# Pistol Caliber Rifles sent to Wildlife Council!



## buckeye dan (Jan 31, 2012)

ODNR Division of Wildlife announces pistol caliber rifles for deer hunting.

Buckeye Firearms Association applauds the Ohio Division of Wildlife for making the proposal so Ohio deer hunters will have another tool available as they enjoy deer hunting starting in 2014. We thank the OFBF for their support of PCR. We hope the Ohio Wildlife Council will adopt the proposed policy.

The whole story here: http://www.buckeyefirearms.org/node/9315


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## Lundy (Apr 5, 2004)

Good news, thanks for your efforts!


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## Ring (Dec 7, 2013)

nice, but how do you "plug" a lever gun?


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## Ben Fishing (Aug 2, 2010)

Ring said:


> nice, but how do you "plug" a lever gun?


Henry now sells them.


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## ironman172 (Apr 12, 2009)

they don't plug hand guns do they?? 
It won't matter to me, I really only need 1 shot anyway, don't take running shots or long distant shots, and if sighted in (with good optics) that should be all anyone needs

looks like I will have to see what ruger makes in mags for the deerfield 44mag(4 shot mag) or the marlin 357 lever action....seems always something
the grand daughter will be happy with this


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## buckeye dan (Jan 31, 2012)

Ben Fishing said:


> Henry now sells them.


Where? 
The last time I spoke with Tony the plugging solutions were not in production yet. That was quite some time ago however.


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## Ben Fishing (Aug 2, 2010)

buckeye dan said:


> Where?
> The last time I spoke with Tony the plugging solutions were not in production yet. That was quite some time ago however.


My father was working with them last month for his .44 Henry.
Its now an easy remedy.


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## walleye machine (Apr 27, 2004)

Forget the plugs and forget the rifles shot gun state my 2 cents


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## Flathead76 (May 2, 2010)

walleye machine said:


> Forget the plugs and forget the rifles shot gun state my 2 cents


They shoot the same bullets as most muzzleloaders. Hope it passes.


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## Mad-Eye Moody (May 27, 2008)

walleye machine said:


> Forget the plugs and forget the rifles shot gun state my 2 cents


Fortunately for you, you can continue to use your slug gun. I probably will too as I have a bolt action 20 guage that will outperform 90% of the pcr rounds mentioned and realistically I don't really hunt ohio during gun season much anymore. For my five hours a year of gun hunting I can't justify another gun.

But if it gives our youth an option besides a .410 slug gun it is a step in the right direction.


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## crittergitter (Jun 9, 2005)

It will get passed. It's a money grab. DOW needs to make up for lost funds due to reduced tag sales.


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## jonnythfisherteen2 (Mar 5, 2011)

If its a auto loader with a mag, then just carry with out the mag. 
One more thing. Why is buckshot not legal to use? Doesn't make sense that you can use slugs and soon bullets that go carry energy farther but not buckshot


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## ezbite (May 25, 2006)

jonnythfisherteen2 said:


> One more thing. Why is buckshot not legal to use? Doesn't make sense that you can use slugs and soon bullets that go carry energy farther but not buckshot


My guess is its a penetration issue, they want you killing the deer not wounding them. If you've ever shot it, you'd see. IMO anything past 40 yards with buckshot is a gamble. I bought a box of 200 shells of 00 buck from cheaper than dirt some years back when I got a home defense shotgun. The only ones that penetrated thru the wood were shot within 20-25 yards. On some of the longer shot, 50 yards and more didn't even penetrate, they simple bounced off of just penetrates enough to stick in the surface of the wood. Don't get me wrong it's nasty at close ranges, but at a distance, it's worthless.


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## hopintocash2 (Aug 14, 2011)

i like the idea of pcr's, i have done very little handgun shooting, but what little i did do, i found that it must take A LOT of practice to have any kind of accuracy with one. so the long gun option is good, imo. so what is going to be the favorite round? .44mag, .454 casul, 45-70, .....? i don't know much about the ballistics and such of the handgun rounds.


