# Gun Fight Rules



## icebucketjohn (Dec 22, 2005)

*"Peace is that brief glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading."*

--------

*In a Gunfight, the most important rule is ...*

*HAVE A GUN!*


The following shooting tips come from various Concealed Carry Instructors. If you own a gun, you will appreciate these rules... If not, you should get one, learn how to use it and learn the rules.


_RULES_

1. Guns have only two enemies: Rust and Politicians. Rust can be prevented, Politicians cannot.


2. It's always better to be judged by 12 than carried by six.


3. Cops carry guns to protect themselves, not you.


4. Never let someone that threatens you get inside arm's length, seven yards is even better... much better.


5. Never say "I've got a gun." If you need to use deadly force, the only sound they should hear is the safety clicking off, or the hammer cocking... better yet, no sound at all.


6. The average response time of a 911 call is 23 minutes; the response time of a .357 is 1,400 feet per second.


7. The most important rule in a Gunfight is: Always Win - There is no such thing as a fair fight. Always Win - Cheat if necessary. Always Win - 2nd place is a bodybag.

8. Make your attackers advance through a wall of bullets... if you get killed with your own gun, they'll have to beat you to death with it because it will be empty.


9. In a Gunfight:

(a) If you're not shooting, you should be reloading.

(b) If you're not reloading,
you should be moving.

(c) If you're not moving, you're dead.


10. In a life and death situation, do something .. it may be wrong, but do something!


11. If you carry a gun, some people may think you are paranoid. Nonsense! If you have a gun, what do you have to be paranoid about?


12. Never fire a "warning shot", that is just one wasted bullet, which could be needed within moments.


13. You can say "stop" or any other word, but a large caliber muzzle pointed at someone's head is pretty much a universal language; and, you won't have to press:

*1.* For Spanish, *2.* for Chinese, or 

*3.* for Arabic.


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## $diesel$ (Aug 3, 2018)

Love the very first quote, John. How true.


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## Deadeyedeek (Feb 12, 2014)

$diesel$ said:


> Love the very first quote, John. How true.


ALL MAKES SENSE TO ME JOHN!!


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

good rules to live by.
sherman


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## cincinnati (May 24, 2004)

Have been told by several "professionals" that, against an opponent w/bladed weapon, you must be shooting BEFORE he breaches the 7 yard barrier, or you will not have time to deploy your weapon.


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## JamesF (May 20, 2016)

In many situations, one never expects to have an experience to use a weapon, mainly a handgun. 7 yards can be covered very quickly, when the oppressor is determined. I don't know exactly how fast this can happen, I feel the variables are emense. I don't carry, due to legal variables! I try very hard to avoid the need for physical confrontation. Not totally avoidable, but accomplishing a bad outcome, either, physically, legally, or financially. Very good John, common sense for having to pull the trigger. One thing about CC,I learned from my nephew, it is not wise to ward off any one by,just showing your weapon, some places consider that as a criminal offense. Among other things. He works for the Secret Security, I haven't a clue what he does, for all I know he may be an accountant, but I don't think so. He was trained on a gun range . I knew a couple of people that worked for them ,both in the Treasury department.


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## $diesel$ (Aug 3, 2018)

Two rules to stay alive;

1.) NEVER bring a knife to a gun fight.

2.) NEVER pull a gun unless you are POSITIVE your going to use it.


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## Specwar (Sep 22, 2014)

"Oh Lord, may my aim be straight and true,and if today truly is the day you have chosen to call me home, may I die in a pile of brass ."

PS- "caution", my barrel will be hot when you pry it from my dead hands.


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## TheKing (Apr 15, 2004)

The optimum NRA business position is to have everyone imminently ready to kill each other - says the sportsman targeting humans. Say this out loud to yourself " I want to kill a human"


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## WETSHIRT (Jun 29, 2012)

TheKing said:


> The optimum NRA business position is to have everyone imminently ready to kill each other - says the sportsman targeting humans. Say this out loud to yourself " I want to kill a human"


No rational person wants to kill another human. On the other hand no one wants to be killed by another human or animal for that matter. Guns are dual purpose tools for sport and defense If you choose to not protect yourself or family that is your choice, good luck with that. If you dislike the NRA don't support it, but to sound like it's purpose is to teach each other how to kill each other, sounds like a irrational liberal political statement.


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## CFIden (Oct 9, 2014)

Sticks and stones may break bones.
But…..
Hollow points expand on impact


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## james. (Sep 20, 2016)

icebucketjohn said:


> *"Peace is that brief glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading."*
> 
> --------
> 
> ...


Greatly appreciate


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## TheKing (Apr 15, 2004)

WETSHIRT said:


> No rational person wants to kill another human. On the other hand no one wants to be killed by another human or animal for that matter. Guns are dual purpose tools for sport and defense If you choose to not protect yourself or family that is your choice, good luck with that. If you dislike the NRA don't support it, but to sound like it's purpose is to teach each other how to kill each other, sounds like a irrational liberal political statement.


Rather a conservative patriot statement. And yes, I abhor the NRA and any other lobby that our politicians have to satisfy. I hope you find success in your hunt.


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## Saugeye Tom (Oct 6, 2010)

I have never wanted to kill a human..but if the need arises I will not hesitate 1 iota. And my training still with me,,may help the way I feel afterwards.....him or me...or my family...its him Every time.


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## 9Left (Jun 23, 2012)

Well THAT thread went spiraling in the wrong direction!


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## $diesel$ (Aug 3, 2018)

TheKing said:


> Rather a conservative patriot statement. And yes, I abhor the NRA and any other lobby that our politicians have to satisfy. I hope you find success in your hunt.


