with the Wuhan Flu sneezes all over the Campbells soup at Kroger....doesn't common sense tell you that the sneezer will expel far less droplets if they are wearing a face covering?


 Absolutely, regardless of what that covering is made of. The better the covering, the less dropletts expelled naturally. Any covering would be better than none. Some just do not get this. They keep posting that mask won't prevent us from getting the virus, which in most cases is not why they are being worn. And most of us know that if the mask is not covering the nose as well as the mouth it's not stopping the spread.


----------



## jrose

SConner said:


> You did not need the FYI, I am aware you do not believe in science.


Source please!


----------



## M R DUCKS




----------



## Snakecharmer

jrose said:


> Source please!


All your posts....


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Lewis said:


> Ok....so if a person infected with the Wuhan Flu sneezes all over the Campbells soup at Kroger....doesn't common sense tell you that the sneezer will expel far less droplets if they are wearing a face covering?


 The the average sneeze or cough can send around 100,000 contagious germs into the air at speeds up to 100 miles per hour. It really doesn’t matter how many germs get through these ridiculous face coverings. Fact is the germs from that sneeze landed on a lot of items besides that can of soup, mask or no mask. Now to some of these people that are mask happy... What are they going to do when they get the virus? Still wear the mask in public knowing that the virus they are carrying is going to land on some people and infect them? It’s very possible you are infecting people already. The “I’m going to save everyone from the virus with my mask” mentality is out the window then yea? So when they become infected, these boys gonna bug out then to save us all? Don’t think so. This mandatory mask thing they are talking about.. once we do that, we might as well give up because once tested positive, we could be rounded up and quarantined on an island somewhere. We have already shown them we will follow everything they have told us to do with this virus no matter how ridiculous it is. Bigger picture fellas.


----------



## multi species angler

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> . What are they going to do when they get the virus? Still wear the mask in public knowing that the virus they are carrying is going to land on some people and infect them[/QUOTE
> 
> The intelligent ones are going to stay home and self quarantine to protect their family.


----------



## multi species angler

The intelligent ones are going to stay home and self quarantine to protect their family


----------



## Snakecharmer

At least Ohio isn't on the NY's list of 19 states that have a 2 week quarantine yet...


----------



## Dovans

Muddy said:


> Yes, that is the common sense and science backed answer. People will still argue the point though until they feel like they won.


People I have seen sneeze, cough, etc... take the mask off. SMH and walk away


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

multi species angler said:


> The intelligent ones are going to stay home and self quarantine to protect their family


Kinda stay home once you get it and let the rest of it run it’s course eh? I didn’t know we could get the virus at our convenience. All good man. You win.


----------



## garhtr

12,000,000 Ohioians
3000 Ohio deaths (slightly less)
I'm not good at math !
0.03 % ????


----------



## Shad Rap

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Kinda stay home once you get it and let the rest of it run it’s course eh? I didn’t know we could get the virus at our convenience. All good man. You win.


Or if they are that afraid they could just stay home til a vaccine and even then they aren't safe...not sure why silly measures need to be imposed on us all.


----------



## EnonEye

Dovans said:


> People I have seen sneeze, cough, etc... take the mask off. SMH and walk away


well I certainly don't want that nasty crap inside MY mask, a real dilemma. 
Got 2 small items from Amazon ordered mid-June not yet recv'd but today my grocery store had KN-95 masks, my how the world is changing. Found some ammo too!


----------



## multi species angler

Good News!
Some of you will be disappointed that I learned today that I'm NOT a SHEEP. I had to pick up some essentials at my local Walmart. Upon entering they have sanitizer but upon exiting they do not. They have barrier tape up so there is separate in and out traffic lanes. Believe it or not, I don't have a picture, but I ducked under the barrier tape into the coming in lane and used the sanitizer again and left the store going the wrong way. A SHEEP would NOT have done this. But it's OK I did have my mask on covering my MOUTH and NOSE.


----------



## cincinnati

Snakecharmer said:


> At least Ohio isn't on the NY's list of 19 states that have a 2 week quarantine yet...


New York covid deaths are 24% of ALL US deaths. Why would anyone, who’s the least concerned about the China Virus, want to go there??

New York can ban me for life, & it would be a badge of honor.


----------



## Snakecharmer

cincinnati said:


> New York covid deaths are 24% of ALL US deaths. Why would anyone, who’s the least concerned about the China Virus, want to go there??
> 
> New York can ban me for life, & it would be a badge of honor.


Some people like to Salmon fish in Lake Ontario.


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

garhtr said:


> 12,000,000 Ohioians
> 3000 Ohio deaths (slightly less)
> I'm not good at math !
> 0.03 % ????











*"You're welcome."*


----------



## jrose

multi species angler said:


> Good News!
> Some of you will be disappointed that I learned today that I'm NOT a SHEEP. I had to pick up some essentials at my local Walmart. Upon entering they have sanitizer but upon exiting they do not. They have barrier tape up so there is separate in and out traffic lanes. Believe it or not, I don't have a picture, but I ducked under the barrier tape into the coming in lane and used the sanitizer again and left the store going the wrong way. A SHEEP would NOT have done this. But it's OK I did have my mask on covering my MOUTH and NOSE.


Way to go! You’ll be running with the big dogs in no time!


----------



## bulafisherman

This is no longer about masks, COVID ECT, it's about who can prove the other wrong while insisting they themselves are right. You guys are hilarious


----------



## multi species angler

bulafisherman said:


> This is no longer about masks, COVID ECT, it's about who can prove the other wrong while insisting they themselves are right. You guys are hilarious


 The increasing numbers are doing that. Dewine says mask are now mandated in public bldgs in 7 counties.


----------



## BuckeyeFishin07

cincinnati said:


> New York covid deaths are 24% of ALL US deaths. Why would anyone, who’s the least concerned about the China Virus, want to go there??
> New York can ban me for life, & it would be a badge of honor.


Most of that is New York City by itself but for some reason most think that is all of New York State! I was just in upstate NY over the weekend to visit my mother and little brother. They can keep the city to themselves though!


----------



## KaGee

MSM intentionally not reporting the death rate. The potential for your demise is much greater riding around in your car... seat belt or no. This is from the Euro CDC.


----------



## Snakecharmer

KaGee said:


> MSM intentionally not reporting the death rate. The potential for your demise is much greater riding around in your car... seat belt or no. This is from the Euro CDC.


Who is MSM?


----------



## Misdirection

Snakecharmer said:


> Who is MSM?


Mainstream Media. CBS, ABC, Fox, NBC, etc...

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk


----------



## Snakecharmer

KaGee said:


> MSM intentionally not reporting the death rate. The potential for your demise is much greater riding around in your car... seat belt or no. This is from the Euro CDC.


You need to check your math.....37,000 in vehicle deaths in a year vs. 140,000 in 6 months for Covid....looks like your about 8 x more likely to die from the virus....

https://www.bing.com/search?q=how+m...sc=8-36&cvid=42dc28c10ed1482785155c748445d035


----------



## jrose

Main stream............ M E D I A. You know, the people that keep you informed of all the death and destruction


----------



## Snakecharmer

jrose said:


> Main stream............ M E D I A. You know, the people that keep you informed of all the death and destruction


Better than the WSM.


----------



## BFG

garhtr said:


> 12,000,000 Ohioians
> 3000 Ohio deaths (slightly less)
> I'm not good at math !
> 0.03 % ????


You are correct, you are not good at math. 50,000 cases in Ohio and 3,000 deaths. That's a 6% death rate. Meaning, for every 100 people infected, 6 die. I'll twist that around and say that 94% survive. Which sounds better is up to you to decide. We've now tested more than 1,000,000 people in Ohio, so with that we have about 950,000+ negatives. However; we cannot deny that the virus is widespread knowing that 50,000+ infections have been documented in our State alone. Please do not tell me that "2,100 of the deaths came from nursing homes and prisons." And your point is what? "They were going to die anyway?" People are dying from this virus. Desensitizing the fact that someone was 75yo with diabetes and is now dead from it is flat out awful. 

The true test of the mortality rate will be over the next 2-3 weeks when the 0-29 age group who now make up 40+% of the new cases in the past 7 days either survive, are hospitalized, put into ICU, or perish. Using historical data from the past three months, there *may *be approximately 400+ deaths from this new batch of cases. We shall see. I surely hope not. If the death rate for the new batch of positives stays at 6% (or worse) that will not bode well for any further societal progress. The important thing will be to parse out the deaths by age group. If the 0-29's perish at the same rate as the 65+ group, we are in a world of hurt here folks. A glimmer of hope is what is going on in Florida where they have 125,000+ documented cases and around 5,000 deaths. Their death rate hasn't increased all that much even with the big spike in cases. DeWine isn't making stuff up when he tells us that death data lags 2-3 weeks behind positive case identification. We will know a lot more by the end of the month. Adding to that, a 24 year old with no complications will be "in theory" a much easier patient to treat and more likely to survive. But then again...the sample size for patients like that is VERY small, so keep your fingers crossed it plays out like we hope. 

I still maintain that trying to control this thing is like peeing into the wind. No matter what, the virus will continue to spread, because those who are asymptomatic and/or mildly symptomatic are spreading it. Add in those who feel like crap, yet need a paycheck and still go to work, and we have the current situation in which we find ourselves. DeWine said that most of the spread is coming from things like family gatherings, graduation parties, funerals, Church, etc. etc. He isn't making that up...that information comes from the contract tracing that is being done for every positive case. Did the protests and riots contribute? For sure. No matter what, this thing is running through our State, but in relatively isolated pockets (i.e. urban areas). 

I just don't understand the resistance to wearing a mask in a public place where distancing is not possible. The fact that wearing a mask reduces the spread of the virus is undeniable. Why is that so difficult to understand? Do you need to wear a mask while walking down an empty sidewalk? No. Do you need to wear one in an elevator at work? Yes. Should you wear one in the grocery store? Absolutely. Should you wear one at Church? Yes. Should you wear one on a boat on the lake? Probably not, as long as you aren't hugging each other every time you land another sheepshead. Should you wear one into and out of a restaurant? Yep. 

I've changed my mind about masks, because I have kids that I want to see go back to school. I have kids who have dedicated thousands up on thousands of hours (and our dollars) to travel sports. I have kids who cannot be recruited or seen in their final summer of travel because of COVID. If you aren't going to wear a mask, then don't bother to cover your face when you sneeze. Make sense? No...it doesn't so put on a mask when you go to public places and can't distance yourself from others. 

I don't think people realize what we have looming on the horizon when it comes to mask wearing. At some point, DeWine (and other governors) are going to mandate masks in ALL public places (restaurants, bars, grocery stores, etc. etc.) and you won't be permitted to go into them if you won't wear a mask. Plain and simple, we are being given just enough rope to get ourselves into trouble here. Bars need to wise up and in a hurry, because if they aren't willing to enforce occupancy and distancing restrictions, they are going to get closed down. Florida stopped selling alcohol in their bars and restaurants. Why? People were not following the rules. 

Be vigilant when looking at the data. Wear your mask when it is appropriate. Wash your hands after touching shared surfaces. This is going to be a marathon, not a sprint.


----------



## MagicMarker

Give it a break. Go hide behind your mask if you want. As far as I’m concerned I’m going about my business as usual


----------



## garhtr

BFG said:


> You are correct, you are not good at math. 50,000 cases in Ohio and 3,000 deaths.


 You have absolutely know idea how many cases there are in Ohio until everyone has been tested and that hasn't happened.
I know how many people reside in Ohio and how many deaths there have been-- 0.03 percent of Ohio residents have died from Covid. Take out the over 70 crowd and that "Huge" 0.03 number is cut in half.
I also know that is no pandemic.


----------



## Snakecharmer

garhtr said:


> You have absolutely know idea how many cases there are in Ohio until everyone has been tested and that hasn't happened.
> I know how many people reside in Ohio and how many deaths there have been-- 0.03 percent of Ohio residents have died from Covid. Take out the over 70 crowd and that "Huge" 0.03 number is cut in half.
> I also know that is no pandemic.


Even if they tested everyone what would that show?...You can be negative one day, go to a party and be positive the next...watch the NBA to see how that unfolds.. They have tested all of the players.


----------



## cement569

lets see, back in march we were told over 2 million americans would die in the fist wave of the flu. not even close, and just today they said over 2 million more americans will die in the second wave. folks im thinking these people have no clue and are making things up as they go


----------



## Lewzer

I hesitate to comment on this but the 3000 covid deaths is a false number. 
There are repeated cases of covid being listed as cause of death when the deceased has not tested positive or has even tested negative as having the virus. 
I have two sisters who are RN or NP and other RN friends from Columbus to Canton, Akron and Philadelphia to a previously posted coworker who all had patients or a father-in-law with covid listed as caused of death on their death certificate when it wasn’t true. It is all about $$$$$. 
As I said before... there are lies, damn lies and statistics. 

Believe what you want. I too want my daughter to go back to school full time next month.
She will.


----------



## garhtr

Snakecharmer said:


> Even if they tested everyone what would that show?...You can be negative one day, go to a party and be positive the next...


 If it's an antibody test and we tested everyone (not going to happen) we could determine exactly how many people have been infected and recovered.
Many have the virus and don't even get sick or only have mild symptoms and those cases aren't being counted.
Remember that deaths of children and teens are almost nonexistent (Ohio)
I try to be careful and even wear a mask but shutting down was IMO a giant overreaction (but I certainly don't blame the powers to be because they didnt know what to expect)
We know now that this virus isn't what we thought it was going to be.
I try not too get involved in these threads and I'm done but
Good luck and -- to each his own.


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

jrose said:


> Main stream............ M E D I A. You know, the people that keep you informed of all the death and destruction





MagicMarker said:


> Give it a break. Go hide behind your mask if you want. As far as I’m concerned I’m going about my business as usual





cement569 said:


> lets see, back in march we were told over 2 million americans would die in the fist wave of the flu. not even close, and just today they said over 2 million more americans will die in the second wave. folks im thinking these people have no clue and are making things up as they go











*"From the bottom of my heart, you're ALL welcome."*


----------



## cement569

i have bad vision, but is that dewine with a wig on in that little box?


----------



## Lewzer

No. Believe it or not that is his female sign language interpreter.


----------



## 9Left

I agree with some of the above posts… I stated before, I am a registered nurse, and I work in a large hospital...And hospitals really and truly are guilty of listing cause of death as Covid when in fact it was not… Usually, the way it would go is this: let's say someone gets in a bad car accident and has a major laceration or limb torn off… they get rushed to the emergency room but die on the way there from bleeding… The cause of death is not listed as MVA(Motor vehicle accident)...The cause of death will be listed as "massive hemorrhaging" or " cardiogenic shock" .The car accident didn't kill them… The hemorrhaging is what killed them… That's the way an autopsy usually works. Even before all this Covid stuff… If a patient came into the hospital with pneumonia, and died of pneumonia… The death is listed as "septicemia" or " sepsis" Which is a major infection in the body…
But hospitals are being reimbursed money for admissions or death from Covid diagnosis ...
So having any kind of Post on here that cites the death rate is complete and total farce and bullshit. It's always about money…
And in the rather large hospital in southern Ohio that I work at… Our current count for admissions with a COVID diagnosis is FOUR, yea 4 total people... as of last night when I worked my shift.


----------



## Snakecharmer

The US set a new record for the most number of cases reported in a single day -- 60,021 on Tuesday.

In Florida, 56 hospitals are out of capacity in their intensive care units.


----------



## AmericanEagle

cement569 said:


> lets see, back in march we were told over 2 million americans would die in the fist wave of the flu. not even close, and just today they said over 2 million more americans will die in the second wave. folks im thinking these people have no clue and are making things up as they go


The statement at the end of March by the task force was 100,000 to 240,000 deaths if Americans stay home and limit their contact with others. If there is no social distancing they predicted between 1.5 and 2.2 million deaths.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/white-house-issues-stark-coronavirus-death-toll-estimate-n1173716

As of today the CDC lists over 131,000 Covid-19 deaths.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/cases-updates/us-cases-deaths.html


----------



## BFG

cement569 said:


> lets see, back in march we were told over 2 million americans would die in the fist wave of the flu. not even close, and just today they said over 2 million more americans will die in the second wave. folks im thinking these people have no clue and are making things up as they go


This is still the first wave for the United States. The way things are going, it'll be difficult to tell when a second wave arrives. I guess when NYC, Detroit, DC, and Chicago start seeing spikes again? 



garhtr said:


> You have absolutely know idea how many cases there are in Ohio until everyone has been tested and that hasn't happened.
> I know how many people reside in Ohio and how many deaths there have been-- 0.03 percent of Ohio residents have died from Covid. Take out the over 70 crowd and that "Huge" 0.03 number is cut in half.
> I also know that is no pandemic.


Why do we take out the "over 70 crowd?" 20% of the population of Ohio is over the age of 65. That's 1 out of 5 if that makes it easier to understand. 20% of 11 million is 2.2 million people. This virus is lethal to the vast majority of elderly that become infected with it. I guess we can just throw away our parents, grandparents, aunts, uncles, etc. etc. eh? 

You are correct in that I don't know how many cases there are in Ohio, but can you honestly scoff at the fact 60,000 (as of today) Ohioans have tested positive? If out of the first 1,000,000 tests that were conducted we found 60,000 positives, extrapolate that out to the entire population (testing everyone as you requested). If for the first million we found 60,000 positives, for the next 10 million we will find (roughly) another 600,000 positives. A 5% death rate on 600,000 positive cases is 30,000 Ohioans dead (remembering we have just shy of 3,000 deaths for 60,000 positives as of today). The more tests that get completed and reported, the more solid (and significant) the data sets become. Remembering that statistics allow for variances (in this case rural (lower positivity) vs. urban population (higher positivity) sampling) the numbers are telling us exactly what will happen should we continue down the current path. The outlier is that we have yet to determine how adversely COVID will affect the age 0-29 population, but as stated earlier we will know exactly how that is going to play out in the next two or three weeks. 



MagicMarker said:


> Give it a break. Go hide behind your mask if you want. As far as I’m concerned I’m going about my business as usual


Which is your right, but don't be surprised when your business cannot be conducted as usual because of COVID. If you are self-sufficient and need nothing from society, then you will be just fine. I understand fully your desire to not want to wear a mask, but don't complain when you can't get groceries or go out to eat without wearing one. Those days are coming faster than you want to believe. Taking a moral stand over wearing a mask to the grocery store is silly. Nobody is coming for your gun, raising your taxes unfairly, or infringing on any other rights as an American. The elected officials and the scientists/medical professionals who advise them are making recommendations to prevent the spread of this virus. They are doing exactly what they are elected/appointed to do for those they serve. 

Let's not forget....businesses are in business to make money, and if they are forced to require patrons to wear a mask, they will do so otherwise they will go out of business. This is not a hard concept to understand. 

I used to smoke, and when non-smoking regulations were put into place, I felt like my rights were being infringed upon. I didn't go to places that I couldn't smoke. At first it was restaurants with minimal square footage, then it was bars, then it was in places like hotels and airplanes, and then eventually it was all public places in Ohio. Pretty soon, the only place you could smoke was in your car or at home. People lost their damn minds because they couldn't smoke. And you know what? It was the right thing to do for everyone. I quit smoking, and I'm better off for it. I recall several local bars who filed lawsuits against local government and the State. They all LOST. Businesses that adapted and became smoke-free quickly saw upticks in their patronage and revenue. The same exact thing will happen with businesses who encourage and enforce masks over those who do not. I'll gladly shop where folks are wearing masks 100x over a place where nobody is wearing a mask. Laugh all you want, but it's going to happen whether you like it or not. Don't wear your mask, but don't complain when you can't go to eat at Applebee's without it. 

I'm not hiding behind anything. The virus is real. It kills the elderly at a very high rate. Whether or not it will kill the same way in the younger population is yet to be determined. We have to be smart in how we conduct our business, and take precautions when necessary.


----------



## Dovans

Lewzer said:


> No. Believe it or not that is his female sign language interpreter.


who is totally worth watching..Give that gal a raise.. She's earned her money.


----------



## Shad Rap

AmericanEagle said:


> The statement at the end of March by the task force was 100,000 to 240,000 deaths if Americans stay home and limit their contact with others. If there is no social distancing they predicted between 1.5 and 2.2 million deaths.
> 
> https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/white-house-issues-stark-coronavirus-death-toll-estimate-n1173716
> 
> As of today the CDC lists over 131,000 Covid-19 deaths.
> 
> https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/cases-updates/us-cases-deaths.html


Again...all the model #'s even from the beginning included social distancing...if it's a model, it includes some form of social distancing...don't let them tell you it didn't...
In other words...the 1.5 to 2.2 million deaths they predicted in the beginning included social distancing...it didn't go as they predicted, so they said it was because of social distancing, which isn't true...or should I say it's not COMPLETELY true...whatever that means....


