# bow Trouble



## Blaze6784 (Nov 3, 2006)

My buddy got aused bow that is 60-70# pull. The guy can pull it back with his fingers (all 4) but cannot pull it back with his release. Any one have some insight on this? He wants to hunt so bad but can't get his bow back and is getting discouraged.

Thanks,
Chris


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## fish4wall (Apr 14, 2004)

i assume you have it backed down to 60lbs. if not back it down...are you able to pull it back with a release?


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## Blaze6784 (Nov 3, 2006)

Its all the way down to 60#s. And I myself can pull it back with a release and also with my non-dominant hand/arm.


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## M.Magis (Apr 5, 2004)

It&#8217;s just too much bow for him, there&#8217;s no way to get around it. I&#8217;m guessing he&#8217;s straining to get it back when he does manage. Even if he finds some way to get it back with his release, trying to get the bow drawn while hunting is another situation entirely. He needs a bow that he can draw smoothly, by pulling straight back. No struggling. To be honest, it pretty late in the year to be getting a bow to hunt with this season.


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## fish4wall (Apr 14, 2004)

i 2nd what M.Magis is telling you...
make sure hes not trying to pull back with his arm...the back muscles is what needs to be built up...and that takes time...if he wants to hunt this year with a bow...i hate to say it but get a crossbow...then have him build up them muscles this winter and spring...he'll hunt with a compound bow next season...


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## ezbite (May 25, 2006)

Blaze6784 said:


> He wants to hunt so bad but can't get his bow back and is getting discouraged.
> 
> Thanks,
> Chris


 he needs to NOT hunt with this bow, i see wounded and lost game all over this. bowhunting takes months of practice BEFORE the season. im not trying to preach here either, IMO its really too late for him this season unless he gets out and shoots everyday for at least a few weeks if not months. then he might be able to hunt the cold months of the season.


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## Semi33 (Mar 5, 2008)

Lift some weights and do push ups


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## Bulldawg (Dec 3, 2007)

These are all great suggestions , well all except for "lift weights and do push ups " . That will do nothing for the muscle memory required to effectively shoot a bow . It is too late to try and get set up now , but he needs to find a bow with a poundage of 50-60 lbs . Start shooting at 50lbs and then he can work his way up to where he is comfortable . Or like everyone else said shoot a crossbow this year . Hope you guys get it straightened out , good luck .


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## ostbucks98 (Apr 14, 2004)

I guess im not as smart as the rest of you but where did he mention his overall bow experience? This guy could be world class shooter just struggling with this bow for all we know..

what kind of release is he using a wrist release or T-type release? sounds to me like if he can pull bow back with 4 fingers a T-type would be better for him...and in my opinion its never to late to learn to bow hunt...I like how man paints this picture of ultimate skill to even consider hunting when deer arent as smart or hard to hunt as we make it


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## M.Magis (Apr 5, 2004)

ostbucks98 said:


> I guess im not as smart as the rest of you but where did he mention his overall bow experience? This guy could be world class shooter just struggling with this bow for all we know..
> 
> what kind of release is he using a wrist release or T-type release? sounds to me like if he can pull bow back with 4 fingers a T-type would be better for him...and in my opinion its never to late to learn to bow hunt...I like how man paints this picture of ultimate skill to even consider hunting when deer arent as smart or hard to hunt as we make it


An experienced shooter knows when a bow is too heavy for him, and that is the one and only reason a person would have trouble drawing a bow.


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## fish4wall (Apr 14, 2004)

WOW!!! here we go....
if he was a "world class shooter" he wouldnt have any issues...like Magis said.."An experienced shooter knows when a bow is too heavy for him" 
thats why i ask Blaze if he could pull it back..my thought was there might be something wrong with the bow...but when he said he could i knew its too much bow for his buddy.
in archery you need to think outside the box sometimes when teaching someone. i've coached many guys and most now are out shooting me... plus any hunter owes that animal a clean quick kill...thats the first thing i tell people who want to start hunting..if you have someone who can't or is having issues drawling back their bow they dont need to hunt. they are a danger to themself and others. plus not getting a good clean kill on a animal just for it to suffer...dirty pool....is all i can say....
wow i just said dirty pool..man i just showed my age....