My friend, you are seriously confused. Yes, the NRA goes overboard at times, but one must fight fire with fire. Any true sportsman that "ABHORS" the NRA, has a wire crossed somewhere. They are the only group that truely has the sportsmans back. In these days of Antifa and rogue judges, not to mention the warped mindset of the Democratic party, they are a beacon of light in a seriously foggy landscape. The Nazi's started out by confiscating the populaces guns. The Bolshavics, the same thing. Our forefathers were smart enough to know that one must be armed to stand up to a rogue goverment. You had better read your history and look in the mirror, i will not defend anybody that stands for oppression!


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## Evinrude58 (Apr 13, 2011)

All I can say after the comments of TheKing the NRA does not promote killing people but does promote defending yourself (no I am not a member but know many people who are). Anyone who has ever used a weapon on (I say it this way to cover bows and knives) another human will tell you it is something you live with for the rest of your life. Years later you can still have self doubts about your actions and some truly never get over having to make such a decision.


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## ezbite (May 25, 2006)

TheKing said:


> Rather a conservative patriot statement. And yes, I abhor the NRA and any other lobby that our politicians have to satisfy. I hope you find success in your hunt.


Nice post ..where's your point


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

^^^Exactly right!^^^
Where did all that come from???
Please explain what your positive or negative views of the NRA has to do with this thread?

There's an old saying that applies to your abhoration of the NRA for them being a 'lobbying' group.

Saying is...'don't hate the players, hate the game!'

The NRA didn't invent the game or the influence of government lobbying.
Like everyone else...they are just playing with the cards they've been dealt.
Right or wrong, government lobbying was brought about long before the NRA was established. The NRA, like all other organization trying to get things they/we want done, just knows without lobbying their voice will never be heard in our political world.
Want to 'abhor' something...abhor the game the politicians have created over the years...don't hate the players that are trying to get things done the only way thats been set up for them to do so.

By the way...don't abhor the entire NRA. There are branches of the NRA that help with wildlife, hunting, handicap children etc.
If you must abhor the NRA...abhor the NRA-ILA part. This is the part of the NRA I contribute to and mark all my donations to go directly to cause they are the lobbying part that greatly helps insure my right to keep and bear arms that so many moronic groups are lobbying at the same time to take away from me.


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## Wow (May 17, 2010)

The King, I admire you for your courage!
This is a sportsman's forum. Did you expect anything different?--Tim


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## TheKing (Apr 15, 2004)

Wow said:


> The King, I admire you for your courage!
> This is a sportsman's forum. Did you expect anything different?--Tim
> 
> View attachment 285641


No I fully expected it. The thread seemed to be headed in the direction of how to hunt and kill another human. It needed derailed IMO.


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## bobk (Apr 30, 2004)

9Left said:


> Well THAT thread went spiraling in the wrong direction!


Did you expect anything else? Some just can't wait to scream from their soapbox. As soon as I saw the post yesterday I started the timer.


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## Deadeyedeek (Feb 12, 2014)

WOW..dont want to start a war, but must reply. This gun thing has and will be beat to death forever, with that said..I grew up with guns and hunting all my life, we were taught at an early ago about safety,etc.. somewere our society got turned around, some creepy, straing people that dont give a chit about life..now I spent 2 years of my life being shot at in VN, being hit twice..I have a cc, and trust me, I haveh ad a great life, and I have that responsibility to protect my family and those I love. I accept the civil liability of maybe taking a life, at my age, what are they gonna do to me? Send me back to Vietnam? Some of you vets can relate, some maynot..thanks for reading DD


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## bobk (Apr 30, 2004)

TheKing said:


> No I fully expected it. The thread seemed to be headed in the direction of how to hunt and kill another human. It needed derailed IMO.


You felt the need to derail the thread? Hey, at least you admit to breaking the TOS. I wish the mods would just nuke your derailing posts but it will get locked instead. It seems to be the game played here now. If you don't like the thread derail it and then it will be locked. I rather see the people that do such things derailed for a while.


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## TheKing (Apr 15, 2004)

bobk said:


> You felt the need to derail the thread? Hey, at least you admit to breaking the TOS. I wish the mods would just nuke your derailing posts but it will get locked instead. It seems to be the game played here now. If you don't like the thread derail it and then it will be locked. I rather see the people that do such things derailed for a while.


Yes that was my feeling. Are you saying that it is more appropriate to support the sharing of tips and tricks to killing humans on our OGF web site?


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Rule #14:
When choosing a firearm for self defense...shoot the snot out of it and make sure that firearm earns the right to be chosen.


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## TheKing (Apr 15, 2004)

$diesel$ said:


> My friend, you are seriously confused. Yes, the NRA goes overboard at times, but one must fight fire with fire. Any true sportsman that "ABHORS" the NRA, has a wire crossed somewhere. They are the only group that truely has the sportsmans back. In these days of Antifa and rogue judges, not to mention the warped mindset of the Democratic party, they are a beacon of light in a seriously foggy landscape. The Nazi's started out by confiscating the populaces guns. The Bolshavics, the same thing. Our forefathers were smart enough to know that one must be armed to stand up to a rogue goverment. You had better read your history and look in the mirror, i will not defend anybody that stands for oppression!


diesel - I believe that we need major changes to gun control not related to self defense, but related to reducing the senseless shootings that have become a plague in this "modern" country. Up to now, NRA has had enough control to stop that notion in its tracks. Always promoting more guns as a solution. I am in favor of self defense and of guns for fun and sport. And I have not seen any proposals from anyone that would eliminate that. The fear that you hold dear to is a scam reinforced by the NRA. We all get the calls from NRA telling us we are about to have our guns taken. Some of us recognize the conflict of interest and ignore it. Some bite hook line and sinker on that fear. And the next time you think you are enabled to overthrow a "rogue" government, I want you to review the capabilities of our attack drones, our gunships, our military ground attack weaponry, and our overhead surveillance capabilities and evaluate your potential to do that.