----------



## crappiedude

BFG said:


> This virus is lethal to the vast majority of elderly that become infected with it.


Say what???? Maybe elderly people with 2 or 3 underlying other issues but age alone doesn't signal a death sentence.



BFG said:


> *If *out of the first 1,000,000 tests that were conducted we found 60,000 positives,





BFG said:


> *If *for the first million we found 60,000 positive





BFG said:


> *If* you are self-sufficient and need nothing


When ever I see anyone quoting statistics and anywhere in the fact portion of the post I see the word "if" then any credibility of the post goes out the window. 

I keep seeing post facts based on numbers and at best all the numbers are all wrong. There is so much bad or flawed info posted on this disease it's really hard to believe or put much faith or have any concern over any any of it. I'm pretty sure even when this is all over with and all the drama is done, no one will still be able to come up with any meaningful numbers based on facts.


----------



## buckeyebowman

Snakecharmer said:


> You need to check your math.....37,000 in vehicle deaths in a year vs. 140,000 in 6 months for Covid....looks like your about 8 x more likely to die from the virus....
> 
> https://www.bing.com/search?q=how+m...sc=8-36&cvid=42dc28c10ed1482785155c748445d035


But, how many people drive vs how many people have tested positive for COVID? Those are the numbers you need to compate.


----------



## AmericanEagle

Shad Rap said:


> Again...all the model #'s even from the beginning included social distancing...if it's a model, it includes some form of social distancing...don't let them tell you it didn't...
> In other words...the 1.5 to 2.2 million deaths they predicted in the beginning included social distancing...it didn't go as they predicted, so they said it was because of social distancing, which isn't true...or should I say it's not COMPLETELY true...whatever that means....


The task force prediction of of 1.5 to 2.2 million deaths was based on no social distancing or mitigation. The link I provided is dated April 1st and can easily be confirmed by multiple sources.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/white-house-issues-stark-coronavirus-death-toll-estimate-n1173716

You are welcome to believe anything you want. The facts speak for themselves.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

Stars-n-Stripers said:


> View attachment 365633
> 
> *"You're welcome."*


Most deaths from nursing homes and prisons..2200.....


----------



## KaGee

Snakecharmer said:


> In Florida, 56 hospitals are out of capacity in their intensive care units.


What percentage are Covid?


----------



## cement569

ok people we are gonna play a little game of connect the dots. a few weeks ago oklahoma had a code red spike, it lasted 3 days and nothing after that. now fla. texas and california are code red, now connect the dots for yourself without the media telling you what to think. you have to be borderline goofy to not see what is going on


----------



## KaGee

9Left said:


> I agree with some of the above posts… I stated before, I am a registered nurse, and I work in a large hospital...And hospitals really and truly are guilty of listing cause of death as Covid when in fact it was not…
> 
> But hospitals are being reimbursed money for admissions or death from Covid diagnosis ...
> So having any kind of Post on here that cites the death rate is complete and total farce and bullshit. It's always about money…
> And in the rather large hospital in southern Ohio that I work at… Our current count for admissions with a COVID diagnosis is FOUR, yea 4 total people... as of last night when I worked my shift.


The company I work for owns 16 cemeteries throughout Ohio. The owner was in today and comparing notes, *none* of our properties are exceeding their 5 year average for YTD burials.

Common sense should suggest that with all of these "Covid deaths" that we in death care should be overwhelmed. But in reality people are not dying in any numbers exceeding the "normal" death rate. The flu season is now all but over. As a result there are fewer deaths occurring of symptoms that can be tagged as Covid. 

So, bottom line, more people may be testing positive for the virus, but less people are dying than you may have been led to believe are dying.


----------



## SConner

cement569 said:


> ok people we are gonna play a little game of connect the dots. a few weeks ago oklahoma had a code red spike, it lasted 3 days and nothing after that. now fla. texas and california are code red, now connect the dots for yourself without the media telling you what to think. you have to be borderline goofy to not see what is going on


Facts do not back your statements.
https://news.google.com/articles/CAIiEJLzt-onAy5E3n77UElzrLoqGQgEKhAIACoHCAowocv1CjCSptoCMIrUpgU?hl=en-US&gl=US&ceid=US:en
Hint: Tulsa is in Oklahoma.


----------



## Bluewalleye

Did anyone else find it totally strange that Dewine yesterday put 6 or 7 counties on mask orders? But then went on to say that high school football teams could start a week of practicing this coming week? lol
Did I hear this wrong? Cause those 2 orders kind of contradict each other.


----------



## cement569

sconner, source please


----------



## MIGHTY

According to this chart the spike in Oklahoma started coincidentally days before the rally..... both of the headlines were posted on June 10th which coincides with the spike on the graph


----------



## SConner

cement569 said:


> sconner, source please





cement569 said:


> sconner, source please


I gave you one already, do you want me to read it for you? Here is another.


----------



## MIGHTY

I clicked on the link but it when it opened it was on CNN’s website so I chuckled and Xed out


----------



## SConner

MIGHTY said:


> I clicked on the link but it when it opened it was on CNN’s website so I chuckled and Xed out


Interesting your graph shows nothing past June 18th... why? When trying to educate myself, I don’t look at 3 week old information when day old info is available. I guess current info does not fit the political narrative you not so subtlety spun.


----------



## cement569

sconner, if your that afraid please by all means stay hunkered down. and one day you will wake up an old man wondering where your life went. try thinking for yourself and quite going on the media and graphs


----------



## MIGHTY

It’s a meme I’ve had saved that I posted to coincide with that cement was getting at. Rally planned??? Oh no Covid spike!!!! Better not do it!!! All the young people getting sick are obviously sick because they’re going to bars and such right? Nothing at all to do with the riots or protesting that’s been going on around the same time frame. Media never connects those dots


----------



## MIGHTY

Posted 2 hours apart.....perfectly safe to protest?????? Just doesn’t make a whole lot of sense to me.


----------



## SConner

cement569 said:


> sconner, if your that afraid please by all means stay hunkered down. and one day you will wake up an old man wondering where your life went. try thinking for yourself and quite going on the media and graphs


And the ever present fraidy cat defense. Do you ever research anything before stating it as fact here? I would love to know were you are getting your information.
I have made every effort throughout this thread to be rational and present the data as it was known at the time ( it does evolve). You have consistently made statements that are demonstratibly false without ever siting source for your information. This is the definition of “fake news”.


----------



## SConner

MIGHTY said:


> View attachment 365777
> Posted 2 hours apart.....perfectly safe to protest?????? Just doesn’t make a whole lot of sense to me.


I agree


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Wear them masks or don’t wear them masks. They are not going to help us either way. Everyone is going to get it eventually hence why the face mask is just a false sense of security. I guess what it comes down to is if you want wear one to put off the inevitable for a minute or two or you go without one and throw caution to the wind. It would be really nice if they come up with a vaccine before we all get it. But most of you wouldn’t take it anyway just like most of you won’t take the the flu vaccine now. Especially after the media and politicians have brain washed most of us with all the lies including false high deaths tolls, mass graves, shortage of hospital beds ect. along with the awful truth of dying alone. I guess it’s a pay me now or pay me later sort of thing.


----------



## jrose

cement569 said:


> i have bad vision, but is that dewine with a wig on in that little box?


No. it's the "Church Lady"


----------



## Shad Rap

jrose said:


> No. it's the "Church Lady"


Well isn't that special...


----------



## jrose

Stars-n-Stripers said:


> View attachment 365749
> 
> *"From the bottom of my heart, you're ALL welcome."*


Are you being sarcastic?


----------



## Shad Rap

I heard today of a few people signing up to get tested, they went to get tested and there was too long of a wait so they left...about a week later they got a letter saying they tested positive...they never even took the test......roflmao.
How many times do you think this happened across the country???..not enough to make a dent in the numbers but still...this was only one instance but there were 3 people involved so you never know...


----------



## jrose

BFG said:


> This is still the first wave for the United States. The way things are going, it'll be difficult to tell when a second wave arrives. I guess when NYC, Detroit, DC, and Chicago start seeing spikes again?
> 
> 
> 
> Why do we take out the "over 70 crowd?" 20% of the population of Ohio is over the age of 65. That's 1 out of 5 if that makes it easier to understand. 20% of 11 million is 2.2 million people. This virus is lethal to the vast majority of elderly that become infected with it. I guess we can just throw away our parents, grandparents, aunts, uncles, etc. etc. eh?
> Not everyone over 65 would die. So, your numbers are off from the beginning.
> You are correct in that I don't know how many cases there are in Ohio, but can you honestly scoff at the fact 60,000 (as of today) Ohioans have tested positive? If out of the first 1,000,000 tests that were conducted we found 60,000 positives, extrapolate that out to the entire population (testing everyone as you requested). If for the first million we found 60,000 positives, for the next 10 million we will find (roughly) another 600,000 positives. A 5% death rate on 600,000 positive cases is 30,000 Ohioans dead (remembering we have just shy of 3,000 deaths for 60,000 positives as of today). The more tests that get completed and reported, the more solid (and significant) the data sets become. Remembering that statistics allow for variances (in this case rural (lower positivity) vs. urban population (higher positivity) sampling) the numbers are telling us exactly what will happen should we continue down the current path. The outlier is that we have yet to determine how adversely COVID will affect the age 0-29 population, but as stated earlier we will know exactly how that is going to play out in the next two or three weeks.
> 
> 
> 
> Which is your right, but don't be surprised when your business cannot be conducted as usual because of COVID. If you are self-sufficient and need nothing from society, then you will be just fine. I understand fully your desire to not want to wear a mask, but don't complain when you can't get groceries or go out to eat without wearing one. Those days are coming faster than you want to believe. Taking a moral stand over wearing a mask to the grocery store is silly. Nobody is coming for your gun, raising your taxes unfairly, or infringing on any other rights as an American. The elected officials and the scientists/medical professionals who advise them are making recommendations to prevent the spread of this virus. They are doing exactly what they are elected/appointed to do for those they serve.
> 
> Let's not forget....businesses are in business to make money, and if they are forced to require patrons to wear a mask, they will do so otherwise they will go out of business. This is not a hard concept to understand.
> 
> I used to smoke, and when non-smoking regulations were put into place, I felt like my rights were being infringed upon. I didn't go to places that I couldn't smoke. At first it was restaurants with minimal square footage, then it was bars, then it was in places like hotels and airplanes, and then eventually it was all public places in Ohio. Pretty soon, the only place you could smoke was in your car or at home. People lost their damn minds because they couldn't smoke. And you know what? It was the right thing to do for everyone. I quit smoking, and I'm better off for it. I recall several local bars who filed lawsuits against local government and the State. They all LOST. Businesses that adapted and became smoke-free quickly saw upticks in their patronage and revenue. The same exact thing will happen with businesses who encourage and enforce masks over those who do not. I'll gladly shop where folks are wearing masks 100x over a place where nobody is wearing a mask. Laugh all you want, but it's going to happen whether you like it or not. Don't wear your mask, but don't complain when you can't go to eat at Applebee's without it.
> 
> I'm not hiding behind anything. The virus is real. It kills the elderly at a very high rate. Whether or not it will kill the same way in the younger population is yet to be determined. We have to be smart in how we conduct our business, and take precautions when necessary.


Not everyone over 65 would die. Your numbers are off unless I read your post wrong.


----------



## Hatchetman

Question....How many people die WITH covid as opposed to how many die BECAUSE of covid? Betcha the first part is a very high percentage which helps out the fear mongers....


----------



## 9Left

Shad Rap said:


> I heard today of a few people signing up to get tested, they went to get tested and there was too long of a wait so they left...about a week later they got a letter saying they tested positive...they never even took the test......roflmao.
> How many times do you think this happened across the country???..not enough to make a dent in the numbers but still...this was only one instance but there were 3 people involved so you never know...


So if I go somewhere, stand in line, and then decide to leave, without being tested… You're telling me that they magically pull these peoples personal information out of their asses and sent them a letter?


----------



## Burkcarp1

9Left said:


> So if I go somewhere, stand in line, and then decide to leave, without being tested… You're telling me that they magically pull these peoples personal information out of their asses and sent them a letter?


Not sure but according to his post they signed up first? That’s the way I read it.


----------



## Shad Rap

9Left said:


> So if I go somewhere, stand in line, and then decide to leave, without being tested… You're telling me that they magically pull these peoples personal information out of their asses and sent them a letter?


Huh?..they were signed up to a testing center, got there, backed out because the wait was long...they already had their info...it wasn't a testing center where anyone can just walk up to...it was by appt...testing was way behind and they chose not to wait...7 days later they received mail stating they tested positive...


----------



## crappiedude

Shad Rap said:


> I heard today of a few people signing up to get tested, they went to get tested and there was too long of a wait so they left...about a week later they got a letter saying they tested positive...they never even took the test..


I've heard this same thing somewhere. I think this is one of those stories that keeps getting passed around that has no merit to it.


----------



## Shad Rap

Burkcarp1 said:


> Not sure but according to his post they signed up first? That’s the way I read it.


Exactly.


----------



## Shad Rap

crappiedude said:


> I've heard this same thing somewhere. I think this is one of those stories that keeps getting passed around that has not merit to it.


It could be...but the person I heard this from in fact knew the people this happened to...and this person is a reputable person...who knows though...just thought it was interesting to share.
Not only that...I can completely see something like that happening in all this mess...


----------



## Burkcarp1




----------



## Shad Rap

Burkcarp1 said:


> View attachment 365835


The next question will be...what kind of mask did he wear?..n95, surgical, cloth, etc.,?...
I can see what looks to be a surgical...


----------



## 9Left

Burkcarp1 said:


> View attachment 365835


We've already been over this point… The masks are worn more for protecting other people from you coughing or sneezing on them…
If you want to take a picture of a test like that… Leave the mask on the table so the outside is facing down on the table...Drop a handful of drywall dust onto the mask, which would reenact you coughing or sneezing… After the dust settles, pick the mask up… And you will see an outline of a mask on the table… Hence helping to keep droplet particles inside your mask when you cough or sneeze


----------



## laguna21

Lorain and Summit counties now at level 3, code red. Thinking this means mandatory mask when in public


----------



## multi species angler

Yea, see if there is any snot on the drywall! What does it say that this has to be repeated over and over. The mask is being worn to help stop the spread of the virus by an asymptomatic person who doesn't know they have the virus and are spreading it everywhere they go. We like to think that someone that knows they are sick STAYS HOME.


----------



## Burkcarp1

Lmao you guys are too easy


----------



## Snakecharmer

Some people are dense.


----------



## EnonEye

We shouldn't forget as this is being discussed that the death rate doesn't mean a hill of beans for those who've "recovered" and end up with life-long health issues of damaged kidneys, strokes, diabetes, cardiovascular issues and the list goes on and on. I'll take my chances with wearing a mask and am heavyhearted not everyone will do the same. 
Mandatory wear coming soon to a town near you. One local sheriff said publicly "we will not respond to complaints about wearing masks." Another local small city police chief said they will. Should be fun!


----------



## LEfriend

Gave this thread up 3 months ago but looped back to see if the deniers of science and those who know more than the doctors are still spewing malarkey and denying facts and numbers. As doctors and nurses in Houston , Phoenix, Atlanta, Miami are pleading for help, pleading for supplies, pleading for the public to stay home and wear masks, Ohio’s numbers are again rising and the deniers are still denying, the conspiracists still delusional. It’s obvious you can’t fix stupid so I’ll wear my mask, social distance and see you maybe in another 3 months.


----------



## jrose

LEfriend said:


> Gave this thread up 3 months ago but looped back to see if the deniers of science and those who know more than the doctors are still spewing malarkey and denying facts and numbers. As doctors and nurses in Houston , Phoenix, Atlanta, Miami are pleading for help, pleading for supplies, pleading for the public to stay home and wear masks, Ohio’s numbers are again rising and the deniers are still denying, the conspiracists still delusional. It’s obvious you can’t fix stupid so I’ll wear my mask, social distance and see you maybe in another 3 months.


What’s your prediction for the next three months? That way when you loop back around we can agree or disagree again. Plus deer season will be going pretty good and I need to know how high to put my climber!


----------



## multi species angler

NOT A PREDICTION BUT FACT: 10's of thousands more cases and 1000's more dead if every one doesn't get on the same page and slow this virus down until a working vaccine and or treatment is available.


----------



## cement569

just a heads up, the n95 mask is nowhere near effective. before retireing from concrete const. after 32 years i cut, i ground and tore out concrete. if you wear safety glasses they steam up all the time so air is escaping. and if you cough or sneeze it just blows out of the sides or top, and when i would get home at the end of the day i would be all stuffed up and when i blew my nose all that would come out was white snot. and im thinking all of these little designer masks they are selling couldnt stop anything, thats not opinion thats work place experiance


----------



## buckeyebowman

MIGHTY said:


> View attachment 365777
> Posted 2 hours apart.....perfectly safe to protest?????? Just doesn’t make a whole lot of sense to me.


When will enough people recognize that much of what we see in the mainstream media is not news. It's propaganda!


----------



## PapawSmith

multi species angler said:


> NOT A PREDICTION BUT FACT: 10's of thousands more cases and 1000's more dead if every one doesn't get on the same page and slow this virus down until a working vaccine and or treatment is available.


Sorry Friend but this is pure prediction. This virus has killed a small fraction of the folks that you believe it has, and don’t ask me for the “source”. What we all see and live every day is all the source we all need and I truly feel bad for those that this farce has terrified.


----------



## cement569

and to continue my mask experiance, there is only one mask that will protect you from anything its a resporator mask and if you can find them they are about 40 bucks a piece plus 10 bucks for the filters. so the n95 is like wrapping toilet paper around your face. but these experts wont tell you that


----------



## One guy and a boat

I haven't posted here in a few months, but have loosely followed. For all you mask debaters. In my house is myself and my wife. I also have my elderly divorced parents living with me. My wife took covid the least serious in the house. Didn't always wear mask or social distance. This morning she got the positive covid results. She's been in our bedroom since Tuesday when she developed symptoms. Now the waiting game starts. As far as the mask debate goes, just ask yourself if wearing a mask is really that big a deal? What vulnerable family member could you help save by wearing a mask and being smart? Are you putting freedoms above what is safest for all ? And by freedoms, I'm not talking about turning your guns in or limiting speech, just a face covering and some distancing. Not judging anybody, just reflecting a little.

Sent from my Pixel 3a XL using Tapatalk


----------



## jrose

multi species angler said:


> NOT A PREDICTION BUT FACT: 10's of thousands more cases and 1000's more dead if every one doesn't get on the same page and slow this virus down until a working vaccine and or treatment is available.


I was thinking it just peters out, but what do I know.


----------



## Snakecharmer

One guy and a boat said:


> I haven't posted here in a few months, but have loosely followed. For all you mask debaters. In my house is myself and my wife. I also have my elderly divorced parents living with me. My wife took covid the least serious in the house. Didn't always wear mask or social distance. This morning she got the positive covid results. She's been in our bedroom since Tuesday when she developed symptoms. Now the waiting game starts. As far as the mask debate goes, just ask yourself if wearing a mask is really that big a deal? What vulnerable family member could you help save by wearing a mask and being smart? Are you putting freedoms above what is safest for all ? And by freedoms, I'm not talking about turning your guns in or limiting speech, just a face covering and some distancing. Not judging anybody, just reflecting a little.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3a XL using Tapatalk


Hang in there Kip. Not easy with the elderly parents. My Mom moved in this week as my sister is having her kitchen redone. 
My sister-in-law's husband had covid in April. He's recovered but knocked him on his ass for 2 weeks.


----------



## Burkcarp1

multi species angler said:


> NOT A PREDICTION BUT FACT: 10's of thousands more cases and 1000's more dead if every one doesn't get on the same page and slow this virus down until a working vaccine and or treatment is available.


Of course there are a bunch more cases.. because we are testing thousands more..


----------



## 9Left

One guy and a boat said:


> For all you mask debaters.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3a XL using Tapatalk


...I'm just quoting this because the word maskdebater funny is as hell.


----------



## One guy and a boat

Snakecharmer said:


> Hang in there Kip. Not easy with the elderly parents. My Mom moved in this week as my sister is having her kitchen redone.
> My sister-in-law's husband had covid in April. He's recovered but knocked him on his ass for 2 weeks.


Thanks Bob. So far everyone is good. Even the wife has only had to deal moderate symptoms. Still early though.

Sent from my Pixel 3a XL using Tapatalk


----------



## One guy and a boat

9Left said:


> ...I'm just quoting this because the word maskdebater funny is as hell.