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

the first thing i will say is it doesnt take 60# to take a deer. here in indiana i think 35# is the lightest weight you can use to hunt. he should have a bow he can hold out in front of him and pull it back without lifting the bow. if he has practiced with his fingers and shoots good enough to hunt then he just needs a new bow he needs to get one that he can pull back even if its a 40 to 50 lb bow the use the highest poundage that he can pull back with no problem. if he cant pull it back at the range he wont be able to get it back while hunting.

a bow can be much harder to pull when your dressed for cold weather and your musles are cold. so if he has to strain with 50# then he needs to drop to 45#. as he builds up his shoulder musles he can go to a heavier bow. but for now he needs a lighter bow.

the first time i bow hunted i bought my bow after our gun season started and i got my deer with a shotgun. and i practiced every day untill our late season came in, which only gave me about 3 weeks. i had a 50# bow and had no problem shooting it. so by the time the season came back in i was shooting pretty good. but if he is just now getting into shooting a bow he shouldnt hunt untill he can keep all his arrows in the center half of a paper plate at 20 yrds. and thats not the ideal shooting, but just a minimum.

i would do like some others if he is just starting i would recommend he wait untill the late season or get a crossbow. there is a responsibility to the animal we hunt to be good at what we use to hunt with. it is a sick feeling to make a bad hit with a bow. and it can happen to even good hunters.

but whatever he decides to do he is going to have to get a lighter poundage bow, if he wants to use a regular type bow. all this is just my opinion and may differ from some others.
sherman


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## billk (Feb 2, 2008)

fish4wall said:


> ...thats why i ask Blaze if he could pull it back..*my thought was there might be something wrong with the bow*...


Nothing wrong with the bow - I sold it to Blaze back in early Sept. 

Prove to me there something wrong with it and I'll buy it back.


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## fish4wall (Apr 14, 2004)

billk you took my post the wrong way...at first my thoughts was there was something wrong with the bow..but thats not the cast because blaze can pull it back with no issues....so im sure the bow is in tip top shape...  please make sure you re-read my post. 
i'm just trying to help his buddy out... my main concern is that his buddy isn't ready to hunt. if he can't pull it back it's way too much bow for him right now..with a little work this winter he'll be shooting in no time. by next bow season he'll be in the woods taking down a monster buck...


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## billk (Feb 2, 2008)

Hey Fish.

I understood your comment. Just making sure that nobody jumps on the "something wrong with it" angle. I'll stand by my comment - and thats the same thing I told him when he bought it.

I'd be hunting with it myself if I hadn't gotten a deal on an Athens last Sept.


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## JoeFish (Apr 2, 2011)

Mechanically, the bow may need adjusted for draw length. With compound bows, the way the cams work, and the way his body works, he may need a shorter draw when using the release. He may be stroking out his body geometry, before the cams allow the drop off of weight. Release wise, it may also be too long for his hand. This all plays into the draw length and body size. This would explain why he can do it with fingers, but not a release.


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## fish4wall (Apr 14, 2004)

good point joefish...
billk i just wanted to make sure you didnt think i was being an a-hole..


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## billk (Feb 2, 2008)

Nothing of the sort, Fish.

Hey Blaze.

Joe had a good point. I think the draw length is 27-30" on that bow. Try dropping it down an inch first (look for the screws on the sidesof the cams) and maybe back the limbs off a full turn. That should put her around 57#. Not really efficient, but maybe just enough for him to start practicing.


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## fish4wall (Apr 14, 2004)

let us know how it goes blaze...


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

another thing that will lower the poundage is to go to a shorter string. if the draw length is to much for him, take it in to an archery shop and have them put a shorter string on it.

alot of people dont know you can use a shorter string to lower the poundage and to shorten the draw length. i use to live right next door to an archery shop and did alot of shooting, and picked up a few little tips like this one. so the shorter string may be all he needs to be shooting. its worth trying and wont cost but a few bucks.

let us know how things work out for him.
sherman


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## Blaze6784 (Nov 3, 2006)

Thanks guys for the help. I agree with you guys when you say he shouldn't hunt until he is comfortable with the bow and has no issues drawing it back. Believe me when I tell you that ensuring animals are taken properly and quickly is priority number 1. (That is why I have yet to hunt...can't get my broadheads to fly straight...but that's another story).