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## miked913 (Feb 29, 2008)

I work with 2 people who have been car jacked at gun point in the past year. One was in his own driveway getting his mail, the other once they figured out they couldn't drive his standard shift made him drive them to an ATM. Neither are the same people anymore, both just living their lives and while they're both glad to be alive both different people now. I thought I wouldn't want this to happen to anyone else but now I guess it's be ok if it happened to someone else.....

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk


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## TheKing (Apr 15, 2004)

miked913 said:


> I work with 2 people who have been car jacked at gun point in the past year. One was in his own driveway getting his mail, the other once they figured out they couldn't drive his standard shift made him drive them to an ATM. Neither are the same people anymore, both just living their lives and while they're both glad to be alive both different people now. I thought I wouldn't want this to happen to anyone else but now I guess it's be ok if it happened to someone else.....
> 
> Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk


miked913 - I grew up in a poverty stricken neighborhood in Washington D.C. Held and robbed at gun point and knife point a number of times, myself, brothers, and neighbor friends beaten by gangs, mom was kidnapped at gun point for a bank robbery. I was a kid - it was taken as normal - we lived with it. Dad figured it out - just get the hell out of there. We CAN work on maintaining self defense, gun sports, AND deal with the social problem which is much much worse than when I was a kid.


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## Specwar (Sep 22, 2014)

Let's all understand one thing here whether it's NRA created or not, there is absolutely NO WAY, NONE, ZERO , chance that the government could force you to give up your firearms!! They may be able to further tighten requirements to purchase going forward , but making you give them up is absolutely BUll$hit!!! If anyone truly believes that they could, I have some oceanfront property in Tuscarawas County I would like to sell you !!


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## joebertin (Mar 26, 2010)

If you think objectively about the subject, you will come to the conclusion that firearms have made "civil" society possible. 

You'll also come to the conclusion that firearms are misused, as are other inanimate tools and objects. 

People who fear firearms are irrational. Their fear is misplaced.

Firearms have no desires, or agendas... people do.


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## TheKing (Apr 15, 2004)

Specwar said:


> Let's all understand one thing here whether it's NRA created or not, there is absolutely NO WAY, NONE, ZERO , chance that the government could force you to give up your firearms!! They may be able to further tighten requirements to purchase going forward , but making you give them up is absolutely BUll$hit!!! If anyone truly believes that they could, I have some oceanfront property in Tuscarawas County I would like to sell you !!


Australia was incredibly successful with their buy back programs. They paid replacement value and dropped murder suicide by 57 percent. http://time.com/4172274/what-its-like-to-own-guns-in-a-country-with-strict-gun-control/


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## miked913 (Feb 29, 2008)

Strict gun rules has really work well for Chicago too. 

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk


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## TheKing (Apr 15, 2004)

joebertin said:


> If you think objectively about the subject, you will come to the conclusion that firearms have made "civil" society possible.
> 
> You'll also come to the conclusion that firearms are misused, as are other inanimate tools and objects.
> 
> ...


Joe - I like it. But I take issue with one item. I think that most owners and operators fear firearms. I have a healthy fear of them and so do my kids. Some owners are rational, and we have a big social problem with the ones that are irrational.


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## Specwar (Sep 22, 2014)

So we have migrated from forced giving up to buying back? I agree many may voluntarily surrender unwanted firearms, but to rid the country of firearms is a ridiculous thought.


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## ress (Jan 1, 2008)

I'am not a gun owner. Used to have a 12 gauge. Have no problem with anyone having guns no matter how many. The thing that gripes me is the NRA buying politicians.


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## TheKing (Apr 15, 2004)

miked913 said:


> Strict gun rules has really work well for Chicago too.
> 
> Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk


Gotta back up rethink it and keep trying.


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## bruce (Feb 10, 2007)

Specwar look at his handle. The King. Take tax payer moneys to buy tax payer guns. Smart guy


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## Specwar (Sep 22, 2014)

I'm not going there.


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## bruce (Feb 10, 2007)

Rule no 1 win.


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## TheKing (Apr 15, 2004)

bruce said:


> Rule no 1 win.


Bruce - you seem to have a position that we are all supposed to hold. Mind tellin' me what it is?


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## STRONGPERSUADER (Nov 5, 2006)

ress said:


> I'am not a gun owner. Used to have a 12 gauge. Have no problem with anyone having guns no matter how many. The thing that gripes me is the NRA buying politicians.


I think it’s more like the politicians buying the NRA. It’s all about votes and there are a lot of us pro gun voters who are NRA members.... 
Using Australia as an example just doesn’t cut it. A buy back program here just wouldn’t work. I remember yrs ago when FLA passed CC. Crime dropped dramatically. I hate to sound cliche’ but guns don’t kill people and we know the rest. But this thread should be closed before one of us says what is really on their mind and what should be done about the guns and people connection, high crime and so on. I can smell it coming. Just sayin. A great original post though.


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## bobk (Apr 30, 2004)

Indeed the original post was good. Too bad some are so self centered and disrespectful that they have to ruin the topic.


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## TheKing (Apr 15, 2004)

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> I think it’s more like the politicians buying the NRA. It’s all about votes and there are a lot of us pro gun voters who are NRA members....
> Using Australia as an example just doesn’t cut it. A buy back program here just wouldn’t work. I remember yrs ago when FLA passed CC. Crime dropped dramatically. I hate to sound cliche’ but guns don’t kill people and we know the rest. But this thread should be closed before one of us says what is really on their mind and what should be done about the guns and people connection, high crime and so on. I can smell it coming. Just sayin. A great original post though.


People with guns kill people is the only fact? Say what is REALLY on your mind STRONGPUSUADER, or shall we just guess at what is really is on everyone else's mind. I am fine with that.


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## TheKing (Apr 15, 2004)

bobk said:


> Indeed the original post was good. Too bad some are so self centered and disrespectful that they have to ruin the topic.