I thought the same thing as I was typing it lol

Sent from my Pixel 3a XL using Tapatalk


----------



## PapawSmith

One guy and a boat said:


> I haven't posted here in a few months, but have loosely followed. For all you mask debaters. In my house is myself and my wife. I also have my elderly divorced parents living with me. My wife took covid the least serious in the house. Didn't always wear mask or social distance. This morning she got the positive covid results. She's been in our bedroom since Tuesday when she developed symptoms. Now the waiting game starts. As far as the mask debate goes, just ask yourself if wearing a mask is really that big a deal? What vulnerable family member could you help save by wearing a mask and being smart? Are you putting freedoms above what is safest for all ? And by freedoms, I'm not talking about turning your guns in or limiting speech, just a face covering and some distancing. Not judging anybody, just reflecting a little.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3a XL using Tapatalk


I, like probably everyone here, pray for the health and safety of your Wife and Family. Nobody that I know wants anyone to suffer any negative impact from this virus. I hope for you the same that occurred for me when I contracted the virus, no symptoms and no transition to any others. That was the same result for the only other guy that I know that was diagnosed and quarantined, like I did. Those of us that believe that the mask mandate is a farce in no way ignore the fact that this virus is contagious, nor do we fail to understand that there are folks that need protected as they are certainly vulnerable. We just feel that the approach that requires all that are well need covered rejects the real need of the few that need protected. We feel that our focus and efforts are grossly misguided. Prayers for your Wife and Family.


----------



## multi species angler

cement569 said:


> just a heads up, the n95 mask is nowhere near effective. before retireing from concrete const. after 32 years i cut, i ground and tore out concrete. if you wear safety glasses they steam up all the time so air is escaping. and if you cough or sneeze it just blows out of the sides or top, and when i would get home at the end of the day i would be all stuffed up and when i blew my nose all that would come out was white snot. and im thinking all of these little designer masks they are selling couldnt stop anything, thats not opinion thats work place experiance





cement569 said:


> and to continue my mask experiance, there is only one mask that will protect you from anything its a resporator mask and if you can find them they are about 40 bucks a piece plus 10 bucks for the filters. so the n95 is like wrapping toilet paper around your face. but these experts wont tell you that





jrose said:


> I was thinking it just peters out, but what do I know.





Burkcarp1 said:


> Of course there are a bunch more cases.. because we are testing thousands more..


----------



## fishless

multi species angler said:


>


I have one of the mask you are talking about I think.I worked in a chemical plant and this mask was made to wear in acid and Chlorine leaks as long as there was enough 02


----------



## Just Fishin'

buckeyebowman said:


> When will enough people recognize that much of what we see in the mainstream media is not news. It's propaganda!


I've been following this thread occasionally for the months that it's been running and have been hesitant to post... but this one comment right here is worth responding to. I really wish people would be more open and understand what the media is all about. Seriously folks, take a freaking step back and think for yourselves. The media is all about ratings and pushing their own narrative... no matter which one you watch or read.

Also... With over 300 million people in this country, we all have our own opinions and beliefs. Accept that and quit trying to change the opinions and beliefs of others. Have a discussion, find common ground, and respect each other.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


----------



## billy4prez

I'm ready for the virus now! 
Anyone else have to play the game? The new masks are much better but they still suck! lol!


----------



## ICENUT

Until a safe effective vaccine is available and people get it all of the midigation, the lockdowns,and masks do is put it off till later. Lockdown early months ago lift restrictions it spikes, other hand open early weeks ago guess what it spikes.Its not going away untill a vaccine and that could be months to years.EWven if available by end of this year there wont be enough to vaccinate everyone,plus time to see if it works and to build up immunity. It amazes me on here everyone is scared to death But when it comes to sports and esp football everyone just cant wait now you tell me how they going to play the games staying 6 ft apart (BIG HUddles) and without any contact!!!.


----------



## Snakecharmer

At this time I don't have high hopes for a vaccine helping to end this crisis. Some people that had a tickle in their throat late 2019 -2020 will think they have immunity, the no mask people will probably be no vaccine people since they think covid is made up by the media, the tin hat people will think the government is trying to poison them, the anti-vaccine people will still be anti-vaccine, the procrastinators will procrastinate.


----------



## TheStinger

cement569 said:


> just a heads up, the n95 mask is nowhere near effective. before retireing from concrete const. after 32 years i cut, i ground and tore out concrete. if you wear safety glasses they steam up all the time so air is escaping. and if you cough or sneeze it just blows out of the sides or top, and when i would get home at the end of the day i would be all stuffed up and when i blew my nose all that would come out was white snot. and im thinking all of these little designer masks they are selling couldnt stop anything, thats not opinion thats work place experiance


A man with experience is not at the mercy of a man with an argument!


----------



## jrose

Snakecharmer said:


> At this time I don't have high hopes for a vaccine helping to end this crisis. Some people that had a tickle in their throat late 2019 -2020 will think they have immunity, the no mask people will probably be no vaccine people since they think covid is made up by the media, the tin hat people will think the government is trying to poison them, the anti-vaccine people will still be anti-vaccine, the procrastinators will procrastinate.


 And you are?


----------



## Shad Rap

Snakecharmer said:


> At this time I don't have high hopes for a vaccine helping to end this crisis. Some people that had a tickle in their throat late 2019 -2020 will think they have immunity, the no mask people will probably be no vaccine people since they think covid is made up by the media, the tin hat people will think the government is trying to poison them, the anti-vaccine people will still be anti-vaccine, the procrastinators will procrastinate.


And a lot of the sheep wanting mandatory masks and lockdowns will not get a vaccination when it's available...works both ways...
Masks alone won't hold up the spread...social distancing is actually more or just as effective.
All the mask does is pamper someone and give them a false sense of security...JMO.
If you're not in full PPE, forget it...and even then, full PPE doesn't stop it...


----------



## Burkcarp1

Snakecharmer said:


> At this time I don't have high hopes for a vaccine helping to end this crisis. Some people that had a tickle in their throat late 2019 -2020 will think they have immunity, the no mask people will probably be no vaccine people since they think covid is made up by the media, the tin hat people will think the government is trying to poison them, the anti-vaccine people will still be anti-vaccine, the procrastinators will procrastinate.


According to what you posted, you obviously wear a mask. If you wear a mask how come you went with your 2 old uncles out to eat last weekend? Taking your mask off to eat would have been putting them in danger, no?


----------



## bridgeman

90 percent of the masks peeps are wearing won't even filter out drywall dust particles that are 4x larger than the virus. Take your mask and shove it ain't wearing it not more..


----------



## Shad Rap

Burkcarp1 said:


> According to what you posted, you obviously wear a mask. If you wear a mask how come you went with your 2 old uncles out to eat last weekend? Taking your mask off to eat would have been putting them in danger, no?


And this is another silly rule...you put the mask on to go in the restaurant, wait to get seated and then take the mask off once you're at your seat...roflmao...huh?


----------



## One guy and a boat

PapawSmith said:


> I, like probably everyone here, pray for the health and safety of your Wife and Family. Nobody that I know wants anyone to suffer any negative impact from this virus. I hope for you the same that occurred for me when I contracted the virus, no symptoms and no transition to any others. That was the same result for the only other guy that I know that was diagnosed and quarantined, like I did. Those of us that believe that the mask mandate is a farce in no way ignore the fact that this virus is contagious, nor do we fail to understand that there are folks that need protected as they are certainly vulnerable. We just feel that the approach that requires all that are well need covered rejects the real need of the few that need protected. We feel that our focus and efforts are grossly misguided. Prayers for your Wife and Family.


Thank you for the prayers papa, very much appreciated. I respect your view on wearing a mask and have some of those same thoughts at times also. There's a lot of uncertainty as society works its way through this dilemma. I have no delusions about being totally protected by a mask or distance. I'm just hoping to improve the odds a little for my family unit.


Sent from my Pixel 3a XL using Tapatalk


----------



## Snakecharmer

Burkcarp1 said:


> According to what you posted, you obviously wear a mask. If you wear a mask how come you went with your 2 old uncles out to eat last weekend? Taking your mask off to eat would have been putting them in danger, no?


Wrong.. Didn't wear a mask.


----------



## Snakecharmer

jrose said:


> And you are?


I'll cross that bridge when I come to it. I've haven't had the flu vaccine ever but I've had polio, smallpox, hepatitis, etc. 

What about you? Which are you?


----------



## Hatchetman

Shad Rap said:


> And this is another silly rule...you put the mask on to go in the restaurant, wait to get seated and then take the mask off once you're at your seat...roflmao...huh?



And then after sitting down and taking the mask off, put it back on to go to the restroom and take it back off when you return to your table....Oh and then put it back on to walk out of the restaurant....Makes sense to me....


----------



## slipsinker

One guy and a boat said:


> I haven't posted here in a few months, but have loosely followed. For all you mask debaters. In my house is myself and my wife. I also have my elderly divorced parents living with me. My wife took covid the least serious in the house. Didn't always wear mask or social distance. This morning she got the positive covid results. She's been in our bedroom since Tuesday when she developed symptoms. Now the waiting game starts. As far as the mask debate goes, just ask yourself if wearing a mask is really that big a deal? What vulnerable family member could you help save by wearing a mask and being smart? Are you putting freedoms above what is safest for all ? And by freedoms, I'm not talking about turning your guns in or limiting speech, just a face covering and some distancing. Not judging anybody, just reflecting a little.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3a XL using Tapatalk[/QUO this is where it starts,what will they take away next? might just be limiting speech


----------



## jrose

Snakecharmer said:


> I'll cross that bridge when I come to it. I've haven't had the flu vaccine ever but I've had polio, smallpox, hepatitis, etc.
> 
> What about you? Which are you?


I'm siding with the 99% of the people who get this will be fine crowd. I'm healthy, and if I have to put a mask on to make people feel "safe" I will, but don't wear one and really doubt it makes much of a difference. If they come up with a a vaccine, that would be great, but like you, I have never had a flu shot. It just doesn't seem that important to me. (Personal preference)


----------



## Burkcarp1

Snakecharmer said:


> Wrong.. Didn't wear a mask.


Oh ok. Why didn’t you?because you sure preach it.


----------



## bulafisherman

This will all die down and fizzle out after the election, wait and see


----------



## slipsinker

bulafisherman said:


> This will all die down and fizzle out after the election, wait and see


i been saying the same thing


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Shad Rap said:


> And this is another silly rule...you put the mask on to go in the restaurant, wait to get seated and then take the mask off once you're at your seat...roflmao...huh?


And the “non maskers”, lol, are the bad guys. The “pro maskers” Sure do like to call you out on it. Hypocrites.


----------



## jrose

multi species angler said:


> NOT A PREDICTION BUT FACT: 10's of thousands more cases and 1000's more dead if every one doesn't get on the same page and slow this virus down until a working vaccine and or treatment is available.


1000's will die one way or the other. Fact. I'm not waiting around.


----------



## MIGHTY

Just to double check, no face coverings if you’re concealed carrying correct?


----------



## One guy and a boat

MIGHTY said:


> Just to double check, no face coverings if you’re concealed carrying correct?


I seen a post from the geauga county sheriff last night that's said it's a myth. You can conceal carry with a face covering

Sent from my Pixel 3a XL using Tapatalk


----------



## jrose

One guy and a boat said:


> I seen a post from the geauga county sheriff last night that's said it's a myth. You can conceal carry with a face covering
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3a XL using Tapatalk


I bet bank tellers are a little jumpy these days!


----------



## Saugeye Tom




----------



## Burkcarp1

3 red counties here in Ohio ( combined) as of yesterday had no deaths and 15 new cases.. but threatening lockdown again
.hmmmm, nothing going on here


----------



## Saugeyefisher

It sounds like michigan is going state wide mandatory masks. Heard it on a detroit radio station today why up near the border.


----------



## garhtr

Interesting-- but I don't have a source (radio while driving) but it should be easy to verify.
2019 deaths from Jan - June with no pandemic were identical to 2020 numbers with a pandemic ? ? ? 
Good luck !


----------



## CHOPIQ

What I dont understand is if the masks work so great then why aren’t people allowed to go to concerts, football games, funerals etc if everyone is wearing a mask? I realize the key here is EVERYONE wearing a mask but that isn’t even brought up. I’m sure a lot of people would wear their mask if t meant they could go to their relatives funeral or other event.


----------



## MIGHTY

CHOPIQ said:


> What I dont understand is if the masks work so great then why aren’t people allowed to go to concerts, football games, funerals etc if everyone is wearing a mask? I realize the key here is EVERYONE wearing a mask but that isn’t even brought up. I’m sure a lot of people would wear their mask if t meant they could go to their relatives funeral or other event.


 I agree. I posted some in this thread when it was young then didn’t check up on it for quite a while so maybe I missed it. Has there been any actual testing/proof that the masks stop the spread of the virus? Everything I’ve seen on tv or read online the Doctors/experts says “the masks might help reduce the spread. Key word being might. Like I said maybe there was actual testing done and I missed it? Then you check the doctors credentials and you realized they studied journalism for a few years


----------



## buckeyebowman

Snakecharmer said:


> Hang in there Kip. Not easy with the elderly parents. My Mom moved in this week as my sister is having her kitchen redone.
> My sister-in-law's husband had covid in April. He's recovered but knocked him on his ass for 2 weeks.


Uh, wouldn't your sister-in-law's husband be your brother?


----------



## BeerBatter

Kinda like wearing a condom 
Lol


----------



## BeerBatter

Lone Ranger oh I guess he was an evil bastard too. Lol
Sorry I’ll quit 
Mask no mask ???
I like no mask I’ll take my chances or hopefully not have too much social distancing
Hard to really get to know somebody at 6’


----------



## Shad Rap

buckeyebowman said:


> Uh, wouldn't your sister-in-law's husband be your brother?


Glad I wasn't the only one to catch it...


----------



## Shad Rap

Saugeye Tom said:


> View attachment 365951
> View attachment 365951


Sounds like this is happening quite a bit.


----------



## Snakecharmer

buckeyebowman said:


> Uh, wouldn't your sister-in-law's husband be your brother?


My wife's sister's husband. My wife's sister is my sister -in-law. Her husband had covid-19.


----------



## Shad Rap

MIGHTY said:


> Just to double check, no face coverings if you’re concealed carrying correct?


What would a face covering have to do with a concealed weapon?..it's concealed.


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

Shad Rap said:


> Glad I wasn't the only one to catch it...


Yup, just you two, the rest of us were smart enough to figure that one out. (wife's sister's husband)
It's been awhile Shad.......here you go 








Have a good weekend.


----------



## MIGHTY

Shad Rap said:


> What would a face covering have to do with a concealed weapon?..it's concealed.


 I just thought in some states it’s a class 6 felony to wear a mask or partial face covering. Just double checking


----------



## Saugeye Tom

MIGHTY said:


> I just thought in some states it’s a class 6 felony to wear a mask or partial face covering. Just double checking


Not ohio


----------



## MIGHTY

^^^thank you sir. Just double checking


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

DeWine says mask order doesn’t apply to lawmakers, judges, and staff housed in a public building. You all better wake up. It’s just going to get worse.


----------



## Shad Rap

Stars-n-Stripers said:


> Yup, just you two, the rest of us were smart enough to figure that one out. (wife's sister's husband)
> It's been awhile Shad.......here you go
> View attachment 366011
> 
> Have a good weekend.


Were smart enough or weren't smart enough?..go figure...you must like me because you quote me quite often.....stay in your lane.
And I really didn't think just two people noticed it....or was hoping not anyway...I wasn't calling anyone stupid regardless...could've been a typo for all I know I didn't read it again...maybe he refers to his brother as his sister in laws husband...lol...next time jump down someone else's throat there candy striper...have a crappie weekend..
Not like I even said anything about it...anyway, I'm glad I made you laugh...tight lines.


----------



## Shad Rap

MIGHTY said:


> I just thought in some states it’s a class 6 felony to wear a mask or partial face covering. Just double checking


I just wasn't sure what it would have to do with a concealed weapon...I haven't heard the laws about it myself...at some point you would have to take off the mask...you could narrow down who is carrying and who isn't if you couldn't wear a mask and carry your weapon...just wondering the logic in it...the whole thing is about concealment anyway.


----------



## yonderfishin

MIGHTY said:


> Just to double check, no face coverings if you’re concealed carrying correct?



Ohio law makes no mention of wearing a mask while carrying. It is not illegal


----------



## yonderfishin

The virus is now proven to have been in the US much earlier than previously thought , atleast Janurary and likely December or November of last year. An incubation period of around two weeks and suppsedly wickedly contagious. Yet the overall death rate in the US for everything together even flu pretty much mirrored the death rate of the past few years until around early March where it spiked out of control....so they say....right about when mitigation and paranoia started going into full effect. How can this be ? What can explain that other than fear and panic induced deaths ? That spike in deaths should have started much earlier , it should not have coincided with the panic and anxiety rush fueled by the media and mitigation efforts in March. Of course deaths surged then , especially when they called EVERYTHING covid. 

Dont take my word for it , the info is available and can be compiled by anyone. The more you know....


----------



## jdl447

yonderfishin said:


> The virus is now proven to have been in the US much earlier than previously thought , atleast Janurary and likely December or November of last year. An incubation period of around two weeks and suppsedly wickedly contagious. Yet the overall death rate in the US for everything together even flu pretty much mirrored the death rate of the past few years until around early March where it spiked out of control....so they say....right about when mitigation and paranoia started going into full effect. How can this be ? What can explain that other than fear and panic induced deaths ? That spike in deaths should have started much earlier , it should not have coincided with the panic and anxiety rush fueled by the media and mitigation efforts in March. Of course deaths surged then , especially when they called EVERYTHING covid.
> 
> Dont take my word for it , the info is available and can be compiled by anyone. The more you know....


Poof?


----------



## yonderfishin

jdl447 said:


> Poof?




Poof indeed...... LOL


----------



## yonderfishin

And of course positive cases are going up right now.......if you actually trust these often inaccurate tests , and the people who have been lying for months now , as the death rate is going down. They are being atleast a little more accurate in what they " CALL " covid deaths now , and they are doing a lot more testing. So strange how the virus seems so much less lethal nowdays dont it ? Nearly everybody is asymptomatic , some are wondering if the virus has changed and become less lethal in just a few months ,......but the most sensible explanation is that they just arent fumbling and fudging the numbers as much and are calling fewer deaths from other things covid.


----------



## MIGHTY

President of Tanzania was growing skeptical of the testing a while back so he did some testing of his own and kept the “patients” a secret. Poor plants can’t wear masks so if they get it it’ll spread like wildfire ......


----------



## cement569

well folks, was watching fox 8 news just now and they are adding new symptoms for the flu that somehow werent around 5 months ago. reading the daily reports from the media is kinda like reading the comic section of the news paper


----------



## bulafisherman

cement569 said:


> well folks, was watching fox 8 news just now and they are adding new symptoms for the flu that somehow werent around 5 months ago. reading the daily reports from the media is kinda like reading the comic section of the news paper


 they gotta keep us guessing


----------



## bridgeman

No... They're guessing they haven't got a clue.


----------



## KaGee

* NBC Contributor Reveals He Never Tested Positive For COVID After Network Followed His Alleged Recovery *
July 10, 2020 By Tristan Justice

After NBC News extensively followed the COVID-19 case of its own on-air contributor Dr. Joseph Fair, the virologist and epidemiologist revealed he tested negative for coronavirus as well as negative for the WuFlu antibodies, meaning he never had the virus.

https://thefederalist.com/2020/07/1...-after-network-followed-his-alleged-recovery/

And people wonder why a lot of us have doubts.


----------



## KaGee

GREENSBORO, N.C. — Seven-time NASCAR champion Jimmy Johnson tested positive for coronavirus Friday, July 3. 

He didn't have any symptoms, but he got tested because his wife, Chani, tested positive. 

The following Wednesday, Johnson was allowed to race again after he tested negative twice. 

Ha! Son, how many of the "thousands" of positive tests being done are accurate?


----------



## bearcat3993

How can you say that was a false- positive? How do you know he didn’t shed the virus within those five days? 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## multi species angler

KaGee said:


> Ha! Son, how many of the "thousands" of positive tests being done are accurate?


Ha! Son, how many of the "thousands" of negative tests being done are accurate?


----------



## cement569

its really funny how the media uses sports players and celebs to increase the fear, and 2 days later they are fine. try thinking for yourself and not what you are fed daily. the nba is ready to start, nascar has been up and running riots and protests are all good. but dont go near a church or place of worship,are americans really getting that dumb?


----------



## PapawSmith

multi species angler said:


> Ha! Son, how many of the "thousands" of negative tests being done are accurate?


Haha, thanks for proving how you miss the point altogether.


----------



## Saugeye Tom

Men. And ladies if there are any.....I will go on living my life normally. I refuse to be bull chited


----------



## Saugeye Tom

I have a terrible case of .....hiccups from eating hot wings


----------



## slipsinker

cement569 said:


> its really funny how the media uses sports players and celebs to increase the fear, and 2 days later they are fine. try thinking for yourself and not what you are fed daily. the nba is ready to start, nascar has been up and running riots and protests are all good. but dont go near a church or place of worship,are americans really getting that dumb?


watched cbs news at 6:30 and they showed people in a full icu ,but looking closer you could see they were mannequins with vents.then they showed one actual looking man on a vent! we were like wtf!


