# opening day...and sunday



## saugeyeslayer (Jul 6, 2004)

hunted at my favorite urban area near my house and sat in a permanent platform stand for 3 hours. shot at a doe, she jumped. it began to pour. went home. NEXT DAY: had deer all around me, shot at a sixmonth old for some odd reason, somehow, i managed to miss that too. then they came running back about an hour later, and nailed him(button buck) right in the vitals. problem is, he was quartering toward me, so what looked like the "vitals" to me was mearly a pass through liver shot. (looked like an excellent shot from my prospective) arrow went through, and was covered from broadhead to nock in chunks of liver and other organs. deer ran and meandered through the small woodlot and bedded down. came upon him bedded in bush honey suckle and spicebush(thick and stubborn) at around 9:00pm and he gets up and takes off....bummer . went back next morning. NOT TO BE FOUND!!! well i hope somthing is using him for food. i felt like crap all night. i am indeed a bambi killer.(that wasnt the first time)  thank goodness its early, so far ive had some close calls. BTW, i used my grunt tube just for kicks, and i had dear sprinting in to examine. then i blew my fawn in distress call, and mama doe comes running in real confused looking. anyways, good luck all!
Be safe.


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## Fishstix (Aug 16, 2005)

Despite missing two deer, I would say you had a great first weekend! You saw a bunch of deer and also saw some things that people normally don't see.

Good Luck during the rest of the season!


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## Papascott (Apr 22, 2004)

Saugeyeslayer, not meaning to sound like a jerk but do you practice shooting? If I made 3 bad shots in a row with my bow I would be in the back yard with a target set up instead of telling others how you missed 2 and made a lethal but unrecoverable shot on another.

I have made bad shots too and I that is going to happen, but 3 bad shots in a row is definitly a sign that somthing is not right, be it broadhead flight diff that your field points or sights are off, or more practice is needed.
Scott


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## Guest (Oct 4, 2006)

To shoot at a deer quartering toward you is about the worst shot you can get on a deer. Its Very unethical. I have taken this shot before, but luckily I missed the deer completly. Please reconsider your shot placement and get in some practice before you get back in the stand.


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## M.Magis (Apr 5, 2004)

> To shoot at a deer quartering toward you is about the worst shot you can get on a deer. Its Very unethical


It's not unethical (I hate that word  ) to someone who can make the shot. The vitals are still exposed, but one has to understand where to aim and be able to make the shot. Obviously in this case, it was a very poor choice by someone who doesn't understand deer anotomy. Rarely is it a shot that should be taken, but to call it unethical is not always right either.


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## Guest (Oct 4, 2006)

I guess unethical is a bad word to use for it, but it definatly should not be taken if you dont know what your doing.


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## jiggin'fool (Dec 18, 2005)

yeah you definately have to think about where your arrow is coming out instead of where it is going in! quartering to you isn't a bad shot if you put it in front of the shoulder into the chest... you could get both lungs or the heart... not a bad shot just bad placement! Ive shot deer and not found them with my bow as well made me so sick I went out and bought a target(I was at camp) and shot until I was satisfied that it was just me that made the bad shot and not the bow!


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## saugeyeslayer (Jul 6, 2004)

wow fellas. im glad to see that im an unethical hunter, and a horrible shot with my bow. thanks for the kindness, how do you know i dont practice each afternoon vigorously to prepare for a weekends hunt? my bow and marksmanship is fine and things do happen when the time comes. not everything goes as planned.
several factors come into play while hunting for big game. a common happinstance called "buck fever" is an issues for most hunters, novice and vetrans alike. i am sad to say i have been hunting for almost 10 years. i am 16 now im asking you, does that mean i dont know what im doing. im probably just a hoodlum teenager right? do the math, i have been hunting since i was 8 thats a little over 8 years of hunting experience. some day i will be an angry older guy cutting down teenage hunters storys on how they made decieving "bad" shots. im sure all this critisizm makes you happy right?
i know the anatomy of a 90lb six month old deer. i know where to place a shot. the angle of entrance, related to the angle of exit caused my arrow to pass through a barely non-vital section of that deer. aiming for the chest would simply increase the chances of me missing, and knicking/ wounding the deer. it would take an amazing shot to place the arrow so that it could go *through* the sternum and puncture the heart or lungs. sure i could have sat there and let them get 5 feet away and pondered weather or not to shoot it where, but at that time, i felt that the angle i had was great. i didnt give the animal enough time to die. it was an accident. it happens. just because you go out first of the season and bag a 1 or 2 year old 6-8 pointer each year dosent mean you are a better more ethical hunter. i dont like the vibes i get from you when i try to relate my situations to other hunters. is there somthing graveley wrong i did by taking a quartering toward shot. after all, i probably havent even passed geometry right? wow. some of these comments are awfully degrading to a hunter who looks up to his elders. thanks, all this makes me feel better.