Whilst searching my favorite hunting and fishing websites, I saw this post that was teaching everyone the ins and outs of killing another human. And you liked it?


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## STRONGPERSUADER (Nov 5, 2006)

TheKing said:


> People with guns kill people is the only fact? Say what is REALLY on your mind STRONGPUSUADER, or shall we just guess at what is really is on everyone else's mind. I am fine with that.


Well King I’ll leave that to your imagination but I believe you’re smart enough to already know. Besides you would just get a lot of opinions you probably wouldn’t like I’m sure. But hey no harm no foul.


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## bruce (Feb 10, 2007)

No, I do not like it but if it needs to be I will without hesitation!


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## Earthworms (Dec 15, 2014)

Popcorn anyone?


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## bobk (Apr 30, 2004)

Earthworms said:


> Popcorn anyone?


 Lol


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## $diesel$ (Aug 3, 2018)

TheKing said:


> diesel - I believe that we need major changes to gun control not related to self defense, but related to reducing the senseless shootings that have become a plague in this "modern" country. Up to now, NRA has had enough control to stop that notion in its tracks. Always promoting more guns as a solution. I am in favor of self defense and of guns for fun and sport. And I have not seen any proposals from anyone that would eliminate that. The fear that you hold dear to is a scam reinforced by the NRA. We all get the calls from NRA telling us we are about to have our guns taken. Some of us recognize the conflict of interest and ignore it. Some bite hook line and sinker on that fear. And the next time you think you are enabled to overthrow a "rogue" government, I want you to review the capabilities of our attack drones, our gunships, our military ground attack weaponry, and our overhead surveillance capabilities and evaluate your potential to do that.


King, i am truely sorry for your onerous up-bringing. Perhaps i did jump the gun(so to speak..lol) I never had to deal with what you did. I grew up in a small town in the 60's, never had to face these iniquities.
But i am an old man now. The things i see on t.v. and read in the papers make me sick.
I will suprise you by telling you that i am a registered Democrat, but i can no longer accept the crowd that has hijacked my party.
They are strictly obstructionist and care not for the average joes that pay their wages.
My take is, if you give an inch, they'll take a yard. Right now they are working toward a national registry of guns and gun owners, JUST LIKE THE NAZI'S DID!!!!!
With that in hand, they can forcefully remove EVERY gun.....all of them. And make no mistake, our military members will NEVER stand against us, our sons and daughters and other relitives being part of that military.
I can not give up my weapons, if nothing else, they make me feel like i can fight back against the wealthy east and west coasters who are driving this agenda out of fear for "US".
And with that, the NRA is one of the few national organizations that believe as i do.
I have been a member for 40 years and will continue to be and try to convert any nonbeliever!


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## Muddy (May 7, 2017)

Well the fact of the matter is that CCW holders are one of the safest demographic groups in the United States. We are all just people who want to live our lives, be productive members of this nation, and protect our own. We believe in being vigilante and beating the threat. That’s about it.


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## glasseyes (Jan 28, 2012)

I admit I haven't read the last page and a half but , anybody here that thinks stronger gun control laws is the answer to the mass shootings and crazies out there shooting people are off their rocker.
I've been an NRA member for years and intend to stay one as long as I feel necessary. Gun control laws solve absolutely nothing besides constricting the honest law abiding citizen.


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## Slatebar (Apr 9, 2011)

bobk said:


> You felt the need to derail the thread? Hey, at least you admit to breaking the TOS. I wish the mods would just nuke your derailing posts but it will get locked instead. It seems to be the game played here now. If you don't like the thread derail it and then it will be locked. I rather see the people that do such things derailed for a while.


Well said....


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## bruce (Feb 10, 2007)

I am a lifetime member of the NRA and will be til the day I die. I will always support our 2nd amendment rights. History has a cruel way of repeating itself, take a look around of what's going on......


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## 9Left (Jun 23, 2012)

... are all the mods on vacation or something? LOL


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## Slatebar (Apr 9, 2011)

$diesel$ said:


> With that in hand, they can forcefully remove EVERY gun.....all of them. And make no mistake, our military members will NEVER stand against us, our sons and daughters and other relitives being part of that military.
> !


 I wouldn't bet on that .... Google _survey that Lt. Cmd. Ernest Guy Cunningham gave on May 10, 1994 at 29 Palms Naval Base . Question 46.. Over 25% said they would..._


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## Saugeye Tom (Oct 6, 2010)

TheKing said:


> Joe - I like it. But I take issue with one item. I think that most owners and operators fear firearms. I have a healthy fear of them and so do my kids. Some owners are rational, and we have a big social problem with the ones that are irrational.


No fear...just respect


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## Saugeye Tom (Oct 6, 2010)

TheKing said:


> People with guns kill people is the only fact? Say what is REALLY on your mind STRONGPUSUADER, or shall we just guess at what is really is on everyone else's mind. I am fine with that.


People with knives kill people....people with clubs kill people people with guns kill people......but if you lay a gun a knife and a club next to each other...without a human in the room...THEY DON'T KILL PEOPLE


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## Saugeye Tom (Oct 6, 2010)

9 left...this is a good thread......no mods needed


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Rule#15:
Pick a style of carry that is comfortable and a holster that is comfortable as well and practice drawing your weapon in carry mode.
Carrying in an uncomfortable manor makes one not want to carry at all.


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## undertaker (Jan 20, 2013)

Great original post


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## Ruminator (Apr 6, 2004)

The King, i believe you made a mistake in reading the first post.
Everything stated in it by the OP was not how to better kill another human as you've stated a couple times; it was rather all about how to stay alive yourself by doing things that improve your chances.

I didn't see statements like- shoot first, or aim for this or that body part. Those would be statements about how to better kill another human.
Someone has said that American guns can never be taken. The short answer to that is- wrong.
The cleanest and simplest way to accomplish the complete removal of them just hasn't quite fully developed yet, but it could be close.