----------



## bearcat3993

Hold your breath.... hold it.... hold it.... hold it.... hold it.... hold it...your hiccups are gone 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## MagicMarker

bearcat3993 said:


> Hold your breath.... hold it.... hold it.... hold it.... hold it.... hold it...your hiccups are gone
> I have better luck taking half teaspoon of sugar. Stops them instantly
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## cincinnati

KaGee said:


> GREENSBORO, N.C. — Seven-time NASCAR champion Jimmy Johnson tested positive for coronavirus Friday, July 3.
> 
> He didn't have any symptoms, but he got tested because his wife, Chani, tested positive.
> 
> The following Wednesday, Johnson was allowed to race again after he tested negative twice.
> 
> Ha! Son, how many of the "thousands" of positive tests being done are accurate?


Watching ABC News interview a guy who had tested 3 times - all negative. The network medical consultant, w/o even blinking, says “You need to get another test.”

Looks to me like you just keep testing until you get the result you want.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Requiring face mask 5 months into a pandemic is like requiring condoms at the baby shower....


----------



## KaGee

Saugeye Tom said:


> I have a terrible case of .....hiccups from eating hot wings


Covid symptoms... better get checked.


----------



## hailtothethief




----------



## Saugeye Tom

hailtothethief said:


> View attachment 366127


Ate a spoonful of peanut butter....wala


----------



## Shad Rap

bearcat3993 said:


> Hold your breath.... hold it.... hold it.... hold it.... hold it.... hold it...your hiccups are gone
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Or a spoonful of sugar.


----------



## Shad Rap

KaGee said:


> Covid symptoms... better get checked.


Yep...they added it an hour ago to the list.


----------



## Shad Rap

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Requiring face mask 5 months into a pandemic is like requiring condoms at the baby shower....


What's wrong with that? we can delay the inevitable for even longer...


----------



## jdl447

How many people posting or reading this thread have had or tested positive for this disease? I have not been tested and no one in my immediate family has been. None of has ever shown any symptoms either. Just curious is all. ( And not your sister in law’s husband who is not your brother)


----------



## bearcat3993

My 20 yr old daughter tested positive. She just finished her quarantine yesterday. She got the virus while she was in Florida with a few of her friends. 6/8 of them tested positive after returning home. She had the dry cough but luckily no other symptoms. I also know a couple of people on my wife’s side of the family that tested positive. One of those (74 yrs old) had it pretty bad. 
Also, have had friends and a couple of my wife’s co-workers (wife is in health care) test positive. All in all, I probably know more than a dozen people that are all positive and have recovered nicely, thank god! 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## bad luck

2 nephews , late 20’s, who lived together ....1 said it was like a bad flu, other said nothing more than a common cold.... almost forgot to add, they both live in Brooklyn, NY


----------



## Workingman

Our daughter is a new nurse in a nursing home in Michigan. She gets tested every Monday. So far, so good!


----------



## Saugeye Tom

We all probably had it


----------



## cement569

i know quite a few people who had a bug in feb. and march including me, my wife, and my two sons. it lasted about 4 to 7 days exept my oldest son who has a low imune system it lasted about 9 days. since then havent talked to anyone who had it since then and im no spring chicken


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

It’s all over the place that the numbers have been pencil whipped. Blatant lies every day to get the sheep to follow. Illegally misdiagnosed people to keep their agenda moving. Yea there is a virus out there but it’s no worse than the flu virus. Everyone lost interest in it when all the violence, pillaging, murder, and looting was going on. So of course it has to be built up again. I like all the new symptoms that came out a few days ago. They have to get their quota to get that money. This way they can diagnose the flu and the common cold as corona. They need those positive tests. Stop being sheep.


----------



## Buster24

buckeyebowman said:


> Uh, wouldn't your sister-in-law's husband be your brother?


Not necessarily..... my sister-in- law’s husband is not my brother!!!!


----------



## burnsj5

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> It’s all over the place that the numbers have been pencil whipped. Blatant lies every day to get the sheep to follow. Illegally misdiagnosed people to keep their agenda moving. Yea there is a virus out there but it’s no worse than the flu virus. Everyone lost interest in it when all the violence, pillaging, murder, and looting was going on. So of course it has to be built up again. I like all the new symptoms that came out a few days ago. They have to get their quota to get that money. This way they can diagnose the flu and the common cold as corona. They need those positive tests. Stop being sheep.


A lot of people are on the same thought that hospitals are pumping numbers for money, is this to help revenue lost because hospitals were making way more money before the virus? Some hospitals paying employees to be off work, less procedures, less visits, clinics and units closing down or only at a small fraction of patients they once were. If the hospitals wanted money they would be full bore running as usual. Outside toilet paper companies not sure who made out on this pandemic.


----------



## bridgeman

Lowe's, Home Depot and every grocery store.


----------



## 9Left

burnsj5 said:


> A lot of people are on the same thought that hospitals are pumping numbers for money, is this to help revenue lost because hospitals were making way more money before the virus? Some hospitals paying employees to be off work, less procedures, less visits, clinics and units closing down or only at a small fraction of patients they once were. If the hospitals wanted money they would be full bore running as usual. Outside toilet paper companies not sure who made out on this pandemic.


None of this is true… Hospitals can't run "fullbore as usual" when they are mandated to shut down certain units and elective procedures, and clear out a certain percentage of their beds for a pandemic… Hospitals actually have to listen to governing bodies such as TJC ( the joint comission) and ODH ( Ohio department of health)
And in order to help recover some money lost… hospitals, like the one I work at, Have gotten rid of coffee machines completely for the nurses, using all plastic utensils, including plates, shutting down the cafeteria so they can lay off the staff that work in the cafeteria, Laying off janitors environmental cleaning staff, and just running with a bare-bones cleaning staff… And every nurse that has been let go has been furloughed… That was their choice… The other choice was to be completely let go....Oh yeah… And not giving a rather well deserved raise for the year 2020 to the nurses that are working during this pandemic.


----------



## Shad Rap

burnsj5 said:


> A lot of people are on the same thought that hospitals are pumping numbers for money, is this to help revenue lost because hospitals were making way more money before the virus? Some hospitals paying employees to be off work, less procedures, less visits, clinics and units closing down or only at a small fraction of patients they once were. If the hospitals wanted money they would be full bore running as usual. Outside toilet paper companies not sure who made out on this pandemic.


They get reimbursed for the cost of care and PPE...do you realize how much PPE is gone through in dealing with just one positive patient?..imagine a nursing home with 30 to 40 positive residents at once.


----------



## garhtr

https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/506930-county-in-ohio-establishes-hotline-to-report-people-not-wearing-masks?
Will you report your neighbors and friends ? ?
Good luck !


----------



## cheezemm2

If only there was some way to know how bad Florida will get...


----------



## Patricio

I know one person who died from it. He was living in Brazil, the Altamira region. A doctor who would go from village to village treating people. I spent about 4 months with him on a river boat cruising the xingu river while he did his thing. 

There's been a small outbreak here in river falls Wisconsin. 10 new cases. All tied to bars. This triples the cases. They think one person who was sick and went barhopping. Mel's, my hangout after fishing remains unaffected. 

I still think it's way overblown.


----------



## burnsj5

9Left said:


> None of this is true… Hospitals can't run "fullbore as usual" when they are mandated to shut down certain units and elective procedures, and clear out a certain percentage of their beds for a pandemic… Hospitals actually have to listen to governing bodies such as TJC ( the joint comission) and ODH ( Ohio department of health)
> And in order to help recover some money lost… hospitals, like the one I work at, Have gotten rid of coffee machines completely for the nurses, using all plastic utensils, including plates, shutting down the cafeteria so they can lay off the staff that work in the cafeteria, Laying off janitors environmental cleaning staff, and just running with a bare-bones cleaning staff… And every nurse that has been let go has been furloughed… That was their choice… The other choice was to be completely let go....Oh yeah… And not giving a rather well deserved raise for the year 2020 to the nurses that are working during this pandemic.


Your facility is not the same as every facility. I'm not sure what of anything I said was untrue. I never said any real statement just that people are inferring hospitals have an ulterior motive to increase numbers under false pretenses with the intention of increasing payouts. I'm simply saying if that was the case hospitals would not be following recommendedations and running more along the lines of "business as usual". I doubt an accrediting body (not governing body) like joint commission is the one calling shots for hospitals. They won't even be making their rounds with what's going on. In fact I can only find recommendations from multiple organizations, federal government, and state governors. The state seems to be the one with the most pull but facilities continue to really function by their own set of rules (seemingly, if you can find publication by state or nationally that specifically states what elective surgeries or percentage of beds have to remain open I would like to learn from it). When hospital x now allowing certain electives hospital y not yet; hospital x more inclined to fill non essential clinic hospital y clinic still at a minimum or closed. This gives the impression again there is not hard rules but facilities doing what they want; so who is stopping them from running full bore (if money was their main goal)? I'm just saying I don't think hospitals are running a conspiracy to falsely raise numbers with the thought of making some huge profit.
To the comment on cost or amount of PPE required for a positive patient yes I am aware and I don't think it is that much especially since many facilities reuse bulk of PPE. Facilities aren't making bank off PPE reimbursement either way.


----------



## burnsj5

garhtr said:


> https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/506930-county-in-ohio-establishes-hotline-to-report-people-not-wearing-masks?
> Will you report your neighbors and friends ? ?
> Good luck !


Yeah, that line would be ringing off the hook. I stopped by bass pro for a few things today and there is a mask mandate, folks not wearing a mask at all or under their nose including employees. I'm not arguing about masks, but mandate or not I'm not seeing a huge change. 
Was listening to some really strict rules Hawaii has in place for their 14 day self quarantine when returning and their neighbors were calling resulting in actual arrests and fines, that is pretty scary.


----------



## Snakecharmer

I just heard my 33 year old niece in Charleston SC was confirmed this week with Covid-10. She is the controller at a large resort and probably got it from a co-worker as she had to interact with some maint. workers filling in for the purchasing mgr who was out sick. Not sure if he has covid or not.


----------



## yonderfishin

Since the tests are known to show false positives/negatives , ..... its a logical conclusion that a certain percentage of the positive covid cases with cold or flu like symptoms are in fact just cold and flu. And a certain percentage of positive cases with no symptoms at all are actually negatives. But what are those percentages .....5% ?.....10% ?......70% ? 

We may never know but this crisis is looking more and more fabricated all the time


----------



## Bluewalleye

burnsj5 said:


> Yeah, that line would be ringing off the hook. I stopped by bass pro for a few things today and there is a mask mandate, folks not wearing a mask at all or under their nose including employees. I'm not arguing about masks, but mandate or not I'm not seeing a huge change.
> Was listening to some really strict rules Hawaii has in place for their 14 day self quarantine when returning and their neighbors were calling resulting in actual arrests and fines, that is pretty scary.


I wonder how many real criminals they let out of jail, to make room for these inconsiderate, self centered non mask wearing mean people?


----------



## buckeyebowman

Buster24 said:


> Not necessarily..... my sister-in- law’s husband is not my brother!!!!


Alright already! I don't have a married Brother, so I missed the connection!


----------



## MagicMarker

garhtr said:


> https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/506930-county-in-ohio-establishes-hotline-to-report-people-not-wearing-masks?
> Will you report your neighbors and friends ? ?
> Good luck !


 No. Hell No


----------



## cheezemm2

These financial claims are hysterical... They do not represent or even come close to cancelling out the massive financial hits that major hospital systems took during the closure of elective surgery. It's a requirement for state hospitals to report their financials, go take a look at their year end close when it's available.


----------



## Shad Rap

burnsj5 said:


> Your facility is not the same as every facility. I'm not sure what of anything I said was untrue. I never said any real statement just that people are inferring hospitals have an ulterior motive to increase numbers under false pretenses with the intention of increasing payouts. I'm simply saying if that was the case hospitals would not be following recommendedations and running more along the lines of "business as usual". I doubt an accrediting body (not governing body) like joint commission is the one calling shots for hospitals. They won't even be making their rounds with what's going on. In fact I can only find recommendations from multiple organizations, federal government, and state governors. The state seems to be the one with the most pull but facilities continue to really function by their own set of rules (seemingly, if you can find publication by state or nationally that specifically states what elective surgeries or percentage of beds have to remain open I would like to learn from it). When hospital x now allowing certain electives hospital y not yet; hospital x more inclined to fill non essential clinic hospital y clinic still at a minimum or closed. This gives the impression again there is not hard rules but facilities doing what they want; so who is stopping them from running full bore (if money was their main goal)? I'm just saying I don't think hospitals are running a conspiracy to falsely raise numbers with the thought of making some huge profit.
> To the comment on cost or amount of PPE required for a positive patient yes I am aware and I don't think it is that much especially since many facilities reuse bulk of PPE. Facilities aren't making bank off PPE reimbursement either way.


They had to purchase the PPE too...I'm not disagreeing with you I'm just saying...facilities didn't have nearly enough PPE, if any at all...


----------



## chrisrf815

cheezemm2 said:


> These financial claims are hysterical... They do not represent or even come close to cancelling out the massive financial hits that major hospital systems took during the closure of elective surgery. It's a requirement for state hospitals to report their financials, go take a look at their year end close when it's available.


You hit the nail on the head. My brother works at an akron hospital in the icu and has seen many covid patients. He said the hospital is 30 million dollars in the red, yes thats negative 30 million, for the year since they shut down elective surgeries 
I was in the mind set that it is messed up hospitals are making money off of "covid deaths" till i heard this. The money they make off covid deaths is nothing compared to what they are losing from no elective surgeries. 
Keep in mind he said they were averaging only 20 covid patients for 150 beds set aside and had 45 at one time. My point is the hoslital never came close to maxing out on covid patients, but lost huge amounts of money because they shut down elective surgeries.
Ive been reading this thread from the begining and was an essential worker through the whole thing and kind of a non beleiver in the whole thing, but ive realized this is very real.


----------



## Dovans

a new norm


----------



## JamesF

The new normal, is most certainly going to be around for a very long time. From my point of view, many people just don't care,understand, or don't want to understand what is at stake here. I have to be very careful about this covid business. I just received some news about my health, that I am trying to wrap my head around. I am having a lot of testing done this week, and between fighting with my insurance and ignorant people, is having a negative effect on my dealing with money grabbers. I am not the kind of person to play games with. Giving me the runaround about co pays,and deductibles, before having a test approved isn't going to work. People don't want to be honest about your health coverage, and trust me,once you give them your insurance information they know exactly what your coverage is. Just to get money up front. And code the procedure so they can make more money without reimbursement.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Hang in there JamesF. Hope they can fix you up.


----------



## cincinnati

Point of clarification: So people are now rationalizing that incorrectly diagnosing & billing covid cases is legitimate, because hospitals are not performing more lucrative, elective procedures?

Asking for a friend....


----------



## loves2fishinohio

cheezemm2 said:


> If only there was some way to know how bad Florida will get...


Oh, it will get worse. I like how the media put in big bold print another record day in terms of new cases, but yet failed to mention it was a record day in terms of the number of test results. About 10% of people tested positive yesterday based on the number of test results that came back.

I'm holding out hope that we can still go down in September for our annual vacation to the beach in the Panhandle area, but I'm not going if I have to sit in a condo all day and look at the ocean.


----------



## Shad Rap

cincinnati said:


> Point of clarification: So people are now rationalizing that incorrectly diagnosing & billing covid cases is legitimate, because hospitals are not performing more lucrative, elective procedures?
> 
> Asking for a friend....


My wifes nursing home chain has received more than 10 million this year in reinbursement so far because of Covid (straight into the owners pocket, not my wifes)...and they still have a bunch more money to get...anytime theres a bunch of money involved it always brings out the crooks...
She's had several instances where Covid has been cause of death and the person was never tested...the families were pissed off...and that's on the facility doctor...
Like I said, I see big lawsuits down the road...fraud at it's finest...not saying it's taking place everywhere but it's out there for sure...


----------



## cheezemm2

cincinnati said:


> Point of clarification: So people are now rationalizing that incorrectly diagnosing & billing covid cases is legitimate, because hospitals are not performing more lucrative, elective procedures?
> 
> Asking for a friend....


No, incorrect billing would be considered billing fraud. The penalty for doing such in the healthcare environment is high, especially from the Medicare/Star Rating perspective. The incentive to try to make up a few bucks by doing this versus the risk of losing reimbursement dollars does not make sense.

Based on these theories, we are saying that physicians and nurse practitioners are incorrectly diagnosing patients in their charts, those charts are then being recorded by a charging/office assistant who is passing them through to the finance/billing department that is responsible for auditing the charges and creating the bill that will pass through to insurance. Can it happen, sure.

Are the vast majority of hospitals engaged in widespread over reporting at the risk of losing licenses, medicare reimbursement dollars, and opening themselves up to CMS and Joint Commission audits/findings? The answer is no.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Shad Rap said:


> My wifes nursing home chain has received more than 10 million this year in reinbursement so far because of Covid (straight into the owners pocket, not my wifes)...and they still have a bunch more money to get...anytime theres a bunch of money involved it always brings out the crooks...
> She's had several instances where Covid has been cause of death and the person was never tested...the families were pissed off...and that's on the facility doctor...
> Like I said, I see big lawsuits down the road...fraud at it's finest...not saying it's taking place everywhere but it's out there for sure...


Here's a link from the official Medicare Website to report fraud.

https://oig.hhs.gov/


----------



## cheezemm2

Snakecharmer said:


> Here's a link from the official Medicare Website to report fraud.
> 
> https://oig.hhs.gov/


I'll wait for everyone on this thread to report all the MASSIVE fraud they are seeing in Ohio and post their findings to us.


----------



## ICENUT

The only fraud are probably the politicians.


----------



## Shad Rap

Snakecharmer said:


> Here's a link from the official Medicare Website to report fraud.
> 
> https://oig.hhs.gov/


I know...I'm sure it's already reported...along with many others across the country...may be fraud, may not be...again I'm just talking about the cause of death being covid and not even being tested...the hospitals and nursing homes should definitely be reimbursed for care, PPE and whatnot...


----------



## Fish-N-Fool

I have no idea if there is or is not Covid fraud going on. But, I can say the gov't does take it very seriously - they closed a practice in my town that was involved in Med fraud and both the doctor and his wife were placed in prison. They seized their personal and business assets as well. It was an intentional fraudulent billing scheme for procedures they were not performing. They got caught being too greedy - computers audit these things for abnormalities and this practice administered an unrealistic # of tests so they investigated. They had invoiced and been paid for like $11 million worth of testing, much of which was never conducted. It was big news because in cases like this they show up and raid the office and home, etc. with no warning - things like that don't happen around here.

Besides people being MOSTLY honest, I wouldn't think doctors and medical professionals would risk ruining their life. There is always a rotten one (see above), but I can't imagine it is wide spread intentional fraud. Maybe I'm too optimistic?


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

You have to remember it’s the hospitals and Amy Clueless that decided to put elective surgeries on hold. Because there were going to be people dying in the streets, they were going to be overrun, not enough equipment, blah, blah, blah. BS... if you think they have lost money you are crazy. Remember all the staff that were laid off right after this flu started going around? They are making money as usual. You know how it works.... if a hospital projects that it will be in the black 3 mil at the end of the fiscal year, but they were only in the black 1 mil at the end of the fiscal year. Well they will say they lost 2 mill on paper. Don’t think they won’t get it back and them some either. You would not believe how much my insurance had paid them the last 6 yrs. BS.


----------



## Snakecharmer

Lots of ostriches out there.


----------



## cheezemm2

loves2fishinohio said:


> Oh, it will get worse. I like how the media put in big bold print another record day in terms of new cases, but yet failed to mention it was a record day in terms of the number of test results. About 10% of people tested positive yesterday based on the number of test results that came back.
> 
> I'm holding out hope that we can still go down in September for our annual vacation to the beach in the Panhandle area, but I'm not going if I have to sit in a condo all day and look at the ocean.


My post was dripping with sarcasm. 

We've had NY and Italy tell us that corona will take off given the chance. Based on what we're seeing in the south, I'm pretty sure heat isn't killing it, but might be helping as more people congregate indoors with the A/C and at the bar (well I guess we all congregate at the bar regardless of season) It will be interesting to see if that happens when we're all inside in winter.

I think somewhere in this thread though we've read about how corona tends to go crazy then die off rather quickly too. We've got about another week until the 4th of July gatherings really get factored in.


----------



## JamesF

In my post, about coding, is related to family and, or single person. The situation involves, our family deductible and co pay is 2k, adding the deductible of just one family member as a single deductible, does not go towards the family deductible, almost doubling the amount of family deductibles. I find this, in my opinion, as fraud. I am having a ct scan and I must pay the deductible first. I inquired about a covid test, and was told that it's not necessary!?