There is nothing wrong with the bow. I am thinking that the draw length might be a little long for him and he just can't get it back past the "break" point with the release. When he gets back into town I will have him go to Gander and get the length adjusted and see what that does for him.

I cannot thank you guys enough for the suggestions in helping me get my buddy into this great sport.

Chris


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## ezbite (May 25, 2006)

sherman51 said:


> another thing that will lower the poundage is to go to a shorter string. if the draw length is to much for him, take it in to an archery shop and have them put a shorter string on it.


by going with a shorter string you'd be over extending the limbs at full draw, with a great possibility of cracking a limb, if not shattering it totally. i dont know what kind of bow this is, but i do know on short ata bows this is a VERY BIG nono!!


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## M.Magis (Apr 5, 2004)

I just don&#8217;t see any way he&#8217;s going to be able to effectively shoot and hunt with that bow. Yes, he may be able to get to the point of being able to draw it. But there&#8217;s just no way to go from not being able to draw a bow, to being able to hunt with it. A person needs to be able to draw a bow straight back with little to no strain, with hunting clothes on, not a T shirt. I would guess he needs to drop a minimum of 10 lbs, 15 would be better. Sounds like a shorter draw length is needed as well. Shooting a bow that&#8217;s too heavy will only lead to bad form and poor habits.


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## billk (Feb 2, 2008)

EZBite,

It's a Reflex (Hoyt) Gamegetter with the slam and a half hybrid cams. 39.5 inches axle to axle. Cables and bowstrings are new and installed last year right before I picked up the Athens. Shot it enough to tune it up and sight it in before I put it away.


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## buckeyebowman (Feb 24, 2012)

M.Magis said:


> I just dont see any way hes going to be able to effectively shoot and hunt with that bow. Yes, he may be able to get to the point of being able to draw it. But theres just no way to go from not being able to draw a bow, to being able to hunt with it. A person needs to be able to draw a bow straight back with little to no strain, with hunting clothes on, not a T shirt. I would guess he needs to drop a minimum of 10 lbs, 15 would be better. Sounds like a shorter draw length is needed as well. Shooting a bow thats too heavy will only lead to bad form and poor habits.


Some good points here. I shot a 70lb compound for years before I eventually switched to a 50-60lb bow. While I could still shoot the higher poundage bow all day at a 3D shoot on a warm summer day, after sitting several cold hours in a tree stand in November it was a whole different story! Suddenly, I couldn't get the cams to flip over as smoothly as I used to, and I started getting busted left and right! Common sense prevailed, and I moved down in poundage and also to a bow with a little less "radical" cam, which smoothed out the draw even more. 

Another good point was about draw length. One time I stopped in at the bow shop just for grins. The owner had his bow, the latest and greatest, hanging on the wall. He told me to take it down and draw it to get a feel for what it was like. Well, his draw length is a couple inches longer than mine. I'm a short guy with short arms, an Oompaloompah! At his draw length, the cams were about half way flipped over, in other words right on the "hump", when I was at my normal full draw position. Trying to complete the draw I thought my right shoulder was going to explode! My body geometry just didn't work with that draw length, and your friend's body geometry will work most efficiently with a draw length that is proper for him. One rule of thumb is to measure his wingspan, middle finger tip to middle finger tip and divide by 2.5. This will at least get you in the ball park.

And please tell your friend not to get in a big hurry. We all should respect the game enough to try to put the best, most effective shot on them we can. When I got started on this gig I shot what would nowadays be considered crappy, eccentric wheeled compounds (no cams yet), with fingers and a glove (no releases yet), and fat, heavy aluminum arrows (no carbon yet). I practiced religiously and could really, really shoot! Still, it took me 4 years to take my first deer with a bow. There's some woodscraft involved, and I guess I was a little slower to learn that than I was in learning the mechanics of bow shooting. Best of luck to you and your friend.


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