I have thought of two ways that can be employed, one already exists; the other will likely soon also. These methods do not necessarily create a revolutionary response, but rather likely avoids it.
By my reckoning we are likely just one generation away. Think about how much resolve the Millennial generation has for this, and how much less their children as adults will have.
How soon will we see a National card of some sort that can be used across the social spectrum beyond the driver's license (since not all have them).

I believe they desire a revolution to be avoided, at least still at this point.
Taking on each citizen singly by themselves gives a simple means of more successfully utilizing coercion, less bloodshed and an eventual 100% success.
[- think of the frog in the pot and slowly turning up the heat, one generation after another]

On the other hand, now with our high schools and colleges now graduating young adults who believe Marxism, or some form of socialism to be the best form of gov't for America; and politicians beginning to win their races running as a socialist, how long will it be until a revolution is also acceptable to them?
Is our society being conditioned to not be so repulsed by blood and gore by movies and TV?

Thoughts to ponder...


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## WETSHIRT (Jun 29, 2012)

bobk said:


> Indeed the original post was good. Too bad some are so self centered and disrespectful that they have to ruin the topic.


I don't know if you are referring to my post, But I wasn't trying to derail anything. I took Umbridge at a post I found irrational and expressed my view as many on here do.


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## joebertin (Mar 26, 2010)

TheKing said:


> Joe - I like it. But I take issue with one item. I think that most owners and operators fear firearms. I have a healthy fear of them and so do my kids. Some owners are rational, and we have a big social problem with the ones that are irrational.


A big Amen to the social problems (sadly).

I share the sentiment, and would use a different word than fear, which would be respect. I respect the potential for damage with firearms, vehicles, kitchen utensils, shop tools... the list is pretty much endless. 

I have a nine year old grandson that I've been shooting with for the last several years. The first order of business was to teach him the absolute lethality of firearms, and the necessity of adult supervision with firearms until he is 18. 

The same principles applied when I taught him to use a drill press and scroll saw. 

Of course, I still watch him like a hawk at the range and in the shop... as I do with my adult friends.

Really love the grandpa gig...


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## joebertin (Mar 26, 2010)

$diesel$ said:


> King, i am truely sorry for your onerous up-bringing. Perhaps i did jump the gun(so to speak..lol) I never had to deal with what you did. I grew up in a small town in the 60's, never had to face these iniquities.
> But i am an old man now. The things i see on t.v. and read in the papers make me sick.
> I will suprise you by telling you that i am a registered Democrat, but i can no longer accept the crowd that has hijacked my party.
> They are strictly obstructionist and care not for the average joes that pay their wages.
> ...




Very satisfying to see someone acknowledge the demise of their own party.

The Republicans have been hijacked as well. Both parties have been co-opted by the globalists.

If you follow the news, it's obvious that we are no longer ruled by elected politicians, but by bureaucrats that remain in position from administration to administration. 

Today, elected officials fear the bureaucrats more than disappointed voters.

The bureaucrats fear no one...


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## bobk (Apr 30, 2004)

WETSHIRT said:


> I don't know if you are referring to my post, But I wasn't trying to derail anything. I took Umbridge at a post I found irrational and expressed my view as many on here do.


No, I wasn’t referring to your post at all. Sorry about the confusion.


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## TheKing (Apr 15, 2004)

Ruminator said:


> The King, i believe you made a mistake in reading the first post.
> Everything stated in it by the OP was not how to better kill another human as you've stated a couple times; it was rather all about how to stay alive yourself by doing things that improve your chances.
> 
> I didn't see statements like- shoot first, or aim for this or that body part. Those would be statements about how to better kill another human.
> ...


Yes very interesting thoughts and some of your forecast is likely I agree. I can view the OP statements both ways as you presented. It's not an outdoors-man sportsman kind of thing for me though.


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## Phish_4_Bass (Sep 18, 2008)

3. Cops carry guns to protect themselves, not you.

Love it.
The first time I got pulled over with my CCW the cop asked why I carried. I told him it was for the same reason he did, to protect myself.


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## Lewis (Apr 5, 2004)

This guy nails it!!!


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## Row v. Wade (Apr 27, 2004)

I carry a gun because a cops too heavy.


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## Shortdrift (Apr 5, 2004)

Lewis said:


> This guy nails it!!!


100% correct.


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## Skippy (Dec 2, 2009)

Very good Lewis. EVERYONE should take the time to watch that video.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Rule #16:
If you pocket carry...still use a holster. Preferably one that is closed on the bbl end and also covers the trigger. And don't have anything else(car keys, change etc) in that pocket.

The holster helps to keep all the pocket lent/debris out of your CCW.


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## TheKing (Apr 15, 2004)

Lewis said:


> This guy nails it!!!


He certainly makes some good points about things that seem to be different. For sure the solution needs to address more than gun control. Not a great choice for reference though, this is an NRA paid spokesman. So the conflict of interest tells me to take his talk overall as not credible. It is also very important to listen to the ones who are affected and living in this mess. 
https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics...s-parkland-shooting-cnn-town-hall-gun-debate/


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## STRONGPERSUADER (Nov 5, 2006)

This pretty much sums it up. Solutions really aren’t rocket science. 
King - take note on Australia’s findings. 

https://www.heritage.org/crime-and-justice/commentary/here-are-8-stubborn-facts-gun-violence-america


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## TheKing (Apr 15, 2004)

Earthworms said:


> Popcorn anyone?


More popcorn ? 

bobk - That pairs very well with popcorn.