----------



## yonderfishin

cheezemm2 said:


> No, incorrect billing would be considered billing fraud. The penalty for doing such in the healthcare environment is high, especially from the Medicare/Star Rating perspective. The incentive to try to make up a few bucks by doing this versus the risk of losing reimbursement dollars does not make sense.
> 
> Based on these theories, we are saying that physicians and nurse practitioners are incorrectly diagnosing patients in their charts, those charts are then being recorded by a charging/office assistant who is passing them through to the finance/billing department that is responsible for auditing the charges and creating the bill that will pass through to insurance. Can it happen, sure.
> 
> Are the vast majority of hospitals engaged in widespread over reporting at the risk of losing licenses, medicare reimbursement dollars, and opening themselves up to CMS and Joint Commission audits/findings? The answer is no.


You are assuming that overreporting and upbilling is something new with covid and it wasnt happening on a huge scale before and without covid , even at risk of great legal consequence later.....and that would be incorrect. Fact is , its very expensive and time consuming to fight the system and seek justice and in most cases nearly impossible to hold anyone accountable for doing such a thing. Healthcare systems have been taking advantage of that for a very long time.


----------



## Snakecharmer

yonderfishin said:


> You are assuming that overreporting and upbilling is something new with covid and it wasnt happening on a huge scale before and without covid , even at risk of great legal consequence later.....and that would be incorrect. Fact is , its very expensive and time consuming to fight the system and seek justice and in most cases nearly impossible to hold anyone accountable for doing such a thing. Healthcare systems have been taking advantage of that for a very long time.


Most people have insurance so if you are aware of overreporting and upbilling report it to them and let them take care of it.


----------



## Dovans

My new masks arrived today.. If you gotta wear one, least make it somewhat enjoyable...


----------



## buckeyebowman

Fish-N-Fool said:


> I have no idea if there is or is not Covid fraud going on. But, I can say the gov't does take it very seriously - they closed a practice in my town that was involved in Med fraud and both the doctor and his wife were placed in prison. They seized their personal and business assets as well. It was an intentional fraudulent billing scheme for procedures they were not performing. They got caught being too greedy - computers audit these things for abnormalities and this practice administered an unrealistic # of tests so they investigated. They had invoiced and been paid for like $11 million worth of testing, much of which was never conducted. It was big news because in cases like this they show up and raid the office and home, etc. with no warning - things like that don't happen around here.
> 
> Besides people being MOSTLY honest, I wouldn't think doctors and medical professionals would risk ruining their life. There is always a rotten one (see above), but I can't imagine it is wide spread intentional fraud. Maybe I'm too optimistic?


Sounds exactly like what happened here, except it was a mental health and addiction counseling outfit. Both the husband and wife are in prison, and their house and all other assets have been seized.


----------



## Saugeyefisher

Dovans said:


> My new masks arrived today.. If you gotta wear one, least make it somewhat enjoyable...


Oh I have fun with my masks when I go into areas its required (the thortons down the road has a armed gaurd in forcing there FM policy). 
But I'll were the sa sheild up as hi as I can without covering my eyes,where my hat as low as I can without covering my eyes,then put on big black sunglasses . The looks I get


----------



## Saugeye Tom

Saugeyefisher said:


> Oh I have fun with my masks when I go into areas its required (the thortons down the road has a armed gaurd in forcing there FM policy).
> But I'll were the sa sheild up as hi as I can without covering my eyes,where my hat as low as I can without covering my eyes,then put on big black sunglasses . The looks I get


----------



## cheezemm2

Houston, a few days old...

https://www.propublica.org/article/...d-icus-leave-covid-19-patients-waiting-in-ers


----------



## Saugeyefisher

montagc said:


> What’s so difficult about wearing a mask anyway? I go outdoors in hot and cold weather and cover up my mouth and nose all the time. I wear a mask working around dust. I haven’t suffocated yet. I don’t even notice I’m wearing a mask at work except for my glasses fogging up. And before you start on about that, water vapor is a gas, just like oxygen, of course it’s going to pass through!


It's not really that difficult. I wear one when required. Like I posted. But if it's not required I have not been wearing one. But I can promise you I have taken every other measure I can to help prevent it. I sanatize before and after. I wipe down my cart before and after. I keep my distance. And I dont sit around and chit chat. I dont touch what I dont want to buy. I can promise you I have yet to cough or sneeze in a store,not even to clear my throat(I'm a healthy 35 yr old and can control my caugh,if I had a cough I WOULD NOT go,and honestl I cant remember the last time I sneezed,maybe 5,6 years ago,100% truth) why I am in the store or gas station,I dont take my kids in unless they specifically want something. But I make them wear a mask because they sneeze at times and cannot quite control there cough. 
I few times I have worn a mask in the store they either fall down my face or rise up,or bunch up. I'm am constantly adjusting it with the hands that I'm using to pick up the stuff that I have no clue who touched before me. So I'm pretty much touching my face 100% more when I do wear face covering. So I am putting myself at more risk by doing so. Significantly more. And I have tried several different face coverings..
So I feel I can protect myself and others better by not wearing a mask. And bye putting myself at extra risk I am putting my family,co workers,and anybody else I come into contact at extra risk. 
If anyone wants to call me selfish for this,or call bs on it so be it. It has nothing to do with politics. I hate politics. They bring out the worst in people imo. 
I know I'm not selfish. I know I look look out for other people. And no offense but quite frankly its nobody's business wether or not I have health issues that a mask might make worst or make it hard to breath.
The man that works behind the counter at my local gas station had to put up a sign stating he has medical issues so doesnt wear a mask why at work. He has ben threatened because of this. He has been called a racist. He has told me he has considered quitting his job because of the threats and tom petty bs he has had to put up with because of his medical problems.


----------



## bobk

^^ don’t be blaming Tom Petty for the virus.


----------



## SICKOFIT

loves2fishinohio said:


> Oh, it will get worse. I like how the media put in big bold print another record day in terms of new cases, but yet failed to mention it was a record day in terms of the number of test results. About 10% of people tested positive yesterday based on the number of test results that came back.
> 
> I'm holding out hope that we can still go down in September for our annual vacation to the beach in the Panhandle area, but I'm not going if I have to sit in a condo all day and look at the ocean.


My son & his family were given a free week at his company's condo in Destin Florida the last week in July. With over 15,000 new cases reported in Florida yesterday,they cancelled their trip. They have 19 year old & 4 year old daughters & did not want to take any chances. I don't care how many more people are being tested these days compared to early on in this pandemic,15,000 new cases in one day is absurd


----------



## jrose

Saugeye Tom said:


> View attachment 366389


That would be great on the front of T-shirts!


----------



## Shad Rap

montagc said:


> What’s so difficult about wearing a mask anyway? I go outdoors in hot and cold weather and cover up my mouth and nose all the time. I wear a mask working around dust. I haven’t suffocated yet. I don’t even notice I’m wearing a mask at work except for my glasses fogging up. And before you start on about that, water vapor is a gas, just like oxygen, of course it’s going to pass through!


It's not passing through, the air is escaping around the mask up towards your eyes...hence fogging your glasses...it's not going through the mask...it's going around it...that same scenario works when you inhale too...you're also inhaling air around the mask...not only through it...


----------



## ICENUT

I read a post the other day that says if a fart can pass thru 2 butt cheeks,a pair of underwear and thru your jeans now what do you think that cloth mask will do LOL


----------



## yonderfishin

Snakecharmer said:


> Most people have insurance so if you are aware of overreporting and upbilling report it to them and let them take care of it.



This affects insurance companies too. They often cover and pay in spite of the upbilling because its so common its cheaper to just accept.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

Just because people don’t wear a mask doesn’t mean they lack common courtesy or disrespect those who do. They simply believe your fear is your issue.


----------



## REEL GRIP

I heard a health care professional refer to these masks people are wearing
as using a chain link fence to keep out mosquitoes.


----------



## Snakecharmer

See where Ohio residents will need to quarantine for 14 days when fishing in NY. Wonder if MLB baseball players get an exemption?



_*Meanwhile, travelers from Minnesota, New Mexico, Ohio and Wisconsin must now self-quarantine for 14 days upon arriving in New York state, Cuomo announced, bringing to 22 the number of states on the isolation list.*_


----------



## Saltfork

I find the mask situation hilarious. Why well there’s no standards on what ya have to wear just cover your face.. 

If anyone knows anything about PPE they are all created different all have different values. All let/block certain size particles. 

If you have a beard. Render your PPE useless anyone that has ever had to wear a PPE knows this much. You’d be kicked off the job until you shaved. Why cause the mask don't seal.If your wearing a cloth on your face it don’t seal.. Good luck folks .

So just putting anything ya have over your face doesn't solve a darn thing!!!!! 

It’s almost as ironic as All politicians,judges and their staff members are exempt from having to wear a mask/any ol thing over their face in the state of Ohio.. (Dewines orders)


----------



## REEL GRIP

The problems with masks, people are gonna think the can go places and do things
thinking they will be protected by the mask and that is not true.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

You do know of what 
“Quarantine” means right?
It means to separate people to a place of isolation who has been exposed to contagious or infectious disease. Not “may have been” exposed.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER




----------



## Shad Rap

REEL GRIP said:


> The problems with masks, people are gonna think the can go places and do things
> thinking they will be protected by the mask and that is not true.


Masks also make people assume they don't have to social distance...and social distancing is just as, if not more, effective than a mask in the general public setting...


----------



## BFG

This^^^^^ Keep your distance. Corona isn't some sort of jumping spider monkey. If you can't keep your distance, wear a mask. If you can't wear a mask, keep your distance. Why is this so hard? 

I laugh at perfectly healthy people who said they are "tired of being quarantined." Um...you weren't quarantined, you were asked to stay home. I was quarantined for 24 days because I had close contact with not one, but two positives. I (nor my family) didn't go anywhere for more than three weeks. I missed the bulk of the walleye run and most of the jig bite. That's what you call quarantined. 

FWIW...Ottawa Co. Health Dept. tested almost 1,000 Put in Bay residents/workers and came up with 65 positives. Yep, those people who have most assuredly been around 10's of thousands of folks since Memorial Day....had a 6.5% positive test rate. What we were not told was how may were asymptomatic. Nonetheless, the low positive rate is GREAT news. 

I saw a graphic that compared Sweden and Michigan in regard to COVID19 cases and deaths. Populations are almost the same, as are the total deaths. Sweden didn't lock anything down, while Michigan did. End result? Nearly the same infection rate, spread timing, and death total. 

Just like Michael Jordan, no matter how hard we try to stop the virus, we can only hope to contain it. 

P.S. Did y'all see the Russians beat the world to the vaccine? Human testing is over. Mass production to come very, very soon. Imagine how many folks will lose their effing minds when Trump tells us he is buying $50 billion worth of Putin's vaccine.....


----------



## Shad Rap

montagc said:


> Not necessarily. The mask redirects air in all directions due to the pressure behind it, rather then sending it straight away from you. Even if it is not tight fitting, what you are saying is it keeps my exhaled air closer to me, which is exactly the point.
> 
> All you people who like shad raps post, do you cover your sneezes?


Lol...don't be jealous of the likes...my point was, you inhale other people germs around your mask...that was it...in my post I said you're inhaling air through the mask (which would filter the air)..but you're also inhaling germs around it...unless you're wearing a mask that suctions to your face for a proper seal...otherwise it's all for show.


----------



## Saltfork

montagc said:


> Not necessarily. The mask redirects air in all directions due to the pressure behind it, rather then sending it straight away from you. Even if it is not tight fitting, what you are saying is it keeps my exhaled air closer to me, which is exactly the point.
> 
> All you people who like shad raps post, do you cover your sneezes?



Not to be snide, but you should really go take a course on PPE to really understand what they are used for and why. Also why there are different kinds and the values that they all have. 

Rule number one if it doesn’t have a tight seal it’s rendered useless... 

Agin don’t take this personal. It’s not meant to be. I feel if people are going to wear them they would want to know what would be best for them and the proper way to wear them..

Masks should be discarded or put in a bag after use. On a job if osha walked in and mask wasn’t in a bag while you were not wearing it you can be fined. Yet with this order any ol thing will do...


----------



## Burkcarp1

montagc said:


> I agree with the first part, second half, not so much.
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, I am not jealous of your likes on that comment, disappointed in them actually. It only takes a few minutes to experiment and gain the experience to see that a lot of what many are saying about masks is wrong. So watching an anti-mask echo chamber full of people who won't verify their statements or even try a mask to see what effect it has that is disheartening. People are putting self above country and somehow calling it patriotic.


 LOL


----------



## PapawSmith

montagc said:


> This isn't PPE as defined by OSHA. We aren't grinding away at friable asbestos, its not intended to filter all air in and out nor is it meant to stop 100% of a particular contaminant. It is is meant to slow down the speed at which droplets move away from our mouth and nose, just like covering a cough or sneeze. Combine that with social distancing and you can see what the end results should look like.


And his point is that the masks that folks are wearing today do NOT do what you are saying. This whole mask thing is seriously a joke, but I have zero problem with those of you that think they are helping, wearing them. Please do, and feel safe, but leave healthy me the hell alone. I too work in an industry that utilizes several types of masks designed for specific disciplines, many folks are walking around with various versions of these masks daily, thinking they are protected from a virus, and they are not. That is his, and many of ours point.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

montagc said:


> I'm really trying hard to understand, because it is such a simple thing to and I can't see why anyone would make a big deal out of wearing a mask. So other peoples' fear is the major factor driving your decision making?


Did you not read it correctly. Its your fear not mine and you are the one that has to deal with it, not me. I have no interest in trying to deal with yours. I have enough of my own to deal with. It’s simple if you would stop trying to twist people’s words. That tells me that is all you got, to try and justify shaming someone into believing the same way you do.. It doesn’t work that way. I could care less if other people fear it or want to wear one. If you think it helps you then do it. Some choose not to is all.


----------



## OnTheFly

Be afraid when the gov't mandates you CANNOT wear a mask in public (like China did during the Hong Kong protesting- want to use AI software to identify those participating in Civil Disobedience). 

I am not going to claim most masks are fitted N95 like my dad had to be fitted as he risks his life in the hospital because people put unfounded personal beliefs and luxuries in front of logic, reason, and overall regard for neighbors. Lets says majority of masks dont have that efficacy and reduce the risk of spread by only a few percentage points. The law of large #s says this will have a massive impact over time. 

If you are going out in public wear a damn mask, you are just selfish and simply have little regard for your common man if you do not. Do it simply as a show of solidarity, to me you look a hell of a lot dumber without one on. 

Wish this was not called a hoax in the first place. The evidence is clear this virus is serious, not just because of # of deaths, the lifelong complications some get are very debilitating. Maybe if this was handled with any poise in the first place we wouldn't be where we are now & the economy would not have suffered as much. 

If you dont wear a mask I sincerely hope you get fined & dont come crying when you dying or 'rona.

This is not going to 'just disappear'. Hopefully there will be a vaccine but I am sure a lot of you loonies have theories about those too.


----------



## MagicMarker

montagc said:


> Other than @Saugeyefisher, who gave a well written and reasonable response about why and when he does and doesn't wear one (Thanks for that response!) , no one has really responded to my query as to what is stopping you from wearing a mask. It seems like if you are THAT vocally anti-mask you'd have a good reason that you are willing to share. I'm really curious.


My reason is it’s my choice and I choose not to


----------



## OnTheFly

MagicMarker said:


> My reason is it’s my choice and I choose not to


Well if it is the law it is not technically your choice. LAW & ORDER am I right? Man of science & reason I see.


----------



## night vision

Should everyone be wearing gloves also?


----------



## AmericanEagle

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/07/14/cdc...ered-after-examining-missouri-hair-salon.html


----------



## MagicMarker

montagc said:


> That's not a reason. What info did you use to make that choice?


I’ve never broken a rule or a law that I agreed with. This I don’t agree with!


----------



## OnTheFly

montagc said:


> I have yet to see someone give me an actual reason why they don't wear one. Just saying it is a "choice" is a non-answer. There is an underlying reason why you made that choice. This is a discourse and I am asking questions to try to understand a group that obviously has an opposite stance than me on this matter.


You are asking the wrong crowd unfortunately. Maybe if we have a consistent reasonable response from the top. This is all a lot of these people will listen too. All those studies, experts, etc. naaaaa cant trust em.


----------



## Snakecharmer

montagc said:


> Other than @Saugeyefisher, who gave a well written and reasonable response about why and when he does and doesn't wear one (Thanks for that response!) , no one has really responded to my query as to what is stopping you from wearing a mask. It seems like if you are THAT vocally anti-mask you'd have a good reason that you are willing to share. I'm really curious.


Lots of ostriches......


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

montagc said:


> Other than @Saugeyefisher, who gave a well written and reasonable response about why and when he does and doesn't wear one (Thanks for that response!) , no one has really responded to my query as to what is stopping you from wearing a mask. It seems like if you are THAT vocally anti-mask you'd have a good reason that you are willing to share. I'm really curious.


The reasons are simple. Some feel they don’t help much if at all and because they don’t have to, among others. These reasons just aren’t good enough for you. It’s definitely not because they all want to piss off montagc. C’mon now, you knew the answers you were going to get before you even typed the question. You have been getting the same answers from responders all along. Either you are trying to be argumentative which I doubt. I think it’s more like I said ,The responses just are good enough for ya and I’m sure that’s ok with opposition.


----------



## Burkcarp1

montagc said:


> I have yet to see someone give me an actual reason why they don't wear one. Just saying it is a "choice" is a non-answer. There is an underlying reason why you made that choice. This is a discourse and I am asking questions to try to understand a group that obviously has an opposite stance than me on this matter.


Choice is an answer. Last time I checked I live in America. Furthermore I don’t walk around sneezing and coughing. AND it’s none your business whether I wear a mask or not. Go ahead if you want to but just like we obviously don’t agree on this mask wearing, you have your opinion and I have mine. So we have to agree to disagree...


----------



## cement569

ive said this before, 32 years of wearing almost every mask out there and the n95 is supposed to be one of the best. well from experiance its less than 50% efective. and no one had to tell me this i found out from personal experiance. these little masks they are selling today are a joke, they are around 20% effective, they are a placebo, in other words....false hope


----------



## Burkcarp1




----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

montagc said:


> I was actually hoping someone would give me an answer. Lots of talk in this thread but ask a pointed question and it's crickets...


I don’t think you are picking up what we are laying down. They don’t have to give you an answer to try and justify your needs or for not wearing one.


----------



## PapawSmith

montagc said:


> Are you serious right now? Are you telling me that my personal experience and the evidence right in my hands doesn't exist? The flecks of saliva and mucus in my mask after I cough and sneeze are not being stopped or slowed down by the mask, but they are in there?


Oh, what was I thinking? I forgot about your "personal experience". The mask manufacturers probably should have consulted you on all that gleaned knowledge so they would have not had to put those pesky disclaimers all over their packaging that clearly states that their product does NOT prevent the transmission of, not protect the wearer from viruses. I'm not trying to be an ass (a real challenge for me some times) but that is the reality of things related to the masks. Does it stop you from spitting flegm all over my face if you sneeze right in front of me? Well, yes it might to a certain extent, but that would never happen anyway, mask or not. So why are we trying to stop ourselves from doing something we would never do?


----------



## PapawSmith

OnTheFly said:


> Be afraid when the gov't mandates you CANNOT wear a mask in public (like China did during the Hong Kong protesting- want to use AI software to identify those participating in Civil Disobedience).
> 
> I am not going to claim most masks are fitted N95 like my dad had to be fitted as he risks his life in the hospital because people put unfounded personal beliefs and luxuries in front of logic, reason, and overall regard for neighbors. Lets says majority of masks dont have that efficacy and reduce the risk of spread by only a few percentage points. The law of large #s says this will have a massive impact over time.
> 
> If you are going out in public wear a damn mask, you are just selfish and simply have little regard for your common man if you do not. Do it simply as a show of solidarity, to me you look a hell of a lot dumber without one on.
> 
> Wish this was not called a hoax in the first place. The evidence is clear this virus is serious, not just because of # of deaths, the lifelong complications some get are very debilitating. Maybe if this was handled with any poise in the first place we wouldn't be where we are now & the economy would not have suffered as much.
> 
> If you dont wear a mask I sincerely hope you get fined & dont come crying when you dying or 'rona.
> 
> This is not going to 'just disappear'. Hopefully there will be a vaccine but I am sure a lot of you loonies have theories about those too.


Wow, 'hook, line, and sinker'....you have swallowed them all my Friend.


----------



## Saltfork

montagc said:


> I have yet to see someone give me an actual reason why they don't wear one. Just saying it is a "choice" is a non-answer. There is an underlying reason why you made that choice. This is a discourse and I am asking questions to try to understand a group that obviously has an opposite stance than me on this matter.