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## Misdirection (Jul 16, 2012)

hopintocash2 said:


> i like the idea of pcr's, i have done very little handgun shooting, but what little i did do, i found that it must take A LOT of practice to have any kind of accuracy with one. so the long gun option is good, imo. so what is going to be the favorite round? .44mag, .454 casul, 45-70, .....? i don't know much about the ballistics and such of the handgun rounds.


.45-70 because I already own one!

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Ohub Campfire mobile app


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## Mad-Eye Moody (May 27, 2008)

If you like to study the charts and numbers, .444 will be one of the more potent cartridges, but somewhat obscure and will be better for a hand loader. .45-70 is more popular, not as flat shooting but has good energy and trajectory to a little more than 200 yds if you know what you are doing.

Those will be popular for someone wanting to match or exceed a slug gun.

If performance is not the key factor the .44 mag will be pretty popular.


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## Mad-Eye Moody (May 27, 2008)

Ring said:


> nice, but how do you "plug" a lever gun?


Dummy rounds in the magazine tube, or a plug.


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## jonnythfisherteen2 (Mar 5, 2011)

Mad-Eye Moody said:


> If you like to study the charts and numbers, .444 will be one of the more potent cartridges, but somewhat obscure and will be better for a hand loader. .45-70 is more popular, not as flat shooting but has good energy and trajectory to a little more than 200 yds if you know what you are doing.
> 
> Those will be popular for someone wanting to match or exceed a slug gun.
> 
> If performance is not the key factor the .44 mag will be pretty popular.


I have a h&r ultra slug hunter light. Its a light 5 pound 12 gauge slug fun. According to the h&r website, I can switch out the barrel to a .357 or .44 magnum barrel. Apparently my frame can only handle shotgun pressures. I'm fine with that though, because I wanted to try to get into rifles as well.


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## ezbite (May 25, 2006)

idk, ive been looking at getting a hand canon larger than my .44 mag for many moons and im pretty sure if this passes, im getting a .454 casull barrel for my encore, it just seems like the right choice to me. the down range energy is great.


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## Mr. A (Apr 23, 2012)

ezbite said:


> idk, ive been looking at getting a hand canon larger than my .44 mag for many moons and im pretty sure if this passes, im getting a .454 casull barrel for my encore, it just seems like the right choice to me. the down range energy is great.


I have the raging bull on .44 that I love and it will get the job done on anything in Ohio (IMO) , and have wondered about going to the 454. Any idea what the ballistics are for that round? I would love a lever action PCR to hunt with, but I'm not sure I'd be happy spending so much on a .44.

Mr. A


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## ezbite (May 25, 2006)

Here ya go..


http://www.ballistics101.com/454_casull.php


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## ironman172 (Apr 12, 2009)

so are the 45acp going to be legal if passed, since they did away with the over 1000ftlbs and went to barrel length only ....just seeing if I have one more option
all my shots are close in the woods or I don't take them


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## buckeye dan (Jan 31, 2012)

@ironman172,
Everyone should try their best to attend an open house and ask for the old straight walled criteria to accompany "the list". That would cover missing rounds from the list and any future rounds that are developed.

To answer your question, .45acp is on the list.

@ezbite,
Try a Google search for "pro hunter katahdin carbine barrels" if you haven't already. Three more options for you, .45-70, .460 and .500 S&W calibers in a 20" barrel.


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## ironman172 (Apr 12, 2009)

so when and where is the open house?


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## powerstrokin73 (May 21, 2008)

ezbite, who makes a Casull barrel for the Encore? I want to get one also, since I already have the ammo. I saw one for sale in the marketplace last week made by a shop in Westerville (I think). I wasn't too sure about one made by a machine shop compared to an actual barrel manufacturer Evin


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## buckeye dan (Jan 31, 2012)

ironman172 said:


> so when and where is the open house?