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## TheKing (Apr 15, 2004)

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> This pretty much sums it up. Solutions really aren’t rocket science.
> King - take note on Australia’s findings.
> 
> https://www.heritage.org/crime-and-justice/commentary/here-are-8-stubborn-facts-gun-violence-america


STRONGPURSUADER - Sources are an important part of information (intel) assessment. Here is the political extremity of your source.
https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/heritage-foundation/

And here is one from right of center media outlet Fortune Magazine.
http://fortune.com/2018/02/20/australia-gun-control-success/


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## STRONGPERSUADER (Nov 5, 2006)

Who died and put “media biased fact check” in charge? Im thinking media biased is biased. Lol. Of course Heritage is biased as most of us who are for gun rights. That doesn’t turn facts into lies. The leftist anti-gun movement doesn’t want to talk about the elephant in the room, instead they point fingers elsewhere. From what I see people are getting tired of having the truth swept under the carpet. If you want to take guns away, maybe take them away from the criminals. Maybe that’s what the extreme left should do, devise a plan, put all that effort towards getting the guns out of the criminals hands. Go forward with that. We promise we won’t scream, yell, point fingers and tell them that the criminals have the right to have guns also, nor would we protest to stop them from doin so... because they’re not taking mine. Just so you know, our constitution, our freedoms, freedom of speech is a good thing, it’s nice that you can freely express your opinion in our great country. Guns played a huge role in that.


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## $diesel$ (Aug 3, 2018)

TheKing said:


> STRONGPURSUADER - Sources are an important part of information (intel) assessment. Here is the political extremity of your source.
> https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/heritage-foundation/
> 
> And here is one from right of center media outlet Fortune Magazine.
> http://fortune.com/2018/02/20/australia-gun-control-success/


King, i'm guessing you are a young fella. Your as guilty as the next for your biases. In your opinion, i'm supposed to take the rantings of an emotional 15-16 year old over a senator? Your as quick to jump on the anti-gun bandwagon as i am to jump toward my side.
You started out with a legitimite bitch, but like most of the left, you can't keep your true feelings from bleeding through.
I side with the Constitution of the the United States of America. Again sir, you need to look in the mirror. People like YOU are the reason i'm an NRA member. 
You can't leave this post alone because you live for stuff like this. As i said, offer an inch and you folks take a mile.


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## TheKing (Apr 15, 2004)

$diesel$ said:


> King, i'm guessing you are a young fella. Your as guilty as the next for your biases. In your opinion, i'm supposed to take the rantings of an emotional 15-16 year old over a senator? Your as quick to jump on the anti-gun bandwagon as i am to jump toward my side.
> You started out with a legitimite bitch, but like most of the left, you can't keep your true feelings from bleeding through.
> I side with the Constitution of the the United States of America. Again sir, you need to look in the mirror. People like YOU are the reason i'm an NRA member.
> You can't leave this post alone because you live for stuff like this. As i said, offer an inch and you folks take a mile.


diesel - I am young by some standards... just 61 years old, retired, handicapped by a stroke 3 years ago. I did not lead this to a gun control debate. I followed Lewis's lead. I sense a great group of level heads that can discuss. And I appreciate your open and honest dialogue.

As one that lived in the middle of this **** until 14 years old, I think the kids deserve a say...


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## Slatebar (Apr 9, 2011)

There is an easy solution to the whole gun control situation. Enforce the laws we already have on the books. If you own a firearm and commit a crime with it you go to jail, you do not pass go, you do not collect $200.00, You go to jail, and you go to jail for the max time for that crime. No more plea bargains, no more paroles, No matter how hard a childhood you had, you go to jail...


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## TheKing (Apr 15, 2004)

fastwater said:


> Rule #16:
> If you pocket carry...still use a holster. Preferably one that is closed on the bbl end and also covers the trigger. And don't have anything else(car keys, change etc) in that pocket.
> 
> The holster helps to keep all the pocket lent/debris out of your CCW.


Proposed amendment to rules - Carry a gunshot wound first aid kit on the opposite shoulder harness. Choose a thin flexible/comfortable profiled package that stays sanitary. It's only needed some of the time...when you accidentally shoot yourself, or someone else. Leads to another amendment though.


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## TheKing (Apr 15, 2004)

Slatebar said:


> There is an easy solution to the whole gun control situation. Enforce the laws we already have on the books. If you own a firearm and commit a crime with it you go to jail, you do not pass go, you do not collect $200.00, You go to jail, and you go to jail for the max time for that crime. No more plea bargains, no more paroles, No matter how hard a childhood you had, you go to jail...


When it's a kid, I put blame on the parent/guardian.


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## STRONGPERSUADER (Nov 5, 2006)

Haha, he justs keeps on stirring. Hey, it’s your right just as much as the next guys to say whatever you like. Is everyone sure the mods aren’t on vacation? Lol.


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## TheKing (Apr 15, 2004)

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Haha, he justs keeps on stirring. Hey, it’s your right just as much as the next guys to say whatever you like. Is everyone sure the mods aren’t on vacation? Lol.


No we're not sure. But ruminator and lewis are here. Can you say which part you would moderate and why?


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## TheKing (Apr 15, 2004)

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> Who died and put “media biased fact check” in charge? Im thinking media biased is biased. Lol. Of course Heritage is biased as most of us who are for gun rights. That doesn’t turn facts into lies. The leftist anti-gun movement doesn’t want to talk about the elephant in the room, instead they point fingers elsewhere. From what I see people are getting tired of having the truth swept under the carpet. If you want to take guns away, maybe take them away from the criminals. Maybe that’s what the extreme left should do, devise a plan, put all that effort towards getting the guns out of the criminals hands. Go forward with that. We promise we won’t scream, yell, point fingers and tell them that the criminals have the right to have guns also, nor would we protest to stop them from doin so... because they’re not taking mine. Just so you know, our constitution, our freedoms, freedom of speech is a good thing, it’s nice that you can freely express your opinion in our great country. Guns played a huge role in that.