Because they don’t block the particulates in the air. Meaning your breathing in and exhaling particulates that is exposing everyone to your or her or his Corona virus.. Probably the same reason Mike Dewine made all Lawmakers,judges, and their staff exempt from wearing a Mask/any ol thing ya wanna throw on your face........... 

If it truly was an issue why would they be exempt?? Explain that.. Please. I mean why would a certain person be exempt.. It’s all about stoping the virus right? 

Well do they have some super gene pool? 

Lawmakers,judges, and their staff? Or just maybe,maybe they are making stuff up? Please educate me what job titles have to do with exemptions? Let’s start there.


----------



## Saltfork

montagc said:


> Choice is not an answer. You made that choice based on something. You don’t need to justify anything to me or anyone else but it would be nice to hear why some of you are so vocally against them.
> 
> Papaw, I’m no expert. I just know what I see, and it’s fairly obvious that a simple cloth face covering can stop a good amount of stuff from leaving my person.[/QUOTE
> 
> Agin maybe try this have someone stand in front of you and spray a can of spray paint about three foot from your face for 1 minute. Then post us a picture of what’s on your lips/mask area..


----------



## Saltfork

montagc said:


> If that is true I’m not sure the reason behind it. I’ll have to look into that.


 That’s 100 percent true!!! Look it up and then post back....Would that make you change your mind tho? Just curious?


----------



## jdl447

Separation of power.


----------



## PapawSmith

montagc said:


> I was actually hoping someone would give me an answer. Lots of talk in this thread but ask a pointed question and it's crickets...


Why don't you wear a helmet everywhere you go? Do you have any idea how much this can help in preventing head injuries? You never know when you may get too close to someone carrying the 'violence virus', especially these days, and a simple helmet will greatly reduce your risk of injury in that instance. It will also help others as well, if they see you wearing yours they would be less inclined to be self conscious about it, and more likely to wear theirs too, and be less likely to suffer a needless and preventable head injury. Don't you care about others? Cant you just wear yours to help protect others? Come on dude, don't be so selfish. Do you have steel toe shoes on right now? You know, in our business, many folks wear steel toe shoes to prevent foot injuries and it doesn't seem to cause them any harm at all. I wish all of you guys would just wear them so you don't get your foot smashed by an elderly driver in a Walmart parking lot. Think about your Family, how would support them if your foot, or feet, got smashed and you could not earn a living, just because you were too stubborn and selfish to wear steel toe shoes? I want to hear a reason why you wont wear a helmet and steel toe shoes, you know, to go with your mask, just one reason. I haven't even got to safety glasses yet, think of all the crap that can get into and damage your eyes each day. This is your argument.


----------



## Saltfork

Here ya all go...


https://ohiocapitaljournal.com/2020/07/09/dewine-mask-order-wont-apply-to-lawmakers-judges-staffs/


Now what? They have some super power? Nahh they just know what the limitations are on PPE even tho they didn’t give any standards on a PPE they just said cover your face!


----------



## OnTheFly

PapawSmith said:


> Why don't you wear a helmet everywhere you go? Do you have any idea how much this can help in preventing head injuries? You never know when you may get too close to someone carrying the 'violence virus', especially these days, and a simple helmet will greatly reduce your risk of injury in that instance. It will also help others as well, if they see you wearing yours they would be less inclined to be self conscious about it, and more likely to wear theirs too, and be less likely to suffer a needless and preventable head injury. Don't you care about others? Cant you just wear yours to help protect others? Come on dude, don't be so selfish. Do you have steel toe shoes on right now? You know, in our business, many folks wear steel toe shoes to prevent foot injuries and it doesn't seem to cause them any harm at all. I wish all of you guys would just wear them so you don't get your foot smashed by an elderly driver in a Walmart parking lot. Think about your Family, how would support them if your foot, or feet, got smashed and you could not earn a living, just because you were too stubborn and selfish to wear steel toe shoes? I want to hear a reason why you wont wear a helmet and steel toe shoes, you know, to go with your mask, just one reason. I haven't even got to safety glasses yet, think of all the crap that can get into and damage your eyes each day. This is your argument.


Dang man with that kind of reasoning I don't see why you are not a lawyer. Preventing personal injury to one self vs. controlling the spread of a virus... hmmmm pretty similar stuff eh? And ya know global pandemics and walking around in a parking lot are both everyday things right?


----------



## OnTheFly

PapawSmith said:


> Wow, 'hook, line, and sinker'....you have swallowed them all my Friend.


What you believe Corona virus is a hoax? Or that there is no software that can identify you by your face? Please elaborate, I am just sure you have some genius theory backed by tons of reason.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

PapawSmith said:


> Wow, 'hook, line, and sinker'....you have swallowed them all my Friend.


Another one of the “First I’m going to try and shame you into wearing one and if that don’t work, I’m going to recommend that they go out get the virus and wish hardship on them” guys..... A lot of them on this thread I’m finding out.


----------



## Saltfork

montagc said:


> Read the whole article, it is because Dewine has no authority over them.


Really, why not? Either he has total control or he don’t. If ya done a google search you would see from his order they are exempt.. If the order was legal as you take it. Job titles don’t change viruses bud nor laws..

We’re all human living under the same flag and laws/constitution or were not.

Not much more I can say. Is what it is.


----------



## PapawSmith

montagc said:


> Lots of effort put into that post on a ridiculous analogy. And besides that did you forget that steel toed shoes and hardhats are mandatory in areas where that sort of injury is likely?


It is a perfect analogy, you want us all to do what you “believe” is good for us Based on the professional opinion you follow, and you refuse to acknowledge any of the professional opinion that supports our position. You may not like it, and it may be absurd, but it fits your argument perfectly. What you are saying is just as absurd to us, get it?


----------



## bobk

OnTheFly said:


> This is not going to 'just disappear'. Hopefully there will be a vaccine but I am sure a lot of you loonies have theories about those too.


Are you not capable of having a conversation without calling people loonies that don’t agree with you?


----------



## PapawSmith

OnTheFly said:


> Dang man with that kind of reasoning I don't see why you are not a lawyer. Preventing personal injury to one self vs. controlling the spread of a virus... hmmmm pretty similar stuff eh? And ya know global pandemics and walking around in a parking lot are both everyday things right?


Sorry that flew so far over your head, guess that helps explain the gullibility.


----------



## kevinw

Okay, here it is. I don't know about others, but this is why I personally don't wear a mask when I'm not required to by policy or mandate.

First of all, you keep bringing up the fact that you can sneeze into a piece of cloth and see captured droplets. That's all well and good. The problem is the aerosol particles that you're also expelling in and through that mask. You can see this in various tests, such as this one...






And that test only shows the particles that are going THROUGH the mask, not the ones that are expelled around all of the edges of the mask as it puffs out an away from your face when you cough, sneeze or even breathe.

An argument can be made that you're preventing yourself from flinging some of those particles directly in the face of someone else, but short of breathing, you could actually get better results from carrying tissues and coughing or sneezing into a handful of those clutched firmly against your face than by wearing any mask.

Beyond that test, Michael Osterholm said months ago that the kinds of masks people are often wearing are essentially useless. They may have some effect if you're already sick, but as even the CDC and WHO said before, there's no real reason for a healthy person to wear one. He said it on Joe Rogan's podcast, which can be found here...






The whole podcast is worth a listen. Nearly everything the man has said has proven true over the last few months, and don't let the fact that he was on Rogan's podcast fool you... the man is the director of CIDRAP. Understanding viruses is kinda his whole schtick.

Given this information, I choose not to wear one because
1: I'm not sick and I've seen no data to suggest a compelling portion of the population is "asymptomatic". I've seen compelling evidence to suggest that most infected people have "mild symptoms", however, and I don't have those either. If I did, I'd simply stay home.

2: Masks are uncomfortable. I wear glasses which fog up, they heat up my face and the weather has already been unbearably hot lately, I have seborrheic dermatitis that is exacerbated by wearing a mask, and I simply don't like wearing one. I'm forced to wear one for 9 hours a day while at work and that's plenty for me.

3: Government mandates forcing the citizenry to wear uncomfortable articles of clothing that are all but proven to have little to no actual benefit is something that really rubs my inner libertarian the wrong way, so you can add principle to my list of reasons.

4: I already did my best to stay away from others before this whole thing kicked off anyway. If I were in a position to go live alone in the mountains for a year or so as an extended vacation, I'd do it. However, like others, I'm not in that position, so I simply do what I can to avoid the other walking disease vectors that inhabit this planet, and given the data, I think stay away from people if I'm sick is going to do far more to stop the spread than wearing something on my face that only restricts my own breathing.

Are these reasons good enough for you?

By the way, just because someone is having trouble articulating their reasons in a way that satisfies you, doesn't mean those reasons aren't valid. Tip for future arguments in case you decide to ask questions in bad faith again.


----------



## Workingman

This, like everything in the country is politicized. I hate to say it but I don't trust any of the numbers or any of the reasons for the government orders. I wish we could focus on all the things we have in common. It has brought my wife and I to disagreements and a couple of my I kids I know better than to even bring it up. Sad how politicians and the media choose to play us. It's not healthy for families, friends or the country. I'm done arguing or trying to sway or convince others. I have my beliefs, and they theirs. I'll focus my conversations on stuff that brings joy and togetherness. We are all more same than different at the level of the heart.


----------



## cincinnati

Saltfork said:


> Here ya all go...
> https://ohiocapitaljournal.com/2020/07/09/dewine-mask-order-wont-apply-to-lawmakers-judges-staffs/
> Now what? They have some super power?


“All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others.”


----------



## yonderfishin

Yep ...


----------



## jrose

OnTheFly said:


> Be afraid when the gov't mandates you CANNOT wear a mask in public (like China did during the Hong Kong protesting- want to use AI software to identify those participating in Civil Disobedience).
> 
> I am not going to claim most masks are fitted N95 like my dad had to be fitted as he risks his life in the hospital because people put unfounded personal beliefs and luxuries in front of logic, reason, and overall regard for neighbors. Lets says majority of masks dont have that efficacy and reduce the risk of spread by only a few percentage points. The law of large #s says this will have a massive impact over time.
> 
> If you are going out in public wear a damn mask, you are just selfish and simply have little regard for your common man if you do not. Do it simply as a show of solidarity, to me you look a hell of a lot dumber without one on.
> 
> Wish this was not called a hoax in the first place. The evidence is clear this virus is serious, not just because of # of deaths, the lifelong complications some get are very debilitating. Maybe if this was handled with any poise in the first place we wouldn't be where we are now & the economy would not have suffered as much.
> 
> If you dont wear a mask I sincerely hope you get fined & dont come crying when you dying or 'rona.
> 
> This is not going to 'just disappear'. Hopefully there will be a vaccine but I am sure a lot of you loonies have theories about those too.


You don’t die from the “Rona”. You can, but A high and I say high probability you won’t. Talk about fear mongering!


----------



## Dovans

montagc said:


> But does it keep the liquids and solids in?


tks for the visual....


----------



## bulafisherman

Guys hold up a sec on the banter....I need to go get a refill of popcorn


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

yonderfishin said:


> Yep ...


Hahahahaa, now that is hilarious as hell and spot on at the same time! Thanks for providing a good laugh in this thread.


----------



## multi species angler

kevinw said:


> They may have some effect if you're already sick, but as even the CDC and WHO said before, there's no real reason for a healthy person to wear one.


 Another person that just doesn't get it. A healthy person doesn't need to wear a mask to help stop the spread of this virus because they don't have the virus. The mask are to be worn because asymptomatic people think they are healthy and are not, therefore they spread the virus everywhere they go. The mask doesn't prevent a person from getting the virus, it (HELP's) stop the spread of the virus.


Moderators, would you please make this a sticky and post it because I'm tiring of repeating it over and over.


----------



## multi species angler

bobk said:


> Are you not capable of having a conversation without calling people loonies that don’t agree with you?


Mask wearers are being called SHEEP. Didn't see you calling out those name callers. Ask them the same question.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

A woman that had the same exact cancer as I do was going to have a surgery on her liver to try and remove some tumors. Well as soon as they opened her up the ammonia was so bad that a surgery nurse passed out and another almost went down too. I can promise you that every person in that room had a mask on and was still affected. Take this one to the bank.


----------



## multi species angler

kevinw said:


> 1: I'm not sick and I've seen no data to suggest a compelling portion of the population is "asymptomatic".


 It is being reported that up to 40% of positive cases are asymptomatic. Even if it was 1% why would you want to risk spreading it to others?


----------



## One guy and a boat

montagc said:


> You don’t need to justify anything to me or anyone else but it would be nice to hear


It's always that " but "that gets things going. Personally I do wear one when the occasion calls for it, like getting a haircut or a crowded store. At a boat dock or walking in a park probably not. I'm also not naive enough to think a mask is a huge benefit, just hope it bumps my odds up a few percentage points. And also wouldn't take on the role of "mask police" unless it was an extreme situation like some dude sneezing all over a person 3 feet away. 

Sent from my Pixel 3a XL using Tapatalk


----------



## Saltfork

multi species angler said:


> Another person that just doesn't get it. A healthy person doesn't need to wear a mask to help stop the spread of this virus because they don't have the virus. The mask are to be worn because asymptomatic people think they are healthy and are not, therefore they spread the virus everywhere they go. The mask doesn't prevent a person from getting the virus, it (HELP's) stop the spread of the virus.
> 
> 
> Moderators, would you please make this a sticky and post it because I'm tiring of repeating it over and over.


Way I read it is wear something over your face, underwear, pantyhose , bob sled, Hat, skateboard , Brake line, coffee cup, Chevy 2500 bumper, ball cap, rail road tie, Condom,koolaide packs, Bandana, rainbows,

What ever ya choose. Just know law makers,judges and their staff are exempt! Bottom line.. Someone prove me wrong!!

Agin no standards on what ya put over your face and politicians judges and staff are exempt from any of it... Then Ya hear they live in a different world/ laws /country/job titles/ than everyone else in ...... America....

Before anyone else judges anyone for wearing or not wearing anything/everything over their face. They should ask why the people ordering it are exempt.


----------



## multi species angler

yonderfishin said:


> Yep ...



If the Amish don't have it yet it is because they don't associate much with us entitled Americans. And my money says they will associate with us less now especially those not wearing a mask.


----------



## KaGee

Say it ain't so! 
"A Florida hospital handling COVID-19 tests confirmed to media this week that its near-100% positivity rate was overstated by a factor of 10, raising already-heightened concerns that numerous labs are over reporting the number of confirmed infections.

The Florida Division of Emergency Management posts a daily coronavirus update on its website, which features a list of the positivity rates of every COVID testing facility in the state. Hundreds of labs and hospitals throughout Florida are regularly testing state residents for the coronavirus. 

In recent days, numerous facilities have begun reporting 100% positivity rates, figures significantly higher than the statewide average of around 15%. Many of those labs claim to have tested only one patient, though others with 100% rates report testing dozens and sometimes hundreds of patients. 

Orlando news station Fox 35 said on Monday that it undertook an investigation of those "astronomical figures," after which several medical facilities confirmed that their actual positive rates were much lower than those reported to the state government."
https://justthenews.com/politics-po...its-its-covid-positivity-rate-was-inflated-90


----------



## multi species angler

Saltfork said:


> Way I read it is wear something over your face, underwear, pantyhose , bob sled, Hat, skateboard , Brake line, coffee cup, Chevy 2500 bumper, ball cap, rail road tie, Condom,koolaide packs, Bandana, rainbows,


 I guess we can't expect everyone to get it. Some of you post some real mature replies, this being one of them.


----------



## One guy and a boat

OnTheFly said:


> You are asking the wrong crowd unfortunately. Maybe if we have a consistent reasonable response from the top. This is all a lot of these people will listen too. All those studies, experts, etc. naaaaa cant trust em.


Wrong crowd, really ? What are we a bunch of neanderthal uneducated slob outdoorsman. WOW!! That is my guy at the top. Regardless of who is at the top, how does that make a difference. Like most people on this site, I consider myself intelligent enough to listen too multiple sources before making a decision.

Sent from my Pixel 3a XL using Tapatalk


----------



## kevinw

multi species angler said:


> Another person that just doesn't get it. A healthy person doesn't need to wear a mask to help stop the spread of this virus because they don't have the virus. The mask are to be worn because asymptomatic people think they are healthy and are not, therefore they spread the virus everywhere they go. The mask doesn't prevent a person from getting the virus, it (HELP's) stop the spread of the virus.
> 
> 
> Moderators, would you please make this a sticky and post it because I'm tiring of repeating it over and over.


Your opinions that you're regurgitating from whatever news organizations you frequent isn't worth a sticky just because you're tired of repeating it like it's fact, and as I already stated, I've seen no actual data suggesting a compelling number of people are 1: asymptomatic, and 2: capable of acting as carriers and spreading the virus. 

You have estimates and conjecture, but no actual data. Mandating marginally beneficial facial coverings that necessarily affect your ability to breathe because of assumptions and conjecture... is nonsense.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

multi species angler said:


> Mask wearers are being called SHEEP. Didn't see you calling out those name callers. Ask them the same question.


The answer is that it’s an analogy which means a comparison between two things for the purpose of explanation or clarification. Loonies simply means a crazy, silly, or dumb person. Very derogatory. Sheep means a group of people that behave in the same way or all behave as they are told and cannot or will not act independently. Not derogatory at all.


----------



## multi species angler

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> It’s an analogy which means a comparison of two things for the purpose of explanation. Loonies simply means a crazy, silly, or dumb person. Very derogatory. Sheep means a group of people that behave in the same way or all behave as they are told and cannot or will not act independently. Not derogatory at all.


 I find it demeaning and an insult. I could say all you anti mask people are sheep, one following the other, but I won't. You have your opinion on topics and I have mine.


----------



## multi species angler

kevinw said:


> Your opinions that you're regurgitating from whatever news organizations you frequent isn't worth a sticky just because you're tired of repeating it like it's fact, and as I already stated, I've seen no actual data suggesting a compelling number of people are 1: asymptomatic, and 2: capable of acting as carriers and spreading the virus.
> 
> You have estimates and conjecture, but no actual data. Mandating marginally beneficial facial coverings that necessarily affect your ability to breathe because of assumptions and conjecture... is nonsense.


 Some can't see the forest for the trees.


----------



## Snakecharmer

montagc said:


> Ammonia vapors are a gas that would pass through a standard mask like any other gas. That doesn’t really apply here.


I always heard that they use ammonia in smelling salts to keep you from passing out?


----------



## Stars-n-Stripers

KaGee said:


> Say it ain't so!
> "A Florida hospital handling COVID-19 tests confirmed to media this week that its near-100% positivity rate was overstated by a factor of 10, raising already-heightened concerns that numerous labs are over reporting the number of confirmed infections.
> 
> The Florida Division of Emergency Management posts a daily coronavirus update on its website, which features a list of the positivity rates of every COVID testing facility in the state. Hundreds of labs and hospitals throughout Florida are regularly testing state residents for the coronavirus.
> 
> In recent days, numerous facilities have begun reporting 100% positivity rates, figures significantly higher than the statewide average of around 15%. Many of those labs claim to have tested only one patient, though others with 100% rates report testing dozens and sometimes hundreds of patients.
> 
> Orlando news station Fox 35 said on Monday that it undertook an investigation of those "astronomical figures," after which several medical facilities confirmed that their actual positive rates were much lower than those reported to the state government."
> https://justthenews.com/politics-po...its-its-covid-positivity-rate-was-inflated-90


KaGee, please stay on point. This is the great mask debate of 2020, you might say between..........The Masketeers.  See what I did there, instead of Musketeers.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

multi species angler said:


> I find it demeaning and an insult. I could say all you anti mask people are sheep, one following the other, but I won't. You have your opinion on topics and I have mine.


No you can’t because they aren’t agreeing or behaving as they are told like you are. And because they are acting independently and you can’t or won’t. You know, kinda like some aren’t drinking the koolaid that they are told to drink. Huge difference. And as I said before, I can care less if your feelings are hurt.


----------



## BuckeyeFishin07

I seriously can't believe you guys are wasting your time arguing with the mask brigade still! You aren't going to make the frightened little sheep change their minds!


----------



## multi species angler

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> And as I said before, I can care less if your feelings are hurt.


 The phrase is I couldn't care less, you said you can care less and I doubt that. The same as you couldn't care less about spreading this virus to someone else. See if you anti mask wearers still feel that way if you bring it home to a family member.


----------



## cement569

heres a swell idea, those who believe in the masks, by all means wear them. and those who dont the same, pretty sure people dont like to be told what to do as i do. dont rely on what the media tells you man up and think for yourself.i dont like the word sheep, but im not offended by the words puppet on a string....thank you and goodnight


----------



## multi species angler

I'm not wearing a mask because I'm told to. I live in a county that it isn't mandated. I wear a mask because it is the smart thing to do.