Sincerely,
Casey


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## ohiobuck (Apr 8, 2006)

Hay Casey dont get down on your self these kind of things will just make you a better Bow Hunter. Just get back out there next time you might kill the buck of a life time. And most of Them other guys are just trying to help. Good luck let us know how you do .


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## Guest (Oct 5, 2006)

WHOA hold on there killer. Nobody said that you was an unethical hunter and a horrible shot. It was simply stated that if you missed/wounded that many deer in that short amount of time then something is definatly wrong. I dont know if its you or your bow or what but as a responsible hunter it is your dutie to fix it. You at least owe that to the deer, if not yourself. Your right, $hit happens out there in the woods every once in a while. Maybe you jerk the shot or perhaps misjudge the distance. Most everyone on here has probably shot deer and not recovered them. I have done this myself. It is definatly a sickening feeling, but it also something that we can learn from. It seems like you keep doing the same thing however, and are not learning from your own mistakes. Hopefully you have shot your bow since then to make sure you are not off. 

One thing that can be prevented however is your shot placement. Its up to you if you pull that trigger or not. The deer you described was a quartering to you when you shot it. While it can definatly be lethal, I would never recomend this shot to anybody, amature or vetern. It is just way to risky and will probably result in a lost deer, just as you have found out. Give that deer 5 more minits and I could almost guarentee you it will give you a good broadside or quartering away shot. IF it doesnt give you a good, then just watch it walk on by for another day. I am no one to tell you what shots to take or not to take, just trying to save you another lost deer. HEck, jsut do a search on shot placement on google and I bet almost all of those sites will tell you a quartering to shot is a very poor shot placement with a bow.



I wish you good luck and hope you get some nice hits in the future.


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## CasualFisherman (May 21, 2004)

Don't beat yourself up to bad Saugeyeslayer. We have all been there. Mistakes are by far the best and most valuable learning experiences. ( We tend not to repeat them) Rest assured that it is better to learn from mistakes now while so young in your hunting tenure as that will pay much larger dividends than learning them later. This will result in you growing into a much better and more "ethical" hunter than most will ever achieve. No one becomes successful in this sport without making mistakes and you recognizing them as such, (even at 16) speaks volumes as to the hunter you will eventually become. So get back out there, learn from your mistakes, and encourage others.

As friendly advice,
Quartering forward shots- Horrible shots. Learing the patience to wait for the animal to pass for a quartering away shot is one of the hardest. Especially the larger the deer get. My experience like yours, resulted in me losing the buck of a lifetime.( I still beat myself up about it) Matter of fact, I was exactly your age. It was a quartering forward shot and it was with a muzzleloader not a bow. There is just two much that can go wrong with them with so much muscle and bone mass in the way. Needless to say, I learned my lesson and in the 11 years since, I have not lossed a single deer. I concede there are many deer killed every year with these shots and it helps fuel the delusion that it is a good shot but the recovery rate for such shots is much worse than broadside or quartering away.

Liver Shots- If you got it's liver, it no doubt is a recoverable deer. Livershot deer will not live long or travel very far before bedding down. Once you identify that it is a liver shot. Give the deer plenty of distance and time. Learn from this experience. A liver-shot deer normally beds down within a couple hundred yards but will potentially stay alive for hours. It will however bleed out and die. Your description seems to support this. Next time, I am sure you will recover your deer.