We gotta go forward somehow STRONGPURSUADER. Good points except bias check web site is on target if you know source checking. And there is no anti gun movement. Realize that we are we - not so darn different. Wanting the same result. You me and the next person.


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## G.lock (Apr 1, 2014)

I'm amazed that this continuous trolling has been allowed to go on this long!!


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Rule# 17
Aim center mass and only shoot until the threat is neutralized.


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## miked913 (Feb 29, 2008)

I'm going to bed tonight in anticipation of taking my semiautomatic shotgun out to shoot a deer in the morning while wearing my 9mm on my belt. I can do this because this is American the greatest place on Earth no matter what some punk a$$ kids from Florida or California think or some DB on the OGF! Good luck everyone who live their lives in the outdoors providing for your families the way GOD and the Constitution meant it!

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk


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## Saugeye Tom (Oct 6, 2010)

G.lock said:


> I'm amazed that this continuous trolling has been allowed to go on this long!!


It can only be trolled if we acknowledge


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Saugeye Tom said:


> It can only be trolled if we acknowledge


^^^Absolutely^^^

Rule # 18
A woman's purse is NOT a good place for her to carry her CCW.
To many purse snatching occur out on the street.


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## Wow (May 17, 2010)

Common sense can prevail when extremist views are marginalized and good sense is common. 
thank you OGF, for your restraint.--Tim


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## Ruminator (Apr 6, 2004)

Being able to disagree on an important subject without belittling anyone or name calling is a big part of what has allowed this thread to remain open.


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## TheKing (Apr 15, 2004)

miked913 said:


> I'm going to bed tonight in anticipation of taking my semiautomatic shotgun out to shoot a deer in the morning while wearing my 9mm on my belt. I can do this because this is American the greatest place on Earth no matter what some punk a$$ kids from Florida or California think or some DB on the OGF! Good luck everyone who live their lives in the outdoors providing for your families the way GOD and the Constitution meant it!
> 
> Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk


miked913 - Good luck and be safe ! Be aware of the new rule - that does can't be taken on public land.


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## Garyoutlaw77 (Feb 3, 2005)

Thanks for the topic John - I will be buying a weapon to protect my person & family shortly.
Surrendering your arms to bury your head in the sand hoping that the bad man doesn't also have a sexual appetite for your delicate liberal hiney is no way to live


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## loweman165 (May 15, 2015)

I was always fond of the rule: " Shoot your assailant to the ground".


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## $diesel$ (Aug 3, 2018)

I am 62 and retired also. The conversation helps all to get a little off of our chest.
I am sorry for your stroke, hope you do better.


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## TheKing (Apr 15, 2004)

$diesel$ said:


> I am 62 and retired also. The conversation helps all to get a little off of our chest.
> I am sorry for your stroke, hope you do better.


I agree. It is an important subject and sometimes hard to find middle ground because of so many assumptions. Thank you for the kind thoughts


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## STRONGPERSUADER (Nov 5, 2006)

TheKing said:


> We gotta go forward somehow STRONGPURSUADER. Good points except bias check web site is on target if you know source checking. And there is no anti gun movement. Realize that we are we - not so darn different. Wanting the same result. You me and the next person.


I’m pretty much staying where I’m at King. I’m staunch and firm with my views is all. I by no means wasn’t insinuating that you are a extreme leftest. I don’t think you would be on this site if that were the case. Those groups tend to be against everything that outdoor sportsmen enjoy. If you thought so I apologize. Actually we can all probably move forward just by realizing that how posting in a forum can be like texting, it isn’t very “personable” and statements can be easily taken different ways especially if you don’t know the person.


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## TheKing (Apr 15, 2004)

STRONGPERSUADER said:


> I’m pretty much staying where I’m at King. I’m staunch and firm with my views is all. I by no means wasn’t insinuating that you are a extreme leftest. I don’t think you would be on this site if that were the case. Those groups tend to be against everything that outdoor sportsmen enjoy. If you thought so I apologize. Actually we can all probably move forward just by realizing that how posting in a forum can be like texting, it isn’t very “personable” and statements can be easily taken different ways especially if you don’t know the person.


No apology needed - I didn't read it as if you had labeled me personally. I know what you mean about reading texts and blogs. It's pretty cool to have a site like this. We share the fun and interest in the great outdoors. And on your views I say "stick to your guns" friend (pun intended).


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## Deadeyedeek (Feb 12, 2014)

TheKing said:


> No apology needed - I didn't read it as if you had labeled me personally. I know what you mean about reading texts and blogs. It's pretty cool to have a site like this. We share the fun and interest in the great outdoors. And on your views I say "stick to your guns" friend (pun intended).


King, been following posts and noticed you slid towards te middle..Thank you..we all had different experiaces in life that make us think the way we do..we can all agree to disagree and be constuctive in coversation! We all have to respect each others views..and NOT to make it personal...Have a great Christmas..DD


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

fastwater said:


> ^^^Exactly right!^^^
> Where did all that come from???
> Please explain what your positive or negative views of the NRA has to do with this thread?
> 
> ...


well said sweetwater. I don't belong to the NRA but in all honesty every person that believes in owning guns or owns them should think about what they do for all gun owners.

I don't carry because I have depression and ptsd so the state saw fit to deny me the right. I still own guns but don't plan to ever use them unless someone threatens me or my family with bodily harm. as much as I deplore the thieves that broke into my pole barn and cleaned it out, I wouldnt even think about shooting them. now if I caught them in the act I would call the cops and prosecute to the fullest extent of the law. I don't own anything worth taking a human life.
sherman


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

sherman51 said:


> well said sweetwater. I don't belong to the NRA but in all honesty every person that believes in owning guns or owns them should think about what they do for all gun owners.
> 
> I don't carry because I have depression and ptsd so the state saw fit to deny me the right. *I still own guns but don't plan to ever use them unless someone threatens me or my family with bodily harm. *as much as I deplore the thieves that broke into my pole barn and cleaned it out, I wouldnt even think about shooting them. now if I caught them in the act I would call the cops and prosecute to the fullest extent of the law. *I don't own anything worth taking a human life.*
> sherman


Uncle Sherm...None of us own anything materialistic that's worth taking a life for.
The above has become rule #19 
And your post is some very good advice for us all to follow.