----------



## cement569

well by all means wear it, just quit telling people what to think and do, its that easy. i dont wear one and im in summit co. where its mandatory. when i see bodys stacked up in warehouses like they are telling us is going to happen i might.......but highly doubtful......key word puppet


----------



## yonderfishin

" Asymptomatic " ......derived from a word in a native American language that means roughly ....." false positive". LOL


----------



## PapawSmith

multi species angler said:


> Another person that just doesn't get it. A healthy person doesn't need to wear a mask to help stop the spread of this virus because they don't have the virus. The mask are to be worn because asymptomatic people think they are healthy and are not, therefore they spread the virus everywhere they go. The mask doesn't prevent a person from getting the virus, it (HELP's) stop the spread of the virus.
> 
> 
> Moderators, would you please make this a sticky and post it because I'm tiring of repeating it over and over.


The health professionals, pretty much all of them, have determined that if you do not have a fever and are not suffering from coughing or sneezing you are a hazard to no one, you are NOT contagious. So your assertion that asymptomatic folks are spreading the virus is 100% false, please do not make your opinion a sticky. If you want to know how I know this it is because the State Health Department called me and told me this on day 12 of my quarantine after a positive blood test. It came straight from Amy Atkins teams mouth.


----------



## kevinw

multi species angler said:


> Some can't see the forest for the trees.


Cool. An idiom that doubles as a platitude.


----------



## luredaddy

There are at least five of you in the running for this prestigious award. Please stop trying to win the award.


----------



## KaGee

multi species angler said:


> I find it demeaning and an insult.


Some find your elitist posts demeaning and insulting.

So everybody, here's the deal... stop the name calling, stop talking down to people. No warnings.
Masks or no masks, this conversation is over. Now.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

luredaddy said:


> There are at least five of you in the running for this prestigious award. Please stop trying to win the award.


Yep.. back and forth is all its ever gonna be. I have more important things to worry about and bigger fish to fry. Pun not intended. I declare myself done with it.


----------



## dcool

I really hope the moderators don't lock this thread down. I think it is hilarious to read it every morning with my coffee.


----------



## bad luck

Great entertainment! So please don’t lock it down.

there are certainly some on here who are victims of micro aggressions...... So we must be aware of their sensitivities....these are likely that same family member when they come over for Thanksgiving you review what you can’t talk about around them.....

bottom line..... in the next six months or so, everybody will either have had the virus or will take the government vaccine. Those who don’t take the vaccine, will either have already had it and been going about their lives....it simply doesn’t affect them much more than a common cold or a flu (nearly everybody already), may never get it and continue to live their lives and will still keel over eventually from this or something. 

Those who do take the vaccine, will comfortably now know they will not get the virus, and will no longer have to worry about who is and isn’t wearing a mask, but also will still eventually keel over from something, and also deal with any possible side effects years down the road from a new vaccine (see the 1976 flu vaccine the CDC shoved on the public ....Do a google search on 60 minutes swine flu episode).


----------



## Shad Rap

They are gonna be testing everyone in nursng homes again so expect the numbers to go up...they just aren't happy if the numbers don't keep rising...or I'll be god damned if the numbers go down...watch this!


----------



## Shad Rap

dcool said:


> I really hope the moderators don't lock this thread down. I think it is hilarious to read it every morning with my coffee.


Me too...spit my coffee more than a few times...


----------



## Shad Rap

So who all wants Amy Acton Day to be Feb 26th (or whatever date)..bwahahahaha...got a big 70% 'no' on the survey on the news last night...telling...can't believe there are 3 out of 10 people who would support it.
O yeah...Kim Jung Dewine tonight at 5:30...he's gonna address us all!..too bad I won't be watching...I expect him to threaten us with closing everything down again...


----------



## burnsj5

Shad Rap said:


> They are gonna be testing everyone in nursng homes again so expect the numbers to go up...they just aren't happy if the numbers don't keep rising...or I'll be god damned if the numbers go down...watch this!


This is probably the most important setting for them to keep close eyes on and have increased testing. A high level of testing of patients and staff for the most vulnerable seems like a wise decision.


----------



## Shad Rap

burnsj5 said:


> This is probably the most important setting for them to keep close eyes on and have increased testing. A high level of testing of patients and staff for the most vulnerable seems like a wise decision.


It is...it's actually one thing agree with...just wanted to say we'll see some more positives...


----------



## Hatchetman

multi species angler said:


> If the Amish don't have it yet it is because they don't associate much with us entitled Americans. And my money says they will associate with us less now especially those not wearing a mask.



Don't associate much with us??!! You got to be kidding me....


----------



## cheezemm2

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/walmart-face-masks-required-july-20/


----------



## MagicMarker

Then Walmart won’t get a penny from me


----------



## Burkcarp1

They need a bribe to get the numbers up


----------



## BuckeyeFishin07

Don't know if it has been said but isn't it funny that the counties with the highest numbers in Ohio are also the ones where most of the rioting and protests were happening! But nobody wants to bring that up do they?


----------



## MagicMarker

montagc said:


> Walmart has had questionable business practices for years and has shut down uncountable small businesses. That didn't bother you enough to quit shopping there, but a mask will?


Yep


----------



## Shad Rap

jrose said:


> just read where asymptomatic people don't spread the virus as was originally thought. So your theory for mask wearing is wrong.


Shhhhhh...quiet...lol...I believe it's just like any other virus...if you show symptoms?..then you're contagious...there's never been an ounce of evidence to say otherwise as far as asymptomatic being contagious...and no numbers to prove anything...scare tactic...


----------



## BFG

BuckeyeFishin07 said:


> Don't know if it has been said but isn't it funny that the counties with the highest numbers in Ohio are also the ones where most of the rioting and protests were happening! But nobody wants to bring that up do they?


Also happens to be where the majority of the population lives....this spread of this virus is almost defined by population density. 

DeWine moved the 2:00 presser to 5:30 today....something big is coming....


----------



## crappiedude

BFG said:


> DeWine moved the 2:00 presser to 5:30 today....something big is coming....


Thanks for the warning...I'll be sure not to watch it.


----------



## crappiedude

cheezemm2 said:


> https://www.cbsnews.com/news/walmart-face-masks-required-july-20/


Personally I'm glad to see it and I wish other stores would make a stand too. To me it's only right that if you are making your employees wear a mask, then make the customers wear them too, no exceptions.
I was just saying to my wife earlier today that this is the only thing that makes any sense to me.
I was at Sam's the other day and almost everyone had a mask on. One guy came to the door without one an employee mentioned they "requested" people to wear a mask he said "if I have to wear one, I'll leave" (he seemed like he was looking for a fight) and of course the poor person at the door pointed out she was only doing her job. Of course they didn't make him leave.
My thoughts were they should either demand people wear masks or take the sign down...I'm good either way.
As a side note there was a young couple shopping and they had these 2 little girls sitting in the cart with their masks on. They weren't fussing, they weren't whining they just sat there (cute as can be I might add). I thought good for these parents teaching their children how to live in a society with others. These kids are lucky to have these parents.

Now before everyone gets all huffy puffy. I could care less if you do or don't wear a mask. I don't care where you shop and I don't care what your education level is or what your political preference is.
No matter what you say most will try to comply, some will try to skirt it and someone is going to fight it.


----------



## BeerBatter

I thought Amy resigned??
Oh wait I just farted
And sweat dripped on something Off my forehead 
Dammit 
On a serious note. I don’t like where all of this is going 
Crazy times want to track your money and spending habits now??? 
Mandatory masks ? Turning your neighbor in for anything you or govt doesn’t agree with 
cant cook a hotdog on a campfire without a permit
???


----------



## Shad Rap

BFG said:


> Also happens to be where the majority of the population lives....this spread of this virus is almost defined by population density.
> 
> DeWine moved the 2:00 presser to 5:30 today....something big is coming....


Stop hyping it up...he moved it to that time yesterday...nothing big is coming...he's already said it's no 'emergency'...a threat of another lockdown maybe...they say he just wants to address everyone about where we're at in this whole ordeal...there's not gonna be another lockdown til we see some results of the mask mandate...at least another week or so...and even then, I don't think we're gonna see another one...


----------



## MICK FISH

Statewide, PA just limited all restaurants to 25% capacity and no alcohol sales for on-site consumption unless ordered in conjunction with a meal. No bar seating, no bars period unless they serve food, no nightclubs, etc, etc.


----------



## Dovans

Dewine gonna say god speed and good luck.. it be foolish to shut the state down now. Lets get it over with.


----------



## Shad Rap

Lol...a bunch of nothing!..just like I thought...next!


----------



## Shad Rap

Dovans said:


> Dewine gonna say god speed and good luck.. it be foolish to shut the state down now. Lets get it over with.


It was foolish to shut it down the first time...should've never been done!


----------



## bulafisherman

This has taken a turn for the worse.


----------



## burnsj5

Shad Rap said:


> Lol...a bunch of nothing!..just like I thought...next!


Right, how are you going to cancel one day and hype up a primetime spot the next to read a mediocre speech with no relevant changes.


----------



## Dovans

One thing we all should take from this speech is LETS BE POSITIVE! Quite frankly, your all a bunch of Debbie Downers. Best thing that could happen is this thread gets locked.

I am one of the ones that dont think masks help.. But Im going to Grin and bear it and wear a mask from now on. 
Prove the Gov. wrong and wear a mask and lets see what happens. Kroger just announced starting July 22nd... no mask no admittance. 

Good luck to all


----------



## bulafisherman

Could this be what Dewines press conference will be about?


----------



## bulafisherman

Very interesting


----------



## cement569

dovans, why lock the thread? people are just expressing thier views and feelings. nothing personal but if you find the debbie downers offensive, dont read them


----------



## Legend killer

Need to make mandatory for all of ohio.
Encouraging is like beating a dead horse


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

DeWine’s presser is a joke. He should be asking about this. But this isn’t put out on every tv commercial break like the Kung Flu is. 
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...pitals-not-send-covid-19-data-cdc/5441730002/


----------



## slipsinker

i was waiting for a shoe to be thrown


----------



## bulafisherman

FYI The YouTube video was a legit clip of a Michigan governor press conference with what their definition of a COVID death was and ironically enough it doesn't matter what you die from if you tested positive for COVID 19, that's what your cause of death is.


----------



## Muddy

Wasn’t there a Walmart parody song in this post somewhere, or was that in a different thread? I can’t find it and I want to watch it again.


----------



## STRONGPERSUADER

And


Dovans said:


> One thing we all should take from this speech is LETS BE POSITIVE! Quite frankly, your all a bunch of Debbie Downers. Best thing that could happen is this thread gets locked.
> 
> I am one of the ones that dont think masks help.. But Im going to Grin and bear it and wear a mask from now on.
> Prove the Gov. wrong and wear a mask and lets see what happens. Kroger just announced starting July 22nd... no mask no admittance.
> 
> Good luck to all


Be careful trying and buying those new mask for your new orders friend. They gave you a mirror to see how you look in them, but also be careful when trying them on. Doesn’t look to heathy.
This is a Target by the way.
Unbelievable....


----------



## MIGHTY

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> View attachment 366761
> And
> Be careful trying and buying those new mask for your new orders friend. They gave you a mirror to see how you look in them, but also be careful when trying them on. Doesn’t look to heathy.
> This is a Target by the way.
> Unbelievable....


 I tried a few of them on but didn’t like the color options so I put them back..................


----------



## Hatchetman

bulafisherman said:


> FYI The YouTube video was a legit clip of a Michigan governor press conference with what their definition of a COVID death was and ironically enough it doesn't matter what you die from if you tested positive for COVID 19, that's what your cause of death is.



Bula....That was the Gov of Illinois introducing his medical whatever she is. He's the guy that his wife flew to Florida to their horse ranch during the lock down and when asked by a reporter about it told the reporter his family was non of the public's business....


----------



## bulafisherman

Hatchetman said:


> Bula....That was the Gov of Illinois introducing his medical whatever she is. He's the guy that his wife flew to Florida to their horse ranch during the lock down and when asked by a reporter about it told the reporter his family was non of the public's business....


 my bad, I watched it in the run missed that part


----------



## Bluewalleye

bulafisherman said:


> This has taken a turn for the worse.
> View attachment 366725


LOLOLOLOLOL That is hilarious. I laughed for 5 minutes after seeing your post.


----------



## yonderfishin

Yep...open your eyes...


----------



## Snakecharmer

yonderfishin said:


> Yep...open your eyes...


So what do you think they will do with the problems?


----------



## yonderfishin

Snakecharmer said:


> So what do you think they will do with the problems?


Think larger scale. 

Since this will be added to my digital footprint or file , just remember what was said here , one day you may get it


----------



## Northern Reb

Here are facts we know about the data:

- Hospitals get $$ for every positive case they report...they will inflate the numbers for monetary reasons and have been caught doing so.
- If you show no symptoms but die due to anything else (ie car accident/heart failure etc), if autopsy shows you had Covid then that is listed as the cause of death.
- Death rate significantly down even with hospitals deceiving us via incorrect cause of death
- False positive test kits are at least 3% as admitted by the manufacturer. 3 out of every 100 tests are falsely identified as positive!
- If I get tested 10 times during the course of illness... ALL 10 would show as unique and NEW cases!!

Imagine running a business using inaccurate information and data. Ohio is on the verge of a second attempt at destroying our economy and lives using incorrect data as the basis for their decision.

These are the facts as I know them via someone working in the medical field in Ohio. I'm open to hear facts that contradict anything I listed above. Debate is a good thing. Hopefully we can find the black and white truth in this virus and the actual numbers. 

God bless!!


----------



## Legend killer

Northern Reb said:


> Here are facts we know about the data:
> 
> - Hospitals get $$ for every positive case they report...they will inflate the numbers for monetary reasons and have been caught doing so.
> - If you show no symptoms but die due to anything else (ie car accident/heart failure etc), if autopsy shows you had Covid then that is listed as the cause of death.
> - Death rate significantly down even with hospitals deceiving us via incorrect cause of death
> - False positive test kits are at least 3% as admitted by the manufacturer. 3 out of every 100 tests are falsely identified as positive!
> - If I get tested 10 times during the course of illness... ALL 10 would show as unique and NEW cases!!
> 
> Imagine running a business using inaccurate information and data. Ohio is on the verge of a second attempt at destroying our economy and lives using incorrect data as the basis for their decision.
> 
> These are the facts as I know them via someone working in the medical field in Ohio. I'm open to hear facts that contradict anything I listed above. Debate is a good thing. Hopefully we can find the black and white truth in this virus and the actual numbers.
> 
> God bless!!


You have proof of all these fake news points?


----------



## bad luck

Legend killer said:


> You have proof of all these fake news points?


if you’re looking for fake news, it’s very easy to find.....any of Amy Acton‘s and Dewines news conferences, daily news from ABC, CBS, NBC, MSNBC, and CNN…… Every single one of them have been caught making up stories, using deceptive video to push an agenda, simply not covering/acknowledging major events that go against their agenda..... (like the Portland riots, deaths/crime in CHOP zone, murders of police/innocents by rioters referred to as “protestors”, or any deaths associated with riots, Spread of the virus due to all the riots, the mis-information spread by WHO & China..... This is an extremely long long list)......

Nearly every day....certainly every week, they have a bombshell story, that then gets corrected within two or three days, and they just simply bury the results, but any chance they get to hype up the Covid, they take it, until the next bombshell arrives about a week later and the process simply repeats itself 


They have a narrative of wanting to keep everybody at home, scaring the living heck out of any of our vulnerable population, and spreading doom & gloom to get the masses to willingly give up their freedoms


----------



## Legend killer

bad luck said:


> if you’re looking for fake news, it’s very easy to find.....any of Amy Acton‘s and Dewines news conferences, daily news from ABC, CBS, NBC, MSNBC, and CNN…… Every single one of them have been caught making up stories, using deceptive video to push an agenda, simply not covering/acknowledging major events that go against their agenda..... (like the Portland riots, deaths/crime in CHOP zone, murders of police/innocents by rioters referred to as “protestors”, or any deaths associated with riots, Spread of the virus due to all the riots, the mis-information spread by WHO & China..... This is an extremely long long list)......
> 
> Nearly every day....certainly every week, they have a bombshell story, that then gets corrected within two or three days, and they just simply bury the results, but any chance they get to hype up the Covid, they take it, until the next bombshell arrives about a week later and the process simply repeats itself
> 
> 
> They have a narrative of wanting to keep everybody at home, scaring the living heck out of any of our vulnerable population, and spreading doom & gloom to get the masses to willingly give up their freedoms


I see all news is fake except fox news. OK buddy.


----------



## garhtr

Isn't this similar to any flu strain ?
If your under 60 ? ? ?
O deaths under 19 ? Should schools open in the fall ? 
Isolate the most vulnerable and the rest should be able to go about normal life.
I just what the true and accurate facts, I'm capable of determining what risk I'm willing to take. Imo the mixed messaging, twisted distorted facts and partial truths have been a far greater problem than the virus its self.
Good luck


----------



## BFG

What we saw in Seattle should have been the red flag for this entire response: Shelter/protect the elderly at all costs.


----------



## bad luck

Legend killer said:


> I see all news is fake except fox news. OK buddy.


I never said Fox News.


If people would only take the time to look a little deeper, there are many other news organizations than the ones I mentioned previously as well as Fox News. 

Look no further than your local Mansfield Ohio TV station, that did an expose about 4 to 6 weeks ago on how Acton/DeWine were fudging the numbers. 

There was a link to it posted in here probably 40 or 50 pages agony


----------



## Legend killer

bad luck said:


> I never said Fox News.
> 
> 
> If people would only take the time to look a little deeper, there are many other news organizations than the ones I mentioned previously as well as Fox News.
> 
> Look no further than your local Mansfield Ohio TV station, that did an expose about 4 to 6 weeks ago on how Acton/DeWine were fudging the numbers.
> 
> There was a link to it posted in here probably 40 or 50 pages agony


You named all but fox news. Fox news is the king of fake news.


----------



## jrose

Legend killer said:


> You named all but fox news. Fox news is the king of fake news.


No, that would be your favorite, CNN. By the way, they are no longer considered a news worthy station.


----------



## Legend killer

jrose said:


> No, that would be your favorite, CNN. By the way, they are no longer considered a news worthy station.


Fox news is listed as entertainment now not news....


----------



## KaGee

Legend killer said:


> You have proof of all these fake news points?


Do you?


----------



## Northern Reb

Legend killer said:


> You have proof of all these fake news points?


As I already stated: my information comes from someone within the medical field in OH. I also said I was open to hearing any facts you have which might contradict mine. Instead of providing any of those facts you called my information fake news points. A debate/discussion doesn't happen when you bring nothing to the table from your point of view


----------



## MIGHTY

https://www.rcreader.com/commentary...f-science-relevant-to-covide-19-social-policy here’s another lengthy read for anyone interested. It’s even got “a review of science” in the title! It dives into the physics/chemistry of a virus. Multiple sources/testing/data to read through like the one I posted a few pages back. I’m sure no one will read it and give the typical “interesting I’ll have to look into that” response. At this point like others have said it’s just beating a dead horse. No one will read too far into anything unless they agree with it from the get go.


----------



## AmericanEagle

Thanks for an interesting post Reb. Here is my 2 cents.

_- Hospitals get $$ for every positive case they report...they will inflate the numbers for monetary reasons and have been caught doing so._

Fraud in the medical billing is about as shocking as gambling in Casablanca. The crooks will steal and the majority of medical professional will be honest and ethical.

_- If you show no symptoms but die due to anything else (ie car accident/heart failure etc), if autopsy shows you had Covid then that is listed as the cause of death._

The CDC typically estimates that 20% to 30% of death certificates are filled out incorrectly or incompletely. With that being said a person driving a car has a heart attack, goes off the road, flips his vehicle upside down, and is crushed to death. Should the death certificate read car accident as cause of death or heart failure, or both? Now consider the same scenario only the driver has Covid19 which put stress on his heart and caused the heart attack. Should Covid19 be on the death certificate? The death certificate could read car accident due to a heart attack due to Covid19. This is discussed in this link.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/me...the-nation/ar-BB15qYV7?ocid=spartan-ntp-feeds

_- Death rate significantly down even with hospitals deceiving us via incorrect cause of death_

As more as learned about COVID19 it would not be surprising for the death rate to go down. This is great news and one of the reasons it made sense to try to mitigate the disease and buy some time to let the medical professionals find the best ways to treat it.

_- False positive test kits are at least 3% as admitted by the manufacturer. 3 out of every 100 tests are falsely identified as positive!_

Yep, the tests are not 100% accurate.