Open House info can be found here:
http://www.dnr.state.oh.us/Default.aspx?tabid=5725


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## ezbite (May 25, 2006)

powerstrokin73 said:


> ezbite, who makes a Casull barrel for the Encore? I want to get one also, since I already have the ammo. I saw one for sale in the marketplace last week made by a shop in Westerville (I think). I wasn't too sure about one made by a machine shop compared to an actual barrel manufacturer Evin


Not too sure, I just started looking. But the more I look the more I like that .460


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## jonnythfisherteen2 (Mar 5, 2011)

Ok. That makes sense. Sounds like the buckshot looses power over longer ranges.
Has anyone considered getting a carbine conversion kit for a glock or 1911? There's a interesting one called a mech tech. It replaces the top part of the gun with a longer barrel and receiver that can take a stock and optics.


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## hopin to cash (Sep 14, 2010)

Does this mean there will be a bunch of good buys on deer shot guns? Will everyone be selling those rifled slug guns we all bought 20 years ago?


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## Mad-Eye Moody (May 27, 2008)

hopin to cash said:


> Does this mean there will be a bunch of good buys on deer shot guns? Will everyone be selling those rifled slug guns we all bought 20 years ago?


They will be for sale by the barrel full. There will be a lot of folks making the change eventually. I have been doing a lot of reading and there will be availability issues. The caliber I want is not currently in production and ammo is incredibly scarce. The buying power of states like ohio making this change has prompted some talk of reintroduction though.

Even the second choice of caliber for me will be tough to find as newer marlins are made by remington and have some very well documented and well deserved reputation issues, so once again I will be seeking used ones.

I may just be buying a barrel for my h and r this year.


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## krustymc223 (Jul 19, 2009)

You know H & R's are made by Remington!


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## papaperch (Apr 12, 2004)

One cartridge not mentioned the 357 MAX. After using the .44 mag for years. I tried the long 357. My set up was Thompson Contendor with 12 inch barrel , 4X leupold scope.

Handloading for the Contender it was rather easy to make it an effective 200 yd weapon. I used .35 remington bullets that were designed for rifle use. Thin walled bullets designed for pistol velocities and their blunt noses was not the ticket. The 150 grain worked extremely well for me. The 170 grain dropped too much for my taste and velocity was sacrificed
"
I was able to shoot a group consistently of 4-1/2 " to 5-1/2 " @ 200 yds. At 100 yds the group was normally smaller than an inch.

Someone using a carbine or rifle in this cartridge should have no trouble surpassing that performance . By the way all of my most accurate loads were with Win 296 ball powder. One caution though small rifle primer must be used. The small pistol primer used in the .357 Mag cannot stand up to the higher pressures of the MAX.

A lot of know -it- all gun magazine writers helped destroy this rounds chance of commercial success. Most of them were highly critical of it because it burned out the forcing cone on the Revolvers that were designed for it. Since the Thompson was a single shot it had no forcing cone.

I tried to make my 44 mag a 200 yd . But 135-150 seemed to be my limit. Hunting southern Ohio created a need for a longer range for me. The 357 MAX was the best solution and was way more accurate than any shotgun. 

The irony was after all this experimenting and ranging and handloading. The longest shot I ever made with the gun was a whopping 39 yards. Not the guns fault just that was how my luck ran. Once I finally had something capable of longer shots. All of a sudden all the deer tried to run me over.

Used the Contender in the MAX until I quit hunting.


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## krustymc223 (Jul 19, 2009)

papaperch. . . A lot of H & R Handi .357 mag rifle owners, ream their mags to max !


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## capt j-rod (Feb 14, 2008)

44mag lever revolution hornadys took my marlin lever to the 200yd mark. I like owning 2 guns that eat the same round. BTW check the ballistics on 41mag... It really is the sweet spot between velocity and knock down.


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## Mad-Eye Moody (May 27, 2008)

Capt j - how many foot ponds of energy are you getting with the 44 mag at 200 yards?


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