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## STRONGPERSUADER (Nov 5, 2006)

sherman51 said:


> well said sweetwater. I don't belong to the NRA but in all honesty every person that believes in owning guns or owns them should think about what they do for all gun owners.
> 
> I don't carry because I have depression and ptsd so the state saw fit to deny me the right. I still own guns but don't plan to ever use them unless someone threatens me or my family with bodily harm. as much as I deplore the thieves that broke into my pole barn and cleaned it out, I wouldnt even think about shooting them. now if I caught them in the act I would call the cops and prosecute to the fullest extent of the law. I don't own anything worth taking a human life.
> sherman


Well put Sherman, unfortunately we probably wouldn’t know their intentions at the time of the crime. I wouldn’t want to catch them in the act while I’m unarmed that’s for sure. Same holds true if I didn’t catch them in the act of anything when they shouldn’t be there at all. Better to have a gun vand not need it than to need it and not have it. That situation could go 100 different ways.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

^^^Very true SP.
Like TheKing and many here, I too have witnessed firsthand the senseless cruelty some twisted humans are capable of doing to innocent people.
Rule # 20
Always be alert...and prepared.


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

fastwater said:


> ^^^Very true SP.
> Like TheKing and many here, I too have witnessed firsthand the senseless cruelty some twisted humans are capable of doing to innocent people.
> Rule # 20
> Always be alert...and prepared.


to darn many rules to keep track. just shoot them all and let god sort them out, just kidding. I am 67 now and only had one occasion where I thought I might have to use my 41 magnum desert eagle. but cool heads prevailed. and the threat went away. I even have compassion for the deer I shoot. I wouldnt want to have to live with shooting someone if there was any other option. but never take caution for cowardice. I would shoot to save me or my family. and in certain situation I would shoot to save lives of others. and I will never shoot to wound the attacker.
sherman


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

sherman51 said:


> to darn many rules to keep track.* just shoot them all and let god sort them out,* *just kidding*. I am 67 now and only had one occasion where I thought I might have to use my 41 magnum desert eagle. but cool heads prevailed. and the threat went away. I even have compassion for the deer I shoot. I wouldnt want to have to live with shooting someone if there was any other option. but never take caution for cowardice. I would shoot to save me or my family. and in certain situation I would shoot to save lives of others. and I will never shoot to wound the attacker.
> sherman


Lol!
Rule # 21
Following the above emboldened part of uncle Sherms advice he jokingly gave will most likely get you a lifetime stay at your nearest grey barred motel.
Amenities of this lifetime stay will include, three hots, a cot and of course your very own boyfriend(whether you want him or not).


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## $diesel$ (Aug 3, 2018)

Maybe this article can help anti-gunners understand what i'm talking about.

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/...t-gun-ban-allows-government-to-dominate-them/


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## sherman51 (Apr 12, 2011)

fastwater said:


> Lol!
> Rule # 21
> Following the above emboldened part of uncle Sherms advice he jokingly gave will most likely get you a lifetime stay at your nearest grey barred motel.
> Amenities of this lifetime stay will include, three hots, a cot and of course your very own boyfriend(whether you want him or not).


haven't seen bubba for some time now. does one hand still wash the other? LOL!
sherman


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## glasseyes (Jan 28, 2012)

$diesel$ said:


> Maybe this article can help anti-gunners understand what i'm talking about.
> 
> https://www.breitbart.com/politics/...t-gun-ban-allows-government-to-dominate-them/


This is exactly why the second amendment is in place.


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## fastwater (Apr 1, 2014)

Quote from above article:
Venezuelans didn’t care enough about it. The idea of having the means to protect your home was seen as only needed out in the fields. *People never would have believed they needed to defend themselves against the government.* Venezuelans evolved to always hope that our government would be non-tyrannical, non-violator of human rights, and would always have a good enough control of criminality.

Mindset sounds soooo very familiar doesn't it???
Rule# 22
NEVER say 'never'!!!


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## $diesel$ (Aug 3, 2018)

Thats the point i want to make, guys, glad you understand. If we could only get more folks to see the danger that lies in front of them.

*GOD BLESS AMERICA!!!*


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## russelld (Jun 10, 2013)

If politicians could work it out like king and strong maybe wecould fix some other stuff don’t back down but be levelheaded


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## glasseyes (Jan 28, 2012)

russelld said:


> If politicians could work it out like king and strong maybe wecould fix some other stuff don’t back down but be levelheaded


 That's asking a lot, lol they just did a partial shut down of fed. Government cause the dems won't give in on money for wall


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## threeten (Feb 5, 2014)

Specwar said:


> "Oh Lord, may my aim be straight and true,and if today truly is the day you have chosen to call me home, may I die in a pile of brass ."
> 
> PS- "caution", my barrel will be hot when you pry it from my dead hands.


I just keep going back to this. Love it!!
Thanks Specwar. Great thread


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## Mickey (Oct 22, 2011)

How about explaining your use of the term "King"? I'm just curious since we don't have them in our country.


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## ress (Jan 1, 2008)

?


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## Saugeyefisher (Jul 19, 2010)

.


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## Evinrude58 (Apr 13, 2011)

I would bet that King refers to the OGF member TheKing who has made several comments on this thread.


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## ress (Jan 1, 2008)

Evinrude58 said:


> I would bet that King refers to the OGF member TheKing who has made several comments on this thread.


I'am sure that is the motive of the post.


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