Support- Shooting at animals is not at all like shooting targets. Even the 3-d ones. A lot can happen from the time you release and the time the arrow impacts it's target(Hopefully a deer and not the ground or tree). Your account seems very familiar to me as every miss I made, the deer were alert and reacted to the bow release. When picking a target out of several, most choose the largest, I chose the dumbest  The one oblivious to your presence are the sure ones. (As they are not as likely to react) 

Good luck! 
Casual


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## fish4wall (Apr 14, 2004)

i found this and felt i should post it....
im a new bow hunter this year(i havent been out yet )
but i hope this helps..i thought it was good.
http://www.huntingnet.com/staticpages/staticpage_detail.aspx?id=8
thanks


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## saugeyeslayer (Jul 6, 2004)

yeah thanks fellas. i just was just angry at how the comments were seemingly critiquing my knowledge and know how. i know the quartering toward shot is possible yet risky to execute. but in my case, i was in a wood platform aprox. 8' above the ground, which IMO is right in a friggin deers line of sight. some other doofball trespasser built it so i sat in it to remove the misquito threat. this means, the deer walking almost directly at me would have noticed me there in a matter of seconds, resulting in all the animals in the forest scattering to the warning snorts(blows) of a distressed deer. so i thought quickly. a matter of inches to the left and it would have been wedged in between the shoulder blade and the sternum hitting the animal most likely in the heart or lung or possibly hitting in a major arterial region. my shot was slightly off and managed to pass through the ribcage area and exit in the soft tissue of the paunch and end up clipping less vital organs. and about liver shots, they arent as bad as gut or intestine shots but when i came upon the animal at 9:00ish he was bedded and alert, but visibly injured. and his breathing was extremely restricted. my dad didnt hear me wisper that hes right in front of us and my dad stood up and took another step and said "What?", at that time, the animal got up took off with the rest of his energy and found a new place to bed and eventually die. he dissapeared into the thick underbrush. 
next time, i will wait for my favorite broad/quartering away shot unless i am certain that i can make it through the sternum area without the risk of my arrow deflecting and/or hitting the middle/rear of the deer.
i am sorry about my eagerness to jump on you guys about your comments, its just i am very maticulous with my shooting and performance, and to hear things like that gets me heated. 
and BTW as far as ethics, i have seen and heard of guys only going after bucks- and its reasonable, if the deer has seen its hayday, or if the deers genes are affected. sure, you can shoot what you legally want,basket rack or not (sure i would) but personally im not afraid to whack a fawn or doe also(in most (personal)cases a mature doe will out-smart a big buck anyday). 
I am glad to get out on weekends, i savor the moments, and when that big boy does come along, i will be proud, because i could have potentally been a presiding factor in that deers sucess. by taking sick, deformed, or not strictly "big boy" type deer, you can almost gaurentee you have paved the way for even better genes in deer to prosper.

sorry bout all that, im probably preeching to the choir but i just had to get it out. Good luck to all of you, and make sure to be careful and practice hunter safety. :!


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## Papascott (Apr 22, 2004)

How is taking a button buck out of the gene pool helping genetics?

Scott


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## saugeyeslayer (Jul 6, 2004)

it could have been a sick or weak animal due to its behavior, wasnt very cautious, and had been sparring with other fawns earlier in front of me, then he ran right to me because of his dominent friends. not saying it was sick or subordinate, but its not good to let the deer grow to huge populations where i hunt. its about a mile from columbus...the actual city. its surrounded by neighborhoods and corporations. this place is absolutely loaded with animals. 40acres, probably about 15+ deer within the lot at one time. thats about 1 deer per 3 acres if evenly dispersed, and i have yet to see anything bigger than a 120s class 8 point there. it can never be bad to remove an animal from that area in order to bring up the ratio. i would say theres probably 4 sexually mature bucks in that woodlot as of now.removing bucks as well as does is just making competition for food a neutral minor issue.


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## M.Magis (Apr 5, 2004)

saugeyeslayer, I'm afraid your just digging a deeper hole.  Your entitled to take any deer you want, but don't try to justify it like you need an excuse. You don't need one. Plus, your reasoning holds about as much water as a landing net.  Just admit you made an error and learn from it. We've all done it.