_- If I get tested 10 times during the course of illness... ALL 10 would show as unique and NEW cases!!_

This does not appear to be the case in Wisconsin or North Carolina. Do you know of a state where this is happening?

https://www.nbc15.com/2020/07/15/your-positive-covid-19-test-wont-count-more-than-once/

https://wlos.com/news/news-13-inves...ecorded-if-a-person-is-tested-more-than-once/

Edited to add Dewine and Husted were asked about this in today’s presser. They said they use names and birth dates to ensure a person who tests positive only counts once.

_Imagine running a business using inaccurate information and data. Ohio is on the verge of a second attempt at destroying our economy and lives using incorrect data as the basis for their decision._

Yep, at times people have to make life and death decisions based on incomplete and or inaccurate data. The military calls it the “fog of war”. All you can do is try to get the most accurate data possible, make the best decision you can, and if it is clear the data was wrong, and you made a bad choice, be open to changing it.


----------



## PapawSmith

MIGHTY said:


> https://www.rcreader.com/commentary...f-science-relevant-to-covide-19-social-policy here’s another lengthy read for anyone interested. It’s even got “a review of science” in the title! It dives into the physics/chemistry of a virus. Multiple sources/testing/data to read through like the one I posted a few pages back. I’m sure no one will read it and give the typical “interesting I’ll have to look into that” response. At this point like others have said it’s just beating a dead horse. No one will read too far into anything unless they agree with it from the get go.


Outstanding read. Best actual detailed report I have seen to date on the actual scientific evaluation of the masks themselves. So many strong presumptive arguments and determinations out there on both sides of the position, but this is the first that I have seen directly address masks. Thanks for sharing it. And for the record, I acknowledge that all of my assertions on this issue have been purely a presumptive argument, too. I claim no special intellect or knowledge.


----------



## Northern Reb

AmericanEagle said:


> Yep, at times people have to make life and death decisions based on incomplete and or inaccurate data. The military calls it the “fog of war”. All you can do is try to get the most accurate data possible, make the best decision you can, and if it is clear the data was wrong, and you made a bad choice, be open to changing it.


AE - We agree the numbers are not accurate.

You make a very valid point about the "fog of war", but I will differ in opinion somewhat. In an actual battle soldiers are making life and death decisions, under fire, with only seconds to do so. The health care industry and our gov't leaders have now had months to get accurate data. 

Like I said... a business would not survive by guessing or hoping its P&L statement is accurate. Those numbers have to be absolute. I would think if our gov't leaders are going to close down businesses, many of whom will not be able to survive a second round, they should at the very least have accurate information.


----------



## MIGHTY

PapawSmith said:


> Outstanding read. Best actual detailed report I have seen to date on the actual scientific evaluation of the masks themselves. So many strong presumptive arguments and determinations out there on both sides of the position, but this is the first that I have seen directly address masks. Thanks for sharing it. And for the record, I acknowledge that all of my assertions on this issue have been purely a presumptive argument, too. I claim no special intellect or knowledge.


 I posted another one a few pages back by a former anesthesiologists of 36 years. There was a test done with 820 patients all having the same types of surgeries split into two groups. Half were operated on by fully masked crews and the other with no masks. 46 out of 421 patients in the masked group developed some type of infection while 37 out of 420 did on the non masked group. Again though, it’s a lot of reading.


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## Legend killer

MIGHTY said:


> I posted another one a few pages back by a former anesthesiologists of 36 years. There was a test done with 820 patients all having the same types of surgeries split into two groups. Half were operated on by fully masked crews and the other with no masks. 46 out of 421 patients in the masked group developed some type of infection while 37 out of 420 did on the non masked group. Again though, it’s a lot of reading.


What does that have to do with covid 19 anyways? I guess you volunteer to go to a covid party?


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## Legend killer

KaGee said:


> Do you?


Your transparent leader is getting rid of more transparency
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/coronavirus-data-cdc-hospitals-trump-administration/


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## MIGHTY

montagc said:


> Is there a link? I'd like to read that one too.


 yea there’s a couple. Probably 3-4 pages back?


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## MIGHTY

Legend killer said:


> What does that have to do with covid 19 anyways? I guess you volunteer to go to a covid party?


 it’s about the effectiveness of masks at stopping (or not) the spread. Don’t bother reading it though I guess?


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## MIGHTY

Legend killer said:


> Your transparent leader is getting rid of more transparency
> https://www.cbsnews.com/news/coronavirus-data-cdc-hospitals-trump-administration/










CBS is a super trustworthy source!


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## Legend killer

MIGHTY said:


> View attachment 366859
> CBS is a super trustworthy source!


OK then
https://khn.org/morning-breakout/tr...s-hospitals-to-bypass-cdc-with-data-on-covid/
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...pitals-not-send-covid-19-data-cdc/5441730002/

https://www.npr.org/2020/07/15/8915...ls-to-bypass-cdc-send-covid-19-data-to-washin


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## Legend killer

MIGHTY said:


> it’s about the effectiveness of masks at stopping (or not) the spread. Don’t bother reading it though I guess?


They did not do a study about not wearing masks around covid + patients, LMAO


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## MIGHTY

Again don’t bother reading any of it. A woman at work in her mid 60’s had her husband test positive supposedly a month or so back when he was in the hospital for a brian tumor. He’s in his mid to late 70’s. She insists on everyone wearing a mask if you go through the office she works in. I asked her how often the doctor recommended her wear one at home with her husband who tested positive and she said he didn’t. She didn’t catch on though. Perhaps you could provide us with some actual testing to show that masks do 100% stop the spread?


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## Legend killer

MIGHTY said:


> Again don’t bother reading any of it. A woman at work in her mid 60’s had her husband test positive supposedly a month or so back when he was in the hospital for a brian tumor. He’s in his mid to late 70’s. She insists on everyone wearing a mask if you go through the office she works in. I asked her how often the doctor recommended her wear one at home with her husband who tested positive and she said he didn’t. She didn’t catch on though. Perhaps you could provide us with some actual testing to show that masks do 100% stop the spread?


Alright dude, hear you go.


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## MIGHTY

Legend killer said:


> Alright dude, hear you go.
> View attachment 366861


 oh well dang it’s settled then! Thanks legend. I’ll disregard the in-depth testing provided by people in the field and go off of the meme someone made on Facebook! Case closed guys, masks work!


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## MIGHTY

montagc said:


> This was posted more than once here. It was an error and they apologized for it.


 pretty odd how often that happens. Oh well honest mistake!


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## slipsinker

MIGHTY said:


> pretty odd how often that happens. Oh well honest mistake!


cbs always shows a room full of mannequins on vents,why?trying to sit there and say they're overwhelmed.....lmfao!


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## Legend killer

Republican governor of Georgia voids mandatory masks in 15 cities. You cant make this crap up.

Georgia gov. explicitly voids mask orders in 15 localities
https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/georgia-gov-explicitly-voids-mask-214116308.html


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## PapawSmith

Legend killer said:


> Republican governor of Georgia voids mandatory masks in 15 cities. You cant make this crap up.
> 
> Georgia gov. explicitly voids mask orders in 15 localities
> https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/georgia-gov-explicitly-voids-mask-214116308.html


We would like to know who made you up.


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## STRONGPERSUADER

Legend killer said:


> Your transparent leader is getting rid of more transparency
> https://www.cbsnews.com/news/coronavirus-data-cdc-hospitals-trump-administration/


About time.


Legend killer said:


> Your transparent leader is getting rid of more transparency
> https://www.cbsnews.com/news/coronavirus-data-cdc-hospitals-trump-administration/


About time. It’s called headhunting why? Because he can. Cleaning up the corruption. And he’s just getting started. Everyone knows the CDC is the one who can’t get their numbers straight and change their minds every week. They are as corrupt as WHO. Keep draining the swamp Sir.


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## STRONGPERSUADER

Legend killer said:


> Alright dude, hear you go.
> View attachment 366861


Not in cartoon form please....


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## MIGHTY

montagc said:


> Can you link that? I havent seen it.


 



 There’s one from a while back. Might be a different event than what was being referred to but it happens so much it’s hard to keep up with. If you have more time I can send you 3-4 more longer videos. This was the shortest one I had on hand.


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## Legend killer

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> About time.
> 
> About time. It’s called headhunting why? Because he can. Cleaning up the corruption. And he’s just getting started. Everyone knows the CDC is the one who can’t get their numbers straight and change their minds every week. They are as corrupt as WHO. Keep draining the swamp Sir.


The swamp is deeper now.
You can't make this crap up


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## Dovans




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## luredaddy

I cannot believe OGF permits this thread to continue. It has gone from the ridiculous to the absurd. OGF has put into print, they will not tolerate political posts, this thread is the Poster Child for political posts. PLEASE NUKE IT !!


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## Dovans

This will be especially true starting next Weds.


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## Saugeyefisher

luredaddy said:


> I cannot believe OGF permits this thread to continue. It has gone from the ridiculous to the absurd. OGF has put into print, they will not tolerate political posts, this thread is the Poster Child for political posts. PLEASE NUKE IT !!


I feel like there more trying to contain it to this thread. They have shutdown quite a few lately with pretty much the same content that's in here. Theres a few in the sports section that have pretty much turned political as well. Gotta be tuff on the mods. I'm surprised this one is still running. 
To be fair though,except for a crazy here or there everybody has played nice for the most part. The last few weeks though it seems to have turned into just a few people trying to change a few peoples minds.


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## slipsinker

montagc said:


> Can you link that? I havent seen it.


all you have to do is tune in to cbs morning or nightly news and look close. been on for days over and over again. they don't show it very long,but long enough for me to see it


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## Saugeye Tom

Legend killer said:


> You named all but fox news. Fox news is the king of fake news.


Wtf. R u nuts? They report more evenly than any other news


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## Legend killer

Saugeye Tom said:


> Wtf. R u nuts? They report more evenly than any other news


You can't make this crap up!


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## luredaddy

Saugeye Tom said:


> Wtf. R u nuts? They report more evenly than any other news


That is the funniest, most ridiculous statement , I have heard in a long time.


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## cement569

well, ive posted this before. i had it, my wife had it, and my 2 sons had it in late feb. early march. had all the symptoms fever cough body aches and im 62 years old. since then i have talked to anyone who has had it. my wife has 36 people who work for her and again no one knows anyone who has it or died from it. we went to our family doctor before they even named this flu, he is old school country doctor. he gave us a seven day antibiotic called cefuroxime and after 3 days was felling better and after 3 more days i was sitting on plx hammering crappie. so if you choose to stay hunkerd down please do so, not me and i dont wear a diaper on my face or will i ever.....they dont stop sh##t


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## yonderfishin

multi species angler said:


> If the Amish don't have it yet it is because they don't associate much with us entitled Americans. And my money says they will associate with us less now especially those not wearing a mask.



According to the news reported , its hit native American communities hard....and they generally keep to themselves too. So I dont know that I could agree with your reasoning


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## fastwater

Saugeyefisher said:


> I feel like there more trying to contain it to this thread. They have shutdown quite a few lately with pretty much the same content that's in here. Theres a few in the sports section that have pretty much turned political as well. Gotta be tuff on the mods. I'm surprised this one is still running.
> *To be fair though,except for a crazy here or there everybody has played nice for the most part*. *The last few weeks though it seems to have turned into just a few people trying to change a few peoples minds*.





Legend killer said:


> You can't make this crap up!


...and then there are the known trolls of OGF...and this thread has surely developed into the perfect platform opening itself up for these trolls to have a hay day posting little short, meaningless, one liners with the soul purpose of keeping people as stirred up as they can.


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## Legend killer

fastwater said:


> ...and then there are the known trolls of OGF...and this thread has surely developed into the perfect platform opening itself up for these trolls to have a hay day posting little short, meaningless, one liners with the soul purpose of keeping people as stirred up as they can.


When a poster says that fox news is the most even, accurate news there is that is poposterous.


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## Snakecharmer

cement569 said:


> i dont wear a diaper on my face or will i ever.....they dont stop sh##t


My grandson's diapers stop their crap, maybe you're using the wrong brand?


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## Burkcarp1

Legend killer said:


> When a poster says that fox news is the most even, accurate news there is that is poposterous.


Way more accurate than cnn


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## Legend killer

Burkcarp1 said:


> Way more accurate than cnn


I have not once posted anything about any network being the most accurate. 

Dewine just needs to post on OGF mandatory masks and that will flatten the curve.


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## cement569

snakecharmer, n95 from my consrtuction years, and they are touted as the best. people need to take a step back and think for themselves instead of what you read and hear, i lived through it without any major problems....so please stay hunkerd down


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## fastwater

Legend killer said:


> I have not once posted anything about any network being the most accurate.
> 
> *Dewine just needs to post on OGF mandatory masks and that will flatten the curve.*


See all...
....this is just another shining example of the 'one liners for the soul purpose of keeping people as stirred up as 'he' can' I posted about
earlier.


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## bad luck

The mods are doing great! 

we just have some folks who are ultra sensitive on here and are VICTIMS (here, society, etc...) of micro aggressions, and refuse to see facts/refuse to believe they were fed BS from multiple so-called news outlets, who used to be news outlets mind you, but stop doing that many many years ago

The same folks, have demanded sources/proof, which has been provided time and time and time again, but refuse to believe it.


Kind of like the guy who everybody tells him his wife is screwing around on him, and he kind of knows it and doesn’t believe it, and walks in on it, and still doesn’t believe it......


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## Burkcarp1

Legend killer said:


> I have not once posted anything about any network being the most accurate.
> 
> Dewine just needs to post on OGF mandatory masks and that will flatten the curve.


You didn’t have to. We know what you watch.....


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## Buster24

Legend killer said:


> When a poster says that fox news is the most even, accurate news there is that is poposterous.


so who is the most accurate....seems like you have a favorite....please share!!!!


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## MagicMarker

Kind of like wrestling a pig in the mud. You wear yourself out till you finally realize the pig is enjoying it


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## Snakecharmer

cement569 said:


> snakecharmer, n95 from my consrtuction years, and they are touted as the best. people need to take a step back and think for themselves instead of what you read and hear, i lived through it without any major problems....so please stay hunkerd down


I thought we were talking diapers?


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## cement569

yep we were, they are called....face diapers


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## Legend killer

Cooler heads will prevail. Let's be united. All start wearing masks and do our part as sportsmen.


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## TheStinger

I've been enjoying this thread from the very beginning. I imagine someone may get their feelings hurt, but I am quite surprised at the number of sheeple there are in this fishing forum. I would not have expected this from "outdoorsmen".


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## Shad Rap

Legend killer said:


> Alright dude, hear you go.
> View attachment 366861


Lol...the pee runs down the guys leg onto the floor and people step in it, then guess what happens?..you're easy.


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## jrose

luredaddy said:


> I cannot believe OGF permits this thread to continue. It has gone from the ridiculous to the absurd. OGF has put into print, they will not tolerate political posts, this thread is the Poster Child for political posts. PLEASE NUKE IT !!


Just stop reading it! Poof, it’s gone. Let the rest of us live and learn.


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## slipsinker

cement569 said:


> snakecharmer, n95 from my consrtuction years, and they are touted as the best. people need to take a step back and think for themselves instead of what you read and hear, i lived through it without any major problems....so please stay hunkerd down


i worked for a rock company in las vegas for 10 years that mined metaquartzite sandstone. unless you wore a rubber mask that was fitted with dual filters,there was a possibility of contracting silicosis ,which pretty much prevents you from breathing.people in the trades are candidates for this and very vulnerable.


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## jrose

yonderfishin said:


> According to the news reported , its hit native American communities hard....and they generally keep to themselves too. So I dont know that I could agree with your reasoning


Indian casinos??????


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## MIGHTY

Legend killer said:


> OK then
> https://khn.org/morning-breakout/tr...s-hospitals-to-bypass-cdc-with-data-on-covid/
> https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...pitals-not-send-covid-19-data-cdc/5441730002/
> 
> https://www.npr.org/2020/07/15/8915...ls-to-bypass-cdc-send-covid-19-data-to-washin


 sorry LK didn’t notice this post earlier and didn’t realize the topic changed so suddenly. Not going to deny that this situation has happened or not (don’t really care) but the sources man! Without clicking on any of them I’m just going to take a shot in the dark: Doom and gloom! How could he do this?! We’re all screwed! Was I close? When I take a jab questioning the honesty of CBS you can’t come back with additional links for USAtoday, npr, main stream media stuff and expect me to take things seriously. Unless of course you’re just having a good time which I almost expect you are.


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## SICKOFIT

multi species angler said:


> Another person that just doesn't get it. A healthy person doesn't need to wear a mask to help stop the spread of this virus because they don't have the virus. The mask are to be worn because asymptomatic people think they are healthy and are not, therefore they spread the virus everywhere they go. The mask doesn't prevent a person from getting the virus, it (HELP's) stop the spread of the virus.
> 
> 
> Moderators, would you please make this a sticky and post it because I'm tiring of repeating it over and over.


Hallelujah!!


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## percidaeben

cement569 said:


> well, ive posted this before. i had it, my wife had it, and my 2 sons had it in late feb. early march. had all the symptoms fever cough body aches and im 62 years old. since then i have talked to anyone who has had it. my wife has 36 people who work for her and again no one knows anyone who has it or died from it. we went to our family doctor before they even named this flu, he is old school country doctor. he gave us a seven day antibiotic called cefuroxime and after 3 days was felling better and after 3 more days i was sitting on plx hammering crappie. so if you choose to stay hunkerd down please do so, not me and i dont wear a diaper on my face or will i ever.....they dont stop sh##t


Cefuroxime is a antibiotic. It does absolutely nothing to a virus.


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## All Thumbs

i have been entertaining myself by reading this thread and thoroughly enjoying the various views and comments - i myself hunker down and only venture out when i have to and when i do so i wear a mask - i don't know if it helps but dewine thinks it does and his next step is to shut ohio back down like in the beginning and i think that will be bad for everyone - call me a sheep i guess but i am doing my part - if the spike keeps rising maybe dewine will admit the masks are not doing any good - 

anyway this is my first post because what i witnessed tonight at a speedway gas station in Montgomery county (one of the hot spots in ohio) they just posted a sign on the door that you cannot enter without a face mask - a gentleman or more like an a$$ i should say tried to enter without a mask - a young lady maybe 18, 19, or 20 that works there stopped him and told him the new policy - he went ballistic on her - his rights were violated, the masks were a sham, he can go anywhere he wants without a mask - called her an ignorant blah blah blah - she tried to explain to him that she was just following orders and was almost in tears - luckily 3 young guys were about to interrupt and possibly make an attitude adjustment when the ranter left and of course the final statement was you will never get my business again

i don't care if you refuse to wear a mask or not but this is wrong - i damn well know this young lady did not make the policy and was made to enforce the rule or probably lose her job - i am proud when i see the young people working at all but to put up with that crap is totally out of line

i know there is a crowd in this thread that call me a sheep and try to explain their reasons and so forth with "facts" but i am hoping that they would not go to such lengths as this asinine individual did to make their point to a person that is just trying to make a living


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## Snakecharmer

montagc said:


> I watched that whole thing and it was certainly not The conspiracy the guy made it out to be. The guy sure made a big deal out of it though. Had I watched the cbs video without his commentary I would have thought there were very few people at the testing site, even with a few extra people trying to get on camera.
> 
> Where’s this video of mannequins on ventilators?


Wow... I had to get my tin hat out to finish watching that journalist (lol). His sarcasm was dripping on my head...


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## Snakecharmer

All Thumbs said:


> i have been entertaining myself by reading this thread and thoroughly enjoying the various views and comments - i myself hunker down and only venture out when i have to and when i do so i wear a mask - i don't know if it helps but dewine thinks it does and his next step is to shut ohio back down like in the beginning and i think that will be bad for everyone - call me a sheep i guess but i am doing my part - if the spike keeps rising maybe dewine will admit the masks are not doing any good -
> 
> anyway this is my first post because what i witnessed tonight at a speedway gas station in Montgomery county (one of the hot spots in ohio) they just posted a sign on the door that you cannot enter without a face mask - a gentleman or more like an a$$ i should say tried to enter without a mask - a young lady maybe 18, 19, or 20 that works there stopped him and told him the new policy - he went ballistic on her - his rights were violated, the masks were a sham, he can go anywhere he wants without a mask - called her an ignorant blah blah blah - she tried to explain to him that she was just following orders and was almost in tears - luckily 3 young guys were about to interrupt and possibly make an attitude adjustment when the ranter left and of course the final statement was you will never get my business again
> 
> i don't care if you refuse to wear a mask or not but this is wrong - i damn well know this young lady did not make the policy and was made to enforce the rule or probably lose her job - i am proud when i see the young people working at all but to put up with that crap is totally out of line
> 
> i know there is a crowd in this thread that call me a sheep and try to explain their reasons and so forth with "facts" but i am hoping that they would not go to such lengths as this asinine individual did to make their point to a person that is just trying to make a living


Glad you didn't have to put your MP come-along on that douche...


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## KaGee

Done.


----------