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## saugeyeslayer (Jul 6, 2004)

haha yeah funny. after all, this is OHIO GAME FISHING. mabye i oughta keep my thoughts to myself. digging a deeper hole? just consider what i said. its not hogwash, it has a point. and yes i am entitled to take any deer i want. so dont beat up on me. i can find folly in taking a buck just for its rack...i shoot small deer so what, it could have been "worse" i could have wounded a huge buck. OH NO!!! A HUGE BUCK!!!??? other than ensemanating a doe, what do they provide for us other than bragging rights, its turning in to a game of SIZE as opposed to a game of starvation...whatever dudes. have fun eating that tough, musty, gross buck for dinner.


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## Mushijobah (May 4, 2004)

Go out back and practice more. Wounding deer isnt fun, you know better than I do though!


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## Lundy (Apr 5, 2004)

saugeyeslayer,

I haven't read every word of every post, but I hope no one is giving you any grief over what deer you elect to shoot or not, that's your choice, no one else's.

I do think however that when many offer critical advice to you based upon your story that you should at least consider it without just blowing it off. Many of those offering advice have years and years of hunting experience and have either personally experienced the same problem as you or certainly know of someone or in most cases many someones that have had the same experience. I don't think anyone is trying to bash you but rather share with you obvious mistakes that you made that contributed to your problem. If you don't at least listen and consider this advice how else for you learn about bowhunting? The best was is certainly not from reading a book or watching hunting shows. You learn from others and your own mistakes. It is much less painful to learn from others mistakes that your own.

You made multiple mistakes that are very, very common for any relatively new bowhunter. I say that not to bash you but so you might reduce the chances of ever experiencing the same results again.

I would like to discuss one. You offered in your explanation that the deer was walking toward you and you were only 8' up and right in it's eyesight and that it would soon spook every deer in the woods so you elected to take the frontal quartering shot. I am told about this and read these accounts all the time. Bowhunters taking a shot that should never be taken just because the think it will be their only opportunity, or it was a huge buck, or it was the last day I could hunt this week, or it was the last day of the season. Bowhunters shouldn't change the standards just because they think it's this or nothing. You took a no no frontal shot only because you thought it was your only opportunity. Would you have taken that shot had your believed you could have waited for a good shot selection, of course not, at least I hope so.

Bowhunting is so, so much more than shooting a bow. It is the art of getting the animal where you want it to be, presenting the shot you want, at a yardage you want,and making a clean, quick kill. The killing of a deer by an experienced bowhunter is simple only because he has learned that the name of the sport is bowhunting, not bowshooting.

No bowhunter should compromise what has been over the years has become ethical standards just for the sake of bowshooting. If the deer is coming in and only offers you a frontal shot and will spook all of the other deer any second, oh well, you don't take the shot. You learn from what happened, move your stand, set up differently, hunt a new area, and try again tomorrow to get the deer where you need it to be, there is always tomorrow. 

Please don't become a bowhunter that measures your success of how many deer you kill, and don't let anyone else measure you that way. Learn from the deer, your successes,your mistakes and others mistakes to become a better bowhunter not a bowshooter.

I really hope you can accept this is the spirit that it is intended.

Sorry you lost your deer.


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## ostbucks98 (Apr 14, 2004)

> how do you know i dont practice each afternoon vigorously to prepare for a weekends hunt?





> hunted at my favorite urban area near my house and sat in a permanent platform stand for 3 hours. shot at a doe, she jumped. it began to pour. went home. NEXT DAY: had deer all around me, shot at a sixmonth old for some odd reason, somehow, i managed to miss that too. then they came running back about an hour later, and nailed him(button buck) right in the vitals. problem is, he was quartering toward me,



If your confident in your shooting then im confident a Doe,Six month old and button buck died this past weekend.


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## saugeyeslayer (Jul 6, 2004)

thanks Lundy, i appreciate the advice. i can tell you have gathered years worth of experience. but, i am not that new to hunting. ive been hunting(bow & gun) and tagging along for 10 years. not that it matters to my selectiveness, but i go to school everyday, i dont drive, and my parents work. i live in bexley, meaning none of my friends are very outdoorsy and i usually/ only get out on weekends except when i take 1 day off school opening monday of gun season. i dont have many options. 
and to you, ostbucks. i didnt wound 3 animals, i missed 2 times clean from nerves. and i shot and i startled A wounded deer resulting in me losing him. -will post only when i have good days in the woods from now on. sorry about causing a roukas.


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